“They Hung Themselves” Pennsylvania Mom Kills Kids and Blames Bullying | Lisa Snyder Case - Love and Murder: Heartbreak to Homicide

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now part of the dark Cast Network. Welcome to indie
podcasts with a dark side. A mother calls nine to
one one to report her children hanging in a basement,
but nothing about her story adds up. What investigators on
covered next would turn this case into one of the

(00:21):
most disturbing child murders Pennsylvania had ever seen. Today, I
tell you the case of Lisa Snyder right now on
Love and Murder. Welcome Lambs. Welcome to Love and Murder,

(00:48):
Heartbreak to Homicide. You're a weakly true crime podcast telling
you cases of relationships that turn to murder. I'm your host,
Kai and if you are new here, thank you so
much for joy. Take a seat, take a listen all
the way to the end, and if you like my
retelling of this case, please don't forget to subscribe for

(01:09):
today's case. I would suggest that you do some positive
breathing before you get into this case, because we about
to be flipping all kinds of desks over this case.
Is who so hard? Before begin, I want to thank
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(01:32):
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(01:53):
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appreciate you either way. Patreon dot com forward slash Love

(02:15):
and Murder. Now let's grab our butts, grab our delicious
glass of apple juice, because you know I love apple juice,
and let's get into this Love and Murder. At four
thirty three pm on September twenty third, twenty nineteen, a
nine to one to one call came in from a
rural home in Albany Township, Pennsylvania. On the line was
thirty six year old Lisa Snyder. Her voice was calm,

(02:39):
too calm for what she was claiming. Lisa told police
that she discovered her two children hanging from a support
beam in the basement of their home. She said they
were hanging from opposite ends of the same dog leash,
and there were two overturned chairs beneath them. Quote. My
son has been bullied. He's been making threats about doing this,

(03:01):
but he didn't want to go alone. When emergency responders
arrived at the house, they found a scene that they
all probably would have to fight to scrub from their minds.
Eight year old Connor Snyder and his four year old
sister Brindley hanging about three feet apart by dog leashes
in the basement. Both children were alive, but in full

(03:24):
cardiac arrest. I honestly, I couldn't be a cop. I
couldn't be a first responder. I would never be able
to forget this. And I'm not saying that people who
do this are they do it, you know, they do
it to help people. I agree, but this would probably
cause me to self harm, Like I couldn't deal with this,

(03:44):
So I commend people who do this type of work.
I know you're in it to help people. I really
commend you. I couldn't I couldn't do it. They were
rushed to Lehigh Valley Hospital and for three days, they
remained on life support in the Pediatric Intense Care Unit.
During questioning, Lisa told police that Connor wanted to build
a fort in the basement with his sister, and he

(04:06):
took two kitchen chairs and a newly purchased dog leash
down with them. She claimed that she then folded clothes,
took the dog outside, smoked a cigarette, and later went
to check on the children, at which point she found
them hanging. Wait a second, hold on, hold on, hold on,
hold on, Okay, wait a second. I just realized something.

(04:30):
She then called nine to one one. They came and
the children were still hanging. As a mother, everybody, stop
what you're doing as a mother, And even if you're
not a mother or father, even if you're not a father,
if you went in the basement, you did all this stuff.

(04:50):
So just think hypothetical situation. You went in the basement
and you found your children or children hanging. What is
the first thing you're gonna do? Are you gonna be
like I should call nine one one and have a
calm voice. Hello, nine one one. Yes, I saw children hanging.
My son said he wanted to kill himself. Oh where
are they now still hanging? I'll wait for nine one

(05:13):
one to arrive. And nine one one arrived and they're
still fricking hanging. Immediate emediate, I will be judge jury. Look,
oh my god, I just thought about that they were
still hanging when first responders arrived. If I went and

(05:36):
saw somebody hanging in a basement or anywhere, the first
thing I'm doing is I'm trying to hold that person up.
If I can't cut you down, I'm going to be
holding you up, and then I'll try and dig my
phone out while i'm holding you up to try and
call nine one one. If I can't hold you up
while I'm getting my phone, then I'm getting a chair

(05:58):
trying to reach and cut you down, and then I'll
call nine one one. Either way, I'm trying to save you.
My first thought is to save you. I don't know
how throughout my research writing this, all of this, I
don't know how that just hit me as I'm recording now,
diabolical dia frickin' but oh my god. Anyways, Wow, back

(06:20):
to what I was saying. She mentioned owning a dog
that she kept outside on a wire cable leash with
plastic coating, and that she had since given the dog away.
She said that Connor was being bullied at Greenwich Lenshartville
I think elementary school where he was in third grade.
Lisa told police that Connor had said he'd wanted to

(06:41):
end his own life but was afraid to die alone. Quote,
he doesn't say much because he knows that I will
call the school. He just comes home and he's just angry.
On September twenty sixth, twenty nineteen, fourteen minutes apart, both
Connor and Brindley were pronounced dead after they were taken
off of life support. Shockinglye the coroner listed their deaths

(07:03):
as homicides, which isn't as shocking now that I realized
that this bit had these children still hanging while she
called nine one one and sat there waiting for nine
to one one to come. The investigation started. During this time,
police served at least five search warrant getting cell phones,
computers from the home, and an xbox. One warrant that

(07:26):
was issued on October second, was looking for a dog.
A black husky pit bull mix weighed fifty pounds that,
according to Lisa, had been conveniently missing for a week.
Investigators wanted to weigh the dog to help them in
reconstruct in what happened on the day of the nine
to one one call. First responded police had taken notes

(07:47):
and pictures of the basement. They noticed two bar height
wooden chairs overturned near the beam, and noted that the
dog leashes were vinyl coded. In the first four warrants,
police had gotten Lisa's cell phone, the plastic coded why
the children were found hanging from the wooden chairs from
the basement, two iPads, a laptop, computer, and the Xbox

(08:09):
game and console. They got all of this to inspect
for clues into the deaths. Then police learned from Lisa's
seventeen year old son, her only other child, that she
had multiple phones, so they went back and got two
more cell phones from her. So it's like, okay, so
number one, you left the children hang in while you

(08:31):
called police and waited for first to responders to arrive.
Then when police asked you for your phone, you were like, oh, yeah,
here's one, but you withheld others. I'm telling you judge
and jury right there, she would already be guilty to me.
Throughout all of their investigation, police noticed that there were
no signs of forced entry and no suicide notes, so

(08:53):
basically saying, you can't blame this on somebody else, and
there's no suicide note, which I mean, do kids really
believes suicide notes? Which, unfortunately, that's a sentence that had
to come out of my mouth. There were also no
evidence that Connor was being bullied at school. Police spoke
with multiple family members, school officials, and classmates, who all

(09:14):
said that Connor was a happy child who had never
been bullied at school and showed no signs of being suicidal.
School bus security video from the afternoon of the incident
showed Connor getting off of the bus and running up
to his house, showing absolutely no signs of distress. Remember
she said he got off from school and he would
always be angry. This is showing something completely different. Basically,

(09:39):
what their investigation concluded was there was absolutely no way
that Connor could have hung both himself and his sister.
Other damon pieces of evidence came out during the investigation.
Police found search history between September seventeenth and twenty third,
which included quote carbon monoxide in a car, how long

(10:01):
to die? Quote almost got away with It? Best episodes,
this bitch, best episode, Oh my god? Quote hanging yourself?
Quote how to hang yourself? Quote does a hybrid car
produce carbon monoxide? Also visits to sites about short drop
hangings and suicide techniques, and quote how to kill? Someone

(10:24):
who does these kind of searches, I mean, even me,
who freaking does true crime, you wouldn't imagine my search history. Literally,
none of this is in my search history. Are you
freaking crazy? And her watch history showed that she watched
the true crime show Almost Got Away with It just

(10:44):
days before her children were hanged. Is that how you
think you get away with quote unquote murder or whatever?
Watch a true crime show almost got away with it
to find out what they You know, what, if you're
diabolical enough to hang your own children sit there while
they're hanging and waiting for first responders to come, then

(11:05):
you're just stupid enough to search this up. So then
police found out that the leash that was used to
strangle the kids had been bought just one day earlier,
on September twenty second, twenty nineteen, at a Walmart in Hamburg.
The leash was purchased online and set to pick up.
Surveillance footage confirmed Lisa made the pickup. The receipt was

(11:30):
time stamped at nine thirty am. This contradicted the idea
that Connor spontaneously used a readily available item for suicide.
Although police had this information, one critical device that they
didn't have was a Samsung Galaxy Note, which was believed
to have been used to order the leash, which I mean,

(11:50):
you saw her pick it up, so do you really
need the phone? Also, how many phones does this woman
have and why? Also in interview and witnesses, they report
that Lisa was looking agitated at the scene. A paramedic
who responded that described the Lisa as quote very anxious,
very nervous, but noted quote she was not crying when

(12:12):
he saw her on the front steps talking on her
cell phone. Okay, okay, okay, okay. Wait a second, wait
a second. So while your children are still hanging, you're
sitting chilling on the front steps talking on the cell phone,
to the point that when they pulled up they saw
you talking on the cell phone, chilling like it was

(12:33):
just another Sunday, not crying, just talking to your just
talking to your friend. Yeah no, I'm just waiting for
first responders to get here. Why oh now, girls, nothing,
there was just an episode that happened at the house.
Nothing to really talk about. But anyways, how's Graham doing?
Are you freaking kidding me? Ah? This is giving me
a headache for real. And also, I also wanted to

(12:56):
point this out, and I'm not saying for this bit here,
I'm saying in general. So you know how they were
saying she wasn't crying, This is just you know, weird.
This isn't the emotional response people expect. But you do
have to remember that some people handle stress and tragedy

(13:16):
in different ways. For instance, if someone with a childhood
of constant and absolute tragedy had this happened to them,
they might have learned to disassociate a long time ago.
So in scenarios where we would be wailing and crying
and you know, just beside ourselves, this isn't what we

(13:37):
would have to expect from them, they may be calm
and rational acting to us. So this, in my opinion,
isn't really evidence. What is evidence, though, is she's sitting
there chilling, talking on the phone while her children are
still hanging. Because these other people that I'm talking about,
who might be calm and rational, they'll still be trying
to get you know, They'll still be trying to help

(14:00):
their children. They wouldn't just be sitting there like, yeah,
I'm just disassociated. No, they'd still be trying to help.
They just wouldn't be wailing and you know, wringing their
hands like we would. Later, Lisa posted on Facebook saying
quote words scar rumors, destroy bully's kill, shut the up.

(14:20):
So this post also made police suspicious. Look, I'm telling you,
as soon as I got there, I would have been suspicious.
I would have already said she was guilty. I wouldn't
even been suspicious, just guilty. In December twenty nineteen, Lisa
was arrested and charged with two counts of first degree murder,
child endangerment, evidence tampering, and she was also facing charges

(14:43):
of third degree murder. Online records also initially indicated charges
of animal cruelty and sexual intercourse with a dog, although
the final conviction details primarily focused on the murder, child endangerment,
and evidence tampering charges. I mean, what an absolute freak, now,

(15:04):
don't ask me more about this. This was just a
passing thing in my research, never to be mentioned again.
Because of how brief it is. Normally I wouldn't have
included it, but it came out of such left field
that I was like, I have to let my lambs
know this bullshit. Prosecutors indicated that they would seek the
death penalty. However, because Lisa accepted a bench trial instead

(15:29):
of a jury trial, she was ineligible for a death sentence.
So a jury trial, the jury decides, you know, guilty
or not guilty. A bench trial, the decision is up
to the judge. In September twenty twenty four, Lisa's trial started.
Owen Snyder, Lisa's now twenty two year old son, gave

(15:50):
his testimony. When asked why he no longer referred to
Lisa as quote mom, Owen said, quote I just don't
see her as my mother anymore. He called Lisa a
quote monster, and expressed his profound sorrow that his younger
siblings would never have the chance to be an aunt
and uncle to his newborn son. Quote that day, I

(16:11):
didn't just lose my brother and sister, I lost my
mother as well. The courtroom sat silent as Owen described
the loss of his siblings. Quote, Connor loved video games,
school and making people laugh. He didn't do this, she did.
He described Connor as happy, playful, and excited about school.

(16:31):
He never expressed suicidal thoughts. If something was bothering him,
Owen said, quote, he would have told me. A cousin
described how Brittley liked to wear bows in her hair
and had just started learning to write her name. Oh
my god, she was only four, remember, and now both
are gone, killed by the one person who was supposed

(16:51):
to protect them. Connor's teachers and school officials also agreed
that Connor was a happy kid who showed no signs
of depression or being suicidal. An occupational therapist from Kotstown
School District testified that due to Connor's fine motor skilled challenges,
it would have been extremely difficult for him to manipulate

(17:12):
the clasp of the dog leash or tie it tightly
enough to cause death. She said that due to his
motor skilled challenges, he couldn't even tie his own shoes yet. Wow,
so how do you supposedly go from not being able
to tie your own shoes to tie the leash and
even put it around yours and your sister's neck. Yeah,

(17:35):
that doesn't add up, does it? Lisa? Lisa's cousin, Jessica Wadelick,
I think that's how you say her last name, who
once called Lisa her quote best friend, testified that the
children were terrified of the basement and almost never played there.
She also revealed that in twenty fourteen, Lisa had once

(17:56):
confessed to wanting to place quote cords and bottle caps
in Connor's crib, hoping he would choke. What the defense? Ugh,
y'all already know how I feel about the defense. Let's
get into it, lambs. The defense pointed out Lisa's documented
mental illness. Of course they did. They said that she

(18:18):
had bipolar disorder with psychotic features, borderline personality disorder PTSD,
and chronic suicidal ideation dating back to sixteen. What the
hell does all of this have to do with murdering
her children and then blaming it on her son. Let's
just throw a bunch of diagnoses in there and say
this is why she did it. Frickin' really, Defense attorney

(18:41):
Dennis Charles told the court, quote, if she did this,
she's not a bad person. She's a sick person. You know,
I really hate when people try to use mental health
as a defense when it actually shouldn't be used, but
when it's actually the case, they completely ignore it. Absolute bullshit.

(19:02):
He revealed that Lisa had been sexually abused between ages
five and seven, which he said contributed to her psychological state.
The frick does that have to do with anything going
on here? Psychiatrist doctor dun Tran testified that Lisa had
a psychotic break when the murders occurred. But get this, Lambs.

(19:25):
Under cross examination, he admitted that he was just speculating.
I'm just spitballing here. He wasn't even present during the
crime and based his opinion on interviews from three years later.
What However, prosecutors countered these arguments presenting evidence of Lisa's
calculated actions leading up to the deaths. A prosecution mental

(19:48):
health expert also disagreed with the defense's assessment, stating that
there was nothing indicating that Lisa wouldn't know right from
wrong at the time of the children's deaths, and I
frickin' concur Then the defense tried to strike a plea deal.
Oh oh, that didn't work, your honor. Okay, okay, Okay,
let's try this instead. Lisa would plead no contests but

(20:11):
mentally ill to two counts of third degree murder. Eh eh,
the judge said no. The trial lasted just under five days.
On September twenty fourth, twenty twenty four, Judge M. Teresa
Johnson found Lisa Snyder guilty of two counts of first
degree murder, child endangerment, and tampering with evidence. In Pennsylvania,

(20:34):
a first degree murder conviction carries an automatic sentence of
life in prison. During the sentence inherin on Thursday October eighteenth,
twenty twenty four, Lisa was given two consecutive life sentences
without the possibility of parole. Judge Johnson also imposed an
additional eight and a half to seventeen years in prison

(20:56):
for the child endangerment and evidence tampering convictions. Lisa showed
no emotion as a verdict was read, no apology, no explanation.
Judge Johnson described the crime as quote the most violent
murder she had ever seen during her time on the bench,
and slammed Lisa for showing quote no remorse and said,

(21:17):
quote the fact that an individual could put their hands
on another individual to commit a murder makes it so
much worse than if you stood across the street and
fired a gun at them. And the fact that you
put your two children on a dog leash and hung
them up to basically just choke to death, and you

(21:38):
sat there and watched them for some time, and then
you calmly went upstairs. Oh my god, I don't want
to think about it. Don't want to think about it.
I want to think about it. Prosecutor Med McCollum said, quote,
her sole job in life should have been to protect
and care for Connor and Brinley. She failed at that.
She chose to harm her children, and they suffered as

(21:59):
they hung by their next gaspin for air. And you
know what another thing is. She could have just given
these children to their brothers, say I don't want anything
to do with them anymore. I'm literally thinking about killing them.
Take them. Like there were so many other different avenues
she could have gone, given it to her parents, told
her best friend. Like so many different avenues she could

(22:22):
have taken, this was the one she chose. Burke's County
District Attorney John T. Adams expressed satisfaction with the verdict,
saying quote, we are very pleased that Lisa Snyder will
never see the light of day and will spend the
rest of her life in jail, where she belongs. I
don't think that it could stand up here, nor can
anyone explain the horrific loss of two innocent children's lives.

(22:45):
I think it goes without explanation. You know, if you
don't want your children anymore, to the point that you're
thinking like you're literally planning on murdering them, please go
drop them off anonymously at a hospital, at a fireplace,
or with friends and family. If you're worried about how
people would judge you, people will judge you more if

(23:07):
you murder them. You freaking moron. Not that I'm calling
you a freaking moron, but I'm just saying people will
judge you harsher and more, and among other things that
will happen to you if you murder your children, or
if you abuse your children. If you don't want your children,
please give them to somebody who wants children, or at

(23:29):
least loves your children and will take care of your children.
Lisa Snyder will die in prison, But for those who
loved Connor and Brinley, justice doesn't bring peace as one
relative said quote will carry this forever. And I'm literally
saying this, like, if for some reason, you're listening to
this episode and you're sitting here searching how to commit

(23:51):
a murder, or listening to this episode to find out
how to get commit one without getting caught, instead of
taking your time and your brain cells to do that,
just put the kids in a car, drive to the
nearest fire station and drop them off. You will not
get in trouble for that. What you will get in

(24:11):
trouble for, and you will get caught for, no matter
how many preparations you do, is for murdering or harming
your children. Drop them off at the fire station, drop
them off at a hospital, drop them off with family
of friends, and just chucked the deuce and said you're
not coming back. That is far more better than if
you're thinking of harming your children. This is just a sad,

(24:34):
sad and demented case. And Lisa actually never said why
she did it. She never even said she did it,
and like the judge said, she never actually showed remorse
for doing it. I feel so bad thinking about the
children's last thoughts. It's not like she even had them
drug throughout this like I can't even imagine. I also

(24:58):
feel horrible for owing that that was his brother and
sister like and to know that this is what your
mother did. I feel so bad for Owen. Owen. I
really hope that you're getting help. You're talking to somebody
about this so you don't like let this weigh on
you anyway, Lambs. Let me know your thoughts about this
case in the comments below. I was planning on reading

(25:21):
your comments from previous cases, but I just I don't
have it in me. I have to stop recording. Anyways.
That's all I have for you for today. As we
end each full episode, I remind you that it's all

(25:46):
love and no murder. And I'm serious, no murder, Like
if you feel like you're gonna harm your children, like
I'm not even playing when I was saying any of this,
please just give your children to somebody who wants to
take care your children so you won't get in trouble
for doing that. Please, all right, Lamb. Bye,

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“They Hung Themselves” Pennsylvania Mom Kills Kids and Blames Bullying | Lisa Snyder Case

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}“They Hung Themselves” Pennsylvania Mom Kills Kids and Blames Bullying | Lisa Snyder Case