May 17, 2025 • 43 mins
Gene Marks- The Marks Group
Jim Mischel- CEO Electric Mirror
Stanley Greer- senior research associate for the National Institute for Labor Relations Research
Jim Mischel- CEO Electric Mirror
Stanley Greer- senior research associate for the National Institute for Labor Relations Research
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
This is Made in America with Rich Rothman.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Welcome to Made in America. Great stuff. Today we're talking tariffs.
We're gonna have some really good people on the show
today and we've come to tariff. We've got Gene Marx,
the founder of the Mark Scoop, is gonna be talking
about tariffs. He's a consultant for a small business. Jim
Mitchell owns a family owned company Electric Mirror, started in
a garage and is worth a fortune now making electric
(00:34):
mirrors that you've probably seen him in a lot of
the hotel rooms that you're in. Stan Greer is going
to be on the show senior research associate for the
National Institute for Labor Relations Research. And we're gonna be
talking about right to work, which is something you know
that I'm very very passionate about. And right now we're
going to talk about what mister Trump, our president, has
done this week in the Mideast. I would say we
(00:59):
have seen an amazing week for America. You know, you
talk about made in America. You saw made in America
America first, absolutely, first and foremost throughout the midies of
all places, you know, with all places first and foremost
made in America and America first throughout the midies. That's
just unbelievable. It's sort of like, you know, President Trump
(01:22):
has a very unusual concept, and that is if something's
not working, sort of like the Abraham Accords. When he
was working on that and you know number forty five,
he changed the concept. He said, well, listen, the two
state solution is not going to work. It's not happening
right now. Let's move on. We'll just cut these other
guys out for the time being. We're going to find
(01:42):
some commonality in the Mid East with countries that want
to work together and see that doing business is actually
a better thing to do. You know, having relationships business
wise is a better thing to do than it is
to be fighting and arguing and blowing each other up
and making demands that are foolish that you're just never
going to get. And because of that, you know, nothing
(02:04):
ever happens. So what did he do this week? He
goes into the Mideast and he cuts like trillion dollars
worth of deals, you know, with Saudi Arabia, cutter and
the United Arab Memerre. Just just unbelievable. You know, the
new White House announced six hundred billion dollar investment commitment
from Saudi Arabia, including one hundred and forty two billion
(02:25):
defense partnerships, twenty billion for you know, artificial intelligence data
centers two billion, and Saudi infrastructure projects for American firms.
Elon Musk announced the deal for Starlink twenty billion dollars
for AI. Cutter did an amazing deal, ordered one point
two trillion worth of business ninety six billion dollars worth
(02:47):
of Boeing jets. If I got to say, who is
the biggest winner of this week, well, first of all
the biggest winners of America, it's US. But Boeing just walked.
I mean, the largest jet order in the history of
jet orders. You know, one hundred and eighty jets Boeing jets,
seven eighty seven jets being built by Boeing being bought
(03:07):
by Cutter forty two billion, and just unbelievable forty two
billion of weapons acquisitions, three billion in advanced events technologies.
The UAE, my God, committed to a ten year, one
point fourty million dollar investment in the US, with over
two hundred billion of new deals announced during the trip.
This includes fourteen and a half billion commitment from their
(03:28):
airways for Boeing aircraft. I mean, there you go again,
Boeing for an AI center also in Abu Dhabi, and
it goes on from there, just goes on from there.
And what is what is the Democrat's response to this?
Listen to this. I want to Phil, I want you
to get this up. Number three, Representative Swallwell an absolute
(03:49):
genius moron from California. And I'm sorry, I'm going to
call a moron a moron. I think it's only fair
that we call a moron a moron, because I think
it helps cure the moron. If you know you're a moron,
you may think twice about what you're saying. This is
what this moron says about all these deals that are
coming through that are job creations right here in the
United States. Let's play that soundbag.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Let's bring a Democratic Congressman Eric Swalloll of California. He's
a member of the Householdland Security Committee and teer with
us at the table. David Corn he's the Washington bureau
chief for Mother Jones and an MSNBC political congressman. I
want to start with Eugene's implicit question there, what do
you think Donald Trump was giving up or exchanging in
these negotiations.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
It's a me me me presidency that he's running. And
as I look at you this trip and what he's
getting out of it, I see how he benefits. I
don't see how americans at home are going to benefit.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
That's unbelievable. I mean, that sums it all up. I
don't see how America will benefit and how Americans will
benefit in terms of manufacturing. So, in other words, creating
almost two hundred and two hundred and fifty planes at
Boeing really does nothing for America because, after all, and
it doesn't do any jobs, does it. Well, you know what.
(05:09):
That's what we're talking about today on this show. We're
talking about the naivete of people who are trying to
control the government or did try to control the government,
and where we're really going right now and the significance
of what this president has done, and I got to
tell you it's nothing less than remarkable. We're going to
be right back on Made in America with Gene Marx,
Great Insight, don't go anywhere. Okay, welcome back. We are
(05:46):
delighted to have you here today. You know, we're having
a very very interesting conversation at least we're about to,
and it's talking about the tariffs. And there is so
much emotionality when it comes to the tariffs. I mean,
I have seen people have meltdowns. I have seen people,
you know, completely lose it with arguments with some of
their best friends, you know. And I'm down in Miami,
(06:09):
and you know, Miami is very trade, very international, pan
hemispheric trade conference oriented, and you know, we understand a
lot about terrorists, we understand about trade. We understand about
certain things that we're going to learn about today in
free zones and manufacturing and you know, near shoring and
all the things that we can do to make life
(06:29):
better in terms of you know, creating business. You know,
two way trade. The two way trade is very important.
It's it's great for us down here, it's really important
in Latin America. And we'll go into a great detail
on that, Okay, on the show. Right now on the
phone is Gene Marx. Jean's the founder of the Marx Group,
a small business consulting firm, which is really important because
(06:52):
we all know that the backbone of the United States
in terms of job creation are the SMEs, a small
to mid sized companies. So Gene, welcome the Maid in America.
Speaker 5 (07:02):
Thank you, Rich. I'm about to be honest, Well the
light did you hear?
Speaker 2 (07:05):
You know? This is a really important topic. It's important,
I think, Jane, for a couple of reasons. One of
the most obvious people don't know what the hell is
going on with tariffs? Am I going to be paying more?
Am I going to be paying less? I'm not going
to have, you know, all the supplies that I need.
You know, some there are reports out there the thirty
five percent few containers are going through the Port of
Los Angeles. I don't know if that's real. I got
(07:26):
to tell you that I gotta think twice about that
before I get involved in it. You know what I mean.
But it is a very emotional topic, Jane, So welcome
to maide in America. So okay, top of mind, what happens?
What's going on here?
Speaker 5 (07:40):
Yeah? I mean, first of all, thank you, you know,
for laying it out in that way. And just so
everybody understands. I mean, you know, I run a consulting firm.
I write every week for The Guardian and The Hill
and Forbes and a bunch of other places, and I'm
a certified public accountant, and you would believe that if
this is a TV show not already shows, you could
(08:00):
take a look at my face. So just so you
know that's my background. You know, everybody's everybody's ringing their
hands and screaming and yelling up and down about you know,
tariffs and all that. But I gotta say some members
my best clients, when any of these issues come up, political, social,
you know whatever, they put that stuff aside and they're like, Okay,
what are we going to do to navigate our way
(08:20):
around this challenge? Okay, let's think with the clear mind
and what do we do? And that's what I think
you and I should talk about, is that. But putting
aside all the emotions about tariffs. If you're running a
small business, because that's why I cover, how do you
mitigate these costs? So I have a bunch of things
that I'd like to recommend to your listeners to navigate
your way around tariffs. You you touched on one briefly,
(08:44):
which is free trade zones and bonded warehouses. So if
you're not aware of this, there are hundreds of free
trade zones and bonded warehouses all around the country. A
bonded warehouse and a free trade zone if you reach
out to them, and you can google and find a
free trade zone or a bonded warehouse in your area.
When you receive goods in from overseas into a bonded
(09:08):
warehouse or a free trade zone, you pay no tariff
on that good. The only time that you pay the
tariffs is when you take the goods out of the
warehouse and use them. So perfect case in point. We
know that we are in a suspended state right now
with China, and you know, I am not optimistic that
(09:29):
we're going to resolve this anytime soon with China because
there's a lot of other issues that go well beyond
just you know, tariffs. But regardless, while the tariffs are suspended,
I have a bunch of clients and really smart readers
and people running businesses that are are buying up products,
bringing them into the free you know now and putting
them there, and then they're they're leveraging and they're hoping
(09:52):
on the fact that the tariffs that are existing right
now with China, Europe, you know, Canada, whatever, if they
go down, then when you pull the items out of
the warehouse, then you will pay less of a tariff,
so it's a hedge against teriffs. We're hoping for these
negotiations to come forward, So that's what people will be doing.
(10:12):
If the tariffs spike back up again, if there is
no resolution and they're high, you can still buy these products,
put them into a bonded warehouse, sit on them for
a while, and wait for things to get resolved. In addition,
if you do any kind of assembly or manufacturing of
those products in a bonded warehouse, when you pull them
out of the warehouse, there will be even less tariffs
(10:33):
to pay. And finally, you mentioned that you're in the
Miami area. You know there's a lot of international trade
that goes on from the Miami area. If you buy
products and then turn around and sell them internationally without
doing anything, bring them into a bonded warehouse, and then
turn around and sell them out of the bonded warehouse,
you will pay no tariff at all. You just avoid
(10:55):
the entire headache.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
So yeah, you know, just let me just hang on
there for a second. Let me just let me just
jump in for a second. Because I've been involved in
international trade down here since the eighties. A member of
the board of the World Trade Center Association, Vice Chair
Pasture of the World Trade Center Association. So I understand
(11:17):
you're very very correct. I think it's very important for
people to understand this a free trade zone. You know,
people think, wow, there's a big fence around it. In
some cases there are, but you know, they store things
there and they bring it in, and you know, it's
it's not really being in the United States. But what
people don't really understand, the neophytes, those who are getting involved,
(11:37):
that it is also a manu and you touched on it.
It's a manufacturing area. Now what does that mean. That
means that parts of a fully assembled product will be
brought in as parts before it's a fully assembled product.
It could be you know, materie l it could be
you know, it could be a a rare earth material,
(12:03):
it could be whatever it is to make the ultimate
widget that you're putting together. And it's taxed differently, and
in some cases it's not taxed at all. So a
free zone is not exactly you know, people think, well,
it's it's it's a warehouse, which it is. It's a
manufacturing area, Well it is, and and it's also a
combination of the two where you can store things, uh,
(12:26):
and you can you know, and have displays, because in
some cases you can have displays in a free free environment,
and there are a lot of them here. Miami has
a ton and they're proliferating throughout the Americas. It's very,
very important to understand free trade zones because you cannot
have on shoring, near shoring, or you know, increase supply trade,
(12:50):
you know, the ability to have products come in on
a timely basis without having free zones in the ability
to do this. So I want to go back for
a second. This has verse for a sec Let's talk
about products that are manufactured in a free zone. So
there's employment going on there, they are manufacturing products. What
happens with the materiel that comes in before it's the
(13:13):
finished product? How is that tax or is it a text?
Speaker 5 (13:17):
Well, it's first of all, it depends on the material
and where it's coming from, obviously, because it's you know,
steel and aluminum or tariff differently than non steel on aluminum.
But there's there are specific tariffs on that which are
still in place, by the way, or if it comes
from Europe or if it comes from Asia or specific
countries bottom line is, though, is that there's no tariffs
when you receive it. So if you're buying it today
(13:40):
it's coming in, you're not paying a tariff when it
comes into a free trade zone warehouse or body warehouse.
You're only going to calculate and pay the tariff when
it leaves the warehouse. That might be three months from now,
in the teriff rates might be lower, or like you
just said, you might have done some manufacturing with those
materials and because they were part of a finished product
from that tariff calculation would be even different. So again
(14:03):
there's there's nothing when you bring it into the free
trade zone. You're not doing tariffs yet until you actually
pull it out of that warehouse. And like I said earlier,
that's why a lot of my clients and readers and
smart business owners are they're they're hedging, you know, they're
they're bringing them in and letting it there. One of
the things Richie mentioned about the there is a cost. Obviously,
there's a warehousing fee to bring to bring it in there.
(14:23):
And if you're buying products in bulk, you're you know,
you are financing that in some cases with working capital
and you know, interest rates are not exactly low right now.
So there are costs that you have to take into consideration.
But like any good business person, do the math and
figure out what makes more sense incurring those costs with
lower tariffs or paying the higher tariff. Just you know,
right off the bat, that's that's the bond of warehouse
(14:46):
you mentioned. I didn't know this. You were on the
board of directions for the World Trade Center Association. Yeah, eight,
tell me, okay, So I talk about I've written about
the World Trade Center Association a number of times as
another way to mitigate the impact of tariffs because you
can join and a member, or you don't have to
(15:06):
be a member. It depends on the relationship you have.
But the World Trade Center Association. I interview twenty companies
in Philly and Chicago that use the World Trade Center
Association to help them find alternate suppliers of materials from
more terrorf friendly countries. So they're relying on stuff coming
from China. They went to the World Trade Center Association.
(15:27):
As you know, they have an extensive database of companies
they're supplying stuff all around the world, and they found
other suppliers from other parts of the world with lower tariffs.
And the World Trade Center made introductions for these people
and in a couple of cases they literally went down
with these companies with the executives to make you know,
face to face introductions as well. I've found out that,
(15:49):
you know, they seem like a great organization and a
great way when you're trying to, you know, figure out
if you can find alternate suppliers around the world. They're
a great resource to go to. And I didn't realize
you you were on the board there, and so good
for you because they're really good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Yeah, guy Tis only when he was alive and he
was the founder. He was running the New York New
Jersey Port Authority, so you know he's a tough guy.
Was a tough guy. Oh yeah, really tough. He sounded
just like George Burns, by the way, he did the
best George Burns, except that was actually him when he
was talking. But no, the World Trade Center, the concept
of a World Trade Center is that to increase an
(16:26):
aid and abet trade. And what does trade do well?
Trade liberates trade, you know, insulates from you know, despotic situations.
If you look at Latin America in the proliferation of
trade in the in the late eighties going into the
early nineties. And that is as a result that we
saw that all the privatizations that were going into Latin
(16:49):
America at the time, so they were actually rebuilding the
infrastructure in Latin America and sort of like hydro electric
and Brazil or bells out A T and T went
into Latin America and completely revamped the communication systems and
actually for a while, Latin America have one of the
most advanced Wi Fi systems. I mean they had three
(17:11):
G when you know, when it was really hot to
have three G and now we're five G. But they
had it before the United States. Why was that because
everything was so corrupt in the certain certain and product
and I mean the people that was corrupt too to
a great degree, but in terms of the product base,
the network that they had, there was no point wiring
(17:31):
Latin America when the technology was already two decades ahead
of that, so you don't need to do that. The
reaction that people are having, some people are saying, well,
oh my god, and this is where this is where
Wall Street went, Main Street went, is that well, you know, products,
we're gonna have one hundred percent tires, they're gonna have
eighty percent teraires. We're gonna have one hundred and forty
five percent taires. Oh my god, it's out of control.
(17:54):
Product's gonna get more expensive. Things aren't gonna be ship
We're not gonna be able to afford anything. And on
the other hand, you have people who are are contemplative.
They think about it and they say, well, I'm not
so sure about that. I may want to keep mind.
You allude to this in your piece that's really really,
really really well done, and I'm very happy reading it.
But keeping your pricing and not losing it, not completely
(18:19):
losing your mind over it may be a smarter, better
way to go because you keep your base. And I
think it's very important to keep your client base because
that keeps your company. Can you react to that from Gene.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
Yeah, I can, and I can tell you again it
counts back to what I've learned from my smartest clients.
You don't have a knee jerk reaction to tariffs like
you just said. You know, you don't get emotional about them.
You know, my smartest clients are the own which they are.
They're looking at their customers and if there has to
be price increases, they're looking on it. They're not just
(18:51):
applying them across the board. They're doing reports of profits
and margins by customer, and they are targeting their price increases.
They might have one customer that's like, you know, these
guys are great. We've been selling them for years. We're
making plenty of money off them, and they've been they're
pay their bills on time. We're really not going to
give them any price increases. We're all good here. They
might have another customer. This guy's a pain in the neck.
(19:13):
He's always giving us a problem. He doesn't pay his bills.
He's going to get the biggest price increase. So it's
not a it's not an emotional decision. It is. It
is analytical. And again I can only tell you what
my best clients are doing, and they are looking at
this analytically and saying, if we do have to increase
prices and we can't absorb these tariffs from a cost perspective,
(19:34):
how do we apply them on a targeted basis so
that we can still make up the difference and still
keep our customers happy.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Okay, so we're going to take a break right now,
make the money for our affiliates. We're going to be
right back with Jim Mitchell, who's going to be talking
about Electric Mirror Company, And we're going to talk to
Stanley Greer, who's really going to have a good conversation
on right to work. Stay. It's really important, don't.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Go anywhere promoting American industry. This is made in America.
(20:20):
With Rich Rothman.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Welcome back to Meadia in America. We're having a very
very emotional and exciting conversation today about tariffs. You know,
we've been following this now for weeks. People have accused
our president of not knowing what he's doing, that you know,
he's doing things are going to benefit himself. I mean,
the emotionality and the whole thing has been farther left,
(20:41):
farther age been absolutely crazy, cats and dogs sleeping together,
a Ghostbusters movie all over the place. But the truth
of the matter is, let's talk to the people who
actually run some of these companies. And in the United States.
We know, particularly with our last guest that we just
had on gene Marx, you know, the small to mid
sized companies are really the backbone of the job creators
(21:04):
of the United States. They are we know that, you know,
we lose those we're in big trouble. So we have
a really good guest on right now, Jim Mitchell. Jim
Mitchell is the CEO of Electric Mirror. Electric Mirror. Now
I want to ask Jim, Jim, welcome to MAID in America.
By the way, thank you for being here.
Speaker 6 (21:22):
My pleasure. Thank you.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
No.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
I love talking to owners of small corporations. I presume
you fit into that. I mean, you're five hundred or
less employees? Is that? Am I getting that right?
Speaker 5 (21:33):
Or that? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (21:36):
Yeah? Yeah, okay, well so am I I've been I've
owned a lot of different corporations. I think the largest
I had was one hundred and thirty five employees. Now
we have about twenty six. And it's very important and
he's a great responsibility. I take it. You know, I'm
the guy that gets up down here. We're in Florida,
in South Florida, Miami. I'm the one that's up at
(21:57):
three o'clock in the morning walking around my pool figuring
it out. You know, where it's going to go and
how we're going to survive the next week. But let's
talk about that for a second. How did you know
you go? You went from a garage environment, which sort
of like, you know, we had that down here with Alienware.
These two young kids started what was called Alienware computers
that were designed solely for gaming, and they grew that
(22:19):
into a three hundred million dollar business. Kids in a garage,
three hundred million dollar business down here Amazon started small
and what looked where they are today. Talk to us
a little bit about how you made that leap from
you know, being in the garage. It took eight years
to really make it come together. You know, what was
the moment of epiphany, what what worked best for you?
And let's go well back into that.
Speaker 6 (22:42):
Yeah, I mean it was a long process. We started
by making mirrors that didn't fog up, which was a
difficult value proposition with just the market wasn't big enough
and pretty much we spent all of our money. And
then a client reached out to us and said, you know,
we want to mirror that lights up, and we decided, okay, great,
(23:04):
we'll make that for them. So we were still in
the garage at the time, and we the family got
together and we started designing it, and the customers like,
this is great. You know, I'll order three hundred of them,
and so we our initial project, you know, was three
hundred of these, and unfortunately every single one was damaged
and shipping. But we you know, stood behind our product
(23:26):
and went and fixed everyone. And by the time I
got done fixing them all, I thought, this is a
great concept. Let's push it everywhere. And that's what we did,
and within a couple of years, I just caught on
and it became latimers became a standard in hotels around
the world, and we've exported to more than one hundred countries.
And then we developed a mirror TV technology. I have
(23:48):
a really unique perspective because I'm a patent attorney as well,
and so all these things kind of come together technology,
you know, protecting IP, but really it was responding into
customers' needs and doing something we've never done before. And
I would say our company is always in startup mode.
We're always looking at new technology to roll out.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
That's right, and that's and that you know, always reinventing
and remarketing and repackaging and making things more exciting is
what really makes the business work really really well. Let
me ask you a question, because I'm sure you were,
you know, really hot on this one, and that's the tariffs.
You know what what in terms of the significant hit
that you could have taken with terriffs. How did you
(24:33):
mitigate that? And you may have made it a really
important decision as a results of the terriffs that benefits
a lot of people right here in the United States.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
You know, the reason why I started talking about this
issue is because, to your point, most people aren't familiar
with manufacturing. A lot of these are small companies. You know,
we have a few hundred employees. I think some people
may consider that big, but it's not big time, and
people don't really realize. I think the struggle US manufacturers
(25:05):
have had, especially with China, and I have to go
back to the first Trump presidency where Trump, you know,
basically imposed a twenty five percent tariff. I would say,
but for that tariff, our US factory.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Would not be around.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
Like that was a critical moment in our history, and
I think for other smaller manufacturers to begin to look into,
you know, what's going on with trade. We talked about
free trade. I'm totally for free trade, but there's not
it's not free trade. And by that I mean you
have products that are being subsidized, industries being subsidized in China.
(25:47):
Those products are coming over flooding into the US market
at extremely low prices because they're being backed by our
government through different policies. And so what happens, what happened
to us, to so many companies, is to compete, you
end up having to outsource your stuff to China, and
so it just becomes this revolving cycle. The next thing,
(26:09):
you know, none of your products are made in the
United States. Now we took we kind of drew a
line in the fans said no, we're gonna hang on
to our US factory. We're gonna do everything possible to
keep us building products in the United States. But it's been,
you know, a huge struggle. So when I look at
at Trump talking about tariffs and in particular with China, yeah,
(26:33):
he's been aggressive. I mean it's been in the last
couple of months, have been quite exciting, as you can imagine.
But I really felt like this is an important time
in our country's history like this. The trade imbalance isn't
because Americans can't build great products. The trade imbalance is
because of really unfair trade policies going on. And so
(26:55):
those that's you know, employment practices, it's what I call
all the dumping of product in order to take over
our market. It's the subsidies by Chinese for manufacturing. Most
people don't know there's actually two manufacturing bases in China,
one that only does export and one that does China domestic.
(27:17):
Isn't that strange that there's manufacturers that aren't allowed to
sell their products into the domestic Chinese market. They can
only export those products. So I just think most Americans
aren't aware that there's real reasons why so many things
have shifted overseas, and a lot of it has to
do with policies. One other point, I looked at the
(27:42):
top ten economies in the world in our product category.
Nine of ten all had substantially higher tariffs and duties
than the United States had on the same products. So
I'm going back, we want free trade. That is not
free trade, so Trump has to negotiate with these countries.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
Well, that's exactly but that's exactly correct. The problem is
most people look at a very superficial, thin layer veneer
of what tariffs really are and what they mean, and
then they go with the emotionality of what the media
is throwing out there, so they really don't know the
truth of what's going on. So here, you are a
manufacturer creating a product could have gone overseas, does not
(28:26):
want to deliver overseas to create the product overseas. You
want to have it here. And basically you want to
also include the ability to have jobs and services created
right here and not export those either. So you know,
I think the truth of the matter is people need
to know the truth of the matter. And what you're
talking about right now is in real time. So in
(28:48):
real time, what you're saying that the tariffs in this
situation create, create equitable trade, create a fair trade. There
is no free trade as such. It's fair trade, you know.
And so you know, in the thirty forty seconds we
have left. So what's the best you know, homage that
you could give to the posts that the folks that
are listening to this right now? Here's the takeaway? And
(29:09):
all right, go ahead, here's your takeaway.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
Go well.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
The takeaway is US manufacturing really matters. It matters for
blue collar workers, it matters for our national security. So
we got to address these critical issues. It doesn't mean
it's not tough, and it doesn't mean like you know,
Trump can't tweak the policies. You know, he brought the
tariff down. I think that was a good move because
(29:34):
so much of US manufacturing has been outsourced, and this
probably should have happened twenty years ago, US correcting this imbalance.
But I think we need to rally around the President
on this important issue. How do we get manufacturing back
to the United States. How do we grow that job
based here. How do we, you know, get into electronics again.
(29:55):
We can't outsource everything to the world, so time to
bring some stuff back home. That's my plan. We're planning
to open up a new factory for that sole purpose.
So that's what I believe that, that's what my family
is supporting.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Well, that's an absolutely great attitude to have. Job creation
is amazingly important. The products that we're creating need to
be created right here. Used to be that unless they
were made in the USA, people didn't want to buy them,
particularly around the world. Our imprimature USA meant so much
more than just the words made in USA. It was
(30:32):
a recognition that it was a far superior product. And
I think that sense of pride in what we were
developing is so important to national security and well being. Listen,
we want to thank you so much. Jim congratulations on
electric mirror. You guys are doing a great job. Jim Mitchell,
thanks for being on Made in America. We're going to
be right back with Stan Greer and we're gonna be
(30:54):
talking about labor relation and the right to work states
and why that's so important. Welcome back to MAIDI in
America on the show. Right now, we have Stan Greer.
(31:14):
Stan is the senior research Associate for the National Institute
for Labor Relations Research, which is always very crucial and
very important, and we're going to be talking about a
topic that that's really near and dear to me into
MADI in America for many years, and that's right to work,
right to work laws, right to work states. And the
evidence is in is a piece that Stan wrote very recently.
(31:36):
Forcing workers to join unions destroys good paying jobs. In God,
We've had this conversation for so many years, the unfairness
of forcing somebody to pay dues to a union and
they don't want to be part of that union. You know,
how corrupt is that? That was a big That was
a big, big lawsuit out in California that got resolved
(31:57):
a number of years ago. So Stan greercome to Made
in America.
Speaker 7 (32:02):
Glad to be with you.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I'm gladd you're here. You know, Just let me just
cut to the chase on this. We have about eight
and a half minutes. Why is it so important for
people to understand the significance of right to work laws
and what that really means to the populations and the
business community of right to work states.
Speaker 7 (32:20):
Well as I think you were saying that the primary
benefit of right to work laws as far as we're concerned,
is that they protect the freedom of the individual to decide,
you know, which organizations they're going to financially support or
not support. That's the primary thing. But there's definitely also
(32:43):
plenty of evidence that right to work laws, which simply
protect the right of the individual employee to join the
union and financially support it or refuse to do either,
there's ample evidence that these laws facilitate the creation of
good bank jobs, especially in the manufacturing sector.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, if you look back over the
last decade or so, maybe fifteen years, there were been
a number of significant shifts of corporations that have come
here from overseas and be even within the United States
intra United States. And then the first one that comes
to mind, of course, which is really significant this week
considering all the planes that were just sold this week,
(33:29):
is Boeing. Boeing made a decision to leave Seattle, or
at least, you know, not just totally leave Seattle as
a misomer. But they opened up a major facility in
South Carolina, and that got challenged by the Obama administration.
Is that right? Did I get that right?
Speaker 7 (33:46):
Remember that I've been in this been in this business
for a long time, and yes, Boeing just decided to
expand production in South Carolina rather than in Washington State.
And the National Relations Board under the Obama administration said
(34:06):
that the company didn't have any right to do that.
That was that was violating the right to join the union.
And ultimately that efforts to illegal, to make illegal expansion
in a right to work state where the non right
to work state. It failed at least for the time being.
(34:26):
But that was an effort by the Abamba administration ten
fifteen years ago.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Yeah, which I thought was just astounding because it's so
obvious to me that they were in the bag for
the situation for the unions. But all right, all right,
all right, So ultimately they wound up they were there there.
But look at let's look at some of the other
companies that are there here. BMW is in the southeast,
you have Mercedes Benzes in the Southeast, you have Volkswagon,
(34:58):
which is another test case that was really a big
deal for a while in Tennessee. Let's talk about those.
I mean, it seems like that the industries wanted, particularly
the order of industries, wanted to be in a state
that had right your work laws. It seems that way
to me.
Speaker 7 (35:17):
Definitely. The bulk of the bulk of the auto manufacturing
that goes on in the United States nowadays goes on
and right to work states. And an important reason why
is that it's more union officials have both less of
an incentive to unionize workers in right to work states,
(35:39):
and it's it can be more difficult for them to
do so. They have less of an incentive because in
a right to work state, even if the union secures
exclusive bargaining power over the employees, the individual employee still
has the right not to pay money to the union.
So it's it's less of a financial boon for the
end to unitize the facility in the right to work
(36:00):
state than it is in a non right work state.
And it's also more difficult because in states with right
to work clause, employers are in a better position knowing
that the power over the workforce that the union can
(36:21):
acquire is always going to be somewhat limited. Employers are
more likely to explain to the employees why unionization isn't
necessarily in their interest and exercise the rights they have
in a federal law. But many employers don't exercise because
they're intimidated and they're worried about what's going to happen
(36:41):
to them the union if the workplace is unionized, and
what the union is going to do in retaliation for
the employer simply sharing with employees information about why unionization
might not be in their best interest.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Yeah, yeah, no, I totally agree. Listen, that was a
big hit to the unions because and it was a
big financial hit to the unions. They lost money, They
lost serious money as a result of that. I mean
to be able to say, well, I don't have to
give you money anymore. I don't watch should I That
was a big deal. It's not a simple, simple discussion.
It was a long term discussion with a lot of aggravation,
(37:18):
and we probably don't even know below the surface, the
things that were going on on those individual communities at
like around Chattanooga. Just an amazing situation. And that dragged
on for quite a few years, and I was glad
to see the way it kind of turned out, because
I thought that that was really good. I want to
go back to a discussion, you know, we know, for example,
when we discussed the auto industry, if you were to
(37:41):
say to somebody, why did why did Detroit go down?
Detroit in the fifties was one of the most successful,
most wealthy, paid middle class environments in the United States.
Great jobs, great corporations. Everything was cool, you know, everyone
was getting along the great, great opportunity for all the
things that go along with the education, help and so forth.
(38:03):
It was just wonderful. And then they all went to hell.
You know, the unions just I mean, my god, the
job bank that they had. People had to be paid
even though they weren't working. So the average cost per
hour was like what was it, Am I getting this wrong?
Or my own drug? Eighty dollars or seventy dollars an
hour to keep an employee going with all the benefits
and with all the job banking and so forth, It
(38:25):
just seemed to me that the particularly the auto industries
leaving Detroit and going into the Southeast and going too
the states that were right to work thrived and did
really well, and they made the comeback in those states
as a result of right to work versus those who
are in states that were in transient would not give
(38:47):
up the right to work and deify or you know,
vilified those states that were allowing right to work. Am
I getting that right?
Speaker 5 (38:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (38:57):
I mean, I think that the union officials that are
short sighted, I think pushed for work rules and really
disincentives to show up and do your job as well
as you can every day, you know, rules that encouraged absenteeism,
(39:20):
and I think they continue to do it even to
this day. Rules that prevent workers from being as productive
as they could be by sharply limiting the tasks that
they can do. Those are the key reasons why it
became so difficult for the Big three automakers, the unionized automakers,
(39:43):
to be competitive and produce cars at a profit in
the United States.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
So all right, So the bottom line is the premise
of your piece that you wrote, which is really good.
The premise is the evidence is in forcing workers to
join unions destroys good paying jobs. That's a fact.
Speaker 7 (40:05):
Clearly. As I note in the piece, over the most
recent ten year period for which data are available, twenty
fourteen to twenty twenty four, the states that had right
work loss of that entire decade had an aggregate gain
of manufacturing jobs in a little bit over ten percent,
whereas there was a net loss of manufacturing jobs in
the states that were non right to work for that
(40:28):
entire period. So it's a strong correlation. And there are
a number of scholarly analyzes, including a couple that I
refer to in the piece, that indicate it's not just
a correlation, that the presence of a right to work
law actually causes or encourages businesses to invest in manufacturing
(40:50):
employment and right to work states.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Absolutely absolutely listen. Thank you so much. We're delighted, Stan Grier,
thank you so much for being here on Made in America,
your research associates for the National Institute for Labor Relations Research. Stan,
thank you so much. Get you back really serious, Well,
this has been an absolutely fun show to do. I
have to tell you that the topics that we had
today in terms of right to work I am so
(41:14):
passionate about right to work states. Anyone who's listened to
me and my partner for that matter, myself and my
partner over the years, Neil Asberry is my buddy and
best friend for so many years on doing our show
that we have so embraced and supported, particularly when the
big fight was occurring in Chattanooga, Tennessee at the BW plant,
we were so positive, we were so invited to support
(41:39):
the men and women that were trying to not have
right to work taken away from them because we knew
that US manufacturing thrives does better. Endure's great benefit to
the states, the communities, the individual families, and the future
for those states and those families in a free environment
(42:00):
that versus a union controlled environment. It's just it's just remarkable.
And I think the conversation we had today is very
very important. Tariffs. We talked about tariffs with our guests today,
very very important topic. You're not going to be done
talking about it. We're going to talk about it for
a long time to come. As we cycle through the
(42:22):
initial terrorists that mister Trump on Independence Day, so to speak,
laid out there for everybody, but they're changing and they're
changing almost daily, so it's actually it's kind of exciting
to watch where this is all going because I think,
as was pointed out by our guest, you know, Jim Mitchell,
he's talking about electric mirror and Stan Greer was talking
about it as well, that you know, we have an
(42:43):
opportunity to eneure a great benefit and the tariffs are not,
as you know, violate as many of those folks are
thinking out there. So I think you have to take
a deep breath, watch all this stuff, step back a
little bit. Let the craze go crazy, let Main Street
react to it, Let Wall Street react to it, which
(43:04):
it did, and it has. And we're gonna, you know,
we're gonna hear more from Charles Pain about that. But
I'm excited for everyone out there. These are very exciting times.
You must admit that. So the idea that we're gonna
be identifying ways to improve manufacturing here in the United
States and produce another golden age for America, which I
(43:29):
thoroughly agree. I agree with Cudler, I agree with Art Laugher,
I agree with Steve Moore, I agree with Gordon Chang,
I agree with all our dear friends over the years
that we've had on the show for a many times.
We're in a good place and we're going in the
right direction, so I wish you all well. We'll see
you next week. I'm made in America, looking forward to
seeing you. I heard that right, seeing you again next week.
(43:50):
Take care,
This is Made in America with Rich Rothman.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Welcome to Made in America. Great stuff. Today we're talking tariffs.
We're gonna have some really good people on the show
today and we've come to tariff. We've got Gene Marx,
the founder of the Mark Scoop, is gonna be talking
about tariffs. He's a consultant for a small business. Jim
Mitchell owns a family owned company Electric Mirror, started in
a garage and is worth a fortune now making electric
(00:34):
mirrors that you've probably seen him in a lot of
the hotel rooms that you're in. Stan Greer is going
to be on the show senior research associate for the
National Institute for Labor Relations Research. And we're gonna be
talking about right to work, which is something you know
that I'm very very passionate about. And right now we're
going to talk about what mister Trump, our president, has
done this week in the Mideast. I would say we
(00:59):
have seen an amazing week for America. You know, you
talk about made in America. You saw made in America
America first, absolutely, first and foremost throughout the midies of
all places, you know, with all places first and foremost
made in America and America first throughout the midies. That's
just unbelievable. It's sort of like, you know, President Trump
(01:22):
has a very unusual concept, and that is if something's
not working, sort of like the Abraham Accords. When he
was working on that and you know number forty five,
he changed the concept. He said, well, listen, the two
state solution is not going to work. It's not happening
right now. Let's move on. We'll just cut these other
guys out for the time being. We're going to find
(01:42):
some commonality in the Mid East with countries that want
to work together and see that doing business is actually
a better thing to do. You know, having relationships business
wise is a better thing to do than it is
to be fighting and arguing and blowing each other up
and making demands that are foolish that you're just never
going to get. And because of that, you know, nothing
(02:04):
ever happens. So what did he do this week? He
goes into the Mideast and he cuts like trillion dollars
worth of deals, you know, with Saudi Arabia, cutter and
the United Arab Memerre. Just just unbelievable. You know, the
new White House announced six hundred billion dollar investment commitment
from Saudi Arabia, including one hundred and forty two billion
(02:25):
defense partnerships, twenty billion for you know, artificial intelligence data
centers two billion, and Saudi infrastructure projects for American firms.
Elon Musk announced the deal for Starlink twenty billion dollars
for AI. Cutter did an amazing deal, ordered one point
two trillion worth of business ninety six billion dollars worth
(02:47):
of Boeing jets. If I got to say, who is
the biggest winner of this week, well, first of all
the biggest winners of America, it's US. But Boeing just walked.
I mean, the largest jet order in the history of
jet orders. You know, one hundred and eighty jets Boeing jets,
seven eighty seven jets being built by Boeing being bought
(03:07):
by Cutter forty two billion, and just unbelievable forty two
billion of weapons acquisitions, three billion in advanced events technologies.
The UAE, my God, committed to a ten year, one
point fourty million dollar investment in the US, with over
two hundred billion of new deals announced during the trip.
This includes fourteen and a half billion commitment from their
(03:28):
airways for Boeing aircraft. I mean, there you go again,
Boeing for an AI center also in Abu Dhabi, and
it goes on from there, just goes on from there.
And what is what is the Democrat's response to this?
Listen to this. I want to Phil, I want you
to get this up. Number three, Representative Swallwell an absolute
(03:49):
genius moron from California. And I'm sorry, I'm going to
call a moron a moron. I think it's only fair
that we call a moron a moron, because I think
it helps cure the moron. If you know you're a moron,
you may think twice about what you're saying. This is
what this moron says about all these deals that are
coming through that are job creations right here in the
United States. Let's play that soundbag.
Speaker 3 (04:10):
Let's bring a Democratic Congressman Eric Swalloll of California. He's
a member of the Householdland Security Committee and teer with
us at the table. David Corn he's the Washington bureau
chief for Mother Jones and an MSNBC political congressman. I
want to start with Eugene's implicit question there, what do
you think Donald Trump was giving up or exchanging in
these negotiations.
Speaker 4 (04:32):
It's a me me me presidency that he's running. And
as I look at you this trip and what he's
getting out of it, I see how he benefits. I
don't see how americans at home are going to benefit.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
That's unbelievable. I mean, that sums it all up. I
don't see how America will benefit and how Americans will
benefit in terms of manufacturing. So, in other words, creating
almost two hundred and two hundred and fifty planes at
Boeing really does nothing for America because, after all, and
it doesn't do any jobs, does it. Well, you know what.
(05:09):
That's what we're talking about today on this show. We're
talking about the naivete of people who are trying to
control the government or did try to control the government,
and where we're really going right now and the significance
of what this president has done, and I got to
tell you it's nothing less than remarkable. We're going to
be right back on Made in America with Gene Marx,
Great Insight, don't go anywhere. Okay, welcome back. We are
(05:46):
delighted to have you here today. You know, we're having
a very very interesting conversation at least we're about to,
and it's talking about the tariffs. And there is so
much emotionality when it comes to the tariffs. I mean,
I have seen people have meltdowns. I have seen people,
you know, completely lose it with arguments with some of
their best friends, you know. And I'm down in Miami,
(06:09):
and you know, Miami is very trade, very international, pan
hemispheric trade conference oriented, and you know, we understand a
lot about terrorists, we understand about trade. We understand about
certain things that we're going to learn about today in
free zones and manufacturing and you know, near shoring and
all the things that we can do to make life
(06:29):
better in terms of you know, creating business. You know,
two way trade. The two way trade is very important.
It's it's great for us down here, it's really important
in Latin America. And we'll go into a great detail
on that, Okay, on the show. Right now on the
phone is Gene Marx. Jean's the founder of the Marx Group,
a small business consulting firm, which is really important because
(06:52):
we all know that the backbone of the United States
in terms of job creation are the SMEs, a small
to mid sized companies. So Gene, welcome the Maid in America.
Speaker 5 (07:02):
Thank you, Rich. I'm about to be honest, Well the
light did you hear?
Speaker 2 (07:05):
You know? This is a really important topic. It's important,
I think, Jane, for a couple of reasons. One of
the most obvious people don't know what the hell is
going on with tariffs? Am I going to be paying more?
Am I going to be paying less? I'm not going
to have, you know, all the supplies that I need.
You know, some there are reports out there the thirty
five percent few containers are going through the Port of
Los Angeles. I don't know if that's real. I got
(07:26):
to tell you that I gotta think twice about that
before I get involved in it. You know what I mean.
But it is a very emotional topic, Jane, So welcome
to maide in America. So okay, top of mind, what happens?
What's going on here?
Speaker 5 (07:40):
Yeah? I mean, first of all, thank you, you know,
for laying it out in that way. And just so
everybody understands. I mean, you know, I run a consulting firm.
I write every week for The Guardian and The Hill
and Forbes and a bunch of other places, and I'm
a certified public accountant, and you would believe that if
this is a TV show not already shows, you could
(08:00):
take a look at my face. So just so you
know that's my background. You know, everybody's everybody's ringing their
hands and screaming and yelling up and down about you know,
tariffs and all that. But I gotta say some members
my best clients, when any of these issues come up, political, social,
you know whatever, they put that stuff aside and they're like, Okay,
what are we going to do to navigate our way
(08:20):
around this challenge? Okay, let's think with the clear mind
and what do we do? And that's what I think
you and I should talk about, is that. But putting
aside all the emotions about tariffs. If you're running a
small business, because that's why I cover, how do you
mitigate these costs? So I have a bunch of things
that I'd like to recommend to your listeners to navigate
your way around tariffs. You you touched on one briefly,
(08:44):
which is free trade zones and bonded warehouses. So if
you're not aware of this, there are hundreds of free
trade zones and bonded warehouses all around the country. A
bonded warehouse and a free trade zone if you reach
out to them, and you can google and find a
free trade zone or a bonded warehouse in your area.
When you receive goods in from overseas into a bonded
(09:08):
warehouse or a free trade zone, you pay no tariff
on that good. The only time that you pay the
tariffs is when you take the goods out of the
warehouse and use them. So perfect case in point. We
know that we are in a suspended state right now
with China, and you know, I am not optimistic that
(09:29):
we're going to resolve this anytime soon with China because
there's a lot of other issues that go well beyond
just you know, tariffs. But regardless, while the tariffs are suspended,
I have a bunch of clients and really smart readers
and people running businesses that are are buying up products,
bringing them into the free you know now and putting
them there, and then they're they're leveraging and they're hoping
(09:52):
on the fact that the tariffs that are existing right
now with China, Europe, you know, Canada, whatever, if they
go down, then when you pull the items out of
the warehouse, then you will pay less of a tariff,
so it's a hedge against teriffs. We're hoping for these
negotiations to come forward, So that's what people will be doing.
(10:12):
If the tariffs spike back up again, if there is
no resolution and they're high, you can still buy these products,
put them into a bonded warehouse, sit on them for
a while, and wait for things to get resolved. In addition,
if you do any kind of assembly or manufacturing of
those products in a bonded warehouse, when you pull them
out of the warehouse, there will be even less tariffs
(10:33):
to pay. And finally, you mentioned that you're in the
Miami area. You know there's a lot of international trade
that goes on from the Miami area. If you buy
products and then turn around and sell them internationally without
doing anything, bring them into a bonded warehouse, and then
turn around and sell them out of the bonded warehouse,
you will pay no tariff at all. You just avoid
(10:55):
the entire headache.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
So yeah, you know, just let me just hang on
there for a second. Let me just let me just
jump in for a second. Because I've been involved in
international trade down here since the eighties. A member of
the board of the World Trade Center Association, Vice Chair
Pasture of the World Trade Center Association. So I understand
(11:17):
you're very very correct. I think it's very important for
people to understand this a free trade zone. You know,
people think, wow, there's a big fence around it. In
some cases there are, but you know, they store things
there and they bring it in, and you know, it's
it's not really being in the United States. But what
people don't really understand, the neophytes, those who are getting involved,
(11:37):
that it is also a manu and you touched on it.
It's a manufacturing area. Now what does that mean. That
means that parts of a fully assembled product will be
brought in as parts before it's a fully assembled product.
It could be you know, materie l it could be
you know, it could be a a rare earth material,
(12:03):
it could be whatever it is to make the ultimate
widget that you're putting together. And it's taxed differently, and
in some cases it's not taxed at all. So a
free zone is not exactly you know, people think, well,
it's it's it's a warehouse, which it is. It's a
manufacturing area, Well it is, and and it's also a
combination of the two where you can store things, uh,
(12:26):
and you can you know, and have displays, because in
some cases you can have displays in a free free environment,
and there are a lot of them here. Miami has
a ton and they're proliferating throughout the Americas. It's very,
very important to understand free trade zones because you cannot
have on shoring, near shoring, or you know, increase supply trade,
(12:50):
you know, the ability to have products come in on
a timely basis without having free zones in the ability
to do this. So I want to go back for
a second. This has verse for a sec Let's talk
about products that are manufactured in a free zone. So
there's employment going on there, they are manufacturing products. What
happens with the materiel that comes in before it's the
(13:13):
finished product? How is that tax or is it a text?
Speaker 5 (13:17):
Well, it's first of all, it depends on the material
and where it's coming from, obviously, because it's you know,
steel and aluminum or tariff differently than non steel on aluminum.
But there's there are specific tariffs on that which are
still in place, by the way, or if it comes
from Europe or if it comes from Asia or specific
countries bottom line is, though, is that there's no tariffs
when you receive it. So if you're buying it today
(13:40):
it's coming in, you're not paying a tariff when it
comes into a free trade zone warehouse or body warehouse.
You're only going to calculate and pay the tariff when
it leaves the warehouse. That might be three months from now,
in the teriff rates might be lower, or like you
just said, you might have done some manufacturing with those
materials and because they were part of a finished product
from that tariff calculation would be even different. So again
(14:03):
there's there's nothing when you bring it into the free
trade zone. You're not doing tariffs yet until you actually
pull it out of that warehouse. And like I said earlier,
that's why a lot of my clients and readers and
smart business owners are they're they're hedging, you know, they're
they're bringing them in and letting it there. One of
the things Richie mentioned about the there is a cost. Obviously,
there's a warehousing fee to bring to bring it in there.
(14:23):
And if you're buying products in bulk, you're you know,
you are financing that in some cases with working capital
and you know, interest rates are not exactly low right now.
So there are costs that you have to take into consideration.
But like any good business person, do the math and
figure out what makes more sense incurring those costs with
lower tariffs or paying the higher tariff. Just you know,
right off the bat, that's that's the bond of warehouse
(14:46):
you mentioned. I didn't know this. You were on the
board of directions for the World Trade Center Association. Yeah, eight,
tell me, okay, So I talk about I've written about
the World Trade Center Association a number of times as
another way to mitigate the impact of tariffs because you
can join and a member, or you don't have to
(15:06):
be a member. It depends on the relationship you have.
But the World Trade Center Association. I interview twenty companies
in Philly and Chicago that use the World Trade Center
Association to help them find alternate suppliers of materials from
more terrorf friendly countries. So they're relying on stuff coming
from China. They went to the World Trade Center Association.
(15:27):
As you know, they have an extensive database of companies
they're supplying stuff all around the world, and they found
other suppliers from other parts of the world with lower tariffs.
And the World Trade Center made introductions for these people
and in a couple of cases they literally went down
with these companies with the executives to make you know,
face to face introductions as well. I've found out that,
(15:49):
you know, they seem like a great organization and a
great way when you're trying to, you know, figure out
if you can find alternate suppliers around the world. They're
a great resource to go to. And I didn't realize
you you were on the board there, and so good
for you because they're really good. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
Yeah, guy Tis only when he was alive and he
was the founder. He was running the New York New
Jersey Port Authority, so you know he's a tough guy.
Was a tough guy. Oh yeah, really tough. He sounded
just like George Burns, by the way, he did the
best George Burns, except that was actually him when he
was talking. But no, the World Trade Center, the concept
of a World Trade Center is that to increase an
(16:26):
aid and abet trade. And what does trade do well?
Trade liberates trade, you know, insulates from you know, despotic situations.
If you look at Latin America in the proliferation of
trade in the in the late eighties going into the
early nineties. And that is as a result that we
saw that all the privatizations that were going into Latin
(16:49):
America at the time, so they were actually rebuilding the
infrastructure in Latin America and sort of like hydro electric
and Brazil or bells out A T and T went
into Latin America and completely revamped the communication systems and
actually for a while, Latin America have one of the
most advanced Wi Fi systems. I mean they had three
(17:11):
G when you know, when it was really hot to
have three G and now we're five G. But they
had it before the United States. Why was that because
everything was so corrupt in the certain certain and product
and I mean the people that was corrupt too to
a great degree, but in terms of the product base,
the network that they had, there was no point wiring
(17:31):
Latin America when the technology was already two decades ahead
of that, so you don't need to do that. The
reaction that people are having, some people are saying, well,
oh my god, and this is where this is where
Wall Street went, Main Street went, is that well, you know, products,
we're gonna have one hundred percent tires, they're gonna have
eighty percent teraires. We're gonna have one hundred and forty
five percent taires. Oh my god, it's out of control.
(17:54):
Product's gonna get more expensive. Things aren't gonna be ship
We're not gonna be able to afford anything. And on
the other hand, you have people who are are contemplative.
They think about it and they say, well, I'm not
so sure about that. I may want to keep mind.
You allude to this in your piece that's really really,
really really well done, and I'm very happy reading it.
But keeping your pricing and not losing it, not completely
(18:19):
losing your mind over it may be a smarter, better
way to go because you keep your base. And I
think it's very important to keep your client base because
that keeps your company. Can you react to that from Gene.
Speaker 5 (18:30):
Yeah, I can, and I can tell you again it
counts back to what I've learned from my smartest clients.
You don't have a knee jerk reaction to tariffs like
you just said. You know, you don't get emotional about them.
You know, my smartest clients are the own which they are.
They're looking at their customers and if there has to
be price increases, they're looking on it. They're not just
(18:51):
applying them across the board. They're doing reports of profits
and margins by customer, and they are targeting their price increases.
They might have one customer that's like, you know, these
guys are great. We've been selling them for years. We're
making plenty of money off them, and they've been they're
pay their bills on time. We're really not going to
give them any price increases. We're all good here. They
might have another customer. This guy's a pain in the neck.
(19:13):
He's always giving us a problem. He doesn't pay his bills.
He's going to get the biggest price increase. So it's
not a it's not an emotional decision. It is. It
is analytical. And again I can only tell you what
my best clients are doing, and they are looking at
this analytically and saying, if we do have to increase
prices and we can't absorb these tariffs from a cost perspective,
(19:34):
how do we apply them on a targeted basis so
that we can still make up the difference and still
keep our customers happy.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
Okay, so we're going to take a break right now,
make the money for our affiliates. We're going to be
right back with Jim Mitchell, who's going to be talking
about Electric Mirror Company, And we're going to talk to
Stanley Greer, who's really going to have a good conversation
on right to work. Stay. It's really important, don't.
Speaker 1 (19:55):
Go anywhere promoting American industry. This is made in America.
(20:20):
With Rich Rothman.
Speaker 2 (20:21):
Welcome back to Meadia in America. We're having a very
very emotional and exciting conversation today about tariffs. You know,
we've been following this now for weeks. People have accused
our president of not knowing what he's doing, that you know,
he's doing things are going to benefit himself. I mean,
the emotionality and the whole thing has been farther left,
(20:41):
farther age been absolutely crazy, cats and dogs sleeping together,
a Ghostbusters movie all over the place. But the truth
of the matter is, let's talk to the people who
actually run some of these companies. And in the United States.
We know, particularly with our last guest that we just
had on gene Marx, you know, the small to mid
sized companies are really the backbone of the job creators
(21:04):
of the United States. They are we know that, you know,
we lose those we're in big trouble. So we have
a really good guest on right now, Jim Mitchell. Jim
Mitchell is the CEO of Electric Mirror. Electric Mirror. Now
I want to ask Jim, Jim, welcome to MAID in America.
By the way, thank you for being here.
Speaker 6 (21:22):
My pleasure. Thank you.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
No.
Speaker 2 (21:24):
I love talking to owners of small corporations. I presume
you fit into that. I mean, you're five hundred or
less employees? Is that? Am I getting that right?
Speaker 5 (21:33):
Or that? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (21:36):
Yeah? Yeah, okay, well so am I I've been I've
owned a lot of different corporations. I think the largest
I had was one hundred and thirty five employees. Now
we have about twenty six. And it's very important and
he's a great responsibility. I take it. You know, I'm
the guy that gets up down here. We're in Florida,
in South Florida, Miami. I'm the one that's up at
(21:57):
three o'clock in the morning walking around my pool figuring
it out. You know, where it's going to go and
how we're going to survive the next week. But let's
talk about that for a second. How did you know
you go? You went from a garage environment, which sort
of like, you know, we had that down here with Alienware.
These two young kids started what was called Alienware computers
that were designed solely for gaming, and they grew that
(22:19):
into a three hundred million dollar business. Kids in a garage,
three hundred million dollar business down here Amazon started small
and what looked where they are today. Talk to us
a little bit about how you made that leap from
you know, being in the garage. It took eight years
to really make it come together. You know, what was
the moment of epiphany, what what worked best for you?
And let's go well back into that.
Speaker 6 (22:42):
Yeah, I mean it was a long process. We started
by making mirrors that didn't fog up, which was a
difficult value proposition with just the market wasn't big enough
and pretty much we spent all of our money. And
then a client reached out to us and said, you know,
we want to mirror that lights up, and we decided, okay, great,
(23:04):
we'll make that for them. So we were still in
the garage at the time, and we the family got
together and we started designing it, and the customers like,
this is great. You know, I'll order three hundred of them,
and so we our initial project, you know, was three
hundred of these, and unfortunately every single one was damaged
and shipping. But we you know, stood behind our product
(23:26):
and went and fixed everyone. And by the time I
got done fixing them all, I thought, this is a
great concept. Let's push it everywhere. And that's what we did,
and within a couple of years, I just caught on
and it became latimers became a standard in hotels around
the world, and we've exported to more than one hundred countries.
And then we developed a mirror TV technology. I have
(23:48):
a really unique perspective because I'm a patent attorney as well,
and so all these things kind of come together technology,
you know, protecting IP, but really it was responding into
customers' needs and doing something we've never done before. And
I would say our company is always in startup mode.
We're always looking at new technology to roll out.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
That's right, and that's and that you know, always reinventing
and remarketing and repackaging and making things more exciting is
what really makes the business work really really well. Let
me ask you a question, because I'm sure you were,
you know, really hot on this one, and that's the tariffs.
You know what what in terms of the significant hit
that you could have taken with terriffs. How did you
(24:33):
mitigate that? And you may have made it a really
important decision as a results of the terriffs that benefits
a lot of people right here in the United States.
Speaker 3 (24:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (24:43):
You know, the reason why I started talking about this
issue is because, to your point, most people aren't familiar
with manufacturing. A lot of these are small companies. You know,
we have a few hundred employees. I think some people
may consider that big, but it's not big time, and
people don't really realize. I think the struggle US manufacturers
(25:05):
have had, especially with China, and I have to go
back to the first Trump presidency where Trump, you know,
basically imposed a twenty five percent tariff. I would say,
but for that tariff, our US factory.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Would not be around.
Speaker 6 (25:21):
Like that was a critical moment in our history, and
I think for other smaller manufacturers to begin to look into,
you know, what's going on with trade. We talked about
free trade. I'm totally for free trade, but there's not
it's not free trade. And by that I mean you
have products that are being subsidized, industries being subsidized in China.
(25:47):
Those products are coming over flooding into the US market
at extremely low prices because they're being backed by our
government through different policies. And so what happens, what happened
to us, to so many companies, is to compete, you
end up having to outsource your stuff to China, and
so it just becomes this revolving cycle. The next thing,
(26:09):
you know, none of your products are made in the
United States. Now we took we kind of drew a
line in the fans said no, we're gonna hang on
to our US factory. We're gonna do everything possible to
keep us building products in the United States. But it's been,
you know, a huge struggle. So when I look at
at Trump talking about tariffs and in particular with China, yeah,
(26:33):
he's been aggressive. I mean it's been in the last
couple of months, have been quite exciting, as you can imagine.
But I really felt like this is an important time
in our country's history like this. The trade imbalance isn't
because Americans can't build great products. The trade imbalance is
because of really unfair trade policies going on. And so
(26:55):
those that's you know, employment practices, it's what I call
all the dumping of product in order to take over
our market. It's the subsidies by Chinese for manufacturing. Most
people don't know there's actually two manufacturing bases in China,
one that only does export and one that does China domestic.
(27:17):
Isn't that strange that there's manufacturers that aren't allowed to
sell their products into the domestic Chinese market. They can
only export those products. So I just think most Americans
aren't aware that there's real reasons why so many things
have shifted overseas, and a lot of it has to
do with policies. One other point, I looked at the
(27:42):
top ten economies in the world in our product category.
Nine of ten all had substantially higher tariffs and duties
than the United States had on the same products. So
I'm going back, we want free trade. That is not
free trade, so Trump has to negotiate with these countries.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
Well, that's exactly but that's exactly correct. The problem is
most people look at a very superficial, thin layer veneer
of what tariffs really are and what they mean, and
then they go with the emotionality of what the media
is throwing out there, so they really don't know the
truth of what's going on. So here, you are a
manufacturer creating a product could have gone overseas, does not
(28:26):
want to deliver overseas to create the product overseas. You
want to have it here. And basically you want to
also include the ability to have jobs and services created
right here and not export those either. So you know,
I think the truth of the matter is people need
to know the truth of the matter. And what you're
talking about right now is in real time. So in
(28:48):
real time, what you're saying that the tariffs in this
situation create, create equitable trade, create a fair trade. There
is no free trade as such. It's fair trade, you know.
And so you know, in the thirty forty seconds we
have left. So what's the best you know, homage that
you could give to the posts that the folks that
are listening to this right now? Here's the takeaway? And
(29:09):
all right, go ahead, here's your takeaway.
Speaker 5 (29:11):
Go well.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
The takeaway is US manufacturing really matters. It matters for
blue collar workers, it matters for our national security. So
we got to address these critical issues. It doesn't mean
it's not tough, and it doesn't mean like you know,
Trump can't tweak the policies. You know, he brought the
tariff down. I think that was a good move because
(29:34):
so much of US manufacturing has been outsourced, and this
probably should have happened twenty years ago, US correcting this imbalance.
But I think we need to rally around the President
on this important issue. How do we get manufacturing back
to the United States. How do we grow that job
based here. How do we, you know, get into electronics again.
(29:55):
We can't outsource everything to the world, so time to
bring some stuff back home. That's my plan. We're planning
to open up a new factory for that sole purpose.
So that's what I believe that, that's what my family
is supporting.
Speaker 2 (30:09):
Well, that's an absolutely great attitude to have. Job creation
is amazingly important. The products that we're creating need to
be created right here. Used to be that unless they
were made in the USA, people didn't want to buy them,
particularly around the world. Our imprimature USA meant so much
more than just the words made in USA. It was
(30:32):
a recognition that it was a far superior product. And
I think that sense of pride in what we were
developing is so important to national security and well being. Listen,
we want to thank you so much. Jim congratulations on
electric mirror. You guys are doing a great job. Jim Mitchell,
thanks for being on Made in America. We're going to
be right back with Stan Greer and we're gonna be
(30:54):
talking about labor relation and the right to work states
and why that's so important. Welcome back to MAIDI in
America on the show. Right now, we have Stan Greer.
(31:14):
Stan is the senior research Associate for the National Institute
for Labor Relations Research, which is always very crucial and
very important, and we're going to be talking about a
topic that that's really near and dear to me into
MADI in America for many years, and that's right to work,
right to work laws, right to work states. And the
evidence is in is a piece that Stan wrote very recently.
(31:36):
Forcing workers to join unions destroys good paying jobs. In God,
We've had this conversation for so many years, the unfairness
of forcing somebody to pay dues to a union and
they don't want to be part of that union. You know,
how corrupt is that? That was a big That was
a big, big lawsuit out in California that got resolved
(31:57):
a number of years ago. So Stan greercome to Made
in America.
Speaker 7 (32:02):
Glad to be with you.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
I'm gladd you're here. You know, Just let me just
cut to the chase on this. We have about eight
and a half minutes. Why is it so important for
people to understand the significance of right to work laws
and what that really means to the populations and the
business community of right to work states.
Speaker 7 (32:20):
Well as I think you were saying that the primary
benefit of right to work laws as far as we're concerned,
is that they protect the freedom of the individual to decide,
you know, which organizations they're going to financially support or
not support. That's the primary thing. But there's definitely also
(32:43):
plenty of evidence that right to work laws, which simply
protect the right of the individual employee to join the
union and financially support it or refuse to do either,
there's ample evidence that these laws facilitate the creation of
good bank jobs, especially in the manufacturing sector.
Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, if you look back over the
last decade or so, maybe fifteen years, there were been
a number of significant shifts of corporations that have come
here from overseas and be even within the United States
intra United States. And then the first one that comes
to mind, of course, which is really significant this week
considering all the planes that were just sold this week,
(33:29):
is Boeing. Boeing made a decision to leave Seattle, or
at least, you know, not just totally leave Seattle as
a misomer. But they opened up a major facility in
South Carolina, and that got challenged by the Obama administration.
Is that right? Did I get that right?
Speaker 7 (33:46):
Remember that I've been in this been in this business
for a long time, and yes, Boeing just decided to
expand production in South Carolina rather than in Washington State.
And the National Relations Board under the Obama administration said
(34:06):
that the company didn't have any right to do that.
That was that was violating the right to join the union.
And ultimately that efforts to illegal, to make illegal expansion
in a right to work state where the non right
to work state. It failed at least for the time being.
(34:26):
But that was an effort by the Abamba administration ten
fifteen years ago.
Speaker 2 (34:33):
Yeah, which I thought was just astounding because it's so
obvious to me that they were in the bag for
the situation for the unions. But all right, all right,
all right, So ultimately they wound up they were there there.
But look at let's look at some of the other
companies that are there here. BMW is in the southeast,
you have Mercedes Benzes in the Southeast, you have Volkswagon,
(34:58):
which is another test case that was really a big
deal for a while in Tennessee. Let's talk about those.
I mean, it seems like that the industries wanted, particularly
the order of industries, wanted to be in a state
that had right your work laws. It seems that way
to me.
Speaker 7 (35:17):
Definitely. The bulk of the bulk of the auto manufacturing
that goes on in the United States nowadays goes on
and right to work states. And an important reason why
is that it's more union officials have both less of
an incentive to unionize workers in right to work states,
(35:39):
and it's it can be more difficult for them to
do so. They have less of an incentive because in
a right to work state, even if the union secures
exclusive bargaining power over the employees, the individual employee still
has the right not to pay money to the union.
So it's it's less of a financial boon for the
end to unitize the facility in the right to work
(36:00):
state than it is in a non right work state.
And it's also more difficult because in states with right
to work clause, employers are in a better position knowing
that the power over the workforce that the union can
(36:21):
acquire is always going to be somewhat limited. Employers are
more likely to explain to the employees why unionization isn't
necessarily in their interest and exercise the rights they have
in a federal law. But many employers don't exercise because
they're intimidated and they're worried about what's going to happen
(36:41):
to them the union if the workplace is unionized, and
what the union is going to do in retaliation for
the employer simply sharing with employees information about why unionization
might not be in their best interest.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Yeah, yeah, no, I totally agree. Listen, that was a
big hit to the unions because and it was a
big financial hit to the unions. They lost money, They
lost serious money as a result of that. I mean
to be able to say, well, I don't have to
give you money anymore. I don't watch should I That
was a big deal. It's not a simple, simple discussion.
It was a long term discussion with a lot of aggravation,
(37:18):
and we probably don't even know below the surface, the
things that were going on on those individual communities at
like around Chattanooga. Just an amazing situation. And that dragged
on for quite a few years, and I was glad
to see the way it kind of turned out, because
I thought that that was really good. I want to
go back to a discussion, you know, we know, for example,
when we discussed the auto industry, if you were to
(37:41):
say to somebody, why did why did Detroit go down?
Detroit in the fifties was one of the most successful,
most wealthy, paid middle class environments in the United States.
Great jobs, great corporations. Everything was cool, you know, everyone
was getting along the great, great opportunity for all the
things that go along with the education, help and so forth.
(38:03):
It was just wonderful. And then they all went to hell.
You know, the unions just I mean, my god, the
job bank that they had. People had to be paid
even though they weren't working. So the average cost per
hour was like what was it, Am I getting this wrong?
Or my own drug? Eighty dollars or seventy dollars an
hour to keep an employee going with all the benefits
and with all the job banking and so forth, It
(38:25):
just seemed to me that the particularly the auto industries
leaving Detroit and going into the Southeast and going too
the states that were right to work thrived and did
really well, and they made the comeback in those states
as a result of right to work versus those who
are in states that were in transient would not give
(38:47):
up the right to work and deify or you know,
vilified those states that were allowing right to work. Am
I getting that right?
Speaker 5 (38:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 7 (38:57):
I mean, I think that the union officials that are
short sighted, I think pushed for work rules and really
disincentives to show up and do your job as well
as you can every day, you know, rules that encouraged absenteeism,
(39:20):
and I think they continue to do it even to
this day. Rules that prevent workers from being as productive
as they could be by sharply limiting the tasks that
they can do. Those are the key reasons why it
became so difficult for the Big three automakers, the unionized automakers,
(39:43):
to be competitive and produce cars at a profit in
the United States.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
So all right, So the bottom line is the premise
of your piece that you wrote, which is really good.
The premise is the evidence is in forcing workers to
join unions destroys good paying jobs. That's a fact.
Speaker 7 (40:05):
Clearly. As I note in the piece, over the most
recent ten year period for which data are available, twenty
fourteen to twenty twenty four, the states that had right
work loss of that entire decade had an aggregate gain
of manufacturing jobs in a little bit over ten percent,
whereas there was a net loss of manufacturing jobs in
the states that were non right to work for that
(40:28):
entire period. So it's a strong correlation. And there are
a number of scholarly analyzes, including a couple that I
refer to in the piece, that indicate it's not just
a correlation, that the presence of a right to work
law actually causes or encourages businesses to invest in manufacturing
(40:50):
employment and right to work states.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
Absolutely absolutely listen. Thank you so much. We're delighted, Stan Grier,
thank you so much for being here on Made in America,
your research associates for the National Institute for Labor Relations Research. Stan,
thank you so much. Get you back really serious, Well,
this has been an absolutely fun show to do. I
have to tell you that the topics that we had
today in terms of right to work I am so
(41:14):
passionate about right to work states. Anyone who's listened to
me and my partner for that matter, myself and my
partner over the years, Neil Asberry is my buddy and
best friend for so many years on doing our show
that we have so embraced and supported, particularly when the
big fight was occurring in Chattanooga, Tennessee at the BW plant,
we were so positive, we were so invited to support
(41:39):
the men and women that were trying to not have
right to work taken away from them because we knew
that US manufacturing thrives does better. Endure's great benefit to
the states, the communities, the individual families, and the future
for those states and those families in a free environment
(42:00):
that versus a union controlled environment. It's just it's just remarkable.
And I think the conversation we had today is very
very important. Tariffs. We talked about tariffs with our guests today,
very very important topic. You're not going to be done
talking about it. We're going to talk about it for
a long time to come. As we cycle through the
(42:22):
initial terrorists that mister Trump on Independence Day, so to speak,
laid out there for everybody, but they're changing and they're
changing almost daily, so it's actually it's kind of exciting
to watch where this is all going because I think,
as was pointed out by our guest, you know, Jim Mitchell,
he's talking about electric mirror and Stan Greer was talking
about it as well, that you know, we have an
(42:43):
opportunity to eneure a great benefit and the tariffs are not,
as you know, violate as many of those folks are
thinking out there. So I think you have to take
a deep breath, watch all this stuff, step back a
little bit. Let the craze go crazy, let Main Street
react to it, Let Wall Street react to it, which
(43:04):
it did, and it has. And we're gonna, you know,
we're gonna hear more from Charles Pain about that. But
I'm excited for everyone out there. These are very exciting times.
You must admit that. So the idea that we're gonna
be identifying ways to improve manufacturing here in the United
States and produce another golden age for America, which I
(43:29):
thoroughly agree. I agree with Cudler, I agree with Art Laugher,
I agree with Steve Moore, I agree with Gordon Chang,
I agree with all our dear friends over the years
that we've had on the show for a many times.
We're in a good place and we're going in the
right direction, so I wish you all well. We'll see
you next week. I'm made in America, looking forward to
seeing you. I heard that right, seeing you again next week.
(43:50):
Take care,
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