August 3, 2025 • 32 mins
In Part 2 of this special tribute episode with Dave Lindell and Mike Yee, we honor the life, leadership, and legacy of Dr. Ron Stewart a visionary physician, the former City of Pittsburgh EMS Medical Director, and a true pioneer in emergency medical services.
Dr. Stewart helped shape EMS as we know it, bringing medical oversight, high training standards, and compassion to the field. He mentored generations of paramedics and physicians and laid the foundation for the modern EMS model.
https://www.spreaker.com/episode/episode-303-dr-stewart-tribute-part-2-dave-lindell-and-mike-yee--67238814
Dr. Stewart helped shape EMS as we know it, bringing medical oversight, high training standards, and compassion to the field. He mentored generations of paramedics and physicians and laid the foundation for the modern EMS model.
https://www.spreaker.com/episode/episode-303-dr-stewart-tribute-part-2-dave-lindell-and-mike-yee--67238814
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Come up, come.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I getting your attention.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
All listeners on this frequency stand by for an important announcement.
Welcome to Medical to Medical Podcast, the weekly podcast for
EMS providers, EMS leaders, EMS, medical directors and others involved
in for those who have an interest in emergency medical services.
Ladies and gentlemen, here's your host, Steve.
Speaker 4 (00:29):
Cohen, coming from the Ferndale Medical medic Podcast Studios. It's
a special edition of Medical Medical Podcast. I know it's
been away for a long long time, but I'm bringing
it back for a few special episodes. Today we have
a special episode dedicated to the life and legacy of
(00:49):
doctor Ron Stewart. He was one of the true pioneers
in EMS and a father of modern pre hospital care.
Doctor Stewart served as the EMS medical director for the
City of Pitts and played a crucial role in shaping
emergency medicine and EMS as we know it today. His
contributions were just not groundbreaking, they were life changing for
(01:10):
countless patients and providers. And today there's three of us
that were honored to be part of doctor Stewart's I
guess would say tribe. You know, he was our medical
director for myself and my excuse me and for my
(01:32):
guest here today. So joining me today to honor doctor
Stewart are two remarkable individuals who have dedicated their lives
to EMS. We have Dave Lindell and Mike Ye, all
who have been influenced in some way by doctor Stewart's work.
Welcome Mike and Dave. Dave, why don't you say hi
(01:53):
and introduce yourself.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Hey, I'm Dave Lindelle.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
What can I say?
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Been involved with EMS seventy one, Freedom House before the city,
first class in the city in seventy five, and certainly
was working in the city when Stuart came on board
and got things rolling as he did there. And I
just retired a couple of years ago after fifty.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
One years of being.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Clinical and an educator. Olden faculty positions at university, is
a coordinator at hospitals and whatever. So I've had the
occasions to fly River Rescue, Big City MS probably about
forty thousand calls.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
But you know, it's.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Been a long time, it's been great, it's been a calling.
So that's more than I need to talk about for me.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
And he worked, he worked as Mike we know he
worked the slowest medic unit at Medic one. We know
a Medic five, we were at it. We know Medical
one was always behind Medic five because Mike and I
worked Mike and I work Medic five. So my other
guest is one of my great partners that I had
(03:06):
when I was working in the City of Pittsburgh and
a really great friend. But Dave's also a great friend
as well. I don't want to leave him out because
Dave and I trek after our city of Pittsburgh days
to Philadelphia, and that's another whole podcast as well.
Speaker 6 (03:20):
But Mike, welcome, Thanks Steve. It's always good to see
great to be here on your podcast today. You know,
we've spent so many years together as colleagues, and it's
one of the things I love about about being an
EMS is that EMS is a career create foster's not
only new discoveries, but relationships that last a lifetime. And
(03:44):
this has proved positive of it and the things that
you and Dave have gone on to do with your
careers and the gift this job has been to me
from the very beginning. You know, we're three old dumbers
now and still I'm still at it. Gearing back my
clinical activity right now, and taking on an education role
(04:06):
here stat Metavac, the helicopter provider for the up MC
system serves.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
SERVE serves three.
Speaker 6 (04:15):
States and has a team basis, so there's lots to
do and still feel like I got a lot of
fire in me looking forward to doing what I can
as long as I can, and kind of setting out
and lay on the ground and work for that right
off into the sunset instead of somebody wearing out my
welcome kicking me off the clift.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
All right, Well, let's kind of start at the beginning.
Doctor stewart work was pivot and making EMS what it
is today. For those who may not be familiar, Dave,
let's start with you. Can you share a little bit
about who he was?
Speaker 2 (04:47):
No, I think I can.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
I mean we can say things like he brought you know,
track you on deobation and EMS, researched Pittsburgh, e MS
and whatever, which is very good and it's worth saying,
and I'm sure we'll talk about it a little bit.
But I think the very first point that I jotted
down when you asked about this was Ron Stewart was
(05:12):
what I consider and probably the only one that I
know that.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
It was a true renaissance man.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Okay, involved with arts and music and medicine and people.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
He had a breadth.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
And depth of experience and knowledge and interests that was
far beyond what most of us all right really live
through or think about and do. He was tremendously kind.
He talked with folks like you were his best friend.
(05:54):
And indeed he befriended you without even thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
And it didn't matter. He was helpful. If you asked
him for help.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
And you had something that you needed to get done
or wanted to do, he would be more than willing
to do it. And as I said, this guy's the
renaissance man. This guy thinks broadly. This guy's doing medical research,
he's taking care of patients, he's teaching people to take
care of patients. He's playing music, he's doing art, he's
building the Center for Emergency Medicine, where you know, Mike
(06:25):
is sitting right now as we speak. And that was,
you know, his thing was to launch people. I think,
for a better way of saying it, he certainly was
contributory to my growth and going forward in EMS. And
(06:46):
I will say that I was, you know, kicked in
the ass and launched by him.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
As well as.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Others like Nancy, Caroline and other people that we encountered
along the way. So he was pretty incredible that way.
And if you're a medic and you deal with him
back in the day when it was almost wild wild
West at times, you could do things with him if
he knew you and your abilities that maybe you wouldn't
(07:17):
normally find ems providers doing. I remember I was working
a pending arrest which ended up being arrest, and he
gave me the good to be the first central line
I ever did all right, And it was like because
you just couldn't get unless beast person a peripheral line
at the time.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
And it was before we were drilling.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Adults with intra ossious needles, So you know, he really
could launch folks, encourage folks to get better and worked
exceedingly hard to make that happy.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Was he perfect? None of us ever are perfect, but
he was darn good all the way way around.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And I couldn't think of something off the top of
my head right now that I would say was ever
an issue that.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
I'm aware of? A rhythm?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Good, Mike, what's the starting point? That's a great starting point? Hey, Mike,
what do you have to say.
Speaker 6 (08:15):
You know, coming off of days uh Day's comments, you
know that when we think about doctor Stewart, you don't
you think of doctor Stewart within the universe that he
helped create. You know, one of the things if you
think about all three of us coming out of Pittsburgh EMS,
(08:36):
Pittsburgh gm AS was built on on basically three names,
Peter Stafford, Nancy Caroline and Ron Stewart.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
And then there's Uh.
Speaker 6 (08:46):
And when you think about the common denominators, the common
thread that followed each and every one of them is
that they were visionary number one, that they were able
to make something out of nothing. Number two and number three,
they had a passion to bring to raise people up,
(09:10):
to bring people along. They didn't just limit their activities
to a narrow fellowship of like minded academics. You know,
although they were included and they were critical, what they
needed was you know, vision is nothing if you have
(09:31):
nobody to carry the vision forward and you have nobody
to apply it. So a leader, a leader is nothing
if those they lead or nothing. And I think that
in the cases when we think about our days of
saffer In, Caroline and Stewart in particular, because we had
(09:53):
the longest time with him. Is they're extraordinary ability to
make something from nothing, to be able to bring people up,
to give them, to not only give them tools, but
to give them vision. And them is us doctor Stafford,
(10:18):
doctor Caroline, the doctor Stewart gave us. They put in
us vision, they put in us abilities by giving us tools.
But those tools were nothing without the vision to carry
those things forward. As to why those things were important
and out of that grew are in the entire ems
(10:40):
indust That when I think about when I think about
doctor Stewart and I think about your comments, Dave, I
think about the common thread that we've been privileged to
be a part of the witness to you knows as
much as being recipients, because now that these that these
three individuals have put their values in us and we've
(11:05):
carried them forward, we get to pass those on to
the next generations, now that our time is coming.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
To an end in this industry. So that's what I think.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Well, what's interesting about those names Saffer and Caroline that
you mentioned as well doing it is you know, I
said I knew one renaissance man and I said, I
think that's Ron Stewart.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And I'll stand.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
By that, But I've probably known a half dozen, maybe
seven truly brilliant, brilliant people. Those three are amongst that
six or seven, without a doubt, and they did not.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
You know, there's a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
And you just mentioned about how people need and do whatever,
and we talked about launching folks, but a lot of
people like the whole knowledge to their breast because if
they let that knowledge go and they give that, it
gives other people a chance to become maybe not equivalent,
(12:10):
but it gives them power that they now hold, and
people some people want to hold onto power. All three
of those people gave that a way, particularly Ron, I mean,
he was willing to let things go. And doctor Saffer
did the same thing.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I had a good.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Opportunity to know him from Freedom House and Nancy Caroline
obviously from Freedom House and early city of Pittsburgh, and.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
They all were willing.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
To just share that information and let it go freely
and challenging to use it and grow.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Yeah, And I think part of that being able to.
Speaker 6 (12:50):
Being able to let go partly because nobody would.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Everybody who thought at.
Speaker 6 (12:56):
Times that they were nuts, you know, was I just
got back from Baltimore, from from the mid Atlantic Transport Conference,
and I was just wishing that they would have resurrected
the original footage of doctor Stafford doing some of the
earliest resuscitation videos on paralyzed Baltimore City firement.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Just goal, just gold.
Speaker 6 (13:24):
But you know, when we think of, uh, when when
when when we when we think of just what these
guys were up against developing a MS, doctor Stewart basically
just kind of moving in and moving into just unoccupied
space and lava ball.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
The next thing, you know, he's you know, he's asking
people to.
Speaker 6 (13:46):
Come in kind of be resident, you know, talking about
being you know, doing an internship and stuff like that.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
The first thing you're doing is like Payton the laws and.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
That kind of thing, and uh and bringing people along.
He's just kind of building things and making in collaborations
where he where he could, and making agitations.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
But such a nice guy that nobody could nobody.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Nobody would say no, no, nobody would say no.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Right, articulate the argument as to why it should go forward.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Right.
Speaker 6 (14:21):
When you think about, like I said before, making something
out of nothing.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Lot for Paul Lover, Paul was nothing. It was their
empty rooms.
Speaker 6 (14:30):
Just out and claim them, you know, Medica, you know,
you know, the meta commander was at it. It was
the it was in the it was behind that glass
of the Lothrop in the beginning with the press. He
did all of these things by developing these ideas in
the face of terrific opposition, not the least of which
(14:52):
and maybe one of the crowning achievements beyond making Pittsburgh
e MS the premiere e M S model, that it
became that that that started with us STAT Metavac that
in the beginning there was a competing program that was
very good. Ron saw the need early on for air
(15:16):
medical within the region and him in partnership with Anti
Pikesman and others, were able to bring that across the
line and create it. You know, it was their vision
that saw that that major c change through that has
been a cornerstone of critical care and continues to develop
(15:41):
in all aspects between both ground provision and the provision
of timely e MS and literally bringing treating them where
they lie, bringing it to the streets, whether that be
by equipping an ambulance, equipping a hell copter. And the
next thing that's coming along that's already there already in
(16:04):
transplant is equipping a drone.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So there's there's amazing.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
Things going on, and I am so privileged to have
witnessed a lot of these things coming about from their inception.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Que A one second, I need to just chime in
here for just ten seconds, because I don't even have
to ask any of these questions because all the things
that I kind of had in my mind, you guys
are answered without me even asking, which is great. But
I just want to I want to stay on one point,
and you've already I think both of you really touched
on this. One of the things most people say about
(16:41):
doctor Stewart is that he's just not a leader, but
he was a mentor. I really like you to share
some personal story because you both have history with doctor
Stewart and how he maybe he has shaped a lot
of individuals and physicians and paramedics and EMTs in our
EMI world, and whether it was through his mentorship or
(17:03):
training or as you kind of just talked about, inspiration.
So if you don't both mine, I don't care. Mike,
We'll start with you on this one. If you can
share kind of a personal story that you had with
doctor Stewart.
Speaker 6 (17:16):
The thing that I remember so much about about Ron
personally was his kindness and his patience, because I know
in the in my gears with in my years at
the city, and anybody listening to this no impact then
knows how many mistakes I made? What a what a
bone head? How many bone headed things I did? And
(17:40):
they were you know, I mean I was but passionate,
you know, being being passionate about something.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Yeah, get through some bone headed things, I guess.
Speaker 6 (17:49):
I guess we all do. But I remember when I
would make mistakes. Doctor Stewart would be so patient in
his concentration.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Was not on.
Speaker 6 (18:03):
Pointing out what a bonehead I was, but what a
how to build you up? You make a mistake, You
make mistake, that's one thing, but that's not the big picture.
And the thing about Ron was Ron Ron was able
to get me to see beyond myself and to help
me get out of my own way by recognizing that
(18:23):
the more that I know is the window to how
much I don't know the universe I don't know. And
I remember so clearly sitting down with Ron, in him
being just within his moments before he would go and
be off to something else, he would have these moments
(18:44):
of transparency where he would reinforce what a gift we
had to be to be doing what we're doing, and
doing what I'm doing. He made me feel that I
was a gift as well. That really made him an
impact more than his articulation, but his extraordinary ability to
(19:06):
make something out of the nothing I want.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
And that's really that, That's really what I remember.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
That was one of his many superpowers. I never, even
if you did make those mistakes, which I think we've
all done right, he never raised his voice. And I
think you hit it really stronger, Mike. He made you,
even though you made the mistake and you were wrong,
you left his office in loth of Paul smiling. It
(19:33):
just made you feel like you were the only one.
And the other part I think Dave you said at
the beginning was that no matter what, he always knew
your name. I actually had the privilege of running into
him at one of the conferences way back when, and
I've been gone for the city for quite a bit,
(19:53):
and I got the biggest hug, Hi, Steve, how you doing?
I mean again, another superpower? Right? Every time he was
gracious enough I tracked him down. He came on my
podcast and came on Medicdematic podcast. It was like, oh
my god, I said like two words, and I was
like gushing because I couldn't believe he came on my podcast.
(20:17):
But that's just me, okay, Dave, not your turn.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
No, I was just going to reinforce what Mike was saying.
And it dawned on me when we talked about how
he never really he.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Was always looking to make you better at what you did.
And you know, in the last ten years, I guess
that's a guess we've heard a lot about maybe it's
been a little bit longer, a lot about just culture
in organizations.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
All right, where you know, we want to.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Foster a environment where when Dave Lindell stepped on the
dog's tail, he will come forward and say, yeah, it
was me that stepped on the dog's tail.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
And then you now had.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
A teachable moment with him where he could look at
what happened, why it may have happened, and how you
could avoid that happening in the future, and other things
you could do to grow. So he was you know,
that's nineteen eighty man, you know that's forty years ago,
not fifteen years ago. When we were talking about kind
of running with a j just culture and it wasn't
(21:35):
necessarily called that. And that was very good in terms
of personally. You know, I had the advantage of being
a clinical associate at the center, so I would teaching
classes there. So he was always in and out, and
he was always available to you. And when you've got
questions you couldn't answer, he would help you answer them
(21:58):
and take that back to your students and everything else.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
You know.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
He always encouraged education, and I worked my way through
my undergraduate degrees and my graduate degree, and there were
times when I'm talking around like Ron, you know.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
This is running me down. Man.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Every time I like trade away a shift for a
month because I need to go to school, somebody at
the last minute comes up and says, now, I really
can't do that month for you. As a crew chief,
I had two people to trade with and that was it.
In my medic unit, that was it was always. He
was always very supportive and encouraging and would would deal
(22:40):
with you on the personal as well as the professional.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
I have nothing but good to think.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
He always invited and you guys probably had the invites,
I'm sure too, to go to Nova Scotia, to canoe
and a hike and do other things and come visit
him when he was up there doing things.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And I never got there.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
I wish I had, but I never did, and just
didn't have that opportunity with the way life was unfolding.
But that's uh, I mean, I have no bad feelings
about having work.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Doctor Stewart was known for his tireless advocacy for better
training and medical oversight. And of course we talk about
training and how do you see his work reflected in
today's world of ms.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
That is actually a great question.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Well, I'm a great podcast host, Mike. What can I say?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
That's actually a great question.
Speaker 6 (23:35):
Uh, there's two ends of it. I would say that
people remember, people enjoyed the benefit of the result of
Ron's work with really no clue of Ron at all.
We were very forgetful, you know. You know, it's like
(23:55):
it's like trying to remember a family history. You know,
some it's sometimes family histories are more important to some
people than they.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Are to others.
Speaker 6 (24:06):
For carrying my life, for tarrying my wife and myself,
it's very very important for lots of reasons.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
But in answer to.
Speaker 6 (24:15):
Your question, I think that the benefits are countless. You know,
such as the introduction of protocols such as the the
brisk development of arrowy control, which has always been a
moving part, but it was Broad that introduced, you know,
(24:37):
the the jellyfish mask. The jellyfish that the jellyfish mask
started with a design that Ron did back the sea leasy,
you know, and it literally was like a jellyfish. And
then there was a Then there was the lighted stalect
you know, and trans illumination, trans illumination is it's kind
(24:57):
of ever left those those things and those technologies of
being able to make things easier, but those were all
on the foundation of Ron. Building on that, even though
even though others you know, would would take the ball
and run with it in different directions. A great deal,
particularly in the development of protocols for practitioners to operate under,
(25:23):
was repeat it was really all wrong. Ron's never really
cited for that because he's he doesn't have to be,
you know, it's not it's not necessary for him too.
But if one looks back at their history there it'll
be because you can't trace any house of e MS anywhere,
(25:44):
I would argue in the world without its stopping at
the doorstep of Pittsburgh Councilvan.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
That's my thoughts on now.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
I think that's that's very well and truthfully said. And
you're right, our memories get foggy over time, no doubt.
I think oglieve when you talk about legacies and how
it's impacted EMS and whatever, all that's true, there's.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
No question about it.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
But I think his development of a EM residency, which
wasn't the first certainly, but an EM residency that had
a major emphasis on EMS. And if we think back
to him driving, I think it was a Volvo station
(26:31):
wagon that was the precursor to the Bronco pilots where
you got the main man out in the field next
to you giving patient care. And I think that type
of involvement and encouragement.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Isn't seen to the.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Cent is not seen today to the same extent. I
think in most residency programs it's still president in Pittsburgh
where he had it's set up, and it's president and
others as well, but it's not perhaps as widely recognized
as whatever. But I think that is a legacy for
(27:15):
the emphasis for emergency medicine physicians to say, look, yeah,
you need to be able to do emergency medicine and
patient comes to your door on a stretcher, or walks
in and has they're having an MI the scept that
they've got the flu or they whacked their thumb with
a hammer. All right, All important that em docs.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Are able to take care of it.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Very important that em docs understand and are involved with
the EMS systems and the providers that are out there
in the street doing it.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
That they may very well be giving command to.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
All right, and his emphasis on building and doing.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
That is a legacy that's here forever I interject with something.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
You just said that about a about that about that vehicle.
Speaker 5 (28:03):
Uh, the audience made the audience probably wouldn't know this,
but the but the volvo, the Volvo was actually a
vehicle that uh, doctor Stewart, and this is from doctor Parrots,
he co signed for a He actually co signed this
for for a medic who needed a vehicle and couldn't
afford it, so doctor Stewart co signed for it.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
The uh that the.
Speaker 6 (28:26):
Guy couldn't keep up the payments, so uh, doctor Stewart
took it. And then he then he put a symbol
on it and a light and low and behold you
have one of the earliest physician response units. You know,
who was doing that before Ron did that, I'm not
I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
I'm not sure anybody was doing that.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Well, wait, Pantridge and Belfast maybe going on m I
calls ah, But that's back in the six mid sixties.
Speaker 6 (28:54):
I mean yeah, yeah, And the and and physician response
you know, was going on for quite a while in
the UK, but that never really caught on in Europe,
not its emergency response, and uh Ron Ron brought that
a revolutionary.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Idea, you know, you know when you bring that up
about about the Volvo.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
And as far as residency is concerned, remember remember too
that the residencies, the residencies that existed where we're we're
we're being developed when emergency medicine wasn't even a specialty,
it was a It would it would be another five
for so years before uh emergency medicine was recognized as
(29:35):
a specialty and the residency programs were already h in
place at the center.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Before we wrap up, if you could say one thing
to doctor Stewart today, what would it be than you yeah, Mike,
anything you monad.
Speaker 6 (29:53):
Yeah, I would, I would. I would say that that
there there is nothing in the English language that that
transmits the amount the depth of thankfulness and gratefulness that
I have for everything that he's been and everything that
he's put into.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
To me personally and.
Speaker 6 (30:16):
Uh to the and to the to the to the
field of medicine that I have been so passionate about
and loved for a lifetime. My hope is that when
my story is written and our story is that the
vision that doctor Stewart planted in us and equipped us
(30:37):
with along with Peter Saffer and Nancy Caroline, will also
be remembered by those who remember us and the contributions
that we made in helping to carry that vision on
to others. So that's if there if there is to
(30:57):
be any thanks at all, it's in the proof of
what he puts into us as well as others lasts.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
I think when you evaluate that, Michael, you're right on.
One of the things I think we have to keep
in mind is we were developing when he was developing
all of this, so it was happening at the same time,
and there's something special about that. There are still places
(31:30):
where that kind of stuff is happening with others. Was
in the formative years for us personally as well as
em and ems professionally.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
Well said by both of you. Doctor Stewart was a
TUOE pioneer. He was a mentor and a visionary who
shaped modern EMS as it is today. His legacy will
hopefully continue to save lives through the systems he helped
build and the countless professionals he inspired. Thanks Dave, Thanks
(32:05):
Mike for joining me and sharing your stories, and I
want to thank everybody for listening to this tribute to
doctor Stewart.
Come up, come.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I getting your attention.
Speaker 3 (00:09):
All listeners on this frequency stand by for an important announcement.
Welcome to Medical to Medical Podcast, the weekly podcast for
EMS providers, EMS leaders, EMS, medical directors and others involved
in for those who have an interest in emergency medical services.
Ladies and gentlemen, here's your host, Steve.
Speaker 4 (00:29):
Cohen, coming from the Ferndale Medical medic Podcast Studios. It's
a special edition of Medical Medical Podcast. I know it's
been away for a long long time, but I'm bringing
it back for a few special episodes. Today we have
a special episode dedicated to the life and legacy of
(00:49):
doctor Ron Stewart. He was one of the true pioneers
in EMS and a father of modern pre hospital care.
Doctor Stewart served as the EMS medical director for the
City of Pitts and played a crucial role in shaping
emergency medicine and EMS as we know it today. His
contributions were just not groundbreaking, they were life changing for
(01:10):
countless patients and providers. And today there's three of us
that were honored to be part of doctor Stewart's I
guess would say tribe. You know, he was our medical
director for myself and my excuse me and for my
(01:32):
guest here today. So joining me today to honor doctor
Stewart are two remarkable individuals who have dedicated their lives
to EMS. We have Dave Lindell and Mike Ye, all
who have been influenced in some way by doctor Stewart's work.
Welcome Mike and Dave. Dave, why don't you say hi
(01:53):
and introduce yourself.
Speaker 2 (01:55):
Hey, I'm Dave Lindelle.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
What can I say?
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Been involved with EMS seventy one, Freedom House before the city,
first class in the city in seventy five, and certainly
was working in the city when Stuart came on board
and got things rolling as he did there. And I
just retired a couple of years ago after fifty.
Speaker 2 (02:19):
One years of being.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Clinical and an educator. Olden faculty positions at university, is
a coordinator at hospitals and whatever. So I've had the
occasions to fly River Rescue, Big City MS probably about
forty thousand calls.
Speaker 2 (02:37):
But you know, it's.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Been a long time, it's been great, it's been a calling.
So that's more than I need to talk about for me.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
And he worked, he worked as Mike we know he
worked the slowest medic unit at Medic one. We know
a Medic five, we were at it. We know Medical
one was always behind Medic five because Mike and I
worked Mike and I work Medic five. So my other
guest is one of my great partners that I had
(03:06):
when I was working in the City of Pittsburgh and
a really great friend. But Dave's also a great friend
as well. I don't want to leave him out because
Dave and I trek after our city of Pittsburgh days
to Philadelphia, and that's another whole podcast as well.
Speaker 6 (03:20):
But Mike, welcome, Thanks Steve. It's always good to see
great to be here on your podcast today. You know,
we've spent so many years together as colleagues, and it's
one of the things I love about about being an
EMS is that EMS is a career create foster's not
only new discoveries, but relationships that last a lifetime. And
(03:44):
this has proved positive of it and the things that
you and Dave have gone on to do with your
careers and the gift this job has been to me
from the very beginning. You know, we're three old dumbers
now and still I'm still at it. Gearing back my
clinical activity right now, and taking on an education role
(04:06):
here stat Metavac, the helicopter provider for the up MC
system serves.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
SERVE serves three.
Speaker 6 (04:15):
States and has a team basis, so there's lots to
do and still feel like I got a lot of
fire in me looking forward to doing what I can
as long as I can, and kind of setting out
and lay on the ground and work for that right
off into the sunset instead of somebody wearing out my
welcome kicking me off the clift.
Speaker 4 (04:34):
All right, Well, let's kind of start at the beginning.
Doctor stewart work was pivot and making EMS what it
is today. For those who may not be familiar, Dave,
let's start with you. Can you share a little bit
about who he was?
Speaker 2 (04:47):
No, I think I can.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
I mean we can say things like he brought you know,
track you on deobation and EMS, researched Pittsburgh, e MS
and whatever, which is very good and it's worth saying,
and I'm sure we'll talk about it a little bit.
But I think the very first point that I jotted
down when you asked about this was Ron Stewart was
(05:12):
what I consider and probably the only one that I
know that.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
It was a true renaissance man.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Okay, involved with arts and music and medicine and people.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
He had a breadth.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
And depth of experience and knowledge and interests that was
far beyond what most of us all right really live
through or think about and do. He was tremendously kind.
He talked with folks like you were his best friend.
(05:54):
And indeed he befriended you without even thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
And it didn't matter. He was helpful. If you asked
him for help.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
And you had something that you needed to get done
or wanted to do, he would be more than willing
to do it. And as I said, this guy's the
renaissance man. This guy thinks broadly. This guy's doing medical research,
he's taking care of patients, he's teaching people to take
care of patients. He's playing music, he's doing art, he's
building the Center for Emergency Medicine, where you know, Mike
(06:25):
is sitting right now as we speak. And that was,
you know, his thing was to launch people. I think,
for a better way of saying it, he certainly was
contributory to my growth and going forward in EMS. And
(06:46):
I will say that I was, you know, kicked in
the ass and launched by him.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
As well as.
Speaker 1 (06:52):
Others like Nancy, Caroline and other people that we encountered
along the way. So he was pretty incredible that way.
And if you're a medic and you deal with him
back in the day when it was almost wild wild
West at times, you could do things with him if
he knew you and your abilities that maybe you wouldn't
(07:17):
normally find ems providers doing. I remember I was working
a pending arrest which ended up being arrest, and he
gave me the good to be the first central line
I ever did all right, And it was like because
you just couldn't get unless beast person a peripheral line
at the time.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
And it was before we were drilling.
Speaker 1 (07:39):
Adults with intra ossious needles, So you know, he really
could launch folks, encourage folks to get better and worked
exceedingly hard to make that happy.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Was he perfect? None of us ever are perfect, but
he was darn good all the way way around.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
And I couldn't think of something off the top of
my head right now that I would say was ever
an issue that.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
I'm aware of? A rhythm?
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Good, Mike, what's the starting point? That's a great starting point? Hey, Mike,
what do you have to say.
Speaker 6 (08:15):
You know, coming off of days uh Day's comments, you
know that when we think about doctor Stewart, you don't
you think of doctor Stewart within the universe that he
helped create. You know, one of the things if you
think about all three of us coming out of Pittsburgh EMS,
(08:36):
Pittsburgh gm AS was built on on basically three names,
Peter Stafford, Nancy Caroline and Ron Stewart.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
And then there's Uh.
Speaker 6 (08:46):
And when you think about the common denominators, the common
thread that followed each and every one of them is
that they were visionary number one, that they were able
to make something out of nothing. Number two and number three,
they had a passion to bring to raise people up,
(09:10):
to bring people along. They didn't just limit their activities
to a narrow fellowship of like minded academics. You know,
although they were included and they were critical, what they
needed was you know, vision is nothing if you have
(09:31):
nobody to carry the vision forward and you have nobody
to apply it. So a leader, a leader is nothing
if those they lead or nothing. And I think that
in the cases when we think about our days of
saffer In, Caroline and Stewart in particular, because we had
(09:53):
the longest time with him. Is they're extraordinary ability to
make something from nothing, to be able to bring people up,
to give them, to not only give them tools, but
to give them vision. And them is us doctor Stafford,
(10:18):
doctor Caroline, the doctor Stewart gave us. They put in
us vision, they put in us abilities by giving us tools.
But those tools were nothing without the vision to carry
those things forward. As to why those things were important
and out of that grew are in the entire ems
(10:40):
indust That when I think about when I think about
doctor Stewart and I think about your comments, Dave, I
think about the common thread that we've been privileged to
be a part of the witness to you knows as
much as being recipients, because now that these that these
three individuals have put their values in us and we've
(11:05):
carried them forward, we get to pass those on to
the next generations, now that our time is coming.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
To an end in this industry. So that's what I think.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Well, what's interesting about those names Saffer and Caroline that
you mentioned as well doing it is you know, I
said I knew one renaissance man and I said, I
think that's Ron Stewart.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
And I'll stand.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
By that, But I've probably known a half dozen, maybe
seven truly brilliant, brilliant people. Those three are amongst that
six or seven, without a doubt, and they did not.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
You know, there's a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
And you just mentioned about how people need and do whatever,
and we talked about launching folks, but a lot of
people like the whole knowledge to their breast because if
they let that knowledge go and they give that, it
gives other people a chance to become maybe not equivalent,
(12:10):
but it gives them power that they now hold, and
people some people want to hold onto power. All three
of those people gave that a way, particularly Ron, I mean,
he was willing to let things go. And doctor Saffer
did the same thing.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
I had a good.
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Opportunity to know him from Freedom House and Nancy Caroline
obviously from Freedom House and early city of Pittsburgh, and.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
They all were willing.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
To just share that information and let it go freely
and challenging to use it and grow.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Yeah, And I think part of that being able to.
Speaker 6 (12:50):
Being able to let go partly because nobody would.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
Everybody who thought at.
Speaker 6 (12:56):
Times that they were nuts, you know, was I just
got back from Baltimore, from from the mid Atlantic Transport Conference,
and I was just wishing that they would have resurrected
the original footage of doctor Stafford doing some of the
earliest resuscitation videos on paralyzed Baltimore City firement.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Just goal, just gold.
Speaker 6 (13:24):
But you know, when we think of, uh, when when
when when we when we think of just what these
guys were up against developing a MS, doctor Stewart basically
just kind of moving in and moving into just unoccupied
space and lava ball.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
The next thing, you know, he's you know, he's asking
people to.
Speaker 6 (13:46):
Come in kind of be resident, you know, talking about
being you know, doing an internship and stuff like that.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
The first thing you're doing is like Payton the laws and.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
That kind of thing, and uh and bringing people along.
He's just kind of building things and making in collaborations
where he where he could, and making agitations.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
But such a nice guy that nobody could nobody.
Speaker 4 (14:09):
Nobody would say no, no, nobody would say no.
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Right, articulate the argument as to why it should go forward.
Speaker 2 (14:19):
Right.
Speaker 6 (14:21):
When you think about, like I said before, making something
out of nothing.
Speaker 2 (14:25):
Lot for Paul Lover, Paul was nothing. It was their
empty rooms.
Speaker 6 (14:30):
Just out and claim them, you know, Medica, you know,
you know, the meta commander was at it. It was
the it was in the it was behind that glass
of the Lothrop in the beginning with the press. He
did all of these things by developing these ideas in
the face of terrific opposition, not the least of which
(14:52):
and maybe one of the crowning achievements beyond making Pittsburgh
e MS the premiere e M S model, that it
became that that that started with us STAT Metavac that
in the beginning there was a competing program that was
very good. Ron saw the need early on for air
(15:16):
medical within the region and him in partnership with Anti
Pikesman and others, were able to bring that across the
line and create it. You know, it was their vision
that saw that that major c change through that has
been a cornerstone of critical care and continues to develop
(15:41):
in all aspects between both ground provision and the provision
of timely e MS and literally bringing treating them where
they lie, bringing it to the streets, whether that be
by equipping an ambulance, equipping a hell copter. And the
next thing that's coming along that's already there already in
(16:04):
transplant is equipping a drone.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
So there's there's amazing.
Speaker 6 (16:08):
Things going on, and I am so privileged to have
witnessed a lot of these things coming about from their inception.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Que A one second, I need to just chime in
here for just ten seconds, because I don't even have
to ask any of these questions because all the things
that I kind of had in my mind, you guys
are answered without me even asking, which is great. But
I just want to I want to stay on one point,
and you've already I think both of you really touched
on this. One of the things most people say about
(16:41):
doctor Stewart is that he's just not a leader, but
he was a mentor. I really like you to share
some personal story because you both have history with doctor
Stewart and how he maybe he has shaped a lot
of individuals and physicians and paramedics and EMTs in our
EMI world, and whether it was through his mentorship or
(17:03):
training or as you kind of just talked about, inspiration.
So if you don't both mine, I don't care. Mike,
We'll start with you on this one. If you can
share kind of a personal story that you had with
doctor Stewart.
Speaker 6 (17:16):
The thing that I remember so much about about Ron
personally was his kindness and his patience, because I know
in the in my gears with in my years at
the city, and anybody listening to this no impact then
knows how many mistakes I made? What a what a
bone head? How many bone headed things I did? And
(17:40):
they were you know, I mean I was but passionate,
you know, being being passionate about something.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Yeah, get through some bone headed things, I guess.
Speaker 6 (17:49):
I guess we all do. But I remember when I
would make mistakes. Doctor Stewart would be so patient in
his concentration.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Was not on.
Speaker 6 (18:03):
Pointing out what a bonehead I was, but what a
how to build you up? You make a mistake, You
make mistake, that's one thing, but that's not the big picture.
And the thing about Ron was Ron Ron was able
to get me to see beyond myself and to help
me get out of my own way by recognizing that
(18:23):
the more that I know is the window to how
much I don't know the universe I don't know. And
I remember so clearly sitting down with Ron, in him
being just within his moments before he would go and
be off to something else, he would have these moments
(18:44):
of transparency where he would reinforce what a gift we
had to be to be doing what we're doing, and
doing what I'm doing. He made me feel that I
was a gift as well. That really made him an
impact more than his articulation, but his extraordinary ability to
(19:06):
make something out of the nothing I want.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
And that's really that, That's really what I remember.
Speaker 4 (19:12):
That was one of his many superpowers. I never, even
if you did make those mistakes, which I think we've
all done right, he never raised his voice. And I
think you hit it really stronger, Mike. He made you,
even though you made the mistake and you were wrong,
you left his office in loth of Paul smiling. It
(19:33):
just made you feel like you were the only one.
And the other part I think Dave you said at
the beginning was that no matter what, he always knew
your name. I actually had the privilege of running into
him at one of the conferences way back when, and
I've been gone for the city for quite a bit,
(19:53):
and I got the biggest hug, Hi, Steve, how you doing?
I mean again, another superpower? Right? Every time he was
gracious enough I tracked him down. He came on my
podcast and came on Medicdematic podcast. It was like, oh
my god, I said like two words, and I was
like gushing because I couldn't believe he came on my podcast.
(20:17):
But that's just me, okay, Dave, not your turn.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
No, I was just going to reinforce what Mike was saying.
And it dawned on me when we talked about how
he never really he.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
Was always looking to make you better at what you did.
And you know, in the last ten years, I guess
that's a guess we've heard a lot about maybe it's
been a little bit longer, a lot about just culture
in organizations.
Speaker 2 (20:54):
All right, where you know, we want to.
Speaker 1 (20:59):
Foster a environment where when Dave Lindell stepped on the
dog's tail, he will come forward and say, yeah, it
was me that stepped on the dog's tail.
Speaker 4 (21:12):
And then you now had.
Speaker 1 (21:14):
A teachable moment with him where he could look at
what happened, why it may have happened, and how you
could avoid that happening in the future, and other things
you could do to grow. So he was you know,
that's nineteen eighty man, you know that's forty years ago,
not fifteen years ago. When we were talking about kind
of running with a j just culture and it wasn't
(21:35):
necessarily called that. And that was very good in terms
of personally. You know, I had the advantage of being
a clinical associate at the center, so I would teaching
classes there. So he was always in and out, and
he was always available to you. And when you've got
questions you couldn't answer, he would help you answer them
(21:58):
and take that back to your students and everything else.
Speaker 2 (22:02):
You know.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
He always encouraged education, and I worked my way through
my undergraduate degrees and my graduate degree, and there were
times when I'm talking around like Ron, you know.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
This is running me down. Man.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Every time I like trade away a shift for a
month because I need to go to school, somebody at
the last minute comes up and says, now, I really
can't do that month for you. As a crew chief,
I had two people to trade with and that was it.
In my medic unit, that was it was always. He
was always very supportive and encouraging and would would deal
(22:40):
with you on the personal as well as the professional.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
I have nothing but good to think.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
He always invited and you guys probably had the invites,
I'm sure too, to go to Nova Scotia, to canoe
and a hike and do other things and come visit
him when he was up there doing things.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And I never got there.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
I wish I had, but I never did, and just
didn't have that opportunity with the way life was unfolding.
But that's uh, I mean, I have no bad feelings
about having work.
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Doctor Stewart was known for his tireless advocacy for better
training and medical oversight. And of course we talk about
training and how do you see his work reflected in
today's world of ms.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
That is actually a great question.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Well, I'm a great podcast host, Mike. What can I say?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
That's actually a great question.
Speaker 6 (23:35):
Uh, there's two ends of it. I would say that
people remember, people enjoyed the benefit of the result of
Ron's work with really no clue of Ron at all.
We were very forgetful, you know. You know, it's like
(23:55):
it's like trying to remember a family history. You know,
some it's sometimes family histories are more important to some
people than they.
Speaker 2 (24:05):
Are to others.
Speaker 6 (24:06):
For carrying my life, for tarrying my wife and myself,
it's very very important for lots of reasons.
Speaker 2 (24:12):
But in answer to.
Speaker 6 (24:15):
Your question, I think that the benefits are countless. You know,
such as the introduction of protocols such as the the
brisk development of arrowy control, which has always been a
moving part, but it was Broad that introduced, you know,
(24:37):
the the jellyfish mask. The jellyfish that the jellyfish mask
started with a design that Ron did back the sea leasy,
you know, and it literally was like a jellyfish. And
then there was a Then there was the lighted stalect
you know, and trans illumination, trans illumination is it's kind
(24:57):
of ever left those those things and those technologies of
being able to make things easier, but those were all
on the foundation of Ron. Building on that, even though
even though others you know, would would take the ball
and run with it in different directions. A great deal,
particularly in the development of protocols for practitioners to operate under,
(25:23):
was repeat it was really all wrong. Ron's never really
cited for that because he's he doesn't have to be,
you know, it's not it's not necessary for him too.
But if one looks back at their history there it'll
be because you can't trace any house of e MS anywhere,
(25:44):
I would argue in the world without its stopping at
the doorstep of Pittsburgh Councilvan.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
That's my thoughts on now.
Speaker 1 (25:53):
I think that's that's very well and truthfully said. And
you're right, our memories get foggy over time, no doubt.
I think oglieve when you talk about legacies and how
it's impacted EMS and whatever, all that's true, there's.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
No question about it.
Speaker 1 (26:11):
But I think his development of a EM residency, which
wasn't the first certainly, but an EM residency that had
a major emphasis on EMS. And if we think back
to him driving, I think it was a Volvo station
(26:31):
wagon that was the precursor to the Bronco pilots where
you got the main man out in the field next
to you giving patient care. And I think that type
of involvement and encouragement.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
Isn't seen to the.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Cent is not seen today to the same extent. I
think in most residency programs it's still president in Pittsburgh
where he had it's set up, and it's president and
others as well, but it's not perhaps as widely recognized
as whatever. But I think that is a legacy for
(27:15):
the emphasis for emergency medicine physicians to say, look, yeah,
you need to be able to do emergency medicine and
patient comes to your door on a stretcher, or walks
in and has they're having an MI the scept that
they've got the flu or they whacked their thumb with
a hammer. All right, All important that em docs.
Speaker 2 (27:35):
Are able to take care of it.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Very important that em docs understand and are involved with
the EMS systems and the providers that are out there
in the street doing it.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
That they may very well be giving command to.
Speaker 1 (27:50):
All right, and his emphasis on building and doing.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
That is a legacy that's here forever I interject with something.
Speaker 6 (27:58):
You just said that about a about that about that vehicle.
Speaker 5 (28:03):
Uh, the audience made the audience probably wouldn't know this,
but the but the volvo, the Volvo was actually a
vehicle that uh, doctor Stewart, and this is from doctor Parrots,
he co signed for a He actually co signed this
for for a medic who needed a vehicle and couldn't
afford it, so doctor Stewart co signed for it.
Speaker 2 (28:25):
The uh that the.
Speaker 6 (28:26):
Guy couldn't keep up the payments, so uh, doctor Stewart
took it. And then he then he put a symbol
on it and a light and low and behold you
have one of the earliest physician response units. You know,
who was doing that before Ron did that, I'm not
I'm not sure.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
I'm not sure anybody was doing that.
Speaker 1 (28:46):
Well, wait, Pantridge and Belfast maybe going on m I
calls ah, But that's back in the six mid sixties.
Speaker 6 (28:54):
I mean yeah, yeah, And the and and physician response
you know, was going on for quite a while in
the UK, but that never really caught on in Europe,
not its emergency response, and uh Ron Ron brought that
a revolutionary.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Idea, you know, you know when you bring that up
about about the Volvo.
Speaker 6 (29:13):
And as far as residency is concerned, remember remember too
that the residencies, the residencies that existed where we're we're
we're being developed when emergency medicine wasn't even a specialty,
it was a It would it would be another five
for so years before uh emergency medicine was recognized as
(29:35):
a specialty and the residency programs were already h in
place at the center.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Before we wrap up, if you could say one thing
to doctor Stewart today, what would it be than you yeah, Mike,
anything you monad.
Speaker 6 (29:53):
Yeah, I would, I would. I would say that that
there there is nothing in the English language that that
transmits the amount the depth of thankfulness and gratefulness that
I have for everything that he's been and everything that
he's put into.
Speaker 2 (30:14):
To me personally and.
Speaker 6 (30:16):
Uh to the and to the to the to the
field of medicine that I have been so passionate about
and loved for a lifetime. My hope is that when
my story is written and our story is that the
vision that doctor Stewart planted in us and equipped us
(30:37):
with along with Peter Saffer and Nancy Caroline, will also
be remembered by those who remember us and the contributions
that we made in helping to carry that vision on
to others. So that's if there if there is to
(30:57):
be any thanks at all, it's in the proof of
what he puts into us as well as others lasts.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
I think when you evaluate that, Michael, you're right on.
One of the things I think we have to keep
in mind is we were developing when he was developing
all of this, so it was happening at the same time,
and there's something special about that. There are still places
(31:30):
where that kind of stuff is happening with others. Was
in the formative years for us personally as well as
em and ems professionally.
Speaker 4 (31:44):
Well said by both of you. Doctor Stewart was a
TUOE pioneer. He was a mentor and a visionary who
shaped modern EMS as it is today. His legacy will
hopefully continue to save lives through the systems he helped
build and the countless professionals he inspired. Thanks Dave, Thanks
(32:05):
Mike for joining me and sharing your stories, and I
want to thank everybody for listening to this tribute to
doctor Stewart.
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