45. Internal Politics

It's all about the politics, which is internal. I don't know, we recorded this ten years ago.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Now establishing data link accessing. Helloand welcome to episode forty five of Make
It So, a Star Trek podcast. I'm Richard Smith, and I'm Mike
Dawson. Hello, Mike, HelloRichard. This week we're discussing the Best
Doctor of all the Star Treks.Taken a while to get around to this.

(00:21):
It has I think we've got alittle bit. I don't know if
people like those, Yeah, doyou like these? Do you like them?
If you don't, you might havealready switched off and you can't hear
us. Maybe you might not haveeven downloaded the episode. Maybe maybe you
just saw Best Doctor and thought Idon't care. And if you did,
then you don't know because you're nothearing a store right now, so you'll

(00:45):
never know. No, should webegin Maybe we should? We have No,
it's not like we do a newssection or something. No. I
did think this week in Star Trek. I did think there were a couple
of emails that we could do withresponding too well. I think I think
we're coming up on our year program. We are, actually, so I
think we should do an email andemail the special thing then and shout out

(01:10):
some a lot for the birthday special. Excellent, excellent. Okay, okay,
So star trek doctors, let's startat the beginning, Star trek doctors
of the medical profession, medical officers, blue shirts, blue shirts, arguably
turquoise, one of the only onesthat doesn't change, in fact, the
only one that doesn't change. Change. Yeah, that doesn't make your previous

(01:32):
statement incorrect, though, I don'tthink. No, just one of the
unnecessary, one of the the onlythe only one of the one of the
implies that there's more of the Yeah, mister, the first sentence was wrong,
the second was correct. So doctorMcCoy, Leonard McCoy, Leonard Leonard
Bones Xavier McCoy McCoy, I madethat middle name up, did you.

(01:56):
Yes, that's not really cool.Savior is just all is a good one,
really, isn't it is? It'skind of like a little bit I
don't know, spooky, but it'sit reeks of Catholicism to me. It
does a bit. Yeah, butI say, reeks, that's pretty unfortunate
for Catholics out there. I didn'tmean that. I mean it sounds like

(02:17):
a Catholic name with smildly of Catholicism. It smells of Catholicism. Oh,
I don't know how a name smellsanyway, who cares? His name is
not Xavier, It's Leonard. He'sthe guy. Damn it, Jim.
I'm a doctor, not a bricklayer. He's cantankerous. He's cantankerous. That's

(02:39):
a good word for Dr McCoy.I don't know if I pronounced it right.
No, cantankerous, cantankerous. Ithink people know what would we know?
You what I mean? You knowthey're not coming here expecting no high
English. That he's got a combustiblepersonality. Combustible. I like Dr McCoy
a lot of words beginning of ce. Okay, you always thought that he

(02:59):
knew what he was doing, didyou? I always did. I always
thought that even when he was wrong, he knew best. It's one of
those weird ones where you know,even when you know his authority, he
had great authority. Yes, hespoke, he meant it. You either
ignored him and paid the price,yes, or followed him and lived happily

(03:23):
ever after. Do you know what? I always got the kind of impression
that even if he couldn't do thewhole, I don't know finding the cure
At four o'clock in the morning becausehe's the last one on the ship about
to die sort of thing. Yeah, that he could fix anything. He's
the sort of guy who can fixanything with duct tape and bear mats.
Well, he's got the problem withhe's got that kind of grand Did you

(03:46):
ever have it where you saw yourparents getting told off by your grandparents?
No, it's quite an unusual experience. And I always sort of see McCoy
as a kind of granddad to earneverything and telling off the lower ranked officers.
And so even though you see theKirk and everyone else is sort of
superior and you know, and higherand older and everything, and then you

(04:10):
see McCoy he's telling them off.So it kind of feels like doctors are
quite weird within the ranking system becausealthough they have ranks, they sort of
exist outside of that. Yeah,because the doctor, regardless of the ranking
of the captain and bollocking and canrelieve the captain of duty and he's the
only person on the ship. Yeah, where data gave Captain Picardo ballocking,

(04:31):
Yeah, that wouldn't be a goodthing. He'd probably get a ballocking back.
Actually, Yes, So doctors havea lot of power sometimes used that
responsibly doctor McCoy did, did alot of good helps, a lot of
people shagged decks. Oh yeah,and just a classic figure an icon of

(04:55):
Star Trek. Well, he's acolloquial character as well, which makes he's
one of the colloquial characters within Imean American colloquialism. Most of the American
characters within Star Trek are you know, your generic American accent, and you
know that's that's actually not the genericAmerican accent. I don't know why I
said it like that, but youknow, he's the only one. He's

(05:15):
got a bit of a seven fromsomewhere. He's from somewhere, not just
the vast array of meaningless America,which is what most characters seem to sort
of come from. It's like whenyou watch the making of for a favorite
TV show liked did you ever watchthe making of twenty four? Slight digression?

(05:36):
Here they're making it behind the scenesof something like that Audrey from twenty
four. You know she's got sortof like a very sort of soft American
accent and not really anything sort ofYou see her on the making of and
it's, oh my god, she'sgot a really strong American accent, and
she obviously like tones it down forthe show. It's really weird. So

(05:57):
she has a crazy annoying voice inreal life. Yeah, he's quite subtle
in the TV and you just madejust subtle on purpose. Yeah, you
just talk like that all the time. But you know, because you know
Audrey's voe. There's nothing wrong withAudrew's voice. Well there's nothing wrong with
the actress's voice either, but it'svery it's much more colloquial. Yeah,
and it's much more pronounced the Americanaccent, which is I think a lot

(06:20):
of Hollywood actors do tone it downa bit, which is quite weird.
No, it's good because it sortof keeps you neutral and people have to
see you as being able to becomeanything else. I think, and if
you were known as being particularly localizedto an area or an accent or something
like that, then within your careeryou'd forever be associated with that in people's

(06:43):
minds. Yeah. James Gandolphine isanother one. Yeah, it sounds absolutely
nothing like he does in true amountall the sopranos or anything like that.
I really were being similarly shocked whenI heard the woman who plays Rita on
Coronation Street speaking in real life,or Ross Kemp or Ross Kemp, Yeah,
in fact, any of those people. Yeah. Really so doctor McCoy,

(07:08):
did he ever do any of thebig saving everyone? Yeah? He
did lots of big disease curing,didn't he. Yeah. I just trusted
him so much. Yeah, Ithink he's you'd be all right, doctor
McCoy's there and yeah, good doctor, good doctor, good doctor. Didn't
you know? Beyond anything else,he's probably got the closest doctor captain relationship

(07:34):
out of all of them. He'scloser to Kirk than now Beverly and Picard
is a different, different sort ofcloseness, but as a sort of male
and male matey kind of relationship,McCoy and Kirk are got something very special.
You've got the feeling that Piccard wouldhave shagged Crusher given the opportunity.

(07:55):
Yes, And I doubt that Kirkwas ever after the same thing. No,
unless he spark ratic one night McGirkwas staying over and they felt he
was left out. Yeah, orthat's horrid image in my mind. Or
if their time at Aurora Pentade lasteda little bit longer than a couple of
days, Yeah, you never knowbunk beds. Shape Shifter gets led out.

(08:16):
Oh, shape shifter was married toDavid Bellie. Yeah, or maybe
the shape Shifter says, can't getcan't get Will Shatner to get it up,
so it has to turn into McCoy. McCoy is older. McCoy is
older. Yeah, okay, andhe was in also featured in the next
gen as well, didn't he Yeah, very old, very old, and

(08:37):
now he's dining one hundred thirty eightcoming to Starfleet Records. I think he
actually was that old in real life. Anyway, did you ever see him
go and fight at the okay,Karl, No, I've never seen him
in anything other than Star Trek.It's a good movie. You always had
that wig though. It's a wig? Yeah? Was it a wig?

(08:58):
Yeah, it's a wig. Yeah. People think it's Kirk. It is
Kirk. No, it was DuctorMcCoy. Yeah, but he has a
work as well. No, yeah, well we'll leave Kirk for now,
okay, but Ductor McCoy that that'sa wig. Yeah really yeah, that
makes sense, but it is surprising. Same with the spark really yeah,

(09:22):
nay, yeah, London Nim wasnot bold. I didn't say it was
a wig. All right, Okay, well that's fair enough and a horror.
So is McCoy bold or is hejust wearing a wig? No,
he's bald. He's bald. Yeah, right, okay, so it's a
horror, right and she's wearing awig. Oh right, okay, yeah,

(09:43):
excellent, what about check off?That's all his own hair. But
an electrical accident when he was achild means he never grew pubes. That's
so, yeah, McCoy. McCoy'sit is sardonic as well. He's quite
uh well, you know, he'sthe old I am constant does the Northern

(10:09):
Star. I'd give real money ifhe's shut up, you know, brilliant
like he's the he's his job isto say what we're all thinking. Yeah,
effectively, yeah, he's the he'sto an extent, he's the twentieth
century every man when exactly when StarTrek was running, wasn't he was the
sort of like you know, theone that the audience is, I can't

(10:30):
relate to Kirk because he's too heroicor whatever, and they can't relate to
McCoy because the spot because he's analien. Then McCoy is that guy that
he is most certainly that guy.He's so stout by things. Things wind
him up, and he's there,always wise cracking when you need one.

(10:50):
Yeah, and he's always ready totell you when someone's dead, yeah,
Jim, Yes he is. Hehas a number of catchphrases. He's dead
Jim. I'm a doctor, nota bricklayer. That's the one everybody always
says. Yeah, a doctor,not a brick There. There must have
been others. I don't think heever said, I'm not an engineer.

(11:11):
I'm not you know, I'm aradio DJ doctor, not a vascular surgeon.
Well, no i am. Whoops, I'm a doctor not a radiographer.
Oh yeah, I'm kind of thattoo anyway. So yeah, he
had catch phrases which none of theother doctors had. No, they didn't
know to be honest, when hedecides when he goes in in Star Trek

(11:35):
two, in the original draft ofThe Squirt, apparently he was meant to
check spos pulse and say he's deadJim, but they decided it would be
too comical. Too Yeah, tocomical. If he said that, you
would have ruined the scene. Ruinedit anyway. So yeah, McCoy pretty
good, Pretty good, I like, this is a tough one. This

(11:58):
is wonderful. Our next contender,doctor Beverly Krusher. And let's we'll move
on to that woman. Okay,let's skip over her. Okay, Doctor
Polanski can wait for a minute.Yeah, doctor Crusher. Now this is
an interesting one for the big crewbattles because the next gen contingent, I'm
pretty sure is getting shoved out ofthis one straight away. She's good.

(12:20):
I like doctor Krusher. She's verybland, though she's a bit of a
non character most of the time.She's very bland. There's not a lot
of passion behind that character. No, there is. They put They put
all of her passion into her hair, yes, and then they left her
to have the personality. Whoops,never mind Piccard. Did Piccard ever do

(12:41):
her No? Never, not once, not like after a Christmas party.
Well, they'd established by season seventhat they hadn't. At the end they
were going to. I think theymay well have done it in some of
the time in between the movies.But you know, like he says in
one of them, as I feltguilty before Jack died to being in love

(13:01):
with my best friend's wife, Iwouldn't feel guilty anymore. After that's been
dropping stuff, I apologized. Yeah, okay, I should put stuff down
and I can't drop it whole thingsand talk at the same time. Yeah,
it's difficult, I know. Sohere now, Yeah, what was
that saying, Beverly Crossier. Yeah, didn't chagd I bet they did eventually,

(13:24):
do you reckon? Yeah, I'mhoping they're doing Nemesis too. If
Nemesis too, I want them tomake it. You just call it ness
Nemesis too, star Trek star Trekeleven, Nemesis too or something like that.
You know that sounds like a reallystrange football score. Yeah. Well,
anyway, so so they did it. She spawned the devil Satan child.

(13:46):
She did. She did. Shesaved a lot of people, a
lot of diseases. Doctory thing.We're not measuring them on doctory things here,
No, not really, she dida lot of doctory things. Yeah,
because she was Untelly for a longtime. Yeah. Gates also helped
with the choreography of the film Labyrinth, did she now, Yes, Now,

(14:11):
I've seen Gates, mcfan and otherthings. I've seen her in a
film called Taking Taking Care of Business, which was also called File EF facts
on its American belation in Charles Groan, when she plays the ruthless businesswoman who
is at the dinner party at theend, I've not really seen it.

(14:33):
I just really know of the film. You mean, yeah, I've not
seen her in it. She's onlyin like one or two scenes. I
think that's that's it. Though,that's the only film I've ever seen Gates
mcvandon. I wonder what else shehas done. Does it matter? She's
very bland. She is very bland. Put all of her passion into her
hair, and then they dyed itblonde, which made it even worse.

(14:56):
I have all the next Gen charactersas well. She gets the least screen
time in the next gen movies.It's fair to say she's she's completely marginal
I mean, Judy gets more timein the next Gen movies than she does.
Damn right, though, she getsshe's completely marginalized. In to write
for her, they had to justgive her an episode, and yeah they
were Some of them were quite good. I like the one where she was

(15:18):
sucked into a vortex. Yeah,that's a good one, and stuff like
that. There were a few ofthem, Yeah, attached as a good
one. I love attached. Yeah, good episode and there I think Ryker
would have gone for her. Well, I think Diana might. Diana.
Diana might have like fucked him offa couple of times in her own I'm

(15:39):
going to have a crack at Beverlywhen he was a bit drunk and then
the next day he regretted it andhopes that Picard didn't find out. Yeah,
she'd never she wouldn't say anything aboutit, and she'd want to,
but she she told back, andshe'd hold back for the sake of Riker's
career because he was just drunk andbeing the horned on. But he is,
so we can appreciate that. Yeah, I think her for La cross

(16:00):
her. It's more about her relationshipwith Piccard. That's that's her big selling
thing is the fact that she's theone that got away for Piccard, which
makes her interesting even though she's notand it's kind of Yeah, yeah,
it's weird, but she's far moretolerable than the other doctor that was in
Next Gen. I hate Pulaski.I really hated that woman. I got

(16:25):
the feeling she was rubbish. Firstepisode. She nearly fucking dies, doesn't
she the child? Does she diein does she nearly die in the Child
Oh? No, the second episode, then she's in sorry, the one
in the Vortex. No, theone way. She goes down to that
planet and the genetically engineered children,and she turns into an old woman.

(16:45):
Kind of thinks yourself, Well,she was kind of already. Yeah,
yeah, she she was all right. I just didn't really like her because
you'd sit watching her going You're notBeverly. I want Beverly. When it's
Beverly coming back, I don't wantyou. Yeah. And she also never
made the obligatory guest appearance again oranything. You know, she never came

(17:10):
back, never came back, nevercame back. After season two that she
seemed to be old friends with Picard, though I don't remember anything of her
backstory apart from the fact that sheshagged Riker's old shag Riker's old man.
Yeah. Really, we're talking anawful lot about which doctor has shagged the
most people, and quite frankly,if we do that, then but she's

(17:32):
just going to win, so weshouldn't really concentrate. We're not going on
that. It's in a side.Do you think she would have shagged Riker
had right? Of course, shewould have Who wouldn't you shag Riker have
given half a chance? So wouldyou? Well that's true, but but
I mean she's already shagged his dad, right, But yeah, that's brilliant.
She might do a comparing contrast onegeneration to the next, who's got

(17:56):
the bigger knob? Well whatever,Yeah, now she's doing Star Trek the
next generation. That's not what youwant to hear when you're in bed,
is you know your dad's is bigger? That would kind of put you off
or I would leave. Yeah,I'd believe that would be it, that
would be under the game. Idon't know if doctor Pulaski could be.
That would be the caliber of womanthat would make me even contemplate having sex

(18:19):
with. Knowing the caliber of woman, it would have to be somebody.
I don't know. I mean,it's it's a weird concept as it is,
because I'm sorry, I'm just enjoyingthe caliber of woman. I don't
know. I'm falling into a weirdbit of despair with this train of thought,
though. Okay, let's move on. Let's move on. Let's move
on. Julian Julian Bisher rocks.Julian Bisher does rock. It's very hard

(18:44):
to not just give it to himstraight away. We're not going to.
We're not going to because that's toopredictable. Yes, but Julie, you
know, there's nothing more really togive it to Julian than any other doctor.
Perhaps he is a much more centralrole he's in comparing more to Bones
than to Crusha. He's a muchmore cential role, crusher to an extent,

(19:11):
especially towards the end of season seven. I've said this before, actually
gets more screen time than Cisco.It's ridiculous. Next to Cisco is probably
the largest character, and I meanthe Space nine is so spread out between
the ensemble anyway. Yeah, butI think next to Cisco it's it's Basher
gets then maybe Odo gets the mostscreen time, And it's kind of like,

(19:33):
it's really odd that the doctor getsthat much screen time and yet doesn't
have a particularly special relationship with Cisco. It's very odd. No, he
doesn't. He doesn't have a verygood, not a very good relationship.
He has a perfectly fine relationship withCisco, but there's no sort of bond
between the two of them. Hisspecial relationship is with her Brian and Jad's
ear. That was part of thegenius of that program was that the interlinking

(19:56):
relationships brought more characters in. Yeah, if you have a doctor link with
a captain, that's very insular.But you can have a doctor and a
captain both the main characters, andhave someone befriends with someone else, and
then you've got another character a sortof brings some in. Um. I
think he didn't seem to do anythingmore from a doctory standpoint than any other

(20:18):
doctor. In particular, he's killedmore people than any of the other doctors.
Well, we see him sort ofhave the he's that one with the
plague on that planet, and hecompletely fucks that up. He did fuck
that up. He killed all ofhis patients. In terms of killing more
people, I think it's probably becausehe is a wartime doctor. That's true.

(20:40):
We've got to give him that.Who we follow through our shoots a
lot of people. He does shootan awful lot of people, but he
saves an awful lot of people too. Yes, he doesn't kill indiscriminately.
He's not a violent person. Heis genetically engineered though, yes, which
is a little unfair. How didyou feel about that whole thing? I
mean, we suddenly discover he's geneticallyengineered. It's against the law. It

(21:03):
was interesting, It was interesting,and it didn't because he was pretending to
be normal. It didn't pose somany questions. And it created some lovely
scenes like when O'Brien suddenly realizes thatevery time he's lost at darts over the
past four years is because Julian lethim win. And it's just things like
that. I was just made youthink you fuck her, you absolutely,

(21:27):
but then at other points you justthink, well, hang on, you're
in a crisis and you're genetically enhanced, and you've got a gun. And
then it just it makes kind ofall the security offices look at like the
doctors are better shot the doctor that'snot. I never really trusted the bijure
and security forces to be no.I trusted Odo, and then I thought

(21:48):
everyone else was a bit tubby anda bit inept and a bit sort of
a gun in a job. Now, yeah, you kind of thought when
the Starfleet guys turned up a bitmore, all right, Okay, they're
there, that's their property, theirproper security guards, you can they didn't
do they didn't really play up onthat. The sort of the amount of
stuff that they could have done withthe different forces. You know, those
Bajur and medical officers and Bajore andsecurity officers were starfleeked personnel, and how

(22:12):
the starfleep personnel will clearly more bettertrained and yeah, with you know,
better equipment. Even I mean theystill carried around Bijore and phases, which
will probably be crap anyway, longtangent phase is a phaser. Phase is
a phaser. But if it shootsthe last words, aren't that was a

(22:34):
ship phaser? No it's not.Ah, yeah, that's the last If
you're lucky, if you're unlucky,you've been vaporized and you might just get
a fuck. Why didn't they dothat to the bog vaporize them? Yeah,
because they adapt, They adapt becauseyou shoot them a little bit and
they fall on the floor. Right, Yeah, if you'd vaporize them,

(22:56):
if they just ceased to be andeverything that they was was just vapor were
everything that they were became vapor Surelyno adaption process there? No, Well,
the shield is the adaption, isn'tI suppose maybe maybe so the first
one hits the shield and goes through, why second one doesn't. Why didn't

(23:18):
they just so the vaporized option createsso many fucking problems, the like you
know what you're saying about the movielogic and stuff like that. Suddenly in
Star Trek six, an alarm goesoff if you fire a phaser in a
starship unauthorized. Never see that again, do we? No, we don't.
I think it's because it's why don'twe? We should because I thought

(23:41):
it was a sensible idea. Itis a sensible idea. Unfortunately, it
does elbow lock your writers into makingthat happen every single time and unauthorized phaser
fight happens. But it should.Yeah, I've done that. They should
have seat belts. I'm just thinkingabout it now. There were so many
things that are so clearly obvious.Yeah, seatbelts are less obvious. Yeah,

(24:04):
I think. No sprinklers. No, they had fire suppression systems but
they just never work. No,we had better fire suppression systems here,
yes we do. You know,maybe the Federation should have taken a bit
more good old British fear of fire. I mean, the Great London Fire
was what three hundred years ago,and yet we still have fire doors and
ever a fucking building in this country. We get we always will because we're

(24:29):
afraid of fire so much in thiscountry. When the last time you died
in the fire, last time Idied in the fire, and not since
the last Thursday. There you go. The safety percussions are working, they
are so. But Sheer kills alot of people. And he has some
special relationships. Out of the maledoctors, he's clearly the best looking.

(24:51):
And his ladies, yes he isladies. He is ladies, which does
add to his que a little bit. He does. Then we have oh,
he has all the sections that youwanted stuff. Yeah, he's a
spy stuff with Garrett No, yousee, because he's so fucking interesting.

(25:12):
You see here we run into aproblem, yes, in that he's given
an absolute crap ton of screen time. Yeah, he is. And this
maybe contributes to the long list ofthings that he's done, achieved what have
you. Plus I mean he's avery accomplished actor as well. Some people
think he's quite over the top,and he does that weird thing of his

(25:33):
voice when he shouts it's like youcan't allow them to do this, damn
it. He sort of goes abit higher. That's exactly what he does.
You know, it's not right andthere's a moral it sort of goes
up. It's really weird. Andyeah, he has had more more of
success than any other with the possibleexception of Colemeney. It's had more success

(25:57):
post Star Trek Dick Space nine thanany of the other cast members, and
has gone on to be in twentyfour and Siriana. And I've only seen
him in three things Vertical Limits andoh no, he's been in loads of
stuff. He's only for Siriana,that one with the dragons and Christian Belle

(26:18):
Rain of Fire for like a shot. Yeah, it was clearly in morning's
work if that. Yeah, No, he's been He's been in a few
things. He's gone on to havequite a success. I think a lot
of his success is attributable to thepolitical state of the world at the moment
and the fact that he plays aconvincing Arab terrorist, which or Arab diplomat

(26:41):
or Arab of anything at the moment, which is a common role in film
at the moment. It is welike to film people who aren't Arabs,
and he didn't look particularly Arabi throughoutthe Spaceline. It's along afterwards. Well,
he was supposed to be Cisco thoughhe was. He was the first
choice for Cisco, but then heturned up for the audition about a beard
and the producers said, no,way too young. But with a beard

(27:04):
he looks so much older. Maybethat's why he had such a significant role
because he was going to they wantedhim a Cisco. Yeah, and so
they still gave him the same amountof storyline. He's just not the captain.
Yeah, m hmm. Never gotDacks though, did he? He
did didn't get jad Zea. Youknow, talk about settling. I know

(27:30):
that it is the intergalactic equivalent ofgoing for a girl, not getting turned
away and shagging a slightly less attractivebest mate is exactly like that. Yeah,
I shagged Dacks, did you right? Well? Wolf had jad Zea,
the guy with the translucent skull hadJadzear. Everyone in the galaxy had
Jazzer except for you. Bones hadJazza. How does that? How do

(27:55):
you like them? Apples? Heshouldn't have Jazer though he had an an
earlier Dak. Yeah, that's true. Damn could have had Jadds here though.
Yeah, if it'd been alive,McCoy would have had judds here.
Yeah. In fact, judds nearlywanted him when they went back in time.
Exactly, that's what I'm basing it. Yeah, exactly, that's exactly
what I'm basing. We should tryand find something to compare them with other
than sexual prowess. I've just seemsto be on my mind this evening.

(28:19):
I don't know why. It's verystrange, just me in the room.
I know that's what scares me.Okay, right, moving swiftly on to
a doctor who isn't actually there,who's brillianty in thin air. Yeah,
he's hologram. He's the doctor ordoctor Zimmerman, didn't they They sort of

(28:40):
call he wanted to be called doctorZimmerman. While now this guy actually crops
up in Deep Space nine as well. He also crops up in next jen.
He also crops up in in firstcontent. In first content. Yeah,
um, this is the emergency medicalSo the Voyager ships that's out.
M Captain Janeway gets it last inthe Delta quadrant and kills a third of

(29:06):
her crew, including chief chief medicalofficer, which is a blinding first mover
as captain. It's sort of setsup her career to come. Really,
didn't kill your first officer and youin your medical officer, make a ghastly
mistake and get a whole load ofMarquis to help you run a ship.
Yes, yea, although they remainthe only surviving Marquis. Yes, be

(29:32):
interested to know what they said whenthey got home. They'd have been quite
upset about that. Oh no,they find out on an episode, yeah
said, before they find out thecommunication arrays, they find out. Oh
they're all dead, old bugger.If only we had some Voyager on DVD.
Yeah, I wonder. So thedoctor, he's an interesting case because
the doctor is not only a verygood doctor and a very good contender for

(29:59):
the best doctor in Star Trek,he's also the best character in Star Trek
Voyager by quite a significant margin.I agree with you on both those points.
Other than I think technically, interms of doctoring, he's arguably the
best because he has all the knowledgeof all the other doctors in terms of
sham medical ability. Absolutely, heis actually the amalgamation of all significant doctors.

(30:26):
But he doesn't have that bedside manneror that ability to understand certain that
more complex human emotions. But hedid develop it later on. That was
his character involved. And yeah,and moved on and so I think not
only that, but on a numberof occasions he's a cheeky fucker for for
a hologram. He's a cheeky whenhe tricks people, or when he's like

(30:51):
the only one left on board totrap the aliens in a certain scenario or
something like that. He's always alittle bit sarcastic. Yes he is.
And there's the evil of version ofhim. Do you remember the evil?
Remember the Evil? Oh? Yeah, it was on the Equinox. There
was Equinox Part one or two,which still remains one of the best two
parties in Voyager was an excellent one. Where was another ship called the Equinox

(31:12):
in the delta quadrant, similar situation. Yeah, In fact, I think
they'd gone looking for Voyager or somethinglike that, and it ended up having
the same thing happened to them,and then they end up trying to travel
back through the Delta quadron. Butthey've not had as much success as Voyager,
and they've had to make dark andhorrible decisions and break the prime directive
and whoever knows who else knows what, and their doctor has been reprogrammed to

(31:36):
take out his ethical subroutines or somethinglike that. So their doctor is exactly
the same physically, but it's justa mean version. It's a little bit
like that episode of Red Dwarf wherethey go to the nice ship and the
bag. I'd like to see that. Yeah. Oh, it's an excellentsome
Voyager and excellent two party. Dowe have any other rich fans who can
send his DVDs because I've got nomoney now no, oh that people have

(32:00):
to go and buy movies. Youshould see. Well, the slim Line
ones are coming out Voyager, slimLine. They're on pre order now really
the next they're going to be releasedover the next three or four months.
Yeah. Now that's interesting because they'llthen they'll be cheap before long. Yeah,
because seventeen nine, seventeen nine.Anyway, why are we talking about
this? So the doctor, Yeah, he's got all the medical information.

(32:24):
He's he's very you know, he'she's great. You know, I think
his character evolves more than the others. Well, he evolves so therefore instantly
is more evolutionary than any of theother characters on Voyage. That's really unfair.
Anyway, He's yeah, he doesevolve more than on the other characters.
He's he's more interesting because the ideaof having you know, what do

(32:46):
you do next? You know,like, as you for your character to
explore humanity, how do you youknow? Oh, well, we've had
an alien, and then we hada robot, and then we had a
shape shifter, and what can wedo now? A hologram? A hologram
who knows he's a hologram. Yeah, that's the key bit. At no
point thinks he's alive. He knowshe's a hologram. He knows exactly how

(33:08):
he gets treaty, understands how he'sbeing treated because he has a learning program,
and it's interesting. Yeah, theepisode of Deep Space nine when you
meet his creator as well, andthey're trying to make Bashir into the next
Yeah, the next one. That'swhen we found out he's genetically checking.
Yeah, a GM product, aGM product. Yeah, so only trusts

(33:32):
organic doctors and he's just organic doctors. So yeah, so he's yeah,
he's it's interesting when you find outhis sort of backstory and everything. And
and I really like the Voyager Doctor. Yeah. The Voyage Doctor is my
favorite, just because he's a cheekof that the bastard, and because he
has some quite cool episodes and he'seasily the most interesting character on that show.

(33:58):
Yeah, and he saves it fromcompany eat pain bottom, monotony and
otherwise wanting to put your eyes outwith a biro while you watch. It's
a bit harsh. That is abit harsh, But hey, why I
break the habit of a lifetime Exactly. I'd like to rewatch it and reevaluate.
I would love to rewatch it.So Enterprise Doctors again one of the

(34:21):
more redeeming features of the show.I like doctor Flux. This is a
tough one. This is a reallytough one because we've got four out of
five a good doctors and Cross isnot bad. No, she's not bad.
She's she's she's just completely out ofthe running. Though. I felt
so bad about that though straight awayI didn't want to just throw her out,

(34:42):
but you have to because she's sogood. But she's so clearly the
weakest I know, because she's lameand she has no passion. Now,
that big thing was, oh,it's the it's the nineteen eighties. We
can have women doctors now, reallyreally yeah? Yeah, okay, So
that a Flux was a oh god, what was her name? He was

(35:06):
a funny alien that we're never goingto see ever again. Who can have
multiple He had four or five wivesthree three wives, three wives and each
of them and had three husbands.That sounds weird because you think at first
that sounds good, and then youthink, oh, but that sounds a
bit bad actually, and then yousort of think, actually that I could

(35:29):
work, and then you think no, no, it really couldn't. And
you think, what if you werelike them, then maybe it could work.
And so you keep sort of bouncingback between the idea if you just
suddenly introduce that rule in human society, and not the idea that all men
can have three wives with the wiveshave to remain faithful to the husband,
but that the wives can have threehusbands as well. Yeah, it's just

(35:51):
it's crazy idea. I don't knowif you are about that. You know
what, if you're the husband witha small cock, I mean, that's
going to really upset you. You'rethe wives lived together, It wasn't like
somewhere they all kind of like,Yeah, so you get some time on
your own, Yeah, do someproper work. That's how you get to
become a doctor instead of a podcaster. Yeah, well you have to mess

(36:14):
around faffing about. I don't knowwhere I'm going with I don't know where
you're going. But I'm sure ifI had three No, if I had
three wives, that would be anightmare. Yeah, they'd all want stuff
if But if you had three wiveswho had three husbands, then it might
not be the nightmare might not behere an i'mare to see what you'd hope

(36:35):
at least one of their other husbandswas a decent provider. Well, yeah,
you'd have to hope that you weren'tthe best husband of all three of
the wives, so that they wereall around at your house all the time.
Yeah, you'd hope that you werethe sort of depending on what they
were up for my jardi, I'vegot it on my mind tonight. I
don't know where it's coming from.I apologize sincerely, Yes, I apologize

(36:59):
for him. My hormones, yourhormones. Yeah, I'm turning into a
man, I see. Yeah,good, it's about time. So flox
is, Yeah, he's he's theonly alien on the ship apart from de
Paul, the other alien. Theother alien, so not the only alien
on the Yeah, but Vulcans don'treally count. Yes, they do that
because we've known them for so long. This was a new alien. He

(37:22):
was something. He was an oldalien, but he was a new alien
because we've never seen them before.And the Interspecies Medical program exchange thing.
That's right, that's what he wasdoing. Yeah. And his counterpart,
well, he actually he got acouple of episodes that were sort of rehashes

(37:44):
of existing episodes. He the shipwe had, Yeah, we had his
episode that was a remake of aVoyager episode. Yeah, the one where
only he can stay awake, wasit or something like that. Yeah,
and he thinks that was it.The doctor did that one. Yeah,

(38:07):
everyone had to be put to sleepexcept for the doctor, and when he
was there to Paul is suddenly therewith him helping him, which is a
direct remake of an episode where thedoctor of Voyager has to stay asleep and
seven of nine suddenly they're helping him. Yeah. And then I think Data's
Day was pretty much remade as aconcept rather than him helping Chief of Brian

(38:32):
get married. Oh well, hiscorrespondence with his counterparty on the Floxian ship
or whatever it was. Yeah,but I liked him. Used animals a
lot, Yeah, kills his triplesin putting him in with targs and things.
That was cool. Yeah, he'sinteresting. And they had that ridiculous

(38:53):
thing where he smiles and he doesthat stupidly big smile on the first episode
for cling on Ridges. Also responsiblefor Clingon Ridges not the advancement of makeup
technology between the nineteen sixties and eighties. No flocks flocks, yeah, pH
Is it's a flocks Yeah. SoFlox was good, a good character in

(39:19):
Enterprise, and I quite like theactor guy as well as seen him in
a couple of things. He wasin Denzel Washington Time. That was not
a bad little film. You knowthe ending as soon as you've seen the
first four and a half minutes.But hey, some movies are there for
that. And also he was inan episode of Nick Tuck where he wanted
them to amputate a healthy leg.So that sounds wrong. It was fucked

(39:39):
up. They did it in theend, did they? Yeah? Odd,
well, I don't enough, I'lldo it. Really would you do
that? Would you check someone's legoff for a yeah? Really? Yeah?
How much would it have to be? Million pounds? Would you do
it for a million? For amillion? Easily? Would do? For
the method chopping? Well, ofcourse it would. I mean, if

(40:01):
you want to do I gave youa hacksaw, yeah, fine, But
no, if I had some surgicalimplement anaesthetis a chainsaw or a large band
chainsaw or a large band saw,then you might have to up the price
a little bit on Fred. Reallyyeah, even if you got to wear
goggles and an apron. I've gotto wear goggles and an apron. It's
the sound of the man screaming thatI wouldn't want to be haunting my dreams

(40:22):
for the left rest of my life. Oh no, because we're assuming that
he's asked you to do this,and he's unconscious. Okay, right,
so he's unconscious and I've just gotto chop his leg off. Well,
you've got to remove his leg inone way. I know that. Yeah,
I'll do that. Really payment enough, Yeah, okay, remember that.
People, If you ever need aleg removing, you've got to dump

(40:44):
load trash, a dump truck ofcash. Then mike dust and look at
your leg, your man. Howlong have we been talking for about these
doctor people? Approximately forty seven minutes. Well, let's sum up. Let's
sum up, doctor McCoy, very, doctor crusher out already yeah, doctor

(41:07):
PULASKI never in Never and never inthe sheer we I this is Flox and
the doctor. This one the finalists. Really, they're all it's too good
to decide between them all. It'sit's difficult, isn't it. It's difficult.
I mean, I'm gonna let's becontroversial. Okay, why not I

(41:34):
break the habit of a show.I'd like to propose, Yeah, the
doctor, okay, from Voyager mThis would be the first time a crew
member of Voyager had won anything ever. I think they won the most ship
character or something like that collectively.Yeah, not including the doctor, worst
character in Star Trek, worst characterin Star Trek. Okay, Well,

(41:57):
the doctor is is a very verygood choice, and I think he's certainly
see it's only a slim win aswell, which kind of makes it a
bit bitter sweet. But I thinkmarginally he's probably the most interesting of the
doctors. I agree with you forbeing a doctor as well, which,

(42:17):
all right, that might be asilly way to judge this matter, but
it's still a little bit better thansaying who'd win in a fight, and
I think that's a better way ofdoing Yeah, and he probably would because
you can't kill him. No,he's a hologram. Yeah, he's already
doesn't exist, so you know youYeah, but I think it's for she
had amount of doctoring. He beatsthe Shia, and I think in terms

(42:42):
of you know, I think asgood as flox is, I don't think
he's as good as the docs wedoes, doctors, probably including himself.
Yeah. Well, this is theproblem with these little summaries, as we're
switching between personal preference and medical slashphysical ability. That's because which is because

(43:02):
the show is a complete mass.Yes, it's very easier to do it
than others. This one is reallythis is really tough. I'm sure we'll
have everyone is agreeing with us onthis one, but yeah, I'm gonna
have to agree with you that I'mgonna have to say the doctor, Yeah,
the doctor voyager person wins. It'snever gonna happen again. Enjoy it,

(43:22):
Enjoy your moment, voyager, besttheme tune. This gonna be realish
it and gonna happen. Someone willfall in love with someone that can't be
with forever and all that, orthis is gonna being Oh no, I'd

(43:49):
like to see it again. I'dlike to see it again, I'll watch
it. I'd quite happily sit throughevery episode of Voyager again. Yeah,
if they were like I did itwith nine, you did it with this?
Well you didn't, did you?I started it what I didn't need
to and watch everyone until there wereno more left. Yes, I will
do that with Voyager. I willdo that with Voyager because Voyager is different,

(44:10):
familiar with Then we can do bestepisode of Voyager seasons. Yeah,
and and know more about it generallywill be better star Trek fans. Well
once if if no one's bought usthem by the time, then at seventeen
ninety nine or fifteen ninety nine onplayoff, we'll start buying them. Right,
well, maybe we'll have enough moneyto buy us a copy anyway one
day. All right, then um, then original series, then Enterprise,

(44:37):
and I don't see the original seriesis not too bad because that's only three
seasons. So yeah, yeah,I don't want to watch Enterprise again.
I don't want to remember. Idon't want to know. So that was
our best of doctors. Okay,you pleased with that, I'm pleased with
that. I feel I hope thejob's angry this time. If you if

(45:00):
you're angry, now, just justfuck off through hoops. We're jumping through
hoops here to please you. Voyageof people. No, really, genuinely,
he was the best. Yeah yeah, So take your moment in the
in the spotlight because it's not it'sshort. Now, it's going to be

(45:22):
over in five minutes and it's onlylasted five minutes. So thank you for
listening. We'll do the wrapping upbit now. OK. DVDs for movies.
You should see Year one in thestore sounded a bit like Christoph walking
though, yeah yeah, Year one, Yeah, that sounded nothing like Christopher
Walking in the store. All theepisodes from the first year of movies.

(45:45):
You should see the water in thereon DVD. What big Wolf, big
bad Wolf. You can't do ChristopherWalker? Have you seen that? Yeah?
Yeah, brilliant. That just aslight day. Anyone who hasn't seeing
Christopher Walk and reading the Three LittlePigs, please type it into YouTube.

(46:05):
It will put a link in theforest. It will change your life as
well. It is, so it'sthe best ten minutes on YouTube. It's
brilliant. That's the sort of thingI'd have on my chat show. So
now the pig has a chin.She's brilliant, said, he knocks on

(46:29):
the door, but it's a strawdoor, so how he knucks. I
don't know who wrote this. Soyou can get those in the store.
So it's every episode. They're ona DVD the Price ninety nine. There's
six discs and they're where possible.They're now encoded at three hundred twenty kbps
stereo, so they sound as lovelyas they're ever going to. Please be

(46:52):
aware, of course, due tothe nature of our recording methods, some
episodes sound better than others. Someof them are. If you've listened to
any shows by Simplies in the Gamesand you will already know this. So
I feel the grand majority of themare very good, indeed to say the
situation in which we record, Butsome of them are. Some of them

(47:13):
have been awful. That's across theboard. It's not just picking on movies.
You should see, that's all.So they're there. The T shirts
have gone. Now you can't getone if you wanted one, You've missed
your chance. Really, yeah,they're gone. I'm putting the odor in
either tomorrow or Wednesday, so youcan't have more. No no more,
no more. One I'd said thisabout the Night Arist T shirts. Once

(47:35):
they this is it all right,They're done. You can you can maybe
special appeal to me. If it'sTuesday where you are, you might be
able to get a special appeal emailinto me. But other than that,
no more Night Arist T shirts becausethose people got sued. And I thought
people got sued. Some people gotsued for printing a T shirt with a

(47:57):
slogan from a movie on And grantedthey saw did far more than us,
and it was a bigger slogan froma bigger movie, but I just thought
I did think that. I knowyou did. I did say this,
but it was it was a Tshirts with nobody puts Baby in the corner
from Dirty Dancing. And although Ithink you could stand up in cotton and
go, I don't think Timeline isquite the cash cow and movie franchise for

(48:22):
the studio that Dirty Dancing is forUniversal. Yeah, so I don't think
probably. Yeah, I think Icould maybe argue it's more my catch phrase
than theirs. Now as much asI hate that because I don't think it's
actually that funny, but there yougo. They'll be making so T shirts.

(48:45):
Was going to do one and anothermovie used to see one. Okay,
so don't despair. There'll be moreT shirts possibly one day. Other
than that, what else we got? You can dig us on dig both
of some podcast alley. Yeah,you can emails, you can join our
forums they're smashing, yes, andyou're gonna listen to an array of other

(49:05):
shows. Great programming from this network, great, fantastic and the best part
about it is it's free, free, free, all free. You know
how this show is free. Allthe others are as well, now they
are. That's a good thing topoint. So if you're interested in society,
culture, music or movies or manin Houses, Men in Houses,

(49:28):
Yes, your little comedy rants fromtwo British guys, download our shows.
You won't be disappointed. Well youmight be, but if you are,
you just hit unsubscribe because they're free. Any thing is a miracle, it's
amazing. I spoke to someone Iwent to school with the other day on
the old Facebook sort of thing andit's like, what do you do now

(49:49):
and all this I told her aboutsimply syndicated and she had a look,
oh that's how much is it?It's free, it's free download, it's
free. You have to worry,and she did it. I never heard
from me again. That's fine enoughbecause I didn't really care. Probably offended
her or something. Probably I wouldhope. So people find our content offensive.

(50:09):
I don't know why we swear alot, do we? And we
talk about Riker changing people, leavingsof the floor that's mopping up. Come.
I think we've been quite clear untilthis end bit. We've just gonna
explicit tabbed ourselves. Why not?I just put it on all of it.
We're just rambling now. This isturning into an episode of Weekend Watch

(50:31):
it, so we'll learn this.And went went there. Oh dear,
thank you for listening, everybody.We'll be back next week. Bye bye.
Yeah, you went there.