Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Good morning. You're listening to Michigan's Big Show starring Michael
Patrick Shields, and I'm Scott Ellis sitting in this morning
filling in to bring you some great guests to My
next guest is Ed Nola. He's from the Michigan County
Road Association. He's the chief Deputy and legislative director. Good morning,
at How are you?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Good morning, Scott, I'm great.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Well, I know you're out traveling the roads this morning,
and you were hoping to join me in the studio
and unfortunately because of the backups and construction that is
a good thing that we're getting done and you couldn't
make it. But you know, I think a lot of
times where people get confused, are you know, kind of
tell us the difference? What are the difference between a
county road versus the other roads? And I don't think
the general public really always understands that.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Well, of what you drive on is either a county
road or a local city street that's based on the
jurisdiction or the boundaries of the cities. Anything i'll inside
the city limits is generally a county road. Even those
county subdivisions or those rural subdivisions that are off of
(01:08):
county roads. Those generally belong and are being maintained by
the county road departments as part of their system.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
And so that means it's a different pot of funding
for you, right. I know you and Lan spin Onimi
from MIA Michigan Infrastructure. You guys have been working together
and battling and trying to find a permanent road funding.
I've learned so much from you over the years of
different concepts. How does the funding flow to the county roads.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well, it goes into the Michigan Transportation Fund, and then
there are some de ducts or right offshoots that are
taken like the Recreation Improvement Fund that's two percent of
just a gasoline tax. And then we've got a mirage
of different types of carve outs for bridges, for transit,
(01:56):
for TEDF to Transportation Economic Development Fund, and then it
comes down to the three road groups m DOT, Cities
and counties. M DOUG gets thirty nine percent, We get
thirty nine percent, and then the cities get twenty two
percent of the balance after those carveouts are taken off
the top.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
So with carve outs, it's a pretty simple process. It
sounds like, uh yeah, I mean, you've tried to explain
it too many times and I still don't understand it.
And you know, with the gas tax, so as you know,
you know, the budget obviously has been you know, a
long battle and you're always the heat of it. But
like I think, this year, of all years, this was
the number one priority by by everybody, by the Governor,
(02:36):
by you know, Speaker Hall, by Senate majority leader when
he brings what what tell me your thoughts on how
the how it ended up and where we're at and
what we can see going forward for our roads, especially
the county roads.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Well that that's what was the unusual part about this
year's tax or transportation funding package is that all three
bodies pretty much agreed on a number concept, which was
start giving more money to local roads and local streets.
Those are the ones that are in dire straits right now.
And we've proven that from the county road level. And
(03:10):
you know, it turned out pretty gosh darn good. I'm happy,
and I want to thank the governor, the Speaker of
the House, and the majority leader in the Senate. They
did their job. They finally got this bad boy across
the finish line. We couldn't be any happier if we tried.
But you know, there are always those you know, that
feel like they were kind of left. But you got
(03:33):
to remember that even though we've got a substantial amount
of money coming in, we lost six hundred million we
had under the twenty fifteen Transportation package. There was income
text revenue that was supposed to go to the Michigan
Transportation Fund and the tune of six hundred million. We
lost all that, and I'm pretty sure that's being used
to backfill places here and there where everybody took a haircut.
(03:55):
So when everybody says that we made out, well, we
took a little bit of a haircut too. So just
remember that.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Sure, and I think you threw me off when you
said all three agreed. But yeah, I'm coming back from
that now. But you know, I think people don't understand you.
And we've heard people talk about toll roads and other
fun I mean the future. You know, we're so far
behind and keeping up with our roads because of not
being able to come to agreements like the bodies disc
did this year. What is the long term? Look, how
(04:23):
do we what are some ideas that we could fund
roads permanently actually maintain them. What do you guys look
at for options?
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Well, right right now, we're going to get about one
point eighty five billion more in the near future. The
reason I say that is because twenty six actually starts January,
so that's when the actual new revenue and the collections begin.
For the new package that would just passed, but not
nac JET, we're still waiting for the governor to sign that.
But that's only three quarters of a year, and twenty
(04:50):
twenty seven will have a full year and we'll see
the full allotment of revenue. Hopefully that that's going to
be generated. And the reason I say hopefully is because
the marijuana tax is not a given, but it's a
it's pretty good. I think the fiscal people who can
estimate really well, and they estimate that's going to be
four hundred and twenty million dollars, and hopefully that's how
(05:11):
much will be generated and collected. So we're looking at
a gradual increase up to twenty thirty, when that new
revenue will jump up to about two point one maybe
two point two billion dollars. So we're we're excited about that.
I'm sorry, Scott, I didn't for the end.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Of your no, I mean that's that's what I wanted
to kind of get in and you know, and I
know that's a tough tax for the cannabis world, and
we're hoping, you know, obviously that's an industry that is
you know, still hanging in there. And you're right. We
talked about that, I think late nights at the Capitol
the other night about what will what will it really generate?
I mean you will continue, obviously, will you continue to
look for other ways to long term fund roads? Are
(05:48):
you guys still having those discussions and research like other
states maybe do?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Actually we are. I think if you look at what
the Senate proposed and what was agreed to was seven
point five million dollars for a road usage charge structure
or method to collecting transportation revenue. What that means is
you're gonna pay by the mile, and that is a long,
long process. First of all, we've got to get the
(06:14):
parameter set up, who's going to collect the money, who's
going to collect the information the data, and the data
being only miles we only contract we're only tracking or
receiving your miles driven, not where you went, how fast
you went, how many times you stop, just miles and
based on those miles driven, you will pay a per
penny rate, and that way everybody's paying the same amount,
(06:36):
whether you're a combustible engine vehicle or whether you're some
sort of an alternative fuel energy vehicle of any kind, hydrogen, electric,
et cetera, whatever's out there in the future. That way
we won't have to worry about this in the future,
and that will generate a consistent long term revenue source.
But we have to start doing something now because this
(06:56):
is a transition that's going to take anywhere is from
eight to ten years. Other states have already said that
have already started this, recognize that, and they generally have
been starting with the alternative energy vehicles, starting with them,
and then they move on the combustible engines by here
or by model. I'm not sure how they're doing it.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Well. I want to say thanks. I know you and
Lance have worked on this for years and years and
you are making our roads better and we appreciate it
and we look forward to see them in spring hitting
those county roads. This is Scott Ellis filling in on
the Michigan Big Show for Michael Patrick Shields
Good morning. You're listening to Michigan's Big Show starring Michael
Patrick Shields, and I'm Scott Ellis sitting in this morning
filling in to bring you some great guests to My
next guest is Ed Nola. He's from the Michigan County
Road Association. He's the chief Deputy and legislative director. Good morning,
at How are you?
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Good morning, Scott, I'm great.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
Well, I know you're out traveling the roads this morning,
and you were hoping to join me in the studio
and unfortunately because of the backups and construction that is
a good thing that we're getting done and you couldn't
make it. But you know, I think a lot of
times where people get confused, are you know, kind of
tell us the difference? What are the difference between a
county road versus the other roads? And I don't think
the general public really always understands that.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Well, of what you drive on is either a county
road or a local city street that's based on the
jurisdiction or the boundaries of the cities. Anything i'll inside
the city limits is generally a county road. Even those
county subdivisions or those rural subdivisions that are off of
(01:08):
county roads. Those generally belong and are being maintained by
the county road departments as part of their system.
Speaker 1 (01:16):
And so that means it's a different pot of funding
for you, right. I know you and Lan spin Onimi
from MIA Michigan Infrastructure. You guys have been working together
and battling and trying to find a permanent road funding.
I've learned so much from you over the years of
different concepts. How does the funding flow to the county roads.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Well, it goes into the Michigan Transportation Fund, and then
there are some de ducts or right offshoots that are
taken like the Recreation Improvement Fund that's two percent of
just a gasoline tax. And then we've got a mirage
of different types of carve outs for bridges, for transit,
(01:56):
for TEDF to Transportation Economic Development Fund, and then it
comes down to the three road groups m DOT, Cities
and counties. M DOUG gets thirty nine percent, We get
thirty nine percent, and then the cities get twenty two
percent of the balance after those carveouts are taken off
the top.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
So with carve outs, it's a pretty simple process. It
sounds like, uh yeah, I mean, you've tried to explain
it too many times and I still don't understand it.
And you know, with the gas tax, so as you know,
you know, the budget obviously has been you know, a
long battle and you're always the heat of it. But
like I think, this year, of all years, this was
the number one priority by by everybody, by the Governor,
(02:36):
by you know, Speaker Hall, by Senate majority leader when
he brings what what tell me your thoughts on how
the how it ended up and where we're at and
what we can see going forward for our roads, especially
the county roads.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
Well that that's what was the unusual part about this
year's tax or transportation funding package is that all three
bodies pretty much agreed on a number concept, which was
start giving more money to local roads and local streets.
Those are the ones that are in dire straits right now.
And we've proven that from the county road level. And
(03:10):
you know, it turned out pretty gosh darn good. I'm happy,
and I want to thank the governor, the Speaker of
the House, and the majority leader in the Senate. They
did their job. They finally got this bad boy across
the finish line. We couldn't be any happier if we tried.
But you know, there are always those you know, that
feel like they were kind of left. But you got
(03:33):
to remember that even though we've got a substantial amount
of money coming in, we lost six hundred million we
had under the twenty fifteen Transportation package. There was income
text revenue that was supposed to go to the Michigan
Transportation Fund and the tune of six hundred million. We
lost all that, and I'm pretty sure that's being used
to backfill places here and there where everybody took a haircut.
(03:55):
So when everybody says that we made out, well, we
took a little bit of a haircut too. So just
remember that.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Sure, and I think you threw me off when you
said all three agreed. But yeah, I'm coming back from
that now. But you know, I think people don't understand you.
And we've heard people talk about toll roads and other
fun I mean the future. You know, we're so far
behind and keeping up with our roads because of not
being able to come to agreements like the bodies disc
did this year. What is the long term? Look, how
(04:23):
do we what are some ideas that we could fund
roads permanently actually maintain them. What do you guys look
at for options?
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Well, right right now, we're going to get about one
point eighty five billion more in the near future. The
reason I say that is because twenty six actually starts January,
so that's when the actual new revenue and the collections begin.
For the new package that would just passed, but not
nac JET, we're still waiting for the governor to sign that.
But that's only three quarters of a year, and twenty
(04:50):
twenty seven will have a full year and we'll see
the full allotment of revenue. Hopefully that that's going to
be generated. And the reason I say hopefully is because
the marijuana tax is not a given, but it's a
it's pretty good. I think the fiscal people who can
estimate really well, and they estimate that's going to be
four hundred and twenty million dollars, and hopefully that's how
(05:11):
much will be generated and collected. So we're looking at
a gradual increase up to twenty thirty, when that new
revenue will jump up to about two point one maybe
two point two billion dollars. So we're we're excited about that.
I'm sorry, Scott, I didn't for the end.
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Of your no, I mean that's that's what I wanted
to kind of get in and you know, and I
know that's a tough tax for the cannabis world, and
we're hoping, you know, obviously that's an industry that is
you know, still hanging in there. And you're right. We
talked about that, I think late nights at the Capitol
the other night about what will what will it really generate?
I mean you will continue, obviously, will you continue to
look for other ways to long term fund roads? Are
(05:48):
you guys still having those discussions and research like other
states maybe do?
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Actually we are. I think if you look at what
the Senate proposed and what was agreed to was seven
point five million dollars for a road usage charge structure
or method to collecting transportation revenue. What that means is
you're gonna pay by the mile, and that is a long,
long process. First of all, we've got to get the
(06:14):
parameter set up, who's going to collect the money, who's
going to collect the information the data, and the data
being only miles we only contract we're only tracking or
receiving your miles driven, not where you went, how fast
you went, how many times you stop, just miles and
based on those miles driven, you will pay a per
penny rate, and that way everybody's paying the same amount,
(06:36):
whether you're a combustible engine vehicle or whether you're some
sort of an alternative fuel energy vehicle of any kind, hydrogen, electric,
et cetera, whatever's out there in the future. That way
we won't have to worry about this in the future,
and that will generate a consistent long term revenue source.
But we have to start doing something now because this
(06:56):
is a transition that's going to take anywhere is from
eight to ten years. Other states have already said that
have already started this, recognize that, and they generally have
been starting with the alternative energy vehicles, starting with them,
and then they move on the combustible engines by here
or by model. I'm not sure how they're doing it.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
Well. I want to say thanks. I know you and
Lance have worked on this for years and years and
you are making our roads better and we appreciate it
and we look forward to see them in spring hitting
those county roads. This is Scott Ellis filling in on
the Michigan Big Show for Michael Patrick Shields
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