325: Conner & Brinley Snyder

One morning in September of 2019, paramedics were directed to a home in the village of Kempton, Pennsylvania. A 911 call had come in from a frantic mother. She described finding her children hanging from the rafters of the basement.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Before we dive into today's episode, I wanted to let
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(00:21):
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out Morbidology Plus in your Apple Podcasts app Well, let's
get into today's case.

Speaker 2 (01:15):
It was a very difficult investigation. Any time that any
of us have to investigate prosecute cases that involved the
abuse or death of an innocent child, it all hits

(01:35):
us in the heart.

Speaker 1 (01:57):
Talked into the rolling hills and farmland to be eastern
Pennsylvania lies the small village of Kempton. It's close to
the base of the Blue Mountain Range, a place where
winding roads cut through pastures and forests. Kempton was settled
in the eighteenth century, primarily by the Pennsylvania Dutch. These
settlers established farms mills and small churches. By the May

(02:19):
eighteen hundreds, it had a post office, general store and
was becoming a small but active farming community. The arrival
of the railroad helped to shape the village's early economy.
Even today, Kempton has kept its unique charm, but it
has a surprisingly active cultural life for such a rural village.
There's the Wannamaker Kempton and Southern Railroad Hawk Mountain Sanctuary,

(02:42):
and it has a thriving folk festival culture. Life for
the residents is quiet and peaceful, but that was all
shattered one day in September of two thy nineteen, a
nine one one call came into police reporting something so
horrific that it sounded like a scene from a horror mood.
Two children were unresponsive, found hanging from the rafters of

(03:05):
a basement. Lisa Snyder was a single mother raising three
children in a modest white home on a dead end route.

(03:27):
Her eldest Owen, was seventeen years old. Then there was
eight year old Connor and his little sister, four year
old Brinley. Connor and Brinley weren't just siblings. They were
best friends, even at that age where older brothers often
want distance from their younger sisters. They were said to
be inseparable. Wherever Connor was, Brinley was always close behind.

(03:50):
At school, their bond was well known. Connor was a
student at Greenwich len Hartsville Elementary School and Brindley had
just started her second year of pre K at the
Early Learning Community. Teachers described them both as warm and joyful.
They were the kind of kids who made an impression
not because they were loud or roidy, but because they

(04:10):
carried something gentle with them. Doctor Christian tem Chyden, the
district superintendent, would later speak of Connor with deep affection.
He remembered how he often earned rewards in school, and
instead of picking a toy or prize for himself, he
would always choose something he could bring home to his
sister Brindley. He recalled, he spoke lovingly of his sister Brindley.

(04:34):
That small act said everything about the kind of boy
that Connor was. Connor had recently discovered the dog Man
book series and had taken to it with a contagious enthusiasm.
He could often have been found giggling during reading workshops
at school. His teacher recalled how his laughter was infectious
kind of sound that started small and then spread through

(04:56):
the class. But reading was in Connor's only passion. He
had a curious mind, especially when it came to science.
He was deeply fascinated by rocks and minerals and loved
to bring his latest finds to show his teacher. He
was a dancer as well, and had mastered the flaws dance,
the kind that requires fast hips and flailing arms. He

(05:17):
wasn't shy about showing it off at any chance he got.
He danced because it made people smile. Brindley was just
four years old, but she was beginning to blossom in
her own way. Kindergarten had opened up a world of
possibility for her, and she loved it. Like so many
little girls her age, she enjoyed the movie Frozen and
dressed up as Elsa or Anna any chance she got.

(05:41):
She had the kind of imagination that turns a living
room into a castle, a blanket into a royal cape,
and her big brother into a trusted sidekick. It was
just after four thirty pm on the twenty third of

(06:02):
September twenty nineteen when the nine one one call came in.
The voice on the other end of the line was frantic.
It was Lisa Snyder. She told the dispatcher that she
had just found her two youngest children, eight year old
Connor and four year old Brinley, hanging in the basement
of their home. Lisa said they were suspended by a

(06:22):
single dog leash, a plastic covered chain that had been
looped over a support beam. The chain stretched across the room,
with one end around Connor's neck and the other around Brinley's.
Beneath them, two small chairs had been tipped over, as
if they'd each climbed onto them before stepping off. Lisa's
voice trembled as she explained she had tried to left Brinley,

(06:45):
who wedg just forty pounds, but claimed that she was
frozen with panic and unable to do anything more. She
said she'd always feared that something like this might happen. Connor,
she told the dispatcher, had been bullied at school, he
had made suicidal months before, and in her words, he
didn't want to go alone. Now, she said, they were

(07:06):
both hanging from the rafters in the basement. Paramedic Eric
bob and Moyer was the first to arrive at the
Snyder home. The nine one one operator had instructed Lisa
to wait for help outside, but when Eric pulled up
to the house, nobody was there. The front yard was
still and the house was quiet. Eric knocked on the

(07:26):
front door. Lisa eventually opened. She seemed anxious, nervous, even,
but not visibly distraught. She wasn't crying. She must have
been in a state of shock. He thought she was
on her cell phone, distracted, talking to somebody. When Eric
asked whether anybody else was inside the house, she didn't answer.

(07:47):
Without waiting for a response, Eric stepped past her and
made his way inside. He followed an arrow stairwell down
to the basement. To the right. He saw nothing, but
when he turned left, the scene that met him would
stay with him forever. Two small children suspended in mid air, motionless,
each hanging by a loop of a dog chain. It

(08:08):
was the kind of thing that nobody, not even a
season paramedic, is ever fully prepared to see. Two little
chairs had toppled over just beneath them. Eric moved quickly.
He felt their skin. It was still warm. He unclasped
the chain around Brindley's neck and brought her down first. Connor,
who was heavier, couldn't be lowered alone. By then another

(08:31):
paramedic had arrived, and together they carefully removed him and
laid him on the floor. Both children were unresponsive. CPR
began immediately as they fought to see of the children.
Pennsylvania State Trooper Jeremy Hummel arrived outside. He finally says,
standing calmly in the front yard, they're in the basement,

(08:51):
she said, simply. She didn't rush towards the commotion, She
didn't follow them inside. She didn't ask for updates. Instead,
she stood back. Soon after, a medical helicopter was dispatched.
Time was critical now. Trooper Hummel helped carry the stretchers
containing Connor and Brinley out of the basement, through the

(09:12):
house and into the waiting helicopter. They were then flown
to Lehigh Valley Hospital Cedar Crest in Salisbury Township, where
doctors and nurses immediately took over life saving efforts. Miraculously,
both children had been revived while in the air, but
when they arrived at the hospital, it quickly became clear
that they weren't out of the woods. Doctors then delivered

(09:34):
the news that no parent ever wants to hear. Both
Connor and Brindley were brain dead. In medical terms, brain
death means that all activity in the brain, including the
brain stem, has stopped permanently. Unlike a coma, brain death
is legally and medically considered death. There's no possibility of recovery.

(09:54):
Machines might keep the heartbeating for a while, but the
person is essentially gone. The children were placed on live support.
Lisa meanwhile began texting her friends. She wrote, I can't
cry any more and I'm completely numb. My life has
been ripped to shreds and it's never going to get better.

(10:14):
For three days, Connor and Brinley remained in the hospital,
their bodies bating only with the help of the machines.
Those who knew them held on to hope, even as
doctors offered none. Then on the third day, Lisa sent
another message, They're pulling the plug. There was nothing more
that could be done. Connor and Brinley passed away on

(10:36):
the twenty sixth of September two thousand nineteen, just fourteen
minutes apart. They'd been together in life, and they went
together in death. That evening, Lisa changed her Facebook profile photo.
The image bore a quote in bold letters, words scar
rumors destroy Billy's kill. To anyone on the outside looking in,

(11:00):
it painted a tragic picture to young children driven to
a suicide, packed by the cruelty of others, but not
everybody was convinced. In the days following Connor and Brindley's deaths,
the great stricken image Lisa Snyder projected was that of

(11:23):
a devastated mother who had just lost her entire world.
But behind the scenes, investigators were beginning to question the
versions of events that she had given. Lisa agreed to
come to the police station voluntarily. Detectives were still entertaining
the possibility that this could have been a suicide. If
other children had contributed to that bullying, there was a

(11:44):
chance that charges could be filed. They needed to understand
what Connor had been going through. In the interview room,
Lisa spoke openly. She told detectives that Connor had been
relentlessly bullied at school because of his weight. She said
that he had lost twenty five pounds since the school
year began, and said that he had been starving himself.

(12:07):
Lisa also said that her son had a speech delay,
in developmental challenges, things that had made him a target.
She explained he's a little slower to grasp things, and
kids make fun of him because he was fat. She
went on to say that Connor once told her I
would have killed myself already, but I'm scared to go

(12:27):
by myself. She claimed that he hated school and told
her that every day. She said he had been having
mood swings, especially around Brimley. Lisa believed that he may
have been a bit jealous of his little sister. She
told detectives that on the afternoon of September twenty third,
Connor had come home from school and asked if he

(12:48):
could build a fort in the basement, something she said
he loved doing. He wanted to use household items, including
a couple of dining chairs and a dog leash. He
loves building for shorts, that's his thing, she said. Lisa
claimed that Connor had dragged the chairs into the basement,
stopping midway to rest and grab a drink. Then, she

(13:09):
said he invited Brinley to come and play with him.
Lisa was putting away laundry and then stepped outside for
a cigarette. She told the detective she was only gone
for about ten minutes when she came back inside to
ask the kids what they wanted for dinner, she found
them hanging from the beam. She told them she had
tried to lift Brinley, but she couldn't. Her anxiety spike,

(13:33):
she said, caused her to sweat heavily and feel weak.
She even claimed she tried to lift Conner, who weighed
around one hundred and fifty pounds, but said that it
was impossible, so she ran upstairs and called nine one one.
Detectives listened closely to her story. On the surface, it
hid all the right emotional notes, her mother desperate to

(13:53):
see if her children, overwhelmed by anxiety, caught in a
living nightmare, But something about it didn't sit right. Almost
immediately they had their doubts. District Attorney John Adams would
later reflect on that first interview. He stated, I would
agree that we all may think that a mother of
children who have found hanging would make every effort possible

(14:16):
to save them. Lisa's story painted herself as helpless, but
for detectives it raised a different kind of alarm. As
they looked closer, more problems began to emerge. Connor, it
turned out, had a physical disability that would have made
it nearly impossible for him to do what Lisa was suggesting,
he had very poor dexterity, the kind of fine motor

(14:39):
issues that would have made it difficult for him to
manipulate the clasp of a dog leash. Not only that,
but the leeha had been looked over the beam with
an equal length on either side, a level of position
that didn't match Connor's known abilities. Lisa had told detectives
that Connor was depressed, that he was bullied, that he
didn't want to live any more, and that he didn't

(15:01):
want to die alone. She had even sent out a
group text to her family before the incident, asking them
to show Connor love. But when detectives reached out to
those same family members, they heard something very different. Owen,
Connor's older brother said he had never seen any signs
that his brother was depressed. He didn't remember Connor complaining

(15:23):
about bullying. Their cousin, Kimberly Watson said the same. In fact,
when she received Lisa's text message, she was concerned enough
to go and pick Connor up from school herself. She recollected,
I said, are you happy I picked you up? And
he said yeah, but I do like riding the bus.
I have a lot of friends. On the bus to Kimberlin,

(15:45):
Connor hadn't seemed to upset at all. He hadn't mentioned
being bullied, He didn't make any dark comments. He was
just his usual self, chatty, cheerful, and full of energy.
The school had also reported no signs of trouble. Connor
had friends and he was engaged. His teachers described him
as happy and friendly and noted if there were any

(16:07):
concerns about depression or suicidal thoughts, they hadn't seen them.
There was something else that stood out to detectives. Lisa
claimed that Connor and Brindley often played in the basement,
but when they spoke with Owen, he said they didn't.
The basement, he said, just wasn't a place where the
children spent any time. None of this added up to

(16:29):
a suicide, at least not the kind that Lisa was describing.
Detectives were beginning to look at Lisa with fresh eyes,
and as they turned their focus towards her, her behavior,
her history, her digital footprint, what they found was deeply unsettling.

(16:55):
The investigation was picking up momentum while Lisa Snyder continued
to present herself as a grieving mother, posting sad messages
on Facebook and changing her profile photo to anti billying
Slogan's detectives were beginning to unravel a much darker history.
At the time of their deaths, both Connor and his
older brother Owen were already known to Child Protective Services.

(17:19):
This wasn't the first time that there had been serious
concerns about Lisa Snyder's ability to care for her children.
In fact, it wasn't even close. Back in twenty and fourteen,
when Connor was just two years old, both boys were
removed from Lisa's custody. Lisa had confessed to harboring violent thoughts.

(17:39):
She told detectives that she had placed cords and bottle
caps in Connor's crib, things a toddler could easily choke on,
and that it was no accident. She admitted that she
hoped her two year old son wouldn't survive the night.
But the disturbing thoughts went back even further. When Owen
was still a baby, Lisa had spoken to her car

(18:00):
Jessica Widlick, about something that chilled her to the core.
Lisa felt abandoned by Owen's father and told Jessica that
if she ever decided to end her life. She would
take Owen with her. She said she would put him
in a car and drive straight into a lake. Despite
these deeply troubling confessions, after six months in a mental
health facility, Lisa was granted Costaday again. The boys came

(18:24):
back home and the next year Brindley was born. Not
years later, one of those boys was dead, so was
his little sister, and suspicion was growing that Lisa had
finally acted on those dark thoughts. Detectives served to search
warrant at the family's home. They removed several boxes of
evidence from inside, including the dog lash the children had

(18:47):
been found hanging from, and the two chairs that had
been knocked over nearby. But they weren't just looking at
physical evidence. They were also focused on digital clues. Lisa
had claimed that Connor was bing bullied on mine. If
that was true, they needed to see those messages. Investigators
collected two iPads, a laptop, and an xbox. If there

(19:10):
was any sign he was planning something, if he had
confided in somebody they wanted to know. Lisa also handed
over her cell phone, but soon detectives discovered something she
hadn't told them. Lisa had a second phone. Her seventeen
year old son, Owen told detectives about it, she hadn't
turned it over during the investigation. That alone raised red flags.

(19:35):
The black Huskie pit bull that the family owned, the
dog whose leash was used in the hangings, it's no
longer in the home. Lisa had given him away. Investigators
had assumed the chain had been the dogs, but now
the dog was gone, along with a crucial part of
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(19:55):
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(21:26):
While detectives worked behind the scenes, life in the small
village of Kempden was at a standstill. On October twelfth,
the community gathered at the Kempton Community Center for what
should have been a celebration. It would have been Connor's
ninth birthday, but instead of a party, it was a memorial.
Sixty people formed a semicircle in the open field behind

(21:48):
the center, clutching bright helium balloons on a table stood
framed photographs of Connor and Brinley smiling at a swimming pool,
running through a playground posing in their pictures. There was
also artwork, one of Connor's paintings, a colorful bouquet of
flowers in a vase. On either side of the painting

(22:09):
were two certificates confirming what the children had done in
death donated their organs. The certificate read through the combassionate
decision to help others through organ tissue or cornya donation
Connor and Brindley who provided hope to the men, women
and children who are in need of a life saving
or life enhancing transplant. When the balloons were relayed, somebody

(22:32):
called out catch them, Connor as the sky filled with color.
Then quietly and mournfully, the group sang Happy Birthday. Connor
and Brindley's older brother, Owen was there, but Lisa wasn't.
Though she had steed away from the public vigil, she
was present online. On Facebook, she posted frequently about her grief.

(22:54):
One post read, every day it gets harder. I miss
you both so much. I just want to hold you,
kiss you. All I do is cry. I love you
both with all my heart. I just want you back.
But in private detectives were beginning to believe that Lisa
wasn't being honest, and for District Attorney John Adams, the
idea that an eight year old boy could orchestrate a

(23:16):
murder suicide was difficult to swallow. He stated, eight year olds,
generally that I am aware of, don't commit suicide. So
of course we had questions. What happened in that basement
was still almost impossible to comprehend. People in Camden couldn't
stop talking about it. At the local bar, longtime bartender

(23:36):
Carolyn Folk said, it's such a horrible tragedy. It was
so shocking. Hailey Dunkelberger, a freshman nearby Kutztown University, echoed
the unease spreading throughout the town. People are upset. I
don't really think everyone knows how to cope with this.
This is a small community. For whatever happens, I want justice,

(24:00):
and soon justice would come. On the second of December
twenty nineteen, Lisa Snyder was arrested. She was charged with
two counts of first and third degree murder, as well
as two felony counts of endangering the welfare of children.

(24:23):
For many in the community of Camden, the arrest didn't
come as a surprise. Whispers had started almost as soon
as the news had broken. Pop wore suspicious of Lisa's story,
and now investigators were confirming what so many had feared.
There was no evidence that Connor had been bullied. Detectives
had gone through everything his Skilled records, online accounts, even

(24:45):
his Xbox. They spoke with teachers and classmates. Everybody said
the same thing. Connor was a well liked boy. He
had friends, He was kind, He wasn't isolated or depressed.
Lisa had claimed he came home from s S Girl
that day feeling down, But when detectives reviewed surveillance footage
from the Skill bus, they saw something different. Connor appeared happy, playful,

(25:09):
even he was rough housing with another boy, the very
boy Lisa had accused of bullying him. The pieces weren't
adding up, and then came something even more disturbing. In
the days leading up to the children's deaths, Lisa had
been searching the Internet. She searched for carbon monoxide in
a car? How Long to Die? I almost got away

(25:31):
with the best episodes hanging Yourself? Does a hybrid car
produce carbon monoxide while idling? She even visited an instructional
website that explained how to carry out a hanging using
a short drop. This was the same hanging method used
to kill Connor and Brinley, and on the very same
day that Connor and Brindley died, Lisa had purchased the

(25:52):
dog leash that would later be used in their deaths.
It had a weight limit of two hundred and fifty pounds,
far beyond what their fifty pound dog would have required.
But the investigation didn't stop there. When detectives looked deeper
into Lisa's digital footprint, they discovered something truly depraved. In

(26:14):
her Facebook messenger history, Lisa had been sending sexually explicit messages.
She had engaged in sex acts with the family dog,
and had taken photographs and sent those images to another person.
Lisa Snyder was now facing additional charges felony, animal abuse
and related defenses. Investigators also interviewed Lisa's cousin, who painted

(26:39):
a grim picture of Lisa's mental state. She said that
Lisa had become depressed and that she was unable to
get out of bed, and, most alarmingly, she said that
Lisa told her she didn't care about her kids anymore.
To her the children had become a burden. Lisa had
also made a disturbing remark to a friend named Jessicas
sion Empft. She told Jessica that if she were ever arrested,

(27:04):
she'd likely be released on bale because she had no
criminal history, but if that happened, she said she would
kill herself. Following her arrast, Lisa Snyder was denied bale.
Prosecutors announced that if convicted, they were going to be
seeking the death penalty. District Attorney John Adams then announced, this.

Speaker 2 (27:25):
Was a very difficult investigation. Any time that any of
us have to investigate prosecute cases that involved the abuse
or death of an innocent child, it all hits us

(27:46):
in the heart.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
As the legal process unfolded, the people of Campden were
left shaken. At Connor's elementary school, teachers in classmates decided
to honor his memory and his sisters in the only
way they could. They began collecting teddy bears. The plan
was to donate the bears to Lehigh Valley Riley Children's Hospital,

(28:08):
local fire departments, and other agencies that worked with children.
Melissa Blatt, one of the teachers, stated, obviously this whole
situation has just rocked our whole community, our whole school.
In just two weeks, the school collected more than three thousand,
six hundred Teddy Bears while the community grave. Lisa's attorneys

(28:28):
announced their legal strategy. They were minding an insanity defense.
Her legal team claimed that Lisa had a chronic history
of mental illness, including major depressive disorder with psychotic features,
anxiety effective disorder, and postpartum depression. At the time of
the murders, they argued, Lisa was suffering from a severe

(28:50):
and recurring form of depression, borderline personality disorder, and symptoms
consistent with post traumatic stress disorder and disassociative identity disorder.
According to our attorneys, Lisa's distorted thinking convinced her that
her children were suffering, that they were being emotionally harmed
or abandoned. They claimed her mental illness created in her

(29:12):
a twisted desire to protect her children from future pain,
that she killed them not out of cruelty but delusion.
But her legal team didn't want the jury to hear
about everything. They asked the court to sever the animal
abuse charges to keep the details of her sexual acts
with the family dog out of the murder trial. They

(29:33):
argued that it would prejudice the jury and the judge
a great He ruled that the evidence of bestiality would
be tried separately. He said he could see no reason
why a jury needed to hear about the acts unless
it was to inflame them. Then, in November of twenty
twenty three, something unexpected happened. Lisa Snyder in the prosecution

(29:54):
reached a play agreement. Under the deal, Lisa had played
no contest but mentally ill, to two counts of third
degree murder. The plea would carry a sentence of twenty
to forty years in prison. But when the plea was
presented to Judge Teresa Johnson, she rejected it. It doesn't
serve the interests of justice, she said before walking out

(30:15):
of the courtroom. That meant that the case was now
proceeding to trial. Lisa Snyder would stand accused of first
degree murder, the most serious charge possible. District Attorney Adams
declined to explain why the plea deal had been offered
in the first place, but in a phone interview, he said,
we don't contest the fact that she's mentally ill and

(30:38):
meets the threshold set up under the law. That she
is mentally ill. Still, in the eyes of the court,
mental illness didn't erase the reality of what had happened
in that basement. On the twenty first of September twenty

(31:02):
and twenty four, Lisa Snyder was led into Burke's County
court House by two police officers. She took a seat
beside her defense attorneys. This wasn't going to be a
trial by jury, Lisa had waived that right. Instead, she
opted for a bench trial, one in which the judge
alone would decide her faith. That decision had major consequences.

(31:24):
It meant that the death penalty was officially off the table.
If convicted, Lisa Snyder would face life in prison without
the possibility of parole. Opening statements painted two vastly different
versions of what had happened on that September day in
two thousand and nineteen. The prosecution laid out their case plainly.

(31:45):
Lisa Snyder, they said, had murdered her two youngest children.
They described a calculated, deliberate act, one that was planned
in advance, not the result of a mental breakdown. The defense,
which was led by attorneys Dennis Charles, took a different approach.
He told the court that the burden rested with the prosecution.

(32:07):
If they could not definitively prove that Lisa had killed
her children, then she must be found not guilty. But
if they could, he said, the court must still consider
her mental illness. Charles said to the judge, she has
no recollection of what she did. You have a history
of a person who has severe mental illness. He described

(32:29):
how Lisa had been sexually abused by a family member
between the ages of five and seven. Why that trauma
had followed her into adulthood, where she struggled with identity
and abandonment. He said she had been diagnosed with bipolar
disorder with psychotic features, borderline personality disorder, and post traumatic
stress disorder. Lisa, he said, had tried to get help,

(32:53):
but the system had failed her. He revealed to the
judge that Lisa had been having suicidal and homicidal thoughts
about con her since he was just two years old.
And then the testimony began. The court heard from the
first responders. Paramedics described the horrifying scene in the basement.
The lifeless bodies of two children suspended from a dog chain.

(33:16):
The chairs they had allegedly stood on were shown to
the judge. It quickly became clear how implausible it was
that an eight year old could have orchestrated what had happened.
The prosecution then turned to Lisa's Internet search history. The
judge was shown the disturbing phrases she had typed into
Google just days before the murders. She had visited a

(33:38):
website detailing how to commit suicide by hanging. She had
looked up whether hybrid cars produced carbon monoxide while idling.
She had watched episodes If I Almost Got Away with It.
School officials testified next. One by one. They painted a
picture of a young boy who loved school, a boy
who was cheerful, outgoing, and well liked by his classmates.

(34:02):
He wasn't bullied, he wasn't depressed, He was thriving. An
occupational therapist was brought in to address another crucial detail,
physical capability. Could an eight year old boy rarely have
manipulated a heavy judy dog leash, placed it over a
basement support beam, lifted his four year old sister onto
a chair, and executed a double hanging. The therapist said, no,

(34:27):
it wasn't physically plausible for a child Connor's age and
size and with his physical disabilities. But perhaps the most
impactful testimony came from someone who knew Connor and Brintley best,
their older brother Owen. Owen took the stand with a
quiet composure. He referred to Lisa by her full name
and explained, I just don't see her as my mother anymore.

(34:51):
Owen denied any suggestion that Connor was suicidal or depressed.
He told the court he was a happy, go lucky kid,
always wanted to be doing something. He was always playing
with his little sister. He wasn't the only one who
said this. Family members testified that Connor had never mentioned billying.
When asked about it, he didn't even seem to understand

(35:14):
the question. Lisa's cousin, Jessica, described Connor as happy, playful,
and full of life, but she also spoke about Lisa's struggles.
She told the court that Lisa had frequent depressive episodes.
There were entire days sometimes longer, or she wouldn't get
out of bed. Her ability to parent was inconsistent and

(35:34):
often severely impaired. Finally, the prosecution played Lisa's NW one
one call, the moment she claimed to have discovered her
children hanging in the basement. They followed that with footage
from her police interrogation. At one point, detectives asked her,
point blank, did you have something to do with your
children's deaths? Lisa responded no, I swear to God, I

(35:58):
had nothing to do with this. They were my world.
I have no purpose now. After the prosecution rested its case,
Lisa Snyder's defense attorney, Dennis Charles, made a bold move.
He requested an immediate acquittal. He argued that the prosecution's
case was based on speculation, not fact, that their version

(36:19):
of events rested on Internet searches and circumstantial evidence on
what might have happened, not what did happen. All you
have is conjecture, he told the court. Charles pointed to
Lisa's search history not as a blueprint for murder, but
as evidence of suicidal thoughts. He insisted that if Lisa

(36:39):
had killed her children, it was the result of severe
mental illness. She was, he said, incapable of understanding right
from wrong. But the judge denied the motion and the
trial moved forward. The defense then called Lisa's mother, Eileen Myers,
to the witness stand. Eileen offered a version of events.
The contract predicted what teachers, classmates, and relatives had said.

(37:03):
She testified that Conner had once told her he no
longer wanted to live, that he'd asked what heaven was like,
that he'd wondered if he'd recognize anybody there. It was
a moment that could have shifted the narrative until cross examination,
prosecutor Meg McCallum pressed Eileen on her memory. She told
the court that Eileen had undergone brain surgery in the

(37:25):
nineteen nineties to remove a tumor. Eileen admitted that she
still suffered confusion and memory issues as a result. She
also acknowledged having discussed the trial with Lisa multiple times,
including details from the police investigation. From there, the case
returned to Lisa Snyder's mental health. Doctor Dungtran testified for

(37:47):
the defense. He believed that Lisa's psychological decline stemmed from
the sexual abuse she allegedly endured as a child. He
said she had attempted suicide at sixteen and had led
ratic behavior throughout her life. He diagnosed her with bipolar
disorder with psychotic fixtures, borderline personality disorder, and post traumatic

(38:09):
stress disorder. According to doctor Tran, Lisa believed not only
that Connor was being bullied, but the Brindley had been
sexually abused as well. He said that these delusions sent
her into a psychotic break. During cross examination, doctor Tran
admitted something critical Her mental state at the time of
the murders was, in his words, all speculation. The prosecution

(38:34):
rebutted with their own expert, doctor John O'Brien. Doctor O'Brien
said that Lisa had a history of anxiety and depression,
but not bipolar disorder, post traumatic stress disorder, or borderline
personality disorder. He said that he had found no signs
of a psychotic break. He also pointed to a major
contradiction during his interviews with Lisa. She never once mentioned

(38:58):
being abused as a child, nor did she ever claim
that Brinley had been abused. In fact, he said that
Lisa gave detailed and coherent accounts of what happened on
the day her children died, hardly the mark of somebody
experiencing a psychotic episode. He also noted that Lisa scored
high on personality tests measuring exaggeration and deception. After weeks

(39:21):
of testimony the trial, due to a close inclosing arguments,
Prosecutor Macallum told the court, I cannot think of any
crime more serious than the taking of a four year
old girl and an eight year old boy. She chose
to harm her children, and they suffered as they hung
by their necks, gasping for air. Prosecutor Kenneth Brown added

(39:42):
a chilling theory, Lisa had only intended on killing Connor.
She had seen him as a burden, but when Brinley
came downstairs and witnessed what her mother was doing, Lisa
had no choice but to kill her as well. He
described Brinley urinating on herself in fe year as she
card in the corner of the basement. In their closing,

(40:04):
the defense doubled down. Charles stated, what they want you
to do is swallow what they've been feeding to the media.
But it took Judge Teresa Johnson only an r to
return with a verdict. She found Lisa Snyder guilty on
two counts of first degree murder, as well as charges
of child endangerment and evidence tampering. On the eighteenth of October,

(40:26):
Lisa Snyder returned to court to be sentenced. Only one
person stood to deliver a victim impact statement, Connor and
Brinley's older brother, Owen, he was twenty two. He was
twenty two years old. Now, he stated, if I could
turn back time, I would just to hear their voices.
That day, I didn't just lose my brother and sister,

(40:49):
I lost my mother as well. Then he turned to
Lisa and said, since September twenty third, twenty nineteen, I
don't consider you my mother. I consider you a monster.
Judge Johnson then sentenced Lisa Snyder to two consecutive life
sentences without the possibility of parole. They would be followed

(41:10):
by an additional eight to seventeen years for the remaining charges.
Lisa showed no emotion before closing the proceedings. The judge
then addressed her directly. She said, the fact that an
individual could put their hands on another individual to commit
a murder makes it so much worse than if you
stood across the street and fired a gun at them.

(41:31):
Your only job in life was to protect and care
for your children. You failed. You robbed them of their futures. Then,
with the sentence delivered, Lisa Snyder was escorted from the
courtroom to begin her life sentence behind bars. Well that

(42:13):
is it for this episode of Morbidology. As always, thank
you so much for listening, and i'd like to say
a massive thank you to my new supporter up on Patreon, Stacy.
I'm just about to record the next bonus episode of
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(42:34):
to cancel your subscription at any point. I upload adfree
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us out at morbidology dot com for more information about
this episode and to read some true crime articles. Until
next time, take care of yourselves, stay safe, and have

(42:56):
an amazing week. Sk