August 19, 2025 • 45 mins
Money can strain any relationship—add gigs, touring, irregular income, and public-facing work, and it gets complicated fast. In this episode, Chris Webb and Dave Tamkin break down practical ways musicians (and their partners, bandmates, and teams) can navigate money, expectations, and emotional ups/downs without burning out—or each other.
What you’ll learn How to budget around irregular income (and reduce stress with simple monthly forecasting) Touring realities: staying emotionally present when you’re miles apart Creative identity vs. partnership needs—protect both without resentment Public image, social life, and boundaries (what to post, what to discuss) Collaboration vs. competition inside creative couples and bands The role your personal “money relationship” plays in every other relationship
A simple weekly action step to open the tough conversation you’ve been avoiding 👉 Don’t forget to like, comment, and subscribe for more tips on money, music, and building a sustainable music career. #MusiciansTipJar #MusicBusiness #MoneyForMusicians #IndependentMusician #MusicCareerTips #MusicianFinance #MusicIndustryAdvice
Visit MusiciansTipJar.com for more resources and tools to empower your financial journey.
Intro & Outro Music Donated by: The Magi https://www.themagimusic.com
Intro Read by: David “DJ” Lee of The Magi
https://soundcloud.com/rockababyrock
Pictures by: Kit Chalberg https://kitchalberg.com/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/musicians-tip-jar--4698023/support.
Visit MusiciansTipJar.com for more resources and tools to empower your financial journey.
Intro & Outro Music Donated by: The Magi https://www.themagimusic.com
Intro Read by: David “DJ” Lee of The Magi
https://soundcloud.com/rockababyrock
Pictures by: Kit Chalberg https://kitchalberg.com/
What you’ll learn How to budget around irregular income (and reduce stress with simple monthly forecasting) Touring realities: staying emotionally present when you’re miles apart Creative identity vs. partnership needs—protect both without resentment Public image, social life, and boundaries (what to post, what to discuss) Collaboration vs. competition inside creative couples and bands The role your personal “money relationship” plays in every other relationship
A simple weekly action step to open the tough conversation you’ve been avoiding 👉 Don’t forget to like, comment, and subscribe for more tips on money, music, and building a sustainable music career. #MusiciansTipJar #MusicBusiness #MoneyForMusicians #IndependentMusician #MusicCareerTips #MusicianFinance #MusicIndustryAdvice
Visit MusiciansTipJar.com for more resources and tools to empower your financial journey.
Intro & Outro Music Donated by: The Magi https://www.themagimusic.com
Intro Read by: David “DJ” Lee of The Magi
https://soundcloud.com/rockababyrock
Pictures by: Kit Chalberg https://kitchalberg.com/
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/musicians-tip-jar--4698023/support.
Visit MusiciansTipJar.com for more resources and tools to empower your financial journey.
Intro & Outro Music Donated by: The Magi https://www.themagimusic.com
Intro Read by: David “DJ” Lee of The Magi
https://soundcloud.com/rockababyrock
Pictures by: Kit Chalberg https://kitchalberg.com/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the show that explores the methods and strategies
on rocking the financial side of your music business. With
over forty years combined experience, here are your host Chris
Webb and Dave Damkid.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Welcome to Musicians Tip Jar, where we talk about musicians
and money, where we believe a good musician can handle
their bills as well as they handle the blues.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
I'm Chris Webb, joined by my co.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Host, who I met when we were both very financially
compatible in that we were both broke.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Dave Tampkin.
Speaker 4 (00:33):
Ain't that the truth? We talk more about money than music,
where I think most musician friendships start talking about the
music first.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Yeah. Probably.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Today we examine the effect of money on relationships in
this music world. We highlight the unique challenges and dynamics
we face in both professional and romantic relationships as musicians
and creatives. Everyone has experienced these challenges and sometimes these
issues can overwhelm us and stop our progress all together.
Today's quote comes from John Legend. There were times I
(01:10):
couldn't pay rent and my partner was carrying us. It
tested everything, but it also showed me what real love
looks like.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
She must have been pretty strong and how far was
she carrying them? This week's nonprofit it's Love in Music
dot org Love and Music, founded in May two thousand
and seven and aftermath of the four to twenty nine
LA Uprising to foster cross cultural collaboration and harmony. They
are dedicated to empowering youth and undeserved communities with free
(01:40):
music education through musically gifted volunteers. If you find this
information useful, please rate and subscribe to the podcast, and
also slam that like button if you're on YouTube so
we can help keep you up on the finance side
of your music business.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
We spend so much time talking about ways to grow
your music business, increase your wealth, and the many ways
to just succeed, but we also try to highlight sustainability
that includes mental and physical health, happiness, and fulfillment itself.
A pillar of happiness is relationship. We love to emphasize
the importance of community and its power, but we haven't
(02:17):
spent much time discussing how to navigate relationships around money.
This can include spouses, business partners, family friends, bandmates, even
our audience and the fans that we communicate with. This
is a great topic that is well worth our attention.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Let's go.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
I came up with a few titles for this. You
want to hear, sure, I hope. So I'm going to
read them. Love rent and late night Sets, Money Talk
for Creative Couples, Money for Nothing, and your Chicks for Free,
Rich girl, she works hard for the money. Love don't
cost a thing. And there were some puffy Colm's titles
(03:13):
that I just thought I should leave that alone. Altogether,
it's such as every relationship, romantic, business, family, creative. It's
time we really talked about it. And I'm surprised. I
think we're so romantic with our loved ones Chris and
really been pretty lucky to just enjoy the company of
(03:33):
the musicians we get to share a stage with that
this conversation didn't come up sooner.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, here are season five, and we're still finding all
these things that are huge topics that we've never really
touched on. This is a big one, and so let's
start with some of the stats on why it's so big.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
First of all, one in five divorces cite money issues
as their primary cause. And we will not only talk
about those relationships, but they really are such a pillar
of our happiness. So they really are important to be addressing,
especially because musicians live a very unique life. Right, Thirty
one percent of Americans admit to committing financial infidelity, like
hiding purchases or secret accounts. The median And I don't
(04:13):
know why that's funny to me. Sorry, I shouldn't be laughing.
Median annual income for the US working musicians is twenty
one thousand, three hundred.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
That's according to the.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Music Industry Research Association, twenty one thousand, three hundred.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Just to go back on the last one, I know
couples that have had one of the couple in a
relationship actually make fake BANKU seats to show to show statements.
And that was the first time I ever heard of that.
But I thought, man, if you have so much time
and you could use that power for evil, just think
(04:50):
of how much money you could get paid if you
use that power for good. You know.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Well, And that's probably because they didn't really want to
admit what's really happening, right, which was they're in trouble financially.
Another stat was that only six percent earn over one
hundred thousand per year from music solely.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Six percent.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
That's actually more than I thought it would be to
be honest to be making over one hunter k. And
this is all in the United States, but that number
should be bigger, obviously, especially as inflation continues to erode.
What one hundred thousand can even do anymore. The last
that I wanted to throw in here was seventy three
(05:33):
percent of musicians report dealing with anxiety, depression or both,
and these can have huge impacts on the relationship and
the health of your relationship. So so much of that
anxiety and depression can come from your financial stress.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
So these are really.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Important things to talk about, and we've tried to kind
of narrow them down to just focus in on the
stuff that maybe everyone here could really benefit from the most.
So let's discuss the most common areas being a musician
and choosing this career where relationships can affect ourselves and
our lives around money.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
One thing I want to mention before we go into
these things is that we're very aware that there is
someone on the opposite side dealing with the musicians in
these conversations that have their own set of frustrations and
things that they need to deal with us. When I
brought this up with a last night, she's like, you know,
(06:32):
I might call Jack attach and see if we could
have our own episode, and we'll probably blow your numbers
out of the water talking about what, oh we're supposed
to you know, how they're supposed to handle us, how
about how we handle them. So we're very aware that
when we go through this that there is someone on
the other end of this that has their own set
of standards that we need to show up for.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
I mean, I think we're really saying is what Taylor
Swift said the best is, Hey, I'm the problem.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
It's me right, Yeah, that's really what we're here to do.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
But how you handle your problem, how yourself is really
what we're talking about here.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
So let's start with number one, which.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Is how do we handle money around the irregular income
and just financial planning in general, because the reality is
being a musician means your income is like your set
list in that it changes almost every night.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
At least I hope you can let us mix it
up every night.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
One month you might flush out with festival paychecks and
merch sales and all this great revenue coming from your streams,
whereas the next you're going to be scrapping cash together
from those low paying gigs and venmo tips and whatever
else last minute stuff you put together like lessons, so
unlike a.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Traditional nine to five job.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You know, your money here doesn't land neatly in your
bank account.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
Every two weeks.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
It trickles in from all these different angles like streaming
royalties and bar gigs and teaching and sync placements, and
sometimes that stuff can be often pretty unpredictable.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
And try to build a life with someone in that context,
you want to planification, you want to buy a house together,
have a kid, even just budget groceries without having anxiety
around it. And that's when you're that's groceries is when
you're just moved in with each other, you know, covering rent.
And then there's that other stuff when you want to say, hey,
this is someone I want to spend the rest of
(08:22):
my life with. It's tough when your income's a roller coaster.
And here's like the quiet tension. When one partner has
more consistent income than the other. You might start to
feel guilty, dependent, or even ashamed because you can't do
what the other person is doing. And meanwhile, that partner
carrying more financial weight might feel pressure, resentment, or just
(08:44):
feel misunderstood. And no one talks about it out loud,
but it's it's there waiting to unleash. And when we're
going through these notes, we work hard to have that
open communication with our partners, you know, and to go
back to have these things like presented again, it is.
(09:05):
It just shows how lucky you can be if you
figure this stuff out, to not have that resentment when
those things happened, because over twenty year marriage, you know,
you get into these abs and flows with finances.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I think the other part of this to me, and
I mean prefaces by saying like, it's amazing that we
as musicians can even find people willing to be.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
With us, because very true.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
I mean, we're such dreamers, we're you know, what we're
trying to do is so out of the norm, right,
it's so insecure for some of people's partners. And I
think back to sometimes the early years I'm and I'm
saying this, I think Jacqueline, my wife, would would absolutely
agree with this. She didn't think there would ever be
(09:51):
a point where I would be making enough money that
she didn't have to work. I mean, that really was
never something that she believed could actually happen. And it's
not her fault. It's society has programmed us to believe that,
and I've take a lot of pride in that we've
shown that that actually is possible.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
But also at the same time, it was.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Always like believing that you're good enough, believing that like
that you could do it together, you know, because there
were plenty of years where she was the breadwinner and
I was playing shows at night and I was doing
all the things that like I could do around the house,
and even the first five years of our kids, I
was the primary caregiver at home because that was where
(10:36):
I was more valuable because childcare is incredibly expensive and
I could play shows at night. So we just had
to make it work. And just like John Legendson, we're
like the same, you know, where Jacqueline was carrying me,
which is also very impressive.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
The thing that I really want to say when it
comes to the irregular situation is to talk about how
you can plan out the budget itself, and if you
know how much you're going to need, and then it
really takes away that whole mystery of like how are
we doing right. That's why we always emphasize having a budget,
and that means every month right, having a new budget.
(11:11):
If you're going to change how much you're going to
bring in, we can change the forecast and then also
put that against the expenses and be able to see
clearly that things are going to be okay. That understanding
that information makes such a difference in being able to
both be on the same page about this is going
to be okay. So that brings us to number two,
which is time away and touring with all the distance
(11:34):
that we have to kind of sign up for. The
reality is a musician isn't just a job, right, It's
a lot of other things involved with it, including a
traveling lifestyle. Often that means late night gigs, that means
weekend festivals, rehearsals that stretch past midnight if you're unlucky,
tours that will pull you away for weeks and sometimes
(11:54):
even months. And while other couples are building routines and
doing daily things, we were packing gear and hitting the
road again. And it's exciting for you, but what about
your partner?
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
It can feel like they're dating a ghost sometimes or
they're with somebody who's gone a lot. And I know
there are plenty of business people that have to do
this stuff. Often too. And I do think that it's
gotten a little bit easier to make this a little
bit more sustainable with traveling now and the way that
people kind of approach tours. Maybe you can make some
(12:29):
adjustments with stuff now that maybe wasn't available to us before.
But it's really something that takes a toll on a relationship.
Speaker 4 (12:35):
That toll. It's like a marathon. It starts out where
this could be exciting. When I first met I met
Anne in March and in April was her birth there
I flew out to Washington, d C. I was on
the road for the next like six weeks. So I'm like,
I'm not gonna let this one get away. I'm you know, oh,
send her flowers. She talked about cereal she likes, so
(12:57):
I sent her cereal. We were reading a book at
the same time together, and we're checking in And then
you go four years into the relationship and April is
a big month for me for touring. So now I'm
not there all the time for the birthdays. In the beginning,
I'm like, oh, let's go fly out here or fly
out there. Well, now she has responsibilities that she didn't
(13:19):
have then, So you have these situations that we're exciting
at first, and now they're like, oh, we're going to
miss another one. And even when you're on the road,
you have bad signals going through Nebraska and you can't
finish conversations, or you know, something snowballs into a crazy
conversation when you're in a van in Ohio and you
can't finish because you have to load in. Even when
(13:41):
you do have that trust, the lack of being present
emotionally and physically, it can create resentment, which is a
word that we're going to be saying a lot over
and over.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
We should bring up.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
When you have a family, you're not just missing out
on those situations with your significant other, but also potentially
your kids, which can have a much larger impact than
just even the relationship with your spouse. So that's a
huge factor in my life right now, and I'm making
adjustments in order to make it worth and having conversations
(14:16):
with my kids just to let them know that this
is how our family is functioning. This isn't just for me,
you know. And I almost say that in a way
that's like selfish for me to be, like, I want
you to know, I'm flying to Seattle this weekend to
play a show.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
But it's not just for me, right, Like.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
I'm bringing in the income that is helping all of
us do all these things that we appreciate being able
to do, you know, in our life. And I'll be back,
And it's just like having those conversations and making them understand,
like the value that you're bringing to the family, your
contribution is really important, because I think sometimes it can
get lost in that like, oh, because you're doing what
(14:54):
you love, you must just be going out to go
have fun.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
We'll see you. Dad's gone again, you know whatever. And
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
I just think that those kind of conversations are equally
important here when we're talking about relationships, because so much
of it can be misunderstood.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
How do you intentionally stay close even when you're that
many miles apart.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Well, face time has really helped, I don't We didn't
have that when we were kids, you know, So I
do think that those technologies have really made a difference.
And so FaceTime is a big one for me or
whatever I'm doing to be able to talk face to
face with them, and texting now because my kids are
old enough to have devices that I can text them
(15:35):
that we just send memes. I literally said, I send
just like what we do with our spouses. I send
them things just like things I know they're going to
like that I see, or you know, talking about sports.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
You can say, Chris, just like the things you do
with me.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And I send you.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
It's funny though, memes have become a way of staying
connected without even talking. It's just like sharing reality or
experiences or emotions, whatever the meme is about. There are
ways of keeping a closeness in your understanding and experience.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
And it's nice to know you're being thought of in
the middle of the day. That get a little smile
on your face.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
Pro tip is create non negotiable moments of connection. It
could be a video call the day of a show
in the morning, or you know, when you get back
to your hotel. That's a little crazy sometimes when you're
on the road, you never know how many schedules are
going to align with that. But a shared calendar of milestones, lace, memo, tradition,
(16:36):
something that builds routine. I think that helped. That has
helped and and I throughout the years.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You know, another thing I was gonna bring up was
nowadays too it's easier for people to bring their families
with them and their spouses to travel with them first,
at least part of the tour. I've been watching Wesley Schultz,
you know, he's from here in Denver, and I see
that he brings kids, and they're pretty young still, they're
not really in the day time school schedule yet, but
(17:04):
they travel with them, and they all over the world,
they travel with them and his spouse to and I
just think that that's a really great thing that they're allowed,
or they're giving them the opportunity to experience it with them,
you know, I think that probably makes a huge difference
in everyone's experience together. Next one on our list is
to talk about creative identity and relationship needs. The reality is,
(17:28):
for a lot of musicians, your art isn't just what
you do. It's it's who you are, your identity, your purpose,
your sense of worth, all that is tied to your music.
The kind of passion that can be magnetic can also
be overwhelming.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And when you're.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Deep in a writing session or chasing an idea at
three am, or emotionally crashing after a bad show, it's
it's easy to unintentionally check out of your relationships or
take get out on them. And when your partner doesn't
fully understand that emotional highs and lows that you're coming
from about trying to be this creative, that disconnect can
(18:10):
grow between the two of you pretty fast.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
When I was taking every gig I could take in Chicago,
we were doing the house band at the House of
Blues three days a week from four o'clock to seven o'clock,
and then we would go do another show from seven
o'clock to ten o'clock around the city, and that would
(18:33):
go on for three four days, and then you have
a Saturday show. I was in a relationship at that
time that I came home on Sunday and I was spent.
I had nothing left in the tank. And it wasn't fair,
you know. I was putting all this effort towards this stuff,
(18:55):
but then left nothing for that Sunday to make connections.
She was a musician as well, so she had shows.
They were just different kind of shows, and probably I
went out a lot later than I should have too,
because maybe her shows ended earlier. But it was nuts,
and it's like you're competing with the music and the
(19:16):
relationship and you're gonna lose unless you can prioritize that relationship.
Another thing I think with that is, you know, musicians
go out and all night long, you are validating your
passion and you're having it validated as well by people saying, oh,
you're doing such a good job, or let's talk to you,
(19:38):
like to get to know you. You did a great
job here, and then you get home and there's chores
that you might not have done or your partner may
not have done those chores, and you need to talk
about it. And now we're not talking about being that
cool rock star anymore. You're coming back to reality of like,
this is a life well lived if we're keeping the
(20:01):
home base moving together. But it's really hard to look
at someone that maybe asking you to do something where
a whole audience was just asking you to sing and
that's all they wanted, and you now have to go
out and get groceries. And at that time it was
weird because you're on the road for months on that
(20:21):
not having to do any of that stuff. And I'm
sure it was the same for her. Awesome singer, awesome, dancer, awesome,
you know I mean, and then to come home and
then to have me be like, well, what are we
going to do this or that? And she's like, I
just rock my ass off for three days straight. You know,
maybe I need a break. The validate a relationship is
(20:42):
partners and they're worth to each other. It's much different
than the validation you get on stage, and you have
to make that switch.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
There are so many times where I come home with
that rush, and not only is it hard to go
to sleep, but it's like hard not to talk about it.
You know, times my wife or kids don't want to
hear about it. It's just you know, it's not like
they're not being mean, they just it's not the stuff
that they really want to talk about. And and if
(21:09):
I'm like playing a song like the other thing is
like my kids will be like, oh Dad, you know, like, hey,
I was just playing this song the other night and
people were really into it. You know, like the kids
are like they kind of like get used to the
reality that that maybe on stage you are something that
you are, You're a totally different thing at home, and
(21:31):
in some ways you cherish that because, I mean, it
is a little exhausting to be on that stage all
the time, right, and and you don't really I think
of like a friend of mine from Chicago that that
is in a pretty successful band and he had he
had the same kind of things to say. Where's like
you come home and it's like for him, like after
playing these massive places and then just being dad again.
(21:52):
You have to learn how to mentally adjust to that
and be okay with your ego has to be let
go of because you kind of build up the ego
a bit and then you have to be back to
being just what you need to be for the family.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
Yeah. I remember when I first started writing songs in
front of Anne, like you know, small place in Colorado,
and then she walk by and be like, you're not
going to sing it like that, are you?
Speaker 3 (22:20):
I know what? That's its own podcast right there.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I think, Yeah, we learned quickly that that's a private
that's a private experience.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
No one wants to watch that.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Well, sometimes you have to let them into that process
because that's where your intimacy is, you know, with the
music and if you want someone, I mean, maybe you
let them in when you ask them not for off
the cuff comments coming from left field when you haven't
dialed it in yet, but you know it is weird.
(22:56):
You want to share that with someone, especially if they're
a nony like I don't want to say non musician
loves music, Those are even worse because they know what
they love and doesn't matter what skill level they're hearing,
they're just like that sounds like crap.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Fix it well.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
And all that is coming back to the money part,
Like if you're writing these songs and your spouse or
your family is watching all this money come in from that,
they're gonna be a lot more tolerant of it when
you're doing it.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
And this isn't judging them on it.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
It's just a fact that gonna they're gonna have a
harder time sitting through all that time and dedication you're
putting towards it when you're not making that money, and
that is part of like finding the right spouse perhaps,
but also you just have to be a you have
to be willing to accept that that's gonna be hard
on them because it takes time to build these things
(23:50):
in this industry, and there's plenty of rejection and there's
plenty of time where you're gonna be struggling.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Right.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
We always say that financial struggle is a part of
the process.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
When you're building in art, and you're building a business
around your art, so it's just going to be a thing.
And maybe that's why people stay single until after they've.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Built up something.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
But I don't know if I would have ever been
able to get to where I'm at if my wife
wasn't able to hold us up for those many years
while I did all that extra legwork and built and
headed towards this.
Speaker 4 (24:24):
Well, if you're listening to this right now and you're
feeling seen by it, you're not alone. We've all been broke, overwhelmed,
or unsure how to ask for what we need. This
isn't about being perfect, It's about being honest. And I
think with what we have left, you're going to find
out that honesty you will always win in these conversations
(24:47):
about music, passion, and money.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Yeah, and relationships are so hard if you don't communicate well.
So here're just a couple of questions we might even
recommend you ask or talk about. Are you both contributing
into the relationship in ways that we recognize and respect?
Speaker 5 (25:03):
Right?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Like?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Are you are you both doing different things? That's not
always about money? And how do you make sure that
financial decisions feel collaborative, not not controlling, right, And that
really is a big part of the budget and a
big part of what we talked. We talk about another
area called inevitables and putting money aside for goals, right,
(25:25):
and those goals can be everything from recording an album
to going to bali right as a family, So like, really,
these are big conversations to have. And is the financial
setup something that you've both talked about. One of the
things I really like about Monarch money the app that
I use that that sinks to all of our accounts,
(25:46):
is that it has it has separate logins for my
wife and I so that we don't have to talk
about the budget. We don't have to talk about where
the budget is at this point in the month, right,
We both just look at it and that's it. Answers
our questions. We don't have to have a conversation about
those kind of things. We obviously talk about bigger purchases
or anything like that, but we don't have to continuously
(26:08):
stay on it together in a way that makes it
feel a little bit more exhausting. I would recommend, though,
at least once a month that you check in on all.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Of these things. We like to look at the basics.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
It doesn't take long, but it's really fun when things
are going well. But like taking a look at like
how your net worth is moving, you know, in your household,
and how have you achieved goals and save towards things
that you're excited about, especially vacations, and prioritize things like
being able to get the kids with if you have kids,
like those things that they want for their birthday or
Christmas coming up or whatever. Those things are just checking
(26:42):
in on those things so they don't build up.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
If they build up, they become big problems. If we
can tackle them when they're kind of still just existing
in a smaller space, it's a much easier way to
handle them. The next topic is public image and social
life and temptation. Being a musician often comes with social
currency late nights and parties and fans and flirtation and
(27:05):
all lots of situations like that. And let's be real,
they don't look great from the outside. If you're posting
selfies with collaborators and staying out past midnight. Sometimes in
these environments and there's all these things, it can often
give people the wrong impression. Sometimes that can lead to
people projecting what they think on you, and that can
(27:26):
bleed over into your family as well.
Speaker 4 (27:28):
I mean, that's why people get depressed by looking at
people's highlight reels. You know, people are only presenting themselves
in the way that they want to be presented when
it's their own reel. But as a musician, if you're
in a room with a bar and there's a bunch
of beers on the bar and you're standing there, it
doesn't mean you drink any of those beers.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
As your spouse gets used to this occupation, some of
these things get easier. Their understanding of these situations get easier, right,
their acceptance of this reality. And like I said, especially
if financially it's working, it's a lot easier to get
used to. But my wife's just not a jealous person anymore.
(28:10):
And if she was, I think this would be hard.
But she's not. And maybe that wasn't the case, you know,
fifteen years ago, but it is now where she's like whatever,
Like it just isn't something they have to deal with.
And I really appreciate that because it would be an
exhausting thing to have to try to deal with outside
of all the other things that you're trying to do
(28:30):
to achieve this goal of being a musician for a living.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
For musicians that are just starting to date people, though,
I can see where one couple might think, where do
I fit into all of this? And it doesn't even
mean the musician's photos. It could mean the person at
home with their family and at birthdays and events and
with friends, or on a boat and they're on the
(28:55):
road alone. You know, how do I fit back into
this picture? I now, forgive me. I don't know the
names of these two people, but it was an older
gentleman who was dating a younger woman, and the older
gentleman was a musician. So I walked into this conversation
where she was like, yes, you should lie to me.
(29:17):
When I stepped back and I'm like, oh, well, you're
telling me you're on the road, you're doing these things.
People are coming up talking to you. You've played all night,
but you're putting on your best face. You're lying to them.
You're saying, hey, I could go out more, I can
do something. You know that not comfortable for me, but
I'm going to pursue my passion and pretty much lie
(29:41):
to yourself to keep on going. So then when you
come home to me, you're saying, oh, I don't have
enough energy left. No lie to me, say you have
enough energy to go out to dinner, to show up
to this relationship. And I think that the thing as
you do for your passions, you probably push you could
(30:04):
push yourself too far sometimes, but you're showing up in
a different way where you're saying, well, because I know
someone loves me, they're going to be there for me
no matter what. That you can forget to put all
that passion into that relationship as well. And she made
such a great point that if you could lie to
someone on the street and put on that smile and
(30:25):
be joyful and be like, okay, let's go out for
one more, you can do that for me too instead
of crash. And I think that's in this kind of
section really hit home for me.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Well.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
That brings up the other idea to me, that people
can grow apart, right, and that that I think happens
a lot. I think people grow apart and then come
back together too. I don't think it's always like you
continuously grow apart, but as you get older, life is long, right,
and if you're going to spend it with one person.
You both are going to go to different places as
(30:57):
you grow and as you experience life, and I think
that's totally okay. But there's also that other end of it,
where like, are you aligned in what you want long term?
Speaker 3 (31:07):
Still? Right?
Speaker 2 (31:07):
That bigger question of what is it that you both
want and does it still match?
Speaker 3 (31:13):
You? Know?
Speaker 2 (31:13):
So, I think that's another one of those worthy conversations
when we're talking about this end of things. Do you
both feel like you're making progress towards that goal?
Speaker 5 (31:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
And that's that g for growth in our financial scale
is really what we're talking about, because you need to
always feel like you're headed somewhere. And you know, we're
all goal oriented, right. We always want to as musicians,
want to have these goals that we're checking off as
we progress, and that's how we often talk about measurement,
measuring your progress. But your relationship has to have some
(31:43):
of that too, where it's approached in that you're headed
somewhere and that you're building towards things, right, whether that's
your kid's college funds or or taking that retirement to
the to that house in Hawaii or all of those
things are a part of it. And then there's It's
going to be sacrifices that are made along the way.
You know, some dreams are not going to come to
(32:04):
fruition and some situations are not going to work out
the way you planned. But if that end goal is
still there, I think that is a big part of it.
And when things go downhill financially, having that end goal
still be there is really really critical in order to
help hold you and all of this together.
Speaker 4 (32:21):
I would say the pro tip on this one would
be to go to that lovely app where you share
all your tattoo pictures with each other and you do
a vision board with Pinterest. I know I haven't Choleden
to you yet, Chris, because I'm not sure you're ready
to see what kind of tattoos and and I have
(32:41):
or want.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
So it's not.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
Just for your career, but for your life as a couple.
It's fond to dream and do these things together, set
your goals, connect support one another. It's easier to stay
in sync when you have something visual. Sometimes and even
when the line or the path journey is it's not straight, Yeah,
you have something to kind of turn back to you
(33:05):
you have nothing else, you just go back to the tattoos.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
I think with a home like our next home, we
kind of have had it. We created a vision board
with just like things that we envision it having. Sometimes
get lost when it comes to like what the heck
I'm doing. I'd like to look back at that for
myself just to remember, like where I'm trying to take
all of this, because I just don't know, Like there's
(33:28):
got to be more right eventually, Like even a song
will lose its meaning to you or lose its magic
because you've played it enough, even if it's a song
that when you wrote it like changed your life, right,
And sometimes we just need to be able to remember
the bigger picture. So let's go to our next one,
which is collaboration versus competition. And this is mostly targeted
(33:52):
towards creative couples, but everybody is creative. So the truth
to me is like every couple is a creative couple.
Speaker 4 (34:00):
Creative friends you know in the same business. I mean totally,
how many singer songwriter friends do we have that we
want to lift them up?
Speaker 2 (34:07):
Yeah, And if you're in a band, or if you
co write, or if you have coworkers at your teaching gig,
you know, all of these things are going to become
a feeling that you have to kind of address in
your relationship, like are we collaborating or are we competing
for things? And sometimes you really are competing for something,
(34:28):
like there's only one guitar spot on this band and
you're both auditioning. But that's not really what we're talking
about here. We're more like talking about how both people
in the relationship can be creatives, even if it's a friendship.
Especially for musicians, this thing can be beautifully complicated. On
one hand, you know, you're speaking the same language, you're
motivating each other, and you're giving each other that kind
(34:51):
of umph, that kind of kick to keep things going.
But then at the same time, you're feeling perhaps a
little bit of competition that could be negative or it
can feel like it's taking a negative toll on your relationship.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
I mean, when you're ever gonna compete with someone to
get that slot in a band, you just make sure
that other person never makes it to that audition, right,
little shive in the tire, you know, get there early.
Where is this guy? Ah, he's gonna be late like
this all the time if you hire them. There's a
ways around that. Chris Well. One person is getting more attention,
(35:29):
like more gigs, more recognition. It's hard not to compare that.
You just feel it and you want to feel happy
for your partner, your friend. But there's also I think
it's easy to feel left behind or inadequate in some way.
And on the flip side, creative critiques can accidentally turn
(35:51):
into I don't know something that you didn't even want
to hear if you're not even asking for that kind
of feedback. But I think in the long run, if
you show up to these relationships wanting to build them up,
all that other stuff goes away. You know very quickly.
The key isn't just chemistry, it's communication. It's clear boundaries.
(36:14):
And I don't think since I left Chicago and went
to Colorado, I've never had that feeling of competition not
being done in a healthy way with the people that
I've met. And I think you learned to have those boundaries,
and you also grow up in a way where you know,
(36:37):
how many people come to a show, isn't your show
compared to someone else's show. It it doesn't define anything.
You know, you're on your own journey. Concentrate on that
and be happy. For their journey. I think that's where
happiness is.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
If we are allowing that feeling in. It's our own
fault in my mind, and I'm not saying that. I'm
not telling somebody that I am saying it's your fault actually,
because I mean it's a lesson you learn, right, You
can't control just the same as much as you can't
control how someone else is feeling about the situation. You
(37:14):
can't change their mind. You can't tell them to feel
that or not to feel that, right, But at the
same time, you are in charge of working through whatever
it is you're feeling, and we are we're so threatened
by other.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
People doing well.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Usually, like we've said before, I know on the show,
is that that's an indication that it's something that you want, right,
that you that's why you're feeling jealous, Right, But you
should say, Okay, I'm around people that are doing what
it is that I want to be doing.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
This is a good sign, right.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
And in a relationship, it could also just be that
your spouse might be jealous that you're out living life
doing what it is for yourself that you set out
to do successful, and they may feel like they're not
getting to do what they need to do. So there's
there's that end of it which is very valid to
address and to make sure that everyone feels like they
(38:10):
have the resources and the time in that relationship to
do and pursue what it is that they feel like
they need to be doing. So that part of it
is valid. But whether you're jealous of somebody else is
an internal issue.
Speaker 4 (38:23):
We talked about your most like the five people that
you hang out with, so they better be kicking ass.
You want to be around people that are succeeding, and
that goes sing with family. You want to be around
the family members that are smiling, going after their goals,
lifting each other up and you up, so you could
(38:45):
do that to them and return well.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
And so much of what our kids learn this will
probably be a whole separate episode, is like how musicians
don't fuck up their kids.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
It should be its own episode.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
But they learn so much about how how we handle
relationship issues.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
They are all watching us all the time, and they're
watching and listening to us about money, right, and they're
learning everything that you and I have learned about money,
even if it's subconscious, was a lot from our childhood
and those moments that maybe stick out as being defining
moments of what you understand money is and what it does.
(39:24):
So having conversations about money is really important.
Speaker 3 (39:30):
So I added a.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Last one on here about what relationships you have with money, like.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Yourself, Like what is it that you do with money?
Speaker 2 (39:42):
That and whether or not you have a good relationship
with money is a really important thing. And I want
to actually save this for another podcast too, because I
think it's a huge topic. But I just kind of
wanted to put in your head that if you don't
have a good relationship with money, life likely to struggle
with that relationship with your spouse and money.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
You're likely to struggle with your kids.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
And money, and your kids are likely to struggle with
their understanding of money and your bandmates, and you are
probably going to have an issue managing money if you
don't have a good relationship with money. So when you
think about spending money, do you feel good right or
just give you anxiety? Like when someone buys you a coffee?
(40:26):
Can you do that without feeling guilty? Like all those
things are indicators about how you feel about money itself.
And so whatever your relationship is with money, it's worth
spending some time thinking about and like I said, dedicate
another podcast to this, probably next season, about how you
should spend some time with this, But for now, I
(40:48):
just kind of wanted to put this in here because
I think everything else stems out of whatever's in your head.
And your relationships are either successful or not based on
your own ability with yourself and your relationship with yourself
and your own money situation.
Speaker 3 (41:02):
So some all this up.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
What it all kind of comes down to is being
a musician isn't just a career, it's a lifestyle. It's
a calling, and sometimes it's a full blown identity crisis.
And when you mix that with love and partnership and
sharing goals, there's a lot involved in keeping things in
(41:25):
healthy communication. So it's no surprise that money can become
one of the trickiest parts of relationships in all of
this in its equation, So whether it's irregular income or
the pressures of making a plan right, or long nights
in long distance in the gaps, or this creative identity
clashing that can happen in relationships and that emotional reaction
(41:48):
to that, or the public lifestyle testing those boundaries and
your trust or misaligned timelines and your dreams, or if
your relationship with money in itself is not healthy. All
of this is going to affect your ability to succeed
and actually be happy with your life. So the truth is,
(42:08):
none of this resolves itself on its own.
Speaker 4 (42:12):
You've got to talk about it honestly, repeatedly and with compassion.
Stability verse freedom ego versus empathy, passion versus partnership, and
artistic ambition versus relational accountability. So and we're here to
say you can have both, but only if you're willing
(42:33):
to show up with radical honesty with your partner, your bandmates,
and as Chris said, the number eight for yourself and.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
So for your actions.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
Step, We're going to have you pick one uncomfortable conversation,
something that you've been avoiding about money, about expectations or
your needs or anything around that area of money in
your relationship, and go and have that conversation this week.
Could be with a coworker, it could be with a
you know, a bandmate or a business partner, or it
(43:04):
could be with your spouse. And it also could be
with your kids or your parents. We didn't even talk
about how your parents screwed you up.
Speaker 4 (43:12):
It's a whole nother.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Season six has.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Got a lot going on, and don't have this conversation
out of frustration.
Speaker 3 (43:19):
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
This is about letting go and growing right. These are
important parts about building your happiness and your sustainability. So
come from a place of curiosity in love with this.
It might feel awkward, It will feel awkward, but it's
the only way to build something that lasts. We know
that your time is valuable and we appreciate you spending
(43:41):
this time with us and being a part of this community.
It's our hope that you feel that sense of community
here at musicians tip jar and that you'll help spread
the word to make us all stronger.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
If you'd like to get hold of us, what's the
best way to do that.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
Check out musicians tipjar dot com for tools, resources and
discounts built specifically to help keep you up on the
finance side of your music business, and reach out to
us anytime at musicians tip jar at gmail dot com.
We'd love to hear your story. If this episode resonated
with you, share it with a friend, leave a review,
or hit the like button if you're watching us on YouTube.
(44:15):
It helps us grow this community and supports more musicians
like you.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
As always, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Remember there is old enough for everyone, You just need
to know how to get it. Until next time on
behalf of Dave Tampkin and myself Chris Webb, Stay happy,
healthy and wealthy. Love is free. Music costs everything, Touring
costs even more. But being understanding and understood with people
(44:41):
you care about, that's priceless.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
This is Musicians Tip.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Jar Somebody somebody.
Speaker 5 (44:58):
Nothing on this show should be considered civic, personal, or
professional advice. Please consult an appropriate tax, legal, business, or
financial professional for individualized advice. Individual results are not guaranteed,
and all discussed strategies have the potential for profit or loss.
Below are operating on behalf of Musician's Tip Jar l
Els exclusively
Welcome to the show that explores the methods and strategies
on rocking the financial side of your music business. With
over forty years combined experience, here are your host Chris
Webb and Dave Damkid.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Welcome to Musicians Tip Jar, where we talk about musicians
and money, where we believe a good musician can handle
their bills as well as they handle the blues.
Speaker 3 (00:24):
I'm Chris Webb, joined by my co.
Speaker 2 (00:25):
Host, who I met when we were both very financially
compatible in that we were both broke.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Dave Tampkin.
Speaker 4 (00:33):
Ain't that the truth? We talk more about money than music,
where I think most musician friendships start talking about the
music first.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Yeah. Probably.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Today we examine the effect of money on relationships in
this music world. We highlight the unique challenges and dynamics
we face in both professional and romantic relationships as musicians
and creatives. Everyone has experienced these challenges and sometimes these
issues can overwhelm us and stop our progress all together.
Today's quote comes from John Legend. There were times I
(01:10):
couldn't pay rent and my partner was carrying us. It
tested everything, but it also showed me what real love
looks like.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
She must have been pretty strong and how far was
she carrying them? This week's nonprofit it's Love in Music
dot org Love and Music, founded in May two thousand
and seven and aftermath of the four to twenty nine
LA Uprising to foster cross cultural collaboration and harmony. They
are dedicated to empowering youth and undeserved communities with free
(01:40):
music education through musically gifted volunteers. If you find this
information useful, please rate and subscribe to the podcast, and
also slam that like button if you're on YouTube so
we can help keep you up on the finance side
of your music business.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
We spend so much time talking about ways to grow
your music business, increase your wealth, and the many ways
to just succeed, but we also try to highlight sustainability
that includes mental and physical health, happiness, and fulfillment itself.
A pillar of happiness is relationship. We love to emphasize
the importance of community and its power, but we haven't
(02:17):
spent much time discussing how to navigate relationships around money.
This can include spouses, business partners, family friends, bandmates, even
our audience and the fans that we communicate with. This
is a great topic that is well worth our attention.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Let's go.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
I came up with a few titles for this. You
want to hear, sure, I hope. So I'm going to
read them. Love rent and late night Sets, Money Talk
for Creative Couples, Money for Nothing, and your Chicks for Free,
Rich girl, she works hard for the money. Love don't
cost a thing. And there were some puffy Colm's titles
(03:13):
that I just thought I should leave that alone. Altogether,
it's such as every relationship, romantic, business, family, creative. It's
time we really talked about it. And I'm surprised. I
think we're so romantic with our loved ones Chris and
really been pretty lucky to just enjoy the company of
(03:33):
the musicians we get to share a stage with that
this conversation didn't come up sooner.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
Yeah, here are season five, and we're still finding all
these things that are huge topics that we've never really
touched on. This is a big one, and so let's
start with some of the stats on why it's so big.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (03:49):
First of all, one in five divorces cite money issues
as their primary cause. And we will not only talk
about those relationships, but they really are such a pillar
of our happiness. So they really are important to be addressing,
especially because musicians live a very unique life. Right, Thirty
one percent of Americans admit to committing financial infidelity, like
hiding purchases or secret accounts. The median And I don't
(04:13):
know why that's funny to me. Sorry, I shouldn't be laughing.
Median annual income for the US working musicians is twenty
one thousand, three hundred.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
That's according to the.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
Music Industry Research Association, twenty one thousand, three hundred.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Just to go back on the last one, I know
couples that have had one of the couple in a
relationship actually make fake BANKU seats to show to show statements.
And that was the first time I ever heard of that.
But I thought, man, if you have so much time
and you could use that power for evil, just think
(04:50):
of how much money you could get paid if you
use that power for good. You know.
Speaker 2 (04:56):
Well, And that's probably because they didn't really want to
admit what's really happening, right, which was they're in trouble financially.
Another stat was that only six percent earn over one
hundred thousand per year from music solely.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Six percent.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
That's actually more than I thought it would be to
be honest to be making over one hunter k. And
this is all in the United States, but that number
should be bigger, obviously, especially as inflation continues to erode.
What one hundred thousand can even do anymore. The last
that I wanted to throw in here was seventy three
(05:33):
percent of musicians report dealing with anxiety, depression or both,
and these can have huge impacts on the relationship and
the health of your relationship. So so much of that
anxiety and depression can come from your financial stress.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
So these are really.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Important things to talk about, and we've tried to kind
of narrow them down to just focus in on the
stuff that maybe everyone here could really benefit from the most.
So let's discuss the most common areas being a musician
and choosing this career where relationships can affect ourselves and
our lives around money.
Speaker 4 (06:09):
One thing I want to mention before we go into
these things is that we're very aware that there is
someone on the opposite side dealing with the musicians in
these conversations that have their own set of frustrations and
things that they need to deal with us. When I
brought this up with a last night, she's like, you know,
(06:32):
I might call Jack attach and see if we could
have our own episode, and we'll probably blow your numbers
out of the water talking about what, oh we're supposed
to you know, how they're supposed to handle us, how
about how we handle them. So we're very aware that
when we go through this that there is someone on
the other end of this that has their own set
of standards that we need to show up for.
Speaker 2 (06:55):
I mean, I think we're really saying is what Taylor
Swift said the best is, Hey, I'm the problem.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
It's me right, Yeah, that's really what we're here to do.
Speaker 2 (07:04):
But how you handle your problem, how yourself is really
what we're talking about here.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
So let's start with number one, which.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Is how do we handle money around the irregular income
and just financial planning in general, because the reality is
being a musician means your income is like your set
list in that it changes almost every night.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
At least I hope you can let us mix it
up every night.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
One month you might flush out with festival paychecks and
merch sales and all this great revenue coming from your streams,
whereas the next you're going to be scrapping cash together
from those low paying gigs and venmo tips and whatever
else last minute stuff you put together like lessons, so
unlike a.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Traditional nine to five job.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
You know, your money here doesn't land neatly in your
bank account.
Speaker 3 (07:49):
Every two weeks.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
It trickles in from all these different angles like streaming
royalties and bar gigs and teaching and sync placements, and
sometimes that stuff can be often pretty unpredictable.
Speaker 4 (08:00):
And try to build a life with someone in that context,
you want to planification, you want to buy a house together,
have a kid, even just budget groceries without having anxiety
around it. And that's when you're that's groceries is when
you're just moved in with each other, you know, covering rent.
And then there's that other stuff when you want to say, hey,
this is someone I want to spend the rest of
(08:22):
my life with. It's tough when your income's a roller coaster.
And here's like the quiet tension. When one partner has
more consistent income than the other. You might start to
feel guilty, dependent, or even ashamed because you can't do
what the other person is doing. And meanwhile, that partner
carrying more financial weight might feel pressure, resentment, or just
(08:44):
feel misunderstood. And no one talks about it out loud,
but it's it's there waiting to unleash. And when we're
going through these notes, we work hard to have that
open communication with our partners, you know, and to go
back to have these things like presented again, it is.
(09:05):
It just shows how lucky you can be if you
figure this stuff out, to not have that resentment when
those things happened, because over twenty year marriage, you know,
you get into these abs and flows with finances.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
I think the other part of this to me, and
I mean prefaces by saying like, it's amazing that we
as musicians can even find people willing to be.
Speaker 3 (09:27):
With us, because very true.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
I mean, we're such dreamers, we're you know, what we're
trying to do is so out of the norm, right,
it's so insecure for some of people's partners. And I
think back to sometimes the early years I'm and I'm
saying this, I think Jacqueline, my wife, would would absolutely
agree with this. She didn't think there would ever be
(09:51):
a point where I would be making enough money that
she didn't have to work. I mean, that really was
never something that she believed could actually happen. And it's
not her fault. It's society has programmed us to believe that,
and I've take a lot of pride in that we've
shown that that actually is possible.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
But also at the same time, it was.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
Always like believing that you're good enough, believing that like
that you could do it together, you know, because there
were plenty of years where she was the breadwinner and
I was playing shows at night and I was doing
all the things that like I could do around the house,
and even the first five years of our kids, I
was the primary caregiver at home because that was where
(10:36):
I was more valuable because childcare is incredibly expensive and
I could play shows at night. So we just had
to make it work. And just like John Legendson, we're
like the same, you know, where Jacqueline was carrying me,
which is also very impressive.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (10:49):
The thing that I really want to say when it
comes to the irregular situation is to talk about how
you can plan out the budget itself, and if you
know how much you're going to need, and then it
really takes away that whole mystery of like how are
we doing right. That's why we always emphasize having a budget,
and that means every month right, having a new budget.
(11:11):
If you're going to change how much you're going to
bring in, we can change the forecast and then also
put that against the expenses and be able to see
clearly that things are going to be okay. That understanding
that information makes such a difference in being able to
both be on the same page about this is going
to be okay. So that brings us to number two,
which is time away and touring with all the distance
(11:34):
that we have to kind of sign up for. The
reality is a musician isn't just a job, right, It's
a lot of other things involved with it, including a
traveling lifestyle. Often that means late night gigs, that means
weekend festivals, rehearsals that stretch past midnight if you're unlucky,
tours that will pull you away for weeks and sometimes
(11:54):
even months. And while other couples are building routines and
doing daily things, we were packing gear and hitting the
road again. And it's exciting for you, but what about
your partner?
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:07):
It can feel like they're dating a ghost sometimes or
they're with somebody who's gone a lot. And I know
there are plenty of business people that have to do
this stuff. Often too. And I do think that it's
gotten a little bit easier to make this a little
bit more sustainable with traveling now and the way that
people kind of approach tours. Maybe you can make some
(12:29):
adjustments with stuff now that maybe wasn't available to us before.
But it's really something that takes a toll on a relationship.
Speaker 4 (12:35):
That toll. It's like a marathon. It starts out where
this could be exciting. When I first met I met
Anne in March and in April was her birth there
I flew out to Washington, d C. I was on
the road for the next like six weeks. So I'm like,
I'm not gonna let this one get away. I'm you know, oh,
send her flowers. She talked about cereal she likes, so
(12:57):
I sent her cereal. We were reading a book at
the same time together, and we're checking in And then
you go four years into the relationship and April is
a big month for me for touring. So now I'm
not there all the time for the birthdays. In the beginning,
I'm like, oh, let's go fly out here or fly
out there. Well, now she has responsibilities that she didn't
(13:19):
have then, So you have these situations that we're exciting
at first, and now they're like, oh, we're going to
miss another one. And even when you're on the road,
you have bad signals going through Nebraska and you can't
finish conversations, or you know, something snowballs into a crazy
conversation when you're in a van in Ohio and you
can't finish because you have to load in. Even when
(13:41):
you do have that trust, the lack of being present
emotionally and physically, it can create resentment, which is a
word that we're going to be saying a lot over
and over.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
We should bring up.
Speaker 2 (13:53):
When you have a family, you're not just missing out
on those situations with your significant other, but also potentially
your kids, which can have a much larger impact than
just even the relationship with your spouse. So that's a
huge factor in my life right now, and I'm making
adjustments in order to make it worth and having conversations
(14:16):
with my kids just to let them know that this
is how our family is functioning. This isn't just for me,
you know. And I almost say that in a way
that's like selfish for me to be, like, I want
you to know, I'm flying to Seattle this weekend to
play a show.
Speaker 3 (14:30):
But it's not just for me, right, Like.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
I'm bringing in the income that is helping all of
us do all these things that we appreciate being able
to do, you know, in our life. And I'll be back,
And it's just like having those conversations and making them understand,
like the value that you're bringing to the family, your
contribution is really important, because I think sometimes it can
get lost in that like, oh, because you're doing what
(14:54):
you love, you must just be going out to go
have fun.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
We'll see you. Dad's gone again, you know whatever. And
I don't know.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
I just think that those kind of conversations are equally
important here when we're talking about relationships, because so much
of it can be misunderstood.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
How do you intentionally stay close even when you're that
many miles apart.
Speaker 2 (15:14):
Well, face time has really helped, I don't We didn't
have that when we were kids, you know, So I
do think that those technologies have really made a difference.
And so FaceTime is a big one for me or
whatever I'm doing to be able to talk face to
face with them, and texting now because my kids are
old enough to have devices that I can text them
(15:35):
that we just send memes. I literally said, I send
just like what we do with our spouses. I send
them things just like things I know they're going to
like that I see, or you know, talking about sports.
Speaker 4 (15:47):
You can say, Chris, just like the things you do
with me.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
And I send you.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
It's funny though, memes have become a way of staying
connected without even talking. It's just like sharing reality or
experiences or emotions, whatever the meme is about. There are
ways of keeping a closeness in your understanding and experience.
Speaker 4 (16:09):
And it's nice to know you're being thought of in
the middle of the day. That get a little smile
on your face.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
Pro tip is create non negotiable moments of connection. It
could be a video call the day of a show
in the morning, or you know, when you get back
to your hotel. That's a little crazy sometimes when you're
on the road, you never know how many schedules are
going to align with that. But a shared calendar of milestones, lace, memo, tradition,
(16:36):
something that builds routine. I think that helped. That has
helped and and I throughout the years.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
You know, another thing I was gonna bring up was
nowadays too it's easier for people to bring their families
with them and their spouses to travel with them first,
at least part of the tour. I've been watching Wesley Schultz,
you know, he's from here in Denver, and I see
that he brings kids, and they're pretty young still, they're
not really in the day time school schedule yet, but
(17:04):
they travel with them, and they all over the world,
they travel with them and his spouse to and I
just think that that's a really great thing that they're allowed,
or they're giving them the opportunity to experience it with them,
you know, I think that probably makes a huge difference
in everyone's experience together. Next one on our list is
to talk about creative identity and relationship needs. The reality is,
(17:28):
for a lot of musicians, your art isn't just what
you do. It's it's who you are, your identity, your purpose,
your sense of worth, all that is tied to your music.
The kind of passion that can be magnetic can also
be overwhelming.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
And when you're.
Speaker 2 (17:48):
Deep in a writing session or chasing an idea at
three am, or emotionally crashing after a bad show, it's
it's easy to unintentionally check out of your relationships or
take get out on them. And when your partner doesn't
fully understand that emotional highs and lows that you're coming
from about trying to be this creative, that disconnect can
(18:10):
grow between the two of you pretty fast.
Speaker 4 (18:12):
When I was taking every gig I could take in Chicago,
we were doing the house band at the House of
Blues three days a week from four o'clock to seven o'clock,
and then we would go do another show from seven
o'clock to ten o'clock around the city, and that would
(18:33):
go on for three four days, and then you have
a Saturday show. I was in a relationship at that
time that I came home on Sunday and I was spent.
I had nothing left in the tank. And it wasn't fair,
you know. I was putting all this effort towards this stuff,
(18:55):
but then left nothing for that Sunday to make connections.
She was a musician as well, so she had shows.
They were just different kind of shows, and probably I
went out a lot later than I should have too,
because maybe her shows ended earlier. But it was nuts,
and it's like you're competing with the music and the
(19:16):
relationship and you're gonna lose unless you can prioritize that relationship.
Another thing I think with that is, you know, musicians
go out and all night long, you are validating your
passion and you're having it validated as well by people saying, oh,
you're doing such a good job, or let's talk to you,
(19:38):
like to get to know you. You did a great
job here, and then you get home and there's chores
that you might not have done or your partner may
not have done those chores, and you need to talk
about it. And now we're not talking about being that
cool rock star anymore. You're coming back to reality of like,
this is a life well lived if we're keeping the
(20:01):
home base moving together. But it's really hard to look
at someone that maybe asking you to do something where
a whole audience was just asking you to sing and
that's all they wanted, and you now have to go
out and get groceries. And at that time it was
weird because you're on the road for months on that
(20:21):
not having to do any of that stuff. And I'm
sure it was the same for her. Awesome singer, awesome, dancer, awesome,
you know I mean, and then to come home and
then to have me be like, well, what are we
going to do this or that? And she's like, I
just rock my ass off for three days straight. You know,
maybe I need a break. The validate a relationship is
(20:42):
partners and they're worth to each other. It's much different
than the validation you get on stage, and you have
to make that switch.
Speaker 2 (20:49):
There are so many times where I come home with
that rush, and not only is it hard to go
to sleep, but it's like hard not to talk about it.
You know, times my wife or kids don't want to
hear about it. It's just you know, it's not like
they're not being mean, they just it's not the stuff
that they really want to talk about. And and if
(21:09):
I'm like playing a song like the other thing is
like my kids will be like, oh Dad, you know, like, hey,
I was just playing this song the other night and
people were really into it. You know, like the kids
are like they kind of like get used to the
reality that that maybe on stage you are something that
you are, You're a totally different thing at home, and
(21:31):
in some ways you cherish that because, I mean, it
is a little exhausting to be on that stage all
the time, right, and and you don't really I think
of like a friend of mine from Chicago that that
is in a pretty successful band and he had he
had the same kind of things to say. Where's like
you come home and it's like for him, like after
playing these massive places and then just being dad again.
(21:52):
You have to learn how to mentally adjust to that
and be okay with your ego has to be let
go of because you kind of build up the ego
a bit and then you have to be back to
being just what you need to be for the family.
Speaker 4 (22:06):
Yeah. I remember when I first started writing songs in
front of Anne, like you know, small place in Colorado,
and then she walk by and be like, you're not
going to sing it like that, are you?
Speaker 3 (22:20):
I know what? That's its own podcast right there.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
I think, Yeah, we learned quickly that that's a private
that's a private experience.
Speaker 3 (22:31):
No one wants to watch that.
Speaker 4 (22:35):
Well, sometimes you have to let them into that process
because that's where your intimacy is, you know, with the
music and if you want someone, I mean, maybe you
let them in when you ask them not for off
the cuff comments coming from left field when you haven't
dialed it in yet, but you know it is weird.
(22:56):
You want to share that with someone, especially if they're
a nony like I don't want to say non musician
loves music, Those are even worse because they know what
they love and doesn't matter what skill level they're hearing,
they're just like that sounds like crap.
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Fix it well.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
And all that is coming back to the money part,
Like if you're writing these songs and your spouse or
your family is watching all this money come in from that,
they're gonna be a lot more tolerant of it when
you're doing it.
Speaker 3 (23:26):
And this isn't judging them on it.
Speaker 2 (23:28):
It's just a fact that gonna they're gonna have a
harder time sitting through all that time and dedication you're
putting towards it when you're not making that money, and
that is part of like finding the right spouse perhaps,
but also you just have to be a you have
to be willing to accept that that's gonna be hard
on them because it takes time to build these things
(23:50):
in this industry, and there's plenty of rejection and there's
plenty of time where you're gonna be struggling.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
Right.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
We always say that financial struggle is a part of
the process.
Speaker 2 (23:59):
When you're building in art, and you're building a business
around your art, so it's just going to be a thing.
And maybe that's why people stay single until after they've.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Built up something.
Speaker 2 (24:10):
But I don't know if I would have ever been
able to get to where I'm at if my wife
wasn't able to hold us up for those many years
while I did all that extra legwork and built and
headed towards this.
Speaker 4 (24:24):
Well, if you're listening to this right now and you're
feeling seen by it, you're not alone. We've all been broke, overwhelmed,
or unsure how to ask for what we need. This
isn't about being perfect, It's about being honest. And I
think with what we have left, you're going to find
out that honesty you will always win in these conversations
(24:47):
about music, passion, and money.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Yeah, and relationships are so hard if you don't communicate well.
So here're just a couple of questions we might even
recommend you ask or talk about. Are you both contributing
into the relationship in ways that we recognize and respect?
Speaker 5 (25:03):
Right?
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Like?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Are you are you both doing different things? That's not
always about money? And how do you make sure that
financial decisions feel collaborative, not not controlling, right, And that
really is a big part of the budget and a
big part of what we talked. We talk about another
area called inevitables and putting money aside for goals, right,
(25:25):
and those goals can be everything from recording an album
to going to bali right as a family, So like, really,
these are big conversations to have. And is the financial
setup something that you've both talked about. One of the
things I really like about Monarch money the app that
I use that that sinks to all of our accounts,
(25:46):
is that it has it has separate logins for my
wife and I so that we don't have to talk
about the budget. We don't have to talk about where
the budget is at this point in the month, right,
We both just look at it and that's it. Answers
our questions. We don't have to have a conversation about
those kind of things. We obviously talk about bigger purchases
or anything like that, but we don't have to continuously
(26:08):
stay on it together in a way that makes it
feel a little bit more exhausting. I would recommend, though,
at least once a month that you check in on all.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
Of these things. We like to look at the basics.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
It doesn't take long, but it's really fun when things
are going well. But like taking a look at like
how your net worth is moving, you know, in your household,
and how have you achieved goals and save towards things
that you're excited about, especially vacations, and prioritize things like
being able to get the kids with if you have kids,
like those things that they want for their birthday or
Christmas coming up or whatever. Those things are just checking
(26:42):
in on those things so they don't build up.
Speaker 3 (26:44):
Right.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
If they build up, they become big problems. If we
can tackle them when they're kind of still just existing
in a smaller space, it's a much easier way to
handle them. The next topic is public image and social
life and temptation. Being a musician often comes with social
currency late nights and parties and fans and flirtation and
(27:05):
all lots of situations like that. And let's be real,
they don't look great from the outside. If you're posting
selfies with collaborators and staying out past midnight. Sometimes in
these environments and there's all these things, it can often
give people the wrong impression. Sometimes that can lead to
people projecting what they think on you, and that can
(27:26):
bleed over into your family as well.
Speaker 4 (27:28):
I mean, that's why people get depressed by looking at
people's highlight reels. You know, people are only presenting themselves
in the way that they want to be presented when
it's their own reel. But as a musician, if you're
in a room with a bar and there's a bunch
of beers on the bar and you're standing there, it
doesn't mean you drink any of those beers.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
As your spouse gets used to this occupation, some of
these things get easier. Their understanding of these situations get easier, right,
their acceptance of this reality. And like I said, especially
if financially it's working, it's a lot easier to get
used to. But my wife's just not a jealous person anymore.
(28:10):
And if she was, I think this would be hard.
But she's not. And maybe that wasn't the case, you know,
fifteen years ago, but it is now where she's like whatever,
Like it just isn't something they have to deal with.
And I really appreciate that because it would be an
exhausting thing to have to try to deal with outside
of all the other things that you're trying to do
(28:30):
to achieve this goal of being a musician for a living.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
For musicians that are just starting to date people, though,
I can see where one couple might think, where do
I fit into all of this? And it doesn't even
mean the musician's photos. It could mean the person at
home with their family and at birthdays and events and
with friends, or on a boat and they're on the
(28:55):
road alone. You know, how do I fit back into
this picture? I now, forgive me. I don't know the
names of these two people, but it was an older
gentleman who was dating a younger woman, and the older
gentleman was a musician. So I walked into this conversation
where she was like, yes, you should lie to me.
(29:17):
When I stepped back and I'm like, oh, well, you're
telling me you're on the road, you're doing these things.
People are coming up talking to you. You've played all night,
but you're putting on your best face. You're lying to them.
You're saying, hey, I could go out more, I can
do something. You know that not comfortable for me, but
I'm going to pursue my passion and pretty much lie
(29:41):
to yourself to keep on going. So then when you
come home to me, you're saying, oh, I don't have
enough energy left. No lie to me, say you have
enough energy to go out to dinner, to show up
to this relationship. And I think that the thing as
you do for your passions, you probably push you could
(30:04):
push yourself too far sometimes, but you're showing up in
a different way where you're saying, well, because I know
someone loves me, they're going to be there for me
no matter what. That you can forget to put all
that passion into that relationship as well. And she made
such a great point that if you could lie to
someone on the street and put on that smile and
(30:25):
be joyful and be like, okay, let's go out for
one more, you can do that for me too instead
of crash. And I think that's in this kind of
section really hit home for me.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
Well.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
That brings up the other idea to me, that people
can grow apart, right, and that that I think happens
a lot. I think people grow apart and then come
back together too. I don't think it's always like you
continuously grow apart, but as you get older, life is long, right,
and if you're going to spend it with one person.
You both are going to go to different places as
(30:57):
you grow and as you experience life, and I think
that's totally okay. But there's also that other end of it,
where like, are you aligned in what you want long term?
Speaker 3 (31:07):
Still? Right?
Speaker 2 (31:07):
That bigger question of what is it that you both
want and does it still match?
Speaker 3 (31:13):
You? Know?
Speaker 2 (31:13):
So, I think that's another one of those worthy conversations
when we're talking about this end of things. Do you
both feel like you're making progress towards that goal?
Speaker 5 (31:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
And that's that g for growth in our financial scale
is really what we're talking about, because you need to
always feel like you're headed somewhere. And you know, we're
all goal oriented, right. We always want to as musicians,
want to have these goals that we're checking off as
we progress, and that's how we often talk about measurement,
measuring your progress. But your relationship has to have some
(31:43):
of that too, where it's approached in that you're headed
somewhere and that you're building towards things, right, whether that's
your kid's college funds or or taking that retirement to
the to that house in Hawaii or all of those
things are a part of it. And then there's It's
going to be sacrifices that are made along the way.
You know, some dreams are not going to come to
(32:04):
fruition and some situations are not going to work out
the way you planned. But if that end goal is
still there, I think that is a big part of it.
And when things go downhill financially, having that end goal
still be there is really really critical in order to
help hold you and all of this together.
Speaker 4 (32:21):
I would say the pro tip on this one would
be to go to that lovely app where you share
all your tattoo pictures with each other and you do
a vision board with Pinterest. I know I haven't Choleden
to you yet, Chris, because I'm not sure you're ready
to see what kind of tattoos and and I have
(32:41):
or want.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
So it's not.
Speaker 4 (32:44):
Just for your career, but for your life as a couple.
It's fond to dream and do these things together, set
your goals, connect support one another. It's easier to stay
in sync when you have something visual. Sometimes and even
when the line or the path journey is it's not straight, Yeah,
you have something to kind of turn back to you
(33:05):
you have nothing else, you just go back to the tattoos.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
I think with a home like our next home, we
kind of have had it. We created a vision board
with just like things that we envision it having. Sometimes
get lost when it comes to like what the heck
I'm doing. I'd like to look back at that for
myself just to remember, like where I'm trying to take
all of this, because I just don't know, Like there's
(33:28):
got to be more right eventually, Like even a song
will lose its meaning to you or lose its magic
because you've played it enough, even if it's a song
that when you wrote it like changed your life, right,
And sometimes we just need to be able to remember
the bigger picture. So let's go to our next one,
which is collaboration versus competition. And this is mostly targeted
(33:52):
towards creative couples, but everybody is creative. So the truth
to me is like every couple is a creative couple.
Speaker 4 (34:00):
Creative friends you know in the same business. I mean totally,
how many singer songwriter friends do we have that we
want to lift them up?
Speaker 2 (34:07):
Yeah, And if you're in a band, or if you
co write, or if you have coworkers at your teaching gig,
you know, all of these things are going to become
a feeling that you have to kind of address in
your relationship, like are we collaborating or are we competing
for things? And sometimes you really are competing for something,
(34:28):
like there's only one guitar spot on this band and
you're both auditioning. But that's not really what we're talking
about here. We're more like talking about how both people
in the relationship can be creatives, even if it's a friendship.
Especially for musicians, this thing can be beautifully complicated. On
one hand, you know, you're speaking the same language, you're
motivating each other, and you're giving each other that kind
(34:51):
of umph, that kind of kick to keep things going.
But then at the same time, you're feeling perhaps a
little bit of competition that could be negative or it
can feel like it's taking a negative toll on your relationship.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
I mean, when you're ever gonna compete with someone to
get that slot in a band, you just make sure
that other person never makes it to that audition, right,
little shive in the tire, you know, get there early.
Where is this guy? Ah, he's gonna be late like
this all the time if you hire them. There's a
ways around that. Chris Well. One person is getting more attention,
(35:29):
like more gigs, more recognition. It's hard not to compare that.
You just feel it and you want to feel happy
for your partner, your friend. But there's also I think
it's easy to feel left behind or inadequate in some way.
And on the flip side, creative critiques can accidentally turn
(35:51):
into I don't know something that you didn't even want
to hear if you're not even asking for that kind
of feedback. But I think in the long run, if
you show up to these relationships wanting to build them up,
all that other stuff goes away. You know very quickly.
The key isn't just chemistry, it's communication. It's clear boundaries.
(36:14):
And I don't think since I left Chicago and went
to Colorado, I've never had that feeling of competition not
being done in a healthy way with the people that
I've met. And I think you learned to have those boundaries,
and you also grow up in a way where you know,
(36:37):
how many people come to a show, isn't your show
compared to someone else's show. It it doesn't define anything.
You know, you're on your own journey. Concentrate on that
and be happy. For their journey. I think that's where
happiness is.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
If we are allowing that feeling in. It's our own
fault in my mind, and I'm not saying that. I'm
not telling somebody that I am saying it's your fault actually,
because I mean it's a lesson you learn, right, You
can't control just the same as much as you can't
control how someone else is feeling about the situation. You
(37:14):
can't change their mind. You can't tell them to feel
that or not to feel that, right, But at the
same time, you are in charge of working through whatever
it is you're feeling, and we are we're so threatened
by other.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
People doing well.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
Usually, like we've said before, I know on the show,
is that that's an indication that it's something that you want, right,
that you that's why you're feeling jealous, Right, But you
should say, Okay, I'm around people that are doing what
it is that I want to be doing.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
This is a good sign, right.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
And in a relationship, it could also just be that
your spouse might be jealous that you're out living life
doing what it is for yourself that you set out
to do successful, and they may feel like they're not
getting to do what they need to do. So there's
there's that end of it which is very valid to
address and to make sure that everyone feels like they
(38:10):
have the resources and the time in that relationship to
do and pursue what it is that they feel like
they need to be doing. So that part of it
is valid. But whether you're jealous of somebody else is
an internal issue.
Speaker 4 (38:23):
We talked about your most like the five people that
you hang out with, so they better be kicking ass.
You want to be around people that are succeeding, and
that goes sing with family. You want to be around
the family members that are smiling, going after their goals,
lifting each other up and you up, so you could
(38:45):
do that to them and return well.
Speaker 2 (38:47):
And so much of what our kids learn this will
probably be a whole separate episode, is like how musicians
don't fuck up their kids.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
It should be its own episode.
Speaker 2 (38:58):
But they learn so much about how how we handle
relationship issues.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:03):
They are all watching us all the time, and they're
watching and listening to us about money, right, and they're
learning everything that you and I have learned about money,
even if it's subconscious, was a lot from our childhood
and those moments that maybe stick out as being defining
moments of what you understand money is and what it does.
(39:24):
So having conversations about money is really important.
Speaker 3 (39:30):
So I added a.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
Last one on here about what relationships you have with money, like.
Speaker 3 (39:37):
Yourself, Like what is it that you do with money?
Speaker 2 (39:42):
That and whether or not you have a good relationship
with money is a really important thing. And I want
to actually save this for another podcast too, because I
think it's a huge topic. But I just kind of
wanted to put in your head that if you don't
have a good relationship with money, life likely to struggle
with that relationship with your spouse and money.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
You're likely to struggle with your kids.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
And money, and your kids are likely to struggle with
their understanding of money and your bandmates, and you are
probably going to have an issue managing money if you
don't have a good relationship with money. So when you
think about spending money, do you feel good right or
just give you anxiety? Like when someone buys you a coffee?
(40:26):
Can you do that without feeling guilty? Like all those
things are indicators about how you feel about money itself.
And so whatever your relationship is with money, it's worth
spending some time thinking about and like I said, dedicate
another podcast to this, probably next season, about how you
should spend some time with this, But for now, I
(40:48):
just kind of wanted to put this in here because
I think everything else stems out of whatever's in your head.
And your relationships are either successful or not based on
your own ability with yourself and your relationship with yourself
and your own money situation.
Speaker 3 (41:02):
So some all this up.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
What it all kind of comes down to is being
a musician isn't just a career, it's a lifestyle. It's
a calling, and sometimes it's a full blown identity crisis.
And when you mix that with love and partnership and
sharing goals, there's a lot involved in keeping things in
(41:25):
healthy communication. So it's no surprise that money can become
one of the trickiest parts of relationships in all of
this in its equation, So whether it's irregular income or
the pressures of making a plan right, or long nights
in long distance in the gaps, or this creative identity
clashing that can happen in relationships and that emotional reaction
(41:48):
to that, or the public lifestyle testing those boundaries and
your trust or misaligned timelines and your dreams, or if
your relationship with money in itself is not healthy. All
of this is going to affect your ability to succeed
and actually be happy with your life. So the truth is,
(42:08):
none of this resolves itself on its own.
Speaker 4 (42:12):
You've got to talk about it honestly, repeatedly and with compassion.
Stability verse freedom ego versus empathy, passion versus partnership, and
artistic ambition versus relational accountability. So and we're here to
say you can have both, but only if you're willing
(42:33):
to show up with radical honesty with your partner, your bandmates,
and as Chris said, the number eight for yourself and.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
So for your actions.
Speaker 2 (42:42):
Step, We're going to have you pick one uncomfortable conversation,
something that you've been avoiding about money, about expectations or
your needs or anything around that area of money in
your relationship, and go and have that conversation this week.
Could be with a coworker, it could be with a
you know, a bandmate or a business partner, or it
(43:04):
could be with your spouse. And it also could be
with your kids or your parents. We didn't even talk
about how your parents screwed you up.
Speaker 4 (43:12):
It's a whole nother.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Season six has.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
Got a lot going on, and don't have this conversation
out of frustration.
Speaker 3 (43:19):
Right.
Speaker 2 (43:19):
This is about letting go and growing right. These are
important parts about building your happiness and your sustainability. So
come from a place of curiosity in love with this.
It might feel awkward, It will feel awkward, but it's
the only way to build something that lasts. We know
that your time is valuable and we appreciate you spending
(43:41):
this time with us and being a part of this community.
It's our hope that you feel that sense of community
here at musicians tip jar and that you'll help spread
the word to make us all stronger.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
If you'd like to get hold of us, what's the
best way to do that.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
Check out musicians tipjar dot com for tools, resources and
discounts built specifically to help keep you up on the
finance side of your music business, and reach out to
us anytime at musicians tip jar at gmail dot com.
We'd love to hear your story. If this episode resonated
with you, share it with a friend, leave a review,
or hit the like button if you're watching us on YouTube.
(44:15):
It helps us grow this community and supports more musicians
like you.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
As always, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (44:20):
Remember there is old enough for everyone, You just need
to know how to get it. Until next time on
behalf of Dave Tampkin and myself Chris Webb, Stay happy,
healthy and wealthy. Love is free. Music costs everything, Touring
costs even more. But being understanding and understood with people
(44:41):
you care about, that's priceless.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
This is Musicians Tip.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
Jar Somebody somebody.
Speaker 5 (44:58):
Nothing on this show should be considered civic, personal, or
professional advice. Please consult an appropriate tax, legal, business, or
financial professional for individualized advice. Individual results are not guaranteed,
and all discussed strategies have the potential for profit or loss.
Below are operating on behalf of Musician's Tip Jar l
Els exclusively
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