November 1, 2024 • 63 mins
Live Halloween Night!! 🎃 Joining me are paranormal and cryptozoological investigators Natalie Fowler and Jessica Freeburg. They are the authors of GHOSTLY TALES OF PENNSYLVANIA and MONSTERS OF THE NORTHEAST.
https://nataliefowler.com/ || https://jessicafreeburg.com/
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HALF LIGHT documentary: https://tubitv.com/movies/678744/half-light
https://nataliefowler.com/ || https://jessicafreeburg.com/
Please help the MYSTIC LOUNGE channel grow. ☕️ SUBSCRIBE, like, comment, and click the YouTube Notification Bell so you don’t miss a show. Thank you! https://www.youtube.com/mysticlounge
HALF LIGHT documentary: https://tubitv.com/movies/678744/half-light
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
I'm Happy Halloween everyone. Thank you so much for joining
us tonight. I'm really excited to be having my two
special guests on, Jessica Freeberg and Natalie Fowler. You guys
are becoming quite the regulars, and there's a good reason
for that, because we always have a good time. You
have great stories, So happy Halloween everyone. If you have
(01:05):
any stories of your own tonight later on, I'm gonna
share a link and then you can join video and audio,
or you can join just audio, it's up to you,
and then would love to hear your your story as well.
So let's bring on our guests, Natalie and Jessica. How
are you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Hey, I'm great, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
How are you?
Speaker 1 (01:24):
I'm good? Happy Halloween, you two. I have to kind
of I'm gonna merge our works. So you guys focused
on a book called Ghostly Tales of Pennsylvania, and we're here,
and I'm actually gonna be in Carbondale, Pennsylvania next weekend
doing a presentation about UFO debunking at what's called the
(01:47):
Carbon Dalien Festival, based on a UFO event that took
place there in nineteen seventy four. So I'm really really
excited to be doing that coo and yeah, so there's
so much going on. You know, we live here in
the Hudson Valley, but you know all of these areas
out here where there's lots of woods and lots of hills, Pennsylvania,
(02:09):
New Jersey, which you know, cover all that. There are
no shortage of creepy tales. So being that I'm born
and raised in New Jersey, I have to start with
the Jersey Devil. So can we take us down that road? Yes,
just a little bit.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
Okay, I'm gonna let Nally take it away because she
did a lot of research on that one for us.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
So this is a really fun story to write because
it was there were just so many versions, and it
was also an old and older story, so it was
a little difficult to try to just go back to
that moment in the eighteen you know, the original. So
the trick was to try to find a way to
tell the story where you could kind of cover all
(02:53):
of those versions. And I happened to have so I
I have back issues of Fate magazine all over my
house because I still keep in touch with Phyllis and
and when we started working on this book, it was
the first book we had done in a while. So
I grabbed stacks of these old fake back issues and
(03:18):
just started flipping through looking for a way to kind
of rein in all the research and all the variations
of that story and kind of try to find a
starting point. And one of the stories I came across
talked about how sightings increased after a forest fire, and
there had been, uh, the second forest fire that got
(03:41):
started because of flare from a nearby air base started caught, caught, caught,
the air caught a whole section of the forest on
fire and nearby, and so I uh, And I happened
to have a friend of mine who's who's a fire
fighter and super interested in the paranormal. So I thought, oh,
(04:02):
this is perfect. I'm gonna have this firefighter going into
fight the fire and reminiscing about all the stories his
babysitter told him about the New Jersey Devil. So it
was it was a great way. We have a little
bit of creative freedom with this to kind of create
some characters in order to frame the stories sometimes. So
(04:24):
it was just it was just a fun one to write, because.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Do you think it's real?
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I do?
Speaker 4 (04:31):
I mean, it's I mean, it's so hard to say, like,
do I think the Jersey Devil is necessarily what we
think it is? I think people are seeing something, so
I think the sightings are real. Now what exactly that is?
It's kind of like the Bigfoot phenomenon, right, like people
are seeing something, but what is it exactly?
Speaker 2 (04:51):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
Is it was it a malformed baby that came from
mother leads? You know, Like I don't know if I
believe the backstory to it, but there's there's something out
there that.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Really interesting point.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
And I think there's something to be said about how
these stories take on a life of its own for
different ulterior motives. I mean, in this case, the story
was retold many many times as a way to get
children to behave, Like if you don't behave, the new
Jersey Devil's going to come get you. So that was
kind of how I couched the story when we when
we worked on it.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So fortunately my parents didn't threaten me that story creatures,
we were right. We grew up right next to the
best river, so.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Yeah, oh you're right there.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:37):
And another thing I think about with some of these
creatures too, is kind of the phenomenon of you know,
like a tollbuff where we talk so much about something,
we give so much energy to a legend that it
becomes real, Like Slenderman. That's one of my favorite examples,
because we know how that originated. It wasn't ever a
(06:01):
real thing, but after it was in the world and
people became very obsessed with it and interested in it,
suddenly you have actual sightings of slender Man, and there's
video that can you can see and pictures that, you know,
kind of show evidence that now Slenderman is a thing.
So do we kind of manifest what we put our
energy and our thoughts into.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Sometimes well, you know, it could be like the way
people claim that we interpret UFOs differently than ancient people's
interpret them. They in the past, they would have said
they were angels, and now we see them as something different.
Maybe slender Man people are actually seeing something like the
Shadow person people or the ha Man, and they're just
attributing it to the slender Man. They're kind of overlaying
(06:42):
how they interpret But the Jersey Devil, you made an
interesting point that perhaps the Leads story is just a
kind of a backstory tacked onto something that people are
actually seeing. So two totally separate things. People are seeing
something in the world, woods, in the pine barrens, and
(07:03):
then this other thing happens. There's another legend about it,
this beastly thing, this at least you know at birth,
and then they merge.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah. I think that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Okay, we nailed that one.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
We're done.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
But in all of your research, like, what what in
let's let's stick to Pennsylvania for a little bit. We'll
go from Jersey to Pennsylvania. What is the creepiest, creepiest
story or creature that you've come across.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
My one of my favorite things that we got to
do this time around was also right about ghost stories
because I kind of think of Natalie and I as
like the ghost Girls first and the Monster Girls second.
We originated in the ghosts, right, We grew up having
personal experiences with the ghosts, and that's kind of what
(08:05):
led us into this journey that we're presently on. So
for me, during the writing of these two books, as
we had Ghostly Tails of Pennsylvania come out and The
Monsters of the Northeast, my real favorite was writing some
of these ghost stories and I found them so chilling,
in part because the history was so tragic, and a
(08:28):
lot of that tragedy is what fed into now what
we experience as hauntings. So I think about like Eastern
State Penitentiary for example. You know, that was a structure
created with such good intent. They really wanted it to
be a place where people could become reformed and have
(08:48):
penants for their crime and find a better path through
complete solitude, which actually ended up making them crazy and
made them worse. And we have this great idea and
this is what we do as humans and ma unkind.
We take this great thing and we're like, look at
this wonderful thing we have, and then we just ruin it,
(09:08):
you know. And that's what I you know, that's the
thing that fascinated me the most. And so looking at
these the history behind the hauntings was the most exciting.
So Eastern State was one of my favorites that we
got to write about in the history of that.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Didn't that close down like pretty late too, like in
the seventies or something, or was it even living.
Speaker 4 (09:26):
That Ah, I'm gonna have to look at the date
when it closed. I don't recall exactly. I think it
was a little later. Do you remember, Natalie, this was
like four books ago. Now I'm going to look at
my book.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
So we when we do know that anywhere there's been
some kind of trauma, that there there is a residual
something that people are picking up on.
Speaker 4 (09:53):
Right, Yeah, oftentimes you have residual energy. I do think
that there's some intelligent hauntings that go on in some
of these places too, that we have souls that, for
whatever reason, they just aren't at peace and they don't
feel comfortable crossing over. You think about a place like
Eastern State Penitentiary, and you know you have people there
(10:15):
for committing crimes, some of them really horrible crimes. Right,
And so the idea of Christian faith being that either
when you die, you cross over to Heaven or you
cross over to hell.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Well, if the light's.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
Coming for you, you may be not going to go
to it because you don't think you get to go
someplace very nice. And so I think there's some of
that there as well.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
All right, so you guys write about vampires.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
I was going to go there next.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Oh yeah, you talked about that.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
I never heard anything growing up about about antipres.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
One of my favorite parts of working on I mean,
they're so research based and we're huge history nerds and
research geeks, and whenever, whenever there's a chance to preserve
a piece of history that might have otherwise been forgotten,
it's it's kind of a cool rush. And I came
across that when we were doing the research for the
(11:07):
Monster book, and you know, I'm looking through Oh Vampires,
the vampire Mercy Brown, and so you start diving into
the different vampire stories and you realize that this is
a period of time that almost got completely forgotten because
it was kind of the backwoods. They were getting their
(11:28):
news and information from the traveling preachers, and at the
same time that coincided with the consumption, which now we
know was tuberculosis. Incredibly contagious. It was wiping out whole families,
and in their grief and despair, they and also not
wiping them out very quickly. You know, over the course
(11:50):
of twenty years, these families would just get wiped out completely.
And so they were looking for answers, and those answers
came in the form of a traveling preacher, and that
had a theory about how the vampires were coming back
from the grave to feast on their family members, and
(12:15):
the way you could tell this was if you dug
up the body and there was a root that had
gone through or And then later the story evolved that
if there was any blood left in the organs or
in the body, then that was a sign that this
person was a vampire and they were coming back from
the grave to feast on their family members.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
So if something like organic in nature, some environmental condition
preserve the body longer.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Well, that was the last one. Mercy Brown was the
last known as the last Vampire. And the poor girl,
I think she had to bury her older sister, her mother,
I mean, just one right after the other over the
course of ten years. And she finally gets this and
gets sick and dies, and I think she died in
(13:03):
in the wintertime, so January, and her brother goes on
to get sick, and the father is just beside himself
with grief. So he's going to latch onto whatever theory
he can to try to save his son. And so
they go digging up this body. Well, I mean it
was wintertime, so that's gonna naturally preserve a lot of
(13:25):
what was left. And it was only a couple months later,
so she was declared a vampire, and I think they
the townspeople kind of were going a little crazy at
this point, and uh had they I mean, the the
solution was to burn her heart and make him drink it.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
So make him drink it.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Was like it was getting a little like out of
control by that point. And actually, and in that story
there was a doctor in town who like I mean
and and that was a you know, the research had
the townspeople going to the doctor to try to get
him to help with this, and he's like, absolutely not,
I'm not going to be part of this.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
But yeah, yeah, so here, what's the rational did they
say about what the drinking of the of the heart.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Was supposedly to stop? To stop it and preserve it?
And I you know it, it's superstition, Yeah, superstition. And
the original one of the other vampire stories in there
was that some boys were playing in a rock pile
and they found a human skull and it uh the
(14:44):
one of the kids took it home and he wanted
to keep it, and the mom made him call the
police and he uh. It started this whole archaeological dig
of this area and they ended up finding a forgotten
town or a family, a rather large cemetery that had
gotten forgotten and one of the coffins that they pulled up.
(15:07):
When they opened it, they found that the head it was,
it was the bones were arranged like the Jolly Roger
and they could not figure out why.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
So that's bizarre.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
Yeah, so they they put their head. I mean, this
was a this was an archaeological site for a while,
and they had students come through and then finally somebody mentioned,
well have you heard about the vampire legends? And they
started looking into it, and that was supposedly a way
to stop the vampire from coming back to to pursue
(15:41):
their family members was to rearrange the bones so they
couldn't get out of their coffin.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
One of these just like tie them up.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
We could go back and ask. I don't think they
had the most accurate information at that point.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Yeah, I don't think they had encyclopedias the time.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
I mean, yeah, for Google, Google.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Google, how does one the rising of the day?
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Right? But I just love that. I love that series
of stories because they aren't even actual monsters. No, They're
so different than any of our other monster stories because
nobody actually saw something. It was all this fear that
created this legend that became alive and and they took
it in their own hands to try to do something
about it.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Did you guys do do you dress up? Or still?
Or the kids dress up? What do you? What do
you do for Halloween?
Speaker 4 (16:39):
Well, we both have two kids in college. I'm a
cowgirl with pigtails.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Nice. But my my youngest did dress up this year.
She was Minyon. She went out with their cousin.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Cool.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
So I got a new shirt that came just in
time for Halloween, and it's you can't see it very well,
but it says I'm fine across and it's all bloody
on the side, And yeah, I was. I was joking that.
Ever since I joined the Horror Writers Association, my Facebook
feed has gotten really interesting. There is.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
It's true though, in the paranormal world, especially people who
appreciate and love horror movies and the paranormal stories, that's
definitely their kind of humor.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
You know, I think I'm going to wear it on
a not Halloween day because I'll get a better reaction.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
You're absolutely right.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Somebody really noticed her today.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Yeah, because their costumes are even bloodier, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I'll notice it. When you were at Christmas shopping I.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Know exactly that's and that's totally my sense of humor too.
Like my daughter one time we ended up with this old,
awful like rat Halloween decoration, and she was about ten
years old and she carried this thing around. It was
the size of a baby doll, so she would walk in.
(18:04):
She would walk into the grocery store holding it like
it was her baby, just to see what people.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
It's funny you say, we have a rat that's it
looks like this, like crazy rat, and it looks like
it's ready to dive and commits suicide and it's placed
gently on a bookshelf.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
And yeah, oh my, I was gonna say. My kids
had a skeleton. We called him mister Bones, and all
three of my kids took him everywhere, Like he would
ride with us to the store in the back seat,
buckled in. And whenever we'd go through like the you
know bank to get do a deposit or whatever, they'd
(18:46):
be like, do.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
You want how many suckers do you want? Do you
want four for.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
All of your kids?
Speaker 2 (18:49):
And I'm like, oh, that one's that's good.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
We did.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
I love my life just just past.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So cute.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
We had a trip to Deadwood planned right after our
first Monster book came out and Jessica and I drove
all the way to Deadwood with big Foot buckled in
the backseat.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Yeah, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if somebody made
a reportant to move on, like I saw.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
We stuffed them with newspaper.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Yeah. It's you know, it's interesting with some of the
move on reports. We get that there's a mix that
people will mix in some like you know, more power,
normal stuff, and you know, we're really not supposed to
be investigating that unless it's like directly related to you know,
the UFO or the ET phenomenon. But I wonder, like,
when you're researching these cryptids in the Northeast, were there
(19:49):
any correlation between UFO sightings or ET's.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
I didn't have a lot of that in this particular selection.
I weirdly like I spoke at MUFON a few years
ago after the Monsters in the Midwest came out, and
then for that presentation, I started researching if there was
a connection. You know, when I was writing the book,
I wasn't really thinking about that, But when I was
invited to come speak, I was like, well, I don't
(20:15):
want to just talk about monsters. I want to see
if there's you know, some you know, elements of extraterrestrial
that I can bring into it. And I did find
quite a startling number of encounters or sightings of UFO
phenomenon in the areas where these encounters were taking place
around the same time. One in particular was about this
(20:39):
beast that was in the river, and it was very
alien ish just by description, but then you add in
the element of there were actually UFO sidings not far
from there.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
That kind of takes it to the next level.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
And with that story, the family got a men in
black visit after that too.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, oh interesting, Yeah, yeah, was it the typical men
in black or was it more alien like?
Speaker 4 (21:07):
They came to her and told her not to talk
about it anymore.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Basically it was that kind of men in black. Yeah,
they were like no more.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
Because it's interesting how the descriptions of the men in
black of kind of or vary, as you can say, change,
but very like John Keel's you know, the moth Man prophecies,
he talks about them having more like a brown tone
skin like, not a typical like Caucasian looking, right, maybe
more Middle Eastern or Indian or something like that, and
(21:38):
then you get more modern, it seems they reports seem
to be more like drawn white or having like big
eyes and this sort of thing.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Oh okay, yeah, And they didn't really get into that in
the description that we found of that situation. But it
was also kind of around the same time with the
Kelly Hopkinsville, Kentucky encounter, and that wasn't very far away
from where there was also, you know, you had that
(22:13):
claude monster in the water. I think we called it
the Green Cloude monster or something to that effect, and
then you had these sightings of like frog like creatures
kind of another stayed over, but it was kind of
in this like little triangle.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
And cures like big smaller.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Big frogmen that people were seeing and including police officers
who were you know, like reporting it and then like
they were like, oh, you know, now, I'm embarrassed that
I said that out loud. But there were these big
frogs that people were seeing that were bipedal basically and
walking across the roads, and some people reported they had
(22:50):
like a hat and a cane.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
Like you're going to burst into the That was in Ohio.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
I mean, you know, it's challenging because there are so
many reports, and when you have repeat reports and descriptions
of people who are, you know, seemingly otherwise sober, that
you have to believe that there's something there. But then
you add on cane and a hat, suddenly it's very
(23:18):
difficult to believe.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
You're like, where there rooms on Magic Mushrooms?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
You almost hear the song Hello am I darling? Hell
am I? Oh? I heard?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
I heard? Actually I don't know if you heard, but
they are going to do a space Balls too.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Yeah, mel Brooks is good. He's like ninety I think now,
but he's still going to be on as a producer.
And then there's a new director and another writer. You know,
they're all working together to do it. So yeah, speaking
of really cool, what's your favorite horror Halloween movie?
Speaker 3 (23:58):
M M.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
I don't like anything gory, so I'm never gonna like
like a Saw movie like, I don't like those. I
really like fall back into the Stephen King classics, like
anything Stephen King give me pet cemetery, like the Shining
of course, Carrie, any of those old classics. I'm all
about it. His new book, I don't know if you
(24:22):
guys have checked it out. Yeah, but he has a
new compilation of short stories out.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
It's amazing really, so he's still writing very well.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Yes, so good, that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
We watched tonight a little bit of Thriller, the whole
original Thriller, the full video music video. It's slightly dated,
you know now that you look at it, but like
it's it's still it's like a music video classic.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
Yeah, at that time it was cutting edge. I was
just gonna say cutting edge special effects back in the day.
Speaker 1 (24:55):
Yeah, but I still appreciate that, like the the prosthetics,
the mechanical the puppeteering, like it's it's brilliant the way
you know where they cut edit right, but like there's
like a little bit of progress in the face, like
whiskers coming out. Then it cuts away, cuts back, and
the face is more deformed as he's turning into a werewolf.
And I mean, I love that stuff. If it's two CGI,
(25:16):
it's like it's just smooth out. It doesn't feel real.
Speaker 3 (25:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
Yeah, yeah, we're getting into a scary I mean, speaking
of scary things, just AI is such a every time,
you know, I do Darkness Radio with Tim Dennis and
he starts talking about AI stuff, I'm like, I don't
even want to know.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
I just don't tell me. I don't want to hear
about it. It's creepy.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Well, I think that the thing that is scary about
it is the unknown. Oh hey, look at that.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
We have a fourth guest where everybody needs their snuggle.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
Yeah, because we don't know where it's actually going to go.
My wife was just sharing a report with me today
that she was reading about some AI that they were
trying to get to do some tasks, and the way
they described it was that the AI was getting bored
so it decided to do something else. I don't know
if bored is the right word, because that's a very
that's a human sensation of feeling. But the fact that
(26:14):
that it's like, oh, it's doing something different we didn't
plan on, right, So as it gets more complex and
gets smarter, that that that could be Vandora's box, right.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
You don't want your computer or your robot to have
free will choice.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Right, Yes, I mean I know there are some parameters
that are that are put in there, but you know,
you don't make progress unless you push push boundaries, especially
in science and engineering and experimentation like you have. You
have to do it. So like, I get it, why
why they pushed the boundaries, but I kind of feel
(26:54):
like the government really does need to to step in
and and create some like safety protocols that are you know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
Gives them rules.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
It's hard when it's evolving so fast though, too, like
you can't stay on top.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
And that's a good point, you.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
Know, if you think of last year at this time,
it was literally just coming out and now it's everywhere,
so you it's hard to it's hard to regulate something
that that you don't even fully understand yet.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Well you know what talking about like scary do freaky
Uncanny Valley. Do you remember when that the video of
Will Smith eating spaghetti came out, Like it was like
the first video they showed of AI. I think it
was about like five years ago, and it was like
so weird and like uncanny, but that was like the
first revealing of this is what we're working on. It's
(27:43):
coming soon and people are like, well no, I don't
need that, thank you. But the intro in the intro
that I did tonight, all those images were done on AI.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Yeah, that was really cool.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
It was cool and the thing is like, but they
can make people look so real, and they can the
ability to make it look like you know, the President
of the United States is saying something that he never said,
like that kind of stuff I think is pretty scary
because it's hard for us to disseminate information. We're just
so inundated with so much information and it's hard to
(28:16):
know what to believe.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
That's why you come to Mystic Lounge. Yeah, the network,
you can just focus on the power normal and UFOs
and it doesn't matter, you know what you believe. You know,
there's something about the mystery of it, you know, I
think that that's so enjoyable, whereas the mystery of AI
(28:40):
as not enjoyable.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
It's it's scary, it's creepy.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Well, and that's I mean, that's one of the reasons
I love writing mysteries. I mean, we're both fictional, we're
both fiction writers too, and that you can completely control
the outcome and wrap things up in a nice, pretty gow.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Yeah yeah, well, speaking of pretty bows, So anywhere can
you can you just tell us about the the Harris
Burd State Hospital at all, because you know, I'm just
(29:20):
kind of focused on in on Pennsylvania right now, and
we were watching this documentary with Martha Stewart, you know,
and she goes to jail, you know, when she was
convicted of insider trading, and you know, even though it
was supposed to be like a softer jail, like, even
there it was like a little scary for her. Right.
(29:44):
So I just want to get your take on on
these prisons and have you have you been able to
look at prisons compare them with the presence of whatever
is being haunted or or the presence of spirits and engauge,
if the the infrastructure of the prison has been, the
(30:07):
way it was run, has anything to do with the
residuals or is it just that prisons themselves are just
create trauma across the board and then you have these
residual effects, ghosts, whatever.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
Yeah, I think you know, with Harrisburg and like Penhurst
is another example. So those were institutions. They weren't necessarily hospitals.
They were where we would send people if they presented
as being what we considered crazy basically back in the day, right,
And that could mean a lot of different things. Like
(30:41):
when we were researching that, I was astounded by the
things that could get you put in a mental hospital.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Reading too many books was one of them.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
I'm like, I would have so been put away from
finding many reasons talking talking back, having an opinion that
just didn't allign with everyone else's. People were put into
these hospitals for having epilepsy, which we know is not
a mental illness, it's a physical condition, you know. And
(31:12):
but then you did have people who sincerely had really
severe mental illnesses. And then in a lot of these hospitals,
you did also have them bringing over people who were
considered criminally insane, so they were charged with crimes, convicted
of crimes, and then put over in the hospitals. I
think Harrisburg was one that was a little bit nicer overall.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Generally. I think they tried to do it really right there.
Speaker 4 (31:39):
When I think of the institutions we wrote about that
were really tragic and sad, I think of Pennhurst as
being probably one of the worst. Again, great intentions, you know,
just like with Harrisburg, but they ended up, you know,
being so overwhelmed with the number of people that were
brought into all of these facilities, hospitals and you know,
(32:02):
penitentiaries included. That's kind of the storyline that we kept
seeing over and over again, overcrowding and under education of
the people that are working there. You know, they said
with Penhurst, she really didn't have to know much about
taking care of people. You just kind of had to
be willing to show up. And so then you had,
you know, understaffing and patients helping take care of patients
(32:26):
and help patients doing jobs they shouldn't have been doing,
and people shackled to their beds. Penhurst in particular, they
did a documentary in the seventies, and I don't think
it was a full documentary. It was more like a
news piece. But the reporter who came in, the journalists
who came in, said he couldn't even keep cameramen on
staff because they were literally getting physically ill from the smell.
(32:50):
And what they were seeing was so disturbing because there
was just fe season urine all over, naked men who
were you know, emaciate, standing in the corners, swaying to
music on their own, children in cribs that couldn't walk
because they'd never been allowed to walk. They didn't get
out of their cribs. So it's almost like the worst
(33:12):
form of torture you could imagine, and just a lot
of tragedy in those places. You know, just of those
are people too who have human desires, and so you
had a lot of sexual assaults going on in the evenings,
of patients attacking patients, and.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Just a lot of sadness.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
So that really, to me, those institutions just can't help
it be a container.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, we always think of ghosts as having experienced some
kind of trauma or something horrible happened, revenge, bitterness, whatever,
But what about the people that cared and maybe they
couldn't do anything. Do they show up? Is there a
right you know, is there a medium and mediumship where
(34:02):
you can connect with those kinds of spirits.
Speaker 3 (34:05):
There was a story I'm not remembering which institution it was,
but there was a worker who was commonly seen in
a personality that they knew. And I think there are
just so many layers that go into haunt, like causing
something to be haunted and that residual energy. And as
Jessica was talking, you just think of all the fear
(34:26):
that would have I mean, just every single one of
those patients would have been afraid of what was coming next.
You've got the fear of the workers, the employees who
are working there, that don't know what to do and
they're afraid of the people that they're taking care of.
So that emits and layers into the space. And then
you've got the people who are passionately trying to do
(34:49):
something to make it better, and you know, all that
emotion and they're just they're all the the rough and
tough emotions too. Is that the fear and the worry
and the overwhelm and anxiety.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
Yeah, And at Penhurst there was actually a doctor who
has been seen. They turned one of the buildings into
like a home for women and their children when they
were kind of in between homes, and so there were
a lot of single moms with a lot of children,
and there's a gymnasium that they created and it was formerly,
you know, one of the patients resident halls. But the
(35:27):
kids would report in the eighties of this man in
a white coat and he would play with them and
they loved him. He was kind and they thought he
was wonderful and he was reported by so many children,
and so that's exactly what you're talking about. There was
a caretaker whose spirit came back and was with these
little children, almost being a caretaker.
Speaker 1 (35:47):
Again, we have a question from the Instagram chat from
a friend Maria Canal, and she says, have you ever
analyzed the geology of the land where the institutions prisons
are located.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
I've not, personally, I would say, you know, anytime you
have things by water, I think that amplifies it. So
that's one thing. What do you think, Natalie.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
My best example of this is the Palmer House Hotel
in Sock Center is actually on a lay line, an
energy line that kind of connects different places, and that
is crazy if you go stand on that. You know,
I've been to psychic development classes. Suzanne Wordley is a
practitioner that goes there and teaches a class where she
(36:39):
actually has participants lining up along the line and close
their eyes without telling them what it is. And it's
hysterical to watch because everybody I'll just start swaying and
and you feel it. So I think that there's a
lot to that. And like Jessica was saying, with water
being around water, you've also got like a lot of
(37:02):
the East Coast stuff is on native land too. I mean,
well everywhere in the United States, there's a lot that
can happen on native land, and and there's a lot
of energy involved with that as well.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, and Mara says there there could be limestone courts,
you know, which can to it. And in the Hudson Valley,
especially in the Pine Bush area, we definitely have higher
just naturally, you know, electromagnetic Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
I felt it at the Stanley Hotel. I was on
a tour in the basement and you could feel like
it just was buzzy down there.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
Yeah, but I don't know what it is exactly, but
there's just certain elements that seem to be a conduit
and create a greater magnitude or maybe turn the volume
up a little bit on this type of stuff. So
that's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, next time you guys come to the Hutson Valley,
you have to let me know.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Yeah, the Stanley's not that far away actually, so yeah,
and that's one of the biggest hot spots that that is.
Like I consistently here investigators discussed the Stanley.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Oh and I was actually talking about the Stanley and
the Shanley.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
I'm sorry, Stanley're right, You're right, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah, yeah, no, but I know we we looked at
doing something out of the Shanley one time. Yeah, yeah,
we did.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Yeah, it's it's what you've not been there.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
Or no, have not. We haven't been out to the
East coast yet. We're going to plan a visit. I
think this.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Spring Okay cool, Yeah, let me know for sure.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Ivents out there in April.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
Well, it's like springtime here right now. It is so
so warm.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
It's today.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
What do you guys have? What what temperature?
Speaker 3 (38:49):
Well it was seventy a couple of days ago and
now and then it's snowed all morning.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
So yeah, oh wow, really blizzarding outside my window. Legitimately, Okay, no,
we're not.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
That's not us at all. It was like it reached
eighty eighty one today and it's warm. Almost wish we
had the air conditioned written still it's that warm.
Speaker 4 (39:13):
Yeah, we've got the eight I've got a blanket on
my lap right now.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Cold.
Speaker 3 (39:17):
We had a huge Halloween blizzard in nineteen ninety one
and everybody talks about it. And these poor kids today
when it started snowing, I'm sure they already have to
hear about it enough, Like I mean talk about feeling old, Like, oh,
when I was a kid, we walked through trigger Tree
day in a snowstorm in nineteen ninety one, and all
the kids today had to hear double about that because
(39:40):
it started snowing this morning.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
Yeah. Yeah, it's like hearing the stories of like I
had to walk twenty miles to the school bus and
when I was here exactly. You know, it's interesting too
because you were you're talking about earlier how people were
me misdiagnosed and let's say it epilepsy, the thought you
(40:03):
were possessed or psychologists psychologically disturbed later on, and then
later on they figured out, oh, it was actually physiological
and I had nothing to do with the actual psychology.
And it's you know, I've been experimenting recently thanks to
the recommendation of my wife, and I've been pretty much
(40:25):
gluten free.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Mhm.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
It's too early to tell, but I can tell you
for a fact that I feel better, Like no doubt.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
I have celiac, So I definitely feel better.
Speaker 1 (40:38):
Okay. Yeah, it's like because I was and it's still
there lingering for sure, but because I know it could
take many months before like the inflammation really actually you know,
calms down. But like I have I have like serious
brain fog, like scary scary brain fact and it's already receding,
(41:00):
and at first I thought, is this psychosomatic? Is it
like a placebo effect? And that it's not. It's definitely not.
Even my skin's getting better right now, knock on one.
So I was just thinking, you know, maybe some of
these people who you know are let's say a psychic mediums,
(41:23):
or or even people on the other side who've passed over.
We're you know, let's say you were struggling with a particular,
you know, disease and someone on the other side had
died or in some related way or suffered in some
related way with that disease. Does that give you a
kind of like a line to connect.
Speaker 3 (41:47):
I mean, I think we're all divine beings and you've
got you know, the theories of consciousness, and I think
we're all connected. And whenever you have something like that
that's gonna maybe illustrate a similarity. That's the story that's
coming into my mind. I worked as a ghostwriter on
(42:09):
a story for a family who's the dad had gotten
a heart lung transplant, and he started having visions of
the woman who had died in a motorcycle accident, whose
lungs he had inherited received in that and he started
(42:30):
having glimpses. He even kind of took on some of
her personality traits. And you read about those stories if
you study some.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
Of that, Yeah, and I've definitely heard about that, and
I guess I'm thinking it's like I feel your pain
kind of a thing. So like if somebody on either
side had experienced something and then the medium has had
a similar experience, then is you know, does that kind
of form a bridge between the two.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
I think there can be a lot of bridges, for sure, a.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Lot of different bridges.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (43:06):
All right, O, there are werewolves in our area?
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Of course?
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Where is there a dog man? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (43:18):
Dog Man's my favorite and I'm I'm just so into
dog man. I don't ever want to meet one. They
seem very scary to me, all the stories that I've
researched about them. I don't think we had a dog
man in Pennsylvania, but we had one in the Pacific Northeast,
which will come out next fall. And that story creeped
me out so much. And the source was it. It
(43:42):
came from a pastor, a minister who went out with
a friend kind of looking for Bigfoot and he kind
of lived next to this kind of they were kind
of on the top of a gorge, so they were
above the gorge, but down below there were all the
trees and you know, the beautif things, but up above
us a little bit more deserty. But he kept hearing
(44:04):
weird noises out there at night, and he was convinced
there was big foot. And so he had a friend
or a person at church actually he was chatting to
after service one day, and he worked for the state,
and he took him out and they kind of went,
you know, looking around to see if there might be
something to bigfoot out there. And when they were out there,
it started to get dark, and their phones started to
(44:24):
run low on battery. They were out there longer than
they expected, and in the darkness, they saw a creature
run across the path and they weren't quite sure what
it was, but it was very big and dark and
bulky and tall. And they went back to the pastor's
house and they were very creeped out by what they
had seen. And that subsequently, after that, the pastor and
(44:47):
his family were haunted and like basically stalked by this creature.
They would hear it on the roof of their house
at night. He sent me photographs of the snow on
his roof with basically like paw prints, like they were
kind of triangular and had toes. They were not normal
(45:07):
looking at all. They were quite large. And his wife
saw at one point something big with a big almost
like a doghead, look over the top of their privacy fence,
you know, which was like eight foot tall, and it
was just standing there looking over it at her the kids.
It was knocking on windows at night, almost kind of
like beckoning the kids out. And that's one of the
(45:28):
things with the dog man legend is that they do
kind of say that they kind of go after children
and try to convince them. They can make their voice
sound like your mom, you know, calling for you to
come outside or whatever. And so like that story was
so creepy and coming from like a man of the cloth, right,
and so like he was like they just had some
(45:49):
special holy water and oils that he had been given
by somebody, and they went outside and they made little
crosses from some of the leaves and trees that were
around their yard, and they buried them. You know, sudden
intention basically, you know, this is what our intentions are
so strong, they set an intention and they believed in
(46:09):
that intention and what they did to protect their space,
and after that it never came to their home again,
but they would still sometimes hear it kind of howling
out in the gorge.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
But yeah, it's interesting how how belief really is very
powerful because you could be of different religions or you know,
religions all around the world that have different methodologies right
for keeping evil or demons or whatever at bay, and
it seems to work when people employ these.
Speaker 4 (46:40):
Yeah, I think, like you know, sometimes Nally and I
will help people if they have energy in their house
of their experience in a haunting, and you can go
in and clear someone's home. And to me, it really
is setting intention and just believing in your intention and
the power of you as the physical being over the
power of the being that doesn't have a body, and
(47:03):
you know, setting the intention that needs to leave. I know, Nalie,
you probably have some thoughts to add to that.
Speaker 3 (47:10):
Well. I think, like you know, one of the ways
that I describe it is that that thought becomes an intention.
It's like a ribbon of energy that goes out there
and it works both ways. Right, Like we all know
those people that keep complaining about things, and then the
bad things keep happening. I mean you can almost watch
that on Facebook, Like the people that are complaining all
(47:33):
the time about something bad happening, it just keeps coming
their way. So you have to just be really careful
about those energy signatures that you are putting out there,
and so you know, but yeah, it's the power of manifestation.
Speaker 4 (47:51):
Yeah, and what you focus on, right, Like November is
actually gratitude month, And it's like actually physiologically impossible to
be sad if you're thankful for something, because your mind
can't focus on those two separate energies at the same time,
Like the synapsis cannot connect, So physiologically you cannot be
(48:14):
grateful and sad at the same time. So, you know,
setting the attention and what you focus on, and I
think like attracts like and I think that is such
a true thing. Like if I'm just focusing on the
good stuff that's happening in my life, and then I'm.
Speaker 2 (48:28):
Just going to get more good stuff.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
And I truly believe that and see that happening all
the time for myself and my family, you.
Speaker 3 (48:35):
Know, And we talk about the veils or thinning, you
know as our vibrations are rising if you are studying
at all about the Age of Aquarius, and our vibrations
are rising, so that's causing the veil to be thinner,
which translates to all of this being even more so.
There's no protection there anymore. So you have to be
(48:58):
very very careful about what you're putting out there. So
when you're putting fear, you know, fear out there, that's
going to draw some really negative energy in.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
The Age of Acqueries. So how does that apply? Well, okay,
first can you explain that? And then how does that
apply to the paranormal.
Speaker 3 (49:18):
I'm a little rusty because I've been working on monster books. No,
just in general. Uh, the theory comes from astrology. And
actually I think we're sitting on like I think I
just saw that we're on the day Capricorn. Pluto has
been in Capricorn for the last twenty years. Right, I'm
(49:42):
going to mess up the dates and my astrology friends,
we're gonna I'm gonna hear about it from that. But
but yeah, so we've been in Capricorn energy, which is
very survivor energy, and there actually there's a couple of
different things going on where the Age of Aquarius is
all is more about the paradigm shift, you know. For
(50:06):
from the time Christ came along, it was about the
searching for a savior, you know that in God we trust.
So it was the age of Pisces. I believe I
am so rusty with this stuff. So yeah, but as
(50:30):
we move into the Age of Aquarius, that the concepts
are that we were finding the Savior in ourselfs like,
we don't have anyone to come to save us, We
have to just save ourselves. That that we have to
find that divine spark in our own selves. And but
in all of that, it's causing the vibration of the
(50:51):
planet to rise. And I have a friend who studies
the human resonance, and his theory is that the more
light workers out there that are doing doing energy clearing
and shifting things, we're actually shifting the vibration of the
planet in a measurable way. As we're kind of waking
up to what all of this is and and our
gifts and our abilities and embracing that and heading towards
(51:14):
more of a spiritual being. That's raising the vibration of
our planet. And that's that's the Age of Aquarius. So
I started off talking about totally the wrong thing.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
But what does that affect that the power?
Speaker 3 (51:29):
So like if you are raising your vibration, it just
you know, you've got all these people embracing their spiritual
gifts and so it's just lessening the distance between austin
spirit in that vibrational space, so there is no veil it.
(51:50):
You know. I think a lot of people are waking
up to gifts that they never knew they had, So
they're seeing things, they're experiencing more paranormal energy than ever before.
We've got a lot of kids being born with gifts
and abilities. I mean all of our kids, Jessica and I.
A lot of this work that we've we've been doing
is to be able to explain some of this stuff
(52:12):
to our own kids, who are very gifted in a
way that was better than what we were taught. And
so they've got uh you know, it's almost like we're
watching evolution happen in front of us with these kids
being born with these spiritual gifts. So you think it's measurable, Yeah,
(52:32):
I think so. And my friends who's studying the human residence.
Every now and then he'll call me and he'll be like,
did you feel that? Did you feel that? And it's
he's watching the spikes go up and and if you
look into that, and I think science is catching up
with being able to study some of this too, and
that's that's part of the Age of Aquarius as well
(52:55):
with just it's more techie.
Speaker 1 (52:58):
Yeah, was it the Monroe Institute that was running the
random number generator that spiked like right before nine to eleven?
Speaker 2 (53:09):
That sounds right. I don't remember.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
I think it was the Monroe Institute, but that was definitely.
I mean, it doesn't it doesn't lie, you know, it was.
It was such a clear spike. It wasn't like, yeah,
there was a spike like that two weeks ago. No,
it was like a very distinct spike. And there was
something that occurred, was that like a collective consciousness.
Speaker 4 (53:34):
Right around the time when it was happening, like when
we were about to switch, Because I think there's something
to that collective fear, right, like I think it's Chad
Gallic did a documentary.
Speaker 2 (53:50):
I can't remember the name of it.
Speaker 3 (53:51):
There's also been a lot of measurable energetic shifts as well.
A lot of psychics can trace their gifts and me included,
can go back to there was a huge energetic shift
in twenty twelve, so a lot of psychics can trace
their gifts back to that time.
Speaker 1 (54:08):
Kind of really, I hadn't read that before.
Speaker 3 (54:11):
Yeah, and and this is all astrology, and again I
don't have the exacts, but and so we're going through
a lot of that again right now as we're shifting
our vibration up.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
So does that mean that there are people who otherwise,
you know, full grown adults that you know, haven't been
able to kind of see and experience paranormal will or
is it really like a younger generation thing.
Speaker 3 (54:39):
Well, that's kind of what happened to me. I mean,
I wasn't going through my whole life seeing this stuff.
I think I saw a lot when I was little,
and I talked, I had imaginary friends, and I had
different things happening when I was young. But I think
that there's some self preservation that happens in there too,
where you kind of shut that down for whatever reason.
And in my case, everyone around me my life was
(55:00):
telling me that there was no such thing and it
was just my imagination. So you're going to believe that
if you don't know what to do with it, because
that's a lot safer than trying to wrap your head
around something that everybody is telling you isn't there. It
was just a yeah, yeah, but you know, as I
started to I mean, it was really when we started
(55:21):
doing paranormal investigations, like we would walk into these haunted
houses and these really heavy history places, and all of
a sudden, like I'd start getting information dumps and things
were starting to happen. And and of course I'm a
very creative person too, so I was constantly and used
to be a lawyer. So you've got that balance between
I'm super creative, I'm also very logically wired with that
(55:44):
legal training, So how am I going to make sense
of this? And I was constantly trying to prove to
myself like how am I? How do I know that
I'm not making this stuff up? No? And so then
it was just about like, Okay, now I've got these
gifts coming online, I'm going to taking classes. I'm going
to start investigating a little bit more about what this
is and what it means for me. Because every one
(56:05):
of us is wired differently too. So if if you
go take psychic development classes from one psychic that doesn't
necessarily mean that that's how your gifts work. You still
have to do that journey of exploration to find how
your own gifts and abilities work.
Speaker 1 (56:19):
Yeah, and if the veil continues to get like super thin,
you know, maybe there's a reality where ghosts need legal
representation and Natalie, you know the perfect it'll be like
it'll be like the movie Ghosts. You know, they're all
(56:40):
going to be coming and lining up.
Speaker 3 (56:41):
Well, that was kind of my like, that was kind
of a foundation for my fictional characters that I started
writing before I knew I was psychic. So in my
tradictional stories, I had a character who was a lawyer
or a law student, and she started I just thought
it would be fascinating to take somebody who's trained to
think logically rationally and then give them something completely irrational
(57:02):
to deal with. So that's where my fiction ideas came from.
And so my my lawyer ended up with these ghost
clients that had their unfinished business that had to try
to that. You know, she barely believed in what was
happening herself and then having to just deal with this.
So I didn't realize that I was kind of writing
my own story at that Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (57:24):
Mean, I'm kind of joking, but I'm kind of like,
kind of not because, yeah, sometimes I think that maybe
we are living in something akin to like a simulation,
and you know, what if these other entities are you know,
fully conscious and we're just not at upstage where we're
interacting with them, right And at some point, what if
that that becomes the case You're walking down the street
(57:45):
and you just see these other things, you know, living
in a different way, but right beside us.
Speaker 3 (57:54):
So my family when my kids were little, we lived
in Belgium for six years when they were when they
were very tiny. And uh, a few years before, like
right before COVID, the fall before COVID, my now ex
husband and I traveled over to London and Ireland for
(58:15):
a wedding and it was the first time I'd ever
been in London where I knew I was psychic and
I can't believe how many dead people are there. Like
I remember walking out of the hotel and just feeling
all the layers of energy and that's something that I
was certainly not open to the first time.
Speaker 1 (58:34):
Have you guys ever seen the movie Waking Life, the
animation now Waking Life? It is a rotoscope animation, so humans,
and then that's you know, animation over top and it
was made by Richard link Later. I think you will
love it. It's very, very fascinating. It's philosophical. It has
(58:59):
a lot to do with consciousness and death and reality.
I think I think you both appreciate it. But anyway,
so that that's it, we're here. I can't believe it.
Speaker 2 (59:09):
Oh, it's already over.
Speaker 1 (59:14):
We've got just really quick. We've got Monsters of the
Northeast and Ghostly Tales of Pennsylvania, So everyone listening, please
go check those out. Natalie, and just get any last
words before we Natalie your lawyer last words.
Speaker 3 (59:35):
No, it's just it's been a fun way to wrap
up Halloween season.
Speaker 2 (59:39):
Well, yeah, I appreciate having you guys on there, so yeah,
thank you.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
It's it's been like a busy month for us, and
we're both super stoked that this is how we got
to spend Halloween night.
Speaker 3 (59:51):
And my brain is a little fried.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
I know, I'm sure. I'm sure. It's a very busy
time for you guys. And an alien level will just
leave with this. Who said Waking Life is a must see?
Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
Okay, we're gonna see it for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
It's one of my favorites. Thank you so much, guys.
I really appreciated that.
Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Happy Halloween, Happy Halloween, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
Yeah, all right, thank you guys for joining. I appreciate
your comments and chat and hopefully I'll see you on
the comment sections and wherever you listen to your podcasts.
If you could, therefore leave a comment down below and
rate this as high as possible, I'd really really appreciate it.
All that helps organically grow the podcast here on the
Mystic Lounge YouTube channel. And if you like this content,
(01:00:36):
maybe you'll also like Coffee and UFOs, also a podcast
on this channel. Both podcasts are rebroadcast on the Unex
Network eleven PMS eleven PMS eleven pm Eastern Standard time
and two am. I'm sorry two am Eastern Standard time
eleven pm Pacific time. Yeah, my brain's a little fried
(01:00:56):
still too, Natalie. But that that's where you can find
this replayed every week, and I think that's it. So
just one last thing, just a friendly reminder to if
you can go to the Carbondaleian Festival, which is in Carbondale, Pennsylvania,
if you live nearby, it'd be great to see you.
(01:01:17):
There's a lot of great speakers and the end of
that is a Heather Taddy. She's gonna kinda be the
the last speaker, last event of the night, and looks
like it's gonna be a really good time. And there's
also a site visit during the festival as well, so
you'll go to where the uf the alleged UFO crash
(01:01:38):
took place in the reservoir there, all right, So that's it,
Peace and love to everyone out there, Thank you so
much for all your continued support, and until next time,
I'll see you on the flip side.
Speaker 3 (01:03:03):
D
I'm Happy Halloween everyone. Thank you so much for joining
us tonight. I'm really excited to be having my two
special guests on, Jessica Freeberg and Natalie Fowler. You guys
are becoming quite the regulars, and there's a good reason
for that, because we always have a good time. You
have great stories, So happy Halloween everyone. If you have
(01:05):
any stories of your own tonight later on, I'm gonna
share a link and then you can join video and audio,
or you can join just audio, it's up to you,
and then would love to hear your your story as well.
So let's bring on our guests, Natalie and Jessica. How
are you.
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Hey, I'm great, I'm good.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
How are you?
Speaker 1 (01:24):
I'm good? Happy Halloween, you two. I have to kind
of I'm gonna merge our works. So you guys focused
on a book called Ghostly Tales of Pennsylvania, and we're here,
and I'm actually gonna be in Carbondale, Pennsylvania next weekend
doing a presentation about UFO debunking at what's called the
(01:47):
Carbon Dalien Festival, based on a UFO event that took
place there in nineteen seventy four. So I'm really really
excited to be doing that coo and yeah, so there's
so much going on. You know, we live here in
the Hudson Valley, but you know all of these areas
out here where there's lots of woods and lots of hills, Pennsylvania,
(02:09):
New Jersey, which you know, cover all that. There are
no shortage of creepy tales. So being that I'm born
and raised in New Jersey, I have to start with
the Jersey Devil. So can we take us down that road? Yes,
just a little bit.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
Okay, I'm gonna let Nally take it away because she
did a lot of research on that one for us.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
So this is a really fun story to write because
it was there were just so many versions, and it
was also an old and older story, so it was
a little difficult to try to just go back to
that moment in the eighteen you know, the original. So
the trick was to try to find a way to
tell the story where you could kind of cover all
(02:53):
of those versions. And I happened to have so I
I have back issues of Fate magazine all over my
house because I still keep in touch with Phyllis and
and when we started working on this book, it was
the first book we had done in a while. So
I grabbed stacks of these old fake back issues and
(03:18):
just started flipping through looking for a way to kind
of rein in all the research and all the variations
of that story and kind of try to find a
starting point. And one of the stories I came across
talked about how sightings increased after a forest fire, and
there had been, uh, the second forest fire that got
(03:41):
started because of flare from a nearby air base started caught, caught, caught,
the air caught a whole section of the forest on
fire and nearby, and so I uh, And I happened
to have a friend of mine who's who's a fire
fighter and super interested in the paranormal. So I thought, oh,
(04:02):
this is perfect. I'm gonna have this firefighter going into
fight the fire and reminiscing about all the stories his
babysitter told him about the New Jersey Devil. So it
was it was a great way. We have a little
bit of creative freedom with this to kind of create
some characters in order to frame the stories sometimes. So
(04:24):
it was just it was just a fun one to write, because.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Do you think it's real?
Speaker 2 (04:31):
I do?
Speaker 4 (04:31):
I mean, it's I mean, it's so hard to say, like,
do I think the Jersey Devil is necessarily what we
think it is? I think people are seeing something, so
I think the sightings are real. Now what exactly that is?
It's kind of like the Bigfoot phenomenon, right, like people
are seeing something, but what is it exactly?
Speaker 2 (04:51):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (04:52):
Is it was it a malformed baby that came from
mother leads? You know, Like I don't know if I
believe the backstory to it, but there's there's something out
there that.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Really interesting point.
Speaker 3 (05:05):
And I think there's something to be said about how
these stories take on a life of its own for
different ulterior motives. I mean, in this case, the story
was retold many many times as a way to get
children to behave, Like if you don't behave, the new
Jersey Devil's going to come get you. So that was
kind of how I couched the story when we when
we worked on it.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
So fortunately my parents didn't threaten me that story creatures,
we were right. We grew up right next to the
best river, so.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Yeah, oh you're right there.
Speaker 3 (05:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (05:37):
And another thing I think about with some of these
creatures too, is kind of the phenomenon of you know,
like a tollbuff where we talk so much about something,
we give so much energy to a legend that it
becomes real, Like Slenderman. That's one of my favorite examples,
because we know how that originated. It wasn't ever a
(06:01):
real thing, but after it was in the world and
people became very obsessed with it and interested in it,
suddenly you have actual sightings of slender Man, and there's
video that can you can see and pictures that, you know,
kind of show evidence that now Slenderman is a thing.
So do we kind of manifest what we put our
energy and our thoughts into.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Sometimes well, you know, it could be like the way
people claim that we interpret UFOs differently than ancient people's
interpret them. They in the past, they would have said
they were angels, and now we see them as something different.
Maybe slender Man people are actually seeing something like the
Shadow person people or the ha Man, and they're just
attributing it to the slender Man. They're kind of overlaying
(06:42):
how they interpret But the Jersey Devil, you made an
interesting point that perhaps the Leads story is just a
kind of a backstory tacked onto something that people are
actually seeing. So two totally separate things. People are seeing
something in the world, woods, in the pine barrens, and
(07:03):
then this other thing happens. There's another legend about it,
this beastly thing, this at least you know at birth,
and then they merge.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Yeah. I think that's a good point.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
Okay, we nailed that one.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
We're done.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
But in all of your research, like, what what in
let's let's stick to Pennsylvania for a little bit. We'll
go from Jersey to Pennsylvania. What is the creepiest, creepiest
story or creature that you've come across.
Speaker 4 (07:45):
My one of my favorite things that we got to
do this time around was also right about ghost stories
because I kind of think of Natalie and I as
like the ghost Girls first and the Monster Girls second.
We originated in the ghosts, right, We grew up having
personal experiences with the ghosts, and that's kind of what
(08:05):
led us into this journey that we're presently on. So
for me, during the writing of these two books, as
we had Ghostly Tails of Pennsylvania come out and The
Monsters of the Northeast, my real favorite was writing some
of these ghost stories and I found them so chilling,
in part because the history was so tragic, and a
(08:28):
lot of that tragedy is what fed into now what
we experience as hauntings. So I think about like Eastern
State Penitentiary for example. You know, that was a structure
created with such good intent. They really wanted it to
be a place where people could become reformed and have
(08:48):
penants for their crime and find a better path through
complete solitude, which actually ended up making them crazy and
made them worse. And we have this great idea and
this is what we do as humans and ma unkind.
We take this great thing and we're like, look at
this wonderful thing we have, and then we just ruin it,
(09:08):
you know. And that's what I you know, that's the
thing that fascinated me the most. And so looking at
these the history behind the hauntings was the most exciting.
So Eastern State was one of my favorites that we
got to write about in the history of that.
Speaker 1 (09:21):
Didn't that close down like pretty late too, like in
the seventies or something, or was it even living.
Speaker 4 (09:26):
That Ah, I'm gonna have to look at the date
when it closed. I don't recall exactly. I think it
was a little later. Do you remember, Natalie, this was
like four books ago. Now I'm going to look at
my book.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
So we when we do know that anywhere there's been
some kind of trauma, that there there is a residual
something that people are picking up on.
Speaker 4 (09:53):
Right, Yeah, oftentimes you have residual energy. I do think
that there's some intelligent hauntings that go on in some
of these places too, that we have souls that, for
whatever reason, they just aren't at peace and they don't
feel comfortable crossing over. You think about a place like
Eastern State Penitentiary, and you know you have people there
(10:15):
for committing crimes, some of them really horrible crimes. Right,
And so the idea of Christian faith being that either
when you die, you cross over to Heaven or you
cross over to hell.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
Well, if the light's.
Speaker 4 (10:27):
Coming for you, you may be not going to go
to it because you don't think you get to go
someplace very nice. And so I think there's some of
that there as well.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
All right, so you guys write about vampires.
Speaker 3 (10:39):
I was going to go there next.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Oh yeah, you talked about that.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
I never heard anything growing up about about antipres.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
One of my favorite parts of working on I mean,
they're so research based and we're huge history nerds and
research geeks, and whenever, whenever there's a chance to preserve
a piece of history that might have otherwise been forgotten,
it's it's kind of a cool rush. And I came
across that when we were doing the research for the
(11:07):
Monster book, and you know, I'm looking through Oh Vampires,
the vampire Mercy Brown, and so you start diving into
the different vampire stories and you realize that this is
a period of time that almost got completely forgotten because
it was kind of the backwoods. They were getting their
(11:28):
news and information from the traveling preachers, and at the
same time that coincided with the consumption, which now we
know was tuberculosis. Incredibly contagious. It was wiping out whole families,
and in their grief and despair, they and also not
wiping them out very quickly. You know, over the course
(11:50):
of twenty years, these families would just get wiped out completely.
And so they were looking for answers, and those answers
came in the form of a traveling preacher, and that
had a theory about how the vampires were coming back
from the grave to feast on their family members, and
(12:15):
the way you could tell this was if you dug
up the body and there was a root that had
gone through or And then later the story evolved that
if there was any blood left in the organs or
in the body, then that was a sign that this
person was a vampire and they were coming back from
the grave to feast on their family members.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
So if something like organic in nature, some environmental condition
preserve the body longer.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
Well, that was the last one. Mercy Brown was the
last known as the last Vampire. And the poor girl,
I think she had to bury her older sister, her mother,
I mean, just one right after the other over the
course of ten years. And she finally gets this and
gets sick and dies, and I think she died in
(13:03):
in the wintertime, so January, and her brother goes on
to get sick, and the father is just beside himself
with grief. So he's going to latch onto whatever theory
he can to try to save his son. And so
they go digging up this body. Well, I mean it
was wintertime, so that's gonna naturally preserve a lot of
(13:25):
what was left. And it was only a couple months later,
so she was declared a vampire, and I think they
the townspeople kind of were going a little crazy at
this point, and uh had they I mean, the the
solution was to burn her heart and make him drink it.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
So make him drink it.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
Was like it was getting a little like out of
control by that point. And actually, and in that story
there was a doctor in town who like I mean
and and that was a you know, the research had
the townspeople going to the doctor to try to get
him to help with this, and he's like, absolutely not,
I'm not going to be part of this.
Speaker 1 (14:09):
But yeah, yeah, so here, what's the rational did they
say about what the drinking of the of the heart.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Was supposedly to stop? To stop it and preserve it?
And I you know it, it's superstition, Yeah, superstition. And
the original one of the other vampire stories in there
was that some boys were playing in a rock pile
and they found a human skull and it uh the
(14:44):
one of the kids took it home and he wanted
to keep it, and the mom made him call the
police and he uh. It started this whole archaeological dig
of this area and they ended up finding a forgotten
town or a family, a rather large cemetery that had
gotten forgotten and one of the coffins that they pulled up.
(15:07):
When they opened it, they found that the head it was,
it was the bones were arranged like the Jolly Roger
and they could not figure out why.
Speaker 1 (15:16):
So that's bizarre.
Speaker 3 (15:18):
Yeah, so they they put their head. I mean, this
was a this was an archaeological site for a while,
and they had students come through and then finally somebody mentioned,
well have you heard about the vampire legends? And they
started looking into it, and that was supposedly a way
to stop the vampire from coming back to to pursue
(15:41):
their family members was to rearrange the bones so they
couldn't get out of their coffin.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
One of these just like tie them up.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
We could go back and ask. I don't think they
had the most accurate information at that point.
Speaker 1 (15:59):
Yeah, I don't think they had encyclopedias the time.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
I mean, yeah, for Google, Google.
Speaker 1 (16:06):
Google, how does one the rising of the day?
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Right? But I just love that. I love that series
of stories because they aren't even actual monsters. No, They're
so different than any of our other monster stories because
nobody actually saw something. It was all this fear that
created this legend that became alive and and they took
it in their own hands to try to do something
about it.
Speaker 1 (16:32):
Did you guys do do you dress up? Or still?
Or the kids dress up? What do you? What do
you do for Halloween?
Speaker 4 (16:39):
Well, we both have two kids in college. I'm a
cowgirl with pigtails.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
There you go.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Nice. But my my youngest did dress up this year.
She was Minyon. She went out with their cousin.
Speaker 1 (16:52):
Cool.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
So I got a new shirt that came just in
time for Halloween, and it's you can't see it very well,
but it says I'm fine across and it's all bloody
on the side, And yeah, I was. I was joking that.
Ever since I joined the Horror Writers Association, my Facebook
feed has gotten really interesting. There is.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
It's true though, in the paranormal world, especially people who
appreciate and love horror movies and the paranormal stories, that's
definitely their kind of humor.
Speaker 3 (17:23):
You know, I think I'm going to wear it on
a not Halloween day because I'll get a better reaction.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
You're absolutely right.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
Somebody really noticed her today.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
Yeah, because their costumes are even bloodier, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:42):
I'll notice it. When you were at Christmas shopping I.
Speaker 3 (17:44):
Know exactly that's and that's totally my sense of humor too.
Like my daughter one time we ended up with this old,
awful like rat Halloween decoration, and she was about ten
years old and she carried this thing around. It was
the size of a baby doll, so she would walk in.
(18:04):
She would walk into the grocery store holding it like
it was her baby, just to see what people.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
It's funny you say, we have a rat that's it
looks like this, like crazy rat, and it looks like
it's ready to dive and commits suicide and it's placed
gently on a bookshelf.
Speaker 4 (18:25):
And yeah, oh my, I was gonna say. My kids
had a skeleton. We called him mister Bones, and all
three of my kids took him everywhere, Like he would
ride with us to the store in the back seat,
buckled in. And whenever we'd go through like the you
know bank to get do a deposit or whatever, they'd
(18:46):
be like, do.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
You want how many suckers do you want? Do you
want four for.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
All of your kids?
Speaker 2 (18:49):
And I'm like, oh, that one's that's good.
Speaker 3 (18:59):
We did.
Speaker 1 (19:00):
I love my life just just past.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So cute.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
We had a trip to Deadwood planned right after our
first Monster book came out and Jessica and I drove
all the way to Deadwood with big Foot buckled in
the backseat.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
Yeah, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if somebody made
a reportant to move on, like I saw.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
We stuffed them with newspaper.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
Yeah. It's you know, it's interesting with some of the
move on reports. We get that there's a mix that
people will mix in some like you know, more power,
normal stuff, and you know, we're really not supposed to
be investigating that unless it's like directly related to you know,
the UFO or the ET phenomenon. But I wonder, like,
when you're researching these cryptids in the Northeast, were there
(19:49):
any correlation between UFO sightings or ET's.
Speaker 4 (19:53):
I didn't have a lot of that in this particular selection.
I weirdly like I spoke at MUFON a few years
ago after the Monsters in the Midwest came out, and
then for that presentation, I started researching if there was
a connection. You know, when I was writing the book,
I wasn't really thinking about that, But when I was
invited to come speak, I was like, well, I don't
(20:15):
want to just talk about monsters. I want to see
if there's you know, some you know, elements of extraterrestrial
that I can bring into it. And I did find
quite a startling number of encounters or sightings of UFO
phenomenon in the areas where these encounters were taking place
around the same time. One in particular was about this
(20:39):
beast that was in the river, and it was very
alien ish just by description, but then you add in
the element of there were actually UFO sidings not far
from there.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
That kind of takes it to the next level.
Speaker 3 (20:54):
And with that story, the family got a men in
black visit after that too.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, oh interesting, Yeah, yeah, was it the typical men
in black or was it more alien like?
Speaker 4 (21:07):
They came to her and told her not to talk
about it anymore.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Basically it was that kind of men in black. Yeah,
they were like no more.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
Because it's interesting how the descriptions of the men in
black of kind of or vary, as you can say, change,
but very like John Keel's you know, the moth Man prophecies,
he talks about them having more like a brown tone
skin like, not a typical like Caucasian looking, right, maybe
more Middle Eastern or Indian or something like that, and
(21:38):
then you get more modern, it seems they reports seem
to be more like drawn white or having like big
eyes and this sort of thing.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
Oh okay, yeah, And they didn't really get into that in
the description that we found of that situation. But it
was also kind of around the same time with the
Kelly Hopkinsville, Kentucky encounter, and that wasn't very far away
from where there was also, you know, you had that
(22:13):
claude monster in the water. I think we called it
the Green Cloude monster or something to that effect, and
then you had these sightings of like frog like creatures
kind of another stayed over, but it was kind of
in this like little triangle.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
And cures like big smaller.
Speaker 4 (22:29):
Big frogmen that people were seeing and including police officers
who were you know, like reporting it and then like
they were like, oh, you know, now, I'm embarrassed that
I said that out loud. But there were these big
frogs that people were seeing that were bipedal basically and
walking across the roads, and some people reported they had
(22:50):
like a hat and a cane.
Speaker 3 (22:53):
Like you're going to burst into the That was in Ohio.
Speaker 1 (22:58):
I mean, you know, it's challenging because there are so
many reports, and when you have repeat reports and descriptions
of people who are, you know, seemingly otherwise sober, that
you have to believe that there's something there. But then
you add on cane and a hat, suddenly it's very
(23:18):
difficult to believe.
Speaker 2 (23:20):
You're like, where there rooms on Magic Mushrooms?
Speaker 3 (23:25):
You almost hear the song Hello am I darling? Hell
am I? Oh? I heard?
Speaker 1 (23:34):
I heard? Actually I don't know if you heard, but
they are going to do a space Balls too.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:41):
Yeah, mel Brooks is good. He's like ninety I think now,
but he's still going to be on as a producer.
And then there's a new director and another writer. You know,
they're all working together to do it. So yeah, speaking
of really cool, what's your favorite horror Halloween movie?
Speaker 3 (23:58):
M M.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
I don't like anything gory, so I'm never gonna like
like a Saw movie like, I don't like those. I
really like fall back into the Stephen King classics, like
anything Stephen King give me pet cemetery, like the Shining
of course, Carrie, any of those old classics. I'm all
about it. His new book, I don't know if you
(24:22):
guys have checked it out. Yeah, but he has a
new compilation of short stories out.
Speaker 1 (24:27):
It's amazing really, so he's still writing very well.
Speaker 2 (24:31):
Yes, so good, that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (24:34):
We watched tonight a little bit of Thriller, the whole
original Thriller, the full video music video. It's slightly dated,
you know now that you look at it, but like
it's it's still it's like a music video classic.
Speaker 4 (24:49):
Yeah, at that time it was cutting edge. I was
just gonna say cutting edge special effects back in the day.
Speaker 1 (24:55):
Yeah, but I still appreciate that, like the the prosthetics,
the mechanical the puppeteering, like it's it's brilliant the way
you know where they cut edit right, but like there's
like a little bit of progress in the face, like
whiskers coming out. Then it cuts away, cuts back, and
the face is more deformed as he's turning into a werewolf.
And I mean, I love that stuff. If it's two CGI,
(25:16):
it's like it's just smooth out. It doesn't feel real.
Speaker 3 (25:20):
You know.
Speaker 4 (25:21):
Yeah, yeah, we're getting into a scary I mean, speaking
of scary things, just AI is such a every time,
you know, I do Darkness Radio with Tim Dennis and
he starts talking about AI stuff, I'm like, I don't
even want to know.
Speaker 2 (25:32):
I just don't tell me. I don't want to hear
about it. It's creepy.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
Well, I think that the thing that is scary about
it is the unknown. Oh hey, look at that.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
We have a fourth guest where everybody needs their snuggle.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
Yeah, because we don't know where it's actually going to go.
My wife was just sharing a report with me today
that she was reading about some AI that they were
trying to get to do some tasks, and the way
they described it was that the AI was getting bored
so it decided to do something else. I don't know
if bored is the right word, because that's a very
that's a human sensation of feeling. But the fact that
(26:14):
that it's like, oh, it's doing something different we didn't
plan on, right, So as it gets more complex and
gets smarter, that that that could be Vandora's box, right.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (26:24):
You don't want your computer or your robot to have
free will choice.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
Right, Yes, I mean I know there are some parameters
that are that are put in there, but you know,
you don't make progress unless you push push boundaries, especially
in science and engineering and experimentation like you have. You
have to do it. So like, I get it, why
why they pushed the boundaries, but I kind of feel
(26:54):
like the government really does need to to step in
and and create some like safety protocols that are you know, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:03):
Gives them rules.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
It's hard when it's evolving so fast though, too, like
you can't stay on top.
Speaker 1 (27:09):
And that's a good point, you.
Speaker 3 (27:11):
Know, if you think of last year at this time,
it was literally just coming out and now it's everywhere,
so you it's hard to it's hard to regulate something
that that you don't even fully understand yet.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Well you know what talking about like scary do freaky
Uncanny Valley. Do you remember when that the video of
Will Smith eating spaghetti came out, Like it was like
the first video they showed of AI. I think it
was about like five years ago, and it was like
so weird and like uncanny, but that was like the
first revealing of this is what we're working on. It's
(27:43):
coming soon and people are like, well no, I don't
need that, thank you. But the intro in the intro
that I did tonight, all those images were done on AI.
Speaker 2 (27:53):
Yeah, that was really cool.
Speaker 4 (27:54):
It was cool and the thing is like, but they
can make people look so real, and they can the
ability to make it look like you know, the President
of the United States is saying something that he never said,
like that kind of stuff I think is pretty scary
because it's hard for us to disseminate information. We're just
so inundated with so much information and it's hard to
(28:16):
know what to believe.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
That's why you come to Mystic Lounge. Yeah, the network,
you can just focus on the power normal and UFOs
and it doesn't matter, you know what you believe. You know,
there's something about the mystery of it, you know, I
think that that's so enjoyable, whereas the mystery of AI
(28:40):
as not enjoyable.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
It's it's scary, it's creepy.
Speaker 3 (28:43):
Well, and that's I mean, that's one of the reasons
I love writing mysteries. I mean, we're both fictional, we're
both fiction writers too, and that you can completely control
the outcome and wrap things up in a nice, pretty gow.
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Yeah yeah, well, speaking of pretty bows, So anywhere can
you can you just tell us about the the Harris
Burd State Hospital at all, because you know, I'm just
(29:20):
kind of focused on in on Pennsylvania right now, and
we were watching this documentary with Martha Stewart, you know,
and she goes to jail, you know, when she was
convicted of insider trading, and you know, even though it
was supposed to be like a softer jail, like, even
there it was like a little scary for her. Right.
(29:44):
So I just want to get your take on on
these prisons and have you have you been able to
look at prisons compare them with the presence of whatever
is being haunted or or the presence of spirits and engauge,
if the the infrastructure of the prison has been, the
(30:07):
way it was run, has anything to do with the
residuals or is it just that prisons themselves are just
create trauma across the board and then you have these
residual effects, ghosts, whatever.
Speaker 4 (30:19):
Yeah, I think you know, with Harrisburg and like Penhurst
is another example. So those were institutions. They weren't necessarily hospitals.
They were where we would send people if they presented
as being what we considered crazy basically back in the day, right,
And that could mean a lot of different things. Like
(30:41):
when we were researching that, I was astounded by the
things that could get you put in a mental hospital.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
Reading too many books was one of them.
Speaker 4 (30:50):
I'm like, I would have so been put away from
finding many reasons talking talking back, having an opinion that
just didn't allign with everyone else's. People were put into
these hospitals for having epilepsy, which we know is not
a mental illness, it's a physical condition, you know. And
(31:12):
but then you did have people who sincerely had really
severe mental illnesses. And then in a lot of these hospitals,
you did also have them bringing over people who were
considered criminally insane, so they were charged with crimes, convicted
of crimes, and then put over in the hospitals. I
think Harrisburg was one that was a little bit nicer overall.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Generally. I think they tried to do it really right there.
Speaker 4 (31:39):
When I think of the institutions we wrote about that
were really tragic and sad, I think of Pennhurst as
being probably one of the worst. Again, great intentions, you know,
just like with Harrisburg, but they ended up, you know,
being so overwhelmed with the number of people that were
brought into all of these facilities, hospitals and you know,
(32:02):
penitentiaries included. That's kind of the storyline that we kept
seeing over and over again, overcrowding and under education of
the people that are working there. You know, they said
with Penhurst, she really didn't have to know much about
taking care of people. You just kind of had to
be willing to show up. And so then you had,
you know, understaffing and patients helping take care of patients
(32:26):
and help patients doing jobs they shouldn't have been doing,
and people shackled to their beds. Penhurst in particular, they
did a documentary in the seventies, and I don't think
it was a full documentary. It was more like a
news piece. But the reporter who came in, the journalists
who came in, said he couldn't even keep cameramen on
staff because they were literally getting physically ill from the smell.
(32:50):
And what they were seeing was so disturbing because there
was just fe season urine all over, naked men who
were you know, emaciate, standing in the corners, swaying to
music on their own, children in cribs that couldn't walk
because they'd never been allowed to walk. They didn't get
out of their cribs. So it's almost like the worst
(33:12):
form of torture you could imagine, and just a lot
of tragedy in those places. You know, just of those
are people too who have human desires, and so you
had a lot of sexual assaults going on in the evenings,
of patients attacking patients, and.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Just a lot of sadness.
Speaker 4 (33:33):
So that really, to me, those institutions just can't help
it be a container.
Speaker 1 (33:40):
Yeah, we always think of ghosts as having experienced some
kind of trauma or something horrible happened, revenge, bitterness, whatever,
But what about the people that cared and maybe they
couldn't do anything. Do they show up? Is there a
right you know, is there a medium and mediumship where
(34:02):
you can connect with those kinds of spirits.
Speaker 3 (34:05):
There was a story I'm not remembering which institution it was,
but there was a worker who was commonly seen in
a personality that they knew. And I think there are
just so many layers that go into haunt, like causing
something to be haunted and that residual energy. And as
Jessica was talking, you just think of all the fear
(34:26):
that would have I mean, just every single one of
those patients would have been afraid of what was coming next.
You've got the fear of the workers, the employees who
are working there, that don't know what to do and
they're afraid of the people that they're taking care of.
So that emits and layers into the space. And then
you've got the people who are passionately trying to do
(34:49):
something to make it better, and you know, all that
emotion and they're just they're all the the rough and
tough emotions too. Is that the fear and the worry
and the overwhelm and anxiety.
Speaker 4 (35:05):
Yeah, And at Penhurst there was actually a doctor who
has been seen. They turned one of the buildings into
like a home for women and their children when they
were kind of in between homes, and so there were
a lot of single moms with a lot of children,
and there's a gymnasium that they created and it was formerly,
you know, one of the patients resident halls. But the
(35:27):
kids would report in the eighties of this man in
a white coat and he would play with them and
they loved him. He was kind and they thought he
was wonderful and he was reported by so many children,
and so that's exactly what you're talking about. There was
a caretaker whose spirit came back and was with these
little children, almost being a caretaker.
Speaker 1 (35:47):
Again, we have a question from the Instagram chat from
a friend Maria Canal, and she says, have you ever
analyzed the geology of the land where the institutions prisons
are located.
Speaker 4 (36:05):
I've not, personally, I would say, you know, anytime you
have things by water, I think that amplifies it. So
that's one thing. What do you think, Natalie.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
My best example of this is the Palmer House Hotel
in Sock Center is actually on a lay line, an
energy line that kind of connects different places, and that
is crazy if you go stand on that. You know,
I've been to psychic development classes. Suzanne Wordley is a
practitioner that goes there and teaches a class where she
(36:39):
actually has participants lining up along the line and close
their eyes without telling them what it is. And it's
hysterical to watch because everybody I'll just start swaying and
and you feel it. So I think that there's a
lot to that. And like Jessica was saying, with water
being around water, you've also got like a lot of
(37:02):
the East Coast stuff is on native land too. I mean,
well everywhere in the United States, there's a lot that
can happen on native land, and and there's a lot
of energy involved with that as well.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Yeah, and Mara says there there could be limestone courts,
you know, which can to it. And in the Hudson Valley,
especially in the Pine Bush area, we definitely have higher
just naturally, you know, electromagnetic Yeah.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
I felt it at the Stanley Hotel. I was on
a tour in the basement and you could feel like
it just was buzzy down there.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
Yeah, but I don't know what it is exactly, but
there's just certain elements that seem to be a conduit
and create a greater magnitude or maybe turn the volume
up a little bit on this type of stuff. So
that's a really good point.
Speaker 1 (37:55):
Yeah, next time you guys come to the Hutson Valley,
you have to let me know.
Speaker 3 (37:59):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Yeah, the Stanley's not that far away actually, so yeah,
and that's one of the biggest hot spots that that is.
Like I consistently here investigators discussed the Stanley.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Oh and I was actually talking about the Stanley and
the Shanley.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
I'm sorry, Stanley're right, You're right, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (38:20):
Yeah, yeah, no, but I know we we looked at
doing something out of the Shanley one time. Yeah, yeah,
we did.
Speaker 1 (38:26):
Yeah, it's it's what you've not been there.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
Or no, have not. We haven't been out to the
East coast yet. We're going to plan a visit. I
think this.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Spring Okay cool, Yeah, let me know for sure.
Speaker 3 (38:38):
Ivents out there in April.
Speaker 1 (38:39):
Well, it's like springtime here right now. It is so
so warm.
Speaker 2 (38:43):
It's today.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
What do you guys have? What what temperature?
Speaker 3 (38:49):
Well it was seventy a couple of days ago and
now and then it's snowed all morning.
Speaker 4 (38:54):
So yeah, oh wow, really blizzarding outside my window. Legitimately, Okay, no,
we're not.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
That's not us at all. It was like it reached
eighty eighty one today and it's warm. Almost wish we
had the air conditioned written still it's that warm.
Speaker 4 (39:13):
Yeah, we've got the eight I've got a blanket on
my lap right now.
Speaker 1 (39:16):
Cold.
Speaker 3 (39:17):
We had a huge Halloween blizzard in nineteen ninety one
and everybody talks about it. And these poor kids today
when it started snowing, I'm sure they already have to
hear about it enough, Like I mean talk about feeling old, Like, oh,
when I was a kid, we walked through trigger Tree
day in a snowstorm in nineteen ninety one, and all
the kids today had to hear double about that because
(39:40):
it started snowing this morning.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
Yeah. Yeah, it's like hearing the stories of like I
had to walk twenty miles to the school bus and
when I was here exactly. You know, it's interesting too
because you were you're talking about earlier how people were
me misdiagnosed and let's say it epilepsy, the thought you
(40:03):
were possessed or psychologists psychologically disturbed later on, and then
later on they figured out, oh, it was actually physiological
and I had nothing to do with the actual psychology.
And it's you know, I've been experimenting recently thanks to
the recommendation of my wife, and I've been pretty much
(40:25):
gluten free.
Speaker 2 (40:26):
Mhm.
Speaker 1 (40:27):
It's too early to tell, but I can tell you
for a fact that I feel better, Like no doubt.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
I have celiac, So I definitely feel better.
Speaker 1 (40:38):
Okay. Yeah, it's like because I was and it's still
there lingering for sure, but because I know it could
take many months before like the inflammation really actually you know,
calms down. But like I have I have like serious
brain fog, like scary scary brain fact and it's already receding,
(41:00):
and at first I thought, is this psychosomatic? Is it
like a placebo effect? And that it's not. It's definitely not.
Even my skin's getting better right now, knock on one.
So I was just thinking, you know, maybe some of
these people who you know are let's say a psychic mediums,
(41:23):
or or even people on the other side who've passed over.
We're you know, let's say you were struggling with a particular,
you know, disease and someone on the other side had
died or in some related way or suffered in some
related way with that disease. Does that give you a
kind of like a line to connect.
Speaker 3 (41:47):
I mean, I think we're all divine beings and you've
got you know, the theories of consciousness, and I think
we're all connected. And whenever you have something like that
that's gonna maybe illustrate a similarity. That's the story that's
coming into my mind. I worked as a ghostwriter on
(42:09):
a story for a family who's the dad had gotten
a heart lung transplant, and he started having visions of
the woman who had died in a motorcycle accident, whose
lungs he had inherited received in that and he started
(42:30):
having glimpses. He even kind of took on some of
her personality traits. And you read about those stories if
you study some.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
Of that, Yeah, and I've definitely heard about that, and
I guess I'm thinking it's like I feel your pain
kind of a thing. So like if somebody on either
side had experienced something and then the medium has had
a similar experience, then is you know, does that kind
of form a bridge between the two.
Speaker 3 (43:00):
I think there can be a lot of bridges, for sure, a.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Lot of different bridges.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (43:06):
All right, O, there are werewolves in our area?
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Of course?
Speaker 3 (43:14):
Where is there a dog man? Yeah?
Speaker 4 (43:18):
Dog Man's my favorite and I'm I'm just so into
dog man. I don't ever want to meet one. They
seem very scary to me, all the stories that I've
researched about them. I don't think we had a dog
man in Pennsylvania, but we had one in the Pacific Northeast,
which will come out next fall. And that story creeped
me out so much. And the source was it. It
(43:42):
came from a pastor, a minister who went out with
a friend kind of looking for Bigfoot and he kind
of lived next to this kind of they were kind
of on the top of a gorge, so they were
above the gorge, but down below there were all the
trees and you know, the beautif things, but up above
us a little bit more deserty. But he kept hearing
(44:04):
weird noises out there at night, and he was convinced
there was big foot. And so he had a friend
or a person at church actually he was chatting to
after service one day, and he worked for the state,
and he took him out and they kind of went,
you know, looking around to see if there might be
something to bigfoot out there. And when they were out there,
it started to get dark, and their phones started to
(44:24):
run low on battery. They were out there longer than
they expected, and in the darkness, they saw a creature
run across the path and they weren't quite sure what
it was, but it was very big and dark and
bulky and tall. And they went back to the pastor's
house and they were very creeped out by what they
had seen. And that subsequently, after that, the pastor and
(44:47):
his family were haunted and like basically stalked by this creature.
They would hear it on the roof of their house
at night. He sent me photographs of the snow on
his roof with basically like paw prints, like they were
kind of triangular and had toes. They were not normal
(45:07):
looking at all. They were quite large. And his wife
saw at one point something big with a big almost
like a doghead, look over the top of their privacy fence,
you know, which was like eight foot tall, and it
was just standing there looking over it at her the kids.
It was knocking on windows at night, almost kind of
like beckoning the kids out. And that's one of the
(45:28):
things with the dog man legend is that they do
kind of say that they kind of go after children
and try to convince them. They can make their voice
sound like your mom, you know, calling for you to
come outside or whatever. And so like that story was
so creepy and coming from like a man of the cloth, right,
and so like he was like they just had some
(45:49):
special holy water and oils that he had been given
by somebody, and they went outside and they made little
crosses from some of the leaves and trees that were
around their yard, and they buried them. You know, sudden
intention basically, you know, this is what our intentions are
so strong, they set an intention and they believed in
(46:09):
that intention and what they did to protect their space,
and after that it never came to their home again,
but they would still sometimes hear it kind of howling
out in the gorge.
Speaker 1 (46:20):
But yeah, it's interesting how how belief really is very
powerful because you could be of different religions or you know,
religions all around the world that have different methodologies right
for keeping evil or demons or whatever at bay, and
it seems to work when people employ these.
Speaker 4 (46:40):
Yeah, I think, like you know, sometimes Nally and I
will help people if they have energy in their house
of their experience in a haunting, and you can go
in and clear someone's home. And to me, it really
is setting intention and just believing in your intention and
the power of you as the physical being over the
power of the being that doesn't have a body, and
(47:03):
you know, setting the intention that needs to leave. I know, Nalie,
you probably have some thoughts to add to that.
Speaker 3 (47:10):
Well. I think, like you know, one of the ways
that I describe it is that that thought becomes an intention.
It's like a ribbon of energy that goes out there
and it works both ways. Right, Like we all know
those people that keep complaining about things, and then the
bad things keep happening. I mean you can almost watch
that on Facebook, Like the people that are complaining all
(47:33):
the time about something bad happening, it just keeps coming
their way. So you have to just be really careful
about those energy signatures that you are putting out there,
and so you know, but yeah, it's the power of manifestation.
Speaker 4 (47:51):
Yeah, and what you focus on, right, Like November is
actually gratitude month, And it's like actually physiologically impossible to
be sad if you're thankful for something, because your mind
can't focus on those two separate energies at the same time,
Like the synapsis cannot connect, So physiologically you cannot be
(48:14):
grateful and sad at the same time. So, you know,
setting the attention and what you focus on, and I
think like attracts like and I think that is such
a true thing. Like if I'm just focusing on the
good stuff that's happening in my life, and then I'm.
Speaker 2 (48:28):
Just going to get more good stuff.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
And I truly believe that and see that happening all
the time for myself and my family, you.
Speaker 3 (48:35):
Know, And we talk about the veils or thinning, you
know as our vibrations are rising if you are studying
at all about the Age of Aquarius, and our vibrations
are rising, so that's causing the veil to be thinner,
which translates to all of this being even more so.
There's no protection there anymore. So you have to be
(48:58):
very very careful about what you're putting out there. So
when you're putting fear, you know, fear out there, that's
going to draw some really negative energy in.
Speaker 1 (49:09):
The Age of Acqueries. So how does that apply? Well, okay,
first can you explain that? And then how does that
apply to the paranormal.
Speaker 3 (49:18):
I'm a little rusty because I've been working on monster books. No,
just in general. Uh, the theory comes from astrology. And
actually I think we're sitting on like I think I
just saw that we're on the day Capricorn. Pluto has
been in Capricorn for the last twenty years. Right, I'm
(49:42):
going to mess up the dates and my astrology friends,
we're gonna I'm gonna hear about it from that. But
but yeah, so we've been in Capricorn energy, which is
very survivor energy, and there actually there's a couple of
different things going on where the Age of Aquarius is
all is more about the paradigm shift, you know. For
(50:06):
from the time Christ came along, it was about the
searching for a savior, you know that in God we trust.
So it was the age of Pisces. I believe I
am so rusty with this stuff. So yeah, but as
(50:30):
we move into the Age of Aquarius, that the concepts
are that we were finding the Savior in ourselfs like,
we don't have anyone to come to save us, We
have to just save ourselves. That that we have to
find that divine spark in our own selves. And but
in all of that, it's causing the vibration of the
(50:51):
planet to rise. And I have a friend who studies
the human resonance, and his theory is that the more
light workers out there that are doing doing energy clearing
and shifting things, we're actually shifting the vibration of the
planet in a measurable way. As we're kind of waking
up to what all of this is and and our
gifts and our abilities and embracing that and heading towards
(51:14):
more of a spiritual being. That's raising the vibration of
our planet. And that's that's the Age of Aquarius. So
I started off talking about totally the wrong thing.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
But what does that affect that the power?
Speaker 3 (51:29):
So like if you are raising your vibration, it just
you know, you've got all these people embracing their spiritual
gifts and so it's just lessening the distance between austin
spirit in that vibrational space, so there is no veil it.
(51:50):
You know. I think a lot of people are waking
up to gifts that they never knew they had, So
they're seeing things, they're experiencing more paranormal energy than ever before.
We've got a lot of kids being born with gifts
and abilities. I mean all of our kids, Jessica and I.
A lot of this work that we've we've been doing
is to be able to explain some of this stuff
(52:12):
to our own kids, who are very gifted in a
way that was better than what we were taught. And
so they've got uh you know, it's almost like we're
watching evolution happen in front of us with these kids
being born with these spiritual gifts. So you think it's measurable, Yeah,
(52:32):
I think so. And my friends who's studying the human residence.
Every now and then he'll call me and he'll be like,
did you feel that? Did you feel that? And it's
he's watching the spikes go up and and if you
look into that, and I think science is catching up
with being able to study some of this too, and
that's that's part of the Age of Aquarius as well
(52:55):
with just it's more techie.
Speaker 1 (52:58):
Yeah, was it the Monroe Institute that was running the
random number generator that spiked like right before nine to eleven?
Speaker 2 (53:09):
That sounds right. I don't remember.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
I think it was the Monroe Institute, but that was definitely.
I mean, it doesn't it doesn't lie, you know, it was.
It was such a clear spike. It wasn't like, yeah,
there was a spike like that two weeks ago. No,
it was like a very distinct spike. And there was
something that occurred, was that like a collective consciousness.
Speaker 4 (53:34):
Right around the time when it was happening, like when
we were about to switch, Because I think there's something
to that collective fear, right, like I think it's Chad
Gallic did a documentary.
Speaker 2 (53:50):
I can't remember the name of it.
Speaker 3 (53:51):
There's also been a lot of measurable energetic shifts as well.
A lot of psychics can trace their gifts and me included,
can go back to there was a huge energetic shift
in twenty twelve, so a lot of psychics can trace
their gifts back to that time.
Speaker 1 (54:08):
Kind of really, I hadn't read that before.
Speaker 3 (54:11):
Yeah, and and this is all astrology, and again I
don't have the exacts, but and so we're going through
a lot of that again right now as we're shifting
our vibration up.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
So does that mean that there are people who otherwise,
you know, full grown adults that you know, haven't been
able to kind of see and experience paranormal will or
is it really like a younger generation thing.
Speaker 3 (54:39):
Well, that's kind of what happened to me. I mean,
I wasn't going through my whole life seeing this stuff.
I think I saw a lot when I was little,
and I talked, I had imaginary friends, and I had
different things happening when I was young. But I think
that there's some self preservation that happens in there too,
where you kind of shut that down for whatever reason.
And in my case, everyone around me my life was
(55:00):
telling me that there was no such thing and it
was just my imagination. So you're going to believe that
if you don't know what to do with it, because
that's a lot safer than trying to wrap your head
around something that everybody is telling you isn't there. It
was just a yeah, yeah, but you know, as I
started to I mean, it was really when we started
(55:21):
doing paranormal investigations, like we would walk into these haunted
houses and these really heavy history places, and all of
a sudden, like I'd start getting information dumps and things
were starting to happen. And and of course I'm a
very creative person too, so I was constantly and used
to be a lawyer. So you've got that balance between
I'm super creative, I'm also very logically wired with that
(55:44):
legal training, So how am I going to make sense
of this? And I was constantly trying to prove to
myself like how am I? How do I know that
I'm not making this stuff up? No? And so then
it was just about like, Okay, now I've got these
gifts coming online, I'm going to taking classes. I'm going
to start investigating a little bit more about what this
is and what it means for me. Because every one
(56:05):
of us is wired differently too. So if if you
go take psychic development classes from one psychic that doesn't
necessarily mean that that's how your gifts work. You still
have to do that journey of exploration to find how
your own gifts and abilities work.
Speaker 1 (56:19):
Yeah, and if the veil continues to get like super thin,
you know, maybe there's a reality where ghosts need legal
representation and Natalie, you know the perfect it'll be like
it'll be like the movie Ghosts. You know, they're all
(56:40):
going to be coming and lining up.
Speaker 3 (56:41):
Well, that was kind of my like, that was kind
of a foundation for my fictional characters that I started
writing before I knew I was psychic. So in my
tradictional stories, I had a character who was a lawyer
or a law student, and she started I just thought
it would be fascinating to take somebody who's trained to
think logically rationally and then give them something completely irrational
(57:02):
to deal with. So that's where my fiction ideas came from.
And so my my lawyer ended up with these ghost
clients that had their unfinished business that had to try
to that. You know, she barely believed in what was
happening herself and then having to just deal with this.
So I didn't realize that I was kind of writing
my own story at that Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (57:24):
Mean, I'm kind of joking, but I'm kind of like,
kind of not because, yeah, sometimes I think that maybe
we are living in something akin to like a simulation,
and you know, what if these other entities are you know,
fully conscious and we're just not at upstage where we're
interacting with them, right And at some point, what if
that that becomes the case You're walking down the street
(57:45):
and you just see these other things, you know, living
in a different way, but right beside us.
Speaker 3 (57:54):
So my family when my kids were little, we lived
in Belgium for six years when they were when they
were very tiny. And uh, a few years before, like
right before COVID, the fall before COVID, my now ex
husband and I traveled over to London and Ireland for
(58:15):
a wedding and it was the first time I'd ever
been in London where I knew I was psychic and
I can't believe how many dead people are there. Like
I remember walking out of the hotel and just feeling
all the layers of energy and that's something that I
was certainly not open to the first time.
Speaker 1 (58:34):
Have you guys ever seen the movie Waking Life, the
animation now Waking Life? It is a rotoscope animation, so humans,
and then that's you know, animation over top and it
was made by Richard link Later. I think you will
love it. It's very, very fascinating. It's philosophical. It has
(58:59):
a lot to do with consciousness and death and reality.
I think I think you both appreciate it. But anyway,
so that that's it, we're here. I can't believe it.
Speaker 2 (59:09):
Oh, it's already over.
Speaker 1 (59:14):
We've got just really quick. We've got Monsters of the
Northeast and Ghostly Tales of Pennsylvania, So everyone listening, please
go check those out. Natalie, and just get any last
words before we Natalie your lawyer last words.
Speaker 3 (59:35):
No, it's just it's been a fun way to wrap
up Halloween season.
Speaker 2 (59:39):
Well, yeah, I appreciate having you guys on there, so yeah,
thank you.
Speaker 4 (59:44):
It's it's been like a busy month for us, and
we're both super stoked that this is how we got
to spend Halloween night.
Speaker 3 (59:51):
And my brain is a little fried.
Speaker 1 (59:56):
I know, I'm sure. I'm sure. It's a very busy
time for you guys. And an alien level will just
leave with this. Who said Waking Life is a must see?
Speaker 2 (01:00:04):
Okay, we're gonna see it for sure.
Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
It's one of my favorites. Thank you so much, guys.
I really appreciated that.
Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Happy Halloween, Happy Halloween, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
Yeah, all right, thank you guys for joining. I appreciate
your comments and chat and hopefully I'll see you on
the comment sections and wherever you listen to your podcasts.
If you could, therefore leave a comment down below and
rate this as high as possible, I'd really really appreciate it.
All that helps organically grow the podcast here on the
Mystic Lounge YouTube channel. And if you like this content,
(01:00:36):
maybe you'll also like Coffee and UFOs, also a podcast
on this channel. Both podcasts are rebroadcast on the Unex
Network eleven PMS eleven PMS eleven pm Eastern Standard time
and two am. I'm sorry two am Eastern Standard time
eleven pm Pacific time. Yeah, my brain's a little fried
(01:00:56):
still too, Natalie. But that that's where you can find
this replayed every week, and I think that's it. So
just one last thing, just a friendly reminder to if
you can go to the Carbondaleian Festival, which is in Carbondale, Pennsylvania,
if you live nearby, it'd be great to see you.
(01:01:17):
There's a lot of great speakers and the end of
that is a Heather Taddy. She's gonna kinda be the
the last speaker, last event of the night, and looks
like it's gonna be a really good time. And there's
also a site visit during the festival as well, so
you'll go to where the uf the alleged UFO crash
(01:01:38):
took place in the reservoir there, all right, So that's it,
Peace and love to everyone out there, Thank you so
much for all your continued support, and until next time,
I'll see you on the flip side.
Speaker 3 (01:03:03):
D
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