Vick's Flicks, Ep. 172: Paul Thomas Anderson

With One Battle After Another hitting theaters this week, Brandon, Brett, and Stoney take the opportunity to dive into the filmography of Paul Thomas Anderson. 

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
And now, ladies and gentlemen, the Soros Network proudly brings
to you some in depth movie discussion with a resident
film critic, Brandon.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
At the evening, everyone, the vic Flicks Podcast is here.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
Welcome back for another episode of the vix Flicks Podcast
right here on Nashville Movie Dispatch. I'll be your host
for the show the e I see at Sobros Network,
Big Natural Stony Keeley. You can follow me on Twitter
at Stony Keeley, collectively at Sobros Network, and you can
check out all of our work at Nashville Movie Dispatch
dot substack dot com. Joined as usual by the star

(00:55):
of the show himself, the man whose namesake it bears.
He is a board member of the Music City Critics Association.
He is a member of the Southeastern Film Critics Association.
He's our resident film critic here at Nashville Movie Dispatch,
mister big shot himself Brandon Vick Brandon, How you doing today,
my man?

Speaker 2 (01:13):
Not too bad? Yeah, yep, I'm older now.

Speaker 3 (01:18):
Yeah, happy birthday. I think, by the way, thank you
a young, sprightly twenty three.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
Yep, got my first gray pube.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
How about.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
At twenty four? I think that's a good sign.

Speaker 3 (01:33):
That is a good sign. I think so. I think
that means you're going places.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yeah, I think that's precisely what that means.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
We've also got our buddy Brett on the line with us.
Brett's back for another podcast. We got a big one today.
How are you doing today, Brett?

Speaker 4 (01:51):
Hey, I'm doing good. Unfortunately I'm not twenty three, I am.
I am forty three.

Speaker 3 (01:58):
Oh oh my, you're old.

Speaker 4 (02:01):
You know, it was kind of not some people know
your wife willed you in here. Well some people know
this that we were roommates in college, and it was
kind of weird the age difference.

Speaker 2 (02:10):
That's true. Yeah, but well it does now. Yeah, now
I realized you should have been graduated like fifteen years
before we should have.

Speaker 5 (02:19):
Yeah. Yeah, well we made it through.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
It was okay, yeah, no, it's fine. We fed you pudding.

Speaker 4 (02:24):
I mean, the age gap was overshadowed by our three
triple stack bunk beds that we slept.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yeah, that's right, that's exactly right.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
Oh man, man, that's funny. But we actually did have
bunk beds in our Yeah, we did have a three person.

Speaker 2 (02:42):
I don't know why no one got ass in that.
It doesn't make any sense to me now that I
look back, being so young and wild.

Speaker 3 (02:51):
I think we had plenty of acts in that room.

Speaker 2 (02:54):
Well not yeah, well not the kind to brag about.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
I wouldn't want I wouldn't want to eat an open
face sandwich in that room. You don't know what's flowing
in the air. The three of us bunk beds and
pretty much a storage closet.

Speaker 2 (03:12):
Was it. You weren't a bunk bed, were you?

Speaker 5 (03:14):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (03:15):
You were? Oh he wasn't.

Speaker 3 (03:17):
I was top. I had the loan bed.

Speaker 2 (03:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, you were top.

Speaker 4 (03:21):
But I think the only reason we didn't have a
triple stack is because the ceiling.

Speaker 2 (03:25):
Was Yeah, I don't think it. I think so. Yeah.
I think someone's like penis chip of scraping the ceiling.
If I tell you what if a dorm had a
living room, we had it, folks. Yeah, being room with
a microwave that sat on someone's dresser. That was it.

Speaker 3 (03:50):
If you if you popped a boner on that top bunk,
you were going to push back a ceiling tile.

Speaker 2 (03:55):
Oh yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yeah you said that like you did that.

Speaker 2 (04:00):
No, I hate I hate top bunks really yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:03):
I always love the top bunk.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
That's why I was glad. I don't I think you
just I think it just worked out that, you know.

Speaker 4 (04:10):
I mean most of my life I am the middle
seed in the car or the top.

Speaker 2 (04:15):
Oh yeah, that's okay, that's true. Well there's also that
thing of like you gotta climb down. Yeah, you know
that's tough. Yeah, But now, thinking back, what an asshole
I was because you were like fifteen years older and
well you're trying.

Speaker 4 (04:29):
To at the time, I was just past peak strength.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
That's true. So that's true. We thought you could do it.
We thought you could do it. I remember it the
first semester. You were like that zombie and World War
Z and that climbed the wall. It was so fast.

Speaker 5 (04:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
Now by the time you got to be a senior.

Speaker 4 (04:45):
Well you just change over time, right, you can't do
it the same way.

Speaker 2 (04:50):
But not us throwing those hot pockets in that microwave
doing valvenus col whips.

Speaker 4 (04:57):
I thought you were gonna say, doing valuum, do it
doing volume?

Speaker 2 (05:03):
Oh man, we taking like six tile and all do.

Speaker 3 (05:10):
Y'all ever wonder what those dorms are like the Corlew
Hall in Middle Tennessee State's campus.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
We were talking was it one of y'all said, there's
a demises, which is a fantastic attack. There's on campus,
on campus, and I know they redid the rec center.
Of all these updates, I guarantee you those dorms are
probably exactly the same.

Speaker 3 (05:31):
From the outside looking in, they look the same.

Speaker 2 (05:34):
I've driven building.

Speaker 3 (05:35):
Yeah, I've driven by there a.

Speaker 4 (05:36):
Couple of times, which, by my recollection, was just like
a notch above or below. I think you could probably
argue either way of like a prison block.

Speaker 2 (05:46):
Yeah, yo, no, yeah, I mean it was just basically
cold marble floor. And I mean and we had a
big room. We had a big room, yeah, because we
stacked our beds, but other people's it was, it was
they were tiny. Yeah. We had a nice window, we did.

Speaker 3 (06:09):
We could see the football stadium Johnny Red Floyd Stadium,
that's right. You could hear the roar of the crowd.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Those banger cups on the bars, and people could see us.

Speaker 3 (06:22):
Oh man, those are the good old days.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
They were, they really were. I'd never liked taking showers
in there. I know you probably you know you. I
know you probably couldn't tell when I would grab your
ankles under the game, But I really didn't like it.

Speaker 3 (06:37):
I was not saying if somebody in those showers would
grab your ankle when you weren't paying attention, I can't
hear either.

Speaker 2 (06:45):
Oh okay, oh.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
I hear you. Okay, I don't hear me.

Speaker 2 (06:49):
Do it again.

Speaker 3 (06:50):
Okay, you're good. You can hear it.

Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yep, Sorry, you got too carried away.

Speaker 3 (06:56):
Yeah, I I somebody.

Speaker 2 (06:59):
I still thought that was.

Speaker 3 (07:02):
Somebody would also slide under those stall doors there bare
ass dragon across the floor.

Speaker 2 (07:11):
That's where I drew the line. I couldn't do that,
but I but the other stuff. Sure, sure, oh man.
And you want to think about people thinking that we
were yeah, we were weird.

Speaker 3 (07:25):
I remember you coming back to the dorm one day.

Speaker 2 (07:30):
I guess, Brett, you were probably the normal one of
the bunch. I don't know me like, I don't think
you got you. You basically just had girlfriends in college.
I guess right, Well, I mean I know, I mean,
I know some funny stuff, but like now that we're
recalling them, like you know, we've Yeah, I guess you're
the most mature one of the bunch.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
You came back into the dorm room one day and
said that, which was also very unfortunate given the bathroom
situation in that dorm where you were taking a shower
and someone was taking a ship in the stall, and
you came back in and said, it sounded like somebody
was trying to start a motorcycle.

Speaker 2 (08:12):
Yeah, yeah, well that's what I mean. How Like, you're
right across the way from a stall, So even if
you had to go poop, yeah, there's people in the
shower and then but if you're showering and people and
someone has to come in and poop, then.

Speaker 3 (08:27):
You're stuck in it.

Speaker 4 (08:30):
And that is why I just did it all in
the shower, is true.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
That is true. That explains why sometimes when I grab
your ankle, I grabbed a turd that.

Speaker 5 (08:41):
Was actually my motorcycle.

Speaker 3 (08:45):
I was bitching about you. Well, one battle after another.
It's coming out in theaters this weekend, so we thought
it would be a fitting time to relive the filmography
of Paul Thomas Anderson.

Speaker 2 (09:01):
And listen, listen, fellas. I appreciate you doing this. This
was my idea. I didn't realize how many hours of
your life would be.

Speaker 3 (09:09):
I never realized that I had only seen two of
his films before this. You know, I really yeah, it
was just There Will Be Blood and Licorice Pizza. We're
the only two that I had seen.

Speaker 2 (09:21):
One Battle of Another makes his tenth film, Yeah, and
I actually had seen all of them at some point
except for his very first one Heart eight. I had
never seen that one before. But everything else, But I
loved going back and rewatching even like I mean obviously

(09:44):
Boogie Knight's Magnolia, but even like I han't seen Punch
Strong Love in years and years and years. And I
also wanted to rewatch The Master because I remember thinking
it's an acting showcase, which ps it is, but I
didn't necessarily I was that thrilled about the movie itself.
But some of these repeat viewings have changed since I've

(10:08):
gotten older, and I guess I've seen I have seen
some ship Brett.

Speaker 3 (10:13):
Where were you at? On his filmography, I had seen.

Speaker 4 (10:18):
Four or five. Probably There will Be Blood is one
that I think for all of us that we've we've
loved for a while.

Speaker 3 (10:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (10:30):
You know, I was thinking I won't spoil it, but
you were mentioning something that was you thought was his
best movie. Yeah, And sometimes picking what's his best is
very hard to do.

Speaker 3 (10:43):
Because I think you're splitting hairs a little.

Speaker 4 (10:44):
Bit, and it's not it's not apples to apples, even
though they're they're all his movies, it's very different types
of movies.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
It's all such a unique perspective of rather a certain
time or certain like themes, which I mean, there are
consistent themes throughout his films, I think, but then there's
others that are very much about a certain period or
you know, sometime. I mean I think a lot of it,

(11:12):
like Dealing with a Master could be you know, it's
a period piece, but it's also about stuff that was
happening then and there when it came out. But yeah,
I I mean it is sort of like splitting hairs.
Like I actually started a letterbox of just his movies
as I was watching them and either re ranking them

(11:34):
and kind of seeing my number one before all. This
is still my number one now. But I will say
there is more that like very there. Only maybe one
or two is under a four.

Speaker 3 (11:54):
Yeah, I have very few. I was Licorice Pizza. I
still will recognize the filmmaking prowess in it. But I
just wanted everybody in that film to just blow.

Speaker 2 (12:08):
Up right right, those kids.

Speaker 3 (12:10):
I inherent vice. I feel like is more of a vibe.
I think you kind of have to suspend disbelief a
little bit and just kind of go with it a
little bit.

Speaker 2 (12:19):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
Other than that, I mean these were all like four,
four and a half five stars.

Speaker 2 (12:25):
For me, I've got a few three and a half's
and Inherent Vice is my lowest ranking one with three
and I have some thoughts on that as we get
to it. But but yeah, I mean we can I mean,
do we just want to go in order?

Speaker 3 (12:41):
Yeah? What a couple a couple of things to start
with for one. One battle after another seems to be
getting some pretty good views so far.

Speaker 2 (12:51):
I've seen the masterpiece word thrown around there.

Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah, I haven't seen it yet. I know you guys
haven't seen it yet either, not yet. I does it
make you kind of nervous? It's starting to build a
little bit of hype? Or is it this just one
of those cases where it's like you've got the filmmaker,
you've got the act, the actor, you kind of go
with it.

Speaker 5 (13:14):
Yeah, that's.

Speaker 4 (13:17):
That is my perspective that I feel like, to some
degree it's can't miss.

Speaker 5 (13:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (13:24):
Now PTA is PTA at the end day and.

Speaker 4 (13:27):
With Leo, with the others in the movie. I feel
like the question for me will be can it surpass
other favorites of PTA?

Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, where does it rank?

Speaker 5 (13:39):
Where can't it surpass?

Speaker 4 (13:41):
For this year? Something like centers Like, I mean, that's
a very high bar on both of those things.

Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yeah, I agree, I I uh, there's things I've heard
that that I mean, Steven Spielberg said that this one
has more action in the first hour of a Paul
Thomas Anderson movie than all of his others combined. Wow,
I've heard that this is kind of the largest film
he's done, the biggest budget he's had.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
That's saying something.

Speaker 2 (14:06):
This was the first time he agreed to have a
pre screening audience people give their thoughts. He's never done
that before, so this is very different. So I'm really
excited that this is the response it's getting. I mean,
sure that the bar is high, but it would be
high even if I didn't hear anything.

Speaker 3 (14:25):
About it fair enough. But yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
Keep hearing one thing over and over, and it is
that Sean Penn has been He's hasn't been this good
in years, and that just give him the best supporting
acting Oscar right now. Really, and I'm really like Leo,
I have no doubts. I like that Regina Hall is

(14:49):
in it, and there's the young actress that plays his daughter.
I think will be really good. Yeah, I'm looking forward
to it. But I now I'm really intrigued with exactly
that arc that Seampin has because there's been a few
things which also, by the way, people love Benezeo, which
come on.

Speaker 3 (15:11):
We've got a Benicio del Toro episode in.

Speaker 2 (15:13):
The Phoenician Scheme. But rewatching some of his films, I
slipped my mind that, like Seanpenn, Beniso, like they've actually
worked with him before. I just forgot. And I think
some of it's because it's in here advice butza.

Speaker 3 (15:33):
But so what do you what do you think it
is about Paul Thomas Anderson's work? What what is his hallmark?
What makes it stand out among other filmmakers script. I
think it's the words dialogue. Dialogue is great, It's very distinct.
But I also think the way that he tells the story,

(15:55):
the way he captures it is still And I think
we were talking about this before we started recording, like
it's a slice of life that doesn't really.

Speaker 2 (16:07):
I don't think a lot of people have come in
contact with, but they exist. It's there, you know, it's
it's real life, but there's exaggerations. And I also like
the humor that's in it, even as kind of as
you can either be kind of as wacky as with
Inherent Vice or I really think the reason why it's

(16:29):
one of my favorites and rewatching it is the way
that humor is is used, like in Boogie Nights, oh,
for instance. So I mean, I think there's things like
that and all these kind of like I mean the acting,
the people he gets and and and the thing is
and not that like like, yes, there is the Daniel

(16:51):
d Lewis, and there is the Walking Phoenix, and there's DiCaprio,
But I mean a lot of his films are people
that were up and coming. I mean, Mark Wahlberg was
not a household name, and Boogie Knights, neither was Don Cheto,
neither was Philip Seymour Hoffman, Julian Moore had some more,
you know, but a guy that I I'm sure we're
gonna talk about Philip Baker Hall. Yeah, is fantastic and

(17:12):
I've seen him in a thousand things, but he's great,
and that's what makes to me Hard eight would not
be as as as terrific as it is without him.
So it's not even these like movie stars, but he
gets he gets the best out of people. Which I

(17:33):
was gonna have a question for you guys later on,
like who do you want to see and maybe you
know in another in the next PTA movie. But yeah, man,
I mean it's just everything is kind of firing on
all cylinders when he's really going, even when things don't
in my opinion, like inherent vice, even when things don't
necessarily all click, there's so much you can walk away

(17:55):
from and think no one else is doing, like no
one else can do that. Yeah, and it's very few.

Speaker 3 (18:01):
I've thought about it a little bit more, uh, since
we had our conversation when I was driving to the
dump earlier today, and I think it's the it's the
slice of life concept, sure, but it's that he draws
these relatable slice of life themes out of stories that
we probably shouldn't be relating to. Yes, things that like

(18:24):
people don't commonly experience.

Speaker 2 (18:27):
But it's in those relationships, yeah, that are that that
he writes about and that you see yeah, exhibited on
screen where it's like there is there is something familiar
about it all. Yeah, even if you know a frog
hits your windshield, frog.

Speaker 3 (18:44):
Hits your windshield. You know, I don't know if any
of us have wieners you could wrote cattle with, but
still drawing that emotion out of Boogie Nights, you know,
I don't think any of us have joined a cult,
but yeah, can relate to some of the themes from
the Master. So I think it's taking those it's taking

(19:07):
those stories and presenting them in a relatable way.

Speaker 2 (19:09):
Every film has every one of his films has something
that you can't connect to, and it makes you think,
even if it's not you, maybe it's a culture, maybe
it's the time that we're living in. But he just
has such a way. But he's such a he's such

(19:30):
a fascinating guy because for people, I don't know, he's
married to Maya Rudolph mm hmm, and he's actually kind
of like a comedy nerd kind of guy. But the
stuff he does it's totally opposite. But I mean, I
guess that's not totally unusual. But I'm just like, he like,
what must it be like to be in his head

(19:52):
or to see, like for him to start writing something
like Boogie Knights, or there will be blood or you
know what have you on what he's doing and like
one battle after another. I mean you know it's I mean,
my goodness, but I now also people should know. I
think one movie will take up at least a third
of your day.

Speaker 3 (20:13):
Absolutely. Yeah, Magnolia is what three hours in?

Speaker 2 (20:16):
Then I think that's his longest one.

Speaker 3 (20:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:18):
So, and his shortest one is either what hard eight
or Punch Drunk Love.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
Punch Shrunk Love is just an hour and a half. Yeah,
it's short. I agree with everything you guys have said.
I was going to hit on Brandon. You mentioned getting
the most out of the actors. Yeah, I think there's
kind of this like self perpetuating cycle of because of that,
he also gets the best talent, so he gets the
best actors. Yeah, and I mean you have all of these.

(20:45):
I think about the master. I think about there will
be blood. I mean, Paul Dano going for blow for
blow with Daniel day Lewis and there will be blood
like it's and I mean Punch Shrunk Love Adam Sandler, like,
there is not a whole lot more. I mean, he's
had some really good performances, but that's up there with
I think the thing that stands out to me is

(21:05):
the and you guys are hitting on it with some
of the relatability, but at the same time, it's a
off kilter way of telling these stories. There's always some
kind of unhinged element that it is.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
It's been quite normal life.

Speaker 5 (21:20):
That's right.

Speaker 4 (21:20):
There's realistic pieces of those relationships, but the story are
The stories are often very surreal in ways too.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
Yeah. Absolutely. And I mean, like you guys mentioned the
acting The Master with Woking Phoenix and Philip Seymour Hoffman.
I mean, I don't know, I got chills watching that movie,
and I think at times it can be quite boring,
But just watching those two go toe to toe, it's like,

(21:53):
how do you like, You've got to have some pull
to make this happen.

Speaker 2 (21:57):
I will say, And that's what I to and and
and there are parts where it is slow, but they
to get someone like Joaquin and Phillips Seymour Hoffman to
do what they do, and the way that they dive
into these characters, and that vulnerability and the regrets and
the sadness and the loneliness and the it's such a facade,

(22:20):
like so much of what is going on as a
facade of who of what they want or who they are,
and Amy Adams is great and as she and she's
almost for The Master start of the one holding the
reins at the end because he's Phillips and more. Hoffin

(22:41):
sings that song and it's almost like they there's there's
jealousy on both sides of the men that they are,
that they'll never be and they can't grasp. But I
actually felt like The Master was more rewarding than I
remember it being by the time it was all said

(23:02):
and done and the way it ends, I think it's
great because it's something that Joaking's character has not been
able to do. And I actually walked away with liking
that more than I thought. And neither though we'll get
into it Liquis Pizza, I still like. I don't know

(23:23):
if it's as good as I thought it was when
I first saw it, but I still liked it. However,
The Master, I think I like it more and appreciate
it more because I think I'm I sort of understand
it more and that acting that the acting is is
top notch. Most of his movies made me just feel

(23:45):
sad that I Philip Simour Hoffman isn't here anymore because
I felt in between she and him and his son.
It's it's a tough thing. But I would like to
think that maybe Philip Seymour Hoffman would be proud because
we have a thing now about Stephen King and the
long row of.

Speaker 3 (24:03):
Us, not us.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
Did I say no, no, no, I just okay, yeah, no,
I don't think about us, especially after he hears about
us her college escapades. But I'm just like good for him.
And also, and I think part of Licorice Pizza is
that nostalge of like it's sort of a full circle

(24:26):
thing because Philip Seymour Hoffmann was in his Simptia's first
film and obviously Buggie Knights and Magnolia and The Masters,
so uh oh yeah, I love I totally forgot he
was in that one, but I love their confrontation. But anyway,
but yeah, I think he I mean, I think Pta

(24:46):
really could get anybody he wanted. And there's some fun
stories that I'll share throughout because I used to live
next door to Pta, so obviously I know, uh That's
why I'm so you know, so pumped to do this one.

Speaker 3 (25:06):
Well, let's rewind it to nineteen ninety six, then dig
right into this filmography. Twenty five minutes into the podcast,
let's talk about Hard eight. I'll be honest with you, guys.
I thought PTA's first film was Boogie Knights for probably
thirty eight years of my life until.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
I would agree with you, except I did know. There
were two things. I remember at some point remembering that
Paul Thomas Anderson had done a movie prior to Boogie Knights. Yeah,
just like the Cohen Brothers had a movie before they
did Fargo. I have now seen both, and they both

(25:49):
very much show you of the filmmakers that they were
born to be.

Speaker 3 (25:55):
If you need a refresher, yeah, on Hard eight. Hard
eight is follows the life of a senior gambler and
a homeless man. That's the wait. That's the snopsis of
Hard eight on Wikipedia.

Speaker 2 (26:08):
Philip Baker, Hall, John c Riley, Gwyneth Paltrow. Yep, am
I missing somebody?

Speaker 3 (26:18):
Samuel L. Jackson, Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
Samuel Jackson. I've heard of him.

Speaker 3 (26:23):
Philip Seymour Hoffman.

Speaker 2 (26:25):
Isn't it he isn't it?

Speaker 3 (26:26):
He's credited as a craps player.

Speaker 2 (26:28):
Yep, must say he was one of the high rollers.

Speaker 3 (26:32):
I was kind of surprised, I mean, for this to
be and I don't know how much of Paul Thomas
Anderson's like personal life we'll get into, but I know
he was kind of considered like a filmmaking prodigy at
a young age, coming up into the game. But for
this to be, for this to be a first film,

(26:54):
like a first feature directorial debut, I was kind of
a prized at how tight it was. I was surprised
at how good it was.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
Performance.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
Yeah, the performances. I mean it kind of I think
you alluded to it a second ago. It's like you
you could watch this film and think, oh, yeah, this
this guy something, there's something here, There's something here. And
John c Riley pops up in a few of his
other films really really surprising. I mean, I think if

(27:29):
you think John c Riley, you probably think like step
Brothers John c Riley. But for a lot of people, yeah,
and I know we've talked about him on an episode
of Drinking with we did about Chicago. But this was
I just just really really good stuff and I just
came away from it so impressed. To a surprising degree.

Speaker 2 (27:52):
It reminded me and obviously of like the obvious reasons,
but also I think some of the the tone and
the theme, but it it was sort of like the cooler, Yeah,
is what it reminds me. It's like there's gritty gambling,
but then there's also a nice little surprise about why

(28:14):
these two people have met that Philip Baker holl and
John c. Rally meat and then kind of what happens
after that. And it's a very I think, simplistic film.
There's not much to it, but there is a lot
of meat on the bone for what they're trying to get.
And it is very much based on performances, very much

(28:36):
an indie film, but you can see the care within
the story and the script and performances that even for
something like this as he's just getting started, there is
a lot of potential there and there was. I agree.
I was very impressed with what he was able to
do with such I think sort of just a small

(28:57):
film and like I said, a simple story.

Speaker 4 (29:00):
Absolutely thinking about Hard eight and I was just thinking,
this is also a theme through all of his movies.
You know, you you mentioned you're kind of left wondering
like how are these characters connected? And you know, you
get there, but that feels like often how he establishes
his film by not establishing them in a in an

(29:20):
orthodox way. You're just kind of thrown in with these characters.
I mean, the last that I watched in this group
was Punched Hrunk Love, and my wife came in thirty
minutes in and said, what is happening? And I said,
I really can't tell you yet. Yeah, but I mean
that's and but you get there. But that's for all
of his movies. I mean, I mean there's some that
may follow a little bit more of an orthodox storyline,

(29:42):
but Hard eight is certainly one that you just get
thrown in. And here's the characters. They're kind of you're
just kind of it's like you walk in stride with
them suddenly, just kind of catching up and trying to.

Speaker 2 (29:53):
Figure out thinking about the next two films, especially that
will follow Hard eight, you are very much set in
this type of atmosphere, this tone and industry or kind
of people when they're in how they connect and what
why should you care? I could see that, but I

(30:15):
and again, this is an hour and thirty something minutes,
so it's very easy to go. But I think a
lot is established in this hour and a half and
I had a whole new found appreciation for Philip Baker
Hall that I was. He was, he was great.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
Yeah, and then I, I don't know, I'm getting ahead
of us ourselves here, but because I was going to say,
like Magnolia with him as well, but yeah, yeah, we'll
save that, We'll push that to the side. Uh did
you guys, do you guys want to give a star
rating for Hard eight?

Speaker 2 (30:49):
I gave it three and a half out of five.

Speaker 3 (30:51):
It was a four for me. Four okay, Yeah, I
really enjoyed it, and part of it was kind of
that surprise of like, man, you were this button on
your first film.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
I think for me it was more of like, Okay,
they're like, this is very promising, but compare it to
the other stuff, it's like and it's really not a
fair rating, I mean honestly because of the things he
has done with his other what eight films, But but yeah,

(31:23):
I thought solid three and happened. I was. I was
very impressed, because you know there's times where like, to me,
off the top of my head, I think a bottle
rocket with Wes Anderson. Yeah, it's fine, And there's there's
kind of flashes of the filmmaker, he'll be Yeah, this
one is more and honestly the so is the Coen Brothers.

(31:44):
It is very much of like a natural progression where
you got to start somewhere, but they they know where
they want, Like it just feels like they know what
they want to do and how they want to tell it,
more so than the way of what of what Wes
Anderson would become Pta Cohen's and I think Tarantino guys

(32:08):
like that are very much like this. This is it,
but it's it's gonna get bigger.

Speaker 4 (32:16):
I gave it three and a half also, and but
I could get to a four. I think I agree
with you. It's it's more like measuring by the standards
it is.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
Yeah, and I don't think it's very fair fair to
that movie.

Speaker 5 (32:26):
But yeah, I really liked it a lot.

Speaker 2 (32:29):
I thought John c Riley was great. Philip Baker Hall,
Samuel Jackson's good in it, but honestly I really felt
like him, like Hall and Riley were, Yeah, they were great.

Speaker 3 (32:40):
What do we what do we think about Gwyneth Paltrow?

Speaker 2 (32:44):
Well, what is this? This is right before she's kind
of doing Emma. She hasn't done Shakespeare in Love yet
she's not an Oscar winner yet.

Speaker 3 (32:51):
No.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
I liked it. She was good in it.

Speaker 4 (32:56):
I feel like it was for me, you know, in retrospect,
it was somewhat surprising role for her because of the
character she plays and I used to seeing I mean,
we've talked about this for before with like Michael Keaton
and Night Shift, like it's this character that you don't
expect because of what you know of the actor later on.

Speaker 6 (33:16):
But yeah, shall I thought, that's oh, that's right, yes,
but yeah, it was for her to play a character
that's very unrefined and that kind of thing, the things
that you think of Gwyneth Paltrow has.

Speaker 2 (33:29):
I feel like for me, the first time I kind
of saw that was maybe roll ten and bombs. Yeah,
but then she's actually like, oh, she actually did shit
like before, and that's what That's what that reminded me of.

Speaker 3 (33:41):
By the way, quick aside, someone commented on our podcast
episode of Shallow Howe where we talked about it on
Movie review rewind and said, the film has aged perfectly fine.
This is my favorite movie of all time.

Speaker 2 (33:55):
Okay, well that is very sad, so sad.

Speaker 3 (33:59):
I just wanted to let you guys know that while
we're talking about.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
Also, on a side or note, I was watching a
podcast where someone was talking to Tom Hanks and one
of the questions I always ask is have you ever
been mistaken for another actor? And he's like the host
of it, and he's like, I'm sure you haven't because.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
You're Tom Hanks.

Speaker 2 (34:23):
But Tom Hanks said, every now and then he gets
mistaken for Michael Keaton. Wow, he said, I have had
where people have come to me and they think like
right now, maybe like I guess old you are. But
I thought that's two legends, folks.

Speaker 5 (34:45):
I could get there.

Speaker 2 (34:48):
And Keaton I could kind of see, but I forgot
his example. He said something where they were like, hey,
you were in that, And I don't even know if
he named a film, but I'm like, I could, but
I we also do feel like Tom Hanks has been
around since the eighties, and I feel like, why would
you mistake him? You should probably know, but maybe when

(35:10):
you're just walking by, maybe you think it could be Keaton.
I mean, you know, they kind of got the same
kind of like thinning hair, and you know they're older
guys now, but I thought like they given too much grace.
I mean maybe, but I'm gonna tell you if I
if I saw either one of them, I would faint.

(35:32):
I wouldn't even be able to get to talk about
Tom Hanks with to Road to Pradition or Michael Keaton.
I wouldn't ask shit about him. I would just say,
when you look Jack Nicholson in his eyes? Yeah, how
did your cock feel?

Speaker 3 (35:47):
Okay? All right, well let's talk anyway. Yeahs the segue
Boogie Knights in nineteen ninety seven.

Speaker 2 (35:56):
You have you ever seen Boogie Knights?

Speaker 4 (35:58):
Bro you?

Speaker 2 (36:00):
Okay, so you did? So, I know you weren't able
to watch a couple, which is fine. We have a
great ranking thing we're gonna do later. We're gonna screen
bullshit no matter.

Speaker 5 (36:09):
What you were.

Speaker 3 (36:10):
But for those that need a refreshing yeah, I'm sorry,
goes ahead. Set in Los Angeles' San Fernando Valley focuses
Boogie Night's focuses on a young nightclub dishwasher who becomes
a popular store of popular star of pornographic films, chronicling
his rise in the golden age of porn of the
nineteen seventies through his fall during the excesses of the

(36:32):
nineteen eighties.

Speaker 2 (36:35):
I love this one.

Speaker 3 (36:36):
You could rope cattle with that thing.

Speaker 2 (36:38):
Not mine, but I could rope cattle with that. But
Dirk Diggler's dick. Yeah, it's all I love, just the
vibe and the energy. And this is Mark Wahlberg's best performance,
which he regrets doing. He regrets, he regrets doing. He
has said he regrets doing it, and a lot of

(36:59):
it is based off his religion and his beliefs. But
I watched a clip and watch What Happens Live with
Andy Cohen enjoying Moore, who's in Boogie Knights, who she's
great to flips some more. Hoffman is great, Don Cheetles great,
John c Riley's great for the Baker. I'm gonna get

(37:21):
to Burt Reynolds in just a minute.

Speaker 3 (37:22):
Oh yeah, there's some spice with this movie.

Speaker 2 (37:24):
Yeah. But there is a thing where they were like,
you know, hey, did you see where Mark Wahlberg said,
you know, he kind of regrets it and he wouldn't
do it today. Enjoy him. Moore was like, yeah, I
saw that, and I'm surprised because it kind of made
Mark Wahlberg into the star that he would be.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
He's real acting and yeah, and she was like, you.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
Should think God Boogie Knights does exist, and that's kind
of how that's kind of how I feel. He really
is great in this, and.

Speaker 3 (37:58):
I don't know what.

Speaker 2 (37:59):
I hate that he has kind of looks back on
it as a regret because well for some bullet's film
acting like I don't know. I mean when someone says
it's because of this and this and whether family or religion,
but I'm like, well, but I mean, you thought it
was good then, and he got a lot of praise
and it led to a lot of open doors. I

(38:22):
feel like that's unfair. And it's not like he did
port like, it's not like it's a trashy movie with
some director. I mean, it's a highly regarded film. I
actually think it is my second favorite after rewatching it.
I've seen it probably three times.

Speaker 3 (38:38):
Maybe it's it's one of like we talk about a
Mount Rushmore situation. I've got my four and you, depending
on the day you ask me, any one of the
four could be my favorite, and it's it's on there.

Speaker 2 (38:51):
But and we were talking about this, but what I
think is so funny is that there are regrets. So
Mark Wahlberg regrets doing it, regrets not doing it, and
apparently he's wanted to do something with PTA since then,
and he said one of his big regrets, obviously now
he's doing the rounds with one after another, is that

(39:13):
he he should have done it, and I think it
would have been a different movie. I don't I actually
wouldn't switch that. I think Mark Wahlberg is perfect for that.
I think he's in his prime. I think he's the
right age and he and his whole approach, the whole
thing is well done, and he's got again a great

(39:34):
supporting cast with him.

Speaker 3 (39:37):
Is it his best movie? Because you know he was
nominated for The Departed.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
I don't think he's the best and Departed, but I'd
like The Departed more than Boogie Knights. But if you
ask me Mark Wahlberg's best film, it's probably Boogeyne.

Speaker 3 (39:50):
That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (39:51):
Because I hate to say the real acting. But yes,
I have gone on record you saying that he indition
needs to retire. I mean, it doesn't matter what he's doing.
He does the same ship. Most of it's on Netflix
or it's streaming. Name me a movie that Mark Wahlberg
has been in that is it? Daddy Daddy's Home Too?
Was the last one in theaters.

Speaker 3 (40:11):
Maybe I did like Daddy's Home too.

Speaker 2 (40:13):
I like Daddy's HOMEO. But did you like it because
of Mark Wahlberg?

Speaker 3 (40:16):
As I know, because I liked it because of John Lithgow.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
I like John Lithgow and the very adorable, lovable Mel Gibson.

Speaker 3 (40:25):
Yeah, not devisive at all. Everybody loves him. And it's
a heartwarming Christmas tale.

Speaker 2 (40:31):
And being trapped in a movie theater on Sunday, hell
night or on a snowy day? Was it? Was it
Christmas Eve? I think the thermostat joke gets me every time,
and it's real. Yeah, it's a real thing as you
get older.

Speaker 3 (40:43):
But to your point, that movie is not good because
of Mark Wahlberg.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
Correct.

Speaker 3 (40:47):
I think you can say that about a lot of Yeah.

Speaker 2 (40:50):
Mark, I'm telling you the stuff he's done is not good.
He did a movie with Halle Berry no one watched.
He did one with Kevin Hart, no one watched. The
other Guys was maybe his last one. I liked Ted
Tattoo is fine.

Speaker 4 (41:01):
I guess what about four Brothers?

Speaker 2 (41:03):
I'd like? Yeah, now we're talking about Mark Forburk's cool.
But then Burt Reynolds, Oh, just so good. I didn't
know much about Burt Reynolds besides him being tough to
work with. He was cool at one point in Nasshu.

Speaker 3 (41:18):
He's really good in this movie.

Speaker 2 (41:20):
He's great in this movie. Yeah, I have seen I've
seen a few of his films. Deliverance is one that
he's great in, and I get he was the shit
at one time. I didn't grow up in that time period,
but obviously in the seventies and stuff. Smoking the bandit
is a classic with Sally Field. But even Sally Field,
who's an angel on Earth, will tell you Bert Burt

(41:44):
Reynolds ain't great, but he is fantastic. And this role
it's almost sort of like the way Tarantino can bring
back John Travolta. Yeah right, well us maybe to a
certain extent, and he's done it with other people. This
did it for Burt Reynolds, and he got an Oscar
nomination out yet And I don't know who beat him,

(42:05):
but I will tell you he is fantastic and the love,
the tough love he has to show dark Diggler and
he's the one that brings them in. But then he
also sees the business because there's always someone behind you
who wants to come up. There's always someone younger, better, bigger.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
Maybe, oh maybe, Okay.

Speaker 2 (42:28):
He fit right in. And I don't know if it's
because he is kind of Burt Reynolds is your sixties
and seventies. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
I think that's part of it.

Speaker 2 (42:37):
I don't know, but that is some of the best
casting in a PTA film.

Speaker 3 (42:43):
I think ever I would agree, but you know, he
said he would probably never work with Pta again after
that movie.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Bert did so checked.

Speaker 3 (42:52):
He couldn't didn't like that Pta was such a young
hot shot. He said something along the lines of like
we would film a scene and this guy would act
like it's the first time that scene had ever been
shot before. And Burt Reynolds was like, I can name
you five movies from the sixties that had that exact

(43:15):
same shot in it, so that they didn't really get
along that well.

Speaker 2 (43:19):
It sounds like an ego thing.

Speaker 3 (43:21):
It kind of does, right, Yeah, And I mean, yeah.

Speaker 2 (43:24):
This is PTA's second film.

Speaker 3 (43:25):
It's a second film film. But I'm also thinking, like, brother,
you got an Oscar nomination out of.

Speaker 2 (43:31):
This, Like when did that? Did it ever happen? Again?

Speaker 3 (43:34):
I don't know. I mean, it's it's nineteen ninety seven,
like he did not you brought your fastball in the film.
I'll give you credit for that. You're he is one
of the highlights of this movie. But yeah, at the
same time, it's like, and I don't know if maybe
it was just the interview happened quite a while ago
before PTA would go on to become PTA, so to speak.

(43:57):
But it's kind of like it didn't age well day Well, no,
it did.

Speaker 2 (44:01):
But also it's like, can you not accept that maybe
he does know what he's doing and he does know
the story he's telling and that he I think Burt
Reynolds is better for it because I get to tear you.
But that was probably the last relevant thing Burt Reynolds
did before.

Speaker 3 (44:21):
I mean, yeah, I don't have his uh filmography off
the top of my head, but I mean.

Speaker 2 (44:27):
I and also, how relevant was Burt Reynolds before Boogie
Knights is my I don't know other question. I don't
know something I hate to hear. I hate to hear
like Mark Wahlberg and Burt Reynolds. However, they both accepted it.
They both did a great job. PTA didn't fill them.
But yet they have their regrets. But I also think,

(44:50):
especially in Wahlburg's case, like how easy it must be
to say that now or back then, like years after
it had been done, because what I mean, what have you?
I don't know. I mean when it comes to accomplishments
and be intact on to say, hey, I worked with
Paul Thomas Anderson. I mean I feel like I would

(45:11):
any actor would wear it as a badge of honor.
And you see these people who have worked with him
multiple times, and people like Jat Keen who's done it
a couple of times, and now you've got Sean Pannabonicio
doing it, now, DiCaprio who's been basically wanting to do it.
He got fucking Daniel da Lewis for two movies. That
guy doesn't do anything for years. Yeah, So I mean,

(45:32):
I think they just got to give respect to him.
But I appreciate pta. And even if he did present
it in a way of like no one's ever done
this before. If I was Burt Reynds, I'd say, okay, cool.

Speaker 3 (45:43):
Yeah. Another film of his that has John c Riley
in it, who is fantastic in this film as well.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Philip Seymour Hoffman, who has a bigger role.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
Yeah, talking about PTA's ability to kind of get good
performances from unexpected situations. Can you name a better Heather
Graham movie than Boogie Knights?

Speaker 2 (46:05):
No, I mean Hangovers pretty fun.

Speaker 3 (46:07):
But yeah, I mean it's just spy who shagged me?
Is that? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (46:13):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (46:14):
Yeah, I always think of what's that? Fairly brothers say
say it isn't.

Speaker 3 (46:18):
So yeah, I think so say it isn't so yeah,
let's just say Boogie Night. I'm gonna say it's Boogie
Knights as well. Yeah, yeah, So that gets us to
nineteen ninety nine's Magnolia.

Speaker 2 (46:34):
Yes, and go ahead.

Speaker 3 (46:37):
I mean this just feels like a big one. I
don't know if you can write a synopsis for this
ensemble cast and epic mosaic of interrelated characters in search
of happiness, forgiveness and meaning in the San Fernando Valley.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
Also, sorry we didn't talk about Himoogie Knights, and he
does play a more kind of prominent role and Magnolia.
But William H. Macy, Yeah, he made me laugh about
his wife and Boogie Knights so so ridiculous. But his
character in Magnolia I thought was really fascinating and very unpredictable.

(47:18):
In the sense of like you don't you don't really
quite know where any of it's gonna go, and I
know it's kind of the point of it. But there's
also a lot of empathy in the film and forgiveness.
It's a I would say forgiveness is a huge theme.
It's not just with Tom Cruise and his father. Even

(47:39):
though this is again Tom Cruise is nominated for an
Oscar for this and I'm gonna tell you this is
still one of his best best performances ever. But we
make Macy, Philip Seymour Hoffmann.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
Philip Baker Hall, right, John Riley again.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
Philip Baker Halls. I loved him in this, yeah, but
rewatching it. I I forgot the arc in his I
forgot the telling of his story. And it's it's done
in a way that it's just sad. He can't even

(48:21):
really tell you what happened. But I think you and
I think it's obviously I think it's intentional, but I
think you know that something did happen. Yeah, it's doesn't
it doesn't really have to be spoken, but the way
that it all wraps up and even though like I

(48:42):
was telling Stony this earlier day, yesterday, not this watch,
but the watch before it. I totally forgot about the
Frogs and I remember when it first hit the windshow
to scar the shit out of him because I'm really
into these like relationships and the torment, regret and everything
that's going on. But then now watching it, it is

(49:08):
sort of like, in a way, like shit happens, guys,
and no matter what is going on, what brings you
to face this kind of whatever obstacle it is, And
you know a lot of it is relationships in some
form of fashion newfound relationships like John c Riley and

(49:31):
I forgot her name, but who plays the daughter for
the Baker Hall And I really like it. It ends
with her yes, and it ends with her smiling, which
I thought was a nice touch. But then with Tom
Cruise and father and William H. Macy who has a
crush on this guy and thinks Braces is gonna be
the way it's It is so intriguing, and even though

(49:52):
it is over three hours long, it it's so intricate
and delicate, but it's also it's just utterly fascinating to
me of how everybody sort of finds their way and
even when something unexplainable happens. It's it's right on point.

(50:14):
I feel like of what I think Pta was trying
to say, just in here's in these characters in this
one town.

Speaker 3 (50:22):
It's such an amazing story about coincidence and like the
cosmic sense of bringing people together. I know there's This
is one of those films that like people have written
essays about and explore, like the religious overtones to it.
They've talked about, you know, the themes of family, like

(50:45):
the father son relationship that you mentioned, Brandon, like the
generational trauma and how we're kind of set up to
navigate things that we don't necessarily understand we're even dealing with.
And that's sort of element of broken people searching for redemption.

(51:06):
And to your point where you said like sometimes shit
just happens. Yeah, there's a few characters in this film
where it's like they don't get redemption, and sometimes it's
like what does the person deserve right to not get redemption?
Really good performances too, I mean Tom Cruise just knocks

(51:28):
your socks off.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
It's so crazy to see him.

Speaker 3 (51:32):
Yeah do that.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
Yeah, And I think people forget and depending on how
old you are, maybe you only know him for the
action stuff, but you know, with that Born on the
fourth of July and and Magnolia and even like his
earlier stuff like the with Paul Newman and Cocktail and
yeah uh and so it's a nice reminder of what

(51:56):
he can do, which you know, I mean, he's he's
I think he's kind of trying to go back to
it because he's with Yurotu doing a movie and finish
it comes out next year and stuff, and so I
think he's trying to kind of get that back now
that I guess mission possible. Other stuff is wrapped up.
But he's so good, and he's so perfect as that
motivational speaker but also just that toxic masculinity and everything.

(52:20):
But then it starts with that interview about his mother
and his father, and then it's like, oh, there's always
something underneath that, like who like what made them? And
even with John c Riley where he kind of finds
what's her name again, what's her name in the movie Claudia, Claudia,

(52:43):
and like you know, and the way like their date
and he talks about losing the gun. There's just this
vulnerability that's that's just widespread throughout the film, and however
you want to cover it up, it's it. It shows.

Speaker 3 (52:56):
It shows through kind of a testament to the eye
idea of loneliness and a sea of people because you
you meet all these characters that are interacting with one another,
and yet they're all so flawed and so lonely and
searching for like deep connection. Again, like one of the

(53:20):
flares of PTA's filmmaking is that he's taking things that
probably shouldn't mean a certain thing, but attaching that meaning
to it. Yeah, like you probably like you shouldn't feel lonely,
but you do, and it's not. It's just so masterfully crafted.

(53:40):
Brett your thoughts on Magnilia.

Speaker 4 (53:42):
I just saw the movie for the first time last year.
Had you seen it Tony before?

Speaker 2 (53:47):
No?

Speaker 4 (53:48):
No, had the had the Frog ending been spoiled for you?

Speaker 3 (53:52):
I remembered seeing something about the Magnolia ending being stupid.
A lot of people have a groy with it.

Speaker 4 (54:00):
Okay, I had no idea when I saw it.

Speaker 3 (54:03):
I wasn't.

Speaker 4 (54:04):
So there were two things that I remember. I mean
this to me, this is the ultimate. You just get
on the treadmill with the characters, like when the movie
yeays and it's just like you just figure it out
as you go, and you figure out like how are
they connected? Like everything's kind of a mystery when you start.

Speaker 3 (54:20):
To that point. The first time I tried to watch this,
I was working and I thought, oh, i'll put this
on and i'll get my work done and it'll be
on in the background. I can keep up. And fifteen
minutes into the film, I'm like, i gotta pause this
because I've You've got to sit down and really, like
you said, get on the treadmill with the characters and
go with this thing. Yep.

Speaker 4 (54:40):
And I mean what you guys said. So many good actors,
all great performances. The two things that I remember when
they all start singing it jumps to this surreal moment
and the frogs that was like, I mean.

Speaker 5 (54:56):
The frogs really sealed it.

Speaker 4 (54:58):
But even the bit where they all start singing the song,
it's just it. I remember having this moment and I
was at the Bell Court, so I was in a
theater with a room full of people, and I just
remember feeling like I've never seen anything like this, and
you know, the connected storytelling. The first film that I

(55:18):
saw like that, which now I don't even know that
I would say that, I think is that good is
crash with these like interconnected lives. And then I saw this,
and since then I've gone back and seen Nashville by
Robert Altman and shortcuts Robert Altman, and it's that same
kind of storytelling Weapons that just came out. But it

(55:42):
really feels like this one because it was such a
tribute to those Robert Altman things like that. He really
kind of hones it in perfectly like that style of stories.

Speaker 2 (55:52):
And I like that it's split up by basically weather reports.
It's how he splits it up. Like Weapons, it goes
to characters.

Speaker 4 (56:00):
It a fun thing about weapons that I read you
and I might have talked about this. Weapons has a
police officer with a mustache that meets a woman that
gets him in trouble.

Speaker 3 (56:10):
The way the.

Speaker 5 (56:10):
Stories are and who is it Zach who's the director.

Speaker 4 (56:16):
Of Web And I mean he's very clearly said there's
some homage to Magnolia in this film.

Speaker 2 (56:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean and rightfully so. But the
way that everything connects and the way that it flows.
And again, Tom Cruise, I know, is I guess is
the big one, but I mean you're still he's more.

Speaker 3 (56:36):
In this movie, her scene where she like pushes back
and starts arguing with the over the the power of
attorney where she's trying to get removed.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 3 (56:49):
Was watching that just like stopped what I was doing,
just wide eyed on my television. Oh my god, this
is this is something I thought you were going to say.

Speaker 4 (56:58):
Don't you call me lady? Yeah, Pharmacy.

Speaker 2 (57:01):
So I don't mean to go back, but I was
blown away by the end of Boogie Knights when I
saw a young shirtless Alfred.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
Molina, alphad Molina's and Magnolia exactly.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
Yeah, I was thinking, like and and so he's using
a lot of people from Hard Eight to Boogie Knights
to Magnolia. It does start to change, I think after this,
but I really did. Magnolia is is great.

Speaker 3 (57:26):
It really I'm really stoked. I found that awesome DVD
at Dangerszone video for five bucks. Have I shown that
to you?

Speaker 2 (57:34):
No, it's in a beautiful case.

Speaker 3 (57:35):
Before we get out of here. Yeah, two thousand and two,
we go to Punch Drunk Love. I don't know that
people knew Adam Sandler had this in and with the
time that it came out.

Speaker 2 (57:44):
No, I think this is kind of the first time
where they get it and and then parts of me wonders.
And I'm sure there's there's been plenty of interviews that
say it, but where he kind of takes this comedy
guy right. It's sort of like I think when Jim
came he does Eternal Sunshine, where oh, we can apply
this and I can put him in this story and

(58:07):
it works really well because it's a very odd character
stuck in his kind of ways, and you know, and
I love the things with his sisters. There's a lot
I did not remember about this one, and I thought
it was I thought it was pretty delightful. It's not
as grand or as dramatic as Boogie Knights and Magha.

Speaker 3 (58:28):
Like Brett said earlier, it's a tight hour and a half.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Yes, it's I think it's the only other short movie
besides Hard eight that he's done. And but I enjoyed it.
It is weird, It is a little bit more off
kilter than the usual stick but again, great stuff. And
I love the confrontation with Hoffman at the and he's like,

(58:52):
all right, just turns and walks. I thought, I thought
that was that's a good one.

Speaker 3 (58:58):
Yeah, this film's reputation preceding it. I kind of thought
this was going to be like a sort of like
melodramatic dramedy kind of thing. I was kind of surprised
at how much I felt like, this is just a
weird guy this. Ye I forgot, weird story.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
Yeah, I forgot.

Speaker 3 (59:19):
How was it really what I thought it was gonna be?

Speaker 2 (59:21):
Yeah me, neither me. Neither I knew it was kind
of this a pta rom com, But I did forget
more of the details of the characters and kind of
how they met, the life he was living, what was
you know, what they were? You know.

Speaker 4 (59:37):
As as he's continued filmmaking, it feels like, and I've
heard this about one battle after another, that it's his
most successible film. And I'm thinking about Licorice Pizza that
that's a more accessible love story than Punch Trunk Love.
But Punch Shrunk Love feels like a very young p

(01:00:00):
a love story, Like just very weird characters and relational
dynamic and all of that, But there's also the sweetness
about it and yes, getting the most out of an
unexpected actor. Yes, all of those things we keep saying.

Speaker 2 (01:00:16):
Yeah, and it was Emily Watson. She's she's great in it,
But yeah, I did. I'm I did love like in
the like his phone conversations where he's mad and like
the manager, and like the ways being talked to like
you all, I mean, you certainly feel for the guy.
But there's also kind of that breaking point too, and

(01:00:37):
that's where that I think that scene with Hoffman really
it plays really well by it by the end because
of what he's kind of dealt with and and it's
sort of like he's really pushed some shit down and
now that he's been able, now that she's kind of
unlocked something in him, he's ready. He's he's kind of
ready to go. But I just love where he yells

(01:00:58):
at the end and he's like just like all right.

Speaker 4 (01:01:02):
Well, there's the unexpected turn of you expect, like you said, stony,
the oddness of his character to be something that pushes
her away. But the PTA part of it is she
kind of matches his freak, so to say, is impressed
that he would would.

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Not so strange in this in this world.

Speaker 3 (01:01:28):
How do you guys feel about this being the only
PTA in the Criterion collection.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
That's odd, It's very Yeah, I don't love it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:36):
I kind of hate it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
I'm kind of confused on why. I'm not at least
Boogie Knights wouldn't be in there, since that's his second
I'm I'm surprised, but I told you now, I still
haven't seen anything to back it up. But supposedly Licorice
Pizza criterion that makes me I'm still confused on why.

(01:02:00):
I just assume Boogie Knight's Magnolia and There Will Be
Blood would just be the thing. Now. I do think
he he's sort of like Wes Anderson and the like.
I think he does kind of work with it and
sign off on it. And maybe but that's so odd
that let's just say Lucris Pizza is the next one

(01:02:20):
of the nine films. I would not say by twenty
twenty six that those are the two that were chosen,
considering I would think the status of those other few
at least.

Speaker 4 (01:02:35):
Yeah, I'm not mad at Punch Trunk Love for being
in there. I mean, I think it fit in that collection.
At the same time, it feels like the same way
we've talked about Michael Sarah, seems like he was born
to be in a Wes Anderson movie. Yeah, There Will
Be Blood feels like it was born to be the
first ever Criterion film or something.

Speaker 2 (01:02:55):
That, or at least like, I know, Boogie Knights kind
of made like, yeah, I'm on the scene, so I'm
just I'm surprised. But then I wonder, so what was it?
Boogie Knights was what ninety six, ninety seven, ninety seven,
So twenty twenty seven could be a good year.

Speaker 3 (01:03:12):
Today, thirtieth anniversary, thirtieth anniversary. Yeah, all right, Well let's
go to two thousand and seven. Let's talk about there
will be blood.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
This is what's crazy to me is and and that's
I guess this is why I feel like Punch Drunk
Love is good, but it's we go from Magnolia to
Punch Drunk Love, then Punch Drunk Love is in the
middle of Magnolia, and there will be blood, and I

(01:03:42):
just don't know how I don't it's I mean, I
and I'm not knocking Punch Drunk Love, But it almost
feels like Paul Thomas Anderson wanted to do something smaller
and then he geared back up for what I think
is his masterpiece.

Speaker 4 (01:04:00):
Well, to me, on that point, before we get all
the way into that, to me, that's a credit to
him that he can change fears.

Speaker 2 (01:04:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, I do, because it's almost like
Hard eight got you there, Boogie Knights would go bigger.
I think Magnolia was a very ambitious, but it works,
so then we kind of scale it back a bit,
and we also introduced a new side of Adam Sandler.
So nothing. I don't think any film he's done is
wasted potential at all, even in her advice, which is

(01:04:30):
a bit nuts, but but shit, when you get to
there would be blood and now you've got one of
the greats. I am just I'm still blown away when
I watch that movie. The only thing I will say
is is that I totally understand because it's Daniel da Lewis.

(01:04:53):
But what you guys were talking about, like Paul Dano, man,
he is He's a force. He is such a force
in that movie. He just doesn't and and I I
I get it. It's like standing in the shadow of
an icon. But it's like I feel the same way

(01:05:14):
about him in Prisoners. Oh yeah, I just wish he could.
I mean, it's great anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:05:20):
To me.

Speaker 4 (01:05:20):
It's the opposite. This is not apples apples for sure,
but it's the opposite of the Godfather. Three with Sophia
Coppola and al Pacino that it's like you're just getting
blown out of the room. You can't act, and you're
with one of the best actors ever. And with Paul
Dano it's you know, at that time, he's young, it's

(01:05:42):
you know, he's relatively unknown, and it's kind of you know,
was this this was after a little the Sunshine? Maybe yes, okay, yeah, so,
I mean he's got some credibility, but still, like to Daniel.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
Daily, right, no, there, it's it's it's.

Speaker 4 (01:05:58):
And the way I mean they literally in those scenes
go toe to toe oh one another, and it's amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:06:05):
The I abandoned my boy, oh boy, and the shape. Yeah,
that's enough, that's enough. And that that's just two scenes
that that doesn't even begin to explain that dynamic.

Speaker 3 (01:06:18):
But I surprised he only got a BAF denomination. I know,
the best actor in a supporting role didn't win it.
But I mean, is is that just a case where
it's like we're all just watching Daniel dehileuis here.

Speaker 2 (01:06:36):
I mean, yes, I think so, And I think some
of it really is unfair because it's not like Paul
Dano is is like you said, I mean it's not
like he's kind of in the background. I mean he's
got he's got some real scenes.

Speaker 1 (01:06:51):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:06:51):
And he is the one person that, like Daniel plain View,
if he's met his match, it's it's with him. Yeah,
or at least one of the twins. But yeah, I
think so. I think so much was Garner just basically

(01:07:13):
around direction and the and the leading guy who was
in it almost in every scene.

Speaker 4 (01:07:22):
Yeah, it feels it feels like the narrative of the
reason that so many quarter good quarterbacks didn't make it
to Super Bowls or win super Bowls during Brady and
Peyton Manning, You're just not going to be better than
those guys, Philip Rivers.

Speaker 5 (01:07:38):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 4 (01:07:39):
He's great, but he's not going to be better than
Daniel Dale.

Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
But there is stuff that I do kind of find
well because I I and I think about like I
think about Gladiator and Russell Crowe was nominated, but so
is Walking Phoenix, and I think Paul Dano does more.
And listen, I I love Gladiator. Paul Dano does more.

(01:08:03):
I feel like that supporting actor that nomination should should
be there winning it. Okay, Yeah, because he steals such
a force, and he is standing across one of the

(01:08:23):
giants of acting. I mean, the man's won three Oscars.
No one else has done that except for Jack and
so In actually maybe a couple of others. But I
am surprised by I was surprised by that. But I
tell you what, boys, I I don't even have to
watch the whole film each time. I love this movie,

(01:08:48):
from almost the opening scene to the man he becomes,
to the regrets that fill him when he talks to
his son for the last time, and that milkshake scene
in the bowling is just it's phenomenal. I am just
I'm still so blown away. And I swear to you,

(01:09:08):
if this did not come out with No Country for
Old Men, it would have been the film.

Speaker 5 (01:09:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:09:14):
That may be a real shame that the two of those,
but I'll tell you what.

Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
God, that's what I was going to ask the The
best Actor in a supporting role Field that year won
by Javiy aer Barda for No Country, Casey Affleck for
the assassination of Jesse James by the coward Robert Ford,
Philip Seymour Hoffman for Charlie Wilson's War, how Holbrook for

(01:09:40):
into the Wild and Tom Wilkinson for Michael Clayton.

Speaker 5 (01:09:45):
That's a good list.

Speaker 2 (01:09:46):
That's a good list.

Speaker 5 (01:09:47):
But he could take one of those spots.

Speaker 2 (01:09:50):
Yeah, I think he could.

Speaker 4 (01:09:52):
I mean I would not say and I don't think
that you would say that he should have won it
over Hobby aer Barden. No, And again that's the shame
that they went.

Speaker 2 (01:10:02):
And again with No Country or Old Men, the first
thing you think of is Anton Sugar, So I mean
that's him. I would probably replace him, probably with Hell.

Speaker 4 (01:10:18):
You know, I was thinking about that, and I think
it's a career nomination, right, And it felt like his
character certainly wasn't as significant to the movie.

Speaker 2 (01:10:28):
No, No, I don't know. I don't think it was.
And honestly, and I really like Charlie Wilson's War, But
I could probably take Hoffman on that one. But Javier,
if he's stal with Vier, I mean, the right guy won.
But again another year, take out No Country for All
Men and put Paul Dano in there. He could have.

(01:10:50):
I think I would have given that to him.

Speaker 3 (01:10:53):
Isn't that? I mean, to Brett's point, that's just such
a such a shame that these two films came out.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Of the cycle, and I think there's a story something
where one of them was filming and I think they
saw the oil or explosion. Yeah, and I'm just like.

Speaker 4 (01:11:12):
On No Country, okay, was in the background though that
was oil fire.

Speaker 3 (01:11:17):
That would have been awesome if they left it in though.
Could you imagine that piece of film history.

Speaker 2 (01:11:21):
I love hearing Josh Brolin talk about his experience and
No Country for All Men from his Robert Rodriguez. He
was working on Planet Terror and Quentin Tarantino directed Josh
Brolan's rehearsal video that he sent in with to the Cohens.

Speaker 3 (01:11:40):
Damn.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
He said, it's the most expensive audition he's ever done
because Tarantino did it and he didn't even really know Tarantino.
But but yeah, I mean, but what a year to
have those two and they both I mean, No Country
for All Men's in Criterion.

Speaker 3 (01:11:58):
I got it too in mine collection.

Speaker 2 (01:12:02):
I was so pumped. There Will Be Blood is the
only one that I really need in four K, because
I well, two there are two films. First of all,
No Country for All Men check and The Departed check.

Speaker 3 (01:12:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:12:19):
I would really like There Will Be Blood and I
would like the Wrestler. I would like both of those, So.

Speaker 3 (01:12:25):
Get on it, people, I can't.

Speaker 2 (01:12:26):
Yeah, okay, don't yell at me.

Speaker 3 (01:12:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:12:30):
Let's go to twenty twelve for The Master. We've talked
about this film quite a bit already. It keeps popping up.
Just a heavyweight title fight between Wakuie and Phoenix and
Philip Seymour Hoffman. I mean, really watching two of the
all time greats.

Speaker 2 (01:12:44):
Go young, Jesse Plemmous.

Speaker 3 (01:12:46):
Jesse Plemmons in it. Your favorite Remy Mallick is in there.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Yeah, I actually forgotten he was in there.

Speaker 3 (01:12:52):
What do we think about twenty twelve as The Master?

Speaker 2 (01:12:55):
I think when he's saying we will rock you in
this was an indications had those bugget that's gonna be Yeah? Yeah,
even says what's up doc in one of it. I
liked it more this time. I appreciated it more. I understood.
I think a lot of stuff that I didn't really
I guess think about. There was more so I even

(01:13:18):
forgot he was coming like walking thing scares coming from war.
So a lot is based off of that and trying
to live a normal life and then someone comes in
who is charming and charismatic, and this is like to me,
and I think I think he's already won for Capodi.
I'm pretty sure he's already won an Oscar for Capodi.

Speaker 3 (01:13:38):
Well this this came out in twenty twelve.

Speaker 2 (01:13:41):
Yeah, I think Capodi was before that.

Speaker 3 (01:13:44):
I think two. I thought it was around two thousand
and eight as well, I could look it up.

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
I remember it was while we were in college because
I went to the theater in Murphysboro and there was
like five of us, and there was a woman and
her mother seeing it, and she they kind of been
talking through the previews and then when the movie started,
when they when the camera first goes into Capodi, I
heard this. I hear the old woman go is that Capodi?

(01:14:10):
And a guy and his girlfriend. He turns around and
snaps at her and tells her to shut up. And
I get it, but I also felt bad because I'm like,
this isn't like there's an older woman. And I was
sitting in the very bag. I just remember this a
very small theater. But she did like if if she

(01:14:32):
thought she was the only one in the theater.

Speaker 4 (01:14:35):
But I think I was gonna come to that. But
I was in the shower in our dorm.

Speaker 2 (01:14:40):
O taking a shut Yeah, that's right, thanks for bringing
that up. Uh two thousand and five, Okay, so god
we were Yeah, it was fresh in college. That's just
such a masterclass in acting. I mean, you're, like you said,
and it's like two heavyweights getting in there, man, and
they are every scene hitting left and right, and it's

(01:15:06):
so good and and I remember appreciating it just for
the acting, even when I wasn't too high on it.
And I think part of it is because I love
there will be blood, So I guess that that bar
was so high, you know, whatever story it is, and
I think that's part of it. But now looking back
and kind of understanding the story more and and the

(01:15:30):
characters and obviously getting older and seeing more stuff and
everything else. But I really liked it. I missed that
Amy Ryan. I wish that she would come back because
she's Amy Adams. That her too, Amy Adams. She deserves
an oscar for something. I guess night Bitch wasn't gonna
do it.

Speaker 3 (01:15:47):
But we thought that was going to be hot for
a minute. Yeah, we thought that was gonna could that
was going to be the one.

Speaker 2 (01:15:54):
But yeah, I mean it's it's it's still great. And
I I was telling stony this. I was reading some
stuff just sort of like, oh, you know it was
about and like one of the things is is the
song at the end is And I don't know how
you guys took it, but it certainly made sense to
me of like like we were talking about kind of

(01:16:15):
two guys kind of one wanting to sort of be
the other and some like having some with identity crisis
of who they are and what they want to bees.
But they said that the end with that song was his.
Was his? Was Hoffmann's character's way of saying basically that
he loved him. Yeah, but his wife and you know,

(01:16:39):
she already knew he was doing stuff she just didn't
want to know, but that it was basically him kind
of admitting that he doesn't like it, but this is
where he is. This is where he's going to stay.
She's not going to allow him to run off. And
but walking Phoenix, you know, I mean, he represents that rebel.
He didn't care what people thought. He lived, there was

(01:17:01):
no standard for him, and then you think about what
war does to you as well. I don't know, it
was much layered than I then, much more layered than
I than I gave it credit for and so I
I am. I enjoyed. I enjoyed it more this time.
And when they first meet, it's a great scene, it is.
And when they and when he does his kind of

(01:17:23):
you know, in a previous life thing with him and
asking those questions and stuff and where he doesn't blink,
and it's great. It's it's just great stuff. And again
it makes me miss makes.

Speaker 3 (01:17:37):
That's that's the feeling I took away watching this for
the first.

Speaker 2 (01:17:40):
Time, not that the other films didn't with him in it,
but this one especially, And this would be this would
be his last PTA film, right, I don't think he
does another one.

Speaker 3 (01:17:51):
Would have been Inherent Vice in twenty fourteen.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
Yeah, so this would be his last one, which I
mean listened. It was a It was a hell of
a thing because I want to say he was nominated,
what King was nominated, maby Adams nominated. It was a
big one. But one thing that I was telling Stony
is is that I had read that a lot of
this could was based I think Paul Thomas Anderson got

(01:18:14):
inspiration at least from Hubbard about scientology and that, and
out of respect he screened it for Tom Cruise before
it just out of respect and that Tom Cruise was
livid and that and Paul Thomas anders said, and I
don't know if Tom Cruise has said or not, but

(01:18:37):
that he's like we had it out now. They've never
shared details, and they said they would never share a pub.
But the scene that Paul Thomas Anderson said that Tom
Cruise got up and was super pissed is when Jesse
Pleman says, you know, he's just making all this up,
because apparently there was a report that Hubbard's kids said
that that he actually said his dad was just making

(01:18:59):
most of the show it up. And anyway, apparently Tom
Cruise took huge offense to it. And it makes me
even like it more. And it's not so much of
like getting Tom Cruise right up anything, but that first
of all, Paul Thomas Anderson is such a good dude
that he showed Tom Cruise a movie that he knew
was probably going to ruffle his feathers. And you know,
Tom Cruise in twenty two. I mean, Tom Cruise is

(01:19:22):
Tom Cruise. But the fact that like one first of all,
and they I think there might be fine now, but
I it just makes me respect him even more that
he is these are the stories he will tell. And
back then in twenty twelve, I think that was sort
of the big deal with saying you know, but I
love that that was the scene because you know what's

(01:19:44):
it's a powerful scene in the movie because he is
that's almost the first real honest thing you hear. But
even then, Joaquin's Phoenix character doesn't take too kindly to
that because it does kind of shake what he wants
to believe, even though he doesn't really ever believe it himself,

(01:20:07):
you know, but it's almost like it's just a false
prophecy kind of kind of deal. But I've found it
a lot. I've found it a lot more intriguing and
and pretty great this time around.

Speaker 4 (01:20:21):
Actually, I think something that stood out to me certainly
the acting. I think that's the lasting thing for me.
Oh yeah, what you guys have said about the acting.
But kind of in what you're going into there, you know,
there's kind of this like both of the characters are
pursuing the same goal in a different way, Like they're

(01:20:43):
looking for meaning, looking for purpose, one from this position
of power, one from a position of no power. And
an interesting like link to me is you see that
same thing and there will be blood. They're both pursuing
power in very different ways, one through wealth and you know,
the business side of it, one through religion. And that's

(01:21:05):
just an interesting connection in both of those man to
have I mean, those four, but really Joaquin Philip Seymour Hoffman,
Daniel day Lewis in back to back films, like who's
better than those guys in that era of acting?

Speaker 2 (01:21:22):
Like yeah, I mean, that's that's that's the thing. And
like I mean every I mean, is there not a
I know, not Hard eight, but I'm pretty sure in
every well, maybe not Punch Drunk, but but like most
of his movies get acting nominations at least, if not

(01:21:42):
wins like You had. I don't think I know Adam Sadler.
The whole thing is, he's never gotten Oscar nomination for acting.
But but everybody else, I mean, Burt Reynolds and in
least Tom Cruise and then obviously there will be blood.
And now we've got where the Master got three. Yeah,
So I mean, and as we go on we know that,

(01:22:06):
you know, people still get hominations, so I yeah, the
acting is just so incredible. But it all still stems
from his writing and his in his directing, and there's
a you know, Johnny Greenwood does a lot of the scoring,
and it's like he he has his kind of like

(01:22:28):
usual suspects, but it's always the stories he tells and
the people that are game to bring them to life.
Is I don't know, it's so it's mind blowing at times.
But yeah, I mean you go from that and like,
to me, just the way that it's done, I just
feel like The Master just feels so criterion to.

Speaker 3 (01:22:50):
Me, it does.

Speaker 2 (01:22:52):
I feel like I'm shocked that that's not the first one.

Speaker 3 (01:22:56):
Yeah, well, let's uh, let's move ahead to two thousand
and four. PTA would team up with Joaquin Phoenix yet
again for Inherent Vice, another ensemble that features Josh Brolin.
We get a pretty pretty fun Owen Wilson performance out
of this. Out of this film, there's some Eric Roberts, Reese, Witherspoon,

(01:23:17):
Benizio del Toro, Maya, Rudolph Martin short shows up.

Speaker 2 (01:23:22):
Oh I liked him. I totally forgot he was in it.

Speaker 3 (01:23:24):
I think this is kind of It's one of those
movies I think if you just kind of vibe with it,
you can have fun. I called it tenant. I think
it's tenant. Yeah, nobody knows what's happening, nobody knows where
this is going. But if you just kind of let
go and don't pay attention to the rules, I think
you can have some fun with it.

Speaker 2 (01:23:44):
This. Yeah, this is my least favorite. I it's very
much a vibe as you were talking about. There's an
energy to it. And to my understanding, like for instance,
like there would be Blood is like loosely based on
the novel oil but from my understanding that this is

(01:24:04):
a pretty straight up like first time Paul Thomas Anderson
has adapted the book and film, so parts of me
thinks maybe that's part of the problem is that I
think he's probably the source material. He's probably very true
to the problem is that I'm just not vibing with it.

(01:24:25):
But it's so much of a just of the atmosphere
and of the time. But I do still really enjoy
walking Phoenix and Josh Brolin's performances. And I just saw
heard a thing where Reese Witherspoon was at least in
the running or was going to play Amy Adams part

(01:24:45):
in the Master and so anyway, she didn't get that,
so she was going to be in his next one,
which ended up being this one, which I'll be honest,
I think another thing is to me and even though
there are a lot of people in it, some are
more forgettable than others, and that's not usually the case,

(01:25:05):
but it's I think it's just because of the of
the pace and kind of the story it's trying to
tell that it's almost like just it's almost just seems
random interactions and then you kind of come back to it.
But I don't know if there's ever any real substance
to any of it, or if any like I think
we were talking about, if any of it's even real,
or if you should even care.

Speaker 3 (01:25:27):
Yeah, you know what I mean? Yeah, I uh. This
is based off of Thomas Pincheon novel, who was kind
of notorious, if you will, for writing complicated stories like
that was part of part of his hallmark, part of
who this guy was, just the stories that you had
to really like lock in to keep up with. I

(01:25:50):
don't know if that's part of the reason he was
so selective, but he had never let anybody adapt one
of his books prior to PTA noting at his door,
and I guess it's just you know, you finally get
a filmmaker of that caliber that says, hey, I'm gonna
be honest to the book and true to the source material.

(01:26:11):
It does kind of make me wonder if you know
there is some sort of self awareness, like, hey, these books,
these stories, you think about things from the author's perspective,
writing things that you know, this probably isn't going to
translate that well to the big screen. If this was

(01:26:32):
just a big swing because you had a filmmaker like
Pta involved in it, that you kind of think like, well,
if there's somebody that's going to get this right, it's
gonna be him. And I'm still not saying that Pta
got it wrong, but I do think that I think
if you watch this film, I think it's asking a

(01:26:54):
lot of audiences to keep up with again, just the
interconnectedness of the care and and just kind of blurring
the lines between what's actually happening and what is some
sort of drug induced fever dream.

Speaker 2 (01:27:09):
Yeah, did you see this one?

Speaker 5 (01:27:13):
This was the other one I didn't see.

Speaker 3 (01:27:14):
I think that's what makes the film suffer a little bit,
is that you kind of I think you have to
be kind of on your game. It's not one that
you can just turn on and.

Speaker 2 (01:27:26):
Sit back, and I this is one of the ones
I watched early because I sort of just wanted to
get it over with because I just really it just
I mean, when I think of his films, it's just
that it's it's not the one I really care for.
And so but my rating kind of stayed the same.
I think this is the lowest one. It's three and

(01:27:49):
even that's not awful. I mean it's still better than half.
But and it is the performance stuff, because again, there
is still something that you are still in the presence
of greatness, even though he's sort of it's not quite
his full like his own work. And I and parts

(01:28:13):
of me just thinks maybe that's why I just did not.
I just wasn't as engaged in it as as as
the others. And again, I really kind of think everything
is sort of compared to like there will be blood
at this point, and that's not I don't I mean,
he has.

Speaker 3 (01:28:33):
A reputation thing to do. He has a reputation at
this point.

Speaker 2 (01:28:37):
That yeah, yeah, this is.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
A very different effort from his previous Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:28:40):
Absolutely, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:28:42):
So let's move right along. Then, let's get to we
have the three hour mark yet, We're an hour and
a half.

Speaker 2 (01:28:48):
Okay, a PTA podcast.

Speaker 3 (01:28:51):
Trying to land the plane here. Twenty seventeen's Phantom Thread
Reunited with Daniel day Lewis.

Speaker 2 (01:28:59):
This is a supposedly was going to be his last film, but.

Speaker 3 (01:29:02):
Yeah, he's a character that is just completely magnetizing that
I just kept wanting more of.

Speaker 4 (01:29:14):
Yeah, for sure, I agree. I mean I start, you know,
like a lot of his films, you start and you
just jump in with this character and you're trying to
figure out, kind of what are we doing here, what's
the big point of this? But I remember thinking early
like I'd literally watch Daniel day Lewis watch paint.

Speaker 3 (01:29:34):
Dry on the wall, and that's that's how I felt.

Speaker 4 (01:29:37):
And I mean, you know, relatively, you know, slow moving
at points and that kind of thing, but very deliberate
and intentional in that. Still, I agree, the character is
completely compelling and the story like so, I mean, Punch
Hrunk Love is kind of the parallel in my mind

(01:29:59):
for this of younger version of PTA older version. Again,
two characters that match each other's freak. Yes, and this
just kind of very kind of off kilter way of
telling this peer kind of like period story couture fashion.

Speaker 3 (01:30:16):
Yeah, it's a little a little different than back and
drop the setting for punch drunk clubs.

Speaker 4 (01:30:21):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, a little bit well, and it's also taking.

Speaker 2 (01:30:25):
It's also taking like okay, there will be blood, you know,
as I say, kind of sets the standard. So what
character who already a legendary picky person that Daniel de
Lewis is, and he does this, which is I mean,
everything is different. This is one that I liked a

(01:30:53):
little better this time around. I I do think it's slow,
and there are parts that I just don't think were
as effective by the time. But with like in that
middle part before we get to kind of the root
of everything and and sort of like the man he
is and the woman that he needs, but also she

(01:31:15):
kind of sees the power in that vulnerability of being sick.
But I tell you what, Vicky crapes, it's fantastic.

Speaker 3 (01:31:23):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:31:24):
And Leslie Manvil, who was his partner, it.

Speaker 3 (01:31:29):
Was nominated for Best Supporting Actress as well. I think
people automatically remember Daniel da Lewis getting the Best Actor nomination.
I think Vicky crapes, No, she did not, but Leslie
Manvil got the Best supporting actress.

Speaker 2 (01:31:41):
She's in a great movie called Miss Harris Goes to
Paris and she's pretty cool and what is it? Never
let Go the Diane Lane Kevin Costner where she takes
their son. Oh man, Yeah, it's pretty good. She's a
pretty good villain. But I think a lot of that again,
soccer performances are It is really the I think the

(01:32:05):
most kind of powerful. That's the real strength of the
of the film. But the production design, the costumes, I mean,
they really go into this period and the way that
he works.

Speaker 3 (01:32:19):
Is the only Oscar they won was for Best Costume Design.

Speaker 2 (01:32:23):
I could see. I would say, I do remember Daniel
d Lewis, who doesn't lose that much at the Oscars,
did lose that year?

Speaker 5 (01:32:29):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:32:29):
Who did he? He lost to that was his last
He lost to Gary Oldman for Darkest an Arcus.

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
So so yeah, I actually found it more. I would
say this in The Master sort of grew on me
after after these watches, and I I liked his I
liked what it had to say, even though it's a
very twisted pta rom com is sort of yeah, but

(01:33:00):
the love that is needed for someone like that and
the way he kind of meets his match in the
same way as I never really thought about this way,
but with Punch Drunk Love, it makes sense.

Speaker 3 (01:33:10):
I like that on the surface, it looks like a
boring period drama, and then I think by the time
you get to the end of the film, you realize
this is some This is some steamy freak shit, if
you will.

Speaker 2 (01:33:24):
Yeah, I think that's how it explains it.

Speaker 4 (01:33:26):
Like a lot of pta films, it just gets more
and more unhinged as it goes, and I love that, Like, yeah,
that's what draws me into the way he tells stories.

Speaker 2 (01:33:36):
It's not quite ariaster unhinged, but no, no.

Speaker 5 (01:33:39):
It's different versions.

Speaker 2 (01:33:41):
Yeah, yeah, but yeah, yeah, I agree.

Speaker 3 (01:33:44):
Well that does get us to twenty twenty one.

Speaker 2 (01:33:48):
Yeah, your favorite.

Speaker 3 (01:33:50):
Yeah, I just I you know, I watched it. When
I first watched it, I'm like, I feel uncomfortable here.
I do think the age difference is kind of weird.
I think it. I don't know how to say this nicely.
She looks so much older than he does, and I
think that.

Speaker 2 (01:34:07):
Just he's a fresh face, he's a fresh faced kid.

Speaker 3 (01:34:10):
I don't know. I don't know how many redeemable characters
there really are in this movie, and I just it
gets on my Like the whole movie just gets under
my skin. I just I'm so annoyed watching it. When
I rewatched it for this podcast, I was like, yeah, no,
I'm I'm going with my gut on this. I hate
all these people.

Speaker 2 (01:34:31):
First of all, I will tell you Bradley Cooper's worth
the watch.

Speaker 3 (01:34:36):
Bradley Cooper is I love insane.

Speaker 2 (01:34:38):
The moment he introduces himself and he plays a real person. Yeah,
who is with barbar Streis in a theod time Then
right when you think maybe you've seen the last of him,
you have not. It kills me. I will say Cooper Hoffman.
First of all, I mean to have like we said,
philips Seymore's kid, but I liked him in this and yeah,

(01:35:02):
he's very charming. He's a guy that is not I
mean in not to sound rude, but like you know,
he's not the most handsome jock guy of the but
but he knows his strengths and he knows what works,
and he is a smooth operator in his own in
his own field. And that time period seems so kind

(01:35:25):
of wild but also kind of innocent, like nobody's really
you know, and so and I'll be honest, I don't
I remember the age thing being a big deal then,
but even rewatching it, I'm I don't know. It's almost like,
I guess, to me is like a freshman liking a senior,
So I it didn't really bother me that much. What
I liked is this was such kind of like a

(01:35:48):
different kind of pta where it's almost like we're kind
of just rediscovering a time in life where look at
what you could do or or get away with, but
also you're meant to be, but you're not meant to be,
and you don't know what love is even though maybe
you have, you've brushed you know, shoulders with it, and

(01:36:11):
that's what kind of leads to like these different girls
and then like her going for an older, much older
guy with Sean Penn. But I've just felt like this
was kind of like this runaway romance, and I actually
thought it was pretty sweet. I thought it was pretty charming.
I do like how it gets a little crazy. I

(01:36:32):
like the Bradley Cooper cameo sort of speaking there, and
then I like I still find the ending to be
that cut, like it just reminds you of these old
romantic films where they're looking for each other, they've kind
of realized this. They're running towards each other, and then
they're running away. You don't know if it's a happy
ending or not. It may not work out, but that's

(01:36:53):
it's young love, and it ends with her saying I
love you, and I still dig it now. I will
say I if I was going to lower one, I
could probably lower that maybe from a four to three
and a half. But I still overall like the way
that it's done, and like I said, and just sort

(01:37:13):
of this whimsical like it really is just about these
two finding each other, going off and finding each other again.
I don't think this relationship is meant to last, but
I think everybody kind of can relate to something where
you just you met this person and even though there's
things of like where you messed up or anything, they're

(01:37:34):
always sort of weirdly there for each other. Just like
with Sean Penn and the motorcycle thing, he's there like
it's I still liked it. It's not my favorite, but
I wasn't bothered by some of the stuff. I certainly
didn't want them all to die. I did, Yeah, I.

Speaker 3 (01:37:54):
Know, I did.

Speaker 4 (01:37:55):
I think this is the one I was most pleasantly
surprised by. I had heard a lot about the age difference,
and that being this was your first time. Honestly, the
only time that really struck me as weird is when
they called it out. I think part of it is you.
You were mentioning he has such charisma and kind of

(01:38:16):
confidence that you feel like he shouldn't.

Speaker 2 (01:38:19):
Feel he's like an adult, that's right.

Speaker 5 (01:38:23):
Older. Yeah, he plays older.

Speaker 4 (01:38:25):
And so that's the reason that I think it didn't
seem so odd to me. I was talking to a
buddy who was saying, why couldn't they have made him
eighteen and her, you know, thirty or whatever, and it
would have been the same story, and you would have
got past some of those obstacles. Knowing pta he probably
was fine to have that tension there a little bit

(01:38:46):
of you know, does this kind of make people uncomfortable
a little bit?

Speaker 2 (01:38:50):
But I also in parts of it feels like during
this time period, I mean, I mean to me and
I know it's not the same, but it's kind of
like the doorky kid in the sandlot, like in the Lifeguard,
like they should be out of the league, out of
his league, but they're not, because there's something about them

(01:39:12):
where he does play it up as in like he
is sort of more grown up than everyone else because
when he opens up that beanbag thing, he's got kids doing,
but he seems like he's the boss and he's kind
of got this persona where I felt like it was
more believable and I didn't really necessarily kind of put

(01:39:34):
that like, you know, this was underage and this was weird,
and just like it doesn't come off as to me,
it doesn't come off like that now. I kind of
thought her being a Sean Penn was kind of weird,
but not not so much as age, just as like,
oh like, but I think it was also again for
the story, she was looking for someone like that who

(01:39:55):
supposedly had their shit together, which is still something that
you know.

Speaker 4 (01:40:00):
And I do think there's a sweetness of like they never,
if I'm remembering correctly, throughout the movie, they never crossed
that line physically where you would really be like, Okay,
this is getting weird, Like there's an innocence to it
and a sweetness Yeah yeah, and shout out to Benny Safty.

Speaker 3 (01:40:21):
Yeah Safty shows up.

Speaker 2 (01:40:22):
Yeah, it's kind of.

Speaker 5 (01:40:24):
This and happy gil Moore too.

Speaker 2 (01:40:25):
Yeah, well good for him. Hey he's an Oppenheimer.

Speaker 5 (01:40:28):
That's he's great.

Speaker 3 (01:40:29):
What a filmography that's all.

Speaker 2 (01:40:32):
You need, That's all you need. But yeah, that I
I still liked it. I get. I will say that
I've seen people say, like, there's not really a story.
I mean there's not. It's sort of I mean, the
story is them. It's not really significant in what happens
in between. It's just more of, like I said, just
kind of young love and kind of being reconnected. But

(01:40:55):
but yeah, now, I mean again, here we are. We're
gonna go into uh, one battle after another, which is
going to be it's gonna be huge one way or another.

Speaker 3 (01:41:08):
How do you guys, uh, how do you guys rink them?
Your top fours at.

Speaker 2 (01:41:12):
The end of this, Well, listen, I can. I can
do the whole.

Speaker 4 (01:41:15):
Damn I'm gonna I'm gonna focus since I haven't seen
all of them. I won't I won't give a ranking,
but I'll focus on my top two. There will be
Blood and Magnolia. It's just it's not they're not apples
to apples films. Yeah, I mean, I would say there
will be blood, but Magnolia is such a unique movie,

(01:41:36):
and Magnolia is certainly a top ten of all time
movie for me, whereas There Will Be Blood is top
two or three. Oh yeah, so though, I mean just
the as we've talked about his ability to shift gears.
I mean those stories you think about, like the characters
in those stories could not be further apart and the

(01:41:58):
way the stories are told, but they're both done so well.

Speaker 2 (01:42:03):
I got it. This is one of those cases where like, yes,
I can rank them, but the difference in what makes yeah,
three or four whatever is slim, I would I will say,
And again the lowest rating is Inherent Vice, and that
was three, so that would be nine. I have Punch
Drunk Love at eight, I think because I was so

(01:42:26):
impressed if it being his feature film. I have Hard
eight at seven. I have Licorice Pizza at six. I
have this was sort of a toss up, but given
the reasons that as we've talked about it, I have
Phantom Thread is five and The Master at four. Okay,
and then my top three three would be Magnolia, two
would be Boogie Knights, and one would be There will

(01:42:47):
be Blood.

Speaker 3 (01:42:48):
I think I go one, Magnolia two, There will be Blood.
Three Phantom Thread, and then four it's ah, it's probably
Boogie Nights. But I like The Master a lot too.

Speaker 2 (01:43:06):
What's your least one? Is it in her advice to or? Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:43:09):
Yeah, sorry, I did mean to ask if you didn't
like the movie. I know you don't like the characters,
but you also didn't love the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:43:17):
It's partly that, like, you get to the end of
it and I'm just kind of you just kind of like,
what is the story here?

Speaker 5 (01:43:23):
If you hate all the parts? It's hard to.

Speaker 2 (01:43:26):
Say if you want everyone to die, I'm not sure.

Speaker 3 (01:43:29):
It's like, you know, I can appreciate this film looks
pretty and it's uh, it's pretty well written, and like
you like, there is kind of a you do catch
a certain feeling watching Cooper Hoffman, knowing the work that
yeah Pta and his father did together. Yeah, so like
there was something to it. I just when you watch

(01:43:52):
something that has a profound effect on you, like there
will be Blood and Phantom Thread and then Master, which
I watched him in that order right before I rewatched
Liquorice Pizza, you just I'm just kind of like, man,
this ain't it.

Speaker 2 (01:44:09):
I was gonna say, is it? Also it's almost a
double edged sword to go back and watch them back
to back to back, because then you kind of start
to say, oh, like, you know, you get four years
before another PTA movie, you're like, oh, okay, I kind
of see. But then when you kind of stack them
up and watch them within a month or so, and

(01:44:31):
you're like, oh, there are some differences. But the one
thing that's to me is Constant is just pta is.
I mean, he's a master at work. I mean, I
don't know how else to put no matter what, no
matter if I enjoyed from Inherent Vice or you're like
Liquor's Pizza, or to like these top ones Magnolia, that

(01:44:51):
would be blood Buggie Knights is a master at work,
which I will be very disappointed if one battle after
another least doesn't live up to something I don't I don't.
I'm not saying it it would be my favorite, but
it sure does have all all signs pointed that this
is going to be something something great and his most accessible.

(01:45:16):
But you know, we were talking about who was it?
What film was it? Where basically there's no one really
too like any redeeming people in it.

Speaker 4 (01:45:30):
You were saying that about Liquors Pizzazza.

Speaker 2 (01:45:34):
What's funny is we were talking about those earlier. We're
talking about the he this was the first time PTA
agreed to kind of have these test screenings. Yeah, and
one of the things was is that no one in
one ballot or another people had come out and saying
that you know that they like apparently Benisio and Champagne

(01:45:55):
rated the highest, uh, and that DiCaprio was great. But
I also kind of feel like we just take him
for granted now because it's just assumed that sure he's
got but that that they've found it hard to root
for anybody in the film. But to me, I hear that,
and I think, okay, like he writes complicated people, they're

(01:46:18):
not good or bad. I believe like Sean Penn, who
plays Captain Lockjaw, which I love that name, he I
think he is the villain of sorts. But you know,
I'm assuming since talking after nine films and what ninety six,

(01:46:38):
so I mean thirty years in the game. Yeah, there's
always more to these characters and so how did they
get there? Where does it come from? So I'm excited.
I'm gonna I'm planning on seeing it in Imax.

Speaker 3 (01:46:54):
Do you want to ask your question before we get
on out of here. Who hasn't worked with PTA that
you would like to see?

Speaker 2 (01:46:59):
Yeah? I was thinking about that the other day because
I think there's a lot of times where we kind
of say, oh, you know what, who would be in
like Tarantino's last movie, or we've done the Wes Anderson
one and where we talk about and like Michael Sarah,
it's like, oh shit, he should and it's fun to
see Tom Hanks and those. But with PTA movies, who
would you like? Who would you guys like to see?

(01:47:20):
I know we shared a sum.

Speaker 3 (01:47:21):
But I had the first name that oddly came to
mind for me was Paul Rudd.

Speaker 2 (01:47:26):
Yeah, I said, and actually Stoney said it too. It
reminded me. But I thought Javey or Bardell would be
a good one speaking with No Country for All Men?
And then Tilda Sminton I feel like she would be great.
I also threw out there as far as like more
like I guess movie stars, I think you find the

(01:47:46):
right one, whether supporting or not. I feel like Ryan
Gosling could really do something. George Clooney, I feel like
you put him. I think about Michael Clayton but I
think about like Alexander Payne in this Indents, I feel like,
give him something like that Nicole Kidman. That's one that

(01:48:06):
I felt like she could she could really do something with,
depending on what the story again, Maine or supporting it
doesn't really I don't think it matters.

Speaker 3 (01:48:16):
Talking some young up and comers. What about Mikey Madison.

Speaker 2 (01:48:19):
Hm hmm, I like that.

Speaker 4 (01:48:24):
Who's the guy that's I'm I'm thinking of Cooper Hoffman.
Who's the guy that's getting so much praise. That was
also in the new Alien movie that's in the law.

Speaker 2 (01:48:34):
His last name is Johnson because he was Michael Johnson.

Speaker 3 (01:48:37):
Is that right, Magic Michael B. Johnson.

Speaker 5 (01:48:41):
I think it's that.

Speaker 2 (01:48:42):
David David David Johnson, that's right. And he was in
Alien Romulus, which a lot of people liked him.

Speaker 4 (01:48:49):
But yeah, I'm kind of cheating here because this is
doubling up. I would love to see Tom Cruise do
something else with him, just because, yeah, he got it
out of him before. Yeah, and I really want, I
really want like old Tom Cruise to get back to acting.

Speaker 2 (01:49:06):
He might he might be on his way. I'd like
to see this in your wrow To movie because I
think this is a great start because that's a yeah
with Revenant and Birdman. I mean, yep, yeah, I don't know.
I also told you I feel like things really cold
off with him lately. But I'd like to see Christoph Waltz.

Speaker 3 (01:49:26):
Maybe get him back in the game. Yeah, back in
the game.

Speaker 2 (01:49:29):
I feel like besides Tarantino movies, I think he was
just a villain and shittier movies like Tarzan and Green Hornet.
So I'd like to see him.

Speaker 3 (01:49:43):
Is that is this where we want to end the ptag?

Speaker 2 (01:49:46):
I don't care. I mean, I hate to end it
on Christoph Watts because I do there's a Hoavier bardim
in No Country for old Men, and there's Christoph Wats
and glorious Bastards that will stand the test of time
and Django.

Speaker 5 (01:50:00):
He's great in both.

Speaker 2 (01:50:01):
Yeah, that's on'y one both.

Speaker 4 (01:50:03):
I mean, and you talk about, you know, getting the
best talent for PTA, like he's one of those guys that.

Speaker 2 (01:50:09):
Well and it makes me wonder, like we're talking about
where I mean, Sean Penn has done everything. I mean,
he doesn't really have to do anything. Uh, And the
fact that he was in Liquor s Beat's in a
small role. So I'm kind of like, oh, this seems
like the a juicier role for him. I also do
love Benicio. I mean anytime he can get in there.

(01:50:32):
But if Sean Penn wins, this would be his third
Oscar as well, he would join the very few wow
to do it. Yeah, And and I I might be wrong,
but I don't even think. I don't know if he's
ever been nominated for Best Supporting Actor. He's only one
and been nominated, I think, and Best Actor.

Speaker 3 (01:50:54):
I would have to effort that. I would have to
effort that.

Speaker 2 (01:50:56):
But he won for Misteric River and he won from Milk.

Speaker 4 (01:50:59):
Something that I'm I'm excited about. This is an aside
of an aside maybe, but I feel like Leonardo DiCaprio
is entering this I'm gonna be I'm gonna take roles
that have a lot of humor in them. Yeah, I'm
thinking about Once upon a Time in Hollywood, Like he's
really funny in.

Speaker 2 (01:51:15):
That Wolf of Wall Street.

Speaker 4 (01:51:17):
It feels like he's gonna be really funny in this one.
Like some of the things that I've said, they've shown. Yeah,
So I'm excited about numb Chucks Man.

Speaker 2 (01:51:24):
Yeah, are they they or thing? I just want to
be polite.

Speaker 3 (01:51:28):
Sean Penn has never been nominated for Best Supporting Actor.

Speaker 2 (01:51:31):
Yeah, I didn't think so, because I'm.

Speaker 3 (01:51:32):
I have Best Actor nominations Milk, Mystic River, dead Man
Walking in ninety six, Sweet and Low Down in two
thousand and I Am Sam in two thousand two. Oh
and I Am Sam Almost thought it was twenty one grams.

Speaker 2 (01:51:47):
But yeah, so if he does, I mean, I if
he's as good as people say he is in this,
then I mean, so be it. I love I I'm excited.
I wish we could have gotten the seventy millimeter in imax.
That would have been fantastic in that Vista vision. But

(01:52:07):
the tickets a year in advance, a year in events,
or I would pay forty dollars and I would get
to watch it next year, a year after everyone else
saw it. Either way either way, but I'm excited. This
is his tenth film, And anyway, thanks guys for watching them,
or most of them, because I know it's a it's

(01:52:28):
a lot, but I'm glad I did it. I have
a new filnd appreciation for him because he really is.
He's really kind of in that elite status of like
it's I think for some maybe not like a Scorsese
or Spielberger Tarantinoe, but when a PTA film comes out
that people recognize it and is excited rather you're mainstream

(01:52:52):
or not. But I hope it makes money. I would
like for it to also be a box office success.
But it appears to be an Oscar front runner, which
I mean take that for what it's worth, but I
mean anytime PTA enters the game, it's it's everyone's on
high alert.

Speaker 3 (01:53:10):
There you go. Well that is going to do for
us here tonight, for Brandon, for Brett, I'm stony. Subscribe
to all of our work at Nashvillemoviedispatch dot substack dot com,
and until next time, you stay classy moviegoers,