September 27, 2024 • 42 mins
This week, it's PART II of my conversation with Lena Cebula, wife and mother of 3 who escaped a life of hell in the former Soviet Union as a human trafficking survivor and was trapped in world of drug addiction, where she eventually found faith and healing. In PART TWO, we discuss her arrival in Canada, still under control of her captors, and how is able to break free with the kindness of a stranger
Sensitive topics are discussed, listener discretion is advised More about Lena can be found here:
http://www.lenacebula.com
Sensitive topics are discussed, listener discretion is advised More about Lena can be found here:
http://www.lenacebula.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Nobodies are somebodies.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
All right, everybody, it's meat chadvice. Welcome to Nobody's or
Somebody's podcast. This is my conversation with Lena Sabula and
this is part two. Hopefully you've heard my part one
interview conversation with her about her amazing story coming to
Canada after being a victim and survivor of human trafficking
as a teenager and a young adult. Very heavy conversation,
(00:27):
very heavy story, but ultimately with a happy ending. We
talked to her again in this one and we get
the conversation picking up when she is about to or
has just arrived in Canada. Unfortunately at that time still
part of the human trafficking circle being sold and transferred
to Canada. But once she got here, she details how
she kind of was able to escape that life, escape
(00:50):
those dangerous people that she was being controlled by, and
how she was able to overcome that and find a
new life and make a new life here in Canada.
Very good positive outcome to the story, but quite a
lot of twist and turns to get there. This is
a good conversation with her. My only regret about that
is this was recorded in the summertime, of this year
(01:12):
of twenty twenty four, and in order to achieve the
best sound, which I love to do for you guys
here on the podcast and so the guests and you
deserve it who listen to the show. I deserve only
the best quality sound that I can possibly make. I
turned off the air conditioning and of course to the
loud sounds, and closed all the outside noise outside windows
in my apartment to try and manage what kind of
(01:34):
outdoor exterior noises might occur to avoid that, however, not
a smart idea. And maybe ninety degree weather, you know,
to ninety five degree weather outside, It was getting pretty
hot in the apartment. And my apologies to Lena. I
don't think she realized this at the time. We were
on video chat as well too, But I was sweating.
(01:58):
I was sweating perfewly. I thought I was going to
pass out. At one point. I was having a hard
time trying to maintain focus. It was like way hot.
I guess in retrospect, I could have, you know, we
weren't live. I could have just said, hey, could you
hang on a second, I need to open a window
or have a drink of water. I did think I
took a drink of water. Actually, I think, thinking back
on this, because it was a few months ago that
(02:19):
I recorded this, I think I did go get some
water at least to try to mitigate that, but it
wasn't helping. I should have opened a window or you know,
done something else. I should have said, Hey, I need
to open a window in here. It's getting hot in here.
The backdrop of a serious conversation had me almost passing out,
but not for the reasons you might think. But I'm
glad we got through it. And again this if Lena,
(02:42):
if you're listening to this conversation, you're probably hearing about
this for the first time. So hopefully I didn't ruin
our conversation, and hopefully I did focus on it as
much as I was able to possibly do. I think
I did, okay. But the main thing is getting her
story out there and heard, and hopeful this is a
vehicle to do that. So once again, my thank you
(03:03):
and big time appreciation to Lena for being a part
of the Nobody's or Somebody's podcast, coming on here and
bearing all, telling all. And she has that book out there.
You can check out her website as well too, which
she details where to buy it and where to check
it out to get the full concept, the full story.
But this is a good offering portion of the of
her story. We get down to the part two of
(03:27):
this here with Lena on the Nobody's or Somebody's podcast
with me Chad advice, check out new episodes when they
drop wherever you get your podcasts on all the major
podcast platforms, and don't forget to check out Nobody's There
Somebody's podcast on Facebook. Lina Sabulah also on Facebook as
well too, and yeah to support what she does, support
what I do, and support more guests coming here on
(03:47):
the Nobody's or Somebody's podcasts. Let's get to my conversation
right now with Lena here. Hey, how are you. It's
good to talk to you again. Lena and I want
to kind of pick off where we left off last time.
Those who didn't listen or listening now, they need to
go back and listen to the part one that we did.
That we run out of time.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
That's like any good times. That's why we decided to
do the part.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
To turn around for you. Yeah, you're about to come
to Canada.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Absolutely just a little bit summarized real fast. The part
one for those who are just gonna end up listening
this podcast and this exact episode. So I was born
and raised in Ukraine and my parents was alcoholic. I
become alcoholic, drug gotic, I lost my firstborn child, and
(04:37):
I was trafficked to two different countries and that's how
I ended up in Canada. Alcoholic drug godic, tons of troma,
PTSD and all that stuff. So if you wanted details,
listen to the part one that you do long to
do if I've been into one. Yeah, but yes, that's
(04:58):
why we love. And this is part where my life
is changed because my traffickers actually allowed me to go
to school and to learn English so I could communicate,
and they actually start the process for me, which was
(05:19):
another just miracle because I was in Israel. You're gonna
guys another part that they forced us under the bard
wire to crouse the border, so I was there illegally.
That's what they hold over me as well, that they
sent me to police and all that stuff. But here
(05:41):
they started the process because they didn't want me to
be deported because I cost them tons of money. And yes,
and that was the blessing in disguise for me because
I was actually going to school with a newcomer, and
that's what they were talking about, how this country has opportunities,
(06:06):
how the police and government will stand up for you,
and honestly from the place and discord that I came
for from, like it was foreign for me, but this
time I was kind of like to start exploring opportunities
and thinking like I probably have opportunity to start my
(06:28):
life with the clean slade, and I run away and
I live and shelter. And I learned English from level zero,
and it was really hard for me because honestly, back home,
my Russian was high. The Hebrew was easy to learn
because it's very similar the structure as Russian. I just
(06:51):
learned a bunch of words and I actually was able
to clearly communicate. But for English, it took me probably
three years until I'm start thinking in English and I
start making sense. At the beginning, it was like WHOA nonsense?
Speaker 2 (07:08):
But I can imagine why. Let me ask you why
Canada versus the US or somewhere else. Why do they trends?
Why did you come to Canada? Why do you think
they sent you there? Here?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I don't know, that's where the was the route and
that's that's how it's ened up. But it's literally in
that time, I literally didn't care where they're gonna take
me because I knew that I'm gonna be dead a
million times over, so I would go like anywhere. So
I didn't really ask the fact that they brought me here.
It was just miracle. I do believe, so yes, and
(07:43):
there I actually by default, I have to quit drugs again,
and I became clean. And there was a moment that
I am, this is so funny. I met this gentleman
who was helping me like with the taxes and get
in like bloods older gentlemen, and he's he's Chinese. It's
(08:05):
so funny how God just put the people together. And
I just read that. You know, when the family note around,
there's always going to be God always going to send
you a stranger to actually help you out. Is your path?
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Yeah it is. I believe in that too, Yeah absolutely, So.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Yeah, he like just starts saying like this Nonesen, like,
oh I see, like no, first, like he said, save
all your money and pay taxes. Make sure you save
all the receipts. And I'm like, what toxes? What are
you talking about? But he was like first person who
was talking to me about the daily life. I had
(08:47):
no idea what the heck daily life look like? What
the normal people do? What is this nine to five? Like,
what is that like? How people behave, how they dress,
how they communicate, like it was like totally foreign to me.
So when he was telling me those stuff, like, I
(09:07):
got really offended because I thought he's judging me for
the way like I behave the speak and all this stuff.
And he's like, well, when you apply for the job,
you cannot speak like this or like you have to
do this. And it was such a weird like relationship
because when I quit drugs and I left everything, like
(09:28):
I know, like I didn't know anyone except on this dude. Yeah,
So I called him like for help, and he and actually,
this is so funny because I was thinking like maybe
like he can help me like to get the apartments
something like, you know, because he always like talking about
this life and all that stuff. And he said, nope,
(09:52):
but I can help you to create the plan for
your life. And I'm like okay, and he goes, I
know how heart is to be a newcomer because he
came like a few years on prior and he built
his life, and he said, I want to help you.
And it was so weird for me because up to
(10:13):
this point I never saw anyone, especially men, who want
to help me without.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Like anything like, yeah, you're cautious about you're paranoid obviously
for a good reason. Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
I like always feel like what is going to be?
So now like you old me, you.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
Know exactly what do you want from this? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Exactly. It was like, it's very interesting how it took
me so long to realize that He's like it's okay,
Like I give you tokens, I give you this, I
buy lunch, and it's okay. I know how hard is
to be newcomer. It was quity strange. But he asked
(10:57):
me what would you like to do for even what
is your dream? Because you have to earn the money somehow,
And literally I was like over twenty five years old
around that I never thought about dreaming. Are you kidding me? Like?
What is that? Future? Never been so guaranteed that I
could make pants? And it's so bizarre that now I
(11:20):
have my children and they steal my daughter in high
school and we've been planning all the future since they were.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, something that you never really have, but you
could give your daughter, which is great. But yeah, something
you're not you're not you're not familiar with, Yeah, because
you never had that. There was like day to day,
can I make it through this day?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
That was it exactly. And you know what's interesting though,
sometimes people don't even understand that and or taken for
granted the fact that you have a freedom to choose,
You have a freedom to be, to have this worth
and in this world, to even like the work, you know,
(12:03):
the my envy that somebody have, like you know, plants
and ideas and aspirations to work.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, those words are foreign concepts to you. Let me
ask you, then, how did you so you've met this
this gentleman who's helped you out, which is finally the
first sounds like positive person that's come into your life
that doesn't want anything to gain, or at least does
seem that way. But how did you get away from
the people that transferred you or sold you to Canada? Like,
how did you get away from them to kind of
(12:34):
get to talk to run? You just run with nowhere
to go? Where did you end up in Canada?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
Which say was in women's shelter?
Speaker 2 (12:42):
In which city has been in Toronto or in Toronto Toronto, Okay,
and you just ran to the shelter and they obviously
took you in there, and they.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Know what's so bizarre about that? Sort of to interrupt
you about the shelter.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
It's good.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I ended up there because I had no family, no money,
no literally no documents too, because it was like with
the like in the court system like whatever, Like I
had nothing. And there were like kids my age. Well
now I'm saying kids because I'm like.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
You're so young, like we were here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, there were people my age that they willingly went
to the shelter and say like, oh, you know what,
I'm going against my parents because they want me to
go to college. Screw them. And I was like, what.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
This is your choice, Like you want to be here
and versus being safe at home with a family that
loves you. Yeah, I know, it's it's hard concept. That's
how spoiled we are. Yeah, that's how spoiled people are here.
They can just do it, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Like I was hanging out with them like a couple
months like or whatever, Like I was there. I don't
remember because I was like on and off until like
I was figuring this out. But during the day you
cannot be there. You can sleep there, but then they
kick you out through the day. They give you like
a couple like bus stalking something you know, and you out,
(14:08):
so like whole day and one one. So there was
like girls and boys that were like separate in one place,
and in one place there was just a women. But
you have to come in a specific time, make sure
you have a bed, you know, like if you don't
show up, it's not and you have no where to sleep.
(14:29):
But I still was like blown away that I'm gonna
have a bed. There's sheets, you know. They sometimes they
give you something to eat to close. I'm like, what
like back home, if you have nothing nowhere to sleep,
you sleep in like in the like doorways.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah. Yeah, you really have no shelter, nothing to cover you. Yeah, exactly,
no building, It's just you there. Yeah, I hear you.
Did they try to do they try to look Did
they try to look for you? Do you know they
try to find you when you're scared, anyone come close
to finding you.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Literally, I was so scared, and I've been scared probably
like for the next ten years, to the point that
like every time I had my court hearing, you know,
like they go through the process like of this immigration
and like I go and every time the judge say,
you'll need to postpone this for more information because they
(15:25):
did investigations and all this stuff. I literally like would
go to the bathroom and throw up how scared I
was that they're gonna send me back or like if
somebody find out because they like through the lawyer or whatever,
they somebody will find out. That I'm scared because so
much I knew that because they tell us all the time,
(15:50):
if you run away or something happened, I'm gonna find you.
I'm gonna kill you. I'm gonna kill all your family.
I skin you life. That that's how they hold you,
like you know, it isn't your slave, you know. So
that it was like the fear and paranora was like
so bad. And even when God called me to share
(16:12):
my story three years ago, I had huge like that,
you know, overwhelmed of fear, thinking like now I'm gonna
say this and now I'm gonna be public. Now my
face is going to be public. You know. Now I
have children, I have to be Like I had so
much fear, but I know God called me to share
(16:35):
my story, and I know that he will protect me,
and I have to trust and you know what it's
been like over twenty years. And I'm safe and I
know that they replaced me probably like next couple of days.
So I'm not as that volleyball of course, like they
lost money on me, but for them, it just lost.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
And there's unfortunately, there's more people that they'll get and
they'll take your place, and that's really unfortunate.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And that's really gonna stay.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Yeah, well, yeah, who's gonna be? Yeah, some people do.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
I was there almost two years. I didn't run. I
had nowhere to run, there was nothing, So they're find
another girl who's gonna stay.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
I never thought about that too, when you put your
story out there, that your face is out there, your
your real name is out there. I mean it's they
could find they could see it. I'm sure someone's seeing something,
but that's too kind of obviously get to you. Now you're safe,
and that's great, but I never thought about the fear
of doing that. You're putting yourself out there.
Speaker 1 (17:35):
Yeah, I trust God because he gave me a job
to to share my story, to share my story of
salvation to tell people how much God loves us and
where I come from and that before and after. So
back to the story that my friend, he actually helped
(17:57):
me to find the government credits. Cool because I said
to him that I actually liked doing here and I
was doing here. I don't know, did I tell you
this story that my mother would Yeah, okay, so this
is so bizarre. Would be probably hearing for you. And
if you guys have little kids around you, please make
(18:19):
sure you understand this is not for kids podcasts, you know,
and yeah, and and take take that, you know, what
is that worth?
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Like use discretion, Yeah, use use discretion and maybe put
the kids the bad. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
So when I was a kid, and because it was
discord and dirt like in my house and and it
was infested with mold, cockroaches and we had lies all
the time. So when we were little, my mother just
shaved my head and she literally shaved my head probably
up to a great one. Can you imagine like shave
(18:57):
like six year old like they already have personalities and
the like identities and then like you're bold all the time.
This is so bizarre and yeah, and it was traumatizing
and this process of shaving your head, like it's traumatizing.
So later on, like I start fighting like against shaving
(19:21):
my head. So then she started putting like the gasoline
on my head, so it would burn like the scalp
and the but it would kill the lives and I
could keep the hair. But you go to school, you're
still like stinky, disgusting, you know, and everybody knows that
(19:41):
that's one of the methods to remove the lies, so
they know that you have lies. So it's so terrible.
And then I was shaving my brother hair, but he
didn't care because most of the guys like they're shaving
their hair and it's actually it's my fia thing, so
you look like my fia.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
For duty, it's cool, but for women it's like it's
it's like was security blanket for me too, you know,
like I'm a girl and what was happening? Though, when
I got little bit older, I find out that the
bugs dye from the what is that here at Chopper
(20:25):
drug mart or pharmacy but whatever, it's colder up, okay,
So that dye would would kill the lies as well.
So sometimes I would end up green or blue or
yellow overever color. But I know that I could kill
(20:45):
kill the lies. I'm gonna look funny, but still nobody
would know that.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
I'm keep your hair your hair, and you'll have just
look like you're trying different things.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Yeah, exactly, but they're gonna think that I just color
my hair and it justn't that funny, rather than I
have lies, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Yeah, So that's why.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
That's why I was experimenting with my hair and then
like it was ruined and I have to cut it
to curl it forever. So honestly, I said to him,
I actually really like to do like my own hair.
You know, it's maybe that's what I'm gonna do because
it's actually.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Some came from that something that encourage you, Like, you
know what, I really enjoy doing different stuff with my
with hair and other people's hair that could be fun.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah, because it brought me confidence and brought me like
something you know, I don't know. I just loved it
and change. I think it's brought me change. Sometimes when
we have problems in our lives and we are not
in control and we don't know what we're gonna do,
Usually like I would use drugs and booze and this time,
(21:51):
I just like I was doing the changes like to myself,
and it's actually brought me some kind of like form
of relief, know that I don't know, maybe hole possible exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Just give me one second when I grab some water.
One second, just one second, guy, I.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Have mine.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
Or I was getting dry there, I was like, oh,
I don't want to start coughing or something.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
That's why I said I have mine.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Yeah, exactly. I should have been a little bit more prepared.
I'm here.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
So yeah, yeah, no money nothing.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
No money, no, no no idea how to make that
opportunity happen. Right, So you told him that you wanted
to do hair, that you liked hair, and you were
you had an interest in that.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, and he literally like he was like, honestly, he's
like a dog on a bone. He doesn't have he
doesn't have like word like no like if he he
put his mind to something like you know, it's crazy.
And now like all these years later, he beat cancer
(23:02):
already like a few times and they put him in
pallilative care three times. And now I call him today,
he's planning visit to Italy. He's like, I have a
dream I'm going to Italy. Okay, dude, So.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Anyway, you're still in contact with him too. I was
going to ask you that as well. Yeah, he's still
a part of your life. He's still there. That's amazing.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
In my life. He helped me to get into school,
my first job. I he interviewed my husband when we
just met, and he's like, are you really you can
find someone rich.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Take care of you? Why do you find set you
up properly? Yeah? Yeah, And I influence in your life.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
And he's alone too. I'm like, don't you want a
girlfriend a wife? He's like, no, no, I need I
need to like set you like so he's literally yeah,
I was like, was the best parent that I never
had here on this earth, you know. And he gave
me away from my wedding. My children think that this
(24:07):
is his like his Chinese but he's our uncle Tom.
So everybody think that, like he never show up without
the gift for my kids, you know. And it's so
interesting though, oh at that time, Yeah, like he's he's
like just become that that hope that always believed in me,
(24:29):
no matter of how like I was like obnoxious, like
I was rude, I didn't speak English, so I the
words that I didn't know. I put f worth in it,
so it makes sense to me that it's a sentence,
you know, because like when you have gaps, you have
to figure out how it works. But he's like he's
swearing a lot anyway. So then he found me this school.
(24:54):
But I've been like in the country for like something
like three or four months. My English like so terr ball.
And we went there submit the application and the woman said, like,
you know, you're a level English, like you're not gonna
make it for that exam. So it was somewhere like April,
so I came like come in the winter. This was
(25:17):
like sprint and the next ball that would be exams
to get into the school. But it's interesting, like from
hundreds of applications they would take on literary people. So
she said to me, you're not gonna make it because
of the English. And I said to her, listen, sign
(25:41):
me up if I fail, at least like I know
I failed, and we'll move on and actually can help
me to find another job at Canada Wonderland. Terrible job.
I hated it, but like anything that I did afterwards,
I hated it because it's the hard labor for a
(26:02):
small amount of money, and there was like so much abuse,
like you know, they didn't allow us to take breaks
to eat and all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
So it's like, really it's terrible.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Like honestly, any job I have here it was really hard.
So yeah, it sucks for newcomers, like no matter like
what job, like you did, you.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Think they can take advantage of you. I think because
you're coming to the country that oh you don't You
don't have any life before. So if you want to
stay here, you'll do anything we ask you.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
And you don't know law. You don't know that you
have to get paid for stuff. You don't know that
they have to give you those breaks. You don't know anything.
You just like they say you wanted this job, you
do this hours and hours. But whatever. The fact is
that it was like outside of the city and it
took me like one and a half hour to get
(26:53):
there and one and a half hour to get back. Wow,
my friend home. He actually sent me up with the
library card and he said go and get them kids books.
So I started reading the kids' books and then he
got me like this little dictionary like Oxford Dictionary. Yes,
(27:13):
at long before cell phones and Google and all that stuff.
That's interesting that I was reading the kids' books to
learn English. So in three months I went to write
the test and from the one hundred people though, it
was chosen and I was one of these people. So
(27:33):
the year that I spent in that school because I
need to learn more English and math to get certified,
to finish the high school and get and get my diploma.
So I literally I finished that cosmetology course with super
high marks around like nineties or ninety six. And I
(27:55):
was actually one of the three people around three people
from home my class who actually went to be hairstylist.
And I was hairstylist for sixteen years and two of
those years actually opened my own business and own my
own salon. But now the interesting part, like that's why
you have to have a trade, no matter like what
(28:17):
you're doing. Like if like life fall apart and you
don't know where to go, you need to go learn
new trade or go get the trade, like honestly figure
out because it's so much of our work and value
tied up like in what we do. But honestly, there's
another missing link that happened because it's not only trade
(28:40):
that helped me to stay off the streets of the
drugs because you need a purpose and anchor that would
hold you, like off the drugs and the and the
drink and whatever. And the money too, like the money
to like when you used to like have like thousands
(29:03):
and thousands of dollars and then like you're poor and
have no food. It's it's hard. It's like mentally really hard.
Although I have nothing to show off because like everything
went on drugs. So anyway, the interesting part that when
I was doing co op for my like her Scharlin,
(29:25):
I met my husband. Well that time, I just met
a boy and then I fall in love with him.
And I didn't think it's gonna be like anything serious.
I thought, like it's gonna be just like link or
whatever it's.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Called and romance.
Speaker 1 (29:45):
Yeah, yeah, I didn't even think about romance, like what romance. Like.
I came from the place that the guys are chitter s, liars,
they violin, they stupid, crazy.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
So negative negative, negative images of that's totally understandable, totally understandable.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
So so it was so weird that this was like
the second person in my life that I actually I
was so blown away the way he treated me. He
actually saw like I don't know a lady. He was
opening the doors for me. He was like treating me
like with respect, and.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
That's respect you exactly, something you never experienced. Yeah, it's
a huge thing. It's like you don't expect it. Then
you don't know how to react to it either. I
can imagine you don't know how to treat it.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
I was weird for me. But you know what's so interesting,
So my friend Tom just like he taught me all
these manners as well. You know, he's like totally people
like every time laughing day they say he's like your
father and say, no, he's my grandma. Because he taught
me how to hold the laundry, how to call the
(31:00):
fork and knife. And it was so funny because my
husband invited me to this fancy restaurant something on our
tour day or whatever, and I was cutting like I
don't know, steak or fish forever I don't remember, but
I was actually cutting with fork and knife and my
husband was so impressed and he gave me so many compliments,
(31:22):
like on disgracing poise, and I was like he he,
I just learned these three days ago. Because my friend
go and he literally like put the napkin on my
plate and say, okay, that's how you do it. And
he make me teach you all.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
The basics, like every other thing that you just didn't
get from your parents who just didn't take that time
with you. Just there's so much opportunities in life. Yeah,
that's so cool.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Yeah, So my husband was so impressed. So we got
another date and and yes, and I feel like there
was like no other just him. And then I ended
up that he actually a pastor's son. So I ended
up in the church listening all these ceremons about how
(32:11):
wonderful God is and how much he loves the sayers,
the people who are screwing up, that he give his
life for us. And I was like, okay, I'll show
up because you know, I need his parents to like me. Yeah,
but yeah, it was hard for them. First of all,
we were dating, like and they're like all about marriage. Second,
(32:35):
while I was working in salon, I have like this
different color hair, My tongue was pears. I have like
this makeup because I love like the makeup.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Trying different things, trying different looks forgot to experiment with.
Yeah that makes three times.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
And I had tattoos and smoke.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
See all the all the habits we take people take
for granted that they get to do. They are allowed
there the choice as theirs to do that. You just
finally get to experience and you're going all out, dude, like.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I'm kidding, I kid you not. They family like they
mom and so like it's five kids, like my husband
have like five all together, five siblings, but like his mom,
soft spoken, kind his sisters like they eating like little bird,
they sweet, they like and I'm and.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
I'm like, b he's just like yeah, loud in your
face like.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Like and they they together, like they go to church together.
They don't start stuff together. I'm literally like, was so
like out of out of place? You know?
Speaker 2 (33:55):
But did you feel welcome that they feel like? Did
they make you feel welcome, like, come and join us,
come and be a part of this, be a part
of our family. Love did they did you feel that way?
Or did you feel like you were trying to fit
in and not really well?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
This is the interesting part. In the beginning, they got
really freaked out. His mom wasn't like living in uh,
they were pastoring in us, so she meant me like
kind of over the phone. But his sister really got
freaked out. She's like, he's not coming home. She's like
(34:25):
all over the place, it's gonna be disaster, Like she's
like and stuff like that, because like it's it's scary,
but it's funny enough because my husband says, like, I
just don't want a church girl. It's like, I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Praise opposite attract. Yeah, he didn't know how I don't
want another person. I'm sure they tried to fix him
up with people who were in the church or people
who are around that community, right, So I'm sure he
probably rebelled in that way about that because he's just like, Wow,
I want to I want to be with someone I like,
I have a connection to, not someone who sat up with.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
He thinks his rebel is I'm like, oh my goodness,
Like you honestly likes.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
That where he was boy. Yeah he's still a good boy.
He just had to find his own his real love
connection exactly.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Well, you know what he did, rebel, He did like
his own bunch of stuff, trying to figure out his identity.
But like he's like, he doesn't know what bad is.
You know, he thinks he's bad, but he was bad
anyway for him, it was better.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
In that context. He was bad, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
And and it's so interesting that he was like, I'm
trying to rebel, but in doubt. He brought me into
his family and he stood by me, and we got pregnant,
and uh, I was I was so scared to tell
them that we are pregnant, because we are we were
living that time as a common law and they didn't
(35:54):
like that either, because they're like.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Oh, I get married. Yeah America, America nobody married.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
So like, I don't even know what their problem was,
because that's what they come on love.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
If you're already living with someone, you're sharing a habitat,
you're sharing finances, you're coming home and person, but that's
you're basically married. You're paying taxes, talking about your.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
Day of having your baby, like that's it. But one
time I'm like, oh, he was talking to someone and
I said to him, like that's so weird, Like I'm like,
why are you not calling me your wife? You like,
if you don't know how to call me, call me Lena.
Because he's like was struggling.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
Because I was there or my partner or was.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
Yeah, something like that and else and he's like, well,
you're not my wife, and it's like broke my heart.
I'm like, what do you mean We've been living for
four years to have a child. He's like, well, we're
not married, and I'm like okay. And then when I
was showing up just for his family, and by that
(36:59):
time like that was that was a beautiful things. You know.
In the beginning they got so friaked out. But when
I got pregnant, his mom said to me, she called me.
We talk for an hour and she says, you know,
my dog got distracted me. He said. She said, you know,
(37:21):
that's not how we do things. But God love you
and he has planned for you. And they accepted me.
The baby was born, they loved me, they loved on
the baby. So I love being part of the family.
His father was amazing too. He goes like, oh, his
father was pastor. When they he got sick. So they
(37:41):
finished with that church in US and they came to
Canada and he goes to me. He calls me and
he's like, oh, I'm coming for borsch. I'm like, I
don't have any borsch. But I was staying home mom
with my daughter. I see you, So I go I
go to him, I have no He's like, no, becoming
(38:01):
for a borsch. I'm like, okay, I sent to my daughter.
I guess were cooking bores. So he loved my cooking and.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Heart is cooking. Is your cooking.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
They literally would come and eating. So so they accepted
me of course, like my hair changed, my tongue, ring
gun and all this stuff. And that was my anchor,
that family, my child, my husband, well he married me, yes,
so that's becoming anchor. I decide, like, I never gonna
(38:35):
lie to him. And I decide I'm never gonna use
drugs because I have to be the mother, you know,
fully sober for the present. So for them, I didn't
give them.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Ye give give your kids the mom that you didn't have.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
And I was so scared.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
You know, you had no one to Yeah, you had
no one to kind of look as a mom roll
well maybe his mom, but for the most for you,
you didn't have a mom that you would ever think
of as a role model. You want to model your
own parenthood out of right, So.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I try to model model his mom. It's very hard,
and I thought like it was unattainable because I was
trying to be like her. But I couldn't be like her.
I was like loud and so much feelings and emotion
and all over the place. So I tried to copy her.
And it makes me really depressed for a very long
(39:29):
time that I thought like, first of all, like I
was tormented by my mind because I heard this like
you know, imposteral syndrome. So I heard these thoughts, who
do you think you are to be a wife and
a mother and have a healthy child and relationship? Who do.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
You deserve it to you? Why you should like? This
is how you This is not how you grew up.
This is you don't belong here. I can imagine those
self doubts of creep and it's very traumatizing.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
And especially seeing his mom all cleaning to together. They
are singing hymns like they like, and I thought like,
oh my gosh, this is like it's so bizarre that
like I cannot sweep the floor, Oh I don't know
how to wash the dishes, like it's it was weird,
but it's honestly. When my mother in law actually give
(40:22):
us a gift, she said, go to the church, just
watch a movie, hang out with Christian people. I got
a babysity daughter, and that's where I went to Alpha course,
and it's actually sharing the God in a judgmental atmosphere
and like you can ask questions why I'm here? Who
(40:43):
is God? Yeah, on the tour day date, I actually
give my life to Christ and I felt like this
love and forgiveness just filled my body. So I stopped
copying anyone and just try to figure out what kind
of mom I can be, Like who am I? And
(41:04):
what can I do? And just like instead of judging
myself all the time, I just start having gratitude for
my life, you know, for being alive. And I'm start
saying like, yeah, I don't deserve this healthy child, but
God give me this gift. So what to do?
Speaker 2 (41:23):
So just live in that moment and just accept what
He's giving you.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Exactly and be grateful. And then I realized maybe like no,
not maybe like none of us don't deserve anything, but
still good things come and we have to be grateful
because guess what, the bad things come, we're beating ourselves
up and up. So like when the good things except
the goody wouldn't like acknowledge and celebrate.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
Yeah, we're gonna run out of time again. Unfortunately, the
zoom is counting down and so it goes so quickly.
I know we have such good conversation, but at least
we ended kind of on a positive thing before it
cuts off. You have a book out there, you have
people can connect with your story and connect with you.
Where should people do that? Just mention that website again
as well.
Speaker 1 (42:04):
Too, Absolutely so. The website it's Lena Sibula l E
n A C b LA dot ca. And you can
listen to my podcast. There's different recordings with awesome as
some guests as well, but you can learn what I'm
doing today and today I'm wife and the mother of
(42:26):
tributable children, and I'm a life coach, and I'm a
Christian woman and I've been wife over twenty years.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
I've been congratulations, you've been listening to the Nobody's or
Somebody's podcast with me Chadvice And this podcast has been
voted the number one podcast by people that don't vote
Nobodies are somebodies.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
All right, everybody, it's meat chadvice. Welcome to Nobody's or
Somebody's podcast. This is my conversation with Lena Sabula and
this is part two. Hopefully you've heard my part one
interview conversation with her about her amazing story coming to
Canada after being a victim and survivor of human trafficking
as a teenager and a young adult. Very heavy conversation,
(00:27):
very heavy story, but ultimately with a happy ending. We
talked to her again in this one and we get
the conversation picking up when she is about to or
has just arrived in Canada. Unfortunately at that time still
part of the human trafficking circle being sold and transferred
to Canada. But once she got here, she details how
she kind of was able to escape that life, escape
(00:50):
those dangerous people that she was being controlled by, and
how she was able to overcome that and find a
new life and make a new life here in Canada.
Very good positive outcome to the story, but quite a
lot of twist and turns to get there. This is
a good conversation with her. My only regret about that
is this was recorded in the summertime, of this year
(01:12):
of twenty twenty four, and in order to achieve the
best sound, which I love to do for you guys
here on the podcast and so the guests and you
deserve it who listen to the show. I deserve only
the best quality sound that I can possibly make. I
turned off the air conditioning and of course to the
loud sounds, and closed all the outside noise outside windows
in my apartment to try and manage what kind of
(01:34):
outdoor exterior noises might occur to avoid that, however, not
a smart idea. And maybe ninety degree weather, you know,
to ninety five degree weather outside, It was getting pretty
hot in the apartment. And my apologies to Lena. I
don't think she realized this at the time. We were
on video chat as well too, But I was sweating.
(01:58):
I was sweating perfewly. I thought I was going to
pass out. At one point. I was having a hard
time trying to maintain focus. It was like way hot.
I guess in retrospect, I could have, you know, we
weren't live. I could have just said, hey, could you
hang on a second, I need to open a window
or have a drink of water. I did think I
took a drink of water. Actually, I think, thinking back
on this, because it was a few months ago that
(02:19):
I recorded this, I think I did go get some
water at least to try to mitigate that, but it
wasn't helping. I should have opened a window or you know,
done something else. I should have said, Hey, I need
to open a window in here. It's getting hot in here.
The backdrop of a serious conversation had me almost passing out,
but not for the reasons you might think. But I'm
glad we got through it. And again this if Lena,
(02:42):
if you're listening to this conversation, you're probably hearing about
this for the first time. So hopefully I didn't ruin
our conversation, and hopefully I did focus on it as
much as I was able to possibly do. I think
I did, okay. But the main thing is getting her
story out there and heard, and hopeful this is a
vehicle to do that. So once again, my thank you
(03:03):
and big time appreciation to Lena for being a part
of the Nobody's or Somebody's podcast, coming on here and
bearing all, telling all. And she has that book out there.
You can check out her website as well too, which
she details where to buy it and where to check
it out to get the full concept, the full story.
But this is a good offering portion of the of
her story. We get down to the part two of
(03:27):
this here with Lena on the Nobody's or Somebody's podcast
with me Chad advice, check out new episodes when they
drop wherever you get your podcasts on all the major
podcast platforms, and don't forget to check out Nobody's There
Somebody's podcast on Facebook. Lina Sabulah also on Facebook as
well too, and yeah to support what she does, support
what I do, and support more guests coming here on
(03:47):
the Nobody's or Somebody's podcasts. Let's get to my conversation
right now with Lena here. Hey, how are you. It's
good to talk to you again. Lena and I want
to kind of pick off where we left off last time.
Those who didn't listen or listening now, they need to
go back and listen to the part one that we did.
That we run out of time.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
That's like any good times. That's why we decided to
do the part.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
To turn around for you. Yeah, you're about to come
to Canada.
Speaker 1 (04:14):
Absolutely just a little bit summarized real fast. The part
one for those who are just gonna end up listening
this podcast and this exact episode. So I was born
and raised in Ukraine and my parents was alcoholic. I
become alcoholic, drug gotic, I lost my firstborn child, and
(04:37):
I was trafficked to two different countries and that's how
I ended up in Canada. Alcoholic drug godic, tons of troma,
PTSD and all that stuff. So if you wanted details,
listen to the part one that you do long to
do if I've been into one. Yeah, but yes, that's
(04:58):
why we love. And this is part where my life
is changed because my traffickers actually allowed me to go
to school and to learn English so I could communicate,
and they actually start the process for me, which was
(05:19):
another just miracle because I was in Israel. You're gonna
guys another part that they forced us under the bard
wire to crouse the border, so I was there illegally.
That's what they hold over me as well, that they
sent me to police and all that stuff. But here
(05:41):
they started the process because they didn't want me to
be deported because I cost them tons of money. And yes,
and that was the blessing in disguise for me because
I was actually going to school with a newcomer, and
that's what they were talking about, how this country has opportunities,
(06:06):
how the police and government will stand up for you,
and honestly from the place and discord that I came
for from, like it was foreign for me, but this
time I was kind of like to start exploring opportunities
and thinking like I probably have opportunity to start my
(06:28):
life with the clean slade, and I run away and
I live and shelter. And I learned English from level zero,
and it was really hard for me because honestly, back home,
my Russian was high. The Hebrew was easy to learn
because it's very similar the structure as Russian. I just
(06:51):
learned a bunch of words and I actually was able
to clearly communicate. But for English, it took me probably
three years until I'm start thinking in English and I
start making sense. At the beginning, it was like WHOA nonsense?
Speaker 2 (07:08):
But I can imagine why. Let me ask you why
Canada versus the US or somewhere else. Why do they trends?
Why did you come to Canada? Why do you think
they sent you there? Here?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
I don't know, that's where the was the route and
that's that's how it's ened up. But it's literally in
that time, I literally didn't care where they're gonna take
me because I knew that I'm gonna be dead a
million times over, so I would go like anywhere. So
I didn't really ask the fact that they brought me here.
It was just miracle. I do believe, so yes, and
(07:43):
there I actually by default, I have to quit drugs again,
and I became clean. And there was a moment that
I am, this is so funny. I met this gentleman
who was helping me like with the taxes and get
in like bloods older gentlemen, and he's he's Chinese. It's
(08:05):
so funny how God just put the people together. And
I just read that. You know, when the family note around,
there's always going to be God always going to send
you a stranger to actually help you out. Is your path?
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Yeah it is. I believe in that too, Yeah absolutely, So.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Yeah, he like just starts saying like this Nonesen, like,
oh I see, like no, first, like he said, save
all your money and pay taxes. Make sure you save
all the receipts. And I'm like, what toxes? What are
you talking about? But he was like first person who
was talking to me about the daily life. I had
(08:47):
no idea what the heck daily life look like? What
the normal people do? What is this nine to five? Like,
what is that like? How people behave, how they dress,
how they communicate, like it was like totally foreign to me.
So when he was telling me those stuff, like, I
(09:07):
got really offended because I thought he's judging me for
the way like I behave the speak and all this stuff.
And he's like, well, when you apply for the job,
you cannot speak like this or like you have to
do this. And it was such a weird like relationship
because when I quit drugs and I left everything, like
(09:28):
I know, like I didn't know anyone except on this dude. Yeah,
So I called him like for help, and he and actually,
this is so funny because I was thinking like maybe
like he can help me like to get the apartments
something like, you know, because he always like talking about
this life and all that stuff. And he said, nope,
(09:52):
but I can help you to create the plan for
your life. And I'm like okay, and he goes, I
know how heart is to be a newcomer because he
came like a few years on prior and he built
his life, and he said, I want to help you.
And it was so weird for me because up to
(10:13):
this point I never saw anyone, especially men, who want
to help me without.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Like anything like, yeah, you're cautious about you're paranoid obviously
for a good reason. Exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
I like always feel like what is going to be?
So now like you old me, you.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
Know exactly what do you want from this? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Exactly. It was like, it's very interesting how it took
me so long to realize that He's like it's okay,
Like I give you tokens, I give you this, I
buy lunch, and it's okay. I know how hard is
to be newcomer. It was quity strange. But he asked
(10:57):
me what would you like to do for even what
is your dream? Because you have to earn the money somehow,
And literally I was like over twenty five years old
around that I never thought about dreaming. Are you kidding me? Like?
What is that? Future? Never been so guaranteed that I
could make pants? And it's so bizarre that now I
(11:20):
have my children and they steal my daughter in high
school and we've been planning all the future since they were.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
You know, something that you never really have, but you
could give your daughter, which is great. But yeah, something
you're not you're not you're not familiar with, Yeah, because
you never had that. There was like day to day,
can I make it through this day?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
That was it exactly. And you know what's interesting though,
sometimes people don't even understand that and or taken for
granted the fact that you have a freedom to choose,
You have a freedom to be, to have this worth
and in this world, to even like the work, you know,
(12:03):
the my envy that somebody have, like you know, plants
and ideas and aspirations to work.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, those words are foreign concepts to you. Let me
ask you, then, how did you so you've met this
this gentleman who's helped you out, which is finally the
first sounds like positive person that's come into your life
that doesn't want anything to gain, or at least does
seem that way. But how did you get away from
the people that transferred you or sold you to Canada? Like,
how did you get away from them to kind of
(12:34):
get to talk to run? You just run with nowhere
to go? Where did you end up in Canada?
Speaker 1 (12:39):
Which say was in women's shelter?
Speaker 2 (12:42):
In which city has been in Toronto or in Toronto Toronto, Okay,
and you just ran to the shelter and they obviously
took you in there, and they.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
Know what's so bizarre about that? Sort of to interrupt
you about the shelter.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
It's good.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
I ended up there because I had no family, no money,
no literally no documents too, because it was like with
the like in the court system like whatever, Like I
had nothing. And there were like kids my age. Well
now I'm saying kids because I'm like.
Speaker 2 (13:14):
You're so young, like we were here. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, there were people my age that they willingly went
to the shelter and say like, oh, you know what,
I'm going against my parents because they want me to
go to college. Screw them. And I was like, what.
Speaker 2 (13:34):
This is your choice, Like you want to be here
and versus being safe at home with a family that
loves you. Yeah, I know, it's it's hard concept. That's
how spoiled we are. Yeah, that's how spoiled people are here.
They can just do it, you know.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Like I was hanging out with them like a couple
months like or whatever, Like I was there. I don't
remember because I was like on and off until like
I was figuring this out. But during the day you
cannot be there. You can sleep there, but then they
kick you out through the day. They give you like
a couple like bus stalking something you know, and you out,
(14:08):
so like whole day and one one. So there was
like girls and boys that were like separate in one place,
and in one place there was just a women. But
you have to come in a specific time, make sure
you have a bed, you know, like if you don't
show up, it's not and you have no where to sleep.
(14:29):
But I still was like blown away that I'm gonna
have a bed. There's sheets, you know. They sometimes they
give you something to eat to close. I'm like, what
like back home, if you have nothing nowhere to sleep,
you sleep in like in the like doorways.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah. Yeah, you really have no shelter, nothing to cover you. Yeah, exactly,
no building, It's just you there. Yeah, I hear you.
Did they try to do they try to look Did
they try to look for you? Do you know they
try to find you when you're scared, anyone come close
to finding you.
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Literally, I was so scared, and I've been scared probably
like for the next ten years, to the point that
like every time I had my court hearing, you know,
like they go through the process like of this immigration
and like I go and every time the judge say,
you'll need to postpone this for more information because they
(15:25):
did investigations and all this stuff. I literally like would
go to the bathroom and throw up how scared I
was that they're gonna send me back or like if
somebody find out because they like through the lawyer or whatever,
they somebody will find out. That I'm scared because so
much I knew that because they tell us all the time,
(15:50):
if you run away or something happened, I'm gonna find you.
I'm gonna kill you. I'm gonna kill all your family.
I skin you life. That that's how they hold you,
like you know, it isn't your slave, you know. So
that it was like the fear and paranora was like
so bad. And even when God called me to share
(16:12):
my story three years ago, I had huge like that,
you know, overwhelmed of fear, thinking like now I'm gonna
say this and now I'm gonna be public. Now my
face is going to be public. You know. Now I
have children, I have to be Like I had so
much fear, but I know God called me to share
(16:35):
my story, and I know that he will protect me,
and I have to trust and you know what it's
been like over twenty years. And I'm safe and I
know that they replaced me probably like next couple of days.
So I'm not as that volleyball of course, like they
lost money on me, but for them, it just lost.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
And there's unfortunately, there's more people that they'll get and
they'll take your place, and that's really unfortunate.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
And that's really gonna stay.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Yeah, well, yeah, who's gonna be? Yeah, some people do.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
I was there almost two years. I didn't run. I
had nowhere to run, there was nothing, So they're find
another girl who's gonna stay.
Speaker 2 (17:18):
I never thought about that too, when you put your
story out there, that your face is out there, your
your real name is out there. I mean it's they
could find they could see it. I'm sure someone's seeing something,
but that's too kind of obviously get to you. Now you're safe,
and that's great, but I never thought about the fear
of doing that. You're putting yourself out there.
Speaker 1 (17:35):
Yeah, I trust God because he gave me a job
to to share my story, to share my story of
salvation to tell people how much God loves us and
where I come from and that before and after. So
back to the story that my friend, he actually helped
(17:57):
me to find the government credits. Cool because I said
to him that I actually liked doing here and I
was doing here. I don't know, did I tell you
this story that my mother would Yeah, okay, so this
is so bizarre. Would be probably hearing for you. And
if you guys have little kids around you, please make
(18:19):
sure you understand this is not for kids podcasts, you know,
and yeah, and and take take that, you know, what
is that worth?
Speaker 2 (18:30):
Like use discretion, Yeah, use use discretion and maybe put
the kids the bad. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
So when I was a kid, and because it was
discord and dirt like in my house and and it
was infested with mold, cockroaches and we had lies all
the time. So when we were little, my mother just
shaved my head and she literally shaved my head probably
up to a great one. Can you imagine like shave
(18:57):
like six year old like they already have personalities and
the like identities and then like you're bold all the time.
This is so bizarre and yeah, and it was traumatizing
and this process of shaving your head, like it's traumatizing.
So later on, like I start fighting like against shaving
(19:21):
my head. So then she started putting like the gasoline
on my head, so it would burn like the scalp
and the but it would kill the lives and I
could keep the hair. But you go to school, you're
still like stinky, disgusting, you know, and everybody knows that
(19:41):
that's one of the methods to remove the lies, so
they know that you have lies. So it's so terrible.
And then I was shaving my brother hair, but he
didn't care because most of the guys like they're shaving
their hair and it's actually it's my fia thing, so
you look like my fia.
Speaker 2 (19:59):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
For duty, it's cool, but for women it's like it's
it's like was security blanket for me too, you know,
like I'm a girl and what was happening? Though, when
I got little bit older, I find out that the
bugs dye from the what is that here at Chopper
(20:25):
drug mart or pharmacy but whatever, it's colder up, okay,
So that dye would would kill the lies as well.
So sometimes I would end up green or blue or
yellow overever color. But I know that I could kill
(20:45):
kill the lies. I'm gonna look funny, but still nobody
would know that.
Speaker 2 (20:50):
I'm keep your hair your hair, and you'll have just
look like you're trying different things.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
Yeah, exactly, but they're gonna think that I just color
my hair and it justn't that funny, rather than I
have lies, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2 (21:02):
Yeah, So that's why.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
That's why I was experimenting with my hair and then
like it was ruined and I have to cut it
to curl it forever. So honestly, I said to him,
I actually really like to do like my own hair.
You know, it's maybe that's what I'm gonna do because
it's actually.
Speaker 2 (21:22):
Some came from that something that encourage you, Like, you
know what, I really enjoy doing different stuff with my
with hair and other people's hair that could be fun.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Yeah, because it brought me confidence and brought me like
something you know, I don't know. I just loved it
and change. I think it's brought me change. Sometimes when
we have problems in our lives and we are not
in control and we don't know what we're gonna do,
Usually like I would use drugs and booze and this time,
(21:51):
I just like I was doing the changes like to myself,
and it's actually brought me some kind of like form
of relief, know that I don't know, maybe hole possible exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:03):
Just give me one second when I grab some water.
One second, just one second, guy, I.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Have mine.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
Or I was getting dry there, I was like, oh,
I don't want to start coughing or something.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
That's why I said I have mine.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
Yeah, exactly. I should have been a little bit more prepared.
I'm here.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
So yeah, yeah, no money nothing.
Speaker 2 (22:33):
No money, no, no no idea how to make that
opportunity happen. Right, So you told him that you wanted
to do hair, that you liked hair, and you were
you had an interest in that.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, and he literally like he was like, honestly, he's
like a dog on a bone. He doesn't have he
doesn't have like word like no like if he he
put his mind to something like you know, it's crazy.
And now like all these years later, he beat cancer
(23:02):
already like a few times and they put him in
pallilative care three times. And now I call him today,
he's planning visit to Italy. He's like, I have a
dream I'm going to Italy. Okay, dude, So.
Speaker 2 (23:17):
Anyway, you're still in contact with him too. I was
going to ask you that as well. Yeah, he's still
a part of your life. He's still there. That's amazing.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
In my life. He helped me to get into school,
my first job. I he interviewed my husband when we
just met, and he's like, are you really you can
find someone rich.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Take care of you? Why do you find set you
up properly? Yeah? Yeah, And I influence in your life.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
And he's alone too. I'm like, don't you want a
girlfriend a wife? He's like, no, no, I need I
need to like set you like so he's literally yeah,
I was like, was the best parent that I never
had here on this earth, you know. And he gave
me away from my wedding. My children think that this
(24:07):
is his like his Chinese but he's our uncle Tom.
So everybody think that, like he never show up without
the gift for my kids, you know. And it's so
interesting though, oh at that time, Yeah, like he's he's
like just become that that hope that always believed in me,
(24:29):
no matter of how like I was like obnoxious, like
I was rude, I didn't speak English, so I the
words that I didn't know. I put f worth in it,
so it makes sense to me that it's a sentence,
you know, because like when you have gaps, you have
to figure out how it works. But he's like he's
swearing a lot anyway. So then he found me this school.
(24:54):
But I've been like in the country for like something
like three or four months. My English like so terr ball.
And we went there submit the application and the woman said, like,
you know, you're a level English, like you're not gonna
make it for that exam. So it was somewhere like April,
so I came like come in the winter. This was
(25:17):
like sprint and the next ball that would be exams
to get into the school. But it's interesting, like from
hundreds of applications they would take on literary people. So
she said to me, you're not gonna make it because
of the English. And I said to her, listen, sign
(25:41):
me up if I fail, at least like I know
I failed, and we'll move on and actually can help
me to find another job at Canada Wonderland. Terrible job.
I hated it, but like anything that I did afterwards,
I hated it because it's the hard labor for a
(26:02):
small amount of money, and there was like so much abuse,
like you know, they didn't allow us to take breaks
to eat and all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
So it's like, really it's terrible.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
Like honestly, any job I have here it was really hard.
So yeah, it sucks for newcomers, like no matter like
what job, like you did, you.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
Think they can take advantage of you. I think because
you're coming to the country that oh you don't You
don't have any life before. So if you want to
stay here, you'll do anything we ask you.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
And you don't know law. You don't know that you
have to get paid for stuff. You don't know that
they have to give you those breaks. You don't know anything.
You just like they say you wanted this job, you
do this hours and hours. But whatever. The fact is
that it was like outside of the city and it
took me like one and a half hour to get
(26:53):
there and one and a half hour to get back. Wow,
my friend home. He actually sent me up with the
library card and he said go and get them kids books.
So I started reading the kids' books and then he
got me like this little dictionary like Oxford Dictionary. Yes,
(27:13):
at long before cell phones and Google and all that stuff.
That's interesting that I was reading the kids' books to
learn English. So in three months I went to write
the test and from the one hundred people though, it
was chosen and I was one of these people. So
(27:33):
the year that I spent in that school because I
need to learn more English and math to get certified,
to finish the high school and get and get my diploma.
So I literally I finished that cosmetology course with super
high marks around like nineties or ninety six. And I
(27:55):
was actually one of the three people around three people
from home my class who actually went to be hairstylist.
And I was hairstylist for sixteen years and two of
those years actually opened my own business and own my
own salon. But now the interesting part, like that's why
you have to have a trade, no matter like what
(28:17):
you're doing. Like if like life fall apart and you
don't know where to go, you need to go learn
new trade or go get the trade, like honestly figure
out because it's so much of our work and value
tied up like in what we do. But honestly, there's
another missing link that happened because it's not only trade
(28:40):
that helped me to stay off the streets of the
drugs because you need a purpose and anchor that would
hold you, like off the drugs and the and the
drink and whatever. And the money too, like the money
to like when you used to like have like thousands
(29:03):
and thousands of dollars and then like you're poor and
have no food. It's it's hard. It's like mentally really hard.
Although I have nothing to show off because like everything
went on drugs. So anyway, the interesting part that when
I was doing co op for my like her Scharlin,
(29:25):
I met my husband. Well that time, I just met
a boy and then I fall in love with him.
And I didn't think it's gonna be like anything serious.
I thought, like it's gonna be just like link or
whatever it's.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
Called and romance.
Speaker 1 (29:45):
Yeah, yeah, I didn't even think about romance, like what romance. Like.
I came from the place that the guys are chitter s, liars,
they violin, they stupid, crazy.
Speaker 2 (30:00):
So negative negative, negative images of that's totally understandable, totally understandable.
Speaker 1 (30:07):
So so it was so weird that this was like
the second person in my life that I actually I
was so blown away the way he treated me. He
actually saw like I don't know a lady. He was
opening the doors for me. He was like treating me
like with respect, and.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
That's respect you exactly, something you never experienced. Yeah, it's
a huge thing. It's like you don't expect it. Then
you don't know how to react to it either. I
can imagine you don't know how to treat it.
Speaker 1 (30:38):
I was weird for me. But you know what's so interesting,
So my friend Tom just like he taught me all
these manners as well. You know, he's like totally people
like every time laughing day they say he's like your
father and say, no, he's my grandma. Because he taught
me how to hold the laundry, how to call the
(31:00):
fork and knife. And it was so funny because my
husband invited me to this fancy restaurant something on our
tour day or whatever, and I was cutting like I
don't know, steak or fish forever I don't remember, but
I was actually cutting with fork and knife and my
husband was so impressed and he gave me so many compliments,
(31:22):
like on disgracing poise, and I was like he he,
I just learned these three days ago. Because my friend
go and he literally like put the napkin on my
plate and say, okay, that's how you do it. And
he make me teach you all.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
The basics, like every other thing that you just didn't
get from your parents who just didn't take that time
with you. Just there's so much opportunities in life. Yeah,
that's so cool.
Speaker 1 (31:47):
Yeah, So my husband was so impressed. So we got
another date and and yes, and I feel like there
was like no other just him. And then I ended
up that he actually a pastor's son. So I ended
up in the church listening all these ceremons about how
(32:11):
wonderful God is and how much he loves the sayers,
the people who are screwing up, that he give his
life for us. And I was like, okay, I'll show
up because you know, I need his parents to like me. Yeah,
but yeah, it was hard for them. First of all,
we were dating, like and they're like all about marriage. Second,
(32:35):
while I was working in salon, I have like this
different color hair, My tongue was pears. I have like
this makeup because I love like the makeup.
Speaker 2 (32:46):
Trying different things, trying different looks forgot to experiment with.
Yeah that makes three times.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
And I had tattoos and smoke.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
See all the all the habits we take people take
for granted that they get to do. They are allowed
there the choice as theirs to do that. You just
finally get to experience and you're going all out, dude, like.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I'm kidding, I kid you not. They family like they
mom and so like it's five kids, like my husband
have like five all together, five siblings, but like his mom,
soft spoken, kind his sisters like they eating like little bird,
they sweet, they like and I'm and.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
I'm like, b he's just like yeah, loud in your
face like.
Speaker 1 (33:37):
Like and they they together, like they go to church together.
They don't start stuff together. I'm literally like, was so
like out of out of place? You know?
Speaker 2 (33:55):
But did you feel welcome that they feel like? Did
they make you feel welcome, like, come and join us,
come and be a part of this, be a part
of our family. Love did they did you feel that way?
Or did you feel like you were trying to fit
in and not really well?
Speaker 1 (34:05):
This is the interesting part. In the beginning, they got
really freaked out. His mom wasn't like living in uh,
they were pastoring in us, so she meant me like
kind of over the phone. But his sister really got
freaked out. She's like, he's not coming home. She's like
(34:25):
all over the place, it's gonna be disaster, Like she's
like and stuff like that, because like it's it's scary,
but it's funny enough because my husband says, like, I
just don't want a church girl. It's like, I don't
want to.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Praise opposite attract. Yeah, he didn't know how I don't
want another person. I'm sure they tried to fix him
up with people who were in the church or people
who are around that community, right, So I'm sure he
probably rebelled in that way about that because he's just like, Wow,
I want to I want to be with someone I like,
I have a connection to, not someone who sat up with.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
He thinks his rebel is I'm like, oh my goodness,
Like you honestly likes.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
That where he was boy. Yeah he's still a good boy.
He just had to find his own his real love
connection exactly.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Well, you know what he did, rebel, He did like
his own bunch of stuff, trying to figure out his identity.
But like he's like, he doesn't know what bad is.
You know, he thinks he's bad, but he was bad
anyway for him, it was better.
Speaker 2 (35:29):
In that context. He was bad, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1 (35:32):
And and it's so interesting that he was like, I'm
trying to rebel, but in doubt. He brought me into
his family and he stood by me, and we got pregnant,
and uh, I was I was so scared to tell
them that we are pregnant, because we are we were
living that time as a common law and they didn't
(35:54):
like that either, because they're like.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
Oh, I get married. Yeah America, America nobody married.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
So like, I don't even know what their problem was,
because that's what they come on love.
Speaker 2 (36:06):
If you're already living with someone, you're sharing a habitat,
you're sharing finances, you're coming home and person, but that's
you're basically married. You're paying taxes, talking about your.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
Day of having your baby, like that's it. But one
time I'm like, oh, he was talking to someone and
I said to him, like that's so weird, Like I'm like,
why are you not calling me your wife? You like,
if you don't know how to call me, call me Lena.
Because he's like was struggling.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
Because I was there or my partner or was.
Speaker 1 (36:38):
Yeah, something like that and else and he's like, well,
you're not my wife, and it's like broke my heart.
I'm like, what do you mean We've been living for
four years to have a child. He's like, well, we're
not married, and I'm like okay. And then when I
was showing up just for his family, and by that
(36:59):
time like that was that was a beautiful things. You know.
In the beginning they got so friaked out. But when
I got pregnant, his mom said to me, she called me.
We talk for an hour and she says, you know,
my dog got distracted me. He said. She said, you know,
(37:21):
that's not how we do things. But God love you
and he has planned for you. And they accepted me.
The baby was born, they loved me, they loved on
the baby. So I love being part of the family.
His father was amazing too. He goes like, oh, his
father was pastor. When they he got sick. So they
(37:41):
finished with that church in US and they came to
Canada and he goes to me. He calls me and
he's like, oh, I'm coming for borsch. I'm like, I
don't have any borsch. But I was staying home mom
with my daughter. I see you, So I go I
go to him, I have no He's like, no, becoming
(38:01):
for a borsch. I'm like, okay, I sent to my daughter.
I guess were cooking bores. So he loved my cooking and.
Speaker 2 (38:10):
Heart is cooking. Is your cooking.
Speaker 1 (38:12):
They literally would come and eating. So so they accepted
me of course, like my hair changed, my tongue, ring
gun and all this stuff. And that was my anchor,
that family, my child, my husband, well he married me, yes,
so that's becoming anchor. I decide, like, I never gonna
(38:35):
lie to him. And I decide I'm never gonna use
drugs because I have to be the mother, you know,
fully sober for the present. So for them, I didn't
give them.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Ye give give your kids the mom that you didn't have.
Speaker 1 (38:52):
And I was so scared.
Speaker 2 (38:54):
You know, you had no one to Yeah, you had
no one to kind of look as a mom roll
well maybe his mom, but for the most for you,
you didn't have a mom that you would ever think
of as a role model. You want to model your
own parenthood out of right, So.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I try to model model his mom. It's very hard,
and I thought like it was unattainable because I was
trying to be like her. But I couldn't be like her.
I was like loud and so much feelings and emotion
and all over the place. So I tried to copy her.
And it makes me really depressed for a very long
(39:29):
time that I thought like, first of all, like I
was tormented by my mind because I heard this like
you know, imposteral syndrome. So I heard these thoughts, who
do you think you are to be a wife and
a mother and have a healthy child and relationship? Who do.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
You deserve it to you? Why you should like? This
is how you This is not how you grew up.
This is you don't belong here. I can imagine those
self doubts of creep and it's very traumatizing.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
And especially seeing his mom all cleaning to together. They
are singing hymns like they like, and I thought like,
oh my gosh, this is like it's so bizarre that
like I cannot sweep the floor, Oh I don't know
how to wash the dishes, like it's it was weird,
but it's honestly. When my mother in law actually give
(40:22):
us a gift, she said, go to the church, just
watch a movie, hang out with Christian people. I got
a babysity daughter, and that's where I went to Alpha course,
and it's actually sharing the God in a judgmental atmosphere
and like you can ask questions why I'm here? Who
(40:43):
is God? Yeah, on the tour day date, I actually
give my life to Christ and I felt like this
love and forgiveness just filled my body. So I stopped
copying anyone and just try to figure out what kind
of mom I can be, Like who am I? And
(41:04):
what can I do? And just like instead of judging
myself all the time, I just start having gratitude for
my life, you know, for being alive. And I'm start
saying like, yeah, I don't deserve this healthy child, but
God give me this gift. So what to do?
Speaker 2 (41:23):
So just live in that moment and just accept what
He's giving you.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
Exactly and be grateful. And then I realized maybe like no,
not maybe like none of us don't deserve anything, but
still good things come and we have to be grateful
because guess what, the bad things come, we're beating ourselves
up and up. So like when the good things except
the goody wouldn't like acknowledge and celebrate.
Speaker 2 (41:46):
Yeah, we're gonna run out of time again. Unfortunately, the
zoom is counting down and so it goes so quickly.
I know we have such good conversation, but at least
we ended kind of on a positive thing before it
cuts off. You have a book out there, you have
people can connect with your story and connect with you.
Where should people do that? Just mention that website again
as well.
Speaker 1 (42:04):
Too, Absolutely so. The website it's Lena Sibula l E
n A C b LA dot ca. And you can
listen to my podcast. There's different recordings with awesome as
some guests as well, but you can learn what I'm
doing today and today I'm wife and the mother of
(42:26):
tributable children, and I'm a life coach, and I'm a
Christian woman and I've been wife over twenty years.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
I've been congratulations, you've been listening to the Nobody's or
Somebody's podcast with me Chadvice And this podcast has been
voted the number one podcast by people that don't vote
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