Catcher in the Rye Conspiracies Pt 2: JD Salinger, Mark David Chapman's Aliens & Joe Atwill's Freemasonry in the Rye!

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
If you ever had catcher in the rye, you know it's loaded with conspiracies

(00:03):
Going back to the 1950s and today in part two
We're gonna unpack a lot of those conspiracies. I'm gonna shed light on some very very dark ideas
So if you haven't listened to part one part one
I walked you through the whole book and the whole story and kind of alluded to various ideas about what we're gonna
Talk about today where we wrap up our conversation of catcher in the rye

(00:25):
We're gonna discuss the creation of the book
Controversies will find out more about the author JD Salengers
His PTSD from going to war pedoclames his eastern orthodox spirituality
We're gonna revisit right early in J. Wyners Kubrick's Odyssey 3. We're talking about July 16th again
Synchronistities mark David Chapman's alien war Joe Atwell's free masonry in the rye conspiracy

(00:47):
Connections to the movie the game and all kinds of fun stuff
We got more explicit lyrics today on this episode to get ready to clutch those pearls
Now if you didn't listen to part one I
Advise you to do that. I just published it not too long ago. It should be the most recent episode on your feet

(01:08):
Because in that I walked you through the whole story I I pulled out a lot of ideas in there
Today we're gonna kind of
Shed some light on those ideas go a little deeper into all the things I talked to you about
And basically in part one I laid out in the book the idea that maybe this is some MK Ultra mind controlled in cell

(01:28):
Killer being groaned
Talked about the people shooting hat a
Holding call field the main character his obsession with sex is by the fantasies
We even tied into some Luigi Mangione stuff. It was a great time. I hope you enjoyed it
So today you're here for part two to wrap it up and we're gonna shed some more light on this

(01:49):
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(02:11):
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(02:32):
First let's talk a little bit about the book
Because we did last time we did it on the time last time we just walked through the whole book
His book was written basically in the mid 40s
In serial form and then novelized in 1951 by JD Salinger now the 40s and the 50s were kind of
Pre-hipy error. This is the beat nicks

(02:53):
Which if you pay attention to Charles Manson story. He always said he was a beat Nick. He wasn't a hippie
And a lot of the a lot of those beat Nick influences
From a lot of you know like your
Out of Huxley's and Alistair Crowley's like that was kind of more of a beat Nick thing right of
Questioning the official status quo and the social constructs

(03:16):
So JD Salinger comes along in 51 writes his book turns out to be the most censored book in
The United States for 20 years from the 60s to the 80s and still challenge to this day. So there's a lot of people I read in the Patreon comments
a lot of people who said man, I can't believe I read this book in high school why they made me read this and

(03:40):
It could be for a variety of reasons right and we're gonna wrap that up in the conclusion
It could be that it's just a controversial piece of American pop culture
I'll kind of so box it in the conclusion, but we'll come back to that
But the major beef of why this book was censored was a variety of things we got vulgar language because again

(04:00):
This was written in the 40s folks
1951
people didn't talk like this in public
Reference is the sex
blasphemy because he questions God and hates the disciples remember that
undermining family values encouraging rebellion
I mean, this is like pre-elvis time okay

(04:21):
Promoting drinking smoking promiscuity and even some sexual abuse in there and the defense of the book
Is that this is a book written for adults not kids
Which raises the question of why do they
have kids in high school read this book and
You know, you know me. I'm I'm a very sort of liberal guy with this kind of stuff. I'm all for it

(04:44):
Like if it's adults go for it, right?
But I do kind of draw the line. I'm like dude. There's a million books you could read like well
Do you ever read something else? That's a little you know because not everyone in high school is equipped to
You know read this stuff and not let it affect them maybe right like I was fine with it
So I was telling someone I was like I watched a clockwork orange when I was like 14 man. I was watching violent stuff and

(05:08):
And I'm a hundred percent fine
I keep getting science infections. So maybe that's why
It's God punishing me for watching filth
God sorry, okay, so the title catcher in the rye
It actually comes from a poem that's described in the book but not recited

(05:30):
Exactly it's called a common throw the rye by Robert Burns and night in 1784 so
Right old timey and it's about this field of rye or wheat
Then you also see seven interpretations to say it's about a narrow cobblestone lane prone to puddles of water
I don't know either way. It's full sexual references

(05:53):
And we can and I think we go through that later in this this uh research here
Now the cover
shows us a horse if you look at the cover artwork it's it's a scene in the book at the end of the book at the merry go round
Which I talked about connecting to

(06:13):
Luigi Mangione in the last episode
But if you look at it you think I don't know it kind of looks like the horse of the apocalypse right
Which is pretty dark and
And but it would be the end because like I argue in the book in the part one
I think this is a lot about

(06:34):
mass murder and suicide of the main character
So it is if it is the end for him
Now of course the official version you'll see about this story is that oh it's just a book about the loss of childhood innocence and holdings very scared to lose his innocence
And I'm like I don't think so

(06:54):
It's because the catcher and the rye in this the story is supposed to stop the kids from growing older
But he's kind of killing them right he's catching bodies. What he says
Because my interpretation of the book was that this is more of american psycho than anything
Which I should have looked up to see if american psycho was uh connected to this or influenced by catcher and the rye I bet it was

(07:18):
Because you got holdon this main character. He's all charged up sexually. He's mad
He's an in-sell. He's a virgin and he's got these fantasies of violence
And I argue that he actually did them
And it's a whole veiled story about his his murdering of these people and the last chapter shows him in the cycord
Because remember you had that red hat. It was his people shooting hat

(07:43):
And you had all these influences and pop culture of various people
conducting murders based on this book's influence right we'll talk about mark david chatman later on
And we're calling the books in the story mr. Antillini who I argue and I don't think it's just me because I
I was looking for the artwork for the part one and other people had I seen a couple articles where people

(08:08):
talking about how mr. Antillini seems to sexually abused holdon so not just me
but
mr. Antillini wanted holdon to go see that psychoanalyst will helm stekil we talked about this a little bit in part one
But stekil was a real psychoanalyst
during the writing of the book in the forties
big collaborator with Freud

(08:30):
And he studied symbolism and dreams
And he talked about the libido being transformed depending on whatever the person
emotional state is experiencing
And he also studied fetishes which
He called the fetish the unconscious religion in a person's
psyche

(08:52):
Psych
Whatever
People always correct me. I don't I don't remember. I don't know psyche or psych. I don't know. I'll say I'm both
The point is Antillini
abused holdon right and then wanted will helm stekil the unpack this for him. What a dick
He's like uh, so I'm gonna essay you and then

(09:12):
I'm gonna have you talk to this therapist who can tell you all about sick fetishes that I've got and
Clear you up a little bit like that's crazy, right crazy work
So JD Salinger, let's talk about who he was first off. He never wanted this put into film
That's why you've never seen a movie for catcher in the rye
And every big a-lister tried to make this happen because the book is so

(09:33):
I don't know controversial popular red whatever
Uh, people like Spielberg Harvey Weinstein of course you would want to try to make this a movie
And everybody all the big names wanted want to be portray holdon call field
Toby McGuire Jack Nicholson Marlon Brando John Kuzak and of course the greatest of all time

(09:58):
The only one that would be acceptable to do this Leo DiCaprio
But Salinger died in 2010
It was an old dude and his work is in a trust
And that trust still doesn't allow anyone to make this a film
Which is probably why you can't even find an audible version of this book

(10:21):
Now I don't know what the copyright time frame is but
I think I think we're probably coming up on that in 10 20 years where the copyright will be expired
Maybe someone can just do it
But if you follow the history of Disney they somehow are able to extend the copyrights past their legal time frame for

(10:44):
Disney characters so who knows what happens
But who was JD Salinger well first and foremost he was a counter intelligence agent in the army
So there's that and his first battle
Uh was D-Day
So lots going on there for this guy right

(11:05):
And he was actually writing catcher on the ride during World War II while he was stationed overseas there
And you know fun fact meanwhile his girl back in the states Una O'Neal
turned 18
And married Charlie Chaplin a man who was at that time in his 50s

(11:26):
I mean that's pretty strange right
He's JD Salinger talked about World War II and he he talked about how he saw these sort of dead bodies and he said
You never really get the smell of burning flesh out of your nostrils
Now what's interesting to me is that I took an anatomy course in college and they talked about how the olfactory

(11:46):
Nerves or center or whatever you call it the olfactory the nose the smell thing
Is connected to your brain
Uh, that's why sometimes certain smells can bring up nostalgia nostalgic feelings
So for him I think those two are connected and I think all this guy's got severe PTSD
He can't get the smell out of his nostrils. I don't think it's like a physical sensation. I think it's a mental sensation right

(12:11):
And to sort of support that argument
If you look at the studies for PTSD, they'll tell you that after 200 days of war you go crazy
Well JD spent 299 days at war so
probably some PTSD through there right

(12:32):
also
A lot of this information there's a documentary that I saw on Amazon
About JD Salinger. That's where I got most of this information if you're looking for more. I'm just summating it for you
So after the war JD Salinger
wants to go back overseas and he goes back and he's hunting Nazis

(12:53):
And doing some intelligence work and he ends up marrying one
Sylvia was her name
He claimed they were connected telepathically and that they'd met in dreams now
I'm gonna guess David Lynch and Mark Frost read catcher in the rye
And David Lynch's vision in twin peaks of

(13:14):
Cooper and Laura meeting in the dreams in the red room
I'm gonna guess there's some influence there and you know Cooper's he's a strong sender telepathically connected
So he's writing all these stories right and he wrote this story called Elzma

(13:35):
About his experience of meeting a girl at the beach sounds innocent enough right well
Punt the brakes
He was 30 years old. She was 14
He in the story he likes her but
But knew she was too young and he wanted to kiss her and steady tells her mom that he would marry her someday very creepy

(14:01):
Couple of the times JD Salinger
Got burned given stories to Hollywood or magazines because they'd always changed something and it came a real
Pea of his like he was real obsessed with it right which is probably why he doesn't want to movie or an audio book is because
He doesn't like when other people are interpreting his thing which is also very lynchian right David Lynch

(14:21):
Always talks about like you fish for these big ideas and then you you commit to that original idea
You do not like deviate from it
Which is you know a lot of a lot of artists sort of embrace that
Someone said that JD Salinger writing catch on the rye was kind of like him exercising demons
Which again

(14:45):
When you look at it from the perspective of holding being a mass murderer
And having contempt for everybody like maybe that was JD Salinger right
Decent sized a murder and war
could be
And JD was in fact very anti-establishment and he came back to the states and saw
America as a shopping center and

(15:07):
America had lost its soul
And he literally said that he saw holding coffee old in himself
He said because after war two he came back to America came back to the states
After you know a year or two or whatever was he ended up spending over there and he said he didn't recognize America anymore
Which I know that feeling I did a short tour in South Korea for a year and I came back and I remember I remember it was a mixed feeling

(15:34):
like on the one hand
it was
Like walking into
Candyland you know you drive on the street and you see a million fast foods and restaurants and shopping and all the colors and logos
But on the other hand you're like wow. This is wild like it just it does have a weird field consumer obsessed feel to it

(15:56):
Which is of course, you know as a capitalism is what we do right
So I kind of I kind of know what he's talking about
I certainly didn't go through what he went through
for what it's worth
But anyway, so the the editor for the book reddit
And he says to JD Salinger he says hey, I think this holding character is crazy

(16:17):
Which is my interpretation as well
Oh, and I want to caveat all this when I read the book I went in completely blind
I'd never read it before I never talked to anyone who read it
I interviewed writer Lee and Jade why near about their movie koobe x odc 3 a couple months ago
And they make a very strong connection you gotta watch it
You gotta watch it on amazon listen to my podcast and to tantalize yourself and then go watch it

(16:40):
They talk about
In fact, let me put a link in the show notes
link koobe x odc 3
Because I want you to listen to that interview if you haven't and
They make a very strong connection of catcher in the rye to the shining amongst all the other
catcher in the rye conspiracies

(17:02):
And and I after I interviewed him I said man, I gotta read this book
I just have to read it and I read it
Didn't consult any studies any articles any reviews. I know idea
And I just jotted all the notes down. I said this is kind of crazy
And to be honest with you, I've stumbled across a couple articles here and there
I still could be off on a lot of things. I don't know. I still haven't studied what the sort of

(17:25):
I just know the mainstream sort of
Reactant to it was that this is a coming of age story and I'm like, what are you talking about? I mean on one level sure
On the crazy tinfoil paranoid level. No
But yeah, the uh
The editor says man, I think this j the editor reads the story tells jd

(17:48):
I think this holding guys crazy
Which I agree with and jd sounder starts crying
Because again jd sounder identifies as holding he's the crazy guy
And I would argue jd sounder like many um, you know if he was if he was into younger folks

(18:09):
Pitofelia it was probably because he was maybe a victim of one like maybe he had a mr. Antelone who abused him right it's this cycle
So jd gets the book done finally publishes in 1951 resonates immediately with everyone kids
Or like oh wow, I got a story that explains how I feel like I'm so full of resentment and angst
And everyone carries it around with them

(18:32):
On the on the documentary John Kusak talks about how it felt cool to carry this book around with you, right?
Or and that's a bit of the rationale for why all these people
Have this book on them and why they always talked about it was just a major
Thing and I think it tapped into something that maybe hadn't been tapped into before right
And ever since then it like it devolved into you know, I was a teenager

(18:58):
Watching Marilyn Manson videos and stuff right it's it's
Kind of ramping up the angst of the teenagers, which I don't know of as healthy exactly
Anyway, so JD Salinger becomes a celebrity instantly he hates it
Hey, thanks people should only know the artist through his work and that is it which is very Kubrickian all right

(19:21):
So jd's like
I'm out of here he ends up leaving the city goes to Cornish nor
New Hampshire and now because he was necessarily a hermit or recluse
Like a lot of people that knew him are like no, no, he was very outgoing. He just didn't like the fame
And so he moves up to Cornish, New Hampshire

(19:42):
He continues writing he didn't write it he didn't publish a ton of books by the way over his lifetime
But he wrote this thing called nine stories. It's a bunch of short stories
And most of them were actually written prior to catcher in the rye he just published them later
And there's themes of suicide in those stories and you know people getting out of the world as he kind of describes it

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(22:39):
and JD ends up
Getting with that younger from the beach the 14 year old
And she tried to kiss him and get intimate but for whatever reason that turned him off
He ends up dumping her because she was in the way of his work because he was obsessed with work
And that sounds very sort of in cell behavior. I guess I don't know. I'm in cells act. I have no idea

(23:02):
But again, remember he right he identifies as hold in call field
So then he meets another woman named Claire Douglas and they end up getting married and they have kids
Um, but he is spending so much time out and he's got a shed in his backyard and he's just writing 24/7 and clairs taking care of the kids

(23:24):
And he's completely absent so she's like man, if this guy they split up in 1967
Then he dates a woman named Joyce Maynard and
Again, there's a 40 year age gap between these two when they hook up now. She was legal
barely
But she eventually breaks it off with him and he's kind of a dick is kind of the idea here and

(23:49):
She writes a book about it and a whole it's a whole thing and
While they were together he led her into his spirituality and he was in the meditation he meditated every day
And in his he's got story stories called the franny and zooey
Stories and apparently I didn't read him he talks about his spirituality because he was interested in Zen Buddhism and Hinduism and

(24:13):
Eastern Orthodox Christianity, which I was like that's pretty fascinating because like those are the things I'm interested in if you forced me to pick a religion or belief or whatever like
It would be a blend of you know Buddhism and Christianity that resonates obviously identify
I didn't like Greek Orthodox so like that's my religion to be clear
But there's like Buddhist elements and meditation that really helps a ton as a tool not as a religion

(24:38):
Just to be clear
So he gets married in 1988
To a different woman named Colleen O'Neal and stays with her till 2010 when he dies in New Hampshire
So he must have figured out a way to be a better spouse, I guess
And after his death his family trust claimed that they were gonna release five more books about the characters that he had written about the the glass family holding call field and a few others right

(25:05):
And one of those stories is about being in counter intelligence because again
We can't forget and let go of the idea that this guy was an intelligence agent which granted
I know that's like a boogie man in the conspiracy world. I'm not saying just because you're in intelligence. You're
a lumine confirm right

(25:26):
It's it's it's like this. It's like
not all
Intelligence agents are lumine confirm but all lumine confirms are intelligence agents right get that
And maybe just because like they're the ones with the secrets that could be just as simple as that right like I'm you know

(25:46):
I worked munitions and ordinance. They're not giving me no secrets about
About aliens and stuff like that
Uh, fun fact
Holden had a Sunday mat and mat was in the movies he was in the
1990 film
Captain America which I haven't seen yet, but I'm very interested because you know growing up back in the day

(26:09):
I was obsessed with comic books and
The movies back then for comic book nerds was like they were terrible
The best thing you had to watch back in the 80s and 90s was the Batman series from the 60s. That was the best
Because like the spider-man movie was trash. I'm gonna guess the Captain America movie was trash
The Batman movies were great. They were great from the jump. That was kind of the first one that was able to pull it off

(26:35):
Yes, so for whatever reason Batman translates the best, huh?
Is the moral of that story
Okay, so that was JD calendar
mix of inappropriate relationship ages
Dark themes PTSD intelligence
And so on now let's revisit clockwork shining kubricks odyssey 3

(26:59):
um the reason that they connect so much of kubricks the shining into
Catcher in the rise because Wendy is reading catcher in the rye in the kitchen at the beginning of the
movie when she's sitting with Danny and
Again, um if you refer back to my I did a show

(27:22):
July of 2024 about the date July 16th because a bunch of ritual type events line up with his date
Why I had some ideas that I presented on that show go listen to it
Links in the links in the show notes as always
Not as always for this episode. I'll put them in the show notes

(27:44):
We had the Trinity test 1945 you had a Apollo 11 and 68 or 69 and then you had
iZoid shut
And you know the Trinity to tomor bomb allegedly opened up the gateway for the UFOs
Apollo 11 of course the big fake moon landing a big ritualistic event

(28:09):
And then iZoid shut a massive sort of ritual
Illumina confirmed movie
And it connects into a wide breadth of conspiracies the Manhattan project James Shelby Donard's synchromisticism of the JFK assassination
With King kill 33 UFOs twin peaks wizard of Oz. I mean all kinds of stuff right and sex magic

(28:29):
And if you try to make sense of it say why 716 well
I mean i'm not much of a jimontrian nerd because I feel like jimontrian nerds find
Any excuse to connect numbers into what they want you to believe
But for this instance I consider it right
because 716 is like 7 for the month and then 16 1 plus 6 equals 7 so you got 7 7

(28:57):
And 77 is the number that represents spiritual awakening enlightenment and connection to the divine
Well catcher in the rye released on july 16th
And then you have all this sort of
Robert Bartow kills Rebecca Schaeffer. She was an actress in a model

(29:19):
And he was obsessed with a bunch of pop celebrities
Tiffany divi gibson Madonna. Oh
I mean every every every desit tragedy but I mean
Come on. Oh, wait. What?
And then um you know I love Madonna John that my my kabala queen
Um, and then John hinkley tried to assassinate reg and he had the book in his hotel room

(29:44):
And then you got marked David Chapman murdering John Lenin who he identified as whole in call field
And there's a massive UFO subplot that I want to get into with him
In case you didn't catch it if you haven't read my book the dark path
It's the magnum opus. It's the best book I've written
It covers everything from start to finish
And it's very prophetic in a million ways. Okay

(30:04):
Um, it's my most red book. It's my most popular
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(30:30):
Um, I give you the ebook for free along with kubricks code something I talk about all the time
So you get two free books. I mean, can you believe it for five bucks?
As of right now inflation. I got to raise those prices though. So get ready for that. I don't know
Now I'll try to keep it five bucks. I know times are tough for everybody
All right, so I'm gonna read you from the dark path. So you don't have to do any of that. Okay

(30:53):
What a guy
Another theory is that mark David Chabin was playing a role in the battle between extraterrestrials
The claim is that Chabin was visited by aliens from a different tribe that were of the malevolent variety. That means bad
They wanted him to take Lenin out to shut down his peaceful movement
Lenin's message of peace and unity was bleed to have been channeled from the benevolent. That's good

(31:17):
The benevolent faction of aliens always have to think it through. That's why I say it
Not for you. It's because I'm an I'm an idiot
Which supports the theory that the Beatles were all being used as conduits for being from another dimension
Described by Lenin in 1988 people magazine quote
I felt like a hollow temple filled with many spirits each one passing through me each one inhabiting me for a little time

(31:39):
And then leaving me to be replaced by another
Sounds like possession to me
As well as this theory sounds John Lenin himself claimed to have been abducted by aliens as a child
In an interview with one of Lenin's former former lovers may pang revealed his belief in life altering alien contact
Lenin held a belief that aliens would have the ability to bridge humanity under some new umbrella of thought of truth

(32:06):
That the world governments did not want us to become aware of
John thought that the governments of the world were covering up the truth about UFOs
He said
If the masses started to accept UFOs it would profoundly affect their attitude toward life politics everything
It would threaten the status quo
spiritually Lenin believed in the same grand creator of free masonry or cosmic consciousness of the new aiders

(32:30):
He laid it out like this quote
Christ Buddha Krishna Muhammad were all messengers of the supreme being
They were all saying basically the same thing
Lying down the laws of the universe and language appropriate to their culture
The trick is to make all the subconscious knowledge conscious
The idea that Chaman was possessed by demonic aliens is not that far of a stretch

(32:51):
His own story reveals he was dabbling with demonic forces and made contact with something of an evil nature
If we read an excerpt from people magazine in 1987
Before he left for Fort Chaffee that August he began seriously dating Jessica Blankenship a friend from the fundamentalist prayer groups
In one such group led by a decadre psychologist

(33:11):
Chaman and Jessica had their first experiences with some of the rare or more dramatic forms of charismatic Christianity the laying on of hands
miraculous healing
Speaking in tongues the gift of prophecy and the deliverance from demons
At times I would be on my back and five or six people would be laying on hands Chaman recalled years later

(33:32):
At other times there would be manifestations of demonic power
I remember one man barking like a dog and then assuming a karate position
We talked about demons more than we did about Jesus
He was finished praying to God for deliverance, but his loss of faith did not extend to the powers of darkness
I began to pray to Satan he told John Marxist co-counsel David Suggs

(33:57):
After months of refusing to talk about what he referred to as the spiritual matters relevant to John Lenin's murder
I said just make me crazy. I want I want to be psycho. I don't want to have to take this
It wasn't like I'd get down on my knees. It was like I'd be walking down the street or just doing what I was doing
And I'd say you know, I want to be crazy. I wanted to be totally mad out of touch with the world

(34:20):
While most would argue that Chaman was just plain crazy
He in fact had several assessments confirming this he insisted otherwise
The pastor of his church Reverend Charles McGowan was the first to visit Chaman in prison
He spoke of the mental illness of Chaman as something much darker in nature quote
There is a dimension to this case that the secular psychiatric world would never understand

(34:44):
I believe there was a demonic power at work
Could it be the Chaman was under the influence of demonic forces where these entities actually estraterials?
I believe it to be possible the idea that aliens exist as plausible
But as will reveal elsewhere in this book and may be that they are demonic forces from another dimension
Some call them fallen angels

(35:05):
And I find it quite possible since there are points of light and dark to be found in this world
Just like the occultus who practice magic believe there are forces of white and black magic. We are capable of contacting either one
I wrote that in 2017 I think
Back when it was crazy to talk about aliens, you know

(35:26):
simpler times
All right final topic we got to cover Joe Atwell
He was on tinfoil hat talking about catch from the ride not too long ago
A couple years ago maybe
And he claims that catch from the rise about a warning to free mason's about breaking the oath
And that's why mark david chaman was reading the book. It's a signal to other masons he was saying

(35:49):
He was sending out a warning to the other mason's apparently you know, you can't talk about what's really going on
And apparently john lemon told playboy magazine he didn't want to be a mason anymore
But he's in there for life and I couldn't validate that personally
I'm not saying Joe's making that up. I'm just saying I couldn't verify it. I couldn't find a

(36:11):
online copy of the interview
Apparently the interview to me in 1980 or the course of several days, but they didn't publish all of it
So I don't get into the little dicey territory there
And I'm not a big enough Beatles geek to know the whole story
um, but
If you read
Joe Atwell's go to his full article on post flavini flaviana

(36:37):
He talks about this thing the free mason and the rye theory
And if you recall the beginning of the story there's that 28 day period where he's studying Egyptian
And I talked about how the halfway point is the 14th day in which is November 18th day 322 remember
Well, he is referring to that whole period

(36:58):
I wonder if he knows that I once someone very reach out to Joe and tell him hey Isaac found the midday is or the midpoint is 322
Does that matter? I don't know
Well
He's saying that the 28th period of studying Egyptian is the same as free masonry
There's a 28 day minimum period between

(37:20):
Confirons of degrees and there's all this Egyptian mythology and they're in their studies
And I read that the process starts that 28th period starts when your petition is read in the lodge
Okay
But anyway, there's this 28 day period so to get from enter to apprentice to fellow craft the second degree
That's kind of what you see in the book and then he talks about how by the end of the book

(37:45):
Holden is actually a third degree of master mason
Which is the highest degree in standard free masonry
Or the blue lodge free masonry because only has three degrees
And once you hit master mason you're permitted to enter the holy of holies to learn the ultimate secret and
um

(38:06):
Robert Burns describes free mason as the sons of light
And they're sworn to implement the apocalypse on all the non-free masons and they're going to kill everyone exposed to the plans
Now that arguably is what holden is doing. He's mass murdering as a sort of
I don't know
Obsession with the free mason idea of killing the non-free masons

(38:27):
Now that enter to apprentice degree is
You know how to dig into some of these things is about learning some of the secrets the language of free masonry
And the fellow craft is more advanced. It's more into the enlightenment wisdom stuff says this degree represents the member reaching manhood

(38:49):
Which is interesting because that's kind of what the story is about
Right, it's about holden
Meturing and reaching
adulthood
becoming a man
And all the advi- he jose says all the advisors throughout the story holden seeks are giving him clues to initiate him

(39:09):
um
The one person says that life is a game with roles which is actually pretty pretty accurate right but recall the game the Michael Douglas movie
I'll put a link in the show notes
July of 2020 if you're on the
supporter feeds scroll back to july 2020 we did a whole analysis on the game

(39:30):
Because Michael Douglas he is born into this sort of wasp family
He's an investment banker told jerk and his brother gets him into the game
Which is this entertainment and this profound life experience
And what follows is basically an initiation to force one to question nature of reality face death and become reborn
Like the free masons

(39:54):
I'm your host Isaac wise hop and I've got some books to sell you down that old grifter alley
You probably know me as the podcast guy talking about pop culture conspiracies and occult symbolism
But did you know that I'm also a writer that's right I've written nine books since 2012 some of them better than others
And you can find all of them right now in three major options
Amazon calm. They've got all the books his paperbacks were in kindle

(40:17):
audible.com has all of them as audio books. I narrowed it all but the first one
And finally gumroad.com/isw is my personal page where you can buy signed copies of all my books including bundled packages
Super soft podcast t-shirts and much more my most popular book is the dark path
I wrote this in 2017 and it was basically a magnum opus for me about how the world of the occult

(40:41):
Intermingles with pop culture to try and create a satanic luciferian future
With aliens and the digital matrix a lot of my talking points have been proven more true over the years
And honestly, that's pretty scary sacrifice magic behind the mic was my second book written
And it's caused more of a stir than any other book that I've written because I talked about the occult symbolism and conspiracies in the world of hip hop

(41:02):
Which the world was not ready for in 2014 in fact
I went to series xm studios in 2016 to defend this book on shade 45
And I did a revision of the book to include a discussion about how I opening that experience was for me
This book was also featured in complex magazine when I got interviewed about the illuminating hip hop with mob deep legend
Prodigy I've written several more books in fact my first book or grand unified conspiracy theory

(41:26):
You can get that for free if you go to alluminitywatcher.com and sign up for my free email newsletter
If you can't find the links I put it on every post as well as you can go to the start here tab and scroll down and you'll find the entry field
And I will email you my first book for free
But you can check out all these books wherever you prefer to get them again
That's on amazon audible or get signed copies a gum road as in bubble gum gum road.com

(41:50):
slash iZac W
He has to follow all the rules right life is a game with roles. That's what they say in catcher and the rye
And the and the movies got free mason symbolism. I don't want to spoil anything go check out my
You got a lot to check out a lot of shows to catch up on if you haven't
So the idea that joa will put forward is that holden has

(42:15):
Previously failed go to get through initiation. That's what all the failings at the prep schools had been before this one
You know i kept getting kicked out of schools
But nonetheless he makes it through
And including the facing of one's own death right there's a scene where holden says something about feeling like he's dead
And this is the third degree the master mason degree which you imitate the death of hire mabiff

(42:45):
Then there's the scene at the end where the two brothers escort holden into the museum and you got all the Egyptian stuff right
And he ends up going into this tomb alone
And this is where like the mummies exhibit is i talked about in part one
Where holden's taking him down the spooky hallway then the kids get scared and they run away

(43:06):
The book he said to get to where the mummies are you had to go down this very narrow sort of hollow stones on the side
That they'd taken right out of the pharaoh's tomb and all it was pretty spooky and you could tell the two hot shots
I was with warnin join it too much
They stuck closest held on me and the one that didn't talk at all practically was holding my sleeve
Let's go he said to his brother. I seen him already come on. Hey he turned around and beat it

(43:31):
I was the only one left in the tomb then I sort of liked it in a way. It was so nice and peaceful
And that could be the chamber of reflection in free masonry
It's like a little tomb where there's a skull and the initiate is to contemplate death
Now joe adwell talks about the poem and this is where things get real interesting and

(43:54):
The real title is not catcher in the ribo fucker in the rye
Crazy
This is what josez where call field heard catch the child must have been singing fuck
Salinger's real title is therefore fucker in the rye and this describes call fields
Revelation in the free mason's holy of holies given below

(44:16):
In other words, that's the deepest secret of free masonry. It's fuck you
Which appears to be the apocalypse to non-free masons and death to members that are traders to the organization
Because you remember at the end of the story that we talked about in part one hold and kept seeing this word fuck you carved in all the walls remember that

(44:37):
And the museum that he's in represents the free masonic holy of holies
Which is why he doesn't go in earlier in the book. He's not initiated to get in there yet
And in the book there's reference to a guy named al pike
Like albert pike i didn't catch that when i read it a friend Carl loose talks about understanding patterns and loose

(44:58):
Also means light like loose a fur and there's lots of talks about ducks in the story
And it could be a reference to shooting ducks like shooting the sheep
Throughout the book hold and keep saying stuff
That you know, he's like that that kills me
Right, and this is more of the death stuff
And hold and goes home and he sees the sister Phoebe

(45:20):
journaling
With this cryptor griding that symbolically is a free masonic interpretation of the book of revelation in the end times
Oh, it's critical. It's pretty crazy if you read his whole uh
Catch it free masonic free mason in the rye
He explains it much deeper
mr. Antelini initiates holden

(45:40):
Into the final state into that master mason degree
That's the sexual abuse um and the book he says i woke up all of a sudden
I don't know what time it was or anything, but i woke up i felt something on my head some guy's hand
Boy, it really scared the hell out of me
What it was it was mr. Antelini's hand what he was doing
He was sitting on the floor right next to the couch in the dark and all and he was sort of petting me or patting me on the goddamn head

(46:05):
Boy, I'll bet i jumped about a thousand feet
And also this is where things get a little more insidious if you recall
um
In the book holden talks about leaving
Town to go to Colorado to work on a ranch and there's rumors of a powerful secret society that exists in Denver

(46:25):
In Colorado
Uh, this is it's in chapter 21 when he's talking to his sister Phoebe says nobody's gonna kill me use your head
In the first place i'm going away
What i may do i may get a job on a ranch or something for a while
I know this guy whose grandfather's got a ranch in Colorado
I may get a job out there i'll keep in touch with you when i'm gone if i go

(46:47):
We're almost done folks hanging there
And if you follow the end of the story
To sort of get back into that apocalypse talk
At the stories end call field now has the ultimate knowledge
and
At the same time this is from

(47:07):
uh
Joe at wills i'm reading from joe at wills free mason in the rye
okay
At the stories end call field now has the ultimate knowledge because he's the master mason right and at the same time
He has resigned himself to his role and his place in life as a free mason
He no longer wishes to catch the children rather. He is the fucker in the rye who lets them fall

(47:27):
He's wearing his shooting hat and is presumably now shooting the bull
That is christianity
Deliriously happy as he is soaked by falling rain
The horses on the merry go round symbolize the four horsemen who ride at the apocalypse
The smoke in your eyes is the smoke from call field symbolic rifle
Or is it a real rifle

(47:48):
Call field sanity and his grip on reality seem fragile
Perhaps his report is a sugar coating of a real mass murder event
In closing call field reminds us as he told us in the beginning
That he's been sent off to some sort of rehabilitation camp on the west coast where he's being subjected to psychoanalysts
Analysis or mind control before he will go on for more schooling

(48:11):
And joe at will has more believe it or not if you want to go deeper into this
It's called pedophile in the rye and he sums up a conspiracy of the above the book and how it ties into culture creation
He says
We asked the reader consider whether salinger created the catcher in the rye as part of this project
Culture moves slowly and the book seems to have been intended to operate as a precursor to the more destructive ideas about sex, drugs and music that would follow

(48:37):
The book helped to among other things begin began the process of isolating teenagers from their parents in order to break down the family structure
The trend started by holding call fields lonely teenage angst would end up in woodstock with drugged out baby boomers
Experience in casual sex in the mud while their rock idols
Many of whom were the children of military intelligence played music designed to diminish their intellect

(49:02):
So made you know shots fired from joe at well my goodness
He lays down a pretty good argument though. I got a hand at to him
And again, you can catch his his full um, I don't know if they're books necessarily, but his writings about this
On his website

(49:22):
Where is it post flaviana is where you can find the full articles if you want to dig deeper into it
And one of the idea in conclusion the book it's
alleged to be a trigger mechanism for mk ultramine control for murderers
And in the book it's argued that the people shooting hat
Which is a red hat

(49:45):
Interesting uh you could tweak that today, but we're gonna keep it
um
The it could be a fes right and the fes aligns with free masonry
Which i'm work i've got a gravity falls analysis i worked on
Years ago and i'm like three quarters through every episode of gravity falls

(50:08):
And uh it's a major part of that and i found a link to Epstein in gravity falls
I mean I got all kinds of stuff. I just got to sit down and finish it, but um
And so say what i'm saying stay subscribed to my show folks
I'm gonna give you a gravity falls dot deep dive one of these years one of these days
Who knows when it happens i really follow my

(50:29):
My sort of intuition when it comes to making shows
Like sometimes i'll be really into a subject and i just dive in and then other times
Kind of float around and like okay, let me get some stuff done
So who knows
But it but it ties into the fes and the shriners. It's tied into free masonry

(50:49):
And because one of the characters in gravity falls wears one all the time okay
um
So holins align with the free masons and he is allowed to break any of the cries he wants for the greater good the
The great work of the free masons so he wears this hat. He's killing kids at the end
He's got the moral authority

(51:11):
Very sandy hook someone in the patreon comments said that i guess the atom lands is said something about
Protecting kids when he was shooting them. I didn't i couldn't find that um i'm not saying it doesn't exist
I casually quickly quickly looked and i didn't see it um
So whoever said that
Please drop a link if you if you got one it it is interesting, you know, huh?

(51:31):
and then um
That you know there's just so much going on this book it's hard to ignore it and say that oh there's absolutely nothing there
And you could come out of this with two viewpoints, which is i kind of go between the two on the one hand
If you take it from the rational point of view
non-conspiratory, you could just argue that

(51:52):
Look, this was an influential book in the 50s and 60s. It was even a radical book because it wasn't just sunshine and rainbows
and the hardy boys
It tapped into the angst of teenagers all over the world that apparently nothing had done before
and
The support for why this is so influential when you see it with all these sort of pop culture moments and murders and things

(52:15):
We it's hard to understand today with our frame of reference because we're majorly desensitized
I grew up and this was just normal
pop culture this angst rebellion sort of vibe
And this kind of book won't even hit the radar today
um
So it's hard to be in that frame of reference of the 40s 50s 60s

(52:40):
So we look at this book and we say well
You know, it's in all these movies and murders and so influential. It's got to be brainwashing people right
But in reality, maybe it was just a radical influential book back then
You know, and I would compare it how it's forced to compare it
I would say we'll look at in 2020 conspiracy theories
They were too radical they were again. We all got censored a ton. I'm still getting censored to this day

(53:05):
and
All the things we were talking about
2020 and before if you're no jeep been around, you know, I've been doing this since 2011
Lot of these conspiracies are coming true
Um the great reset the aliens the transhumanism and the billionaires shoving us into the digital matrix and it's we're sliding into it

(53:25):
I mean, it's plain as day. I'll do a show about that one of these days and
You could just argue from a rational point of view that like this was just influential on the other hand
If you put on that Tim foil hat, which I know you do
You got this author who was military intelligence
Around the time of MK all trying to fifties when the CA was doing this stuff

(53:49):
planted a ton of subtleish sort of not so subtle references to in-cell murderers and sex perversion of pedophilia and sex abuse
mass murdering
And author himself who identified as holding
Kind of had these strange petal vibes and anti-social behaviors
And then you got all these actual murders that happen right

(54:13):
people actually catching bodies
influenced by this book
in their hands
And it ties into a lot of real MK ultra mind control murder earth that conspiracies like project chaos that Tom O'Neil wrote about with Charles Manson
So I'd argue that there is something real in city as beneath the surface

(54:34):
uh, but obviously it's up to you right um, I just thought it was a very interesting study and
If you made it this far into the two-parter
Thank you for listening. Thanks for sticking with it. I appreciate that again
I'll put links to the show notes for some other shows that we talked about if you're on the supporter feeds
You're gonna have to scroll back on the app. I'm sorry. This is kind of the way it goes
uh

(54:55):
And um again, I got some super soft t-shirts. I haven't sold them in a while. I'm like what happened
You guys don't like these shirts in a ward you hate me. What's going on?
By a shirt gumrow.com/iswlinkovershow notes is always till next time. Stay positive
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Catcher in the Rye Conspiracies Pt 2: JD Salinger, Mark David Chapman's Aliens & Joe Atwill's Freemasonry in the Rye!

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