November 20, 2024 • 41 mins
As Open Era gets close to closing the circle, Rafael Nadal got there before us. Devang and Simon celebrate the life of the great Spaniard before turning their attention towards the ATP Finals and the BJK Cup. They also give their thoughts on Taylor Fritz’s hair and Carlos Alcaraz’s nose strips. Riveting podcasting.
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Come join the Patreon family for bonus content, access to the exclusive discord server and ad free episodes.
Follow @OpenEraPod on Twitter! While you're there say hello to @DesaiDevang or reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@openera.ca
If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store.
If you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Open Era 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Hello, and welcome to the Open Air Podcast. My name
is Devilling Design. I'm joined as always by mister Simon
Bush or Bush. Our final countdown has begun. As we
noted last week, we are wrapping up Open Era at
the end of the year. How are you feeling, Bush.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
I feel good. We've got some nice messages of support.
I don't think we're dialing back the clock yet. I
don't think we're changing our mind, but we're.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Not done yet. We're not done yet. Yeah, we're not
changing our mind, but we're not done yet. And I
messaged you over the weekend because I lost sense of
time and we probably the reason this episode is not
out earlier is because of things happened, including news. But
I lost sense of time and then realized as I
was watching mister Taylor Fritz beat down Zverev again, I'm like, hey, Bush,
(01:05):
do you want to talk about tennis? And I will
miss that ability to do this, which because I think
that's something I took for granted all these years, was
to be able to be like, Hey, let's talk about
such and such. And it just so happens that we
have a shitload to talk about, don't we.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, And I also feel like there is a contingent
of podcasts out there that stick around in people's feeds
and post once every four years and everyone's surprised when
it comes up. Watch this space. You never know.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
When ash Party wins twenty twenty six Australian Open. You
better believe I'm coming back, man. Yeah, that's a very
good point. Okay, Well, like I mentioned a lot of news,
but we'll begin with the biggest and saddest, a sudden
end to a legendary career, Rafael Nadal and Spain going
(01:59):
out in the quarterfinals at home to the Netherlands Botik
van der Zanderslip. Bush I feel like it was a
few years ago when we've brought Botik onto the scene
and we're in awe of his awkward game that we
grew to love. But I would not have predicted that
he would be the person to end it, to end
(02:22):
Raphael Theodal's career. But here we are in a rock
is Rock Is atmosphere at Martin Carpina Arena and Malaca
incredible scenes outside of the grounds as well. Bush I
felt like it was sort of going to be destiny,
that Spain was just going to wield themselves past at
least the Netherlands into the semifinals to give Rafas some
(02:44):
more runway, especially after we heard the reports about RAFA
practicing getting there early, having the practice set against Alcaraz
and looking good. It felt like they would have another
day at least in the sun. But no, the Netherlands first.
It was Botic beating Grapha in straight sets. Carlos Alcarraz
(03:06):
beat Talon Greek Spoor in the second tie, which prolonged
it into the final rubber. But Wesley kolhoff Man Bush
you saw him in Paris. He came through in a
big way along with Botic against Carlos Alcarez and Mark Renolers.
So that's it. Initial reactions pushed this, I mean.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Death taxes and Botic, is it not? You can't outrun
either kind of the country of Spain either. Given how
he performed at the US Open, taking out Carlos Akaraz
as well, this was a competitive Davis Cup tie. I
don't think anyone can argue with the fact that the
probably the better team won here just on tennis merit alone.
(03:46):
I think everyone was willing for the fairy tale finish,
but truth be told, dev the fairy tale finish was
never on because listening to the Nadal quotes afterwards, he
wouldn't even have made himself available in the coming rounds. Afterwards,
this was once and done. He wanted to be there,
he wanted to play a match. I thought he actually
gave a really good account of himself against a very
good player and a very good ball striker. It was
(04:10):
high level tennis. We got to see him one last time,
and I think for all the things we were trying
to work out what his final match and what the
sendoff would be, they seemed pretty good. Dev It seemed
I'm sure they would have liked to have won the
Davis Cup. I'm sure they would have liked to have
gone further than one round and one rubber, but it
didn't happen. But I really enjoyed watching that final matchup
(04:30):
because there's something very special about a Raffi and a
Dal match where even though if he's down a set
and a break, in the back of your mind, you're
still going, ah, he might have this. Still he still
can still feel like coming and I think having that
magic one more time was something that I think we
can all circle and feel happy that we got to experience.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Yeah, when it was four to one and he got
the first breakback, I was like, Okay, it's happening, It's
gonna happen. But no days, I feel like we're getting
used to this in tennis. Bush like, these exits are
not fairy tales realistically, like Pete Sampras's side, and I
might be forgetting others. I also called him Mark Granoler's
(05:15):
Marcel Granoler's apologies to the Granolers fan, but the fairy
tale endings, they don't usually happen in any sport. I
mean there are, sure there are some, but maybe it's
recency bias, but I feel like tennis is quite cruel
to its grades when it's over. I'm thinking Fed hobbling
off Wimbledon, and then obviously Rafa trying to gut through
(05:37):
the Olympics, and then here today. I think, like you said,
this was less about like a visibly ailing Grafa. I
think this was more about I just didn't have the
level anymore. And you, to your credit as well regarding Botic,
like he looked nervous as hell, but like obviously and
I think not only playing Rafa and is potentially last match,
(05:58):
but representing your country as well. I thought it was
really impressive the way he pulled it together, because I
thought there was a chance he might have just thrown
it away after seeing some of the double faults and
like just the general nerves. But it feels surreal, I
will say, like seeing all of the tributes and Fed's
note Feed's post today Serena's message, like really felt a
(06:23):
wave of sadness come over me. And I don't know
if it's because of just like generally how the world
is going these days. It probably is. But even on
social media, like consuming it felt bad. And I think
that's because X's or Twitter, whatever the hell you want
to call it is just truly cooked and bad, bad, bad.
So even taking it in there did it feel good?
(06:44):
I don't know, man, it just felt like, rather than
a celebration, I felt more about I felt more sad
in general by Rapha's departure.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I felt more okay with about things when I knew
it was going to come, rather than how I feel
now that it's happened.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
I think just the length of time that it's been
since he's been competitive at the top end of the sport,
just how long we've waited for his retirement to come,
and I think a lot of the time it was
more in hope than an actual expectation that he was
gonna be competitive at the at the tail end of
Grand Slams and be competitive really at tour level at
(07:24):
the top end of the tour. And I think that
is what made this a little easier for some people
to take because we've had so many good moments. I think,
if you really want to look at it, that French
Open final where everyone was standing around, going is he
going to retire? Feels like the feels like the right
time for him to do it, and it didn't happen,
(07:44):
and then you sort of got this two and a
half years of will he warranty questions about it. Yeah,
I've said this before, and apologies for repeating myself. This
just felt right, and to me, it isn't It isn't sad.
It is just closure. And I think he said as
much right. I was gonna pull on of his quotes
up where he's he said, in some ways, it's it's good.
(08:06):
Maybe this was my last match because I lost my
first match in the Davis Cup and I lost my
last one. We closed the circle, which is a very
rapping on the dal quote, but I think it is
damn You can.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
We of crying in the club, of crying at the club.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
I don't. I mean everyone, everyone has their own association
with raffing on Nadal and his career and how they
feel about this moment. Just yeah, I can't think of
a better way of saying. It just feels fine, like
it feels right. It feels like this was not someone
who who who went out with so much unfulfilled potential.
(08:46):
He did everything, literally everything, and we got one last
match of him fighting and competing for his for his country.
That that's that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
That's well said, and perhaps more, I think this is
a better sentiment than I have, which is devastation and despair.
Let's honor, let's honor the moment, Let's honor the spectacle.
I saw oh and Lewis our friend in front of
the show on Blue Sky Show. Some Blue Sky people
flock there saying maybe the doll's perfect role would be
(09:16):
a coach for someone like Alcaaz, which should be amazing.
I think that would be awesome. I'm curious about raf
his next steps. I do think he'll be around because
based on my reading of his stuff with the Academy,
he is super hands on and I think that will continue,
so that would be cool. Like it's not like we're
gonna see the last of them, but I'm beginning to
(09:38):
respect more and more, and not like I don't respect
these other players who have retired the way they have,
but people like ash Bardy, you're people who are like, nah,
I'm done in a way that I leave completely on
top and able to fully fully leave you on their
own merit. I think there's somebody who said about longevity
(09:59):
and battling and warrior mentality and everything that Rafa had
to offer, but I do remember a little bit more.
I think about the way some of these guys have
gone out towards the end and feeling just general sadness,
and that's on me. I get it. But there's something
to be said about people choosing to walk away when
they can still do it. And I know that's it's
(10:19):
such a short list, but I'm thinking about those those
athletes more and more of these days as we see
people like Mike Tyson like going and even though everyone
knew and that this was ridiculous and not not possibly
right to have happened. A part of me was like,
maybe he'll win, because yeah, like that's that's what people
are holding on to.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Dev I think there's an interesting series here, whether it's written,
whether it's video, whether it's podcasts, whatever medium, it takes
on about the end of professional athletes careers, because if
you were to circle the best of the best in tennis,
I feel like we know most of them of how
their career is ended, and it has largely been out
(11:04):
on their backs, like it's largely been being dumped out
in a third round. It's largely being you know, not
as competitive anymore. There's very few occasions that you can
find within our sport of players like reaching the top
of the mountain and then just handing in, handing the
card in, Right, I'm done, it's over. And I think
(11:24):
the decision making process of what goes through the athlete's brain,
especially like players who have been at the very very
top end of the sport of any sport, what goes
through their head to actually start the process of finishing
their careers and what do they want those those situations
to look like. We may never know why rafin Adar
chose this moment and why at this time it felt
(11:48):
right for him, in the same way we might ever
know why Serena Williams wanted to play that final US Open,
or Andre Agasi losing to Benjamin Becker of all people
at the US Open. But I think there is interesting
stories behind that, and I hope one day someone explores
a little more of the back end of a lot
of these pro careers, because I find it very, very interesting.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
You've given me an idea that I will they will
take away and then ruminate over.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
But Tony one of us worked for a big sports company.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I know That's why I was going to say it,
but I maybe I can try and sell this or something.
Bojic said that Nadal is the biggest sports figure in
Spanish history. I think that's right, right. I mean, we
are not We're obviously not the the anger. It's just
are the people who can adjudicate this, But it feels right.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
I think he's right on that one. I was trying
to think of any players or athletes that would rile
with him. The only one that came to mind for
me was Fernando Alonso. I don't I don't think Fernando
Alonso comes close to the career of rapping Nadal with
all jurispect to Fernando Alonso, who is a great champion
in his own right. There's obviously any number of Olympic athletes.
(13:02):
There's what's this what's his face? Gosh, I'm terrible at this.
You can tell. Watch a little cycling.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
That's a real content.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
No Spanish, isn't he No, he's not Spanish, he's not
during during Spanish? Right, Yeah, okay, okay, there you go, Miguel.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Yeah, so that we were dope and then the contour
was Spanish. But I mean, all these guys are on
ip Okay, So the answer is yes. The fact that
you didn't know someone in your names is is true?
Positive that it Isn't it? All right? It shows to
Gasol shouse, to the Gasol brothers, because you know, you
got to respect them. There are it's not a crazy
(13:43):
list though, it's not a you know what, I'll say
this at the risk of rankling our Spanish friends and listeners.
Not a crazy list there, Spain, I thought, uh, I thought,
I mean maybe the team sport aspect, just a lot
of great athletes, but truly.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Great and they're not historically a great Olympic nation. Either
in terms of their competitiveness at the top end for
gold medals either. So you kind of they have had
great Olympic athletes, not least Mita Belmonte, who was a
fantastic swimmer in our own right. But yeah, they don't
have a long list of individual champions. It's much more
(14:24):
on the team sports side of things.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
How about this, I think Rafa is a top five
most recognizable athlete full stop in the world.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
You mean currently or historically.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Currently, Yeah, historically it's a bit tough. But like I
think right now, if you put twenty Randoms in a
room and showed them his face, they're going to get it.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, I think I could be talked into that. I
think I could. Yeah, that seems seems reasonable.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
And I think his last We're going to do an
episode I think before we wrap on Rafa specifically, but
for a legacy. I think to be someone that people
think of what it means to fight and challenge yourself
and push through and never give up and always keep
believing in yourself. To be like, that's the guy that
(15:12):
I think of when I want to feel those emotions.
That is probably the coolest thing that you could possibly
have as an identifier that everyone associates you with, that
idea that it's never over, it's always worth fighting, it's
always worth giving your all. I think that's just an
(15:32):
incredible testament taraff in Adell's career. And I, like I said, Bush,
I think I'm more sad than anything today because I
did want to see it continue a bit longer. But
if this is the way you wanted to go, it
does feel, like you said, closing the circle feels right
for someone like him.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Can we just play a really quick game. I'm so
fascinated to hear your answers on this one. If I
had some let's do it game show music, I would
play it quickly.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
At a time like this as a weaving control. Let's
play a game.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
I should save this for the end. This is quality
material that I'm letting go it. Okay, let me play
a game with you. Who globally more famous. Let's start
with an easy one. Nadal or Andy Murray, Nadal, Okay,
Wrapping Nadal, Novak, Djokovic, still Nadal, I'd say rapping Nadal.
Serena Williams Serena, Williams, Serena, Williams, Roger.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Federer, Serena Williams.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
I agree, it's it's funny that we heard the same
answers on now and we should do that more broadly though.
It'd be interesting to see, like how far down the
list we get before we disagree on things.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
I get who's famous, well, I think it's I think
it's barely federer like I think it's and truly I
think it's a little bit because he's been around slightly longer.
If that is only on years, I'm gonna say it's
it's like. I think Novak in a few more years
will get up there closer.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
To being I don't think so well. Prinsibians was Prime
Minister of Serbia. I suppose that's yeah, or like.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
The head of data or some shit. But yeah, like
I think, yeah, that's a good one. I think Serena
is the winner, but Novak's up there. I think you'd
be surprised how how recognizable Novak is. Like in India,
I guarantee you. In India, I guarantee you ninety percent
of people know who Novak Djokovic is interesting.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I want to what he's like in China as well,
how well known he.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
Is, it's a huge number. I bet it's a huge number.
I think it's up there on that messire in all
though tire for these people.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
That's my no, not a chance.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
It might not bury out. Might it might not bear
out in the social media numbers though not so maybe
I'm wrong.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
That's such a good game Jokovic or Messi. There's no, no,
not a chance. Messi is like probably two three times
more recognized.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but still. I was in Mexico, in
Mexico City, Mexico City, walking down the street, just through
some shops, did not expect to see Novak Djokovic head here,
but it was there with his big old face on,
(18:22):
and it was just him.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Congratulations at all. It's great.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
We'll end it there. When we come back on Partying Shots,
we will talk about those ATV finals, which fully confirmed
where I'm at with the ATP hint not good. We'll
also talk about the Billy chin Kin Cup other alcaazz stuff,
plus some more news and notes coming up next. Welcome
(18:54):
back to the Open air podcast Bush. The ATP finals
went down. They went down. I mentioned this in the discord,
but I was discussed and shocked by the final four
No slight two three time Slam finalists cast, but rude
who is not box office for me, or Taylor Fritz, who,
(19:15):
in all fairness and I think you pointed this out
Bush had a really really great year, Taylor Fritz. And
to be able to just totally own a top five
player like he has now done with Alexander servis something
to put on your put under your cap, but overall
a big old meh for these ATP finals. How do
(19:35):
you feel about them? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
I feel much the same way. I would agree with
you on the week and season four Taylor Fritz terrible
hair choice asides, and I was glad to see that
got rectified quickly. Not to give too many spoilers away
for year end awards, he's the most improved player on
the ATP. He's also probably the most improved player in tennis,
(19:58):
like Bonnan with greatest respective Joan HARLINI and some of
the stories we've seen on the women's side, it's been
a remarkable ascent. I didn't think for ITTs had this
in him to go from a sort of middling fifteen
to twenty five player to being a top five player.
What a what a season for him? And I tip
my cap you.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
Message me during cinner rude and it was one of
the more pointed shots at Castle rude I've I've received.
But also unfortunately this is just it. That match was
almost unwatchable, and I don't think it was so much
a Yannick Cinner thing.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Yeah, not a caspar rut and had a nice week.
You got to go to Turin, you got to be
part of the club. But there are levels to this,
aren't there. And perhaps giving one of the more interesting
quotes of the week when asked about the difference between
Nick Cinner and Novac Joho quote the Norwegian here, Yannick
(20:58):
hits a faster ball than Novak. He doesn't let you
Breathe not going to say easier to play Novak because
he's the best in history. At least with Novak you
can play more rallies and not be terrified of Novak
ripping like a bomb down the line or cross court
of these things. For me, you don't realize how Fastick
plays unless you watch him live and you're there in
(21:18):
the stadium on the TV. It's not fair the speed.
I put a note in a discord and I think
I messaged you to say this as well. John Nick
Sinner is well and truly the world number one. This
is not you know, all the things that we can
say and rightfully point at the allegations towards him are reasonable.
(21:40):
I think there's lots of things that we can be
made of that. But on tennis alone, if you remove
all of the other factors, fucking hell, dev this kid
is really really good.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
The contrast is something these end of seasons in Carlos
is limping home, did not have a good atp finals,
last of people you shouldn't be losing to, comes to
the Davis Cup, huge, huge emotional time, wins the singles match,
loses the doubles. Where's Yannick somehow beating the allegations and
just continuing to win and win in such convincing fashion.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Yeah, he's getting better. I think that's the thing that's
really really scary to a lot of the top of
the tour is that I don't even think this is
anywhere close to his final form of what he's capable
of doing, to the.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Point now where, because everything you said is true, there's
no way in hell he could possibly lose this appeal
right with Wata and friends, because what's riding on this
is that he is it. He is the it man
for men's tennis going forward at the top of the game.
Not obviously not saying Carlos is done or anything, but
(22:48):
he is the best men's player in tennis. That if
he were to be suspended as one of the first
big moments posting it all, that's a terrible thing, right,
So allow me to put my tinfoil had on and say,
even though I was skeptical that anything would come up
the appeal, anyways, this couldn't happen, right, that would be
one of the most stunning things.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I feel like the thumb is going to be placed
fairly onto the scale one way or another. It's we
will make this go away.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
We have to and I yeah, And if it does,
I wonder how quickly it goes away. Probably very quickly,
to be I mean, it's already gone away. Listening to
the commentary because they can't mention it every time, it
sounds probably a bit ridiculous, right, I guess if you're
the commentators, But also this post true era we live in,
it's a bit much like it's a bit crazy. I
(23:38):
know he's not the only one, and I know it's
it's not nefarious, and his lawyers cleared him and they
went through the channels, etc. But something a bit wild
to me Bush that this all happened in the same
year that he announced himself as the best player.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
In the game. It's very, very weird, isn't it. I
think it's partly's story as well. That's not that doesn't
look good for him, just being a player that was
hanging around the top ten, and you're like, well, you
know he sometimes he fades away in matches, you know.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
I wish he was stronger.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Oh shit, Look, he's number one. He won seventy three
matches this year.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
He's puked all the time. Now it's pure, it's pure. Now,
it's pure hysteria, just asking the questions. Snalled info Wars
has been shut down. God, okay, boy, should we go
more ATV files or do you want to move on?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
I'm not sure there is much else to talk about me. Well,
maybe let's just circle back on this question. Maybe I
can ask you this, what's wrong with Carlos Akaraz.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I honestly don't know other than fatigue and too much tennis.
Unless you have a theory.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Do you think it is the nose patch? Do you
think that was the.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Oh gosh, I know you have of an extreme. You
wrote a lengthy, lengthy response to this nose patch in
the notes that I was a bit bit bothered by.
But I'll see the floor to you if you wanted.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I can't actually remember another professional tennis player doing this.
I'm trying to think of other athletes that I've seen
doing this. There must have been people historically. I must
be forgetting someone who's a very like famous nose patch.
Where what are those things even? Cool? Breathing breathing patches?
I don't know what the what the actual forgetting?
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Okay, so like a zillion NFL players, I.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Feel it war Yeah, but you know it's the NFL.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
In the NFL, it's the NFL where it's a lawless king.
It's fair. Clearly he lost all aura. Though the color
was off. I don't think you go with that color
unless he was trying to match.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I don't think he rocked it particularly well. With the
greatest respect to the world number or whatever is.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Yeah, it was. I wish he didn't go. I guess
he had to go. I'm not quite sure actually how
that worked out once Novak said he wasn't going, But yeah,
I think he said he was battling illness, right, couldn't
Breathe sounds like being sick to me. A hell of
a long year, right, a crazily long year. Several points
(26:22):
at this year where I was like, he should take
a break, And here we are at the end where
it's November what nineteenth, and that's his last match of
the season barring fourteenth Saudi exhibitions. But needs a rest
and he's back at it.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
In a couple of weeks, okay, after doing some very
quick duck duck going here. It is the official terminology
according to very Well Health, which I actually don't know
the origins at that website, even though it appears at
the top of searches. Is it legit?
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
It doesn't feel very legit anyway. I've never heard it
as quickly trying and look at their about page to
see anyway. Nasal strip is what it's medical terms.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Free advertising.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Geez okay heeus for this stuff.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Billy jin Kin cup push. The Brits are back and
it's sickening.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Brits are back. The takeover is complete. First, Kirstarmer came
into power and right of the world. Secondly, David Lammie
turned up at the United Nations read the Riot Act
to Vladimir Putin and that will end the war. Thirdly,
we take over the BJK Cup.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
We did a queer, we did a queue.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
We all knew we had it in a small island,
but we are mighty in stature. I'll stop now. It
was a really good week, though, wasn't it. It was nice
to see especially on the Radi of Carnoe front. I
thought she played some really good stuff with respect the
place that she she played. You can only beat what's
in front of you, and I thought she actually gave
a really good account for herself. They of course did
(28:04):
lose to Slovakia, but still it was nice to see
British tennis, especially on the women's side, which has been
a little dormant, especially at team competition level for a while.
It's been nice to see them get some results here.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Some pretty spicy results in general. I watched the Canada tie.
I was hoping we'd get Laila Racha Kanu for a
US Open rematch, but speaking of as all, as someone
who's played so much tennis, Layla Man not surprised that
she looked out of gas against Katie Bolter as well.
(28:36):
But Rachie kind of looked amazing against Rebecca Marino on
that first set and then was able to win in
the second and then yeah, I mean, I will say
I thought they should have beat Slovakia. A bit disappointed
by that loss, but I think the big one, the
big match of the ties for me was Schianta Paulini bush.
(28:57):
I know you guysiga, and she's I don't even think
we've written her off, right. I think it's just like
sabal Anca, with the way she's played at the end
of the season, has taken over the mantle a little
bit similar to center outcras if you can, if you
put Eager in that alcraz bucket. But I thought that
was a massive win over Paulini before they lost in Devils.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
It's interesting you say that, because I yes, it's a huge.
When Frigus Brontek has given the context of the tournament
that they were playing in, the competition they were playing in,
I thought this was a really good account for Jasmine
Paulini as well, just playing I was gonna say the
world number one, she's not the world number one anymore.
Playing the world number two and running her as close
(29:38):
as she has done just given some of the performances
that Paulini's had in big matches, on the big stages,
I thought there was encouraging signs of her that she's
not being overawed by these situations anymore. I'm I'm stoked
to see what I'm calling her the hornet. That's what
I'm going with from now on. Yeah, I don't think
(29:58):
this is a fluke. I don't think there's a fluke here.
I think she's there on merit. She's firmly inside of
the world's top five. Yeah. I think there's more room
for growth there. And it wouldn't shock me if she
repeats her twenty twenty four campaign again in twenty twenty five,
although it's going to be very, very hard to follow
up which has been a really outstanding campaign.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Who is the best Slovakian tennis player in your mind
in history? Got some? We got some like true tennis
head picks to go from. We've got dominic her body,
a tennis player, a tennis fans ultimate pick. We got
Martin Kleizan, who I was a fan of, Lucas Laco
(30:40):
Lucky Lucas. On the women's side, Dominikas Sibil Kova, Daniella
Harte Kova. But I will say Mary and Weida Slovakian
Snovak's coach, former coach. But this team that's made the
final bush quite unheralded. This is quite a run for them.
Victoria here on Cuova, Rebecca's round, Kova turn, it's Milankova.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
What a run. Just a collection of players ranked between
thirty and one hundred in the world. You just get
them all together and create a good atmosphere. They have
a chance to run really deep in this competition, which
is the way that it shook out.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Similar seen it with countries like Canada as well Bush
where they have that Just a lot of great players
who are maybe not top twenty but very very good,
all playing well at the same time. And here we
are playing a power like Italy in the final. Okay, bosh,
what do you mean? Harvard? Is this right? Harvard?
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Yeah? Have you read about this story about which I
didn't realize. Okay. The background of this is that the
WTA and Harvard Business School working together to provide a
pathway for players, either in competition or post retirement, for
them to get a degree or learn lessons of how
(31:58):
to make the transition to what they want to do afterwards.
Which I didn't realize is that actually several of the
sports have done this as well. I'm not very prominent,
the NBA have done this as well. And I am
buy in large, very supportive of higher educational post secondary
education having more routes and professional sports because I think
that is a very positive thing. Lifelong learning is fantastic,
(32:19):
and a lot of these athletes don't have clear pathways
to know what to do post playing career, so I
think that's a very positive thing. Can it just not
be fucking Business School? And can it just not be
Harvard University as well? Why if I.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
See Caroline Garcia reading out Laurence Summer's press release about
the freaking, the freaking IMF canceling a twenty billion dollar
loan to Sri Lanka because the terms are insane, I
good guy.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
I want to believe that Harvard Business School and Harvard
University are doing this because they care about the the
individuals and giving them perhaps the chance to gain some
excellent education and enrich their post playing career. I can't.
(33:14):
I'm trying really hard to do this without saying the
fucking opportunity because it's such a disgusting word.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Kings cha about the season being too long. Convience, Okay,
so I feel like it's.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
So. I guess we are fans of Village and King.
She is one of the most important figures in professional tennis,
one of the most important figures in all of sport.
I would say, just given the nature of who she
is as an athlete, what she has done, especially for
for gender equality, and not just from the women's side
of things. I think very positive influence on men as well,
(33:55):
on men's sport, because you have to recognize that in
that capacity as well. It's it's forced more of a
conversation and equality is not just a women's issue. It's
it's an everyone issue and everyone should partake in it.
That's the only way that we move forward. She's had
a few clunkers, though, you know, she's starting to get
(34:15):
a bit I don't know, there's some stuff here that
is like just a bit, a bit naf So I
don't really know where to land on this. It's probably
a positive thing that we're ending the podcast before I
start slandering one of the most important people ever.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Exactly exactly. I mean, that's well said, because the names
and numbers, thing like this will probably happen, you know,
some of these things I was thinking about, like to
make these players more recognizable. It's not far away, but
that makes me shudder, you know, like the fact that
it's not that far away, and like, and I get
(34:55):
what she's saying where it's like, this is about the
people after me, and like, don't target got try and
target me when you're marketing the game, like it's the kids,
et cetera. But that's one thing, But then it's another
thing that the ideas are the ones that are being
an actor are coming from the octagenarians or like the
people who have been in the game for sixty years, right,
or like the it's a fine line. And I see
(35:19):
examples where and she's been involved heavily with the PWHL
and the Women's Hockey League and you're seeing like really
good examples.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
Of which is very positive.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Don't have to do things, Yeah, they don't have to
do things like like they have been doing and it's good.
And I'm like, okay, So to write off all of
these charges is bad. It's not fair, I don't think.
But from what it sounds like, I don't think. I
like the changes that are being proposed, and that that
probably is a sign regarding my overall fandom, you.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Know, definitely, I think I disagree with Bilijin King on
Suny Saudi Arabia influence of where the WTA is getting
its money. And I've said this before on the podcast.
I think that is a legitimate conversation to have because
there are inches of even inside of feminism as an
ideology or always a concept that would have that division
(36:06):
as well about what is the correct path forward. I
think I think that is a legitimate conversation. It's some
of the tennis stuff I just find like really just
not just blah, but like really insulting is far too
strong a word. But the thing like one, two, three,
four as opposed to fifteen love fifteen thirty, Like, how
(36:27):
stupid do you think children are? That's the thing that
I always find strange. Oh, we have to make it
easier for how fucking dumb do you think a child is?
That they can't work out like that? How many things
in the world don't make sense and we still call
them a certain thing that you have to learn as
a child. Just because like something is the way it
is doesn't mean that a child is not able to
pick these things up.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Ah yeah, I help. My size says it all. Yeah,
how dumb do you think we are? I think pretty dumb.
This is a question. The answer, well, shock gonna sound
you Okay. I think that's it for tennis. Do you
have anything for two challenges a reading?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
I have quite a few things. Actually. I went to
see both Conclave and Anora.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Good good things that were both.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
I I said to you this before we started recording.
I have mixed things to say about both of those films,
and indeed, I have to say I think this has
been an incredibly weak year for films in general. The
stuff I saw at the film Festival, A lot of
the big releases, even some of the stuff that's in
Oscar Contention and of course like Behaving Me awards are
(37:40):
not the arbiter of good taste or anything like that.
I just have not seen a lot of even a
lot of the highly praised and highly reviewed stuff. Critically,
I think it's been pretty naff, to be honest, I
think it's been pretty middling. And honestly I put Anora
and Conclave in that as well. I thought they were fine.
I thought they were like solid seven, seven and a
half out of ten films in a year that's had
(38:01):
a lot of like five to seven out of ten range,
I would.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Say, damn Bush. I like it though, I like the.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
Strong takes like the fire. We have six weeks left.
I got to try and annoy everyone before I know.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I know, I don't even have one. I don't really
have a good one. I think it was might chout
out to Buffalo Bills. Is that allowed? I will say,
like the the regular seasons being meaningless issue across all
sports is definitely real. And that being said, there were
(38:40):
the opposite of that, like the Premier League, where like
there is no playoffs and every game is life or
death felt like a lot, and I found myself gravitating
back towards the easy going times of NFL football, which
ahn's insane, but god, Buffalo beating Kansas City and not
letting them go undefeated felt really good. And it's been
a while, it's been I've taken a lot of L's
(39:02):
fandom wise recently, just to see that. I know it's
a it's a could be a meaningless game in the end,
but I enjoyed it as a sporting spectacle and I
hope to not take so many else and in your future.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
Rough sporting year for me, was it not? In twenty
twenty four Leads losing the playoff final, well was losing
the Stanley Cup final, England losing the Euro's final. That
was all within a space of whatever it was three months.
Was not a good twenty twenty four from me.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
Twenty twenty five, sir, So I'm glad that.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
You got some success, some success at least this Bills
team is good as well. Well, actually, I don't think.
I don't think this Bill team is you know, outstandingly good,
but they are more than capable enough of competing in
a season which doesn't have many outstanding team better.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
They're better than they've been and I think the other teams.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Are a little worse too, which is fine.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Workout. Yeah, all right, we'll leave it there. We've got
a few more shows left. I think we're going to
do three more Bush. Does that sound right? Ah?
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, three or four? I might have one more. I
can speak in three or four.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Okay, so three or four more shows. Stay tuned for those,
Stay tuned for whatever else news we have in the meantime.
But yeah, keep it locked here on open Era un
till the end of the year. For Dylan on the
Once En Ties, and for Bush, thank you so much
for listening to open Era. I was good to shout
out the Discord, but I realized now the show is ending.
(40:27):
So I will say again our wonderful friends on the
Discord are wonderful. Their messages after the last week show
were awesome, and I, like, I mean, they're a huge
reason we have kept doing the show as well. So
love you guys. Thanks so much for sticking with us,
and we'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to
open Era. Take care of the
Hello, and welcome to the Open Air Podcast. My name
is Devilling Design. I'm joined as always by mister Simon
Bush or Bush. Our final countdown has begun. As we
noted last week, we are wrapping up Open Era at
the end of the year. How are you feeling, Bush.
Speaker 2 (00:30):
I feel good. We've got some nice messages of support.
I don't think we're dialing back the clock yet. I
don't think we're changing our mind, but we're.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Not done yet. We're not done yet. Yeah, we're not
changing our mind, but we're not done yet. And I
messaged you over the weekend because I lost sense of
time and we probably the reason this episode is not
out earlier is because of things happened, including news. But
I lost sense of time and then realized as I
was watching mister Taylor Fritz beat down Zverev again, I'm like, hey, Bush,
(01:05):
do you want to talk about tennis? And I will
miss that ability to do this, which because I think
that's something I took for granted all these years, was
to be able to be like, Hey, let's talk about
such and such. And it just so happens that we
have a shitload to talk about, don't we.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Yeah, And I also feel like there is a contingent
of podcasts out there that stick around in people's feeds
and post once every four years and everyone's surprised when
it comes up. Watch this space. You never know.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
When ash Party wins twenty twenty six Australian Open. You
better believe I'm coming back, man. Yeah, that's a very
good point. Okay, Well, like I mentioned a lot of news,
but we'll begin with the biggest and saddest, a sudden
end to a legendary career, Rafael Nadal and Spain going
(01:59):
out in the quarterfinals at home to the Netherlands Botik
van der Zanderslip. Bush I feel like it was a
few years ago when we've brought Botik onto the scene
and we're in awe of his awkward game that we
grew to love. But I would not have predicted that
he would be the person to end it, to end
(02:22):
Raphael Theodal's career. But here we are in a rock
is Rock Is atmosphere at Martin Carpina Arena and Malaca
incredible scenes outside of the grounds as well. Bush I
felt like it was sort of going to be destiny,
that Spain was just going to wield themselves past at
least the Netherlands into the semifinals to give Rafas some
(02:44):
more runway, especially after we heard the reports about RAFA
practicing getting there early, having the practice set against Alcaraz
and looking good. It felt like they would have another
day at least in the sun. But no, the Netherlands first.
It was Botic beating Grapha in straight sets. Carlos Alcarraz
(03:06):
beat Talon Greek Spoor in the second tie, which prolonged
it into the final rubber. But Wesley kolhoff Man Bush
you saw him in Paris. He came through in a
big way along with Botic against Carlos Alcarez and Mark Renolers.
So that's it. Initial reactions pushed this, I mean.
Speaker 2 (03:25):
Death taxes and Botic, is it not? You can't outrun
either kind of the country of Spain either. Given how
he performed at the US Open, taking out Carlos Akaraz
as well, this was a competitive Davis Cup tie. I
don't think anyone can argue with the fact that the
probably the better team won here just on tennis merit alone.
(03:46):
I think everyone was willing for the fairy tale finish,
but truth be told, dev the fairy tale finish was
never on because listening to the Nadal quotes afterwards, he
wouldn't even have made himself available in the coming rounds. Afterwards,
this was once and done. He wanted to be there,
he wanted to play a match. I thought he actually
gave a really good account of himself against a very
good player and a very good ball striker. It was
(04:10):
high level tennis. We got to see him one last time,
and I think for all the things we were trying
to work out what his final match and what the
sendoff would be, they seemed pretty good. Dev It seemed
I'm sure they would have liked to have won the
Davis Cup. I'm sure they would have liked to have
gone further than one round and one rubber, but it
didn't happen. But I really enjoyed watching that final matchup
(04:30):
because there's something very special about a Raffi and a
Dal match where even though if he's down a set
and a break, in the back of your mind, you're
still going, ah, he might have this. Still he still
can still feel like coming and I think having that
magic one more time was something that I think we
can all circle and feel happy that we got to experience.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Yeah, when it was four to one and he got
the first breakback, I was like, Okay, it's happening, It's
gonna happen. But no days, I feel like we're getting
used to this in tennis. Bush like, these exits are
not fairy tales realistically, like Pete Sampras's side, and I
might be forgetting others. I also called him Mark Granoler's
(05:15):
Marcel Granoler's apologies to the Granolers fan, but the fairy
tale endings, they don't usually happen in any sport. I
mean there are, sure there are some, but maybe it's
recency bias, but I feel like tennis is quite cruel
to its grades when it's over. I'm thinking Fed hobbling
off Wimbledon, and then obviously Rafa trying to gut through
(05:37):
the Olympics, and then here today. I think, like you said,
this was less about like a visibly ailing Grafa. I
think this was more about I just didn't have the
level anymore. And you, to your credit as well regarding Botic,
like he looked nervous as hell, but like obviously and
I think not only playing Rafa and is potentially last match,
(05:58):
but representing your country as well. I thought it was
really impressive the way he pulled it together, because I
thought there was a chance he might have just thrown
it away after seeing some of the double faults and
like just the general nerves. But it feels surreal, I
will say, like seeing all of the tributes and Fed's
note Feed's post today Serena's message, like really felt a
(06:23):
wave of sadness come over me. And I don't know
if it's because of just like generally how the world
is going these days. It probably is. But even on
social media, like consuming it felt bad. And I think
that's because X's or Twitter, whatever the hell you want
to call it is just truly cooked and bad, bad, bad.
So even taking it in there did it feel good?
(06:44):
I don't know, man, it just felt like, rather than
a celebration, I felt more about I felt more sad
in general by Rapha's departure.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
I felt more okay with about things when I knew
it was going to come, rather than how I feel
now that it's happened.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
I think just the length of time that it's been
since he's been competitive at the top end of the sport,
just how long we've waited for his retirement to come,
and I think a lot of the time it was
more in hope than an actual expectation that he was
gonna be competitive at the at the tail end of
Grand Slams and be competitive really at tour level at
(07:24):
the top end of the tour. And I think that
is what made this a little easier for some people
to take because we've had so many good moments. I think,
if you really want to look at it, that French
Open final where everyone was standing around, going is he
going to retire? Feels like the feels like the right
time for him to do it, and it didn't happen,
(07:44):
and then you sort of got this two and a
half years of will he warranty questions about it. Yeah,
I've said this before, and apologies for repeating myself. This
just felt right, and to me, it isn't It isn't sad.
It is just closure. And I think he said as
much right. I was gonna pull on of his quotes
up where he's he said, in some ways, it's it's good.
(08:06):
Maybe this was my last match because I lost my
first match in the Davis Cup and I lost my
last one. We closed the circle, which is a very
rapping on the dal quote, but I think it is
damn You can.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
We of crying in the club, of crying at the club.
Speaker 2 (08:22):
I don't. I mean everyone, everyone has their own association
with raffing on Nadal and his career and how they
feel about this moment. Just yeah, I can't think of
a better way of saying. It just feels fine, like
it feels right. It feels like this was not someone
who who who went out with so much unfulfilled potential.
(08:46):
He did everything, literally everything, and we got one last
match of him fighting and competing for his for his country.
That that's that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
That's well said, and perhaps more, I think this is
a better sentiment than I have, which is devastation and despair.
Let's honor, let's honor the moment, Let's honor the spectacle.
I saw oh and Lewis our friend in front of
the show on Blue Sky Show. Some Blue Sky people
flock there saying maybe the doll's perfect role would be
(09:16):
a coach for someone like Alcaaz, which should be amazing.
I think that would be awesome. I'm curious about raf
his next steps. I do think he'll be around because
based on my reading of his stuff with the Academy,
he is super hands on and I think that will continue,
so that would be cool. Like it's not like we're
gonna see the last of them, but I'm beginning to
(09:38):
respect more and more, and not like I don't respect
these other players who have retired the way they have,
but people like ash Bardy, you're people who are like, nah,
I'm done in a way that I leave completely on
top and able to fully fully leave you on their
own merit. I think there's somebody who said about longevity
(09:59):
and battling and warrior mentality and everything that Rafa had
to offer, but I do remember a little bit more.
I think about the way some of these guys have
gone out towards the end and feeling just general sadness,
and that's on me. I get it. But there's something
to be said about people choosing to walk away when
they can still do it. And I know that's it's
(10:19):
such a short list, but I'm thinking about those those
athletes more and more of these days as we see
people like Mike Tyson like going and even though everyone
knew and that this was ridiculous and not not possibly
right to have happened. A part of me was like,
maybe he'll win, because yeah, like that's that's what people
are holding on to.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Dev I think there's an interesting series here, whether it's written,
whether it's video, whether it's podcasts, whatever medium, it takes
on about the end of professional athletes careers, because if
you were to circle the best of the best in tennis,
I feel like we know most of them of how
their career is ended, and it has largely been out
(11:04):
on their backs, like it's largely been being dumped out
in a third round. It's largely being you know, not
as competitive anymore. There's very few occasions that you can
find within our sport of players like reaching the top
of the mountain and then just handing in, handing the
card in, Right, I'm done, it's over. And I think
(11:24):
the decision making process of what goes through the athlete's brain,
especially like players who have been at the very very
top end of the sport of any sport, what goes
through their head to actually start the process of finishing
their careers and what do they want those those situations
to look like. We may never know why rafin Adar
chose this moment and why at this time it felt
(11:48):
right for him, in the same way we might ever
know why Serena Williams wanted to play that final US Open,
or Andre Agasi losing to Benjamin Becker of all people
at the US Open. But I think there is interesting
stories behind that, and I hope one day someone explores
a little more of the back end of a lot
of these pro careers, because I find it very, very interesting.
Speaker 1 (12:07):
You've given me an idea that I will they will
take away and then ruminate over.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
But Tony one of us worked for a big sports company.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I know That's why I was going to say it,
but I maybe I can try and sell this or something.
Bojic said that Nadal is the biggest sports figure in
Spanish history. I think that's right, right. I mean, we
are not We're obviously not the the anger. It's just
are the people who can adjudicate this, But it feels right.
Speaker 2 (12:40):
I think he's right on that one. I was trying
to think of any players or athletes that would rile
with him. The only one that came to mind for
me was Fernando Alonso. I don't I don't think Fernando
Alonso comes close to the career of rapping Nadal with
all jurispect to Fernando Alonso, who is a great champion
in his own right. There's obviously any number of Olympic athletes.
(13:02):
There's what's this what's his face? Gosh, I'm terrible at this.
You can tell. Watch a little cycling.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
That's a real content.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
No Spanish, isn't he No, he's not Spanish, he's not
during during Spanish? Right, Yeah, okay, okay, there you go, Miguel.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Yeah, so that we were dope and then the contour
was Spanish. But I mean, all these guys are on
ip Okay, So the answer is yes. The fact that
you didn't know someone in your names is is true?
Positive that it Isn't it? All right? It shows to
Gasol shouse, to the Gasol brothers, because you know, you
got to respect them. There are it's not a crazy
(13:43):
list though, it's not a you know what, I'll say
this at the risk of rankling our Spanish friends and listeners.
Not a crazy list there, Spain, I thought, uh, I thought,
I mean maybe the team sport aspect, just a lot
of great athletes, but truly.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
Great and they're not historically a great Olympic nation. Either
in terms of their competitiveness at the top end for
gold medals either. So you kind of they have had
great Olympic athletes, not least Mita Belmonte, who was a
fantastic swimmer in our own right. But yeah, they don't
have a long list of individual champions. It's much more
(14:24):
on the team sports side of things.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
How about this, I think Rafa is a top five
most recognizable athlete full stop in the world.
Speaker 2 (14:31):
You mean currently or historically.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Currently, Yeah, historically it's a bit tough. But like I
think right now, if you put twenty Randoms in a
room and showed them his face, they're going to get it.
Speaker 2 (14:44):
Yeah, I think I could be talked into that. I
think I could. Yeah, that seems seems reasonable.
Speaker 1 (14:51):
And I think his last We're going to do an
episode I think before we wrap on Rafa specifically, but
for a legacy. I think to be someone that people
think of what it means to fight and challenge yourself
and push through and never give up and always keep
believing in yourself. To be like, that's the guy that
(15:12):
I think of when I want to feel those emotions.
That is probably the coolest thing that you could possibly
have as an identifier that everyone associates you with, that
idea that it's never over, it's always worth fighting, it's
always worth giving your all. I think that's just an
(15:32):
incredible testament taraff in Adell's career. And I, like I said, Bush,
I think I'm more sad than anything today because I
did want to see it continue a bit longer. But
if this is the way you wanted to go, it
does feel, like you said, closing the circle feels right
for someone like him.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Can we just play a really quick game. I'm so
fascinated to hear your answers on this one. If I
had some let's do it game show music, I would
play it quickly.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
At a time like this as a weaving control. Let's
play a game.
Speaker 2 (16:08):
I should save this for the end. This is quality
material that I'm letting go it. Okay, let me play
a game with you. Who globally more famous. Let's start
with an easy one. Nadal or Andy Murray, Nadal, Okay,
Wrapping Nadal, Novak, Djokovic, still Nadal, I'd say rapping Nadal.
Serena Williams Serena, Williams, Serena, Williams, Roger.
Speaker 1 (16:33):
Federer, Serena Williams.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
I agree, it's it's funny that we heard the same
answers on now and we should do that more broadly though.
It'd be interesting to see, like how far down the
list we get before we disagree on things.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
I get who's famous, well, I think it's I think
it's barely federer like I think it's and truly I
think it's a little bit because he's been around slightly longer.
If that is only on years, I'm gonna say it's
it's like. I think Novak in a few more years
will get up there closer.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
To being I don't think so well. Prinsibians was Prime
Minister of Serbia. I suppose that's yeah, or like.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
The head of data or some shit. But yeah, like
I think, yeah, that's a good one. I think Serena
is the winner, but Novak's up there. I think you'd
be surprised how how recognizable Novak is. Like in India,
I guarantee you. In India, I guarantee you ninety percent
of people know who Novak Djokovic is interesting.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
I want to what he's like in China as well,
how well known he.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
Is, it's a huge number. I bet it's a huge number.
I think it's up there on that messire in all
though tire for these people.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
That's my no, not a chance.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
It might not bury out. Might it might not bear
out in the social media numbers though not so maybe
I'm wrong.
Speaker 2 (17:54):
That's such a good game Jokovic or Messi. There's no, no,
not a chance. Messi is like probably two three times
more recognized.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but still. I was in Mexico, in
Mexico City, Mexico City, walking down the street, just through
some shops, did not expect to see Novak Djokovic head here,
but it was there with his big old face on,
(18:22):
and it was just him.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Congratulations at all. It's great.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
We'll end it there. When we come back on Partying Shots,
we will talk about those ATV finals, which fully confirmed
where I'm at with the ATP hint not good. We'll
also talk about the Billy chin Kin Cup other alcaazz stuff,
plus some more news and notes coming up next. Welcome
(18:54):
back to the Open air podcast Bush. The ATP finals
went down. They went down. I mentioned this in the discord,
but I was discussed and shocked by the final four
No slight two three time Slam finalists cast, but rude
who is not box office for me, or Taylor Fritz, who,
(19:15):
in all fairness and I think you pointed this out
Bush had a really really great year, Taylor Fritz. And
to be able to just totally own a top five
player like he has now done with Alexander servis something
to put on your put under your cap, but overall
a big old meh for these ATP finals. How do
(19:35):
you feel about them? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (19:36):
I feel much the same way. I would agree with
you on the week and season four Taylor Fritz terrible
hair choice asides, and I was glad to see that
got rectified quickly. Not to give too many spoilers away
for year end awards, he's the most improved player on
the ATP. He's also probably the most improved player in tennis,
(19:58):
like Bonnan with greatest respective Joan HARLINI and some of
the stories we've seen on the women's side, it's been
a remarkable ascent. I didn't think for ITTs had this
in him to go from a sort of middling fifteen
to twenty five player to being a top five player.
What a what a season for him? And I tip
my cap you.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
Message me during cinner rude and it was one of
the more pointed shots at Castle rude I've I've received.
But also unfortunately this is just it. That match was
almost unwatchable, and I don't think it was so much
a Yannick Cinner thing.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Yeah, not a caspar rut and had a nice week.
You got to go to Turin, you got to be
part of the club. But there are levels to this,
aren't there. And perhaps giving one of the more interesting
quotes of the week when asked about the difference between
Nick Cinner and Novac Joho quote the Norwegian here, Yannick
(20:58):
hits a faster ball than Novak. He doesn't let you
Breathe not going to say easier to play Novak because
he's the best in history. At least with Novak you
can play more rallies and not be terrified of Novak
ripping like a bomb down the line or cross court
of these things. For me, you don't realize how Fastick
plays unless you watch him live and you're there in
(21:18):
the stadium on the TV. It's not fair the speed.
I put a note in a discord and I think
I messaged you to say this as well. John Nick
Sinner is well and truly the world number one. This
is not you know, all the things that we can
say and rightfully point at the allegations towards him are reasonable.
(21:40):
I think there's lots of things that we can be
made of that. But on tennis alone, if you remove
all of the other factors, fucking hell, dev this kid
is really really good.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
The contrast is something these end of seasons in Carlos
is limping home, did not have a good atp finals,
last of people you shouldn't be losing to, comes to
the Davis Cup, huge, huge emotional time, wins the singles match,
loses the doubles. Where's Yannick somehow beating the allegations and
just continuing to win and win in such convincing fashion.
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Yeah, he's getting better. I think that's the thing that's
really really scary to a lot of the top of
the tour is that I don't even think this is
anywhere close to his final form of what he's capable
of doing, to the.
Speaker 1 (22:26):
Point now where, because everything you said is true, there's
no way in hell he could possibly lose this appeal
right with Wata and friends, because what's riding on this
is that he is it. He is the it man
for men's tennis going forward at the top of the game.
Not obviously not saying Carlos is done or anything, but
(22:48):
he is the best men's player in tennis. That if
he were to be suspended as one of the first
big moments posting it all, that's a terrible thing, right,
So allow me to put my tinfoil had on and say,
even though I was skeptical that anything would come up
the appeal, anyways, this couldn't happen, right, that would be
one of the most stunning things.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
I feel like the thumb is going to be placed
fairly onto the scale one way or another. It's we
will make this go away.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
We have to and I yeah, And if it does,
I wonder how quickly it goes away. Probably very quickly,
to be I mean, it's already gone away. Listening to
the commentary because they can't mention it every time, it
sounds probably a bit ridiculous, right, I guess if you're
the commentators, But also this post true era we live in,
it's a bit much like it's a bit crazy. I
(23:38):
know he's not the only one, and I know it's
it's not nefarious, and his lawyers cleared him and they
went through the channels, etc. But something a bit wild
to me Bush that this all happened in the same
year that he announced himself as the best player.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
In the game. It's very, very weird, isn't it. I
think it's partly's story as well. That's not that doesn't
look good for him, just being a player that was
hanging around the top ten, and you're like, well, you
know he sometimes he fades away in matches, you know.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
I wish he was stronger.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Oh shit, Look, he's number one. He won seventy three
matches this year.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
He's puked all the time. Now it's pure, it's pure. Now,
it's pure hysteria, just asking the questions. Snalled info Wars
has been shut down. God, okay, boy, should we go
more ATV files or do you want to move on?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
I'm not sure there is much else to talk about me. Well,
maybe let's just circle back on this question. Maybe I
can ask you this, what's wrong with Carlos Akaraz.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
I honestly don't know other than fatigue and too much tennis.
Unless you have a theory.
Speaker 2 (24:54):
Do you think it is the nose patch? Do you
think that was the.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Oh gosh, I know you have of an extreme. You
wrote a lengthy, lengthy response to this nose patch in
the notes that I was a bit bit bothered by.
But I'll see the floor to you if you wanted.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
I can't actually remember another professional tennis player doing this.
I'm trying to think of other athletes that I've seen
doing this. There must have been people historically. I must
be forgetting someone who's a very like famous nose patch.
Where what are those things even? Cool? Breathing breathing patches?
I don't know what the what the actual forgetting?
Speaker 1 (25:32):
Okay, so like a zillion NFL players, I.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Feel it war Yeah, but you know it's the NFL.
Speaker 1 (25:38):
In the NFL, it's the NFL where it's a lawless king.
It's fair. Clearly he lost all aura. Though the color
was off. I don't think you go with that color
unless he was trying to match.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I don't think he rocked it particularly well. With the
greatest respect to the world number or whatever is.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Yeah, it was. I wish he didn't go. I guess
he had to go. I'm not quite sure actually how
that worked out once Novak said he wasn't going, But yeah,
I think he said he was battling illness, right, couldn't
Breathe sounds like being sick to me. A hell of
a long year, right, a crazily long year. Several points
(26:22):
at this year where I was like, he should take
a break, And here we are at the end where
it's November what nineteenth, and that's his last match of
the season barring fourteenth Saudi exhibitions. But needs a rest
and he's back at it.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
In a couple of weeks, okay, after doing some very
quick duck duck going here. It is the official terminology
according to very Well Health, which I actually don't know
the origins at that website, even though it appears at
the top of searches. Is it legit?
Speaker 1 (26:53):
Probably not.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
It doesn't feel very legit anyway. I've never heard it
as quickly trying and look at their about page to
see anyway. Nasal strip is what it's medical terms.
Speaker 1 (27:08):
Free advertising.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Geez okay heeus for this stuff.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Billy jin Kin cup push. The Brits are back and
it's sickening.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
Brits are back. The takeover is complete. First, Kirstarmer came
into power and right of the world. Secondly, David Lammie
turned up at the United Nations read the Riot Act
to Vladimir Putin and that will end the war. Thirdly,
we take over the BJK Cup.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
We did a queer, we did a queue.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
We all knew we had it in a small island,
but we are mighty in stature. I'll stop now. It
was a really good week, though, wasn't it. It was nice
to see especially on the Radi of Carnoe front. I
thought she played some really good stuff with respect the
place that she she played. You can only beat what's
in front of you, and I thought she actually gave
a really good account for herself. They of course did
(28:04):
lose to Slovakia, but still it was nice to see
British tennis, especially on the women's side, which has been
a little dormant, especially at team competition level for a while.
It's been nice to see them get some results here.
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Some pretty spicy results in general. I watched the Canada tie.
I was hoping we'd get Laila Racha Kanu for a
US Open rematch, but speaking of as all, as someone
who's played so much tennis, Layla Man not surprised that
she looked out of gas against Katie Bolter as well.
(28:36):
But Rachie kind of looked amazing against Rebecca Marino on
that first set and then was able to win in
the second and then yeah, I mean, I will say
I thought they should have beat Slovakia. A bit disappointed
by that loss, but I think the big one, the
big match of the ties for me was Schianta Paulini bush.
(28:57):
I know you guysiga, and she's I don't even think
we've written her off, right. I think it's just like
sabal Anca, with the way she's played at the end
of the season, has taken over the mantle a little
bit similar to center outcras if you can, if you
put Eager in that alcraz bucket. But I thought that
was a massive win over Paulini before they lost in Devils.
Speaker 2 (29:18):
It's interesting you say that, because I yes, it's a huge.
When Frigus Brontek has given the context of the tournament
that they were playing in, the competition they were playing in,
I thought this was a really good account for Jasmine
Paulini as well, just playing I was gonna say the
world number one, she's not the world number one anymore.
Playing the world number two and running her as close
(29:38):
as she has done just given some of the performances
that Paulini's had in big matches, on the big stages,
I thought there was encouraging signs of her that she's
not being overawed by these situations anymore. I'm I'm stoked
to see what I'm calling her the hornet. That's what
I'm going with from now on. Yeah, I don't think
(29:58):
this is a fluke. I don't think there's a fluke here.
I think she's there on merit. She's firmly inside of
the world's top five. Yeah. I think there's more room
for growth there. And it wouldn't shock me if she
repeats her twenty twenty four campaign again in twenty twenty five,
although it's going to be very, very hard to follow
up which has been a really outstanding campaign.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Who is the best Slovakian tennis player in your mind
in history? Got some? We got some like true tennis
head picks to go from. We've got dominic her body,
a tennis player, a tennis fans ultimate pick. We got
Martin Kleizan, who I was a fan of, Lucas Laco
(30:40):
Lucky Lucas. On the women's side, Dominikas Sibil Kova, Daniella
Harte Kova. But I will say Mary and Weida Slovakian
Snovak's coach, former coach. But this team that's made the
final bush quite unheralded. This is quite a run for them.
Victoria here on Cuova, Rebecca's round, Kova turn, it's Milankova.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
What a run. Just a collection of players ranked between
thirty and one hundred in the world. You just get
them all together and create a good atmosphere. They have
a chance to run really deep in this competition, which
is the way that it shook out.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Similar seen it with countries like Canada as well Bush
where they have that Just a lot of great players
who are maybe not top twenty but very very good,
all playing well at the same time. And here we
are playing a power like Italy in the final. Okay, bosh,
what do you mean? Harvard? Is this right? Harvard?
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Yeah? Have you read about this story about which I
didn't realize. Okay. The background of this is that the
WTA and Harvard Business School working together to provide a
pathway for players, either in competition or post retirement, for
them to get a degree or learn lessons of how
(31:58):
to make the transition to what they want to do afterwards.
Which I didn't realize is that actually several of the
sports have done this as well. I'm not very prominent,
the NBA have done this as well. And I am
buy in large, very supportive of higher educational post secondary
education having more routes and professional sports because I think
that is a very positive thing. Lifelong learning is fantastic,
(32:19):
and a lot of these athletes don't have clear pathways
to know what to do post playing career, so I
think that's a very positive thing. Can it just not
be fucking Business School? And can it just not be
Harvard University as well? Why if I.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
See Caroline Garcia reading out Laurence Summer's press release about
the freaking, the freaking IMF canceling a twenty billion dollar
loan to Sri Lanka because the terms are insane, I
good guy.
Speaker 2 (32:52):
I want to believe that Harvard Business School and Harvard
University are doing this because they care about the the
individuals and giving them perhaps the chance to gain some
excellent education and enrich their post playing career. I can't.
(33:14):
I'm trying really hard to do this without saying the
fucking opportunity because it's such a disgusting word.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
Kings cha about the season being too long. Convience, Okay,
so I feel like it's.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
So. I guess we are fans of Village and King.
She is one of the most important figures in professional tennis,
one of the most important figures in all of sport.
I would say, just given the nature of who she
is as an athlete, what she has done, especially for
for gender equality, and not just from the women's side
of things. I think very positive influence on men as well,
(33:55):
on men's sport, because you have to recognize that in
that capacity as well. It's it's forced more of a
conversation and equality is not just a women's issue. It's
it's an everyone issue and everyone should partake in it.
That's the only way that we move forward. She's had
a few clunkers, though, you know, she's starting to get
(34:15):
a bit I don't know, there's some stuff here that
is like just a bit, a bit naf So I
don't really know where to land on this. It's probably
a positive thing that we're ending the podcast before I
start slandering one of the most important people ever.
Speaker 1 (34:34):
Exactly exactly. I mean, that's well said, because the names
and numbers, thing like this will probably happen, you know,
some of these things I was thinking about, like to
make these players more recognizable. It's not far away, but
that makes me shudder, you know, like the fact that
it's not that far away, and like, and I get
(34:55):
what she's saying where it's like, this is about the
people after me, and like, don't target got try and
target me when you're marketing the game, like it's the kids,
et cetera. But that's one thing, But then it's another
thing that the ideas are the ones that are being
an actor are coming from the octagenarians or like the
people who have been in the game for sixty years, right,
or like the it's a fine line. And I see
(35:19):
examples where and she's been involved heavily with the PWHL
and the Women's Hockey League and you're seeing like really
good examples.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
Of which is very positive.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Don't have to do things, Yeah, they don't have to
do things like like they have been doing and it's good.
And I'm like, okay, So to write off all of
these charges is bad. It's not fair, I don't think.
But from what it sounds like, I don't think. I
like the changes that are being proposed, and that that
probably is a sign regarding my overall fandom, you.
Speaker 2 (35:46):
Know, definitely, I think I disagree with Bilijin King on
Suny Saudi Arabia influence of where the WTA is getting
its money. And I've said this before on the podcast.
I think that is a legitimate conversation to have because
there are inches of even inside of feminism as an
ideology or always a concept that would have that division
(36:06):
as well about what is the correct path forward. I
think I think that is a legitimate conversation. It's some
of the tennis stuff I just find like really just
not just blah, but like really insulting is far too
strong a word. But the thing like one, two, three,
four as opposed to fifteen love fifteen thirty, Like, how
(36:27):
stupid do you think children are? That's the thing that
I always find strange. Oh, we have to make it
easier for how fucking dumb do you think a child is?
That they can't work out like that? How many things
in the world don't make sense and we still call
them a certain thing that you have to learn as
a child. Just because like something is the way it
is doesn't mean that a child is not able to
pick these things up.
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Ah yeah, I help. My size says it all. Yeah,
how dumb do you think we are? I think pretty dumb.
This is a question. The answer, well, shock gonna sound
you Okay. I think that's it for tennis. Do you
have anything for two challenges a reading?
Speaker 2 (37:10):
I have quite a few things. Actually. I went to
see both Conclave and Anora.
Speaker 1 (37:16):
Good good things that were both.
Speaker 2 (37:19):
I I said to you this before we started recording.
I have mixed things to say about both of those films,
and indeed, I have to say I think this has
been an incredibly weak year for films in general. The
stuff I saw at the film Festival, A lot of
the big releases, even some of the stuff that's in
Oscar Contention and of course like Behaving Me awards are
(37:40):
not the arbiter of good taste or anything like that.
I just have not seen a lot of even a
lot of the highly praised and highly reviewed stuff. Critically,
I think it's been pretty naff, to be honest, I
think it's been pretty middling. And honestly I put Anora
and Conclave in that as well. I thought they were fine.
I thought they were like solid seven, seven and a
half out of ten films in a year that's had
(38:01):
a lot of like five to seven out of ten range,
I would.
Speaker 1 (38:06):
Say, damn Bush. I like it though, I like the.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
Strong takes like the fire. We have six weeks left.
I got to try and annoy everyone before I know.
Speaker 1 (38:18):
I know, I don't even have one. I don't really
have a good one. I think it was might chout
out to Buffalo Bills. Is that allowed? I will say,
like the the regular seasons being meaningless issue across all
sports is definitely real. And that being said, there were
(38:40):
the opposite of that, like the Premier League, where like
there is no playoffs and every game is life or
death felt like a lot, and I found myself gravitating
back towards the easy going times of NFL football, which
ahn's insane, but god, Buffalo beating Kansas City and not
letting them go undefeated felt really good. And it's been
a while, it's been I've taken a lot of L's
(39:02):
fandom wise recently, just to see that. I know it's
a it's a could be a meaningless game in the end,
but I enjoyed it as a sporting spectacle and I
hope to not take so many else and in your future.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
Rough sporting year for me, was it not? In twenty
twenty four Leads losing the playoff final, well was losing
the Stanley Cup final, England losing the Euro's final. That
was all within a space of whatever it was three months.
Was not a good twenty twenty four from me.
Speaker 1 (39:32):
Twenty twenty five, sir, So I'm glad that.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
You got some success, some success at least this Bills
team is good as well. Well, actually, I don't think.
I don't think this Bill team is you know, outstandingly good,
but they are more than capable enough of competing in
a season which doesn't have many outstanding team better.
Speaker 1 (39:49):
They're better than they've been and I think the other teams.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
Are a little worse too, which is fine.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Workout. Yeah, all right, we'll leave it there. We've got
a few more shows left. I think we're going to
do three more Bush. Does that sound right? Ah?
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, three or four? I might have one more. I
can speak in three or four.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Okay, so three or four more shows. Stay tuned for those,
Stay tuned for whatever else news we have in the meantime.
But yeah, keep it locked here on open Era un
till the end of the year. For Dylan on the
Once En Ties, and for Bush, thank you so much
for listening to open Era. I was good to shout
out the Discord, but I realized now the show is ending.
(40:27):
So I will say again our wonderful friends on the
Discord are wonderful. Their messages after the last week show
were awesome, and I, like, I mean, they're a huge
reason we have kept doing the show as well. So
love you guys. Thanks so much for sticking with us,
and we'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to
open Era. Take care of the
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