Are the Steelers better or worse following the Ramsey/Smith trade?

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Underground, The steel City Underground, the black
and gold standard for Pittsburgh Steelers coverage. Now here's your hoes.
Joe Kuzma and Brian E. Rose.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
Hello everyone, and.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
Welcome to another edition of the steels City Underground podcast.
My name is Joe Kuzma, joined here by my colleague
a co host of one, mister Brian E.

Speaker 2 (00:30):
Roach.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
Mister Brian, how are you doing today at this start
of a lovely week?

Speaker 4 (00:36):
So I'm you know, I'm glad that we could have
this opportunity to jump on to talk about what is
the most critical and important piece of information of the day,
which is my wife thinks that this is getting too long,
and so I need some backup here. Should should I
be trimming this beard? Should I be letting it do
the zzy top thing and get all the way you know,

(00:58):
down to the belly and whatnot? What do I need
to do? She's she's unhappy with it. She says that
there's too much food that gets stuck in it and
it grosses her out, even though I keep it fairly clean.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
Is she getting some of your That is?

Speaker 4 (01:12):
That is why we're on today, right, That's why we
decided to have thiss of this show, right, That's the
important topic we needed to discuss.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
Am I wrong?

Speaker 4 (01:21):
Is something else going on that I have maybe been
completely unaware of?

Speaker 2 (01:25):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:26):
Are you living under a rock?

Speaker 2 (01:27):
Brian?

Speaker 3 (01:28):
Is the is the wife? Is the woman getting leftovers
from your dinner but via your beard?

Speaker 2 (01:34):
No, the dog might be, but she's not.

Speaker 3 (01:37):
Hey, it's ezy top over there, shark dressed man the
steel City Underground T shirt today. Somehow the fashion football
fashion gods have us both. We both did this, not intentionally.
We just jump on and it's like the same got
the same hat, kind of going with the different monochrome colors.
I don't know, Brian, there might be something going on

(01:59):
because we're here at the beginning of a week.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
I heard this little rumor maybe you know what. I
know what it was.

Speaker 3 (02:06):
We were gonna talk the fans wanted us to talk about,
like like this non football stuff because there's nothing going
Oh wait a minute, my phone probably died this morning
because there was football. There was quite a bit of
football this Yearly was did we not say the last
episode this isn't your Granddaddy's or Daddy's Pittsburgh Steelers and
the way they operate. Holy cow man. Now, let me

(02:27):
tell you, I'm gonna feel a little I got a
little bit of a sad panda face here because my
Mica Fitzpatrick jersey has now been made null and void
for guys under contract for another year or two. I thought,
if anybody was safe on this Rosterer, nobody's safe. Apparently,
let's let's boil down to very basics of things in
case someone is kind of coming across this and they

(02:48):
don't know what happened, because at first it was like, Wow,
holy crap, the Steelers traded with the Dolphins for Jalen Ramsey,
and then like a couple of minutes later, it was
like WTF. But if Fitzpatrick has been traded in, it's like, oh, well,
they're getting John al Smith from the Miami Dolphins now too,
which had been rumored for a while. And there's a
swap of some draft picks. So that's a whole lot

(03:11):
of stuff to digest that all happened within Like, I
don't know, you got that Tom Pilsara, you got Ian Rapport,
you got Adam Schefter, you got all these like insider
gurus and the posts, the tweets, whatever, you call them now.
They were just flying. My phone starts blowing up. I
swear to you, I think I had to plug it
back in and charge it. I had all kinds of
people start blowing up my phone, like dude, what whoa,

(03:33):
whoa whoa, like all this crazy stuff. We're gonna break
this down because there's a lot to the lot to
chew here, and on the I don't know how to
feel about this. On the surface, on one hand, it
was like, oh, Jalen Ramsey comes across, and I'm like,
I almost had like kind of a gut feeling that

(03:54):
that could have happened. But then sending Mika, I'm like, eh,
But then you get John al Smith back in the
deal here too, and it's like, Okay, the Steelers have caproom,
they got all this money to spend. They don't have
a lot of mega players that they're throwing money at.
Aaron Rodgers is you know, signed for thirteen million. We
say all this stuff all the other time, and then
you get rid of another guy that's one of the

(04:14):
top or was one of the top paid players at
his position, definitely a top five on the Steelers roster,
and Mika Fitzpatrick. But wow, I mean, people like kind
of turned on Maca really quick on this trade, right,
And I'm thinking to myself, the reason you don't always
hear his name in the headlines is he doesn't make
a lot of mistakes, and I think teams tend to

(04:34):
avoid him. But there's people that have been trying to
shoot holes in that recently.

Speaker 2 (04:40):
Yes, there are.

Speaker 4 (04:41):
Look, you know, I think that the bottom line is
when there was Meca magic going on, everybody loved Meca.
When Mica becomes at the especially at the pay scale
that he was being paid at a very quiet contributor
where there's not a lot of spot happening, the interceptions

(05:01):
weren't coming anymore. You know, his name is not getting
called because he's not making you know, those those splash
impact plays. But he's just being a constant, consistent performer.
You know, you overlook him a little bit and we
will see because you know, maybe maybe the writing was

(05:25):
on the wall for Mika. You know, maybe when this
contract was up, that was going to be it anyway.
You know, there's a lot of movement here that tells
me the Steelers are trying to make themselves relevant for
this upcoming season.

Speaker 2 (05:41):
When I just don't see that happening.

Speaker 4 (05:45):
But hey, I mean that's their job, right, that's their
job to try and put themselves in the best position
to win. So they're definitely making some moves. This one
has left me a little, As you said, I'm a
little unsure how.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
I feel about it at this point.

Speaker 4 (06:03):
Not enough really, not enough time to digest and take
a deep dive into what Jalen Ramsey's gonna bring, where
he's gonna play. Is he's gonna be the slot guy.
Is he gonna, you know, be a boundary guy? What's
he gonna do? And I realize he's thirty, but that's
you know, people are going he's only thirty. Thirty is
about that age where they start to drop off, you know,

(06:25):
So I get it.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
I think it's a one.

Speaker 4 (06:28):
You know, he's only got one year left on his
contract if I'm not mistaken, So it's you know, it's
a short term rental for a year. I don't know
how that differentiates between what they would get in savings
next year off of MICA's deal not being on the books.
A lot of stuff to digest that I just haven't
had a chance. So I'm a little I'm a little

(06:50):
suspected this one at the moment.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
Yeah, I hear you on that. Just to answer your
question on the Minca contrary micas twenty nine. So he's
starting to get there now. Safeties play a little older.
As you said, or if we've said many times on
the show, corners wide receivers thirty and thirty one, that's
when you know you've hit the peak. And now it
starts to come on the back side. And we've got
Darius Slay it's like thirty three. I think thirty four

(07:15):
signed in the off season. But the makeup contract real quick,
and we'll talk about is maybe factors in with Sleigh
and everything else. A big Maca fan, always have, always
will be. I tend to forget that he wasn't originally
a stealer. That's how highly I think of him. He
feels like just like almost like an original guy that
they had drafted. I had wanted them to draft him.

(07:35):
His base salary for this year is fifteen and a
half million, seventeen point six in twenty twenty six, So
that's a sizeable chunk of cash that's coming off about
thirty three plus million dollars that easily accounts for the
two men that are coming in as part of this
trade from the other direction, and most of his money

(07:56):
was not paid ahead either. There was a day a
decent payout last year with a twenty one point three
million cap hit, but in the previous years his base
salary four million, one million, about eight million a season,
and then the twenty one point three would have been
twenty two point three and twenty four point four and

(08:16):
for this upcoming season and then the following season, So
just talking about making his usage, you know, twenty twenty
three was a little bit of a down year for him.
He had missed seven games and portions of others. He
did play in ten games, all ten were starts, but
no interceptions that year, and only won last year in

(08:36):
seventeen games. Only won in the last twenty seven appearances
for the Pittsburgh Steelers. Three passes defensed in twenty twenty three,
four passes defence last season. That's kind of a far
cry from when he was an All Pro in twenty
twenty two, where he had the six interceptions, eleventh passes defense,
also ninety six total combined tackles. The year before that,

(09:00):
in twenty one, he had led the Pittsburgh Steelers with
one hundred and twenty four combined tackles, so tackling machine
playing or near the line of scrimmage. And I think
that's what we're going to see with Jalen Ramsey. I
think you hit the nail on the head already. I
was actually talking with Flash not available today, but very excited.
Jalen Ramsey's one of his favorite players of all time,
so he's just getting you know, his wish list right now,

(09:22):
kind of checked off before he joins us back on
the show, but just to he brought up an excellent
point talking with Zach Saladonia, one of our other hosts
here when he's finally going to get off of the
summer break or wherever he's at. But Brian, he makes
a good point. He goes, look what they do with
Patrick Peterson. You know, Patrick Peterson wasn't always on the
field all of the time. So if Darius Slay's not

(09:44):
on the field all the time, maybe Ramsey bumps outside.
Maybe Ramsey stays up near the line of scrimmage. And
Ramsey's a tackling machine himself. He's not afraid to get
his nose dirty. So I'm really wondering we've seen in
years past. I've always said, you know, the Steeler their
defensive tendencies. We didn't see a lot of usage out
of Mike Hilton. That's why he was goodbye, right, and

(10:07):
then they started to bring in some different players. Formerly
safety is usually like an Arthur Mallett. They tried this
with Terrell Edmonds, didn't work last year. You've got some
guys who could play hybrid, like Cam Sutton, who did
see a little more snaps last season than a Beanie
Bishop on the defensive side of the football. Right, When

(10:27):
you're talking about that Beanie Bishop sometimes out on the
field fifty percent of the time, I said sometimes thirty
percent of the time, depending on injuries and you know
availability of other players. Hilton was playing thirty forty percent
of the snaps. When we're talking about the Steelers and
we're talking about a nickel defense. When you bring Jalen

(10:50):
Ramsey into this picture, and for the amount of money
he's playing, if he's playing as a nickel corner, do
you really think that Jalen Ramsey's only going to play
like half a game. I think they're going to expect
him to be on the field maybe close to one
hundred percent of the time, whether he's on the boundary
or whether he slides in for an older Darius Slag
where if you manage his snaps, Slay really hasn't. We

(11:12):
haven't seen a decrease yet with Slay's play, even though
we're talking about father time Pat Pete. We already kind
of had an inkling of that when he was with
the Minnesota Vikings, but and then coming to the Steelers.
So this is going to be kind of interesting because
I think you could replace a lot of what Minca
did with Jalen Ramsey as stands from he's not gonna
be playing center fielder.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
Yeah, I you know, that's that was my initial question
in thought was how much how much of what they
asked Ramsey to do is going to be what Minka
was doing. You know, I think it's it's safe to say,
you know, the corner room got a little better, but
I'm not.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
I'm not.

Speaker 4 (11:54):
I can't view this any other way. The safety group
got a little got weaker, and maybe not even just
a little weaker.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (12:01):
It depends on what some of the other folks that
they brought in end up being able to contribute. But
if if Ramsey is on the field almost all the
time and is taking up the workload that Minka was
taking up, you know, playing slot or playing close to
the line, maybe, you know, maybe it works out. Look,

(12:22):
I'm sure they've got a plan. It just isn't one
hundred percent crystal clear to me what that plan is yet.
You know, we'll we'll see as training camp approaches and
we start to see how this group really starts to
work together, we'll get a better understanding of what they're
trying to accomplish.

Speaker 3 (12:39):
I think training camps could be really interesting.

Speaker 2 (12:42):
Right.

Speaker 3 (12:43):
We went from having probably no excitement a few weeks
ago to Roger signing to these various trades to you know,
now you go see Ramsey in a Steelers uniform, John
O'smith in a Steelers uniform. I'm hearing Ramsey. Well the
trade details, of course, Ramsey and Smith and a twenty
twenty seven fifth rounder for the Dolphins, well, I'm sorry,

(13:07):
seventh rounder from the Dolphins for a Steelers fifth rounder
in twenty twenty seven and Mika Fitzpatrick. So basically, the
Dolphins are moving up the draft a little bit and
getting Fitzpatrick. The Steelers are still getting an extra pick,
but in twenty seven, not in twenty six, where they're
gonna have up to twenty six or not twenty six,
they could maybe in theory before this soul said and
done to draft Sandy, I'm sorry, in twenty six, they

(13:29):
will have maybe up to a dozen draft picks. So yeah,
they're gonna still have some ammunition there. They may need
all of those picks depending on some of these one
year deals, some of the older players that are there.
We'll get back to Ramsey. Well, some of Ramsey's stats too. Okay,
so Ramsey, He's had five interceptions over the last twenty

(13:51):
seven games. He played ten games as well for the
Dolphins in twenty twenty three and then all seventeen last season.
He made sixty combined tackle as a corner. That's pretty
impressive for the most part. And then passes defense eleven
last year in a full season, have five the year before.
He's been an All Pro three times in his career.

(14:14):
I think, I don't know, man, It's like you said,
the corner room has definitely improved. But with Jalen Ramsey
now there, like who's who's not gonna play? The amount
of time out there are they just gonna roll with
all three corners. Are we not going to see a
nose tackle on the field? Ever, it was it was like,
oh they add Ramsey and this is like unbeatable. But

(14:36):
then you lose Mika Fitzpatrick and you start scratching your
head and you're like, mate, were you reading tea leaves?
That's what some people are saying they brought in one Thornhill,
and I'm like, I never saw one Thornhill as starting.
There could be another move somewhere. I don't know.

Speaker 4 (14:50):
It won't surprise me if this isn't it, because you know,
like as as you said, we say the cornerback room
has improved, right, but again we're dealing with other than
Joey Porter.

Speaker 2 (15:01):
We're dealing with guys who are on that.

Speaker 4 (15:03):
Cusp age wise, where you know, skills may start to
drop off.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
We may you know, I don't want to be a pessimist,
but you.

Speaker 4 (15:13):
Know, there's certainly a reasonable chance that come the season
we find that the corner room actually didn't improve. But
I'll stay optimistic and say, I you know, the way
it looks is that it has improved. We'll have to
see what happens with one Hawthorn Hill. Yeah, I never
thought one when they brought one thorn Hill. It was

(15:34):
never like, oh, well there's Micca's par ticket out of
the place, thought.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
That, Yeah, it's Casey's replacement. Casey had gotten older and
Casey's getting suspended for.

Speaker 2 (15:44):
A mine's replacement. He's used replacement.

Speaker 3 (15:48):
That's uh, the old mar Tavis Bryant Sammy Coates exchange
right there. Let's see Jalen Ramsey he has. Yeah, it's
going to be interesting. His contract. His contract actually runs
through twenty twenty eight. That was currently with the Miami Dolphins,
So I don't know if that's been ripped up or changed.

(16:10):
This was the latest thing that I have on over
the cap. I'm going to see what the over the
CAP's competitive spot track says here in a second, but
it's healthy numbers. Cap numbers in twenty twenty five a
cap number sixteen point six. His base salary is only
like a million dollars. There's different pro rated and roster
bonuses that are tied to this with some guaranteed salary.

(16:31):
Guaranteed salary is somewhere in the neighborhood of twenty four
point two million. So we'll see if part of this
was a salary dumped by the Miami Dolphins, you know,
one of the higher paige. I don't think he'll make
it to age thirty four on this contract through twenty
twenty eight with a thirty six point one million cap hit.

(16:54):
I just I don't see that unlikely. Yeah, I don't
see that ever happening. I'm gonna see what spot rac
has to say here, Brian, because sometimes we don't have
all of the up to date information and they might
be guessing too. At this point, we may not have
all those details. Although the trade, oh, they already have
Ramsey on the roster, so that's a that's a promising sign.

(17:17):
Let's see, they're saying it's cap hit for the Steelers
for a five point three a base of one point two.
There's some different options and stuff there, but a five
point three cap hit for the Pittsburgh Steelers. And then
the potential out, of course, is that they get completely
out of this if they had the Dolphins contract, depending

(17:39):
on what's owed on that Right now, they're showing a
twelve point seven dead cap, so if that's accurate, otherwise
he's out a substantial chunk of change with that contract
I don't understand this. This reminds me of like Julio
Jones signing. Was it with Tennessee where they signed him
like this gigantic deal and he was like thirty two
years old. I'm like, he's never going to He's never

(18:00):
going to play that out, And I've seen it happen
with some other players of the same pedigree. Just makes
me shake my head a little bit there. But I
don't anticipate that the Steelers will. They're not obligated to
pay all of this out. We'll see how much of
this actually sticks in. If this has been reported the
way it is, a five point three million cap hit
for a player the caliber of a Jalen Ramsey, he

(18:23):
still plays up to a Jalen Ramsey level. Lookout now
we're talking about We're not talking about Joey Porter leaving
the field here. And one thing I think that's getting
lost in this shuffle, Well, everybody talks about Aaron Rodgers
mentoring Will Howard or something like that. How about the
impact of Darius Slay and Jalen Ramsey playing with Joey Porter.
And some people are saying, well that Joey regrets this

(18:45):
and that Joey had one game against the Bengals where
he could not keep his hands off of t Higgins.
He had a bad day in the office, and I
think that happens. You're not going to be perfect all
the time. I didn't have a lot of complaints with
Joey Porter last year. Dante Jackson off and on, not
the most consistent player, not terrible, but you potentially have

(19:05):
you got Ramsey. I don't know if they'll follow people,
if they've been to end up following people around, but
you've got Ramsey and Slay who are like goats at
this position, with a young Porter who could be This
is an arms race. They see the Baltimore Ravens go
and get Jayira Alexander. They get Jayra Alexander because they
have to play against the Bengals. Guess what, so do

(19:26):
the Steelers. So when you're trying to stop the t
Higgins of the world and the Jamar Chases and everybody
else that they've got. With Joe Burrow at quarterback, it
makes a lot of sense to me, And especially if
Ramsey's gonna be able to play along the line of scrimmage,
they don't have to maybe do as many personnel swaps.
Defense could be very strong, and there's still some players
maybe floating around out there that they could still sniff

(19:48):
at if they feel they need another safety. But for
the most part, they locked in Elliott a little longer.
Elliott has played a lot of free safety in his career.

Speaker 2 (19:58):
So he can change up.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
And I think they just want guys that are versatile
and just keep everybody guessing.

Speaker 4 (20:05):
Yeah, I don't know, I'll buy what you just said,
because I just don't know.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
This is as as we have.

Speaker 4 (20:14):
Have come to sort of expect, uh during the Omar
Khan era.

Speaker 2 (20:20):
Uh you know.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
I don't know what the hell they're gonna do. Yeah,
we're gonna surprise us and do something that we don't
expect nobody. No, I don't think anybody expected them to
pull this kind of a trade off. It is certainly
possible that Minka was being shopped, but I don't know
that that's the case. I'm wondering if during the conversations

(20:43):
with about John Us Smith, they just went, hey, you
went Ramsey, We'll take Minka, uh, you know, and and
something just kind of of click.

Speaker 2 (20:50):
I am I don't know how to.

Speaker 4 (20:55):
Uh really project what this group of admin. Folks with
the Steelers are going to do it is not you know,
it's cool because it's an uncomfortable feeling. Right, anything could happen, Right,
We've said over and over again how TJ. Watt is safe?

Speaker 2 (21:15):
Is TJ. Watt safe? I don't know anymore. I think yes.

Speaker 4 (21:19):
I know they've repeatedly said they want him to end
his career as a Steeler, and they didn't say the
same things about Mecup. But the way that these folks
operate is and is in a different place than the
way Steelers have operated in the past.

Speaker 2 (21:35):
Right if if, in.

Speaker 4 (21:37):
Fact, they get the right thing in place and they
think it makes them a better team.

Speaker 2 (21:43):
As you said at the very.

Speaker 4 (21:44):
Beginning of the show, nobody is untouchable at this point,
and that seems very clear from the way that they're operating.

Speaker 3 (21:53):
Yeah, I'm looking at the safety list. If they were
to add somebody, there's names, some aging ones. Justin Simmons,
who's thirty two, last played with the Falcons, Jordan Whitehead
who was involved in a car accident and I think
it was actually his fault and he was placed on
an NFI list and no longer with the Buccaneers. He's

(22:13):
still out there at twenty eight years of age, Julian Blackman,
Quandry Diggs, Jordan Poyer who's thirty four, he's up there,
Chuck Clark, a former familiar face from the Baltimore Ravens,
Kevon Wallace, Marcus May, John Johnson, and even to Sean
Gibson who's now thirty five, Von Bell who's thirty one.
There's in Ronnie Harrison in twenty eight. So there's there's

(22:37):
quite a few players who are still floating around out
there at the safety position at free agency. For in
free agency, if they wanted to, if they didn't want
to make a trade, if they want to make a signing.
At this point, nothing's going to affect their compensatory formula.
So it's kind of interesting though if they don't end up.

(23:00):
I was looking at Ramsey and was like, oh, well,
if Ramsey ends up in the hitting free agency or
something like that, then that would be a little different
than you know, Mike a hitting free agency. But they've
got so many picks next year it doesn't really matter,
and it would be for the following year anyway, so
they could add some other guys. But aside from that,
like maybe tiny bit of concern across the field. In

(23:22):
that secondary, He's still got Elliott thorn Hill's a thumper
and Ben a ron stopper. Maybe he's more of a
strong safety type Ramsey if he plays in the slot
or floats Darius Slay Joey Porter junior, that looks mighty good.
You got Cam Hayward, he's ageless as all hell. You've
got what Pro Football Focus actually gave the Steelers the

(23:43):
number one ranked defensive front, and I know they're probably
counting outside linebackers with that. So you've got Alex Highsmith.
You've got TJ. Watt, who's always in the MVP conversations.
Like I said, Hayward is quietly maybe the best player
at his position in all of football at like thirty five,
heading into thirty six years years of age. He keeps that,

(24:04):
He just keeps going. Can Keanu Benton move up there?
Can Derek Harmon be a guy if Benton isn't solid enough?
Those are all great questions, Those are all pluses in
my book. Then you look at the other linebackers and
you still have Peyton Wilson, who's there, Pitt Patrick, Queen
Cole Holcomb's returning Nick Herbig and Jack Sawyer. As depth

(24:27):
on the edges, the defense is freaking loaded. I mean
the depth, the depth in the secondary is the only
concern because I remember two years ago and he ended
up with Mason Rudolph playing guess what else was happening,
Trenton Thompson and Elijah Riley and who else was back there?
Patrick Peterson had to play safety a little bit, so
that's always concerning. They really sold high on micka Fitzpatrick.

(24:51):
I think they get two quality players back in doing so.
We'll talk about John L. Smith and how he fits
the offense in a minute, but let's close our thoughts
on the defense.

Speaker 2 (24:58):
Man.

Speaker 3 (24:59):
Are you feeling good about defense as I am?

Speaker 2 (25:02):
I feel.

Speaker 4 (25:05):
Okay, you know, I'm as I said, I'm trying to
remain optimistic, but the more realistic side of me keeps going.
It looks great on paper, Let's wait and see what
the product looks like on the field. There's also a
consistent narrative that has occurred with the secondary of the

(25:27):
Steelers over the past few years, which is communication. And
we all know that communication is much more difficult when
you have a bunch of new pieces. Well, now they
got a real shitload of new pieces. So you know,
I'm looking at it like, all right, let's wait and see.
I'm cautiously optimistic that we're in a good position on

(25:47):
the defensive side of the ball.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
Yeah, I'd like to see more out of Benie Bishop.
I'm not sure how he gets on the field. So
I do want to revert back to that though, because
we're talking about like Aaron Rodgers and wide receivers, right,
and Beatie Bishop got not one but two of those
balls Rogers was attempting to throw to Garrett Wilson last year, right,
So you know, the same trust factor with George Pickens

(26:13):
leaving could be part of that.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
Right.

Speaker 3 (26:16):
So the Steelers are looking around and they've got dk Metcalf,
big physical guy, and you're like, if you want to
bully everybody on the offensive side of the ball, what
are you going to do? And you still got Darnell
Washington and you could throw out there. He could help
if Roderick Jones Troy Fatanu maybe on that edge just
aren't as solid. But if one of those two guys,
if both work out, great, offensive line looks great. If

(26:38):
one doesn't, then you can help, right, And you've got
Pat Fryerman, who this guy who's been catching a lot
of passes, a lot of yards, a lot of touchdowns capable.

Speaker 2 (26:46):
Now you're at.

Speaker 3 (26:46):
Johnil Smith to this same mix, big physical guy that
could be capable of being a receiver. I just feel
like in both cases with the Steelers, the sub packages
aren't going to be as plentiful. They're not going to
have to keep running guys on and off the field
to match up with other teams. Or they could leave
teams guessing as to what they're doing on offense. That'd

(27:08):
be just leaving the tight ends out there. If Rowan
Wilson ends up panning out with his sub four to
three speed, I believe he was in a four to
two plus. He's part of that Michigan team that just
ran the ball down your throats, and he's capable of
catching the ball. We didn't see what he could do
last year. Dk Metcalf part of that. The multiple tight ends.
Caleb Caleb Johnson out of Iowa, the rookie along with

(27:31):
Jalen Warren who loves to get physical, provided Zach Frazier
doesn't have any setbacks, and Isaac Samalu is still the
guy that he is. If Atanam comes in there and
plays really well. This is looking really really good because
he just leave the two tight ends out there all
the time. Is it a run, is it a pass?
We don't know necessarily when you throw darnout Washington out there,

(27:53):
and surprisingly, like half the passes he caught or whatever,
sixty seventy percent of the passes he caught last year,
right were for first downs number one. They can't tackle them.
But you know what little usage that he's gotten. Still
love him. He's still He's not going anywhere. So they
could really try to bully some teams, which is I think,
in the second year of an Arthur Smiths system, what

(28:15):
Arthur Smith's been looking to achieve.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
Yeah, I agree with that. They definitely want to play bullyball.

Speaker 4 (28:21):
They want to run the ball, they want to pound
the ball, they want to play do play action off
of that, and I think they are They have the
moves that they are making are all targeted at getting
themselves in that kind of position. You got big tight
ends who are going to be physical. You've got a
receiver type tight end in Friarmouth, You've got you know,

(28:45):
DK as a physical receiver. You know, whether they add
more to that receiver room or not. You know, whether
Roman Wilson is uh, you know, we know he's a
willing blocker. Whether he's going to be a capable blocker
will have to wait and see. At this level, we
don't know what we're gonna get from him. I don't
you know. I honestly, when you get past those two

(29:06):
guys in the receiver room, I don't know what else
is going to be there.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Calvin Austin is not moving anybody, no, no, yeah, off
the ball.

Speaker 3 (29:15):
They move them on their ass, They're gonna like just
you know, they'll trip over their own feet trying to
cover them though, So that's another thing.

Speaker 4 (29:21):
Yeah, I think that the real question, uh, in my
mind comes to be how the marriage between Aaron Rodgers
and Arthur Smith works out. You know, Aaron has been
consistently a pass happy kind of guy, wants to throw
the ball, and if if that becomes a problem, if

(29:44):
there is is any kind of divergence in their relationship,
that's gonna spell problem for the Steelers during the season.
If they are on the same page and they're having success,
you know, maybe maybe things will go the way they
want them to go. I think this offense is absolutely
it's designed to be a run first, power heavy kind

(30:07):
of offense.

Speaker 2 (30:08):
Whether that will be what it is.

Speaker 4 (30:12):
Whether Mason McCormick is going to be the guard that
can can put them in that position. You know, whether
the offensive line gels enough to put them in those
kinds of positions. You know, whether Caleb Johnson is a
running back that can take advantage of.

Speaker 2 (30:26):
That along with Jalen Warren. All that stuff is up
in the air.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
Right there's we're in that position and that point in
the season where things can be made to look as
rosy as you want them to be.

Speaker 2 (30:37):
You can project.

Speaker 4 (30:39):
Happy, happy thoughts and unicorns and rainbows on what the
season is going to look like.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
I'm just still not convinced.

Speaker 4 (30:46):
And I probably won't be a one way or the
other until two or three games into the season.

Speaker 3 (30:52):
I hear you going back to John L. Smith. He's
a little stock here guy right listed six to three
to forty eight. He's capable of movements of people around.
He was able to find success last year regardless of
to a tag of Baliloa being on the field or not,
which is important when we're talking about the Steelers and

(31:14):
they're a quarterback turmoil, right, But he's one year. He's
a one year deal. He was looking for extension. He's
looking for some more money. So we're going to get
some more more details on some of that as it
comes along. Right now, I don't think that there's a
whole lot of movement, but I am looking to see
if there's any changes. His cap hits about four million dollars.

(31:39):
He has a per game roster bonus. I believe that
factors into some of that, aside from a base salary
of just about three point four mill. Now. I know
I go back and forth with the Pro Football Focus folks, right, Brian,
But John al Smith was ranked fifth among their thirty
seven eligible graded tight ends last year. Overall great at

(32:03):
seventy eight point two he was fourth, and receiving yards
in that same group, he was second with eight touchdowns overall,
his yards per reception was only ten point one, which
bounces him down to about twenty third best. But then again,
this isn't his first rodeo with Arthur Smith. This will
be the third team he's played for under Arthur Smith.

(32:25):
It really started to break out those final years in
Tennessee where the final year that he was there in Tennessee,
caught forty one passes for four hundred and forty eight
yards and eight touchdowns. Kind of not the same kind
of production he just had Miami with Mike McDaniel and
that offense. But in Atlanta Arthur Smith's final year there,

(32:46):
he was still out playing Kyle Pitts somehow. Kyle Pitts
has just never really popped off the page and speaking
which I think, I think that's who the Dolphins are
going to be looking. There's already like speculation of Dolphins
are looking for somebody to replace Smith. Now I think
Kyle Pitts might be on that block. But aside from
that non Steelers titbit fifty receptions with the Fucks for

(33:07):
five hundred and eighty two yards only three touchdowns. However,
a very bad quarterback play. If you remember, the kid
from University of Cincinnati was a Desmond ritter, Taylor Heineke.
They had some had some really bad quarterback play there.
Last season though with the Dolphins, he was targeted one
hundred and eleven times, eighty eight passes, eight hundred and
eighty four yards and eight touchdowns. If you have eight

(33:30):
in your lottery numbers for tonight, you should probably go
eight and nine seem to be what might be best here.
We'll see what number he ends up wearing in Pittsburgh.
But I am excited about this because we were speculating
before as to whether or not they would make this
move and what it would mean. And I think, you know,

(33:52):
you don't always see a lot of the tight end usage.
Maybe the Steelers come up with something in these copycat
leagues like the NFL, all these copycat teams, maybe they
come up with something a little unique here. When you
come up with something unique, it means it's a little
bit harder to defend. Everybody's trying to defend. They are
trying to defend Travis Kelce, But are they defending tight
ends as much in Buffalo? Are they defending him? Maybe

(34:13):
with Baltimore. So aside from that, it's like GUYSICKI was
in Cincinnati last year. I had a decent year as
a tight end. But there's usually not multiple tight ends
that you're looking at in the overall picture. So arms race,
arms race, arms race? Does it make them better or worse?

Speaker 2 (34:34):
Man?

Speaker 3 (34:34):
I could see both sides of this. It's gonna be tough.
Time will tell they don't think that they got worse necessarily.
I think that at the very least that floor is
still the same floor.

Speaker 4 (34:47):
Yeah, I think that's a fair assessment. Right, there's the
chance that they got better. There's a chance that they
got worse. It really depends on what the balance is
and the play coming from Ramsey.

Speaker 2 (34:59):
And whoever is taking over for Minca.

Speaker 4 (35:01):
Right, Mega goes to Miami and has an all pro
season and goes back to being the Minca that we
were used to.

Speaker 2 (35:08):
Everybody's going to second guess this.

Speaker 4 (35:09):
I don't think that'll happen, but if it did, you know,
everybody will second guess this trade.

Speaker 2 (35:15):
Go oh my god.

Speaker 4 (35:16):
But the problem with that will still be the same
problem that it always is. It's a different context, it's
a different system. The fact that he may have excelled
just means that they put him in positions that were
better than the positions he was going to be put in.

Speaker 2 (35:28):
Here, different style of play, who knows.

Speaker 4 (35:33):
I think it's fair to say that the calibers of
players are both very similar. You know, they both have
been all pro level players, slightly different position. Whether they
are better or worse will We'll have to wait and see.
As the season unfolds.

Speaker 3 (35:51):
Well, I know for sure, I'm excited to see this unfold.
Training camp got a lot more exciting backs on backers
is going to be a lot of excitement. We're gonna
see how feisty Jalen Ramsey is. Let's talk about like
just the personality's in this locker room.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
Now.

Speaker 3 (36:06):
Mike Tomlin's got Aaron Rodgers, You've got Jalen Ramsey. He's
been around and now. Ramsey's an interesting guy because he
seems to be pretty straight, straight and narrow, right, but
he's bounced around a lot of teams. He's gotten you know,
I want out of here and stuff like that. So
you've had some of that too, Darius Slay certainly he's
backed up his smack talk. You got Joey Porter. This

(36:28):
could be like a really nasty defense and just bounce
back to your original comments at the beginning of the show, TJ. Watt,
I love how like you get something like somebody asks
Mike Tomlin or Omar Kahn and they've already kind of
maybe Art Rooney the second and they've already kind of
let the cat out of the bag. Both sides are talking.
Something's probably gonna happen around training camp. But all of

(36:48):
a sudden, it's like today you got somebody like Schefter
putting out there, Well, TJ. Watt's unhappy with this contract, yeah,
because there's one year left on it and he's watching
everybody else getting you know, forty million a year like
a Miles Garrett. Now, But does that mean he's necessarily unhappy?
It sounds like a It sounds more like the agent
pushing for something here. But we know those deals, those

(37:10):
deals happen. They're going to happen in le trop It's
going to happen in about a month there. You know, TJ.
If you don't see him the first few days or
week or whatever, you might not have any Ways, they're
just going to take it a little easier with him.
He's he's thirty, but doesn't mean he's going on the
shelf anytime soon either. And this is a team that
can't win unless that guy is on the field. So
I do think that deal ends up happening. I don't

(37:31):
think he goes anywhere, but like you said, never say never.

Speaker 2 (37:35):
Just Mike A.

Speaker 3 (37:36):
Fitzpatrick already out the door. But would you get enough
for TJ. Watt with one year left on his contract
to make it worthwhile.

Speaker 2 (37:43):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (37:43):
Well, that's that's what I mean. You know, it has
to be the right situation. I think it's unlikely. I
think TJ stays. There is still the desire to have
people in their career be one helmet kind of guys
who who you know, were drafted and finished their career
with the same team. I'm sure TJ wants to be
that kind of guy. I know that the Steelers would

(38:05):
like him to be that kind of guy. It all
just depends on how balance is out. We'll have to
wait and see, all right. Bonus question for the two percenters.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
How many different color cans of sparkling water did I
drink during the show? Oh?

Speaker 3 (38:26):
Man, dude, I don't know how big of the bladder is.
I'd say four.

Speaker 4 (38:34):
No, No, Well, I'm not going to answer the question.
It's a bonus question. Answer it next. It's a bonus
question if we'll see if anybody comments about it, you know,
and if they do, then you know, we'll mention it
in the next show.

Speaker 3 (38:49):
Yeah, I'm telling you, dude. So once again. Ramsey Chino
Smith a twenty twenty seven seventh round pick for Micky
Fitzpatrick a twenty twenty seventh fifth round pick. That's another
big deal. Steelershipped away George Pickens a few weeks ago.
They went and got dk Metcalf. At the beginning of
free agency, they waited around and finally got Aaron Rodgers.

(39:10):
This is a wild ride. I'm not used to seeing this,
Dar say, it feels very much. I know you're not
a baseball guy. I'm not the biggest baseball guy, but
it's like what the New York Yankees do. They go
out and trade and they buy players in order to
make a run for a championship, and maybe a lot
of times we tie those hopes and dreams to maybe

(39:30):
a quarterback, for example. Oh well this is this quarterback,
big Ben's last ride. Got to give him everybody you
can in order to maybe get Ben another championship. This
feels like it's for Hayward. It feels like it's for TJ.
Very specifically. These guys, well, you have these pieces still
on your defense. Everybody's been just saying all kind of
inflammatory things about the Steelers. Why waste these guys. Doesn't

(39:54):
look like they're wasting anything. So it's going to be.

Speaker 2 (39:57):
Definitely not trying to. They're trying not to.

Speaker 4 (40:00):
I mean, as I said, I look, I've viewed. I've
said this from the beginning of the offseason. I view
this team as not being a championship caliber team. None
of this has changed my mind. But last episode I
also said the same thing. If this defense were to
play lights out, that's just a different story, right, And

(40:22):
they are definitely reshaping this defense to be what they
wanted to be. Mean, nasty, physical, run jamming, run stopping defense,
a defense that can get after the quarterback. That's what
they want to be. That's the identity they want to be.
They want to dominate physically the other team. And if

(40:42):
they can be that kind of defense, you know, and
that defense can limit scoring and limit limit scoring of
the teams that have been proven to be their kryptonite,
you know, like the Chiefs, like the Bengals, like the Ravens.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
Like the Bills. If they can start to beat.

Speaker 4 (41:00):
Those teams and hold them down to under twenty points
a game, then you don't need your offense to be
of the same caliber, right because you know the other
defenses aren't going to be. So if you can win
a war of attrition in that way, who knows.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
Maybe they can go all the way.

Speaker 4 (41:20):
I'm not convinced, but I can at least see the
road they are trying to take to get there, and
I understand that. So they are absolutely trying to do
the things that they feel are necessary to move the
team in the direction that they always intend to go in,
which is, you know, Super Bowl or nothing.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
Every year.

Speaker 4 (41:41):
It's not about trying to win a play a playoff game,
it's not about trying to advance to a later round.
They want to win championships. That's what they want to do,
and anything else is considered a failure. So they're making
the moves that they can make and that they think
are necessary to go that route. Whether it will succeed
or not is always a crapshoot. You just have to

(42:01):
wait and see.

Speaker 3 (42:02):
Yeah, well, it's definitely an arms race, not only in
the AFC North, but in the AFC in general. This again,
it's not Kevin Colbert. Kevin Colbert would have been content
with what they've already done, whether they made that DK
Metcalf trade or not, or just hung on the pickings
until his contract expires, by hook or by crook, if
he costs you games, or not, so it's it's refreshing.

(42:26):
It's also like good luck trying to figure out whatever
their plans are, but certainly feels as though that the
Steelers are definitely in. For everyone who thought they were
just gonna lay down and try and tank and get
a number one overall pick for a future quarterback. That's
about the only spot the future that seems scary. But
now I'm more set in that twenty twenty five will

(42:46):
not be a throwaway year. With all of these moves,
They're gonna be as competitive as they ever have been.
And you know, for as much as people give Mike
Tomlin flack for mediocrity and no losing seasons, there's only
one game that Mike Tomlin's ever coach that has not
meant anything when it comes to any kind of postseason
or standings or or or had any true meaning or

(43:07):
value as to whether they played. They could have just
sat whoever they wanted, and you know, their seasons folded up.
It's only happened once in eighteen years under Mike Tomlin.
That speaks volumes. I think we're going to see a
lot of the same with that this upcoming season, and
then with twelve draft picks. Who knows what they do
next year, because they still got the draft picks for
the pre for the following years after that, who knows.

Speaker 4 (43:30):
But I'm flat out terrified of what mock draft insanity's
going to look like in twenty twenty six. I you know,
I may have the whole first round in the Steelers
book by the time I'm done.

Speaker 2 (43:40):
I just don't know what the hell that's going to
look like. That's gonna be a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
Well, Brian, thanks for joining me, my friend. It's good
that we had actual stuff to talk about, not that
we didn't want to talk about some other fun things.
But wow, what a morning, man. I'm out of breath.
It's just I still am trying to process all of it.
Half of my closet, half of my jerseys go like
you know, the goodwill now, I think, so I don't
get rid of any any of them. Actually, for the

(44:06):
most part.

Speaker 4 (44:07):
Either, I think there's what there's I don't know, twenty five,
twenty six, twenty seven of them over there, and they're not.

Speaker 2 (44:15):
I just you know, I just stopped wearing them.

Speaker 4 (44:17):
Like I still got my Le'Veon Bell jersey, I still
got my Antonio big checks.

Speaker 3 (44:22):
I've got several of those, several several of those.

Speaker 2 (44:25):
So I don't get rid of them. I just don't
wear them anymore.

Speaker 3 (44:29):
I might I may just take the picket name played
off of my number eight and then just not replace it,
and I could just be in protest.

Speaker 2 (44:37):
I'll be honest.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
Since I bought that one from China, I actually gave
that one away to somebody and just went but you
know what, to be fair, I gave it away before
then because I just was like, I don't know why
I bought this.

Speaker 2 (44:48):
I don't really want this jersey.

Speaker 3 (44:51):
I've got a couple of those too. I surprisedly didn't
add much last year. But we'll get into that. What
are the best bets? Because we talk about that every year.
There might not be good bets anymore. Your best bet
might be he's only spending twenty five dollars and get
one from China.

Speaker 4 (45:05):
But with the price that jerseys go up to nowadays,
I don't know you and the way that they are dealing.
I'm just telling you, I don't know. I don't you know.
You just have to accept that you're outputting the money
for whatever you're you know, if you can afford it. Hey,
just accept that that's the expense you're paying to get

(45:26):
the jersey that you want, and you know, next season
it might not be valid.

Speaker 3 (45:32):
I've got two that are going in, you know, the
deep part of the closet with Russell Wilson and I'm
making Fitzpatrick both of.

Speaker 4 (45:38):
The I was never going to buy Russell Wilson jersey
was gifted to No one was going the next the
next season.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
He was never coming back.

Speaker 3 (45:45):
It was gifted to me. But when we had the
same conversation, I'm telling the significant other, you know, hey,
what's a good idea on what to buy? And you say, well,
MICA's under contract for a while and I don't see
him going anywhere, and that's that's things at it.

Speaker 2 (46:00):
But that didn't happen.

Speaker 3 (46:01):
Did not happen. So, folks that don't do it for
us for this show, thank you for tuning in, watching
or listening wherever you may be. May be at Next
Day video available on one of our Spotify feeds. Don't
forget to like, comment, subscribe, leave a rating, or review.
My name's Joe, his name's Brian. As we always close

(46:21):
out this show, we like to tell our watchers and
our listeners out there. We hope you be safe, be good,
and we'll catch you later.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Now tell me if the beard's too long, we.

Speaker 3 (46:35):
Would like it.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
Thank you for listening, and remind our listeners to follow
us on social media and our website www. Dot steel
City Underground dot com

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