Have the Steelers effectively filled the holes on their roster?

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Underground, The steel City Underground, the black
and gold standard for Pittsburgh Steelers coverage. Now here's your hose.
Joe Kuzma and Brian E.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Rose.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
Hello everyone, and welcome to another edition of the steel
City Underground podcast. My name is Joe Kuzma and bringing
you all of this fantastic offseason free agency and whatever
Steeler's news alongside with me as a one, mister Brian E. Roach. Brian,
how's going, my friend.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
I'm living in the epicenter of life. It's wonderful. Life
is excellent.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
I don't know what the hell that means.

Speaker 1 (00:47):
I don't know either. I don't know what I just
said even beans, because there isn't anything going on right now.
Everything is speculation. Everything's here say. Almost all attention is
turned toward the NFL Draft, which means we should maybe
close a bit look on free agency in the offseason
moves that the Pittsburgh Steelers have made thus far, and
thus far it does look like their attention may be

(01:09):
headed towards the draft. Because free agency, let's put it
this way, aside from one blockbuster trade, this would this
would maybe be one of the worst free agent periods
and signings and everything else. But the Steelers have done
in like decades. I mean, you remember when Kevin Colbert
was the GM and people, I mean for a very
long time obviously, and not too long ago. Omarkan took

(01:32):
over officially two years ago. He was starting in transition,
but this will be this is his third offseason in
that full capacity. But man, Colbert used to get, you know,
kind of berated because they had all this money tied
into Ben Roethlisberger, which doesn't seem like a lot of
money now, but when we were looking at Ben's final
year retiring and after the twenty twenty one season, he

(01:55):
was looking to have a forty million dollar cap hit
and then he had to take a pay cut to
remain with team, and it's like, you look at that
now and it's like, oh, man, But I mean, like
Mike Mitchell was one of the big names. Darius Green
was a big flop, but you know, it was a
splash into free agency and Kevin Colbert even trading a pick,

(02:15):
a first round pick for micka Fitzpatrick. Unheard of kind
of things. We're saying with omark On, this isn't your father.
Steelers but it sure looks like them right now because
either with Steelers. This is hard for me to come
to terms with though, man, because like, Okay, the Steelers
they lost five games, that's including a playoff game to
finish the season. Yet they have so many players that

(02:39):
exited out the door that are going to factor in
this compensatory formula, and that means that they were sought
after and had pretty nice contracts with new teams. I
didn't know that such a mediocre team could provide so
much value to the rest of the league, so to speak.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
It's just it's weird to me. If a team's sucks,
usually nobody wants the players that are there that are
from that team are becoming free agents, unless it's like
some bona fide star that's you know, desperate to get
out of town.

Speaker 2 (03:11):
You know, it's it's yet to be seen what what
transpires with some of these players who have moved on.
But you know, there's it's that, it's that it's that
hopeful phrase upside or he's got potential. There's a potential there.

(03:32):
You know, we'll see. I don't know. I I agree
with you. This is if you take that trade away man.
This was a boring free agent period Steelers.

Speaker 1 (03:41):
Woof man. I mean the players players gain versus players lost,
and some of these aren't really losses. There's it's not
completely up to date on over the cap just yet
because I saw Nate Herbig sign somewhere else. Some of
them maybe pending free agents that are owning out there.
Preston Smith was the guy he traded for from Green

(04:02):
Bay at a large cap kit to be determined in
his career. He's thirty three years old. Nate Herbet did
sign somewhere else to Monte Case, Michael Pruitt, Cameron Sutton,
Russell Wilson, who will. We're going to try and refrain
from too much quarterback talk here, but obviously as a
very lacking spot in during this offseason, it's just another

(04:24):
offseason of the Steelers trying to find I don't even
know their quarterback in the future. I don't even know
their quarterback for twenty twenty five, Tyler Matakevitch, James Pierre
did re sign Max Sharping, Kelvin Anderson, CJ. Henderson, and
then Jeremiah Moon is also back as well, And then
you start getting into some of the players lost, Larry
Ogajobi was released, Mike Williams, Dante Jackson, Najie Harris all

(04:48):
signing with the Los Angeles Chargers, James Daniels moving on
to the Miami Dolphins, Justin Fields of course, signing with
the New York Jets, and Kyle Allen, another quarterback third
stringer last year now with the Detroit Lions. Alan and
Roberts goes to the Las Vegas Raiders. So what did

(05:09):
the Steelers do? That seems like a pretty a decently
talented group to you know, have to fill in for it.
But at the same time, it felt like the Steelers
and Omar Kane had been building and shaping a roster
for years, that they had a lot of depth last year,
so they could like maybe weather this storm. But I'm
not sure that they did a whole lot in this

(05:30):
free agency period. We're gonna go name by name. Of
course some I can't pronounce, leading these defensive linemen, me too,
but there's a man it does feel like I don't
feel as good, and obviously the quarterback position doesn't help.
Mister Rogers waiting on his decision, That decision might not come.
I think that decision Brian let's talk about that real
quick with quarterback. We know he met with the Steelers

(05:51):
for six hours. We'dbe morons to ignore that he left
without a deal. He got released by the Jets. It
doesn't impact the compensatory formula thing that it looks like
omar Con is gonna be loading up on. They should
get the max four picks if it remains the way
it is. But because Rogers wasn't, you know, an expiring contract,
it doesn't factor into that formula at all. So they

(06:12):
could sign yesterday.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Right.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
Feels to me like it's we're gonna wait and see
what happens with the draft and then and then pick
up the phone. And that's holding up some other teams too,
maybe or maybe some other teams are waiting the same way.
What do you think about that?

Speaker 2 (06:26):
I honestly believe it is the steal. It's what I
said last time we were talking. I believe the Steelers made
Aaron Rodgers an offer, and Aaron Rodgers was like, well,
you know, we'll see. I have to look into my
inner eye and go consult with the sheep whoo and
see what you know, what what I can derive from

(06:47):
the entrails Basically, he just is a diva and he
wants to be the center of attention, and he likes
being courted, and you know, he's gonna drag it out
to me. I'm okay with them not removing the offer
and just going screw you. You don't want to say, yes,
we're done, We're gonna go elsewhere. Leave it there, but

(07:09):
expect that he's maybe not gonna say yes.

Speaker 1 (07:13):
I kind of wonder too if in Rogers' mind there's
probably something there he's talking. He doesn't want to look
over his shoulder at an incoming younger player. It didn't
seem like he's He's like Ben. He didn't didn't look
favorably upon anybody that was ever drafted or brought into
Green Bay as maybe the next guy. And he had
made a big fuss about Jordan Love, and of course

(07:36):
they went and the Packers went and did the same
thing they did when they drafted Aaron Rodgers. Shouldn't have
been a big surprise for Aaron Rodgers, right, But I
kind of wonder if he's like, you know what, I
don't really want to play for the New York Giants,
so this might be Pittsburgh or retirement, and the Steelers
are like, you know, we're gotta keep our eyes on
everything because regardless if you sign here or not, you're
gonna be forty two in December. Dude, you're forty one

(07:56):
right now. You're gonna you have to do something that
nobody else has. Really, you have a handful of quarterbacks
that have been starters in the league at north of
age forty, a few Hall of famers even, but that's
those are the exceptions to the rule. Tom Brady obviously
the most recent, Drew Brees, but he fell off a
cliff after forty. He didn't even play two full seasons
after that. Warren Moon, another guy, Brett Farv, another guy

(08:19):
at you know, the same guy we're talking about, Aaron
Rodgers replacing. So he has to do something that somebody's
never done. And honestly, the best the best spot for
him probably isn't even the Steelers. He might like Mike
Tom and he might have an infatuation. He might look
at the culture in Pittsburgh. Blah blah blah. Some remember
floating around if he could wear twelve, Terry Bradshaw's unofficial
retired number, and I'm like, yeah, no, maybe not, but

(08:43):
that may too good. But Minnesota just won fourteen games
with Sam Darnold and they have a compliment of skilled players.
We mentioned this on the last show. You have Jordan
Andison and Justin Jefferson and Aaron Jones and TJ. Hocketson
and an offensive minded coach, you know, and you're back
in your division. You could stick it to the Packers
twice in one season. Why is that not a more

(09:04):
appealing place unless it's about money. You get to play
in a dome too. You don't have to play in
any cold weather like. That could be good on the
brittle bones, the arthritis setting in like. But regardless, Well,
go ahead.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
You know you talked about retirement. I look, if I'm
Aaron Rodgers, I really do feel like I'm sitting there
thinking to myself. Do I want to play against the
Browns defense and the Ravens defense twice a year? Do
I want to do that? Do I want to get
involved in that kind of rivalry and that kind of
violence at my age and knowing you know full well

(09:44):
how many sacks the Steelers gave up over the last
couple of seasons. Do I want to be that guy?
I don't think I do, really, because I'm gonna die.
I'm gonna get killed and maybe not. Look, you know,
we don't know what the offensive line is gonna look
like next year. Maybe he won't get killed. But he's,
as you said before, he's a statue statue. He's not

(10:05):
he's not he's not a young mobile quarterback. You know,
if Miles Garrett's coming off the corner and beating Broderick Jones,
I don't want to be Aaron Rodgers standing there going Okay,
this is this looks yeah, this is good. This was
a really great choice on my part. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:23):
And not only that, but the Bengals have the sacks leader,
and Trey Hendrick said the Browns have the second overall
pick that could be Abdul Carter coming in to pair
up with Miles Garrett. I mean, that's a scary proposition
just to get the Steelers overall. And you said it best.
The Vikings have a better offensive line, Like you go
to the Giants, it's a complete dumpster fire. The Steelers
aren't a complete dumpster fire. There's still a team that's

(10:45):
in reset rebuild. They still need some pieces, but there's
some unknowns and offensive line is a giant unknown. Rogers took.
He took forty sacks last year. It's not terrible. At
full seventeen games, forty is not a bad number for
a forty year old guy on the list on a
team that he went five to twelve with. So I
missed two other free agents I had to mention too,

(11:07):
since we're mentioning offensive line Dan Moore going over to
the Tennessee Titans for that huge deal, and Van Jefferson
joins him there in Tennessee. Also, so two others that
the Steelers lost quarterback position obviously one that will continue
to be talked about. I know, you know as much
as I said, and I even said this on one
of the other shows before you'd ask or somebody maybe

(11:29):
even pitched about Bason Rudolph returning, and I'm like, nope,
that ship sailed. Now he's back. And I'm like, you know,
for the floor that you have for an Aaron Rodgers,
he should be able to throw for like two fifty
two tds. He had a couple three TD or more
games last year. But he had all of his buddies
in New York. He had his former offensive coordinator from
Green Bay. He had Davonte Adams, he had Garrett Wilson,

(11:51):
he had Brese Hall, you had a better offensive line.
The team was bad in many aspects, got the coach fired.
Robert Salah, the shiny you know, new toy everybody wanted
to hire a few years ago. Big trade for Aaron
Rodgers that didn't work out. Now he's older and you
don't know if he's still effective. You don't know how
much he's still got left in the take. People always

(12:12):
want to exhume some of these legends. Bring Ben Roethlisberger back,
you know what I mean, Bring in this guy. This
is a Tom Brady coming off of you know, being
forced out of New England and Brady actually still being good. Right,
And even for Brady, he had a lot of turnovers
and stuff and they had to have a lot to
go their way to win that Super Bowl. I don't
know that Aaron Rodgers jumps in. He might give you

(12:35):
a little bit higher floor than like Mason Ruolf and
people roll their eyes and the laugh and everything else,
But it's pretty much gonna be like the same going
back to the same thing as like maybe Russell Wilson.
I'm not sure that you know Russ held the ball
for a while, so Rogers might get rid of it
a little faster, but he might not take as many
sacks that way. But he's not running away from anybody

(12:56):
at his age. Maybe he just doesn't throw that he's
thrown two of his last three seasons, because the one
in the middle of those three he didn't play, but
four snaps. Two of those are two of his worst
statistical seasons that he's had as an NFL quarterback over
the years. What is last in Green Bay and last
year with the Jets, he's thrown more interceptions for a
guy not knowing known to be throwing interceptions. So the

(13:19):
Steelers have a whole quarterback, and you know, does Mason
Rudolph provide the same level like his ceiling above Rogers'
floor or his floor man, who knows he'd come in
and just suck completely. You know, over a full season,
we don't know what he looks like. If he solves
the problem, great, it's twenty nine going on thirty. He
could be future. But if Rogers comes here or whatever,

(13:40):
the solution's going to be the long term solution. Even
if it were Mason Rudolph isn't on this roster. You're
talking maybe five years. Max Rogers ain't playing for five
more years. I think he's got one or two tops,
might be looking for a three year deal like Darnold got. Unlikely.
If he plays one more season, that's it, and then
you're right back in the same scenario next year.

Speaker 2 (14:03):
Yeah, you know, I don't. I don't want to keep
beating the mister overrated course to death. But yeah, he's
not a long It's obviously he's not the long term solution.
Mason's not the long term solution, and I don't care.
I don't care that they don't have the long term
solution right now because we need to just deal with

(14:23):
what we have, get to next year and find a
long term solution. But I you know, we'll talk about
obviously the draft over the next FEO months. I still
expect them to draft a quarterback. I just don't expect
them to draft a quarterback in the first round. I
expect them to draft a guy that they think can
be a developmental quarterback, and if they happen to hit
a home run with that guy, great, but if they don't,

(14:46):
All right, that's that's your new Mason Rudolph, that's your
new Landry Jones. Right, that's your new backup, and you
double dip in twenty twenty six, you go out and.

Speaker 1 (14:54):
Try again, maybe again. Yeah, I think that's the way
you've got to go with the unknown, and the unknown
isn't isn't a guy that has to buck the trend
of beating father time, Father times almost undefeated. The only
guy who didn't beat was TB twelve method, not Terry Bradshaw.
That would be Tom Brady. Mason Rudolph's brought in. He's

(15:15):
you know, it's surprising. I'm actually surprised about the positivity
there is from some of the fans out there. A
lot of people will acknowledge you and I ourselves that
maybe he's not a starting quarterback in the NFL. He played.
How many games did he appear? He was in eight
games for the Titans, not all starts. He had five
starts last year, completed sixty four percent of his passes,
a little over fifteen hundred yards, nine touchdowns on a

(15:37):
very bad team, in a new situation, in a new situation,
and I think going there and learning from Callahan, who
was the OC with the Cincinnati Bengals, he got a
little bit maybe further education. He comes back. Now you
got Arthur Smith far better than Matt Canada. But Rudolph
didn't really play under Canada, so he played under this
combo of Eddie Faulkner and Mike Sullivan. But that left

(15:58):
a positive taste in everyone's mouth. Russell Wilson did not.
For whatever reason. He's on the way, he's on the
outside looking in. He's gonna probably have to play as
a backup somewhere where he might have to look. You know,
enough quarterbacks have started over the last few years, like
usually about sixty end up starting for various reasons. People
get benched, people get hurt. So there's probably a spot
somewhere for Russell Wilson. Doesn't look like it's in Pittsburgh.

(16:20):
So it's Mason Rudolph. Maybe Skyler Thompson, who has like,
you know, a handful of starts with the Miami Dolphins
in his career. Maybe he's holding the clipboard. Maybe a
rookie somewhere is holding the clipboard. But it's gonna have
to be the unknown as rookie, and the rookies are crapshoot.
And that's a whole other topic that you and I
are gonna cover maybe in our next show or maybe
in like it's it's coming soon, because the draft's right

(16:41):
around the corner at the end of April. We're about
a month out from it right now. I think it's
actually April twenty fourth, I believe, So we're we're a
month out, and we'll discuss that all the former first
round picks using the gamble. We don't want to say
all that right now. Just strictly this offseason. Quarterback is
still probably a big goose egg on this roster. Maybe
Rogers is the backup plan. If it isn't, then it's

(17:03):
Rudolph who has twenty nine career games. He's started eighteen
of those games. Career wise, sixty three point seven percent
completion percentage for forty six hundred and fifteen yards twenty
eight touchdowns. So, like I said, you might that might be.
I think that floor might be just a little higher
than what you were getting with Trubisky. Picket fields is

(17:26):
tough to say. Fields will still scamp around and get
you something, but they're things that are handicapped. But I
wouldn't expect much more than that. I'm not expecting much
more than that. And the same thing is it's like, Okay,
you expect more with Aaron Rodgers, maybe just a little
bit more, but then you're spending thirty million dollars or more.
We assume has to be the price tag. And people say,
Joe Brian, the salary cap goes up every year. This

(17:49):
is chump change. No, it's not chump change. Miles Garrett
is now averaging forty million per season. DJ Watt is
entering the final year of his contract. He's earning about
thirty ish per year, but TJ up ten per year.
And you don't pay a quarterback thirty million dollars. There's
that thirty million dollars. Extend TJ three three years, pay
him what he's already getting paid, plus ten mil ten

(18:11):
million each of the next three there's your thirty. That's
why I don't want to do a move like this.
Thirty million dollars can net you like Darius Slay was ten.
It could get you some some quality players, maybe two, three,
four players depending on how it's spread out, versus maybe
some just mid kind of play at the quarterback position.

(18:33):
I'm not there for it, you know what I mean.
And we were saying off air Russell Wilson asking for
fifteen to twenty it's like, Okay, that's a little more palatable,
maybe with some incentives or whatever. But man, I know
that's where it's going. But not for a forty one
going on forty two year old quarterback.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
Think about this as well, all right. I think it's
a perfectly equitable comparison to say, do you want to
sign Aaron Rodgers for thirty million dollars a year? Or
do you want to sign TJ. Watt back and extend
him and keep him in the fold? Do you want
to sign Aaron Rodgers to thirty million dollars a year?
Or next year when Joey Porter is on the third
year of his rookie deal and is looking to be extended,

(19:09):
do you want to be able to extend Joey Porter? Right,
and and and spend the money you're going to have
to spend to do that, right?

Speaker 1 (19:16):
What is it the year? Year four? He's in three now,
so four. I know he'll be in three. But they
usually like to do it, you know, for final you know,
I mean, he doesn't have a fifty year option that
it'll be his last.

Speaker 2 (19:30):
That's why I'm saying it'll be his last year, and
you don't want to get that hold in crap, right,
he's going to look for the you know, the extension,
and they're going to try and make it work. I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (19:40):
So.

Speaker 2 (19:40):
I mean, you've got young players that you're going to
have in that position that you're going to have to
make determinations about, and all of a sudden that's going
to start to ramp up. Do you want to have
invested two years at thirty million dollars and in Aaron Rodgers?
Who I'm sorry, I could eat my words. Maybe Aaron
Rodgers comes in here and with DK and either George

(20:01):
Pickens or another receiver and some running back in the draft.
Somehow they managed to win a Super Bowl. I don't
believe that. I don't think you're winning anything with Aaron Rodgers.
So why spend the money that you are likely to
need to do other things?

Speaker 1 (20:17):
That's where I'm at. I don't care if the cap
goes up. You never know how much it's going to
go up, right now, Just hold on to the money,
extend some of your own players. You've got some young
guys that you may want to invest in. What if
they just want to throw that money at George Pickens
and extend them too. I mean that becomes less of
a positive ill possibility thirty a year. So if it's
Aaron Rodgers, we're talking one at thirty, do at sixty three,

(20:38):
at one hundred or more. I mean, thirty still puts
them at like the twentieth or twenty second highest paid
quarterback on average per season. But the way these contracts
are going, he might ask for more. He might want
thirty five. But I'm just using, you know, some ballpark figures.
I don't want this to be all. If we've talked
till we're blue in the face about quarterback, it's that's
that's pretty much where I'm at.

Speaker 2 (20:59):
Talk about other guys.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
Well, you know, and and from last year too, I
was I was a big Russell Wilson fan, but I
was so cautious in wanting to be you know, over
the moon for him. I was happy with the way
things started, the way things ended, not entirely his fault.
I think he kept them in some games more than
maybe some other guys would. But I mean that's not
saying the same collapse wouldn't happen with Aaron Rodgers, right,
So some other holes, the other the other some other holes.

(21:23):
So at the top of our list, of the freeze
aside from Mason Rudolph, where the trade for DK Metcalf
was huge as a wide receiver. But we're you know,
as far as the Sason, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Quite Frankly, Look, I think it's the only thing. I
think it's the only thing that they did that I
really categorized as a strong move. And you know, it's
it puts them in a position where they don't have
to go hunting that number one receiver again, right, they
don't need the pairing. If they want to keep Pickens,
they'll keep Pickens and that they have a nice tandem.

(22:00):
It's gonna stretch the field. It's gonna, you know, put
pressure on defensive backs. It's going to allow them to
potentially open up the run game in the underneath passing game.
Simply by having those two guys on the field. It
changes the dynamic of what the Steelers have had in
the past couple of years. If they don't keep Pickings

(22:20):
and they draft a new guy, it could be you know,
you're in a better position because you have a proven
wide receiver one in DK Metcalf. So it's a great move.
I think, you know, kudos for them to get forgetting it. Done.

Speaker 1 (22:36):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (22:36):
You know, I think this really just boils down to
Seattle was looking at extending Metcalf and Gino Smith and
just went, we don't want to pay that money because
we don't think we're winning anything anytime soon. Wow.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
I mean that's a fun that's a funny. That's a
funny uh comparison. And I'm glad you brought that up,
because here you have a team that won ten games
and missed the playoffs last year. Yeah, and now they
go and they go out and they pay Sam Donald
and he's still at the lower end, but it's still
enough of a contract. It's more than Minnesota was going
to give him, and Minnesota offering Donald still says, I

(23:09):
know a lot of people just jump in and say,
well they got j. J. McCarthy, why would they need
Aaron Rodgers. Well. JJ McCarthy has yet to take a
snap in the NFL and now had a major injury
that kept him out a whole year of football. There's
a lot of unknowns there, and especially we never know
who's going to be good. It doesn't matter if it's
a first round pick or not. For a quarterback, it
usually helps, but when you're like the fifth guy at

(23:30):
a position taken and it's you know, it's a coin
flip on quarterbacks. So absolutely, that's the reason why I'm like,
you know, I'm not willing to bet the farm. We'll
talk about this on another show, but I'm not willing
to spend. I'm not willing to do the Bryce Young
Carolina Panthers move in order to get up to that
top pick. For I don't ever want to do that.

(23:50):
I think if they did something with Rogers and it
was one year, it's like, yeah, it's like you're kicking
the can, it can get to continue kicking the can.
And quarterbacks just don't enter free agency. Even some of
the mediocre ones usually don't hit the market and you're
still paying a decent price for them when they do.
So the draft is eventually, the draft eventually has to

(24:13):
be the answer for the Pittsburgh Steelers unless there's some
miraculous Mason Rudolph thing that we didn't see. The coaches
bring him back and he turns into, you know, the
second coming of Ben Roethlisberger, which would be, you know,
I'd have to eat my shorts even on that. Even
I'm not that firm a believer being a Mason, Rudolph Defender.
So moving on, Brian, we talked about the wide receiver

(24:37):
will happen.

Speaker 2 (24:38):
Ye, that is absolutely what is going to happen.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
Not everybody will become.

Speaker 2 (24:43):
Mason will become the best quarterback in the history of
the Steelers.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
That is fresh sarcasm, the fresh sarcasm sign. I'm glad
you keep that just sitting around over there so they
can pull it out. Yes, it comes in handy. Wide
receiver though, was the was one of the big ones.
They've been seeking something for, you know, all of last
year from what we can tell, and now you got
DK Metcalf, Roman Wilson will come back after being hurt,
a draft pick spent there. George Pickens does iner to

(25:11):
finally over his contract, but it feels like that's a
little solidified. Sticking with offense, running back, Okay, Naji leaves
running backs a problem. Running back can be a problem
because I don't know Jalen Warren is in every down
back that he has the durability to get every down back.
Ball security not only an issue with him, but also

(25:31):
Kenneth Gainwell came over from the Philadelphia Eagles, and I
see a lot of people blowing smoke over Kenneth Gainwell,
and I'm looking over here like this is a guy
that maybe in jeopardy of even making this. I'm not
even sure that he's a lot to be on the
fifty three man roster when it's all said and done. So.

Speaker 2 (25:48):
So he two hundred and nine rushing yards, yeah, with
a touchdown last year, one hundred and sixteen receiving yards
for the season. He's an he is he is a
downgrade from Jalen Warren. I mean, let's be realistic. He's
he's got less, he gets less involved in the Eagles

(26:09):
offense and Jalen Warren, I get it. Sa Kuan was
there right.

Speaker 1 (26:13):
You know, even when he was.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
This is look you you again. You have to expect
them to address running back in the draft because right
now the rotation that they have is not gonna be
adequate for what they need. I don't dislike the Kenneth
Gainwell signing, Don't get me wrong. I like having, uh,

(26:38):
you know, Jalen Warren and Kenneth Gainwell as two pieces
to a rotational puzzle. But I don't know that Kenneth
Gainwell offers you the same kind of change of pace
that Jalen Warren did with Najie Harris. If Jalen Warren
is running back, one, uh, Kenneth Gainwell is just Jalen

(27:00):
Warren Jr. It's not a change of pace guy.

Speaker 1 (27:04):
Yeah, he's gonna be a guy that probably gets the
ball thrown to him more than not. And he's also
here to play special teams and be a kick returner.
So Jalen Warren doesn't have to do that this season
if Jalen Warren is the feature back. So yeah, that's
still concerning. And when you're talking about, well, can you
use a draft pick on a quarterback? So you use
a draft pick here. Running back has to be sitting

(27:24):
there and it's a deep class, but it has to
be sitting there in the back of your mind. So
it's still an area of need. If they bring in Rogers,
then maybe quarterback is not like a primary focus anymore.
Maybe it shifts the running back, Maybe it shifts to
another area on the defense that we'll talk about here
in a moment. Momentarily, Well, we're not all entirely done

(27:45):
with I don't know that they've done anything with offensive line.
I gotta go look back at the transaction by the
guy off Waivers. Yeah, that's the one I saw, and
I have to go find his name now, but I
will in a second.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
Lasidious Smith. Yeah, let's I think it's Lisidious or less.
So you know, I can't pronounce people's names. I'm just
gonna say L E, C I T U S. It's
mister Smith. Mister Smith is the offensive lineman they claimed
off with Waivers from the New England Patriots.

Speaker 1 (28:18):
Yeah, and that one is still floating out here on
Steelers dot it's not I don't know that it's been official.
Maybe it is four pm today or something. It hasn't
been officially stated or put in a transaction wire on
Steelers dot com. The tight end has We have one

(28:38):
tight end that's been added to this mix that we
should mention. Why can't I say this for it's Donald Parimu.
He was a big guy. He's a guy that came over.
He was believe x FL, maybe even in the UFL,
but I remember he went over to Chargers. He was
a big body target. Let's put it this way. He's
the third tight end. He's a guy that's meant there
to be there and Jumbo package just play some special teams.

(28:59):
There's not a lot to get super excited over that.
Donald Parham Junior, so he was already a street free agent,
released ahead of actual free agency. Also, Ryan McCollum comes
back to the Steelers two on a one year contract,
so that that's one that you can put on there.

(29:20):
I'm trying to look and see, and we pretty much
just got to go over the defensive line, and it's
like some run of the mill kind of journeyman veterans.
Daniel Equelle maybe and aziz O to Mayo formerly of
a couple of different teams Vikings and Jaguars for Otemayo
and Brown's Jaguars and Patriots for a quale. I'm hoping

(29:46):
I'm saying those right. Sorry, guys. If I am not,
You've got one Samoan in here in the Simo names.
I mean, it's not even Daniel, that's his nickname. His
actual name is tan Alu or Tanalu. So I actually
like that that kind of rolls up the tongue a
certain way. But these are guys with some like very
minimal experience in the NFL. They're gonna be up for

(30:09):
grabs for well, well what.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
Well, I'm just gonna use Daniel's first name, and I'm
gonna say, oh, Tom because I can't. I don't know. Okay,
so Daniel, I mean he at least has started sixteen games. Okay, Yeah,
he's he's the veteran presence that they're adding that can

(30:33):
come in like a Dean Lowry kind of guy. Right,
he's yeah, exactly, he's adding depth, veteran presence depth. So
he's not a He's he's that's the journeyman guy. I
do think a Tom me Wu is as easy as easy.
Maybe that's his first name. Maybe I'll just call him
as easy. I think he has the potential to be

(30:55):
Remember he was only drafted in twenty twenty two, so
this is he's he's a younger guy. He is, he's
maybe a potentially developmental guy. They may like what his
attributes are. I think both of them are being brought
here to help boost bolster the run, defense and play rundowns.
I don't think either one of them is giving you
tremendous pass rusting you know, options. But hey, you know

(31:20):
what these two signings say to me? First round pick
is a defensive lineman.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
That's what Well, well, maybe maybe I have some opinions
on that. As you know, a quality Daniel, he's been played.
He's played fifty seven games, only ninety one career tackles.
So none of these neither of these guys are really starters.
As you mentioned, the other guy as easy is only

(31:45):
fifth round twenty two, twenty twenty two draft pick, though
this would be his third year in the NFL. I'm
not even sure. I'd have to look he's paired in
nine games if he's been on a roster to even
be a tenured player at this point. Daniel at East,
I believe, is at least a guy that's getting some
veteran benefits from the players you do so, but that's
what you're looking at. You're not looking at guys that

(32:07):
are good jump in. This is not a Larry Ogunjobi
type two. And you're saying draft pick because Cam Hayward
up there in age you want to give him some
You're going to give him some rest. Larry goes away.
So now the only other guy there is Kean o'benton,
who we really love. Think he'll be extended eventually. He's
entering year three. Give him a line, share playing time.
See if he's the guy he's probably shown it enough.

(32:28):
Plus Larry Ogunjobi, I think there was a hint of
he's about to be suspended. Was it six games for
performance in handing games?

Speaker 2 (32:35):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (32:35):
Yeah, so that might.

Speaker 2 (32:37):
Be just performance enhancers to keep his back straight.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
He's always play seems like he was always under Andrew
report practicing maybe once or doing a walk through at
the end of the week. But you can't count on either,
and who knows how much that affected his performance. But
the only reason I don't I mean, we're gonna get
into this more draft priorities. One reason I don't say
first round quarterback or quarterback, sorry, is because the quarter
position maybe running back, woul they shoot their shot on that. Again,

(33:04):
depending on who's there. I would be surprising not out
of the question they don't have a second round pick.
Eline is deep. I do think they take one. But
if you take well, if you take a first round
defensive lineman, they're not playing yet over Hayward or over Beton,
who are probably going to play sixty five, seventy percent
or more of the game. But it's also scary if

(33:25):
you don't take one and there's nobody behind Hayward or
Betton and one of those guys gets hurt. Can't be
the two guys that we can't pronounce their names. So yes,
that is those are holes.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
They don't have a second round pick right now, that
doesn't mean they won't have a second round pick by
the time the draft starts. I'm going to tell you
my honest opinion. I expect them to have maybe the
most energized draft that we've seen them have in a while.
I expect them to move around. I expect them to
make some trades. I don't expect them to move up

(34:00):
from twenty one. Don't get me wrong, that's gonna cost
too much capital. But I do expect them but to
potentially manipulate things so that they can be in position
to get the running back that they want, to get
a D lineman that they want to, maybe get a
developmental quarterback that they want, and probably get a wide
receiver Outside of that. I don't know, but those four

(34:24):
things I think will happen, and I think D line
or running back in the first round are probably the
most likely choices. Because I'm just telling you, I don't
care who falls. I don't care who's there at twenty
one unless his name is Cam you're not drafting I do.

(34:44):
That's my point. Unless his name is Cam there's no
reason to spend the twenty first pick on any of
the guys in this draft at quarterback.

Speaker 1 (34:53):
Yeah, I don't disagree with that. It's just a matter
of It's like the Knny Pickett thing. So if there's
a guy that's there and you don't have to spend
anything extra, you gotta take your shot. And I'm going
to get into the lottery the powerball aspect of taking
money play that quarterback.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
Is exactly what you said. It's Kenny Pickett. That's who
you're getting well at this at this in this this
is a draft class that is judged to not be
great at quarterback. Okay, So I'm just telling you you're
gonna invest that kind of a pick in a in
another quarterback, you better at that place, your your your

(35:32):
lottery ticket. You better have spent a lot of time
trying to fix the lottery because it's not going to happen.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
Perhaps we've seen scouts be wrong, but we do know
that probably a third or fourth round quarterback isn't going
to jump into being an NFL starter either. So it
all depends on where they feel it's scouted and whatnot.
And again I don't know about wide receiver, like I
really do like struggle with that because with DK which
we're Pickens, with Calvin Austin, with Rouman Wilson, there's four

(36:02):
guys and they brought back Bence, Ronnick and Scottie Miller
who those guys roster.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
They will absolutely draft away.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
Oh absolutely, if.

Speaker 2 (36:11):
They trade Pickens. If they don't trade Pickens, then it's
more of a luxury pick. Running back and d line
are the two critical ones. Maybe corner but I think
you've made yourself. You put yourself in good position with
the free agent signings at cornerback, all right, I don't
think you're in desperate Ney. Darius Slay should be good
enough to play for a season and still get acceptable

(36:35):
performance from him, you know, and then you'll see I
you know, well again you never know with injuries, but
we'll see.

Speaker 1 (36:44):
Yeah, correct, And you know, Skeeronica Millard just being on
the roster the probably helped the Steelers win one or
two games just with splash plays that they made. You
can't discount those guys, even if they're only getting a
handful of snaps or they're primarily popping off the page
of special teamers. But would you trade George Pickens for
a second or third round pick and then take a

(37:05):
Mecca Abuka with twenty one? There's a question for you.
Interesting and I.

Speaker 2 (37:10):
Would definitely trade George Pickens for a second round pick.
I don't know that I would trade George Pickens for
a third round pick.

Speaker 1 (37:17):
Okay, especially not in this particular draft class. It doesn't
seem to get very deep outside of like the top
handful of names. This isn't last year's wide receiver class.

Speaker 2 (37:27):
It's not I I this is. That's the downside is
I think in a lot of ways from an offensive standpoint,
this just isn't that good a draft. Next year's is
going to be better, I think in almost every offensive position.
And you get another year out and then you got

(37:47):
Jeremiah Smith. It's gonna come out.

Speaker 1 (37:50):
So you know, getting drafted third or fourth overall like
Marvin Harrison Junior did so.

Speaker 2 (37:56):
But I just you know, running back is probably the
deepest offensive position in this draft, and I do think
that they will have to take a stab somewhere at
running back.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
Jeremiah Smith for the buck Eyes. I mean, Travis Hunter
was putting a pretty pretty good name out there too
for being like a lot. When's the last time a
wide receiver went one overall? You have to go all
the way back to Keshawn Johnson. Maybe it's it's been
a long time, and I know Sammy Watkins was like
fourth overall and you don't have very many to go
super high. Jamar Chase was six to the Bengals. So

(38:30):
but aside from that, you started to match a DB's.
It's a good place to jump over to after we
talk about linebacker. Real quick, Steelers made a deal cut
of deal all to bring Cole holcome back. I think
that's a sharp, sharp maneuver. Malik Harrison a questionable one.
I'm not sure that he provides a lot other than
maybe some depth like a fill in spot starter special

(38:50):
teams play, but yet another former Raven that fills in there.
So the inside linebackers are looking okay. They really haven't
added anything on the outside. I mean they have like
a zz marked as a as an edge. And I
hate when you get this because you get some guys
to come over from a four to three to a

(39:12):
three four. He's six five, two eighty four, he's he's
cam Ish size, You know what I mean, He was
a little too big to be an out a three
four outside linebacker. So I don't like calling him and
edge uh in the in the Steelers system, so there
isn't a lot of depth on the edge part. But
linebacker pretty much I think is lockdown. I don't think
we have a lot of debate there that The debate was,

(39:34):
you know, you can't just go into this offseason which
is Joey Porter and Corey Trice. It seemed like Omar
Kahn wasn't happy with that Corey Twice. Corey Trice could
develop into a solid player, but he is just very
minimal playing time over two years in an injury history.
That doesn't make Cam necessarily the most reliable candidate to
be out there. You put him in a tall task

(39:54):
with covering Jamar Chase, and Jamar Chase is good Jabar
Chase things, but they didn't want t Higgins to body him,
and you got to face those guys now twice a
year with those contract extensions in Cincinnati. So to supplement that,
Darius Slay thirty four years of age, A lot of
people seem favorable about this. They still say his tape

(40:16):
much better than what Pat Patrick Peterson or Pat Pete
was doing when he came over from the Minnesota Vikings.
As you know, this similar thirty three year old veteran.
We'll see while Sleigh factors into this, and behind him
Brandon eccles so and eccles six round pick to the
twenty twenty one NFL Draft. He spent four seasons with

(40:39):
the New York Jets. He played quite a bit, nineteen starts,
fifty seven games, appearances, five interceptions, two of those returned
for a touchdown. Probably one of these guys that Mike
Tomlin and company scouted initially. Maybe he was a guy
they were looking to draft in that same kind of thing.
So they come back around and then it's like, let's
kick the tires on them. Maybe a decent depth play.

(41:02):
I do think this is one.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
Could challenge Beanie for the slot. Maybe maybe Nickel guy
could be a guy that challenges for that.

Speaker 1 (41:10):
And we'll have to see. I think he's a tweener
between both of those. Sleigh will not be playing in
the slot, I can't envision in any way, and Slay
is a corner too. You could probably do worse, a
lot worse than that, and that would be James Pierre,
who they brought back primarily because the special teams. So
I mean this is one area they did a lot.
They also went and got one Thornhill. I'm not a
big one thorn Hill man, but if you're just trying

(41:32):
to stop the run, which is what you're thinking, one
thorn Hill is good at stopping the run. He you
don't want him as a starting safety. You don't want
him in either spot where Mika or Deshaun Elliott is playing.
But if you throw him out there as an extra player,
when you've got like a dime quarters package with your
extra dbs, maybe you can bring him out as a

(41:53):
big nickel safety dimebacker by all means, bring him out there.
And it's a veteran player. He's seen a lot of things,
he's got some smarts, He's played in a lot of
good systems. I think it was a savvy move. You
just couldn't go with case he was not only older,
but also he's another guy with availability issues because he
tends to get fined and you know, ejected from games.

(42:15):
So I can't have that happening either. But secondary, I
think they did a pretty good job. If anything, this
was one area they attacked and added a lot of
quality players too, and who's to say they also won't
add some in the draft.

Speaker 2 (42:29):
Yeah. I mean, the thing that's going to stand out
to you in ninety percent of the contracts that they
signed is this phrase one year deal. All right. Yeah,
they they are, they're they're they're bridging their their their
positions consistently, and the fact that they are building draft

(42:49):
capital for twenty twenty six would lead you to believe
that they plan on getting much younger, very fast and
then trying to ride those rookie deals for quite a while.

Speaker 1 (43:05):
Yeah. And you see Tom and Cheese in it there, DK,
Darius Slay, all these guys did some photo ops throughout
the Steelers' facilities. Pretty cool to see everybody's signing some
other contracts. But it's kind of like, wait, who's that guy?
You know, just you know it really is, it's kind
of it's very lackluster outside of you know, Sligh was

(43:29):
kind of eyebrow raising because we were like, we called
it and we didn't want to call it. We were like,
come on, Tom, and don't be looking at this. You know,
older guy, it's been around the league that you've been
flirting with playing and paying you know, when he signed
the previous contract. Before you know it, Tron Matthew will
be here next year. So another guy they flirted with,

(43:49):
Aaron Rodgers, the guy they flirted with. There's all kinds
of them like this, you know, so, But for the
most part, when you're looking at Isaiah ltder Milk also
coming back, I'm looking at some of the names James Pierre,
zez Wan Thornhill, Daniel that we mentioned, louder Belkschronic, Scottie Miller,
Mason Rudolph, trading for Dk Metcalf, Darius Slay, Malie Harrison,
Kenneth Gainwell, Brandon Equals, and then bringing back Ryan McCollum,

(44:14):
redoing the deal with Cole Holcomb, Donald Parham Junior. There's
not like a whole lot Jonathan Ward on a futures contract.
Maybe you know he's been he kind of got to
see I think a little bit of time on the
main roster, but not enough that's gonna get you particularly
super excited for the future. At some of these positions.
There's still some holes to fill. It's not a whole

(44:35):
lot of panic because they obviously have a plan for
the draft. They could be aggressive. As you're saying, it
looks like this year a little more lackluster with the draft,
just because you had all those super super seniors from
COVID carry over eligibility last year, where you had six
quarterbacks go in the top twelve picks. I think it's
I think it's gonna swing back around. It's good boomerang

(44:57):
back around this year. That there's gonna be more defensive
players maybe taken in the first round, because that's what
teams skipped on last year. So that's why I'm like,
I'm not turning away from offense. This team still has issues.
They got to be able to convert on third and
one and fourth and one and in the red zone,
and those were still issues last year. If Arthur Smith
wants to pound the ball, you've got to add some

(45:18):
bodies to this. So we're gonna be looking at some
more of that in the coming episodes. And who's throwing
them the ball? We still don't know the great mystery,
but that's yeah, And you know what, if that's the
way it is, that's the way it's got to be.
And it's hard to be optimistic if it's Rudolph, If

(45:38):
it's Rogers, Jamis Winston out of the picture. He's so
going into the Giants. So we mentioned this on the
previous shows. Go back and take a look at those folks.
If you haven't already like comment, subscribe as well. Brian,
any closing thoughts, my friend.

Speaker 2 (45:55):
I don't have any more to say about any of
this right now.

Speaker 1 (46:00):
Well, I mean we're starting to get excited for the
draft and the prospects of new players incoming, and then
the following year is the twenty twenty sixth draft, which
is in Pittsburgh. We said, if they could have as
many as four comp picks, got to look at what
else they still had on the board their original seven,
that's eleven picks. If they hadn't traded anything away, maybe
they maneuver, Maybe they gained some others in that process too,

(46:21):
Going back and forth, that's a lot of picks. It
means there's gonna be a lot more holes on the roster,
especially with one year contracts. But maybe some of that's
ammunition for this year. We'll have to Well let's.

Speaker 2 (46:32):
See, So here you go. This is what's been weighing
on my mind recently, ever since the Ireland game was announced.
Would it be. And maybe I've said this already on
the show, or maybe I haven't. I don't know. I
I think that it would be the coolest thing ever
if the Steelers went over to Dublin, played as the

(46:52):
home team and in the fourth quarter renegade.

Speaker 1 (46:58):
You had mentioned something about that.

Speaker 2 (47:00):
That's like, I don't know that. That's like a lifetime
event to be in a foreign country in the stadium,
your team is in the home is the home team,
and then renegade happens, and in Ireland, everybody's waving the
terrible towels? How cool would that be? How cool would
that be?

Speaker 1 (47:17):
Hopefully they understand what's going on, because I feel a
lot of times the international games, and maybe not so
with the Steelers. This being their marketing and their marketed
designated area. Maybe they have more of a fan base there.
I know they do in Mexico, So maybe the fan
base won't just sit on their hands. You're not gonna
have people show up in Let's pick the team that
they're not gonna play this year. I don't know, off

(47:38):
the top of my head. They got the Lions. Who
else they have? They have the whole NFC North, don't
they So forty nine ers. They don't have the forty
nine ers on their schedule, and you're gonna have people
wearing like Brock Purdy jerseys, you know what I mean,
or George Kittle jerseys sitting there in the crowd, and
they're just they're they're like you know, the football, soccer,
the other football, and they're just gonna ants and chant

(48:01):
and throw smoke bombs and whatever else they do turn
a game and not know what renegade is, but be
cool if they do. Brian Man, thanks once again for
joining me. We're trying to hold up the fort here
as we turned the corner into the NFL Draft, So
more on that coming. We're gonna start talking about we
got to talk about these quarterbacks until something happens, and then,

(48:21):
knowing our luck, it will. But I still don't think
it changes a whole lot because even if Rogers does sign,
they've still got to have their eye on the future
somewhere else, unless they're gonna look for the next guy
who gets released from a veteran contract somewhere else, you know,
in the next year or two, like Matt Stafford almost
became that guy. So yeah, just it's we said this,

(48:42):
we set this at the tail end of Ben We're like,
this is gonna be We're gonna be talking about this
for years, purgatory until we find the next guy.

Speaker 2 (48:51):
And I'm just telling you the next guy. Look, the
next guy does not come, generally speaking, in the low twenties.
The next guy comes a year after you really stunk
the bed.

Speaker 1 (49:07):
Yeah, well that's our next topic, my friend, is how
many of that we did this years ago too? How
many of these quarterbacks after the first two or three
picks in the draft, top five, even outside of the
top overall, unless top overall was bad, team gets it wrong.
We don't know about Race Young just yet. Heexit's takes
CJ Stroud right, And we're also looking at the same

(49:29):
things last year with the with the guys that came
out Caleb Williams, Jade Daniels May So I don't know,
we'll see so or Drake May. I'm sorry anyways, I digress. Folks,
don't forget to leave us rating review wherever you're watching
or listening from. Thank you again for supporting still see
Underground podcast. My name is Joe Kuzba. His name is

(49:51):
mister Brian E. Roach. We'll catch on the flip side
until then. Encourage everyone out there to be safe, be good,
and we'll catch you later. We would liked it. Thank
you for this thing, and remind our listeners to follow
us on social media and our website www. Dot steel
City Underground dot com.

Speaker 2 (50:11):
H

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