#395: Love Languages, Life's Passion, Therapeutic Back Bone

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Oh. The first time I was in Paris Royale with cheese. Okay,
so I moast romantic McDonald's has ever eaten? Y you
handle it?

Speaker 2 (00:10):
The McDonald's of the lights they called romantique. If you
watched the Parisian Olympics opening ceremonies, that McDonald's was heavily featured.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
No, So I I went there and I ordered the
Royale with cheese. Okay, okay, and the guy's like, we're out, oh.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
And I was like, you can't be out, yes, McDonald
that can't happen, right, but you know, And so I
got something else.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
And then I went back to the table and I
sat next to my my ex brother in law who
was there, and he had a Royal cheese.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
The last one, the server he went to was not
a dick okay? The last one, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
Was it called the Royale with cheese? Okay? I was
wondering if maybe you just said that trying to be cute,
and really it was called something else, and you're like,
like this both fiction.

Speaker 3 (01:01):
I'm sure. I like the America that day that Yeah,
there's a good motherfucker berger.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
I quenched my first from.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
This big it's just gonna keep quotes selling from fabulous
Las Vegas. No matter. This is pod therapy, real people,
real problems, and real therapists. You can set your questions
anonymously at pod therapy dot net or email us at
pot therapy guys at gmail dot com. Now broadcasting from

(01:34):
the Churn. That's Jim and Neck.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
It's time for some pod therapist Jane the Rockets Studios.
You've changed the script.

Speaker 3 (01:45):
Okay, you're gonna have to say that again so I
can write it down.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Bro, it is so obvious. Clearly, Let's say Jacob's house.
I like the scenic choy pond thing you would and
the shout out to es J and the Ruckus. This
is their house, bro, that is this is very much Chase.

Speaker 3 (01:59):
We got some new music equipment in here.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
Well they just got back from a tour gig this
morning and so some of the gear got loaded in here.

Speaker 1 (02:07):
Yeah. Actually, when I got here, Jacob was in the
workshop like fixing a like a piano bench, piano. It
was really cool, Like I got to watch him like
do metallurgy. It was really exciting. I bent a piece
of metal. It was wild. I know, it was pretty exciting.
He used a vice and there was like a crowbar

(02:28):
and a and a hammer.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
It was really fun. We rent Laura and I uh
uh and uh. I don't know what the deal is,
but every single light switch in her house has just
fucking fallen apart, Like they still work, but they're the
they're the switches where it's just you press the top
part or you press the bottom one of those Rocker
switch Rocker switch, Yeah, and they're all just John Rocker

(02:53):
switch Racial time talking about the New York City subway. Yeah,
google John Rocker. I have to go back to nineteen
ninety seven for that one. Yeah, somebody was listening.

Speaker 1 (03:09):
It was like, fuck yeah, baseball reference, You're welcome.

Speaker 3 (03:13):
This is pre Chipper Joan's back. This goes so anyway.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
There's like one listener who was like just clapping, like yeah,
I get that listener.

Speaker 3 (03:24):
I say you're welcome, You're yeah. Uh no. So like
every one of these switches, they're just barely hanging on. Yeah,
Like I don't know who had the house before us,
but they must have just punched.

Speaker 1 (03:39):
They caved in, because I feel like those ones cave
in a lot where you're push from two far.

Speaker 3 (03:43):
Like, no, they're not caved in but like only half
of it is still like there's like a little catch things. Yeah,
like it's just it's just barely like it's it's very loose.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
Like a breeze would shut it off kind of thing. Yeah, okay,
got it.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
So Laura's in the bathroom because she's got her own
bathroom upstairs.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
Yes, can turn her off.

Speaker 3 (04:07):
Her switch had broken and years ago, so to keep
it on you had to have your finger in the alright,
preferbial dyke if you will. She listens to the show again.

Speaker 1 (04:28):
What none more? Shut it off by now we gave
up on the Nazi ship, so give up a stroke.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
No, we should because that in the last two years,
that's like that's a real thing. Now that's like it
was funny and haha joke, and then now it's like
we do have a real life Nazi.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
Oh yeah, that's true.

Speaker 3 (04:48):
The world has changed.

Speaker 1 (04:50):
Yeah. Yeah, they were fiction all the time. They were Okay, bro,
they're like fairies and vampires. Okay, you read stories about them,
they don't actually exist.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
Back to the light switch, So I I was like, okay,
I could put in a work order, but then we
have to wait and we have to have some stranger
candy man come in to do the handed man. So
I just like, not, fuck it. I'm just gonna do
this one myself.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
I'm here, sniff all the light switches.

Speaker 3 (05:24):
I heard they need to be flipped.

Speaker 1 (05:27):
Show me where each light switch is slowly, so.

Speaker 3 (05:32):
I go to home depot. I get a couple of switches.

Speaker 4 (05:34):
Have you already named each of your light switches? And
name the while we proceed about a label maker. This
is this one's nice. This is not a difficult task. Okay, okay,
you could probably do this. But have you ever switched?
Have you ever the top? But you know I could switch?

Speaker 3 (05:54):
Have you ever done any kind of electrical stuff? No
at all?

Speaker 1 (05:57):
Okay, I called an electrician ones when a breaker went.

Speaker 3 (06:00):
Out that counts. Did you or did your son?

Speaker 1 (06:02):
I did it?

Speaker 3 (06:02):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (06:03):
No. I called him and then he told me, hey,
this is just the breaker. You do not need electrician.
I was like, no, no, no, I've I've looked into this.
It's not a breaker. And then he literally walks over
and just he's like, that'll be one hundred dollars.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
Okay. It's like, damn, never mind, you can't do this.
I'm not the guy that guy, but it's funny because like, is.

Speaker 1 (06:24):
That's what it was? Not?

Speaker 3 (06:25):
Oh yeah yeah, so, uh, Laura has not really seen
me do a lot of handiwork because we've just been renting.

Speaker 1 (06:31):
The whole time off your shirt.

Speaker 3 (06:33):
So I roll.

Speaker 1 (06:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
And then so like I'm doing this and she's panicking
where this is electricity? She's like if you get electrified?
Like she's like, what do? What do I do? Because
I can't, Like if you're being electrocuted, I can't touch
you because then I'll be electrocuted too. Correct And I
was just kind of like, if I die doing this,
let me die, I lie, you can tell people just

(07:04):
I love you. Put the gun in my hand and
shoot me in there and so and so like the
whole time, I'm just fucking around with her. Yeah yeah
that she did not like that at all. But yeah,
the whole thing took Like it's really easy.

Speaker 1 (07:19):
Okay. I like those little press light switches that when
you turn them off, they glow like or there's like
a little light bulb inside you know what I'm talking about. Yep,
that's perfect because then you can always see them and
they're like a little red light inside.

Speaker 3 (07:32):
Well, I've never I can't remember a time I've walked
into a room and not known where the switches. Dude,
it happens to a lot like I have to be
able to see the switch. Usually you just you.

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Know, reach Something that weirdly bothered me in Portugal is
the building code there is a little different. So the
light switches are just a little lower on the wall
than I think they're.

Speaker 3 (07:50):
Going to be.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
Yeah, interesting, and they're usually they're in a different place
than the US puts them too, Like the bathroom light
switches are outside of the door, and that kind of thing,
which is that's that's fairly common. Okay, it wasn't anything
weird or anything.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
But then you can shut off the lights when somebody's
taking a.

Speaker 3 (08:04):
Ship, that's true.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
I don't like that.

Speaker 2 (08:06):
But then you can also the idea is you can
turn the lights on before you walk into the room.

Speaker 3 (08:10):
Okay, makes sense, but does make.

Speaker 1 (08:12):
A lot of sense. I don't know the risk perse
of the reward on that. I don't like that.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
I was someplace, Oh no, I remember, I remember, I'd
say I was someplace where the stairs were all different heights,
different depths, different, No what it was. It was a castle, yes, okay,
and they do that intentionally, okay, because if the stairs
are all exactly the same, you can just run up them, right,

(08:38):
So it's a defense. And so the other thing that
they do too is they have the staircase, those winding
staircases go it counterclockwise instead of clockwise.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
Enemy's right arm against the wall. Oh.

Speaker 3 (08:58):
Castle design is really really is kind of cool. That's
really me.

Speaker 1 (09:02):
I actually used to use this as a will protect you.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
No.

Speaker 3 (09:12):
I used to do this in group when we're talking
about like relapse prevention and and about like okay, you
kind of like this is your recovery.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
You have a castle there you go.

Speaker 3 (09:23):
You have to build a defense mechanism. I would talk
about like castle to hear all the things that they
did to protect themselves from an invading army. That's great.

Speaker 1 (09:33):
You know, I love that liquor yeseah. This is the
basement stores of liquor and drugs.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
So what I'm saying is when you sneak in your alcohol,
you got to protect that ship. Don't let anybody know
where you're hiding it.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Oh my god, I'll tell you. So, as you discovered,
I have started working at a rehab again. Okay, so
Jacob working, Yeah, world's collided. Yeah, okay, because I had
to certify a program.

Speaker 3 (10:03):
Are we talking about this, I'm not.

Speaker 2 (10:05):
I'm not going to go into I was only gonna
I was I'm going to dig into it.

Speaker 3 (10:10):
I was only going to talk about the exit interview.
So we do our exit interviews over zoom. Okay, okay,
So I didn't see Jim at all during the entire thing.

Speaker 1 (10:19):
Just one you should explain to the audience. You work
for an organization that certifies substance a piece.

Speaker 3 (10:25):
Think of me as an auditor.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, and is the man then the
griff of Here's here's the thing, man, here's the thing Jacob.

Speaker 3 (10:34):
That you need to know is that the entire time
I was waiting to be able to throw in mister
jobin into the conversation.

Speaker 1 (10:45):
Wow, what an asshole, and it never came up. Yeah,
and I left early. I'm glad I did know. That
is really funny. What a dick. Yeah, it ended up
going really well, But that was that was really funny.

Speaker 3 (10:59):
On Lord James.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
No, definitely not Colonel Definitely not Colonel James. My interns
were so confused that you were there. They're like, I've
met him. He spoke to our class. Yes, he did,
like should he be here? I was like, probably not.
I don't think he knew that.

Speaker 3 (11:14):
I worked here, So that was pretty fun.

Speaker 1 (11:17):
But yeah, no, I was just gonna say that it's
a shitty trying to monitor people smuggling drugs. Now that
I'm back into that life, I'm like, God, damn it, dude,
so much of your life is just spent trying to
keep drugs out of this house is so hard. It
really should They should put rehabs in a castle. Honestly,
probably more sense. But anyway, if you're wondering where the
hell's Whitney, you know what we don't know. Okay, nobody's

(11:38):
seen her in weeks. It's not our business week.

Speaker 3 (11:41):
Nobody's seen her in week.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
Nobody's seen her in week, you know, And I think
that you call off the search at that point.

Speaker 3 (11:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (11:46):
Just I've abandoned all hope.

Speaker 3 (11:48):
I've moved on.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
You know, she comes back, it'll be a nice surprise. Yeah. Yeah,
I don't want her to not come back. Yeah, for
I'm emotionally prepared for it. Yeah, I'm fine with it.
I mean not fine. That sounded mean, Okay, I've just
I'll be who are we talking about? Glad shit the
pew pew girl. Remember that chick from Texas love language

(12:12):
is Hi Whitney. Oh that's her name? Oh that was
it Whitney, Colonel Jim, Jacob and Nick. I've been thinking
about a topic a lot lately. It's interesting how our
upbringing shapes our expectations in relationships, and I would like
your perspective on that. Me and my fiance talk about
this topic a lot. We get along great and rarely fight,

(12:33):
but when we do it's usually surrounding this good, the yeah,
juicy stuff. The other night, over dinner, we were talking
about how different our families were and how we grew
up completely opposite from each other. I come from a
family where we show lots of affection with each other,
lots of hugs and verbal affection, and her family is
not as lovey dovey. I told her the way here.

(12:55):
I told her the way her family functions is strange
and foreign to me, and she said it was the
same way for her with the way my family does things.
The problem is I require verbal and physical affection in
our relationship to feel secure, and she doesn't require it
as much. This makes up eighty five percent of our squabbles.
I love that word. Even though I know she loves

(13:17):
me and she tries the best to understand what I
need from her. Not getting that affirmation as often as
I need is hard for me and causes me to
feel insecure at times, especially when I'm already stressed due
to unrelated matters. We're getting better at having conversations surrounding
the topic, but how do you give someone something that
doesn't come naturally to you? We understand we naturally on you,

(13:40):
AH do that doesn't come naturally on you? AH? What
we understand we both are the way we are because
of how we were raised, and we do our best
to understand each other's love languages. We have tried an
app that I believe Jim suggests that if I'm not mistaken,
on the podcast called love Nudge, I did to try
and be more friend of meeting each other's needs, but

(14:02):
the app was unreliable and glitched often. Shit that's sad
to hear. The question is is there a way to
meet each other in the middle on this? Are there
other apps or exercises that we can use to strengthen
this part of our relationship? I hope I provided enough
information was clear enough in my thoughts. Thank you for
this amazing podcast and everything you do and the amazing

(14:23):
community that you have created. Lost in translation, Anthony Camarada,
car Buddy, Tony Kay, Hey, hey, Tony, hey, hey girl.
It's sad to hear that love Nudge is glitchy. I
still recommend it. I need to re download that and
make sure it's a It probably is shitty, I DK.

Speaker 3 (14:43):
Yeah, no, this is uh. This is always a fun
thing to explore with couples. Sounds like it how how
we grew up and what things mean to us and
things that we've never questioned before until you get into
a relationship with somebody else. Yeah, and then how everything
they do seems really weird.

Speaker 1 (15:02):
Isn't it weird that people end up together though, Like
because you look at things like this and you're like, oh, well,
this person really craves affection and this person doesn't give it,
and yet we're together of each other, and it's like
how did that happen?

Speaker 3 (15:14):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (15:14):
And then here we are going like, man, we really
need to like work on this because like I'm unhappy
a lot, or I don't feel very safe in our
relationship and like I'm asking food for these minimal things,
but like, you just do not do these things naturally,
And then it's easy to take offense at that and
like read into that and be like, oh, well, it's
because you don't love me or you don't care about me.
Like I've told you my needs are, you're not meeting them.
The other person's trying to explain to you, Like, I
just not wired that way. I just do not think

(15:37):
that way.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
Was your family of origin like affectionate as far as
hugs and stuff like that?

Speaker 1 (15:44):
My mom was, yeah, yeah, your mom is as you
guys know, I mean, she can't keep her her hands
off you. You know, it's just very very.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
Nor do I ask her to.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
Now? Mom was like, lots of hugs and kisses, dead
fine hug kisses. Yeah, not really is The dad is
more just kind of in another room most of the
time doing his own thing. What about you? No, I
feel like in Iowa, you guys like shook hands and
didn't make eye contact.

Speaker 3 (16:08):
Yeah yeah, it was just a good handshake, a good
hearty handshake.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
Hi mom, how are you at the anniversary as well?
But like animals today, how are the crops? He's been good?

Speaker 3 (16:29):
No, my my we Yeah, like hugs still feel weird
to me.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
Okay, Like my dad's side of the.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
Family, a few people, mostly my female cousins and my
aunt hug and then my sister is a big hugger.

Speaker 1 (16:43):
I feel like in feminine culture, it's it's very acceptable
to just hug. It's just yeah, you can just everybody else.

Speaker 3 (16:51):
No, we never really did, okay, And even like Laura
and I were just talking about this this morning, like
even things like just things that you learn that you
kind of take responsibility for, like manners, you know, saying
please and thank you for stuff, you know, like she
never did that. She never grew up that way, because

(17:11):
it was like Mom took care of it. Like Mom
just did this. You just don't really say anything. It's
not expect You're like, yeah, it's like okay, I'm done eating,
Leave my dishes there. Leave Mom takes care of it,
you know. And it's not until you like become an
adult or you know, interact with other people and you're like, oh,
no one's here to take this stuff. What happens to

(17:32):
these dishes?

Speaker 1 (17:32):
Yeah, they magically go away.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
It's like that weird, sly way that you're telling Laura
on the show to put the fucking dishes in the dishwasher.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
I feel like this is how he's doing. This is
going to be his new method to passive aggressively.

Speaker 3 (17:46):
It's actually, as I think about it, I'm the one.

Speaker 1 (17:49):
I'm the problem, Like who is who? If there's more
surprise in your relationship, who is more affectionate? What is
your love language? I feel like this has been discussed
years ago, but don't even mind's physical touch. Oddly enough,
I guess because I crave it. Because I never crave
those handshakes. Nothing gets me off faster hand handshake and

(18:10):
she puts her other hand on my elbow. I'm like,
this is happening.

Speaker 2 (18:14):
And so when she switches the handshakes where we're holding
each other's thumbs.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
Flip it. Yeah, quick, quick, hard? What what is What
is Laura's love language?

Speaker 3 (18:30):
I shouldn't know this.

Speaker 1 (18:31):
Oh yeah, it's you verybody.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
What's the verbal one? Just the affirmation affirmation? That's what?

Speaker 1 (18:38):
Verbal affirmation? Verbal affirmation? Okay, yeah, the old out of boy.
Oh she loves a good out of Yeah, ladies love
a good out of boy. Real good there, fella, keep
it up the sport.

Speaker 3 (18:53):
Great job, champ.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
I now want to do that for like a week
and just see how long it takes. Just keep using
these like you know, chief, hey, Chief has your day,
and just.

Speaker 3 (19:03):
Wait until like this gets brought up. Can you go home,
go home tonight and call your wife, chief chief and
please record fun.

Speaker 2 (19:15):
No.

Speaker 1 (19:16):
But I get this question, and I appreciate it because
I think for a lot of couples it's weird to
us that you know, you you organically fall for each other.
It's a great connection. But then realizing that, like, no,
the way that you do your relationship, and this is
another piece too. We often, as as Anthony said, we
often do what comes naturally to us, right. It goes
back to the old treat others the way you want

(19:36):
to be treated thing, which is very natural. I think
that that is a a lot of times you can
figure out your partner's love language by what they keep
trying to do at you, like the way they're trying
to show you love, and you're sort of like, like,
I know, for us, you know, we've been married in
nineteen years now, but early in the relationship, I discovered
that hers was quality time and for me, I do
not care like I don't need to hang out after work.

(19:56):
I don't want to watch a show with you, Like
you can go watch another show in another room that
does not offend me. But I would do that and
she would just be like, wow, I guess that we're fighting.
And then she'd kind of be a bitch me like why.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
Are we what? What's going on?

Speaker 1 (20:06):
Like I was that's it?

Speaker 3 (20:07):
I like we're good. What the fuck?

Speaker 1 (20:09):
And then realizing like okay, So she would try to
spend time with me and I'd just be like, go away,
like I want to play mega man, you know, like
what are we doing right now? You realize that about
the other person, And so like, I love this question
because I think for a lot of couples that is
a really like difficult thing to sort of sit down
and say, Okay, hey, let's let's notice this, because a
lot of times you don't notice it, you just feel
a certain way. And I like that Anthony's noticing it

(20:31):
and learning from it because a lot of people will say,
and I'll hear this in therapy, they'll be like, uh,
my partner doesn't love me, my partner doesn't care about me.
And I'll be like, well, why do you think that?
Like you'll talk to the partner and be like, so,
what's going on. I'm like, you're falling apart. You don't
care for this persontion well by hand anymore, right, Yeah?
And it's like, well you don't. You don't ever give
me hugs And they're like, what what does that have
to do with it? I love you? And it's like
that I don't feel like you do. So realizing this,

(20:54):
I think is huge. And then what I love about
the love language is a lot of people complain about
it now because they're like, it's a really date paradigm.
They they don't like the concept. I like it because
it places an intentional effort in the relationship that your
partner is not going to passively through osmosis pick up
affection or or feel like something's happening in this relationship

(21:15):
that's not gonna do it like, You've actually got to
send that their way, and it burdens you with doing
that in the way they best receive. To take the
time to get to know your partner and be intentional.
And that's what I loved about that love nudge app
And I think why the books have been so wildly
successful is because it basically says, here's a list of suggestions.
And if a person is this way, they like gifts,

(21:37):
they like quality time, they like words of affirmation, they
like physical touch. Like these are things that you should
do for them, And it's good that a book would
teach you that because you don't naturally think that way,
you know, like for you, Nick, I'm pointing at Nick.
I feel like yours is not probably words of affirmation.
I feel like because like you just said, it's physical touch.
Do you know what your second one is?

Speaker 3 (21:58):
What are my options?

Speaker 1 (22:00):
Words of affirmation, physical touch, money, gifts is one acts
of service just solving the problem in your life, and uh,
quality time. If I guess, I would say yours physical touch, fine,
you know, but then I would probably say your next
one is maybe acts of service. Like I feel like
if somebody just solves a problem for you to like
thank you like that, Yes, that was great?

Speaker 3 (22:21):
Yeah, I think so probably because like, uh yeah, if
Laura just, oh, here's a good example. If she goes
out to eat with one of her friends or goes
out to eat with her sister or something, and she
brings me back something, oh like a dessert or something
you thought of me that was left overs, like, oh,
that totally makes my day.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
Yeah, I feel like you do not need compliments very much,
Like in the.

Speaker 3 (22:43):
Years that I've I've noticed that.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
I've noticed that because in the years that we've worked together,
there have been times where, like mine, I tend to
give out praise generously to team members and stuff like
I try to give people their flowers, Like I have
this whole mantra about like being intentional about that because
I think I need that in my life, right, so
I naturally give that away. And throughout the years, I
can think of so many times that I've tried to
pay you a genuine compliment, and I remember just watching

(23:09):
you the most fucking uncomfortable you've ever been, Like I
think there's been times you've literally interrupted me, like so
you're gonna get the nachos or what. I'm like, Hell, bro,
I just you really handle this, thanks man, I get it,
Like Jesus, you do not. You're not about that, So
you're embarrassing me. Stop it? Well, I did. I do
tell every restaurant that it's your birthday as well, because
mostly for the free dessert.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
You're fair.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
What are your love languages, Jacob, I'd just like to
be left alone. Oh, that's that's the sixth one. I
think just mind your own fucking business.

Speaker 3 (23:38):
I mean, almost eight billion people on the planet love Jacob.
That's right.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
I've never felt mar there's this one chick that lives here.

Speaker 3 (23:47):
It's kind of a mask.

Speaker 1 (23:49):
Not about that one. Sure, do you like everybody else?

Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yep? Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
I like the idea of like working on this though.

Speaker 3 (23:56):
Yeah, with the the app is nice, but honestly, the
app just gives you, you know, a reminder. So there's
ways to do it without the app. If the app
is glitchy, you can do an old school way of
figuring out. Yeah, you know. For for me, I like
I just kind of make a conscious effort every day

(24:17):
to do certain things or like pay compliments, And it's
one of those things like to me, I feel like
the more I say this, the less it means.

Speaker 1 (24:28):
Okay, but that's my interpretation trying to that's like not currency.

Speaker 3 (24:31):
Yeah, but that's not true for the person receiving it, right,
If verbal affirmations is what this person needs, it doesn't
lose it doesn't seem to anyway lose its power over time.
It seems like it's always valuable currency.

Speaker 1 (24:46):
Yeah, I think that's absolutely true. The other thing about
that too, So like, first off, I agree with you.
The app was a useful way to connect a couple
of dots, but those dots can easily be connected with
Google Calendar or whenever you're scheduling, like your Apple person whatever,
like back in the day before the app. That's what
I did, is like I just bought the book and
then just like downloaded a list of all the suggestions

(25:06):
that the book had, or like people in the world
had made extra lists and like extra long ones for
different like you know, categories, and I'd just gone through
and found ones that matched my spouse, and I just
scheduled them in my calendar, and I set reminders like
you know it every week, like try this. Try it.
Just be like a one, like it would be an
all day reminder, So just pop up and be like today,
try to do this. It'd be like send a text

(25:27):
message or whatever and be like oh okay, and I
just do it and then click the little task complete
button and it was done. So like, I mean, you
can do that, Anthony without the app. I mean, it's
just there to skip a step and make it a
little bit easier. It's tough though, because I think sometimes,
like in Anthony's case, if you're a person who gives
a lot of affection, a lot of times that person
is also the one who's gonna do the love languages
because they're like, great, I want to be putting an

(25:49):
energy in our relationship, and a lot of times the
other person maybe doesn't do that, and you're like, why
don't you care? And they're like, I just don't even
think to do things in the relationship.

Speaker 3 (25:59):
I think thing that's helpful too, just a little trick
is like to try to make your thoughts obvious to
the other person like that. Like so like you know,
if I'm if I'm out like golfing. This actually just
happened the other day.

Speaker 1 (26:15):
I was back to golf, just everybody. I brought it
up only an hour into this.

Speaker 3 (26:20):
God, I was golfing and something reminded me of Laura. Okay,
so I sent her a text message, Oh there you
go right away, like just right away, hey is thinking
about this or whatever.

Speaker 2 (26:31):
Any male dog just walked across the golf course and
I thought of you, you.

Speaker 1 (26:35):
As an alligator in the ninth hole. I just twisted
my ankle and the pain bade me think of you.

Speaker 3 (26:43):
I just I just saw two rabbits having sex in
a bush.

Speaker 2 (26:47):
You what, But like, I just saw two golfers have
a bush I was thinking about you.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
Never guess which one was going faster. Yeah, it was
the rabbit. But honestly, it's it's like if the other
person could see your thoughts, they wouldn't know how much
you care. But they can't, right, so you have to
be able to translate your thoughts into something that they
can experience, whether that be verbally written or your acts
of service or whatever.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
It is. One thing I really like about this letter,
Badonka Donk. You got to give that Badonka donk a
little slap. But no, like, one thing that I see
go wrong in a lot of relationships is people will
be critical of the needs of the other person because
it'll be like your family was weird, Like you guys
were all huggy kissy and you're all codependent and you're

(27:39):
all enmeshed or what like these really unkind interpretations of something.

Speaker 2 (27:43):
Christmas presents are the one that still gets me. Okay
with my wife's family. My wife's family is a Christmas
present given motherfucks.

Speaker 1 (27:51):
That they are generous at Christmas.

Speaker 3 (27:53):
It is.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
It's not even generous, it's just a lot successive.

Speaker 2 (27:57):
It is just like I will go to like that
family Christmas and I will leave with like twenty gifts.

Speaker 3 (28:04):
Jesus wow.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
And it's not that many people. Yeah, there's definitely two people.
There are fewer than twenty of us there. Yeah, it's
just it's so much and I just did not grow
up that way. I think I like my family gives
each other like a gift or two.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
Okay, we would.

Speaker 3 (28:22):
Usually get like one big gift. Yeah, and then like
a couple really yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:29):
Our family certainly not as adults.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
No, I'm talking about like currently, I'll go to my
in laws, I'll currently leave with like twenty gift.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
Among the adults, we do one right, like we usually
do a Secret Santa. We've stopped everybody's assigned.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
We've stopped completely.

Speaker 1 (28:43):
Yeah. I love that show.

Speaker 3 (28:45):
I do too. We were all and that was the
great thing is we were all on the same page. Yes,
we're all like, hey, I'm gonna give you the gift
of not feeling obligated to give me anything. That's all
I want for Christmas.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
I think we should all like our family there's now
like everybody's having kids. Like for a long time I
was the only one with thinning kids. So now everybody's
got kids, and I would love to transition to we
all get the kids ship. Every kid gets a gift
from every aunts and uncle or every couple. That would
be great. All the cousins can get each other gifts.
That's great. And I would love for the adults just
be out of this ship because it is the fucking worst.

Speaker 3 (29:18):
We used to do. Our family used to do just a.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
It wasn't like a Secret Santa, but it was like
a designated You just get a person.

Speaker 1 (29:26):
Okay, you draw that, you draw it, which is sensible.

Speaker 2 (29:29):
Yeah, so you'd show up with gifts for the kids
and for the one adult you drew.

Speaker 1 (29:35):
See. But what I like about this though.

Speaker 3 (29:37):
What I have yet to get Laura's mom a gift
that she appreciates. Oh no, maybe you should get there
the gift, the gifts, some of the gifts.

Speaker 1 (29:48):
So one of them was a weighted blanket. Okay, that's
it's fine.

Speaker 3 (29:52):
Yeah, I think she returned that.

Speaker 1 (29:54):
Did you throw it at her? I did? Okay, there's
just some dumb bells, but that's again that my family's
love language. Yeah, we throw, how we do throw? We
grew up and throw things in people's faces.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
So a blanket that she didn't care for I got, Okay,
So I got u a couple of years A few
years back, I got my mom one of those digital frames.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
Okay, yes, and that how it's And she's great. She's
constantly seeing updates.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
Yes, And so anytime Laura and I go on vacation
or something, I'm posting, shut up there. She absolutely loves it.
So my mom loves it. So I'm like, oh, we
get Laura's mom and I've I still have not seen
it anywhere in the house.

Speaker 1 (30:34):
How great would it be if he accidentally sinked the
wrong photo folder to the mother in law?

Speaker 3 (30:40):
That would just be great?

Speaker 1 (30:41):
Can you can you share the mother in law's photo folder?

Speaker 3 (30:47):
Actually, what's yours?

Speaker 1 (30:49):
I should if you would have a great idea for us,
like in the next studio, we should get a digital
frame and put the fucking address on the Patreon and
just let everybody put a great would be fun. That'd
be really cool. It'd be a lot of dick pings
and be honest, but we've asked for them before. We'll
finally get them.

Speaker 2 (31:06):
We can't have them on Twitch though, oh that would
be cool twitch. We can't have dicks on Twitch.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Okay, so except for Jim, all right, But no, I
do like this idea, Like I appreciate because I've seen
this a lot where couples will be very critical of
the other style and they'll categorize it a certain way.
They're like, oh, your family was dysfunctional, or your family
was you know, excessive or codependent or whatever. Your family
is stoic and unattached, and you guys are cold and distant.

(31:31):
And I really dislike those interpretations. It's just not fair.

Speaker 3 (31:34):
Well, because that's a judgment.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (31:37):
It's one thing to be like I'm not used to this, yeah,
or my family didn't go this way, or this seems
foreign to me, that's perfectly fine. But then to judge
it on top of it, I hate that's that's harmful.

Speaker 1 (31:50):
No, And I also it also excuses you from any
like obligation to do for your partner because and you're like, no,
you are too needy, that's the problem. And like it's
tough because this is a therapist that comes up, right,
because they'll be like, Jim, make a judgment call here
is this person too needy? Do they need to work
on like reining it in a little bit? Or is
this other person too cold? And it's like tough to
kind of like, as Anthony says, like, how do you

(32:11):
kind of meet in the middle on some of these
love language needs? Like we have to And Anthony, I
think that that's a fair question to ask, because I
do think that there's room for us to ask ourselves.
Am I needing too much reassurance in this relationship? And
that's exactly what Anthony talked about, is like, you know,
I'm seeking a lot of reassurance. That's how I feel
safe in the relationship is you've been making some kind

(32:31):
of gesture toward me or signaling to me with affection.
And it's difficult because I think as relationships do grow
in maturity and they do get more comfortable, I think
that there is kind of a natural waning of a
lot of that affection and that can fill in with insecurity.
And I think a lot of times the partner who's
sort of rescinding that affection, they get annoyed and they're
sort of like, hey, I've already put in my due diligence,

(32:51):
Like I shouldn't have to keep reassuring you that we're okay.
We have time for that, we have history for that.
That's what does it go back in the photo album,
I've stuck around and we're still together, Like we're obviously okay,
but I don't know, Like it's a it's a very
delicate balance, which I think is only best solved with communication.
But I would also just caution you, Anthony, like when
you're the person in that place where you do need

(33:13):
that reassurance, I really think you've got to grow as
a person too through that process of relationship. That was
something that I had to go through a lot of
like transformation in was like realizing, Okay, like some of
the things that I'm meeting in this relationship, I am
not going to get And like that doesn't mean that
you're not love, that doesn't mean you're not important, But
you've got to like have that personal ability to reassure yourself,

(33:35):
to come back to your own history to find other
things that your partner does that that are meant to
be communicating of love. And I think that that matters too,
because a lot of times the love language theory can
like nullify what people naturally do, because it's like, well
that's not what I need, and I don't think that's
fair either, Like if your partner naturally cooks for you
or something or does something sweet like gets you the
leftover or does some other nice thing like does a

(33:57):
chore or something like that, and just that is how
they show life looks your buttle. Occasionally, you know, a
special occasion, Well everybody does that, you know, yeah, like
it's a Saturday or something, you know, just like a
normal and special occasion.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
In Iowa, that's just how.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
They say hello, quick, little quick, little U look ado.
So yeah, but like I think it's tough because some
people will be like, well that doesn't count because that's
not how I receive love. I don't love that either. Man, Like,
I think you've got to also have this sense of
like I know your intentions. I remember once like I
heard a therapist describe it as like if a little
kid draws you a picture and you look at that
and go. But I don't give a fuck about art,

(34:33):
and I don't care about this, and I don't I
don't like to die. I already have a picture, yeah,
I already have pictures. I have selfies that are way
fucking better than this. Thanks a lot. You're a douche
because you don't appreciate that that little kid put their
heart into that little potato figure of you, and that
was meant to be this thing of Like I was
thinking about you, you're the best like I like you.
I hope you receive it in the intention it was
offered right and like to me, Anthony, that's also meeting

(34:55):
in the middle, per your question, Like, I think that's
part of it too, is understanding the other person's intentions
on things that don't resonate with you and learning to
lean in that direction too so that can still count
for something, and reminding yourself to make it count. Yeah,
lick that butt hole, Anthony. Anyway, we are gonna take
a quick break and when we come back, we're talking
about losing life's passion. You're listeners Pod Therapy.

Speaker 3 (35:18):
Today's episode is brought to you by Smitdi Scoop, Mason Miller,
Test Miller, Pilot, Team Paris, Team Monaco, Oscar Swanrose, Anna, Marie,
Emma Kine, Myra, and Sam Cone. Would you like to
sponsor the show? Become a therap producer? Paton do.

Speaker 2 (35:38):
All right, you just reminded me of something happened to
be at a gig a long long time ago. I just, uh, okay,
you've reminded me two things that happened against Yes, but
one of them was when saw a children's theater production
of a of some show.

Speaker 1 (35:54):
And it was a company, a children's theater company that
I just started working for.

Speaker 2 (35:58):
And I said, after the show was to the woman
who was directing it, who was a new coworker of mine,
said yeah, I made four kids show.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
It was really good.

Speaker 2 (36:06):
I thought it was, and I was being just genuine enough,
and I was really happy with it and was in
a good mood. I was like, man, for a kid
show that was so good, and she like got a
little dour and was like, don't don't do the four
kids show thing.

Speaker 3 (36:21):
Just say it's either good or bad. Oh.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
Well, in that case it was ship Broadway. This was
no cats. I saw likew York a week and a
half ago.

Speaker 3 (36:36):
This was much worse.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
Don't have the caveat for a kids show. Just so
it was a great complimenting it and saying that I
had enjoyed my time. That is so salty. Yeah, that
is just dumb. Get the stick out of it. It
was shitty, then that's dumb. Wow, just say it was
a good show. Okay, it wasn't that it was bad.
You're welcome trivia.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
Wow.

Speaker 1 (36:56):
Several of the children didn't look suited to the parts
they were playing it all. That kid that played the
tree sucked a bag of old deuteronomy.

Speaker 3 (37:03):
I'm not even sure if he use a cat. I'll
be honest. I don't think that beard was real. Alright.

Speaker 1 (37:10):
I saw that kid before the show.

Speaker 3 (37:11):
He was four. Uh, trivia from Emma before they were famous.
Oh okay, okay, this is gonna have to be multiple choice. Yeah, alright, Jacob, all.

Speaker 1 (37:24):
Right, showdown action Jacob will one v one.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
Who once worked as a telemarketer selling ballpoint pens. Okay,
A Brad Pitt's b Jennifer Aniston, C Johnny Depp or
D George Clooney. Geez, I know I've heard this before.

Speaker 1 (37:43):
Oh Clooney, I like that answer a lot.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
No.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
Oh, that's where my heart was. Do I get rebounds
on this?

Speaker 3 (37:52):
Sure?

Speaker 1 (37:53):
All right, it's gonna be process of elimination until Nick
just fucking gets five points. Give me Johnny Depp.

Speaker 3 (37:58):
It is Johnny Depp right, give you half a point from.

Speaker 1 (38:01):
I'll take that.

Speaker 3 (38:02):
I'll take that half a point, all right, Jim, which
actress was once a human statue in New York's Central Park.
Oh my god, Lucy Lou, Angelina, Jolie Whoopy Goldberg or
Kristin Wig Kristin Wig.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
No shit, oh, Angela jo Lee will be Goldberg?

Speaker 3 (38:22):
And who Lucy Lou Bro It.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Cannot be Angelina and Jolie. She she was famous as
a kid. There's no way she would even bother with
that ship. I'll say, whoopee. I feel good about whoopee.

Speaker 3 (38:32):
No, okay, Lucy Lou, I believe that's my point.

Speaker 1 (38:36):
Shit, wow, both This guy's an Assholey who luy?

Speaker 3 (38:44):
All right, Jacob, This Marvel star used to be a
children's party entertainer dressed as a giant chicken.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Oh wow.

Speaker 3 (38:53):
Chris Hemsworth, Chris Evans, Paul Rudd or Hugh Jackman.

Speaker 1 (38:58):
Oh wow, huge, I feel good about it. Huge as
hey because he was like a pe teacher eight points.
Oh he was, yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
There's a whole bit where he's on the red carpet
and like one of his old students became a member
of the press, and he interviews him, and he recognizes him,
and he's like, not answering the guy's questions, and stead
he's asking the guy questions. He's like, so, if you
kept up with your physical education, not really, man, if
you give a reporter, he's like, oh, so you.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
Do some push up? Okay, climb this rope? Jim before
landing major roles, who cleaned chicken coops and sold newspapers
door to door?

Speaker 1 (39:35):
Okay?

Speaker 3 (39:36):
Tom Cruise, Harrison Ford, Jim Carrey or Robert de Niro?

Speaker 1 (39:41):
Oh boy, yeah, de Niro is another one. He's been
doing this a long time. Jim Carrey's been doing this
a long time.

Speaker 3 (39:48):
What what what do you do? Clean chicken coops?

Speaker 1 (39:51):
What chicken coops?

Speaker 3 (39:52):
Sold newspapers door to door? Okay?

Speaker 1 (39:54):
What was the first one?

Speaker 3 (39:55):
Tom Cruise?

Speaker 1 (39:56):
No, it's not Tim Cruse. Here's the third one, Jim Carrey,
second one, Harrison Ford, Harrison Ford. Harrison Ford feels like
a guy who kind of stumbled into his fame. I
don't think so, No, shit, I think it's both wrong.

Speaker 3 (40:10):
Jim Carrey, Harrison Carpenter, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
That's what it was. Yes, all right, I think I'm
winning by five points there, all right, losing life's passion.
Hello pod therapists. Hopefully all of you like how everybody's
referencing Whitney. Fuck you writer, you can't count on Whitney. Sorry,
he's a flake. I'm a relatively new listener, and I

(40:37):
remember hearing episode one and mumbling to myself, thank God,
I'll never need to ask them a question. And yet
here I am. Wow, all right, I'm in therapy. I
talked to my friends wild I know, and I've built
a good toolkit for my mental health. But there's one
topic I'd love to hear your thoughts on. I grew

(40:59):
up with more vintage cars than siblings, and they definitely
received more love too. These cars have become the most
important thing in my life, but they require a lot
of work and knowledge to maintain, so from early on
I showed interest in learning how my father restored them.
Despite that, and unless Eastern Christmas fell on the same day,

(41:20):
he was never keen to teach me. So I thought, fine,
I'll prove to him that I'm serious. I studied mechanical engineering.
I even worked for a while with in the modern
engine industry, but it wasn't my thing. During a project
in Australia. I fell in love with a man and
the adventures we had in his vintage cars. Long story short,

(41:41):
he turned out to be a narcissist like my dad.
He also didn't let me in the workshop or behind
the wheel. It took me far too long, but I
finally left him to fulfill my life dream by myself.
I moved to the UK to finally learn how to
restore cars properly in a real workshop. I found a garage,
sorted my visa and made it happen. But over the

(42:01):
past year they slowly pushed me out of the workshop
and into the role of the tea lady and desk
dust catcher. I bought my own car and through trial
and error, began restoring those myself. I've learned a lot,
but I'm exhausted. I poured all my savings into trying
to make this life possible, and the situation at work

(42:21):
frustrates every cell in my body. And as the cherry
on top or was it the filling, I'm leaving the
vintage car world because I've been bullied out of it,
mostly out of jealousy. I assume I worked hard to
earn my place, but I was constantly met with resistance, condescension,
and subtle and not so subtle ways of being told
I didn't belong. I tried to stay strong, but it's

(42:42):
worn me down more than I care to admit. After
much back and forth, I've accepted a spot on a
psychology conversion master's program. I'll leave my job in a month.
A few years ago, while studying for a semester in Israel,
a professor read my final paper and made it his
mission to convince me that my place was in psychology.
I'm fascinated by human decision making and everything that comes

(43:04):
with it, but I never thought I could make a difference,
especially because my father always told me psychology was wizard
poop and not a real profession. All wizard poop. Fucking
episode title, that's fantastic. I'm trying, Bethole. Okay, yeah, skip
the slurping sounds. I got that. Shall not o, man,
I really thought you were gonna go with you shall

(43:26):
lick my ass or something? Right there? It was right there,
So here I am. And yet notes for a child?

Speaker 3 (43:35):
Yeah, really good. It was a pretty good joke for
a child.

Speaker 1 (43:39):
And Yet, the closer I get to leaving the vintage
car world, the more I feel like I'm breaking despite
the struggles and always depending on the support of others.
I had some amazing adventures last year. I'll miss the cars,
not for their material value, but for the life I
lived with them. And now I'm swapping all that for
what feels like a boring psych student life that so
many people choose. Every One keeps telling me I can

(44:01):
always come back to vintage cars later, but I fought
for so long to finally own one. I have to
sell them now for many reasons, and to be allowed
to work on them. Now that I'm so close, I
have to let it all go again. So I guess
here are my questions? Or how can something feel so
deeply like my life's purpose and yet leave me so exhausted?

(44:22):
And if it is my life's purpose, why am I
running constantly in situations that want to or why am
I constantly running into situations that want to prove the opposite?
And how do I cope with this overwhelming feeling of
becoming an insignificant person? Sorry for the ramble. My grammar
school teacher told me twenty years ago that summaries aren't
my strength, But to be fair, she also said, I'd

(44:44):
never managed to form a full sentence in English. She
was closer to write on that last one. Thank you
so much. The anonymous insignificant. My pronouns are she and her.

Speaker 3 (44:54):
So this actually kind of, first of all, writer sucks
because it does feel to me that, at least to
some degree, some of this is just being a female
working in a male dominated and that really sucks. Have
you guys seen on Netflix there's a they do, the
Untold series where they're breaking down like a sports story

(45:17):
or something. They've got one on Hope Solo. Okay, okay, okay,
soccer player. Yes, she was huge, like as far as like.

Speaker 1 (45:26):
Women's women, like Andrea the Giant. Yeah yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (45:31):
Meanolar disorder back and like late ninety well it would
be early two thousands.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
She was the big name.

Speaker 1 (45:39):
Okay.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
She was all over like when you thought of women's soccer,
Hope Solo, that was the name.

Speaker 2 (45:44):
She would paint like, she would paint her face and
she would run down to the ring and shake the
ropes yet people, yeah, the whole thing.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (45:52):
But anyway, and then all of a sudden she just
disappeared like she didn't exist. She fell into a hole.

Speaker 1 (45:59):
Oh my god like Whitney.

Speaker 3 (46:00):
So this story is fucking fascinating if you get the
chance to watch that on Netflix. This little documentary, now,
granted it's probably one sided because it really kind of
focuses on her side of the story versus us women's soccer,
but the whole thing of how she's just pretty much

(46:23):
like persona on grata, like completely excommunicated from women's soccer,
and how that all happened, and some of the things
were like comments that she made. She is very outspoken.
You ask her question, she'll say what she thinks and
so and But anyway, the thing that I left with
at the end of that was like, had that been

(46:46):
a male athlete that said the exact same thing, it
wouldn't have even made the news. But because it was
her and it was just a completely different world, it
became a huge deal.

Speaker 1 (47:00):
And it just sucks.

Speaker 3 (47:01):
Yeah, and this kind of this letter kind of reminded me.

Speaker 1 (47:04):
I feel like it's one of the most tired things
that you'll bump into in any industry, Like you'll meet
a female police officer, and like pointing out that this
is a female police officer just seems dumb and like,
but it's like the number one thing I'll see people
do is like this person's the writer's a mechanicals.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
That's why I always just say hatty police officer.

Speaker 1 (47:20):
Yeah, like that much more respect. Yeah, Yeah, they really
appreciate when you just say that badge with badge but no,
like a episode title. No. But like I this comes
up a lot like and it just sucks because you're
working in vintage cars. You're kind of signaled over and
over again that you don't belong you're a mechanical engineer,
and they're sort of like this energy of like, oh

(47:41):
that's cute, you know, like you don't you're not one
of us, you Like the writer keeps talking about earning
the the opportunity to work on vintage cars. Is this
Is there something I'm not understanding about this that like.

Speaker 3 (47:53):
You have to you're not doing you're not doing the
math all the way through.

Speaker 2 (47:55):
Okay, so if I have a vintage car, If I
own a vintage car, there aren't that many of them.
Oh so if I own a vintage car, I get
to be picky with who I'm going to allow to
work on my vintage car. I see, So if you
don't own one, like if you own if you own
one and you want to work on it, I see,
knock yourself out.

Speaker 1 (48:12):
So she's not getting opportunities maybe because of stigma, not
getting taken into body shops because it's like, well maybe
we don't, you know, think that we can showcase her work.

Speaker 3 (48:21):
Maybe.

Speaker 1 (48:22):
Wow. Interesting.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
It's also I mean vintage cars, it's also a weird
one because it's almost a hobby made into a profession. Okay,
because like the people you're dealing with are almost all
going to be basically I mean it's a different form
of being a hobbyist, right yeah, like like collecting a
vintage car. So I mean that does that puts you

(48:43):
in a weird mindset because then it also you're you're
getting into that, like people are doing this for more
reasons than just having a vintage car, right, you know
they might have it like a father might buy one
to work on with their son.

Speaker 3 (48:56):
You know, it could be it could be things like that.
I don't.

Speaker 2 (48:59):
I mean, it's probably a lot of sticky little things
to wade through in that industry.

Speaker 3 (49:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
That it's interesting how the writer talks about kind of
that self awareness of this was something my dad loved
more than me, Right, So I wanted to be good
at this and I like it kind of like the
writer seems pretty aware and like there was kind of
a quest for Dad's approval throughout the years that turned
out to be kind of a narcissist. I haven't bumped
into other relationships that were like again familiar to me

(49:25):
because like this was similar to my father, and it
took me a little bit to like connect these dots.
And it seems like the writer's been like on many
ways a lifelong sort of journey of revelation through the
lens of the vintage car stuff and like this pursuit realizing,
like a lot of this just has to do with me.
Excepting that Dad may never approve or whatever, I may

(49:45):
not win that affection that I've kind of like been
yearning for my whole life, and that's fine. Like maybe
I'm ready to go like blaze my own trail. It's
interesting this idea of like knowing your life's purpose and
like hitting these headwinds, hitting these obstacles, and if it
is my life's purpose, do I get exhausted? That's an
interesting concept of like life's purpose.

Speaker 2 (50:06):
It's so hard because I'm betting this is a lot
like the entertainment world, you know, people trying to break
into that to work inside it, because I mean, it's
just going to be such a niche community in so
many ways. For your life's purpose to be tied directly
to your income always makes me feel a little weird

(50:30):
because life's purpose seems bigger to me than your than
your gig. Yeah, Like, if you love working on old cars,
then you get a gig whatever whatever job you have,
and then your hobby is working on older cars because
that's what you want to be doing, that's what you
want to spend time doing it. If you can make

(50:52):
a living doing it as well, maybe bonus. But at
the same time, like this, this situation shows us like
maybe not bonus. Maybe it it kind of sours you
on the whole thing.

Speaker 1 (51:02):
Yeah, the thing that.

Speaker 3 (51:04):
Makes me kind of itchyre kind of weird. It's just
the idea of the life's purpose general.

Speaker 1 (51:10):
Yeah, I hear a lot of people talking about met
to do this.

Speaker 3 (51:14):
Yeah I've found my special purpose. Yeah, I've never felt
that way because to me, that feels very, uh like
fate driven.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
I think you're I think you're just such a wonderful person,
and I think you're so good, you know, achieving your
life's purpose and you and you're so attractive while you're
doing it and such so handsome and rugged looking.

Speaker 3 (51:35):
Like you make a good point and really.

Speaker 1 (51:37):
Just you know so kind may really really really ridiculously. Yeah,
you're doing great. By the way. I like this, uh
physical touch actually is my give me a handy twitchraw
just the foot went right across across, just started rubbing

(51:57):
his thighs, your toes on my cheeks, just feel which cheeks?

Speaker 3 (52:02):
Yeah, all.

Speaker 1 (52:06):
In there.

Speaker 3 (52:07):
Yeah, I hear you.

Speaker 1 (52:07):
Though, there's there's a particular world I think.

Speaker 3 (52:10):
Yeah, because like to say I have like life's purpose,
it puts so much pressure on you, like number one,
like you've got to be good at this thing, right right,
and you damn well better enjoy it, right, I mean,
it just seems like a lot of pressure to put
on yourself. He does.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
We'll do that, like say the ship Like, oh, you know,
if you love what you do, you never go to
work the day in your life. And then when you
get through with work on something that you think you
love and it felt it felt like a day at work.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
Yeah, you're like, wait, do I really love this thing?

Speaker 2 (52:40):
And you start questioning and yeah, I mean, don't tying
it to your income get sticky really fast in the
INDIEA what what Nick said too?

Speaker 1 (52:49):
I also like this, So like this is problematic as
a way of thinking, because I do think it puts
you in an identity box that then you're scared to
leave because like who am I if I'm not this thing? Yeah,
and I think it's fascinating. Like for me, I went
through several like career evolutions, like originally went to school
to be a church pastor, Like that's what I thought

(53:10):
I was called to do. I felt, did you go
to school for that? Liberty University? Uh? Sponsored? I've heard
of that somewhere where Have I heard that name before?
Usually in four Chan and in a lot of hate media, Yeah,
a lot of Liberty Drive, Yeah, very strong populations. So yeah,
we show up in a lot of rallies. But yeah, no,

(53:31):
Like I mean my first that was gonna be my career,
and so like my identity was wrapped up in that.
And then I became a school teacher for eight years,
which I didn't intend to be a profession. I was
trying to pursue that the church stuff, and I kept
hitting all these obstacles. I just could not get a
position in a church. Either I was too young to
be like, you know, an adults pastor, or I was
a little bit too old, and like they wanted to

(53:52):
just kind of raise up their own like you know,
people from their own high school groups into college, and
I didn't want to bring this guy from outside, even
though he went to school for it. Just like I
could not find an opening. And I remember like really
struggling with not the Catholic church. Yeah, the Catholic Church
was not let me in.

Speaker 3 (54:07):
Oh yeah, and.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
So the Catholic Church, I hear, is good at finding
opening all day.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
But yeah, let me get.

Speaker 3 (54:14):
Behind those drugs.

Speaker 1 (54:15):
Yeah, honestly, we're not using this thing.

Speaker 3 (54:17):
It's right there, like thing really fast.

Speaker 1 (54:20):
But I remember like going through that identity shift of
being like, oh no, this is my life's purpose, and
you know, obviously it was very tied into religion at
the time, and then like switching around Oh sorry, that's right, flipper,
So yeah, like and and then like switching roles become
a teacher, and then switching roles again and going into
mental health. And mental health can be one of those
things that can like very much define you right, Like,

(54:40):
I mean, we started a podcast around it, We do
a lot of charitable work around it. There's a lot
of public education around it. I think that the public
welcomes it a lot, and so like you would just
become associated with it so much like that's who Jim is.
Jim's a therapist whatever, But like it's a dangerous game
because like I've been in the career now long enough
that if if I hit the lottery, i'd probably like
I'd probably be like, I'll still do pod therapy or

(55:02):
something because I derive joy from this. But no, my
identity doesn't have to be this anymore. Like if you
and LV called me and said, hey, man, we're just
gonna make you a professor and you're gonna stick to
teaching this stuff, you know, forever, and like you're not
gonna perform it anymore. I could see myself saying, Okay, great,
I'm gonna be a professional teacher again. Like I could
leave this identity. So like, I do think that there's
a little bit of a an interesting intermingling of putting

(55:24):
too much of your identity into a profession. I get
why it happens. I've struggled with it, but then it's
like Jacob said, like I'll have a bad day at
the office and or like I suck and like I'm
just I'm not doing very well as a therapist right
now or something, and then I'll think like I am worthless,
and it's like, no, it could also just be this
industry is really tough and like there's a lot of
like land minds in it, like the writer, It's like, hey,

(55:46):
it could just be vintage cars is a very unique industry.
And Yep, the deck is stacked against you in a
lot of ways, and that shouldn't be, you know, your identity.

Speaker 3 (55:55):
It also depends too, like how you enjoy it as
a career that you know, pays the bills, right, versus
how you enjoy it as a hobby right right, you know,
and those are two very different things. Yeah, and yeah,
I mean maybe maybe this is a good thing.

Speaker 2 (56:12):
I would I would take the opportunity while you have
it to step back from it.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
I mean, like us, step back from it and and
kind of.

Speaker 2 (56:20):
Look at it and look at the place that it
holds in your life and maybe decide if you like
that place. I like that maybe trying to kind of
think about it a little bit and kind of reflect
on the little bit. Maybe, dare I say, meditate on
it a little bit?

Speaker 1 (56:32):
Whoa getting all new age WU in this ship?

Speaker 3 (56:35):
Yeah? Yea, throw the wo.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
Be mindful about it, be thoughtful about it, Yeah, and
be unafraid to examine it and and examine how much
happiness it is bringing to your life or how much
sadness is bringing to your.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
That's a good point because I think a lot of
times we align with shit and we're like, no, this
is who am, this is what I do, and it's
making me miserable.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
Don't do the sunken cost fallacy thing on this. You don't,
I'd be like, oh, I've spent you know, however many
years doing this, right. I don't want to turn my
life around now. No, no, yeah, we only have so
much time to do all this shit.

Speaker 3 (57:09):
Well, so do what you want to do.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
That's directly connected to the second question, how do I
accept insignificance? Overwhelming feeling of becoming an insignificant person? That's
a big thing, but the kind of goes hand in
hand with what you're saying of like, it's okay if
that didn't work out, Yeah, especially like in industry's like
entertainment and talent. There's so many people chasing the star, right,
and at some point, I'm sure many of them have

(57:32):
to hit a point of like, Okay, I'm not gonna
make it quote unquote. And I know people who have
done that.

Speaker 2 (57:37):
After they have made it, Okay, they have made it,
done huge jobs, huge gigs, they that people have heard of,
and then go like cool, that was fun.

Speaker 1 (57:47):
Yeah, and how do I accept that that will not
last forever?

Speaker 3 (57:49):
I'm going to do something else now.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
Wow, and they can just do something entirely different. Yeah,
that's pretty cool.

Speaker 3 (57:54):
I would give some thought too to what it means
to be an insignificant person.

Speaker 2 (57:59):
Yeah, because you know, they're like significant than other people
measure that or also like, I mean, there's eight billion
people on the planet.

Speaker 3 (58:08):
I am insignificant to almost eight billion of them. Yeah,
eight billion of yeah. Yeah, if I'm round all of them, yeah,
first all of them. Yeah, But that doesn't mean that
my life isn't important. I'm very significant to me. The
dogs that I mean, I am, my priority of putting

(58:30):
the food out themselves, that's right. And you know, I
mean so the people that I do have significance with,
I think that's very important. I don't know just the
whole you know, who we define as significant or what
we define as significant. I think it needs context.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
I mean we're spending time on it, right, Yeah, yeah,
it's been significant, this segment at the very least.

Speaker 1 (58:51):
This is a I think it's a really good existential
question that I've I've often struggled with because I've listened
to some really good talkers that have shared, like some
of those important humans who have ever existed, right, like
people that shaped empires, right, like Julius Caesar Epstein, the greats. Yeah,
you know your Einstein's here we are ye talking about.

Speaker 3 (59:16):
Sorry about that, but you.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
Know, like it, no matter who you were, how significant
you were, even if you owned the world, you're the
Genghis Khan of your time. Nobody gives a fuck today
like it, and it does not take very long before
you achieve insignificance.

Speaker 3 (59:32):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was pretty significant to a
lot of people.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
I mean, yeah, we're talking about it forever. So when
Hulk Hogan died and they were, you know, they announced that,
all of a sudden, I remembered that in high school
I had gone to the ninety nine cent store with
my buddy, and there had been a Hulk Hogan c D.
It is Hulk Hogan and the Wrestling boot Band, and
I think it was just self title thing. It was

(59:56):
just called Hogan Hogo maniacent like that, and I remember
we bought it as a joke and started listening to
it and kind of unironically got into it and like
really started like this is great, like blasted shit all
the time. And one track is called when the Hulkster
Comes to Heaven, and it's like, when the Hulkster comes
to Heaven, we'll tag up again when we lose another
Hulk Maniac, you know, like Hulk weeps and like one

(01:00:16):
day he'll find Heaven. Yes, it's fucking awesome. Okay, is
so fucking good and in a terrible kind of way,
like just not good. So like when he died, I
messaged my buddy, who I haven't talked to like in
probably fifteen years, and I'm like, dude, you do you
remember the CD? And he sends back a photo of
him holding the CD. Is that The Hulkster goes, oh, yeah,

(01:00:36):
oh it's just wasn't that horn so good?

Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
Can we get away with this?

Speaker 3 (01:00:47):
Are we gonna get flagged. No, we're talking about it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
Okay, it's gonna get flagged on YouTube, but whatever that might.
I can take a few strikes on YouTube. But yeah,
it was anyway, Hulk Hogan, Uh, greatest entertainer of our time.

Speaker 3 (01:00:59):
Just good guy, very significant.

Speaker 1 (01:01:01):
Yeah, but he sent me back a phot of him
holding the CD. He still had it. No, that's really cool.
That's a collector's item right now. Anyway, right, go buy
a Hull Cogan CD. I think is where I'm going
with this. But no, like insignificance, like Hull Cogan just died.
Oh my god, he was so important for so many years,
and like in five noy'll ever talk about him again.
It'll just be a meme and that'll be the end
of it. There is no such thing as like significance
in a sense, like it is inherently a lie that

(01:01:23):
we tell ourselves so we can feel like we matter.
So I really like that both of you are kind
of like challenging that narrative to say, hey, like redefine
what significance is, or like to who, or like what
else in your life you could be living for, Because
if your whole point is to feel like you matter
to an industry that doesn't fucking care about you or
respect you. You're chasing the wind, you know, like you'll
never be satisfied. It'll never matter. It's like being famous

(01:01:46):
enough to like matter some bullshit like that. It's like
it doesn't. It's all inherently pointless. So like I kind
of like what you said, Jacob, of like finding something
that means something to you in the now that you derive,
you know, some kind of joy from that meets your
needs and is stable, and that it's about life and work,
life and just friendships and all that. Like, find other

(01:02:06):
values I think, to pursue versus just significance. How do
you deal with being an insignificant person?

Speaker 3 (01:02:12):
Nick, who I'm not talking to me? That's right, I'm
very significant.

Speaker 1 (01:02:17):
You won golf trophies, my man.

Speaker 3 (01:02:19):
Yeah, I I have the power to uh remove certain certifications.
Are we doing this again? Fuck around and find out
never mind, I'd like to retract. I'm not, like I said,
I'm not a very significant person to a lot of people.
But to the people I am significant to, I'm very significant.

Speaker 1 (01:02:40):
I like that. Yeah, that's that's a that's a key point. Yeah,
So then who matters in your life? And writer, I mean,
like not to psychoanalyze you too much here, but my
last thought on this, you seem to have a lot
of good insight into chasing your father's approval throughout life
and then also chasing other men, uh and and their
approval of you, and in the same kind of way,

(01:03:00):
like still trying to catch that that thing that always
eluded you. And I would just ask you to continue
to reflect on that, like how much of that concept
is really woven into your you know, And again that's
not to minimize your own affection for vintage cars and
like this being independently your hobby, something you discovered through
your dad, but not something necessarily always to be redirected
to your dad. I realize it could just be independent

(01:03:21):
of him. But like questions like would I still be
significant if I abandoned that career and found something else
that kind of smacks of this idea of approval And
just I think that that's interesting, and I would just
encourage you to continue to meditate on that and ask
that question of like do I weave my sense of
value and relevance through this one particular venue and is

(01:03:43):
there really just a vacancy of my father's approval, and like,
is that what I'm really chasing?

Speaker 3 (01:03:49):
Deep?

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
Hashtag deep. We're gonna take a quick break and when
we come back, we're talking about how to have a
backbone as a therapist. You're listening to pod therapy.

Speaker 3 (01:04:00):
Today's episode is brought to you by Spinny Scoop, Mason Miller,
Tess Miller, Builer, t Paris, te Monico, Oscar Swanrose, Hannah, Marie,
Emma Cain, Myra, and Sam Cohen. Would you like to
sponsor the show? Become a therapist patreon.

Speaker 1 (01:04:15):
Dot com, slash therapy.

Speaker 3 (01:04:17):
I'm a head by ten Kay Jacob which Friends star
dammit once worked as a bicycle messenger in New York City.

Speaker 1 (01:04:28):
I would give him a plaavid name all.

Speaker 3 (01:04:30):
Of Shwimmer, Matt LeBlanc, Matthew Perry or Courtney Cox gonna
be one.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
Of the dudes.

Speaker 3 (01:04:37):
Matthew Perry.

Speaker 1 (01:04:39):
No, you can't rebound, give me, give me le Blanc rebounded.

Speaker 3 (01:04:44):
It is matt rebound?

Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
What damn it?

Speaker 3 (01:04:48):
Who was discovered working while at a fast food restaurant
called Tommy's.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
This is also Friends related.

Speaker 3 (01:04:57):
No, uh yeah, I guess you need options, don't you?

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
Any celebrities Okay, yeah, there's only like five of them, right.
Uh Charlie's stern was that one? Uh, Jennifer Lopez, even
Mendez or Megan.

Speaker 2 (01:05:12):
Fox's throw Uh oh, it's Gym's turn, it's my I'm
not falling for your fuckery.

Speaker 1 (01:05:19):
Okay, I'll tell you right now. Too obvious, my man, Okay,
not subtle, good, don't fall for I'll bet you it's
Eva Mendez Mendoz that one. She is so gorgeous that
I feel like if she just walked in, sister and
she was like serving you, you'd be like you just
should be before.

Speaker 3 (01:05:39):
Yeah, his first role was on TV Better Young.

Speaker 1 (01:05:45):
Brothers. That's right, those guys.

Speaker 3 (01:05:48):
It was not even.

Speaker 1 (01:05:51):
Oh fuck, oh my god, I really thought you were
working with me. God damn it. Uh Okay, Jake absolutely
just picked what with it and it just turned out
to be right. I was hoping that's what turned out
all right. At least that wasn't wrong. At least my
instincts were correct.

Speaker 3 (01:06:10):
Uh, do what I say. That's what your instinct should be.

Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
I probably should just follow your advice.

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
Jacob which a list actor used to clean lion cages
at a zoo.

Speaker 1 (01:06:20):
Huh, I'm just gonna be really critical of these names
and whether they are a listers.

Speaker 3 (01:06:24):
Liam Neeson.

Speaker 1 (01:06:25):
Yeah, I want to see the new Naked Gun so bad.

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
Yeah, it looks it's great, It looks great. I did
see a Fantastic Four today. Oh, I think I'm done
with comic book movies.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
I think you should be. But I've been dealt with those. Yeah,
although I did see the last movie last night. Oh,
I don't consider that comic book. This is a good
popcorn flake, Like it's it's silly and great. You know
exactly what's gonna happen. Yeah. Yeah, you've hung in there
with this stuff longer than.

Speaker 3 (01:06:51):
I can't do it anymore. It was time.

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
Yeah, yeah, it was definitely time. Anyway, Pedro Pascal is
like that.

Speaker 3 (01:06:57):
He was good. Like they all did a great job.
Everybody in that movie did a great chop.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
The plot is just too package at this point. You
just don't care.

Speaker 3 (01:07:06):
Yeah. Well, and like the way that they get their powers.
Here's the other thing to like, it doesn't work in
the world that we live in.

Speaker 1 (01:07:16):
Most of them don't because like I'm not going to
give it a radiation the Hulk.

Speaker 3 (01:07:21):
Yeah, but like like they live in a world where
they can just address the world and the world is like, yeah,
you're right, we're on your side. Oh yeah, it's no, Yeah,
that would never happen matter what you do. Fifty of
the world has a conspiracy theory that you're trying to
kill them.

Speaker 1 (01:07:42):
Twenty four hour News Network with you right now, like
it just doesn't fit anymore. Thanks for explaining it. We're
on your side now.

Speaker 3 (01:07:50):
Uh, Lion cages at the zoo, Jacob all right, Liam Neeson,
Invester Stallone, Hey lister, Harrison Ford.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
Hey lister. I would argue, no, I'm fine with Stallone,
Clint Eastood, I wouldn't put on the list anymore. His
time's done. Hall of Fame.

Speaker 3 (01:08:07):
Fine.

Speaker 1 (01:08:07):
I feel like a lister is a very current events state.

Speaker 2 (01:08:10):
You think you stay active to be and I think
I think once you're once you're an A lister, you're
an A list. I don't think you once you're dead,
you're still an a list. There are people that were
a listening dead A listers or whatever, like people that
were being like trotted out as like like Joey Lawrence
was an A lister one, No, he wasn't.

Speaker 1 (01:08:29):
Come on, there was a time man, Toby fucking maguire.
That's what I'm saying. Though there was a time people
were like that was it. There were a heart throb,
that's a get You get that one on the Late
Show like they're pumped about it, like, come on, Vince
Vaughan was an a lister. I don't consider him a list.

Speaker 2 (01:08:48):
I'm gonna say, let's see, I'm either gonna go Eastwood
or lying Harrison Ford.

Speaker 3 (01:08:55):
I think.

Speaker 1 (01:08:56):
Don't fall for him. Twice bro here, he got me
what I thought. He was the guy who did the
chicken eggs thing or something, and he turned out to
not be the right choice.

Speaker 2 (01:09:06):
Now, I know Harrison Ford worked as a carpenter, but
it would surprise me if he mucked out some stalls
or something at some point. Who were the other two?
And it's that's right, Yeah, I don't think it was
the lone. I don't know about Liam Neeson.

Speaker 1 (01:09:20):
Boy that there's room for that. I could see that
one being true. I feel good about that. No, buddy,
I would like Clint Eastwood, please, yay, all right?

Speaker 3 (01:09:33):
Just always fucking listen to Jake last one before stardom,
who was a breakdancer on the streets of Paris.

Speaker 1 (01:09:42):
Oh, go ahead, say it more.

Speaker 3 (01:09:48):
Uh then Diesel? No, Jean Claud van Dam very likely
Iris Alba or Tom Hidleston.

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
Oh Jesus, oh fuck, give me Jean Claude von Dam.

Speaker 3 (01:10:05):
Which is the one I would have picked.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
You got to be the red herring.

Speaker 3 (01:10:08):
Yeah, ship from Brussels. Yeah, he's from Brussels, so that's well.

Speaker 1 (01:10:14):
I figure he can get to that place. All right,
Where are you going with Jacob? Who is off the rim? Irish?

Speaker 3 (01:10:24):
As soon as you said Vin Diesel, I thought it
was Vin Diesel, so let's go there. Wow.

Speaker 1 (01:10:30):
What that seems like a douchebag gig that Vin Diesel
would have had. How dare you?

Speaker 2 (01:10:36):
Vin Diesel is somebody who would absolutely answer to the
question hey can you break dance with an affirmative?

Speaker 1 (01:10:43):
Ah?

Speaker 2 (01:10:44):
Yeah, okay, all right, yeah, but there's not a single
chance that my answer that question is ever going to
be a guest. Okay, No matter how much I think
I can break dance, I'm never going to say yes to.

Speaker 1 (01:10:55):
You will never identify as someone who can break down?

Speaker 3 (01:10:58):
Got it?

Speaker 1 (01:10:59):
Okay? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (01:11:00):
All right?

Speaker 1 (01:11:01):
Fair that. I like how you logiced your way through that. Yeah,
because I think Idris Elbow would have been my next go.

Speaker 2 (01:11:07):
I also just heard a long form interview with andrews
Elba on Amy Poehler's podcast recently, and he didn't talk
anything about street performing.

Speaker 1 (01:11:15):
Oh, that was probably would have come up.

Speaker 3 (01:11:18):
I feel like it would have come up.

Speaker 1 (01:11:19):
Yeah, I tried to bring that up.

Speaker 3 (01:11:20):
I think Ben Diesel would have been the last one
I would have picked out.

Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Of that list. You would have gone Van Dam Who
would have been your second choice?

Speaker 3 (01:11:27):
Tom? Who is that? Spider Man?

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
Huddles, Huddles, the spider young one, that one? No, he's Loki.
Tom who is spider Man?

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:11:43):
Spider Man? He's an attorney. Attorney Tom Sendaia Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
Tom Holland. That's Tom Holland. I the fries. All right,
I like it. I'm winning how to have a backbone
as a therapist? Hi, all, Duffy the as soon as
I get my number, I'll be a therapist.

Speaker 2 (01:12:02):
Bear.

Speaker 1 (01:12:05):
That's sweet. It's neat how Duffy's name has changed over
the years. Congratulations Duffy. That's wonderful. And I have a
serious question I work with kids as a therapist. Seven
has always the answered. I've been told that my strength, Okay,
I've been told my strength is how many kids.

Speaker 3 (01:12:21):
Can I hit.

Speaker 1 (01:12:23):
To get out of media? We've already hit the button.
The police, they are on their.

Speaker 3 (01:12:27):
Way to remove you.

Speaker 1 (01:12:28):
I work with kids as a therapist. I've been told
that my strength is also my weakness. My strength that
I strength I hit them too hard, also my weakness
I love too hard. My strength that I want people
to feel safe and connected, and that I want to
give them grace. How is this a weakness? I'm so
glad you asked. I struggle with pushing people past their

(01:12:50):
comfort zone. I hate confrontation. I never want to be
that bitch. I come from a long line of what
I perceive to be that bitch women, and I've seen
how awful they can be. I vowed to not be
like that. But being that hard nose gets Being like that,
it gets results. When I call parents and kids out,

(01:13:10):
they seem to snap into attention, they stop fucking around
and do what they need. So how do I balance that?
How do I give people that safe place but also
not take their crap?

Speaker 3 (01:13:22):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (01:13:22):
Also, I am still at that place of employment. From
my very first letter over four years ago. The paperwork
has gotten easier, and I was finally diagnosed with ADHD
and started medication which helped me so much thanks of
the podcast Duffy.

Speaker 3 (01:13:37):
I do kind of remember that letter.

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
Yeah about the paperwork. That is a really good question.

Speaker 3 (01:13:43):
I think a lot of my answer with this would
depend on the context in which you're working, right, Like
when you're talking about working with kids, Yeah, okay, so
kind of being hard nosed and being more directive. Yeah,
Like that to me sounds like a lot of the
work that I've done in substanitute treatment, you know, working

(01:14:06):
in rehabs or working with kids, working with foster kids
or kids in treatment or whatever. Because yes, that sometimes
is a difficult line to walk, because you want to
be safe, you want to be kind, you want to
be empathetic, and then you also have to enforce very
specific boundaries and sometimes you just have to tell people

(01:14:29):
that what they need to do, you know, like especially
working with kids, you know, you can't just be like, well,
I know, you know you feel this way and blah
blah blah, but but you need to put the knife down,
you know, like like no, you need to do like
you got to stop. And so I think for me,
what has been helpful And so that's one situation or

(01:14:49):
one context. The other context is motivating. Yes, And how
do you you know, outside of holding them accountable, how
are you able to be kind of hard nosed and
motivate them to be I think those are two different questions.
To go back to the first one. What worked for
me is to try to remove emotion from the equation

(01:15:14):
and just focus on facts. Okay, yeah, I understand this
is what you're going through. I understand how this is
your how you're feeling. However, if you do this behavior,
this is going to be a consequence, right, I will
beat the shit out of Yeah, that's hard. I will
double backflip split kick you in the base.

Speaker 1 (01:15:35):
Sean Claude Van damn it.

Speaker 3 (01:15:37):
If you don't stop yelling, I will let you pick
which arm I beat the fuck out of you with.
Uh No, So I think you kind of have to.
But but just be and again, like, you can't be
emotional when doing that, Like, because once you get emotion involved,
and now we're in a pissing match.

Speaker 1 (01:15:57):
Yeah, And it also disqualifies your advice because then it
seems like you're more attached to this advice than you
are presenting me with my truth in an obvious way.

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
That feels right, Yeah, And presenting options correct and being
in a presenting options from the context of like, my
feelings are not affected one way or another, but you
should know, yes, that doing this behavior elicits this response. Right,
doing this behavior will elstit this response, So go ahead
and choose whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:16:24):
Fine with that. I'm fine with being what you might
call directive only whenever it's rooted in an understanding of
the patient. What drives me crazy is whenever some therapist
is some asshole hot shot that just thinks that they're like,
quote unquote is stuff he's at that bitch. There's a
lot of really ignorant therapists that fame being great at

(01:16:45):
this by like constantly calling people out and like doctor
filling everybody and like that's a fucking.

Speaker 3 (01:16:52):
That bullshit.

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
And then it's just like, oh, that's a great therapist
because they're no nonsense, they don't put up with it,
they call you out, and it's like there's no shortage
of people in the world that will fucking boss you
around and tell you what to do, and yet that
doesn't seem to cause a lot of change a lot
of people's lives. Therapists start from a posture of deep
and I feel like if you start from that position

(01:17:15):
of like, I've taken the time to really get to
know you, I know the world that you live in,
I've really come to understand where you stand. And then
whenever you present to me like, yeah, this thing is happening,
and now I challenge you from a position of deep
understanding in your life, where I'm just saying, you know, Nick,
the last two times this happened, it seems like this
keeps being the outcome. Like, whenever you date this kind
of person, this kind of you, you end up being

(01:17:37):
really upset later on. Doesn't seem to work out. Can
I challenge you today? I'm concerned that if you do
this again, you're gonna get that same response.

Speaker 2 (01:17:45):
That is basically the same speech that John Rocker gave
on that subway Okay, full circle.

Speaker 1 (01:17:51):
The language was a little different, but it's basically the
same idea.

Speaker 3 (01:17:55):
Yeah, he was just trying to motivate people.

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
Yeah, that's right to be better, that is the right
way to do it, John Rockers way, the John Rocker therapy.

Speaker 3 (01:18:03):
I think we're all on John Rockers.

Speaker 1 (01:18:05):
I feel like, yeah, I think in the fullness of time, yeah,
it's proven right hindsight me in twenty twenty.

Speaker 3 (01:18:12):
Oh, that's terrible. John Rockers had horrible things. Yeah, don't
look them up. Everybody, we're joking.

Speaker 1 (01:18:17):
Yeah, yeah, caveat, none of this is endorsed. But no,
Like I just to me, that's one of the most
annoying kinds of therapists that I'll ever meet is somebody
that like tries this directive like call them like they
see him method, and they like they try to like
clothe themselves as like a straight shooter.

Speaker 3 (01:18:33):
And I think we are.

Speaker 1 (01:18:34):
I think every profession knows people like this.

Speaker 2 (01:18:37):
Yeah, and it is someone that you that you quickly
realize has a bag of tricks, yeah, and says these things,
has kind of these but buzzwords that they say, and
they they do the whole thing where like, I'm this person,
so you should respect the things that I'm saying, right,
And I'm gonna say them in such a way that

(01:18:57):
I'm just gonna rattle them off.

Speaker 1 (01:18:58):
I'm gonna say, I'm very almost militaristically.

Speaker 2 (01:19:00):
Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna put this persona on and
I'm just gonna bark these things out and I'm going
to work with the assumption that you respect me. So
much that you're just gonna soap that language in. But
nobody respects you. No, they don't know who the fuck
you are. You haven't you haven't earned that respect yet. Yeah,
and that's how you get to be known as that bitch. Yes,

(01:19:21):
and then your insistent now itself that bitch is yelling again,
that bitch is what to do again, That bitch is
telling me how my life isn't right anymore, and how
and how that bitch knows the knows the right thing.

Speaker 1 (01:19:31):
I don't admire people like that, but I get that like,
and I like that the writer is trying not to
be that bitch right and and look duffy, there there
is a time and a place for directive, and there
is time and place for challenging and and observing things.
But like, I like therapists, and I think they are
more effective overall when they observe patterns in a way

(01:19:52):
the patient can agree with. Whenever you point this out,
not as not not as your antagonist, not as your teacher,
but as the person standing shoulder to show with you
in the journey. And like, I observe, Hey, it looks
like this keeps happening. What do you think about that
in this really like unoffensive way that's non threatening. It's
more able to be ingested and understood and like life

(01:20:13):
change can happen. So like to me, I've never admired
people that are like overly directive, overly challenging, calling people out,
unless they've earned the right to do that and they're
reading that person correctly and they realize that person will
thrive with this, and I'm gonna call them out and
that's what they want from it.

Speaker 2 (01:20:28):
But I think I might have a good middle ground
for Duffy here, Okay, because Duffy, it sounds like, is
a direct person at gonna be but they're also you
know that this carrying and supportive person, right, So I
think the goal that the target that I would aim
for if I were you, is not one or the other. Okay,
I would aim for that carrying, uplifting person who is

(01:20:50):
no nonsense. Okay, it's not that you are that bitch,
it's simply your no nonsense. Yeah, but you want to
strive for that repute of being the no nonsense person
that truly has my best interest in mind, A very.

Speaker 1 (01:21:05):
Honest person that's right, Like I won't sugarcoat it doesn't
sound like no nonsense.

Speaker 2 (01:21:10):
Yeah, yeah, but you always will know that I'm coming
to it from a place of caring and compassion.

Speaker 1 (01:21:16):
Okay, that I'm fine with that. Yeah, it's just it
has to start with that that sense of empathy and understanding,
which I do not think is a weakness, like one
of the And again, every therapist has different styles I'm
really aligned with, like motivational interviewing, which I've always found
when when you meet a therapist who can really do it,
the ones who do it very naturally have done it
for your especially in substance abuse counseling. It is a

(01:21:39):
superpower to witness them at work where they're like walking
backward and guiding this person right into huge conclusions and
decisions that the worst consequences of life couldn't do but
they've managed to do while not seeming like they were
making them do it or pointing them in direction or
forcing them or chasing them around with a stick, but

(01:22:00):
like helping this person arrive at genuine personal conclusions that
the therapist walked backward into without being challenging, but like
if they are, they're doing it in this again, motivational
interviewing is sort of like a way of talking that
encourages people to arrive at these conclusions in these epiphanies
in a pretty organic way, and it doesn't usually challenge.

(01:22:22):
It uses resistance and rolls with it. It can playfully challenge,
it will earn the right to do that. But like
it works with people that are the most disagreeable, the
most ignorant of their patterns, and arrives at like genuine
epiphanies that like change their lives. So to me, that's
just a style that like uses agreeability while also like
peppering in truth, but in this way that isn't like

(01:22:43):
shining the light right in their eyes. It's like this
non directive way.

Speaker 3 (01:22:46):
Yeah, it's kind of like if the way I've always
viewed this is it's like if if there was a
path with a fork in the road, and you are
you are as a therapist, are on one branch and
the client is on a different branch. You can't just
yell and say hey, come here, because they're not going

(01:23:10):
to do that. They see where you're at, they see
where they are at. They're not going to be like,
oh yeah, I'll just come over to you.

Speaker 1 (01:23:17):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (01:23:18):
No, it's not going to work. So what you have
to do is you have to slowly work backwards until
you are at the same point before the path split off,
and then you just start talking with them as you're
walking walking and you just have that conversation and they
don't even realize that they've made a decision until you

(01:23:39):
started down that path. And that's how to truly get
real motivational interviewing working, because they can't know that it's happening,
and it's got to be authentic, organic, and it's got
to be their idea.

Speaker 1 (01:23:55):
Yes, it is the closest thing to ethical mind control
that I could possibly think of, Like, and it is ethical,
Like it's very hard to do, and like I think
it comes with an incredible restraint on the therapist part.
But like addiction treatment and teenagers are very difficult populations,
and like Duffy's working with younger people, but like teenagers
are another one where it's like I don't see that

(01:24:16):
that there's a problem here a lot of the times,
Like there's a lot of stubborness, especially teenage addiction, and
like you know, there it takes a lot of connection
and congruence before you can get somebody to see some things.
But I feel like, especially with teenagers. I think that
is a special population where you do have to take
the risk at some point as a therapist, you do
have to be bold. You do have to kind of

(01:24:37):
like not break the relationship, and I think leverage it
and cause truth to happen.

Speaker 3 (01:24:42):
And for that to occur, I think it goes back
to Jacob's earlier advice, which is you have to know, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:24:49):
Okay, get to lick it. Yeah, it seems to always
solve the problem.

Speaker 3 (01:24:53):
You gotta know what your relationship. You have to have
that awareness of what your relationship with.

Speaker 1 (01:25:00):
This person everything.

Speaker 3 (01:25:01):
Yeah, before you can just throw that out because like
I can think of one bullet that gun, if you
spend it right now, hit what you're aiming at. I
can think of maybe in the twenty plus years I've
been doing this, two maybe three clients that I was
able to just kind of use a sarcastic comment, okay

(01:25:26):
to get them to understand something.

Speaker 1 (01:25:27):
But you you wagered the whole relationship on that.

Speaker 3 (01:25:30):
But I knew my standing, I knew where I was
with this person. I knew why we had already established
a really good rapport. They knew my sense of humor,
they knew I was coming from a good place. They
knew I was there to help them, and I was
able to throw in something like a hey, that seems

(01:25:53):
like a great idea. You've never tried that before, have you? Yeah,
And then they were just like I got it. Yeah,
fuck yeah, I have done this before. You know. But
like that's one tenth of one percent of the people
I've worked with. Right, you know, Now that makes for
amazing TV and movies. Right, if you want to think
of a TV therapist, Yeah, that makes for a great TV.

(01:26:15):
There bangs the table, calls.

Speaker 2 (01:26:17):
You out like that's what they want to It's also
a good way to communicate with Laura. It works well
with Laura, backhanded comments and sarcasm at loves it, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:26:29):
But you know what's what's tough too, is like I
think that's.

Speaker 3 (01:26:31):
The visions don't need to be washed.

Speaker 1 (01:26:33):
It's fine. I just living a pig stick.

Speaker 3 (01:26:34):
I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:26:34):
Fine, I love it. Yeah, it's fine.

Speaker 3 (01:26:37):
I love not being able to see the countertop. It's great, wonderful.

Speaker 1 (01:26:40):
Who cares remember what color it is?

Speaker 3 (01:26:42):
Then we don't have to wash it.

Speaker 1 (01:26:43):
No, But like one time here in the question you
asked the white staff at the restaurant. I feel like
with kids it is a little bit more difficult because
I think that a lot of times the relationship can
flow really naturally, and it's hard sometimes to even keep
it focused on therapeutics. And sometimes you do have to
like just kind of be direct sometimes and like say

(01:27:05):
the thing in an obvious way, Whereas with adults, most
of the time, depending upon you know their cognitive abilities,
I feel like we can take this scenic route to
epiphany and to realization by helping them understand patterns, asking
probing questions, repeating themes, like you can get them there,
and you can get that agreeability and that therapeutical liiance
strong enough that you can use subtle things like humor,

(01:27:26):
teasing or even when we're direct. We've earned the right
to be direct in this way that they finally accept
and it actually lands. With kids, sometimes I feel like
they just forget everything week to week, and so it's
just like sometimes you just have to be like, hey, yeah,
it sounds like you're lying again. Is that something you're
trying to stop doing or what's going on with that?
And like, yeah, I feel like sometimes you can't pussy

(01:27:46):
foot around this thing with especially with pediatrics like that, well.

Speaker 3 (01:27:48):
Especially I mean the other thing too, is like, I
mean a lot of kids that I've worked with, how
they learn to say things for shock value, right, you know?
And so another example, God, he's a parent screaming up coming,
Oh yeah, shock value kids a parent. Kids and parents

(01:28:12):
are basically the same, yeah, teenage parrot. But even kind
of being just genuine about that and kind of calling
it out and just like it feels to me like
you're saying this because you want my attention, right, you know,
and it kind of disarms them a little bit, you know,
Like I've done stuff like that, and that's I don't know,
if you call it direct, it's more. But again like

(01:28:33):
I'm not saying it with an attitude, I'm not saying
it with any emotion.

Speaker 1 (01:28:37):
I'm saying it very Yeah, I'm fine with being direct.
I'm final being challenging duffy, especially with youngsters. I think
that's fine. I'm never going to step away from my
Carl Rogers kind of you know, synthesis of of like foundations,
which is it always Oh Jesus Jesus Christ, what wow?

(01:29:00):
Witnes's gone for one week and we've doven into pedophilia again. Jesus,
she was the rope holding us up. But no, Like,
I just feel like you've got to start with that relationship.
And I'm fine with some amounts of directive, like you know,
challenging somebody. I think that can always be accomplished from
a position of I like you, I'm rooting for you,

(01:29:22):
I believe in you, and gosh darn it seems like
this keeps happening. Why do you think that is? And
if the kid wants to sit down and talk about
their latest video game and waste fifteen minutes of the
session talking about life, I do think we have to
come in as therapists and be directive sometimes and say, so,
how is that challenge going, what's better, what's worse? What
are we doing to work on that? I think you
can borrow from solution focus brief therapy. I think that

(01:29:44):
is a great technique that likes to address what's happening
in approving and optimistic ways, while also still identifying how
we can be intentional. I like that theory, am I
I think is a great theory for this too. But yeah,
I think that both can be done. I think you
can be directed. In my opinion, I have no respect
for therapists that just come out guns blazing trying to

(01:30:04):
teach everybody, and they're not doing the work. They're not bonding,
they're not connecting, they're not disarming, and I think ultimately
they're ineffective. Even if in the session people are like, Wow,
you're really smart, it's like, clearly you're a self aggrandizing
asshole therapist that needs to be padded on the back
until how fucking smart you are, and like, to me,
that's just it's it's just self serving. I just don't
think it's client focused. So mister, you'll get your ass

(01:30:26):
back in the fucking closet.

Speaker 3 (01:30:27):
Oh terrible.

Speaker 1 (01:30:28):
You do what I tell you to do. You're not
invited to come out here. You stay in that closet anyway. Duffy, congratulations,
I'm waiting for your number. That's terrific that you have
made it into the winner's circle of this profession. I
saw the other day at fifty seven percent of people
that graduate from graduate school do not ultimately go on
to achieve their full licensure. Fifty seven percent, two thirds

(01:30:51):
of people that graduate do not make it to this
to where Duffy is getting why washing out an internship,
just not completing the hours, maybe not passing the exams. Uh,
getting distracted along the way, maybe like life's happening.

Speaker 3 (01:31:04):
You get your ass bat.

Speaker 1 (01:31:05):
I'm gonna get you that finished line. My interns will
always make it. Supervision carry you across. That's right.

Speaker 3 (01:31:12):
I was.

Speaker 1 (01:31:13):
You know that. My my interns are very impressive. They
get their shit done. They're they're they're hard workers. So
no thanks to me, but I think that they do
a good job. We're gonna take a break and when
we come back, we're wrapping up the show. You are
listening to pod therapy.

Speaker 3 (01:31:26):
Today's episode is brought to you by Minny Scoop, Mason Miller,
Tess Miller, Biler, T Harris, t Monico, Oscar Swann, Rose Anna, Marie,
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Speaker 1 (01:31:42):
As we wrap up the show, I want to remind
you visit patreon dot com slash therapy and you can
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well as enjoy our live chat discord community in our
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(01:32:03):
com slash Therapy. We've got some new friends who've joined
the therap party. Who is new to the bunch there.

Speaker 3 (01:32:07):
We got a new therapal uh Lizna Lemon.

Speaker 1 (01:32:10):
I love that name. I I when I saw that
come through. Sometimes I'll see a handle and I'll be like, Oh,
that that they probably just cleverly picked that, and I'll
bet when I click on them, I won't see that
that actually is the email associated with the name, and
this is one that it was And I was like, oh, great,
that's actually this person.

Speaker 3 (01:32:27):
That's wonderful.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
Thought it was a fake name.

Speaker 3 (01:32:28):
Cool, love it. And we got a new therap pod
K Trauma Welco K Trauma. And guess what we got
two new therap producers what Sam Cone? Hell yeah, thank you,
thank you so much and bgay Do Crime.

Speaker 1 (01:32:43):
About damn time. Welcome to the producer circle. Bgay Do Crimes.
You've you've been needed in this group for a while now.
And Sam Cone lovely to have you. And we'd like
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(01:33:03):
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Speaker 3 (01:33:48):
If you'd like to do this episode uncut and unedited,
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Speaker 1 (01:33:58):
That's all the time we get for this week's say
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(01:34:19):
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Speaker 3 (01:34:23):
Do you want to spend a question of the show,
ask anonymously a pot Therapy is at nat email us
at pod therapy guys at gmail dot com, or click
the link in the episode description.

Speaker 1 (01:34:32):
I'm Nick Tangermin, I'm Jim, I'm Whitney.

Speaker 3 (01:34:35):
Thanks, we'll see if your appointment next week you need
to talk to you about quitting smoking. Whitney can't stop
bon stuff. Hacko Day spits in the picture least.

Speaker 1 (01:34:48):
Goodbye everybody, BA

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#395: Love Languages, Life's Passion, Therapeutic Back Bone

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