September 4, 2025 • 32 mins
On this episode, Alex Bozich is joined by Greg Waddell of Sleepers Media for a preseason Big Ten tier list.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Welcome back to a new episode of Podcasts on the
Brink Thursday, September fourth, Greg Whatel Sleepers Media this week's
guest on Podcast on the Break returning guests before we
get to Greg. If you enjoy the show, please leave
us a five star rating over on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
If you're watching over on YouTube, like the video, subscribe
to the channel. Really helps us grow our reach. As
(00:40):
Greg knows, he's a prominent I think I can call
you that college basketball YouTuber at this point. Greg. One
of the reasons I love to have you on you
and Carter, what you do year round in terms of content,
how much you guys grind, and the fact that you
just don't take it so seriously. I feel like sometimes,
you know, I take it so seriously, and I like to.
I like to watch you guys because you have fun
(01:00):
with everything. You do a lot of different things throughout
the off season to kind of keep the content fresh.
I really enjoy it. Thanks for taking the time to
come on, and thanks for being a good sport. I
kind of put you on the spot when we got
on this call and I wanted you to go through
an exercise with me here and you came up with
your list in like five minutes, so I really appreciate
you taking the time to come on the show absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Man Likewise, I'm a huge fan of everything you guys
are doing with inside the Hall. We know you guys
are the go tos for Indiana, so it's great to
be back. Great to see you again, and you know
your personnel here because there's nothing I love more than
being put on the spot and coming up with lists
and having fun talking Big ten hoops. Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So we got about two months until the regular season starts,
and what I enlisted Greg with the challenge of doing
is giving each Big ten team a spot on a
tier list. So I broke it up into five tiers,
just kind of going from top to bottom. Big ten
National contender. I kind of defined that as a team
that can win the Big Ten title, go on a
(01:59):
D tournament, run solid and CAA tournament. Teams teams that
we expect to get in but maybe not maybe win
a game, maybe get to the second weekend, but flame out.
Then we have could be in bubble teams, which are
you know, teams that have a chance to make it,
but could also be on the bubble not not totally
sure where they're gona end up. The four tiers kind
(02:20):
of see you in the Crown, you know, a little
bit of a joke there because of that tournament and
everything that went on with that last year and then
no shot at the postseason, which you know, there's certainly
some teams in the league that probably fit into that category.
So Greg, I want to start with that and work
our way up teams that you kind of look at
(02:40):
in the preseason here as we get ready for another
season the Big ten hoops and say no shot at
the postseason? Who are those four are I don't want
to say four. I don't know that there are four,
but who are those teams? And maybe give me a
little bit on each team and why you feel that way?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Sure, so I only have two teams in this tier,
and as we work our way up the list, I
think a couple things are going to become abundantly true
about how I feel about this league right now. But
I want to give a little hat tip to your
colleague Dylan Burkhart from You have Hoops. As you guys
are working through the Big ten, players count now, which
is one of my favorite features every offseason. He has
(03:15):
made the point repeatedly that there's only I think maybe
two teams in this entire league that would consider changing
coaches right now, and I think that's very real. In
an eighteen team league, there are sixteen teams that either
feel very good about a new hire they just made
(03:36):
or the trajectory of the coach they hired a couple
years ago, or have coaches in their prime that are
still winning at a high level. So, to me, the
only two that you can put definitively in that there's
no postseason future here are the two that may be
looking elsewhere in a year or so. It's Penn State
and it's Rutgers. And you know, two years ago, I
(03:57):
would have never thought that we would see Steve pikeel
on the hot seat. But it was quite a risk
for him to bring in those five stars and build
everything around two players who so clearly had their feet
out the door coming into the season, and he did
a horrible job surrounding them with the things they needed
and what could have been a very special year. He's
reset the book here. This Rutgers team is really beare
(04:20):
on paper, There's not a lot to like from what
they bring back and I guess you could argue after
a miserable season, it's good to kind of start fresh.
But I just think the juice is run out for Pikel.
With Penn State, they have some talent, Don't get me wrong.
Mingo is a guy that a lot of people like,
and I think it's hard to see how little they've
(04:40):
been able to build momentum since Shrewsbury had the Jalen
Pickett year. I mean, there have been good players. Ace
Baldwin is a great player, and Mike ros just couldn't
figure out how to win in this league. I'm not
expecting much. So yeah, I'm gonna keep this tier to
two as the hopeless teams coming into the season.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Do you actually think Rhodes or Pikel are actually on
the hot seat going into the season. I mean, Roads
is what this is gonna be. Year three of Pikel's obviously,
I think built up some at least credibility there in
terms of what he's been able to. I mean, Rutgers
before he got there was an absolute joke of a program.
He's made some NCAA tournaments, but you mentioned last season
(05:20):
there was a ton of high hopes. I'm just curious
if you think there's a realistic chance that either of
those programs would move on after the season.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I think there really is. And with Pikeel that that
really bumps me out because everybody loves Steve Pikeel. He's
a great guy. But yeah, I think just from a
general pulse and kind of what are you guys hearing
asking around, it feels like there is a real sense
of last season went as bad as it could have,
It's never going to be better than that in terms
of talent at this school, and the wheels have fallen
(05:48):
off with Rhads. It's still early, but also once you
get through your third year, how early is it. And
he's won sixteen games both of those years. I don't
think anyone's expecting Penn State to win more more than
sixteen games in year three with how loaded this conference is.
So we'll see. Those two are both gonna have to
to pleasantly surprise. I think if either one of those
(06:09):
teams ends up like in the bubble conversation, then you're
probably talking about some job security. But I just don't
expect that to happen, And quite frankly, I'd be surprised
if either of these teams made the Crown.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Yeah, so moving up to that next category are tier
teams that could kind of make the postseason, the Crown,
whatever postseason, just not the NCAA Tournament, but some type
of postseason. How many teams do you have in this
tier and who do you have?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I have three teams in this tier, and two of
them I'm very upset with myself that I'm putting in
this tier, so I'll do the third first. I have
Minnesota in this tier. Now this is just simply a
Nico Medved hat tip. And I'm used the term hat
tip twice in five minutes. Now, I gotta stop doing that.
But a lot of smart people tell me they love
(06:56):
Nico Medved. He's an offensive genius and a guy that
will get the most out of his rosters at all times.
I have pushed back on that from time to time previously.
I think, you know, he's had talent at Colorado State
that quite frankly, I think could have been more successful
and made some postseason runs. And it's a credit to
him and how he built those rosters. But we just
(07:17):
watched john Tonjie go to Wisconsin and look like the
second best player in the league. He certainly didn't look
like that, and his years at Colorad, I don't state
before it on teams that had some real superstars with
Isaiah Stevens a point guard people liked. But I think Minnesota,
I would argue, is the hardest place to win at
in this league, and that sounds crazy when Penn State
Basketball exists. But you know, we've seen guys that have
(07:39):
proven themselves to be good coaches elsewhere go there and
just fail. If you're Nico, there are reasons to believe
that he's a better culture fit with that program, and
I'm very curious to see what he'll look like in
year one. But yeah, roster wise, what he's put together,
I don't expect them to be competitive. If it was
a different coach, I would probably bump them down to
(08:00):
the Penn State Rutgers tier. But you have to give
Nico the benefit of the doubt. The two I want
to love together here and I'm curious to get your thoughts.
Nebraska and Northwestern. These are two programs with two coaches
that have proven they can overachieve in this league. Fred
Hoiberg and Chris Collins are two guys that quite frankly
have dragged nit at best rosters to the NCAA Tournament
(08:23):
multiple times in the last five years, and Northwestern has
a top six player in the conference and Nick Martinelli,
who you know, if all goes well, it's not crazy
to think that he would be in the Big Ten
Player of the Year conversation at the end of the year.
There's some breakout candidates in kJ Windham and a few
other young pieces on the Northwestern roster that kind of
(08:44):
raised the upside. And then Nebraska last year went sideways
for them, I think largely because they didn't have Rank Mast.
Who remember the last time they had Rank Mast was
incredible and we don't know what he's going to be
post injury. But I think, you know, these are two
guys in Collegeburg. I want to believe in them on
an annual basis. But I do think there is so
(09:06):
much talent in this conference from all of these big
spender schools elsewhere that for now you need to drop
them below the teams that just have a little more
star power.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, I would agree with that. And the thing that
I mentioned to Dylan when we went we went through
and made the list. I feel like last year, previous
years it got to a certain point where it was
hard to come up with names to put on this list.
I feel like this year the talent overall in the
Big Ten is just so deep, and there was guys
I think we left off and we did that. We've
done it in the past. We've made mistake like last
(09:38):
year we didn't. We didn't have john Tonji on the
list in the preseason. I don't think anybody would have.
But I just feel like overall that the talent in
this league, and a lot of it has to do
with obviously the NIO and resources that programs are committing
to men's basketball is deep, and I agree. I mean
Nebraska and Northwestern, they're going to have games at home
(09:59):
where they not off you know, a top two or
three team in the Big Ten. We're gonna say, wow,
is this team, you know, potentially NCAA tournament team. I
feel like they could play well in the non conference
against I don't examine both of their schedules all that closely,
but I think they could rack up some obviously some
wins in the non conference. But I agree with you,
(10:19):
they both have so many question marks with just some
key positions and what they lost. I mean Northwestern losing
Jalen Leach and Brooks Barnheiser. We kind of saw what
that team looked like later in the season without those guys.
It was tough in Nebraska, I mean, losing Brice Williams.
That's you know, he was such an important piece for them.
So I do feel like those are two teams that
(10:40):
by season's in, we could say we missed on one
of them and they worked their way into the bubble conversation.
But I think for a starting point with both of them,
that's probably a fair spot for both of them.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
And to add, they both went seven and thirteen in
the conference last year, And you know, I don't think
there's a world either one of those teams is like
non competitive. To your point, they're gonna win home games
and be a tough out any given night. But I
think the baseline expectation is almost in that, you know,
six to eight wins category for either. I would say
this this tier we're about to get to, I would
(11:14):
bet really good money that at least one, if not two,
of the teams in the tier we're about to talk about,
ends up finishing below Nebraska Northwestern. There's some more volatility
in this upcoming tier, but there's also higher upside.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So is this the biggest tier of the five for
you in terms of number of teams?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
By far the biggest tier for me?
Speaker 1 (11:34):
How many? How many you have here?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
I have six teams in my on the bubble tier, okay?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
And who are those who are those six?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
I have Washington, Indiana, Iowa, Maryland, Ohio State and USC. Now,
if if I don't know, if we were being even
more creative on this, I like the way you tiered this,
you could are you to me that there's a sixth
tier that I would just throw Indiana, Iowa, and Maryland
(12:05):
into basically brand new hires. We like the rosters. At
least one of these guys is going to have like
a top twenty five good team, and the other two
probably should be around the NCAA tournament. But you know,
when I've talked about this offseason, I really just don't
know which ones to trust. Quite frankly, I like all
(12:26):
three on paper. I think Ben McCollums resume speaks for itself.
I think DeVries clearly is a great cultural fit at Indiana,
and I was impressed with how they looked overseas. And
I think Buzz Williams gets a bad rap. He has
such a high floor as a coach. I mean, Maryland
probably has the most questions with what they've done from
a roster standpoint, But I don't know how you don't
(12:46):
look at what he was able to do in the
SEC these last three or four years, always have his
teams firmly in the tournament and think that that guy
could win games at Maryland in the Big ten in
year one. So you know, for me, it's easy to
just kind of lump them together. I don't think there's
any teams in this tier that I feel are can't
miss enough that you need to elevate them into the
(13:08):
solid NCAA tournament picture. But you know, the beautiful thing
about this league, I would bet four, if not five,
of these teams end up making the tournament, even if
they're sweating a little bit on selection Sunday. Washington, just
a single one out Washington is the one that I
would bet the most on here because I love this roster.
I think they are deep. I think they've got serious talent.
(13:31):
JJ Mandiquit was a kid that looked great in the
Feeble World Cup U eighteen summer training camp stuff and
he may not even have a huge role on this team.
Hans Steinbach was arguably the best international player at the
entire event. And then you've got guys that they stole
from one of the other West Coast teams in Wesley Yates,
who should be an obvious breakout Canadate. And you know,
(13:52):
I don't love the pairing with desk Claude just saying
let's run it back in new uniforms. But those are
proven guys that it went sideways with must but that
was largely because USC had no front court help. Washington
has front court help. So if not for how Danny
Sprinkle's first year went, and that kind of goes back
to my point on how much should we trust the
first year coaches. I think Sprinkle's a good guy with
(14:14):
a very bright future. It just didn't come together for
him in year one. And if that year was a
raise from memory, I would probably put Washington higher on
this list. But I think the safe thing to do
with all these year one and year two guys who
we just don't know is to lump them all together,
admit that four of these are going to make the tournament,
and it's kind of a fish in a barrel on who.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Did you find it curious that Claude and Yates both
ended up at the same place after last season?
Speaker 2 (14:41):
I did. I'm stunned that they would sign up for that,
quite frankly, but you know, I think individually they're both
very good players. I think from what I saw from
USC last year, neither one of those guys was ever
the problem. I mean, they were playing with the worst
front court in the league, so in a weird way,
the fact that they I do want to continue playing together,
(15:01):
and I'm sure Nil played a part in it. Danny
Sprinkle's spending some good money right now, it makes me
optimistic that this could work because clearly there wasn't any
friction issues that will carry over into this year. I think.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
So the one team I want to ask you about
in that tier that we didn't really expand on Ohio State.
I feel like this is more of an indictment on
Jake Deebler than it is the actual talent on the roster,
because you look at this roster and you say, I mean,
they've got Bruce Thorton, They've got Mobley, they've got Devin Royal,
three guys that we had in the top forty of
(15:34):
our list, and you think this should be a team
that's solidly in the NCAA tournament. And then you look
at the fact that they've had Thornton the last three
years haven't really haven't made the tournament. He's been an
all Big ten type of player, specifically last year. Is
this more of a you know, question mark in terms
of Deeblo's ability to get this team enough wins to
(15:55):
get them in the tournament?
Speaker 2 (15:57):
From your standpoint, so, I think this starting five is
probably top fifteen to twenty good in the country. Now,
the question for me, beyond just what is Jake Tepler doing,
which is a very fair question, is do they have
anything depth wise that will matter. I mean, the only
proven player they're gonna bring off the bench is big
(16:19):
Oh Josh. I don't know if I'm gonna bosch. They
have O'john Wouna, I believe from Baylor. He's been a
good bench big his whole career. I mean, a guy
that theoretically will give you great secondary center minutes. But
to me, they're gonna be very top heavy. They're gonna
need thirty five minutes from Bruce Thornton, which he's done before.
Devin Royal, which he hasn't done before, and probably Mobile.
(16:42):
I don't really buy a Tyson Chapman year two breakout
after he missed all of last year with injury. He
was a prestigious recruit, but it hasn't looked the part yet.
And nobody else off the bench is a proven player
at the Division IE level, let alone the High Major
Big ten level, so you know it's star heavy. Bruce
Thornton is not a guy I personally want to attach myself.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
To, so same saying.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
If we could swap them coaches with somebody else in
this league, they're probably up one tier solidly in the tournament.
But let's be honest, it's not gonna surprise either of us,
is that if this team misses the turn fifth.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah, Thornton and Mobile are gonna have to play thirty
six thirty seven minutes. Becauld you look at the I
mean Gabe Cups is I think the backup point guard.
And nothing against Gabe Cups, but we saw him play
as a freshman in Indiana. He was timid, looked scared to shoot.
Who knows, maybe he's better with a couple of years
under his belt. Red shirting last year but this is
the guard depth there scares me. So moving into the
(17:38):
next tier, which I believe, we have seven teams left Illinois,
Michigan State, Michigan, Ohio or Oregon, Purdue, UCLA, Wisconsin. These
are solid NCAA tournament teams, but not necessarily teams that
you would predict to, let's say, win the Big ten
or go to the Elite eight. Who is in this
tier for you?
Speaker 2 (17:58):
You know? I think the hardest part for me of
hearing this up was figuring out where to put the
group of seven that is still to come here, how
to divvy them up. I think there's an argument you
could put Purdue completely in a tier of their own,
and there's an argument you could put I don't know,
five or six of these teams I'm about to name
all in the top tier of making a deep run
(18:18):
and being contenders to win the league. So the way
I ended up going with, I put four teams in
the solid le NCAA Tournament teams category, and I'll work
down the list in order of how I view them
for this upcoming year. I would have Wisconsin fourth, the
closest to the very top tier. I'm buying Greg gard
(18:40):
in general, at this point. I mean, when he has
a first team All Conference caliber player, he's been in
the mix. I mean he has been a top four
team repeatedly in the last few years, when he's had
a Johnny Davis or a John Todji. Now, even look
at aj Store and how horrible he looked at Kansas
he was in his one year at Wisconsin. So I
(19:02):
think there's a very safe argument here that Greg guard
will will optimize the guys he's got. John Blackwell is
a huge breakout candidate. For me, I will not be
surprised whatsoever if he's a top five player in the league.
Nolan Winter in the front court, I think has been
waiting for his opportunity and has all the talent in
the world. And you know Nick Boyd, a former one
(19:23):
of the guys from the Florida Atlantic teams that had
some really good seasons. I think it is a player
I really believe will establish a high floor for this group.
So you know, Wisconsin, I really flirted with putting them
in the National Contenders tier, but I ended up putting
them in Tier two just because I think they're a
little bit less talented than the best of the best
in this League. From there on, I went with Oregon,
(19:44):
Michigan State, and Illinois, three teams that I think are
all very big in variation. I think Oregon's upside with
their star power. You know, they could make a Final
four in March. I wouldn't bet on it, but to me,
if that happens, they probably finished in the league fourth,
(20:04):
fifth or sixth and then surprise people and make like
a six seed magical run where Shell's dad makes clutch shots.
Michigan State it feels weird not putting them in the
top tier given what tom Izzo is, But I hated
their offseason. I hated this offseason for the Spartans. I
think Trey Holloman was a huge loss that everyone shrugged aside,
and he was their culture guy. He should be the
(20:27):
captain on this team. He's gone for a paycheck, and
I think that's a rather large hit to the entire
tom Izzo operation. I think Trey Fort is the guy
they're gonna expect to replace Jase richardson shot making. To me,
Trey Fort is a bucket ball product from the Sanford system,
and if you go through the history of guys that
looked great at Samford and then try to go up
(20:48):
a level to power five basketball. It's not pretty, So
you know you're leaning on Jeremy Fears and Cohen car
to carry water there. Respectfully, if those guys are fourth
and fifth on your team, I think you can win
the league. If they're first and second on your team,
I don't think your offense is going to be very good.
So to me, it's almost a bump up for Izzo
respect wise to have them here. Other people won't like that,
(21:12):
but to me, if it was coached by anyone else,
this roster would probably be in my bubble category. And
then lastly, Illinois, this is the one team I'm lower
on than consensus. I would say another one for me
where I think they're over correcting a little bit to
the youth experiment last year where Yakashonas and Riley I
(21:35):
think are taking a lot of the blame for the
inconsistencies that team had, when in reality, that team could
not shoot, that team did not defend at a very
high level at times, and those were issues that guys
like Kylin Boswell and benham Rickhouse were responsible for. Now
they're back expected to be in big roles, and you
bring in some twenty two year old Serbians instead of
(21:58):
the nineteen year old line. He pick serbians. I'm not
super into a team that is going to be centered
around Tom avisag is the go to guy. I think
Maras Johnson was a huge cultural loss for them the
way Holloman was for Michigan State. And uh, for me,
it's a sign of respect to Brad Underwood and Tom
Izzo to have them firmly in this tier as is.
(22:18):
But I don't see a world where those teams compete
for the big ten crown. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
I agree with you one hundred percent on Michigan State.
If if you just look at the roster of the
seven teams that kind of you can have in these
top two tiers, I think they clearly have the worst
roster of the seven. I don't.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
I understand the idea behind Izzo not wanting to go
portal heavy, but at some point you have to embrace
kind of what the system is at this point, and
I don't think he's fully done that. I agret I
didn't like the offseason that they had, and well, I
do think Fears and car and Kohler could be a
solid trio to build around. I don't see a star group,
(23:00):
so I think, like I think the best case scenario
is they're a solid and CAA tournament team. But I
also do think they could have their fair share of
struggles and then potentially be a bubble team. So it'll
be interesting to see how that works out. Illinois, I
don't know what to make because I, you know, I
don't know any of the players other than watching scouting
video of two or three minutes that they brought in
(23:22):
to know enough about how those guys are going to translate.
They kind of obviously had a ton of talent last year,
and you know, at one point in the season I
looked at him and thought, you know, this could be
a team that makes it a really deep run. And
then they get destroyed by what was a duke in
that non conference game late in the season. It's like,
you know, they're just kind of all over the place
that they didn't defend well enough. I don't know that
(23:45):
those issues are going to be fixed at all. So
I agree with you on all of those teams. So
I'm guessing your top three just by process of elimination.
Here we've got Michigan purduing UCLA, and that tier yeah,
that's a you must love what UCLA did in the offseason.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
I do, I really do. I think I am probably
one of the highest on UCLA Big Ten fans or
whatever you want to call me that I've seen. So
I really think it depends on how you view last
season for UCLA, what you believe their upside is this season.
I thought they were pretty awesome last year, and that
(24:26):
is not the consensus here, and I get it. But
finished twentieth in Ken Palm twenty three and eleven. The
disaster stretch for that team was a four game losing
streak that included three trips East Coast, where they went
to Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers, all in the same ten
day span in which the Los Angeles wildfires broke out.
(24:50):
I don't know how you can hold that against them.
And I understand that Mick Cronin is kind of this
curmudgeon guy that's easy to hate. I'm certainly not a
mc cronan guy either, and he said some crazy things
as they went through that span. But I mean, before
that tragedy occurred, this was a team that got to
(25:10):
win against Arizona, a win against Gonzaga in the non
conference and when on an eight game win streak in
Big Ten play after they kind of got their feet
underneath them again. So to me, I did not like
their roster last year, largely because I hated their guards.
I just never wanted to believe in Dylan Andrews and
(25:33):
Sebastian Mack as a duo. To me, they have maybe
the most clean we fixed this problem spot in the
entire country. Donovan Dent is one of the best point
guards in the nation. He's electric. He's a guy who
can carry a team to wins. And there are some
stylistic questions on how it's gonna mesh with, you know,
(25:53):
the way McK cronan wants to play. But I just
think that mc cronin is a guy who has built
team around offensive engine types. You think back to the
High may Hawk as years, Johnny Juzang years. Even He's
gonna be able to win games with how good of
a defensive coach he is when you have an offensive
superstar like Dent. I know there are some people who
(26:15):
believe the front court still has issues, and Tyler Billadout
is certainly not a great defender. I don't think Xavier
Booker is gonna be an impact player on this team
at all. That's not part of my pitch on UCLA.
But I don't think they need him to be really truly.
I think they can win games going small with Tyler
billet out and Eric Day manning the four and five,
(26:36):
and the upgrade of the guard spot is enough to
take them from twentieth in the country into really the
top ten in the country for me.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
And then your top two. How do you kind of
make rank these two teams? I mean, I think most
people would say Purdue the favor in the preseason, but
I look at Bart Torvik. I think right now he's
got Michigan ahead. So is it close between these two?
Are are you going with Purdue over Michigan?
Speaker 2 (27:00):
It's not close for me now. Just ranking upside, I
think you can argue Michigan's upside is top five in
the country good. But I also think Michigan is the
most volatile team out of the entire top seven here,
And as a Michigan fan, I say that, but I'm
perfectly comfortable saying it. Yax Se Lendeborg's amazing. I think
(27:21):
him in the Danny Wolf role again, kind of like
Dent at UCLA, I think it's one of those things
that is just a perfect fit and a huge, honestly upgrade.
As crazy as that sounds, Danny at times, I think
they had to play through him more than they wanted
to because of the limitations they had at Point Guard.
I don't think there's going to be many moments this
(27:42):
year where you're feeling forced to get the ball to
Yaxe Lendeborg and letting him inflict pain on an opponent.
I am not an Adaimara believer. I am not an
Elliott Cado believer. And if you want to buy the
Michigan upside pitch, you have to buy both of those guys,
not one of those guys. I understand the reasons to
(28:03):
believe in them. I think Mara's in a system defensively
that will work with the things he does well and
hide the things he does poorly. I think you could
argue the same with Cadeo. Dusty May is a great
guards coach and a very fun system to play in,
But at the same time, Cado's turnover issues are not
going to be helped by the freedom that a Dusty
may offense brings, and they really don't have much of
(28:27):
an insurance plan. To me, the thing you can nitpick
about Michigan is that if Cadeau does not take a leap,
you don't have an alternative. They really don't have a
backup point guard they're going to turn to other than
getting creative and having Yakxel be this jumbo power point forward.
So for me, there are people who believe in Caddo.
(28:48):
If you believe in Caddell, you should have Michigan very
close to Purdue. I'm not one of those people. I
just really was disgusted by his development at North Carolina
and the way the brand of basketball he plays to
be honest with you, So they're so deep. I mean,
Trey mckenney's a stud who would start on most of
these teams. He's Michigan's eighth or ninth guy coming into
the season, and I think Dusty May has a pretty
(29:09):
high floor with how he's coaching right now. So to
me comfortable too. For Michigan, Perdue is just Perdue. And
if I want to play skeptical devil's advocate to this team,
I would point out that it was their defense, their rebounding,
their lack of im protection last year that had this
team in a spot to finish tied for fifth in
(29:30):
the league with no banners and no deep march run.
And as good as some of the additions they've made are,
they didn't address the biggest problems from last year's season.
Omer Meyer and Oscar Kluffer are not going to fix
this team defensively, and if those are the best five
in between Fletcher Lawier, Braden Smith, and Trey Kauffman Rehn,
(29:51):
I think we'll basically just see a souped up version
of what last year's team was. So you know, that
team was between fifteen and twentieth n nationally. I expect
this team to be one of the best two or
three teams in the country. That's my expectation for Purdue,
but I think it's gonna be largely because they have
the best offense in the sport and smart teams that
(30:12):
are well built to exploit some of those weaknesses. I
think we'll still be able to get to Purdue, but yeah,
to me, they're in a tier of their own. Is
the only favorite in this league.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Last thing before we get you out of here, is
is this a year that you could see the national
championship drought ending for the Big Ten? I feel like
we have this conversation every year. It's been since two thousand,
which is crazy to think about it. I mean, the
longer this goes on, it's like, you know, I know
there's a lot of luck and chance in terms of
the NCAA tournament, but at some point you feel like
(30:43):
the Big ten is going to have to break through, right,
you would.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Think at some point for sure, I think if you're
playing that game, it has to be Purdue that you're
banking on. I really would be stunned if anyone outside
of Matt Painters group does this. I will say, if
we're going through the last twenty years and trying to
pick out individual teams or spots where we're like that
was our best chance as a league, this is a
(31:06):
pretty good one because the top of the sport, to me,
is a little more wide open than it's been. Oddly enough,
I think the transfer portal nil era has Weirdly, it
hasn't created parody to the mid major level, but it
has created some parody within the elite teams because everybody's
spending money. Now it's not just three or four schools
that are so I think, you know, they're the favorite
(31:29):
on paper, the Final four is in the home state,
and in a lot of ways, when you have a
National Player of the Year candidate, another All American with him,
three guys that started in a national championship game two
years ago, it's fair to say this should be the year.
It's probably going to be Matt Paynter's best shot at it.
There are reasons you can pick holes in it as well,
but right now they're my national title pick Alex. As
(31:52):
much as that probably pains your Indiana listeners to hear.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Hey, you know what, the Big Ten's got to get
a championship at some point, so well, Indiana fans will
hope it did somebody else, but I agree with you
in the preseason. If you're going to pick a Big
Ten team, it's got to be produe. Greg, thank you
as always for being gracious with your time. Coming on
the show brought a ton of I mean we went
through what eighteen Big Ten teams in just a little
(32:15):
bit over a half hours, so that's a quick way
to do it. I really appreciate the time. And for
those who haven't checked Greg and Carter's workout, check them
out on social media, YouTube, sleepers media. You guys are
putting out stuff every day, you do any football stuff
as well.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
We lean a little bit into football. We did more
last year, but we're still don't worry. We got our
eyes on Signetty at all times.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Okay, all right, Thanks everybody as always for listening, Thanks
Greg for coming on the show, and we'll be back
soon with another episode of Podcast on the Break.
Welcome back to a new episode of Podcasts on the
Brink Thursday, September fourth, Greg Whatel Sleepers Media this week's
guest on Podcast on the Break returning guests before we
get to Greg. If you enjoy the show, please leave
us a five star rating over on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
If you're watching over on YouTube, like the video, subscribe
to the channel. Really helps us grow our reach. As
(00:40):
Greg knows, he's a prominent I think I can call
you that college basketball YouTuber at this point. Greg. One
of the reasons I love to have you on you
and Carter, what you do year round in terms of content,
how much you guys grind, and the fact that you
just don't take it so seriously. I feel like sometimes,
you know, I take it so seriously, and I like to.
I like to watch you guys because you have fun
(01:00):
with everything. You do a lot of different things throughout
the off season to kind of keep the content fresh.
I really enjoy it. Thanks for taking the time to
come on, and thanks for being a good sport. I
kind of put you on the spot when we got
on this call and I wanted you to go through
an exercise with me here and you came up with
your list in like five minutes, so I really appreciate
you taking the time to come on the show absolutely.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
Man Likewise, I'm a huge fan of everything you guys
are doing with inside the Hall. We know you guys
are the go tos for Indiana, so it's great to
be back. Great to see you again, and you know
your personnel here because there's nothing I love more than
being put on the spot and coming up with lists
and having fun talking Big ten hoops. Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So we got about two months until the regular season starts,
and what I enlisted Greg with the challenge of doing
is giving each Big ten team a spot on a
tier list. So I broke it up into five tiers,
just kind of going from top to bottom. Big ten
National contender. I kind of defined that as a team
that can win the Big Ten title, go on a
(01:59):
D tournament, run solid and CAA tournament. Teams teams that
we expect to get in but maybe not maybe win
a game, maybe get to the second weekend, but flame out.
Then we have could be in bubble teams, which are
you know, teams that have a chance to make it,
but could also be on the bubble not not totally
sure where they're gona end up. The four tiers kind
(02:20):
of see you in the Crown, you know, a little
bit of a joke there because of that tournament and
everything that went on with that last year and then
no shot at the postseason, which you know, there's certainly
some teams in the league that probably fit into that category.
So Greg, I want to start with that and work
our way up teams that you kind of look at
(02:40):
in the preseason here as we get ready for another
season the Big ten hoops and say no shot at
the postseason? Who are those four are I don't want
to say four. I don't know that there are four,
but who are those teams? And maybe give me a
little bit on each team and why you feel that way?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
Sure, so I only have two teams in this tier,
and as we work our way up the list, I
think a couple things are going to become abundantly true
about how I feel about this league right now. But
I want to give a little hat tip to your
colleague Dylan Burkhart from You have Hoops. As you guys
are working through the Big ten, players count now, which
is one of my favorite features every offseason. He has
(03:15):
made the point repeatedly that there's only I think maybe
two teams in this entire league that would consider changing
coaches right now, and I think that's very real. In
an eighteen team league, there are sixteen teams that either
feel very good about a new hire they just made
(03:36):
or the trajectory of the coach they hired a couple
years ago, or have coaches in their prime that are
still winning at a high level. So, to me, the
only two that you can put definitively in that there's
no postseason future here are the two that may be
looking elsewhere in a year or so. It's Penn State
and it's Rutgers. And you know, two years ago, I
(03:57):
would have never thought that we would see Steve pikeel
on the hot seat. But it was quite a risk
for him to bring in those five stars and build
everything around two players who so clearly had their feet
out the door coming into the season, and he did
a horrible job surrounding them with the things they needed
and what could have been a very special year. He's
reset the book here. This Rutgers team is really beare
(04:20):
on paper, There's not a lot to like from what
they bring back and I guess you could argue after
a miserable season, it's good to kind of start fresh.
But I just think the juice is run out for Pikel.
With Penn State, they have some talent, Don't get me wrong.
Mingo is a guy that a lot of people like,
and I think it's hard to see how little they've
(04:40):
been able to build momentum since Shrewsbury had the Jalen
Pickett year. I mean, there have been good players. Ace
Baldwin is a great player, and Mike ros just couldn't
figure out how to win in this league. I'm not
expecting much. So yeah, I'm gonna keep this tier to
two as the hopeless teams coming into the season.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Do you actually think Rhodes or Pikel are actually on
the hot seat going into the season. I mean, Roads
is what this is gonna be. Year three of Pikel's obviously,
I think built up some at least credibility there in
terms of what he's been able to. I mean, Rutgers
before he got there was an absolute joke of a program.
He's made some NCAA tournaments, but you mentioned last season
(05:20):
there was a ton of high hopes. I'm just curious
if you think there's a realistic chance that either of
those programs would move on after the season.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I think there really is. And with Pikeel that that
really bumps me out because everybody loves Steve Pikeel. He's
a great guy. But yeah, I think just from a
general pulse and kind of what are you guys hearing
asking around, it feels like there is a real sense
of last season went as bad as it could have,
It's never going to be better than that in terms
of talent at this school, and the wheels have fallen
(05:48):
off with Rhads. It's still early, but also once you
get through your third year, how early is it. And
he's won sixteen games both of those years. I don't
think anyone's expecting Penn State to win more more than
sixteen games in year three with how loaded this conference is.
So we'll see. Those two are both gonna have to
to pleasantly surprise. I think if either one of those
(06:09):
teams ends up like in the bubble conversation, then you're
probably talking about some job security. But I just don't
expect that to happen, And quite frankly, I'd be surprised
if either of these teams made the Crown.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Yeah, so moving up to that next category are tier
teams that could kind of make the postseason, the Crown,
whatever postseason, just not the NCAA Tournament, but some type
of postseason. How many teams do you have in this
tier and who do you have?
Speaker 2 (06:35):
I have three teams in this tier, and two of
them I'm very upset with myself that I'm putting in
this tier, so I'll do the third first. I have
Minnesota in this tier. Now this is just simply a
Nico Medved hat tip. And I'm used the term hat
tip twice in five minutes. Now, I gotta stop doing that.
But a lot of smart people tell me they love
(06:56):
Nico Medved. He's an offensive genius and a guy that
will get the most out of his rosters at all times.
I have pushed back on that from time to time previously.
I think, you know, he's had talent at Colorado State
that quite frankly, I think could have been more successful
and made some postseason runs. And it's a credit to
him and how he built those rosters. But we just
(07:17):
watched john Tonjie go to Wisconsin and look like the
second best player in the league. He certainly didn't look
like that, and his years at Colorad, I don't state
before it on teams that had some real superstars with
Isaiah Stevens a point guard people liked. But I think Minnesota,
I would argue, is the hardest place to win at
in this league, and that sounds crazy when Penn State
Basketball exists. But you know, we've seen guys that have
(07:39):
proven themselves to be good coaches elsewhere go there and
just fail. If you're Nico, there are reasons to believe
that he's a better culture fit with that program, and
I'm very curious to see what he'll look like in
year one. But yeah, roster wise, what he's put together,
I don't expect them to be competitive. If it was
a different coach, I would probably bump them down to
(08:00):
the Penn State Rutgers tier. But you have to give
Nico the benefit of the doubt. The two I want
to love together here and I'm curious to get your thoughts.
Nebraska and Northwestern. These are two programs with two coaches
that have proven they can overachieve in this league. Fred
Hoiberg and Chris Collins are two guys that quite frankly
have dragged nit at best rosters to the NCAA Tournament
(08:23):
multiple times in the last five years, and Northwestern has
a top six player in the conference and Nick Martinelli,
who you know, if all goes well, it's not crazy
to think that he would be in the Big Ten
Player of the Year conversation at the end of the year.
There's some breakout candidates in kJ Windham and a few
other young pieces on the Northwestern roster that kind of
(08:44):
raised the upside. And then Nebraska last year went sideways
for them, I think largely because they didn't have Rank Mast.
Who remember the last time they had Rank Mast was
incredible and we don't know what he's going to be
post injury. But I think, you know, these are two
guys in Collegeburg. I want to believe in them on
an annual basis. But I do think there is so
(09:06):
much talent in this conference from all of these big
spender schools elsewhere that for now you need to drop
them below the teams that just have a little more
star power.
Speaker 1 (09:17):
Yeah, I would agree with that. And the thing that
I mentioned to Dylan when we went we went through
and made the list. I feel like last year, previous
years it got to a certain point where it was
hard to come up with names to put on this list.
I feel like this year the talent overall in the
Big Ten is just so deep, and there was guys
I think we left off and we did that. We've
done it in the past. We've made mistake like last
(09:38):
year we didn't. We didn't have john Tonji on the
list in the preseason. I don't think anybody would have.
But I just feel like overall that the talent in
this league, and a lot of it has to do
with obviously the NIO and resources that programs are committing
to men's basketball is deep, and I agree. I mean
Nebraska and Northwestern, they're going to have games at home
(09:59):
where they not off you know, a top two or
three team in the Big Ten. We're gonna say, wow,
is this team, you know, potentially NCAA tournament team. I
feel like they could play well in the non conference
against I don't examine both of their schedules all that closely,
but I think they could rack up some obviously some
wins in the non conference. But I agree with you,
(10:19):
they both have so many question marks with just some
key positions and what they lost. I mean Northwestern losing
Jalen Leach and Brooks Barnheiser. We kind of saw what
that team looked like later in the season without those guys.
It was tough in Nebraska, I mean, losing Brice Williams.
That's you know, he was such an important piece for them.
So I do feel like those are two teams that
(10:40):
by season's in, we could say we missed on one
of them and they worked their way into the bubble conversation.
But I think for a starting point with both of them,
that's probably a fair spot for both of them.
Speaker 2 (10:53):
And to add, they both went seven and thirteen in
the conference last year, And you know, I don't think
there's a world either one of those teams is like
non competitive. To your point, they're gonna win home games
and be a tough out any given night. But I
think the baseline expectation is almost in that, you know,
six to eight wins category for either. I would say
this this tier we're about to get to, I would
(11:14):
bet really good money that at least one, if not two,
of the teams in the tier we're about to talk about,
ends up finishing below Nebraska Northwestern. There's some more volatility
in this upcoming tier, but there's also higher upside.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
So is this the biggest tier of the five for
you in terms of number of teams?
Speaker 2 (11:33):
By far the biggest tier for me?
Speaker 1 (11:34):
How many? How many you have here?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
I have six teams in my on the bubble tier, okay?
Speaker 1 (11:41):
And who are those who are those six?
Speaker 2 (11:43):
I have Washington, Indiana, Iowa, Maryland, Ohio State and USC. Now,
if if I don't know, if we were being even
more creative on this, I like the way you tiered this,
you could are you to me that there's a sixth
tier that I would just throw Indiana, Iowa, and Maryland
(12:05):
into basically brand new hires. We like the rosters. At
least one of these guys is going to have like
a top twenty five good team, and the other two
probably should be around the NCAA tournament. But you know,
when I've talked about this offseason, I really just don't
know which ones to trust. Quite frankly, I like all
(12:26):
three on paper. I think Ben McCollums resume speaks for itself.
I think DeVries clearly is a great cultural fit at Indiana,
and I was impressed with how they looked overseas. And
I think Buzz Williams gets a bad rap. He has
such a high floor as a coach. I mean, Maryland
probably has the most questions with what they've done from
a roster standpoint, But I don't know how you don't
(12:46):
look at what he was able to do in the
SEC these last three or four years, always have his
teams firmly in the tournament and think that that guy
could win games at Maryland in the Big ten in
year one. So you know, for me, it's easy to
just kind of lump them together. I don't think there's
any teams in this tier that I feel are can't
miss enough that you need to elevate them into the
(13:08):
solid NCAA tournament picture. But you know, the beautiful thing
about this league, I would bet four, if not five,
of these teams end up making the tournament, even if
they're sweating a little bit on selection Sunday. Washington, just
a single one out Washington is the one that I
would bet the most on here because I love this roster.
I think they are deep. I think they've got serious talent.
(13:31):
JJ Mandiquit was a kid that looked great in the
Feeble World Cup U eighteen summer training camp stuff and
he may not even have a huge role on this team.
Hans Steinbach was arguably the best international player at the
entire event. And then you've got guys that they stole
from one of the other West Coast teams in Wesley Yates,
who should be an obvious breakout Canadate. And you know,
(13:52):
I don't love the pairing with desk Claude just saying
let's run it back in new uniforms. But those are
proven guys that it went sideways with must but that
was largely because USC had no front court help. Washington
has front court help. So if not for how Danny
Sprinkle's first year went, and that kind of goes back
to my point on how much should we trust the
first year coaches. I think Sprinkle's a good guy with
(14:14):
a very bright future. It just didn't come together for
him in year one. And if that year was a
raise from memory, I would probably put Washington higher on
this list. But I think the safe thing to do
with all these year one and year two guys who
we just don't know is to lump them all together,
admit that four of these are going to make the tournament,
and it's kind of a fish in a barrel on who.
Speaker 1 (14:35):
Did you find it curious that Claude and Yates both
ended up at the same place after last season?
Speaker 2 (14:41):
I did. I'm stunned that they would sign up for that,
quite frankly, but you know, I think individually they're both
very good players. I think from what I saw from
USC last year, neither one of those guys was ever
the problem. I mean, they were playing with the worst
front court in the league, so in a weird way,
the fact that they I do want to continue playing together,
(15:01):
and I'm sure Nil played a part in it. Danny
Sprinkle's spending some good money right now, it makes me
optimistic that this could work because clearly there wasn't any
friction issues that will carry over into this year. I think.
Speaker 1 (15:14):
So the one team I want to ask you about
in that tier that we didn't really expand on Ohio State.
I feel like this is more of an indictment on
Jake Deebler than it is the actual talent on the roster,
because you look at this roster and you say, I mean,
they've got Bruce Thorton, They've got Mobley, they've got Devin Royal,
three guys that we had in the top forty of
(15:34):
our list, and you think this should be a team
that's solidly in the NCAA tournament. And then you look
at the fact that they've had Thornton the last three
years haven't really haven't made the tournament. He's been an
all Big ten type of player, specifically last year. Is
this more of a you know, question mark in terms
of Deeblo's ability to get this team enough wins to
(15:55):
get them in the tournament?
Speaker 2 (15:57):
From your standpoint, so, I think this starting five is
probably top fifteen to twenty good in the country. Now,
the question for me, beyond just what is Jake Tepler doing,
which is a very fair question, is do they have
anything depth wise that will matter. I mean, the only
proven player they're gonna bring off the bench is big
(16:19):
Oh Josh. I don't know if I'm gonna bosch. They
have O'john Wouna, I believe from Baylor. He's been a
good bench big his whole career. I mean, a guy
that theoretically will give you great secondary center minutes. But
to me, they're gonna be very top heavy. They're gonna
need thirty five minutes from Bruce Thornton, which he's done before.
Devin Royal, which he hasn't done before, and probably Mobile.
(16:42):
I don't really buy a Tyson Chapman year two breakout
after he missed all of last year with injury. He
was a prestigious recruit, but it hasn't looked the part yet.
And nobody else off the bench is a proven player
at the Division IE level, let alone the High Major
Big ten level, so you know it's star heavy. Bruce
Thornton is not a guy I personally want to attach myself.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
To, so same saying.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
If we could swap them coaches with somebody else in
this league, they're probably up one tier solidly in the tournament.
But let's be honest, it's not gonna surprise either of us,
is that if this team misses the turn fifth.
Speaker 1 (17:18):
Yeah, Thornton and Mobile are gonna have to play thirty
six thirty seven minutes. Becauld you look at the I
mean Gabe Cups is I think the backup point guard.
And nothing against Gabe Cups, but we saw him play
as a freshman in Indiana. He was timid, looked scared to shoot.
Who knows, maybe he's better with a couple of years
under his belt. Red shirting last year but this is
the guard depth there scares me. So moving into the
(17:38):
next tier, which I believe, we have seven teams left Illinois,
Michigan State, Michigan, Ohio or Oregon, Purdue, UCLA, Wisconsin. These
are solid NCAA tournament teams, but not necessarily teams that
you would predict to, let's say, win the Big ten
or go to the Elite eight. Who is in this
tier for you?
Speaker 2 (17:58):
You know? I think the hardest part for me of
hearing this up was figuring out where to put the
group of seven that is still to come here, how
to divvy them up. I think there's an argument you
could put Purdue completely in a tier of their own,
and there's an argument you could put I don't know,
five or six of these teams I'm about to name
all in the top tier of making a deep run
(18:18):
and being contenders to win the league. So the way
I ended up going with, I put four teams in
the solid le NCAA Tournament teams category, and I'll work
down the list in order of how I view them
for this upcoming year. I would have Wisconsin fourth, the
closest to the very top tier. I'm buying Greg gard
(18:40):
in general, at this point. I mean, when he has
a first team All Conference caliber player, he's been in
the mix. I mean he has been a top four
team repeatedly in the last few years, when he's had
a Johnny Davis or a John Todji. Now, even look
at aj Store and how horrible he looked at Kansas
he was in his one year at Wisconsin. So I
(19:02):
think there's a very safe argument here that Greg guard
will will optimize the guys he's got. John Blackwell is
a huge breakout candidate. For me, I will not be
surprised whatsoever if he's a top five player in the league.
Nolan Winter in the front court, I think has been
waiting for his opportunity and has all the talent in
the world. And you know Nick Boyd, a former one
(19:23):
of the guys from the Florida Atlantic teams that had
some really good seasons. I think it is a player
I really believe will establish a high floor for this group.
So you know, Wisconsin, I really flirted with putting them
in the National Contenders tier, but I ended up putting
them in Tier two just because I think they're a
little bit less talented than the best of the best
in this League. From there on, I went with Oregon,
(19:44):
Michigan State, and Illinois, three teams that I think are
all very big in variation. I think Oregon's upside with
their star power. You know, they could make a Final
four in March. I wouldn't bet on it, but to me,
if that happens, they probably finished in the league fourth,
(20:04):
fifth or sixth and then surprise people and make like
a six seed magical run where Shell's dad makes clutch shots.
Michigan State it feels weird not putting them in the
top tier given what tom Izzo is, But I hated
their offseason. I hated this offseason for the Spartans. I
think Trey Holloman was a huge loss that everyone shrugged aside,
and he was their culture guy. He should be the
(20:27):
captain on this team. He's gone for a paycheck, and
I think that's a rather large hit to the entire
tom Izzo operation. I think Trey Fort is the guy
they're gonna expect to replace Jase richardson shot making. To me,
Trey Fort is a bucket ball product from the Sanford system,
and if you go through the history of guys that
looked great at Samford and then try to go up
(20:48):
a level to power five basketball. It's not pretty, So
you know you're leaning on Jeremy Fears and Cohen car
to carry water there. Respectfully, if those guys are fourth
and fifth on your team, I think you can win
the league. If they're first and second on your team,
I don't think your offense is going to be very good.
So to me, it's almost a bump up for Izzo
respect wise to have them here. Other people won't like that,
(21:12):
but to me, if it was coached by anyone else,
this roster would probably be in my bubble category. And
then lastly, Illinois, this is the one team I'm lower
on than consensus. I would say another one for me
where I think they're over correcting a little bit to
the youth experiment last year where Yakashonas and Riley I
(21:35):
think are taking a lot of the blame for the
inconsistencies that team had, when in reality, that team could
not shoot, that team did not defend at a very
high level at times, and those were issues that guys
like Kylin Boswell and benham Rickhouse were responsible for. Now
they're back expected to be in big roles, and you
bring in some twenty two year old Serbians instead of
(21:58):
the nineteen year old line. He pick serbians. I'm not
super into a team that is going to be centered
around Tom avisag is the go to guy. I think
Maras Johnson was a huge cultural loss for them the
way Holloman was for Michigan State. And uh, for me,
it's a sign of respect to Brad Underwood and Tom
Izzo to have them firmly in this tier as is.
(22:18):
But I don't see a world where those teams compete
for the big ten crown. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
I agree with you one hundred percent on Michigan State.
If if you just look at the roster of the
seven teams that kind of you can have in these
top two tiers, I think they clearly have the worst
roster of the seven. I don't.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
You know.
Speaker 1 (22:37):
I understand the idea behind Izzo not wanting to go
portal heavy, but at some point you have to embrace
kind of what the system is at this point, and
I don't think he's fully done that. I agret I
didn't like the offseason that they had, and well, I
do think Fears and car and Kohler could be a
solid trio to build around. I don't see a star group,
(23:00):
so I think, like I think the best case scenario
is they're a solid and CAA tournament team. But I
also do think they could have their fair share of
struggles and then potentially be a bubble team. So it'll
be interesting to see how that works out. Illinois, I
don't know what to make because I, you know, I
don't know any of the players other than watching scouting
video of two or three minutes that they brought in
(23:22):
to know enough about how those guys are going to translate.
They kind of obviously had a ton of talent last year,
and you know, at one point in the season I
looked at him and thought, you know, this could be
a team that makes it a really deep run. And
then they get destroyed by what was a duke in
that non conference game late in the season. It's like,
you know, they're just kind of all over the place
that they didn't defend well enough. I don't know that
(23:45):
those issues are going to be fixed at all. So
I agree with you on all of those teams. So
I'm guessing your top three just by process of elimination.
Here we've got Michigan purduing UCLA, and that tier yeah,
that's a you must love what UCLA did in the offseason.
Speaker 2 (24:03):
I do, I really do. I think I am probably
one of the highest on UCLA Big Ten fans or
whatever you want to call me that I've seen. So
I really think it depends on how you view last
season for UCLA, what you believe their upside is this season.
I thought they were pretty awesome last year, and that
(24:26):
is not the consensus here, and I get it. But
finished twentieth in Ken Palm twenty three and eleven. The
disaster stretch for that team was a four game losing
streak that included three trips East Coast, where they went
to Nebraska, Maryland, and Rutgers, all in the same ten
day span in which the Los Angeles wildfires broke out.
(24:50):
I don't know how you can hold that against them.
And I understand that Mick Cronin is kind of this
curmudgeon guy that's easy to hate. I'm certainly not a
mc cronan guy either, and he said some crazy things
as they went through that span. But I mean, before
that tragedy occurred, this was a team that got to
(25:10):
win against Arizona, a win against Gonzaga in the non
conference and when on an eight game win streak in
Big Ten play after they kind of got their feet
underneath them again. So to me, I did not like
their roster last year, largely because I hated their guards.
I just never wanted to believe in Dylan Andrews and
(25:33):
Sebastian Mack as a duo. To me, they have maybe
the most clean we fixed this problem spot in the
entire country. Donovan Dent is one of the best point
guards in the nation. He's electric. He's a guy who
can carry a team to wins. And there are some
stylistic questions on how it's gonna mesh with, you know,
(25:53):
the way McK cronan wants to play. But I just
think that mc cronin is a guy who has built
team around offensive engine types. You think back to the
High may Hawk as years, Johnny Juzang years. Even He's
gonna be able to win games with how good of
a defensive coach he is when you have an offensive
superstar like Dent. I know there are some people who
(26:15):
believe the front court still has issues, and Tyler Billadout
is certainly not a great defender. I don't think Xavier
Booker is gonna be an impact player on this team
at all. That's not part of my pitch on UCLA.
But I don't think they need him to be really truly.
I think they can win games going small with Tyler
billet out and Eric Day manning the four and five,
(26:36):
and the upgrade of the guard spot is enough to
take them from twentieth in the country into really the
top ten in the country for me.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
And then your top two. How do you kind of
make rank these two teams? I mean, I think most
people would say Purdue the favor in the preseason, but
I look at Bart Torvik. I think right now he's
got Michigan ahead. So is it close between these two?
Are are you going with Purdue over Michigan?
Speaker 2 (27:00):
It's not close for me now. Just ranking upside, I
think you can argue Michigan's upside is top five in
the country good. But I also think Michigan is the
most volatile team out of the entire top seven here,
And as a Michigan fan, I say that, but I'm
perfectly comfortable saying it. Yax Se Lendeborg's amazing. I think
(27:21):
him in the Danny Wolf role again, kind of like
Dent at UCLA, I think it's one of those things
that is just a perfect fit and a huge, honestly upgrade.
As crazy as that sounds, Danny at times, I think
they had to play through him more than they wanted
to because of the limitations they had at Point Guard.
I don't think there's going to be many moments this
(27:42):
year where you're feeling forced to get the ball to
Yaxe Lendeborg and letting him inflict pain on an opponent.
I am not an Adaimara believer. I am not an
Elliott Cado believer. And if you want to buy the
Michigan upside pitch, you have to buy both of those guys,
not one of those guys. I understand the reasons to
(28:03):
believe in them. I think Mara's in a system defensively
that will work with the things he does well and
hide the things he does poorly. I think you could
argue the same with Cadeo. Dusty May is a great
guards coach and a very fun system to play in,
But at the same time, Cado's turnover issues are not
going to be helped by the freedom that a Dusty
may offense brings, and they really don't have much of
(28:27):
an insurance plan. To me, the thing you can nitpick
about Michigan is that if Cadeau does not take a leap,
you don't have an alternative. They really don't have a
backup point guard they're going to turn to other than
getting creative and having Yakxel be this jumbo power point forward.
So for me, there are people who believe in Caddo.
(28:48):
If you believe in Caddell, you should have Michigan very
close to Purdue. I'm not one of those people. I
just really was disgusted by his development at North Carolina
and the way the brand of basketball he plays to
be honest with you, So they're so deep. I mean,
Trey mckenney's a stud who would start on most of
these teams. He's Michigan's eighth or ninth guy coming into
the season, and I think Dusty May has a pretty
(29:09):
high floor with how he's coaching right now. So to
me comfortable too. For Michigan, Perdue is just Perdue. And
if I want to play skeptical devil's advocate to this team,
I would point out that it was their defense, their rebounding,
their lack of im protection last year that had this
team in a spot to finish tied for fifth in
(29:30):
the league with no banners and no deep march run.
And as good as some of the additions they've made are,
they didn't address the biggest problems from last year's season.
Omer Meyer and Oscar Kluffer are not going to fix
this team defensively, and if those are the best five
in between Fletcher Lawier, Braden Smith, and Trey Kauffman Rehn,
(29:51):
I think we'll basically just see a souped up version
of what last year's team was. So you know, that
team was between fifteen and twentieth n nationally. I expect
this team to be one of the best two or
three teams in the country. That's my expectation for Purdue,
but I think it's gonna be largely because they have
the best offense in the sport and smart teams that
(30:12):
are well built to exploit some of those weaknesses. I
think we'll still be able to get to Purdue, but yeah,
to me, they're in a tier of their own. Is
the only favorite in this league.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Last thing before we get you out of here, is
is this a year that you could see the national
championship drought ending for the Big Ten? I feel like
we have this conversation every year. It's been since two thousand,
which is crazy to think about it. I mean, the
longer this goes on, it's like, you know, I know
there's a lot of luck and chance in terms of
the NCAA tournament, but at some point you feel like
(30:43):
the Big ten is going to have to break through, right,
you would.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Think at some point for sure, I think if you're
playing that game, it has to be Purdue that you're
banking on. I really would be stunned if anyone outside
of Matt Painters group does this. I will say, if
we're going through the last twenty years and trying to
pick out individual teams or spots where we're like that
was our best chance as a league, this is a
(31:06):
pretty good one because the top of the sport, to me,
is a little more wide open than it's been. Oddly enough,
I think the transfer portal nil era has Weirdly, it
hasn't created parody to the mid major level, but it
has created some parody within the elite teams because everybody's
spending money. Now it's not just three or four schools
that are so I think, you know, they're the favorite
(31:29):
on paper, the Final four is in the home state,
and in a lot of ways, when you have a
National Player of the Year candidate, another All American with him,
three guys that started in a national championship game two
years ago, it's fair to say this should be the year.
It's probably going to be Matt Paynter's best shot at it.
There are reasons you can pick holes in it as well,
but right now they're my national title pick Alex. As
(31:52):
much as that probably pains your Indiana listeners to hear.
Speaker 1 (31:55):
Hey, you know what, the Big Ten's got to get
a championship at some point, so well, Indiana fans will
hope it did somebody else, but I agree with you
in the preseason. If you're going to pick a Big
Ten team, it's got to be produe. Greg, thank you
as always for being gracious with your time. Coming on
the show brought a ton of I mean we went
through what eighteen Big Ten teams in just a little
(32:15):
bit over a half hours, so that's a quick way
to do it. I really appreciate the time. And for
those who haven't checked Greg and Carter's workout, check them
out on social media, YouTube, sleepers media. You guys are
putting out stuff every day, you do any football stuff
as well.
Speaker 2 (32:29):
We lean a little bit into football. We did more
last year, but we're still don't worry. We got our
eyes on Signetty at all times.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Okay, all right, Thanks everybody as always for listening, Thanks
Greg for coming on the show, and we'll be back
soon with another episode of Podcast on the Break.
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