Chicago Indepenent Pro Wrestler "Generational Treasure" Shaq Jordan PWE Report Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Well, Sean lying here with the p w E Report,
and one of our guests coming on the show this
week will be Shack Jordan. We're having him one for
the first time, and of course make sure to check
out Rocket Pro Wrestling. You'll be facing Gunna Brave in
a no holds bar match. This is a loser leaves

(00:22):
Rocket Pro Wrestling as a stipulation at keep Its Carnage
this Saturday, Joliet, Illinois. And we know him from as
a freelance wrestling and graduate. And also he's been professional
wrestler for Russell League, Squirts, Circle Megastars, Frontline Pro and more.
And I think you're also a student of Chris Shogun,

(00:44):
right Logan, Yes, yep, yep, Okay, all right, awesome, We
can't we can't leave him out, you.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
Know, absolutely absolutely, And so yeah, Shak.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
We welcome you on the show. I hope you're doing
very well.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
I'm great man like I'm great man, like I told
you when I when I risually picked up, getting a
little getting over a little bit of a cold, waiting
for my voice to come back. I'm at about ninety
eight percent. But I'm good.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
I'm good, Okay, glad to hear that, Well, I think
that you're going to be ready, of course for this
upcoming match, right, because this is gonna be your first
match in the month of February.

Speaker 2 (01:21):
Oh, yes, I'm excited. I'm excited. I'm I've been, I've been.
I've been waiting for this match ever since. So I
don't think anybody knows. I don't think anybody knows this,
but I haven't wrestled at Rocket Pro since October, right, Yeah?
So yeah, So the entire time I've been out, I
have been training, wrestling, hitting the waits, you know, chomping

(01:45):
at the bitch. So I'm excited for this one.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah. And I think that was their annual Halloween show
back in October. Yep, who did you wrestle on that show?

Speaker 2 (01:55):
Man? I honestly, I don't even remember. It might have
been September the last time I wrestled. I'm not I'm
not even I'm not even because I know the last
time I wrestled. I wrestled twice in one night. I
wrestled in the I wrestled Sam Knight later on in
the night for a opportunity to be in the Rocket
to the Top Briefcase match, which gonna break screwed me
out of might, I add, and then we wrestled earlier

(02:18):
on in the in the beginning in the rumble for
the Zero Gravity Championship, which I lost, got eliminated by Gunner,
but came back out eliminated him. So you know, even Stevens,
you know.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
For sure Gunner have got this rivalry. That's just brewerying.
It's it's bringing a lot of attention, a lot of
eyes to Rocket Pro Wrestling. And how did you feel
like when this match was announced, Like your mattress, We're
Gonna break was first and foremost. It's like the main
match on the poster, if not the only match, it's
on the main poster, right.

Speaker 2 (02:52):
Yep, yep, froend center man, me and him.

Speaker 1 (02:55):
That's crazy. Did you ever think you'd have that much
attention on your match?

Speaker 2 (03:00):
Right? Absolutely? Absolutely, because from the very first day that
I turned my back on them, as people like to say,
I personally don't think I turned my back on them.
I just think I personally think I opened my eyes
for one. But you know, I'm gonna let I'm gonna
let people think what they want to think. Uh, From

(03:20):
the first day I did that everybody's been excited about,
Oh snap, what's next for Shaq Jordan like Shack showing
some attitude and Shock showing some aggression. And I don't
know if I like this new shack. This isn't a
new shack. This is a shock that I've always been,
the shock that everyone knows is a caricature, but the

(03:41):
real meat is the meat that they're seeing now. I
don't tolerate bs. I don't like. I don't like, and
I damn sure don't like being called anybody's sidekick because
leading up to what I did, when leading up to
what I did to Gunner Break, I was I was
pretty much his sidekickslash bodyguard for like the entire season.
I didn't. I don't like that. I'm my own man.

(04:04):
I don't write nobody's coattails. I'm doing my thing. And
if Gunner Brave is the person that's got to feel
the brun of it, and so be it. You know. Yeah,
but I but I digress back to what I was saying.
Everybody's been talking to everybody's been wondering what my next
move is gonna be. I never tell anyone my next move.

(04:27):
And yeah, so every chance I got I just been
coming in kick gunner Graves, kick gunner Braves. But get
paid if I get paid, if I to show up,
because that's how I do. I just get paid to
show up now and then I leave. So they're gonna
have to bring they they had to bring out the

(04:47):
big bucks for this match, and they were able to
do it. So here here I am.

Speaker 1 (04:52):
Yes, And we were just talking about this before. You
have never competed in a street fight, you said, the
closest thing was allowed match.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, never could never, never competed in the street fight before.
Never never had an opportunity to put myself in that
kind of danger, you know. So I'm I'm I'm ready
for it.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
So are you looking at anything for inspiration? Are you
checking out any kind of street matches, death matches, anything
from that?

Speaker 2 (05:19):
Rong? Man? Oh man, you are you? You already know? Man?
I got my I got my list of the street
fights that I'm checking out. Uh, you know, Triple H,
Triple Ah, Cactus Jack, Royal Rumble, Sean michaels In Triple
H at uh Summer Slam, stuff like that, you know,
just to just to just to get just to get
a gauge on what to expect and how how aggressive

(05:44):
I'm how aggressive I need to be. Trust I know
how aggressive I need to be. But just to see
if like the person I'm into gonna be in a
ring with with it in this case, is gonna breave
can handle the aggression that I'm that I'm prepared to bring.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
You know, right, He's been some crazy matches on his end.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
Oh yeah, absolutely so, yeah, definitely he can take a beating,
now give him that.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Yes, yeah, he had a match of Rocket Pro. I
believe if I forget who it was, it was one
of those kind of crazy matches though.

Speaker 2 (06:16):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he's good for those.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
Yeah, I Thinkna Hopkins was in one of the matches.
Oh no, you know it was Brooks Berner. Brooks Berners,
Yeah he was. He was in one of those crazy
matches as well. Yeah, I think with Christian Rose, I
think that's what I'm thinking of Rocket Pro. But I
know Gunna Braves has been in some of those matches,
So all be excited. I'm sure you're watching a couple

(06:41):
of his matches and see what you can do to
really expose him.

Speaker 2 (06:45):
Oh absolutely absolutely, I got I got my strategy in
mind already We're good. We're good. I'm prepared.

Speaker 1 (06:52):
All right, Well, let's put things up. I just wanted
to talk to you about being a professional wrestler. How
does it changed your life for the better? I think
you've been in the business since what year about it?
Since the pandemic?

Speaker 2 (07:03):
Right now, since twenty eighteen.

Speaker 1 (07:06):
Twenty eighteen.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
Okay, yeah, I had, I had my I had my
first match six months into my career. Yep.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Okay, So talk about how it's changed your life for
the better.

Speaker 2 (07:16):
Uh, it's gonna get gonna it's gonna get a little
happy around here. I ain't gonna lie tell you. But
I don't know if you've seen the Steve Errans Steve
Erran's podcast that he has over there Rocket Pro. But
I talked a lot about like how wrestler helped me
get through the death of my wife and everything. So yeah,

(07:38):
when when my wife was when my wife was diagnosed
with like brain cancer or whatever, I took a little
bit of a break. I was honestly thinking about quitting
because it's like, Okay, wrestling's gonna be here when I come.
Wrestling's gonna be here if I ever decide to come back.
My wife needs me. But and she got to a

(08:00):
point where she was getting a little better and she
could get out of bed and move herself around the
house a little bit more. She gave me her blessing
to start wrestling again. So that's what I did, got
back to training because I was out for I was
out for about four or five maybe six months, uh
after her after her diagnosis, like I dipped my toe

(08:21):
in every now and again, go back to training, maybe
have a one maybe, have like one match here or there,
like a quick little like squash match or something here
or there, get buried or whatever, and then right after
the show, leave, go back home, get back to taking
care of canvas. And so six months saying, I think, yes,

(08:42):
she she was diagnosed with cancer, like literally the week
after my first match. Yeah, because she couldn't attend said
match because she wasn't feeling well. You know, at this point,
she had lost the feeling because the tumor developed on
the right side of her brain, right, so that took
all the feeling out of her life side of her body.
So yeah, by this time, she had lost the uh,

(09:06):
she had lost the feeling in her left arm and everything.
And yeah, so after my first match, I'm okay, cool,
I need to take a breakaway. My wife just my
wife just got diagnosed with cancer. So I'm gonna go away,
take care of her for a little bit, and if
I decide to come back, I'll be back. But if not,

(09:26):
then it's been real. But after everything got better, after
everything well looked like it was getting better and she
was able to take care of herself a little bit more.
She said, Yo, wrestling is what you Wrestling is what
you love to do. Wrestling is keeping you from being depressed.
Wrestling is what I want. I want you to be happy.

(09:46):
So if wrestling makes you happy, then go back to training.
Try to have matches stuff like that. I'll attend if
I can. If I can't, then that's cool too. We'll
watch it on YouTube or something, and uh yeah, So
that's that's where it's from there. I took another couple
months off after she passed away, because she passed away
in July of twenty nineteen. So I took another couple

(10:08):
months off after that. Got back to it like right
after that because this thing was this was what I needed.
Like when she passed away, it was like, yeah, I
got family and everything, but family can only do so much.
I need something to take my mind off of what
I'm going through. Yes, and yeah, wrestling. Wrestling was that
thing for me. Wrestling's been that thing for me ever since.

(10:31):
And I lost passion for it because at first I
was doing it because and this is actually what I
told to Ma Sool Champa at a at a tryout.
I hadn't even a try out a month after my
wife passed away, and the Masso Tampa asked me like,
why are you Why do you? Why do you wrestle?

(10:53):
And at first my honest answer was, well my wife.
I told him. This is what I told him. My
wife passed that the way a month ago, and what
I told her was I wouldn't let her death consume me,
and I keep doing what I want to do. So
I'm here because I made a promise to her. I
wasn't saying I was here because I loved wrestling. I

(11:15):
wasn't saying because I wanted to go to WW or
anything like that. At that point. It was because, Hey,
I made a promise to my wife, and even though
deep down I guess I don't want to be here,
I told her i'd be here. So here I am
right and then after a while, and then it took
it took a long time. It took a long time
and a lot of like mental health work and a
lot of therapy and it. But it eventually got to

(11:36):
a point where I was like, okay, where I went
from Okay, I'm only here because I told my wife
I wouldn't quit wrestling to I'm here because I love
wrestling and I want to This is this is all
I wanted. This is what I want to do, and
I'm here doing it and I'm happy with doing it again,
you know. So yeah, I said, I started feeling that

(11:57):
way literally maybe about two years ago. Okay, so yeah,
it's it took it took a while for me to
get that passion back that uh that I had when
I first got in you know. And yeah, but I'm
I'm back there when I'm happy to be back there,
you know for sure.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
Sorry to hear about that, but it seems like you,
uh you had you had the ability to move past
and and and really uh started your career.

Speaker 2 (12:24):
Yeah, absolutely absolutely.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
I'm sure she's proud of you in heaven.

Speaker 2 (12:28):
I hope. So, man, I'm doing the best I can, brother.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
Yeah, I hope. So, yes, and Uh, you know talk
about also being this uh being part of the freelance
wrestling Uh, being a graduate of the academy. How is
that open doors for you in the business as opposed
to when you started out and uh you kind of
were just making your name.

Speaker 2 (12:52):
Oh dude, being in freelance has helped me a lot. Uh.
I got an enroll too. I got an enroll to
w w E through freelance, which I'll forever be grateful for.
I would say, like, see when I first when I
first heard, when I first told Showgun that I wanted

(13:15):
to go to freelance because I was like, I personally
felt like I got to a point where at the
rest of League Academy I had gotten all I could
out of that place, and there was no disrespect to them.
I just felt like I was ready for something new.
And Showgun, being a father figure that he is, when

(13:37):
I told him, he was nothing but accepting for it.
He was, yeah, yeah, dude, go do it. I encourage
you like you should have been there a long time ago, honestly,
so yeah. So, but yeah, from the very first day
I came into freelance, like everybody's been, everybody's made me
feel like welcome a part of the family. Isaiah's kylie Gpa.

(14:00):
They all made me feel like one of I've always like,
they made feel like I've always been one of them,
you know, and like yeah, and that's the and that's
the kind of environment I strive to be around because
when you're around that environment and they bring that energy,
you put that energy back out and then it's a
it's a it's a circle. It's a circle of good vibrations,
you know, and everybody's happy and things flow perfectly. And yeah,

(14:24):
but it's it's been it's been a real nice experience.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
Yeah. And I know they do some kind of seminars, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:31):
Yeah, absolutely, Yeah, Yeah that that gave the Posty seminar
man changed my life. Like it's it's like just one
seminar freelance like changed every changed everything for me over
the course of like a month. And like, yeah, it's
been and it's been like nothing but up from me
ever since then, because like I got a good report
with gave some Posty. Now every now and again, I'll

(14:52):
send them matches and I'll send them like promo promo
pictures and stuff, and he'll email me like can you
be here and can you be here and can you
be here on this eight? Yeah? And so yeah, it's been,
it's been, it's been. It's been blowing. It's been a
mind blow, man, Like I'm yeah, like getting the like, Okay,

(15:12):
So I was backstage on the last row before WrestleMania, right,
and it was so surreal to me because it's like
I'm backstage, like I don't want to and I don't
want to sound like a I don't want to sound
like a Mark or anything. But it's like I'm walking backstage,

(15:33):
Cody Rose is practicing his promo in Rial Ripley is
running and Real Ripley is walking around them, having an
anxiety attack because she can't remember a certain part of
her promo. And Becky Lynch walking by, and Seth Rollins
is walking by him. The Rock walks by, and I'm like,
if it felt like a dream, dude, I was like, bro,
I was watching these people on TV like last year.

(15:56):
I was, I was watching these people on TV two
months ago actually, and now here I am backstage working
side by side with him.

Speaker 1 (16:04):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 2 (16:06):
Like it was it was it was nuts, man, Like,
it was just something like I had to I had
to wrap my head around and keep myself from getting
emotional about because it was like I was bullied for
like in wrestling as a kid, because like wrestling was
like that fake, that fake sport. Everybody else was all
off into football and basketball and stuff like that. And

(16:28):
I don't want to sound like an asshole or anything. Sorry,
I don't know if I use that language on the podcast,
but I don't want to sound like an asshole or nothing.
But the kids that bullied me, they idolized, like people
like Tracy McGrady and Alan Iverson and Kobe Bryant like
I had, like I had The Rock, and I had

(16:48):
Randy Jordon, and I had Triple H. Y'all, y'all, y'all
ain't never met y'all, ain't never met Tracy McGrady or
Kobe Bryant or Alan Iverson. Guess what I'm doing. I'm
stage with Randy Orton Triple H in the Rock. You know,
I'm I'm I'm in a profession where I'm meeting my heroes.
And that's that's been and that's what being a good

(17:11):
person is, sticking to what I love got from me,
you know, sure, And it was it blew my mind, dude,
Like I couldn't. I could. I just couldn't believe it.
Like I was just waiting to like I was just
waiting to wake up, you know, and like now it's
it's a dream and I'm still in bed and everything,
but it's like, nah, man, I'm really backstage with these
people that I idolize and I watch on TV, you know,

(17:33):
and they living and breathing and their human beings just
like me. It's it's it was wild, I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
And you're just mentioned a few names right there. So yeah, yeah,
I've done a lot in the in the industry.

Speaker 2 (17:49):
Yep, yep.

Speaker 1 (17:51):
Who is the most star struck you were to see?

Speaker 2 (17:54):
William William Rigo easily, really William Rego definitely, because they
put they put William Rigel in charge of the extras
that day. So we are all sitting at the table
waiting for a direction, and Rigo just comes down and
sits with us and essentially has a two hour seminar

(18:16):
with us, just talking, just talking about wrestling, just sitting
in catering for like two hours talking about wrestling. And
when we just soaking this thing in, I'm like Storm
Gracing is sitting with me and Kylie Ray is sitting
across the table from me, and I'm just it's like, dude,
we are right here. We're back here talking to We're
back here talking to William River right now. This dude

(18:38):
got like thirty thirty five years of knowledge of wrestling.
He's just giving us game for free. Man. Yeah, I couldn't.
I couldn't believe it. I shook his hand and he
told me to call him Darren. I was like, no,
you are not Darren. You are William Regal to me,
that's all I know you as. That's all I'm gonna
call you.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
Wow. Yeah, that's incredible, it really is.

Speaker 2 (19:03):
And I was at.

Speaker 1 (19:06):
No, No, I was.

Speaker 2 (19:07):
I was about to say, see him. Punk remembered me
from a random encounter on the streets in Chicago, which blew,
which blew my mind. Yeah. I was like, I don't
know if you remember me, but I ran into you
in like wicker Park like seven years ago, and he
was like, were you the kid that was asking me

(19:27):
questions about like what to expect about being a wrestler
and everything. I was like, yeah, that was me. He
was like, oh, yeah, I remember you. He was like, yeah,
we we chopped we chopped it up. About that that
was and that blew my mind because I was like, dude,
I didn't I didn't even think he would remember me
because I just bought it. I just brought it up
and he just yeah, yeah, I remember you. Yeah, absolutely,

(19:48):
how you been doing. It's good to see you here.
It was nice.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
That is that's that's awesome. And when you go to training,
uh talk about you who we work with? You said,
Kylie Ray is one of your trainers, and you know,
does she have any advice for you for your upcoming match?
He's done some kind of street fights and she's mingling
that stuff before.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
I will be one hundred percent honest with you, I
haven't been asking Kylie any questions about street fighting. It's
all been Isaiah's. Yeah, because I was I was just asking,
like Isaiah's these random questions about like psychology and what
to uh go into the crowd and everything once like

(20:38):
at what at what point do you know? Like how
do you like?

Speaker 1 (20:41):
What?

Speaker 2 (20:41):
What do you like? How do you know when you
got the crowd like during the street fight. Stuff, Just
just just stuff like that, and he's been Yeah, he's
given me a lot of he gave me a lot
of game about that which I which I hope to
remember for which I hope to remember from upcoming match.
But yeah, like those two between Isaiah's and Kylie Ray,

(21:04):
they've been giving me like a wealth of knowledge like
all the time, and I'm very I'm very happy about that.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
Well, yeah, I can't wait to see what you have
in store. And Isaiah's Blast of course, he's been on
a lot of matches too.

Speaker 2 (21:21):
Yeah, yeah, he'd been Yeah, he's been around the block
a few times. Man.

Speaker 1 (21:23):
Yes, yes, Now when you wrestled at Freelance Wrestling in
the Aporium, it was I mean November twenty twenty three
scramble match. Talk about that experience. Was that your debut
for Freelance Overall or yes?

Speaker 2 (21:38):
That was that was That was my first That was
my first ever match with Freelance. Okay, I didn't even
know I was having that match until about an hour
before the show. Wow, Because I'm pretty sure Kazam McKenzie
was supposed to wrestle Isaiah's.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
Right, Yes, she was supposed to be one on one, Yes, and.

Speaker 2 (22:01):
She got sick. Yeah, So Isaiah's had the So Isaiah's
pulled one person from Isaiah's pulled one person from the
from the scramble match. It was originally supposed to be
in the scramble man that was that was Robbie Reeves.
Yeah yeah, because Isaiah's came up to me and asked me, like,
do you have gear? And I was like yeah. I

(22:21):
was like yeah, woy, what's up? And he was like,
Scout's not going to be here tonight. I need you.
I need you on the show and he was And
then I was like, oh, you want me to wrestle you.
I got excited. I got too excited. He was like,
you want to wrestle you? He was like, no, no, no, no,
I'm wrestling. No, I'm I'm I'm put I'm pulling DJ
from the I'm pulling the RG from the scramble match,

(22:41):
and I want you. I want you to be in
the scramble. I was like, oh snap, hell yeah, let's go.
So yeah, I spent I spent like two hours like
working it, working myself, working myself into that match. Nervous
as hell because it's like this is freelance, Like I've
been a fan of this since twenty eighteen, and here

(23:03):
I am about to have my first match unexpectedly, might
not add so I don't know. I don't. I was like, all,
I have my tights and my kick pass. I don't
have my jacket, my full entrance guard with the glass. Well,
I had the glasses, but I don't have my glove. Yeah,
I don't have my leather jacket. All I brought was
my tights and my kick pass, like on the off
chance I might get booked, you know, but yeah, it

(23:26):
got got booked in I have my Wu Tang. I
have my Wu Tang crop top. Yeah, but it was
fun man Like every time I like got nervous, I
would look too like I would look to Dan Perch.
Actually because Dan Perch kept me calm throughout that entire match.
Damn Perch, yep, Damn Perch. And actually Chico Suave helped

(23:46):
helped get me through it too, and because they because
they both knew how nervous I was. Because when I
when I was before the show started, I talked. I
talked to Perch all the time because Perch is one
of the most like underrated mind that I've ever met
and wrestling so far, and he and he knows a
lot more. He knows like a hundred times more than

(24:07):
people think he knows, so I go to Perch and
I asked purchase. I ask Percha a bunch of questions.
I hope I didn't drive him too crazy with as
many questions as I asked him. And then when I
got to the ring and he was checking me, checking
my my gear and everything for weapons and you know,
like rest due. He was like, you got this, you
worked hard, Just relax, have fun. I was like, all right, cool,

(24:28):
cool cool. And me and Chico, while me and Chico
are battling the ring, he's helping me get through it too,
because he sees how nervous I am. So he's talking
to me while we're doing moves with each other. And yeah,
so every pretty much everybody in that match just was
just like, uh, just brought the energy that I needed
to help me get through it, you know. And yeah,

(24:50):
and I was happy for that.

Speaker 1 (24:52):
But that's good. And do you remember who won the match?

Speaker 2 (24:56):
Yeah, she con pinned me. Oh yeah, yep, hit me
with that big angle slam man.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Yeah. And then there was this big thing that happened afterwards,
I believe, right with the mask man came out and attacked.

Speaker 2 (25:11):
Yeah. Yeah, I was like, yo, that's not my fight.

Speaker 1 (25:17):
Yeah, we found out who it was. It was Frank
Frank Yeah, yeah, that.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
Was making everybody life a living hell man, just like
he always.

Speaker 1 (25:26):
Do, yes for sure, and so uh that would have
to be one of the most exciting, uh matches, Like
you couldn't invite friends and family last minute to come,
so it.

Speaker 2 (25:39):
Was just yeah, right, well I had I had a
couple of friends. I had a couple of friends in
the crowd, but they just they didn't come to see me.
They were just they just like freelance regulars. They just
happened to be there, like, oh, snap, you wrestling tonight.
And I was like, yeah, I guess I am now glad,
I'm glad I came now.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
Yeah. Yeah, they didn't know until you came.

Speaker 2 (26:02):
To the current, until I came through the current.

Speaker 1 (26:03):
Yep, yeah, that's that's that's awesome man, that's that's really
cool for sure. And that's why not how you envisioned
your your debut but for freelance.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
But it was nah, man Abes, I honestly didn't envision
my debut for freelance, honestly, like more months down, okay,
because because at first I'm not even gonna I'm not
even gonna lie to you I thought it was like

(26:35):
more of a hierarchy thing, like, yeah, you're a good wrestler,
but there are people there who have been training longer
that are just as good as you, so they're gonna
get on first. Don't get your hopes up.

Speaker 1 (26:46):
You know, right.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
But like Isaiah's and Isaiah's and them, they see something.
They see something in me that I didn't even did.
I didn't even see in myself at first. But thankfully
they kept, you know, chipping away and chipping away at
me until like I got my confidence up a little
bit more. And it took me a little It took me.
It took me a couple of manchs with freelance in

(27:10):
order to see that like, okay, cool, maybe I'm maybe
I'm good, Maybe I'm good enough to maybe I'm good
enough to learn this system and thriving this system. But yeah,
they they saw they saw what I didn't see for
some reason, because I just didn't think I was getting
the concept because I'm I'm learning the old school I'm
I come from. I spent the entire first six years

(27:31):
of my career learning the old school like meet the potatoes,
n WA type style, and freelance is more of the
new school style. Fast paced yeah, with the psychology, but
it's still fast paced wrestling, you know. And I just
did honestly didn't think at first that I was getting
the concept. And I was like, dude, I'm I'm I'm

(27:52):
never gonna debut here. Like if it's not me not
if it's me not learning how to do the moves,
then it's me not grasping the idea of the psyche
cology behind the moves, you know. So it's like I'm not.
I don't. I just don't think I'm getting it. I
don't know what it is. I just don't. I'm just
not confident in myself right now. And yeah, Isaiah's pretty

(28:13):
much told me, yeah, we think you, we think you ready, man,
so go out there and show us what you can do.
Like it's he pretty he pretty much put me on
the show and said like, dud sink a swim man,
this show, this show, this your this's your debut match
single swim dude. Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 (28:30):
I also want to talk about another big debut you
had it cs W.

Speaker 2 (28:34):
You were in the.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
Future Royale. Now, there was a stipulation for this month
for for for last month by Royale the winner would
gain opportunity to compete in the scramble match later that night.
And uh, you see is that opportunity? So like, did
anybody expect you to show up? Yes, w I know this,

(28:58):
there's Battle Royals and that and now ahead of time.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
So a few people, a few people got me to
a few people convinced me to show up. Okay, I
didn't honestly didn't expect to get booked. I just went
there to meet people. You know, it's a new environment. Hey,
I'm shack.

Speaker 1 (29:18):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (29:19):
I'm gonna try to help out as much as I
can from that on, unless the show is obviously on
the day where I'm booked, then then then I can't.
I can't come obviously, but I'm gonna try to show
up here from now on just to help out and
see what's and see what's good. And yeah, they just
told me, hey, we need more hands in the scrambles,
so do you have gear? It was pretty much the

(29:41):
same thing. It was pretty much the same concept as
my Freelancer, as my Freelance debut. Yeah, so yeah it
was so yeah, it was wild. But but luckily this
time I'm a little I was a little more confident
and I knew and I was a little bit more
comfortable with the people I was in the ring with, so.

Speaker 1 (29:58):
Definitely, and then you got the face off in the
scramble against wrestlers you hadn't been the ring with yet.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
Right, right, right, it was It was fun.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
Man was in there, yes, yes, Russ Hamilton.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
Was Rs Hamilton, Joey Pearson, Eric Schultz, who I'm very
familiar with. Yeah, we wrestled at Rocket Pro like a
thousand times against each other. Joey Pearson, who is new.
It was a Joey Pearson who was what's his name's brother,
which Robbie Reeves brother. They look exactly alike. It's so

(30:35):
it's so odd, but yeah, yeah, it was. It was.
It was a good time, man.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
Yeah, yeah, for sure. And you got to see so
many surprises in the show later on. But that's cool
and so hopefully you'll be back at TSW. They are
one of the uh, you know, top promotions besides freelance,
and yeah, glad you got the opportunity to be there
and and even have your debut match there. That's crazy.

Speaker 2 (31:01):
Yeah, same same. Didn't even didn't even go there expecting
to get booked and walked out with a book and
I didn't. It was wild.

Speaker 1 (31:08):
Wow, Wow, that's that's great, and not only you know,
and then also how did you overcome that the ropes
during the match, during the Battle Royal got broken? That's crazy, right?
Did you ever have to do it?

Speaker 2 (31:22):
Yes? I know. I honestly thought that was how the
match was structured, honestly because I'm like, wait, yes, because
like I've been a part of like some promotions that
do unorthodox stuff, like they have matches, but they put
their own little twist on it to make it different,
you know, so like okay, cool, we can't okay cool.

(31:44):
So we're having a Battle Royal where there's no ropes.
That's different. God, I didn't ask anybody. If I didn't
ask anybody if that's the way, if that's if the
ropes were broken. You know, I just assumed by the
time I had gotten out there, the ropes were already gone.
So I was like like, oh, okay, this is new,
totally totally gotta totally gotta adjust around this. But I

(32:06):
can do it, you know. But yeah, it threw me.
It threw me. It threw me off real big when
I got out there, because I was I was like, wow.
I was so confused. I was like, wait did this
because I was one of the people that tightened the ropes,
so so I was like, so, what's what's going on here?
And they were they were like, yeah, the ropes are

(32:27):
just going to do. So we're just going to work
around at this time. And I was like, I was like,
I was like, am I bad luck or something like
the one time I show up as a time of
rope snap? You know, like I feel I feel like
I had something to do with this.

Speaker 1 (32:40):
You know, yeah, that's the fun crowd and the fun
venue as well.

Speaker 2 (32:46):
Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah, so hopefully you'll be back there. I did want
to talk about when you did the Freelance Academy show
Run the Ropes. You had that spri Amal match, and
so how was that for you? That was the environment
than you know what we saw Freelance Logan Square and Emporium.
It was the academy and where you trained for most
of your your career there in freelance, So how how

(33:10):
was like, how was that Like did you a lot
of friends and family come through? Nah?

Speaker 2 (33:16):
I had I had a few. I had a few
friends come through because you know, like a lot a
lot of my friends and family is they're just busy people,
you know, Like a lot of them said they were
gonna come, but couldn't get the days off from work.
A lot of people said they were gonna people said
they were going to travel through but like couldn't find

(33:36):
a time or couldn't rent a car to drive out here,
which I understand, there's no hard feelings about that, But
that did not stop me from having fun with my
friends at freelance, you know, because I was in there
with nothing but my friends. Like these people have become
these people have become my friends over time. And yeah, yeah,

(33:58):
like I said, they made me feel welcome from day one.
They made me feel welcome before I even started training
the freelance because I came through shows every now and
again and helped out and like I introduced myself in
like as time. As time went on, I kept coming
to a few more shows, they started to know me,
you know, like, oh, what's up shack stuff like that.
But and then when I actually started training more, the

(34:20):
same making me feel welcome, making me feel like, making
me feel like I've been there from day one. So
I didn't I didn't let the fact that like not
a lot of my friends and family didn't show up.
I didn't allow it to distract me from the fact
that I'm out there with people that I enjoy being around.
You know for sure, at the end of the day,

(34:41):
that's what makes that's what makes for a good match.
But you can have fun and when you went there
with people you know you can have fun with. So
I had a real good time.

Speaker 1 (34:51):
That's great. I think Reagan she got the victory that night, yep,
over Trevor Outlaws.

Speaker 2 (34:58):
Oh yeah, Trevor, I'll out pitch me out of the MA.
And then she took a she took over Trevor and
beat Trevor. Yep.

Speaker 1 (35:05):
Ray Rayan is really tough and she's gain her name
out there as a late Would you ever consider like
an intergener match with her?

Speaker 2 (35:15):
Absolutely? Absolutely yeah. But the pop, the pop I got
when like, for like the one second that me and
her stare down at my debut was like it was
like Loki one of the It was like Loki, one
of the strangest pops I've ever had, because it's like one,

(35:38):
It's like one. I know these people are familiar with
ray with Reagan Lightdell, but I didn't know these people
were like familiar with me in a way. I guess
it was because I'm tall, and I'm big, and I'm
like six two and I'm two hundred and twenty five pounds.
You know. It's like you got a five foot eleven,
six foot tall woman like right here posturing up with me,
Like who is this? Who the girl think she is?

Speaker 1 (36:00):
Right? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (36:01):
So yeah, so it was. Yeah, so I and I've
been I've been a fan of Reagan from like the
first day I met her because because of just like
her energy and her charisma and on top of on
top of her size. Because it's like a lot of
like a lot of girls that hype, they feel like
they got to be big, tall, overbearing, like tough women,

(36:24):
you know, and she just goes out there. She's just
a happy She's just a happy chick who wrestles, you know,
and she's really good and she's really good at it,
and that's just something and that's just something you gotta respect,
you know.

Speaker 1 (36:36):
Definitely, I can't wait to see her. I think she's
doing the Freelance Academy show. That's yere.

Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, yeah, I'm wrestling Mason Morgan, I believe. Yeah, I
have had I haven't had a chance to wrestle him yet,
but I would love. I would love to wrestle Mason.

Speaker 1 (36:49):
Mason's on the list, Okay, cool, Yeah, he's actually gotten
some matches in the on the main card. Yeah yeah,
dev my road too and kicking it at freelance and
of course all over the country too.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
That you probably have a good match with Devon till oh.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
I feel like me and Devon would have a banger man.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
And and uh, talk about your match with Conle Hopkins
at faull Bral last year for Rocket Pro Wrestling, I
would know THEMBITS championship was on the line, And how
did you feel about that match?

Speaker 2 (37:28):
I honestly, honestly, I feel like that match was like
my breakout match at Rocket Pro because that was the
first like really long match that I got to wrestle
where I didn't share the ring with other people, because
up to that point, all my long matches at Rocket
prow were all multi man matches. I didn't get a chance.

(37:48):
I never really got a chance. I have a real, true,
like intricate one on one match, and I feel like
that match like really showcased what I was, what I
was capable of doing in that in that in that
arena to those people, and I feel like that mass
really got me over and that match really like endeared

(38:08):
me even more than I thought I could to them.
And not to mention, I ended up on bach Mania
for kicking the light out, so that that was that
was the highlight of my career too. Oh wow, Yeah,
Moon Salt is so hot that I kicked the light out?
Can you believe that?

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Wow? I saw that. That that was insane.

Speaker 2 (38:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:31):
I had to bring up that match and hopefully you
and Conor will mix it up in the future as well.

Speaker 2 (38:35):
I guess, Oh absolutely, I'm sure we will.

Speaker 1 (38:39):
Yeah, he's been doing big things the Dreamwave wrestling.

Speaker 2 (38:44):
I've been following his Dreamwave stuff. Yeah. He he a
different beast and Dreamwave. I love it.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Then you talk about your teacher versus trainer match with
Showgun Logan last fall at Russell League. How much how
much did you feel like this match, you know, not
only elevated you, but you are kind of able to
pay respects to him even though you were in the heel.
You know, obviously you didn't you didn't you didn't go
about things the right way or the honorable way.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Yeah, he'll be all right if it makes him feel
any better. Way he's watching this, I was sore. I
was sore for like the next week after that match.
He beat the excuse my excuse my language. He beat
the ship out of me in that match. Yes, yeah,
like this was mostly my fault because I didn't I

(39:37):
didn't land the right way. But I actually got legitimately
like knocked out in that match for a second.

Speaker 1 (39:43):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
Yeah he uh he he went to give me, I think,
a sky high with Delo Browno's move to sit out,
power to sit out spinebuster, and yeah, like my my
head hit the back of the mat. I was out.
I was out for like maybe five ten seconds.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
Yeah, oh wow.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
But somehow still, somehow still got through the match, still
got through the match. And so whenever I look at
that match, like I was, I was actually watching it
with my girlfriend maybe a week ago, and the first thing,
the first thing I said before I put it on,

(40:21):
I was like, all right, so I was legitimately knocked
out in this match. I want you to I want
you to see if you can tell the point where
I was actually knocked out. And she knew as soon
as she saw it because of how because of how
I was moving, she was like, that's it right there.
I can tell like because you're not moving well, like
you're trying to move, like the lights are on but
nobody's home, you know, Like but I digress. Yeah, it

(40:45):
was that that kind that match made. That match rolls
my confidence level to like a level that it can't
come down from, you know, because just like just like
Isaiah's isaiahs and kyling him over in Freelance, Showgun for
longest time has been trying to convince me that I'm

(41:06):
better than I think I am as well, and like
for the longest time, man, I just didn't see it.
I was like, yeah, I'm I'm I'm all right, but
but it's like yeah, and then Showgun is like no,
after that match, she was like, no, you're good, Like

(41:28):
you're good and you need to see that. And that's
what And from that point on, that's when I started
to like, that's when my that's where my confidence started
is like really really boost up because it was like
if I can keep if I keep up with the
man that taught me how to not only keep up
with him, but actually blow him up as well. Yeah,

(41:49):
and I was like then, I was like, I'm I'm
I'm gonna I'm gonna be okay. So like I don't
like to sound cocky, but it's like, I'm I'm finally
at that level of confidence in my off that I
don't think anything or anybody can shake me. And it
took me a long and it took me a long
time to get here. And here I'm I'm I'm fully

(42:09):
embracing it. And I got so good to think for that,
and I got my trainer is a freelancer thing for
that too.

Speaker 1 (42:16):
That's cool, man, I mean, I feel like your confidence
has been boosted because you've been You've been tested.

Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, absolutely well. I needed was them a couple of
tests to put me over the hump, Like that's that's
just what I needed.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
So back in December, Russell League had a big match
with Mustaf A Lee and we had EC three. E
C three was not able to put to make the fight.
So you're you're you're pitted up against Mustaf A Lee
a few days out right, and talk about that. When
you heard that you were going to take on Mustafa

(42:52):
a Lee. How special was that for you?

Speaker 2 (42:57):
Very very very very special. I was a I was
a bag of nerves for that entire I was a
bag of nerd for that entire like two three days
I knew I was wrestling him, and when he arrived
at the place, I want to go over the match
with him, but I want him to walk around and
do his thing too, so like I don't want to

(43:18):
irritate him, you know. So it's like, do I go
up to him and hey, you want to you want
to go over the match?

Speaker 1 (43:25):
It's just no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (43:26):
We got plenty of time, so I'm gonna just let
him come to me and do his He was. He
was very cooperative, very respectful about it. I knew I
was nervous, and helped made sure I kept my own
spirit up because it's like this is souph Ali, you know. One,
I don't want to look like an idiot. Two, I

(43:47):
don't too. I don't want to hurt him. I don't
want to mess up in the ring and naturally hurt him,
you know. But yeah, like from a wrestling standpoint, the
match was, the match was perfect. I wouldn't trade on
my end at least, I feel like I kind I
feel like he had to kind of dumb down his
skill set in order to keep in order to uh,

(44:08):
in order to stay with me. But that's just me.
I'm my own worst critic. You know. He could it
could it could be the exact it could be the
exact opposite way from his from his point of view.
But I was proud of that match, you know. And
back to the confidence thing, man like it it really

(44:28):
it really didn't want us for my confidence as well.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
That's awesome. And and you've just seeing your post name
on that picture or whatever that poster. Yeah, and this
was this this was main event too, right, yes, yes,
your main event for us the league before.

Speaker 2 (44:45):
Oh absolutely, yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:47):
Okay, so you've had a couple of main events on
your belt, but nothing that's nothing of this magnitude.

Speaker 2 (44:52):
Nothing of that magnitude before.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
Yeah, so how excited How excited were you just to
see after it came out? You know, there's video footage
of it, the whole match, And so is that also
exciting for you to like to watch back the matches?

Speaker 2 (45:06):
I hate I hate watching back my matches, but okay,
I know it's it's not it's not because like one
of them things, well, it is one of them things
where I'm my own worst credit but I'm also well
aware that at some point I'm going to have to
do it, because it's like you can't understand where you

(45:27):
need to improve unless you watch yourself, right, unless you
watch yourself mess up. And I go through every match
I wrestle, I go through it with a fine tooth cone,
and I'm just like, oh, this would have been a
good opportunity to put this here, and this would have
been a good opportunity to put and like the one
of my favorite wrestlers is Randy Savage, right, and I

(45:50):
approach I approached wrestling with the same mindset as him,
Like I'm a perfectionist, and it kills me when I
realized that I could have done something and I can't
go back to fix it, you know, right. So I'm like,
this would have been so great right here, and this
would have been good if I would have taken just
like two three seconds longer with this, and blah blah blah.

(46:11):
But it's it's one of those it's one of those
what I like to call good flaws, but it's a
flaw nonetheless, you know, Like I'm my own worst critic.
I'm too much of a perfectionist. I hate the fact
that I can't go back in time and tell myself, Hey,
you should do this instead of this, and you should
stick this right here, this will fit better right here.

(46:34):
It's yeah, I hate it. I hate it and love
it at the same time because it pushes me to
be better, but it also it also keeps me constantly
criticizing myself, you know for sure.

Speaker 1 (46:47):
And the only thing that I feel like I drew
your match, Vyballs was Jesus match. Yeah, I feel like
that got like the most of the Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:59):
Like that that caught me off guard. I did not
I legit did not know that was going to happen. Wow,
I under Santa was gonna be out there. But I
know anything about Jesus.

Speaker 1 (47:11):
And you've had matches with Quinn Winnock, you know, and
and uh yeah, he has a dangerous stable there over
in Russell League pestilent, but you've seen him now he's
gone on and then the cocaine character for other promotion,
Juggle Championship Wrestling. So because everybody gets their necks, you know,
we have a step flow who is now doing the
even flow from Yeah, yeah, you know, I know he

(47:34):
was at Rustle League as well.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
So yeah, I was silly. I'm telling Stephen Flow's first
match was against me, and I'm telling everybody I'm never
letting anybody take that away from me. Ever.

Speaker 1 (47:47):
And then what was your thought about that cocaine?

Speaker 2 (47:52):
Yeah, man, when Quinn brought it up. I'm an open
mind when it comes to wrestling, right, you know, different
shows for different four people like different things. When he
brought up cocaine to me, I was like, bro, no
fucking way, not a bad way, not a bad way,
Like that's terrible, that's gonna work, not in that way.
But I was like, dude, that is such an insane idea. Yeah,

(48:15):
but in this day and age, in the social media
age of wrestling, Like, dude, that's that ship is good.
That ship is gonna go crazy, like I already knew.
And Quinn is such a good wrestler, like psychologic like
psychology wise, Quinn like knows what to do to make
people hate him and to get people on this side.

(48:37):
So if any if there was anybody in the business
I knew that would crush it, it would have it
would have been him. And he crushed it. Man, He's
still crushing it. Couldn't be happier, couldn't be happier, like
as somebody that he was, like I think three years
in when I came in so as so as somebody
that came up with him. It was like I couldn't

(48:59):
be proud of you know, like I'm happy for them.

Speaker 1 (49:01):
Yeah, hell yeah, definitely. And really I saw you at freelance,
I believe, back in uh February Logan square right mm
hmm yeah, and then you are in a scrabble match
there as well. Yeah yeah, so hopefully we'll see your
back get there one day, hopefully.

Speaker 2 (49:20):
So man, I'm I'm still grinding, man, I'm still training. Wait,
it's it's it's a freelance is a big roster, so
I'm sure they'll find something for me eventually. But until then,
I'm a patient. I'm a patient guy. I'm not in
any resh too. I'm not any reush to get booked.
Like the I feel like personally, the longest I stay,

(49:42):
the longer time I stay not getting booked. There's more
time I could be spent learning their system a little
better and learning how to wrestle like them to to
their learn how to wrestle in psychologically adapt to their
crowd a little bit better. So by the time I
do get booked again, I'll be ready, I'll be great,
I'll be golden.

Speaker 1 (50:01):
That's a that's a good answer.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
Now, when your music hits, how do you feel going
what's the feeling going through your body before your match?

Speaker 2 (50:13):
I am a literal bag of nerves before every single match, Like,
I go through different stages of nervousness. During my match,
I go through, I go through the match going OKAYO cool,
I got it in my head. Then over time, I
keep going back and going back and going back and
going over the match with the person I'm in there with.

(50:34):
And after a while, it's like, oh, I forgot this spot.
Why am I even here? I shouldn't even be wrestling, Like, ah,
I'm gonna suck tonight. I'm gonna I'm gonna fucking I'm
gonna fucking blow the match, and everybody's gonna be mad
at me. And once my music hits, and once I
go out there, and once I'm in the ring, and
I'm like and once I'm in the ring and I see,
especially if I'm in the ring with people I trust

(50:55):
to know what they doing, I just look at them like,
let's like take like the last scramble I wrestled in
at Logan Square, for instance, Like you got August Matthews,
you got aj Z and uh you got AJZ and
ATM and and everybody else. And I'm just like, okay, okay,

(51:19):
these people know what they're doing. I know what I'm doing.
I'm not nervous anymore. I got this, we got this.
And I'm just in my head waiting for the Builder ring,
just hyping myself up like this. I'm like, okay, so
Alfred O'meilli has know what he's doing, ATM knows what
he's doing, Adz knows what he's doing, August Matthews knows
what he's doing. Blah blah blah blah blah. Man, we

(51:39):
got this. This magic is going to be a banger.
And I don't even know why I was nervous to
begin with, because if I lose I know, if I
lose my shit, if I lose my shit out here,
I know these guys will help me get through it.

Speaker 1 (51:53):
Right.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
And as long as I got that in the back
of my mind on top of I'm good at I'm
I'm actually a good wrestler, and I and this is
what I'm supposed to be doing. I'll be I'll be okay.
So everything everything up until my music hidding and me
going out there is me doubting myself. And then when
I go out there, I'm just like, nah, man, I

(52:16):
got this. This is what I'm this is what I'm
supposed to be doing.

Speaker 1 (52:19):
Yes, and that that's cruel how you visualize that? Yes,
And I know you've gotten to work like stuff like
t NA you helped that backstage there as well or
I'm on W. I'm on W. Wasn't it right?

Speaker 2 (52:33):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, So that was pretty cool seeing you there.

Speaker 2 (52:36):
Absolutely, thank you, thank you, and well that was fun.

Speaker 1 (52:41):
Yeah yeah, I like, like you look up to anybody
in the business. But you can tell us about the
I'm a W experience.

Speaker 2 (52:51):
No. I was just gonna say, out of all the
place I've done extra work out, I probably had the
most fun at MLW.

Speaker 1 (52:57):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (52:58):
Yeah, Yeah, that's about it, because it's like, uh, like
I like, like I said, these are guys that I
watched on that I that I've been watching on TV
for years and it's like they wrestled for major promotions. Yeah,
but now that they now that they're back on the indies,
they got that hunger back again, and they like and

(53:21):
they don't. They don't. They look at everybody on the
They look at everybody on the car, from the top
guys to the mid card guys, even the extras. They
look at everybody as equals, and they treat each other
as equals, which is something you always which is something
you always want. You don't want, you know, people big
time and you just because you know you're on a

(53:42):
higher spot in the car than them. It's like, we're
all human at the end of the day, you know.
So it's like they treat everybody with an equal amount
of respect. And that's the kind of vibe you always
want in the locker room.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
You know. Yeah, that's great. And do you look up
to anyone else in the business of pro wrestling. It
could be not have to be a wrestler, could be
a commentator, or manager or promoter or anybody.

Speaker 2 (54:07):
Oh. One of the people who have been, like I
told you earlier, one of the people who have become
one of my one of my most underrated mentors without
even knowing he's one of my mentors, is Dan Perch right,
because like I said, Dan knows, Dan's probably forgotten more
than a lot of a lot of us know and

(54:30):
everything he says he tries to instill it in you
so that he can make you see that even if
it's something like this seems insignificant, it has a purpose,
you know. So every time I'm at a freelance show

(54:51):
when purchase there, I never I never missed a chance
to ask Perch a question because I know he's always
gonna have an answer, and I know his answer is
always gonna help me be a better help me be
a better wrestler, like especially like psychologically, because you know,
wrestler just the biggest part of the matches, the wrestlers,
you know. Yeah, so Ba's like one of the one

(55:16):
of my one of my biggest problems early on in
my career was I wasn't getting the refs involved enough
in my match and in my matches. And Perch taught
me how to get rid of that problem like easily.
He's like, Boom, you calling a spot and you know
the person the person you the I mean, the person

(55:37):
you're in the ring with is like outside the ring
and they as on the other side of the ring. Boom,
That's when the ref comes in, comes in and checks
on you. That's when you hate hey, relate, relate it
to them, and then they'll drag it on. And like,
I didn't even know that until I talked to Perch.
You know, so he has in a lot of ways.
I like to say, I'm a I'm a much better

(55:59):
wrestler because of him too. So I look up to
Perch a lot I look up to I look up
to Quinn Widick because Quinn took me under his wing
when I first came in. He he didn't, he hadn't
been wrestling long, but he knew. Like I said, he's
a he's pretty much he's pretty much a theater kid
that wasn't a theater kid. He gets the he gets
the performance aspect of wrestling, and he always helps me

(56:25):
out with ways to become a better performer as opposed
to just a wrestler. You know. Uh Man, it's a
lot is does yees show Showgun Showgun just Showgun just
helps me. Showgun just helps me with technique and how
to be a tougher wrestler. Isaiah's helps me with finesse.

(56:46):
Kytie Ray helps me with Kytie helps me with finesse
because I see her in the gym every day. Pretty
much and every time I see her, I never hesitate
to ask her a question about wrestling either, and she
always has a and she always has something that because
I'm at the point in my career where I'm at
the point where I'm at freelance where I call Kyler
my wrestling mom even though she's only six months, even

(57:08):
though she's only six months older than me, I still
call her. Yeah, I still call her my wrestling mom
because like when I introduced my girlfriend to her, she
was like, I'll stop. You know more than me. I
was like, Kylie, stopped, You've probably forgotten more than I know,
you know. So, Yeah, there's a few people I look
up to and I cherish. I cherish what they tell me,

(57:32):
and I take it and I try to apply it
as much as I can. Like I'll be like, let
me write this down before I forget it, because I
will forget it. Yeah, I will forget it. So let
me write this down before I forget it. And then,
like everything they tell me, I try to apply it
as much as I can.

Speaker 1 (57:46):
You know, right, that's great. You have so much invaluable resources.

Speaker 2 (57:52):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, I'm blessing. Oh. Another one is Ben
McCoy Okay, yes, I can for I cannot cannot forget
Ben McCoy. Ben McCoy has helped me so much with
my wrestling career over the last two years, two three
years because he's one of the He's one of the

(58:14):
first people I look to when I'm not feeling my best,
like I'm not like I got this big match coming
up and I think I'm gonna shit the bed like
Ben will Ben Will, Ben will hype me up, Ben
will help me remember who I am. And that's something
that I always that I always love and respect about him.

(58:34):
So yeah, that's that.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (58:36):
Those those are all my mentors for sure.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
Is he what Prustol league?

Speaker 2 (58:42):
No, Ben is the Ben is the owner of Frontline Pro?

Speaker 1 (58:46):
Oh okay, yeah, and Frontline Pro. That's that was definitely
out of your comfort zone, right going to Yeah, marsh Field, Wisconsin,
which is I've looked it up because the cards look amazing,
but it's.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
Well, we finally finding our foot and again and it's
it's I'm happy to be one of the I'm happy
to be one of the guys at the helm of
that because, like I was, I came in, I came
into front Line when they were like on a high.
When they were like on a high end, then I
don't know what happened, but they experienced a little bit

(59:21):
of a drop off, you know, things things happen started
to go But we are we were getting back to
that high again and it's been like a consistent high
ever since. And like, I am so happy to be
a part of a part of that ride, you know,
because like you like to you like to be a
part of things when you first start out and when

(59:41):
times get tough, y'all ride it out together. And y'all
y'all sit in the trenches together until things get better.
And when things get better, everybody benefits, you know. That's
just that's just one of the things I appreciate about Frontline.

Speaker 1 (59:56):
Yeah, and you and you had a big match with
Congo KNG. It's been on TV. Yes, Yes, that was
pretty insane. And you had a wrestle I think another
match later on right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
Yep Quinn Wick Joey Avalon and Jake Parnell war.

Speaker 1 (01:00:11):
Horse, oh war and it was that the first time
you were in the ring with with Jake and and
uh what Joe.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
Joey before No, never be the first time.

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
Oh wow, that's crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
I showed uh. I showed Warhorse a picture of him
that we took together when I was still not necessarily training,
but I was about a year and a half in.
It was like when everything was opening back up again
during the pandemic in twenty twenty. It was. It was
at a Warrior wrestling show. Oh yep, I just went
there to get I just went there to get promo

(01:00:49):
pictures taken with Basil, with Basil Bassel my mood, you know.
And yeah, Warhorse was there and I'm like, dude, I'm
a fan. And then like took a picture with him
and I showed him. I was like, dude, this, I'm like, dude,
this from twenty twenty. And he was like, that's nuts.
I was like, I was pretty much just a fan

(01:01:10):
back then. Dude. I was only like thirty matches in
and just came to get promo pictures taken.

Speaker 1 (01:01:15):
Yeah, it was.

Speaker 2 (01:01:16):
It was funny, like now here we are wrestling and
we friends and everything. Yeah, it's yeah, It's it's wild.

Speaker 1 (01:01:22):
For sure. Now, what's your advice? Anybody is watching and
watch the train to be a professional wrestler, they want
to make it. What's your advice? To them if they
come and stop you at the after the show.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
The number one thing I try to tell them is one, well,
the things that the top things I try to tell
them One to have fun. Two, No, don't do not
let anything or anybody kill your fandom of wrestling because
you got into this because you're a fan. Never forget that.
No when to be a professional, but no one but

(01:01:57):
still remain a fan of it at because at the
at the core of this, we got into it because
we're fans will we got into it because we love it.
And the third thing I try to tell people, and
this is the hardest one that there is for him
for them to hear. Not everybody is made for the
wrestling portion of wrestling, right, And that's okay. Some people

(01:02:21):
are great as managers. Some people are good as referees.
Some people are good as Some people are good as
commentators because they're good talkers and they're good at putting
people over. You know, they're good at helping, they're good
at helping other people look good. That's one hundred percent okay.
If you're not made to be uh, if you're not
made for the athletic part of it, I'm positive there

(01:02:43):
is something else you can be doing where you will
be just as valuable as you would be if you
were if you were actually in the ring wrestling like
it does not It does not mean you're useless. It
does not mean you don't have a place in the business.
You just gotta find that place. And if they're and
if you can't find a place in the business, then
that's okay too. Like it's it's it's it's nothing. It's

(01:03:05):
nothing wrong with that, like the one. But that's the
one thing I try to preach to people the most
is have fun. Have fun with it. And also, for
the love of Christ, look up good schools, yea, look
look up good schools and save your money and try
to get the best education you can out of it,

(01:03:26):
because you don't want to be that one. You don't
want to be that one person who is on the
card full of studs and then you're the one person
that stinks out the building because you got trained by
and I don't want to sound disrespectful, but you got
trained by a weekend warrior, you know, right, So look up,
got gotta gotta look up good schools, gotta have fun

(01:03:46):
with it, and you can't let anything kill your passion
for wrestling.

Speaker 1 (01:03:51):
That's good answers. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and but I appreciate
you and are you big into that? I want to
just just out the time of my had I see
you have Star Wars behind you, so you have some posters.
Would you ever consider wrestling as costplaying wrestling? Have you
ever considered that there's something promote like there're like some
pop up shows they're now they're like costplay wrestling for rustling.

(01:04:14):
Just seeing the posters, I thought i'd asked you that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:18):
Dude, I would love that. Actually, I was supposed to
want I remember a couple of years ago, I was
supposed to do a and I completely forgot where it was.
Somewhere in down state Illinois. I was supposed to do
a Halloween show, just like a rumble. You dress up
as a character and you show up to a rumble.
I was gonna go as Blade, okay, but I ended

(01:04:40):
up getting a concussion. Had to pull out the show.
Couldn't you make it to the show? Yeah, so I
had to, so I had to return my costume for one. Yeah.
So I was pretty bummed because I was like, dude,
it's been my first cosplay show. I'm gonna go with
the black superhero, right, like the black superhero that kicked

(01:05:03):
off the pretty much kicked off the entire Marvel universe.
And it was like, I can't do it because now
now my uh I landed wrong and my brain is
rattling around my head and I can't. I can't do
it now.

Speaker 1 (01:05:17):
Well, I hope we'll you'll get another chance to do that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
I hope so too. Man, I'm looking forward to it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:05:24):
Yeah, I put I put on a little bit of
muscle since then, so I had to. I had to
get rid of my Blade costumes. So hopefully I can.
Hopefully I can do something better next time, though, probably
goes probably go with Samuel or Jackson, you know from
Pulpe fiction, that character. Yeah, I've been experimenting with a lot. Yeah,

(01:05:45):
and you have some great.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
Advice to the trainees that are listening there, so hopefully they'll,
you know, they'll continue to path and as well.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, the hard, the hard, the hard times
we're gonna be hard, man, but the good times are
going to be great. Those are the those are I
tell people, those are the those are the times you're
gonna want to live for. So you got to stick
through those hard times to get to the good times,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
Yeah, And I wanted to mention any promotions that you're
going to be popping up in the area soon, that
that are coming back or they were on hiatus.

Speaker 2 (01:06:20):
Man Black Wrestlers Matter on the fifteenth. I haven't wrestled.
Black Wrestlers Matter hasn't had a show since twenty twenty,
twenty one or twenty two, I want to say, so
this will be their return show. I'm excited about that.
I'm not going to be on the Freelance Student show,
but I will be there because you know, it's the Academy.
I gotta help, I gotta I gotta show up to

(01:06:42):
support the Academy. Front Line Pro on the front Line
Pro on the what I'm looking at my calendar right
here on the twenty Oh my god, Roman numerals Man
front Line Pro on the twenty first, front Line Pro
on the twenty first, front Line Pro again on the no, no, no,
that's Hybrid Wrestling on the twenty first. And I'm gonna

(01:07:04):
be in Green Bay on the twenty eighth, and then
March first, hopefully no, ain't no, Hopefully I'm beating Gunner
and I'm getting them out of Rocket Pro. So March first,
I'll be a Rocket Pro okay.

Speaker 1 (01:07:18):
And that's the same weekend as another promotion that you
had done some work with three c W.

Speaker 2 (01:07:23):
Yeah, yeah, are you?

Speaker 1 (01:07:25):
Are you looking at every turn there? I know they
doing hiatus.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
I will at some point hopefully. Uh. I had to.
I had to like pull out of the last couple
of shows I got booked on there because I don't
book myself. That's yeah, that was just my fault. But hopefully, yeah, hopefully,
hopefully ill show up there again soon.

Speaker 1 (01:07:46):
Yes, yeah, I know you and Mike Strong had a
big tag team match on their debut.

Speaker 2 (01:07:50):
Yeah yeah, yeah and opened up the.

Speaker 1 (01:07:53):
Show actually, so uh huh as well? Yeah hopefully and
and then and then this is another thing, is uh,
do you have like a dedicated tag partner or someone
you would have in mind to be a dedicated tag
partner if that opportunity to rose, you could go on
a tag team run.

Speaker 2 (01:08:12):
If I had to pick anybody, I'd probably say Corey
McHenry Okay, yeah, cash money, Corey McHenry because we came
up together, we know each other styles, We we wrestled
as it, we wrestled in tag team matches before, so

(01:08:34):
I've had them. I had the most tag team experience
with him. I think I've only wrestled like five tag
team matches over my entire career, and I think like
two of them. Yeah, I think like two of them
were with him, So okay, So yeah, of that time,
he's my tag team partner, so yeah, probably.

Speaker 1 (01:08:51):
Him, Okay. Cool And in Frontline Pro, Man, they're bringing
in a lot of big names. I mean they're sitting
in the past year he see three were seen Richard
uh and so hopefully you'll get more opportunities there as well, hopefully.
So man, Yeah, I've seen I've seen their posters and

(01:09:11):
their their their stuff looks really good. But you're closer.

Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
But you know, they will have to make a promo
with me calling out Showing Benjamin one day. Yeah because right, no, no,
but it'd be nice.

Speaker 1 (01:09:28):
That would be crazy, that would be yeah, just as
someone else did you that caught your attention when you
were watching and stuff. He caught your attention.

Speaker 2 (01:09:39):
No, no, Showing Benjamin is one of my favorite wrestlers
of all time. Yeah, and like, yeah, I met him
for the first time at Legacy Pro maybe like last
summer and Yeah, it was. I was like, Bro, you're
my here, You're one of my heroes. Man. It was like,
I gotta I gotta wrestle you one day. But he's
signed with a e W now, so yeah, well you

(01:10:00):
never know. Yeah, so him having them getting him to
clear out the schedule is probably gonna be difficult, like
for any promoter.

Speaker 1 (01:10:08):
Oh yeah for sure, but maybe if it's meant to happen,
and it'll happen, and absolutely that's cool. I like Shelton
a lot as well. You know, I'm a fan of
his back in the day until now.

Speaker 2 (01:10:19):
Yeah, definitely, definitely, yeah, for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:10:22):
Well I appreciate you again. Me and I'm p W
re Report and Shaq Jordan. Great to have you. Do
you have a nickname? That's what I want to ask
you to do you have a nickname that you want
do you want to put put on like the you know,
the thumbnail for this video or anything like.

Speaker 2 (01:10:37):
Man, you man, you can pick the generational treasure, you
can pick the notorious, you can pick.

Speaker 1 (01:10:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
That's yeah, that's just about it. Man.

Speaker 1 (01:10:45):
Okay, cool, And before I let you go, can you
do a quick shout out for pe W y'all and
this recording and i'll start anyone, is that cool?

Speaker 2 (01:10:54):
Absolutely all right,

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