TV Party Tonight: The West Wing (Season 7)

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
The following may contain offensive language, adult humor, and or
content that some viewers may find offensive. The views and
opinions expressed by anyone speaker does not explicitly or necessarily
reflect or represent those of Mark Ratleage or W two
M Network. Please listen with caution or don't listen at.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
All, ges of hers cause of anything else we don't
find dedicated.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
Yes, sir, we bob. We are back on TV party tonight,
and tonight our favorite show is The West Wing season seven.
I am joined as I always am on these old
school TV parties by the main man himself, the VP
on the ticket. He's gonna bring Ohio home for me,
ladies and gentlemen. Arch conservative from the Appalachia, West, Virginia's

(01:27):
own Jesse Starcher. How do you do, sir?

Speaker 2 (01:32):
Oh my goodness, the electoral votes are right here behind
the banner. Trust me, they're stacked high, and we're taking
it home. Mark Radlitch taking it home Season seven of
this thing.

Speaker 1 (01:46):
My own personal attack dog, Jesse Starture.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
That's right, rough, rough, Jesse.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
This was not my idea. This is not my idea
of a good time. This is not my idea. No,
this was not my idea to do the West Wing.
This was Andrew's yes. And you know, it's funny. Over
the course of seven the seven months we've done this,
we had Dorian in and on, we had Andrew in
and on. But now, just as it always is, just

(02:14):
me and you baby.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
Down to me and you Mark Radleche to just discuss
what we experienced seven months worth of and in this
final season as well.

Speaker 1 (02:25):
Yeah, this is it. This is the last season of
the West Wing before we get into season seven. I mean, overall,
I'm really curious. Like I said I would not, I
did not watch this in this initial run. I'm a
network TV snob and I felt like a show like

(02:47):
this on network TV's not going to kind of get
into the kind of grit and grime that a Keble
news show would get into, which is why I avoided it.
I also, even back then, I was like this, this
feels like political fan fiction, you know, political fantasy. I'm
not interested in that. You know, if I'm gonna watch

(03:08):
a show like a show that deals in heavy politics,
sometimes I'm gonna make you watch K Street and then
you'll walk into the woods to live Deliberately. It was
a cable news show, a cable show about like lobbyists
in Washington, like on K Street, and it was really Sorry,

(03:32):
fucking Chris. I was looking forward to talking about comics
with you and Starter, but you guys are talking about
the West Wings.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
Sorry, Bailey, Sorry, just.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
Because every time I say Bartlett, just think Captain America.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
If that helps. Yeah, there you go.

Speaker 1 (03:46):
Yeah, when I say Santos, think iron Man. When I
think Alan al The think Magneto. Anyway, but uh yeah,
I would not have watched this show in its initial run,
and I wouldn't have thought to even do it. But
Andrew was like, can we please talk to West Wing?
And I'm like, sure, I have to say, and this

(04:08):
is what I want you to get your reaction to
seven seasons of this and you know, six previous conversations
about it. We talked about some pretty heady stuff, and
I think there's a good mix of dabbling in real
politics of the day, yeah, you know, mostly Clinton era politics,
but with a you know, a nice mixture of drama.

(04:29):
Because this is you know, nighttime soapy television right right.
It is definitely swerved all over the place. And I
have some thoughts on this this particular season, but I
want to get your thoughts here overall on where we've
been and where we're going.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
Sure. Yeah, I mean, look again, you've heard me say
this on previous podcasts. This wasn't a series that I
probably would have had any inclination to actually start watching.
I had heard from other people out there about West
Wing being like a really good show, especially the first

(05:06):
few seasons, but again, political drama is not my bag,
That is not my cup of tea?

Speaker 1 (05:14):
Has that changed since we started watching this? Like? Are
you more interested now in a political show?

Speaker 2 (05:20):
I can. I can appreciate it more. I think I
could understand that it has something to offer that I
might enjoy because I didn't think that I would enjoy this,
and I have. I really have coming out of this,
being able to watch all the episodes. It's just tell
Mendy tonight, I was like, can you believe we sat
down and watched one hundred and forty some episodes of

(05:42):
The West Wing, And you know, we would have never
done that in the past, but we we became very
invested in these characters. The characters I believe we were
done well enough. There's definitely some relationships that you get
involved in as well, and also watching the trials and
tribulations of people trying to navigate Washington, and you pat

(06:03):
my back, I'll pat yours, or you know this person
did me wrong. You know I'm gonna cut them out somehow.
It's you know, you know that stuff happens in real life,
so it's I didn't think it would be as interesting
as it actually was portrayed here in this show.

Speaker 1 (06:19):
Yeah, I definitely think season sevensoul drop off from the
quality of the first four seasons, but none of it's
necessarily bad. I sent you a note about the Al
Smith dinner that, yeah, you did. This went from you know,
Democrat wish fulfillment to just Democrat high fantasy.

Speaker 2 (06:37):
I was working at the time when you sent that,
and I was like, man, if I had like ten minutes,
I would I would reply because I I could tell
you were obviously upset. You were done with this show.
I'll finish it, but I'll you know, I do not
like this, and it gets better.

Speaker 1 (06:56):
I'm glad, I Andrew even said at the time, and
I sent that message out, he was like, please be patients,
Like right right.

Speaker 2 (07:02):
I was at the point where probably I was probably
three or four, maybe five episodes ahead of you at
that time, and I was like, yeah, it is, give
it some time. You ain't gonna hate it all like
you are.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
Right then, when did you know Santos was gonna win?

Speaker 2 (07:17):
Uh? Boy, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (07:21):
And did it become obvious he was gonna be he
was gonna end up winning the election?

Speaker 2 (07:26):
It should have been obvious when I watched the opener
of this of this first episode, to be honest, because
I went back and watched it after I finished the
final episode, because I know, uh, Andrew had brought it up,
and I was like, I remember watching that and going, oh, okay.
But I'd also noticed that there were a couple of
clues that I didn't pick up one that I should

(07:48):
have at the time when I watched the opener to
figure out that, Okay, it's probably going to be Santos,
but regardless, you didn't know for sure, you know, you
didn't know, And I would say that, I mean, it
kept me me, you know, on the hook until they
finally called it, because I could see the West Wing
saying or the crew or whatever saying, Okay, we've got

(08:09):
to make this kind of real and our Republican representative
is going to win and we're not. We're going to
end things not on a it wouldn't be on a downer,
because there's a lot to say about Vinick and his
you know, his character.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
But but yeah, every he is what Democrats wish Republicans were.

Speaker 2 (08:29):
It's really kind of true. I mean, honorable is the
one word that I would probably say that he is.
And there's a few moments throughout this season that kind
of shine a light on that. But but really, honestly,
it had me on the hook. I didn't think that
Santos was Santos was going to win for sure until
they finally called the election, like just like normal.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Yeah, I want to there's a bunch of diffent things
I want to get into, but it became very obvious
to me early on in the season. I'm like, he's
gonna end up winning this. I mean, don't get wrong,
I think they they did a good job of at
least making it plausible, because first of all, I don't
think we've had like back to back in the same

(09:13):
party after a full to you know, for eight years
of one president right.

Speaker 2 (09:18):
Right, it was always flipping over to the next, right.

Speaker 1 (09:21):
I mean, Reagan finishes his eight years and then and
then his vice president becomes president. But then he's defeated
partially by Ross Purot, but but in the history books,
he's defeated by Clinton. And then Clinton does his eight years,
and then and then it's Bush and then Bush does
his eight years, and then it's Obama and then Obama
does eight years, and then it's Trump and then Trump

(09:43):
is defeated by COVID, but Biden takes it. But Biden
gets the win. You know, COVID kind of hit Trump
with the briefcase and then you know, but then cashed in.
But then but then Biden, you know, picked up the
victory and then you know, Trump resumed read me, in
his eight years. Be interesting to see who ends up

(10:05):
being who ends up winning again.

Speaker 2 (10:07):
Yeah, cycle, weird cycle we're in.

Speaker 1 (10:10):
Yeah. But my point is like it's a hard sell
if you're trying to be like this is you know,
this is somewhat resemblance of real life to have Santos
pick up after Barblin.

Speaker 2 (10:27):
I understand there are Democrats.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
Yeah, so they have to do so much too. And
then they made Vinnick so you know, such a such
a great John McCain Republican. You know, it's just like
I just have a like we're basically the same guy.
I just have a different way of governing than you do.
It's like, but we mostly believe the same stuff. Like
he's so moderate, and it's like there's a I called

(10:54):
him like a John McCain Republican because like John McCain
was one of those guys who was you know, he
was fairly he was fairly moderate. The a lot of
a lot of the Christian Republicans did not love him.
He struggled, And it's that that's up why George Bush
ended up getting the nomination was he was the values president,
you know, and he was will willing to work with

(11:14):
some people that John McCain was not. And that's kind
of like without knowing that they were doing it, that's
kind of the way they modeled Vinnick. You know, he's
he's just like moderate, modern, non values related Republican and
he's and but and then it's like they almost wrote
themselves into a corner because there's no reason why Vinnick
wouldn't have won. You know, you know, if Christians sit

(11:38):
home on election day, that leaves the undecided moderates. I
mean this we're a center, right country. So if you
don't play any funny ball, you know, if you if
you just leave things, if you just present the issues
and go this guy is closer to most people's feelings
on everyday issues than this guy. The center right guy

(11:59):
would win every time. That's this country in a nutshell.
So they have to blow up a nuclear plant after
he spends an episode, after he spends an episode saying
nuclear power is perfectly safe, which it is, but nothing
is safe, but it's built poorly, you know.

Speaker 2 (12:15):
Right.

Speaker 1 (12:17):
Right right, Like it was an interesting we can get
into this now. It's it was an interesting thing because
the Al Smith dinner, the debate, and then a couple
of episodes later, the nuclear episode where they blow up
the plant are all kind of related to each other.
So that's kind of where I want to start up.

Speaker 2 (12:35):
That's okay, Yeah, yeah, wherever you want to go, man, Okay.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
So the Al Smith dinner, I'll start there, just kind
of set this up. Santos is losing he you know,
Vinnick is well ahead in every state, and Santas like,
but if we don't need debate, Santos, But if you
don't need debate me, and then the people would get
a clear picture of who I am and who you are,
and that would you know, this would be a real
election if you'd only debate me. Venick and and Vinx

(13:01):
people are just like, now, A, don't don't get into
a fucking oratory match with this guy. It's that's bad,
that's bad for us. Be what is the line CM
punk said about Triple Ah, I don't have to I
don't have to wrestle you. You have to wrestle me.
It was kind of one of those It's like Vinicks, like,
I'm a moderate Republican in this fantasy world where that's

(13:24):
gonna win me an election, you know, and the Christian
Right doesn't really matter as much by the way. That's both.
But I'm winning in every poll, I'm winning most of
the states. Like at that point, Ron Silver, who plays Bruno,
was doing the whole like fifty state win, you know,
the fifty state solution, and so like there's no reason

(13:47):
for anything to do a debate, so they just keep
they just keep yanking the Santos chain on and on
and on and then finally and this is where I
freaked out. This is when I sent you the message.
When they're at the Al Smith Din and they're backstage
and they like confront each other like fucking gunman.

Speaker 2 (14:06):
Looking at each other and which one's gonna move first.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
I saw Tumbleweeds blow through that kitchen. I don't know why,
you know, like why are you like? And then they're
just you know, and then Vinnick, like I think my
problem with it was it's not believable that a guy
with a big as lead as him, who's as centrist
as he was, would come down to Santos and and

(14:30):
do a debate. And then they do the debate and
and it's and it's great. It was great television, but
it was but it was pro wrestling. And then and
no one's going to agree to this, Like when Vinick's
finally I can't remember which one, if it was Santos
or Vinick, which one? And finally, oh, it was Vinnick
at the very beginning, you know, where like like make

(14:52):
opening statements and then he just has like this very
dramatic like come to Jesus moment where he's like, you know,
you know, Jesse, Jake to Snake Roberts, Jesse. When a
man runs for president, he's not just running for president,
he's running for a master of the union. What the
fuck are we doing here? He's like, let's just have

(15:14):
a fucking debate. Let's throw the rules out in that
poor moderated Like.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
Why, oh okay, I was hired for one thing and
I gotta keep the audience in check.

Speaker 1 (15:25):
Dude, He turned bic, would you like to let the
candidates speak?

Speaker 2 (15:28):
Like? You guys can keep clapping if you want. That's
all you're going to hear.

Speaker 1 (15:33):
You want to hit the candidates speak? You just want
to hit yourself, your fucking animals. That's why they don't
let me moderate debates. Look, it is all shut ups.
You can respond this, but like the Ousmith dinner. In
the debate itself, it was such it's good television, it's
bad realism, which, okay, it's just the criticism of that
of my of that comment from me might be, Hey,

(15:54):
check ass, it's a fictional television show.

Speaker 2 (15:56):
That was That was probably what I was about to
type in when I when I saw you, right, remember Mark, Hey,
it's okay to hope, buddy, It's okay that there might
be two candidates that might see each other.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
I die and wanted to do something stranger things that's
not real either.

Speaker 2 (16:17):
No, no, I'm telling you that I think that was
really I understand what you're saying, this is realistically, would
Winnick have made that move? And I one hundred percent agree.
I don't think he would have at all. But yes,
it made for good television and they did it has.

Speaker 1 (16:36):
Done because like you're the one, you're the one leading. Yeah,
so like the guy the Siantos had to be the
one to do that. The fact that it ended up
being Vinick made no sense.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
Right right, Yeah? I I mean I enjoyed it for
what it was. I enjoyed I think number one, what
you wanted to I guess why they wanted to show
this is to show you, Okay, we understand your Republicans
supposed to be the enemy. But Vinnick is a good guy.
He's going to do this, he wants to do this again.

(17:05):
I want to use the word honorably to describe him,
because I feel like that's what it is, like he had,
he has this, He's honor bound to do some certain
things a certain way, and I feel like, you know,
he respects the political monster as much as it as
much as it is to to give Santos an option
or an opportunity here Now, granted, maybe he went into

(17:27):
it a little bit more of an ego, thinking, well, look,
you know, I can handle this, This will be no problem.

Speaker 1 (17:32):
I'm pretty sure a sitting senator can beat the junior congressman.
From what Texas.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
Right right, the live debate is really I mean, as
far as what was happening there, I think I was
just in awe of the fact that they did actually
live and they did those shows, which I thought was
really really cool, one for the East Coast and one
for the West Coast, which that's I thought was a

(17:57):
brilliant piece of television right there. But yeah, as far
as the show goes, I mean, I think it was
just again entertaining fiction, is the way I was looking
at it, and hopeful. I think that's the big thing
that you come out of this is like, okay, looking.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
At it as an aspirational show.

Speaker 2 (18:14):
Sure, yes, yes, I remember when I first started like
talking about doing I told somebuddies that, yeah, I want
to do the West Wing and he's like, well, it's
just a bunch of idealism that isn't actually real you know,
it's not realism, it's idealism. And but fuck Texas, I've
been there. Yes, Oh, oh goodness, right in the south, somewhere.

Speaker 1 (18:43):
Right where you pooped today. So there's a bit that
that Alan Alda's character, Senator Vinnick says where they're talking
about energy, you know, what's your energy policy going to be?
And I thought it was interesting that the writers went
this way because you know, at that time, solar and
wind were just starting to be a thing.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
But even today, like.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
A lot of people don't love wind farms. They look ugly,
Like they wanted to put wind farms out off you know,
into the off the coast of Massachusetts, and the people
of Cape Cod were like, you know, not in my backyard, Nimby,
because they like they're ugly. People don't want the fucking
wind farms there, you know. So like we're willing to
continue to like frack and drive ver oil and you know,
go to war in the Middle East because God forbid,

(19:29):
we should have a not pretty view of the water
out by Cape Cod. Yeah, and then you know, I
think solar was I don't think solar back then was
as good as it is now. Like we've got some
pretty good solar technology, a lot of like lightweight solar paneling,
and you know, things like that. So but back in

(19:51):
the early two thousand, solar was not a as cheap
as it is today be as good. So really the
only like, the only other, as my father keeps saying,
and cold fusion has been around the corner for the
last thirty years. Oh man, my favorite criticisms. So but

(20:13):
those don't know, Chris Chris Rattle. It is my father
when he loves to bring that one up. Cold fusion
is just around the corner, All right, Dad, we get it.
Science stinks. But so like their point about Europe is
just chock full of nuclear power plants is not wrong.
I think, like making that a plot point of this season,

(20:36):
Like Vinnick is all in on this, on this nuclear plant,
and he pushed to get it built. Then they don't
keep up the regulations and it's not built as well
as it should have been, and there's a problem, and
we you know, you know, we have to like I
think they had to bake evacuate San Diego.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
Yeah they were they Yeah, they're pulling, uh, trying to
get everybody out of there because you know, they're hoping
that the Santa Ana wins will take the radiation out
to sea. And yeah, there's there are some there are
some really really uh you know, big worries here with
what's happened with this thing.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
It was an interesting like using that to damage Vinick,
And you know, they didn't want to do like a
sex scandal or anything like that, like a weird October
surprise kind of a thing. So instead they just invented
this at a whole at a whole cloth. And in
terms of I'm just talking about and just in terms
of writing, it's weird that a group of liberals wrote
in nuclear power bad, you know, without really offering any

(21:35):
other solutions. It's not like like Santos is in character.
Santos's energy policy didn't make any sense to me, Like
he didn't really have one, you know. I think it
was like, oh, develop wind and solar good and confusions
right around the corner, you know. Meanwhile, Vinnie's like, how
about more nuclear power plans? Why are we so afraid
of this? Europe isn't. But I think the point was

(21:58):
the point made was a good one. It was like
the problem with the United States is we tend to
do the right thing, but we don't want but then
we don't really want to put the monetary investment in
keeping it up. Yeah, you know, we have we we
since Reagan. It's just one deregulation after another to the
point where you you know, have a lot of problems.

(22:19):
And yeah, they were highlights a lot of risk. Yeah,
so they hang a lot about on Vinnick. I'll say
this and then I'll let you speak on it. My
favorite thing about that was Vinick's way of handling it
politically was to do and in the heat of the day,
ask me anything in front of the power plan.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
I think he goes on, are just like.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
We give up, fine, you win?

Speaker 2 (22:42):
Yeah, I gotta go yeah, yeah, I mean I think
it is You're right, this is a weird like kind
of big problem that happens that really, when you think
about it, it's the one thing that could derail his
campaign is this thing.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
It did derail him. He lost the election because of it.

Speaker 2 (23:02):
Because of it, right, I mean and Randon.

Speaker 1 (23:04):
It came down to one fucking state. But still in.

Speaker 2 (23:07):
What a state that was?

Speaker 1 (23:08):
What was it?

Speaker 2 (23:08):
That was Nevada?

Speaker 1 (23:09):
Lada. Nevada is what puts Santos over. But you know
what he wins. So that was the thing though, like
he that was the other thing they built up all
this tension about whether or not he was gonna like
because if Santas won California, that was the game.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
Yeah, that was it.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
But Santos won Texas, which costs of Venice Vinick big.
But then Vinnick went California and they kind of offset
each other. But like that whole part of the plot
point was because of the nuclear power thing that was
going to cause Vinnick his home state, which is California,
and then he won it, and then it and then
that that that's what the Santos campaign and then it

(23:44):
came down to Nevada, which was never in play to begin.

Speaker 2 (23:46):
With, right, right, and you would have never thought it was.
And it's just so yeah, I think it was the
one thing to actually kind of derail him, and just
it's plausible. I mean, he was the was what was
he was a representative of California at some point senator
of California.

Speaker 1 (24:05):
He was the Senator of California senator.

Speaker 2 (24:07):
So I mean he felt that he owed that state.
And remember we they had that long discussion about should
he go and deliver a speech to make it seem,
you know, make the people of California feel a little
bit safer and his campaign managers were like, no, do
not do this, you do not need to do this.
I think the other people, you know, Santos's campaign is like,

(24:28):
he'll never do this, and he goes and does it.
And honestly, if you look at that, I mean, that
might have been what saved him the state, because if
he would me have done it, maybe it would maybe
it wouldn't, he wouldn't have gotten It.

Speaker 1 (24:39):
Reminded me that the Rush Limbaugh thing from Family Guy,
where it was like, don't go to Family Guy, the
writers are gonna make you look silly, and they were like,
they fucking turned him into an eagle. He flew away
the end. They they gave Rush plenty on Family Guy,
and they and that's in this all fairness to to
the writers of this show. They gave a lot to

(25:00):
ollan out this character. But I think that was almost
like the compromise, like we'll make this a strong Republican,
we'll make it a good Republican. But he's a Republican.
You know, he's not a he's not a conservative Christian,
he's a moderate. He believes in science. You know, he's
just like there are plenty of like fiscally responsible liberals
out there, and that's kind of what they think Republicans

(25:22):
should be. Republican, You're you're basically a progressive, You're just
not a spend thrift right good republican, liberal republican everyone.

Speaker 2 (25:34):
Yeah, there's a lot of a lot of bipartisanship throughout this,
throughout this.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
Oh wait, do we talk about the finale?

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (25:42):
I almost threw something at the television.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
Now, I can tell you there were a couple spots
going into after the election and maybe leave a little
bit before. I said, if Santos wins this x y
Z is happening because I got that vibe from this,
from this from the show, and turns out not everything hit,
but almost everything hit. So but anyway, yeah, we'll talk

(26:04):
about the finale here.

Speaker 1 (26:05):
In the few, right, what do you think of addition
to the show?

Speaker 2 (26:09):
Goodness? Okay, Well, aside from the fact that I might
have a thing for she might be like the narrative girls,
do you she's uh, she is. She definitely her character.
Let's just focus on her character here. Aside from aside
from the fact that she uh, you know, she added

(26:29):
something to the show. We'll just put it on.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
I got asked and since you have like had the hotofolo.
Have you always had a hotoolo or you just discovered.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
Her with this It's no, I've I've I've been I've
enjoyed her in other things such as Mystery Men. I
think she was in Mystery Men right with Ler. That's
what That's what I thought.

Speaker 1 (26:48):
But no, I mean was the truth? Was the truth
about cats and dogs?

Speaker 2 (26:53):
Brunette snack sized brunettes with glasses. There you go, that's
your thing.

Speaker 1 (26:58):
Tiot is gonna gets gonna be.

Speaker 2 (27:05):
I put it out there, the internet will grab it
and make it. You know, yes, please. But as far
as her character goes, yeah, you know, bringing her in
here and uh, I mean she was there to try
and right the ship, I guess for Josh in the
campaign and actually maybe helped Josh along make some tough decisions, uh,

(27:26):
in order to try and get this campaign to succeed,
you know. Aside from Aside from that, I don't really
have much else to say about her. She It was
nice to kind of see her at the end after
everything was said and done that you know, what's she
going to do? And she kind of makes Josh realize
that you know, he has he needs to have a
life outside of what he's been doing for the past

(27:49):
two years or whatever he was doing with Santos. But
regardless that, that's about as far as I took it.
You what are your thoughts.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
So I've been a fan of Gene Garoffalo stand up
comedy since she was part of that wave of like
with Patton Oswald and then like, yeah, the early ninety
sort of like angry old comics, you know, Brian Posain,
Patton Oswald, her to a lesser extent, Dennis Miller, that group.

(28:18):
I I like nin Garofalo, she's got she's gotten to
be shrill in her old age, like not now, I
think now she's I think I think the two thousands
beat the shit out of her. And you know, losing
Air America. I don't know if you know that or not.
What Basically, so you have to Reagan deregulates AM radio
and that gives rise to you know, uncontested conservative radio. Right,

(28:41):
this is where Rush Limbaugh and Michael Savage, Sean Hannity,
Bill O'Reilly, this is where they Bill Bennett, this is
where they all come from. Right, Okay, yep, there's no
fairness doctrine. So they basically so so AM radio producers
just programming a bunch of these conservative guys and because
those are the because Middle America is what was listening

(29:03):
to AM radio at the time. You know, they they
were attracted to what they were saying. So uh, there
were a handful of lefties on AM radio, like Randy Rhodes,
not the guitar player. But around somewhere in the Bush administration,
I don't remember what year this was, there was like
a casset recognition that the reason why the leftist struggling

(29:29):
is because talk. Because the Republican Party, the Conservatives have
a basically free use communications wing okay radio, Like they
don't have to spend a fucking nickel Rush limbab Michael Savage,
Bill Bennett, Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly. Those guys will all

(29:50):
talk for them and put their message out there before
a single message, before a single commercial was paid for.
And so the Democrats are like, we need a you
need a liberal Rush Limbaugh.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
So they created Air America.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
One of the people that got a show in Air
America was Janine Garofolo. Other than watching her in this show,
I couldn't, I wouldn't. I never saw her happier. She
fucking loved Air America. Okay, all right, and it only
that's why I brought that up. It only lasted a
few years, and I'm pretty sure when it was over
went into the woods to live deliberately.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
Jeez uh, poor girl.

Speaker 1 (30:28):
They tried me. I try. I listened to it. I
liked a lot of Air America.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
I never I didn't even know it existed.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
The long strange trip to Chuck D had a show,
Chuck D he had, Yeah We're two with two other women.
It was the weirdest three somebody'd ever been a part
of Chuck D and two women. I think one of
them was Rachel.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
Maddow now that I think about it, Oh wow, oh wow.

Speaker 1 (30:53):
Yeah, yeah, America had some fun shows anyway. So all
of that to say, look, Jenny Garoffalo clearly had an
interest in politics, and she she's not. I yeah, hang on,
we're getting a lot of messages in the chat, so somebody,
oh no, so Brad Duquet, bruh. You know you're in
a small community when lo l but I love this

(31:16):
all right, thank you? And then our our friend from
Europe is here. I'm not sure if anyone is reading
the chat tonight. Oh I am trust me.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:26):
In fact, let me put this in, let me do this.
I keep forgetting to do this. Here we go, now
that now the stuff will come up automatically. So Jeane
Garofalo to the point that, like the guys at south
Park in the World Police movie made fun she was
one of the ones they made fun of. She clearly
had a vested interest in politics. She had a uh

(31:46):
she she definitely had a had a voice that she
thought should be heard. She you know, she was one
of these people that definitely wanted to weigh in on
the now rational conversation what was going on in this country.
So getting a show like The West Wing where she's
the director of communication in someone's you know, in a

(32:07):
Democrats presidential bid, I think was a nice fit for her.
She got she got to do what many of us
wish we could do, which was live out of fantasy.

Speaker 2 (32:15):
I was going to say that might be where, you know,
the fantasy train started rolling for you, Like, okay, come on, now,
wait a second, this is obviously somebody's.

Speaker 1 (32:23):
I'm not who might have pissed on Jeane garoffelos fucking dreams.

Speaker 2 (32:26):
Like well, sure, sure, I'm saying that a gg. I'm
just saying, look, hey, we're we're you're starting to realize
that there may be more a fantasy fulfillment.

Speaker 1 (32:39):
Fulfillment.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yes, there you go.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
As opposed to I think I think she was a
good foil for Josh. Yes, because the character his character
arc is he basically is like a workaholic control freak,
and then like one of the first things that sort
of tempers him is he has to get paired up
with Jenny Garoffalo and Jolo because they gave her every
you know, they gave her. It's like when you like

(33:02):
in D and D, we like someone just rolls you
a perfect character. This is here, play this one. Oh
I have ten, I have an attribute of ten and
everything like, oh great, and here here's this plus ten
mace for no good reason. All right, oh look, I
kill lots of stuff. Good for you. But anyway, you know,

(33:23):
so like they gave her a great character. She was
a tempering influence for Josh. I happened to like Jinny
Garoppolo personally. I mean, I don't agree with a lot
of what her opinions are, and I think her her
condescending approach to people didn't help keep air America alive.
I'll tell you that. Much like I'm gonna say this,
I'm gonna leave the subject alone. The reason, for the
most part, the reason why conservative radio worked as well

(33:44):
as it did was it didn't treat the audience like
they were idiots.

Speaker 2 (33:46):
They were.

Speaker 1 (33:48):
There were there were some dopes that would call into
the Rush Limbaugh Show. And I mean on both sides,
both conservative and and uh liberal. But some of these
people that were calling the Rush Limbah Show, but Rush
Limbaugh always spoke to them like he was a therapist.
It was like, I hear what you're saying, you know,
but couldn't you just make the kid a peanut butter
and jelly sandwich.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
True fucking story.

Speaker 1 (34:09):
With the brief moment that Rush had a television show,
he actually like his whole argument against free school lunch
was he made his own lunch and brought it to
the fucking set and then priced it out. He was like,
this is how much you spent in the day like
they school lunch, and it was like one of it
was like a peanut, butter and jelly say. I was

(34:30):
just like, he's such a fucking dick. Good stuff got
I remember those were the days.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
Jesse, those were the days.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
The last bit after he wins, and like she hooks
up with Otto Prato, the speechwriter guy. Yep, that fucking
Josh abuses an episode later. That was all good stuff.
And like her line about I'm interested in money and
I don't have a life. Yeah, she is definitely the
ghost of Christmas future.

Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yes. Yeah. Poor Josh just kind of stares off as
she rambles on, and he's like, what am I doing
with my life? Yep? Okay, Well that that.

Speaker 1 (35:09):
Leads to this and I really wanted to talk about
because I think there's that much more to add about Genarolo.
So Donna and Josh.

Speaker 2 (35:16):
Oh my goodness, what a season.

Speaker 1 (35:21):
Sam and Diane finally got together.

Speaker 2 (35:25):
Uh yeah, so was it in this one? Maybe it
was last season. I cannot remember. I feel like it
was this season where they were in the hotel together.
I think it was last season.

Speaker 1 (35:35):
I came last season where they're doing the bit where
they're where they were, because it was it was prior
to the It was probably to the convention. She was
still with uh bag Dad Bob's party.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
Okay, that's right, right, right, right? It was not bag
Dad Bob. But yeah, yeah, so okay, so we got that,
we got that bit attention last season, and then this season,
you know, as soon as they oh my goodness, what
is it that they won something I cannot remember?

Speaker 1 (36:08):
And he was so excited he kissed her. He kissed
her right on the yeah, and it became a very
romantic kiss.

Speaker 2 (36:15):
Yes, And then you know, people come storming in there,
and you know, they immediately separate. But then of course
later on down the line, there's that one moment where
she leaves her room key and he like kind of
leans up to get it, and somebody else is like,
oh my goodness, she left her room key. It takes
it back to her, and uh that was like, you know,
oh my goodness. And Josh is just sitting there watching

(36:35):
the other lady take off with her room key's like,
oh my gosh. But then finally, yes, they finally hooked up.
We finally get this romance that we have been itching for.
Me and the wife have been sitting there going I mean, yeah,
as far as fist pump moments on this show.

Speaker 1 (36:52):
Because I thought it was kind of anticlimactic.

Speaker 2 (36:54):
What do you mean, like, do you feel like it
was what do you mean aunt I climactic.

Speaker 1 (37:01):
I don't know. I feel like for seven seasons these
two were, you know, pinching and tickling each other and
running around in circles, and there was all this like
sexual tension built up between them, and finally they you know,
and finally they do with finally they they they kiss
like they should have been like fucking fireworks, man, And
I didn't feel fireworks.

Speaker 2 (37:20):
Come on, man, that was I don't I don't think
it wasn't let down in any way.

Speaker 1 (37:25):
I think that they it felt like that like pad
Ma and Anakin in Space Venice.

Speaker 2 (37:31):
First off, their colleagues and they're going to try to
be careful around the people that they work with.

Speaker 1 (37:38):
So I don't think it was framed well. I think
I think the people working on this show needed like
a romance coordinator or something, so you know, bring in
bringing the guy who did the notebook, like they feel
something like I like, I was relieved, Oh good, Mom
and Dad weren't getting a divorce. That was what I
felt like.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
Wow, all right, then, No, I do not think it
was anti climactic at all. I think that they handled
it like they should have. I mean, as as two
colleagues who had been working together for a very long time.
They you know, come together and they are you know,
they've got to try and now navigate the world as
a couple, I guess you would say amongst their their

(38:19):
peers in the middle of this campaign. So yeah, I
feel like it was handled. It was handled decently, you know.
But I was so glad, man, I was so glad
that they finally finally kissed and finally started a relationship.
And it seemed a little rocky there at first, but
you could tell these two were you know, they were

(38:41):
made for each other. Come on, they were made for loving.
That's right.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
I'm glad they got together. And I think, joh, I'll
tell you what I felt, more tension, more more emotion
when Josh was like, I can't wrap my head around
this relationship anymore. So a real quick story. When I
went to go see Goodwill hunting. I went with my
best friend Tom at the time, and there's a bit
and then when when you know Will who is having

(39:08):
some struggles, he's back into a corner and he lashes
out and he tells men the driver, I don't love you,
fucking broke my heart. Me and me and my friend
Tom just bawling in the theater, like both of us,
we love you, Minny, like we were ready to catch her.
You're right there, man, fictional fucking character on screen, and
we were like, no, no, it hurts. Why why would

(39:29):
you hurt poor many driver that way? When he said
that to her, same feeling, I was like, oh no,
you just got together, man, don't don't walk away from
the leggy blonde.

Speaker 2 (39:43):
And oh my goodness, Donna and a brawl too. We
got that this season, which is I mean, top three moments.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
Mail Gaze baby, I'll gaze all night long. But I
think it's after that that we get Robb blow back, yeah,
and Rob like, if you don't leave, I will, and
then he and then he goes back to Donna and like,
let's go.

Speaker 2 (40:05):
On vacation together, and right right, you didn't know.

Speaker 1 (40:08):
I don't think they resolved it though. I don't think.
We don't think we as the audience know where they
landed together.

Speaker 2 (40:14):
Again, Uh, I think we yeah, don't. You're you're right,
I mean we see that they do go on vacation together, right,
because you're wondering if Josh is just gonna go alone,
and sure enough, Donna comes in and slips in and
sits beside him on the plane.

Speaker 1 (40:28):
Right.

Speaker 2 (40:29):
So but I think that, yeah, that's it. The next
episode doesn't have Josh and Donna in it at all. Uh,
that's episode twenty one, and then episode twenty two we're
kind of back to Okay, it's Santos is uh, you know,
getting ready for inaugurate eight inauguration day, and you know,
we don't see much of the lovey dovey stuff between
Josh and and Donna during that. We just know that

(40:49):
there are a couple and there's opportunities going out to everybody.
My goodness, you get a job, and you get a job,
and how about you get this job? Shock.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
She wasn't put in the communications thing, you know, they
kept it in garoppol. So this is like their transition
was a little bit weird because okay, so it made
sense that Josh was the chief of staff, him going
to get rob Load to put the band back together.
By the way, when he gets there and they do
the replay of the fucking first yes, he's like, he's like,
what it took you long enough?

Speaker 2 (41:17):
I thought you never called.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
I thought you'd never call. I was like, that would
see that had more romantic sexual tension for me than
Donna and Josh.

Speaker 2 (41:26):
Get out of it.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
I thought you'd never call like fucking and my girlfriend.
Oh everywhere, I know, My god, there's more sexual chemistry
between Bob Low and Bradley Whitford than between him and
horrible horrible whatever. Oh my god, I'm shipping Rob Loo
and Bradley Whitford.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
All right, so everybody's getting jobs. Were you taking off at?

Speaker 1 (41:53):
Okay? So those two were the chief of staff and
the deputy chiefs staff. We don't. I thought that we're
gonna give Donna the press secretary job like that seemed
the obvious thing. That the fact that she was like
the per First Lady's chief of staff, I thought was
an odd choice. So we still don't know who their
press secretary is for the Santos administration. Oh that I

(42:15):
could recall because but because Christian.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
Chenner were, Yes, he did, he did.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
I did that just for you, babe. It's a running
gag literally anyway. So anyway, they named me garoppolo as
like what was Toby's position, but he but there's no deputy.
Christian Chennerworth got sent to the First Lady as her
press secretary or like director of Communication with the jobs

(42:46):
titles she had, so like there what you know? The
one Gal was ends up being takes over Lily Tomlin's
job as the president'sy, like the the really hunky guy
looks like he the fucking new Charlie. He's like the
President's handler.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
What is the affair?

Speaker 1 (43:06):
Got the meat? No George Bush bit. So yeah, they
didn't carry everything over, And I thought, I thought the
obvious choice was to McDonald the Press Secretary. I would
have loved to have seen like six months later, you know,
I think the way and this is kind of transition
to the next thing I want to talk about. But

(43:26):
I really thought the ending that the series finale was
very anticlimactic. I did not love the way that we ended,
and part of it was I would have liked to
have seen a functioning Santos administration, and you know just
kind of like kind of like with the Wire, do
you know how the Wire had kind of a natural ending,

(43:46):
and then there's like an extra ten minutes of everyone
just doing stuff, okay, all right, and then we get
and then and then we get down in a hole
one more time. The reprise I wanted that. I wanted
like six months later and it's a day in the
life of the West Wing, and I thought it would

(44:06):
would have made more sense for Don And I wanted
to see Don dealing with the press because that's what
she'd been doing for the past season and a half, right,
So yeah, I thought that was weird. We're gonna have
to talk about the Toby's Toby stuff in a minute,
but before we do, I just kind of want to
stay on this. Uh only the Wire is the Wire?

Speaker 2 (44:30):
Correct?

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Yes? But there was a lot of great television stuff
in the Wire that could be emulated, is my point.
So one of the things I don't love about this
season is how much they spend on the campaign trail,
how much we're spending with Jimmy Smith's and Alan Alda
and not in the West Wing like the first four seasons.

(44:51):
What I loved about the West Wing, and I mentioned
this even when they did the when they did this
he was running for a second term stuff that I
as much as I, you know, find campaign politics interesting,
I like this show and I'm more interested in the
wonkiness of policy and politics than I am in campaign politics. Well, so,

(45:17):
like the first three to four seasons of the West Wing,
watching Josh un around and try to get policies passed
was more interesting to me than the campaign stuff. And
then this is almost entirely about the campaign between Santos
and Vinnick, which is okay, but it's it didn't feel

(45:41):
like the West Wing to me.

Speaker 2 (45:42):
Well, you got to think that they are probably wanting
to go I wouldn't say a different direction, but I
mean they've you can only go so far with the
wonkiness of policy. You know. I think if you sat
down and said, hey, I have this story to tell
about policy that was getting set up or you know,

(46:04):
all this which there is some crazy stories, but I
guarantee you there's more crazy campaign stories out there about
what they were trying to do to try and get elected,
and how they were trying to get over on the
opponent and and things like that. So I feel that
most likely the writers were just drawn to the excitement

(46:25):
of these campaigns and trying to also show you know,
I don't know if another show has ever done this.
Maybe they have, I don't know, but I mean they're
also trying to show what it goes in, what goes
into something like this from both sides and me personally,
I well, let me just say that your criticism you're
not alone. I mean, I've looked at other reviews of

(46:48):
the seventh season and the previous season and they said
pretty much the same thing. They did not like the
split between the two campaigns shows it does. It does.
A matter of fact, I think they're colored different too,
Like I don't know if you notice the color palette
looks a little bit different when they're hanging out with
the Democratic Party and then when they're doing a Republican Party.

(47:08):
It's a little bit different there.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
It's even like the West Wing feels different, like because
they've lost a lot of staff because of the Toby thing,
you know, like because a lot of the Kazakhstan storyline
eats up a lot of what happens in the West
Wing part of the show. It feels like a darker,
gloomier place. Like I remember saying when we reviewed the
first season that the music is so fucking goofy on

(47:32):
this show. But look, it's a happy place where we
have a lot of fun here. We're making policy, we're
appointing judges, we're doing politics. Welcome to the West Wing, everybody,
Like by the end of this where it's fucking Mortormy.
Just the end of the Return of the Republican's like,

(47:53):
what are we doing here? Everything is so fucking gloomy.
Everyone's like, like, CC, she's gonna kill herself by Oh.

Speaker 2 (48:01):
My gosh, you're right right. I think it's also tough
for them. I mean, we got a ton of characters.
If we didn't have enough characters before, gosh, now we
have two. We have two campaigns.

Speaker 1 (48:12):
That campaigns.

Speaker 2 (48:13):
Yeah, that we got to learn. You know. We got
Patricia Richardson and vin Alan Alda And this.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
Was like the like the major TV stars fucking season.
It really was were you a successful TV actor, come
on down, you're on the West Wing NOWO time?

Speaker 2 (48:30):
Or would you like a part? Okay? Yeah? Uh there was.
There was a lot of characters that they had to
try and deal with, which might have also that I
don't think that worked in the favor of the season
for sure, because it's tough, and I can understand the argument,
but for as for you know, as for hanging out
with them on the campaign trail, I was fine with it.
I didn't have any problem. I liked I liked watching

(48:51):
the intricacies of what was going on in them trying
to beat the other guy. What was the next strategy
going to be Josh about to lose his mind and
the process of losing his hair.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
On elections like my mother, Josh, Josh Josh.

Speaker 2 (49:10):
Yeah, it was all I mean again, I enjoyed. I
enjoyed what we got.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Yeah, so let's talk about Toby.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
Okay, So Toby.

Speaker 1 (49:19):
We find out the season that Toby is the one
that leaked the story about the about the malfunction I
guess on the space shuttle.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
I think it was like a top secret deal of
some sort.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
Yeah, Oliver Platt speaking of TV actors. He figures it
out and and Toby takes the hit on it, and
he doesn't want to give up his brother, so they
offer him a deal basically, you name a conspirator, you'll
skip prison, or you'll only go a year instead of
six years. And he won't, you know, and he won't
name his brother for whatever the reasons are. He ends

(49:52):
up getting I saw that coming a mile away. He
ends up getting pardoned by the president. But like, that
was another one where I it was so the fight
that happened between Toby and Josh last season had been
building up and building up, and you know, you me
and Andrew talked about that you guys had a different
perspective on than I did, which is fine. I kind

(50:12):
of wanted to see like Toby versus the President, you know,
because when when they did the whole thing where Martin
Sheen lies about having MS and Toby is over the
out of his fucking mind about it, like you are
playing with the presidency in a way that is disrespectful
to the office, to the American people. Like Toby is

(50:33):
really like condescending, fucking idealist, you know, He's just like
this is not how things should be. He is He
really is like the spiau Agnew of this show, where
he's so smart. He has absolutely no like people's skills
at all, you know he has. It's like he just
has this unbending way of like this is how it

(50:54):
should be and if it's not that, I'll just yell
until it is. And it's like all right, at this point,
we're all over you the yelling Toby. So the rest
of us are living in the real world, not in
you know, not in this. He reminds me a lot
of Robert. Actually, Toby and Robert very similar, like this
is the way it should be, and you know. If
you're not this way, you're wrong. And that's the way
it is. Okay, Well, it's a very lonely place to live.

(51:18):
I'm not going to debate you on those points.

Speaker 2 (51:19):
But I don't think. I don't think I want to
get anywhere. You know, you're not going to get anywhere
with Toby usually you're not. And and I mean.

Speaker 1 (51:28):
When you get to got Toby fucking fired from the
White House and almost into prison.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, uh, and then most of the
season is what I think. Earlier today I coined the
Toby palt where somebody comes up and tries to talk
to him and he gets all upset and dignant about something.
But you know, so you said you saw it coming

(51:53):
in a mile away, him getting pardoned. I assume correct. Yeah,
But the thing is is that you wonder if it's
going to happen. You know that most likely Jed's going
to air on the side of his friend.

Speaker 1 (52:05):
I got ahead of myself. I wanted so the bit
where he has to fire Toby. Toby your tries to resign,
He's like, no, I have to fire you, yea, And
I and and because again, because we'd already done the
bit with the MS A couple of seasons back, and
Toby got fucking loud with the President. I wanted there
to be like a knockdown, fucking screaming match between these two,

(52:26):
Like I wanted Martin Gen to fucking let them have it,
you know, like you So this might be some projection
on my part, but I really see thirty seconds ago,
I really wanted fucking Martin Gan to just let Toby
fucking have it. Man. I wanted to be like, you
are not the president, you know, blah blah. You don't
as smart as you are. You don't always know what's right.

(52:47):
You might sometimes the sometimes the the sum, the the
answer to the equation is not still the right answer.
It's something else.

Speaker 2 (52:58):
The thing is is that, I mean, I know you
wanted that, and that would have been fun. It would
have been fun to see. It probably would have made,
you know, some really interesting television because both of those
characters are so I wouldn't say hard headed, but they
are very resolute.

Speaker 1 (53:12):
Believing in Robert schiff a great orders, they are right.
They can deliver a line right. In one of my tiktoks,
I used the bit from the Two Cathedrals where he's
like did I displease you? You feckless thug? More of that.
I need that writing to come back.

Speaker 2 (53:27):
Yeah. But one of the things that we see a
lot of in this I say a lot of but
a few times in this series is playing chess. I
have a feeling that when these two guys looked at
each other, knew where each other stood, they were already
working each other like okay, three moves ahead and figured
out how things were going to end. There wasn't any
point to get into a shout and match. And you know,

(53:50):
those are some strong words by uh, those are some
strong words by the president where he's just like, you know,
you're going to walk out of this place and there
are going to be many people that call you a hero,
but do not think that I'm one of them. And
I think that's where you're at the end of this.
That's why, you know, with that pardon sitting there on

(54:10):
the desk forever and ever until finally he signs it,
you're wondering if he's going to do it or not.
Is he so steadfast in his beliefs that what Toby
did was wrong? Of course, you know he jud Jed
Bartlett has a compassionate side to him, and even the
even when he signs it, he pounds his fist into

(54:32):
the desk. Like right after he does that, Jed goes
boom and hits the desk because he knows, like he
I don't know if it's not a situation where he
thinks he shouldn't have done it. When you hate a guy,
there you go, there you go.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
Okay, and I fucking I think there's like real hatred there.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
You think there's hatred.

Speaker 1 (54:52):
It's the kind of hatred smart people have for each other.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
Okay, all right, Well there is that.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
There is that. There is the you're so smart, I
can't dismiss you. Well, you're so smart, I can't dismiss you. Yeah,
but I don't like any of what you're saying, and
I don't believe what you're saying. I don't think your
answers are the right answers. Well, I feel the same
way about you. And this is where smart people want
to punch each other in the face. And I think
that's it. Like Martin Sheen is like the super intellect

(55:19):
right part. President Bartlett is this you know again, he's
Democrat wish fulfillment. He is, you know, Spiro agnew and
a you know in a charming you know, with with
charm and good looks, uh, you know for an elder
white statesman. And and then here comes Toby, this angry Jew.
He's the renegade Jew. He's coming after you. And it's like, if.

Speaker 2 (55:44):
You're referencing something there, I gotta know what that is.

Speaker 1 (55:47):
Oh, look it up when we're done. Age. Okay, there's
an old Jewish rapper called A to the D and
he put and he put out a single, put out
a single called the Renn gains you.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
He's coming after you. You have now you know, you've
put this out there for the whole community. Whoever watches
his YouTube video to go and find I love I
Love that.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
A to the D. It was a single that was
making its way around people like in the mid to
late nineties, early two thousands.

Speaker 2 (56:20):
All Right, Toby's mad, Toby, Toby's Toby is upset.

Speaker 1 (56:24):
Go ahead, so like Toby's you know, Toby is a genius,
Bartlet's a genius. And they both they both kind of
it's Toby is that kind of genius. Well, I'll never
be the president, I'll never be the king, I'll never
be the leader. But I'm smart enough and I have
all the answers, and then this President Bartlet. But I'm

(56:46):
smart too, I'm I might even be smarter than you
in all the.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
Ways that matter. Both have convictions of what they believe
is right.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
Yeah. I again, I don't want to project too much
or you know, or or get into some countertransfer urns here,
but I feel I feel like President Bartlett at times,
and I have definitely met my fair share of Toby's Okay,
all right, then, Yeah, there's fucking hatred there, all right. Then,
when especially when you can't dismiss somebody for being a moron,
it's like you have to respect the fact they're just

(57:16):
as smart as you, if not in many ways smarter,
and you still are like and they don't respect you.
That's the thing. It's like, I don't think Toby had
a lot of respect for for Bartlett, you know, because
he was living in this very respect in the sense
of like he wanted Bartlett to do more, and Bartlett
was living in the real world with actual leavers of

(57:37):
political power that he had to work with.

Speaker 2 (57:39):
He had more respect for the presidency and what that
idea was.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
But not the guy.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
But not the guy or at least he thought the
guy that was in the role had a few shortcomings.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
And he found and Bartley I like, you know, look,
I don't think it's trong to have an ego and
Bartlett had one.

Speaker 2 (57:59):
How how many times is he going through and quoting
stuff from different places? And I could just be I mean,
if I was in the same room as Bartlett, I'd
believe immediately that's the problem. I can't let Hill.

Speaker 1 (58:15):
Talking.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
That's true, that's true, all right, right, So.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Yeah, the Kazakhstan stuff was was like the major plot
point of this of the of the season. Like once
they dealt with the league stuff, like the leak took
up you know, about a third of anything happening at
the White House. Then there was a lot of CJ
stuff and then Kazakhstan kind of takes up the rest
of it. And he thoughts about like the Kazakhstan storyline,

(58:49):
by the way, the fact they wrap that around the
wedding of his daughter and he and he finally tells,
like the Chinese Prime minister whatever, the premiere He's like,
please shut up, like your daughter married, and it's like
this silence and like yes, yeah, well then you know
what it's like, and my daughter's waiting on me. Please
don't invade the country while I'm dealing with his wedding.

Speaker 2 (59:10):
Just give me two hours, please, I've got to walk
her down the aisle.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
Within a human moment, it was like, please, they have
to a wedding, right a country.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
Yeah, and it almost felt well, I think when you
look at the campaign part of things, the Kazakhstan stuff
was really kind of background. Oh, here's a problem, you know. Okay,
what's the next day bringing? You know, how's this thing revolving? Uh?
What ends up happening is you know, it's going to
be dumped into the next Alex Lap. How are they

(59:39):
going to handle it? Uh? So, you know, as far
as thoughts on what they were doing there, that just
felt like to me kind of like, Okay, we got
a problem that's going to hover in the background a
little bit and cause a few wrinkles here and there
every episode. Uh but yeah, you know, speaking of Ellie,
by the way, the guy that she was marrying was
hitting way out of his weight class. What a NERD's

(01:00:05):
all right?

Speaker 1 (01:00:10):
Wow, you.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
Jesus Christ, let's take my glasses and go here. Okay,
what a nerd?

Speaker 1 (01:00:19):
Oh? My god, the to whatever. I think even.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
Jed Bartlett agrees with me that because I feel like
he said a couple of lines in this he's like
the Mayfly guy or whatever the hell he was. I
cannot remember what he was, what he was a part
of in his research. But anyway, so, uh, I don't
know what you got on the edgenda. Next, but we

(01:00:44):
got to talk about Leo.

Speaker 1 (01:00:46):
Oh yeah, give me a second, because I want to
talk about Santos in the first like in his wife. Okay,
then and then we can talk about Leo. Thank you,
because I actually almost forgot about that.

Speaker 2 (01:00:55):
Dude, not forget about Leo.

Speaker 1 (01:00:56):
Yeah, dude, let's not forget about Leo. I wanted to
bring her up because I think they did something pretty
cool with her. I think sometimes we forget that, like
the first lady doesn't always have to be this, you know,
there's no one kind of first lady, And I think
that this whole she has a line before he gets elected,
which is like, I don't even know if I want

(01:01:16):
him to win. I think through her, we deal the
very serious storyline of the cost of what it does
to everyone around you when you decide to run for
public office. You know, and yeah, she would obviously talk
to your spouse or whatever, and your spouse is like,
I support you, honey, but I don't think anyone truly

(01:01:39):
understands the scrutiny your family will go through and what
you're kind of being permissive about when you just when
you support your spouse and running for office, because no
one because you're not really thinking about the kinds of
things that are now going to happen to you. Like

(01:02:01):
look at the Halloween episode where the kids are part
of like a you know, a photo op, and there's
so much going on, no one's really watching the kids
and the kid one kid eats ice cream and vomit
on the one you know on this you know, it's
like your kids become your kids become props in you know,
in the in your presentation, you're you know, if they

(01:02:22):
can't get at you, they'll go after your family. Mm hm.
And look at the one episode where he leaves his
briefcase in the one room and Bruno gets it and
it's it's assumed he's cheating. He was cheating on his
wife and like paying some lady off, and he was
it was connected to his brother, and it's like but
all of this to kind of cover it up, and
no one would have cared had he not been running
for president.

Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Mm hm right, you.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
Know, And again I was I laughed at that, like
Vinick was above it all, like here, just here's a
briefcase back, don't you know if you're hiding something, don't
hide something like get out in front of this. And
he's like, right, you know, like sure, that's what would
have happened, Like they wouldn't have fucking flastered his notes
all over the front page of the New York Times.

Speaker 2 (01:02:58):
Are you a setic Mark? I mean, come on now,
fuck up, jaded.

Speaker 1 (01:03:08):
Everyone's smarter than me is a nerd, and everyone dune
with than me is an idiot.

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
Absolutely yes.

Speaker 1 (01:03:14):
But my favorite thing that she does, you know, so
like through her you kind of get that struggle of like,
I'm not the one running for president. I didn't really
sign on for this, and I don't feel like, you know.
And then they're like they're gonna try to stay in
Texas and they really can't.

Speaker 2 (01:03:27):
It's too much of a thing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
They can't.

Speaker 2 (01:03:28):
You can't sport the party, right. What's his name walks
out of the room as soon as he hears that
He's like, I'll be right back. Yeah, he knows. It's
gonna be a very Santa's line.

Speaker 1 (01:03:38):
As I would drive you to the airport if it
didn't involve.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
Right, I'm gonna go check the mail. Well, let us
shut down the street first.

Speaker 1 (01:03:45):
Look, if I ran for president, like I can't run
for president, I'm not going to not a fucking fifty
years old and not a single tread of political uh uh,
you know experience. But let's assume tomorrow I ran for presidency.
What are the amount of people like you know, they
would they would look at you. I have, you know,
I have a long standing, very public relationship with you.
They would look at Robert, my kids, look at my

(01:04:06):
ex wife, look at my ninety seven girlfriends. I've had
just the fast five.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
Years alone, forty five of them at once.

Speaker 1 (01:04:13):
Yes, at the same time. Baby. But none of these
people agreed to this, you know what I mean. But
you're a part of it, and you're in your fair
game unfortunately. And I hate to be the one to
say this, but because I don't think it is fair.
But that's you know, like that line, that's like that
line drives me crazy when you hear reporters say it

(01:04:34):
both in fiction and real life. The public has a
right to know. Really, the public has a right to
know about my dating life. The public has a right
to like dig into, you know, dig into the lives
of those who whose only sin was that one time
they loved me and maybe still do and for that
they have to have that whole life blown up. Because
I want to be president. So our friend here from

(01:04:56):
Europe was like, what's your policies?

Speaker 2 (01:04:57):
Be?

Speaker 1 (01:04:58):
Oh boy, you have an hour. I'm well, I will
say the stuff I've already said in various TV parties.
I am a fan of drug decriminalization and harm reduction.
I am pro choice, pro choice, but I am not
a huge fan of abortion. I'm just not. I'm just
even less of a fan of prohibition of any kind.

(01:05:19):
I have a very libertarian speak in me. Uh, I'm
I'm pretty much a fiscal conservative. But I don't know
if you've ever looked at the US federal budget, it's
like ninety military spending and social security. That's it. Like
I I they and you know this because they just
fucking did the whole thing with doge and dog like
we're call those weightsful spending and then it was like, well,
we can't touch the military, so there's two thirds of it,

(01:05:43):
and we can't touch fucking social security and medic air
and whatever else. So there's the other fucking third. So
what's left is like the buck fifty we spend on
social services. Yep, Like our federal budget is ridiculous. You know,
I would love to see term limits and a line
item veto, but you know, no one would, No one

(01:06:04):
will agree to that, though it's been brought up many
many times. I don't know. I don't uh, trying to
think of like what the big issues are. Oh, I'm
pro gun control, but mostly I don't want like insane
people and criminals to have them, and I don't think
we should have, you know, And I don't think we
should have the same kind of weapons the military has.

(01:06:26):
I think it's a real which I think is a
reasonable policy.

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
But you've already said pro nuclear power, right.

Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
Yeah, I'm I'm I'm definitely for alternative energy. I would
like to get off oil as soon as possible, but
I'm not going back to living in a cave either,
you know, Yeah, right right. I don't think we should
be drilling in national wildlife preserves and like it's like, oh,
just it's just a little bit of Alaska or Antartica,
whatever the fuck it is they want to drill in.
It's like, how about none of it? How about just
do something else? Like that line always bothered me because

(01:06:53):
and I mentioned it because they mentioned it in the show.
Finnick brings it up. He's like, right, like, well, just
going to drill the small part of it. That's how
it starts. First, it's a small part of it, and
then there's nothing left.

Speaker 2 (01:07:04):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:07:05):
We also were like, oh, we're just gonna burn down
a little bit of the rainforest. Okay, it never stops.

Speaker 2 (01:07:10):
That's the problem, that's right.

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
You know. So at this I'm not running for president, So.

Speaker 2 (01:07:16):
Not running for president some.

Speaker 1 (01:07:17):
Of my ideas anyway you want to talk about, Oh
so I wanted to say this and get your thoughts
on the first on Santos's wife when they when he
finally does get elected, and then kind of like the
other side of this is again, you never signed on
for any of this stuff. You don't realize how much
of it of your life it's gonna get eaten up
by the presidency. That you're not the one that's president.
When she goes to the residence and she meets the

(01:07:39):
fucking staff and it's like that scene in Annie where
they sing You're gonna like it here.

Speaker 2 (01:07:46):
That's what I thought of.

Speaker 1 (01:07:47):
I was like, she walks in that room and and
I wanted to do the You're gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
Like it here song. Yes, yeah, Like if you've.

Speaker 1 (01:07:54):
Ever seen the original Annie, there's a whole thing with
the fucking staff just sings to her. Missus Pew comes
to take it away. I wanted that. I don't wanted
them to break in the song.

Speaker 2 (01:08:10):
Yeah, there is a lot of opulence that they I
don't think she was expecting.

Speaker 1 (01:08:16):
For a country that doesn't have royalty, right, dude, right,
But just in them taking the Bartlet stuff down and
putting up the Santo stuff, like the amount of meticulous
attention of dressing the White House because god forbid, you
don't have your personal stink on the plate.

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
It was the one, the one lady that comes up
to her and says, we're wanting to redecorate, but we
only have a modest budget. And she's like, what's the
budget two hundred thousand dollars, But if you want to
do some fundraising, we can get it to a million
and she's just about falls over right. It's like, that's

(01:08:54):
just redecorating him.

Speaker 1 (01:08:55):
I went from a mom and put fuck Texas to this.
I feel skip the.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
Step right right, She's yeah, yeah, ly show oh right, perfect, perfect,
But yeah, I mean she's as we watch her and
grow to know this character, know this character throughout the
time that we spend with her, clearly she's she's very

(01:09:23):
down to earth and yeah, this is a this is
a change. This is a big change that has to happen.
And and you're right, you know now that Santos is
in the limelight. My goodness, he's going to be the
next president. Possibly there is. There are targets on their
back for things, and they have the whole They have

(01:09:45):
the whole like scene where the security guards are talking
to the kids and trying to explain to them. You know,
if somebody comes up and wants to give you something
to give to daddy, do you give it to your dad? No?
And then the mom's like, oh my gosh, what is happening?
You know, she she can't believe, like all of this
is happening, and how scary it would be for a

(01:10:06):
child to experience all that so very uh, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:10):
The way again crushed a lot of families, like the
Otter Girls will never be the same again.

Speaker 2 (01:10:15):
I'm sure, you know, I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
I mean, I think I mentioned this in a previous show.
Chelsea Clinton took a beating, and yes she did, like
she seems to have recovered nicely and has made a
life for herself. But I think if Chelsea, you know,
daimed to ever come on TV party tonight be like, hey,
what was it like for you? Like the lights would
come down and be like the year was nineteen ninety, It.

Speaker 2 (01:10:38):
Kind of crossed my mind today. I'm sure there's got
to be some books out there, you know, these kids
that experience life in the White House and what it
was like. I'm sure it was. Those would be an
interesting read.

Speaker 1 (01:10:48):
Right even I know we mentioned this the last time,
Like the Obama girls, like they were mostly kept out
in but you can't keep mount entirely right, you know,
Like I think the Obamas did a really good job
of limiting their exposure and the press didn't go after
them the way they went after some of these other kids.
But still, like you still have to live that life,
you know, you still have to like and then it's

(01:11:08):
so funny. It's like you get used to the royal
treatment and then you're like, all right, you sexist shit,
you're out now.

Speaker 2 (01:11:14):
You know you're out of here, right job.

Speaker 1 (01:11:18):
It was a little bit of Bartlett and Abbey good
old Stocker chatting, like just kind of having that feeling like, oh,
we're old news. Now it comes to sexy new couple.
M h right, all right, I'm gonna let you leave
the discussion on Leo Well.

Speaker 2 (01:11:30):
I mean, look, uh, I don't know when it was.
It might have been at the end of last season
where I learned John Spencer had passed away. In the
middle of this season, it was December. I don't have
the date in front of me when he passed away.
I feel like it was early December when he did.
I could be wrong, but it was December of two

(01:11:52):
thousand and five. So the big question I had in
my mind was like, I mean, that's that's huge. Is
that going to impact the seventh season in any way?
Or is it a situation where they were able to
film all these episodes, have no idea what the TV
schedule was like.

Speaker 1 (01:12:10):
To assume they had they had prepared scripts already and
then they had to throw those scripts out.

Speaker 2 (01:12:15):
Okay, all right, well yeah, I could see that for Rember.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
They probably had before modern movie history, where we're writing
things on the fly as we're shooting the movie. They
used to be, right, They used to be propriety in Hollywood,
where you had to have everything locked ahead of time
and then you shot.

Speaker 2 (01:12:32):
That's kind of where I wish Andrew Graham was here,
because I bet you he would know what possibly those
other scripts look like. And that's probably pretty easily defined
on the internet. I did not go looking, but.

Speaker 1 (01:12:43):
John Spencer stamps Jimmy Smit's in the back now line
the president.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Oh what a turn. I wasn't expecting that, But yeah,
I mean this there.

Speaker 1 (01:12:56):
Can be only one because for some reason, I think
John Spencer is the island.

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
There, and they would have never they would have they
would have continued to like season thirteen on this thing,
I guarantee it. So yeah, that was kind of what
was at the forefront of my mind, is like, okay,
he's I know, he passes away during the season. Did
they have everything filmed beforehand? Turns out that is not
the case, so uh yeah, we end up losing him

(01:13:26):
at goodness. I want to say his episode, well, it's
right right before the right when they call the election.
That's when we find out as far as the character
Leo goes, he passes away, but we find out that
John Spencer dies much earlier because Charlie Charlie Charlie Martin

(01:13:47):
Martin Sheen comes out and delivers a small speech at
the beginning of one episode, which is Leo's VP debate,
I believe and what First off, he dies of a
heart attack, which in real life he dies of a
heart attack, which is you know, eerily similar to what
happened to him last season, right, So that's that's there

(01:14:13):
the episode that they feature and they announce his death
on where they feature him. It was such a great episode.
You can watch John Spencer b Leo and Leo's crafty
and I swear because he's having problems. Everybody's thinking he's
going to have problems with the debate. He's going to
continue because he's not there. They're practicing and he's just

(01:14:36):
keeps failing at it and failing at it. And then
there's a point where I was like, I think Leo's
just making every well. He was leaking to the press
that he was doing bad himself. Everybody's trying to figure
out who's leaking that Leo sucks at these debate questions
that they're preparing for, and it turns out it was Leo.
And I feel like, you know, Leo was just being

(01:14:59):
crafty and trying to get the public sentiment to think
one way, and then when he finally gets out there,
he crushes.

Speaker 1 (01:15:04):
That's why he got the VP nomination. Wasn't to win
any states. It was to have that experience on the campaign, right,
because he knows all the dirty tricks.

Speaker 2 (01:15:16):
Yeah, so that episode alone is great. I love the
fact that they were able to feature because it's it's
just a straight up Leo episode. You don't get very
many of these, even prior to when he passes away
in the show. Ye now, let's you know. I want
to ask you, how did the episode hit you? How

(01:15:39):
did the moment hit you when when when you find
out that Leo dies? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:15:43):
No, I cried a lot like that. Really it upset me.
I loved it. I talked in previous reviews. I love
John Spencer. I think he's great on this show. I
will some of the stuff now lives rent free in
my head, like little things will replay over and over
and fucking what's a secretary's name that ends up?

Speaker 2 (01:16:01):
Margaret? Margaret?

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
And Margaret was like, I can I can sign the
letter for the president. I can. I've got to say
nature down And he's like, do you think that'll work?
And he's like, it's a coudata yea. The way she
delivered that line, you know, when he's trying to soothe
Josh and he's like, we govern what is it we governed? Oh,
we governed, We we run in poetry, we govern in pros.

(01:16:27):
You know, Like what a great line that is. And
the way he delivered it is excellent. You know, this
is the worst part of your liberalism. He has some
fucking banger lines throughout this series, and I think that's
also what I was missing here was, you know, we
got more emotion out of Martin Sheen when missus Langham

(01:16:47):
died whatever the fuck her name is, you know him
him at the does she die in the second season?

Speaker 2 (01:16:55):
Oh? I goodness, I think I think so. I feel
like that's the case.

Speaker 1 (01:17:00):
Yeah, at the end of Two Cathedrals is the season
two finale?

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:17:07):
And she dies then and he's like, you know, and
you know, and he's arguing with God about it, Like
I wanted that here, Like, you know, it's it's Leo
in this world. It's Leo that got him to run
for president. It's Leo that got him out of retirement.
Essentially in New Hampshire, it's Leo who you know. They
have this really great relationship, you know. At one point, Martin, Martin,

(01:17:29):
she's talking to somebody and he's just like, get yourself
a best friend and make sure he's smarter than you.
Like there's a lot of love between brothers there and
I and I and I wanted more of that, like
I wanted, you know, I want I wanted Leo's death
to mean more to Martin Sheen and I feel like
the writers of this season didn't really grab onto that

(01:17:50):
that I think, you know, they should have. Like this
is one of the examples of why I don't love
this season. I don't feel like the writers of this
really off the characters the way they should have. So
there are elements of drama. I kind of want to
reference it again. I thought, I'm trying to think of

(01:18:13):
something else that we've done. Wu Tang and American saga there.
You know, there's there there were relationships that were frayed
by the end of that were you because you were
on that journey with them, you know, by the time
it's over, you're like, it's really heartbreaking here. I feel

(01:18:36):
like they were so concerned with wanting to get these
progressive Hollywood ideas out in the show. They were, you know,
so busy building this fantasy world where Republicans don't deal
with the Christian right at all, or you know, I
think it's I think it's as dumb as the Hollywood
elites do. That we never got the right kind of

(01:18:57):
character interactions that we should have. Leo's death should have
crushed Bartlett, and I don't feel like we ever got that.

Speaker 2 (01:19:08):
Well, there's a moment I think in the funeral episode,
which I think is episode seventeen, where he is I
think he's talking to CJ about it and he or
maybe it was a group of people, because you know,
during the way he's talking to people, but there's a
personal moment where he says, you know, we were kind

(01:19:32):
of ready for this previously, and he was mentioning something
that happened before the heart attack, that the heart attack
angle that happened in season six, but you could tell
that this was something that he sort of knew was
going to happen. But I think he even says that
he certainly wasn't expecting get to happen like this. The

(01:19:55):
moment that stood out to me that made me go okay,
and I see what you're saying. You feel like you
should have been able to see Bartlet go through some
of the trauma of losing his best friend.

Speaker 1 (01:20:11):
Dude, he loses missus Langham Schmid or whatever the hell
her name is. You know, his wife for a while,
doesn't want to be around him. His best friend's gone.

Speaker 2 (01:20:22):
Yeah, he suffers a lot of loss, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:25):
You know, and like not only that, but like you know,
Toby's gone, Josh is gone. They led you to believe
in the first four seasons that this was a really
solid team and that yeah, he's the head guy in charge,
but he was supported by these really talented, smart people.

(01:20:48):
They all kind of loved each other, and that relationship
is so beyond fractured.

Speaker 2 (01:20:55):
Yeah, And like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:57):
I'm like, no, no, no, If it's gonna be like that,
then it needs we need more of this on screen.
And it's not happening. It's almost like the writers don't
didn't really understand the relationship between him and Leo the
way that it was portrayed in the first four seasons.

Speaker 2 (01:21:13):
The moment that struck me where I could tell that
Bartlett was suffering was where he's getting ready for the
wake and I think Stockard Chanting, his wife, you know,
is sitting there and she kind of looks over at him,
and he just he's you could tell that he is
just emotionally drained and he now has to go out

(01:21:38):
and be not only President of the United States with
all these people that are at his wake, but also
you know, kind of make other people feel good when
he feels absolutely crushed. So he kind of puts his
cuff links on and he's just kind of and then
he kind of takes a big deep breath in and

(01:21:59):
then walks out the door. And there's also a moment
and I so identify with this where he is with
everybody in the room and they're telling Leo's stories and
their story after story, and Abby of course is like, hey,
it's ten thirty, it's getting late. It's time to go
to bed, and he's like, no, it's not getting late.

(01:22:19):
And that's not him just because he wants to stick
around and tell stories. That's because he doesn't want to
be alone. He doesn't want to have to think about
what happened. And it's been coming and he's in the
company of friends, and he knows that once they leave,
that's when the real thoughts start coming in.

Speaker 1 (01:22:35):
Yeah, all right, before we get out of here, and
I let you do your notes, we've talked almost nothing
about actual Jimmy Smitz.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
Jimmy Smitz, Jimmy Smitz.

Speaker 1 (01:22:48):
I mean again, I think the episode where I was
feeling him the most was the bit where he has
to deal with the kid that gets shot by the cop,
and more importantly, he's like, why is it Why am
I the being held like responsible or some sort of
like spokesperson like, because I'm Latino, I'm now responsible for
what every Latino boy does?

Speaker 2 (01:23:09):
You know?

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
Like there were no, there were He doesn't want to
exploit the family, but they were like, but it's you're
running for president. You kind of have to address this, right,
you know. And then he gets there and like the
one that I think it's like the brother or something
that was like you're blocking the street. His family belongs here,
you don't, and he's like, what he's supposed to say
to that?

Speaker 2 (01:23:26):
Just get the hell out.

Speaker 1 (01:23:27):
You smile and say I'm sorry, and then you leave. Yep,
that's a rough set of episodes. I I like Jimmy
Smith's He's a fine actor. I think he plays a
role really, really well. I don't love that character like
Santos again, it's democrat wish fulfillment. You know. I love

(01:23:49):
the debate episode because, well, not as it was nonsense,
it was interesting to kind of hear two moderate people
discuss ideas the way we do, you know, when we're
when it comes up on these shows. You know, I've
said it before, like one of the reasons why I
like doing Damiel Hollywood is Robert and I, you know,
and some of the TV parties that we've done, Robert

(01:24:12):
and I really kicked around some issues. Like one of
my favorite podcasts that Robert and I ever did was
when we talked Not Jupiter, Jupiter's Legacy, because that dovetailed
into a lot of different like political stuff that that
show covers, Like we had a really extended discussion about
the death penalty and things like that. So that's kind

(01:24:32):
of what they do in that, Like they they discussed
there are no there are no pots, there are no
easy answers, there are no pie in the sky solutions.
Everything has a cost. There's a really you know when
they were talking about you know, when Alvis like I
want to do tax cuts and you know, and oh,
they're talking about healthcare, like talk to people in Europe
and Canada who have universal health care. They'll tell you

(01:24:54):
what the problems are. They're happy to like they were like,
we wish we could we had helped, you know it.
Some of them talk about it's great to have universal
health care. I never have to worry about not having
health care. It's not great that I have to wait
forever to see a doctor mm hm. And there were
certain you know, there are certain things they're not going
to deal with. So so so you know, the guy

(01:25:17):
was asking me before, like what in some of your policies,
Like I've put it out there, I think Medicaid should
be available to everybody, or you know, just get rid
of Medicaid entirely and just make Medicare the National Health insurance.
Will people will some people choose that sure will some
employers stop offering healthcare sure others don't. Like That's that's

(01:25:39):
the weird thing about the market is you don't really
know what's going to happen. It'll change the the you know,
the country will change when there's universal health care available
to you know, through through the auspices of Medicare. But
and it's it's hard to know what that's going to
look like. But the but I brought it up because

(01:25:59):
they talked about it. Uh they they talked about that
in the debate episode. And you know in Santos and
Santos is the one that that literally says like either
I think he says Medicaid for everybody or Medicare for
everybody that like Medicare, I think I think it's Medicare.
It's like Medicare is like the best, like healthcare on

(01:26:19):
the platter or something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:26:21):
All you know, the problem is is that it's like
bogged down, not not Medicare, but the private insurance is
bogged down by paperwork, if I remember correctly, that was
kind of like his argument and like governmental paperwork though
for Medicare is two percent. But anyway, yeah, I mean,

(01:26:42):
so your your thoughts here that you just feel like
Santos or Jimmy Smitz's portrayal of Santos wasn't wasn't wrote.

Speaker 1 (01:26:52):
They wrote him like he's just the most perfect democrat.

Speaker 2 (01:26:55):
Okay, all right, you know, I mean, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (01:26:59):
It's not him, it's not his performance. It's the writing
I have an issue with.

Speaker 2 (01:27:03):
Okay, all right, I mean, look, I I'm the last
person that's going to be criticizing somebody for what party
they portray, because a lot of times I am oblivious
to some of the I mean, who somebody who Let's
try it again. The impression I got was this is

(01:27:24):
somebody who was trying to do something good for our
nation and uh people, And what we realized here Vinnick
and Santos both have a vision for our nation and
both want good things to happen for our nation.

Speaker 1 (01:27:45):
Yeah, I will tell you this. Like x vinix commentary
about Santos is every Santo's policy is more is spend
more money. And he was like, we have met, like
they were talking about head start specifically, and he was like,
we've we've got data that says head start doesn't work, though,
like and you can throw more money at this, and
this is why, like I tenderly conservative on some things

(01:28:07):
and others, because I also am a big fan of
like at the federal level, could we get you know,
I'm not a huge fan of the federal government being
involved in state level things like preventing slavery, sure making sure,
making sure we have interesting commerce. Absolutely, military spending big fan.
Not maybe to the point where it's two thirds of

(01:28:28):
the fucking budget. But that's a whole other conversation, right,
But it's one of the things I don't love about
Democrat policies is their solution to everything is more federal overreach. Sorry,
I've been to social working for the past twenty five years.
I've seen I've seen what federal overreach does. It's like
a It's like a blind man trying to feel his

(01:28:50):
way around a party.

Speaker 2 (01:28:55):
Oh man, you know looking at talking about the live debate,
just real quick, because I wanted to ask you this
after I watched the show, watched the episode who do
you think one? Who would you? Who would you have said?
One that debate?

Speaker 1 (01:29:11):
I had agreed with the way the show handled it.
I thought it was a tie.

Speaker 2 (01:29:13):
No, you thought it was tie? Okay, Yeah, I thought
Vinnick came away stronger. I was like, as far as
this live debate thing went, I thought it was a
neat experiment for a TV show, And I thought, and
I think a lot of that has to do with
Alan Alda and how well of an actor he is,
and yeah, you know, how good let's try that. How
good of an actor he is. But yeah, yeah, yeah,

(01:29:36):
I really enjoyed that part of it. So yeah, as
far as like who I agreed with, I was like, well,
Vinnick's coming off here pretty good. I think he actually
handled this one pretty well.

Speaker 1 (01:29:45):
It's a lot of like so the Republicans always feel
like Dad, you know, like like Dad has entered the room.
It's like, you can't just spend all of your money
on you know, on prostitutes and drugs. You have to actually,
you know, the on propriety. And the Democrats are just like, no,
every every solution had every solution, every issue has a solution.

(01:30:07):
We just spend more money on this, you know. Like
so again, because I tend to have a lot of
conservative leadings, but I'm from very like liberal cultures. Like
I remember a bump a bumper sticker around where I
used to live that a lot of people had. It
was like I long for the day that the Air
Force has to have a bake sale to buy a bomber,
and schools have what they need, you know, because again,

(01:30:31):
schools have bake sales.

Speaker 2 (01:30:32):
Get it, I do.

Speaker 1 (01:30:36):
But we've also, since you know, since No Child Left Behind,
I have thrown a lot of money at education throughout
through the country. And I don't know if you've talked
to people who teach these days, I've got the sentiment
we've been of a struggle in the last year odd years. Yep, yeah, yeah,
you know, maybe maybe throwing money at the schools is

(01:30:56):
not always the answer. I'm just gonna throw that out there.

Speaker 2 (01:31:01):
Though.

Speaker 1 (01:31:01):
I do like our current federal policy of women hate
men and don't want to have their babies, which, you know,
good on you. And this government solution is what if
we give you money? Is that?

Speaker 2 (01:31:11):
What is that what they've landed on.

Speaker 1 (01:31:13):
Yes, you, you don't spend enough time on TikTok. There's
a lot of women out there doing tiktoks about like
the five thousand dollars, like fucking bonus check if you.

Speaker 2 (01:31:21):
Have Oh okay, yeah, I remember hearing a little bit
about this.

Speaker 1 (01:31:24):
Yeah, and women are just like, nope, no thanks.

Speaker 2 (01:31:28):
Our paths and a little bit more expensive than that
and a little Oh my gosh, I only want to
I mean, not just money wise, but let's talk about
your time and energy that you're going to spend on
raising that kid.

Speaker 1 (01:31:44):
Yeah, that five thousand dollars is gonna go quick, especially now.

Speaker 2 (01:31:47):
It better be five thousand a week. Really, it might
make that might actually be worth it.

Speaker 1 (01:31:53):
All right, I got nothing, You got anything else before
your list?

Speaker 2 (01:31:56):
I do have my list here, but I do also
want to give and Drew Graham's notes A. I don't
know if you looked at them, and we've already talked
about him or not, but he sent us something over,
didn't he? And I would gladly.

Speaker 1 (01:32:09):
I don't know. I haven't really been trying to be
on messenger lately because okay, I had, you know, I'm
just busy. I just got back from I was out
of town for a week Erica and I went to
go see toe with the whatsbro.

Speaker 2 (01:32:19):
That's right, Jef. I forgot all about that.

Speaker 1 (01:32:22):
So I was trying to not be on my phone
as much.

Speaker 2 (01:32:24):
Believe it or not. Well, he did send us some stuff,
so take care of this for me, Deputy. He sent
us some stuff Bear with me. I'm going to read
and you are going to feel free to jump in
at any point here, okay and comment on what he says.
All right? Uh yeah, and thank goodness he apologized for

(01:32:45):
the length of the notes. Wait, all right, way to
go a Canadian apologizing we love you, Andrew. All right,
So you need to start at the beginning. The cold
open does not work. Glad he starts there. I do
want to say that I went back, like I said
at the end of this episode, and watched it, and

(01:33:05):
it is weird now that you think about it, like, Okay,
we're the very first episode there, I don't know, maybe
three years ahead, and I thought we were going to
revisit it because they're opening up to the Josiah Bartlet,
Jedediah whatever Bartlett library, and they kind of, oh, here

(01:33:31):
comes Josh, comes in, Here comes to President. We've seen
that Danny and CJ have had a baby. Oh wow, okay,
Toby's there, so that kind of spoils that because he's
there and they you know, he shakes hand with Bartlett,
shakes hands with Bartlett, Will and Kate, by the way,
who become a thing, a definite thing, And there are

(01:33:51):
a lot of romances going on in this In this season,
Will and Kate are a are a couple at the
end of this season, but when we look at this
flash forward, they're not standing by each other and between
them sits Charlie. Now that doesn't I mean, I'm just
that's subtle. But yeah, I agree, it doesn't work. I
think the biggest criticism I have about that is that

(01:34:14):
they didn't go back and revisit it at the end.

Speaker 1 (01:34:16):
That's what I'm saying, like I needed that at the end.

Speaker 2 (01:34:19):
Right needed to see something. So yeah, he says, doesn't
go anywhere. It doesn't pay off, and it kills some
tension later in the season. For example CJ and Danny,
which yeah they are they will they or won't they?
Is CJ going to make her career choice and Danny's
going to be left behind? Well we already know how
that's going to end by that little open in the
first first episode. Right. Main thrust of the season is

(01:34:42):
the campaign, and they pull a nice little film short
hand with keeping the White House episodes in the traditional
West Wing style while keeping the campaign trail episodes handheld
and rougher. I'll agree with that. I know Mark has
some valid reservations about the idealism of the campaign. I

(01:35:02):
like a lot of this in terms of showing the
swings and momentum, pop up issues and how each team
reacts to them and the sheer bloody exhaustion. I'm glad
he weighed in on that, yeah, because I mean, like
we said, Josh is pretty much at his wits, and
Josh look he's drinking like he's like, you know, drinking
MAYLOCKX or whatever it is, and acid that when.

Speaker 1 (01:35:24):
Rob finally tells him, get the fuck out. If you
don't go, I will right right like he looks gross, he.

Speaker 2 (01:35:33):
Onster he does. He's falling apart, Yeah, he says, Speaking
of the teams, I like how they filled out each
campaign staff with a character point of point of view
and made it feel like either side could win. I
felt like that as well. We got to see each
team under pressure and making decisions. Definitely, as noted, Josh
continues to be the focus of the season and the

(01:35:54):
main character. We continue to see him evolve and devolve
throughout the course of the season, some times being the
cool professional and sometimes reverting to his more manic control
freak tendencies when the deep exhaustion sets in him.

Speaker 1 (01:36:08):
Screaming on election night was hilarious to me, right like,
because everyone's like, oh my god, like we could win
this thing. We're doing so well, and John's like not
good enough.

Speaker 2 (01:36:18):
It's like watching watching him and Ron Silver like obsess
over these numbers and polls. Oh, you can just tell,
like their brains are just you know, they're short circuiting
because they believe something should have happened and it's not.
These numbers are wrong. Okay, next Tay.

Speaker 1 (01:36:39):
That's that's a real thing. So John Kerry, I'll never
forget this because Sean Hannedy sounded like he was gonna
kill himself on air.

Speaker 2 (01:36:48):
Oh goodness, John.

Speaker 1 (01:36:50):
The exit polling for John Kerry mid day through the
two thousand and four election, I think it was had
John Carry up like he was the presumption like winner
of that election. He ends up getting beaten pretty handily
by George Bush. But when the Sean Hannity Show was
on the air, which was sometime around three o'clock in
the afternoon Eastern Standard time. By that point, a lot

(01:37:13):
of the exit polling had shown like John carry was
going to run away with it, and Sean and I
swear to god, Sean Hannity never sounded more depressed, And
you're like, it's just you can't you know a lot
of times like exit polling is wrong because you know
what an exit poll is. Hey, who'd you vote for? Yeah?
Like I don't know. You seem the kind of person

(01:37:33):
who wants me to vote for the other guy, so him, yep, yeah,
Like that's not what you did though, you know, it's.

Speaker 2 (01:37:39):
Not a good representation.

Speaker 1 (01:37:41):
Every election we go through. This is why I don't
pay that cloes attention. Every election shows polling data ends
up being wildly skewed. Actually continue reading. I want to
check something really quick.

Speaker 2 (01:37:53):
Okay, all right, well this is what you just said.
Kind of ties in and talking about you know what
having with John Carrey speaking of exhaustion. Man, does Jimmy
Smith show how hard this hits him? As the campaign
goes on that moment where they're kind of focusing on
everybody getting just on each other's nerves because they're all
so tired. Jimmy Smith's eyes are like just caked and black.

(01:38:16):
You could tell he is just war out. Smit's and
Terry Polo continue to have great chemistry and are eclipsed
only by the Bartlets in term of marital chemistry. Side note,
the entire Cleveland bedside story like, yeah, the one where
the bed was the bed was supposed to be still reinforced.
I mean, come on, oh yeah, by the she has

(01:38:39):
a did she have a tramp stamp? I don't remember
she had a We definitely got to see that thong
to thong, thong thong. I remember that much that happened.
That was that was a big news story. But anyway,
side note, the entire Cleveland bedside story was a hilarious
moment in the season. Yes, it was funny. Uh, you
just pop in here if you find what you're looking for.

Speaker 1 (01:38:59):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (01:39:00):
Speaking of bed damage, hallelujah, Josh and Donna finally get together.
The team had a lot of fun with the post
get together awkwardness through though. They move in a pleasantly
mature mark don't go there, he puts in parentheses. Love
how he knows where you're going. They move in a
pleasantly mature in terms of conversations they have on the

(01:39:24):
future of their relationship. I agree, since good things Coming.
Three also really enjoyed conversations between CJ and Danny on
their next steps.

Speaker 1 (01:39:34):
Yeah, that poor fucking Danny like this, I've never felt
so bad for a guy in my life.

Speaker 2 (01:39:41):
That I think it's that. It might have been in
the second and last episode where yeah, because they close
out the show where CJ shows up at his apartment
and this is just like shortly after earlier that day.
She didn't she did not blink. When he's like, your

(01:40:01):
future is you see a future without me, don't you?
I'm not in the picture. He's like, oh, okay, that's great.
And then he goes off and I don't think he
expects to see CJ again, And of course, you know,
CJ goes visit Toby and then she ends up back
at Danny's place.

Speaker 1 (01:40:16):
Going what this show? I'm gonna read the summation what
the show's twenty year pattern. National polls usually mirror the
results within one to three points. Two thousand and eight,
two thousand and four were spot on. Twenty twelve and
twenty twenty were larger national misses, one overstated, one one understated,
one overstated. State polling eras matter for more for her wins.

(01:40:37):
In twenty sixteen, the national miss was one point, but
late state polling in upper Midwest was off to flip
the electoral college. Twenty twenty also saw state level democratic
overestimation in several battlegrounds. Post Mortems point to things like respondents,
non response, especially among working class voters, late movement, and
waiting challenges. Waiting challenges. These dynamic drove the eight misses

(01:41:00):
in twenty sixteen and the national state overstatement in Democrats
in twenty twenty. Keep going, but that's different than what
I thought.

Speaker 2 (01:41:10):
Okay, all right, so can you sum that up for
me one more time? What you were reading?

Speaker 1 (01:41:14):
Well, you keep going. I'm gonna I'll get back to
you in a second.

Speaker 2 (01:41:16):
All right, Okay, So, yeah, Andrew's talking about the I
just want to talk speech that Danny gives CJ finishing
out the campaign. I like how it moves to the
idea of transition, setting up staff dealing with legacy issues
from the past administrative administrations, such as Kazakhstan moving to
the White House. The season starts off with the blowback

(01:41:40):
from the military shuttle leak. A lot of the investigation
elements call back to the MS storyline, but I found
the Toby reveal and following episode Gone Tomorrow to be
among the best moments of the season and series. Toby
is then off routed into his own storyline with dealing
with the fallout of the leak, while occasionally interacting and

(01:42:01):
counseling Josh and CJ on both professional and personal matters. Yeah,
you know, Toby gets We don't see much of Toby
like we used to in previous seasons since he's you know,
the big thing is hit and he's kind of confined
to his home, and every once in a while we'll
see a phone call between him and Josh or him
and CJ. Next up when the.

Speaker 1 (01:42:24):
More bottom line, you're absolutely right to pinpoint two thousand
and four as a vivid example, early exit pol data
gave the public and likely campaign insiders a misleading sense
of Kerry had it within reach. In reality, those numbers
reflected incomplete and skewed data, not the final outcome. Exit
pultry mean useful tools for trend spotting and demographic insight,
but It's two thousand and four showed they must be

(01:42:46):
interpreted with caution, especially early on. They're just part of
the picture, not the final verdict.

Speaker 2 (01:42:51):
Okay, all right, all right, and we then move on
to a number of other crises Russia, China, the nuclear
accident at LEAs wedding, Charlie skulking out of Zoe's room.
That happened in this series? Did that happen? I feel
like that happened earlier than this, But anyway, maybe you

(01:43:13):
know that's I'm sure, I'm sure there's issues. I want
to know what happened after the series finished. Okay, will
as wedding planner? That was funny. That was funny, Like
she did, we'll get.

Speaker 1 (01:43:25):
Like an empress something or other and we'll what's that?

Speaker 2 (01:43:27):
Don't worry about it? The fuck is that? And at
the wedding, like he he wasn't invited, like he tried
to help plan, his intentions were good, and then he
doesn't get invited and Kate's like, you want to be
my plus one? And when he shows up, Ellie's like,
what is he doing in a tux? So funny stuff?
What is he doing here?

Speaker 1 (01:43:48):
Yeah? That is exactly one of the comments that I
had read that the season return finally got it the
sense of humor back.

Speaker 2 (01:43:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:43:56):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:43:56):
With the end of the Bartlett administration coming, we are
heavily moving towards themes of legacies and futures for Bartley,
it's giving up the weight of office for CJ is
trying to escape its gravitational pool as the new administration
comes in. Yeah, that moment.

Speaker 1 (01:44:11):
Can you imagine Jeff Bezos walks up to you and says, Jesse,
here's ten billion dollars.

Speaker 2 (01:44:14):
That's going through my head when that happened, And I'm like, damn.
And then she gets the I mean really, when you
think about it, the two offers that she gets are
probably some of the greatest offers a person could get.
You know, we got our rich guy, our philanthropist or
whatever is going to give you money to do what
you want to do, help them change the world. Oh
and by the way, here comes the president with the

(01:44:36):
job offer as well, who's like, yeah, I'll give you
some time to sleep when it call me tomorrow and
tell me yes. Uh yeah. That's a tough decision she's
got to make. And I love when Danny asked her, like,
do you want to be in the White House? Do
you want to you want to stay in the White House?
And you can tell like it's taking every fiber of
her being to say no, but she realizes her heart
is telling her no. She doesn't want to be.

Speaker 1 (01:44:58):
I think I think that wanted. If you'll remember like
some of the early on like flashback stuff, it was
very much like Bartlet's our guy.

Speaker 2 (01:45:06):
Yeah, Bartlet's the guy. Oh my gosh. That reminds me
of that present that Leo gave.

Speaker 1 (01:45:13):
That that made me cry the bar the Bartlet for
America napkin, I bawled like my girlfriend at won't you know?
She she was kind of like in bed with me,
but like I was watching she was doing whatever, and
she like like looks over and she's like, excuse me, sobbing,
you're right, And I'm like, but yeah, like I think

(01:45:37):
that's that. That that's it. Though like Santo's wasn't her guy,
Bartlett was Inatly spends a lot spends a lot of
the season in conflict with the Santos for America campaign
because it's not in line with what the President's doing. Yeah,
and and even though Josh is like, why can't we
all work together, we're all Democrats, She's like, I work
for the president period.

Speaker 2 (01:46:00):
Of course. The unexpected, tragically unexpected event of the season
was the real life death of John Spencer. This came
part way through the season and killed the planned eighth season,
the final episode with focus on Leo's debate performance was
a real showcase of a great character and great actor

(01:46:20):
who poured a lot of himself into the role.

Speaker 1 (01:46:23):
Boy.

Speaker 2 (01:46:23):
It's like Andrew is participating in the same conversation that
we had, because he hit on everything that we wanted
we talked about, he says. Overall, I really enjoyed season
seven and found it to be a fitting endo these
characters and stories of the White House West Wing still
remains one of my favorite excuse me, one of my
most rewatched series, and has a unique place in TV

(01:46:45):
history as the bridge between network dominance and drama in
whits such as NYPD, Blue Er The Practice, and prestige
TV such as The Sopranos. Also really glad we are
not doing another twenty plus episode season going forward.

Speaker 1 (01:47:01):
New fucking rule if anyone makes into the television request
of me ten episodes of season or less. Yeah, this
is a lot I like, and not that we were.
We stayed in Baltimore and then drove into Virginia because
it was closer to Baltimore than it was another part
of Virginia. So but so, it's not like I missed
an opportunity to go touring on Saturday. On Wednesday, but

(01:47:25):
I legit stayed in the hotel and just watched The
West Wing until Erica was done with work and we
went to the concert because I needed to get this
fucking show in. This is a tall.

Speaker 2 (01:47:34):
Ask, it is it is. I mean, I was telling
Alexis last night when we were playing uh, when we
were yeah, we were playing Stranger Things. It was crazy,
it was right, Oh my goodness, you ever played Stranger
Things with somebody? We were talking stranger Yes, I have,
you probably have. That's the thing, like I was making
a joke and you probably have something that you've played

(01:47:56):
called stranger thing. Dirty perver.

Speaker 1 (01:47:58):
Just yes, you're at the Driven snow.

Speaker 2 (01:48:01):
You're a dirty pervert. We were talking Stranger Things, and
I told her, I said, you know that show is
eight episodes a season. This show is twenty two. I said,
I I cannot believe. Basically we would finish we do
a talk like we're doing right now. And if I

(01:48:22):
wanted to do one episode today, I had to start
within a week. So the next month that rolls around,
I have the season in. If I do one episode a.

Speaker 1 (01:48:31):
Day, Resident Alien, which I'm reviewing this Wednesday. Ten episodes.

Speaker 2 (01:48:35):
Yeah see, yeah, twenty two episodes. It's huge. I mean,
at the very least, if we ever do anything like that,
space them out like two months apiece. But here's the
thing that then puts it on us to be the
ones to be like, oh, I need to start watching
this shit in order for it to be done. I
guarantee you it'll be one week before the show is
supposed to air, and I've got to get in there

(01:48:56):
and watch all these episodes. Do three episodes a day,
your buddy here.

Speaker 1 (01:48:59):
So I honestly couldn't remember much about Stranger Things except
that I was really impressed by the music and atmosphere.

Speaker 2 (01:49:04):
Yeah, he joined us there last night. We talked a
little bit about that. That was yea, love it, love it,
love it.

Speaker 1 (01:49:09):
So I've enjoyed this. Next up is The Newsroom. There's
two and a half seasons of the Newsroom. We're gonna
I think, uh double checked the calendar.

Speaker 2 (01:49:21):
TV party.

Speaker 1 (01:49:26):
Try that again.

Speaker 2 (01:49:28):
We'll drag you over here. So I'm not looking off.

Speaker 1 (01:49:32):
So the next series of TV that Jesse and I
are gonna watch as Paris Has Fallen, which is a
TV show from the has Fallen movie series, which I
think would be fun. I kind of threw that on
there just to do it. I didn't realize that there
was one, and I was like, Okay, I'm gonna take
a chance on this show and I'm gonna make Jesse
watch it.

Speaker 2 (01:49:50):
So that's that with my discussion. YEP, I will fall
down on the episode every single episode. Just be ready perfect.

Speaker 1 (01:50:00):
We're doing to Jesse has Fallen. Yes, that's gonna be
the show that I write, Jesse has Fallen. We're gonna
do two episodes of TV Party for the news Room.
One is season seven, and then we're gonna do what
with Treme and combine seasons two and three because three
is like like four episodes longer. Some crazy shit. We

(01:50:21):
got Alien Earth coming up in October because Jesse made
me push it off like a whole year, like I
wanted to do this last December, and he was like, no,
heal season two and I'm like, fuck, so I'm gonna
make I'm gonna make Jesse talk Vinyl in October, okay,
and then we got only Murder season five in November,

(01:50:41):
which I'm just now seeing. We got Legit season one
in November, and then Legit season two because I like
the comedian that's in that and I wanted to talk
about it. I threw this one on here, White House Plumbers.
This is about the Watergate. Oh okay, that's in January,
and then that's only it's only a mini series, and

(01:51:02):
then we're back to Aaron Sorkin, I believe with Sports Night. Okay,
I'm gonna do season one in season two. That might
be into the tall ask. I gotta see how many
episodes are. But I know Gavin's been wanting me to
do Sports Night for a while now, so I figured
we'll do that next January. We're doing Happy Seasons one
in season two, and then oh boy, Jesse starting next

(01:51:24):
June June seventh, the week of my birthday.

Speaker 2 (01:51:28):
Guess what, we're going back into the wy Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:51:32):
No, we're not.

Speaker 2 (01:51:36):
No.

Speaker 1 (01:51:37):
One, two, three, four, five, six seasons of The Sopranos.

Speaker 2 (01:51:42):
Well, I might just buy myself a gun. Is that
how that song goes? I can't remember and shoot yourself? No,
that's not right. No, anyway, So you.

Speaker 1 (01:51:52):
Know, I feel like everyone's been telling me I should
watch The Sopranos because like I don't, necessarily it's weird like,
there are mob movies that are some of my favorites,
like Casino, but I'm not necessarily a mob show guy,
so I you know, I kind of have my grandmother
in me. It's just like, ugh, another show about the
Italian mob? What the fuck is this? All the Italians
are known for me and mobsters and dummies. So I

(01:52:13):
never watched the Sopranos, but apparently it's okay. That's been
haunting me to do the Sopranos for years. We'll see
if he shows up fronty of those. So we we
do this TV party to talk old TV. So let's white,
So why not talk about the Sopranos?

Speaker 2 (01:52:26):
Why not?

Speaker 1 (01:52:27):
Why not? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:52:28):
I think I got the first two seasons back, like
in two thousand and one. I got both from the
library and watched them with my wife. Crazy old old
timey stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:52:39):
So you have to rewatch them again.

Speaker 2 (01:52:41):
I'm fine with that, but we know how it ends.
One of the like most talked about endings ever of
a show is that in the Seinfeld I would.

Speaker 1 (01:52:52):
Damn it you beat me too? Is that in Seinfeld? Yep?
So that's what's going on for the history for the
for TV party. However, it's a pretty busy week. Sunday,
you and I talked The Crow, the Merry Death of
Play of the Star, and The Butcher of Paris. Monday, myself,
Gavin and Robert talk Wore the World with ice Cube.
Have you watched that yet? No?

Speaker 2 (01:53:13):
I know guys of Lamb basted it.

Speaker 1 (01:53:17):
Yeah, we we fucking beat the piss out of it.
It's a fun watch. Can give it a watch. It's
just to be just adjoining on the hilarity of it. However,
Alexis and Robert talk weapons on Tuesday. Yesterday, as you said,
you and Alexis played stranger things with each other's penises.
It's fantastic.

Speaker 2 (01:53:34):
You might have got demonetized. Sorry, w two m on air.

Speaker 1 (01:53:43):
This Sunday, we got the mental hammer of Doom. Now.
I helped me out with this, like, should we review
in addition to talking about baby Metal, should we review
the first ever Fraudyablo album?

Speaker 2 (01:53:54):
Well, you know that really crossed my mind and I
I honestly think that Fraudy needs to have its own episode. Okay,
I mean, if you're if you're hurting for content, I
don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:54:05):
I'll tell you this. We we don't have a December episode.
Just yet. Then the next Fradyavlo album, the Holiday album,
comes out in the beginning of September. Yeah, so maybe
what we'll do this year will do the Fraudyavlo. Maybe
what we'll do we will end the year with. We'll

(01:54:26):
do the November show is Fraudyavlo recipe for for the Damned,
Recipe for the Damned. Yeah, and then I don't even
want to go and say that this is your fucking
album and you forgotten. I'm so tired, don't believe me.

(01:54:46):
So So in November we'll do recipes for the Damned,
and then we'll do in December our our our Christmas
show will be Fraudyavlo Holidays or hell love it.

Speaker 2 (01:54:56):
I love it. That's a great idea.

Speaker 1 (01:54:57):
You know, listen to and we'll have a listening party.

Speaker 2 (01:55:01):
That's great. That's great.

Speaker 1 (01:55:03):
So uh, I think that'll be fantastic.

Speaker 2 (01:55:06):
Yeah, it'd be a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (01:55:07):
Yeah, because because why not review my own album on
my podcast? Listen, and we can play the whole song.
I don't have music videos, that's right.

Speaker 2 (01:55:16):
You put on this earth to do this, dude.

Speaker 1 (01:55:19):
We can play the entirety of a song. I don't know,
I have you. I don't know how much of Holidays
or Hell you've listened to, but I'll tell you right now. Uh,
this is every Irish song ever. Is the best thing
I've ever done, and that includes have Children. Okay, it's
so good.

Speaker 2 (01:55:36):
Lily Jonas, and then you're just kind of moving this
up the list right above them.

Speaker 1 (01:55:42):
I can't tell you how many times, like I listened
to the song on repeat.

Speaker 2 (01:55:47):
That's great, that's good stuff. I I I love it.
I cannot wait to discuss it.

Speaker 1 (01:55:54):
So yeah, so we're talking baby metal this Sunday. Monday
is Night all Ways com starring Vanessa Kirby, the Old
Sue Storm. Tuesday, I don't think there's anything going on.
Wednesday is me and Alexis will be reviewing Resident Alien
season four, and then a week from tonight is a
triple feature. It'll be myself and Mick. We'll be talking

(01:56:16):
fear Street, prom Queen the Old Guard to and Fountain
of Youth, which I believe is an Apple TV movie.
Jesse starts your Show's what youpis from?

Speaker 2 (01:56:24):
Oh my goodness, Well, ladies and gentlemen, I do a
podcast called The Source Material Comics podcast where we talk
comic books and recently on that feed myself and Mark Radlice.
No coming up, I should say, next Monday, we are
starting into the Darth Vader series, so we have got

(01:56:47):
quite a few issues to talk about with Darth Vader.
This was the Marvel series I think from twenty seventeen.
I want to say maybe its twenty fifteen. I can't
remember the date, but anyway, that starts this coming Monday,
and there's I think three or four episodes I can't remember.
I think these three episodes of Darth Vader, so keep
an eye out for that. Then, previously, this past Monday,

(01:57:08):
Unspoken Issues our ninety centric Comics book, Comics Book, Comic
Book podcast that aired Fantastic four, number three, seventy one,
and yes, I'll promote it as gimmick cover Summer where
my goodness, the whole cover was completely white because Johnny
Storm went nova in that issue, burnt up Liberty University.

(01:57:28):
But like I said, the hottest thing that happened in
that issue was Sue Storm debuting the boob window costume. Oh,
put Janine Grofflow in that thing and just call it
a day. And then and then of course Marvel Snap
Hither we have a Marvel Snap podcast called Get This,
Get Ready, Master Branding Snap Material, Me and Evan Bevans

(01:57:51):
get together and talk Marvel Snap once a month, four
episodes four or five episodes drop that happened earlier this month.
So if you play Marvel Snap, you might want to
check it out. Don't expect to get a lot of
great info, but you can hear a couple of guys
just talk about some good times on there. So that's
all I got.

Speaker 1 (01:58:06):
Mark Radls, Well, folks, it's been fun talking the West Wing.
Now I'm gonna torture Jesse with a cable news show
with the Newsroom. Oh, I can't wait to the end
of the Newsroom and I can tell you how I
got to Memphis. Okay, you'll know when you see it.

Speaker 2 (01:58:23):
All right, then it's how I.

Speaker 1 (01:58:24):
Got to Memphis. Oh, your your friend here is saying
I'm not playing right now, but I do have three snaps.

Speaker 2 (01:58:33):
Yeah. I saw his comment there yesterday where he said
he's placed he plays some definite snaps, so I mean, yeah, hey,
it's never too if you it's you can pick up
and play in five minutes. So that's that's the best
part about that game.

Speaker 1 (01:58:45):
So I'm not like I said. In two months, I'm
gonna show Jesse how we got to Memphis, so.

Speaker 2 (01:58:50):
I can't wait to get there, Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:58:51):
Sir, all right, I cannot wait for you to watch the.

Speaker 2 (01:58:57):
Newsroom so good. I look forward to it.

Speaker 1 (01:59:00):
All right. Well, folks, that is our coverage of the
Westering all seven seasons for Jesse. I have a lot
of work to catch up on because I did not
do podcasts off the last three days. Well, be safe
and behave

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