October 5, 2022 • 44 mins
Jordan Foote is joined by Conner Christopherson to answer mailbag questions from the MVLs ahead of the Kansas City Chiefs' Week 5 matchup against the Las Vegas Raiders.
A sincere thank you goes out to everyone who's supported RTK over the past couple of years. Whether you agreed or disagreed, liked or didn't like, hated or loved the show, any sort of interaction was appreciated. You all helped create a glorious community, and it was a privilege to be your host.
This isn't a goodbye in totality, but rather a goodbye from RTK until it potentially picks back up at some point in the future. If you'd like to follow Conner (@Conner_DKC), Zack (@zackeisen21), Mark (@MarkTheOverseer) or myself (@footenoted), we're on Twitter and always willing to chat. - Jordan
A sincere thank you goes out to everyone who's supported RTK over the past couple of years. Whether you agreed or disagreed, liked or didn't like, hated or loved the show, any sort of interaction was appreciated. You all helped create a glorious community, and it was a privilege to be your host.
This isn't a goodbye in totality, but rather a goodbye from RTK until it potentially picks back up at some point in the future. If you'd like to follow Conner (@Conner_DKC), Zack (@zackeisen21), Mark (@MarkTheOverseer) or myself (@footenoted), we're on Twitter and always willing to chat. - Jordan
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Keeps Fans, Football Fans, podcastfans alike. Welcome the board. I'm
Jordan Foot and this is the Roughin the Kicker Podcast, the Kansas City
Chiefs Podcasts, an association with Aarheadreport. As always, if you guys
are having a wonderful day, thanksfor making us a part of your Wednesday.
With that said, let's jump intotoday's show. Got Connor Christopherson here
(00:22):
with me. We're going to doa rough into mail bag. Lots of
good questions this week. You canfollow Connor on Twitter at Connor with an
E Underscore DKC Connor. How's itgoing, man, It's going great on
a nice October afternoon. I knowin my real life, I got a
new job offer today, so that'ssomething other than that. We have news
(00:46):
later in the podcast, but Ithink we wanted to do a mail bag
first, so I don't have anythingnew other than that. Yeah. No,
I also have something new that's kindof job related. But again,
what we'll chat at the end ofthe Most people that listen probably already know
what that is. With that said, I guess let's just jump in man.
Our first question comes from Pat good, friend of the pod. Which
(01:08):
position do you think is a higherpriority for a potential trade defensive end or
wide receiver. I interpreted this asin season this season trade. Is that
what you took it as too?Sure, let's say I took it as
that. I can also talk aboutthat too, But in season do you
(01:34):
think? First of all, doyou think they would even do it in
season trade? I think they woulddo it to some degree, but not
like a So my thought was lookingat next year's free agent class, which
position looks worse, and like there'splaymakers at both. But I do think
(01:55):
they'd make one Allah Melvin Ingram,but not like anything bigger than that,
if that makes sense, And Idon't think they have quite as big of
a need right now. I thinkthe excuse this year is going to be
over still letting our whiteouts jelled together, blah blah blah, ten weeks into
the year, when the deadline isso on one hand, no, on
one hand, yes, but aminor move. And like my logic,
(02:17):
next year's defensive end class has MarcusDavenport, JJ Watt, Jendavian Clowney Arden
Key, Dante Fowler, Samson Abucham, a couple other guys, not particularly
Swell, and then white out Nelson, Agilar, DJ Chark, Sterling Shepherd,
Juju McColl, both Chiefs Zach Pascal, so either one is particularly rich.
(02:43):
So in terms of higher priority,basically Pat's asking in a vacuum,
which position needs more help. Yeah, and I think because of the new
bodies, I'm not gonna go widereceiver. I would lean defensive end.
I guess I would too. Ialso think it's still more important than wide
(03:06):
receiver that we're seeing a resurgence inwide receiver priority in the NFL. I
guess it really comes down to willthe Chiefs be able to stomach having mvs
and sky More as the only returningwide receivers next year. I think that
room still needs an alpha. Ithink sky More is like a perfect wide
(03:27):
receiver too for an offense, andthey should use them more as that right
now, But they don't. Likewe saw all these teams go out and
get to alpha. We saw,of course Tyreek Hill get traded for.
We saw A J. Brown gettraded for, and we saw Davante Adams
get traded for. I just reallythink with Travis Kelcey entering his elder ears,
(03:53):
they need somebody who can younger soit wouldn't be a Tyree kill or
to Adams like thing. But iflike an AJ Brown type wide receiver is
available on the trade market, theyshould I think they should consider getting him.
I don't know who is on themarket at edge. It feels like
that market is not as robust asa wide receiver market was, at least
(04:17):
from last offseason. So I wouldassume they would want to get a defensive
end Moore, but I think there'smore realistic possibilities to get a wide receiver.
Speaking of wide receiver, Pat's bonusquestion Odell Beckham junior to Kansas City
Connor. Immediate thoughts on that,I'm going to decline because it's off the
(04:44):
ACL tear. You don't know whathe's looking like two years or two ACL
tears in his career now. Also, I think there's just too many concepts
for wide receivers in the Chief's offensefor him to come in and make the
same impact he did like for theRams last year, he just has too
much to learn in the middle ofthe season. And I even from what
(05:09):
we've seen from the wide receiver group, I think they'll be fine enough to
where it just doesn't make sense tosign him, so I think I'll pass.
You would say, yeah, he'sthe Rams sadly, so it's not
even up. Didn't he visited withthe Giant? Didn't he visited with everybody?
And like, part of it's beenunofficial, like I'm just at the
(05:30):
game, But part of it's alsolike I'm planning seats. I think he's
trying to make the Rams like keephim in their mind. I also don't
think it's a fore conclusion. Ithink he's a rammer a bill. I
don't think he goes anywhere else.Yeah, with that said, I agree
with everything you said about it's goingto take a while for the wide out,
any wide out to learn the Chiefsoffense, and he's coming off the
(05:51):
ACL tear and another offense. Ido think he showed last year he looks
really good. Like not prim Odell, but yeah, pretty damn good.
Is a really, really good numbertwo wide out. We talked about the
importance of the secondary wide receiver.You touched on that a little bit in
a vacuum. Yeah, it makessense, but then there's too many outside
(06:13):
factors I think that come into play, Like if this was in the off
season and he was coming off anac altar, but was going to be
healthy for week one. Then youthink about it. Now, what five
weeks into the year, he's stillnot one hundred percent. He's still not
signing anywhere. It's gonna be awhile the Chiefs don't have If they had
veterans everywhere else, then yeah,maybe, But everyone else is trying to
learn the system too, really outsideof Hardman, who might still be learning
(06:39):
some stuff anyway. So I'm gonnahave to decline Odell even though like that's
not an indictment on him, it'sjust an indictment on kind of the context
of that situation. I think,Yeah, I think he's a RAM.
They're just waiting, I hope.So No, I don't know after seeing
the play all the way, butinteresteeing how they played, well, he
(07:00):
really want to sign on for thathe might be the savior, like he
might have that kind of that saviorcomplex. But like, I can fix
this. I thought they brought anAllen Robinson. So this is not a
RAMS podcast, eve though I'd likeit to be. But part of me
thinks and I do believe that partof it's on s John McVay for he
called some really weird games so farthis year, and Stafford has not been
(07:24):
good by any stretch of the imagination. I need to watch the alternate angle
of a Robs film. But likehe doesn't seem to have it anymore.
Like I'm not convinced that he's cooked, but like he's in the oven and
the ovens preheated. I think.So he's in the dishwasher. Yeah,
(07:44):
he's in there, and it justhasn't started running yet. But like the
minit of press is that button.It's gonna be washed. So like he
just is taking so long to separate, and sometimes he just can't. Cooper
cup was routing people up. Obviously, Cooper Cups like a top two three
wider restar. Yeah, a rob. It's not all Stafford and mcva's fault.
(08:05):
I promise it's not them. It'salso a Rob just might not be
that guy. They need Van Jeffersonback, and they also need Odell.
But then, yes, if youhave Cup, Odell, Van Jefferson,
Robinson, Higbee, cam Makers anda somewhat healthy offensive line and Stafford playing
(08:26):
better, then you're kind of cookingwith fire. But like that's a lot,
so yeah, I don't know.They're an enigma. Yep, another
enigma, Legarius Sneed or Steve Gray. I mean, however you want to
look at it. Um. Steve'sfirst question, what is the max average
annual value you would offer Legarius Sneedthis offseason? Connor, you published an
(08:50):
article last week I believe Lagarius Sneedand how the Cheeps need to lock him
up long term. Um, youmade a really good point that I didn't
even think of about if he isreally exclusively this kind of slot guy that's
getting paid to be that guy,the contracts there are few and far between,
(09:11):
I think for like a true premiumtype slot guy. Yeah, but
with that said, he has thesize of an outside guy. Doesn't mean
he's going to get paid like anoutside guy like DK Metcalf isn't going to
get paid like a tight end becausehe's a wide receiver. What would you
be willing You mentioned a couple guysand one that had a somewhat recent contract.
What would you be willing to payLagarius Sneed on the open market?
(09:31):
Considering he's more of a do itall type player than a couple of the
slot guys I've signed recently. Iwould pay him a three year, forty
million dollar extension, which is adecent amount above other slot players, but
it would be added on to thelast year of his rookie deal, so
you can spread out the signing bonusa bit that way. And I think
(09:54):
he's worth that because right now,Lagarius sneed leads the Chiefs in sacks like
and he's also an incredible run defender, and he's the NFL's moving towards those
bigger slots, like we're seeing VantAdams play a lot from the slot.
We're seeing Drake London plays from theslot. Kyle Pits will play from the
slot, like these bigger wide receivers. Cooper cups six two and he plays
(10:16):
from the slot. It doesn't matterthat if you're cornerbacks tall now in the
slot and maybe not as agile aslike a five nine guy, as if
they can handle those bigger wide receiversand they can bulitz and they can run
defend, that's like the premium likemodern nickelback, and that's what Lagarius sneed
is. So I'm willing to goabove a lot of what those nickelbacks have
(10:39):
made previously just because he is thatprototype to make sure that they keep him,
because honestly, other than we'll seewhat happens with one Thornhill. But
other than Justin Reid, the Chiefsdon't have any long term lockdown cornerbacks,
and they've never done that. ButI think Lagerius Sneed, especially because he's
a bread Beach draft pick two,I think Lageri Snee might be the first
(11:01):
guy who breaks the mold at cornerbackwhere they actually do pay for him.
Yeah. And I think it wasEric Eager who brought up the Chiefs drafting
five defensive backs kind of excludes themfrom the corners. Yeah, those were
not mutually exclusive. I do thinkhe could have made the argument it was
right there for the taking Charvarius Board. It's an example of them not doing
(11:24):
it. Charvarious Wards still playing prettywell, like he's been a decent cornerback
now for three years, better partof two or three years. Jarius Sneed
though, being a Brett Beach guy, being he just seems like a really
good fit. He seems like areally good kid to kid. He's older
than me, but still the ChiefsI think, yeah, exactly, so
(11:45):
I think it does make sense forthem to lock him up. He is
a very versatile piece. Steve Spangvillo. Like we talked before the year,
I think if the Chiefs defense kindof sputtered and struggled, this might be
the end of Spags with like anew era of defensive players. Spags is
going to be there as long ashe wants to be. At this point,
(12:05):
like kisses, this is the bestBags season we've seen so far,
and like it should have been theworst because he had so many young guys
and somebody new players, like he'sso stubborn, she'd play the young guys
earlier. Something. Yes, yes, so Steve Spagnello's in his bag.
Legarius Sneed should be in his bag, and in about a year less than
(12:26):
a year, that bag is goingto be pretty big. Like you look
at I was looking at cornerback contracts, very imperfect science. Kennel Fuller's ten
million a year, dj Reads elevenmillion a year. A Door Jackson is
thirteen million year. I think Sneedyou said three for forty that would be
pretty much what i'd give him,like thirteen and a half million a year.
(12:46):
You know what you're gonna get.Like, he's not a this is
obviously hard to predict, but nota player who gets paid and then starts
to struggle. He doesn't have ahuge injury history, He has good size,
He can do a lot of differentstuff. He also, if needed,
and I'm not saying it would be, he can play on the outside
(13:07):
and play adequately at worst. Ithink the sample within the slot's obviously growing,
so you can do that. Youcan have Trent McDuffie long term,
You can have Jalen Watson long term. Like I get, getting the most
out of the cornerback position. Butat a certain point, if everyone's on
a rookie contract, pay one guylike Effitt. Just go pay Lagarius Sneak
(13:28):
because he's worth it and is stillyoung and is gonna be there. Lock
him up through age twenty eight,twenty nine, twenty seven, whatever you
want to do, revisit it,then maybe let him go once you have
somebody else in the fold. SoI think from a Lagarius sneed standpoint three
for forty probably like fifteen million yearsseems a little bit rich, but like
(13:50):
thirteen and a half or fourteen,I don't think the Chiefs should have a
major issue with doing that for him. Yeah, And like I said,
it's an extent because if the playeris good enough, you don't wait till
that last year for them to hitthe market because sneed's in the the no
go zone where you wouldn't franchise tagthem, but you also don't want to
(14:13):
lose them. So those are theguys you actually sign after year three,
which is when you can sign theplayers after the rookie deal. That's the
first eligible year you can sign them. So I think they just need to
lock up one of those guys.And la Jerry Steed makes sense because the
skill set is unique compared to theplayers they have right now. Trevarious Ward
(14:35):
was not. I think they werelike, yeah, we can replace an
outside cornerback because in Specnol's system,outside corners are devalued in a way.
I know they took a first roundcornerback, but like, they're not going
to pay fifteen million for Trevarious Ward. But I don't know if they can
go find a do it all nickelbackerwho can blitz, who may be the
(14:56):
best blitzing cornerback in the league.That feel it is a bit more difficult
to find. So they have thatguy, why don't you just lock him
up? Another line of thinking ofyou already have that guy, why don't
you just lock him up that bothof us have been kind of iffy on
Chris Jones, and Steve has areally good banger of the second question.
I have been of the belief that, especially with the Tirey Kill thing,
(15:20):
even before the Tirey Kill thing,Chris Jones would get traded this upcoming off
season. It just made sense.They can draft a guy, or they
can go after and pay somebody lessthan Chris Jones, but a premier interior
defensive lineman is tough to come by. They can do the stuff Chris Jones
can do against the pass. He'sbust in three players exactly. It's a
(15:41):
very short list. He's been phenomenalto start this season. It's not like
he has ten sacks or anything,but he's still been really really good from
a just pure win per down standpoint. Steve wants to know, with that
in mind, what is the minimumtrade comp you'd be willing to move him
for rather than letting him play outthe final year of his deal. O'Connor
(16:03):
is the most recent example, theBuckner trade. Would that be the comp
for it? Yep? And thatwas a pure mid first round pick.
So for Jones, who I thinkwhen Buckner was traded. I think Jones
next year has more of a valuebecause he's more proven than when Buckner was
traded. Buckner still proven it sincethen, so but I would want to
(16:29):
first in like a third for Jonesat a minimum, because I mean,
he's going to be twenty nine andthat's pretty old. But it seems like
teams don't have a they're not thatadverse to age around then. I think
he still would have three good yearsleft in him at after this year,
so I think a team could valuehim like that. I how do you
(16:56):
feel about the Chiefs being the oneto extend him though? I think it's
hard to compare him fully to otherplayers, But I mean they had a
guy like him who was elite attheir position, at his position, like
Tyreek Hill, and they let himgo. However, I don't know if
Jones is going to come at theChiefs and with aspirations Yeah, yeah,
(17:18):
like Tyreek Hill had for his contracts. So like you see Aaron Donald,
like you up that, like topthat Brett Beach, Yeah, I don't
like, I don't see that.I don't think he's going to do that.
So it really depends on him andwhat he asks because the Chiefs had
a number with tyreek Hill where hewould have stayed. So it really depends
(17:40):
on that with Jones and how hevalues himself. But a first and the
third is what I would want ina trade. Definitely the first, though
I think the mid round pick Ican live without. But when we see
Buckner get traded for a mid firstround pick, I think it was pick
sixteen or somewhere in there. Youwant to get that for Chris Jones,
who was probably the second best interiorpass rusher in the NFL. So Jones
(18:06):
got four for eighty and his caphit next year. This year it's twenty
nine millions. Like you weren't gettingout of that next year, you can
get out of it with seven millionand change in dead cap and something crazy
twenty seven million dollar cap hit.What would you be willing to give him
(18:26):
on that next contract. Well,we'll probably have this conversation to message later
on, but I figured, justfor the sec of the pod right now,
week five in the twenty twenty twoseason, yeah, I would give
him like a three year, sixtyeight million dollar extension. Maybe to add
on top of that, it wouldbump up above twenty million a year,
(18:48):
but it would not get close toDonald money because nobody should. But I
don't think there was any like Bucknergot for eighty something as well, so
there's not been really any market resettingat that position recently. So I don't
think he can ask for too muchmore. You can ask for a bit
more because the CAP's going up,but I would I'd be willing to give
(19:11):
him that, especially because of thelast few the last year, so that
deal would be easy to get outof, and that he would still only
be like thirty two thirty three,which is usually how long interior defensive alignement
last. Yeah, so Jonathan Allensigned when he was twenty six four for
seventy two, just twenty six fourfor seventy one. Buckner sign when he
(19:36):
was twenty five four for eighty four. So like I'd give Jones three for
like sixty six, like you said, maybe sixty eight, like twenty two
twenty three max million dollars per year. He should age relatively well, but
he also is not a very healthyplayer. Generally, he's not completely injury
prone, but part of that comeswith I think getting beat the hell up
(19:59):
with the lack of help on theinside or really on the defensive line in
general. But it's not to thepoint where, like man Chris Jones is
guaranteed to miss eight games a yearor whatever, we can't pay it.
I don't think it's quite that bad. So it's a risk, and it's
a calculated risk. And even ifyou do get your first round pick and
you do drop somebody not guaranteed,it's not going to be Chris Jones at
(20:19):
all. So I'm more open toit now than I was to begin the
year. Part of that's just becauseconventional wisdom has kind of cracked me a
little bit. Also, he's beenreally good so far. Yeah, I
just I don't know what the Chiefswill do. They've set a president with
older players, especially if they cangive value out of them in a trade.
(20:41):
So the only one that hasn't setthat is Travis Kelsey, and that's
just because for some reason he's finewith being woefully underpaid. So that's the
only example we've seen of them keepinga veteran for very long out of a
reasonable contract. So we'll see whatChris Jones once this offseason. Yeah,
(21:03):
he's a big part of the Chiefsdefense, and he's a big part of
a Cheaps defense that has been prettygood so far. And Danielle Soxy,
her question is just how legit isthe Cheaps defense. It seems legit to
me. I'm going to credit somebody, Matt verder Am. He did kind
of a mini threat on the Cheapsdefense. I'm just gonna read it verbatim.
(21:26):
Everybody's talking about how the Cheaps defense. Everyone's talking about the Cheaps defense
right now, but a quick minithreat on the defense currently. Gosh,
I absolutely butchered that. Everybody's talkingabout the Cheaps offense right now, but
a quick mini threat on the defense. Currently, the Chiefs defense is top
six in sacks, pressures, pressurerate, quarterback knockdown rate, hurry rate,
(21:48):
average depth of target, and yardsallowed. Their eighth in yards per
play. Then he applied like thegarbage time filter and like strip that out.
They are fifth in yards per playallowed, they are fifth in points
per game allowed. They are seventhin yards per drive and fourteenth in points
per drive. So, like Ithink on the EPA chart they finally slipped
(22:12):
just below even. I think they'relike minus point oh five or some shit
like. It's nothing crazy. It'sa lot of garbage times with the Cardinals
in Tampa game. But I knowthat guys a football outsiders do do Dboa
say that you shouldn't truly discount garbagetime because some of it is predictive.
(22:33):
But it feels like Spags is justso like his prevent is like prevent pre
vent. I know Zach friend ofthe show Zach Guys and posted a picture
of one of their prevent defenses.It was like four guys like twenty yards
deep, and I'm like, that'sthat's prevent for you. M Spacks was
packing it in like so we didn'tcare. Yeah, I would say they
(22:59):
are are more legit than I expected. I'm still curious about the pass rush
because I don't think a lot ofthis pressure is with four man fronts.
It's been a lot of stimulated pressurewith blitzes. As I said earlier,
Legarius needs leading the team in sacks, which is kind of odd for a
team that's so high in pressure rateand sacks that a cornerback would lead it.
(23:23):
So I'm curious as the Chiefs playlike the Bills and some of those
offenses, what exactly will the defenselook like? Will they be able to
get pressure with four with carloftistun Lapand Jones and Clark, or will them
bringing blitzes come back to buy themlater in the year when teams are figuring
(23:45):
out, Hey, they can't pressureunless there's a blitz that might come back
to buy them in the butt.I don't know. I believe in the
talent more this year though than thelast few years. The young players Chiefs
have are playing well. When WillieGate comes back, they'll be a big
edition. When Trum McDuffie returns,I'll be a big addition. I believe
(24:10):
in that talent, and they've beenshowing off more and earlier than I thought
they would, so that's good tosee him. Ahead of schedule. I
mean, they almost won that Coltsgame, and it was a bit disappointed
they gave up the game winning drive, but they held the clamps on the
Colts the whole game for the mostpart. So and they played really well
against the Bucks. They played reallywell against the Chargers. I mean some
(24:33):
of these games I was expecting themto give up thirty five points, and
I know they give up thirty winof the Bucks, but that was with
prevent So they're ahead of schedule,legit. I don't if Legit is like
top ten, I still need tosee more, but I can believe they
can be an average defense this year. What's up, guys, Thanks again
(24:56):
for listening to today's show and takingsome time to welcome Refrom the Kicker into
your speakers and headphones. We're goingto take a quick break to hear from
our sponsored programs, and right afterthat we'll be right back. Yeah.
No, I completely agree with that. So right now I think they are
(25:17):
two tiers better than I thought theywould be at the end of the year,
which I think heading end of theyear, and I could be totally
off on this. We thought likethat seventeen to twenty four range, and
probably a little bit higher than thattwenty four. We're like, if they're
twenty first or twenty second, thatis relatively end of your ranking exactly.
(25:38):
So I thought if they were seventeento twenty four, that wouldn't be the
end of the world. They're inthat next tier of eleven to sixteen or
eleven to seventeen or eleven to eighteen, whenever you want, twelve to eighteen
maybe where right now, at thisvery moment, you could make a case
for them being nine, ten,eleven to twelve by the end of the
year. I think they settle init like teenth or fifteenth, which you
(26:03):
get good enough. It's the topthree offense or top five of the very
worst that they sputter. Really topthree, you give them a top sixteen
defense. That's the best defense he'sever had, fairly comfortably, right,
that's how good the defense was inthe Super Bowl winning run. They actually
turned it on at the end ofthe year. I think they were pretty
high in DVOA two. I know, I think they were around sixteenth.
(26:26):
Sounds like it's comparable to that.They caught fire, right, Yeah,
and then all three playoff games.You can make an argument to defense was
a big factor in them winning.So if it's that good, I mean,
they won a Super Bowl that year, so that's it is, yeah,
and that's for tu. It is. We will have to see though,
(26:47):
because it is a lot of youngtalent um. I think we saw
a few cracks and some of theplayers like Jalen Watson was picked on a
bit, but it was Mike Evansand Tom Brady, So you can give
them pass. But it's not likethey're gonna play easier teams in the playoffs.
Is Josh Allen's to fun, Dick'sgonna go easy? Young Jayla Watson
probably not. So those cracks mightbe their downfall, but we'll see how
(27:08):
the young talent responds to that.Yeah, And the thing with this year's
Cheeps team is like their schedule isn'textremely backloaded. It was really frontloaded.
Like it's still tough all the waythrough. Don't get me wrong, but
like this shouldn't be a team thatgets worse throughout the year. It should
maintain or get better considering opponents.So like I think if the Cheeps even
(27:30):
struggle against Buffalo, and your takeawaythrough six weeks is like Cheeps have a
top half defense, it should stillbe top half or at least middle of
the pack the rest of the way. So I think to a degree,
like you said Legits in top ten, I don't think so. I haven't
seen enough yet Legitis in the bestMahomes has had outside of that, like
(27:51):
six y eight weeks stretch in twentynineteen, twenty twenty, I think that
is very fair. Totally agree.You seem to have a common theme of
that. We very rarely disagree onthe podcast, which I don't know if
that's good or bad. And wealso have thought about that before too.
All right, let's say it's good. Yeah, let's say think it is
(28:12):
or we're just completely insane. ButI mean people still listen and some people
agree. So UM, bonus questionfrom Danielle. Which Chiefs player would tackle
a fan on the field? Soin the Rams game on Monday night?
Um, the forty nine Ers playedtoo. It wasn't just the Rams game,
but whatever one would argue forty nineErs game. Yeah, okay,
(28:36):
So in the forty nine Ers gameon Monday, UM, a fan ran
on the field and Bobby Wagner madehis biggest play of the year. Um,
I'm not salty at all by layingout the fan. I think it's
got to be Nick Bolton right likeBolton would it would be him, or
like Justin Reid, or like LeoChanelle. I could see Carlottis is a
(28:56):
little too nice. I think hewouldn't be furious at that point. Leo
Chanelle would literally kill somebody. NickoBolton would just like seriously injured them.
I think how about this underrated consideringhe's he's always just he seems like a
bat out of hell on the field, Isaiah Pacheco, I could see that,
(29:17):
Yeah, like he's gonna steal that. He's gonna steal that man's job.
Yeah, I could see him.I could see Juju doing like a
like I'm trying to think of ananalogy, like you would be filming,
you would be filming the TikTok wouldPatrick, No, he wouldn't do it.
There's really a short list, man, Like I think it would be
(29:38):
Nick Bolton, m Pacheco, Icould see doing it because he runs fast
to not that you know, anyoneon the Chiefs could not catch the fan.
Um that's about hit man. Ithink that would be the three Colin
Saunders maybe. I mean and consideringlike consistent playing time and like notable names
(30:02):
on the field, I think NickBolton definitely takes the cake. Yeah,
I don't think he. I don'tthink he even knows. He wouldn't know
that the streaker was not on theother team. I think fury tackle.
He just gets on the field andhe turns it on. Let's keep it
(30:22):
on. We saved the best forlast. Of course, Mike Denny always
brings the heat. He said,what is the best condiment to dip a
fry? In. Does the cutof the fry change that answer? I
miss Willie gay, Um, Idon't. That's a tough one, dude,
Like Mike always makes me think,and obviously I kind of think throughout
(30:45):
the podcast, but like his questions, it's because you're going from football mode
to like usually not football mode.Um, what do you think I'm gonna
go? I think it's still acatch up. Um, but I'll put
an asterisks on it a few.Um, hot ketchup is very good.
(31:07):
Yeah, sure there's are any anyhot Ketchup is good. I don't usually
like spicy things too, but likehot ketchup is usually decently mild, so
it adds a bit of zest toit, so I like that. Also,
if it's potato wedges, which aretechnically fried potatoes, those are better
with ranch because I don't know there'smore potato. I guess. Yeah,
(31:33):
I still don't counteract that. Ithink it's still ketchup, though I think
ketchups to go for a reason.I'm gonna go ranch just because I'm a
huge ranch dressing guy. So I'ma huge, huge, huge ranch guy.
My mom used to always dip herfries in mayo, and I was
like that is borderline foul, butI mean it was actually not terrible.
(31:56):
I like Mayo, so I woulddo that. Ketchup is good obviously,
Like I think in terms of likethe catchup, I need to formulate my
words wisely here brising ketchup is likea more iconic duo, but that doesn't
mean it's better. Like Tom Bradyand Randy Moss went seventeen and OZ or
(32:21):
sixteen and OZ and got to thesuper Bowl, but like Travis Kelsey and
Patrick Mahomes have actually won one andhave had this sustained success. I don't
know what comp I'm trying to makehere, but ranch is a better condiment
for that, I think. Nowhear me out. This is very specific
and very telling on my part.Sure Yardhouse has this garlic aoli and it's
(32:43):
a malt vinegar version of that thatthey have and it's it's just it's the
best. Actually, cane sauce wouldbe up there too, a body.
So like, in terms of widelyavailable condiments, whatever bottle of ranches in
your refrigerator or Valley, yes,Valley, or I think mine's like whatever.
(33:06):
Walmart's brand is mighty like yeah,which quick aside eating healthy kind of
sucks because like a lot of thestuff I can still make taste good.
The ranch I can tell. There'ssuch a big ass difference, And like
I went out. I went toGuy's Delhi on Thursday, actually, as
we're recording this, I went atnoon and picked up some pizza bones,
(33:29):
which is their little, uh stuffedpizza stick type things. I had two
ranches from them that I ran outand I put a little bit of my
like light crap on the plate.And it's such a massive difference. I
was like this, that thing sucks. Like so ranch catchup cane sauce or
(33:50):
malt vinagreoli from Yardhouse, preferably thedowntown location. But also the legends is
fine, very specific on the lastone, but I'll agree with those.
I would leading catch up Eileen Ranch. Those are the only two. Both
good, both good. Yeah.If Tom Brady, this is another micro
question, of course, if TomBrady gets divorced, does he play until
(34:10):
he's fifty five? Connor does hewon't play until he's fifty five, obviously,
But if Giselle calls it quits,why wouldn't he come back next year?
He's still really good? I think, Yeah, yes, I think
he. I think he will,man, I think he'll maybe do one
more year. I still I stillthink he Something about him, I guess
(34:37):
it's maybe just the divorce. Justsomething about him is different this year.
Um. We all saw that.Now we're seeing it apparently in the courts.
Um. But also like Todd Bowlesis the head coach now, Um,
I don't know if he would wantto come back for Todd Bowles.
So that's the issue. Maybe whathappens is the Miami the rumor Miami thing
(35:00):
that was apparently actually close to happening, or it would become a part time
owner or a part owner of theDolphins and also play for the Dolphins.
Maybe that happens. But with twoof playing, well, it's like,
maybe that won't happen. Now,I'm sure it's hard to say. I
(35:21):
think there's definitely a bigger chance hecomes back though, because I mean,
we all knew he was quitting asa family, and if he came back,
it's like there's something amiss. Yeah, before all of this crap happened,
I was like, there's about athree percent chance he comes back.
I was like, he really isgoing to be done this time. Now,
though, if the divorce does happenand go through, and I don't
(35:45):
know what the timing of that wouldbe like, or if it's actually gonna
happen, or if the rumors archeror whatever, He's gonna win MVP the
year after it happens. Like ifthey divorced during the offseason, he's gonna
throw like seventy touchdowns to next yearand it's going to be insane. He
I almost feel bad for him,and like Brady's had a lot of good
fortune, Like you can tell,he does not feel great right now about
(36:07):
where things are in his life.And I even made that comment that I
thought he got like plastic surgery doneduring the off week, because he's been
known to do that throughout his career. It's indisputable, but look at his
pictures in his twenties versus now,it's obvious something, so he's gotten stuff
done. I kind of feel badthat I made that comment, But apparently
he's been going through it, man, And he didn't look particularly great until
(36:31):
this last week, and he wasn'tlike world beating or anything. He's still
stat padded quite a bit, butis he still a top ten quarterback in
the NFL. I would take himthis year over a lot of guys,
maybe even all but four perhaps,But does he played till fifty five?
I don't think so. Does heplay until forty six, forty seven?
(36:54):
That option would be on the table, and I think, like you said,
the Dolphins thing would come into play, the Buccaneers situation would come into
play, and opening somewhere else ina good spot. Maybe the other was
forty nine ers. Yeah, butthey have Lance, but they get injured.
So Brady on with that defense andthose weapons in that offensive line,
(37:16):
like went healthy, dude, andhe's from there, right, Yeah,
I believe so, Yes, hewould wreck. Like they would win fourteen
games. I think if they hadend this year, If they had ended
this year, yeah, can youimagine if Jimmy like re upped for another
year and Trey Lance came back andthen Brady was like, actually, actually
(37:39):
I want to play for the fortynine ers. Yeah, so I there's
a non zero chance he comes back. Now, I'm not putting a number
on it. I don't want tosay like twenty percent, thirty percent,
whatever. It's very early. Butin spite of this, ironically, the
worst his life gets off the field. I think that just gives him more
reason to keep playing as long ashe's healthy. M so, and he
(38:00):
has that announcing job waiting for wheneverhe does so. Yep, I'm not
crying too many tiers for Tom Bradyright now. I'll just say that,
Yeah, that, guys, wasa mailbag, and it was It was
our final mail bag for the foreseeablefuture. You guys who listened already know
(38:23):
probably if you saw it on Twitterwherever. I'm joining Kansas City Sports Network.
I'm very, very excited for that, humbled and grateful that bj Kisslin
the group over there gave me anopportunity. With that said, with timing
conflicts and just general workload stuff,I'm gonna have to be stepping away from
(38:44):
our TK three times a week evenin general. I'm just for the sake
of continuity. So that's gonna beit for our TK for a while.
It was quick developing. It wasn'tsomething that we premeditated, and this was
a cutoff point halfway through week fiveof the twenty twenty two season. Um,
but that's kind of the nature ofthis stuff. UM. It had
(39:06):
been a blast, man, Ithas been a blast over the past when
me and Tucker we started this inMan, it's been a couple of years.
I think it was like August oftwenty twenty. Yeah, yeah,
it was right into the season oftwenty twenty. We didn't know where it
was going to go, We didn'tknow what was going to develop, We
didn't know how long it was goingto last. And it was very um
(39:30):
continuous, through him hosting it everyweekday, to him cutting back during the
off season, to him moving onto KCSN, to him handing it off
to me, um, to mecutting it back to a few times a
week during the off season, tome doing it now. That was a
blast. The k CSN is responsiblefor the death of urtk Yes, so
(39:51):
if you have any like qualms withthis, you need to go hit up
too. Um. No, I'mjoking, of course, But like I
said, man, it's it's beenvery humbling to host this podcast and not
only just have the outlet to talkmore football, but talk football with friends,
(40:12):
and have Mark and have Connor andhave Zach, have opposing publishers on
to talk about different teams, dothose previews. It's been very enlightening.
It's been very humbling. Um,it's been fun. I regretfully am stepping
away from it. With that said, we don't really know what's going to
happen with our TK. I thinkit's not the end of it. Something
(40:37):
tells me that it will get revivedin some capacity at one point by somebody.
It's not going to be me forthe foreseeable future, obviously, and
it won't be me, And I'mnot going to take up the Jordan mantel
wind Tucker left. Sure. Ihave a real life job. As I
said earlier, I just got anew one, so I don't have the
time nor the patience I think Jordanhas for it. Yeah, sometimes life
(41:00):
hits man, and it's it's unexpectedand you just have to be along for
the ride and see where it takesyou. Luckily, it's taken me to
some really cool places so far,RTK and Si Cheeps being one of them.
I'm still going to be doing theArrowhead Report inside the Royal stuff.
I'm super excited again for what's next, but also man super grateful to be
(41:22):
having this platform and to have thisspace and have this podcast and be able
to shape it the way I wantedto. Josh Briscoe, the Podfather,
very accepting of whatever creative decisions we'vemade, whatever we want to do.
He wants us to have fun.Tucker very accepting and helpful and transitioning from
(41:43):
him to me or from Josh tohim, and obviously doing it with my
pals Man and Connor's been here forthe entire process. Extremely grateful to have
shared the stage with you many atime. I think we've had some banger
podcasts. There wasn't ever a timewhere I was like, man, I
have to jump off, but podwith Connor like this sucks. It's always
(42:04):
something I look forward to every week, and something I look forward to multiple
times a week is is chatting witheverybody else. So thank you guys for
tuning in. I promise I'm notcrying. My voice is just kind of
giving out. Thank you for tuningin and being so supportive and chatting and
interacting. And Connor Man, thankyou for coming on not only today but
(42:28):
whenever you have in the past.It's it's been a fun, right,
It's been very fun. Um,I really you've covered it all, Jordan,
you covered all in a great sendoff. Thanks to all for listening.
Um, I'll be on Twitter,Jourdan will be on Twitter still so
if you want our takes, we'llbe firing them off there. But I
think you covered it well otherwise.Yeah. So that's it, guys.
(42:52):
This isn't goodbye forever. It's justgoodbye from our tk UM. I promise
we're still out there. We're stilldoing stuff. Of the written content.
I fully encourage you, got it. I'm really making myself sound like I'm
crying. Guys, you're gonna watchthe video. I promise I'm not.
It is fully encourage you. Checkout Connor stuff on SI cheps, Everheadreport
(43:15):
dot com or SI dot com,slash NFL, slash Cheeps, Zack Eys
and Mark fan Sickle, M SamHayes when he had stuff. It's still
out there, Marlo Ferguson Jr.Everybody, the opposing publishers, all that
stuff is out there, still goingto have content coming. Even at KCSN.
I I shouldn't be fielding the Gocheck out KCSN stuff on this podcast.
(43:37):
Go do that, UM. Followeverybody on Twitter, Connors on Twitter,
at Connor with an E underscore DKC, Zack Eisen twenty one, Mark
the Overseer, I'm at footnoted that'sfoote noted. M I really again,
I don't think this is it fartk um just indefinitely. It is till
(43:58):
something happens down the road. Ido think it'll be back at some point
with somebody. But until then,guys, take care of stay safe,
and somebody will be talking to yousoon. Thanks for listening, Mom.
The Roughening The Kicker Chiefs podcast isthe Kansas City Chiefs podcast, hosted and
produced by Jordan Foote in association withArrowhead Report dot com and almost entirely in
(44:20):
LLC. Subscribe to the show whereveryou get your podcasts, or by going
to smart yourl dot it slash rtk show. For more Kansas City Chiefs
covers, go to Sports Illustrated,its home through the Kansas City Chiefs Arrowheadreport dot com
Keeps Fans, Football Fans, podcastfans alike. Welcome the board. I'm
Jordan Foot and this is the Roughin the Kicker Podcast, the Kansas City
Chiefs Podcasts, an association with Aarheadreport. As always, if you guys
are having a wonderful day, thanksfor making us a part of your Wednesday.
With that said, let's jump intotoday's show. Got Connor Christopherson here
(00:22):
with me. We're going to doa rough into mail bag. Lots of
good questions this week. You canfollow Connor on Twitter at Connor with an
E Underscore DKC Connor. How's itgoing, man, It's going great on
a nice October afternoon. I knowin my real life, I got a
new job offer today, so that'ssomething other than that. We have news
(00:46):
later in the podcast, but Ithink we wanted to do a mail bag
first, so I don't have anythingnew other than that. Yeah. No,
I also have something new that's kindof job related. But again,
what we'll chat at the end ofthe Most people that listen probably already know
what that is. With that said, I guess let's just jump in man.
Our first question comes from Pat good, friend of the pod. Which
(01:08):
position do you think is a higherpriority for a potential trade defensive end or
wide receiver. I interpreted this asin season this season trade. Is that
what you took it as too?Sure, let's say I took it as
that. I can also talk aboutthat too, But in season do you
(01:34):
think? First of all, doyou think they would even do it in
season trade? I think they woulddo it to some degree, but not
like a So my thought was lookingat next year's free agent class, which
position looks worse, and like there'splaymakers at both. But I do think
(01:55):
they'd make one Allah Melvin Ingram,but not like anything bigger than that,
if that makes sense, And Idon't think they have quite as big of
a need right now. I thinkthe excuse this year is going to be
over still letting our whiteouts jelled together, blah blah blah, ten weeks into
the year, when the deadline isso on one hand, no, on
one hand, yes, but aminor move. And like my logic,
(02:17):
next year's defensive end class has MarcusDavenport, JJ Watt, Jendavian Clowney Arden
Key, Dante Fowler, Samson Abucham, a couple other guys, not particularly
Swell, and then white out Nelson, Agilar, DJ Chark, Sterling Shepherd,
Juju McColl, both Chiefs Zach Pascal, so either one is particularly rich.
(02:43):
So in terms of higher priority,basically Pat's asking in a vacuum,
which position needs more help. Yeah, and I think because of the new
bodies, I'm not gonna go widereceiver. I would lean defensive end.
I guess I would too. Ialso think it's still more important than wide
(03:06):
receiver that we're seeing a resurgence inwide receiver priority in the NFL. I
guess it really comes down to willthe Chiefs be able to stomach having mvs
and sky More as the only returningwide receivers next year. I think that
room still needs an alpha. Ithink sky More is like a perfect wide
(03:27):
receiver too for an offense, andthey should use them more as that right
now, But they don't. Likewe saw all these teams go out and
get to alpha. We saw,of course Tyreek Hill get traded for.
We saw A J. Brown gettraded for, and we saw Davante Adams
get traded for. I just reallythink with Travis Kelcey entering his elder ears,
(03:53):
they need somebody who can younger soit wouldn't be a Tyree kill or
to Adams like thing. But iflike an AJ Brown type wide receiver is
available on the trade market, theyshould I think they should consider getting him.
I don't know who is on themarket at edge. It feels like
that market is not as robust asa wide receiver market was, at least
(04:17):
from last offseason. So I wouldassume they would want to get a defensive
end Moore, but I think there'smore realistic possibilities to get a wide receiver.
Speaking of wide receiver, Pat's bonusquestion Odell Beckham junior to Kansas City
Connor. Immediate thoughts on that,I'm going to decline because it's off the
(04:44):
ACL tear. You don't know whathe's looking like two years or two ACL
tears in his career now. Also, I think there's just too many concepts
for wide receivers in the Chief's offensefor him to come in and make the
same impact he did like for theRams last year, he just has too
much to learn in the middle ofthe season. And I even from what
(05:09):
we've seen from the wide receiver group, I think they'll be fine enough to
where it just doesn't make sense tosign him, so I think I'll pass.
You would say, yeah, he'sthe Rams sadly, so it's not
even up. Didn't he visited withthe Giant? Didn't he visited with everybody?
And like, part of it's beenunofficial, like I'm just at the
(05:30):
game, But part of it's alsolike I'm planning seats. I think he's
trying to make the Rams like keephim in their mind. I also don't
think it's a fore conclusion. Ithink he's a rammer a bill. I
don't think he goes anywhere else.Yeah, with that said, I agree
with everything you said about it's goingto take a while for the wide out,
any wide out to learn the Chiefsoffense, and he's coming off the
(05:51):
ACL tear and another offense. Ido think he showed last year he looks
really good. Like not prim Odell, but yeah, pretty damn good.
Is a really, really good numbertwo wide out. We talked about the
importance of the secondary wide receiver.You touched on that a little bit in
a vacuum. Yeah, it makessense, but then there's too many outside
(06:13):
factors I think that come into play, Like if this was in the off
season and he was coming off anac altar, but was going to be
healthy for week one. Then youthink about it. Now, what five
weeks into the year, he's stillnot one hundred percent. He's still not
signing anywhere. It's gonna be awhile the Chiefs don't have If they had
veterans everywhere else, then yeah,maybe, But everyone else is trying to
learn the system too, really outsideof Hardman, who might still be learning
(06:39):
some stuff anyway. So I'm gonnahave to decline Odell even though like that's
not an indictment on him, it'sjust an indictment on kind of the context
of that situation. I think,Yeah, I think he's a RAM.
They're just waiting, I hope.So No, I don't know after seeing
the play all the way, butinteresteeing how they played, well, he
(07:00):
really want to sign on for thathe might be the savior, like he
might have that kind of that saviorcomplex. But like, I can fix
this. I thought they brought anAllen Robinson. So this is not a
RAMS podcast, eve though I'd likeit to be. But part of me
thinks and I do believe that partof it's on s John McVay for he
called some really weird games so farthis year, and Stafford has not been
(07:24):
good by any stretch of the imagination. I need to watch the alternate angle
of a Robs film. But likehe doesn't seem to have it anymore.
Like I'm not convinced that he's cooked, but like he's in the oven and
the ovens preheated. I think.So he's in the dishwasher. Yeah,
(07:44):
he's in there, and it justhasn't started running yet. But like the
minit of press is that button.It's gonna be washed. So like he
just is taking so long to separate, and sometimes he just can't. Cooper
cup was routing people up. Obviously, Cooper Cups like a top two three
wider restar. Yeah, a rob. It's not all Stafford and mcva's fault.
(08:05):
I promise it's not them. It'salso a Rob just might not be
that guy. They need Van Jeffersonback, and they also need Odell.
But then, yes, if youhave Cup, Odell, Van Jefferson,
Robinson, Higbee, cam Makers anda somewhat healthy offensive line and Stafford playing
(08:26):
better, then you're kind of cookingwith fire. But like that's a lot,
so yeah, I don't know.They're an enigma. Yep, another
enigma, Legarius Sneed or Steve Gray. I mean, however you want to
look at it. Um. Steve'sfirst question, what is the max average
annual value you would offer Legarius Sneedthis offseason? Connor, you published an
(08:50):
article last week I believe Lagarius Sneedand how the Cheeps need to lock him
up long term. Um, youmade a really good point that I didn't
even think of about if he isreally exclusively this kind of slot guy that's
getting paid to be that guy,the contracts there are few and far between,
(09:11):
I think for like a true premiumtype slot guy. Yeah, but
with that said, he has thesize of an outside guy. Doesn't mean
he's going to get paid like anoutside guy like DK Metcalf isn't going to
get paid like a tight end becausehe's a wide receiver. What would you
be willing You mentioned a couple guysand one that had a somewhat recent contract.
What would you be willing to payLagarius Sneed on the open market?
(09:31):
Considering he's more of a do itall type player than a couple of the
slot guys I've signed recently. Iwould pay him a three year, forty
million dollar extension, which is adecent amount above other slot players, but
it would be added on to thelast year of his rookie deal, so
you can spread out the signing bonusa bit that way. And I think
(09:54):
he's worth that because right now,Lagarius sneed leads the Chiefs in sacks like
and he's also an incredible run defender, and he's the NFL's moving towards those
bigger slots, like we're seeing VantAdams play a lot from the slot.
We're seeing Drake London plays from theslot. Kyle Pits will play from the
slot, like these bigger wide receivers. Cooper cups six two and he plays
(10:16):
from the slot. It doesn't matterthat if you're cornerbacks tall now in the
slot and maybe not as agile aslike a five nine guy, as if
they can handle those bigger wide receiversand they can bulitz and they can run
defend, that's like the premium likemodern nickelback, and that's what Lagarius sneed
is. So I'm willing to goabove a lot of what those nickelbacks have
(10:39):
made previously just because he is thatprototype to make sure that they keep him,
because honestly, other than we'll seewhat happens with one Thornhill. But
other than Justin Reid, the Chiefsdon't have any long term lockdown cornerbacks,
and they've never done that. ButI think Lagerius Sneed, especially because he's
a bread Beach draft pick two,I think Lageri Snee might be the first
(11:01):
guy who breaks the mold at cornerbackwhere they actually do pay for him.
Yeah. And I think it wasEric Eager who brought up the Chiefs drafting
five defensive backs kind of excludes themfrom the corners. Yeah, those were
not mutually exclusive. I do thinkhe could have made the argument it was
right there for the taking Charvarius Board. It's an example of them not doing
(11:24):
it. Charvarious Wards still playing prettywell, like he's been a decent cornerback
now for three years, better partof two or three years. Jarius Sneed
though, being a Brett Beach guy, being he just seems like a really
good fit. He seems like areally good kid to kid. He's older
than me, but still the ChiefsI think, yeah, exactly, so
(11:45):
I think it does make sense forthem to lock him up. He is
a very versatile piece. Steve Spangvillo. Like we talked before the year,
I think if the Chiefs defense kindof sputtered and struggled, this might be
the end of Spags with like anew era of defensive players. Spags is
going to be there as long ashe wants to be. At this point,
(12:05):
like kisses, this is the bestBags season we've seen so far,
and like it should have been theworst because he had so many young guys
and somebody new players, like he'sso stubborn, she'd play the young guys
earlier. Something. Yes, yes, so Steve Spagnello's in his bag.
Legarius Sneed should be in his bag, and in about a year less than
(12:26):
a year, that bag is goingto be pretty big. Like you look
at I was looking at cornerback contracts, very imperfect science. Kennel Fuller's ten
million a year, dj Reads elevenmillion a year. A Door Jackson is
thirteen million year. I think Sneedyou said three for forty that would be
pretty much what i'd give him,like thirteen and a half million a year.
(12:46):
You know what you're gonna get.Like, he's not a this is
obviously hard to predict, but nota player who gets paid and then starts
to struggle. He doesn't have ahuge injury history, He has good size,
He can do a lot of differentstuff. He also, if needed,
and I'm not saying it would be, he can play on the outside
(13:07):
and play adequately at worst. Ithink the sample within the slot's obviously growing,
so you can do that. Youcan have Trent McDuffie long term,
You can have Jalen Watson long term. Like I get, getting the most
out of the cornerback position. Butat a certain point, if everyone's on
a rookie contract, pay one guylike Effitt. Just go pay Lagarius Sneak
(13:28):
because he's worth it and is stillyoung and is gonna be there. Lock
him up through age twenty eight,twenty nine, twenty seven, whatever you
want to do, revisit it,then maybe let him go once you have
somebody else in the fold. SoI think from a Lagarius sneed standpoint three
for forty probably like fifteen million yearsseems a little bit rich, but like
(13:50):
thirteen and a half or fourteen,I don't think the Chiefs should have a
major issue with doing that for him. Yeah, And like I said,
it's an extent because if the playeris good enough, you don't wait till
that last year for them to hitthe market because sneed's in the the no
go zone where you wouldn't franchise tagthem, but you also don't want to
(14:13):
lose them. So those are theguys you actually sign after year three,
which is when you can sign theplayers after the rookie deal. That's the
first eligible year you can sign them. So I think they just need to
lock up one of those guys.And la Jerry Steed makes sense because the
skill set is unique compared to theplayers they have right now. Trevarious Ward
(14:35):
was not. I think they werelike, yeah, we can replace an
outside cornerback because in Specnol's system,outside corners are devalued in a way.
I know they took a first roundcornerback, but like, they're not going
to pay fifteen million for Trevarious Ward. But I don't know if they can
go find a do it all nickelbackerwho can blitz, who may be the
(14:56):
best blitzing cornerback in the league.That feel it is a bit more difficult
to find. So they have thatguy, why don't you just lock him
up? Another line of thinking ofyou already have that guy, why don't
you just lock him up that bothof us have been kind of iffy on
Chris Jones, and Steve has areally good banger of the second question.
I have been of the belief that, especially with the Tirey Kill thing,
(15:20):
even before the Tirey Kill thing,Chris Jones would get traded this upcoming off
season. It just made sense.They can draft a guy, or they
can go after and pay somebody lessthan Chris Jones, but a premier interior
defensive lineman is tough to come by. They can do the stuff Chris Jones
can do against the pass. He'sbust in three players exactly. It's a
(15:41):
very short list. He's been phenomenalto start this season. It's not like
he has ten sacks or anything,but he's still been really really good from
a just pure win per down standpoint. Steve wants to know, with that
in mind, what is the minimumtrade comp you'd be willing to move him
for rather than letting him play outthe final year of his deal. O'Connor
(16:03):
is the most recent example, theBuckner trade. Would that be the comp
for it? Yep? And thatwas a pure mid first round pick.
So for Jones, who I thinkwhen Buckner was traded. I think Jones
next year has more of a valuebecause he's more proven than when Buckner was
traded. Buckner still proven it sincethen, so but I would want to
(16:29):
first in like a third for Jonesat a minimum, because I mean,
he's going to be twenty nine andthat's pretty old. But it seems like
teams don't have a they're not thatadverse to age around then. I think
he still would have three good yearsleft in him at after this year,
so I think a team could valuehim like that. I how do you
(16:56):
feel about the Chiefs being the oneto extend him though? I think it's
hard to compare him fully to otherplayers, But I mean they had a
guy like him who was elite attheir position, at his position, like
Tyreek Hill, and they let himgo. However, I don't know if
Jones is going to come at theChiefs and with aspirations Yeah, yeah,
(17:18):
like Tyreek Hill had for his contracts. So like you see Aaron Donald,
like you up that, like topthat Brett Beach, Yeah, I don't
like, I don't see that.I don't think he's going to do that.
So it really depends on him andwhat he asks because the Chiefs had
a number with tyreek Hill where hewould have stayed. So it really depends
(17:40):
on that with Jones and how hevalues himself. But a first and the
third is what I would want ina trade. Definitely the first, though
I think the mid round pick Ican live without. But when we see
Buckner get traded for a mid firstround pick, I think it was pick
sixteen or somewhere in there. Youwant to get that for Chris Jones,
who was probably the second best interiorpass rusher in the NFL. So Jones
(18:06):
got four for eighty and his caphit next year. This year it's twenty
nine millions. Like you weren't gettingout of that next year, you can
get out of it with seven millionand change in dead cap and something crazy
twenty seven million dollar cap hit.What would you be willing to give him
(18:26):
on that next contract. Well,we'll probably have this conversation to message later
on, but I figured, justfor the sec of the pod right now,
week five in the twenty twenty twoseason, yeah, I would give
him like a three year, sixtyeight million dollar extension. Maybe to add
on top of that, it wouldbump up above twenty million a year,
(18:48):
but it would not get close toDonald money because nobody should. But I
don't think there was any like Bucknergot for eighty something as well, so
there's not been really any market resettingat that position recently. So I don't
think he can ask for too muchmore. You can ask for a bit
more because the CAP's going up,but I would I'd be willing to give
(19:11):
him that, especially because of thelast few the last year, so that
deal would be easy to get outof, and that he would still only
be like thirty two thirty three,which is usually how long interior defensive alignement
last. Yeah, so Jonathan Allensigned when he was twenty six four for
seventy two, just twenty six fourfor seventy one. Buckner sign when he
(19:36):
was twenty five four for eighty four. So like I'd give Jones three for
like sixty six, like you said, maybe sixty eight, like twenty two
twenty three max million dollars per year. He should age relatively well, but
he also is not a very healthyplayer. Generally, he's not completely injury
prone, but part of that comeswith I think getting beat the hell up
(19:59):
with the lack of help on theinside or really on the defensive line in
general. But it's not to thepoint where, like man Chris Jones is
guaranteed to miss eight games a yearor whatever, we can't pay it.
I don't think it's quite that bad. So it's a risk, and it's
a calculated risk. And even ifyou do get your first round pick and
you do drop somebody not guaranteed,it's not going to be Chris Jones at
(20:19):
all. So I'm more open toit now than I was to begin the
year. Part of that's just becauseconventional wisdom has kind of cracked me a
little bit. Also, he's beenreally good so far. Yeah, I
just I don't know what the Chiefswill do. They've set a president with
older players, especially if they cangive value out of them in a trade.
(20:41):
So the only one that hasn't setthat is Travis Kelsey, and that's
just because for some reason he's finewith being woefully underpaid. So that's the
only example we've seen of them keepinga veteran for very long out of a
reasonable contract. So we'll see whatChris Jones once this offseason. Yeah,
(21:03):
he's a big part of the Chiefsdefense, and he's a big part of
a Cheaps defense that has been prettygood so far. And Danielle Soxy,
her question is just how legit isthe Cheaps defense. It seems legit to
me. I'm going to credit somebody, Matt verder Am. He did kind
of a mini threat on the Cheapsdefense. I'm just gonna read it verbatim.
(21:26):
Everybody's talking about how the Cheaps defense. Everyone's talking about the Cheaps defense
right now, but a quick minithreat on the defense currently. Gosh,
I absolutely butchered that. Everybody's talkingabout the Cheaps offense right now, but
a quick mini threat on the defense. Currently, the Chiefs defense is top
six in sacks, pressures, pressurerate, quarterback knockdown rate, hurry rate,
(21:48):
average depth of target, and yardsallowed. Their eighth in yards per
play. Then he applied like thegarbage time filter and like strip that out.
They are fifth in yards per playallowed, they are fifth in points
per game allowed. They are seventhin yards per drive and fourteenth in points
per drive. So, like Ithink on the EPA chart they finally slipped
(22:12):
just below even. I think they'relike minus point oh five or some shit
like. It's nothing crazy. It'sa lot of garbage times with the Cardinals
in Tampa game. But I knowthat guys a football outsiders do do Dboa
say that you shouldn't truly discount garbagetime because some of it is predictive.
(22:33):
But it feels like Spags is justso like his prevent is like prevent pre
vent. I know Zach friend ofthe show Zach Guys and posted a picture
of one of their prevent defenses.It was like four guys like twenty yards
deep, and I'm like, that'sthat's prevent for you. M Spacks was
packing it in like so we didn'tcare. Yeah, I would say they
(22:59):
are are more legit than I expected. I'm still curious about the pass rush
because I don't think a lot ofthis pressure is with four man fronts.
It's been a lot of stimulated pressurewith blitzes. As I said earlier,
Legarius needs leading the team in sacks, which is kind of odd for a
team that's so high in pressure rateand sacks that a cornerback would lead it.
(23:23):
So I'm curious as the Chiefs playlike the Bills and some of those
offenses, what exactly will the defenselook like? Will they be able to
get pressure with four with carloftistun Lapand Jones and Clark, or will them
bringing blitzes come back to buy themlater in the year when teams are figuring
(23:45):
out, Hey, they can't pressureunless there's a blitz that might come back
to buy them in the butt.I don't know. I believe in the
talent more this year though than thelast few years. The young players Chiefs
have are playing well. When WillieGate comes back, they'll be a big
edition. When Trum McDuffie returns,I'll be a big addition. I believe
(24:10):
in that talent, and they've beenshowing off more and earlier than I thought
they would, so that's good tosee him. Ahead of schedule. I
mean, they almost won that Coltsgame, and it was a bit disappointed
they gave up the game winning drive, but they held the clamps on the
Colts the whole game for the mostpart. So and they played really well
against the Bucks. They played reallywell against the Chargers. I mean some
(24:33):
of these games I was expecting themto give up thirty five points, and
I know they give up thirty winof the Bucks, but that was with
prevent So they're ahead of schedule,legit. I don't if Legit is like
top ten, I still need tosee more, but I can believe they
can be an average defense this year. What's up, guys, Thanks again
(24:56):
for listening to today's show and takingsome time to welcome Refrom the Kicker into
your speakers and headphones. We're goingto take a quick break to hear from
our sponsored programs, and right afterthat we'll be right back. Yeah.
No, I completely agree with that. So right now I think they are
(25:17):
two tiers better than I thought theywould be at the end of the year,
which I think heading end of theyear, and I could be totally
off on this. We thought likethat seventeen to twenty four range, and
probably a little bit higher than thattwenty four. We're like, if they're
twenty first or twenty second, thatis relatively end of your ranking exactly.
(25:38):
So I thought if they were seventeento twenty four, that wouldn't be the
end of the world. They're inthat next tier of eleven to sixteen or
eleven to seventeen or eleven to eighteen, whenever you want, twelve to eighteen
maybe where right now, at thisvery moment, you could make a case
for them being nine, ten,eleven to twelve by the end of the
year. I think they settle init like teenth or fifteenth, which you
(26:03):
get good enough. It's the topthree offense or top five of the very
worst that they sputter. Really topthree, you give them a top sixteen
defense. That's the best defense he'sever had, fairly comfortably, right,
that's how good the defense was inthe Super Bowl winning run. They actually
turned it on at the end ofthe year. I think they were pretty
high in DVOA two. I know, I think they were around sixteenth.
(26:26):
Sounds like it's comparable to that.They caught fire, right, Yeah,
and then all three playoff games.You can make an argument to defense was
a big factor in them winning.So if it's that good, I mean,
they won a Super Bowl that year, so that's it is, yeah,
and that's for tu. It is. We will have to see though,
(26:47):
because it is a lot of youngtalent um. I think we saw
a few cracks and some of theplayers like Jalen Watson was picked on a
bit, but it was Mike Evansand Tom Brady, So you can give
them pass. But it's not likethey're gonna play easier teams in the playoffs.
Is Josh Allen's to fun, Dick'sgonna go easy? Young Jayla Watson
probably not. So those cracks mightbe their downfall, but we'll see how
(27:08):
the young talent responds to that.Yeah, And the thing with this year's
Cheeps team is like their schedule isn'textremely backloaded. It was really frontloaded.
Like it's still tough all the waythrough. Don't get me wrong, but
like this shouldn't be a team thatgets worse throughout the year. It should
maintain or get better considering opponents.So like I think if the Cheeps even
(27:30):
struggle against Buffalo, and your takeawaythrough six weeks is like Cheeps have a
top half defense, it should stillbe top half or at least middle of
the pack the rest of the way. So I think to a degree,
like you said Legits in top ten, I don't think so. I haven't
seen enough yet Legitis in the bestMahomes has had outside of that, like
(27:51):
six y eight weeks stretch in twentynineteen, twenty twenty, I think that
is very fair. Totally agree.You seem to have a common theme of
that. We very rarely disagree onthe podcast, which I don't know if
that's good or bad. And wealso have thought about that before too.
All right, let's say it's good. Yeah, let's say think it is
(28:12):
or we're just completely insane. ButI mean people still listen and some people
agree. So UM, bonus questionfrom Danielle. Which Chiefs player would tackle
a fan on the field? Soin the Rams game on Monday night?
Um, the forty nine Ers playedtoo. It wasn't just the Rams game,
but whatever one would argue forty nineErs game. Yeah, okay,
(28:36):
So in the forty nine Ers gameon Monday, UM, a fan ran
on the field and Bobby Wagner madehis biggest play of the year. Um,
I'm not salty at all by layingout the fan. I think it's
got to be Nick Bolton right likeBolton would it would be him, or
like Justin Reid, or like LeoChanelle. I could see Carlottis is a
(28:56):
little too nice. I think hewouldn't be furious at that point. Leo
Chanelle would literally kill somebody. NickoBolton would just like seriously injured them.
I think how about this underrated consideringhe's he's always just he seems like a
bat out of hell on the field, Isaiah Pacheco, I could see that,
(29:17):
Yeah, like he's gonna steal that. He's gonna steal that man's job.
Yeah, I could see him.I could see Juju doing like a
like I'm trying to think of ananalogy, like you would be filming,
you would be filming the TikTok wouldPatrick, No, he wouldn't do it.
There's really a short list, man, Like I think it would be
(29:38):
Nick Bolton, m Pacheco, Icould see doing it because he runs fast
to not that you know, anyoneon the Chiefs could not catch the fan.
Um that's about hit man. Ithink that would be the three Colin
Saunders maybe. I mean and consideringlike consistent playing time and like notable names
(30:02):
on the field, I think NickBolton definitely takes the cake. Yeah,
I don't think he. I don'tthink he even knows. He wouldn't know
that the streaker was not on theother team. I think fury tackle.
He just gets on the field andhe turns it on. Let's keep it
(30:22):
on. We saved the best forlast. Of course, Mike Denny always
brings the heat. He said,what is the best condiment to dip a
fry? In. Does the cutof the fry change that answer? I
miss Willie gay, Um, Idon't. That's a tough one, dude,
Like Mike always makes me think,and obviously I kind of think throughout
(30:45):
the podcast, but like his questions, it's because you're going from football mode
to like usually not football mode.Um, what do you think I'm gonna
go? I think it's still acatch up. Um, but I'll put
an asterisks on it a few.Um, hot ketchup is very good.
(31:07):
Yeah, sure there's are any anyhot Ketchup is good. I don't usually
like spicy things too, but likehot ketchup is usually decently mild, so
it adds a bit of zest toit, so I like that. Also,
if it's potato wedges, which aretechnically fried potatoes, those are better
with ranch because I don't know there'smore potato. I guess. Yeah,
(31:33):
I still don't counteract that. Ithink it's still ketchup, though I think
ketchups to go for a reason.I'm gonna go ranch just because I'm a
huge ranch dressing guy. So I'ma huge, huge, huge ranch guy.
My mom used to always dip herfries in mayo, and I was
like that is borderline foul, butI mean it was actually not terrible.
(31:56):
I like Mayo, so I woulddo that. Ketchup is good obviously,
Like I think in terms of likethe catchup, I need to formulate my
words wisely here brising ketchup is likea more iconic duo, but that doesn't
mean it's better. Like Tom Bradyand Randy Moss went seventeen and OZ or
(32:21):
sixteen and OZ and got to thesuper Bowl, but like Travis Kelsey and
Patrick Mahomes have actually won one andhave had this sustained success. I don't
know what comp I'm trying to makehere, but ranch is a better condiment
for that, I think. Nowhear me out. This is very specific
and very telling on my part.Sure Yardhouse has this garlic aoli and it's
(32:43):
a malt vinegar version of that thatthey have and it's it's just it's the
best. Actually, cane sauce wouldbe up there too, a body.
So like, in terms of widelyavailable condiments, whatever bottle of ranches in
your refrigerator or Valley, yes,Valley, or I think mine's like whatever.
(33:06):
Walmart's brand is mighty like yeah,which quick aside eating healthy kind of
sucks because like a lot of thestuff I can still make taste good.
The ranch I can tell. There'ssuch a big ass difference, And like
I went out. I went toGuy's Delhi on Thursday, actually, as
we're recording this, I went atnoon and picked up some pizza bones,
(33:29):
which is their little, uh stuffedpizza stick type things. I had two
ranches from them that I ran outand I put a little bit of my
like light crap on the plate.And it's such a massive difference. I
was like this, that thing sucks. Like so ranch catchup cane sauce or
(33:50):
malt vinagreoli from Yardhouse, preferably thedowntown location. But also the legends is
fine, very specific on the lastone, but I'll agree with those.
I would leading catch up Eileen Ranch. Those are the only two. Both
good, both good. Yeah.If Tom Brady, this is another micro
question, of course, if TomBrady gets divorced, does he play until
(34:10):
he's fifty five? Connor does hewon't play until he's fifty five, obviously,
But if Giselle calls it quits,why wouldn't he come back next year?
He's still really good? I think, Yeah, yes, I think
he. I think he will,man, I think he'll maybe do one
more year. I still I stillthink he Something about him, I guess
(34:37):
it's maybe just the divorce. Justsomething about him is different this year.
Um. We all saw that.Now we're seeing it apparently in the courts.
Um. But also like Todd Bowlesis the head coach now, Um,
I don't know if he would wantto come back for Todd Bowles.
So that's the issue. Maybe whathappens is the Miami the rumor Miami thing
(35:00):
that was apparently actually close to happening, or it would become a part time
owner or a part owner of theDolphins and also play for the Dolphins.
Maybe that happens. But with twoof playing, well, it's like,
maybe that won't happen. Now,I'm sure it's hard to say. I
(35:21):
think there's definitely a bigger chance hecomes back though, because I mean,
we all knew he was quitting asa family, and if he came back,
it's like there's something amiss. Yeah, before all of this crap happened,
I was like, there's about athree percent chance he comes back.
I was like, he really isgoing to be done this time. Now,
though, if the divorce does happenand go through, and I don't
(35:45):
know what the timing of that wouldbe like, or if it's actually gonna
happen, or if the rumors archeror whatever, He's gonna win MVP the
year after it happens. Like ifthey divorced during the offseason, he's gonna
throw like seventy touchdowns to next yearand it's going to be insane. He
I almost feel bad for him,and like Brady's had a lot of good
fortune, Like you can tell,he does not feel great right now about
(36:07):
where things are in his life.And I even made that comment that I
thought he got like plastic surgery doneduring the off week, because he's been
known to do that throughout his career. It's indisputable, but look at his
pictures in his twenties versus now,it's obvious something, so he's gotten stuff
done. I kind of feel badthat I made that comment, But apparently
he's been going through it, man, And he didn't look particularly great until
(36:31):
this last week, and he wasn'tlike world beating or anything. He's still
stat padded quite a bit, butis he still a top ten quarterback in
the NFL. I would take himthis year over a lot of guys,
maybe even all but four perhaps,But does he played till fifty five?
I don't think so. Does heplay until forty six, forty seven?
(36:54):
That option would be on the table, and I think, like you said,
the Dolphins thing would come into play, the Buccaneers situation would come into
play, and opening somewhere else ina good spot. Maybe the other was
forty nine ers. Yeah, butthey have Lance, but they get injured.
So Brady on with that defense andthose weapons in that offensive line,
(37:16):
like went healthy, dude, andhe's from there, right, Yeah,
I believe so, Yes, hewould wreck. Like they would win fourteen
games. I think if they hadend this year, If they had ended
this year, yeah, can youimagine if Jimmy like re upped for another
year and Trey Lance came back andthen Brady was like, actually, actually
(37:39):
I want to play for the fortynine ers. Yeah, so I there's
a non zero chance he comes back. Now, I'm not putting a number
on it. I don't want tosay like twenty percent, thirty percent,
whatever. It's very early. Butin spite of this, ironically, the
worst his life gets off the field. I think that just gives him more
reason to keep playing as long ashe's healthy. M so, and he
(38:00):
has that announcing job waiting for wheneverhe does so. Yep, I'm not
crying too many tiers for Tom Bradyright now. I'll just say that,
Yeah, that, guys, wasa mailbag, and it was It was
our final mail bag for the foreseeablefuture. You guys who listened already know
(38:23):
probably if you saw it on Twitterwherever. I'm joining Kansas City Sports Network.
I'm very, very excited for that, humbled and grateful that bj Kisslin
the group over there gave me anopportunity. With that said, with timing
conflicts and just general workload stuff,I'm gonna have to be stepping away from
(38:44):
our TK three times a week evenin general. I'm just for the sake
of continuity. So that's gonna beit for our TK for a while.
It was quick developing. It wasn'tsomething that we premeditated, and this was
a cutoff point halfway through week fiveof the twenty twenty two season. Um,
but that's kind of the nature ofthis stuff. UM. It had
(39:06):
been a blast, man, Ithas been a blast over the past when
me and Tucker we started this inMan, it's been a couple of years.
I think it was like August oftwenty twenty. Yeah, yeah,
it was right into the season oftwenty twenty. We didn't know where it
was going to go, We didn'tknow what was going to develop, We
didn't know how long it was goingto last. And it was very um
(39:30):
continuous, through him hosting it everyweekday, to him cutting back during the
off season, to him moving onto KCSN, to him handing it off
to me, um, to mecutting it back to a few times a
week during the off season, tome doing it now. That was a
blast. The k CSN is responsiblefor the death of urtk Yes, so
(39:51):
if you have any like qualms withthis, you need to go hit up
too. Um. No, I'mjoking, of course, But like I
said, man, it's it's beenvery humbling to host this podcast and not
only just have the outlet to talkmore football, but talk football with friends,
(40:12):
and have Mark and have Connor andhave Zach, have opposing publishers on
to talk about different teams, dothose previews. It's been very enlightening.
It's been very humbling. Um,it's been fun. I regretfully am stepping
away from it. With that said, we don't really know what's going to
happen with our TK. I thinkit's not the end of it. Something
(40:37):
tells me that it will get revivedin some capacity at one point by somebody.
It's not going to be me forthe foreseeable future, obviously, and
it won't be me, And I'mnot going to take up the Jordan mantel
wind Tucker left. Sure. Ihave a real life job. As I
said earlier, I just got anew one, so I don't have the
time nor the patience I think Jordanhas for it. Yeah, sometimes life
(41:00):
hits man, and it's it's unexpectedand you just have to be along for
the ride and see where it takesyou. Luckily, it's taken me to
some really cool places so far,RTK and Si Cheeps being one of them.
I'm still going to be doing theArrowhead Report inside the Royal stuff.
I'm super excited again for what's next, but also man super grateful to be
(41:22):
having this platform and to have thisspace and have this podcast and be able
to shape it the way I wantedto. Josh Briscoe, the Podfather,
very accepting of whatever creative decisions we'vemade, whatever we want to do.
He wants us to have fun.Tucker very accepting and helpful and transitioning from
(41:43):
him to me or from Josh tohim, and obviously doing it with my
pals Man and Connor's been here forthe entire process. Extremely grateful to have
shared the stage with you many atime. I think we've had some banger
podcasts. There wasn't ever a timewhere I was like, man, I
have to jump off, but podwith Connor like this sucks. It's always
(42:04):
something I look forward to every week, and something I look forward to multiple
times a week is is chatting witheverybody else. So thank you guys for
tuning in. I promise I'm notcrying. My voice is just kind of
giving out. Thank you for tuningin and being so supportive and chatting and
interacting. And Connor Man, thankyou for coming on not only today but
(42:28):
whenever you have in the past.It's it's been a fun, right,
It's been very fun. Um,I really you've covered it all, Jordan,
you covered all in a great sendoff. Thanks to all for listening.
Um, I'll be on Twitter,Jourdan will be on Twitter still so
if you want our takes, we'llbe firing them off there. But I
think you covered it well otherwise.Yeah. So that's it, guys.
(42:52):
This isn't goodbye forever. It's justgoodbye from our tk UM. I promise
we're still out there. We're stilldoing stuff. Of the written content.
I fully encourage you, got it. I'm really making myself sound like I'm
crying. Guys, you're gonna watchthe video. I promise I'm not.
It is fully encourage you. Checkout Connor stuff on SI cheps, Everheadreport
(43:15):
dot com or SI dot com,slash NFL, slash Cheeps, Zack Eys
and Mark fan Sickle, M SamHayes when he had stuff. It's still
out there, Marlo Ferguson Jr.Everybody, the opposing publishers, all that
stuff is out there, still goingto have content coming. Even at KCSN.
I I shouldn't be fielding the Gocheck out KCSN stuff on this podcast.
(43:37):
Go do that, UM. Followeverybody on Twitter, Connors on Twitter,
at Connor with an E underscore DKC, Zack Eisen twenty one, Mark
the Overseer, I'm at footnoted that'sfoote noted. M I really again,
I don't think this is it fartk um just indefinitely. It is till
(43:58):
something happens down the road. Ido think it'll be back at some point
with somebody. But until then,guys, take care of stay safe,
and somebody will be talking to yousoon. Thanks for listening, Mom.
The Roughening The Kicker Chiefs podcast isthe Kansas City Chiefs podcast, hosted and
produced by Jordan Foote in association withArrowhead Report dot com and almost entirely in
(44:20):
LLC. Subscribe to the show whereveryou get your podcasts, or by going
to smart yourl dot it slash rtk show. For more Kansas City Chiefs
covers, go to Sports Illustrated,its home through the Kansas City Chiefs Arrowheadreport dot com
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