SARCast S3 Ep 2- Update from the Arctic, AI SAR & 4x4 Response

Welcome to Season 3 Episode 2 of SARCast - Luke is joined by Ralph Simonsen aka Famous Ralph. It is a jammed packed discussion covering a wide range of subjects including the Icelandic ICE-SAR Conference, Avalanches and a good update on what Ralph has been up to in the Arctic Circle! At the end of their discussion they discuss Artificial Intelligence (AI) use in Drone search and rescue.

Later Luke is joined by Sam Vincent from Derbyshire 4x4 Response Team who discuss what a 4x4 Response team is, what they get up to here in the UK and Sam shares his experiences of Snow and a good view of what it’s like in the team.

Episode Links:
ICE-SAR Conference - https://www.rescue.is/
Norsk Folkehjelp - https://folkehjelp.no/
Norsk Folkenhjelp Midt-Troms - https://www.instagram.com/nfmidttroms/
Derbyshire 4x4 Response Team - https://derbyshire4x4response.org/
Modern Outdoor Survival Snow Episode - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/52204362


Dr Robert Koester: Robert J. Koester first joined the Appalachian Search & Rescue Conference in 1981 and since then has participated in hundreds of searches. He holds a PhD in search theory from the University of Portsmouth and is CEO of dbS Productions. His contributions to search and rescue include seminal research on lost person behavior (with emphasis on dementia), the International Search and Rescue Incident Database (ISRID), a tactical decision aid software – FIND. A Search Mission Coordinator, instructor for the Virginia Department of Emergency Management, and past president of the Virginia Search and Rescue Council (15 years), Robert has also worked for the United States Coast Guard, National Aeronautics and Space Administration, National Park Service, Department of Homeland Security, and Federal Emergency Management Agency. Author of numerous books and articles on search and rescue. He has presented in Aruba, Australia, Iceland, Ireland, New Zealand, Poland, the United Kingdom, and throughout the United States and Canada.

A link to Lost Person Behaviour - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lost-Person-Behavior-Search-Rescue/dp/1879471396


Gear Links:
Rigerloo Rescuer - https://rigloo-rs.com/rescuer/
Ortovox Peak 45 rucksack - https://nettbutikk.folkehjelp.no/produkt/beredskapssekk-vanlig-rygg/
Helly Hansen - https://www.hellyhansen.com/journal/custom-made-for-search-and-rescue
SAR Cast TShirt - https://sarstore.co.uk/product/sar-store-sar-cast-t-shirt/



Podcast Links -
Join the conversation over on Discord - https://discord.gg/sX98QHg777
SARCast Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/sarcastuk/
SARCast Twitter - @SARCastUK
SAR Store Online Shop - https://sarstore.co.uk/

Episode Transcript

(00:35):
Hello and welcome to sarcast, theSearch and Rescue podcast. If you'd like
to find out more about items inthis episode, check out the show notes,
have a browse of our discord server, or follow along on our socials.
On this episode of Sarcast, wehave some insight into four by four
response from here in the UK.But first we have a fan favorite returning

(00:58):
to grace your ears right. I'mnow joined by a very special guest.
He is renowned in the search andrescue world, especially from the colder sections.
It's famous Ralph Hi Luke and everyonethat listens. Someone said we were

(01:23):
like top Gear a long time ago, and I was trying to work out
a way of introducing you in atop Gear esque style way, and I
thought that that would be would bethe one. So well, anyway,
welcome Ralph. It's lovely to seeyou. Yeah. Likewise, I'm glad
to be a back at it all. Nice to have you back. What
have you been up to since thelast time I was underfill I've been up

(01:48):
to quite a lot there. I'vebeen on this fantastic conference in Iceland is
SA magnificent experience, and of coursesee seeing how volunteers starting rescue is done
in Iceland's It was thrilling and gaveme a lot of motivation to continue the

(02:09):
work. And in here in Norway, we have a lot of stuff going
on. We started the easter withthree avalanches that killed five people within four
hours. That was the part ofthe easter. And we have a lot
of stuff with education with grown andusing drones and helicopters simultaneously in operations.

(02:36):
Wow, it never stopped. Younever stopped. We used a lot of
work and we're involved with a fewnew projects as well. Awesome. Well,
should we dive into your conference?What did you learn and how was
Iceland? Iceland is a little bitwarmer than the area I'm in. That

(03:00):
it usual, but it's main difficentto experience the landscape and and of course
the volcanic Volcanic island that it is. Well, it's mandatory to visit the
Blue Lagoon. But that's a touristtrap. So you can't be in a
new country without being stuck in ina tourist trap. Oh yeah, you've

(03:23):
got to experience it. Oh thatsounds amazing. And there's search a rescue
an environment and such a rescue inIceland have a very high position within the
community. And there I see wehave a lot to learn in Norway,
especially because the start is of beinga volunteer search a rescue. In Iceland,

(03:46):
it's pretty done high. They get, they get tax refunds when they
buy cars, they get a lotof money from both the public and companies
to use such a rescue and buytheir fantasy equipment, and of course for

(04:08):
all the training. And I reallyliked the thing that they are training in
all kinds of weather. If it'sa ship the weather, it's a perfect
day for training. And I reallyliked the way they do things. And
the small country of Iceland with onlythree hundred and thirty thousand people sent along

(04:32):
four or five guys to to Turkey, Syria in the earthquake for leading the
urban search and rescue and the heavyurban search search and rescue. So the
small country that's quite poor actually comparedto Norway, they have a lot of

(04:53):
investment in search and rescue and provideheavy equipment for such a rescue and urban
such and rescue for the volunteers.So we have a lot to learn.
Well, it sounds like a reallygood country that people should be taking a
leaf out of. That book.Yeah, absolutely, And I have to

(05:13):
say, if you ever get thechance to to visit the Iesar convention,
and I have to hop on itat first cost. It's a perfect way
to to learn something and to getnew motivation. And I had I had
the opportunity to stand and chat withdoctor Koister for approximately one hour and we

(05:41):
talked about avalanches and how how he'smissing Daughta from avalanches. So he gave
me a challenge, and this hapendingon on on providing on providing Norwegian number
from avalanches for the new chapter,for the new Lost and Person for the
upgrade and lost person behavior a amazingYou really will be famous, Ralph.

(06:04):
Then in the in the new cutwho have you in the small print at
the back and in famous Ralph statsthat my main skill is that I'm not
afraid to contact people and speak withthem. So there's a lot of good
guys that knows a lot. Soand when you and when you meet people

(06:29):
with a little bit of humbility andyou all but assumed that they know everything
better than yourself, and then that'sthe way everyone meets each other. So
when you start talking, it's alot to look brilliant brilliant. Oh that
sounds fascinating. Did you was therelike show and tell and stuff at the
conference or was it sort of justlots of guest speakers? It was,

(06:56):
it was actually all kind. Itwas elections. Some of the elections were
clearly for the Icelandic such a risk, and it was translated from Icelandic to
English, and some of the translationswere quite poorly because we missed a lots

(07:20):
of punchlines. But I think maybemost of it got lost in translation.
I met a fantastic police officer atthe convention, and here's a chubby beaded
man, and I actually like chubbybeaded man. It seems like that's my

(07:42):
preference. And got to see alot of equipment. And we visited for
such a rescue organizations in Iceland andI'm not going to try pronouncing one of
them because I'll fail epically. Ohyeah, I hate when that happens.

(08:11):
And I had there were one daywith the meeting read for all conventions participants,
and then there I met one ofthe guys on the discord server and
chatted a lot with him, andI got the challenge coin. They used

(08:35):
challenge coins in Iceland and that wassomething I really really liked and appreciate that.
It's it's a great honor to receivea challenge coin. Oh yeah,
the next time I'm back in Iceland, if I don't have my challenge coin,
I will have to buy Beau toeveryone. I like that. Yeah,

(08:56):
oh wow, that's brilliant that youmet up. We saw from the
discord server and the challenge coin.What an honor, What an honor.
That's a great honor. So that'snot something I take likely on. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, I bet yeah. Oh wow, Well, what
a great experience. Well that's onefor people to put in their diaries if

(09:18):
they can get on it. It'sthe ISAR conference in Iceland. The next
one is in twenty twenty four.Twenty twenty four, they go book it
in now, Book it in now, as approved by a famous Ralph.
So what else have you been upto them Ralph? It's basically the normal

(09:43):
stuff with training and of course alot of callouts. In my team.
We had the all time high callout with twenty nine callouts last year in
the region we're in the normal amountof callouts for our team is fifteen to
maybe eighteen. Oh well, wehad a lot of callous, but a

(10:07):
lot of them were were of coursedue to avalanches we had. Last season,
we had six avalanches in twelve days, and this seasons we've been turned
out for five avalanches. Wow andon on. On the night on too

(10:30):
Christmas Eve, we had a callout with our ambulance for picking up a
patient transferred by plane from from Majorcato to Bottle Fox and we drove to
Trumpsa and this was one of thedays where we had a little bit of
snow. So during that night itfell down approximately eighty ninety centimeters of snow

(10:56):
in five six hours. That's ridiculous, that's ridiculous. So we have this
our ambulance. It's a Volvo Vninety with all wheel drive, and a
few times there was so much snowthat the snow went over the hood and

(11:18):
over the front window. So itwas ridiculous amounts of snow. I bet
that's quite challenging as well, becauseyou'll you'll, I guess you go through
parts where there's not too much andthen you turn around the corner and it's
built up and drifted. This night, we got the call out at six

(11:41):
o'clock and the plane landed in Battleforsat nine o'clock in the evening, and
when the plane landed it started tosnow, and it snowed continuously until we
were back at Vinceness at five o'clockin the morning Christmas morning. Wow,
that's some dedication that that's that's along drive as well, isn't it.

(12:01):
It's actually not the long drive.It's only one hundred and sixty five kilometers,
So that's that's not a long drive. In myan moment, it's massive
for us. But yeah, Iappreciate your your your your short journeys a
hundred k If I'd drive a thousandkilometers to the south, I still have

(12:26):
seven hundred kilometers left to come tothe south southern parts of Norway. And
if I'd drive eleven hundred kilometers north, then I'm on the boarder to Russia.
So it's a long country. It'sa really long country. Oh,
so you the avalanches, I meanthat, I mean you've done, as

(12:48):
you said, double the callouts inlast year. Is that have you to
increase your team size or recruit morepeople to help with those additional call outs?
Call us in avalanches now is it'sa little bit of game changing now
in how it's it's done because wesee more and more avalanches are sold with

(13:16):
increased helicopter capacity, so we havemore such a rescue helicopters now because of
yeah, we have a lot ofavalanches and my county is the deadliest county
in Norway. We have of twelvethirteen annually killed by avalanchees, nine or

(13:39):
ten are killed in my county.So so we we got to such a
rescue helicopter to Trumpsa this season andit's been a game change and we see
they solve more and more of theregular avalanches and for us, the volunteer

(14:01):
searching rescue, we we get thecall us, but we are a more
bad weather condition. So when whenit snows, for instance, one meter
that we've had this this winter,when it snows one meter over one night,
then it's something that the volunteer searchand rescue have to solve because it's
uh and it's not flying conditions.Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah yeah,

(14:26):
So so we have to fix this. We have to solve all matters that
are bad weather conditions. So wesee that's a game shifter that we don't
have a lot of Sunday days wherewe do our where we do a volunteering,
it's almost exclusively in poor weather conditions. Yeah, that's the same with

(14:54):
us. It's it's it's always raining, or it's always it as o'clock in
the morning. Assisted my neighbor teamin in urban close to close to the
Swedish border. They had they gotthe call out with a father and two
sons got stuck on a snowmobile andthe drive was approximately twenty five kilometers.

(15:22):
The normal route is this ride takesapproximately forty five minutes. They started,
the call out was at two o'clockand at five thirty we lost communication with
them because they were out of tetrareach and two hours later then they returned

(15:46):
to Tetra reach thirty minutes after theabsolute maximum deadline we have we have agreed
upon, so we have. Wehad actually started with the next team to
be to go in and look fortheir searchers when conditions were so bad that

(16:06):
the visibility was five to ten meters, So a drive that normally takes forty
five minutes they used four four fourand a half hour off. Wow,
that's not They went in and theyfound the father and the sons and then

(16:29):
put the sons in in the scooteron the slane and put them in the
blankets and the father put hopped onone scooter and they went and found and
retrieved the scooter for the father anddigged it out from the snow and towed
it back to to the starting point. So that's something that helicopters can't do

(16:52):
when when the visibilities high meters,it's impossible for helicopters to do this,
so then the volunteer, your heroeshave to do it. You've we've been
doing a lot of snowba bill stuffrecently with training and stuff. How's that
going. Yeah, we bought thisall terrain vehicle from Candam but that we

(17:18):
put snow oh snow belts on andwe tested it's this winter and it's an
incredible tool to to transport patients.It's much better than driving a snowball bill
and put the patient in a sleigh. But of course when you have when

(17:41):
you have an all terrain vehicle thathas a weight of nearly seven hundred kilos
on quite small snow belts, thatwe have some challenges when when there snow
is one meter and it's very soft. To our listeners who trying to work

(18:03):
out exactly what this looks like.It's a stoma bill that looks almost like
a tank. That's the that's theeasiest way to describe it. I think
for me, that's the easiest wayto describe it. I'll send you a
video and and some pictures you canshare on the discord or everyone will be
waiting for that though worries, it'sall that's brilliant. So h with your

(18:30):
avalanche stuff if you had an increasein drown activity. There's been some increased
activity with with avalanche of with ROLDS. But this past year year and a
half we've done a lot of workwithin such a rescue in in Norway with

(18:52):
talking with helicopter pilots and police andother drowne operators and just mending the way
of how we want to cooperate becausethe main goal is to fly at the
same time so we can have drownthe helicopters in the air. It is
at the same time because that's thebest for the patients that most tools are

(19:18):
in use to locate them. Andwhen we located the patients, then the
drone can go back on the groundand the helicopters or the ground team can
recover the patients. Our drones arefantastic, but they still can't do CPR
or patients. You wait, Imean yeah, it must be really difficult,

(19:41):
especially as some of those trains arequite small, aren't they for the
pilots to see when they're when they'reflying. And so is it more of
a case of like radio communications andhaving a set flying plan for that stuff,
Ralph, Almost all our flights arebeyond the line of sight, so

(20:04):
our normal is that we don't seethe drone when we're flying because of whether
conditions or the distance from the pilotto where the drone is. So this
this needs this puts now, I'mlost the words. I'll try again.

(20:25):
This means that we have to wehave to have a good plan, We
have to pre plan flights, andwe have to have a good communication with
especially helicopters, on how we wedo these lights and how we put our
fail safe and in case of crimincommunication loss, what are we what are

(20:47):
our procedures so they can trust us. So helicopters, manned aircraft, we
need to get them to trust usguys that are flying the unmanned aircraft,
because putting a drone to the groundis much easier and cheaper than putting a

(21:08):
start queen or a seeking on theground. Oh wow yeah yeah. So
does that mean you've been doing somejoint training with them to sort of upscale
and improve that relationship. Yeah,we done joint training and we also done
joint operations in such a rescue.We had a quite big exercise in January,

(21:33):
really heat outside my home in Sanyawhere we where we trained with helicopters
and tree drones from from the CoastGuard and from the police and from my
organization. So we flew simultaneously withthe air ambulance and such a rescue helicopter.

(21:56):
When when everything is pre planned,everything is easy, that's the problem,
isn't it. Actually we had acall us on a despondent person and
we were flying with one drone fromFire Services and one drone from Red Cross

(22:21):
and one grown from my team,and then searching rescue helicopters came into the
area and when there were ten minutesout because we have proceeded that we always
we always say on the tetral radiowe're flying drones and we were in this
area. And when the search arescue helicopter got close to the area,

(22:42):
they asked, are all drones onthe south side of this bridge? And
and we all acknowledge, yes,we are on the south side of the
beach. Okay, keep searching.We'll work on the north side of the
beach. So let's easy. Itwas to coordinate, but there's been We've

(23:04):
used twelve, thirteen, fourteen monthstoo to speak for them, to get
the noo one another and get themto trust us. So everything seems easy
in everything sounds easy on the Tetraradio, but it's a lot to work
that's invisible that nobody knows about.Yeah, yeah, yeah, I bet

(23:26):
yeah. And I suppose it's hardas well, because until you actually physically
beat the person as well, youdon't know. Yeah, it's what they
really like to Yeah, and it'sactually it's it's kind of cool when you're
out on a certain rescue mission andand you hear the pilot talking on the

(23:48):
Tetra radio and you just go,oh, yeah, I know him.
Ahome, So have you have yougot any new drones recently or any new
tech ins outside of the world.We're waiting for this drone with a life
seeker for with with locating people withthe mobile telephones there's some regulatory issues we

(24:18):
have to work out, because it'snot allowed for anyone to use an emstycatcher
to locate people in Norway. Ifyou need to locate someone with the emsycatcher
in Norway, they have to havecommitted a crime that's worth ten years of

(24:40):
prison or there or it has tobe a foreign spy that the military is
is searching for. So the techcomes quicker than the regulations. So we're
working with the regulations and I'm notpaid enough to wait. The government is

(25:03):
that when you're doing your your missingperson description, go yep, missing missing
spy, missing missing criminal. Tenyears just to just to get the use
of the technology. So the waywe use to locate people with mobile telephone
right now in Norway is that weuse in in the criminal code. We

(25:30):
have a regulation that gives us,oh, I think the right term would
be emergency right, we get theemergency right to break the law to find
them because we don't have any regulationthat said we can do this. So
so we use this this criminal conductthat gives us the right to to break

(25:56):
the law to save a life.Nice, get sensible? That is sensible.
Yeah. The problem is that sincewe are search a rescue. There's
another regulation that says that it's notallowed to plan to use emergency right for
emergency. So there are some someissues. So I think the authorities are

(26:22):
looking the other way while we waiton the regulations to catch up with the
tech. Yeah yeah, yeah,but we're working now with with two manufacturers
in in the UK with two hundredand fifty gram romes, some two or
fifty gram dromes, and we foundwe found some dromes that actually have one

(26:48):
hour of flight time and IP gradeof sixty seven and that kind of been
stand the winter to twenty two meterper second. So wow. So when
you have a small drone with aquarter of a kilow that can with sand
this much wind and also its operationaldown to twenty minus degrees and in rain,

(27:12):
then it starts to get interested.Yeah. It's a game change and
that isn't it. Yeah, it'suh, it's quite different to carry a
two hundred and fifty grand rone inyour backpack rather than trying to carry around
on on a dj I AM thirtyor Matris three hundred drones or six seven

(27:36):
eight kilos plus twenty kilos of batteries. Yeah. Yeah, with with small,
small wheels in the forest. SoI say the small drones they are
carry ons, and the DJI matrissaid, yes, they they are transportable.

(28:02):
Yeah, it's possible to transport themif you have an all terrain vehicle
or a snowmobile or a car.Yeah. Yeah, that's not something you
want to put in a rock stack, is it. No, So if
you have to to walk out tothe side to do a search of rescue
operation, then the Dji drones areuseless basically because they're too happy. Since

(28:30):
most of our missions are in quiterural places, then we look for options
that work within our climate. Yeah, but you do, yeah, which
is yea. And some of ouroperations in last year we walked with a

(28:52):
drone on my backpack for eight kilometersand then I started flying eight kilometers hike
and up on the mountain, andthen we could start flying. Because it's
not possible to transport with a ulterrain vehicle or or a snowmobile. Yeah
yeah, it's yeah, especially upin your area with all the mountains and

(29:15):
the rockiness. Yeah. We don'thave a mountain rescue or lowland rescue.
We don't. We only have searchand rescue and we have this uh,
this rope guys, these rope guys. So so we do the search and

(29:38):
rescue up to approximately forty five degreesand when it's forty five to ninety degrees
angles, then the rope guys comein and they fixed it. Nice.
Nice, that's good. That's that'sstill that's still steep, Ralph. Forty
five degree stepness, that's crazy.If I've learned on I've learned by a

(30:03):
colleague, and if it's if thesteepness is above forty six degrees, if
something starts rolling, a rock ora human, it won't stop. So
if if the steepness is above fortyforty six degrees, it will just keep
rolling and rolling and rolling. Wow. Yeah, and it won't stop rolling

(30:29):
until until you're at the lower angle. So that's kind of why we work
up to forty five degrees like that. That's good. Good, stop you
rolling down there forever. At leastyou wouldn't have to go far to get

(30:51):
home. Though in some of ourareas, if you start rolling, then
you can start digging. Oh brilliant. What else have you been up to
in the Arctic circle them, Ralph? Anything else? Yeah, we do

(31:15):
a lot of uh, we doa lot of training. Now we're in
the training season. We're educating newsearch and rescue operators and and new team
leaders. So I'm I'm doing instructionfor search for a team leader. I'm

(31:36):
doing education now in in June,and and some of the the team leaders
will educate, they will go onand get training to be such a rescue
search planning leaders. Yeah yeah,yeah, oh wow. So how many

(31:56):
people have you grown by this year? Uh? Oh, We've lost some
members and we got some new members. But right now in my team,
we are twenty eight active members.We educated six people this winter, brilliant.

(32:22):
And how long does it normally takefor them to get qualified? The
minimum requirements we have they have togo through a thirty hour practical and theoretical
training weekend and some additional electronic learningfor the search and rescue part. And

(32:50):
for the first eight part they haveto go through electronic learning that takes approximately
fifteen hours and then a thirty houra weekend with with courses, with training
and courses and exercises too. Andwhen they have done this, they they're
at the minimum basic level. Andand then we start adding on with the

(33:14):
extra skills with with the steep andslippery. That's something betrained them in.
And we trained them in use theuse of of snowmobiles and the use of
all terrain vehicles. And we trainthem in the avalanches to be qualified for

(33:38):
avalanches. It's education of thirty sixhours. And on this courses, it's
normal that we uh, two outof three managed to get through the courses
and one other three drop out.Wow, and and and then you're at

(33:58):
the basic level too to do thefun stuff. Fun stuff is handling patients
and then we try and then westart adding on with for the guys that
want to fly at romes. Wehave approximately forty hour education to be a

(34:20):
drone pilot, and we have fortyhour educations to be a team leader,
and we have one hundred and twentyhour education to be Advanced First daither then
you can man the ambulances. Ohwow. But not all teams have ambulances.

(34:45):
But some team have the need topick up the patients out in the
wilderness and bring them to ambulances,and they also have this one hundred and
our twenty hour course of First AidsAdvanced First Date. And of course we

(35:06):
have the one hundred hour of ateam leader to to put on on top
and and then you basically are onthe top of education in in the volunteer
world. And and then you canadd on because when we're at the top

(35:29):
level educated in volunteer search and rescue, then we can attend the training courses
at the police Academy to to todo search and rescue and manage trainings between
multiple agencies and so on. Soit's a lot to add on. Yeah,

(35:50):
and to keep I guess, keepon date and up up, you
know, keep up your skills aswell. Yeah, and of course we
have this this swift education also,so I'm one of the I think we're
ten people, ten instructors in Norwayon Safe doctor within and paid. So

(36:15):
I'm one of the technicians. Well, brilliant. Have you had much water
callouts over the last year. Wehave some water call outs, but basically
it's, uh, the normal onesis despondent jumping of bridges. Yeah,

(36:37):
so that's actually not the main thingthe swift water is meant to cover.
Yeah. Yeah, So most ofthese cases are are fixed by helicopters or
fire services with boats. Yeah yeah. Yeah. They have a little bit

(37:01):
better economy than us, and ofcourse they have a shortly dispatched time.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeahyou all you all do use blue lights,
they don't you I think if Iremember rightly. Yeah, in my
team, we have blue lights andwe have education on driving blue lights.

(37:21):
And this is this is quite expensiveeducation. I think it costs approximately eleven
thousand pounds. Oh wow wow.And this is something we have to pay
as volunteers. So if there's anyoneout there I'd like to sponsor Ralph and
his team, then please do getin touch. That's that's that's a lot

(37:43):
of money. That's a lot ofmoney we have. We had the sponsor
last year, so we educated twopersons in my team and we only paid
the six hundred pounds each for theeducation. Wow only only. But that's

(38:06):
that's still a lot of that's stillquite a lot of money. Yes,
oh yeah, definitely. Yeah wow. So have you had any new vehicles
this year? Last year? No, we haven't bought any new vehicles except
this all terrain vehicle we bought andthat one is ridiculous, ridiculous cool and

(38:34):
ridiculous expensive. Because we are everythingwe wanted. We put on this and
we had a wish list and westarted and We're thinking, okay, this
is everything we want. How expensivewill it get? And it turned out
to cost approximately forty pounds And thenwe started to collect the money and this

(39:02):
was actually done in within six months. We had raised all the money and
uh and then we uh and thenwe bought it. But there's been some
there's been some things to the eastthat has done that. Everything that is
produced with belts has been delayed.So we have had to wait six seven

(39:23):
months to to receive this alter invehicles. So it was lived in December
January to us. Yeah, Iguess. Uh. Is that affecting other
things as well? Yeah, it'saffecting a lot of things. Oh wow,

(39:45):
Well, you have been incredibly busyand there's been a lot going on.
Have you bought anything for yourself?Have you got any new kit or
anything? I mean, last episodewe were talking about Ben's trousers and all
sorts of random stuff that he'd beenbuying from various brands. But is there
anything I heard something about some trousersand some temperatures that it's actually quite childish.

(40:16):
But there was a sentence with there'sNorwegians. So I'll leave it to
that. I have this little thing. I buy a lot of of gadgets
and stuff, and some of thethings I buy I are quite clever,
and some of the things I buyare really really stupid and just get thrown

(40:40):
away. But in my team weuse Hallie Humsen as as as the main
close distributors. So I have Ihave the extreme Extreme life saber equipment from

(41:04):
Halle Hunsen and that one is ridiculousexpensive, but it's really really good,
especially for the part that we doye in our in our environment. Yeah,
you definitely, definitely wouldn't want acheap cheap gear and jacket and trousers
for what you guys do. Andof course shoes, shoes. It's important

(41:28):
if when we buy shoes for forarctic work, it's normal to pay from
two hundred pounds and up. Yeah, I guess you've got to think about
crampons and all the accessories and allof that as well. Yeah, and
when we go out in the winterand it's deep, then when then we

(41:51):
need there's no change for the shoesalso, yes, yes, so there's
a lot of stuff and get saidwe we have to have we for this
winter. We bought oh we useNow I've lost the works again. The

(42:17):
the underlying mat, the termal mat. Yeah. Yeah, we bought twenty
of these lightweight turmal mats for allour avalanche crew. And then we bought
twenty pieces of oh the advent.This the advent bags that we can almost

(42:45):
like a sleeping bag but a littlebit light, lighter and lightweight, and
twenty wind shelters oh wow. Yeah, and this is bought to our avalanche
crew at the plan behind. Itis two parted because one thing is for

(43:07):
them to use in treating treating patientsto do some hypothermic treating to keep them
warm or to reduce reduce the riskof getting them no more hypothermic. But
it's also equipment meant for the sercialrescuers to have something to surviving because in

(43:32):
some of our missions it's not it'snot unlikely that we have to spend four
or six, maybe eight hours towait for the weather to change before we
can continue. It's it's a survivalkick and the first aid kit. Yeah.

(43:52):
Have you ever heard of a rigaloo? No? I never heard
of. Oh, we'll send youthe details. It's an it's an inflatable
shelter that you can you can carryin a bag put in a vehicle and
you like an air beam style tent. You pump it up in about six

(44:13):
seconds or something like that, andit can yeah, you you sort of
you can put it over a casualtyyou can. It's got a base,
it's a it's an interesting piece ofkit made here in the UK, or
at least designed here in the UK. Sort of up and coming tool which
is being used by lots of differentpeople search and rescue, police, fire

(44:37):
and also the military comes into variouscolors and stuff. But their responder version
I think it is is is brightorange so you can't miss it. But
yeah, it's a a rigorloo.We'll ping you with the details. That's
quite interesting. Were almost like newgadgets. Uh. And of course I've

(45:02):
been I've to do a little bit, a little bit of advertising. I've
been to to this so our storeand bought me some stuff T shirts and
this pouch for for iPad. Niceand of course uh i uh, I

(45:30):
was unlucky when because I didn't receiveany picture of a duct, but I
received a duck they got there.That's the main thing. That's the main
thing. Yes, it's a quitefun gimmick actually, and I heard you

(45:52):
talked about backpacks on the on theshow. We are in Norwegian people and
we use of ox Peak forty fiveliter and we had we have had a
version that's been customized for search arescue and it's a really really good backpack

(46:15):
for search a rescue. And wehave this h this small waterproof bag.
So we have a lot of differentequipment in and we organized them by by
a color and or a texture toto know the difference between them. When

(46:37):
when we are in the dark andyou don't have her your head talk,
it's quite impossible to to to feelthe color. So I have the important
stuff I have in a in abag, but another texture, so when
I put my hand in the bag, I can feel that this is the
bag. Oh wow yeah, goodgood good idea good point. Yeah,

(47:01):
when I need to get this bagquickly out because that's the one where I
have the first aid kit for patients. Yeah. And in the in the
top compartment, I have the firstaid kit for myself because I have I
have one kid. For the patients, I want kit for for myself good

(47:22):
and for myself. It's basically I'ma matin and blisters pack and some plasters,
just to get the essentials like that. Yeah, we talked about that
with Ted on the on the lastepisode and it was interesting too to see
what everyone has everyone because everyone hassomething slightly different to their personal kit.

(47:45):
But yeah, it's just good.In my bag, it's there's a lot
of of clothes all. I alwayshave two extra extratermal dresses or for changing
the inner layer because, especially inavalanche, as we work and we get

(48:09):
sweaty, and the inner layer getwet and when this get wet, you
get really really cold, very fast. So it's important to have a dry
wolves to put on and and becauseif you're dry, then you're warm.
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,yeah, you don't want to I don't

(48:30):
want to freeze from the inside outthat Oh yeah yeah, what what was
that? What was that rock sack? Again? It was an auto box?
Was it? Autobox? Autobox?Lovely? Yeah, I'll send you
a link on that one as well. Brilliant. I guess there's there'll be

(48:52):
some people out there who are reallyinterested in it. Equipment is it is
always something we uh, we likeand we want to want to check out.
Yeah, that is definitely not whybrows just dropped that in the message

(49:15):
box for us, and that isnot what I've written on why notes,
which is Yep, that's brilliant,Thank you very much. We'll stick that
in the show notes so people cancan have a look. Yeah, that's
the that's the small thing with Norwegianpronunciation. It's some things get lost in

(49:37):
translations. Yeah, I'd written otterwhich which is completely different to what you've
just written in that box. Yep. I'm gonna have to learn some more.
So what training have you been upto you? Have you? Have
you done anything different this year?Have you uh tried anything? I have

(50:05):
to admit that I haven't attended verymuch training, only the minimum to to
to be active as a member,because I use a lot of all my
time right now to with some nationalprograms within drones, where we we're making

(50:29):
national standards how to operate drones,and we're also making a national operational manual,
and we're cooperating with everyone within sucha rescue on to have a joint
training on so everyone get the samebasic skills and then we get the same

(50:53):
language when we talk to each other, regardless if you're a volunteer or police
officer, or or you work inthe coast Guard or whatever. So this
one has taken up a lot ofmy time unfortunately, so I haven't gotten
enough training this past twelve months.So the goal for this year is back

(51:16):
to basics. Back to basics likethat, and it's something we also have
for the teams. We the goalfor this year is back to basics because
we've bought a lot of drones andvehicles in the last year. So this

(51:36):
year the equipment me by is equipmentfor for the search and rescue operators and
we focus on training, especially toto train in skills, skill and skill
sets before they are forgotten or atthe dangerously low level. Yeah, I

(52:00):
suppose that that definitely doesn't help whenthere's so much going on in terms of
you know, you've got water,you've got drone, you've got actual searching,
you've got to think about the firstaid on top of that. It's
a it's a lot, and Iguess that's what happens in the voluntary side
of things is everyone wants to doeverything as well, don't they. Yeah,
And we, of course, likeeveryone else, we have to earn

(52:22):
money to by telling our volunteer firstaid courses or first aid equipment to finance
to search and rescue. So basicallywe have to pay to start to save
people lives. Yeah, yeah,yeah, that's so. Yeah. If

(52:44):
you need a course and you're inNorway, hit hit up Ralph. He'll
he'll do his thing. We'll doour magic things magic. Is there anything
else that you want to update uson from no Way? Yeah, we're
working with this foundation, Norwegian AirAmbulance, so we're cooperating them on the

(53:13):
project. Now with artificial intelligence.Wow, So the plan is to first
we need to make the search enginebig enough and robust enough to to actually
be of any help. But theplan is, and the proof of concept

(53:35):
is that at this point we canwe can distinguish a human person even in
the dense forest. We can wecan get the artificiecial intelligence to tell us
in that green area there's the personunder those leaves. So this has been

(53:58):
tested and a proof of concept,and we're gonna add on now with getting
artificial intelligence to tell us everything andevery time we fly over something that's not
natural, it will be marked upon the camera. We start with using
of drones of course, because that'swhere we get the most data. But

(54:23):
now that we're getting the fifth generationof telecom and and the broad band of
data networking is not an issue anymore. So the body camps are getting more
and more thought about and planned forusing in search and rescue to document but

(54:45):
also give the feedback when when suchan rescue operators walk walk around them,
suddenly the artificial intelligence picks up somethingand two year left fifty meters there's something,
check it out. Yeah. Soif you can use the skill set

(55:07):
and experience of a such a rescuercombined with technology, then we're going the
right way. Oh yeah, definitely. Yeah. Well, from from my
side, we've I've noticed a lotmore body coms being used in in operations
and with that added AI that wouldyeah, and the live feedback to a

(55:27):
control vehicle or or an operator who'sremote is it's only going to help the
situation of that operation. So yes, only a good thing. AI is
a massive thing at the moment oneveryone's radar, and it's almost like a
new toy in the in the toybox, and lots lots to learn about
what the limitations are, what wecan use it for. And I think

(55:51):
it's only going to be a anotheruseful tool that we can use. Yeah,
AI, I think I think it'sactually the same as as a drone.
You have to remember this is atool, so it's it's something to

(56:14):
add on and not instead of.So we added to to such a rescuer
and not instead of to such arescuer. So that's something we have to
remember. Because even though I seethe computer power that's is available with the

(56:35):
AI, AI still can't do aCPR or hypothermic treatment. No no,
oh wow. Yeah. Technology isgood, but it's not everything. No
yeah, And I suppose for youguys as well as I guess, like
battery time and conditioning of definitely inthe cold weather is you know, the

(57:01):
product might say, oh yeah,it can last an hour, but in
reality, I guess that's that's alot less once you've you've got it out,
it's it's doing this thing. Andwe have this discussion with the telephone's
iPhone versus Android, and the onlygood thing I'll say about the Android is

(57:24):
that the battery capacity is much muchbetter than iPhone. Yeah yeah, But
by living in this area of theworld, and it's a rural section of
the world, we we learn wehave some tricks that perceives so we we
know how to maximize battery time,so we use a lot of I use

(57:52):
this a lot of handwarmer I startand I have on the back side of
my phone or my iPad two maximizethe battery time. I love that they
go listeners. Top tip. Ifyou're in a cold environment, the little
handwarmers on the back of your device. Top tip. Yeah, and this

(58:14):
is basically just physics because batteries arebest stored in the cold, and they
are best charged and discharged when theyare hot. So the discharge goes slower
when the battery is hot is hot, and the charging goes faster when the
battery is hot. So when youknow a little bit how batteries are are

(58:39):
operated and how they are functionally using, then it's quite easy to use them
in extreme conditions. Yeah, brilliant, normal things for us is actually a
lifex others Exactly, Ralph. Therewe go, we have to get you

(59:02):
back and do Ralph's life acts foranother episode. I had a pleasure with
with with visiting Richard On on hisUH Modern Survival podcast podcast where we talked
about snow, because I mentioned tohim that you talked a lot about snow,

(59:25):
but you know nothing, So heinvited me to talk about snow brilliant
and and then I see everything that'snormal for us, it is quite obscure
and and foreign knowledge for for others. Yeah yeah, And I guess it's

(59:45):
that extreme, isn't it. It'shere in the UK. A bit of
snow to us is is a coupleof inches if we if we're lucky,
where's to you? That's that's that'sthat's nothing, is it? This winter
we had one day where the communitystopped and then we had one meter of
snow in six hours. But thatwas the only day the community stopped.

(01:00:08):
And this was three weeks before thecall out I had on Christmas Eve.
And it's the first I've been I'vebeen a grown, grown man in the
northern part of Norway now for twentyfive years, and that was the first
time I've ever experienced that the wholecommunity is stopped up because of No,

(01:00:35):
it's never happened before. Once ina lifetime, or do you reckon it's
going to happen again. I don'tthink I'll experience ever again. Wow,
that was unusual. Yeah yeah,yeah, oh blimey, okay, magic
all right, well it is itis there anything else that you want to

(01:00:59):
want to say to our listeners,or anything else that we've we've not covered.
I think we've covered the most basicsfrom now and it's important not to
share all the fun stuff that onceexactly. Yeah, we'll definitely be back,
that's for sure. Well, thankyou very much for joining us,

(01:01:19):
Ralph, and we wish you allthe best and we'll speak to you seen.
Yeah, thanks for having me,no worries, Thank you so much,
Bye bye bye magic. All right, so I'm now joined by Sam

(01:01:45):
Vincent from Derbyshire four by four ResponseTeam And correct me if i'm onm You're
the publicity officer, aren't you.Yep, So I'm one of the trustees
and I'm in charge of the publicityrole but also fundraising. Oh wow,
so double whammy there. Yeah.How did you first become involved with Derbyshire

(01:02:09):
four by four Response Team? SoI've been a responder with a previous group
for a while prior to this,but then a few a few of us
had left that group and we've beentwiddling our funds for what thumbs for a
while, and then we all gottogether on the pub one night and decided
that we wanted to join the nationalgroup and set up our own group of

(01:02:31):
derbysh year. So I've been withthe group since the beginning. Oh wow
wow, So how long have youbeen Derbyshire four by four Response. We
are in our second year now,so we were nearing the end of our
second years. Yeah, it's grownmassively in that time. That's brilliant.
Well, so some of our listenersare from all around the world, So

(01:02:53):
could you explain what four by fourResponse is and what do you do?
What's your mission as different? Yeah, of course. Yeah. So one
of the problems we've got is thatthe emergency services in our areas don't always
have the ability, numbers or equipmentto deal with every situation in terms of

(01:03:16):
adverse weather. So where we comein. We're a charity organization and we
basically provide logistical support to mainly keyworkers and carers and doctors and people like
that during times of adverse weather,so extreme snow, flooding, any event
like that we assisting. But wealso help with marshaling on charity events throughout

(01:03:39):
the years, so it's quite quitea varied lot of jobs, but main
purpose is the logistical support in theextreme weather. Got you, oh,
nice one. So I guess there'sa typical call out for you is rescuing
someone or delivering someone to a placewhere they couldn't get in random weather or

(01:04:01):
extreme weather. Yeah, so themajority of our callouts, it's sort of
split fifty fifty. I mean,most of what we do is ideally a
carer or a doctor will arrange aseries of visits or a visit once the
snows aware, once are aware there'sgoing to be snow or flooding, they
tell us they're not going to beable to get somewhere and can we get

(01:04:24):
them from this place to this place? And most of the time we are
able to assist that. So,for example, earlier in the year when
we had the bad period of snow, a lot of the jobs what we
were dealing with were, Okay,this doctor needs to get from to these
three appointments today, but he's anafford focus and is going to get out

(01:04:44):
of his driveway. Can you collecthim from his house, drop him at
the surgery to collect an equipment heneeds, and then take him to the
three jobs and then return them towherever needs to go. So often often
that can be a good day outfor one of the responders, whether they're
out all day, particularly with someof the district nurse calls, they can
be out from eight to look inthe morning until five o'clock at night on

(01:05:05):
one call out. Oh wow,that's good commitment that So so how do
you sort of get your call outs? Is that is that done by directly
to you or via emergency services orit comes in a variety of ways.
So we have some contracts with particularlycare homes and places like that, where

(01:05:29):
we've got an agreement in place beforehand, and generally what we what we do
is we don't we don't make anymoney of it off of it, but
we charge forty five pm month milefor a lot of the care homes and
private care home organizations. So withthose we will try and set that up
ideally before it all kicks off.However, obviously when we need it is

(01:05:50):
when people think of us. Sooften it's on the day it's okay,
we'll do this one for three andthen and then set you up next time.
So a lot of it comes throughwith pre arranged contracts, and that
does include a lot of the NHSstuff as well. The other side of
it is when someone just contacts usdirect and we make a call and say,
okay, can we help this personor not? And if we can,

(01:06:11):
we always will. Brilliant. That'sawesome. So are there any like
specific areas or terrains in Derbyshire thatyou post a bit of a challenge to
you guys? Yeah, so,I mean it's although although we cover the
whole of Derbyshire, obviously there areareas that get significantly worse and as you
get into the middle of the Peakdistrict there's some quite high places, and

(01:06:34):
particularly up towards the Buxton area,we get a lot of points where the
roads are closed and often part ofthe problem that the cares have is there's
even if they could drive there,the roads are closed and they have no
way of getting past that, andso we have to look at options like

(01:06:54):
going downside roads. We have understandingwith insurance that we can drive past road
closures while on us at one certaintaskings, so we're able to get a
lot of places that other people can't. But yeah, particularly the high areas
can be a real challenge, especiallywhen you're you're looking at going up there
and there's no signal. So quiteoften we'll have to assess the job before

(01:07:18):
we even leave and say, Okay, do we need two vehicles on this
job? It may only be onecareer in the car, but do we
need an extra vehicle just to supportand just to make sure if anything does
happen there's someone that can recover andvice versa. Yeah, it must be
a quite quite hard to sort out. Definitely, if you've got multiple jobs,
you need a quite quite a bigteam. How many are there in

(01:07:40):
your team? So at the moment, I think we've got thirty five active
responders and they are all active membersof the group, So we've got We've
been quite careful over the years.We expect a certain amount of input from
our responders and a certain amount oftraining. So there's a there's a basic
set of training we go through tobecome that. And so although we were

(01:08:03):
relatively small team at thirty five,all of those are active and will be
admittedly that in a variety of vehicles, So some of those will be restricted
to town and local work, whereassome of the more modified vehicles, more
experienced members can go further into thesnow and more challenging jobs. Yeah,

(01:08:25):
yeah, I can imagine. Sowhat sort of training do you guys get
up to so we've got a basicset of online training that we expect all
responders to do prior to any activitiesand that we've we've developed ourselves, and
it includes things like before you doanything, including the fundraising events, we
have to do the safeguarding module.It's just such an important thing nowadays,

(01:08:49):
you've got to cover it. Butwe also do things like understanding your vehicle,
understanding tires, reading road conditions,navigation, health and safety. We
have a monthly training session that wetry and get everyone involved in, but
on top of that, we havepractical training sessions where our training team will

(01:09:12):
take a small group of responders.And so the first course anyone does we
call it winching and towing course,but it is basically the very basics of
doing vehicle recovery. But during thatwe also go over how to drive in
the basics of how to drive inthe snow and all the simple stuff,
but stuff that you need to reinforcedbefore you go out in the snow basically.

(01:09:34):
And then so we have what wecall respond to levels, and again
this is this is something we've we'vedeveloped in house, but basically everyone starts
off at a level four, whichmeans that they are started, but they
are not tasked on anything, andonce they've done that essential training, they
instantly get bumped up to a levelthree. Then once those level threes have

(01:09:55):
done our in house qualification and havesome serious experience, they get by up
to a level two. And thenonce we up to level one, that's
our official lanter trained responders that theycan do multi agency work and significant challenges
because they've they've got that training andgenerally the vehicle to go with it.
That's brilliant. Yeah. Good differentlevels of training that you guys do,

(01:10:20):
and I suppose it makes it easierfor nowhere who can do what it does.
Yeah, and it's at the endof the day, it's about Yes,
it's getting the job done, butit's about keeping our responders safe.
And there's no point sending someone onit in a very lightly modified SUV up
into the middle of the peaks whenyou know it's going to be I mean,

(01:10:41):
last time we were up there inthe series, whether some of the
snow drifts were eight foot tall,and it's not whether you can get past
that or not, it's knowing notto try. Yeah, So tell us
about some of the vehicles that yourmembers have got so be in the UK,
a lot a lot of them Landrovers. We've got everything from old Defenders

(01:11:03):
that people have as their second vehiclethat we basically we expect as a minimum
people to have all trained ties ontheir vehicles. It's just one of those
where it's not safe to send peopleout on normal ties and as you know
or not, it doesn't matter whetheryou've got full drive or not when you're
trying to stop. It's about yourtires at that point. So but we

(01:11:28):
yeah, we've got a series ofDefenders. We've got everything from disco ones
all up to disco fowards. We'vegot a brand new Defender that's just joined
the group, which is we're allquite jealous of. We've we've got a
variety of other vehicles. We've gotsome jeeps, a couple of midst of
Bushies and things like that, soreal variety. But and then we've got

(01:11:48):
some of the small SUVs like Ithink we've got a couple of Citrons and
things like that that are perfectly capableof doing all the in town stuff and
make up a good core of whatwe do really oh brilliant, A nice
nice variety. We'll put some picturesup so that people can see it on

(01:12:09):
when they look at the posts lateron on our discorders as well as on
our socials. So obviously you've gotall those vehicles. Is there any sort
of other equipment that you guys have. Yeah, so we've got to go
along with the responder levels. We'vegot sort of minimum expected equipment lists for
each of the levels, and theyobviously get more complex as you go up.

(01:12:30):
So by the time you get upto one of the land trained individuals,
you'd be expected to have some moreof the advanced recovery gear. But
as at our base level, wehave things on there like we have a
first aid kit and a list ofstuff we expect to be in that.
Now that first aid kit, fromthe group point of view, is for
you, is to keep you safe. All of our members are first trained,

(01:12:53):
however it is up to them whatthey get involved in in terms of
first aid. I know that thewhole every responder in the group is a
is a very conscientious person and wouldhelp someone in any situation, but as
a group we're not we're not afirst aid group and we're not asking you
to do that. We've also gotthings like if you're going out of the

(01:13:15):
snow. Shovels are always a goodideas. It's amazing out if you dig
out, dig yourself out, torches, warm clothes and food and things like
that, and anything that could keepyou safe in the snow. We've we've
got We've covered a decent list ofit. And then, as I say,
once you get up to sort ofthe level one responders, you've got

(01:13:36):
things like winches are useful, varietiesof toeing, strops and shackles, arrangements,
various things that help you can dothose more difficult tasks. Sure,
brilliant, Thank thanks for thanks usknow about that. So we talked about

(01:13:56):
like the altrain tires. Is thatIs there any other modifyings that the vehicles
need. Do they need like aroll cage or anything like that, or
just pretty much a standard road roadlegal car. No, I mean we
they're no road legal cars, allof them there. I mean, some
of them have got suspension lifts andthings like that, but that's that's down
to the owner of the vehicle.It's not something we insist on or even

(01:14:19):
really encourage. Yes, once youget up to some of the more difficult
jobs, it does become helpful andknowing that it's modified means we can send
them in more difficult situations. Butit's not something we ask people to do.
Our basic requirement for the vehicles areit has to be road legal,
it has to have a root,has to have insurance, and then and

(01:14:41):
then it's the tires. And tobe fair, the tires make more difference
than pretty much any other modification.Yeah. Yeah, So, what's one
of the most challenging situations the teamsin account if you can share. Yeah,
So, we we've done a varietyof quite challenge situations, but we
had one earlier this year which wasa it was a big multi agency situation

(01:15:04):
where I don't know if you rememberthe snow backing earlier this year, but
essentially we had a call from thepolice saying that the Mountain Rescue Team,
Darby Mountain Rescue Team were looking fora missing person up in the hills around

(01:15:24):
sort of the Buckston Leak area,and they were they'd been stranded there for
a serious amount of time. Andit was a bit of a strange situation
because it started off as as therewas a lady in a car and it
ended up as there's a lady inseveral children stuck in a car, so
it was it was a bit ofa confusing situation, and it was that's
time we got the call. Ithad reached ten o'clock at night, so

(01:15:45):
it was only dark, and thesnow at that point it had been drifting
as well. So that was thesituation where the snow drifts were eight to
ten feet and in certain roads andyou just couldn't It didn't matter what you
would drive, and you couldn't getpast. So we met up with some
of the police and Mountain Rescue teamsand basically we were that we knew where

(01:16:06):
they were on the ridge. Wehad a what three words location, and
we all looked at it and wedecided on a few different routes to try,
and we all split off and justbasically see which routes were most open,
which could get them closest. Sowhen when we first started, there
was darn Mountain Rescue were down onthe main road and they weren't. They'd

(01:16:29):
been trying a few different routes,but we managed to find one where they
got to about a mile from thelocation and they were able to walk from
that point. But it was aboutthree o'clock in the morning by this point,
so that the family were very coldand they'd run out of fuel and
it was getting quite serious. Butthey actually were aware there are absolute heroes.
Are strapped on their gear and walkedup the rest of the way and
took them coats and various things andthen walked them back down in the morning.

(01:16:51):
Oh wow. There were quite afew routes there where at one point
the Staffishire Fire Brigades a unimal gupand matt even that couldn't get up.
That's a that's a capable vehicle aswell, and it's as capable as they
get. But just proves how wella bit of training and a bit of

(01:17:13):
a diversity of the of the likedifferent routes makes a difference. So yeah,
well done there. That's sounds ayeah. Could have could have gone
really horribly and nasty, but yeah, but as I say, everything was,
everything was sorted and they I thinkthey ended up taking them to a
local farm yard up on the topof the reefs. They walked them there

(01:17:33):
and kept them there for a fewhours to warm up and then brought them
down. So it was all happyand yeah, working amount and rescues always
good because it's such a professional outfit. Yeah. Yeah. Other than that,
is there any particular rewarding moments thatstand out in your memory of the
last two years. Yeah. Sowe've we've we've done a lot of jobs,

(01:17:55):
and we've done a variety of Ithink a lot. Often the most
rewarding ones are where you've got offof the care or a nurse that is
dealing with someone remote and that personwill have had they may have medical needs,
they may just need social needs.And the number of times it's just

(01:18:15):
been given a biscuit and told thankyou by someone who hasn't seen someone for
the rest of that day and wouldn'thave had that care without you. It's
generally those jobs that actually provide thebiggest reward. Yeah, I bet.
Yeah, it's just sort of yeah, sad if they've never got that person
to be there, or you knowwhat else could happen if they're Yeah,

(01:18:35):
that care I couldn't get there isthe yeah. Yeah, And that's and
that's a lot of a lot ofall the jobs we do. They I
mean, the ones where you're ontop of a mountain rescuing someone are great.
They do give you a real feelgood feeling afterwards and they're very exciting,
but at the end of the day, we do it to help people
carry out their normal lives and providethe care that they normally do so that

(01:18:57):
they are incredibly rewarding their own way. Nice one. So how can the
general public support Derbyshire full by fullresponse? So obviously if you're in Derbyshire,
we're always looking at people to helpout in the group, whether they've
got a full by four and oneto become a responder, or whether they
want to help us with some ofthe fundraising things. So throughout the summer

(01:19:20):
we'd do a lot of fundraising events. So for instance, we've just done
car park management and recovery What theWhy Not Festival which was incredible, muddy
and very late nights, but itwas it was great fun and we raised
the these amount of money there.But then on the other side of that
we also do events such as localfairs and steam rallies where we set up

(01:19:45):
a we've got a couple of heavyduty gazebos that we got through fundraising and
we've got a remote control obstacle coursethat one of our responders built and we
give out the group's information. Butwe also charge a small fee for kids
and adults to have a go onthe Rod Control car course, and we
raise quite a bit of money outways, so we're always looking for that.

(01:20:08):
But then the other side of itis just donations. We have on
our website. We have donation facilitiesavailable and it's always appreciating. It allows
us to do more when we're neededbrilliant. Well, we'll put all the
links in the in the show notes, so if anyone wants to donate to

(01:20:29):
the team, then you can doso, no worries. Do you do
anything to educate the local community oranything like that, So yeah, we've
done a few a few talks onthings like how to drive in the snow,
when to be aware of the conditionschanging and that sort of thing.
We also try and just give outour details to say, look, if

(01:20:51):
you're if you're worried about it,this is what we're here for and this
is what we can do. Soit's a balance of trying to trying to
make people safer when they're driving,but also letting them know that it's perfectly
fine to say actually it's too badand we need help. Yeah. Yeah,
we are a charity and generally it'sgoing to cost them about the same

(01:21:13):
as it would cost for the nurseor cares drive anyway, because we only
charge normally forty five PMR, sooften it's it's cheaper to use us in
those situations. Anyway, I guessyeahs oh, we lost my thoughts there.

(01:21:35):
It's a well, obviously the team'sonly two years in, but how
how do you see the team growingover the next couple of years. So
yeah, I mean we're we're aggressivelyrecruiting and we're always taking on new members.
For instance, my role originally waspublicity and fundraising and events, and

(01:21:56):
it was it was chaos and gotto be honest though, I wasn't doing
a good job at any one ofthem. But because the group has grown,
we've we've diversified and we've now gota media officer, and we've got
an events officer, and we've gota fundraising officer that work with me and
they those I sort of lead theteam, but they do a lot of
the work for me, which isbrilliant because now we're able to do a

(01:22:18):
lot more of these events and alot more publicity. So the more people
that get involved we've got we're alwayslooking for people to get involved, both
in the responder side of things,but also in running the group and improving
the group and the trustees as asmuch as we love doing it and a
lot of us would love to handover control the group and say, look,

(01:22:39):
this is your group, you dohow you want. We just want
to be part of it. Nice. Yeah, I know that feeling.
Yes, too many hats sometimes,isn't it too many hats? Yeah,
definitely, but now it's it's apleasure to do it. To be fair,
it's just given up, given up. The responsibility was more about doing
that what was right for the groupthem not wanting to do it. That's

(01:23:02):
brilliant, Thank you very much.Sam. So if someone's interested in joining,
go via the website. The bestoption is to email membership at d
four by four our dot co dotuk, which I'm sure we can put
on the links somewhere and then wewill email the information. We tend to

(01:23:25):
do recruitment events as of when weneed it or at worst quarterly, Yeah,
during which time because because because weexpect to be a commitment, we
like to explain what people are goingto get involved in before they sign up.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitelydefinitely don't know. It's a It's
a big commitment as well, isn'tit. Yeah. We're very appreciative of
the time that we get from ourresponders, and we do understand that we

(01:23:49):
ask quite a lot of them sometimes, but that's that they all love doing
it and they get a lot ofpleasure out of it, and I think
it's a very rewarding thing to do. Yeah. Is there anything from you
being involved in the footboy resports that'sinfluenced your personal life or perspective? Oh?
Yeah, I actually met my partnerthrough thes of it. Yeah,

(01:24:13):
so it's changed my life quite significantly. But yeah, there's a great social
life to it, and it hasled me to do quite a few things
that I wouldn't normally have done.Oh yeah, brilliant. And there's there
any sort of like funny moments thatyou can share with us, There's quite
a few that can't share. Wehave a great laugh every time we're doing

(01:24:34):
anything, whether it's training. It'sjust such a good atmosphere. But yeah,
I'm just trying to think off thetop of my head, but most
of them are embarrassing for me,so I'm not sure. I'm sure you
get each other, probably some ofthe funniest moments where it why not to
be fair? Where I mean generally, why not it's often easier just to

(01:24:57):
push people out rather than it's toa cup of vehicle and toe the and
the number of times you'd turn aroundto see one of your colleagues absolutely spatter.
It was fantastic, brilliant, butyeah, it's definitely when you can
capture a photo as well. Yeah, yeah, brilliant. Well that's been
really insightful, so thank you verymuch, Sam, appreciate your time.

(01:25:21):
And just to just to close out, if you could describe your team in
three words, what would they be? Okay, yeah, I would say
dedicated, kind, and adventurous.It's probably however, described them brilliant.
Well, thank you very much.Why not join the discussion over on our

(01:25:44):
discord server. You can find outdetails of how to join in the show
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