Beyond The Clitoris: A Dissertation On Female Pleasure Zones

Beyond The Clitoris: A Dissertation On Female Pleasure Zones

There is a concerning phenomenon in the field of sexology involving the emergence of a nearly militant insistence that the clitoris is the ONLY source of female orgasm.

This viewpoint not only dismisses the lived experiences of millions of women but is also simply anatomically incorrect.

While the clitoris and its surrounding structures are indeed extraordinary, they are not the only sources of orgasm. Orgasms can vary significantly and can originate from various parts of the body, the brain, and even the energy body.

After over a decade of teaching people how to expand their orgasmic capacity, we've discovered that orgasms come in many variations, influenced by a broad range of factors—physical, psychological, emotional, intellectual, and energetic. 


In this episode of Sex Is Medicine, Devi and Alaina explore the many types of orgasmic pleasure that do not originate from the CUV complex, such as:

• - Cervical and uterine orgasms
• - P-spot orgasms
• - Anal orgasms
• - Breast and nipple orgasms
• - Orgasms from stimulation of the skin, ears, or feet
• - "Throatgasms"
• - Exercise-induced orgasms or coregasms
  

Tune in for a Ph. D. level dissertation on Female Pleasure Zones

Thank you for listening to Sex Is Medicine! We appreciate YOU! :-)

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See you next week!
With Love,
Devi and Alaina

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi, I'm Davy ward Ericson and I'm Elena Salks, and you.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Are listening to sex is Medicine, your number one resource
for holistic sex education. Elena and I are bringing you
over twenty seven years of combined expertise in the field
of holistic sexual wellness to help you integrate your body, mind, spirit,
and sex.

Speaker 1 (00:23):
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Now let's get started.

Speaker 2 (00:41):
Three. Hello, and welcome to sex is Medicine, your number
one resource for holistic sex education, and the woke podcast
for sexual rebels and spiritual warriors. I am one of
your delightful hosts, Miss Davey ward Ericson, and I am
once again honored and delighted that you are choosing to

(01:03):
spend time with us here today. We thank you again
for all of your questions and all of the engagement
and interaction you've been sharing with us. We love it
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you again for trusting us with your vulnerability and asking

(01:26):
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(01:48):
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can really help us out by subscribing and like the
videos and even sharing the videos. That would really meet
our needs for support and encouragement to continue bringing you
this amazing content. Today, I'm going to be interviewing my

(02:11):
amazing co host, Elena Salks, about her work dissecting I
would say, dissecting and dismantling this cultural concept that the
clatorus is the sole source of female pleasure. So not
trying to throw shade on the clatorus. We love the clatorus.

(02:32):
The clatorus is way more extensive than many people realize.
It's more than just that little beautiful button at the
top of your vulv. It actually reaches deep inside the body.
And so we're going to outline where it is and
what it looks like. But also, you know, just the

(02:52):
way we're wired, the way we're wired neurologically, the clatorus
is simply not the only source of female pleasure. It's
just not. It's factually incorrect. Like if it was correct,
we that would be fine, we'd be like, Okay, that's correct.
But it's simply factually incorrect. And once you understand the
neurological wiring of the I'm gonna say female pelvis, you

(03:14):
will you will see very clearly that we have multiple,
multiple zones in and around the vagina that give rise
to orgasmic sensation and pleasure. And it's not fair to
leave out all those other beautiful parts. It's it's time
to invite everyone to the pleasure parties. I like to say,
invite invite all of our parts to the pleasure party. So,

(03:37):
without further ado, here we are with my our dear
cow houst the Lena sucks breaking it down. Welcome, welcome, welcome,
round of upon Lena. Thank you so much for this work.
And so I remember you sharing with me about this
work several several months ago actually, because this was part
of the research that we were doing, that you were

(03:59):
doing for the whole sexology certification program. So tell me
more about how you compiled this work.

Speaker 1 (04:05):
Yeah, yeah, thank you, Davey, and thank you for interviewing
me today. Yeah, this is this definitely came up as
a part of our work developing specifically the genital anatomy
components of the holistic sexology portion of our certification program.
So when we were developing this part of the program,

(04:26):
we wanted to go beyond just this physical anatomy just
kind of like pointing out this and this and this
is what this does. And we wanted to get more
into some of the sociocultural aspects of that's around our
genital anatomy, right, like going in deep into myths, into
social pressure around how we relate to our anatomy. And

(04:49):
as I was doing research and going deeper, I kept
coming across something that you and I have seen many
times in our very very long career, which is this
claim that theists, the clitterists, or the c literal urethrow
vaginal complex is the only source of orgasm for women.
And what I really kind of have found alarming of

(05:12):
late is that this myth is continuing to spread and
is gaining traction. So I'm seeing it a lot, you know.
I have this at this lovely feminist bookstore in my
community that has a beautiful sex education section. They're like
really on it. They're getting all the new books in
all the time, and of course whenever I'm there, I'm
kind of paging through them, and I keep seeing every

(05:34):
time I open a new sex education book there it
is like a new sex educator is claiming that the
clitterists or the literal you throw vaginal complex or CUV
complex is the sole source of orgasm for women. And
like you said, it's problematic because it's it's simply not true.
And so I was really curious as to why this

(05:57):
this pathway, like this this line of thinking, like what
was happening there, Why was it continuing, and why is
it gaining traction?

Speaker 2 (06:05):
Yeah, and I think that I think that like what's
arising for me is that there's there should be a distinction, right,
I would love us to like present a distinction that
in terms of the clitoris or clitteral urinary vaginal complex
the cuv which we will outline for you if you
haven't heard of that. It's a kind of an inclusive
concept for the clatorus, but it you know, the concept

(06:28):
that it's not the sole source of female pleasure, but
it can be a primary source of female pleasure, right,
And so that is part of what we teach. Absolutely,
your clatorus is absolutely a primary source of pleasure for
many people with claittoruses. But our point is it's not
the only source. And so that that is where the

(06:48):
I guess the alarm bells start ringing for me, is
the insistence that every that that every sensation that we experience,
sexual pleasure sensation should be and is sourced from this complex.
When in fact, as we've described, the cervix, which is
completely independent of the clitteral urinary vaginal complex, it's completely independent,

(07:12):
is a primary source of female pleasure, as is the
A spot, as is the peace spot. And these all
are all zones towards the back end of the vagina.
And so what happens for many vagina owners, women and
vagina owners, is that these are also these areas towards
the back of the vagina are also areas where there's
usually numbness or pain. And so this danger in the

(07:36):
conversation what I see is the danger in the conversation
of no the clatorus is the soul or the only
source of female pleasure. Is that when you do have
numbness or pain towards the back of the vagina, it's
it's categorized as normal or or or you know, or
that's just the way it is. You just don't have
nerve endings back there. But that's not true. We do,

(07:56):
and in fact, in some of our episodes about the survey,
we've talked about how studies have shown that some cervixes
have up to two hundred or two hundred and fifty
thousand nerve fibers. That's way more than the c literal complex. Right,
So what a tragedy and a travesty if like, let's
say for myself, you know, twenty years ago, when my

(08:18):
cervix was either numb or painful, the only sensation I
had there was pain, if any at all. If I
had just been like, oh, well, it's not supposed to
feel pleasure at all. Right, that's just I'm just going
to ignore it because there's not that's normal, instead of
instead of you know, the little red flag letting me know,
hey baby, you got some trauma there, you got some wounding,
you have some you need to apply some medicine to

(08:41):
this spot. And because I did that, I now have
access to mind melting cervical pleasure. And in fact, for me,
my cervix is a more reliable orgasm zone than michaelatorus.
That's just the way it's shaped up, right, But it
didn't start that way, and so so for me the
day in this conversation, that the cuv is the sole

(09:05):
source of female pleasure kind of gives people permission to
ignore and brush aside when they have numbness or pain
and their entire sexual organ your entire vagina is built
for pleasure. The entire thing is built for pleasure, not
just parts of it. Right, And the other piece I'm
gonna add before I hand you back the mic is

(09:25):
that I'm very you know, it's very striking to me
kind of this, I'm gonna say, militant attitude around No,
the clatorus is a sole source of female pleasure when
the clatorus is basically a penis turned inside out, right,
So it's kind of like saying the penis is the
sole source of pleasure for men when it's not. Y'all, guys,
your anus is beautiful, your prostate has pleasure to give you, right,

(09:50):
And so that's a whole other conversation, which we'll get
into in season two. But our point is is that
claiming something is the sole source of female of pleasure
is danger because.

Speaker 3 (10:01):
It it it allows for us to ignore and not reclaim
I will say, not bring into the picture, not not integrate,
not integrate into our being, the totality of.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
Our of our pleasure zones, as opposed to just focusing
on this one piece and limiting ourselves. We want more
than that. We want unlid bliss and unlimited sensation. So
that's my that's my rant.

Speaker 3 (10:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah, And as we've talked about before, it seems it
seems like the motivation for this is really rooted in
in trying to soothe people, right, because there are a
lot of people who aren't experiencing different orgasms, maybe some
at all, and many only just from stimulation of the clitterists,
and I think the often the motivation is to reduce

(10:49):
shame and stigma for those folks, which is a beautiful motivation,
but it's but it's harmful if it doesn't include the
whole picture. Like I think that we can find ways
to sue with people and let them know that they're
not broken and that it's like it's looking that their
experiences are okay and leave space for nuance and leave
space for them to explore more if that's what they

(11:11):
want to do. And like you said, just taking these
other parts of ourselves out of the picture is robbing people.
It's robbing people of their ability to potentially have, you know,
a greater capacity for pleasure.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
Well said, well, so let's let's dig into this, into
this work that you've done, because you've spent a lot,
a lot of time. So what is the CUV the
c literal your wreathful vaginal complex. This is a fairly
new terminology because when I started in the field in
two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine, that is
not what. That is not what, that's not what was happening.

(11:47):
That's how what's what we're calling it. So, yeah, I've
heard this come up in the last I'm going to
say five years this terminology.

Speaker 1 (11:55):
Yeah, yeah, So the c literal urethrow vaginal complex are
starting to kind of put together a number of different
structures within within the vagina and the volva. So they're
categorizing as a complex, vast internal network of a rectile
tissue interconnected with other pleasure structures including the periuregional sponge

(12:16):
and the anterior vaginal wall. And so specifically this region
can produce several distinct orgasmic experiences, so most notably clitteral orgasms,
U spot orgasms, which are orgasms originating from stimulation of
the opening of the urethra, and G spot orgasms. So

(12:37):
some sources also include the A spot orgasm in this,
but the structures responsible for A spot orgasms are largely
unresearched and really not understood from a scientific perspective.

Speaker 2 (12:52):
Okay, I gotta slow you there. I gotta put the case.
The hypogastric nerve like innerve a. It's the area where
the acepot and the peacepot is like. It's not like
when you look at a pelvic diagram and neurological you know,
pathways the hypogastric nerve which connects to the cervix connects

(13:12):
to the uterus is right there. So I'm like, it
doesn't take rocket science. It's just like deductive, right, and
it's not it doesn't know they're looking for a structure.
If it's not a structure, it's it's it's like it's
like massaging just a zone. So okay, go on. I know,
I frustrate with the ignorance of Western science.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
I just it's so it is really frustrating. And you know,
I mean I think I don't even get started on
like the obsession with with researching, you know, women's orgasms,
because we don't like spend a lot of time and
effort researching men's orgasms. You know, like, oh, why are
men able to have uh an anal orgasm? How is

(13:53):
it possible that they can have an orgasm from their penis?
Like these are not conversations that we have people who
have penises, but for people who have bolves in vaginas,
it's like, how can it be possible? We must know why,
and in reality, they just anywhere you have nerves, pleasure
sensing nerves, you can have a pleasurable experience and possibly orgasm.

(14:16):
It's really, I think, as fucking simple as that.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Yeah, yeah, thank you, thank you for that. So, so
the CUV incorporates the cliteral glands, the urethral opening, the
G spot. Now what about these clinteral bulbs and these
cliteral legs and stuff.

Speaker 1 (14:35):
Yeah, it's supposed to include that as well. Yeah, and
I feel a little torn about this concept of the
literal wreath throw vaginal complex. I mean, yes, on one hand,
all of our body systems are connected. But on the
other you know, the the paara urethral sponge, which is

(14:55):
essentially what most people are referring to when they talk
about the G spot, has completely different biological org than
the clitterist does. Right, So, yes, maybe they're connected, maybe
they're not. Does it matter, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (15:07):
Well, the G spot is a female prostate, right, So
it's like spongy tissue that surrounds the urethra. Guys, you've
got spongy tissue that surround your it sounds surrounds your
urethra as well. So it's you know, homologous to the
corpus spongiosum.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (15:24):
So is it made out of that? It is? Isn't
it made out of different a rectil tissue or am
I remembering that incorrectly? No, it's the clitteral legs and
the cliteral bulbs that are two different Uh yeah, two
different types of rectil structure.

Speaker 1 (15:35):
Okay, yeah, yeah, they're two different types of retail structure
that kind of map onto the rectile. Like, since the
penis and the clitters have the same biological origins, they're
rectile tissues, and what about each other?

Speaker 2 (15:46):
What about the perineal sponge because that's another bed of
a rectail tissue between the opening of the vagina and
the anis. So is that included in this clitteral urinary sea?
So it makes all these parts And I have had
perennial sponge orgasms.

Speaker 3 (16:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (16:01):
It leaves out the cervix, It leaves out the uterus,
it leaves out the pea spot, it leaves out the
peranial sponge, it leaves out the anus, It leaves out
so so so much. But before we get into everything
that it leaves out, I wanted to kind of talk
about some of the research I did into like how
did we get here essentially right? And and like how

(16:22):
are people why are people so passionate about this, and
so well, now this is like the defenders of the
clitterists is the only source of orgasm are like they
are vehement, They're vehement about it. I had a very
long argument with the sex educator on Reddit just this

(16:42):
week about it.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
I mean, tell me, you haven't ever had a clin
so what do they say about cervical orgasms? Then if
they're arguing and they're like, oh, well you like so,
and you're like, I have cervical orgasms and they're like, no,
you don't.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
Her argument was you can't have penetration without stimulating the
bulbs of the glitterists, and therefore all the clatics is
still involved no matter what you do. That was the argument.

Speaker 2 (17:04):
So it can still be involved, Like whoever said you
had to separate the clatorus out, No, I'm gonna cut
the glatorus out and only have cervical orgasms.

Speaker 1 (17:11):
But we're talking like anyway, I know, I know, I know.
And then I told her about I told her about
this the study that they did on people with you know,
severed spinal cords, where they were still able to orgasm
from the cervix without because once your spinal cord is severed.
You don't have access to your your literal system anymore
because bodies, yeah, exactly. And and once I gave her

(17:33):
all that, she said, well, that's too complicated. I could
I could never tell someone all of that in one sentence.
And I was like, actually, it's really not that complicated.
You just you just say the clitterist is one of the.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
Many, one of the many sources of female pleasure, and
maybe the primary maybe by Mary.

Speaker 1 (17:53):
It's okay, yeah, you love it.

Speaker 2 (17:56):
It's just not the only y'all. Like, no segregation, no genital.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Segregation, exactly exactly.

Speaker 2 (18:09):
We're here from assaggination.

Speaker 1 (18:14):
So okay. So in thinking about this, I was like, okay,
what's happening here? And so what I've what I'm aware
of and we've been aware of through our time working
with this, is that for a really long time, the
clitterist was done wrong, right, Like, there's just horrible, horrible
information about the clitterists, the clitteral system. It was just
demonized and treated very very very badly through human history,

(18:37):
well through European and US history specifically.

Speaker 2 (18:44):
Not human history. Sister did not occur. Inn.

Speaker 1 (18:53):
I know there's a lot of other cultures who have
long recognized different kinds of orgasms, pleasure and sensation other
than uh, the one that you know is dominant in
our culture. So okay, So the complicated and controversial history
of the clitterists in the West, all right, so ancient

(19:14):
Greece will start there. So, and female anatomy was considered
an inversion of male anatomy, which is like like has
some truth to it, but not total truth, because they
considered the clitterists as an unfinished penis, right, rather than
understanding that, they just that they just had similar biological
origins and that was I think what's what's important about

(19:37):
that distinction is that they kind of used it in
order to belittle and keep like it was another example
of women being lesser than men in that culture. Is
kind of like saying, oh, you just have an unfinished penis.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
Right, Yeah, well that's that's that's probably that's that's penis domination.
So you can think of like, in my mind, you
can think of the penis as an outside culture, as
an extra on clatorus. Right, that's another way thinking it
is the clator inside, and that's you know, that's the
basic structure, and the penis is just a is a
is a clatorus turned outside?

Speaker 1 (20:10):
Yeah, one hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (20:13):
And then then we go to the fifteenth century witch
trials and at that time the clitters was dubbed the
devil's teeth. There was a document called the Malleus Maleficarum
which was written about about witches and witchcraft and it
associated clteral arousal with witchcraft specifically, and clinical stimulation was

(20:36):
even proposed as a test for witches.

Speaker 2 (20:39):
So the beginning of sex magic, clitteral pleasure was was
a form of witchcraft, ladies, So there we go. That's
incentive to get your get your masturbation on, get yourself
pleasure on. Is do your do your to your magic?
My friends, what strokes the if you felt good that
you're burning? Talk about sexual trauma. If you have an orgasm,

(21:04):
w I can say you on fire?

Speaker 1 (21:10):
You have the devil's teat taken over.

Speaker 2 (21:16):
Imagine could you imagine? And can you imagine that the
dudes who would test the women and likeorses to try
and see if they can make them orgasms so they
could burn them. That is crazy, That is so crazy.
You have an orgasm, now you have to die? Yeah?

(21:39):
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(22:00):
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(22:28):
oh my god, wild, Okay, how do humans come up
with this shit that is insane?

Speaker 1 (22:39):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (22:43):
Okay, all this is part of our history, is North Americans?
Like they did that on North American soil. I just
want to this is part of our sexual heritage as
a culture that they used to burn women for having
literal orgasms. So there we go.

Speaker 1 (22:57):
Yeah, So moving on. Fifteen forty five, French physician dissected
the clitters for the first time and named it the
I can't speak French very well Membre two. I'm sorry.
People who are French probably know that better than I do.
But he basically called it the shameful member.

Speaker 2 (23:19):
The shameful member. Oh yes, because female pleasure is shameful.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, yeah, yep, yep, yep. And then we get into
our our good old friend Sigmund Freud, probably who's probably
the biggest villain in this conversation for how we got here.
So Sigmund, among his many contributions to the world, had
a lot of ideas about orgasms, right, and so he

(23:47):
liked to refer to the clitterists as an infantile organ
so constantly kind of putting the glitterists down.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
Like hearkening back to the Greek thing, it's an undeveloped penis,
so it's inferior to a male member.

Speaker 1 (24:00):
Hm hm. And he promoted the vaginal orgasm as the
hallmark of mature femininity. So unless you could do that,
you weren't a mature then you weren't a mature woman,
and that was all the cause of your problems.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
So I have a question why, how did and maybe
this is bigger than this conversation, but like in your research,
like why did people listen to fucking Freud? Like was
he having great orgasms, Like it's like some homeless dude. Well, sorry,
I'm not gonna shavee like whatever, just some person at Walmart.
I'm gonna go to some person Walmart and be like, Okay,

(24:35):
what do you think about orgasm? And they start telling
me what they think about orgasm? Why am I going
to believe them? Like? Who is Sigmund Freud when this
is his qualification for designating certain types of orgasm? What
qualified him to speak on the topic of female orgasm?

Speaker 1 (24:50):
I guess just because of his fame as becoming essentially
the father of therapy, right, and he that lended him
the credibility to talk about out. You know, the intersection
between the body and the mind is my my best guess,
But I'm not. I'm not a historian on on Freud,
but I do know that you know, he rose, he

(25:10):
rose to fame as the father of modern therapy.

Speaker 2 (25:17):
And here we are today and here we are worked
out for us all how has that worked out? So
here we are today pecking up the pieces because yeah,
letting some random dude with maybe add some cash, hand
him a mic and he's an expert. Now yep heard
that podcast, bros.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
Yeah, So thankfully, we've we've abandoned a lot of Freud's
Freud's theories. He also claimed that failure to failure to
achieve vaginal orgasm indicated mental illness. Uh, and he introduced
the concept of penis envy, viewing the glitteris as a
failed penis.

Speaker 2 (25:58):
I think that makes me sad. I feel a little
sad in my heart at the thought that there have been,
you know, probably hundreds thousands, if not millions of women
who have believed that they were broken because they haven't
had a vaginal orgasm, largely because of this really shitty misinformation.

(26:23):
So you know, that's the the legacy of Freud is
that he has convinced, you know, multitudes of women that
their bodies are broken because he simply didn't understand human
physiology and that a woman must be fully engorged or

(26:44):
at least somewhat engorged in order to have a vaginal orgasm.

Speaker 1 (26:51):
Yeah, yeah, it's true. And he's primarily responsible for the
massive pendulum swing in any other direction that.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Will Yeah, that we'll talk about.

Speaker 1 (27:00):
But I couldn't leave this conversation without presencing our friend Kellogg. Yes,
dearlog of the Breakfast cereal name.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
So innocuous, so innocuous, one would never guess.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
And I think you actually know a little bit more
about Kellogg than I do. We talk about him a
lot more specifically when we talk about men, because he's
one of the primary tell me, if I'm correct about this,
he's one of the primary kind of bad actors involved
in proliferating the spread of male infant male circumcision in
this country.

Speaker 2 (27:35):
He's the number one. He's he is, he is the
person that got it institutionalized. Yeah, yeah, specifically to make
sex less pleasurable for all partners, for penis owners and
vagina owners. Like it makes sex less pleasurable. I was
actually gonna, I actually want to talk about this at
some point because, like I was thinking about it this week,

(27:55):
that the circumcised penis wix moisture pulls more sure out
of the vagina because one of the functions of the
foreskin is that it creates a seal around the vagina
opening to keep moisture in, and then it also applies
pressure to the underside of the g spot, a catalyzing
female ejaculation, which is actually healthy and great for our bodies, right,

(28:15):
and so again, because of these bad actors and these
bad these you know, Kellogg and Freud and whatever. There's
a lot of women walking around feeling shame because they
want to or need to use lubrication with their circumcised
male partners and thinking that again, their vaginas are broken
because they don't stay wet enough or they dry out

(28:35):
or whatever, they get tearing, whatever, when actually it's it's
a circumcised penis creates friction, heat, friction in the vagina
and actually pulls moisture out of it. So I mean
he interrupted a significant biological function. Yeah, he did with
intentionally to cause harm.

Speaker 1 (28:58):
Yeah. Yeah. And we could talk for a long time
about Kellogg. You know, listeners, if you haven't ever done
any research into who this man was, like he was,
he went way beyond breakfast cereal. He he straight up
invnded a cult, you know, And basically a lot of
these sexual issues that we're seeing, like circumcision, are as

(29:20):
a result of of Kellogg, and the breakfast cereal was
just one part of the quote unquote healthy lifestyle he
was trying to create with his with his.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
Celibate cult, his pleasureless, his sexual pleasureless lifestyle, healthy lifestyle.
So why did he contribute to the conversation of the
clatorius other than I know he used to pour acid
on teenage girls as clatorous to dissuade them from masturbating.

Speaker 1 (29:49):
Yeah, yeah, so that's that's that's the part of it
that that I was going to bring up. So he
wanted to burn the clitoris with acid just basically he
believed that all sexuality was bad.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
So yeah, yeah, I know, if y'all can't see us,
I'm like making this. He poured acid on people's cltoruses.
Oh my fucking god, and that was like culturally accepted.

Speaker 1 (30:15):
Yeah, it's psychotic. So he was on a mission to
and masturbation and sex, and so he promoted circumcision in
men to stop them from masturbating, and proposed bringing clittoricism
in some cases did with acid. So that's lovely, Okay.

Speaker 2 (30:36):
So this again is our sexual history as a culture, y'all.
Is so we need to be aware because these concepts,
even though they happened a long time ago, they are
part of the fundamental foundation of our at least in
North America, our cultural dialogue around sexuality. Right, So these

(30:58):
were these were seed it in to the culture at
very you know, early stages, and they perpetuate today. So
for example, we're talking about doctor Kellogg, who you know,
a couple centuries ago was the thing, while they're still
performing infant male circumcision in hospitals today and causing irreversible

(31:19):
brain trauma, you know, effing up these little infants' portal
brand new nervous systems by traumatizing their genitals, performing genital
torture on these little baby boys, and then wondering why
they're dysfunctional when they grow up as adults. And then
damaging the sex lives of heterosexual couples of piv intercourse,

(31:43):
making it less pleasurable and prone to tearing and friction
burns and all kinds of stuff. So these even though
these concepts were seeded into the culture centuries ago, they're
still in operation today. The system was built upon, The
system that we live in today was built upon some
of these ft up know this, I'm trying not to

(32:04):
cuss ft up fed up psychotic quite frankly psychotic psychotic ideologies.
Burning people's clatoruses off is a form of torture, that
is torture that is psychotic, that is not okay, people,
please please don't burn people's clatoruses. Don't do that. Yeah, truly,

(32:29):
all right, So that's how we got today. That's the history.
Where are we going from here?

Speaker 1 (32:33):
Okay? So then eventually towards the second half of the
twentieth century, you know, our culture started researching sexuality masters
in Johnson Kinsey, all of that started to begin and
we started to in our culture see sexuality through a
slightly different lens. But it wasn't until the nineteen nineties

(32:54):
that we began to actually map the c literal system.
So no one had any idea that the clitter was
anything but our little glands are that little nub until
the nineteen nineties.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
Okay. I also want to say nobody in Western society
because I can't ask to what they need in their places. Yes,
so nobody in Western society was aware that there was
more to the clatorus than the little tiny button on top.
Thanks in some cases big button on top. There are
different sizes of clatorus, and some people are very right,
there are very big buttons.

Speaker 1 (33:28):
Yes, thank you for having me back around to all
of the biological differences that we have that are completely normal.
So yeah, So in the nineteen nineties, Helen O'Connell was
the first person to start studying and mapping the clitteral
system using embry imaging and discovered that the clitterist is
ten times larger than it was previously believed to be.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
And the times yeah times lit ten times larger.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
O yep, yep, And yeah, this I think this is
what really kind of sparked this pendulum swing in the
other direction. I mean, I mean, this is a this
is a beautiful thing that we learned, right, and this
inspired and activated so many women and peoples with volvos

(34:16):
and vaginas, you know, all over the place. It really
empowered people. And this is this is wonderful. I'm so
happy to have this information and to understand more about
my anatomy and what my body is capable of doing.
And the pendulum went from swinging to a healthy place

(34:36):
to swinging over into the opposite direction.

Speaker 2 (34:41):
And so.

Speaker 1 (34:43):
It's interesting, I see this really kind of in the
same vein as so much of what we talk about,
being that it just kind of it all feels like
it's the same wrapped up in the same kind of
oppressions that we talk about on a regular basis. Right, So,
like we experien and suppression around our bodies, and then

(35:04):
once we discovered that we that we actually have this wonderful,
beautiful system, then instead of staying there and staying with
the nuance, like the beauty of that and the nuance
of what our bodies are capable of doing, then most
of these primarily white feminists swung to the other direction

(35:24):
and then became you know, hardened and militant about the
clitters itself.

Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah, that militancy is something that we encounter, and the
like you were describing in the Reddit thing, the insistence
that like this is the only way it can possibly be. Whereas, like,
you know, in terms of feminism, aren't we supposed to
honor the experiences of all women? And if a woman
is coming you and saying, wow, I actually have cervical
orgasms and acepot and peacepot and anal orgasms and nipple

(35:58):
orgasms and I like I know my body to then
try and convince them that they don't know what they're
talking about, or discount what they're saying, or it's a
very white feminist thing to do. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
Yeah, And it's a very white supremacist thing to do, right,
because we go right back into you know, categorizing things
into ultimates, you know, like a good bad, you know.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
And curior inferior.

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Mmmmm h yeah. Yeah, so let's talk about what's good.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
Okay, Yeah, So we'll talk about that in a moment.
I do also want to give a shout out in
terms of mapping the internal internal rectalleito she you want
to give a shout out to Sherry Winston Women's Anatomy
of Arousal. If y'all haven't gotten that book yet, please do.
That changed my whole world in terms of now there's
you know, some problematic aspects, but I'm talking about, like

(36:52):
there's problematic aspects of the book, but specifically the map
that she offers for the internal beds of a rectil tissue,
because it is we're about to go into all the
different parts of it. So I won't, I won't, I won't.
I won't steal your mic on that. But there's an
extensive network it's of internal rectil tissue. It goes far

(37:16):
beyond just the glittorus itself, right, And so Sherry Winston's work,
I remember encountering it in about twenty ten twenty eleven
has been revolutionary in terms of bringing us visual awareness
of that internal internal rectile structure. So I wanted to
give her a shout out, give her props for being

(37:37):
a you know, pioneer in terms of bringing that information
to the masses.

Speaker 1 (37:42):
Yeah, yeah, thank you for that.

Speaker 2 (37:44):
All right, So what are we working with in there?

Speaker 1 (37:46):
Okay? So I just want to talk about some of
the different types of orgasm that do not originate from
the CUV. So we talked a little bit about them,
but I want to outlay them because because there's a
lot of them, and you know, we want to prioritize
people's lived experiences in addition to our scientific understanding of things,

(38:09):
because that's really important and we can't we can't, we
can't discard what people are experiencing well, And the.

Speaker 2 (38:18):
Science is very it's very small. It's it's only it's
only like what studies get funded and what those researchers
decide that they're going to look at. But it's a
very small, very narrow window. And my understanding is the
way that scientific studies are done is actually from gathering
anecdotal evidence, like anecdotal evidence like lived experience is anecdotal evidence.

(38:41):
It kind of points people in the direction of like, oh,
so there's like masses of people reporting this phenomena. Maybe
we should study this phenomena specifically. So lived experience is
evidence that then encourages people to look more deeply into
the origins of where this lived experience may be being
generated from. So I want to put that out there.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
Yeah, thank you. Okay, So different kinds of orgasm of
pleasure not originating from this UV. So we've already talked
about cervical and uterine orgasms, which again cervix is innervated
by three different nerves, including the vagus nerve, and the
uterus is innervated by the vegas nerve. As well, are

(39:24):
pea spot orgasms, which is the posterior fornix erogen's zone
that's basically up near the cervix, towards the back of
your body, coming towards your butt. Also, I didn't put
paraneal orgasms on here. I forgot about that, but that's
one too. There's also anal orgasms that's a very common

(39:46):
orgasmic orgasm that many many people have. This is definitely
not related to the clitter. The clitters, so the clitteral
urethral vaginal complex m H excuse me. We have breast
and nipple orgasms, which we just talked about in one
of our last episodes. There's also orgasms from stimulation of

(40:06):
the skin, the ears, the feats. There are throatgasms, so
there are people who orgasms from giving blowjobs whoooo.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
Amazing.

Speaker 1 (40:22):
There are exercise induced orgasms what they call orgasms, so
some people will have orgasms at the gym while they're exercising.
I mean, there are people have reported having orgasms from toothbrushing,
which I've I've never experienced myself, but that's pretty incredible.
And there's also energy orgasms. Oh gosh, there's so many

(40:45):
different kinds of orgasms. Some of the other ones that
some of our students have reported just they keep growing, right,
So energy orgasms. We've had students orgasm from doing the
ocean breath right, so extended breath work with absolutely no
physical touch gave them an an orgasmic experience. And then yeah,

(41:06):
just recently I heard of someone who experienced orgasm while
they were receiving acupuncture as well. So it really feels
limitless to.

Speaker 2 (41:17):
Me, yes, exactly. Our orgasmic potential is limitless. That's the thing.
Our bodies were built for bliss. Our bodies are wired
for bliss. The human body is in the Buddhist tradition,
the body is Buddha, and the Buddha consciousness is bliss consciousness.
The body is wired for bliss. And so that's why

(41:38):
we want to inform we want to bring this education
to you so that you are not limited. So you're
so because we can be limited, you know, by our imagination,
by our by our concepts of what's possible, and so
we want to open expand your horizon so that you
you you know, there's limitless possibility. And so if you're
having some pleasure and you have you know, different and

(42:00):
orgasmic sensations arise, you don't shut them down because you
think that they're wrong in some way or oh no,
I'm not supposed to be able to feel that, right,
And sometimes I found that for me, like just knowing
that something is possible opens up that experience. For me,
it opens up then I start having that experience because
I believe it's possible, Therefore it is, Therefore it happens. Right.

(42:20):
So that's why it's important for you as our audience
to understand that your capacity for orgasm and pleasures is
as limitless as you are. It's as infinite as God.

Speaker 1 (42:34):
Truly, Yeah, it truly is. Oh, and there's also orgasms
driven by the brain. We're talking a lot about the body,
but the brain is a huge contributor to orgasm as well.
So psychological, emotional, intellectual pleasures can induce orgasm. And one
of my favorite fun facts is that sometimes people who

(42:58):
are in power play like Matrix will have orgasms in
the middle of a scene. So they won't they're they're
engaged in a scene themselves and they're so turned on
by the experience that they have orgasms and they're not
touching themselves at all.

Speaker 2 (43:11):
Yeah, beautiful, I love that says so limitless, right, It's like,
I mean, why limit are why limit our capacity for bliss? Why?
Why why would you want to do that?

Speaker 1 (43:22):
Yeah? So so there are y.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:29):
And then my concluding statement here is talking about like
it's important to note while Western medical and religious traditions
often suppressed or ignored the clitterists, which I did talk
about this earlier, many Asian, pre colonial, African and indigenous traditions,
especially those that incorporate spirituality with sexuality, embraced female pleasure
as essential transformative and even divined, and they outline paths

(43:52):
to orgasm that included stimulation of the clitterists but also
the vagina, the cervix, and much more so. What has
been like discovered by the white Western world has been
known and practiced for years in other cultures millennia.

Speaker 2 (44:06):
Yeah, and some of the tnric conturing Buddhist texts they
refer to the orvajr Yoghini herself refers to her volva
but the clitorius as her stamen of bliss. She calls
her volva my three pedaled lotus with my with a
stamen of bliss. Right. So, and this isn't a like
two thousand year old text that you know they're talking about,

(44:28):
you know, combao before my three pedaled lotus and statement
of bliss and you know, love me long time and
get on your knees and lick it. Boy. So she
gives some very explicit instructions about how she wants her
staymen of bliss to be pleasured. But yeah, it's referred
to as a stamen, you know, or a bliss point
bliss pearl, my pearl of bliss. Yeah, so I love

(44:48):
that it's referenced in ancient, ancient, ancient traditions. So yeah, cool,
So let's talk again. So just to clarify, the CUV
is only the the cliteral glands, legs and bulbs, and
the urethral sponge right the c literal urinal vaginary vaginal complex.

(45:11):
So it's just the.

Speaker 1 (45:12):
Parts, and sometimes they include kind of the whole antior.
Some people include the whole anterior wall of the vagina
with that, but it seems like definitions are maybe differ
a little bit depending on who you're talking.

Speaker 2 (45:26):
To, because we're talking about a rectile tissue structures. The
rectile tissue on the enterer wall vagina doesn't typically extend
all the way to the cervix, which, like my understanding,
is about one to three inches inside the vagina. So
something that we teach in our training programs are the
five beds of a rectile tissue, so the three part clatorus,

(45:48):
so the cliteral glands, which is you know, there's a
debate about whether the glands is actually a rectl tissue
or just actual nerve fibers. So the clteral glands and shaft,
the clitoral legs, and the clateral bulbs which attached to
the legs. So if you don't know what this looks like,
please go Google or chat gp a diagram. But then
there's the perennial sponge, which is a bed of a

(46:10):
rectile tissue between the anus and the vagina, which is
homologous to the root of the penis. And then there's
the the periurethral sponge, which we were talking about, which
was is the spongy erectile tissue that surrounds the urethral.
So that's five pieces parts beds of a rectile tissue.
That also doesn't include the four specific nerve pathways that

(46:35):
innervate the female genitals. Right, So sorry if anyone's triggered
by the word female, that's just the way my brain
is working in terms of like the anatomical structures of
that we're talking about. So so I apologize if that's
trigger but something we also teach and I don't know if
you were going to talk about this again, are those
four nerve pathways that nourish nourish the genitals. Were you

(46:56):
going to talk about that? No? Please do? Okay, well
then out so not to give you to give you context.
So right, so there's you know, we've got the spinal column,
and we have these nerve, these nerve pathways that come
down the spinal column that then you know, branch out
into nerve branches and pathways and end up in nerve fibers. Right,
and then we have that beautiful vegas nerve that bypasses

(47:17):
the spinal column and connects directly to the uterus and cervix.
And so Elena was alluding to a study that was
done by Commosauric was a Rucker study by Commasaaric and Whipple.
I believe about the I believe that's I believe that
was the ye how they did a study on women
who were paraplegic and they stimulated, they had no sensation,

(47:41):
you know, waist down right, none at all, could not
feel the clatorus, could not feel, you know, the vulva,
could not feel the anus. But when the cervix was stimulated,
it gave rise to they had cervical orgasm. And that
was because of the vegus nerve which bypasses the spinal column,
which bypasses a spinal cord. That's where I was looking
for before. So the three nerve pathways that are part

(48:04):
of the spinal cord are your hypogastric nerve. Your hypogastric
nerve connects to your uterus and your cervix, and according
to the research that we've done, that is the main
nerve nerve pathway that also gives rise to the A
spot and the PA spot orgasm. A spot is front
of the body, in front of the cervix. P spot

(48:26):
is posterior behind the cervix, right, So it's that hypogastric
nerve that you're stimulating when you're stimulating right up around
the cervix. And then there is the pelvic nerve. So
the pelvic nerve again neervates the uterus, the cervix as
well as the vagina, and the specifically the periurethra sponge

(48:48):
is the pelvic nerve innervation. And then the pudendal nerve
is what is considered to be I've heard it references
a more shallow nerve nerve branch, which a nerve A
it's the external of your volvus. So the C literal
glands your labia, your inner and outer labia, the X
your your vaginal opening, your in troitis your perennial sponge,

(49:10):
and the opening of your anus. And then of course
inside the anus, your pelvic nerve also innervates that area
as well. So these are four distinct nerve pathways that
feed and nourish all these different areas of your body.
And I just want to point out how much God
loves us. God loves us so much that even if
we cannot walk, even if we cannot walk, we can

(49:33):
still come. God loves us so much that even if
we cannot walk, we can still come with that cervicalasm, oh,
cervical stimulation. So I mean, that's beautiful, that's beautiful.

Speaker 1 (49:48):
And it's beautiful. I've even heard in my kind of
Around the same time I was doing that research davy
years ago, I came across the study where they were
researching how folks who had lost limbs started experience and
seeing some of them started experiencing orgasm in the limb
that they lost, so like they would have an orgasm
like let's say they lost their hand, and they would

(50:09):
feel it in their kind of like phantom hand. It's
because the brain is so incredible that it kind of
since that part of the brain wasn't being used anymore,
it kind of got took over by other parts of
the brain and this ended in experiencing their orgasm in
that place that the brain used to have dominion over.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
That's again, that's that's beautiful, and it also brings to
mind the concept of the energy body. Right, So the
energy body is senior to the physical body. And so
I've talked often in terms of Tibetan medicine and the
energy body. We reference this in terms of if if
a Yoni owner or a woman has a hysterectomy, can
she still have, you know, cervical orgasms. Well, you know,

(50:52):
if you don't have a cervix, then you can't necessarily
have a cervical orgasm specifically, but some of those nerve
pathways will still be intent and the energy body is
still intact. Right, So the energy just because you remove
the physical organ doesn't mean that those energy channels are
necessarily removed. That the energy body will remain present, will
remain available, and so that also helps regenerate nerve pathways.

(51:16):
Is when we work directly with the energy body and
boost those energy pathways, it then translates to the physical
body and nerve pathways, so that phantom I've often thought
of that in terms of phantom pain and phantom pleasure
for lost limbs. Is that's a really beautiful, I would say,
tangible example of the reality of the energy body. The
physicalness is gone, but the energy is still there, right,

(51:40):
but also the concept that you know that there's still
pleasure to be accessed. And I wonder in terms of
that for folks who may have lost limbs and maybe
maybe experience phantom pain, I wonder about being able to
do the translating pleasure exercise for that being able to
so if there's phantom pain, maybe stimulating you know, a

(52:00):
pleasurable area of the body and seeing if you can
translate that to the energy the expression of pain that
you're feeling from the energy body.

Speaker 1 (52:09):
Just the thought bring your breath and awareness to the
pain while stimulating pleasure in other parts.

Speaker 2 (52:14):
Yeah, yeah, see if you can translate the pleasure. Yeah yeah.
If y'all haven't learned the translating pleasure technique, you will
learn it in my Sacred Art of Self Pleasure for
Women that is happening December ninth. If you haven't had
an opportunity to sign up, please go ahead. I will
have to drop the link in the description because I
can't remember it on the top of my head but

(52:35):
the Sacred Art of cell Pleasure. December ninth, We're going
to do a sacred pleasure ritual together. We will not
be naked, but we will meditate and we will breathe,
and I will guide us through pleasure Moudrus and the
practice of pleasure surfing and dancing your winds, dancing your
winds through pleasure and intention and breath and again that's

(52:59):
the Saber ninth and I will drop the link below
so that you can go ahead and signed up. We're
running a special right now until November thirtieth. It's only
sixty nine dollars to join us for this event and
you will have lifetime axis. It will be recorded and
you will have lifetime access. So just wanted to throw
that plug in there as we're talking about translating pleasure,
because that is a technique that I will be teaching
during that class two and a half hour workshop with me. Yeah,

(53:23):
all right, So what else we got, Elena, That's what
I have. That's it, all right, that's the things you like.

Speaker 1 (53:30):
To talk about, all right.

Speaker 2 (53:31):
So the so the intention with this episode is to
highlight for you the exact science behind why your clicktorus
is not the only source of female orgasm, because, as
Elena said, there's a lot of noise out there in
the industry trying to tell you that it is. Now.

(53:54):
It is a primary source of female pleasure, one hundred percent.
It is one of our for those who have awakened clatoruses,
and you know, not that that's some special club. It's
just like, the clatorus is generally the most pleasurable zone.
But I have in my seventeen year career encountered some
the you know, women whose clatoruses are not sensitive, They're

(54:16):
clatorus is maybe numb for a variety of reasons. Right,
So I also want to put that caveat in there
that you know, if your clatorus is not your primary
source of pleasure, that's okay too. Whatever your primary source
of pleasure is is good. Say yes to your pleasure
wherever it happens. It's a good thing, right. So, the
clutaorus is a can be a primary source of pleasure,
but it is not the sole source of female orgasm.

(54:37):
And we really wanted to illustrate that for you clearly,
to allow you to open pathways to access your full
orgasmic potential, because why the heck not.

Speaker 1 (54:49):
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (54:50):
Yeah, beautiful, beautiful. So this is some of the information
that we include in our Holistic Sexology Certification training program,
the beautiful in depth dissertation that Elena does. These deep
dives into topics specifically of genital anatomy. And we've been
doing this together for over a decade, so this is

(55:11):
not new for our students, our current students and graduates,
but it will be new for you if you join
our Holistic Sexology Certification training program. And we are now
still in the early registration window until December thirty first,
so if you are if you want to become a
certified sexologist from the only government accredited school offering this

(55:34):
type of sexology certification, then please go to Holistic Sexology
Institute dot com and check out our certification page. We
do have a little forty five minute dissertation i would say,
video dissertation on the curriculum that you can go ahead
and sign up and watch if you want to learn
more about the nuts and bolts of the curriculum. But

(55:54):
we do have it all there on the page displayed
for you. And then if you have any questions, you
can of course send us send us those questions. We're
happy to answer them, but you can also just go
ahead and apply now and book a free consultation with
us to answer any of those questions. So again that's
Holistic Sexology Institute dot com and our Holistic Sexology Certification program,
government accredited and currently under a SECT a SECT review,

(56:19):
currently under a SECT review, so that this will also
be an a SECT approved program because we want we
want you to have as many credible credentials as you can.
I know that's the best terminology, but you know, this
field is is you know, it's full. It's a full
field's and it's a wonderful thing. There's a lot of

(56:41):
a lot of wonderful conversation about sexology, and some of
it's very accurate and some of it's not. And so
we want to ensure that for our students and our
graduates moving out in the world that you have the
most up to date, accurate information to share with your clients.
And we also, because it's holistic, we also offer a

(57:02):
holistic lens. So it's not just the Western you know, dissecting,
cutting up and putting people into these little compartmentalized, isolated
silos of information in your body or just these these
little parts that you know don't they can't figure out
how they work together. We offer a holistic view and
the holistic lens of all of our parts and not

(57:24):
just our body parts, our emotional parts, or psychological parts,
or spiritual parts, our systemic parts, our communal parts, our
societal parts, because we are whole human beings and the
whole includes everything. So that's my pitch, Beautiful, that's my pitch.
Y'all go ahead and check it out. You know, there's

(57:46):
no pressure. If you want to sign up, you can.
If you want more information, you can get it. But
if you're interested, if you want to invest, if you
want to invest in an accredited credential certification program in
the field of holistic sex all, then we do invite
you to check out our program because we work hard
to make sure that we keep those credentials in place,

(58:07):
that government accreditation and that ASEX certification. Yeah yeah, yeah,
all right, anything else on this topic, our dear Elena.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
No, thank you for letting me talk about it. That
was nice and thorough and I feel vindicated that I
was able to discuss this today and put it out
in the world. So if you're out there and you
see sex educators talking about this, feel free to link
them back to this episode so that they can learn more.

Speaker 2 (58:37):
Yeah, I was gonna say, you should drop this link
in that little reddit group where folks were arguing with
you about it, and they can hear you talk about them.
I will. Hi, y'all, we were talking about you. Bless
your hearts. Thanks for listening. All right, everybody, thank you
so so much for tuning in. Again. We appreciate you,

(58:58):
We value you. Yeah, it's just it's a it's an
honor to be back. And I also I also just
want to say, like I was reviewing, you know, the episode,
so this is we're coming to the end of season
one yea. Also, last episode of season one is going
to be December eighteenth. Then we're gonna take a little
hiatus and gather our gather our wins, so to speak,
and then we will be back in action in February

(59:18):
of twenty twenty six. And so yesterday I was just
kind of going through some of the episodes and kind
of like you know, observing the arc, and and I
and I wanna, I wanna again express appreciation for all
of you listeners who who have stayed with us through
this kind of journey, you know, came out with a
like big blast of you know, my house burned down.
This is where we've been doing. And then we're exposing,

(59:39):
you know, exposing efferee in the industry, and Davy's gonna
try and stop cussing, but she really doesn't. But anyway,
so just the whole arc of where we've been for
this season, and and I appreciate those of you who
have stayed with us again it really meets our needs
for encouragement and support and inspiration to continue bringing you

(01:00:01):
this work, to continue bringing you this medicine. So we
appreciate again and keep saying that word of appreciation is
one of my love languages, if you want to know
Davy's love language, words of appreciation is one of my
primary love languages. So your words of appreciation really, really
really are a source of nourishment for my spirit, for

(01:00:21):
my heart and my spirit. So thank you, thank you,
thank you, thank you. All right, we will leave you
at that signing off, and we look forward to seeing
you next week for another episode of Sex Is Medicine.
Make sure you like and subscribe, Like and subscribe, like
and subscribe.

Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
You've been listening to Sex Is Medicine, your number one
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Speaker 2 (01:00:45):
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(01:01:06):
please at Questions at Holistic Sexology Institute dot com. Thank
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