Unraveling 'King of Ashes' | Book Chat #BuddyRead - Shelf Addiction Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, book lovers, Welcome back to shelf Addiction, the podcast
where we dive deep into the pages of thriller and
fantasy reads. I'm your host, Tamara, and today we're discussing
our August thriller Buddy Read. But first a quick heads up.
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(00:25):
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wherever you're listening. And speaking of community, I am thrilled

(00:46):
to welcome back my fabulous thriller mystery co host and
friend Classy from the Bookish Virtual Assistant. Welcome back, Classy.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
Hey Tamara, how are you?

Speaker 1 (00:54):
I'm doing great? How are you?

Speaker 2 (00:56):
I'm doing pretty good too. Can't complain all.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
Right, that's stuff. So the links to find both of
us on our socials are below in the show notes,
So click around. Do all the things. We appreciate you
for doing that. As always with book chats, we talk
full spoilers here, so spoiler alert you've been warned. Today
we are discussing the book King of Ashes, written by S. A. Cosby.

(01:20):
The audiobook is narrated by Adam Lazar White, published June tenth,
twenty twenty five, by Pine and Seer and McMillan Audio.
The hardcover is three hundred and thirty three pages and
the unabridged audio is thirteen hours and nineteen minutes. Classy,
would you kindly read the synopsis.

Speaker 2 (01:38):
Absolutely A sun returning home, A dangerous debt secret's about
to ignite in a family consumed by flames. Roman Carruthers
left the smoke and fire of his family's crematory business
behind in his hometown of Jefferson Run, Virginia. He's enjoying
a life of shadow excess as a fine financial advisor

(02:00):
in Atlanta until he gets a call from his sister Nevea,
telling him that their father is in a coma after
a hit and run accident. When Roman goes home, he
learns the accident may not be what it seems. His
brother Dante is deeply in debt to dangerous, ruthless criminals,
and Roman is willing, willing to do anything to protect

(02:22):
his family anything. A financial whiz with a head for
numbers and a talent for making his clients rich, Roman
must use all of his skills to try and save
his family while dealing with the shadow that has haunted
them for twenty years, the disappearance of their mother when
Roman and his sibling and his siblings were teenagers. It's

(02:44):
a mystery that Navea, who has sacrificed so much of
her life to hold her family together, is determined to
solve once and for all. As fate and chant and
heartache ignites their lives, the Carruthers family must pull together
to vibe or see their lives turn to ash. Because,
as their father comes with them from birth, nothing lasts forever.

(03:08):
Everything burns, Everything burns, baby, everything, everything burn baby burn
just going furn out.

Speaker 1 (03:19):
Okay, look you have that in your head, you know.
When I finished this book, I was trying to find
a gift for Gangster's Paradise. That was the song that
was flowing in my head most.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
Parades.

Speaker 1 (03:39):
I was like, this is the vibe right.

Speaker 2 (03:40):
Here, and and it never fails, Like when we read
black Top Top Wastline, it was it's always like some
soundtrack to some of his books. So yeah, that's a
good one. Gangster Paradise.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
Yeah, And actually, before before we even give our initial
thoughts and reactions, I have have to say, I was like,
look at that crossover. He slid that in there, and
I was gonna text you. I was like, I don't
know if she's there yet. I don't want to give
it away, so I just held it.

Speaker 2 (04:10):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
I'm like, okay, Cosmy, you did it. He went in
the character Ike from Blacktop Wasteland.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, I'm like, no, from Raizor Blade Cheers.

Speaker 1 (04:23):
You're right, it was Razor Blade Tears. Yeah, it's the
best friend's name. You know. He's talking about the white dude.
The white dude is Buddy Lay Buddy Buddy.

Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah. I was just trying to make sure, Like when
you said best friend, I was like, from black Top Waistline,
I couldn't remember who that guy was, but yeah, Randolph.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah. I was like, oh my god, I said, wait
a minute, he's so clever the sun yeah, and the
granddaughter and his best friend.

Speaker 2 (04:50):
Yeah, Because I was like, why does Ike Randolph sound
so familiar and then you know, yeah, he slowly. I
was like, Okay, I get it now. I'm like, well,
I know we would have probably recognized other characters in
other books. So I was like, did he do that
in any other books?

Speaker 1 (05:08):
I don't think so, well, you know what, and I can't.
I don't even know why I could not remember the
right book because I've looked at this earlier. I wanted
to see if it showed the city they were in
in this book, and when I went to good Reads,
it just says this one is Richmond, Virginia and this one.

Speaker 2 (05:26):
Is Virginia Run.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
Yeah, so I guess it must be close enough.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
Yeah, because they do mention Richmond in this book, so
I'm assuming it's not that far.

Speaker 1 (05:39):
Yeah, from Jefferson Run. So I'm like that was pretty
interesting and it was like a totally unrelated It didn't
have anything to do with anything. He was just doing
their lawn work.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
Which is his job, yeah, which is his job.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
Hopefully he didn't put nothing in your lawn, you know.

Speaker 2 (06:00):
Yeah, a little nice fertilizer. I was just hoping that
the landscapers weren't some other criminals that was coming to
kill Dante that after you know, like after you've seen
just so much in this book, you're just like, are
they really lawn men or are they plants? Right? Are
they from the ghost crew or whatever that one crew was? Yeah,

(06:23):
that's what my concern was.

Speaker 1 (06:25):
I was just like, oh, these siblings. I swear, I
swear these siblings. But we gonna get into that. Okay,
let's go to our usual. What'd you think when you
finish the book?

Speaker 2 (06:37):
Damn? That is just like this was pretty. It was gritty,
it was dark, hard to put down, which is classic
sa Cosby. But I felt like the character developed in

(07:01):
the the plot it was you know it. I think
like the flow characters kind of had this plot moving
pretty damn quick. So I just I was I was like,
this was good. I really enjoyed it. I enjoyed, Uh.
The way he flushed out his characters, the three siblings,

(07:24):
how everything impacted them and how they developed as adults
wasn't my favorite essay, probably not, but this was just
he writes such good stories. And again I could see
this as a movie.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
Yeah I could too.

Speaker 2 (07:43):
I mean the way and the difference with him is
I don't think he writes for it to be a movie,
you know what I mean, Like we've we've we've read
a few books where you could tell like they wrote
this to be a script, right, And I don't see
him writing this. I see him. This is how he writes,

(08:06):
and it's almost like Cosby Vision for you know, his
own little verse, Cosby verse, and he's playing his movie
in his head, but he's putting it on paper. Yeah yeah, yeah, Well.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
I uh when I finished that, I was like, well,
he was messed up at the end there. I'm like,
you know what, I was not surprised at all by
that ending. I knew really early on that Roman was
going to turn into a villain. I said he gonna

(08:46):
be running that gang. Yeah, I said that very early on.

Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yeah, I mean, he is what he is, it's just
he was doing it in a higher level.

Speaker 1 (09:00):
He is not a good person. It's like he is
one of And I think that's kind of what I
liked about the all, Like these characters like they are
what they are and they're not trying to pretend to
be anything else really, and it was kind of refreshing
that even though they had like a sad origin story,

(09:20):
you know, an unfortunate origin story that It wasn't one
of these things where you can't be a villain just
because of your origin story. You sure as hell are
you still are? Mm hmm.

Speaker 2 (09:33):
And the thing is is like, like when you say that,
I felt that like he was trying to tamper it
down with his degree and his intelligence and the job
he held. He tried to tamper it down, but he couldn't.
And you know, it would creep up in his his
meetings with his dominatrix and his sex life, you know,

(09:55):
and again the the trauma of their street, from their
mother's past, how all of that affected each one of
them differently. And you're right, I did like that he
didn't make this cookie cutter and tried to to, you know, say,
but look at them now.

Speaker 1 (10:15):
Yeah he did.

Speaker 2 (10:16):
He was successful, but in the end when it all
came down, yeah, and he said, I'll do anything for
my family.

Speaker 1 (10:23):
But think about it. Roman has always been coloring outside
the lines. Always. When he came back home and he
figured out what the hell his brother's gotten into, he's like,
oh great, I'll call my person, get this money situated,
call my other person. He'd come up here and help
me clean this mess up, you know, so he's always
been operating outside the lines, even though he has it.

(10:46):
I guess he was a higher level gangster. He's always
kind of been a gangster.

Speaker 2 (10:52):
Yep, yep in his choge. He just yeah, he just
tried to legalize it, or tried to I don't even
say legalize it, but yeah he was. I mean, you're right,
he always colored out of the lines.

Speaker 1 (11:05):
He's like a law taxes I got somebody for that,
and could lie with a straight ass face. Yeah, But
his sister called him out, like, you just lie, like.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
Nave I told you the truth.

Speaker 1 (11:24):
He's lying to me, But he said, but the thing is,
it's like this is how you know he he countered
that from all his readings, you know, mcavelly, The Art
of War, all those books always mingle in a little
bit of the truth. So it does sound like, look,
it's not a lie made that type of person never

(11:46):
find me never, because I mean even when he got
with Jay, she's calling him out. He is lying to
her face, just straight lying. Again, this fool cannot tell
the truth to save his own life.

Speaker 2 (12:03):
No, it was it was second nature. It was second nature.
And I think the other part is it's like once
you do it? How do you go back? I think
he kind of said that in the books, like I've
started this, it's like that snowball that you're pushing down,
It's like, how do you backtrack it?

Speaker 1 (12:22):
You can't.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
No, you're right, he was record speed. Yeah, he couldn't,
and and he had so many balls juggling in the
damn air. So so yeah, he definitely has always been diabolical,

(12:47):
just in a different manner. And Torrent said it every
you know often, you always thought you you just think
you smarter than.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Me, And he college boy, he does think he's smarter
than him. Oh yeah, he is in a way like
he's very he is worse than Torrent. And so the
whole time he knew, Okay, I'm gonna infiltrate, I'm gonna
turn your people, and then I'm gonna get rid of you.

(13:15):
I gotta cut all the snakeheads off at once. M h.
And when you are the war.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
Baby, strategic I mean, he was throwing out all those
strategic terms. That's how you know, Like when I'm reading this,
so I'm like, oh shit, yeah, crossing the rubicon, you know,
he was quoting Caesar mac Yeah, you're right, he was
way worse than Torn torn. They only knew violence.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
Turns out Roman knows violence too. That first scene, look girl,
when he the first time Torrent Sorry Roman showed himself
to really be that kind of person, was when he's
set that man on fire alive. You're not even gonna
kill him first, You're gonna put him in there alive.

(14:08):
That's cold.

Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yeah. But the way he wrote this, he made it
seem like because we because this is our first introduction
kind of to that side of Roman. Essay tried to
make it seem like he was afraid to kill, like
I'd rather just no, I'm not shooting no gun, I'm

(14:32):
not gonna kill him. No, I'll just you know, maybe
this would be easier, you know. That's how That's how
when I read it, I was like, Oh, he's trying
to like say, you know what, But then you think
about it, that's torturous.

Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, it is torturous. And in hindsight, I feel like
maybe he was fearful for taking the lid off the
box because he couldn't close it back mm hmm. Not
that he was scared that he couldn't do it, but
he was scared with that meant if he started down
this path. Yeah, because he clearly has no fucking problem.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
Because even the one, the one, the one guy who
uh Dante, I think Dante killed that one who said, man,
you're not even gonna kill him, that's real gangster.

Speaker 1 (15:20):
Yeah yeah, wow, you're gonna put him in there like that.
Oh my god. Yeah, I'm like that guy. I don't
care how much you think you knocked him out. When
his body starts burning, he's gonna jump up, it starts screaming.
And that was so.

Speaker 2 (15:39):
Man.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
He was writing this really dark, intense things, like even
the first thing that hit me I think was around
seventeen percent. When you know, Roman's like, I'm gonna talk
to this guy, and I think he underestimated him at first.
He underestimated Torrent at first he thought it would be easy,

(16:00):
but instead he got his teeth knocked out, his brother
got his bigger cut.

Speaker 2 (16:05):
Yeah, he just thought, oh, he's just a little thug.
He's just some little game member. You just owed him
some money. Money talks, that's what. And that's what he thought.
All I need is a little money we get we
can get out of this.

Speaker 1 (16:16):
Real easy, like yeah, and then he's like, oh, that's
what we're dealing with. Okay, change, game change, game change.

Speaker 2 (16:25):
He kept talking about the taste of that gun in
his mouth.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
I was like, oh shit, yeah, I mean honestly he
and that shows like the amount of money he actually
has and like what he's able to do, because the
next day he is at a dentist like fix all
this ship, and the dentist is like, do you know
how much it's gunn coss? He's like, I have a

(16:50):
black car, Just do it? Do it now?

Speaker 3 (16:53):
Do it now.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
I cannot walk around with my teeth knocked out and
mentor coming on it later like oh nice new teeth,
you know, or something like that. Done quick?

Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, he said, if I didn't know any better, if
I know I didn't knock those, I wouldn't have knowniced
those are not your teeth.

Speaker 3 (17:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:16):
Oh he has the power. He's like calling people and
things are happening just like this. Oh he's getting hundreds
of thousands of dollars like this like clockwork.

Speaker 2 (17:25):
And it's like, yeah, his connections, you know, like he
knew a man who could you know the the shell
accounts and call so and so and she knows where
my this account is and Khalil and you know, he
has a man who could do this, He knows a
man that knows a man that could do this and
could do that. So he was a gangster thug in

(17:49):
his own right. It was just on a different level
or in a different tax bracket, different education class, but
he was still a thug.

Speaker 1 (18:02):
Yeah, absolutely, yeah, absolutely, which is crazy. And I really
enjoyed that about the character I did. And I thought, like,
even when you know you talked about his Dominara tux lady,
I'm like, oh, man, what is his problem? What is
his hang up? And oh I knew that surely he's

(18:23):
got mommy issues, but what is it?

Speaker 2 (18:25):
Mm hmmm, yeah, what is it?

Speaker 1 (18:29):
And then when we find out what it is, I'm like, oh, I.

Speaker 2 (18:33):
See, yeah, he needs to feel it.

Speaker 1 (18:38):
Yeah, he needs like a kazillion hours of therapy mm hmm,
but he'd rather just get someone to do Yeah, you.

Speaker 2 (18:50):
Go to therapy. That means you you you possibly will
reveal what you did.

Speaker 1 (18:56):
What to be fair, it's like I think about that.
I'm like, at the time, you were sixteen and it
was an accident, nothing would have happened to him. Worst
case scenario if they had like done the right thing
and called the police immediately or called nine one one
or something. Nothing would have happened, right, worst case scenario,

(19:16):
he goes to juvie for a couple of years and
he's out because he's sixteen. Yeah, but because they decided
their father decided to cover that up like that, it
created a clear divergence of their life, especially for Dante.
That tore Dante up like he could not deal.

Speaker 2 (19:36):
He was already socatic, He was already soft as as
Dante and that Dante Roman say, he's always been a soft,
a gentle kind of you know, he was a gentle kid.
You know, he didn't like to kill bugs or a
snake or whatever his dad had killed. He you know,
he was very I'll just say, a gentle kid. So

(19:58):
for him to see that, and he's probably a mama's boy,
he was the baby. And to see that and then
to cover it up because you know, I know they
replay that in their head constantly. Yea and yeah, and
that was his escapism is drugs. And I mean this kid,

(20:19):
he used everything.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
He was always high or drunk all ways. That was
his baseline. He couldn't deal with the things that were
going on in his head.

Speaker 2 (20:33):
Yeah, those demons were Yeah, And now I see why
when Roman gets to town and Dante says, you're not
gonna ask me how I'm doing? Oh okay. At first,
I was just like, yo, daddy is you know your
daddy's in the hospital and you're concerned about that. Now
I get it because he's like, dude, what happened back then?

(21:00):
This is why I'm like this, you haven't even called
to check on me. But I think the thing is,
it's like they're all trying to deal with their demons,
and it's hard because it divides you those secrets, that
generational trauma. It's like, how do we come together? Because
they had to keep that secret away from Nevea, and

(21:21):
then them two had to kind of keep it together.
And I think by separating himself from Dante that kind
of I think that was his own protection too, Romans,
because he's probably like, if I saw my brother in
that state, who.

Speaker 1 (21:41):
Yeah, And it has been a long time. These are
full grown adults. We're not talking about twenty year olds.
These are full on adults.

Speaker 2 (21:51):
You it's got to be what are they in their thirties?

Speaker 1 (21:53):
Maybe might be in his late twenties if that, because
obviously is the oldest, and he's still young enough that
you know, yeah, he might be in his thirties.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
So it's got to be at least sixteen years. Yeah,
at least or did they say twelve years that the
mom had passed.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
Oh? Maybe? So if it's twelve years, that means that
Roman is what twenty eight or twenty nine. Yeah, and
that means Nevea, she's the middle child, and then Dante's
the youngest child. And if like we're gonna assume there
was a couple of years between them when the incident happened,
so he might be like he might have five years
on him or something.

Speaker 2 (22:34):
Yeah, I'm thinking, I don't know why twelve is playing
in my head, but I think I've heard, like my
mother's death was twelve years ago or something.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
But yeah, so even then, you know, he's well over
twenty one, he's like in his mid twenties, and he
in Honestly, when Nevea got told that you know, Dante
was dead, I don't know how she was shocked. I'm
surprised that she wasn't so thinking he would be dead
by then. How much drugs he was doing, who he

(23:05):
was messing around with in the streets, like, how would
you expect nothing less?

Speaker 2 (23:09):
Yeah? But it still hurts nonetheless, I know, but she.

Speaker 1 (23:13):
Acts like she was genuinely like, oh my god, how
like what do you mean? How do you know your
own brother? What do you mean? How?

Speaker 2 (23:21):
Yeah? But you know what just from because I've kind
of lived that experience, not with a sibling, but with
another relative who I know lived a precarious life. Because
you always hope, You always hope, yes, you know, yeah, yes,

(23:45):
you know it's a possibility, but you always hope that,
I mean, doctor. I think the other thing is is
that Roman kept saying I'm gonna fix this. You know,
That's what I played to in my head with her,
Like you, I thought that too, like her, you know,

(24:05):
he was headed that way. But but the possibility is
that I think the difference in him dying is he
was murdered, yes, and he didn't die.

Speaker 1 (24:20):
He as a result of his lifestyle. He was messing
around with those thugs already, and honestly, and did you
think about this? So Roman basically killed their mother. He
basically killed his brother as well, because at when the

(24:43):
girl came back, remember he had that whole ass conversation
Cassidy yes, when Cassidy came back, he had that whole
conversation with his boy and he said, Okay, you want
me to scare her into leaving, but what do you
want if she doesn't leave? Like, let's get this clear.

(25:03):
And then we have a scene later where he's like
apologizing to the girl before he shoves her body into
the damn thing.

Speaker 2 (25:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:11):
So the whole time, poor Dante is thinking that the
other gang did this, so he's off on revenge mission
on Cassidy's behalf and his brother did it. Yeah, so
he got his brother killed. Yeah, this is your fault, dude,

(25:34):
mister fix it. This is your fault.

Speaker 2 (25:36):
Mm hm.

Speaker 1 (25:38):
And Naveah knows it because when you finally caved, well,
he doesn't even know. She doesn't even know all the
things you did.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
No, no, she does not. No.

Speaker 1 (25:48):
But now Neveah is also a killer. And I knew
she was gonna be a killer as well, especially after
she had that conversation with that nurse that talked about
asked for and I said, oh mm hmm, She's like,
what is that. Oh.

Speaker 2 (26:04):
I was like, ooh, pops, ain't gonna survive.

Speaker 1 (26:08):
So in her heartache in trying to figure out what
happened to her mother, that if they had told her
the truth. Yeah, secrets never ever result in anything good.
They're always bad.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
Oh no, And I mean granted it wasn't accident. It
was an accident, but woof you guys left her out.
And by leaving her out, you left her to her
own devices. And what do you expect if she finds
her mother's ashes in a cookie jar.

Speaker 1 (26:45):
Right in her dad's face.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
And you guys were teenagers. She wouldn't expect a teenager
to do that. And her mother was having an affair
with her co work. Yeah, yeah, her husband's employee friend.

(27:10):
So yeah, I mean deductive, She deducted that, hey it
had to be yeah between Yeah, because Dante and Roman
had no reason to kill mom.

Speaker 1 (27:24):
And right, she did her detective work. She was right,
she deduced the right thing. Mm hmm what she was given.
And I mean, honestly, the dad did cover it up.
He put the car there, he was the last one
in the car. Yeah, he burned the body up. I
still don't understand, like, you know, yes, this is just
the story and this is how the author chose to

(27:46):
get here, but like just thinking, like as a full
grown adult, Why wouldn't you just call nine one one, dude?
It would have been fine, It would have been completely fine.
Like that would have sucked. But guess what, Neveah would
have a different line right now. Has she know what
really happened to her mother? Yeah, instead she's off and
no one knows where she is because she's like never

(28:09):
gonna speak to her brother again. That's what it seemed like.
She's done with them.

Speaker 2 (28:12):
Yeah. Yeah, and I'm and I'm glad for her. I
hate saying this in the story, but you know, she
she finally chose herself. Yeah, because in the end, her
brothers did what they did, but they still left her
to take care of her father and that business, knowing

(28:35):
what they did, and I won't even say they will
go with Roman. Granted they were strangers, but even as
you aged, you never even thought to come and help her.
And this, like she said, even if he did recover,
she was going to be the.

Speaker 1 (28:54):
Caretaker exactly her brother laid her.

Speaker 2 (28:57):
Mm hmm yep. So she chose herself. Granted, I'm sorry
that dad was collateral damage, but it.

Speaker 1 (29:11):
Worked out for her.

Speaker 2 (29:12):
Yeah it did.

Speaker 1 (29:13):
But even if you know, mister kind hearted Dante, how
you never cave and told your sister, like, you know,
when you started seeing that she was really going after
the Dad is a prime suspect. Why I say, look,
I gotta tell you something. Yeah, you know, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (29:35):
But he, you know, he always he thought he was
the fuck up. Remember that's what he told Ike, Hey,
my family thinks I'm a fuck up.

Speaker 1 (29:43):
Well, you know why he thinks that. It goes all
the way back to that day because he is the
one that went crying to Roman, and he thinks that's
his fault because he set off the chain of events
by going and crying and blabbing his mouth. Yep. Yeah,
so he feels responsible even though he's not the one
that actually pushed her shoved her.

Speaker 2 (30:06):
Right, but he got the ball rolling and then yeah,
you know, then this situation. So yeah, I mean, he's
a drug addict. He's not the most successful of the family.
So yeah, he is like the black sheep. He feels,
you know that he is, and you know, and Roman
had to constantly remind him, no, you sit here, don't
go drink, don't go out there doing myth or whatever

(30:29):
the heck he was doing drink from daddy's bottle because
he knew he was. He was afraid Dante was probably
gonna run his mouth.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
Yeah, which later Dante kind of accepts it. Well, he
might have been right. Yeah, you know, point taking.

Speaker 2 (30:44):
Yeah, but that is like this this part of the
story of the two plots that he put in this story,
you know, the two parallel stories of the mom's mystery
and Dante and Roman story.

Speaker 1 (31:00):
How he does you know.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
I like how he did that in this story and
how they you know, came together. But those two parallel
stories was just brilliant. He's such a good writer.

Speaker 1 (31:14):
Yeah, I agree. Yeah, Okay, now it's a great time
to take a quick break. You guys, check off these
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and don't forget to check out our merch store over
on dash Rey. We have new stuff there, so click
the link below and check it out. We'll be right back.
Welcome back everyone. So you were talking about like how

(31:37):
he merged these two storylines. I think it was great,
And I also think it was good that we actually
got some flashbacks to the past that really amped it
up because we got to see them as kids going
through this. I think that added a whole nother layer
of yeah drama, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:58):
Yeah, another dimension to the characters. Yeah, it really and
I saw that when you were saying how Roman always
colored outside the lines. You know, you could just see
little bits and pieces. Even though Dante was a little crybaby,
as they will probably call it in Mama's Boy, Roman

(32:19):
was was a little you know, he even mentioned, you know,
he whatever year in college he was dating his professor.
You know, it was always just little you know, his
little nuggets of reveal of who who Dante? I mean
Roman was. Yeah, and then to see Nevella and uh

(32:42):
and you know how close knit they were too, and
then how it just slowly began to crumble.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah and it did. That was really sad, honestly, that
whole chain of events. It just sent them spiraling. But okay,
so to switch notes just a little bit. Did you
notice that both sets of siblings in this story where
two brothers and a sister, So torrent and tranquil and jealousy. Okay, Roman,

(33:13):
Dante and Navella. I'm like, oh, he's got too the
same sibling makeups. Yeah, going on here, and it's like
kind of similar in the same way both of the
brothers up to no good. The sisters like, I'm trying
to stay out that shit. What are you guys doing?

Speaker 2 (33:32):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (33:33):
Basically, yeah, it's bad girls good.

Speaker 2 (33:38):
Yeah. Wow. I mean I noticed that, but I didn't
think about the dynamics of the characters of how they
both the girls was like, yeah, I know what my
brothers do, and I'm staying out of this. Yeah. And
then you know, I enjoy too, Like the vea her

(33:59):
storyline of losing her mom and looking for love and
losing her mom and then not really having that father figure,
so you know, she had daddy issues and so she
was just accepting any old man.

Speaker 1 (34:12):
So she wanted like she I don't think she thought
she deserved a good guy for some reason.

Speaker 2 (34:17):
Oh yeah, no, not at all. She didn't. Yeah, she
I think she felt like she deserved.

Speaker 1 (34:26):
Crumbs, yeah, which is what he gave her, crumbs. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
And then I think she she finally woke up and
was like, you know what, And I think she said
a piece of a man, right. I think I think
that might have been basically kind of what she mentioned.
She's like, yeah, I got a piece of a man.
But then she realized, you know what, I'm worth so
much more than this you know. She's like, yeah, she
started looking at him through the the rear view mirror

(34:53):
and she's like, that's exactly where he needs to be.
And I think that was like the turning point her
for all the men in her life. Yeah, I mean,
you took care of a whole bunch of these little
suckers she did.

Speaker 1 (35:09):
I almost think though, I thought the turning point for
her was when he threatened Dante at that after the
people got like stabbed by the gang in the.

Speaker 2 (35:22):
Wasn't that? Wasn't that when she saw him in her
rear hear.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
That they got her car and they left. But like
when she threatened to tell his business like she like,
you know what, You're gonna leave me and this is
my brother alone, because I'm gonna call your wife and
tell her everything. I'm gonna show her all these text
messages she decided in that moment she was telling him
the way she blew that shit up.

Speaker 2 (35:44):
She's like there's She's like, I'm risking it all.

Speaker 1 (35:47):
What else do I like? We getting in this car,
we leave in good, good day, sir, get little like
that was the last straw for her, Like how dare
you sit up here and try to like, escape goat
my little brother.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
Yeah, just because they're in this shitty ass town where
crime is high.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
Grant they were, but how dare you? But how dare you?

Speaker 2 (36:13):
And I knew he was an old dirty cop. That
was that was just like I was just waiting for that. Yeah,
I was just waiting for that to happen with him
in touring. I was like, he, you cannot tell me
in that little bitty town that this man, this officer
does not have some kind of dealings or know something

(36:34):
with the biggest gangsters around.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
Yeah. So, I mean, but from the way that the
that Cosby wrote it, it seems like he didn't have
any affiliation with them until after Rowman said, f you,
I'm not giving you twenty five grand. Yeah, and then
he said, well the wife kicked me out, she got
my house, I can't see my kids. I need some money.

Speaker 2 (36:56):
Right. Yeah. I was just saying I knew he's dirty.
But yeah, you're right, but you knew that he knew
how to find this dirty man.

Speaker 1 (37:05):
Yeah. Yeah, but he's not a good person. He was awful.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
Oh no, he didn't. He only like she said, like
Neveah said, his character, he showed me his true self
when my dad is on life support. This man calls
me for a booty call. His wife is out of
town and my daddy is on life support.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
Like that would have been kick rocks right then, Like,
what are you talking about, man.

Speaker 2 (37:34):
Peter Dickon dies?

Speaker 1 (37:35):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (37:39):
Oh really right? Like she finally did say are you available? Nope? Yeah,
what you mean, I'm not available?

Speaker 1 (37:46):
That's what I told you, don't. I swear that guy
was aw oh man awful like, and she just dealt
with him for so long because she that's what she
thought she deserved.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
I mean, the men in this book were pieces of shit, yeah,
all of them.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
So I was I mean grant, like I said, I'm
sad that she killed her father, but I'm glad that
she chose herself and got the fuck out of there.
Don't get back, honey, Yeah, let them deal with that.
Let Roman deal with that.

Speaker 1 (38:19):
I would have loved to just get like a six
month later. From her point of view, I just want
to see that she was okay and didn't like spiral
into like something.

Speaker 2 (38:29):
Worse, you know, like a Dante.

Speaker 1 (38:32):
Yeah, because she did that, and she was like I
did that for nothing. She was so mad, right, rightfully.

Speaker 2 (38:38):
So I just killed my daddy.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
He didn't even do it.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
God, yeah, he was an accomplice.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
He wasn't accomplice.

Speaker 2 (38:50):
She in the bottle, though, she probably didn't smoke the
whole pack of two a new porch or whatever the
heck she was smoking. Yeah, she's probably at the wine
the the wine place she was.

Speaker 1 (39:03):
She had one of the wineries, drinking all the wine.

Speaker 2 (39:07):
And smoking cigarettes. Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1 (39:11):
Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (39:13):
Mean I just killed somebody for nothing.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
Yeah, exactly. And that's one thing. I you know, through
all the choices that she made, I'd like that she
understood how serious this was. Like out the gates, she's like,
what are you doing? What are y'all doing? Tell me
what's going on? This is She knew immediately something was up.
They were up to no good, And like, even though

(39:36):
she made bad choices, she knew this was a serious
situation and she was gonna hit the stand.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
Yeah, Like she said, I know this crematoria up and down,
I run this place. Yeah, daddy doesn't take count.

Speaker 1 (39:51):
I do, and then he goes again. Roman just lied
to her face. She's like, Okay, why what happened to
all these these extra urns or whatever. He gonna say,
oh I found some ashes. She like stopped lying to me.

Speaker 2 (40:07):
He just like, I'm telling you that girl. I I
one time punched him, like like either punched my brother.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
Yeah, like shot up learned to me.

Speaker 2 (40:18):
You know, I didn't now when I say that. Like
there were moments where Adam Lazar he did a damn
good job with this. There were points like some I
think somebody yawned. Was it the old man that he
went to see that? She went to see that her
dad caught the mom with and he yawned and lazarre.

(40:40):
And I was like, oh you do, Like you could
see the progression in the the of Adam's narrating essays
books and there was something else that he did. And
I was just like I could just feel it, you know,
in this book this. You know, granted he's read them all,
but I just to see him at vance in his narration,

(41:02):
I was just like, oh it just it brought it
to life.

Speaker 1 (41:05):
He's an excellent narrator.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
And I except he reads slow.

Speaker 1 (41:09):
He reads, so I was gonna say he reads, he
reads like this, and he makes sure he gives all
the accents.

Speaker 2 (41:20):
The southern and it still sounds normal.

Speaker 1 (41:29):
We love you, Adam, Yes, we love you, but you
know also, I do have one more small complaint, and
it is not Adam's fault. He is very good. But
the producer or whoever decided we needed one more narrator,
just one. I've been very spoiled with more than one narrator,
and I feel like we needed a woman because we

(41:51):
had Naveya's point of view and Jealousy's point of view.
We needed a woman to break this up a little
bit because he, honestly, Adam sounded kind of similar sometimes,
so especially if you.

Speaker 2 (42:07):
Say that, you're right, because I think this might be
the only story where there were a woman's point of view,
two women. Well, Razor Blade tears, he had the wife,
but she didn't have that such of a yeah her
her in the book. Yeah, yeah, this would have been
a good.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
One, but we had whole pel view changes, and we
needed a woman to speak for Jealousy and Neveda. That
would have helped a ton, That would help a ton.

Speaker 2 (42:38):
Yeah, you're right, yeah, because he would slip into flashbacks
and sometimes you weren't you. I mean, it wasn't like
we knew it. Sometimes it would just kind of slip
back into it because I can't. Yeah, I wish i'd
brought my book so I could have because I took
some notes, but I forgot it. But yeah, I agree

(43:00):
with that.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
I do.

Speaker 2 (43:01):
I think a woman would have brought brought this story
even more to like, yeah, I think.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
So I needed that so bad. But I thought about
that about I don't know sixty or seventy percent, and
I'm like, man, he's starting to sound real similar, even
though you know, I could tell when he tries to
soften his voice a little bit, but that accent sounds
the same on everybody.

Speaker 2 (43:30):
You know. Yeah, you're right.

Speaker 3 (43:32):
Yeah, so.

Speaker 2 (43:34):
You're right, you are so right. And you know, like
I was thinking, well, the character names, I'm not sure
about Nevea. I needed probably to look up Nevea the origin,
but like Roman.

Speaker 1 (43:50):
It's Heaven spelt backwards.

Speaker 2 (43:52):
Okay, Okay, That's what I thought about, was like, is
there something else to it? And then you know with Roman,
because you know, he the Roman Empire, all that Dante
Dante's Inferno, and I was like this, you know, but
I know, did you listen to that interview that I.

Speaker 1 (44:11):
Told you no get a chance.

Speaker 2 (44:13):
Yeah, he's he's a es say. It's a big reader himself,
and he loves Shakespeare, which he quoted a lot, which
I loved with Khalil Uh his his uh wing man,
who would quote little Shakespeare things. But I love how

(44:33):
he threw this in here, especially as black men, because
so many times they want to say our black men
don't read and to read historical and Shakespeare and you know,
so those are some things that I really enjoyed about
his writing and how he mixes that in.

Speaker 1 (44:56):
Yeah, he had to give it to the college boy,
of course, yeah, because the others, like he was even
saying like, oh, should I even have given him that
that quote?

Speaker 3 (45:05):
I don't know, right, yeah, yeah, he was like that
might have been a little too much, and I don't know, yes,
But when he turned.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
I know, I wrote these notes down, so I know.
When they marketed this book, they tried to say this
was kind of like The Godfather meets Blah blah blah.
But the more when I was listening to this story,
because he threw in the wire a lot. I don't
know if you watched The Wire before I finally watched
The Wire. My girlfriend and I finally we binged it together,

(45:43):
well not together but you know, we kind of watched
it in the same timeframe and the Wire he mentioned
like Omar and Stringer Bell, and there's some other little
plot lines that are very similar to The Wire, like
the dirty maid there, the businessmen. But you know that

(46:03):
grittiness of the Godfather. But I feel like they probably
said the Godfather versus the Wire because it's probably going
to cross over a lot better to a certain audience
versus the Wire. But it also gave me and I
don't know if you got this vibe at the end

(46:27):
training Day, did you watch Training Washing It? This is
the scene when they are meeting up at the last
moment where Terrance and Torrent and they all and all
of torrent men, Terrence, Torrent and tank It and Tranquil's men.

(46:55):
They turned on Torrent, remember when they're gonna shoot Roman
and he he turns on him and they say, do
you think this is how it's gonna go down? And
all I could think of is he was like, you
don't I treated you like this? And all I could
think of was training Day with Zell Washington. I'm the police,

(47:16):
you know, And he said, I think, y'all are I
made you? I don't know I was like, oh my god,
this is so training Day. I should have I should
have pulled up the scene and did the whole line.
But you know that little scene where Denzel Washington is
in the projects basically and he is about to get

(47:37):
He's trying to go get that money and everybody turned
their back on him like nope, yeah, we don't know.

Speaker 1 (47:43):
Who are you. That is exactly what happened. That whole
team said deuces because he looked so yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
I'm like, what did I do for you? Oh? He
got me set for my dece I got her, she
got a four year ride. How about you? I got
a four to oh one case set up.

Speaker 1 (48:02):
I was like, he said, I or some of my
mom the other person like, oh, I was able to
get in on that deal with the bigger guy. I said, like,
we don't have to take your crumbs.

Speaker 2 (48:12):
No, I got seventy eight thousand dollars in my account. Yeah,
but yeah, I was like, yeah, I was like, he
gave me training day vibes, the wire vibes and you know,
the guyfather. But yeah, but I was like, oh my god,
this it really And I think to the other thing

(48:35):
that I really enjoy is because so many times we
read white male and female crime thriller authors, and sometimes
some of their plots and storylines we don't relate to,
you know. And with with Essay, there's always going to

(48:57):
be something that we can relate to as black women
or as black people.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
You know.

Speaker 2 (49:04):
And you know, and when you hear that, you just
smile because you're like, yep, I show that, yep. So yeah,
it just made you just feel really good. So but yeah,
I was like, oh King, oh, Ain't got nothing on me.

Speaker 1 (49:21):
Yeah. Yeah, that was kind of that moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
so irate. He was not believe it, man.

Speaker 2 (49:32):
Yeah, And I was like, they are they gonna do this? Yep.

Speaker 1 (49:37):
Roman was ready for that. He was ready and he
just knew and like I think he was hoping the
cop wouldn't turn on him, that Chauncey wouldn't turn on him,
but he was ready if he did.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
H Yeah. But yeah, but you knew he was. The
guys were going to turn on him. Like you said,
after you gave him that one quote that he said,
I'm not sure if I should have gave the one
guy the quote clue Yeah that He's like, yeah, a
good leader won't push you down he'll lead you to
the top, but he won't you know, he'll lead you
to the top of the mountain, but won't push you

(50:07):
over or over the class tough.

Speaker 1 (50:10):
He's not going to leave you in the muck.

Speaker 2 (50:12):
Basically, Yeah, he's making him think. Yeah, he's like, hey,
tying to say.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
Yeah, like, are you being treated okay by this guy?
I think about it. He's like, I mean it's all
over for everybody.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
You like it dirt, but you want to come over
on this side of the darkness, right, He's like, right,
I'm sharing the wealth. Yeah, I mean he that guy
that he was talking to, he broke his finger because
he spilled a drenkh No.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
I think he laughed or something. Oh no, that was
the other kid that they he stabbed that kid because
he and that was one of their gripes. They said,
how you gonna kill somebody for laughing? And yeah, he
did break his that other guy's finger or something. He
did something crazy because you drink, yes, yeah, but the

(51:03):
little boy lassy yeah, oh yeah, yeah, the little boy laughed.
He was like sixteen or something. He was like, yeah, yeah,
like kill a child just because he laughed. Get the
fuck out of here, man, that's how he he ruled.

Speaker 2 (51:20):
He ruled by fear. Yeah, so nobody. Yeah, but I
mean when you rule like you don't have nobody, you're
not gonna have anybody loved. You're gonna be constantly recruiting
new you See.

Speaker 1 (51:29):
The thing is this ruling with fear only gets you
so far. You need loyalty. You need loyalty that is given,
not demanded through fear, because that all it takes is
a little bit to turn them. Because Roman didn't have
to work that hard no to turn them.

Speaker 2 (51:46):
No, No, all he had to do was just show
them basically, like.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
Look, look at the other side of the fence. Isn't
it green or over here? Yes?

Speaker 2 (51:56):
It is like money in your pocket or do you
like your finger? It's broke, I know. I mean it
got to the point of like desperation. It was like
I can't and I think and I cannot remember. The
guy's now he's like, you can't live like this, We can't.
I can't live like this.

Speaker 1 (52:12):
Yeah, so which is true, you can't. They can't. They
just want to live their lives. They don't want to
be running that stuff all the forever, doing that crazy stuff.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
Yeah, you know that's a short like you said, you
know that life. If you live that life, your lifespan
is very short. And then just to see that kid
who was only fifteen or six I mean he was
what sixteen? He was sixteen because Roman mentioned he was
the same age Roman was when his mother died. Yep,
And this kid will never Your lifespan is short.

Speaker 1 (52:42):
So I guess Roman will draw a line somewhere. He
has a line in the sand.

Speaker 2 (52:48):
I guess, Well, yeah, I wonder if that's going to
be a part. I don't know because I don't know,
because because that says not notorious for second part books.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
No, And I'm okay with leaving it where it is, honestly,
although I do feel really bad for like and that's
an awful name to name your child, jealousy, but that
is a really bad situation. Now she might be pregnant
and she like this dude you got with a gangster girl.

(53:23):
But she believed him lies, she did she like lied
to me, I guess, And you know that is also
very strange. At the end. I gotta I gotta be honest.
That is not probably the kind of it is not
not probably, No, probably is by it. That's not the
kind of relationship I could deal with. So the out
in the street boyfriend girlfriend. What they said in private,
he's mama and he's the bad bad boy or whatever.

(53:47):
Oh yeah, I'm like, oh hell no, don't be calling
me mama that I'm sick. I'm sick. I'm not doing that.
He couldn't even find of the night quote unquote to
do that ship right. She was like, what what do
you want?

Speaker 2 (54:04):
Hey, but she wanted that. She the one that started
and she you know what I mean, she.

Speaker 1 (54:09):
Bit him and she was just like, yeah, but now
she on another level doing some other stuff because we
know what he likes. He liked to be beat up on.

Speaker 2 (54:19):
Basically, yeah, I mean she had the belt. She was like,
oh you like this, Okay, I'm good.

Speaker 1 (54:31):
I'm not doing that to nobody.

Speaker 2 (54:33):
I cannot the polar woman of the night that he pays.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
She like, I don't know what you want me to do. Yeah,
She's like, I don't understand. You want me you get
to it, and he like, here's somebody get out. Thank you?

Speaker 3 (54:49):
Right.

Speaker 2 (54:51):
He was like, she's too young. She don't know what
to do with this belt.

Speaker 1 (54:55):
I mean, I'm old and I know what to do
with it. And I still don't want to do it. No,
thank you.

Speaker 2 (55:00):
Yeah, that's not yeah, that's not my lane. Get missed whatever.
Her name was, Delta, Delphi, Delphi whatever. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
I mean he's so obsessed with he got to the
point where he couldn't even like go to an important
meeting without getting his back and chewed up. I don't know.
It's like, I got an important meeting, Let me stop
buying my domination.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
Can you imagine what his back looked like. I think
he said his back head, you know, just before he
got yeah, before he got to his see his dad,
his back was probably welted. Yeah, it's toe up, but
you know that's that redemption that he was trying to
redeem itself.

Speaker 1 (55:39):
So yeah, hmmm jealousy. Do we need a safe wor
he spit that safe for it out so fast? He's like,
this is so exciting. That's the word.

Speaker 2 (55:51):
What was it? Flame? Flag? Flame?

Speaker 1 (55:53):
Flame?

Speaker 2 (55:54):
Flame? It was flame because King of ashes, yep, I remember,
because I remember I had to go back and I
was like, oh, okay, I get it.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
You so excited. Well, I guess it worked out for them,
except for now she got a liar. She dealing with
this straight up liar, which she would. That was her
line in the sand. Remember, she was like, don't even
call me. But then when he showed up because his
brother died, she took him right back.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
I said, oh god, yeah, and then she goes to
him talking about I can't find my brothers.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
Have you seen him? Woman? She knew. She knew when
she went to the back and she saw all those
people in that gang with their back to her talking
and he's the ringleader. She knew in that moment. She knew,
and she like, mother, Yeah, she.

Speaker 2 (56:41):
Eighteen years, eighteen years, she's stuck with that. Even if
she don't marry him. She stuck, oh yeah, eighteen years
with him.

Speaker 1 (56:49):
Yeah, Oh my god. Now one girl. I did feel
bad for a little bit, but I was more frustrated
with her than anything was. Gosh. I'm like, now, you,
miss thing, are the biggest dribleaged like you are a
dumb one. I don't care how privileged you are. You
just saw your boyfriend get put into a oven alive.

(57:12):
You witnessed that and you almost got killed there. Yeah,
but they saved you and said you need to run.
You need to run, girl, run and don't come back,
and don't come back, and she like, I missed my mom.
I miss I'm like, you was a dumb one. You
are not gonna live out the day. You will not
see this evening.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
No, all we need to do is just call the police.

Speaker 1 (57:37):
I was like, like, you are so stupid.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
Drugs. This is what drugs do to you kids.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
I mean, honestly, I thought that she was going to
be killed in the hotel. When she was in the
hotel on the outskirts of the city and Dante was
coming to see her. I thought for sure someone would
see that crazy looking car with the spoil back and
kill her in the hotel. But yeah, she was so
far out, but she riding through the city with that

(58:04):
crazy like clown car. You know that car is a
red flag? Like why didn't you at least go rent
a car? Like why are you driving that crazy shit around?
Like you're you got a flat you gotta sign on
your back here I am kill me.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
I'm right here, I'm driving old drug dealers.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
Girl. What an idiot. I'm like, this is the dumbest
thing I ever heard. I don't she had no sense
of self preservation at all, No, not that or thinking
of anybody else, and Honestally, all she had to do
was wait until Roman said it's all good, because guess what,
he killed everybody. He killed the head, he killed Salazar

(58:45):
to their gang, that other gang. He took out Salazar,
who was yeah, or Carlos or whatever. He took out
all of them. He replaced the all those people with himself.
Basically at that point, he could have said, sure, Cassidy,
come back, it's safe now.

Speaker 2 (59:04):
Yeah, and that's what you're saying. He told her maybe.

Speaker 1 (59:07):
Maybe, but she couldn't wait it out. She's so stupid
out and then and then Dante couldn't even convince her,
like you in this you see what these people are doing.
You lost a finger? How much that sounds stupid? And
you couldn't convince her to stay away?

Speaker 2 (59:26):
What kind of what kind of maths? Crack heads?

Speaker 1 (59:33):
Like?

Speaker 2 (59:33):
You want bring heads?

Speaker 1 (59:35):
Get your ass out of towel?

Speaker 2 (59:37):
What are you bring you some gooddies? I'd be up there,
I'll bring you some giddies.

Speaker 1 (59:42):
Get out, just like, oh my god, Like what is
wrong with these people?

Speaker 2 (59:50):
And I'm surprised she wasn't killed at her mama house
like them people, well, they you know what, they thought
she was dead. So he did. Yeah, so that's probably
why nobody even kimped out at her mother's house. Yeah,
I forgot about that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:02):
They thought they did think she was dead. But all
it takes is one person to see that damn car. Yeah,
which they were. The author was clear to let us know.
That car was like it stood out. It was very
blatant and.

Speaker 2 (01:00:16):
A nice little spoiler kid on it, lady.

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
It's not like he's got vehicle. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
He really was loud as hell. Mmmmmm.

Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
It's one of those cars where you see that car,
you know who's there.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
When you said that, I already have seen some I
know some around you know you just like I mean,
because they do it for attention. They do certain things
to the car that probably got rims. Spoiler. Oh I
had an underbody, the blue underneath.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
Yeah, oh look at me I got I'm in a
flashing clown.

Speaker 2 (01:00:54):
Car right now, come and get me.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
Make it all the noise.

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
Yeah, they probably saved her. It had tinted windows, but
I'm assuming. But still the man is missing. Who's driving
his car?

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
Yeah? And the gang, you know, they were looking for him.
Torran was like, where is that effort? Where'd he go?

Speaker 2 (01:01:24):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:01:25):
I don't know but these characters were all really interesting bad.

Speaker 2 (01:01:29):
Yeah. Yeah, I didn't root for anybody, but that didn't
stop me from not liking this store.

Speaker 1 (01:01:34):
Nobody was likable, you know, and I yeah, but I
still enjoyed it anyway.

Speaker 2 (01:01:40):
Oh yeah, definitely. I'm not one of those people that
if I didn't like the character, but I was like,
none of y'all was likable. I tried to like, yeah,
or relatable. But Nevella, I felt bad for her likable.

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
No, she wasn't very likable, not really.

Speaker 2 (01:01:59):
No, but it was a damn good story.

Speaker 1 (01:02:01):
Yeah, I was.

Speaker 2 (01:02:02):
It really was.

Speaker 1 (01:02:04):
All right, shall we rate it?

Speaker 2 (01:02:06):
Yes, ma'am?

Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
Okay, how about you go first?

Speaker 2 (01:02:09):
I gave it a four.

Speaker 1 (01:02:11):
Same I gave it a four as well. Yes, it
was very good. Just a couple of things, but it was.
It was really good. It was worth to read, one
hundred percent. I'm glad we did it. It broke up
the monotony of the things we were reading before. Yeah,
like Night Day, this book was different.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
God, I mean the pace was just like it was
to the point camera where I could have finished this
book so fast, but I didn't want to, you know, Like,
he's that kind of writer for me. That I know
once I start, I will devour it so quick. But
I know once I'm done with him, I usually get

(01:02:56):
book hangover cause it's like, so what do I read next?
Because like, after you read that, it's like what's going
to live up?

Speaker 1 (01:03:03):
It's almost like everything else is so mundane compared to that.

Speaker 2 (01:03:08):
It's like.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
Like our last book, The Ghost Writer. I mean it
was good, but like it was so weak compared to
this man.

Speaker 2 (01:03:20):
This was like action for every I could. I didn't
want to put it down, so I was like, slow down, classic,
you got time, you know, you can finish it by Tuesday.
And then when I got to you know, because I
finished it today, but I knew I had plent I
knew I was going to finish it in time. I
finished it early, but it was just like, so now

(01:03:40):
what I'm gonna do?

Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
Look, I have the perfect analogy, So I feel like,
you know, Essay Cosby's writing is like a good old
fashion It's strong, it's you know, you sip on it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 1 (01:03:57):
It feels expecsively on a nice cube of yes, like.

Speaker 2 (01:04:02):
That one he mentioned that twenty five one hundred dollars bourbon.
H yeah, because he's a bourbon drinker exactly. That says
a big bourbon drinker.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
See, and we can tell that.

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
And like he throughout Elijah Craig, he threw out a
couple of yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:04:17):
Yeah, and some of the other thrillers we've been reading.
It's like, you know, we might have a martini here, uh,
you know, an espresso martini there. It's not the same,
you know, it's all of those drinks that everybody is drinking,
you know what I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:04:33):
Saying, Strawberry dakerya margarita.

Speaker 1 (01:04:37):
Like the go to drinks that everyone is drinking. It's
all the same variation of the same kind of cocktail.
Nothing unique about Nope.

Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
Nope, this one is straight, no chaser.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
Yes, hmm okay mmmm mmmm that's right.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
Yeah. And he his books are one of those books
too that I can go back and read, so yeah,
because you know, there's always gonna be something else I'm
gonna pick up. But yeah, yeah, such a good book.

Speaker 1 (01:05:10):
Yeah, definitely.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
Like I said, it's not my favorite. But the thing
is is, like I don't know if I've given any
of his Book of Five maybe all Centers Bleed, maybe
all Centers Bleed, I can't remember. But even though here's
the other thing about Essay. He right, all of his
books are all different, you know what I mean. He

(01:05:32):
still has that Southern noir, but they're all really different.
Like Blacktop Wasteland, it was a getaway driver, you know
what was the next one? Was it? Razorblad Tears was
after that, after black Top Wasteland. Yeah, and then that
was the Revenge of two fathers who were revenging the
death of their their son. And then All Sinners Bleed.

(01:05:55):
You had the sheriff with the the serial killer. Yeah,
and then this one, you know, is the gangs and
the violence and how this family gets involved. Darkest Prayer
was like way before that, and that was kind of
a small town something. But you know what I mean,
like all his stories are different.

Speaker 1 (01:06:12):
That's the only one I've never read by him.

Speaker 2 (01:06:15):
Which one my Dark Prayer that was. Yeah, that's one
of his first books. And he doesn't disappoint there either.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
Hmm. Okay, I might have to check it out because
that one does not have a lot of reviews because
that was obviously he hit the jackpot with I think
his note. He started to be well more known with
Black Top Wastlam. That was where it started.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Yeah, but My Darkest Prayer is a good one too.
I enjoy it. I think, yeah, I think, Like I said,
maybe all Sinners Bleed. I may have given a five,
but I know he's gotten at least a four, nothing
below a four. But all of them are different. Yeah,
like you know, like how you know, like wait right, well,

(01:06:57):
I'll just use Riley Savier for you know, you know
what you're getting, and I know we're going to get
GrITT in Southern noir. But all of the stories are
just totally different. And it's like, you're a good writer
when you could do something totally different in the subject matter. Yeah,

(01:07:20):
that's it. That subject matter is different. You still have
that the Virginia Southern noir, but your subject matter is
totally different.

Speaker 1 (01:07:28):
Yeah. So I agree. And actually I just went back
and took a quick peek at all the ratings I
read it. So this is the fourth book by him
I've read, and all of them are fours across the
board to fourth book.

Speaker 2 (01:07:41):
So you read Blacktop, Wasteland, what's the other the Center's
Bleed and Okay, so yeah, all are fours. Yeah, yeah,
and he's doing better with his female characters.

Speaker 1 (01:07:55):
He is, he is doing better, and he.

Speaker 2 (01:07:59):
Does mention that in that interview.

Speaker 1 (01:08:01):
I think I feel that's to our credit. I feel
like we helped him with that because that was.

Speaker 2 (01:08:11):
That was Yes, that was our biggest complaint. Yes, and
he did it with the second book that in his
Gay Care like he was really like kind of homophobic,
it felt like with one of his comments or something.

Speaker 1 (01:08:28):
But yeah, he came on Twitter and said, oh thanks
for that U.

Speaker 2 (01:08:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
Yeah, so he listened to that whole.

Speaker 2 (01:08:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:08:41):
We don't hold back over here our self edition. No,
we do not, but we try to just we don't
hold that yeah yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (01:08:51):
Mean we paid the money to get to read the book. Yeah,
that's you know, I'll never forget.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
J R.

Speaker 2 (01:08:57):
Award mentioned that at a polyN and she's like, if
you get a bad review, so be it. The readers
pay to read the book. If that's how they feel,
that's how they feel. But don't let that discourage you
as a writer. I keep on writing.

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
I think, you know, I stand firm on this. I
think unless you have fixed skin, authors should not be
reading reviews anyway. They're not doing them. If you wantn't
going to catch you on the back. That's what your
publicist is for. That's what your manager is for. And
you're fan marketing teams, and your marketing team they hike
you don't expect you know, readers, you know fan base,

(01:09:39):
not how they were. Oh but you know, if you
got the thick skin, listen if you dare, read if
you dare, but otherwise don't look at it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:49):
No, and you're going to run across somebody that's not
your reader. You know, that's not the one who's going
to You're not going to auto They're not going to
auto by your stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:10:00):
So it's true. And no matter how hard you try,
and us as just humans in general, we have to
know we're not for everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:10:07):
Period, exactly exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:10:11):
Otherwise we'd all have a million friends and we'd all
like each other. We're not for everyone.

Speaker 2 (01:10:16):
Nope, not at all.

Speaker 1 (01:10:17):
That's the lesson to be taken from that. Okay, So
up next, we're gonna read Listen for the Lie by
Amy Tantera. We have not read her before.

Speaker 2 (01:10:28):
I haven't either, so.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
We're gonna see what that's about. I think the ratings
are still that's been recommended a lot of times. To me.
I've seen that a lot of times over and over again,
people keep saying how good that is. The average rating
as of today is four point zero eight out of
five with over four hundred thousand ratings. Wow. Yeah, that's

(01:10:55):
a lot. That is a lot. They've won the Good
a Choice Award for but oh wait, they were a
nominee for Favorite Mystery Thriller of twenty four and Favorite
Audio Book of twenty four.

Speaker 2 (01:11:11):
Ooh, that's good to know.

Speaker 1 (01:11:13):
Yeah, so I'm very excited for that one. I know
it's gonna be way different than what we just finished,
but I'm okay with it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
Yeah, just shake it off a little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Yeah. I almost feel like this is a good palate cleanser,
Like he's a palate cleanser because he's so different from
the other stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
Yeah yeah, okay, Okay, if you have Kindo unlimited, it
uh it's free, so oh nice. If you should tell
your tell our book club people if they have Kindo unlimited.
But you know, we do audio, but but I do
have kndon limited in case I want to uh read

(01:11:51):
and listen. Yeah take notes.

Speaker 1 (01:11:53):
So yeah, awesome. Okay, so I guess we are done
for today. That was really fun. I'm so glad we
did that one.

Speaker 2 (01:12:01):
Yes, yeah, somebody nominated this one, right, who did? Someone
in our group nominated this.

Speaker 1 (01:12:10):
From Club Slash. She's a Patreon member, longtime supporter of
the podcast. We love her. She's great. She recommended this
and we took her up on it. Nay, thanks, yes,
thank you, Trinette. Good suggestion. I love that. Another reason
why you should join on Patreon or join us in
their book club's group, because you know, we might take

(01:12:33):
suggestions from you guys. So yeah, all right, So that's
it for today. Thanks for listening to this entire episode.
We appreciate you for doing that. It will catch you
in the next one. Take care of yourselves.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
Bye, guys.

Speaker 1 (01:12:55):
Did you enjoy today's episode? If so, please head over
to Apple podcast or Spotify and leave a positive five
star review. It's a simple action that makes a big difference.
You can also like this episode on your favorite podcast
player or share it with your fellow bookworm friends on
social media. Joining the shelf Aediction Patreon family is another

(01:13:16):
way to support us, where as little as two dollars
a month you can help our team create even more
amazing bookish content. If Patreon isn't your thing, consider becoming
a supporter on the Breaker app for just five dollars
a month and gain access to exclusive audio only content.
You can find me everywhere, including Instagram, x and TikTok

(01:13:37):
under the handle shelf Addiction. Join our book club of
the same name on the book club's website and app,
where we discuss all things bookish and more in a
safe space. The shelf Addiction podcast is a part of
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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Unraveling 'King of Ashes' | Book Chat #BuddyRead