Aug. 12/25 - Studying Paranormal Researchers with Dr. Urszula Wolski - Spaced Out Radio

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello and welcome to the radio and podcast side of
spaced Out Radio. Tonight. My name is Dave Scott. We're
gonna be talking to doctor Ursula Wolski about researching researchers
who researched the pair of normal. Say that three times fast.
That's what we're gonna do today. It's gonna be a
lot of fun. We're gonna bring it on momentarily. We
are in roll call on our YouTube side Warden Dragon,

(00:22):
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and Neighborly Kimberly Burgess. How are you my friend? Big
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(00:43):
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Speaker 2 (00:54):
Are you ready to hear your mystic voice of the Knights?
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(01:26):
Radio with.

Speaker 1 (01:28):
Dave Scott from the mountains of Central British Columbia. To
you listening around the world. This, my friends, is spaced
Out Radio. I'm your host, Dave Scott, sitting in the
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(01:49):
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We have a fantastic show coming at you tonight. We

(02:33):
are literally going to get into someone who researchers, researches,
researchers who are researching the paranormal. Momentarily, doctor Ursula Wolski
will join us. Then in our number three swamp dweller
will join us for another spooky story. We're gonna follow
that up with Robin Haynes coming in for the UFO

(02:55):
or make that the cryptid Q and A Oh, I
am actually quite cited about this show tonight. Why well,
it's just going to be absolutely amazing, you know, because
we get to actually talk about someone who is studying
researchers who research the subjects we love. Doctor Ursula Wolski
is an independent researcher, associate lecturer at Buckinghamshire New University

(03:19):
and a consultant and trainer in research methods. Her research
interests are in new technologies for social research, quantitative research
methods and software, the sociology of sport, the sociology of religion,
and positive psychology. Current research projects include gendering inequalities within
sports coaching roles and in exploration into the experiences and

(03:42):
beliefs of investigators of para normal phenomena. And that's where
we get into this tonight. We're going to have a
lot of fun. So get your knowledge caps on because
doctor Ursula Warski is here. Thank you so much for
coming on spaced Out Radio for the first time. How
are you.

Speaker 3 (04:00):
I'm good, Thank you so yeah. Good evening to you
all and wherever you're in the world. I guess it's
a good morning as it is here, and a good afternoon,
So whatever time of the day it is, thank you
for having me on the show.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
You love to research your biography says that, how come
what fascinates you about digging into researching topics.

Speaker 3 (04:22):
Just like hearing about what people have got to say
on the topic. Usually I'm focusing on experiences. So the
best way to do that is to talk to people
to find things out.

Speaker 1 (04:37):
How long ago did you decide this is what you
wanted to do?

Speaker 3 (04:41):
Oh? Wow, gosh, over twenty years ago when I first start, well,
when I first did my degree and then went on
to do a master's and a PhD, so I kind
of knew that that's where I was heading. Where I
wanted to go. What I wanted to do.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
It about people and their patterns. It just makes humans
so fascinating.

Speaker 3 (05:08):
Because sometimes they're quite predictable, but also very unpredictable as well.
And like I said, the only way to find that
out is talk to people, a bit like what you
do on the show.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
True. True, except you have a doctorate behind you. I don't.
I just have my journalism degree. That's it, that's it.

Speaker 4 (05:34):
But either way, that's not just is it?

Speaker 1 (05:38):
Talking about people and learning about people is such a
fascinating subject to be like, I've been in conversations and
I've been invited to conferences and talk to people about
these subjects and many other subjects for well the better
part of my life. You know. I graduated college in
two thousand or part of me nineteen ninety eight, and

(05:59):
I've been pretty much interviewing people ever since. And I
think it's interesting to watch how people react, how they
talk to you with, you know, from without a microphone
to compared to when a microphone is in their face.
It is always very interesting to watch how the psychology
works behind that. People are fascinating though, and everybody is different.

(06:22):
But you know, how did you go about choosing your
topics that really intrigued you to study?

Speaker 3 (06:31):
So the paranormal investigator is one I went to a
conference about two thousand and eight, now, I think it was.
I can't remember how I found out about it. Was
it word of mouth or someone told me about it?
And it's called Exploring the Extraordinary. And that's where I
first learned the academics are researching the paranormal. I didn't

(06:56):
know that, and then I thought, well, okay, and then
that's when I discovered groups people go out and do investigations.
You know, it's not just confined to a lab, it's
not just confined to academia. And I'm like, okay, so
what are their experiences? Why do they do this? You

(07:17):
know a lot of groups go out almost every week
or you know, or once a month, spend most of
the time it's overnight because that's when there's less noise
from the environment, less people around, depending on where they are. Yeah,
what makes people do that? And why? And what do
they experience and what do they make of those experiences?

(07:39):
So I was just interested to find out. And I
found out that there hadn't been much research done in
that area, and I thought, brilliant, Why don't I do it?

Speaker 1 (07:49):
I love it? Now? Have you ever believed in the paranormal?
Had you had an experience that maybe intrigued you about
this topic or was it just off the cuff.

Speaker 3 (08:01):
I've always had an interest. So, whether it's from you know,
good old Ghostbusters.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
Films that, oh, you froze up on us, you froze
up on us. Hopefully we can get you back here. Momentarily,
We're going to get her to answer that question. Doctor
Ursula Wolski over in the United Kingdom where it is
mourning for her. So we're hoping that we'll be able

(08:27):
to get her back here momentarily as she You know,
sometimes technology doesn't want to work. There is a big
ocean in there. See in my conspiracy theory about her
just having this happen and freezing up on us, there's
only one solution to this, Megalodon. Megalodon obviously bit the

(08:55):
jumper cables that run in between North America and Europe
for communicy, and we are now screwed for it. We
are now screwed for it. So thank you Megaladon for
taking a chomp out of the wiring, going across the
ocean and ruining everything that we're doing. People are amazing,

(09:23):
aren't we. We are amazing. Different cultures, different backgrounds, different
belief systems, absolutely everything, absolutely everything that we adore. Have
you ever just sat back and watched people. One of
the reasons why I love going to Las Vegas is

(09:46):
just so I can watch people. You know, you watch
couples walking around, You watch friends, you know, getting absolutely
small liquored up. You watch people getting dressed up to
go to all these dance clubs and nightclubs. You watch

(10:07):
the guy or the woman who has absolutely lost everything
on the night, their entire budget. Oh, it is so
fascinating to watch, so fascinating to watch. And we're just
waiting for Doctor Ursula to rejoin us here. But I
love watching people. I do. I love watching people and

(10:33):
just relaxing and having a good time. And I think
it's fascinating when you go to a place like Vegas
or Paris, or London or Vancouver or New York or
wherever it may be, and you just you could tell
the tourists from the locals. Even in my little town,

(10:58):
you can tell the tourist from the locals. There's always
a little bit of a different aura with them. The
people who come visit, isn't there. You know, they're not
as friendly, they're quiet. They bring their big city ego
to the small town of redneck hicks. They don't wear camouflage,

(11:24):
and when they do wear camouflage, they have an overabundance
of it on, you know, like around here, camouflage is
an actual fashion statement, it really is. So it's funny
when you get the tourists coming around, especially during hunting

(11:45):
and fishing season, when literally you can tell them apart
because they're decked head to toe. Like around here, people
will wear their you know, they'll wear their camouflage jackets,
their camouflage hoodies, camouflage ball cap or tuk beanie, whatever
you want to call it. But usually it's blue jeans,

(12:07):
sweatpants that follow on, you know, not like army pants.
When the tourists COVID, oh, they are decked head to toe.
You know, you could tell that they're four hundred dollars
hiking boots, have never seen dirt before. You know, they

(12:27):
got the wooly socks on, which I don't know, it's
not even that cold up here, but it is what
it is. We are waiting for our guests to return.
Doctor Ursula Wolfskin. She's just having some computer troubles at
this time, and we are hoping that you know, probably
what happened, because I don't believe this time it was Aliens.

(12:52):
I really don't believe this time it was Aliens. Probably
what happened is she might have got caught up in
one of those Microsoft updates, you know, when you're busy
doing your thing and then all of a sudden Microsoft
kicks in and it's like you need to update now,
or we're going to ruin your day. I bet you

(13:13):
that's what happened. Like one of those uncontrolled update that happens. Yeah,
one of those uncontrollable updates that happens that you have
zero choice on. I'm very interested in getting to to

(13:33):
learn about this topic. I want to know about her study.
I do. I totally want to know. I was absolutely
pumped up for this show. I apologize that the technical
issues happen here, but you know what, the show must
go on. It must. So she has been interviewing a

(13:54):
number of different scientists because, like she said, there momentarily
moments ago, she had no idea that there were this
many scientists who were actually studying these fields. So I
popped a couple of names her way, of course, Science Bob,
who will be on the show tomorrow night. And doctor

(14:15):
Paul Kingsbury from Simon Fraser University at Vancouver, who's a
good friend of mine, and she's coming back on here
one second. Who's a good friend of mine, doctor Paul Kingsbury.
And we're able to we're able to get him hopefully
connected with her because he actually did a study similar

(14:37):
to hers a few years ago. Let's see if we
got her are you there, doctor Ursula?

Speaker 3 (14:45):
Hello, Hi, can you hear me?

Speaker 1 (14:47):
We can hear you.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Oh brilliant, Yeah, sorry that it's just everything crushed.

Speaker 1 (14:52):
Well, we're wondering if it was one of two things.
Number one. Number one, maybe it was Megala down that
was swimming through the ocean that took a bite out
of the cables that connect North America and Europe. Or
number two, in typical Microsoft fashion, it did an update

(15:13):
that you had no choice.

Speaker 3 (15:14):
On yep, yep, or yeah, some other kind of unexplained
phenomena only the IT world knows.

Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yes, normally around here we call that aliens. But we're
not going to call it aliens. No, not this time.
Doctor Ursula. Wolski is with us, And right before you
cut out, you were talking about, you know how you
kind of became intrigued in this subject and you went
to a conference and you started seeing that there were

(15:44):
other researchers and people of the scientific background looking into
this and it kind of caught you in shock.

Speaker 3 (15:52):
Uh yeah, oh wait, I just realized can you see
can you see me?

Speaker 1 (15:56):
No, We're fine for right now, Okay.

Speaker 3 (16:00):
Alright, I'll carry on. Yeah. Yeah, So I was intrigued
that it just didn't realize that this was something that
people actually researched on at a quite you know, a
serious level. So then I was intrigued to know, what
what do people you know, people go out on investigation,

(16:21):
spend so much time going on investigations, what they actually
why they do it, what they experience, and what they
make of those experiences. So that led me, I find,
you know, didn't find that there was that much research
out there, so I thought, yeah, sure, why don't I
do it? So I have?

Speaker 1 (16:42):
I love it. I love it. And why did it
shock you so much to find other scientists looking into
UFOs or paranormal activity or cryptid research.

Speaker 3 (16:57):
Well A, I just didn't think it was a top
that people would explore, always because of my own interests.
And you mentioned before before I lost connection that I'd
had a few experiences of my own, and everyone knows
someone else who's had some experiences. But yet in some

(17:17):
situation it's still regarded as to be particularly I mean,
it's more acceptable in some societies and some cultures in
some countries, but not every country's will come out and
talk about that in such a way. Sometimes you'll get
that reaction, if you know, depending on who you're talking to.

(17:38):
You might say to them, oh, well, you know, I'm
going on an investigation, and they'll laugh at you. So
if we're talking about you know, this was two thousand
and eight and we're twenty twenty five now. I do
think things have changed since then, and my research has
showed that. But in still some cases people don't say
what they're doing to you know, they keep it to

(18:01):
a small group of people and you know that they
will share these experiences. And I think also significantly it's
people who are experiencing things and don't know who they
can turn to for help because they're worried that they're
going to be ridiculed.

Speaker 1 (18:17):
So you go to this paranormal conference just to check
it out. It was a curiosity that you were going
to this, and you know what, you had no make
er wish. You just wanted to see what it was
all about. What fascinated you by.

Speaker 3 (18:32):
It, the different perspectives. You know, there were a number
of academics there talking about doing research in the area.
I think, you know, one person was talking about psychedelics
and how that can really you know, lead to transformation

(18:55):
in consciousness which can then lead to experiences. Yeah, there's
just a variety, and I'm like, well, why are you
interested in this kind of which is then why I
led me onto you know, researching the researchers of the
paranormal is why do you do it?

Speaker 1 (19:18):
As you started talking to people. We're going to get
more into this in the next half hour. But as
you started talking to people, did you did you look
deep inside yourself to just kind of say, I think
I'm onto something here. I think there's something here that
I need to take a little bit more seriously. How
did you question yourself on it?

Speaker 3 (19:39):
Oh, that's that's an interesting one. I don't think I did.
I think i've and I still remain an open minded skeptic,
So I don't totally disregard phenomena based on what people
have told me, based of what of my own experiences
that I've had in the past and that I've experienced

(19:59):
because I've also gone on paranormal investigations myself, and I've
still remained that. Yeah, you know, that's a bit unusual.
Always try to look to see what could have you know,
what explanation there is that could have made that noise
or that you know, why am I having these feelings
or etc. So, Yeah, I have also become quite part

(20:21):
of the research as well. Yeah, I think so.

Speaker 1 (20:27):
As you went on, as we got about three and
a half minutes before we have to go to break
at the bottom of the hour, Doctor Ursula Wolski is
our guest tonight on Spaced Out Radio. As you started
looking into this subject more and delving into it, were
you surprised at the actual popularity of how many people
are actually doing this?

Speaker 3 (20:49):
Yes, I was absolutely so. When I started my research,
I just didn't and I guess that's what was a
surprise to me was just how big my research project became.
There's still more, lots more people that I could talk to,
There's lots more that I could do. I have to
stop my research at some point, right up my findings,

(21:12):
but then hey, I can do future research.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
When you started looking into this, did you jump right
in and just want to learn, like, had you ever
been on a paranormal investigation prior to that? Had you
ever had a UFO sighting or anything along those lines.

Speaker 3 (21:33):
Nope, none of those. I'd not been on an investigation before.
As I said, I didn't know people did those things.
I was interested in UFOs growing up, but not really
had an experience myself.

Speaker 1 (21:48):
No, So all of a sudden, when you see all
this going on, did you think at first that you
were going to take a pragmatic approach to it, or
did you think that, you know what, I'm just going
to go in open minded and just see what happens.

Speaker 3 (22:04):
The latter absolutely, always open minded.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
Well, when it comes to our topics and science, we
usually are used to the to the first one, you know,
where people always want to come in not believing.

Speaker 3 (22:19):
I guess it depends on the perspective. So you can
have different perspectives. Certainly so I come from an academic
approach on this, So there are different perspectives that.

Speaker 5 (22:28):
You can go in.

Speaker 3 (22:29):
And because I knew I was studying a community or
what I refer to a community of for paranormal investigators,
I knew that I couldn't go with any kind of
hypothesis or questions. It was just that I was going
to study the community to find out what they do,
why they do it, and what they experience. Is what
they experience and what they make of those experiences, And

(22:51):
that's what I started off with. So I'm using an approach, sorry,
I'm going to use a little bit of academic speak here.

Speaker 5 (22:59):
I'm using a.

Speaker 3 (23:00):
Which called grounded theory social world theory, which I gather
the data and then the theory will emerge from that data.
So I don't go with any kind of perspective beforehand.

Speaker 1 (23:12):
How much fun have you had going down this road?

Speaker 3 (23:16):
So much fun. I don't want it to start by
I have to start. I owe it to my participants
to stop at some point and get my research more
out there. I get it written up, but yeah, I
have ideas for a few further research. So you know,
research doesn't stop. You can't get all the answers in
one go, and you don't always get the answers. You
just get more questions more often than not.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
Is that part of the frustration with the paranormal is
that really, I know you were focused more on people,
but that there really are no answers out there to
the phenomena.

Speaker 3 (23:50):
I think that's debatable. Some people will debate that that,
haven't we you know, I call it, you know, the
law of large numbers, in the sense that you might
have so many normalities or repeat experiences. For some people,
this is everyday experience that they get this, so to
them it's normal hold that thought.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
Doctor Ursulawolski is our guest tonight on spaced Out Radio.
When we return, why is she researching researchers who research
the paranormal and what she learned from it? Next on
spaced Out Radio, All right, we are clear.

Speaker 3 (24:47):
Okay, So.

Speaker 1 (24:50):
Do you want to retry restarting your camera? Yeah, okay,
I'm not hooking up.

Speaker 3 (25:00):
I've not had problems before. I've changed computer, so this
is a new one. It should work fine. Camera. Okay,
I've gone into settings.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
So yeah, while you're doing that, I'm just gonna say
hello to there.

Speaker 4 (25:18):
You are, there.

Speaker 1 (25:19):
You are Jeff Steve Garvey is here. He'll hit a
home run for you. Who else has joined us? Lenda,
nice to see you and who else here?

Speaker 3 (25:34):
Let me go. It's going to move as well as.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
I move, So love it. This is a great convo
so far. Yes, Dave did change his microphone cover. I
got a new one. I got a purple one too.
Where I got purple one too. I'll be a rebel

(26:03):
and I'll put the purple one on. Now, let's be
a rebel testing one too. Purple. Oh that looks actually
kind of cool.

Speaker 3 (26:26):
It stands out more on the camera. That's good color.

Speaker 1 (26:30):
Hold on, Oh no, shit, looks pretty good. Mh. Sirens
going off around here.

Speaker 3 (26:45):
We still like we're still live on the podcast.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, we're still live on podcasts and YouTube. Good morning
from the UK Ian mcphaden. How are you, Forest Louis.
Thank you very much, my bud. That's an ambulance sirens

(27:18):
in my area. You pay a little bit more attention
to the sirens at this time of year because we're
in a forest fire area. So we've had a couple
spring up around here in the last few days. Nothing,
nothing to put us in danger. But that actually looks

(27:40):
really good on camera. I like that.

Speaker 3 (27:43):
We've got a bit of a heat wave over in
the UK at the moment, so we've had a few
fires break out as well.

Speaker 1 (27:51):
Yeah, I think the closest one to me is about
thirty five miles away.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
Okay, well that's quite close though.

Speaker 1 (27:58):
So yeah, it's let's see how what the fire is that?
Mm mm where are we here? Let's check the map here?
We got some time? Oh wildfire? Check that map here?

(28:20):
Come on, give us the map. Okay, all right, there
we go. Let's just quickly share this because we have

(28:43):
the opportunity to do that. Let's share a screen. So
there's Vancouver down here. This is my area here. Well,
that's a new one. Where is that one?

Speaker 6 (29:01):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (29:03):
So, oh that one's getting contained. Good, that one's being held.
That was a scary one right here. Then these little
bitty ones here, what's that big one there? Where's that by?

Speaker 3 (29:22):
These common at this time of year? Oh yeah, climate change?

Speaker 1 (29:27):
Yeah no, no, it's not climate change. Well it was
lightning that that caused it. But that's normal for this
time of year. Okay, yeah, because the moisture hits the
mountains and then lifts the clouds up to get over

(29:50):
top of the mountains, and it's where it kind of
causes everything to happen. In my pseudo professional way, give
me two seconds here. Thank you to cat chase your
t bone. B uh, and Louis for the great super chats.
Here we go with the second half hour. Second half

(30:26):
hour of Spaced Out Radio is now underway. My name
is Dave Scott. Thank you very much for tuning us
in where we learn tonight about researchers researching the paranormal.
Our guest doctor Ursula Wolski, will join us here momentarily,
but first we want to say, hey, if you haven't already,
check out our archives. They're always free because I want

(30:49):
them that way. Free is a good word and really
a hard word to find. So you get to download
our shows for free that you miss on any major
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listen to as many as you want, and make sure
you give us a thumbs up. That's all I ask.
Our website, spaced out radio dot com, we have a
plethora of features for you. Rock out to bumblefoot, read

(31:11):
the news wire, check out our swag as well. Follow
us on Exit, spaced Out Radio, Instagram, at spaced Out
Radio Show, and on Patreon. In the Space Travelers Club.
Here is doctor Ursula Wolski. She's joining us in the
early mornings of the United Kingdom to talk about paranormal research.
She's actually in the midst of conducting a study that

(31:35):
her research is into researching people who research the paranormal.
I love saying that. That's why I've said it so much. Tonight,
doctor Ursleth, thank you so much for being here.

Speaker 3 (31:47):
Thank hi, thank you for having me.

Speaker 5 (31:50):
Hi.

Speaker 3 (31:50):
Everyone.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
Okay, talk about your study. How did this even come
into your head that you wanted to learn why people
were researching the unknown.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
I guess it's just the way I do my research.
My research interests are kind of always focused on experiences.
Why people do things that you know that they do
for what purpose? But I think, you know, it's a
subject that's always I've always had an interest in. I've

(32:22):
always been fascinated about reading, watching horror films, reading horror books,
and things like that. Until when I learned that people
actually go out and investigate this stuff, I just wanted
to know more.

Speaker 1 (32:36):
Did you think that people at first were wasting their
time or that there was no point to it so
you wanted to check out the curiosity of it all?

Speaker 3 (32:46):
Not at all. I didn't regard it as a waste
of time. I thought it was absolutely amazing, brilliant that
people are actually going out and doing this stuff to
more often than not, seek out the truth or try
to find the true tried to find evidence. I mean,
there's lots of different reasons why people do what they do,
but those are fundamentally the key ones. Really, they have

(33:09):
a curiosity and interest, They've had their own experiences, and
they want to find answers. Yeah, those kind of things,
so not at all, not a waste of time at all.

Speaker 1 (33:21):
So how do you start a study like this?

Speaker 3 (33:26):
How did I start? I as a result of the conference,
I had got contacts. I got to know people, so
I started with them. I posted a questionnaire out very
early on which I reopened this year because I wanted
to increase responses. And then as a result the questionnaire,
I asked at the end, if people want to talk

(33:47):
to me or we do be interested in taking part
in an interview. I got interviews that way. And I
have to say, because I've done other research the parental community,
they want to talk.

Speaker 1 (34:00):
Oh, we love to talk. We'll talk to anybody who
that is the dress. So, as you're preparing this on
a human level to go for this kind of study,
were you preparing for it to be something along the
lines of, you know, I'll interview a few people and
then go like this, and then it catapulted into something

(34:21):
much larger.

Speaker 3 (34:23):
Absolutely. You know, with a questionnaire, you want to get
as many responses as you can. Really, I think when
I first closed it, I got to about just over
two hundred, and I'm like, one night when the field developed,
when I found out that there's more groups out there,
you know, The number of groups that there are in

(34:44):
the United States and in Canada is amazing. You know,
in the time that I've been doing the research, that's
that that's grown, I would say since the time I've
started my research, and now there are far many more
groups out there doing research. So yeah. Then I started
to interview people and then they made suggestions and it

(35:06):
kind of snowboard and before I knew it, I had
this massive project on my hands.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
What was the goal of this, I think.

Speaker 3 (35:23):
Yeah, to find out why people do what they do,
their experiences, their beliefs, and what they make of those.

Speaker 1 (35:32):
Did you find any commonality right off the bat?

Speaker 3 (35:37):
Yeah, yeah, people that's similar reasons for investigating so as
I mentioned before, to find explanations for their own experiences
or other people's experiences, to help, you know, quite a
lot of people have said that they want to help
others who have, you know, potentially you know, having a

(36:00):
scary experience, to understand that even if it's to say, look,
it's not paranormal, it's normal. It's the pipes in the house,
for example. But then to give that kind of support
and help to people who may not know who to
go to. So yeah, So helping others wanting to know

(36:22):
about their own experiences and their beliefs as well. And
I think you mentioned at the start of the show
that you know, maybe before we're on air, before we're
on air, I don't know, I can't remember now, but
you said that there were you know, so you knew
someone who was originally a skeptic and became a believer.
And I've come across those people as well. They've gone

(36:44):
into the field saying Okay, well I thought i'd go
and investigate that I was skeptical, but I've had experiences
that now I'm a believer and actually interesting, it's also
opposite as well. I've had a few people who started
as believers and then have become more skeptical.

Speaker 1 (37:03):
As you have gone down this path through the paranormal,
what's caught you off guard?

Speaker 3 (37:13):
So probably where I've been involved. So as well as
my questionnaire and interviews, I've also done a participant observation,
so I've gone on a few investigations. First off, was
not prepared to experience a few things that I did,

(37:34):
and that has resulted in me staying I'm now part
of a group that does investigation. I'm now a paranormal investigator,
which now that part is not part of my research.
But I joined a group and I stayed so that
I wasn't expecting that. I wasn't expecting to that then
to suddenly become part of my life. So my experience

(37:57):
is joining a group and staying. Yeah, and the fact
that what started off as a research project I now
see as probably a lifetime that I'm going to keep
keeping and keep looking at and keep wanting to know
more and understanding and never stop talking to people. That's

(38:19):
the best.

Speaker 1 (38:20):
As a scientist, you have a job to do. But
as a as a person of intrigue, this has really
caught your attention, is really you know, made you want
to find out more on a personal level. It's kind
of a cool combination.

Speaker 3 (38:37):
Absolutely, and I have to, as you know, as being
an academic, as being a scientist, remain objective in my research,
which is why I have spoken to people who are
skeptical as well, just get that balance. But absolutely, you know,
you asked the question, would I have You know what
surprised me, what shot me is how much this has

(38:59):
affected me on a person level.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
For sure, we'll take let's go down that road. How
has this affected you on a personal level.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
It's led me to question my own belief system. I
mean I was raised Catholic, kind of practicing, nonpracticing, I guess,
like you know, weddings in fune or as a lot
of people I know, so you know, but I also

(39:29):
sort of have other beliefs that maybe kind of Buddhist
with hid and just be a nice person basically is
what I believe in. But it's made me feel that
there is more out there that we don't know right
that sometimes maybe we shouldn't.

Speaker 7 (39:51):
It should be left atone were you like motion, that's.

Speaker 3 (39:56):
Fine, I mean, this is something that I've I've learned
as a result of talking a variety of people. So
I think I want to say that I have spoken
to people in different countries in the world. A majority
are UK, USA based, because I think that's where this
paranormal investigation is bigger. You can go to a you know,
town city and there'll be a group doing an investigation.

(40:19):
In other countries it's less So there's still groups out there.
I've had to dig deep to find them on social media,
but they keep it more quietly. It's more behind closed doors.
So yeah, talking to people in different countries, bringing different
perspectives and also different beliefs as well, different religious backgrounds.

(40:40):
So for some of us, you know, for them, again,
the paranormal is normal. It's part is ingrained into some
extent in their in their religion.

Speaker 1 (40:52):
For you and most scientists, you you have an agnostic
or atheist look at the world because you're trying to
find true scientific answers to how things were created or
and you know, it's a tough way to try and
you know, even though you grew up Catholic, I'm sure

(41:13):
it was a tough way to try and figure out. Okay,
do I believe what I've what I've learned from from
going to church all these years and now becoming a
scientist where I have to question everything? Did you have
that battle going on in yourself leading up to this subject?

Speaker 3 (41:32):
Yeah? Always, Yeah, it's always the this is what I believe,
will want to believe, which is why I love the
X Files phrase, I want to believe. It's you know,
what you've grown up with, what you've taught, you start
to question that, you learn about doing research, you know,
scientific research to question everything, and then that's that is

(41:55):
it's always an ongoing battle between your own beliefs and
what you find out. So yes, sure for me, how
different is it? If you know, do we want to
find proof about God? Some people will say, well, again,
it's it's I believe, it's I've had experiences, I've seen miracles,
I've seen you know, things happen. How different is that

(42:16):
to then a haunting or UFO? There is very there
is actually similarities there.

Speaker 1 (42:24):
Tell us about your questionnaire.

Speaker 3 (42:28):
Sure, it's got a variety of questions about demographics, so
I can see that I've got a good representation of
different demographics from the population, so gender, age, ethnicity, country,
et cetera. And then I ask people about are they

(42:50):
part of a group or you know, so what kind
of investigation did they do? Is it a group event,
is it a solo one? And actually that's something else
that there's I found was interesting as well. Its number
people that do investigations on their own because they feel
that there's too much disturbance by doing a group investigations.
So maybe that's something we can pick up on after.

(43:11):
But that's one of the questions that I ask I
asked them, do they feel that there's some kind of
rational explanation so that you know, with a questionnaire, you've
got like a tip box, So is it always a
rational explanation or is there some other explanations? So also
give them the opportunity to fill in an answer. And

(43:32):
most of the time people, I would say that across
the questionnaire and the interview, people are skeptical but open
minded as well. So they might believe in some phenomena
not in other phenomena, but they will always approach approach
it more with a well it could be this, it
could be that, let's get away with the you know,
the plausible explanation, and then if that's left, then then

(43:56):
it can go down as unexplained phenomena. I asked people
to define themselves. Again, this isn't both in the questionnaire
and in the interviews, So what would you call yourself?
So I've used the term paranormal investigator and I had
to call my research projects something and I use that
as an umbrella term for different types of phenomena. So

(44:18):
it could could include cryptozoology, uap ufo, haunting's, poltergeist, you know, everything.
So I ask people, how would you define what you do?
And by far people have said paranormal investigator. Some people
say paranormal researcher, some people say a paranormal historian, I guess,

(44:42):
because they delved more into the history and the background,
the culture of the context surrounding any haunting. And some
people have used the term ghost hunter, but other people
have quite clearly expressed the fact that they don't like
that term ghost hunter because they don't like they think

(45:02):
it's derogatory that they're they're not hunting ghosts. So it's
been fascinating. So those kind of the you know, the
questions that have asked there there are others as well.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
That so as you continue to to kind of go
onto your first paranormal investigation after you know, putting this
study out, how did you or did you redefine any
of the questions on it as you are now learning

(45:34):
how to you know, chase down spirits and ghosts.

Speaker 3 (45:38):
M hmm.

Speaker 5 (45:40):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (45:41):
So I went on in an investigation and taking an
ethnographic approach and was actually this is interesting. I was
actually went along intending to just observe, which I did
start off at just seeing what everyone was doing, which
was interesting. I had to I asked questions. I wouldn't
really know what questions to ask until the time so

(46:03):
I was asking about different bits of equipment, Oh what
does that do? And so the group knew that I
was researching, so that, you know, so I could openly
ask questions. I didn't do anything covertly, So yeah, asking
question what are you're doing? What the equipment does that do?
And they explained to me the kind of process that

(46:24):
they would go through. And that's something that's common with
most investigation groups. As you go along to a site,
you'd split up into smaller groups how to use equipment audio,
you know, audio, video, EMF readings, and I've learned about
all sorts of equipment, are still still trying to get
around my head around some of it. They do calling

(46:47):
out as well. Most groups, including the group I was
involved in, had a medium or sometimes they refer themselves
to as a sensitive, so they would you know, use
themselves as all. So yeah, it was it was fascinating
going along on an investigation, you know, particularly for the
first time, and just seeing just how and I'm guessing,

(47:13):
you know, trying to and I use that we're trying
to use a scientific approach because I think I'm not
just on one group. I've been on other groups as well,
and I think there's a difference, slight difference in how
the equipment might be used. And I do know that
there is a debate, particularly from those more skeptical, saying
that groups don't necessarily follow a rigid, strict scientific approach,

(47:39):
so some might notes, randomly record something so and again,
through my conversation with others as well, I think this
differs so some people, some groups will record all the time,
take the audio, the videos going all the time, continuously

(48:00):
making notes, continuously monitoring the environments. To me, that's more
of a scientific process. That's that's less fun though other
groups are less kind of so systematic, right, and so
vigorous and doing that.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Did you focus the study strictly on ghost hunting or
did you delve into.

Speaker 3 (48:22):
Oh i've lost the audio from you, I can't hear
you there.

Speaker 4 (48:27):
You go, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:29):
Did you just focus the entire study young ghost hunting
or did you want to include UFOs, because even though
it's a different genre, it is still kind of a
strange type of investigation.

Speaker 3 (48:46):
I would have happily have done anything, but by far
it was ghost investigations that are available.

Speaker 4 (48:57):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
If someone said to me, we're going to go you know,
that there's been a sighting. Do you want to come out? Sure,
I would, It's just the way that the research unfolded
that that was by far the most common that people
do type investigation that people do, certainly in the UK.
So all my investigations have been UK based. I mean

(49:19):
that would be for future study. Is I'd love to
go and do investigations in some other countries so that
therefore then might be UFOs or looking searching for bigfoot.
I'd love to go and you know, go and search
for bigfoot and things like that. Absolutely, but by far
it has been and that even in the questionnaire as well,

(49:41):
so not just investigations, but interviews questions. By far people
are most interested or not well. By far it has
been ghost investigations, and I think that ties in with
people's belief system wanting to find out and another thing
that could have mentioned earlier as people's desire wants to

(50:05):
know do we survive bodily death? So is their life
after death, which I think is a fundamental human question.

Speaker 1 (50:12):
Naturally we want to know that one hundred percent. I mean,
I think for a lot of paranormal investigators, and I
have interviewed hundreds over the years. You know, I think
there is a mass confusion of what they're actually trying
to accomplish. You know, are you trying what are you
trying to solve? Are you trying to solve a mystery?
Are you trying to solve whether or not there's life

(50:34):
after death? Which I think should be the most important question,
because we all have something in common. We're all going
to die one day, and for many of us, self included,
we'd like some one hundred percent confirmation that, you know,
we aren't a Darwin Award for a one and done,
you know, I mean we don't. I kind of like living,

(50:55):
and I know most people I know like living too,
and so you know, I think for a lot of
the pair and normal, at least in my opinion, I'm
curious yours, there is a confusion of what they're trying
to do because there's a big difference between scientifically researching
this and going out for thrill seeking m h.

Speaker 3 (51:17):
And I think there's a kind of arrange. So I
think I've spoken to people who are parapsychologists so will
very much follow the scientific method and the way that
they do things. They'll set up experiments. Then you've got
I think like more group type events, but also solo

(51:39):
investigators that fall in between the strict scientific method and
then the thrill seekers. And then of course at the
other end you've got the frill seekers. I think by far,
certainly in the interviews I've spoken to the majority of
people in the middle, but also parapsychologists. No frill seekers

(51:59):
in the interviews, obviously, they're maybe in the questionnaire responses. Yeah,
So I do think there is a variety. I think
that part of the problem is there is no professionalization
of this aside from being in an you know, I

(52:19):
mean I've spoken to academics as well that you know,
parapsychologists that do this investigation. They might not go on
a group investigation, but they research pie phenomena within the
kind of more of a laboratory setting or I figure
what it's called now, but you know, field investigation, but
still using a more scientific process. So I think there's

(52:42):
a variety. So I think that's something that the skeptics
will then bring up on question and say, well, you're
not doing this following the scientific method, You're doing it
kind of more haphazardly, So of course there's going to
be false They're going to find false. But I equally, then,

(53:02):
how can you use the scientific process for somebody who's psychic,
who's a medium. They don't need to They intuitively pick
up some you know, some are so you've got a
clear audience. You've got so people who hear things, You've
got people who see things, or people who just feel things. Okay,
so there's are different different types of mediums that well,

(53:26):
they can't be tested. I mean, sure you can go
into a laboratory and be tested that way, but when
you're out in an investigation, that's not possible. And they
will argue that actually myself is in the instrument and
that is enough. So for me. I and this is
how my research. I do my research anyway, it's kind

(53:47):
of a mixed approach. So you get the objectivity. So
I can do that through the questionnaire. I can do
some statistical analysis with the questionnaire. But I have also
spoken to people, have asked them about their experiences, and
they could be subjective experiences. But I think that's equally
important as well. So before and I guess the other

(54:07):
thing to say is a lot of the time paranormal
phenomena are one of phenomenalies. So how can you capture
that scientifically?

Speaker 1 (54:17):
I don't think you can. I really don't. We're going
to continue this conversation in our number two with doctor
Ursula Wolski, who's looking into why people research the paranormal. Yes,
researching researchers who research the paranormal. It's a great night

(54:38):
on spaced Out Radio. Hour two coming up right after this.
This is spaced Out Radio with Hopes A. Scott. All Right,

(55:01):
we are clear, doctor Ursula. I'm going to put you
in the green room. We got about five and a
half minutes and I'm just gonna step away for a minute.
I'll be right back. Okay.

Speaker 3 (55:11):
Oh so breat time.

Speaker 1 (55:12):
Yeah, all right, make more team, be right back. All right, everybody,
we'll see in a few.

Speaker 8 (56:02):
Sis.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
All right, we got about a minute to go here
and High Broken Shadow, Feather, Hi, Seymour, High Lotus, Spider,
Dirty Filth, how are you hello? Dirty? Who else? Join us?
If you guys have questions, put them in capital letters.

(01:00:25):
I will get to them this hour. Thank you tonight
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(01:00:50):
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go with our two. Our number two of spaced Out

(01:01:17):
Radio is now underway. Thank you for joining us. My
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(01:01:38):
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(01:02:02):
Quasi Quasi is your password? Use it wisely. Space Travelers
as a clam says the password each and every night.
Right here on spaced out Radio, Let's go to our guest,
Doctor Ursula Wolski is here hanging out with us. She's
doing a current research project in the United Kingdom about
researching why people research the paranormal and other strange phenomena.

(01:02:25):
Doctor Ursula, welcome back, Hi, Hi again, Hi. What have
you learned about this subject of the paranormal? What do
you think a ghost is?

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
I think it can be many things. I think it
can be possibly spirits of the departed, our loved ones,
or spirits that have become stuck here have not moved
on for one reason or another. Can be residual of

(01:03:01):
the past. Yeah, I think it can be many things.
That's certainly the kind of things that people have explained
to me from within the questionnaires in the interviews as well,
and other people that I've spoken to. Some also believe
that it's energy as well our consciousness.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
How do you scientifically explore the paranormal when it's very
hard and difficult to get ghosts to come out and
chat with you on a daily basis.

Speaker 3 (01:03:41):
Absolutely, I think, and you know, people will go investigations
have said that more often than not, you're sitting there
and and nothing happens, so you can't. And I think
that's also why people said that they didn't like the
term ghost hunting. It's not something that happens on demand. Sure,

(01:04:01):
I guess the same as well with cryptids as well,
you're not you're not gonna They're not going to come
out and demand either as well. So I think it's
it is difficult. I think it can take time. I
think that's why people refer sometimes on an investigation as
an area having a hot spot, so there it's, you know,

(01:04:25):
well known that this particular area has experienced people have
experienced so multip people, multiple people have experienced phenomena on
different occasions. So I think people then will tend to
gravitate to a particular area because it's well, it's well
known as a spot, so then you're more likely to
get something there they're not. And I think for me,

(01:04:46):
the key term in terms of the scientific process is repeatability.
So having things that occur time and time again from
different people, different groups, I think amounts to a certain
amount of evidence.

Speaker 1 (01:05:05):
What was it for you, like the first time you
communicated with a spirit?

Speaker 3 (01:05:12):
I can't say for sure that I did so if
I Because I mentioned before being on an investigation and
having my own experiences, I'm an open minded skeptic, so
I don't know. I thought maybe something was speaking to me.
It felt like it was coming to me in my head,

(01:05:35):
but I couldn't be certain that it was just my
own mind making that up. So it's a difficult question
to answer.

Speaker 1 (01:05:44):
Did it kind of weird you out a little bit
that all of a sudden, these strange noises or these
strange voices through EVP electronic voice phenomena, we're starting to
come together? Like it had to be a little bit
of an eye opener.

Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
It was an eye opener, but it just made me
want to know more. Why is it happening? Is it
actually this this a spirit? Or is it some interference
that the EVPs can pick up so audio recordings can
pick up. No, I'm just more curious, curiouser and curious her.

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
Did you ever have because you've gone on a number
of paranormal investigations, now, did you ever have the same
spirit come out and say hello to you?

Speaker 3 (01:06:36):
No? Even though I've been on an investigation in you know,
similar venue, so same place. No, people have Some people
have picked up on the same kind of entity, but no,

(01:06:57):
never the same one. Really not for me.

Speaker 1 (01:07:01):
How would we make such a situation repeatable?

Speaker 3 (01:07:06):
I think you go to the same location multiple times,
I feel that you should be audio and video recording
at the very least, continuously monitoring the environment, and then
if you're getting the same effects each time, then I
think you could say that there's more likely something going
on there. So that, to me, is how that would work.

Speaker 1 (01:07:30):
I can see that it is a weird instance when
you are trying to get phenomena to communicate with you,
and for some reason, I know from personal experience over
the last few weeks that a lot of times the
phenomena seems to know when you're not recording, or seems

(01:07:53):
to know when you've got the cameras off, and then
something explosive happens. Example, a couple weeks ago, we went
out to one of our research sites and we had said, Okay,
no cameras tonight, We're just going to sit back and
allow the phenomena to kind of, you know, dictate what happens.

(01:08:15):
No cameras know nothing, and probably within forty yards fifty
yards of us, we had the loudest tree knocks I
have ever heard happen, and they were violent, like somebody
took a baseball bat and just slammed them against a
tree twice. It shot every hair up of my body

(01:08:37):
within a second when this happened, because I thought Bigfoot
was literally good. Yeah, I thought Bigfoot was literally going
to run through the trees right at us and say
get out of here, this is my forest, right But
he didn't, thankfully, you know. But it was intimidating.

Speaker 3 (01:08:58):
I yeah. I mean people have spoken of the fact
that even when they have had recording sorry equipment on,
it's malfunctioned, so videos have stopped. In fact, somebody talked
about actually on a UFO investigation, had a video camera
and with back up batteries and a back up equipment,

(01:09:20):
and it all failed. It all malfunctioned at the time
that they saw a citing. And that's kind of fairly
well known in UFO phenomena, isn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:29):
I think in all phenomena for sure. You know, like
where we're where you were, or where we are investigating
around here, we're investigating one of those hotspots I've never
been in. I've never been an investor or, a researcher,
it's my first research project. I'll tell you it's a

(01:09:50):
learning curve.

Speaker 3 (01:09:51):
It really is is Yeah, you know, it's.

Speaker 1 (01:09:55):
A complete learning curve because usually I'm an enthusiast. I
don't care about cameras. I don't care about microphones. I
don't care. I just want to go out there and
have some fun and experience some weird stuff, you know
what I'm saying. And now to actually have to try
and you know, watch camera angles and watch for evidence
and watch for things that are out of the ordinary

(01:10:18):
in the forest. I mean, it's a little odd to
try and remember everything of what you're supposed to do,
that's for sure. I don't really know if I'm good
at it. I haven't figured that part out yet.

Speaker 3 (01:10:35):
I guess that's where experience comes in. And it's an
interesting one as well. That's also come out of my
research is whether the training is required, and that's been debated.
Some people say, well, I've been experiencing phenomena in my life.
I don't need training. I don't need training on how
to go and do things. It's do you learn by doing?

(01:10:58):
You learn by experience. Other people have argued that absolutely
unique training, whether it's in the equipment, how to do
an interview, had to you know, do the field investigation
of Sometimes people have referred to that as such. So
I think that is definitely a huge, massive debate that

(01:11:18):
has come out of my research that some people argue
that training is essential, other people say it's not. Of course,
the other issue that comes at, you know, related to
that is the question of ethics. Are people doing research
or the sorry their investigation ethically. Some would say yes,
they do, they follow a strict process, others have not.

(01:11:41):
I mean, you know, I think everyone has heard of
stories that people going around and this is when I'm
referring more to private investigations rather than sort of the
more public ones where you might go to somebody's house
because they're experiencing unexplained phenomena and I've been told that they, oh,
you've got a demon there, which then freaks the hell

(01:12:03):
out of the people, and they might do they might
not do. So I think that is definitely something that's
come out of the research is there's a big question
of ethics. Are paranormal investigators whatever they're investigating are doing,
are doing that ethically? And again that could relate to
going outside looking for cryptives or UFOs, Are you trespassing,

(01:12:26):
are you disturbing other people in the area, All all
sorts of kind of ethics that arise. So yeah, I
think that's that was interesting as well. That came out
of the research, out my research.

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
Do you think that we are doing this or part
let me rephrase it. Should we be doing this? Should
we be trying to get in contact with the deceased?

Speaker 3 (01:12:55):
That's a good one. Sure. I think that if the deceased,
we could turn that the other way around. Would the
disease want to make contact with us? And I think
then that's a common and common occurrence, particularly when someone's
recently lost someone. Again, skeptics would argue that, well, you're

(01:13:19):
you're you're grieving, so that's why your your your emotions
are heightened. But what if what if loved ones, you know,
was a final way of saying goodbye?

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
Sorry about that? Isn't that though? Just the romanticism of
it all?

Speaker 3 (01:13:38):
Perhaps? But then I think you you mentioned earlier that
you know, we want to know do we survive bodily death?
And that would be one way of finding it out.
If we can communicate with the dead, then that's one
way of telling us it's all right. You know you're here,

(01:13:59):
and sure, you know we hear from a loved one
and say it's all right, I'm in a good place now,
I'm happy now. That gives us comfort, That gives us
reassurance to living, to you know, to the loved ones
that are still living. Sure, is it a romanticism? I
guess in some cases it is, but for others it's again,
I think part of part of us being human. And

(01:14:21):
you know, if that's going to bring that bring comfort
to people, then okay, and I think that's why people
go to mediums.

Speaker 1 (01:14:31):
Let's quickly talk about your study again for a minute,
because earlier on in the show you said all good
things must come to an end paraphrasing here, You've been
doing this for how long?

Speaker 3 (01:14:44):
Oh five years now, But I'm doing it independently in
my own time, so yeah, sure, it's kind of when
I have time. So it's taken me a while.

Speaker 1 (01:14:55):
And how long do you see this study continuing for?

Speaker 3 (01:15:00):
I am, yeah, I am coming to an end. I've
got my questionnaut open for next two to three weeks
just to boost final responses, and I'm pretty much done
with the interviews. Then maybe like one or two that
might crop up that oh I should really talk talk to.

(01:15:21):
Then I'm going to close up. So yeah, then it's
the analysis of all the data and the write up. Yeah,
so I approaching the end.

Speaker 1 (01:15:33):
Why end it? If you're having this much fun? Why
end it?

Speaker 3 (01:15:38):
Because I'm going to continue. I am going to continue,
but I'm going to finish this part of it. So
I want to look at other groups outside the UK
and go on investigations with with some of those groups,
just to see what they do. Do they do anything differently?
Sure we don't get bigfoot in our country, We've got

(01:15:59):
other cryptids. We've got the Lockness Monster for example up
in Scotland, big cats, the black Shook. Yeah, so explore further,
but really close this part down and then say, okay,
so this is first So research really doesn't actually ever end.
You just finish with one part, write it up, here's

(01:16:22):
the findings. Oh, this is what I'm going to do next.
So yeah, I'd like to look at other groups in
other countries, other kind of paranormal phenomena as well that
hasn't really featured. And I just let the research happen
in a way, and what came came up. Obviously, there
was some part of me trying to reach out to others,

(01:16:43):
So I did go on to things like LinkedIn to
try and find people who were researching UFOs for example,
rather than Yeah, so I did try to boost those responses.
But yeah, there's further research later on. And also you said,
you know, earlier we touched upon how this has affected
me personally. So I would like to do something what's

(01:17:04):
called an auto ethnography again academic speaks, do you apologize
where I'll be looking at myself as a participant and
noting down what happens to me and that you know,
on investigations and such. So, yeah, there is more research
to follow. So it isn't going to end.

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
Really, you're just changing the tone of it.

Speaker 3 (01:17:29):
Sure, yeah, direction so as a result of doing some research,
you get some findings. Always leads to more questions, and
then the research continues.

Speaker 1 (01:17:41):
This is a story that never ends because the phenomena
of it all. I personally believe that everything is tied together.
So ghosts are tied to UFOs, which are tied to cryptids,
which are tied to consciousness and near death experiences, astro travel,
the esp you name it. I think I do believe

(01:18:01):
that there is a common thread that we have yet
to discover in this, and a lot more researchers before
me have have kind of figured that out and kind
of taught me about it, and a lot more are
starting to figure that out as well. Have you noticed
any commonalities between the phenomenons or the subjects of the phenomena?

Speaker 3 (01:18:23):
A few people have said just what you've said, that
there is a connection between all of these. And one
participate participant that I spoke to in particular talked about
quantum entanglement, which was a new one on me. Yeah,
I knew I sort of vaguely have an idea about
quantum physics, but he was talking about quantum entanglement and

(01:18:47):
how we're all kind of connected through the universe. So yeah,
that was one of my most recent participants. So I've
yet to go and read up about quantum entanglements. You
have a better idea, please you can talk.

Speaker 1 (01:19:06):
You know what's funny is I actually try and dodge
the science of it all. I've been intimidated by science
my entire life. I love it. I don't understand a
word of it. But you know, with this show, my
my focus of this show is to try and bring
the feeling aspect of what people go through, whether they

(01:19:29):
are researching, or whether they're writing a book or a novel,
or or they're wanting to tell their own personal story
of how it's affected them. To me, it's about the
people because you know, I'm a storyteller, you know, not
a fictional storyteller, but I'm a storyteller of people's stories,

(01:19:50):
and that's what we want to kind of bring out
as a focus. So that's what I kind of stick to.
Just like you have a focus with with your research.
You know, you can't stray off of that, even though
the phenomena probably has wanted you to stray a number
of times. You have to stay focused on what you're
there for.

Speaker 3 (01:20:10):
Absolutely, I get you. I'm with you on the scientific
kind of path kind of way, And I guess that's
why my focus is on more the subjective experiences of people.
So it's more, you know, a qualitative approach rather than quantitative. Sure,
I have the questionnaire, but I've not gone out there

(01:20:30):
and done hard stats and tested hypotheses and the correlation.
So it is about people's experiences. So maybe you know,
it could be seen as a soft science in a way.
But that has what I've been interested in. And what's
something that's just come to mind is a few people
have said, well, perhaps this path was chosen for me,

(01:20:51):
that I was meant to be doing this. Who knows?

Speaker 1 (01:20:56):
Have you noticed in the people you have interviewed regarding
this subject. We got about three minutes to go before
we go to break. Have you noticed a pattern in
the people as to why they're choosing to do this?
You know, for a long time there, at least in
North America, it was about I want a TV show.

(01:21:17):
And like you said, there is no schooling on this,
There is no college course that you could take to
try and you know, learn about this subject. But you know,
people are learning on their own, and some people are
very aggressive, others are very meek. You know, what have
you learned about the people you've met about this subject?

Speaker 3 (01:21:38):
Well, first off, there are actually courses that you can take,
so I know in the USA you've got the Ryan
Research Center. They do courses online. I forget the name,
but I know there is one or two in Canada
as well, so you can go and do online courses.
In the UK as well, there are organizations that have

(01:22:01):
talks lectures. So you've got a society for psychical research.
You have the Ghost Club that do monthly regular meetings
so you can come and have discussions about phenomena, about
different phenomena. I know the Ghost Club is called the
Ghost Club. It also you know, does talk about cryptids
as well. So in fact, we had a couple of speakers,

(01:22:23):
so I'm a member of those groups. There were a
couple of speakers who were actually talking about Bigfoot. So
there are places that you can go and learn and
talk about this. But there are also courses as well
that you can do online. So I think it's there
if you want, if you want to, and I know
people that have spoken to have done those courses, but

(01:22:45):
others just say, well, I've experiences enough for me, I
don't need to go and study this. Formerly sure, okay, fine,
fair enough. So for me, that was the kind of
commonalities that there were people. Again, I think it just
leads to this curiosity of why people are doing this
in the first place, will then lead to curiosity to

(01:23:05):
wanting to find more learn from others, and how do
you learn from others by people who have done it,
who then put their knowledge into courses. So I mean,
I personally would study to find out more, taught to
others to find out more. Yeah, so I think that's

(01:23:26):
I think also there's a big, big group in India
as well. I believe they offer courses as well. I'd
have to check my facts, but certainly there is a
big group out there.

Speaker 1 (01:23:40):
Well, you know what, I want to learn more about this,
and we do have some audience questions coming up for
you in the next half hour on the show. We
have doctor Ursula Wolski for another thirty minutes on spaced
Out Radio. I love the fact how Ursula is so
open minded to learning not only about the subject, but

(01:24:01):
it's a whole different divination of science that is just
budding out there that we call the paranormal. We'll be
right back. You're listening space over you with your whole

(01:24:25):
Dave Scott, all right, we are clear. This has been awesome.

Speaker 3 (01:24:46):
I can't believe how time has gone so quickly. I
know we had a little break earlier and enabled me
to make more tea, but yeah, I feel like company
getting started right right.

Speaker 1 (01:24:59):
I think it's been a great conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:25:03):
I think it's interesting about the scientific method because maybe
we can touch upon this when we go back again
about how a lot of people have said that there
just isn't the terminology within the current science paradigms, and
I think that's true.

Speaker 1 (01:25:22):
We can do that. Well, we can do that definitely.
Well you can do that. So what's for breakfast?

Speaker 4 (01:25:40):
Me?

Speaker 3 (01:25:42):
I don't know. I haven't thought about breakfast. I'm just
thinking when we finish this, I need to make coffee.

Speaker 1 (01:25:50):
So Jaron's carter, how you doing? Good to have you?

Speaker 3 (01:26:06):
Yeah, some people be having dinner, won't they? Yeah, well
late dinner. It's what what time is it with you now?
Half ten?

Speaker 1 (01:26:17):
Right now? Yeah, it's uh ten thirty. Yes, nobody's eating
breakfast foods for dinner. I know what you guys are
trying to do in the chat room right now, and
I don't like it. All Right, she's allowed to eat
breakfast because it's breakfast time at her place.

Speaker 3 (01:26:40):
Yeah, it's now half six in the morning.

Speaker 1 (01:26:42):
Yet none of this crazy talk of eating bacon and
eggs for dinner. It's not a dinner meal. It's a
breakfast meal.

Speaker 3 (01:26:49):
Oh, bacon and eggs sounds good, yes, yep, baked beans, yep. Sorry,
I'm reading the chat.

Speaker 1 (01:27:04):
Now ahead, we've got time yep, yep, we do.

Speaker 3 (01:27:08):
Like bait beans. We do? You have a full English breakfast? Yeah? Yeah,
that's the one thing that if I moved abroad, I'd
have to take suit cakes eat beans with me. She
can't really get them elsewhere.

Speaker 1 (01:27:25):
They're coming cans here you get.

Speaker 3 (01:27:28):
Yeah, okay, all right, Well maybe you know France, Spain,
those kind of places you can't really get a bit.
You might be lucky. I guess I can't believe I'm
having a conversation about beans. Half six in the well
it is breakfast time.

Speaker 1 (01:27:45):
So well, some of these people eat breakfast foods for dinner,
so they're crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:27:55):
Love bacon for dinner.

Speaker 1 (01:27:57):
Well, bacon's universal. Everything has univer Yeah, bacon is Bacon
and pizza are totally universal because there's nothing any time
of day exactly but hash browns and eggs and pancakes
and waffles. That's breakfast food.

Speaker 3 (01:28:17):
Yeah, yeah, I like waffles.

Speaker 1 (01:28:25):
We have about a minute and a half just over Superron.
How you doing.

Speaker 3 (01:28:38):
They're all talking about food.

Speaker 1 (01:28:43):
Super Roun just had eggs, bacon, and hash browns. Because
it's quick and easy. It's also wrong, it's very wrong.

Speaker 4 (01:28:51):
Half ten, one minute to go, Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:29:09):
Big Thank you tonight to Louis Times Too, t Bone,
my Man, cat Chaser, Kira and AJ for the wonderful
super chats. We greatly appreciate your love and support. You
can also join our membership. We got a new video
coming on out. I'm going to try and figure out
how to play that for you guys early. If you
are a member. That's one of the perks. You get

(01:29:32):
to see them early, early, early, I tell you. And
you can shop at our spaced Out Radio store. Why
we do not have ugly swag, people, no ugly swag,
so make sure you check it on out. Appreciate you.
We have about twenty seconds. Thank you again, AJ very much,

(01:29:59):
appreciate the love. Nice double tap tonight and five seconds.

(01:30:26):
Here we go with the second half of spaced Out
Radio Tonight. Good to have you with us. My name
is Dave Scott. We always appreciate earning your listening ears
wherever you are on this beautiful planet we call Earth. Hey.
We want to remind all of you that if you
miss portions of this show or others, you can always
check out our free archives on YouTube or any major

(01:30:47):
podcast network. Our website spaced out Radio dot com. We
have a plethora features for you. Rock out to bumblefoot,
read the news wire, check out our swag as well.
You can follow us on exit, spaced Out Radio, Instagram,
at spaced Out Radio Show, and on Patreon in the
Space Travelers Club. Here we go our good friend, because

(01:31:11):
we're gonna call her a friend now. She's pretty awesome.
Doctor Ursula Wolski. She's from the United Kingdom. She is
studying right now for the next few weeks before she
changes her avenue. Why do people research the paranormal? And
one of the problems that you have noticed in the
scientific community is there's not really a place to put

(01:31:34):
the paranormal genre. Why is that?

Speaker 3 (01:31:41):
Well, again, something I've noticed and also the you know,
people I've spoken to have said that there is just
no terminology within the current scientific term terms, you know,
within the science, you know, within science to explain, I
mean sometimes the parent has been referred to as pseudo scientific.

(01:32:04):
But how different is it to theoretical physics, for example,
So we can touch upon, you know, Paradise by the
work of Thomas Kuhne, who you know, and people have said,
and again this is something I think as well. It's
just that it's pre pre paradigm that there is just
currently no terminology used, and that is part of the problem.

(01:32:26):
Why for some for skeptics in particular, that the paranormal
is not accepted.

Speaker 1 (01:32:35):
Why do you think so many people in the scientific
community have such trouble accepting this as a potential legitimate science.

Speaker 3 (01:32:49):
Because it's difficult to obtain the evidence that would require
to fit the scientific model, which requires validity, which for
some people would say, well, we've got that, we've been
on investigation, we've got that. But just having things that,

(01:33:10):
you know, following the process for them. A lot of
paranormal investigators don't follow a very strict and rigid scientific
process when they're investigating, and therefore cannot provide reliable and
valid results, which you know, I think we mentioned earlier
in the show that you know, a lot of phenomena

(01:33:32):
are just one off occurrences, So how can you get
that they happen if you, you know, spontaneously, you might
be you know a lot of times. So we're talking
about so my research has been about paranormal investigators, So
people that go with a purpose, with an intention to
go and investigate an area or you know, or a
place more often not people. You will experience something when

(01:33:56):
you're least expecting it to. So you're out walking and
something strange happens, You're not going to say, oh, hold on,
can you hold that foot while I get my phone out,
while I record it, while I record the temperature, the environment,
everything that's going on. It's gone, But how can you
record that? And I think that's part of the difficulty
that the you know, within the current scientific terminology is

(01:34:19):
that we have, is that it isn't there at the moment.
Do I have an answer for that? No, I don't.
So I think it's something that as a science, as
if we talk about the you know, in terms of
Thomas Kuhne's perspective, is that it's something that will develop,
so perhaps in time we will.

Speaker 1 (01:34:41):
I think you were a lot closer to that than
what we actually see happening right now from what I've
heard from a number of scientists that I've interviewed over
the years. You know, these gentlemen and women are afraid
to lose their grants, they're afraid to lose their tenure,
they're afraid to you know, lose their their positions because

(01:35:03):
if they start delving into a pseudoscience, and somebody in
their surroundings doesn't believe that it is a true science,
then there is you know, retribution for that. Have you
heard of that as well?

Speaker 3 (01:35:19):
I have, Yeah, and that that is the problem. I
think it's it's changing, but I think, yeah, so a
lot of the paranormal investigators are non non academics. Out
of you know, there are a few that do this,
but I have spoken to some and heard from some
that yeah, it's not been accepted within their department. Maybe

(01:35:42):
they've been permitted to do it as a side project
but had to sort of do research that fell more
within the mainstream and that was more acceptable. But I
do think that is starting to change. And I think
what what is wonderful about seeing the growth in paranormal
investigate investigators and however they do that research, is that

(01:36:04):
it's that, you know, to some extent is irrelevant. What's
important is that they're bringing awareness, greater awareness that actually
there is this stuff out there that does need further
exploring an investigation, and then hopefully eventually that will filter
more into academia.

Speaker 5 (01:36:24):
I think.

Speaker 3 (01:36:26):
With some regards that akademios meant which is meant to
be at the forefront of science sometimes isn't always.

Speaker 1 (01:36:36):
Let's get some audience questions here. Let's start off tonight
with Carrie, who is asking have you ever interviewed someone
and something manifested in front of you?

Speaker 3 (01:36:50):
I have, thank you for the question. I have had
a couple of interviews where the yeah, that the technology
just went a little bit weird. As in one interview
in particular, which we then decided to abandon, I was

(01:37:11):
we were doing it on zoom, and then suddenly multiple
versions of this person came on like different I don't
know how to explain it, different like videos. So like
you can see two screens here, there were multiple screens
or one screen. I don't know what viewers are actually seeing,
but there were multiple screens and then it kept moving

(01:37:34):
and then I couldn't hear him. So was that paranormal?
Was it just the wonderful world of it? Who knows?
But that was certainly strange.

Speaker 1 (01:37:47):
All right, let's move on to a second question here.
It's got to carry Have you ever oh I just
asked that when I apologize, it's got a mister Cowley
from the UK. Do you find more active or sites
more active on lay lines?

Speaker 3 (01:38:04):
It's not something that I've actually looked in and something
that's discussed within the groups that I've been with. But
people I've spoken to have mentioned that they think that
there is yeah, definitely more activity where lay lines meet. Yeah,
so not something I've experienced myself, but something that I

(01:38:26):
have that my participants have said that there are certain
hot spots and that is where the lay lines do meet.

Speaker 1 (01:38:35):
I got to ask while we're I kind of on
the topic, what is your dream paranormal investigation.

Speaker 3 (01:38:43):
To see a full bodied apparition? Who wouldn't most people say,
oh my god?

Speaker 5 (01:38:49):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:38:49):
And again that's the other thing that you know, people
who maybe are a bit not not skepticism that I
think skeptic. Being a degree of skeptism is quite healthy.
But I think people who think it's nonsense would say, well,
why would you want to do that? That's scary? And
I'm like, does it have to be scary?

Speaker 6 (01:39:06):
I mean?

Speaker 3 (01:39:06):
And I think that's actually important point to make is
we've all grown up with horror movies and things like that,
that that's the type of genre that that people find fun,
people find interesting, you know, and more often though, when
you watch the paranormal TV shows, it's all frightening is
all scary, because yeah, that makes great TV.

Speaker 5 (01:39:25):
For sure.

Speaker 3 (01:39:26):
I've always been incredibly boring. If you've got a nice,
nice ghost. Sure there's an exception, you've got Casper the
friendly ghost. But on the whole people report experiences of frightening.
But there were a few people that I spoke to
who said, no, I've had a nice experience. It's you know,
it's been fine. And a lot of the people paranormal

(01:39:46):
investigators will say that, yeah, that would be what I
would like to see is a full bodied deparition.

Speaker 1 (01:39:54):
The Yeah, how do you think you would react to that?

Speaker 3 (01:40:01):
I would probably go I'm not allowed to swear online.
I think I would freeze. I don't think it'll be
frozen toura. I think I'd just be an absolute probably disbelief,
because to see a full bodied apparition is quite uncommon.
Most of the time we hear EVPs, we might capture

(01:40:23):
something on video, but to see a full body and
I have spoken to people have seen full bodied apparations,
but it really isn't that common. Yeah, difficult to say,
but I would probably freeze and then probably did, like
you rub my eyes and you know, can you do
you know if it disappears, can you come back again please?
So I can, you know, make sure that I just
my head wasn't making something up.

Speaker 1 (01:40:45):
Yeah, tell you a quick funny story before I get
to the next question. I had seen a full body
apparition of a man in my backyard. And so if
you go to my studio is in my home, and
during the breaks, I'll go outside check the weather or

(01:41:06):
whatever it may be. In about you know, probably fifteen
feet eighteen feet from my door, I have a tree,
about a twenty foot tree. And this one night I
walk out there. I'm looking at my phone, and out
of the top of my eyes I see a man
standing there and he's got the old seventies feathered hair,

(01:41:29):
with a white T shirt, light blue jeans, and white
running shoes on. And I picked my head up and
he vanishes right in front of me. So it kind
of made me jump back. I happen to have a
psychic on that night, told her what happened, and she
starts channeling him while we're on the air, and she

(01:41:51):
said I wasn't supposed to see him. There's rules about that, apparently,
and that she go and she lives in New York.
Never been to my home and she goes, you have
an extension on the back of your house. Correct, I said, yes.
She's like, he's telling me that he doesn't like the

(01:42:12):
extension because before the extension was on, his woodworking area
was at that part of the house outside. So long
story short, we did this communication and I said I
need a favor because we'd only been in this place
for a few weeks. And he goes, what's that. I said,

(01:42:34):
I need you to keep the bears out of my yard,
the bears and cougars out of my yard. And his
response through her was you know where you live, right,
I said yes, but I don't want my young my
son who is now twelve, he was two at the time.
I said I don't need a bear, thinking that he's food.

(01:42:54):
And to this day, ten years later, I've only had
my garbage cans knocked over once in ten years my neighbors.
Every year, my neighbors, but Rick patrols the yard looking.
His name is Rick Richard. We got that out of him,
and he patrols my yard to keep the bears out

(01:43:16):
of my yard. And in return, if you go into
my car port, I have wood there for him to
work on.

Speaker 3 (01:43:26):
Excellent.

Speaker 1 (01:43:28):
It's a good train.

Speaker 3 (01:43:29):
And that's brilliant. That's brilliant. That's a great story. Yeah, brilliant.

Speaker 1 (01:43:34):
Yeah, let's get to another question here. Let's go to
sweet Tony D from the UK. Good morning to you, Tony.
He says, what is your thoughts, doctor Ursula about crop circles?
Do these fall into the paranormal related category or other?

Speaker 3 (01:43:53):
Some would say yes, some would say no. I think
a lot of crop circles are man made one reason
or another. I think that's been proven. I've certainly watched
documentary about how they were made. But some are, you know,
possibly not so therefore then that would make them paranormal.

Speaker 5 (01:44:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:44:15):
Have you ever seen crop circles?

Speaker 6 (01:44:19):
I have?

Speaker 3 (01:44:20):
I have, I did.

Speaker 4 (01:44:23):
What were we now?

Speaker 3 (01:44:26):
Sorry, it's been early, early start for me. Yeah, I
have gone to there's an area in the UK that's
quite common for them. Well, there's several areas that one
not far from me. A long time ago I did
went with a group of people. Yeah, there was a
crop circle. We went in and we sat in it

(01:44:47):
and yeah, nothing happened. My friends claimed that they felt
more kind of a spiritual and a presence, and I
didn't feel anything.

Speaker 1 (01:44:56):
So do you now believe in the whole psychic phenomena
and everything? Now are you going into the world of
the will well trying to keep your scientific head on
your shoulders.

Speaker 3 (01:45:06):
I do feel that if a lot of people have
psychic ability, that have sihability, I believe that not everybody
acknowledges that and therefore is able to in tune with it.
And I think it's of different degrees. So I think

(01:45:26):
we can. And I think part of that is because
of our our genetic makeup. Are you know, in the past,
we had that instinct if something was going to come
and attack us and we'd run away or fights, fight
or flights. So I think that instinct is kind of
still with us, but I think because of our modern
day living, we're not so much in tune with that.

(01:45:50):
I think we can pick up on other people's thoughts,
maybe not necessarily have a conversation, but I think, you know,
and I think this is where people there and we
know our psychic or mediums or as sensitives because they
can pick up on other people's thoughts. So I think
we all have that ability. Definitely. I think some of

(01:46:11):
us can tune into it more than others.

Speaker 1 (01:46:14):
All right, let's go to another question here. Let's go
to Paul. Have you investigated any graveyards?

Speaker 3 (01:46:23):
No, not an investigation. But I do go into plenty
of graveyards because I like them, which this is the
world of weird, so that's fine, that's okay to say, right.
I just find them peaceful and relaxing. And I think,
if you're going to haunt somewhere, would you haunt a
graveyard or would you go back to a more happier time?

(01:46:44):
So rather whe than you've been late to rest, would
you go back to where you used to live or
place that you like, a more happier place. So, yeah,
not investigated.

Speaker 1 (01:46:55):
No, let's go next to Jose. Have you ever heard
or seen a black wispy thing that sort of resembles
a broom with a skirt. They are seen floating around mausoleums,
very bizarre. Have you heard of these?

Speaker 3 (01:47:15):
No? No, not at all, Thank you for sharing that. Yeah,
a black whispy thing that resembles a broom with a skirt. No,
not at all. Interesting, not heard of that at all.

Speaker 1 (01:47:27):
Jose comes up with the most incredibly descriptive questions.

Speaker 3 (01:47:34):
Clearly then, Also, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:47:37):
Super Ron is asking he calls himself super Ron because
he wears a cape. He's asking has a smaller spirit
shown up before a bigger spirit.

Speaker 3 (01:47:49):
We have sometimes in group investigations detected multiple spirits. So
I when I say we collectively more more the people
the mediums in our group, well we call them sensitives
that have Yeah, I would say where one spirit is
more dominant the other than the other, one is more presence,

(01:48:13):
and often it's the kind of unpleasant ever sorry, unpleasant
presence that is felt. So I guess that's what you
mean by spawn spirit rather than a bigger one, rather
than a child or an adult.

Speaker 1 (01:48:30):
We have about five and a half minutes to go
here before we have to say good night to you.
And this has been an amazing adventure with you, doctor Ursula.
I'm learning about this just your overall thoughts of your study,
what you've accomplished, and where you feel you want to
look next.

Speaker 3 (01:48:50):
M Yeah, wow, I have a lot of data, so
I need to plow through it. I haven't you know,
fully done the analysis yet, but in terms, I think
basically what we've been saying is it's I think it's
opened my mind more. It's made me want to know more.
So that's where I want to go next, explore further,

(01:49:15):
look at other groups overseas as well. So just that
I've only just done in the UK. I love traveling anyway,
so that kind of you know, it's easy for me
to do.

Speaker 5 (01:49:29):
Just that.

Speaker 3 (01:49:30):
Actually, this is far much I think overall. If I'm
to conclude, I would say that this is much more
common than I'd ever expected, and I wish people would
be more open with each other about it and not
be afraid to speak out. There is no ridicule if

(01:49:50):
it is difficult for people to speak to someone because
they feel that they might be shunned or exclude, you know,
excluded or for whatever reason, there are others that you know,
and this show proves it. There are other shows, there
are other you know, communities on Facebook, and I think,
you know, just find someone to talk to. Then I
think it is changing. I think it is becoming more

(01:50:12):
widely acceptable that you know. Why should we not study
this these phenomena? Sure, yeah, there's plenty more research to do.

Speaker 1 (01:50:25):
Do you think the funnel will continue for you?

Speaker 3 (01:50:29):
Absolutely? I don't intend on it ending.

Speaker 1 (01:50:34):
Excellent. Let's sneak in a question from Jaketta here. Do
you have a favorite researcher.

Speaker 3 (01:50:43):
As in an academic or overall. Oh, I mean I do.
I do like the work of Thomas Khone. If within
the sociology of science, I guess I've liked so as
a result of my research, I've liked reading about the

(01:51:04):
works of the pioneers within the paranormal so within the UK,
you know, Andrew Green, Peter Underwood. I've enjoyed reading about
the Ryan Research Center, you know, also looking at the
history of the Ghost Club and the Society for Psychical Research.
Of course there was an American version as well, which

(01:51:27):
those were the ones that I first became familiar with,
and then learning about other groups as well as a
result of my research in different countries, that has been amazing.
Favorite researcher. No, they're all good.

Speaker 1 (01:51:44):
Quick question for you regarding just the overall subject matter tonight,
you know, and that would be how far do you
think we can go with paranormal research?

Speaker 3 (01:51:59):
Personally, I feel that there will always be questions. It's
the same. It's like the religion question, the God question
or God's depending on your religion or whatever you believe.
People accept it and that's fine, but for others they're
still questions because if we reach the ultimate answer, what
do we have next?

Speaker 1 (01:52:23):
I don't know. I really don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:52:29):
We don't know. I think there will always be further questions.
I think just to say that if we do come
to some answers, I mean the think about it, this
fundamentally changes our whole worldview, our whole belief system. It
puts a question mark over those people who believe in

(01:52:51):
God or God's etc. Changes everything. So I don't think
it's possible. I think there always will be as in
with life as in with other things, there will always
be people that will question, that will be skeptical, that
will be oh okay, well about this, because that is life.

Speaker 1 (01:53:13):
I would like you in the next forty five seconds
to tell people where they can find your study, how
they can follow it or potentially get a hold of you.

Speaker 5 (01:53:24):
Sure.

Speaker 3 (01:53:24):
I think probably the best way is on LinkedIn. If
you're on LinkedIn, If not, you can follow me on
so you know, please deconnect and not everyone's on LinkedIn,
so Facebook, you can connect on Facebook. I'm also on
x formerly known as Twitter, so very yeah, through very
social media. If you want to connect and follow me,

(01:53:45):
that'd be great. If you're interested in taking part in
my questionnaire that can also be found online, or maybe
if they would, would be able to kindly share it somehow.
If not, that's not a problem. But yeah, do do
please take Oh it's keeping it open for the next
next few weeks because I do need to finish this

(01:54:05):
part of my research. So thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:54:09):
Always a pleasure. We got to have you back on again,
doctor Ursula Wolski on spaced Out Radio. Coming up next,
Swamp Dweller and Robin Hayes. You're listening to spaced Out
Radio with your host Dave Scott. I loved it. Thank

(01:54:45):
you very much.

Speaker 3 (01:54:47):
Are we still live?

Speaker 5 (01:54:49):
Will we?

Speaker 1 (01:54:49):
We're still live on YouTube? I have another hour. You
were amazing. Okay, you were amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:54:57):
Thank you for having me. I completed the analysis and
have more conclusive thoughts to share.

Speaker 1 (01:55:06):
Please do all right, you stay in touch with close
our booking guy who got you, brought you in and
let us know. We'll get you right back on.

Speaker 3 (01:55:15):
All right, brilliant, All right, doctorler, Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
Go enjoy your bacon and eggs and coffee.

Speaker 3 (01:55:23):
I will do. Thanks very much, Take care, good night
and good morning or whatever it is. Everyone, goodbye, bye bye, I'll.

Speaker 1 (01:55:31):
Be right back. Everybody. Thank you. What a great, great guest.
I love her. All right, let's get ready for Robin.

(01:59:22):
Let's bring her onion.

Speaker 5 (01:59:25):
Hi, Robin Eator, Hey, sweetheart, how are you good? How
are you I'm doing good?

Speaker 1 (01:59:33):
Excellent, excellent. Good to see you.

Speaker 5 (01:59:37):
Yeah, good to see you too. How's the week going?

Speaker 1 (01:59:41):
Not bad?

Speaker 4 (01:59:43):
Not badad?

Speaker 1 (01:59:46):
Yeah, yeah, I'm uh. I'm having a contemplating life week.

Speaker 5 (01:59:56):
Oh I've had those, God bless you.

Speaker 1 (01:59:59):
Yeah, yep, you know, just wondering what I want to
do when I grow up, I know.

Speaker 5 (02:00:06):
And it's like then you you think about it, and
you're like, well, all right, I'm supposed to be already
grown up, and how much time do I still have
to grow up?

Speaker 1 (02:00:13):
Right?

Speaker 5 (02:00:14):
Or you look at it and then you're like, I'll chat.

Speaker 1 (02:00:17):
With you about it after. I'll chat with you about
it after the show. I have a couple questions, okay,
all right, big Thank you tonight to Walter AJ times two,
Louis Times two, T Bone, Kira and cat Chaser for
the wonderful, wonderful super chats. Thank you for the love
and support Ozzie Ange as well. Thank you very much

(02:00:38):
Ozzie and much love to you. Don't forget. You can
shop at our spaced Out Radio Store. We do not
have ugly swag. People, no ugly swag, So make sure
you check that on out and you can shop, you know,
and join our YouTube channel membership. Yeah, we got that
going too. We're gonna get going here in about five

(02:00:59):
second and Swamp Dweller is six minutes. Okay, here comes
the third and final hour of spaced Out Radio tonight.
My name is Dave Scott. We have Swamp Dweller and

(02:01:21):
Robin Haynes and her Q and a coming up momentarily.
But we want to say hello to all of you
tuning us in on our terrestrial affiliates around North America
digitally on every major podcast network. Our website spaced out
Radio dot com. We have a plethora of features for you.
Rock out to bumblefoot, read the news wire, check out

(02:01:43):
our swag as well. You can follow us on Exit,
spaced Out Radio, Instagram, at spaced Out Radio Show, and
on Patreon. In the Space Travelers Club, the Desert Clam
has set the password for tonight in the sor Space
Travelers lub. Quasi Quasi is your password, Use it wisely.

(02:02:04):
Space travelers. As the clam says the password, each and
every night, right here on spaced Out Radio, let's head
to the swamp.

Speaker 7 (02:02:14):
Hello, and welcome to spaced Out Radio's swamp. I'm swamp dweller,
and tonight I'm going to take you on a mystic
journey of the unknown, sharing tales of monsters, legends, and nightmares.
Welcome to the spaced Out Radio Swamp.

Speaker 1 (02:02:31):
I grew up in a.

Speaker 7 (02:02:32):
Very safe area for most of my young life. It
was one of those neighborhoods where all the kids knew
each other and often stayed out well after dark in
the summer is to play flashlight tag or search. Our
biggest concern was calling our parents to let them know
we would be sleeping over at our friend's house. I
mention all of this to understand how terrifying my mother's
story was to a relatively sheltered sixteen.

Speaker 1 (02:02:54):
Year old me.

Speaker 7 (02:02:56):
My mother was and remained one of the most muscular
women I have ever known. She survived decades of mental, emotional,
and I suspect in her early years physical abuse from
my sociopathic father when he tried to prevent her from
getting away by refusing to help cover college expenses, she
moved out and paid every cent independently. When a drunk

(02:03:18):
redneck attempted to assault a friend of hers in a
way that's not so good for YouTube, she gave him
a hard right hook and dropped that pile of human garbage.
And if people ever threatened her kid's safety, God help them.
That woman would make Mama Grizzlies look friendly. So as
you might imagine, I never thought anything could scare this woman,

(02:03:38):
but now I understand that even the bravest person can
fear for their survival when monsters come out of the shadows.
This takes place around nineteen eighty five in my home
state of South Carolina. My parents had only been married
for about two years, Both very excited and determined to
make something of themselves. They didn't have much money back

(02:04:00):
then and rented a tiny apartment till they could save
enough to buy a house. My mom hated that apartment
precisely the large window in their bedroom that people from
the street could easily see into. They wanted to put
up curtains, but there were no rods, and the landlord
was a cheapskate who threatened to keep their deposit if
they even put a dent in the wall. It annoyed
them that they couldn't even have privacy in their own home,

(02:04:23):
but they decided to ignore it since it was a
short term lease. This would be a very big mistake.
Never ignore your guts. This open window would cause mom
to have nightmares for years after. And now let me
tell you about how a murderer first targeted my mom
as a potential victim. My mom was an avid runner
and a competitive cross country athlete through high school and college,

(02:04:47):
so she often went for three or four mile long
runs in the evenings to clear her mind after work.
She was running in a rural area with few houses
and a little traffic on the road. It was an
area that highs schools like to use in the fall
for track and cross country training. She was out in
early summer, so there were no students or other runners around.

(02:05:07):
She liked the quiet and kind of mentally drifted off
for a bit. As an old, brown colored car with
tinted windows came up behind her, she moved off the
road to let them pass. The car seemed to be
going past her the windows were even with her, and
then it slowed down. The vehicle stayed this way for
about ten minutes or so, never speeding or slowing, only

(02:05:28):
staying a few feet behind her. My mom realized this
person had bad intentions and knew her life was potentially
in danger. Worse, there was no one around who could help.
She had to make a quick decision, so she sprinted
off into the field next to her, thankfully finding a
small ditch aligned with several thick bushes. She crawled into
the largest one and laid flat on her stomach to hide.

(02:05:50):
The car had tried to follow, but the curb had
hindered the back wheels. The person attempting to gun it,
but the car would not go forward. They were able
to reverse it and get back on the road. They
drove up the road several times, most likely trying to
see if they could spot my mom. After five or
six passes, they gave up and drove off. Mom was
so scared she barely remembered to breathe, shaking and crying

(02:06:14):
waiting for this malicious person to get out of the car. Thankfully,
they never did. After waiting thirty minutes and no sign
of the car, she returned to her apartment as quickly
as she could. My dad was home at the time
and shocked to see her state. She told him when
had happened and wondered if they should call the cops.
My dad promised her he would take care of it
and told her to take a long, warm shower so

(02:06:36):
she could relax. After all, this was home and he
would never let anyone hurt her. Mom took that shower
and started feeling better when she looked out their bedroom window.
I think you can guess what she saw parked just outside.
It was the same car. Utterly terrified, she screamed and
my dad came running. She pointed out the car and
he lost it. He bolted out of the apartment and

(02:06:56):
ran towards the car, shouting that he would kill them
if they even thought about touching it.

Speaker 1 (02:07:00):
Wife.

Speaker 7 (02:07:00):
Just to let you know, my dad was about five
to ten in thinisirail, friendly and always ready to give
a helping hand. He was not an intimidating figure to
most people. But that day my dad showed that animal
side of him. He showed this creep that he would
do whatever it took to protect his family. The car
immediately backed up tyres, squealing as the man booked it.

(02:07:20):
My parents later called the cops and told them everything Unfortunately,
there wasn't much they could really do but ask questions. Basically,
since there was no actual physical attack, all they could
do was make a note and advise my mom not
to run For quite some time, the way they said
it made it seem as if she was the problem.
They grudgingly accepted this and moved to a new place.

(02:07:42):
Shortly after, no deposit was worth their lives. A few
months passed in reports of multiple young women going missing,
followed by two murders, brought closure to this story. My
mom recognized the car the murderer was driving. It was
the same one that had stalked her. What made her
below run cold was the picture of his victims, all young, blonde,

(02:08:04):
blue eyed women who could have been her sisters. Over
the years, I've googled the victims and it's shocking how
they looked just like her, down to how they styled
their hair. According to the FBI profiler who went on
to write the book that inspired Mind Hunter, this man
was one of the most vicious and sadistic killers he
had ever dealt with, maybe the most evil one in

(02:08:26):
his career. After reading about how he would torture the
families and make those poor girls write a last will.

Speaker 1 (02:08:32):
Before murdering them.

Speaker 7 (02:08:34):
I'm inclined to agree for anyone wondering. You can learn
more about this sick guy in his crimes by googling
Larry Jean Bell.

Speaker 1 (02:08:45):
Thank you swamp Dweller for another creepy story. If you
want more just like that, head on over to his
YouTube channel, swamp Dweller hit subscribe, ring that Bell. Swamp
Dweller kicks off our three each and every night on
this show. Time for Robin.

Speaker 6 (02:09:07):
Hear you think.

Speaker 1 (02:09:25):
There she is, Robin Haynes, thank you so much for
coming on in back on our show. How are you?

Speaker 5 (02:09:32):
I'm good, always happy to be here.

Speaker 1 (02:09:34):
It's always good to have you here. Thank you for
coming on in and joining us. So it's been a
couple of days since we shot our last video of
Flight twenty one and we included you again in on it.
I know you're having a lot of fun with that.

Speaker 5 (02:09:49):
I am.

Speaker 1 (02:09:52):
What the heck is going on?

Speaker 6 (02:09:55):
Well?

Speaker 5 (02:09:55):
First off, you went back farther than you normally do.
Oh okay, And it's not that you can't go back.
There's there's a limit to.

Speaker 9 (02:10:07):
How far back you should go because now you're into
their private area and so when you went that far back,
everything's frequency and energy, so your frequency and energy went
back with it.

Speaker 5 (02:10:19):
And so they came forward. They were checking you out.

Speaker 1 (02:10:24):
Oh you know, I have never ever been at a
place like that where and Robin, I had been in
that meadow before, not a lot of times, but I
would say probably between seven and ten times. I think

(02:10:45):
that's a fair assessment. And I have never been in
that area where all of a sudden, it was like
all of the oxygen left the area, Like we're right
in the middle of everything, you know. Oh yeah, we're
right in the middle of the forest. There's air there.

(02:11:06):
And it literally felt like we had a dome over
top of us that was taking the oxygen.

Speaker 5 (02:11:13):
Yeah. And just so the audience knows what's going on
with that, and a lot of them probably already know
this because they've had their own experiences. But because cryptids
sasquatch are such a high frequency and energy, when you
get up close to them, and they are not doing
this on purpose, it is just part of their body

(02:11:34):
chemistry and makeup, it feels like a weighted blanket being
put over the top of you. It is not that
they are zapping you. That is not what it's like
when you get zapped. Okay, it's just that is the
way they are made. They are high frequency and high energy.
So when you get up close to them, when they
walk up close to you, whether it's cloaked or uncloaked,

(02:11:56):
you feel that heaviness. When you do what Dave did
the other night and had a whole group of them
surround them, there's literally no it's not that you can't breathe.
It feels like you can't breathe. They've had it done
to me before, and it does. It feels like your
whole body's made out of concrete. You cannot take a
full breath because it's almost like you if something weighted

(02:12:18):
over the top of you. And it's the frequency and
energy that they radiate because it's so much stronger than ours.
We live in a three dimensional body. Okay, not that
they can't be in a three dimensional body when they're
in flesh and blood, but they are high frequency, high energy,
and that changes it. Their body is a high frequency body.

(02:12:40):
Ours is third dimension. Theirs is not, so it affects
us different. So when you get like that, you can
always ask them to pull it back. And I want
to say out of every ten times I've asked, nine
times they have pulled back the energy, so it's not
as strong. The last one I had walked two four
in front of me and he it literally, you know.

(02:13:04):
And the more they used the woo, the stronger that
frequency is. And he used it a lot, and he
walked right up to me and he had the other
members of the klan were walking around me, but he
got two foot for me and he was like twelve
and a half foot tall, and it was so strong
I could hardly stand up, and it was definitely not
being zapped. But I had to say to him, please

(02:13:26):
pull it back because my little three D body can't
handle it, and he did, and it made it a
little bit easier to breathe. But it still feels like
you just had this weighted blanket on top of you.
So in your case, that's why it felt like that,
because you didn't have just one or two around you.
You had a ton of them circling around you to
see what you were doing that far back.

Speaker 1 (02:13:48):
Were they in spiritual or physical?

Speaker 5 (02:13:50):
For they were actually cloaked. They were physical, but they
were cloaked, so you would say more spiritual. But yeah,
they were cloaked. You did have some that were uncloaked
that were in the trees and around. There's no reason
for them to cloak because you couldn't see them where
they were, but they were there like if they wanted to,

(02:14:11):
and at times they will they will take and put
their hand. When they're cloaked, they can put their hand
on you and you can physically feel it. They used
to come up behind me and when I would walk
in the woods with them, and they'd play with my
hair or they would pat my shoulder. I had one
squeeze my shoulder, not roughly by any means, but just
almost reassuringly squeeze my shoulder. And I would sit this

(02:14:33):
be standing there and they pick up my hair like this,
you know, and play with my hair. And they were
one hundred percent cloaked. But that doesn't mean that they
can do anything less than what they did when they're physical.

Speaker 6 (02:14:46):
You know.

Speaker 5 (02:14:47):
I've had them leave footprints in the snow while they
were cloaked, so they can do all of those things.
And you had some that were cloaked, you also had
some that were in physical form, but they were back
in the tree line. And I think there was one
or two that were up in the trees, so you
wouldn't have seen them, or wouldn't have thought to see them,
you know. But it does feel heavy like that. That

(02:15:08):
is very common, and like I said, for the people
that are in the audience that have experience being out
in the woods with them when they got that close,
they will probably recognize that feeling as well. And it
does make you feel like you can't breathe because of
the heaviness of it. You absolutely can breathe, but it
makes you feel like you can't because it's that pressure

(02:15:29):
of that energy and frequency.

Speaker 1 (02:15:32):
Yeah, it was. It was a pretty crazy feeling to
be blunt.

Speaker 5 (02:15:36):
Oh yeah, yeah. I had to tell that one. I mean,
I was outside of my vehicle and I had called
for him and he came up, and then the rest
of them came up in a circle around the vehicle,
but he had come directly to a foot in front
of me. I had to lean up against the car
because it was that heavy of a feeling, and you

(02:15:56):
do feel like you can't breathe. It's like when you
have pneumonia and your lungs are filled, you can't get
enough air because you can't expand your lungs well, because
of that frequency and how much pressure it puts on
your body, you feel like you can't. You know. I
was fortunate with him and I asked them, you know,
please step back because you're too strong for me. I
can't do it. And he pulled. He didn't step back,

(02:16:17):
but he pulled the energy back. If you ask them,
they can do it. If not, it's just the normal
way they are. They are not doing that to hurt you.
They are not forcing it on you. Not that they can't,
but that's just part of who they are and what
they are. Same thing will happen with dog men, with
cat people, goat man, lizard man, all of it. ET's
all of it.

Speaker 1 (02:16:39):
The other strange part was the feeling outside of I
think Bigfoot farting on us. Literally they loved that Tim
and I because of that breaking wind experience. Okay, we

(02:17:00):
literally now are going to make sure that when Tim's
not carrying the camera that we have a camera rolling.

Speaker 5 (02:17:09):
Yeah, because yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:17:11):
Like I don't know if it was sasquatch, I don't
know if it was a moose or a bear. We
knew there was something big back there, but yeah, I
mean the just the thoughts of that ten to fifteen
seconds where Tim and I were so caught off guard
we were like, are you kidding me? Right now? Tim

(02:17:33):
thought it was a growl, and I'm like, that isn't
any growl whatsoever.

Speaker 5 (02:17:39):
All I hear is laughter in my head right now.
So my guess would be that I had a lot
to do with them. But they will absolutely do that,
and they can also project that smell and that noise,
like if you're in your vehicle, you can hear it
cut loose and because they can project that on you.
But what you got was the real and they, honestly,

(02:18:01):
I've yet to find any of them that do not
think it is hilarious when they fart on you, Like
they think farts are the funniest thing known to mankind.
It's just ridiculous. And they will sit there and do that,
or they would come up and just to think that
they're funny, and they will make that noise with their
mouth so it sounds like a fart, like you know,

(02:18:24):
they're just a riot. They think that's hysterically funny.

Speaker 1 (02:18:28):
It was weird. It was weird because you know, it
seemed like once again really close, and it happened very close.
To the area where we got the tree knocking from.

Speaker 5 (02:18:52):
Yeah, yeah, they were. You had a lot of them.
I think that's the most I've seen come up to you,
excuse me, since I started working with you on this.
They were just right there, right on top of it.
You know. I think there's a couple different things going on.
You know, you went farther back than normal, and now
you're more into their personal space, and you already had

(02:19:15):
them coming up, and you seem to be drawing bigger crowds.
As time goes by, as they're finding out you're safe,
they're letting more and more of them come up. And
when you first contacted me and we're on your way there,
there was only three, remember because I said the three
of them out there, So there were the three that
were already out there. But then as you got out,
they had already started walking up, and then you went

(02:19:37):
farther back. Now they want to know why you're farther back,
and again, frequency and energy. I sound like a broken record,
but it's just the way the world is, and now
they want to know why it's different in that space.
Do I think it could have been a moose or
whatever that made that noise? I really don't, only because
as many of them as they were, those animals, because
those are prey animals would have gotten out a dodge.

(02:20:00):
They would not have hung around for it, not with
that many of them. Because some of the ones that
came up were the hunters in the klan, So I
can imagine that anything like that, you know, would have
But they will make these weird noises and they think
they're just absolutely hysterical.

Speaker 1 (02:20:17):
What about the creature that Tim saw going up there,
that emaciated deer looking things with rabbit ears and jet
black in color.

Speaker 5 (02:20:29):
Now, the one that I saw, that's why I said
to Tim before he told me the entire description of it,
I said, was the back haunches, you know. Did it
go out farther? That is what And I told you
about this before. The one I saw was more of
a brownish dark color, but it was over in my
side bushes. I don't know what those things are. They

(02:20:50):
seem to be non aggressive. But what I had here
matched that description that Tim had. Like Tim had already
given me a description of the front of it, and
I said, okay, the back of it was like this,
and he said, yeah, that's exactly what it looked like
I wish I knew what they were called. Like I said,
the only thing that Sasquatch would tell me is makaiah.

(02:21:11):
But again, a makaiah is a blanket term that means
they that walks the earth that haves no name. For
all these crazy cryptids that are running around that nobody
knows what to call them. You've got the ones that
the government makes and drops off. You have ones that
the ets drop on me and you know they're running around.
You have ones that will cross breed and they create

(02:21:33):
their own and so there's a lot of cryptoids. People
don't realize that there's so many cryptids out there that
we have no knowledge of. You know, we don't know temperament,
we don't know what they're doing, how they got there,
who created them, or what. But they exist. And the
one that was like what you guys saw that timsaw
walked down the tree line and my property and it

(02:21:55):
was huge, and I watched it and it kind of
looked over towards then it went walking, just kept going
down the tree line and it got partially into the
woods and it was there and then I watched it
cloak and it's been around here a couple different times,
but it's never tried anything aggressive. Never. I mean, it
seems quite shy. It was more than happy to just

(02:22:18):
move away from me, which is basically what happened with
you guys the other night. You know, once it saw
you were there, it turned around, went in the woods.

Speaker 3 (02:22:26):
Or it could have cloaked.

Speaker 5 (02:22:27):
They do have cloaking capabilities. I have not found a
cryptid yet that doesn't. But the one that was here did.
I watched it cloak. It's crazy, I know, And I
don't know what to call it other than you know,
like the sasquatch called you know, I said, what is it?
It's one of one of the makaiah. And again the
makiah is a blanket term for the ones that don't

(02:22:49):
have a name, you know, the military ones. They're all
they don't even have a name for them. They're labeled
by letters and numbers.

Speaker 3 (02:23:01):
You know.

Speaker 5 (02:23:01):
But I don't think these that particular ones. I don't
think the government created those because the only reason the
government would have to create them is for warfare. And
these things are very passive, like I've not seen it
be aggressive with anything at all. It doesn't bother like
where I'm at we have a lot of feral cats.
Doesn't bother the feral cats, doesn't bother the feral dogs.

(02:23:26):
You know, it wasn't aggressive to me on any of
the times that I've seen. It didn't even act like
it was. It was more shy. It was just like, oh, okay, well,
I'm just going to go on about my business and
leave now.

Speaker 1 (02:23:37):
And it left.

Speaker 5 (02:23:39):
It was very non problematic. But they're there.

Speaker 1 (02:23:46):
Well, you know what, when we return from the break
here with Robin Haynes coming up here in the final
half hour of the show, we're going to get to
some audience questions because if not, I'm going to dominate
this show with all my interest in what we're doing
out in the forest of Flight twenty one. And I
know you guys are kind of, you know, sick of it.
We don't want you to get sick of it it.

(02:24:06):
We want you to keep watching our videos that we're
putting out on our YouTube channel called Secrets of the Forest.
Your questions next on spaced Out.

Speaker 10 (02:24:17):
Radio is spaced Out Radio and your hooks needs gone?

Speaker 1 (02:24:41):
All right, We're clear?

Speaker 5 (02:24:43):
Yeah, Well, you guys go got going on out there.
It was fantastic, like there was so many of them
out there, and they just kept coming up from the
back and coming up from the back, and they literally
went in a circle around you. From what I could see,
it was just we you're.

Speaker 1 (02:25:00):
At the end of the night. Though. When it was
it's time to leave now, yeah, it was very forceful,
but not in a dangerous way.

Speaker 6 (02:25:13):
No.

Speaker 5 (02:25:14):
And I think too they were probably out there they
were going to hunt, they were going to get food,
you know, whatever, And they entertained you guys for a
little bit and then they were like, okay, we got
business to do, you know, We're out here for a purpose.
We got to do this, and you guys got to
squirt it out. They followed you all the way back
and kind of edged you out. I don't think I
could not pick up anything there that wanted to intentionally

(02:25:38):
harm you.

Speaker 1 (02:25:39):
No, I didn't feel that way at all.

Speaker 5 (02:25:41):
No, But they were going to make sure that you
understood that it was your exit time, m you know,
And that's okay. As long as they don't want to
do harm, you know, you can work with it, right,
you know. And the thing too, with these guys, they
have this infinite amount of patience, which is great. They

(02:26:02):
can stand behind a tree and not move for hours
at a time, so you don't see them. But when
they want something, when they have it in their head,
they're going to do something. Think of a two year
old toddler. Because they want it then they want it now.
They don't understand the patience with it. When they need

(02:26:22):
patience for their survival, it's incredible. But when they want
something and they get it in their head, it's now,
that's just it's got to happen now. It's like dealing
with the toddler that has the highest IQ that you
can even imagine. And they do they you know, when
they're done, they're done, and they can get over stimulated.

(02:26:42):
They can, you know, And so your energy and frequency
is there on top of theirs. They you know, there's
a few minute time have always come up and they've
got those are used to you, guys. They're used to
your your frequency. They're used to the energy that radiates
off of you. But a lot of them aren't. You know,
you had a ton, You had a ton up there

(02:27:05):
and all circled around you, and not all of them
are used to you guys. So they you know, got
to that point where it's okay, we're good now. We
need to get back to work. We need to get
back to what we're doing. You guys are now leaving.

Speaker 1 (02:27:16):
Was it the big guy who left Merle the staff
last year?

Speaker 5 (02:27:22):
And see if I can get him and tell me yes.

Speaker 1 (02:27:27):
How do you think he's going to react to seeing
Merle again this weekend?

Speaker 5 (02:27:33):
I think it'll be okay. I think you know, he
probably wondered where he went. I think he thinks of
Merle as being part of your group anyway, Yeah, you
know what I mean. I think he'll be okay. I
think he's going to be there to find out, check
him out. He's going to want to know what's going

(02:27:56):
on because he wasn't there for a while. But I
think it'll be okay. I said, when you go back there,
I wouldn't take a lot of people or strangers other
than you and Tim. I would not go back as
far as you did right. They tolerated that from you too,
because you're the ones they have the most contact with.

(02:28:18):
Right to bring anybody else back there, I would be
not as comfortable telling you to do it right and
let them come back up to you guys. That's their
safety point. They've gotten used to that, where you guys
are in a certain area and then they come up,
you know, by the gifting area and everything, and they

(02:28:39):
go to you guys. So stick to that when you're
bringing anybody else.

Speaker 1 (02:28:42):
Do you see anything happening this weekend?

Speaker 5 (02:28:46):
I think you're gonna get noises I hear. I keep
thinking that you're gonna hear not growls, but maybe little
huffs or whatever, just like little noises here and there.
I think you'll hear people walk, hear them walking around
a bit. You know, it's going to depend on how
they react with your guests.

Speaker 1 (02:29:05):
Oh they'll be respectful, Oh.

Speaker 5 (02:29:08):
Yeah, But I mean if if they have been out
with a lot of other areas, a lot of other
sasquatch around them, they may be a little bit not
bad acting, but they may be a little bit more
standoffish because that's another clan coming into their territory, that
residual energy off of them. They'll pick up right, makes sense,

(02:29:30):
and they also it takes them a while, even with
nice people that are new depending on a clan, sometimes
it takes a bit for them to get used to it.
I think if they feel relaxed enough around them, you'll
hear them moving around definitely.

Speaker 1 (02:29:44):
All right, Robin, I'm going to get you to hold
on right there. We're coming back in twenty seven seconds.
Big thank you tonight to Ozzie and Walter AJ times two,
t Bone cat Chaser Kira Louis times two. Thank you
very much for the love and support. Don't forget you
could join a Hi, Deba Rooney, how are you? You
could join our YouTube membership and shop at our store

(02:30:07):
spaced out Radio dot com. We're coming back in five seconds.
Here we go with the final half hour of spaced

(02:30:28):
Out Radio. Robin Haynes and the Cryptid Report hanging on
out with us. We'd love it when she's here. My
name is Dave Scott. I'm the host of this train
wreck that we call spaced Out Radio, and we're glad
for you to tune us on in. Hey. We want
to remind all of you that if you missed most
of this show or others, check out our free archives
on YouTube or any major podcast network. Our website spaced

(02:30:52):
out radio dot com. We have a plethora features for you.
Rock out to bumblefoot, read the news wire, check out
our swag as well. You can follow us on x
It's spaced Out Radio Instagram it's spaced out radio show
and on Patreon. In the Space Travelers Club, here's Robin
Haynes hanging on out with us doing a lot of

(02:31:14):
fun talking about some weird topics. Robin, you are the
best when it comes to all of this weird, strange topics.
Thank you for being here.

Speaker 5 (02:31:23):
Oh, thank you. You're so sweet. I love being with
you guys.

Speaker 1 (02:31:26):
Anyway, well, let's get to some audience questions here, and
you know, uh, there's a couple I'm not going to
ask because they are a little you know, podcast ish,
so we're not going to do that. We're not going
to do that. We're not a podcast here, all right,
Blue Cruise starting. Are the Sasquatch and the dog Men

(02:31:48):
the only cryptids that build stick structures?

Speaker 5 (02:31:51):
No, I'm actually you will see structures from any of them.

Speaker 2 (02:31:59):
You know.

Speaker 5 (02:31:59):
I think primarily think that it's the Dogmen and the
Sasquatch because that's what we are talking about more than
the other ones. But they all will, and then you
get into the elementals and dimensionals, and then they're building things.
You know, if it's out there, it's it's fair game.
So yeah, they will all build them. I think it's

(02:32:20):
more common with Sasquatch and dogmen because we tend to
be more aware of the Sasquatch and dogmen. But the
reality is all of the different cryptids will do them
in their own way. They don't all look the same,
but they will do them all in their own way
as well as elementals and dimensionals.

Speaker 1 (02:32:44):
Are the Sasquatch sticks structures more intricate than dogmen?

Speaker 5 (02:32:49):
You know, I've had people ask me that before. I
think at times, yes, But that's just my experience with them.
I would never or if somebody else's had a different experience
where they've noticed more intricate things with the dogman structures
than I would never say they're wrong. But in my experience,
what I've seen the dog men do opposed to the Sasquatch,

(02:33:11):
the Sasquatch get more detailed. They really they in my experience,
they have.

Speaker 1 (02:33:21):
The Sasquatch and the other cryptids locally source the construction
materials for their own stick structures.

Speaker 5 (02:33:28):
But you know, it's funny about that. When I was
living in Michigan and I had like six massive plan
it was two or three clans that came in. There's
like sixty different individuals, but they would literally, I don't
even know where they got them. I had ten acres
and probably seven of it was wooded, and I would

(02:33:48):
wake up in the morning and I'd walk out there
with them in the morning, and they would have brought
in these logs from these trees. And these logs were
like anywhere from ten feet to thirty feet long. Like,
I don't know where they came from. We never found
roots to them. We never found where they were brought,
you know, or broken off on my property. But they
would bring them in. They would bring in anything they

(02:34:11):
could find that they wanted to use to build a structure.
So in my opinion, no, they'll bring it from anywhere.
We had At one point in fact, egor borstuff was
at my house when this happened. We went out to
where my gifting area was and there was a smiley
faced balloon that it was a helium balloon, and they

(02:34:33):
sold them right in town. So I'm sure that's probably,
you know, somebody had dumped it in the trash bin
or whatever, and it was in my woods and it
was wrapped around the base of a bush and this
place that there's no way it could have blown into
because it was just too thick of the woods. This
had been taken and carried into the woods. I lived
on a private drive. There was nobody down by me,

(02:34:55):
and there's no way for somebody to come in because
I lived at the dead end, you know, so it's
not like anybody could have walked in there. So they
would literally bring in whatever they wanted to use from
other areas. They had no problems bringing it in now.
I mean, I always use the things that were around,
but they would bring all kinds of crazy stuff in

(02:35:18):
and use it to do whatever they wanted, whether it
was to play with or whether it was to build with.

Speaker 1 (02:35:25):
Well, let's go to another question here. Let's go to
Blue Crewise again. Do the Sasquatch, dogmen and other cryptids
step into other cryptids territory or do they respect the
boundaries of each other's space.

Speaker 5 (02:35:39):
Most of the time, my groups that I've worked with
were very respectful of each other's space. There were times that,
you know, let's be honest, that our people don't follow
the rules all the time either, so theirs wouldn't. Some
areas you will find that dogmen and sasquatch will not
share territory. They will not share that space. Other places

(02:36:04):
they will every place I personally have lived at. They
shared territory in space with the dogmen. Did not mean
they all gathered around the campfire together. It meant that
they had respect for what the other one did. They
stayed out of each other's way, but they shared the territory.
But I do know of several places some I've gone
and visited where the dogmen will not be in the

(02:36:26):
same area as a Sasquatch. So I think, to be fair,
it would just have to do with the clans and
what that leader is going to allow. But they do
try to respect each other's boundaries. Now, we would get
occasionally one that would wander into the Sasquatch territory and
other sasquatch that might have been by himself or whatever,

(02:36:47):
and you would look out in my yard and you'd
see him throwing rocks at him. Rocks would just be
flying out of the woods at this one sasquatch, and
they would run it off. They wouldn't allow it to stay,
But I think primarily they are pretty respectful of it.

Speaker 1 (02:37:03):
That's awesome. That's awesome. Okay, let's head on over next
to Joe. Has there ever been a creature such as
a skunk man.

Speaker 5 (02:37:15):
Have I seen one?

Speaker 4 (02:37:17):
No?

Speaker 5 (02:37:17):
Do I believe so? Yes, And the reason why I
say that is I've seen one that had the head
of a possum and a body of a man, all
covered in hair and even hit the possum tail. I've
seen some really crazy cryptids out there, And to say
that there would not be a skunk man, I would
never say that just because of what I've seen. I

(02:37:38):
have not seen a skunk man, but I have seen
the possum thing. And a lot of ets will grab
whatever animal that they find, whether it's a feral dog
or cat, whether it's something in the woods, and they
make these highbreds, and so I would say, in my
opinion that it's entirely possible. Yes.

Speaker 1 (02:38:02):
All right, moving on here, let's go next to and
in Australia, Robin, have you had any contact with the
ant people and does sasquatch have contact with them?

Speaker 5 (02:38:16):
I had a very unpleasant experience with ant people years ago,
and they were not overly kind. But understand that everything
there's good and bad, and everything like there's not bad.
Reptilians all of them aren't bad. Summer good, summer bad.
I would imagine that would be the same thing with
the ant people. My experience with them was not pleasant.

(02:38:39):
They were trying to harm me at the time. As
far as the Sasquatch, they are very cautious which echies
they deal with. I've had my group where they had said,
we're out there and we've seen ships in the sky,
and they were terrified, just terrified. But then other times
certain ships would come in and they were happy. So

(02:39:04):
do I think that they've had contact with them? My
guests would be they probably have. They haven't specifically said
they did, but there are certain et races that they
are very comfortable with and others that they are petrified of.

Speaker 1 (02:39:19):
What explain to people what the ant people are?

Speaker 5 (02:39:24):
What I saw that I believed to be an ant
person bipedal. It had it's an insectoid, and it had
the head that looked just exactly like an ant. The one, well,
there's three of them there, and the one was the
problem that I had. They were probably I want to
say five and a half six feet tall, and they

(02:39:46):
literally the head looked like that of an ant. The
first two that I ran into that night were like
a neutral color. They really they were one color. They
were kind of like a It was weird. It was
like a tannish, weird green color. But the third one

(02:40:08):
that I saw was bigger than those two, and that
one was white and black, and they were all together
because the two were coming up from behind me, and
then the other one came up towards the front, towards me,
and he was white and black where the other ones
were not. So, you know, it was pretty weird. But
they were bipedal. You could definitely tell that they were insectoid.

(02:40:32):
And the head the neck looked exactly like an ant exactly.
The arms on it were very long and spindly, and
you know, as far as the bottom part of it,
I was more focused on looking at what was going
on with the upper half of them than the bottom.
But they were bipedal, and they were very thin built.

(02:40:56):
The legs that I saw, the part of the legs
that I saw were very thin, with a very bony
almost like it wasn't even looking like a kneecap. It
looked more like a joint than it did anything else,
and a thin foot. Now, I have heard of people
that have seen insectazoid that had almost like a three

(02:41:19):
toad that looked like a tripod for their feet. I
personally have not seen those that I remember, but they
are quite tall, they are very very large, and they
have that three pronged that you know they walk on.
The ones that I saw that I felt were ant people,

(02:41:42):
they did not have that.

Speaker 1 (02:41:46):
Are they alien or are they something else?

Speaker 5 (02:41:49):
No, they're alien. Do I think that there could be
a cryptied out there made out of an ant I
think there could be a crypto out there made out
of anything. In my opinion, the energy that radiated off
that I saw were strictly aliens.

Speaker 1 (02:42:08):
Let's go to our next question. Let's go to Seymour.
If bigfoot, end or dog man truly exist, do they
have any incentive for letting us know that they exist?

Speaker 5 (02:42:21):
To know, a lot of them will stay either up
in the mountains or in very heavily forested areas so
that they don't have to have contact with us because
they don't want us. We're not kind. We kill what
we don't understand rather than learn about it, and we
are a lower frequency and energy which makes them uncomfortable.
Although a lot of people are raising their frequency now,

(02:42:42):
but there are some that try to get through to
us to realize the damage that we do to ourselves
to them, not so much the dogmen. That there's a
few dogmen that actually do try to help. I've been
helped by dogmen before, but they seem to want to
say more away from us than the Sasquatch. The Sasquatch,

(02:43:02):
God love them. They just keep trying to help us
out and try to, you know, teach us. And we
are the problem. Not that there aren't bad ones of them,
but we are the problem.

Speaker 1 (02:43:14):
Okay, so let's let's go to another question. You know,
let's go to Rock and Rory. What do you consider
the Sasquatch mean by play? What do they mean by
come play with us?

Speaker 5 (02:43:26):
I want you to be very careful when you hear that. Okay,
a lot of times they just want interaction. But what
I will say is this, I've had the good ones
want me to come out and they'd want to play.
But all I do is almost like playing hide and seek.
You know, I'd go out there. But a lot of
the bad ones will do that because they know we

(02:43:48):
as our type of humans, we are out there trying
to figure out what they're doing, what they are, and
they'll say, oh, come out and play. The reality is
they don't want us to go to them. They want
to come to us. So when you get some that
say come to play, I want you just to be
very careful because some of the bad ones will do

(02:44:09):
that to lure you into the woods so they can
do whatever they're going to do. Now, I have had
good ones, you know, worded a little bit different, still
kind of the same thing, or you know, come out
walk with us or come out sit with us. They
used to do that to me every night when I
was in Michigan. But I knew those I knew those ones.
I knew I was okay. So if you're dealing with

(02:44:31):
ones that you don't know, or if you don't know
how to read the energy to make sure it's one
that you know or don't know, Please when they say that,
don't do it, because number one, you don't know for
sure if it's a Sasquatch. It could be anything out
there that wants to harm you. And they are truly
much more comfortable when they come to us, not us

(02:44:51):
going to them. That puts them in a different comfort level.
So just I caution you to be careful. I'm not
telling you that everyone that says that is bad, but
it is something that you need to be seriously cautious about.
They prefer to come to us so that they have
that control when they are asking you to come into

(02:45:13):
the woods with them. There are a lot of times
it is for a nefarious reason. So I want you
just to be very careful when you do that. You know,
if it's one you know well and you've been hanging
out with or whatever, that's a little bit different.

Speaker 4 (02:45:29):
You know.

Speaker 5 (02:45:29):
They the ones that I knew very well would ask
me to come out all the time, and I did,
but I knew them, I had worked with them for years.
I knew I was safe there. But if it's not
one that you have one hundred percent confidence in and
they're saying that, please do not do that just for
your own safety, I'm like safety policewoman.

Speaker 1 (02:45:47):
Five minutes ago. Robin Haynes is our guest or the
cryptid Q and A. Here, let's go to AJ. How
can you identify benevolent versus non benevolent aliens?

Speaker 5 (02:46:00):
It all comes excellent question. It all comes down to
energy and frequency. Energy and frequency does not lie, It
cannot be faked. This is where it's so important that
you learn how to read the energies and read the frequencies.
This is why I went into business, This is why
I started teaching these classes, because that is what keeps
you safe. You cannot hide your energy and frequency. If

(02:46:24):
you are a person that is not a kind person,
or an et or a cryptid, and you are not
kind and you portray yourself to be just the sweetest thing, ever,
your energy and frequency give you away, and it still
comes off that your lower frequency and energy and you
are bad. It cannot be faked. It is impossible. And
so that is how you tell. Because the bad things

(02:46:47):
will try to trick you. The good things are going
to be honest, so that's not a problem. But the
stuff that is bad will come to you and pretend
that they're good to gain your trust, to get you
to do what they want want you to do, and
then you have problems. And that's not just with cryptids,
that's with aliens, that is with elementals, dimensionals, spirits, all

(02:47:09):
of those things. So that's why if you're going to
be involved with this, it doesn't have to be learning
from me. I don't care who you learn it from,
but it's so vital that you learn how to read
the energies and the frequencies because your safety depends on it.

Speaker 1 (02:47:27):
Three minutes ago here, why is safety dependent on this?

Speaker 5 (02:47:35):
Because those energies and frequencies don't lie, and anything can
come to you and tell you that they're good. And
because our people want to have contact with these beings
so badly we want to believe they're good. We have
a lot of people that just automatically think they're bad
because they exist, okay, But the reality of it is

(02:47:58):
the bad things will come to you and tend to
be good so they can do whatever it is they
have planned for you. And certain entities have to have permission.
I'm not talking about sasquatch and dogma. I'm talking about
certain entities, certain aliens. They have to have permission for
us to allow them to do whatever they want to do.

(02:48:19):
So if they portray to you that they're good and
it's come play with me in the woods or let
me in the door or whatever, and we think they're
good because they're sounding really nice, and then they're not.
We just gave them permission to do what they want
to do with us, you know, and so that becomes
a big problem. They can come to you like, let's
say you are my speaking with one named Billy Bob.

(02:48:41):
And you do this for two or three weeks and
you're very comfortable with it, but you don't know how
to read the energies and the frequency. And one comes
in and it says, hey, it's me Billy Bob. It
could be the devil Incarrent. You don't know because you
didn't learn how to read the energies and the frequencies,
and so you're going to take it at its word,
and it could be using that good one that you've
been working with and telling you it's that one in

(02:49:03):
order to harm you. The bad things do not want
people with high frequency and energy. They want to take
them down. They want to destroy them because it makes
them uncomfortable and they can't survive around it. So if
you are working with good ones, that is because you
are a higher frequency and energy, So the bad things
want you destroyed. And if they have to pretend to
be a good one and to be able to get

(02:49:24):
hold of you, they will do that. And so that's
why it is so vital that if you're going to
be working with any of these things, know your frequency
and energy.

Speaker 1 (02:49:37):
Ninety seconds ago, Robin and I want to say thank
you always for being just a major, major help for
what we are doing out of Flight twenty one and
everything that you do. I mean, you know what's amazing
is when we go in you don't give generalized quotes.

(02:50:00):
You say exactly what you're saying and exactly what you're
seeing and exactly what you think is going to happen,
and then we go in there and it all happens.
It all happens, and well, I'm telling you, like, look,
anytime you have somebody on the air that is intuitive

(02:50:25):
in one way or another, there's usually the eye rollers
out there who are like, oh yeah, another psychic, or
they're vague or you know, does the name start with
the letter T? Picking up a T? You know, I mean,
you know how it goes. And watching you in action,
well not watching, but listening to you in action because

(02:50:47):
you're like three thousand miles away from me, yeah, never
been to the area, never seen the area, and predicting
what is going on. It is incredible. You are absent
resolutely incredible.

Speaker 5 (02:51:02):
Thank you. I'm just I'll be honest with you. I
am very humbled and honored to even be a part
of that journey that you guys are on. Like it
means the world to me. I've always been this person
that I can't imagine why anybody would want to hear
anything I have to say to begin with. So to
be part of that with you guys, I absolutely love it.
I'm very honored. I really am.

Speaker 1 (02:51:25):
Well. We're glad that you are a part of it too,
because you know, with Tim and I, you know, needing
some sort of direction on what's going on between you
and Lawn Strickler. You guys have really brought that to us.
So thank you very much, Robin, and we love you
and we appreciate you.

Speaker 5 (02:51:43):
I love you too.

Speaker 1 (02:51:44):
All Right, We're going to say good night to Robin Haynes. Robin,
you hold on as we say hello next to mister Ron.
Bumblefoot thal Rocket in the background with little brothers watching.
Bumblefoot is the official music of Spaced Out Radio Rocket
US in and out of every single show. Get your
horns up for the guitar gods himself special Thanks to

(02:52:07):
everybody listening in at work, at home, in your cars,
wherever you may be. Thank you to everyone in our
chat rooms tonight, YouTube, Twitch, elgab, Facebook, Spreaker, LinkedIn, the
Space Travelers Club and on x at hashtag spaced Out Radio.

(02:52:32):
Remember this show is copyright by spaced Out Radio and
Bigfoot Broadcasting Limited. Thank you so much for using TUESDA
to share your evening with us, because together, my friends,
we own the night. Mister Bumblefoot, we need a favor,

(02:52:52):
We need you to take us home. Yes, the WU
train has docked for the night, but soon, my friends,
we shall ride again. Your seats are always available, your
tickets never expire, and if you want to bring a friend,

(02:53:15):
we've got room for them too. Good Night, everybody,

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Aug. 12/25 - Studying Paranormal Researchers with Dr. Urszula Wolski

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Aug. 12/25 - Studying Paranormal Researchers with Dr. Urszula Wolski