Oct. 10/25 - Life on Mars with George J. Haas

George J. Haas is an author and a research of the planet Mars. George believes that there's a plethora of evidence showing that there was life on Mars at one point in time, before some sort of nuclear holocaust caused the entire planet to shift into lifelessness.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hello, and welcome to the radio and podcast side of
spaced Out Radio tonight. My name is Dave Scott. We
are in roll call right now prepping for George Jay
has where we're gonna talk about Mars. Oh, it's gonna
be fun. Its gonna be a lot of fun. And
Paul Nicholas, how you doing tonight? Good to see you,
and let's see here. Who's next on our list? Algaray

(00:26):
over on Twitch. Fourteen hundred pull ups in six and
a half minutes to warm up for the Mars talk tonight.
That's good.

Speaker 2 (00:34):
And who else is here? Well?

Speaker 1 (00:37):
Scrolling on down running out of time? Necessary dialogue? Thank
you for the super chat. Greatly appreciate your love and support.
And I'm hardcore over on X. Nice to see you,
my friend. What else do or who else do? We
got here? Deanna and nice to have you here. And Alexi,

(00:59):
nice to see you. Throw those horns up. Let's rock.

Speaker 3 (01:08):
Are you ready to hear your mister Voice of the Knights,
he's here, the quiet ready useless, Let's point our ears
tools that we can cabin Knights went together, my friends.

Speaker 4 (01:30):
Oh the.

Speaker 3 (01:39):
Last time for spaced Out Radio with Dave.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Scott from the Mountains of Central British Columbia to you
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I am your host, Dave Scott, sitting in the Captain's
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(02:06):
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(02:27):
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our website. We have an amazing show tonight because we're
gonna look up way and if you get that reference,

(02:50):
you're as old as I am. Look up up. Do
you remember the friendly Giant? You remember him? Or is
that just us Canadians who remember him? Anyways, we're gonna
have George J. Hass here. We're going to talk about Mars.
What was happening up there? What's going on up there?
It's a fascinating topic. We'll get to him momentarily. Then

(03:12):
in nour number three, swamp Dweller will kick things off.
Then the man we call b Arthur because he has
a golden voice, Brent Thomas from the Paranormal Portal podcast,
will be here hanging on out with us for the
Q and A. So let's have some fun tonight, shall we.
George J. Hass is the founder and premier investigator of

(03:34):
the Mars research group known as the Sedonia Institute. A
member of the Society for Planetary Seti Research, he has
co authored two books and six peer reviewed science papers
related to anomalous formations on the surface of Mars. He
has appeared on many television and radio shows to discuss

(03:54):
this major topic, and tonight, for the first time, he
joins us on space Out Radio. His website Thesedoniainstitute dot
com if you want to check it on out George
Jhas Welcome to spaced Out Radio for the first time.
How are you pretty good? It's good to have you here.

(04:16):
A nice solid beard and mustache combination. That's what we'd
like to see around here. You know, I know our
radio audience can't see it, but you know you can
take my word for it, George, I mean the love
of Mars. How did this begin for you?

Speaker 5 (04:32):
Well, I'm a graduate of the bisentennial class from high
school in nineteen seventy six. That was the bi centennial
period of our country back down here in America. The
States and NASA had put up two probes going to Mars,
the Viking one and Viking two. And you know, that

(04:53):
summer of nineteen seventy six, NASA had taken a picture
of the Sedonia area and they found an image of
formation that looked like a human head, and they had
a press conference and it was a big ordeal. Everybody
was excited. And then they said, well, we took another
picture a couple hours later and it disappeared, and basically

(05:13):
that was the end of that story. But that's when
I initially got involved in having this idea that possibly
there's structures and maybe some lost civilization on Mars. From
my high school time and through college and things like that,
it was always in the back of my mind, and
you know, I didn't really get back into it until
much later in the late nineteen nineties when NASA decided

(05:36):
to go back to Mars.

Speaker 6 (05:37):
So that's basically how this all started for me.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
I think we all kind of have a fascination with
the Red planet, you know, because all the movies growing
up in our generations, if there was aliens or extraterrestrials,
they all seem to come from Mars. At that point,
you know, it was always very interesting that we think
that there is life there, let alone, you know, some

(06:01):
sort of civilization that may have lived and colonized on
that planet many moons ago. U pun intended the love
that you had as you started kind of looking into
it and started taking it seriously. What made you kind
of just give your own head and shift and say,
you know what, there might be something here, There could

(06:22):
be something I need to look at here.

Speaker 5 (06:26):
Well, after I graduated high school, I went into art
school my academic training.

Speaker 6 (06:33):
I'm an artist. I'm not a scientist.

Speaker 5 (06:36):
I just want your listening audience to know that I'm
not a scientist.

Speaker 6 (06:40):
I'm not a geologist. I'm not a physicist. I'm an artist.

Speaker 5 (06:44):
I went to school studied art in the nineteen eighties.
I exhibited up in New York in Soho and in
the East Village area. I had a one man show
at the Ivan Karp. Now Ivan Karp worked for the
Leo Castelli gallery back in the sixties. He was the
one that discovered Andy Warhol and a lot of the

(07:08):
big artists in the sixties, and so.

Speaker 6 (07:10):
I was very happy to have a show at that gallery.

Speaker 5 (07:15):
I'm not a famous artist or anything, but that's basically
my history.

Speaker 6 (07:18):
I'm an artist. I'm a sculptor, painter, so I have.

Speaker 5 (07:21):
That visual eye and looking at Mars, you know, seeing,
of course, the face on Mars is sculptural image of
a human face.

Speaker 6 (07:29):
That kind of really got my attention.

Speaker 5 (07:31):
And I really didn't get involved in really studying Mars
until the Mars Global Surveyor mission went up, and that
was in nineteen ninety eight when NASA decided to take
another picture of this famous face on Mars, and you know,
let's scotch this thing up once for good and prove

(07:51):
to the world that this is just a pile of rocks.
So that's what really got me studying this in late
nineteen nineties.

Speaker 1 (07:59):
Going back to people, you've obviously talked to thousands upon
thousands of people regarding this subject, over the years. Why
do we just fascinate about this planet?

Speaker 5 (08:12):
Well, I think it's the history of Mars a lot,
like you said earlier, a lot of the science fiction
movies surrounded Even if this whole story wasn't about Mars,
there was always this inclination in the film that whatever
the creature was might have come from Mars, and so
a lot of people are fascinated by it, especially with
Perceville taking his telescope and seeing what he thought were

(08:36):
canals and things like that. So we've always been intrigued
with Mars, and in the back of our minds, we're
always hoping that, oh, maybe there was life on Mars,
and maybe someday we'll go there and find out.

Speaker 1 (08:49):
Do you think we'll ever get there in our lifetime?

Speaker 5 (08:52):
Well, I think we're on our way to Mars. Elon Musk,
you know, he's obsessed with building a colony on Mars.
He got a little sidetracked with politics here in the
beginning of the year. So I don't know what's going
on with the plans with NASA and Elon must They
Originally they were going to do the Artemist mission and

(09:13):
go back to the Moon. The idea was they were
going to have the first woman, you know, walk down
the ladder and go on the Moon, and I don't
know if that's been put on the back burner because
I know Elon he wants to bypass the Moon and
go right to Mars. But there hasn't been much talk
of what they're doing in the last couple of months

(09:33):
that I know of, so it's all been like, like
I said, push to the back burner. I don't know
what they're doing, but the plans are they'd like to
set up a colony on Mars that we could you know,
study the planet and possibly look for minerals and things
like that. There's because there's a lot of probably exotic
type of minerals that we could be finding on Mars
to use.

Speaker 1 (09:53):
Well, if you look at Elon Busk for a second,
everything that he has realistically done, you know, we look
at the technologies of Tesla or his Boring corporation, his
robotic company, his obviously his rocketry with SpaceX, it's all
built for Mars, you know, because there's not going to

(10:16):
be gas stations on Mars, but you know what the
cars will be able to charge, right.

Speaker 5 (10:24):
Well, yeah, he's focused. That's what he wants to do.
He thinks that it's time that we need to explore
and put settlements on at least at least Mars go
that far. And you know, I think within the next
ten years we're going to be there.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
Man, I would love to see that in my lifetime,
I really would, you know. I think the one thing
that kind of trips me out about us potentially, you know,
populating Mars is a study that I heard a couple
of year years ago where when humans get acclimated to Mars,

(11:05):
they will never be able to come back to Earth
because of the gravitational pull. That is, you know, their
bodies will not be able to handle Earth's cravitix and
that literally their their bodies will eventually collapse on themselves.
And I just found that really really interesting that you know,

(11:28):
Mars is really a one way trip. You know, maybe
not for humans in the future where you know, there
will be intergalactic tourism, but the other way around is
going to be able to work.

Speaker 6 (11:41):
Well.

Speaker 5 (11:41):
I think initially it's going to be like you know,
the English chauver in England when they decided to go
to the New World, they weren't coming back.

Speaker 6 (11:49):
It was a one way trip.

Speaker 5 (11:50):
You're going to America and you know setting up the
first you know, thirteen colonies. And I think once we
get to the Mars, either with Elon Musk or someone else,
it's probably going to be the same type of thing.
They're going to set up bases of colonies, and we
may have a similar, you know, replay of history where

(12:11):
we decide to settle on Mars with all these little colonies,
and you know, all of a sudden, you know, now
we have thirteen states on Mars, and then they say, well,
we don't want to be connected to Earth anymore.

Speaker 6 (12:24):
We want to run our own show, and then there's
going to be a war.

Speaker 5 (12:28):
So it may be history repeating itself, but going to
another planet. And I think that's that's probably the scenario
when you go to Mars, if I had the opportunity,
or you or whoever is going to go, it's it's
not going to be that you're going to go to
Mars for three months and come back.

Speaker 6 (12:43):
You're going to go there to stay and live.

Speaker 1 (12:45):
Would you do it?

Speaker 6 (12:48):
I'd love to do it, but.

Speaker 5 (12:49):
I have a lot of ailments with my elbow and
my knee, and I don't think i'd pass the physical
and I'm I'm in my sixties.

Speaker 6 (12:57):
I don't think i'd be qualified.

Speaker 1 (12:59):
No, but let's say you were thirty years younger, you know,
but you still had that awesome beard and mustache combination. Okay,
would you go?

Speaker 6 (13:10):
Sure?

Speaker 5 (13:10):
I'd love to go. That's you know, that's for me.
It would be like going to the New World.

Speaker 6 (13:16):
I mean, who wouldn't want to go.

Speaker 5 (13:17):
I'd be right on the right, on the boat or
the ship however we're going to get there.

Speaker 6 (13:21):
I'm ready to go. I'm going to stay there.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
I wouldn't go.

Speaker 6 (13:27):
You wouldn't go.

Speaker 1 (13:28):
I wouldn't go. I would go for like I would
go to like the International Space Station or the Moon.
Totally do that. But Mars, it just I'm not a
guy who likes finality on things.

Speaker 6 (13:45):
I see.

Speaker 5 (13:45):
Well, I'd like to go there because I think there's
a lot of civilization there, which you know, we'll probably
talk about later. There's there's so much evidence of structures.

Speaker 6 (13:54):
And there's all of these ancient settlements that are up
there and they need to be explored. And that's one
thing I'd love.

Speaker 5 (14:03):
To go up there and look at and you know,
start doing a little digging.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
Oh man, I wonder what you would find up there,
you know, because I don't believe for a second NASA
has shown us anything.

Speaker 5 (14:21):
Well, I think all the images that we get from
the Mars Global surveyor the Mars Reconstance orbiter, that the
new camera that's up there, I think these are all
legitimate pictures that NASA's sending back.

Speaker 6 (14:34):
A lot of the people working at NASA, they're just
looking at geology.

Speaker 5 (14:37):
They want to see how this history of the planet,
what happened to it, how did it lose its atmosphere.
They don't even have a thought that there might be
structures up there. And so as for NASA hiding information,
I don't think they're really hiding a lot because we
have so much information. And I've been doing this for
thirty years, and I have files full of structures that

(15:00):
would blow your mind that NASA has taken pictures of.
NASA is like a photographer that takes pictures of their
surroundings and then sticks them in the drawer and doesn't
talk about them.

Speaker 6 (15:11):
That's basically what they do.

Speaker 5 (15:13):
They don't really do much science or any discussion about
what they're taking pictures of. They put them out there
and you know, let the public look at them occasionally.
If there's some type of geological formation that scientists can
delve into and figure out how this affects the surface
and was this water area, Oh, they're all into that.
But if there's something up there that looks like a pyramid,

(15:33):
five sided pyramid and three sided pyramid, they don't have
anything to do with it.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
Hey, they've played dumb on the UFO subject for decades now,
so it's not surprising, right.

Speaker 6 (15:47):
I think the next shoe to drop.

Speaker 5 (15:49):
You know, they've already shown these UFO pictures that the
Navy has taken, the tic TAC and all these other
oddities that the official you know, pilots have taken pictures
of these things film them. So we're pretty much, you know,
being enlightened about what type of vehicles that the government
knows about. And I think the next thing they will

(16:09):
be telling us, probably in the next year or so,
that they found microbial life. That'll be the opening the
door for us to understand what's on Mars. I think
the first step will be saying they found these microbial
things with the little rovers that are driving around, and
after that then they'll talk structures and artifacts.

Speaker 1 (16:30):
The one thing that the NASA is very good at
is giving you morsels rather than you know, proper information.
Do you think that, you know, with them coming out
a couple of weeks ago about the microbial you know,
life on Mars that they believe they had found it,
do you believe that they are you know, taking the

(16:50):
first steps to saying that maybe there was something else there.

Speaker 6 (16:54):
Yeah. I think there'll be more and more information about
the microbial life.

Speaker 5 (16:58):
But then you're going to have the critics in the
scientific community will say, well, you know, we've already contaminated Mars,
that's why you're finding microbial life. So there'll be all
this debate going back and forth, was are these actual
microbial organisms that were indigenous to Mars or is it

(17:19):
something we know?

Speaker 6 (17:20):
We have things that.

Speaker 5 (17:21):
We have rovers that go there, and of course they're
supposed to be sanitized. But you know, the Russians have
sent missions there, they've crashed. We have no idea what
was involved in those missions. And that'll be the criticism
that once they are one hundred percent sure they have
a little microbial things crawling around, the critics will say, well,

(17:42):
we put them there, we brought them when we took
the rovers and all of the crash satellites that happened there,
and that's all that is.

Speaker 6 (17:48):
It's nothing to do with Mars. So we'll have to
go through that.

Speaker 5 (17:52):
The only way we're going to have real concrete evidence
about what's on Mars is to go there, and so
I'm all for musk mission to go there.

Speaker 6 (18:01):
So once you go there, it's going to be easy
to look at this stuff.

Speaker 1 (18:07):
What do you think would be the hardest challenge for
humanity when we get there?

Speaker 6 (18:15):
But I guess, you know, living in the isolation.

Speaker 5 (18:19):
One thing that the colonies had when they came to America,
they had, you know, lions or the cougars, and they
had wolves and bears to look out for, and of
course the indigenous people that were at times hostile and
attacking them. They were attacking the Indians, So there were
people there going to Mars. There's, as far as I

(18:40):
can see, there's nothing there. If there's any if there's
anybody living there, it's it's the Ets, it's not indigenous people,
because Mars is a dead planet. So I think it
would be pretty safe to say that if you go there,
you don't have to worry about you know.

Speaker 6 (18:52):
Animals eating you at night.

Speaker 5 (18:54):
It's just that you're going to be living in pretty
harsh environment.

Speaker 1 (19:00):
You think we'll be able to adjust or do you
think it's going to take years of robotics setting things
up before we're able to actually plant humans on the ground.

Speaker 6 (19:10):
Well, yeah, robotics will probably pay a big part of it.
You know. Of course, you know humans are apt.

Speaker 5 (19:15):
To get you know, space madness. You know the old
Ren and Stimpy.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
Good good call. I will always take an analogy from
Ren and Stimpy.

Speaker 5 (19:24):
You know, space madness could be a problem, but we'll
see how it goes. You know, they already nacess already
doing experiments with these people living in these habitats, you know,
making believe they're on Mars.

Speaker 6 (19:35):
To see how that goes. So they're already getting people
ready for that trip. So we'll see what happens.

Speaker 5 (19:42):
I think they'll they'll they'll do well because they're military minded,
you know, they're they're trained to do this. It's not
like they're just picking you know, school teachers or somebody
that works at Walmart to go to Mars. These are
they're all going to be people that have been trained
and you know, people that also possibly told that if
you see any artifacts, do not touch them or tell

(20:02):
anybody that you saw it.

Speaker 1 (20:08):
Do you think or how many rockets do you think
it's going to take to get up there? I mean,
we haven't even launched one. We're still in the testing phases.
When I say we, I mean humanity, not you and
me personally. We know it's SpaceX. But how many do
you think? How many rockets do you think you're going
to have to get up there before we're even able

(20:28):
to start even thinking of colonization.

Speaker 5 (20:32):
Well, I think Musk is pretty confident in what he's doing,
and once he has something ready to go, I think
it's it's.

Speaker 6 (20:38):
Going to be pretty quick.

Speaker 5 (20:40):
But you know, when we in the United States when
we had the you know, the the Shuttle missions that
were going back and forth and we lost that one
that blew up, I mean, we didn't have a space
program for years after that. It was I thought that
was really a bad way to advance the scientific and

(21:02):
you know, to venture out into space, you know, going
back again to like you know, coming to the New
World from Europe. You know, back in the day when
they lost a ship, they didn't say, oh, we can't
be sending any more ships out.

Speaker 6 (21:17):
Because we're going to fall off the edge of the Earth.

Speaker 5 (21:19):
You know, they were still sending ships out, but we
stopped our whole space program for i mean almost ten years,
and that that was a big setback. And I think
when you decide to go explore Mars, we're going to
lose people.

Speaker 6 (21:33):
I mean, ships are going to blow.

Speaker 5 (21:34):
Up, rockets are going to blow up, they may land
incorrectly on Mars, or we're.

Speaker 6 (21:38):
Going to lose people. But that's what you have to.

Speaker 5 (21:39):
Do to progress, and you know, learn from your mistakes.
So I mean, I've that's how I'm looking at it.
That you know, we've had disasters, you know, trying to
go to the North Pole and going to New worlds,
so the same thing will possibly happen going to Mars.
There's going to be accidents, and we can't just stop
the program because you know, of a few lives that

(22:02):
are lost, not to diminish any lives, but this is
this is science, this is man's destiny.

Speaker 6 (22:08):
We have to keep going.

Speaker 2 (22:10):
I wonder how that make any sense.

Speaker 1 (22:12):
No, I think it makes a lot of sense, because
you're right, you know, there are going to be people
lost on the way, if they shoot up eight rockets,
there's a high chance of probability that all not all
eight rockets are going to make it, you know. I mean,
and you've got to realize, I mean, with these rockets,
they're not going to be sending up just three or
four people at a time. They got to be able

(22:34):
to figure out how to send twenty or thirty at
a time.

Speaker 6 (22:38):
Right, So that's what Elon Musk is thinking of doing.

Speaker 5 (22:41):
Yeah, there's going to be these whole, you know, massive
ships going to Mars once.

Speaker 6 (22:45):
They start to settle it. So yeah, you're going to
have an ex fighting time, you know.

Speaker 1 (22:51):
But I mean, I think it's still going to be
I'm going to say maybe another twenty five years before
we even look at seeing a human put on there though,
because I mean, they're going to have to get things
set up, and they're going to need the robotics of
Elon Musk's robots there in order to set up things

(23:13):
like encampments, and probably because of the heat, they'll have
to be able to set up things like air conditioners
and and oxygen tanks and and maybe dig tunnels underground
and set up the boring machines so that way they
have areas to be a lot more comfortable for the people.

(23:34):
You know, you have to be able to set up
all this stuff. Will they find you know, they believe
there's water up there, maybe it's in the poles frozen,
but I mean they still have to figure out if
that's going to be healthy enough or contaminated for humans.
You know, there's a lot of things that they will
need to do before people even attempt to get there.

Speaker 6 (23:55):
Yeah, you're right.

Speaker 5 (23:56):
The probably the initial programs will be you know, set
habitats that can be inflated and built or whatever with
by the robots and with a very small human footprint there.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
Well, we're going to learn, you know, and like I said,
I think it will be in our lifetime before we
you know, when we start to find out if it's
even possible. I mean, the question is how many billions
is it going to cost? That's the big one, and
we're going to get to more. George Jhass is our
guest tonight on spaced Out Radio. The Sedoniainstitute dot Com

(24:34):
is his website. You can find his books there for
your library. This is spaced Out Radio. We will return
for the second half hour right after this all right,

(24:59):
we are clear. We got about five minutes. All right,
let me unmute you here, boss, are we me? I'm here,
m hmm, A little warm in here. Just gonna open

(25:22):
up my studio window one of these days. I'm hoping,
just hoping that when I got my window open, like
all of a sudden, like a bear shows up at
my window and it's like sticking his nose in there.
I think that would be really cool. I want to
see that.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
I do want to see happen.

Speaker 1 (25:42):
George place now now it's warm in here. There we go,

(26:24):
don Patrick, you make it two hundred. We may have
a deal, but you gotta fight my kid for it.
Oh man. I think the website is going up next
week for a Caribou kan So we'll let you guys know.
Lacy Blue, good morning to you. M Deb Brooney. How's

(27:09):
the autograph signing going? Yes, Deb, I'm warm because you're here.
That's exactly right. I'm gonna turn that off so that
way we can see that beautiful face here is George.

Speaker 6 (27:30):
What's that.

Speaker 1 (27:46):
H one second here?

Speaker 6 (27:53):
Alrighty mm?

Speaker 1 (28:01):
I know everybody wants the sports updates. Some of us
are recording, some of us are recording. Go easy on him, Joe,
go easy on him. It's not like the idiot the

(28:23):
other day who was trying to sneak in some racist comments.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:33):
We caught a dude the other day in our chat
room where he was making racist comments by typing out
a bunch of stuff and then capitalizing the first letter
of each word.

Speaker 6 (28:47):
Nice.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
Yeah, I didn't see it. One of my mods did,
and I'm like.

Speaker 6 (28:53):
Wow, that seems premeditated.

Speaker 1 (28:56):
Yeah, I don't do that crap. I'm pretty Uh. People
need to realize my chat room is not freedom of speech,
it's a devocracy, and kind of go from there. All right,
Jaron's Carter, how are you? I will not be watching

(29:20):
the halftime show only because I'm not a fan of
Bad Bunny. Why won't they just play Metallica just once?
The people who have the money to watch to pay
for the Super Bowl tickets are Metallica fans. Although I
would have loved to have seen that one in LA

(29:41):
with Doctor Dre and Snoop Dogg and eminem was that
was a good, my favorite one in a long time.
All right, Uh, we've got about twenty seven seconds. Thank
you tonight to Debor Rooney Von Patrick Necessary Dialogue and
Caddy Whackers for the super chats tonight. Really appreciate you

(30:06):
supporting sor much love. Don't forget to shop at our
space Out Radio store on our website. Why we do
not have ugly swag, people, no ugly swag, so check
it on out. Here we go with the second half hour.

(30:41):
Welcome back to space Out Radio. My name is Dave Scott.
Second half hour underway, as we're going to get into
talk about Mars with researcher George Jay Haas and his website,
The Sedoniainstitute dot com. Hey, before we bring George back on,
we want to remind you that if you've missed portions
of this show or others, check out our free archives

(31:03):
on YouTube or any major podcast network. Our website spaced
out Radio dot com. We have a plethora of features
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on Patreon in the Space Travelers Club. Here we go

(31:24):
George Jay Haas the Sedonia Institute dot com and we're
going to talk about Mars here. Now you started studying
these photographs very seriously.

Speaker 5 (31:35):
When George back in nineteen ninety eight with the Mars
Global Surveyor, when they NASA decided to send another spacecraft
out there to take some more pictures of the surface,
and it was an exciting time. They actually took a
new photograph of the famous face on Mars and a

(31:57):
lot of other things on the planet.

Speaker 6 (31:59):
And we were finding stuff all over.

Speaker 5 (32:02):
The place, not only in the famous Sidonia area where
the Face on Mars is with the DNM pyramid and
all the city structures that Richard Hoagland had talked about,
but we were finding there were things that looked like pyramids,
four sided pyramids, three sided pyramids, all over the place
on Mars.

Speaker 1 (32:22):
Was there one photo that caught your attention that really
brought it home for you?

Speaker 6 (32:30):
Well, we uh the problem with NASA.

Speaker 5 (32:34):
You know, they had the pictures of the Face on
Mars from nineteen seventy six, and they only had basically
the one really.

Speaker 6 (32:41):
Good picture they took. There was two pictures of the
face on Mars originally.

Speaker 5 (32:45):
And there was a large panoramic view of the Sidonia area,
but they were poor Viking images and so we didn't
see anything new for like over twenty years, you know,
So if you're a signientist that was interested in looking
at these things that took you know, you could have
been dead by the time we got new images.

Speaker 6 (33:09):
And science is very slow.

Speaker 5 (33:11):
With NASA, it takes a long period of time for
them to take pictures of these structures that we find
to be interesting.

Speaker 6 (33:20):
They have a program with the Mars.

Speaker 5 (33:23):
Reconnaissance orbiter which takes these high resolution pictures, and at
one time in the early two thousands, they had a
it was called a hot it was the High Rise
Camera high resolution, and they had the High Request where
you could actually tell them in the public could actually
submit an area on the planet that they'd like to

(33:43):
have a picture of, and that was a popular program. However,
you had to be very scientific about your.

Speaker 6 (33:50):
Request and given an explanation for a reason for why
you wanted this area photographed, and what was the geology,
what was the scientific you know, reasoning behind your request.

Speaker 5 (34:02):
You couldn't just say well, I'd like this area and
the coordinates because it looks like a pyramid.

Speaker 6 (34:06):
You couldn't say that, or you'd never have it photographed.

Speaker 5 (34:09):
So there were a lot of things that we'd like
to get other pictures of and you just have to
basically wait for NASA to come around to that area
and take more pictures.

Speaker 6 (34:21):
Now. Earlier in the year, on the Joe Rogan, you.

Speaker 5 (34:25):
Know, the guy that has the big podcast, he had
spoken about a square formation that was a photographed back
in two thousand and one by the Mars Global Surveyors old.

Speaker 6 (34:37):
Photograph or one of the earlier.

Speaker 5 (34:40):
Images, and he brought that to the world's attention just
the beginning of this year. And that was a you know,
an image over twenty four years ago. And you know,
people like myself we had looked at this years ago
and it kind of looks like the foundation of a
square fortress or something. And so it's it takes a

(35:00):
long time for NASA to get additional pictures of something.
And if you're looking at this scientifically, you need more
than one picture because you want to see what the
shadow is. Let's take it at a different type of
different time of year with the different lighting conditions, you know,
morning afternoon. You know, if you're working in the museum
and you've got a mask, you want to take a

(35:21):
archival picture of it. You'd want to have a you know,
a three quarter view on each side in the front
of view, nice lighting, and to do an evaluation, this
is what you'd need.

Speaker 6 (35:30):
So it's like pulling teeth trying to get a.

Speaker 5 (35:32):
Nice set of images from NASA to that you could
use as evidence that, hey, this is a structure. It's
not just one image that kind of looks like a
three sided pyramid. So that's basically the research that we're
doing here. And these are the problems we have with
working with NASA.

Speaker 1 (35:50):
Is that, Yeah, yeah, I get that. Let's go back
to though the nineteen seventies when the famous photograph of
the face of Sidonia was taken by voyager. I mean,
to everybody in the world, it looks like it's just
too perfect not to be just a bunch of mountains

(36:11):
and shadows at that exact same time. And why would
they release that exact photo if it was just nothing,
you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 6 (36:22):
Well, that's an interesting part of the story. You know.

Speaker 5 (36:24):
The Viking was, you know, mapping out the planet for
the Landers, and they were also using the Mariner nine,
the Mariner nine mission to look for landing sites. And
for some reason, doctor Soffen, who was running the Viking
program decided to have a press conference and they released

(36:45):
to the public that hey, we looked, we found a
formation on Mars in this Sedoni area that kind of
looks like They called it a head because it looked
like a human face, and they actually took another picture
of it a month later, but I think a week
after they announced this face that they found. It's kind
of like roswell, you know where, Hey we found a

(37:06):
crashed UFO. Oh no, it's just weather balloon. So they
did the same thing with the face on Mars. One
week it was a face, next week it was, oh,
just a trick of light and shadow. We took this
other image, and they never showed the second image. Actually,
the second image they took of the face looked more
like a face, it had more detail, But that picture
didn't surface until nineteen eighty when two researchers from JPL

(37:32):
got permission from NASA to go through their files and
see what if there were any other pictures of the
face on Mars, and that was the patron molinar to scientists,
and they actually found They were famous for finding the
five sided dn M pyramid, which is great down below,
it's like a pyramidal formation and that's actually named after them.

(37:53):
The DNM pyramid means departe in Marlinar. So they not
only found that, they found the other picture of the
face on Mars, which actually had more detail. But that's
all we had for like twenty years, those two pictures
that people looked at, and we had a nice panoramic
view and aerial view of the Sidonia area, and we
had a lot of odd structures that looked like a city.

(38:15):
But of course this was very low resolution, and we
never got anything else until the nineteen nineties, nineteen ninety eight.
From nineteen seventy six to nineteen ninety eight, and then
after nineteen ninety eight.

Speaker 6 (38:26):
We've gotten a lot of pictures up until now.

Speaker 5 (38:29):
I mean they've probably taken of the just getting back
to the face on Mars, NASA's probably taken thirty to
forty pictures of it. Now, this is a formation that
they say they have no interest in because it has
no geological scientific interest to them, but they've taken that
many pictures of it.

Speaker 1 (38:50):
At what point do you think that Mars was previously colonized?

Speaker 5 (38:57):
Well, I have some thoughts about that. Well, I call
this it's called the gatekeeper hypothesis. And it's the idea
that at one time in our distant past, when we
had probably crow magnet or Neanderthal.

Speaker 6 (39:23):
Men living on Earth, Mars was a vacant planet. There
was no one there.

Speaker 5 (39:31):
So the scenario is from the evidence that we've collected
looking at the ruins and structures on Mars, is that
probably sometime in a distant past, about a million years ago,
a runaway civilization from some other galaxy came here and
when they came into our Solar system, they saw this
beautiful little third planet from the Sun that was like

(39:54):
a paradise, and they were running away from probably some
militant group from their galaxy. So they come to our
solar system, they find this beautiful place Earth, they land
and they need to create a civilization here, so they
possibly find the available you know, humanoids on the planet,

(40:17):
the Chromagne and Neanderthal or whatever, and they use them
as slaves and to protect themselves. They set up bases
on the Moon, and they set up bases on Mars
because Mars has low gravity that it's a nice and
they set this up as like a guardian outpost. So
going back to the idea of you know, setting up

(40:37):
little colonies so they set bases up like Elon Musk.

Speaker 6 (40:40):
Wants to do on Mars.

Speaker 5 (40:42):
So if this culture that they're running away from, these
extraterrestrials or enemy that they're trying to get away from,
comes to our Solar system, like you know, George Bush
said during the Gulf War, it's better to fight them
over there than over here. You follow me, Yes, So
you have this outpost on Mars, which is a military

(41:03):
base all over the planet to fight off who's ever
coming out there before they get to the Moon or
Earth if they get past Mars. We have outposts on
the Moon, and there's evidence that there's structures on the
Moon also, so this moon base would also be a
second defense from then getting to Earth.

Speaker 6 (41:22):
And what I think happened from.

Speaker 5 (41:24):
What we're seeing with these structures on Mars that at
one time are you familiar with doctor John Brandenburg.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
I was actually just going to bring him.

Speaker 6 (41:33):
Up right well.

Speaker 5 (41:35):
His scenario is that he found evidence of Zenine one
twenty nine in the Sedoni area of the planet and
also over in the Utopia area, and he talks about
an air blast that there must have been some type
of battles going on. So with this scenario that I'm
talking about, that this aggressive culture came back, found out
where they were hiding, and they had these battles, and

(41:57):
whatever they had built on Mars was blown up and destructed,
and of course whatever bases they.

Speaker 6 (42:03):
Had on the Moon were also destroyed.

Speaker 5 (42:05):
Now the scenario may be that kind of like the
Ananaki that Zachariah Sitchen talks about and the Samerians that
you know, when they came to Earth. This is all
written down in you know, the Samerian text. This is
considered mythology. But the Ananaki came to Earth, they created
the human race through the Neanderthal or Promagnant. They called

(42:27):
them the available man beasts that they found here, and
they had bases on the Moon and Mars, according to
the Samerian text. So and that would be a great
idea to protect the planet, putting out these guardian outposts
on Mars and on the Moon. Now these were all destroyed.
And the other interesting thing I had realized.

Speaker 6 (42:48):
Is that.

Speaker 5 (42:50):
When I I live in Virginia now in the United States,
and I'm originally from.

Speaker 6 (42:58):
New Jersey, I'm a Jersey boy.

Speaker 5 (43:02):
So when I lived up in New Jersey, I used
to go over to the University of Pennsylvania, and I
used to go uh and go take courses on the
weekends about Maya civilization, uh Maya hieroglyphics and writings and
things like that. And through my studies over there, I
found out about this ah Maya mythology that archaeologists talk about.

Speaker 6 (43:28):
It's called the Maya Star Wars. Are you familiar with that?

Speaker 2 (43:31):
No?

Speaker 1 (43:31):
Please fill me in.

Speaker 5 (43:33):
Now, this is archaeologist talking, not me. I'm not calling
this the Maya Star Wars.

Speaker 6 (43:37):
It's the archaeologists that do.

Speaker 5 (43:38):
This, and it's kind of like a playoff of, you know,
the Star Wars series.

Speaker 6 (43:43):
So what the Maya did.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
They were concerned with Venus and Mars, and when these
the planets were in certain positions, they would have these
ceremonial battles. And you know the Aztec, the Maya Almac,
going all the way back to the Olmac, and they
talked about these battles that they had between Earth, which
was around It's a little place called Naranjo in Mexico.

Speaker 6 (44:07):
I'm sure a lot of your listeners probably have never
heard of Naranjo.

Speaker 5 (44:11):
Naranjo is very near to Calkzamel in Mexico, and according
to the hieroglyphic writings. This is the interpretation that the
archaeologists are talking about, that they had these these battles
between Earth and Mars. Now they called Mars sixth Earth

(44:32):
placed like the number six, and the Maya counted the
planets from the outside end, kind of like the Samarians did.
Zacharia Sitchen talks about how they the Samarians gave all
the planets names, and I also had numbers, like you.

Speaker 6 (44:47):
Know, we're the third rock from the Sun.

Speaker 5 (44:50):
But according to the Maya, Earth was the seventh planet,
Mars was the sixth planet, and Venus would be the
eighth planet. Wording to the numbering system. Now sixth earthplace
was an earth like place. The sixth planet, which was
Mars they also called Mars, was associated with the Mars beast,

(45:11):
which was like a reptilian creature. And these battles between
Earth and Mars happened at two different periods. The Maya
talk about it was I think eight hundred and ninety
six thousand years ago, which was like almost a million
years ago.

Speaker 6 (45:29):
That was the oldest record of these conflicts.

Speaker 5 (45:32):
And the second conflict was twenty two thousand years ago. Recently,
and Bill and I my early co author. We'd been
doing this for like thirty years. We also noticed that
there's a lot of structures that we're finding on Mars,
these perimidal formations and so forth, and some of them
are really damaged, kind of like this square foundation that

(45:54):
Joe Rogan was talking about, it's totally almost destroyed in rubble.
And then we're any other things that look pretty pristine.
So it's almost like there's these two different periods of
ruins on Mars.

Speaker 2 (46:05):
At were finding.

Speaker 6 (46:08):
So this seems all.

Speaker 1 (46:09):
Like, Yeah, we did talk to doctor John Brandenberg a
couple of times on this show, and I got to
meet him earlier this year at UFOCON in San Francisco,
and just a fantastic, fantastic guy, you know, and the
astrophysicist basically saying that he does believe that there was
some sort of nuclear holocaust and that there is evidence

(46:32):
through the photographs that we have seen, and I guess
even some of the of the scientific experiments the rovers
have collected to see that there was some sort of
radiation on there.

Speaker 5 (46:48):
Yeah, and it's very scary. Actually, it appears that Mars
suffered lots of battles, you know. It is the Planet
of War, you know, the war God. But you know
Stephen Hawkins, he warned scientists and especially SETI about sending

(47:10):
messages out because you don't know who's going to answer.
And this could have been a scenario that happened with Mars,
that they made contact with some extraterrestrial militant group that
came and attacked them. And Brandenburg talks about this about
you know, there's this whole scientific probability that if you

(47:34):
make contact with extraterrestrials, they.

Speaker 6 (47:37):
May not be friendly.

Speaker 5 (47:38):
I mean, look, how when we came to the America,
is what we did to the indigenous people? You know,
you conquer, and we may have that similar scenario. This
may be what happened to the colonies and the structures
and the civilization that was on Mars. Either they fought
with themselves like we do, or it was someone else.

(47:59):
So you've got to be caut and Brandenburg thinks that
there may be this type of militant culture in extraterrestrial
cultures that go out and destroy cultures when they find
out where they're at.

Speaker 6 (48:11):
So it's better to be quiet. And he also talks
about the Fermi mystery.

Speaker 5 (48:18):
About you know, there's yes, which is another scientist that
spoke about, you know, if we find all of these
planets and solar systems throughout the galaxy, and so it's
like Carl Sagan, you know, billions and billions of planets
and stars, where is everybody? How come we're not hearing
from them? And it may be that you want to
go quiet.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Yeah, you definitely don't want that, that's for sure.

Speaker 6 (48:40):
I mean, but don't tell them we're here.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
But here's the thing, like when I remember asking doctor
Brandenburg whether or not that was maybe a human society
up there that had something happen or some sort of
extraterrestrial type society. He believes that it might have been
a combination of both. Back then that was attacked by
some ethereal species that was warlike you know, that said

(49:06):
a probe down there to basically you know, rid the
planet of life.

Speaker 2 (49:11):
Correct.

Speaker 5 (49:12):
And you know, we have a lot of references to
these ancient battles and some other cultures that in India,
you know, they talk about the battles with the gods,
and so we do hear a lot about in ancient
mythology and this type of sometimes called history that these
conflicts happened in the past, so we may find when
we go to Mars that you know, this may be

(49:33):
what happened.

Speaker 6 (49:34):
We'll find all kinds of evidence.

Speaker 5 (49:35):
The little rovers that are driving around, they're taking pictures
of rocks and things, and sometimes in the distance you
see something that looks like a machinery, all rusted and
looks like all kinds of artifacts sitting all over the place.

Speaker 6 (49:47):
When when the rover goes driving around.

Speaker 5 (49:50):
And you know NASA, they'll take these panoramic views of
the landscape and if something looks like a rock, they'll
drive the rover closer and they'll put the little snow
if we're on there, and we'll grind it and.

Speaker 6 (50:01):
Take a sample and look at it.

Speaker 5 (50:03):
But if something looks like it might be, you know,
the remnants of an old fifty seven Chevy, they just
drive the other way.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
We got four minutes to go before we have to
go to break. In the next half hour, you're going
to do something that we don't usually do on this show,
and that is for our YouTube audience. You're going to
share some photographs that you're going to for our radio
audience be able to describe very uniquely, so that we're

(50:32):
we're going to paint a picture for them and what
we're looking at, and of course we will encourage them
to check out these photos on our Spaced Out Radio
YouTube channel when they get the opportunity. The photos that
you show or that you are studying, where do you
get them from?

Speaker 5 (50:51):
These are all official NASA photographs that NASA has taken
over the years, all from the different programs, the Mars
Global Survey program, and they're all archived on the NASA
websites and you can go there and go through all
the archives.

Speaker 6 (51:05):
They all are numbered.

Speaker 5 (51:07):
It's sometimes not very user friendly, but they do have
all of the images they've ever taken, including the old
Viking images of the face and the newer images, and
you can just go through them. They have a there's
a you can go to a program where there's a
map and you can just put the little arrow on

(51:27):
us area and the pictures from that area will come up.
So you can just spend hours and hours going through
NASA photographs and you know, and after you do this
for a while, you know what you know, rocks and
mountains look like in hills, and then all of a
sudden you'll see something that just is geometric geometry is
the key here. We're finding a lot of things in

(51:49):
these images. You know, after you do this for a while,
you know your normal Martian terrain, so you can go
through them kind of quickly. And once you see something
that doesn't you know, sticks out of place like a
sore thumb, it's usually a geometric shape, a pyramid five
sided or something, and that will look like something that's

(52:10):
not a rock, not natural, and it has that you know,
symmetry to it in geometry, and if you find one,
there's usually others around it. So we usually find these
little areas that have kind of like these little compounds
or these little settlements. So there's usually like American Indians,
they would have all these mounds, they'd be in a
circular alignment or whatever, and we're finding very similar type

(52:33):
structures on Mars. Brandenburg talked about the level of the
technique of the building that we're looking at on Mars
or probably like Bronze age on the Earth, So that's
kind of like how he coordinates it.

Speaker 6 (52:51):
A lot of mounds and things like that.

Speaker 1 (52:54):
Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see how you
break this down, because you know, the one thing that
humans are really good at is paradolia? And oh yeah,
you know, like, look, I've seen photographs coming from Mars,
especially what looks like the lady sitting on the rock.
I mean, that photo just absolutely blows my mind because

(53:17):
I just don't see a rock structure looking like a
human being that close. But I mean, how do you
prejudge for paradolia.

Speaker 5 (53:26):
Well, paradolia is a word that was coined in the
late nineteen nineties early two thousands, and it appeared in
an issue of This Skeptical Inquirer, and it was basically
a hit piece about the face on Mars, and the
author of the article was the first one to use

(53:48):
this word paradolia. When I was working on my book,
I did some investigation into this whole history of this
idea of paradolia, where things look, you.

Speaker 6 (53:57):
Know, like you look in the clouds and you think
you see.

Speaker 5 (53:59):
Your dog or your aunt Millie's cal you know, this
this rock kind of looks like a face.

Speaker 6 (54:05):
There's a lot of things in nature that do look,
you know, face.

Speaker 5 (54:08):
Like or have a little you know, animation to them,
But what we're seeing on Mars goes well beyond that. Now,
this word paradolia comes from the eighteen hundreds. It was
from a science journal. Excuse me, and it's mentioned in
the book. I hate to mention that it's in the book.
But we can get back to this after the break.

Speaker 1 (54:30):
Yeah, let's do that, because I think, you know, paradolia
is a big one that we do need to talk
about because we want to see it, and especially for
those of us who want to believe, we want to
make sure that we're live and not memorycs to use
a nice eighties term there.

Speaker 6 (54:47):
George J.

Speaker 1 (54:47):
Host is our guest tonight on spaced Out Radio, so
you can find his books and information on his website,
the Sidonianinstitute dot com. He is faced out, breaking up,
look like hopes Dave Scott. All right, we got about

(55:11):
five and a half minutes. George be right back, everybody, Yeah.

Speaker 7 (56:00):
Said, yeah, all right, I am back, Lunico.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
How are you, Seymour? Are you gonna be good tonight?
Are you gonna be an idiot? Let's just be blunt, okay,
because I know what you did last night and I
don't put up with that shit in my chat room.
So you got a choice smarting up or or be gone,

(01:00:14):
plain and simple. All right, let's bring George back. Yeah,
how you doing, George.

Speaker 6 (01:00:27):
I'm doing good. We're gonna talk about Paradolia.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
Yes, we are in about a minute and a half,
or we're coming back live in about forty seconds. The
beard and mustache are still looking good.

Speaker 6 (01:00:46):
Thank you. The beard's new. I just started growing a
beard last year. I normally just had the mustache. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:55):
That's a beautiful lip blade you got there, buddy, beautiful.
All right, A big thank you tonight to area fifty
four times too, Darryl Kitty, Caddy Wack, necessary dialogue, Von
Patrick and Debor Rooney. So don't forget to shop at
our spaced Out Radio store. And we got five seconds.

(01:01:33):
Here we go with the second hour of spaced Out
Radio tonight. My name is Dave Scott. We're glad you're
with us talking about Mars with George Jay Haas, and
it's been an interesting show. Indeed, before we bring Joe
back on, we want to say hello to everyone tuning
us in on our terrestrial affiliates around North America, digitally
on every major podcast network. Our website spaced out Radio

(01:01:57):
dot com. We have a plethora of features for you.
Rock out to bumblefoot, read the news wire, check out
our swag as well. You can follow us on exit
spaced Out Radio, Instagram, at spaced Out Radio Show, and
on Patreon. In the Space Travelers Club, the Desert Clam
has set the password for tonight in the SR Space

(01:02:18):
Travelers Club Balatron. Balatron is your password. Use it wisely,
space Travelers as the Clams. It's the password each and
every night. Right here on spaced Out Radio. From the
website the Sidonia Institute dot com, George Jhas is here
and we're talking about previous life and civilizations on Mars.

(01:02:40):
Did it actually happen? The photographs we're going to get into.
We're talking about Paradolia right now. And by the way,
we also want to say that George is a great author.
You can find all of his books on his website.
Once again, the Sidonia Institute dot Com. George, welcome back.

Speaker 6 (01:02:57):
Well thanks for having me on again.

Speaker 1 (01:03:00):
Paredolia.

Speaker 6 (01:03:01):
Yes, yeah, it's a wonderful word.

Speaker 5 (01:03:04):
It's overused and I think it goes all the way
back to NASA wanting to diminish the public's interest in
the face on Mars.

Speaker 6 (01:03:13):
They got this guy. His name was Steven Goldstein.

Speaker 5 (01:03:19):
He wrote an article in Skeptical Inquirer back in nineteen
ninety four, and that's when the word was first used,
and I mean everybody.

Speaker 6 (01:03:27):
Uses it all the time to anytime you see something.

Speaker 5 (01:03:29):
On Mars that kind of looks like a bird or
an animal or a face, it's.

Speaker 6 (01:03:34):
Oh, that's paradolia.

Speaker 5 (01:03:35):
You know, we see faces because you know, we're when
we're children, when we're babies, were first thing we notice
is mom's face. And you know, we have to be
it's in our DNA to see the tigers and the
bears in the woods, and we have to see the faces.
So we're used to seeing things like this. And this
word comes from a science journal that was published in

(01:03:57):
eighteen sixty eight, a mental science journal, and the article
talks about this phenomenon called paradolia, and it's a it's
a science study that was done.

Speaker 6 (01:04:12):
And like I said, this article is produced in this.

Speaker 5 (01:04:15):
Journal and it talks about this mental condition where people
see faces everywhere. It's a mental instability people suffer from this.
This was written about, you know, the eighteen hundreds or
eighteen sixty eight or whatever.

Speaker 6 (01:04:29):
So yeah, that's basically where the word comes from. From.

Speaker 5 (01:04:32):
This ailment, this fixation where people are seeing faces everywhere
on the walls, you know, in their rooms. And it
has nothing to do with this whole idea of you know,
seeing things that come.

Speaker 6 (01:04:45):
You know, we can anthropomorphize a lot of things.

Speaker 5 (01:04:48):
I mean, you can look at a in a bathroom
and see the handles and kind of looks like a
face with the spout.

Speaker 6 (01:04:55):
Coming out like a nose. You know, we can you know,
look at things and say that.

Speaker 5 (01:05:00):
You know, sometimes you'll find a pepper that kinds of
looks like a grimace face or something that we all
know that that's not real. You know, that's not an
intentional face, that's just something that's comical. We can see
up in the sky, look at the clouds. Sometimes a
cloud may look like a dog or a cow, like
I said earlier. But when you see contrails going up

(01:05:22):
in the sky, you know that's artificial. That's produced by
a plane. Or you can see sometimes airplanes will go
up and go you know, I love Lucy, or they'll
be the smiley face the airplane will you know, put
the little eyes. We know that that's artificial, that's man made.
So I think we can distinguish between clouds and you know,

(01:05:43):
contrails from planes. So I think just as we can
discern between those formations. I think we're able to discern
between natural landforms and something that's artificially constructed.

Speaker 6 (01:05:58):
Does that make any sense? Any other questions about this paranal.

Speaker 1 (01:06:02):
Para, Well, no, I understand with that actually what you're getting,
and I think you described it very beautifully to be blunt,
you know, but there is always going to be the argument.
There's always going to be the argument about whether or
not we're actually seeing what we're seeing. I mean, the
greatest example, and you use it already, but I'll reiterate,
is the fact is in clouds, we can see things

(01:06:25):
in clouds that one looks like a dinosaur, that one
looks like a fish, that one looks like a face.
You know, that's a UFO in the sky. Okay, and
probably is a ufo. But just for you know, giggles,
we will sit there and say, you know that we
can see things because our eyes are always trying to
adjust to references that we already know. So how do

(01:06:48):
we know that this isn't happening with what we're seeing
on Mars right?

Speaker 5 (01:06:54):
Well, getting getting back to seeing, you know, dogs and
cows and things like that.

Speaker 6 (01:06:58):
Usually when you look.

Speaker 5 (01:06:59):
At cuds or mountain ranges that kind of look like
a fish or whatever you think you're saying. Usually those
are just silhouettes. They don't have any secondary and tertiary.
It may have a dark area that looks like we're
an eye would be, but you don't see a pupil,
you don't see an eyelid, there's no detail. These are
just very generic type of formations that you're looking at,

(01:07:22):
normally silhouettes, and again they don't have a lot of detail.
We have this parrot formation that we found on Mars
that we had one of our early members of the
Sidonia Institute, Will Foust, found this back in two thousand
and two, and it's a profiled image of a parrot.

Speaker 6 (01:07:41):
He's laying on his side, he's got his wing up
and it looks just like a parrot. But it's very difficult.

Speaker 5 (01:07:47):
To convince people that this is an artificial structure because
people say, oh, that's just paradolia.

Speaker 6 (01:07:52):
You're thinking it looks like a parrot. So it's very
difficult to convince people.

Speaker 5 (01:08:00):
But if you find structures on Mars that look pictographic,
because the first excuse is that it's paradolia, and it's
really just kind of looks like a parrot. It really
isn't a parrot. Now, this parrot formation, we had a science.

Speaker 6 (01:08:15):
Paper published on this.

Speaker 5 (01:08:16):
Originally we had two geologists work on the paper we had.
We brought in three veterinarians to do their study. We've
gave them pictures of this. They found eighteen points of
anatomical correctness, which goes way beyond you know, looking at
a cloud.

Speaker 6 (01:08:31):
So there's a lot of detail in this, this parrot formation.

Speaker 5 (01:08:34):
And this parrot from the beak to the tail is
about a mile long. Everything's large on Mars because of
the low gravity. The famous face on Mars is a
mile and a half from the top of the head
to the chin.

Speaker 6 (01:08:44):
So everything's big.

Speaker 5 (01:08:46):
Now this parrots, it has a head, it's got a beak,
it's got an eye. The upper and lower beak is
open partially. You can actually see the tongue. There's the eye,
there's a little neck fret line, there's the body. You
have the tail feathers, there's a foot that goes down.
You can see the toe digits and the claws. Lots
of detail. So, like I said, eighteen points of anatomical correctness,

(01:09:09):
and we had this formation sent out to some journals.
We actually got it published in a science journal, so
we were pretty happy. This goes all the way back
to twenty eleven and NASA recently a couple of years ago,
I think twenty twenty three or whatever, they took a
Mars reconnaissance high resolution image of this parrot formation. So

(01:09:30):
we have about five different pictures previously of this parrot formation,
and this new Mars reconnaissance high resolution. I mean, the
camera's so powerful. It can take pictures of like something
the size of a Volkswagen on the surface, so you
get a lot of detail. So if this parrot's there,
this image that they took was going to prove it

(01:09:51):
was either just an illusion of ours or it was
really there. When this picture was taken, we again invited
the We had like five veterinarians look at it. They
were just a that this has such detailed a sculpted
parrot formation, and now we have twenty two points of
anatomical correctness. It's actually increased, so we're pretty excited about that.

(01:10:12):
And that was also published in a science journal in
twenty twenty two, so that formation has been published in
two different science journals, so that's pretty cool and this
whole idea of paradolia. Now with my new book, I
kind of tried to focus on geometry. We're looking at

(01:10:32):
things that are highly symmetrical and geometric in design because
that's a lot more convincing for people.

Speaker 6 (01:10:39):
It's hard.

Speaker 5 (01:10:39):
I mean, this parrot has twenty two points of anatomical correctness,
but still people laugh and say, oh, no, it's not
They just don't want to look at it. But when
you're looking at geometry with straight lines, that's more convincing.
And so my new book is just packed full of geometry,
and I think it's been received pretty well. A lot

(01:10:59):
of people are very surprised about all the structures on
the surface of Mars, and I.

Speaker 6 (01:11:05):
Think I'm making I'm convincing.

Speaker 5 (01:11:07):
A lot more people with the geometry as opposed to
pictographic formations. What's there's a lot of those also, But
the new book only features one chapter there on the
parrot formation.

Speaker 6 (01:11:17):
Because we have so much evidence.

Speaker 1 (01:11:20):
You wanted to show some photographs to our social media channel.
You'll describe them for our radio audience. What would you
like to show us?

Speaker 6 (01:11:29):
Are we able to do share screen?

Speaker 1 (01:11:32):
So just bring them up. What you want to do
is hit the presenter invite button.

Speaker 6 (01:11:39):
Where's that at.

Speaker 1 (01:11:42):
Let me see you if you go to the screen
at the bottom.

Speaker 5 (01:11:45):
Yeah, I got I got a microphone, I got a camera,
and then I got a I guess a plus screen?

Speaker 6 (01:11:51):
Is that it?

Speaker 3 (01:11:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:11:51):
The plus screen there and you.

Speaker 6 (01:11:53):
Can share that, says share screen. Okay, share screen?

Speaker 2 (01:12:00):
All right?

Speaker 6 (01:12:04):
Are you seeing that? Or where are you?

Speaker 3 (01:12:05):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:12:06):
No, you have to.

Speaker 6 (01:12:09):
Hit okay, allow, it's not where is okay? It says not.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
Now, well, we'll figure it out. We'll bring it up
in the next half hour. Let me ask you a
couple of questions from our audience here first and foremost. Okay,
while we're waiting, we'll figure.

Speaker 6 (01:12:28):
That one out.

Speaker 1 (01:12:30):
Yeah, we'll figure it out. During the break, Joe was
asking why did Mars tint their photos read in the
original or NASA tint their photos read in the original
photos from the Landers? They were busted when they filmed
the lander in colors on the land? Are we not?
And they weren't correct well.

Speaker 5 (01:12:51):
From what I understand, the the guys that released the pictures,
the NASA teams, JPL or whatever the high you know,
the people that are releasing these pictures, they kind of
turned the color up to red for some reason. This
has been a controversy for a long time. Now that
they have the rovers up there, the rovers all have

(01:13:12):
a little dial card on there that shows like a
color wheel, so which is you know, like a where
you can get the standardized inclination of what the color
should be. And that kind of led to them backing down.
So a lot of the pictures now usually are a
very light tinged gray sky.

Speaker 6 (01:13:34):
Or sometimes it's a little bluish. It depends on what
you're looking at. NASA's actually released pictures that show clouds
on Mars, which we never knew they had. But the
rovers are finding clouds.

Speaker 5 (01:13:46):
But that's that's been a long controversy about Mars, you know,
tweaking the you know, turning the red up to eleven.

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
Another question, little final tap there, let's go to Jaketa.
What are your thoughts on the ten years ago a
human looking shadow repairing a Mars are over.

Speaker 6 (01:14:09):
Well, that was actually.

Speaker 5 (01:14:12):
NASA has an area in I think it's in Iceland
where they have there's an area in Iceland looks just
like Mars, and that's where they do a lot of
study for these new rovers that they're going to send
up and eventually when you know, Musco's up there with
all these robotic things and the terrain looks just like

(01:14:33):
you're on Mars.

Speaker 6 (01:14:34):
It's unbelievable.

Speaker 5 (01:14:35):
And one of these pictures of the scientists out there
looking at one of these new vehicles that they had
kind of like got stuck on the internet and people
were saying, oh my god.

Speaker 6 (01:14:43):
There's scientists.

Speaker 5 (01:14:44):
Look that people And then one would the shadow look
like a person there that's probably from Iceland, the Mars.

Speaker 6 (01:14:53):
The NASA has the base over there.

Speaker 1 (01:14:55):
And here I thought it was from Transformers.

Speaker 5 (01:15:00):
I don't know, but yeah, there's a lot of and
see things like that get a lot of attention. But
you know, we have a parrot with twenty two points
of anatomic for correctness, and you know nobody wants to
look at it. But you know, you see a shadow
of a guy next to the rover boy, We're gonna
that's all over the internet.

Speaker 1 (01:15:18):
Well, you know what, there are many of us who
believe that, you know, NASA's been fudging things for years.
You know, I and I've pointed this out that I
got a real bone to pick with NASA after the
way they've treated the UFO community by by you know,
treating us like we're just a bunch of idiots. And

(01:15:38):
I don't think anybody really trusts NASA and nor should they.

Speaker 6 (01:15:43):
So well, let's you know, NASA is never a straight answer,
that's right. Well what do you what do you think.

Speaker 5 (01:15:50):
About the Area fifty fifty one where they had the
crash last week or the beginning of this week. One
of the vehicles crashed there, that was a down here.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
I don't think that's UFO at all.

Speaker 5 (01:16:08):
No, it's it's probably some type of you know, experimental
Yes you're working on.

Speaker 1 (01:16:14):
Yes, it probably took a a firefighting crash retrieval team
too to make sure that it was all it was
all cleaned up nicely. You know.

Speaker 6 (01:16:29):
I should have been a training exercise, right, training.

Speaker 1 (01:16:32):
Exercise, absolutely absolutely, you know. And and I say that,
but you know, I am a big UFO guy. I've
I've been fortunate to see a number of them. I've
I've including two on the ground. Like It's not that
I'm trying to be skeptical or anything, but in places
like Area fifty one and getting to talk to people

(01:16:54):
who have a lot more experience in the black ops
than I do, it is something that opens my eyes
quite a bit to some of the games that are
being played on a base like that. Right, let's go
to Eve. What about the foundation thing that's made of
right angles on Mars.

Speaker 5 (01:17:16):
I guess she's talking about the the formation that Joe
Rogan brought to the public's attention.

Speaker 6 (01:17:23):
Earlier this year. Yes, yeah, that that is.

Speaker 5 (01:17:27):
It's got a ninety degree angle at the top and
the bottom. It is in a north degree north to
south orientation orientation. It's kind of like a pyramid that's
shaped like a diamond. The foundation. And my co author,
William Saunders and Robert Shock, he's the one.

Speaker 6 (01:17:46):
That I'm not sure if your audience knows who he is.
He's at.

Speaker 5 (01:17:52):
Yeah, he actually co wrote the paper with us, the
three of us, and we just had a paper published
during the summer dealing with that square shape format on Mars.

Speaker 6 (01:18:00):
So if the.

Speaker 5 (01:18:02):
Listeners out there go to our website or they just
look up George Jay Hawes and William Saunders and Robert Shock,
they can find that. I can send you a link
to the paper. It was published in the Journal of Astrobiology,
and we have a pretty convincing case showing that this
is an artificial structure. You don't have geometry like that

(01:18:23):
that happens naturally.

Speaker 1 (01:18:26):
Another question from our audience, let's go to Joe again. George,
what do you think about the photograph that shows a
woman's statue on Mars or any of the other anomalist photos.

Speaker 5 (01:18:39):
That is another formation that got a lot of attention
when it was released, and some young guy.

Speaker 6 (01:18:46):
Found that and got a lot of attention with the online.

Speaker 5 (01:18:50):
Articles and things like that. I'm not very sure that
it may be just an angle of a rock that
kind of looks like that a lot of detail. The
rover takes multiple pictures of an area as it goes by,
so there's numerous pictures of that and the other pictures
of that area. It doesn't seem to look like a

(01:19:12):
you know, a woman sitting on a rock, you know,
from other vantage points.

Speaker 6 (01:19:16):
That's the problem with a lot of which we were
talking about paradolia.

Speaker 5 (01:19:20):
When you see like a mountain range, or you look
like at a cliff and he kind of looks like
a face. You move a little bit to the west
or east, it sometimes will disappear. You don't see it anymore.
Has to be at the right angle, and I think
that's mostly what that was. There's a lot more evidence
of structures and machinery parts and all kinds of anomalies

(01:19:44):
that are a lot better, I think than the little
mermaid sitting on the rock that a lot of people see.

Speaker 6 (01:19:50):
That's just my.

Speaker 5 (01:19:50):
Personal opinion from what I've seen, I don't see any
supportive images of that. And that's why when like the
science paper we have just published with this square foundation,
we have multiple pictures of that formation that can verify
it different times of the year under different lighting, and

(01:20:11):
to show that that formation is still supported by other images. Now,
that little statue that people are seeing, we don't have
any secondary images to look at that.

Speaker 6 (01:20:22):
I'd like to at least have.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
Two very true. All right, let's move to another question here.
Let's go to jewels. Could they light our Mars?

Speaker 5 (01:20:33):
Well, the light r it's done with a beam, comes down,
bounces off the surface, that actually goes right through foliage
like the trees and grass, and it hits the surface
and bounces back. That's how they make these pictures. Mars
doesn't really have any plant life that we could see.
There's no grass, there's no foliage, no trees, so there's

(01:20:53):
really no need for that. I don't know what they
would do with it, because Mars actually looks like we're
using light R already because there's nothing there. I mean,
it's all whatever's on the surface, you can see it
unless it's covered over with debris and ice and dust.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
Mm hmm. All right, moving on one more question. This
one comes from Mel. How about the keyhole?

Speaker 5 (01:21:15):
Oh, Glad Mel mentioned that that's another formation that's in
our book.

Speaker 6 (01:21:20):
That's I call these the two the smoking guns on Mars.

Speaker 5 (01:21:24):
If you want to look for the best evidence, the
best evidence of a pictographic formation would be the parrot,
which has you know, the twenty two points of anatomical correctness.
We've had geologists look at it, We've had veterinarians look
at it, and they all confirm that this is, you know,
the shape and detail and anatomical features of a parrot.

Speaker 6 (01:21:45):
Now, the keyhole is a that's all geometry.

Speaker 5 (01:21:48):
That's a highly symmetrical formation that takes the shape of
a keyhole. It has the wedge shape at the top
and then there's the dome at the bottom. You know,
the shape of you put your key in the keyhole.
That's the old classic keyhole shape. And we had a
science paper published with that keyhole formation in the Journal

(01:22:10):
of Space Exploration back in twenty sixteen. That formation has
been featured on Ancient Aliens, The Unexplained with William Shatner.
So it's been on TV programs, it's been in a
lot of magazines, newspaper articles and stuff, and it is
an amazing formation and it actually mimics it almost looks

(01:22:32):
identical to this keyhole formation in Japan called the Kufon Tomb.
If your listeners out there, just go check this out
on the internet. A lot of people have spoken about
and there's little videos about the keyhole. It's probably one
of the best examples of the artificial structure on the
planet Mars.

Speaker 1 (01:22:56):
All right, we've got about thirty seconds to go here
before we have to go to break. At the bottom
of the hour, George Jay Haas is here talking about
potential life on Mars, and I'm just looking for more
questions here. We don't seem to have any of this time,
but that's okay, George. The one photo that really caught

(01:23:19):
a lot of people's attention, I believe it was earlier
this year was the structure inside the mountain side where
it looked like there was a square door and an
entry level into that into that mountain side. Did you
happen to catch that photo?

Speaker 5 (01:23:35):
Yes, I posted that on my Facebook and did some
comparisons with side by side pictures. I don't have any
pictures to show your audience, but that got a lot
of attention early on.

Speaker 6 (01:23:48):
It's actually very small. It looks like an air vent
because it's up on the hill at the top the
crop pictures.

Speaker 5 (01:23:54):
People get confused. They think it's like right on the ground.
It looks like something you could walk into. The doorway
is very strange. It's actually cut out, rectangular, and there's
so much detail. It looks like the interior wall that
goes into this this hole here entryway. This tunnel has

(01:24:17):
like marbled walls. The walls are very flat and smooth
and shiny, so it looks like it's some type of
air vent, you know, like the pyramids in Egypt at
the top, you know, they have these air vents that
go down into the chambers and stuff, so it may
be something like that.

Speaker 6 (01:24:32):
It's very interesting. It does not look natural, No.

Speaker 1 (01:24:36):
It does not. We're going to discuss that more with
George Jay Haas here on spaced Out Radio as we're
talking Mars all night long. The Sedonia Institute dot com
is George's website. You can find his books there as well.
This is spaced out Radio. You're listening your space down

(01:25:05):
video with your host Dave Scott. All right, we're clear.
Mm hmmm, good job tonight, George. You having fun?

Speaker 5 (01:25:26):
Oh yeah, I I I enjoy talking about this stuff.

Speaker 6 (01:25:30):
That's why I do it.

Speaker 1 (01:25:32):
All right. So to share, what I want you to
do is I want you to press that screen button.

Speaker 6 (01:25:38):
Okay, I did. It says uh share screen, image file,
video file.

Speaker 1 (01:25:45):
Which one do you want to share?

Speaker 6 (01:25:48):
I guess we'll hit share screen.

Speaker 1 (01:25:49):
Yeah, share screen.

Speaker 6 (01:25:52):
All right, And then it says, uh share screen sharing tips.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
Uh it should show you.

Speaker 5 (01:26:00):
And then it says at the bottom it's got says
share screen.

Speaker 1 (01:26:04):
Yeah, just hit share okay, and.

Speaker 6 (01:26:07):
Then it says at the top here it says not
now weird.

Speaker 1 (01:26:12):
Okay, let's try something else here hit that now. Are
these in a file or are they on.

Speaker 6 (01:26:20):
It's it's actually in a in.

Speaker 1 (01:26:21):
A Is it on your website?

Speaker 5 (01:26:25):
Yeah, it's it's no, it's right here in my computer.
It's part of it's a power point.

Speaker 1 (01:26:30):
Okay. Let's see here. So let's go let's go share.
Let's go image file. Try that.

Speaker 6 (01:26:47):
Where is that at? Oh? Share image file?

Speaker 1 (01:26:51):
Yeah, try an image file.

Speaker 5 (01:26:54):
Uh yeah, I'll just go to it.

Speaker 6 (01:27:00):
Hold on. What happened? Says, nothing's in there? That's not working?

Speaker 1 (01:27:24):
All right. Well, if that's not working, that's try something
else here. So if we hit that one, now we
don't want that. Try slides and PDFs. Do you have
that one?

Speaker 6 (01:27:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:27:42):
Try that one.

Speaker 6 (01:27:44):
It says Google slides in your computer. What happens in
your computer?

Speaker 1 (01:27:48):
I don't know that's your computer.

Speaker 6 (01:27:51):
Yeah, then it wants to upload. Um, let me take
a look, see if it'll do it.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:28:21):
I was able to did it work.

Speaker 6 (01:28:25):
It's not coming up.

Speaker 1 (01:28:26):
Though, Okay. I was able to pull these images up
from your website.

Speaker 6 (01:28:33):
How did you get them from my website?

Speaker 1 (01:28:35):
I went to radio with pictures.

Speaker 5 (01:28:38):
Oh you're looking at you're you're you're on the Sidonian Institute.

Speaker 2 (01:28:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:28:41):
I didn't load any pictures up over there. Yeah, I
see that was from a while ago. Yeah, that's the
parrot formation. Uh, that's uh the raptor complex. That's uh,
that's a.

Speaker 6 (01:28:52):
Pyramid there that looks like in Yeah, this is older stuff. Okay, yeah,
that that's not going to do us any good. We
can just talk like we've booked.

Speaker 2 (01:29:04):
I mean, well, not a problem.

Speaker 6 (01:29:06):
If the people are intrigued enough, they can go get
the book.

Speaker 2 (01:29:10):
Yeah, go get the book, or these all.

Speaker 5 (01:29:13):
These images are on my Facebook if they want to go,
or they can go to the Sidonian Institute and actually
go to the I have a discussion board for the
Sidonian Institute.

Speaker 6 (01:29:22):
And uh, there's a thread over there.

Speaker 1 (01:29:26):
Are we on the air or we're just well, we're
just in behind the scenes.

Speaker 6 (01:29:29):
Okay, Yeah, there's a thread over there that has the
best examples of structures on Mars, which has like seventy
five examples of the best structures on Mars, which are
pretty igh mind boggling.

Speaker 5 (01:29:45):
I challenge anybody to look at five of them and
tell me that there's nothing on Mars. But I got
seventy five examples of structures on Mars, so they're.

Speaker 6 (01:29:52):
All over the place.

Speaker 1 (01:29:54):
We're coming back.

Speaker 6 (01:29:55):
I have enough information for probably three or four more books.

Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
All right, we're coming back in twenty seconds. Big thank
you tonight to Darryl Area fifty four times, to Debora,
Roony Vaughn, necessary and Kitty for the great super chants.
We greatly appreciate your love and support, guys, and we've
got more questions coming up here for you as well.
George here momentarily. Here we go with the second half

(01:30:42):
of spaced Out Radio. Good to have you with us.
My name is Dave Scott. We appreciate you tuning us
on in wherever you are on this beautiful planet. We
call er Hey. We want to remind all of you
that if you missed most of this show where others,
you can check out our free archives on YouTube or
any major podcast network. Our website spaced out Radio dot com.

(01:31:05):
We have a plethora of features for you. Rock out
to bumblefoot, read the news wire, check out our swag
as well. You can follow us on exit, spaced Out Radio, Instagram,
at spaced Out Radio Show, and on Patreon in the
Space Travelers Club. Here we go final time tonight from

(01:31:25):
the Sedonia Institute dot com. We have George Jhas hanging
on out. You can get his books on his website
talking about Mars and much much more. George, thank you
so much for being here. Let me get you unmuted. Here,
There we go, Hold on one second, there we go. Yes,

(01:31:46):
all right.

Speaker 6 (01:31:47):
Are you seeing that on your screen? I think it
just popped up?

Speaker 1 (01:31:51):
Yep, I put it up there.

Speaker 6 (01:31:53):
Oh you did it, yep.

Speaker 5 (01:31:55):
Oh so it's actually working. Oh great, So we actually
got the PowerPoint to work. So this is the great
architects of Mars.

Speaker 1 (01:32:11):
Are you ready, I'm ready. Let's rock and roll. It's
on you man.

Speaker 5 (01:32:13):
Okay, we'll go through this quickly. This is just an
aerial view of our planet Earth over here. This little
white dot, that's Zion, China. Back in nineteen forty seven,
an American pilot during World War Two went off course
and went into China. He took this picture of this pyramid.

(01:32:34):
You see this large white pyramid here. This is a
very famous photograph. Over the years, people said that this
was a hoax. There's no pyramids in China. The Chinese
government said, no, we have no pyramids, and so this
kind of went to the Mysteries of the Universe in
the World kind of books, and this was thought to
be just a hoax. That's until the advent of Google Earth.

(01:32:57):
Here's the pyramid right here. These are pictures of Zion, China.
These were taken in two thousand and three. So this
is just showing that things that at one time were
thought to be hoaxes and had no scientific basis, we
have Google. The satellites took these pictures over China. These
pyramids are all over the place in this area. China

(01:33:19):
doesn't really like to talk about them. We don't really
know their origins. But that's the use of aerial photographs.
This is just showing the audience anyone out there that's
able to see this, is that we're using the same
type of technology looking at aerial photographs on Mars, just
like Google Earth is looking down on Earth and we're
seeing these great pictures. The idea of pyramids not looking

(01:33:44):
like pyramids on Mars. This is a picture of Tiotia
Khan in Mexico back in nineteen hundreds, early nineteen hundred. Actually,
when they were looking at this pyramid, it was all
covered with dirt, had plants growing on it.

Speaker 6 (01:34:00):
Trees growing on it.

Speaker 5 (01:34:01):
It wasn't until they did excavation and got the dirt
off of it and did some reconstruction that we see
this beautiful pyramid it is today. A lot of the
pyramids and formations were finding on Mars. We're seeing the
four or five sides sometimes three sided pyramids, but a
lot of them were covered with dirt and dust. So
just like they were finding these pyramids on Earth. You

(01:34:23):
know that we all know about in Mexico that at
what time they were covered. Now, interesting thing about the
Maya and the Aztec and the almost they had a
propensity to when they built these pyramids, they would bury them.
They would like they would kill the pyramid by burying it.
And archaeologists find a lot of smaller pyramids in Mexico
and they'll find those pyramids inside the pyramids that they

(01:34:45):
would build one on top of another, and then they
would be ceremonially buried kind of like this. This might
have been just ceremonially buried by the ancients, this whole
idea of going to Mars, like we're discussing tonight, and
looking at these photographs and trying to find markers for
highly symmetrical geometrical designs. This book came out in twenty

(01:35:10):
fourteen by a guy named Douglas van Kotch, and he
got a bunch of scientists together to discuss this probability.
I'm sure you're all familiar with the Brookings Institute. Back
in the late nineteen fifties, they actually had Margaret Meade
was one of the scientists. They were trying to discuss
what we would do if we found artifacts on another

(01:35:31):
planet and what the Brookings Institute. Basically, to make a
long story short, they said, if we find it, hide it,
don't tell the public because the public would not be
able to accept it because we have such.

Speaker 6 (01:35:43):
A thin veneer of our mental psyche that we we
just couldn't handle it.

Speaker 5 (01:35:47):
But they never talked about would be be able to
recognize structures, And that's what this study was, and they
found remarkably. What they had concluded was that scientists just
looking at aerial photographs of a potential structures on another
planet would not be able to identify them, which was

(01:36:10):
pretty remarkable.

Speaker 6 (01:36:12):
But I'm finding them. This is the whole idea of
covering things.

Speaker 5 (01:36:18):
When we go to Mars, we're just gonna build habitats
and the best way to protect us from radiation would
be to cover them with dirt.

Speaker 6 (01:36:24):
Just like the Maya, we're covering the temples and things.

Speaker 5 (01:36:27):
So this whole idea of living on Mars would be
protecting us from the Martian radiation would be cover things
with dirt. Now, we're moving to one of the first
chapters in the book of the Great.

Speaker 6 (01:36:40):
Architects of Mars. This is Elysium.

Speaker 5 (01:36:42):
This little white dot over here, this is just a
mola map of Mars showing the heights.

Speaker 6 (01:36:47):
This low areas where the oceans would be. This is the.

Speaker 5 (01:36:50):
Flat area, the lower area. And over here next to
the shoreline, this is a place called Elysium. Now, this
was first taken by the Photographs of Elysium were taken
by the I'm sorry back, was taken by the Mariner nine. Now,

(01:37:10):
the Mariner ninth took a lot of photographs of Mars,
but they were very high contrast, as you can see here,
very light and dark, and these pyramidal formations caught the
eye of Uh. This guy here, mac Gibson. He was
a scientist. Now, before the Face on Mars, which kind
of ruined all of the scientific research conducted to Mars

(01:37:33):
with paradolia and trying to dismiss any kind of interest
in Mars. Uh, this was before all that. In the
in the mid seventies, scientists were actually very interested in
looking at the possibility of finding.

Speaker 6 (01:37:44):
Structures on Mars.

Speaker 5 (01:37:45):
And this this uh scientist here, mac Gibson, He actually
had a science paper published which was titled Pyramidal structures
on Mars in Icarus. Now Icarus is a high brow,
very you know, well known science and he had an
article back in nineteen seventy four about these pyramids from
the Mariner nine photographs. This was before Carl Sagan. Nobody

(01:38:10):
talks about this guy. Carl Sagan looked at the same pyramids.
He said, they were pyramids, something that we needed to
look at.

Speaker 6 (01:38:17):
They were mentioned.

Speaker 5 (01:38:19):
These pyramids were mentioned on his show The Cosmos and
in his book. All you young people out there probably
don't know. Carl Sagan had a big TV series back
in the eighties and he.

Speaker 6 (01:38:29):
Talked about billions and billions of stars.

Speaker 5 (01:38:32):
He was very famous and he took this seriously and
he was looking at these pyramids. These are two different
pyramids that are in Elysium, some of the pyramids I
hear that Carl Sagan saw. Unfortunately, Carl Sagan didn't get
to see any of these pictures. He died in nineteen
ninety six, I believe, so all he got to see

(01:38:54):
were the original Mariner nine pictures of the pyramids in Elysium,
and he also saw some of the pyramid. The pictures
of the same pyramids from the Viking cameras.

Speaker 6 (01:39:06):
However, those were very bad.

Speaker 5 (01:39:07):
They were very poor, so he really not he never
got to get any resolution of these formations.

Speaker 6 (01:39:13):
Now these pictures were taken in the two thousands.

Speaker 5 (01:39:16):
These are from the Mars Reconnaissance orbit or these are
the CTX images. These are great images. But you can
see that the three sided pyramids very geometric. This is
something that does not happen in nature. In the same
area that Carl Sagan initially found these pyramids in the
Elisim area.

Speaker 6 (01:39:36):
This is what I call star shield.

Speaker 5 (01:39:37):
You see the shape of this, it's totally symmetrical, does
not look like something that was made naturally. This is
just to the northwest of that. This pyramid here almost identical,
except it's about.

Speaker 6 (01:39:50):
Half the size.

Speaker 5 (01:39:52):
The formation in the middle is a Fort Teresa which
is in Uruguay, and you can see it's almost got
the same type of buttresses and everything. So it's pretty remarkable.
And what I do throughout the book is show these
side by side pictures of these potential geometric structures and
pyramids that we're finding on Mars with their earth based

(01:40:16):
structures that look very similar This is highly symmetrical. This
one here just and you'll notice these little points at
the top. This one kind of curves off to the side.
So does this one, which we're not going to talk
about here. But these are all alignments that go from
one structure to the other. So not only are we
finding these structures that are very highly symmetrical and geometric,

(01:40:39):
they also have alignments with the surrounding structures. Now we're
moving on to a place called the Penthes. This is
the Penthes Mars. We were over here at Elysium. This
is going down a little south again. You see we're shoreline.
A lot of these bases.

Speaker 6 (01:40:55):
That we're finding.

Speaker 5 (01:40:56):
All these structures are you know, around the water where
the water would have been at one time. This is
another starburst. Again, this shows a earth based This is
Fort Henry, which was in Tennessee. This goes back to
like eighteen sixty one and during the Civil War and stuff.
A lot of these structures were made as these were

(01:41:17):
forts and we're finding all these forts now.

Speaker 6 (01:41:20):
Earlier in the discussion, if you remember, we talked about
this idea that a.

Speaker 5 (01:41:26):
Gatekeepers for this runaway culture that came to Mars and
they built these fortifications on Mars. This is exactly what
you would build. These have these buttresses. I mean, look
at the symmetry here. This is amazing.

Speaker 6 (01:41:37):
It almost looks like I dentical. You see this flat
area here on the fort it has the same thing here,
the same flat and this is where the little buildings
inside would be, which would be where you'd have the
weapons or the barracks and things like that.

Speaker 5 (01:41:50):
So this is pretty remarkable. This is a five sided
pentagonal pyramid. And here it is out the lines. I
just put the lines to show you. It's almost like
a Meso American step pyramid. Very geometric. Again, this is
a whole area of structures. This is highly anomalous. All

(01:42:12):
of these. You have triangles, you have squares, and what
I've done here I just outlined them.

Speaker 6 (01:42:18):
This is not natural.

Speaker 5 (01:42:19):
This is a whole city complex here, and we have
these rod formations. See these long rods. There's little squares, circles.
There's this strange looking thing here, there's a pyramidal formation.
These these long rod rectangular things are very similar. And
we'll move on to the next one. This is that

(01:42:40):
same This little structure here I did. This is a
close up of it.

Speaker 6 (01:42:44):
Highly symmetrical.

Speaker 5 (01:42:45):
It almost looks like it's a space vehicle that's parked there.
It has that that whole look to it with these
wings coming out. It's got this little beak area, highly symmetrical,
and right next to it is another mound which seems
to be a five sided formation there. So all of
this geometry is all over the place. This formation here

(01:43:09):
is the one down here. You have this mound here
with this rod on a platform. That's this last one
we're looking at. This is what we have on Mars,
and this is the cylindical part, and then you have
this mound at the end. This is the same structure
that we're finding here on Earth. Now, Dave, these are
almost identical. You have the mound here with the cylindrical part,

(01:43:31):
and this is all on a platform. This was produced
by the American Indians. This is in the Sue Johnson
Mound group right here on Earth. So again showing side
by side comparisons of what we're finding on Mars with
similar structures here on Earth. This one here is one
of the really amazing pieces. You see the geometry here,

(01:43:57):
it's just remarkable. This is also in the same area
the Penthes and this was found in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 6 (01:44:08):
The picture was taken.

Speaker 5 (01:44:09):
Now this structure on the end, Dave, this is over
in Turkey.

Speaker 6 (01:44:15):
This is on Earth. This is on Mars.

Speaker 5 (01:44:17):
It has the same shape. It has the mound in
the center. This has a mound in the center. Pretty remarkable.

Speaker 1 (01:44:26):
No kidding, no kidding, this should be possible.

Speaker 6 (01:44:32):
No.

Speaker 5 (01:44:34):
Now, if you notice this mound on Mars that has
the same you know it's an elongated formation, that's the
hexagonal formation. But you notice all these little this this
is all like little adobe structures here, all this little
this pattern here. When you when you zoom in, you
can see this is all the city area here, it's

(01:44:57):
on the other side. It's almost like a mirrored image.
You have the city on top of the mound. Here
on this on Mars, on Earth, the city.

Speaker 6 (01:45:05):
Is on the side. It's almost the reverse. It's like
you can't make this stuff up.

Speaker 1 (01:45:14):
No, no, not at all.

Speaker 6 (01:45:16):
I mean this is in Libya Mounds.

Speaker 5 (01:45:19):
This is where the one of your callers called in
and talked about the keyhole formation. This is the famous
keyhole formation. You have the mound at the bottom and
the wedge at the top. These straight lines. Now the
geologists of our science paper talked about if you looked
at wind mechanisms or what type of surface wind or whatever,

(01:45:42):
that geologists will say, oh, this was just caused by
you know, wind.

Speaker 6 (01:45:46):
Blowing down this way and causing these nice striation ridges.

Speaker 5 (01:45:49):
But if wind was coming down here, it would destroy
the mound at the bottom. So one geological explanation can't
explain this whole thing, which gives it more lenience to
this being artificial. This is just showing some of the
internal geometry, how this thing is totally symmetrical.

Speaker 6 (01:46:06):
This has exquisite geometry. Now the same design.

Speaker 5 (01:46:12):
These are keyhole tombs found in Saudi Arabia. These are
all over the place. They don't really know much about
these over in Saudi Arabia. They've always been there. A
lot of people didn't even know about these until Google
Earth came into effect, where people, you know, you can
be an armchair archaeologist and zoom around and go through
Google Earth and you find these things. They're all over
in Saudi Arabia. But this is the one that's most convincing.

(01:46:35):
This is the Kufan Tomb in Japan. And I'm doing
side by side comparisons here it's almost identical. I'm considering
this is on Mars and nobody's taken care of it.
This has been maintained in Japan because they want tourists
to come look at it. And these things are very
ancient in Japan. But if you look at the design,
it's just remarkable. I know you're speechless.

Speaker 1 (01:47:02):
I am a little blown away.

Speaker 6 (01:47:04):
Now.

Speaker 5 (01:47:05):
This was featured in the Journal of Space Exploration back
in twenty sixteen.

Speaker 6 (01:47:10):
Now we're moving to this.

Speaker 5 (01:47:11):
A lot of people are very excited about the Atlantis chaos.
This is what NASA causes area Atlantis chaos. Do you
see the grid? This is a city. This is the
grid city. These are building tops. They're kind of like
these compartmentalized structures. Here we have a dome formation. There's

(01:47:34):
a like a meso American a temple here.

Speaker 6 (01:47:40):
Excuse me, I've got to get it a little drink here.
But do you see the whole gridded area. I mean
these are cubicles, you see that.

Speaker 1 (01:47:50):
Yes, this is a comparison.

Speaker 5 (01:47:54):
Now again, this is something you find on Earth ops
like one too far. These are over in Saudi Arabia.

Speaker 6 (01:48:03):
These are those little uh, they're kind of like Adobe.

Speaker 5 (01:48:06):
They build these little complexes over there where everybody lives
next to each other. The one building is part of
another building. And these are all left in ruins. They
haven't been using these for like fifty years, but it
looks almost identical to what we're.

Speaker 6 (01:48:18):
Finding on Mars, the same grid.

Speaker 5 (01:48:21):
You can actually look down in some of these and
seeing seed debris, just like you can do here with
this this other pictures.

Speaker 6 (01:48:26):
It's pretty remarkable.

Speaker 1 (01:48:31):
So this is just approximately on Mars. Are these being located?
Excuse me, we're on Mars. Are these approximately being located?

Speaker 2 (01:48:43):
Structures?

Speaker 1 (01:48:44):
Are they? Are they all over? Are they in a cluster?

Speaker 6 (01:48:48):
No?

Speaker 5 (01:48:48):
There, we're finding they're in clusters all over the place
like you would have you know, little city, different parts
of the Pubsanta. But they're But where they're found is
we found that most of these cities that we're finding,
like the parrot ope, the parrot is not alone either,
there's a whole city next to that. But they're found
either thirty to forty degrees above the equator or thirty

(01:49:10):
to forty degrees below the equator. You know, the hots,
the sweet spots, just like you would have on Earth.
You know, those seems to be the you know, well
that's where all the civilization is the same thing on Mars,
and a lot of these are next to the shoreline
where you would have a port city and you know,
things like that.

Speaker 6 (01:49:30):
This shows those three main structures.

Speaker 5 (01:49:33):
This is interesting because you know doctor Brandenburg talked about
bombs going off above ground, and you know this is
part of the war. You have all these ruins here
and then you have these three main structures. This one here,
I call this is kind of like a woodmill or
a barn. It's got a chimney. There's a back porch here,
it goes off to the cliff. Here, there's all these

(01:49:54):
other ruins. This looks like the Capitol in DC. You
have the little dome there, the Capital Dome. This is
kind of like a step pyramid that goes all the
way up. Very interesting, you see that. Yes, this is
kind of like what happened to Hiroshima. You know, they
dropped the bomb and only this main building was survived.

(01:50:15):
And we see on Mars that everything else here is destroyed.
But we got these three buildings. So this may be
some of the evidence that we could use to discuss
what doctor John Brandenberg talks about.

Speaker 6 (01:50:26):
You know, this nuclear.

Speaker 5 (01:50:27):
Event, you know, finding the xenon one twenty nine in
the atmosphere. So this looks like, you know, the remains
of a nuclear attack. This is below the Lamars City.
These are just foundations. This is a triangular one. Here
there's an arrow shaped formation. These are just foundations. These

(01:50:48):
have been totally destroyed. This is just showing the outlines.

Speaker 6 (01:50:54):
Now.

Speaker 5 (01:50:55):
The interesting thing about these, Dave is that we had
our friend James Miller, he's part of our Sidonia Institute.
He did all the measurements of these and he found
that like from here to here is the same, From
here to here is the same measurements.

Speaker 6 (01:51:12):
Everything is the same. This is this matches the same
size as from here to here.

Speaker 2 (01:51:18):
No kidd.

Speaker 1 (01:51:20):
Say that is a no kidding. Yeah, Now he explained that.
Explain the measurement here to hear for our radio audience.

Speaker 6 (01:51:29):
Well, if you go.

Speaker 5 (01:51:30):
From the there's a triangle formation here which is the
foundational ruins. And if you go from the back of it,
it's actually has rounded corners. It's not like your typical
pointed triangle, and the corners are all rounded on all
three sides.

Speaker 6 (01:51:46):
And if you go from the.

Speaker 5 (01:51:48):
The western end over to the eastern side to the
tip of the point. That is the same measurement as
the tip of the arrow to the back of the arrow,
and a different structure. And if you go from there's
a triangular formation with pointed triangular points and the same thing.
If you go from the back of that to the
point of it, it's the same dimension. It's actually the

(01:52:09):
same size as the rounded triangle, as the arrow shape
and the triangle are all the same. Now, these things
here are kind of interesting. Are you familiar with fractals?

Speaker 6 (01:52:21):
Does the audience know it? Fractors are repeated pattern, Yes,
you find that in nature. These are fractals.

Speaker 5 (01:52:27):
These are all rounded triangle, a rectangle shapes, I'm sorry,
and they overlap one on top of each other. This
whole structure here is just fricking amazing. Below that we
have a triangle with this wedge shape overlaid on.

Speaker 6 (01:52:44):
Top of it. So these are all very geometric.

Speaker 5 (01:52:47):
Now, going back to this formation here that has the fractals,
we're doing a side by side comparison. This is an
American Indian ruins on the right side of the screen.
The left side were showing these rectangular fractals overlaying each other.
And on the right side of the screen, these are

(01:53:10):
four American Indian ruins of these rectangular shapes that are
just one on top of another. They're fractals. And these
were found accidentally in Arizona when they were putting a
new road in. These are the remains of pithouses that
the American Indians built, you know, hundreds of years ago,

(01:53:30):
and they were found while they were, like I said,
they were digging up to put a new road in,
taking the asphalt off, and they found like a corner
of one of these and.

Speaker 6 (01:53:39):
They said, oh, we got to stop what's going on here?

Speaker 5 (01:53:41):
And they found this whole fractal area, which is pretty
amazing that it looks almost like what we're seeing on Mars,
this whole idea of the fractal design of archaeology.

Speaker 1 (01:53:52):
My friend, it is time for us to start to
wrap things up here. It's hard to believe we've already
rushed through this entire show with you, but I want
to say thank you for coming on George on spaced
Out Radio. It's been an absolute pleasure to have you here.

Speaker 6 (01:54:08):
I feel spaced out myself right now.

Speaker 1 (01:54:12):
All good, my friend, you know, and we want to
encourage people to go to your website and and make
sure that they they excuse me, that they get your
books there. And if you're looking for the website, it
is the Sidonia Institute dot com. Space out Radio.

Speaker 5 (01:54:32):
Thank on my Facebook, you know, I want to friend
me or whatever.

Speaker 6 (01:54:36):
I'd be happy to talk to anybody you know privately on.

Speaker 1 (01:54:39):
The space beautiful Dave Scott. We'll be right back everybody.
I loved it.

Speaker 6 (01:54:56):
Thank you man, well, thanks for having me on.

Speaker 5 (01:54:59):
Sorry about to get that little plug in the end.
But if any of your audience out there wants to,
you know, go to my Facebook. I'm happy to talk
to people, show them more evidence, and you know, help
them with any kind of questions they have.

Speaker 1 (01:55:12):
All right, buddy, you take care. Okay, thanks a lot, Dave.
That was a lot of fun. Thank you. Take care. Yeah,
but George has everybody. It was a different show than
what we normally do, but that was so amazing, absolutely
so amazing, great time. I'll be right back.

Speaker 4 (01:55:30):
Everybody, US, USA, US.

Speaker 1 (01:59:42):
All right, let's bring in special guests tonight. You may
know him. It's part of the Golden Girls.

Speaker 7 (01:59:55):
It's b Arthur.

Speaker 1 (01:59:56):
Everybody there.

Speaker 2 (01:59:57):
He is Hey, other, how you doing good?

Speaker 1 (02:00:01):
Look at good Bee that you look at golden.

Speaker 2 (02:00:06):
You know, you bring out that shine in me every time.

Speaker 1 (02:00:08):
I appreciate that. Rob de Valley, Welcome to so our chat.
Oh it's Driftwood. How you doing, buddy? How you doing?
Polly Roderman, Nice to see you. Mm hmm, it's all good,
all good.

Speaker 2 (02:00:28):
I didn't get to listen to the whole interview.

Speaker 1 (02:00:30):
It just fascinating, absolutely fascinating.

Speaker 2 (02:00:35):
I've always been marveling at Mars and a lot of
the imagery that kind of gets scrubbed and it kind
of gets pushed under the table. But there's some really
weird things up there. Jarnce Carter. Why does Dave always
look more like Santa Claus the closer we get to December? Wow, Wow,

(02:00:58):
gig zip here Jaron's Carter there he is just one time.
Just say ho ho ho you.

Speaker 1 (02:01:12):
Ten seconds, my friend. We're gonna go to swamp Dweller.
He'll be about five minutes. Okay, perfect, All right, here
we go. Here we go with the final hour of

(02:01:32):
spaced out Radio. Good to have you with us. My
name is Dave Scott. We always appreciate you're tuning us
on in wherever you are on this beautiful planet we
call Earth. Hey, we want to remind everybody that we
have Swamp Dweller coming up and the Q and A
with b Arthur. We call him be around here because

(02:01:55):
his voice is golden. Brent Thomas from the Paranormal Poor
podcast is here, so we're going to have some fun
with him here coming on up. But first we want
to say hello to everyone tuning us in on our
terrestrial affiliates around North America digitally on every major podcast network.
Our website spaced out Radio dot com. We have a

(02:02:18):
plethora of features for you. Rock out to bumblefoot, read
the news wire, check out our swag as well. You
can follow us on exit, spaced Out Radio, Instagram, at
spaced Out Radio Show, and on Patreon. In the Space
Travelers Club, the Desert Clam has set the password for
tonight in the sr Space Travelers Club Balatron. Balatron is

(02:02:43):
your password. Use it wisely, space Travelers, as the Clam
sits the password each and every night. Right here on
spaced Out Radio, let's head to the swamp.

Speaker 8 (02:02:54):
Hello and welcome to spaced Out Radio Swamp. I'm swamp
Dweller in tonight going to take you on a mystic
Journey of the Unknown, sharing tales of monsters, legends, and nightmares.
Welcome to the space out Radio Swamp.

Speaker 9 (02:03:10):
For this next case, we need to travel back to
nineteen ninety two in the city of Columbia, South Carolina.
Colombia is a rather large city with an estimated population
of around one hundred and thirty two thousand people. Colombia
is also the state capital is in the center of
the Columbia metropolitan area, which boast upwards of eight hundred

(02:03:31):
and fifty thousand residents. It is safe to say in
an area with so many people living their lives, it
is no doubt that some may go missing in broad daylight.
Unfortunately for Dale Dinwity, she would be one of the
many who seemingly vanish in a crowd of people. On
September twenty third, nineteen ninety two, Dale and a group

(02:03:52):
of her friends were attending a U two concerts. For
those who are not aware or may not know or
were born after two thousand. U two was an Irish
rock band from the mid seventies. The show was happening
at the ever buzzing Williams Bryce Stadium, home to the
South Carolina game Cocks college football games. This stadium currently

(02:04:15):
holds over eighty thousand people, but in nineteen ninety two
it had the capacity to sit around seventy three thousand,
still a lot of people. The concert went on until
about eleven to fifteen pm. Then Dale and her friends
decided to head toward the Five Points area of Columbia.
They went to a popular nightclub in the area at

(02:04:35):
the time, named Jungle Gyms. It is rather unclear what
happened that night, as sometime during the hour and a
half they were there, Dale would get separated from her
group of friends. Around one am on September twenty fourth,
the group left the club and assumed Dale had called
her parents or had gotten a ride home. Sadly, this

(02:04:57):
was not the reality of the situation. Dale was still
in the nightclub, unaware her friends had left without her.
Dale could be seen on surveillance footage asking a bouncer
if they had seen her friends. Sometime around one thirty am.
She stopped talking with the bouncer and was seen walking
north on Harden Street. Consequently, Dale has never been seen

(02:05:21):
or heard from again. Dale Dinwiddie is a Caucasian female
with brown hair and brown eyes. She was twenty three
at the time of her disappearance and weighed approximately ninety
six to one hundred pounds and was about five feet tall.
She was last seen wearing a forest green sweatshirt, a

(02:05:42):
blue nylon LLL bean jacket tied around her waist, faded
blue jeans, and sneakers. Now I realize there is not
a ton of information behind this case, but that is
exactly why I chose to cover this one, as I
feel there is so much being left out or kept
from the public. Been multiple theories thrown around as what

(02:06:02):
happened to Dale Dinwiddie, the most popular theory being well
abduction or murder. This is the primary theory that most
investigators have gotten behind. Some people close to the story
insist Dale had to have been taken by someone who
knew her, or potentially a stalker or stranger who had
been following her for some time. Many have stated that
it would be very unlikely for Dale to enter a

(02:06:23):
stranger's vehicle on her own accord, leaving many to think
she was familiar with whoever she got in the vehicle with.
It does look like the lack of clues in this
case indicate Dale's disappearance was likely a carefully planned event.
Investigators have gone on record to say anyone who kidnapped
her own impulse would most likely have been sloppy, leaving

(02:06:44):
behind clues. To me, this is not necessarily a solid argument,
and as with the lack of witnesses, we clearly have
a lack of clues, which does not mean the potential
abduction was planned or unplanned at all. The absence of
evidence does not mean the evidence of absence. I am
unsure of where I lean in this case, but I
can say there have been a few suspects over the years.

(02:07:07):
A popular suspect who was investigated was a man named
Ronaldo Javier Rivera. He confessed to killing four women in
Georgia and is suspected to have been behind many more.
What made Rivera a solid suspect was that he was
a violent killer who had lived in the area at
the time Dale disappeared. He was even attending the University

(02:07:29):
of South Carolina in nineteen ninety two. The university is
not terribly far from the Five Points area Dale was
last seen. Outside of the possibility of him being in
the area, though no evidence has ever been found linking
him to the crime, and at the end of the day,
Dale and her family deserve answers and closure. Over the years,

(02:07:50):
investigators have followed up on thousands of tips, many of
which are somewhat useful, but there are quite a few
that border un ridiculous. Many properties have been searched after
reports of foul odors and deer bones were dug up.
Ground penetrating radar, scent dogs and more have all been
dispatched and used to aid officials in lighter news. Dale's

(02:08:14):
dental records and DNA are on record. If her remains
are ever found, she will likely be identified. Even though
odds are slim that this case will be solved, I
see no reason to not share this in hopes as
someone possibly knowing something. There is still a twenty thousand
dollars reward for anyone with information that solves this case.

(02:08:35):
If you, or anyone you may know have any information
regarding to Dale Dinwoodie's whereabouts, please call the Columbia Police
Department at eight Oho three five four five three five
zero zero.

Speaker 1 (02:08:50):
Thank you swamp Dweller for another spooky story. If you
want more just like that, head on over to his
YouTube channel Swamp Dweller and it's subscribe ring that pell.
There's thousands of stories there for you to listen to.
Let's go to the Q and A. Well, these strousses

(02:09:28):
off this time because he is out and about looking
for Bigfoot and aliens in the mountains of Washington State.
So filling in is the man, the myth and the
Golden Legend. Brent Thomas from the Paranormal Portal podcast, How
you doing, Buddy good?

Speaker 2 (02:09:47):
I hope I can fill his shoes, but I'll do
my best.

Speaker 1 (02:09:49):
Well, you're golden, you got that golden voice be and
it's always good to have you here.

Speaker 2 (02:09:55):
That it's great to be here.

Speaker 3 (02:09:56):
Man.

Speaker 2 (02:09:57):
I would love coming on your show with you and
I always have a good time. So thank you for
having me back again.

Speaker 1 (02:10:03):
Appreciate that. Mars Man, we were just talking about Mars
with George Jay Haas a little bit ago. I mean,
what do you think of this theory that you know
it's already been a civilization that may have been destroyed.

Speaker 2 (02:10:19):
I'm really into that. I really believe that. I've seen,
you know, of course a bunch of photos through the
years from the orbiters and stuff, and of course the
the faith on Mars's everybody knows about that. But there's
a lot of other things that have been found there.
I really liked that he was I just caught the
end of it again, and he was highlighting like the foundations.

(02:10:41):
And I've seen other, you know, pictures like that that
have allegedly come from the Mars orbiter. And that is
not a natural that's not a natural thing. I mean,
it's geometrically, you know, angular and square, and that has
to be intentional. I just can't buy the fact that
it's some kind of erosion or something else. And there's

(02:11:01):
lots of strangeness there. I'm pretty sure in my opinion
that it was there was something significantly going there. And
I've heard theories all the way back to maybe that's
where we came from, Like maybe our ancestors started there
and then bailed out of Mars because of whatever they
all happened there and dumped us off here.

Speaker 1 (02:11:23):
Yeah, it's very much something that I want to believe,
you know. I mean, like, how did we know like
centuries ago that this was a violent planet and that's
why they named it Mars for god of war. I mean,
then you find out that there's there's things on there

(02:11:44):
that just cannot be explained, like these a lot of
these photographs and a lot of these these materials that
the rovers have recovered. It makes you wonder. I don't
know if it does for you, but it really makes
me wonder for me, how much do we really know?
And how much are we covering up from regular society?

Speaker 2 (02:12:05):
You know, I think even here terrestrially, we have the
phenomenon known as like OOPArts, the out of place artifacts,
you know, where machined aluminium has been found when they're
excavating mastedon skulls and things like that. It's like, well,
how did that happen? Because that didn't aluminiums have been
around that long, you know, in terms of elemental discoveries,

(02:12:29):
I think it's really really recent, in the last couple
of centuries anyway, But how did it get down to
like mastedon skull level in the strata and the sediments
and you know other things that have been found that
just don't now. I know, some of the parts maybe
are scammy, but even here there seems to be at

(02:12:49):
least evidence, I think pretty convincing evidence, Like when you
look at Puma Punka and other ancient areas that were
perhaps legendarily assisted the early man with construction. When you
look at the you know, there's granite blocks that look
like they're melted into place and then solid, and then

(02:13:10):
there are themes that are too tight to even slider
piece of paper through, you know, or a razor blade.
And somehow these ancient cultures with Bronze era tools managed
to do that when you know, our best draftsmans would
be seriously challenged to complete that even today. So I
think that, you know, just speaking of Earth, there's a

(02:13:32):
whole series of histories that we aren't aware of. And
then you know, when you're looking at Mars, which was
maybe habited millions of years ago. I don't know what
the geological timetable is on that for sure, but it
stands to reason to me that you know, there's a
lot we aren't being told or they just don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:13:54):
It always makes me wonder because I know a big
part of science is theory and theoretics, and always makes
me wonder how some of these theories come about from
just you know, viewing a photograph or something through a
camera lens. It just baffles me. Maybe, Look, I'm not

(02:14:14):
a smart guy when it comes to science. I'm more
than willing to admit that that's why I took up
journalism instead of doing something real in life. You know,
But I look at this and I and a lot
of this I just can't fathom. And I'm pretty open
minded guy. But when they're sitting there saying, you know,

(02:14:35):
like doctor John Brandenburg saying, you know that it looks
like about a million years ago there was some sort
of nuclear holocaust on Mars that wiped everything out. How
do you get that from still images? You haven't been
able to sit there and study the dirt or the
or the compounds within it. You haven't been able to

(02:14:57):
step on the planet to see the radiation levels, even
though I guess the rovers could send the radiation levels over.
I mean, it just seems so complicated to come up
with some of these weird, strange answers. Yet we don't
believe that there's a civilization out there that's smart enough

(02:15:17):
and technologically advanced enough to fly here.

Speaker 2 (02:15:21):
Yeah. Well, I agree, it's hard to know how they
got to the assumptions that they got to from photographs.
I'm with you there, but there does seem to be
ample evidence to suggest. Now here's the thing. You know,
a lot of people say, well, you know, I follow
the scientific method. Well, if you truly follow that, and

(02:15:42):
I may have said it here before, so sorry if
it's redundant, but I think it's a great argument is
that if you truly follow the scientific method, you have
to allow for all eventualities and possibilities until they can
be systematically rolled out. And we have a real hubris
in our sciences that, well, that doesn't follow what we think,
so we're not willing to entertain it. Well that's already

(02:16:04):
not scientific then, But you know, I in following that,
I think it's also amazing that they can look at
a telescope thousands, tens of thousands of light years away,
watch for a wobble in the light and decide that
there's planets there, and then judging by the spectaography of

(02:16:24):
the light going next to that planet, they can tell
whether it has an atmosphere and what kind of gases
are in it. So, my god, it's just like, how
do you do that? So I think there's a there's
there's certainly a lot to unpack with all of that,
but I think there is at least enough evidence to

(02:16:45):
suggest it's okay to ask the questions.

Speaker 1 (02:16:49):
I would agree with that. Let's switch topics here. All right,
let's go because Halloween is just, you know, a couple
of weeks away, and have you picked out your costume.

Speaker 2 (02:17:01):
I'm going as a podcaster. No, I'm not sure. I
probably will just put on my wizard robe again and
that same thing I did last year and go around
with my kid while he drags them a bunch of
candy for us to eat. But I don't know, probably
a wizard, how about you.

Speaker 1 (02:17:19):
I splurged this year and got myself one of those
inflatable alien costumes, so I'm literally going to be a
big green alien.

Speaker 2 (02:17:31):
You know, just keep keep the fart spray away from
the event.

Speaker 1 (02:17:36):
I'm just saying, well, you know what, I did think
about that, because you know, my kid would probably try
something silly like that. But so the face is exposed,
so oh okay, yeah, the face is exposed, so there
is no way I will be caught for something like that.

Speaker 2 (02:17:55):
So either you'll be an alien or a teletubby, one
of the two.

Speaker 1 (02:17:58):
One of the two. One of the two too. But
it's going to be good, nonetheless, and I'm going to
take my boy out. Hard to believe, man, that it's
another Halloween already upon us. But I want to ask
you something. Okay, one of the Halloween traditions that a
lot of people have, especially people who don't really know

(02:18:20):
about it, is people get out the old wija board
at this time of year like that. What do you think?

Speaker 2 (02:18:29):
Are you a big fan of the wija board? So
here's here's my take on the wija board. I think
that I don't know how much time we got, you're
going to get the ten dollars answer day we got.
I think wija boards in and of themselves are just
a print on a on a medium, and that in

(02:18:50):
and of themselves doesn't make it any dangerous, more dangerous
than like a place matt for your kid's cereal bowl
to sit on, or you know, a seating place. I
think that the big problem with wigia boards in ninety
nine percent of the time people will use them and
have almost no activity or very little activity, or maybe
a slight movement. But the risk, I think is that

(02:19:12):
when you're using a wija board, you are putting yourself
in a spiritual circuit. You are directly inserting yourself as
a blind channel to something to come through you. And
I think that anytime you communicate with spirits. You should
really know what you're doing because you don't know what
you're dealing with, and you should be able to protect yourself,

(02:19:34):
you know, because you're touching a piece of plastic, you're saying,
is anyone there like to speak with me? Well, maybe
nothing is, maybe something is. Maybe that something is really
not someone you should be talking to. But I think
the problem is that you are creating a contact and
you're asking something to come through your energy, your body

(02:19:58):
and in a sense and work in unison with you
to communicate answers. But you're already green lighting something to
come through you and into you that you have no
idea what it is. So I think anytime you create
a blind channel of yourself, it's incredibly risky. And you know,
in esoteric schools, magical practices, you know any number of

(02:20:23):
divination techniques that usually people are trained and have an
understanding of what could be there, how to set your environment,
how to open it correctly, open a session correctly and safely,
how to deal with the session safely, and then how
to close it. And I'm here to tell you I
don't believe that dragging a piece of plastic over goodbye

(02:20:44):
is closing a session. So I think that if you
make that circuit happen, you welcome something in, and you've
also left the door wide open for something to continue
to come in. See.

Speaker 1 (02:20:56):
I think a lot of the people who have the
best experiences are unfortunately people who were using it, probably
at a time in their life where they didn't know
or understand the power of the board. Now do I
own a weege board? No, I don't. I haven't played
one one for well over a decade. Would I do

(02:21:19):
it again? Sure I would. Actually, that's that's a lie.
In twenty twenty four, Meurle, myself and Samantha used one
Samantha moment and so that was the first time in
a decade that I had used one. And I think
for most people out there, we don't. We're using them

(02:21:40):
without using them properly. And especially you know a lot
of people had that bad experience when they were teenagers
hanging out at a buddy's house and brought out the
little wige aboard. Let's see if we could let's see
if we could contact the devil. Let's see if BL's
abub will come, you know, put a devil for aside

(02:22:00):
for us right, you know, let's let's get Zozo around.
You know, yeah, it's it gets a little ridiculous. And
and I think people, you know, had those bad experiences
because they didn't close the door, they didn't say goodbye,

(02:22:22):
they didn't practice any sort of safety. They were there
strictly for the spook factor. I mean, you've done enough
ghost hunting and been around you know, ghost tours. I've
done ghost tours where you get those people who come
they don't care what happens to them. They just want
to be scared. They want that freak out session just

(02:22:45):
to you know, think about you know, think about having
some sort of activity. They want that that TikTok reel
of spookiness to fly at them and hit them on
the side of the head. And that's what I think
a big problem with the weedgeboard is. You know, yeah,

(02:23:06):
I would agree. I think that largely people look at
the spiritual stuff. And maybe it's a byproduct of the
fact that, you know, there's ghost shows on every channel
and you tune in and they run around with these
things and things happen, and then the show's over and
then you know, we'll see them next week do the
same thing. But there's a lot of stuff they don't address,
and that is protecting yourself spiritually and making sure that

(02:23:27):
you have a plan and that you have a system
in place to properly document. But I think that largely
it's given the impression of this being the newest reality
TV where you just go into haunted places and you
start poking around and see what you can find. And
there are.

Speaker 2 (02:23:44):
Dark, horrible things out there, and I don't think a
lot of times those shows really address the dangers.

Speaker 1 (02:23:50):
I would agree with you on that, and I would
agree that the biggest problem that paranormal television over the
last twenty years is brought forward is thinking that anybody
can do this right, you know. I mean not everybody
can play in the NFL, not everybody can act in
a movie, not everybody can drive a car, and there's
a lot of people on the road that probably shouldn't

(02:24:12):
be right. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, Yet ghost hunting it's like, yeah,
just buy the gear and go. You don't need any
formal training, learn on the fly. When we come back,
we're going to continue the paranormal Talk with our good
friend friend Thomas com Paranormal Portal podcast.

Speaker 3 (02:24:34):
This is spaced out Radio and.

Speaker 6 (02:24:36):
Your host's name Scott.

Speaker 1 (02:24:58):
All right, buddy, we're clearing cool. We'll get into the
conjuring house next. Oh sure, sure, that's an interesting story. Yeah,
I kind of.

Speaker 2 (02:25:11):
There's been a few curve balls been thrown on that lately. Yeah,
somebody's trying to cash in on it now. They brought
out the debt from the bank and then they're going
to reauction. Somebody went, ooh.

Speaker 1 (02:25:23):
Cool, aero, how you doing.

Speaker 2 (02:25:27):
So as I was looking in Dave's window.

Speaker 1 (02:25:33):
No, Carl, tonight, Carl, where the hell are you? Hey, Jesus,
let's get her going. So what prompted you to do
the alien costume? That's gotta be hilarious. I've got to

(02:25:55):
see pictures of that. Oh, there will be pictures. I
don't and I don't mind embarrassing myself like that.

Speaker 2 (02:26:01):
Oh no, I think it's fun. I think that's great.
I'll use it as wallpaper on my desktop.

Speaker 1 (02:26:15):
Did take you? Just get the photo and put it
through chat GPT.

Speaker 2 (02:26:20):
We'll have you all flex and then stuff with your
alien muscles. Moist lots of moist comments tonight.

Speaker 1 (02:26:32):
By the way, for everybody wondering about next year's Caribou con,
up here, one hundred and eight mile ranch that'll be
sponsored by Spaced Out Radio. B Arthur is going to
be here to speak.

Speaker 2 (02:26:49):
I am.

Speaker 1 (02:26:49):
Yeah, b Arthur will be here. So if you want
some autographs from b Arthur photographs, he'll shake your hand.
He'll give you the tip of the cap when he
sees you. He's gonna go like this, you know, just
for you.

Speaker 2 (02:27:07):
They hare is just a mess.

Speaker 1 (02:27:09):
We're gonna be We're gonna be confirming guests here soon.

Speaker 2 (02:27:13):
Oh cool.

Speaker 1 (02:27:14):
Yeah, I've already invited Bee and I've told him he's
not allowed to change his mind.

Speaker 2 (02:27:19):
No, no, I'll be there.

Speaker 1 (02:27:21):
Yeah, he's gonna make the drive up from Idaho. She's
gonna bring some Idaho potatoes with him.

Speaker 2 (02:27:30):
You know that's not really a big thing anymore. Here.

Speaker 1 (02:27:40):
You're gonna have a nice drive, man, I bet you
it's beautiful.

Speaker 6 (02:27:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:27:44):
Yeah, man, you got two choices. You could go through
Bonner's Ferry north through to Creston. Are they where they
brew cocony beer?

Speaker 2 (02:27:53):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (02:27:54):
Have you ever had cocony beer?

Speaker 6 (02:27:56):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (02:27:56):
Yeah, yeah, it's best. Nice cold Joe in the chat room.
What do you think of cocony beer? I send him
a forty eight pack one day?

Speaker 2 (02:28:08):
You really? Yeah, it's like the beer here, that's the beer.

Speaker 1 (02:28:14):
There's nothing better than ice cold cocony.

Speaker 2 (02:28:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:28:20):
When it starts to warm up, it's a little bit
just like every beer. But when it's ice cold. Oh
does it go down smooth? Are you yetti or rue yetti?
How are you welcome to sour chat?

Speaker 2 (02:28:37):
It just slides down when it's cold.

Speaker 1 (02:28:41):
I got a fridze. I get a fridge full of
near ice cold ones.

Speaker 2 (02:28:46):
Do you really all nice? When I come up with
the conference, you'll have to left to sit in the
studio there and hoist a few.

Speaker 1 (02:28:53):
Oh, it's a good time. Yeah. Then you just take
a highway, no Highway five, I guess, no highway three,
Highway three west to a soy Use and then ninety
seven north.

Speaker 2 (02:29:15):
Oh very good. Are you over a by the coast
or where?

Speaker 1 (02:29:17):
Oh man, you gotta you gotta go way up?

Speaker 2 (02:29:22):
Oh? Really? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (02:29:23):
Okay, he said you're about an eight hour drive.

Speaker 2 (02:29:28):
Yeah, it won't be too bad.

Speaker 3 (02:29:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:29:29):
I just drove twenty one hours to Missouri the other week.
That was a lot nice drive. Yeah, that's just beautiful.

Speaker 1 (02:29:40):
Yeah, that's going to be next when September eighteenth, to twentieth,
eighteenth to twentieth. Okay, we're gonna have the website going
next week.

Speaker 2 (02:29:56):
Fantastic, so.

Speaker 1 (02:29:59):
Yeah, it shall be good. Big thank you tonight to
Kitty Caddy Wack Necessary Dialogue, Von Patrick, Debor Rooney Area
fifty four times two and Darryl thank you for the
super chats. Greatly appreciate the love and support tonight, and
here we go, everybody, We've rounded third. We're heading for

(02:30:43):
home tonight on spaced Out Radio. My name is Dave Scott.
Thank you for tuning us in wherever you are on
this beautiful planet we call Earth. We're going to continue
the Q and A with Brent Thomas coming up here momentarily.
But first we want to remind you that if you
missed most of this show or others, our archives are
always free on YouTube or any major podcast network. Our

(02:31:06):
website spased out Radio dot com. We have a plethora
of features for you. Rockout to bumblefoot, read the news wire,
check out our swag as well. You can follow us
on exit, spaced Out Radio, Instagram at spaced Out Radio Show,
and on Patreon. In the Space Travelers Club, we call
him be around here because he's Golden Brent Thomas from

(02:31:29):
the Paranormal Portal podcast joining us for the Q and
A as he's filling in for Lee Strauss this week.
And interesting story coming out of Rhode Island where the
famous Conjuring House that has created a big time paranormal
horror suspense movie series is now up for sale and

(02:31:53):
there are many people within the paranormal world that are
going absolutely haywire because the owners currently have gone into bankruptcy.
They've foreclosed on the mortgage. Now the house is apparently
going up for auction, but may have an offer on
it so that way it doesn't go up for auction,

(02:32:15):
but it's probably still going up for auction. And as
confusing as that sounds, that's literally what's happened here. Many
paranormal celebrities like Jason Hawes from Ghost Hunters and many
others are trying to put together money to try and
buy this paranormal museum, this paranormal paradise of a home.

(02:32:38):
Andrea Parrin, who is a child living in that house,
has basically said she doesn't want it going to anybody
who is going to try and claim major profit on
it because of the paranormal happenings there. This has turned
into quite a soap opera there, Brent Thomas.

Speaker 2 (02:32:58):
Yeah, it has. I think I think there's quite a
bit of hubrist there on her part to say, well,
I used to live there. I don't want this to happen,
and it's like, well, I appreciate that, but it's not
your house anymore.

Speaker 6 (02:33:11):
So.

Speaker 2 (02:33:12):
I mean, they could make a petting zoo in the
living room in there, and if somebody buys it, they
buy it and they can do what they want. But
I can understand that she has hopes for the property.
But I think I'm concerned about the same thing though. Honestly,
I think that whoever grabs it, I think is gonna
make a lot of money or try to make a

(02:33:33):
lot of money on the overnights and the investigation part
of it. And I don't know, I don't the thing
that kind of concerns me, Dave, and tell me what
you think. But I think the bigger these properties get
and the more traffic they get, the more played out
the activity is. Like I was in Saint Ignatius researching
and investigating with a friend of mine and it was

(02:33:56):
during it was two years ago, during the month of
October and it was dead and quiet. There was like
nothing going on in that place. And I just think
that the more traffic that goes through a place, the
less likely are to have activity. What do you think
of that?

Speaker 1 (02:34:11):
I would agree with you on that, I really would.
And I think that in this case, I understand Andrea Parrin.
You know, there's a big attachment to that. Number one,
The Conjuring story never told the real story of what happened.
Let's remember when Hollywood tells you that this is based
on a true story, what that means is they've paid

(02:34:34):
off the family to use portions of their story to
turn that movie into anything they want, and that's what happened. So,
for instance, they made Andrea's father looked like a real
bad guy, and he wasn't a bad guy, but they

(02:34:54):
needed some controversy for the movie, so they did that
with the father. Okay, they made the Warrens look like heroes,
and yet there was some trouble with the Warrens at
the house. You know, even the latest Conjuring movie with
the Smurle family, the Smurle family was not impressed with

(02:35:16):
the way Ed and Lorraine Warren handled the investigation at all.
But you know what Money Talks and the Conjuring Family
or the Conjuring series and whoever owns that wanted big
time to cash in on the Smurls story with a

(02:35:37):
movie and Money Talks, and that's kind of the way,
kind of the way it's played out. I'm trying to
get a date to have Karen Smurle come on this show.
She's a good friend. She's done this show about four
times over the years, three four times, and I want
to get her back on to talk about it because
I know she's not happy about it. That being said,

(02:35:59):
I understand the passion. You know that even though the
Andrea Parrin doesn't live there anymore, there is a solemn
love and admiration of history for what they went through
in that house. It's kind of like, you know, even
the museum down down the road. I don't own the museum.
I don't have any financial aspect or tied to the museum,

(02:36:23):
but I'll tell you man that Big Clydesdale Barn I'm
protective of it. Yeah, you know, I don't want people
going through there because you build something with the spirits
that are in there, and when somebody comes in and
screws it up. You don't want it to go that way, right,
And unfortunately, like I think it was, comedian Matt Rife

(02:36:47):
was trying to buy the house, you know, by the
conjuring one. Pardon me, the conjuring house. Yes, trying to
buy the conjuring house. And now Jason Hawes has go
fund me trying to put together that house, and they're
all saying the right things. Look, we don't want it

(02:37:09):
taken advantage of Sure, I don't know if you could
do that. I don't know, I really.

Speaker 2 (02:37:19):
Know, But you're really right, you're really dead on when
you're talking about the whole based on a true story thing,
It's like that movie Cocaine Bear. It was based on
a true story, but the true story was this plane
dumped some of its cocaine down because it was getting overtaken.
That part was true. The cocaine landed in the forest

(02:37:41):
and a bear did get into it, But the true
story is the bear made it about one hundred feet
and diet of a heart attack. It didn't go on
in a killing spree. So it's based on a true story,
even though it's an absolute fabrication, you know, So I
can understand how that must hurt to offer your story

(02:38:02):
or to have it for sale, have somebody buy it
and say, oh, we're going to stick to this, and
then when you watch it, it's like, that's not my story.
That must be just heartbreaking.

Speaker 6 (02:38:12):
M h.

Speaker 1 (02:38:13):
Well, the same thing happened with with Travis Walton and
the guys during Fire in the Sky.

Speaker 6 (02:38:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:38:20):
You know, there were only six of them in the movie,
but there were seven in the truck. How do you
eliminate somebody? Right?

Speaker 2 (02:38:30):
No, Yeah, it's it's tragic how much liberty they take
with those stories to create, you know, whatever it is
they're creating. But you know, whatever it says based on
a true storm, I'm like, yeah, yeah, no, it's barely
based on a true story.

Speaker 1 (02:38:47):
If you had the money, would you buy the Conjuring
Conjuring House?

Speaker 2 (02:38:51):
I don't know if I would. I mean, I think
it's probably going to be grossly overpriced for what it is,
not withstanding the historical value. But I don't know. I
don't see. The thing is is, I don't think I
think that anywhere and everywhere is prone to be just
as haunted as anywhere else. This stuff happens where it happened,

(02:39:14):
when it happens why it happens. And we don't know
what any of those formula are, but there certainly is
a history of the house. But I don't know that
paranormal activity is locked into a real estate's plot, you know.
It's just I don't know. I don't even know what
it's supposed to go for. But I'm sure it's going

(02:39:34):
to be grossly overpriced.

Speaker 1 (02:39:36):
Oh I'm sure it will be. And that's what the
banks are opening on and the you know, I mean,
why not get a bidding war going. It saves the money,
you know. But I also understand too, the concern that
they don't want it to turn into a paranormal carnival.
And I think that's that's something that we see in

(02:39:57):
a lot of these locations. Look at Waverley Hill, so
it's turned into a paranormal carnival, you know, a lot
of the ex prisons that are now paranormal hotspots have
turned into carnival acts, you know. And I agree that
paranormal tourism is something that is very important. It's a

(02:40:18):
great way to promote a community. It's a great way
to promote history if you tell the history properly. And
I think it's a great way also to raise money
for museums or local charities or something along those lines.

(02:40:38):
But I think people are also there, and I have
to be careful here because I'm a capitalist when it
comes to things like this. I don't have problem with
people making money as long as they're doing it honorably.
I don't have a problem. Like one of the things
that I read with Jason Hawes on his GoFundMe account

(02:41:01):
was that we don't we don't want them jacking up
the rates for people to have a paranormal experience. Well,
that is not the the problem of the ownership or
whoever buys it. That's the problem of the people who
decide to pay it. Okay, there are certain things I
won't pay a dime for, but there are certain things

(02:41:25):
that I will break the bank account for even if
I can't afford it. Yeah, and we're all that way.

Speaker 2 (02:41:34):
Yeah. I think I think the you know, a lot
of people in the paranormal get all pissy when they hear,
oh they're charging you know, two hundred dollars a night
to do that. Oh they just want to wake in money.
But it's like another thing that that does is it
helps to sustain these properties. I don't think people should

(02:41:55):
expect people to invest their own money, like they shouldn't
expect some party go and invest our own money. Fix
it up, make it safe, keep it up to code,
open the doors and say come on everybody, it's free.
I mean everything they they do deserve to make make
an income on it. It should it should It shouldn't

(02:42:15):
be taboo to charge money for people to come in
and maybe find some amazing evidence, maybe find nothing. But
they're they're creating a space for that to happen, you know,
And a lot of people in the paranormal get real
turned off by that. It's like, oh, they're charging money
forget about it. I'm not going there. It's like, well,
if you had people storming through your house all night

(02:42:36):
with you know, meters and stuff, wouldn't you want to
be compensated for that?

Speaker 1 (02:42:40):
Well, not just that, but you're having to pay a staff,
You're having to pay insurance, taxes, mortgage. Okay, there's a
lot of bills that go on there. Electrical hydro, yeah, wi, it.

Speaker 2 (02:42:59):
All adds up, electricity, lights, everything, working, toilets at work.
I mean, yeah, the list goes on and on, and
I don't think there's anything wrong with people making money. Now,
I've heard some stories of some properties that are like, oh,
they want like six thousand dollars a night for this small,
little little space. It's like, my god, that's that's actually gross.

(02:43:23):
That is the other side of the spectrum. It's like,
it's okay to make some money.

Speaker 1 (02:43:26):
And I will I will say this though, I'm gonna
apologize for cutting you off.

Speaker 2 (02:43:31):
No, no, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (02:43:33):
I know why they do that. Yeah, okay, and just
hear me out on this. A lot of these paranormal
locations do that because they're trying to keep the riff
wrath out. Okay. There are a lot of paranormal teams
out there that they don't care about what the locations

(02:44:00):
says or what their rules are or regulations are. They're
going to do their thing. Give me an example there is,
and we've said this story on this show a few
times with Merle. Merle heavily investigates a place called the
Bailey House in Merit, British Columbia. A paranormal team went

(02:44:22):
in there and vandalized it. Oh god, So the paranormal team,
they're very well known for going into locations on their
YouTube channel. Then they do their voice of God thing
that they're going to clear out all the spirits and
make this place peaceful and spirit free again. So in

(02:44:45):
the Bailey House, going down the stairs into the basement,
somebody a number of years ago put a chalk drawing
of a of a angel and a devil, and there
was a little saying on that, and in fact, if
you watch our YouTube channel you will actually see that

(02:45:08):
on our opening video. We have a copy of that.
And this paranormal group decided that that was evil and
done by evil spirits. So without telling the museum, they
went out, got a can of paint and they painted

(02:45:31):
over it. Oh my god, yes, well that's his criminal.
Now they are banned by the location. But this is
what when you have that one hundred dollars two hundred
dollars come, you know, per fee for paranormal teams. They
anybody could quickly round that up, but not everybody is

(02:45:55):
going to be able to round up one thousand dollars
two thousand dollars or more. So the museums and the
locations who are charging that exorbitant amount are doing it
to protect themselves from the riff raff of the paranormal community,
from ruining their location.

Speaker 2 (02:46:18):
I think that should just get a credit card on
file and any damage goes right off of their thing.
But I understand what you're saying, and I don't disagree
with you. It just I just think that, you know,
I encourage anybody that's truly interested in this stuff. Well,
I do investigating. And again, you don't have to go
to a famous location. You can do it in your backyard.
You can do it, you know, in your neighborhood whatever.

(02:46:40):
I wouldn't encourage you to do it in your house.
But it depends on what connectivity you want. I guess.
But I think that that that gate is so high
that it takes it out of the potential possibility for
ninety nine percent of the people out there.

Speaker 1 (02:46:58):
I would agree with that. And look, I'll be honest
with you. I have a realtor, I have three realtors
in my little town that I've said, I want the scariest,
spookiest property you can find, because I do want to
turn it into a bed and breakfast, an air being

(02:47:18):
a haunted Airbnb.

Speaker 2 (02:47:20):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (02:47:21):
Now I know that it's going to be seasonal. I
know that I'm going to have to charge you know,
a number of a number of bucks. But you know what,
if I can, if I can help make a living
off of that by renting it out at say a
couple thousand a week. Oh sure, that's a good income. Yeah,

(02:47:43):
that's fair. Yep, I don't.

Speaker 2 (02:47:46):
I don't. Yeah, I think that's great. And I hope
you I hope you do it. That'd be awesome.

Speaker 1 (02:47:53):
They've approached me, they've approached me on two properties already.
But the but the problem with the properties was they
were they were kind of like in a countryside subdivision
with houses really close by, and that's not really what
I want. I want a little bit of property because
I want to build like a UFO landing pad in there.

Speaker 2 (02:48:14):
And that's awesome, yeah, man.

Speaker 1 (02:48:18):
And hopefully it goes on to government land, which we
call up here Crown land because the King owns the land, okay,
And I want to I want to see if we can,
if we can actually maybe have an area, find an
area where there's also bigfoot activity in that area, try
and lure them in as well. Yeah, that's what I'm

(02:48:41):
looking for. But there's a couple of couple of freaky
houses around here. Oh nice, Yeah, Dave's Paranormal Disney.

Speaker 2 (02:48:48):
I love it.

Speaker 1 (02:48:51):
Absolutely, absolutely, But getting back to the whole conjuring house
thing here, I think that once again, you know, because
this is kind of the one of the meccas of
the paranormal world. If we could use that term very loosely,
you know, others would be Gettisburg, Alcatraz, Waverly Hills, the

(02:49:17):
former Bobby Mackie's, you know, anything that you saw on
every paranormal television show the last eighteen years, because they
every show goes to the same location every year, you know.
And I think that I do like the premise of
it though, that they are trying to protect the house,

(02:49:38):
they have the house in their best interests.

Speaker 2 (02:49:42):
Yeah, I do too, because I think these locations are important.
I mean, it's kind of the legacy and they all
tell the story of how we got here in a sense.

Speaker 1 (02:49:56):
Do you think it would be beneficial for this house
to be in the paranormal community still and be as
promoted as it should be.

Speaker 2 (02:50:07):
I don't know. Again, I'm not really a big groupie
on these really popular places. I'd love to see them
all just to say that I've seen them, but I can.
I think anywhere and everywhere can be paranormal, so you
don't have to empty your bank account to go find activity.

Speaker 1 (02:50:29):
Well, what is your thoughts We've got about two minutes
to go. What is your thoughts on paranormal tourism. I
think it's great.

Speaker 2 (02:50:36):
I think it's wonderful, and I think it's an opportunity
to share maybe a dark history, but it is part
of history, and I think that's valuable that we can't
forget our histories, that that's a foundation for everything going forward,
including the dark stuff. I think it's good for raising awareness,

(02:50:57):
maybe even educating people on how to do it and
best practices. I think there's a lot of opportunity in
there for teaching because people won't get it from YouTube
or a television show. They'll just get the highlight reel.
And I think it's wonderful and it can be a
real bonding experience for people to do it together and

(02:51:20):
families or whatever. But I think that I do get
concerned about the commercialization of it and the neglect to
really talk about the risks because I think people just
think it's the newest thing.

Speaker 1 (02:51:35):
Bred Thomas from the Paranormal Portal podcast, thank you very
much for filling in for our good friend Lee Strauss
tonight tell everybody fifteen seconds where they can find your podcast.
The best place to go for all the information about
the Paranormal Portal is to go to Paranormalportal dot nets.
You'll find about the podcast, the live streaming, and everything

(02:51:56):
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