August 23, 2024 • 22 mins
After three years of a starting pitcher bromance in bloom, AJ Burnett left our beloved Toronto Blue Jays to sign with the Yankees. In 2009, he returned to Skydome in a head to head matchup against who else? Roy Halladay. This month on Sportsfeld Storytime we look back at the "Playoff Atmosphere" in the dome several years before the actual playoffs would return to Toronto. In episode one, we remember the AJ Burnett era, three years where the Jays were quietly pretty good, and try our best to put some respect on the name of Vernon Wells.
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And as always, thank you for listening to another episode of Sportsfeld.
Sick of hearing all the ads? Subscribe to Soda Premium on Apple Podcasts to get rid of them!
Follow @Sportsfeld on X! While you're there say hello to @theZubes and @JGoldsbie or reach out to the show and say hey: podcast@sportsfeld.ca
If merch is your thing, be sure to check out the store: http://bit.ly/merchfeldIf you enjoyed today’s show, please rate Sportsfeld 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts.
And as always, thank you for listening to another episode of Sportsfeld.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
For to Toronto Blue Jays. AJ Burnett man. He has
really been pitching well for Toronto. He's won the seven
of his last eight decisions. He is seventeen and ten
in the season, and he leads the American League in
strikeouts for two hundred eight.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Rtez strikes out Josh Beck and his former teammate at
the Florida Marlins. The roll goes around, strikes out, swinging
a miss. Lowry strikes out three ks for Burnett. Back
to Burnett to first. Then he's out of it again.
Strike three, call Maritech's gone. Burnett knocks it down. There's
(00:43):
time to recover and does so. Strike three call fifth,
strikeout for a J.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Burnett.
Speaker 4 (00:52):
Well, here it is the matchup that we've been waiting for.
The doctor, doctor Halliday doing his thing. I said, possibly
playoff type atmosphere, and you've got it tonight.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
There's a basic down the line. Snyder over to get
it quickly as Damon turns for second.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Here's the throw in and Damon is out. Joe Girardi
up quickly too. Well.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Damon what he does, what he does best is put
the ball on the ground hard in play.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Nice play by Snyder to pick the ball.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Turn around.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Let's see if he's in there though.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Thirty two year old A. J.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Burnett, where's going to be Colors tonight? He is two
and zero on the year, A five point two six era.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
We having a miss. Kevin Cash goes down swinging in
his first game as a Yankee. Two strike, pitch and
a swing and a miss.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Snyder goes quickly, oh, two pitch strike three, calls say.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
Good night, mister Tsera.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Boy Helliday is just mowing him down.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Now, I believe, and try to put him away.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
There's the breaking ball and that's a basement down to
the line.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Rios is in the score.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Here comes Wells Hof to second, goes rolling and it's.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
Do nothing for the Blue Jays.
Speaker 4 (02:32):
A good piece of hitting by Scott Rowland found off
the fastball and got the breaking ball, able to place
it down the line, hit it hard enough him get
it past a rod A couple runs.
Speaker 6 (02:44):
In sports it is Sports Felt storytime.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
We were looking back at the there are some of
the best and worst moments of our fandom as Toronto
sports fans, and we picked I'll tell you, Jake, I'm
actually pretty proud of myself for this one. We hit
all the headlines right. We did every lease moment we
can possibly remember. I think we're almost out of least moments.
We've done the Kawhi shot, We've done the ninety two
to ninety three World Series. We've done We've done Wait,
(03:36):
we didn't do ninety two. We did ninety three. Though
we've done a lot of different things this month, we're
a little bit outside of the box. I would say,
I'll say this.
Speaker 7 (03:44):
When you suggested this, he was like, Man, that's a
great idea. I was. I was into this immediately.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
Thank you very much. This month we were looking back
to the twenty t nine nine was a nine Toronto
Blue Jays versus New York Yankees. It's Roy Howiday versus
a j Burnette. I will tell you not only was
I at this game, but before twenty fifteen, Jake, before
(04:13):
the Blue Jays made the playoffs. This is what Blue
Jays fans called a playoff atmosphere. This is what we
were convinced the playoff atmosphere was all about. Do you
remember this game?
Speaker 7 (04:27):
I do. I've been trying to remember if I was
at it or not. Though I definitely remember the game,
I've been trying to place because its been like right
on the border of when I would have gotten home
from Montreal for the summer, and I can't remember. I
there's my gut tells me I was at the game,
but I don't remember. But I do remember the game,
(04:50):
and I do remember the lead up to it and
the sort of I guess, for lack of better word,
hype around it, and how fun it was after years
of medium to good to bad Blue Jays teams having
having a villain, yes for daring to not want to
(05:11):
play for a non playoff team.
Speaker 5 (05:13):
It was May twelfth, two thousand and nine, is the
day in question, Holliday versus And I'll tell you this.
We'll get to it in a little while, but BOYD,
for mid May two thousand and nine, the Blue Jays
drew forty three thousand fans that night. That goes to
tell you, like that was a big deal. The Blue
Jays did not draw forty thousand fans when it wasn't
(05:36):
a huge deal back in the day.
Speaker 7 (05:37):
The Blue Jays did not draw forty thousand fans in
mid May in twenty fifteen.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
Right, So we'll start at the beginning with AJ Burnett,
because he's somebody that I think you know, history, as
Blue Jays fans we look back on and opinion could
be maybe a little bit split. I remember the day
they signed him before the two thousand and six season.
(06:03):
It was five years, fifty five million, which in hindsight
is hilarious. This hilarious wanting to get a J Burnett
at considering how good he was in the three seasons.
Obviously he had opt outs, but he was pretty darn
good over three seasons as a Blue Jay.
Speaker 7 (06:20):
The I guess, let's call it the courtship of AJ
Burnett still lives large in my brain. I remember him
and Halliday sitting courtside at the Raptors game as like
a big moment of like, oh, he actually like showed
up and is willing to be wined and dined by us.
(06:40):
Maybe we have a chance and kind of funny how
the I guess the evolution of the process of signing
big name free agents has gone in the last fifteen
years of like how the courtship now is like sell
them on winning. Yeah, But then it was like go
(07:01):
to a basketball game with Roy Halliday, which I will
say hard to beat. A selling point of going to
a basketball game with Roy Halliday.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
That sounds about a few as it gets another guy
and another sort of maybe that guy is the right word.
But the revisionist history, and you know, looking back at
it now as Blue Jays fans in twenty twenty one,
and you say, you know, A J. Burnette came along
and was part of some fairly mediocre years with the
(07:31):
Blue Jays. His first year two thousand and six, they
went eighty seven and seventy five and finished second in
the East. Like that's that's a high watermark. They were
ten games back at the Yankees. But eighty seven and
seventy five, you would take that in a heartbeat. Other
than the two twenty fifteen and twenty six teams that
those are two of the better teams of the new
decade for the for the Blue Jays, it's.
Speaker 7 (07:51):
I also think it's funny in terms of revisionist history.
How like I have this memory that is false of
like a J. Britt And probably because we were this was
like just around the cusp of like moneyball becoming a thing.
I feel maybe it's a little bit after but like
because AJ Burnette's wins and losses save for his last
room in Toronto, like weren't great because the team was fine.
(08:16):
I have this memory of aj Burnette being far worse
than he was. I'm a right, I have a memory
of him being after like the false narrative that's been
put into my mind. I guess because those teams didn't, you,
to your point, teams that were better than we give
them credit for. I have memories of aj Burnette coming
(08:37):
and being sort of note not a bus by means,
but like a disappointment compared to what the hype was.
Then you look at his numbers now and it's like, oh,
he was, he was great.
Speaker 5 (08:47):
And eleven million dollars is nothing nothing. Eleven million dollars
a year is a steal for a guy who was
as good as he ended up being.
Speaker 7 (08:54):
And his two thousand and eight is bananas good.
Speaker 5 (08:59):
Yeah, two thousand and eight he is. He goes eighteen
and ten eight just over four two hundred and thirty
one strikeouts, ERA plus well over one hundred in each
of his seasons. Two thousand and seventy is also very good.
ERA was three point seventy five. He only made twenty
five starts, though there were some injury stuff. The first
two years he didn't make his full slate of starts
(09:20):
for the first two years, but in his three years
as a Blue Jay, eighty one games, three point nine
to four ERA five complete games, one shutout, five hundred
and twenty two winnings, ERA plus of one hundred and twelve,
a FIP of three point eight two, and he went
thirty eight and twenty six, which as a number two
(09:42):
guy behind Royaladay, that's about the best you could possibly
ask for.
Speaker 7 (09:47):
It's funny to me. I obviously very different situations and
very different pitchers and very different players, but it does
kind of strike me as funny how the sort of
the narrative around Marcus Strowman and how it was like
there's like off field aside, there was kind of like
he is he was sort of pained to be x
(10:11):
And now with the Blue Jay's currently construction twenty twenty one,
he's exactly the guy that they need in the rotation, right,
Like his numbers, in his style exactly what you would
plug into the current Blue Jays rotation. I feel like
with AJ Burnett, he was he's sort of viewed as
like either not being that good or being disappointment or
being the villain. From afterwards, you're going to discuss but
(10:33):
like to your point, behind Roy Holliday exactly the number
two you want.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
And it is funny that he ended up like they
ended up being. You know, it was it was use
the term romance. They were like it was it was
the going to see a Raptors game. It was the
like they show up the spring training together laughing and
like arms from each other. This is man, this is
like the first honestly, god, this is like the beginning
of reading blogs that I can remember is like the Yeah,
(11:00):
the Howard A. Burnett romance two thousand and six, two
thousand and seven, two thousand and eight. Yeah, this is funny,
this hit.
Speaker 7 (11:08):
You're right, this is right when like my DJF.
Speaker 5 (11:11):
Reading DJF goes frounund first, like you name it. This
is like reading about Roy Halladay and A. J. Burnett
was was the whole thing. And it's so funny that
that's how the pairing of friends would be. Like you
think of the guys who were famously close to Roy,
it was Burnett and the other one was Chris Carpenter,
And it's like Chris Carpenter makes sense to you, right,
(11:31):
It's so this other similarly like stoic quiet guy who
goes about his business and whips ass, but like a J.
Burnett was like the wild thing, dirt goateee like hair
out the back of the thing, got a lipper going
like it's it's so funny that that dichotomy of like
(11:52):
the difference between the two of them, but the similarity
of course is that they both like were absolute fucking horses.
I think that was so cool and part of the
thing of just like what Roy liked was dudes who
were fucking badass at pitching right and sort of like
he like guys that fucking shoved. But it is so
(12:12):
funny to you to your point is to look back
and be like it did feel like AJ was not
that good and you look at like man two thousand
and six, the rest of the rotation was Ted Lilly,
Casey Jansen, Gustavo Shas Scene and Sean Markham. Three of
those guys had eras above five, like how did we
how did we ever give any blame to AJ Burnett
(12:32):
when everybody else was like on the next year it
was Dustin McGowan, Sean Markham who we love, Jesse Lytch
and Josh Towers like aside from Doc and AJ, like, man,
that's all they had is pitchers.
Speaker 7 (12:45):
And like, yeah, and even the year sorry, the year before, yeah,
the year before. Obviously we're we were excited for AJ
to show up for exactly this reason. And like the
year before, it was like Josh Towers was your like
started Josh Arison established a scene. Both started thirty plus games.
Speaker 5 (13:06):
Crazy.
Speaker 7 (13:07):
Then you had Roy who only started nineteen that year,
Dave Bush five and eleven. Dave Bush was your fourth
starter for the Blue Jays in two thousand and five.
Speaker 5 (13:28):
I'll tell you this thing that I will remember for
a long time is I was actually at a game
with my dad in A. J. Burnett's first season as
blue Jay two thousand and six, and thanks to the
wonder of Baseball Reference, I can look back at this
A J. Burnette against the Washington Nationals and it was
his first win as a blue Jay, and he was
so good it was it was like ridiculous. He was like,
(13:51):
oh my god, this is the guy. It was a
nine inning, complete game shoutout. He threw seven k's six hits.
He was absolutely unhip. It may go down as, if
not the best, one of his best performances as a
Blue Jay. Gamescore eighty two. So depending on how you
view your metrics, it was like unquestionably a top two
(14:16):
or three a J Burnett Blue Jay performance. I was in.
I was a fan, but but I think to your
point earlier is that you never really bought fully into
these Blue Jays unless you were like super deep into
the kool ad. Like it's crazy to think now, like
eighty seven wins was just like just not impressively. Eighty
seven wins is mediocre. Ten back of the Yankees, your
(14:37):
your four back of being in the Wildcard. You're just like,
that's not even close.
Speaker 7 (14:40):
Eighty seven wins, Yeah, eighty it was kind of like
it wasn't that it was bad, It just it just
wasn't good enough.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
Yeah, that's a good way to put it.
Speaker 7 (14:49):
And especially like you look at like all three of
the of AJ Burnett's teams as a Blue Jay one
eighty plus, yeah, eighty seven, eighty three in eighty six,
and it's kind of like, I don't want to say
the expectations, but like the standards I guess are kind
(15:10):
of remarkable now, especially because that twenty eight team, though
w in eighty six games, finished fourth in the East
eighty six wins with a Pythagoran win loss of ninety
three crazy, like that was a good team.
Speaker 5 (15:24):
Crazy. But people people people think, man, oh Man, I
hated the Black Jays. They were so bad, right, they
were a victim of the time. It was actually a
fairly well built team. Turns out, yeah, they.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
Six six of their starter of the nine had ops
plus is over one hundred.
Speaker 5 (15:43):
We're gonna dance around the fact that two thousand and
six R Johnson was a five win player. What the
type of guys who were maligned? And I think I
think we've course corrected on this, but I don't know
if we will ever say enough about like two thousand
and six Vernon wells man, m that's a that's a
(16:07):
six wins center fielder. That's where, that's where that's ridiculous.
Speaker 7 (16:11):
That's a ridiculous I always found this sort of the
Vernon contract talk to be so funny in retrospects. It's like,
maybe you could say it was too much money, but
the years he had absolutely justified his contract.
Speaker 5 (16:25):
He was thirty two home runs, he was at three zero, three,
three fifty seven five forty two one twenty eight WRC
plus a goal glove, center fielder like man. There's not
a lot of guys at the time in the league
in two thousand and six that are equal value. That's
like six wins center fielder.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
And a Rod has batted second and combined they are
hitting four to twelve with six home runs and thirty
four runs batted. It not a bad way to start
a ball game. But two too.
Speaker 7 (16:57):
Swung on hit in the air at teek Center, Well's
going back on the track at the wall.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Geez gone?
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Who it was caught by Wells.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
Wells jumped over the fence and came back with the ball.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
I almost don't believe it.
Speaker 7 (17:12):
Who's that?
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Devin White though? My goodness?
Speaker 3 (17:15):
And you know, as IVN wise as Kitty mentioned, maybe
the best outfield they're playing the wall I've ever seen.
But this is a great catch by Vernon Wells brings
it back into the ballpark. Who times his leap bangs?
Speaker 5 (17:31):
Look at this thing. That thing takes about fifteen minutes
to come out of the sky.
Speaker 6 (17:38):
Second level home run Vernon.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Wells with Troup direct feel by Wells.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
But who jays are in Frank Rod in Boston through
the lines, This one Scott till my field that hit
Well yeah, goes back to the wall.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
That call is gone.
Speaker 6 (17:56):
Oh, look off for Verdon Wells.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
Had a brute.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
What more do you want? Oh?
Speaker 7 (18:06):
And he signed that extension in two thousand and seven
and it was seven to one twenty six, which works
out to h I'm trying to do the math on
that one twenty six to five by seven, it's eighteen
million dollars a year. It's hilarious, right, which, by today's
standards is left five. It's five million dollars more than
(18:28):
ten of Roark is making this year. And it's on
Like you if you google Vernon Well's contract today, one
of the first things that comes up is Vernon Well's
Alex Rodriguez and the ten worst free agent contracts of
all time. Crazy, it's nuts, and like, yeah, I get it,
(18:51):
it didn't pan out the way they hoped, but also
like he was really fucking good in two thousand and six.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
And I'll say he has two of his top five
to his top four years in two thousand and eight
and twenty ten.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
Right, doesn't eight? He slugs eight forty he ops plus
is one twenty three. He hits twenty four runs in
only one hundred and eight games, Like crazy.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
Vernon And I'll bang this drum for Vernon belongs on
the level of excellence, Like it's not a question to me.
He's one of the best players in franchise history.
Speaker 7 (19:24):
He's one of those guys along with Doc and Carlos,
where he was the only thing to watch for a
lot of those DearS.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
Yeah, and like you said, the money ends up being
like what people remember. But it's like in terms of
you know, he's sticking the most at bats. He's top
three in hits, in runs, in total bases, you name
a category, Vernon Wellos is like top five in Blue
(19:52):
Jay's history. And I know this is supposed to be
about a J. Burnett, but like, Vernon Wells is unquestionably
a top five Blue Jay of all time terms of offense,
Like it's me, it's not it's not even debatable. And
if you look at career numbers.
Speaker 7 (20:04):
Yeah, I agree, But but to tie it into a J.
Burnett it is And kind of what you're saying with
the Blackjas, it's it is funny how blignd those teams
are and they're like they were the best teams we
saw for like a decade.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
They're really they're really good. We would kill for an
eighty seven win team now in the day's one eighty
seven eighty seven games this year, people will be like,
oh man, what a huge success, this is right crazy.
You can't, you just can't. You can't please everybody, Jake,
it's that's your that's your rule here. But I'm I
get out well of this time. I'm very biased because
(20:43):
I loved I love the Black Jays, I love this era.
I am somebody who is a real apologist for this
sort of stuff because I think that I wanted these
teams to be so good.
Speaker 7 (20:54):
Yeah. I think that I have revisioned myself out of
how I felt at the time. Yeah, because like I
was all, I was super into. I was hugely into
these teams. But I think I've spent the last whatever
fourteen years being like, fuck those teams.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
And the black Hats. Oh my god, the black Hats.
Speaker 7 (21:14):
I wonder if I truly and I know how dumb
this is gonna sound, but truly, I wonder had they
not rebranded with the black jerseys, if the team would
be better remembered.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
That's a good question because they just come out of
that era with the with Musclebird. Yeah, musclebird in the
maple leaf the Clemens era, So a great question. Anyway,
we will move forward. In the next episode, We're we're
gonna talk about Burnett jumping to the Yankees, which, oh
my god, how could he go to the Yankees? How
could somebody pick the ninety seven win Yankees over this?
(21:44):
Luminate with Royaladay. All that and more in the next
episode of Sports Felt Storytime Next week.
Speaker 6 (22:01):
Fo
For to Toronto Blue Jays. AJ Burnett man. He has
really been pitching well for Toronto. He's won the seven
of his last eight decisions. He is seventeen and ten
in the season, and he leads the American League in
strikeouts for two hundred eight.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Rtez strikes out Josh Beck and his former teammate at
the Florida Marlins. The roll goes around, strikes out, swinging
a miss. Lowry strikes out three ks for Burnett. Back
to Burnett to first. Then he's out of it again.
Strike three, call Maritech's gone. Burnett knocks it down. There's
(00:43):
time to recover and does so. Strike three call fifth,
strikeout for a J.
Speaker 3 (00:50):
Burnett.
Speaker 4 (00:52):
Well, here it is the matchup that we've been waiting for.
The doctor, doctor Halliday doing his thing. I said, possibly
playoff type atmosphere, and you've got it tonight.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
There's a basic down the line. Snyder over to get
it quickly as Damon turns for second.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Here's the throw in and Damon is out. Joe Girardi
up quickly too. Well.
Speaker 4 (01:25):
Damon what he does, what he does best is put
the ball on the ground hard in play.
Speaker 2 (01:30):
Nice play by Snyder to pick the ball.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
Turn around.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Let's see if he's in there though.
Speaker 2 (01:35):
Thirty two year old A. J.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
Burnett, where's going to be Colors tonight? He is two
and zero on the year, A five point two six era.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
We having a miss. Kevin Cash goes down swinging in
his first game as a Yankee. Two strike, pitch and
a swing and a miss.
Speaker 3 (01:52):
Snyder goes quickly, oh, two pitch strike three, calls say.
Speaker 5 (01:56):
Good night, mister Tsera.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Boy Helliday is just mowing him down.
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Now, I believe, and try to put him away.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
There's the breaking ball and that's a basement down to
the line.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Rios is in the score.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Here comes Wells Hof to second, goes rolling and it's.
Speaker 5 (02:13):
Do nothing for the Blue Jays.
Speaker 4 (02:32):
A good piece of hitting by Scott Rowland found off
the fastball and got the breaking ball, able to place
it down the line, hit it hard enough him get
it past a rod A couple runs.
Speaker 6 (02:44):
In sports it is Sports Felt storytime.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
We were looking back at the there are some of
the best and worst moments of our fandom as Toronto
sports fans, and we picked I'll tell you, Jake, I'm
actually pretty proud of myself for this one. We hit
all the headlines right. We did every lease moment we
can possibly remember. I think we're almost out of least moments.
We've done the Kawhi shot, We've done the ninety two
to ninety three World Series. We've done We've done Wait,
(03:36):
we didn't do ninety two. We did ninety three. Though
we've done a lot of different things this month, we're
a little bit outside of the box. I would say,
I'll say this.
Speaker 7 (03:44):
When you suggested this, he was like, Man, that's a
great idea. I was. I was into this immediately.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
Thank you very much. This month we were looking back
to the twenty t nine nine was a nine Toronto
Blue Jays versus New York Yankees. It's Roy Howiday versus
a j Burnette. I will tell you not only was
I at this game, but before twenty fifteen, Jake, before
(04:13):
the Blue Jays made the playoffs. This is what Blue
Jays fans called a playoff atmosphere. This is what we
were convinced the playoff atmosphere was all about. Do you
remember this game?
Speaker 7 (04:27):
I do. I've been trying to remember if I was
at it or not. Though I definitely remember the game,
I've been trying to place because its been like right
on the border of when I would have gotten home
from Montreal for the summer, and I can't remember. I
there's my gut tells me I was at the game,
but I don't remember. But I do remember the game,
(04:50):
and I do remember the lead up to it and
the sort of I guess, for lack of better word,
hype around it, and how fun it was after years
of medium to good to bad Blue Jays teams having
having a villain, yes for daring to not want to
(05:11):
play for a non playoff team.
Speaker 5 (05:13):
It was May twelfth, two thousand and nine, is the
day in question, Holliday versus And I'll tell you this.
We'll get to it in a little while, but BOYD,
for mid May two thousand and nine, the Blue Jays
drew forty three thousand fans that night. That goes to
tell you, like that was a big deal. The Blue
Jays did not draw forty thousand fans when it wasn't
(05:36):
a huge deal back in the day.
Speaker 7 (05:37):
The Blue Jays did not draw forty thousand fans in
mid May in twenty fifteen.
Speaker 5 (05:41):
Right, So we'll start at the beginning with AJ Burnett,
because he's somebody that I think you know, history, as
Blue Jays fans we look back on and opinion could
be maybe a little bit split. I remember the day
they signed him before the two thousand and six season.
(06:03):
It was five years, fifty five million, which in hindsight
is hilarious. This hilarious wanting to get a J Burnett
at considering how good he was in the three seasons.
Obviously he had opt outs, but he was pretty darn
good over three seasons as a Blue Jay.
Speaker 7 (06:20):
The I guess, let's call it the courtship of AJ
Burnett still lives large in my brain. I remember him
and Halliday sitting courtside at the Raptors game as like
a big moment of like, oh, he actually like showed
up and is willing to be wined and dined by us.
(06:40):
Maybe we have a chance and kind of funny how
the I guess the evolution of the process of signing
big name free agents has gone in the last fifteen
years of like how the courtship now is like sell
them on winning. Yeah, But then it was like go
(07:01):
to a basketball game with Roy Halliday, which I will
say hard to beat. A selling point of going to
a basketball game with Roy Halliday.
Speaker 5 (07:08):
That sounds about a few as it gets another guy
and another sort of maybe that guy is the right word.
But the revisionist history, and you know, looking back at
it now as Blue Jays fans in twenty twenty one,
and you say, you know, A J. Burnette came along
and was part of some fairly mediocre years with the
(07:31):
Blue Jays. His first year two thousand and six, they
went eighty seven and seventy five and finished second in
the East. Like that's that's a high watermark. They were
ten games back at the Yankees. But eighty seven and
seventy five, you would take that in a heartbeat. Other
than the two twenty fifteen and twenty six teams that
those are two of the better teams of the new
decade for the for the Blue Jays, it's.
Speaker 7 (07:51):
I also think it's funny in terms of revisionist history.
How like I have this memory that is false of
like a J. Britt And probably because we were this was
like just around the cusp of like moneyball becoming a thing.
I feel maybe it's a little bit after but like
because AJ Burnette's wins and losses save for his last
room in Toronto, like weren't great because the team was fine.
(08:16):
I have this memory of aj Burnette being far worse
than he was. I'm a right, I have a memory
of him being after like the false narrative that's been
put into my mind. I guess because those teams didn't, you,
to your point, teams that were better than we give
them credit for. I have memories of aj Burnette coming
(08:37):
and being sort of note not a bus by means,
but like a disappointment compared to what the hype was.
Then you look at his numbers now and it's like, oh,
he was, he was great.
Speaker 5 (08:47):
And eleven million dollars is nothing nothing. Eleven million dollars
a year is a steal for a guy who was
as good as he ended up being.
Speaker 7 (08:54):
And his two thousand and eight is bananas good.
Speaker 5 (08:59):
Yeah, two thousand and eight he is. He goes eighteen
and ten eight just over four two hundred and thirty
one strikeouts, ERA plus well over one hundred in each
of his seasons. Two thousand and seventy is also very good.
ERA was three point seventy five. He only made twenty
five starts, though there were some injury stuff. The first
two years he didn't make his full slate of starts
(09:20):
for the first two years, but in his three years
as a Blue Jay, eighty one games, three point nine
to four ERA five complete games, one shutout, five hundred
and twenty two winnings, ERA plus of one hundred and twelve,
a FIP of three point eight two, and he went
thirty eight and twenty six, which as a number two
(09:42):
guy behind Royaladay, that's about the best you could possibly
ask for.
Speaker 7 (09:47):
It's funny to me. I obviously very different situations and
very different pitchers and very different players, but it does
kind of strike me as funny how the sort of
the narrative around Marcus Strowman and how it was like
there's like off field aside, there was kind of like
he is he was sort of pained to be x
(10:11):
And now with the Blue Jay's currently construction twenty twenty one,
he's exactly the guy that they need in the rotation, right,
Like his numbers, in his style exactly what you would
plug into the current Blue Jays rotation. I feel like
with AJ Burnett, he was he's sort of viewed as
like either not being that good or being disappointment or
being the villain. From afterwards, you're going to discuss but
(10:33):
like to your point, behind Roy Holliday exactly the number
two you want.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
And it is funny that he ended up like they
ended up being. You know, it was it was use
the term romance. They were like it was it was
the going to see a Raptors game. It was the
like they show up the spring training together laughing and
like arms from each other. This is man, this is
like the first honestly, god, this is like the beginning
of reading blogs that I can remember is like the Yeah,
(11:00):
the Howard A. Burnett romance two thousand and six, two
thousand and seven, two thousand and eight. Yeah, this is funny,
this hit.
Speaker 7 (11:08):
You're right, this is right when like my DJF.
Speaker 5 (11:11):
Reading DJF goes frounund first, like you name it. This
is like reading about Roy Halladay and A. J. Burnett
was was the whole thing. And it's so funny that
that's how the pairing of friends would be. Like you
think of the guys who were famously close to Roy,
it was Burnett and the other one was Chris Carpenter,
And it's like Chris Carpenter makes sense to you, right,
(11:31):
It's so this other similarly like stoic quiet guy who
goes about his business and whips ass, but like a J.
Burnett was like the wild thing, dirt goateee like hair
out the back of the thing, got a lipper going
like it's it's so funny that that dichotomy of like
(11:52):
the difference between the two of them, but the similarity
of course is that they both like were absolute fucking horses.
I think that was so cool and part of the
thing of just like what Roy liked was dudes who
were fucking badass at pitching right and sort of like
he like guys that fucking shoved. But it is so
(12:12):
funny to you to your point is to look back
and be like it did feel like AJ was not
that good and you look at like man two thousand
and six, the rest of the rotation was Ted Lilly,
Casey Jansen, Gustavo Shas Scene and Sean Markham. Three of
those guys had eras above five, like how did we
how did we ever give any blame to AJ Burnett
(12:32):
when everybody else was like on the next year it
was Dustin McGowan, Sean Markham who we love, Jesse Lytch
and Josh Towers like aside from Doc and AJ, like, man,
that's all they had is pitchers.
Speaker 7 (12:45):
And like, yeah, and even the year sorry, the year before, yeah,
the year before. Obviously we're we were excited for AJ
to show up for exactly this reason. And like the
year before, it was like Josh Towers was your like
started Josh Arison established a scene. Both started thirty plus games.
Speaker 5 (13:06):
Crazy.
Speaker 7 (13:07):
Then you had Roy who only started nineteen that year,
Dave Bush five and eleven. Dave Bush was your fourth
starter for the Blue Jays in two thousand and five.
Speaker 5 (13:28):
I'll tell you this thing that I will remember for
a long time is I was actually at a game
with my dad in A. J. Burnett's first season as
blue Jay two thousand and six, and thanks to the
wonder of Baseball Reference, I can look back at this
A J. Burnette against the Washington Nationals and it was
his first win as a blue Jay, and he was
so good it was it was like ridiculous. He was like,
(13:51):
oh my god, this is the guy. It was a
nine inning, complete game shoutout. He threw seven k's six hits.
He was absolutely unhip. It may go down as, if
not the best, one of his best performances as a
Blue Jay. Gamescore eighty two. So depending on how you
view your metrics, it was like unquestionably a top two
(14:16):
or three a J Burnett Blue Jay performance. I was in.
I was a fan, but but I think to your
point earlier is that you never really bought fully into
these Blue Jays unless you were like super deep into
the kool ad. Like it's crazy to think now, like
eighty seven wins was just like just not impressively. Eighty
seven wins is mediocre. Ten back of the Yankees, your
(14:37):
your four back of being in the Wildcard. You're just like,
that's not even close.
Speaker 7 (14:40):
Eighty seven wins, Yeah, eighty it was kind of like
it wasn't that it was bad, It just it just
wasn't good enough.
Speaker 5 (14:47):
Yeah, that's a good way to put it.
Speaker 7 (14:49):
And especially like you look at like all three of
the of AJ Burnett's teams as a Blue Jay one
eighty plus, yeah, eighty seven, eighty three in eighty six,
and it's kind of like, I don't want to say
the expectations, but like the standards I guess are kind
(15:10):
of remarkable now, especially because that twenty eight team, though
w in eighty six games, finished fourth in the East
eighty six wins with a Pythagoran win loss of ninety
three crazy, like that was a good team.
Speaker 5 (15:24):
Crazy. But people people people think, man, oh Man, I
hated the Black Jays. They were so bad, right, they
were a victim of the time. It was actually a
fairly well built team. Turns out, yeah, they.
Speaker 7 (15:36):
Six six of their starter of the nine had ops
plus is over one hundred.
Speaker 5 (15:43):
We're gonna dance around the fact that two thousand and
six R Johnson was a five win player. What the
type of guys who were maligned? And I think I
think we've course corrected on this, but I don't know
if we will ever say enough about like two thousand
and six Vernon wells man, m that's a that's a
(16:07):
six wins center fielder. That's where, that's where that's ridiculous.
Speaker 7 (16:11):
That's a ridiculous I always found this sort of the
Vernon contract talk to be so funny in retrospects. It's like,
maybe you could say it was too much money, but
the years he had absolutely justified his contract.
Speaker 5 (16:25):
He was thirty two home runs, he was at three zero, three,
three fifty seven five forty two one twenty eight WRC
plus a goal glove, center fielder like man. There's not
a lot of guys at the time in the league
in two thousand and six that are equal value. That's
like six wins center fielder.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
And a Rod has batted second and combined they are
hitting four to twelve with six home runs and thirty
four runs batted. It not a bad way to start
a ball game. But two too.
Speaker 7 (16:57):
Swung on hit in the air at teek Center, Well's
going back on the track at the wall.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
Geez gone?
Speaker 2 (17:05):
Who it was caught by Wells.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
Wells jumped over the fence and came back with the ball.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
I almost don't believe it.
Speaker 7 (17:12):
Who's that?
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Devin White though? My goodness?
Speaker 3 (17:15):
And you know, as IVN wise as Kitty mentioned, maybe
the best outfield they're playing the wall I've ever seen.
But this is a great catch by Vernon Wells brings
it back into the ballpark. Who times his leap bangs?
Speaker 5 (17:31):
Look at this thing. That thing takes about fifteen minutes
to come out of the sky.
Speaker 6 (17:38):
Second level home run Vernon.
Speaker 3 (17:40):
Wells with Troup direct feel by Wells.
Speaker 2 (17:43):
But who jays are in Frank Rod in Boston through
the lines, This one Scott till my field that hit
Well yeah, goes back to the wall.
Speaker 5 (17:53):
That call is gone.
Speaker 6 (17:56):
Oh, look off for Verdon Wells.
Speaker 4 (17:59):
Had a brute.
Speaker 5 (18:04):
What more do you want? Oh?
Speaker 7 (18:06):
And he signed that extension in two thousand and seven
and it was seven to one twenty six, which works
out to h I'm trying to do the math on
that one twenty six to five by seven, it's eighteen
million dollars a year. It's hilarious, right, which, by today's
standards is left five. It's five million dollars more than
(18:28):
ten of Roark is making this year. And it's on
Like you if you google Vernon Well's contract today, one
of the first things that comes up is Vernon Well's
Alex Rodriguez and the ten worst free agent contracts of
all time. Crazy, it's nuts, and like, yeah, I get it,
(18:51):
it didn't pan out the way they hoped, but also
like he was really fucking good in two thousand and six.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
And I'll say he has two of his top five
to his top four years in two thousand and eight
and twenty ten.
Speaker 7 (19:03):
Right, doesn't eight? He slugs eight forty he ops plus
is one twenty three. He hits twenty four runs in
only one hundred and eight games, Like crazy.
Speaker 5 (19:14):
Vernon And I'll bang this drum for Vernon belongs on
the level of excellence, Like it's not a question to me.
He's one of the best players in franchise history.
Speaker 7 (19:24):
He's one of those guys along with Doc and Carlos,
where he was the only thing to watch for a
lot of those DearS.
Speaker 5 (19:31):
Yeah, and like you said, the money ends up being
like what people remember. But it's like in terms of
you know, he's sticking the most at bats. He's top
three in hits, in runs, in total bases, you name
a category, Vernon Wellos is like top five in Blue
(19:52):
Jay's history. And I know this is supposed to be
about a J. Burnett, but like, Vernon Wells is unquestionably
a top five Blue Jay of all time terms of offense,
Like it's me, it's not it's not even debatable. And
if you look at career numbers.
Speaker 7 (20:04):
Yeah, I agree, But but to tie it into a J.
Burnett it is And kind of what you're saying with
the Blackjas, it's it is funny how blignd those teams
are and they're like they were the best teams we
saw for like a decade.
Speaker 5 (20:22):
They're really they're really good. We would kill for an
eighty seven win team now in the day's one eighty
seven eighty seven games this year, people will be like,
oh man, what a huge success, this is right crazy.
You can't, you just can't. You can't please everybody, Jake,
it's that's your that's your rule here. But I'm I
get out well of this time. I'm very biased because
(20:43):
I loved I love the Black Jays, I love this era.
I am somebody who is a real apologist for this
sort of stuff because I think that I wanted these
teams to be so good.
Speaker 7 (20:54):
Yeah. I think that I have revisioned myself out of
how I felt at the time. Yeah, because like I
was all, I was super into. I was hugely into
these teams. But I think I've spent the last whatever
fourteen years being like, fuck those teams.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
And the black Hats. Oh my god, the black Hats.
Speaker 7 (21:14):
I wonder if I truly and I know how dumb
this is gonna sound, but truly, I wonder had they
not rebranded with the black jerseys, if the team would
be better remembered.
Speaker 5 (21:24):
That's a good question because they just come out of
that era with the with Musclebird. Yeah, musclebird in the
maple leaf the Clemens era, So a great question. Anyway,
we will move forward. In the next episode, We're we're
gonna talk about Burnett jumping to the Yankees, which, oh
my god, how could he go to the Yankees? How
could somebody pick the ninety seven win Yankees over this?
(21:44):
Luminate with Royaladay. All that and more in the next
episode of Sports Felt Storytime Next week.
Speaker 6 (22:01):
Fo
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