EPISODE 159: The Dating Game Killer

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to my world.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
Bitch good.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
Here, that's right, listeners, we are here. I'm Jason Knight.

Speaker 1 (00:36):
And I'm Oscar Spector.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
And this is the one hundred and fifty ninth episode
of the Supernatural Occurrent Studies podcast.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
So sluggishly paranormal.

Speaker 3 (00:47):
Another adjective, Happy Christmas season, my little Candy canes, very happy.
Oscar's more peace. See, I'm a Christmas guy. Yeah, well,
happy Christmas, my little Candy canes, my little Santa hats.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
Oh my god, so weird it out. I'm sitting with them, folks.

Speaker 3 (01:10):
I just makes it. It's Christmas and I'm saying all
your Christmas Is things. But we have a fucked up
episode tonight, Yeah we do. It's it's kind of ugly.
But before we get into that, Oscar, we uh. Even
though we're releasing this on December first, this is being
recorded before Halloween.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
Yes, well before Halloween's a few weeks away. Still, that's
right from our current stature.

Speaker 3 (01:31):
So echoes from the past.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
So I would say that when you listen to the show,
we must have been happier people at the time.

Speaker 3 (01:43):
Why would you say, I don't know that it's gonna
get worse. It does it just gets worse and w worse.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
You're listening to us and very happy old in times.

Speaker 3 (01:54):
So three months ago, happy old three months yes.

Speaker 1 (01:56):
Not even I guess no, but SI say though, Jay,
I think I'm gonna try to perict the future with
you and the future. So like we're in October, we're
in October, we're time releasing this episode. When we listen
to this next, it'll be released on air in December
first for our listeners. Yes, I think by then there's
a good chance you you're.

Speaker 3 (02:19):
Predicting my future. So you're predicting my future.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
I personally think you will be addicted to vicodin.

Speaker 3 (02:26):
Yes, I'm gonna come down with a prescription addiction.

Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've been watching House lately also, wow,
oh my god.

Speaker 3 (02:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
So that's my prediction for you. What do you think
is that happened to me?

Speaker 3 (02:36):
I think you are going to stumble upon a designer
drug really, and you are going to jump in feed
first really and be addiction adduled.

Speaker 1 (02:48):
I don't do anything half asked.

Speaker 3 (02:49):
By January, I would hope.

Speaker 1 (02:51):
So that's my birthday month. It's my birthday month.

Speaker 3 (02:54):
I get all your New Year's baby, that's r yes, right, yes,
you're gonna pick, You're gonna find it. A designer drug.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
Okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 3 (03:01):
Some take on on mes some new spin.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
What's that fence andyl? Is that designer drug? What's a
designer drug?

Speaker 3 (03:08):
What does that mean?

Speaker 1 (03:09):
What makes a designer drug?

Speaker 3 (03:11):
Like you know in my day?

Speaker 4 (03:12):
Is it?

Speaker 1 (03:13):
Is it something pack it?

Speaker 3 (03:14):
That ecstasy that was malli like a.

Speaker 1 (03:17):
Designer I feel like a designer drug was a designer drug.
What's popular with the young people? Is that what that is?

Speaker 3 (03:22):
I don't know, Like I feel like hearing at one
time was a designer drug. Then it just you know,
just started creating fighting zombies and right everything else. So
that's that's just kind of a dirt bag drug now, Yeah,
I guess just just the bottom of the barrel, fucking
dirt bag drug. I don't know. Yeah, indeed, like your ecstasy,
your molly, your.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
Yeah, I guess I never thought about looking about you know,
the meaning of the cocaine.

Speaker 3 (03:44):
I'm sure still a designer drug. I don't know. I
never got into drugs. It's one thing I never did.
I would like the drug.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
I would like to upgrade my crack house to a
cocaine house one.

Speaker 3 (03:54):
Day, dude, you gotta shoot for the stars.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
I'm trying.

Speaker 3 (03:56):
It's the holiday season.

Speaker 1 (03:57):
I'm trying.

Speaker 3 (03:58):
Miracles happen.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
I tell you about that one time I did try cocaine, right,
didn't tell you about that time?

Speaker 3 (04:03):
I don't think so.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
For the first time ever, two years ago, I tried
cocaine one that one day, one night only. It was
like I tried it again?

Speaker 3 (04:10):
What was it like?

Speaker 1 (04:10):
It was good?

Speaker 3 (04:11):
I can see that.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
I can't see like I went to I went to
not a rave but no an DM concert with a
friend and she was like because we were like, She's like,
I'm gonna bring something special. I don't know what it
was gonna be. And she's like it's a little baggy.
I'm like, is that fucking chalk powder? No? No, He's

(04:35):
like no, it's like really and like, yes, we want
to try it. I'm like yes, Oh my god, I
said yes. With that hesitation.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
We got to put a disclaimer on this episode.

Speaker 1 (04:43):
It's fine, no one that you limiteddu is a long gune.
The not in my system.

Speaker 3 (04:47):
But yeah, no, I'm worried about the children out there.

Speaker 1 (04:49):
That they're not listening to it. If they are, we
say fucked up ship here we do so we do anyway.
But I did try it and it was fun. I
liked it. I had a few bumps. Got me going,
I hate my hey, my throat though differently, which is
I had to get used to that, the throat thing.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know how to feel
right now.

Speaker 1 (05:06):
That's that's fine. It's just a drug. It's not like
I'm into it.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
No, no, no, no, you're not into it for sure. You
have to start stealing my fucking silverware? Are you thinking
from your coke?

Speaker 1 (05:15):
I've seen your silverware. It's barely silver.

Speaker 3 (05:18):
Oh my lord, the revelations that come out on this show,
I swear to God, Well, for a Christmas miracle, you're
gonna you're gonna get hooked on some some designer drug
and you updated to a cocaine.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
Just so you yeah, exactly, just so you all know.
The concert was for Lady.

Speaker 3 (05:33):
De John, Lady Jon de Jon Mustard.

Speaker 1 (05:36):
YEA believe that was her.

Speaker 3 (05:38):
Nice all right. Well, since this is talking from the past,
I don't have any news or any anything to talk
about as far as catching up.

Speaker 1 (05:47):
I mean, because it will we know who got elected.

Speaker 3 (05:50):
Yeah, not yet.

Speaker 1 (05:52):
No, by that time the episode comes out for sure,
as I'm saying, yeah, but.

Speaker 3 (05:56):
We can't talk about it now. No, But I mean
I haven't idea who's going to get elected. I'm not
going to talk about it.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
No, I'm not saying that. I guess either.

Speaker 3 (06:04):
Let's talk about these election These canvassers that do they
come to your house all the time? No, multiple times
a week people ring my doorbell. It's hooked up through
ELECTSA and all this ship, so it rings like werewolves
fucking throughout the house.

Speaker 1 (06:17):
That's Jesus Christ.

Speaker 3 (06:19):
So multiple times a week's.

Speaker 1 (06:21):
What kind of wearob like te teen wolf or like
something old school.

Speaker 3 (06:24):
Out of from American wearl from London. So at times
a week these people come to my house and they're like,
are your plan to vote?

Speaker 2 (06:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (06:31):
I planned to vote who you're voting for? I remember
a time, but back in my you didn't talk about
this ship politics, You didn't who you're voting for.

Speaker 1 (06:41):
People didn't talk about money. But you don't ask people
about money.

Speaker 3 (06:45):
I feel like that's still the same. People still don't
like what you make of it.

Speaker 1 (06:50):
In general.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
I still consider that full pall. But yeah, politics, we
never talked about it. Growing up. No that you just
didn't talk. It's my business, not your business. So these
people are always come to the house and they want an
answer who am I voting for? And I always tell
them I just well, I used to say Kennedy and
you should see the fads to look on these people's faces,
and then they would leave. Now I just tell them, dude,

(07:12):
I don't talk about it, and they're like, okay, I
respect that, and they walk away.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
Okay, get the fuck out of here. Yeah, I've had
I have a couple of friends literally, just two that
do canonsen, one in Ohio and one in Chicago or
the outskirts of Chicago, and they tell me some they've
been texting me lately about some interesting people.

Speaker 3 (07:34):
They meet, like you know, I'm sure, oh, I'm sure.

Speaker 1 (07:36):
People conflicted about this, so that or the way to
talk about it is they find it interesting. And they're
very blue people, by the way, as you can imagine
being from Chicago. And uh yeah, they don't. They don't
hassle me.

Speaker 3 (07:48):
Jay.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
For one reason is that not only do I live
in an apartment, second floor type, but I have no doorbell,
thank you, thank god. No one can bother me and
as they know my fucking phone number, I'll keep bastard,
so God damn riding. No one's gonna fucking hassle me,
Lucky Lucky.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
All right, Well, should we get into this episode. Let's
do it, Oscar. Could we take a break? Listeners, welcome

(08:35):
back to the show. Well, the lights are turned down low,
the ceremonial candle is lit, and the drinks are about
to start flowing. Let's start this show. Okay, So, just
like last episode.

Speaker 1 (08:51):
It's funny how just the drinks portion of that intro
is actually right?

Speaker 3 (08:54):
Or two episodes ago? Would it be two episodes ago?
When we I gave you to drink whiskey. As we
podcast loosens up a bit, I gave you three bottles
to choose from. Yeah, last time, and you chose the
very old Saint Nick. This time, I kept two of
those bottles and I introduced a new third bottle, which

(09:17):
would you like me to open? Oscar. We have the
Elijah Craig toast. This was one of your picks last time.
Ninety four proof picked that up from the distillery. I
have written house Rye bottled in bond, so it's one
hundred proof. Also not not Kyle mitten House, Oscar, you're
gonna get us canceled. Picked this up from the distillery too.

(09:40):
That's bottled in Bond one hundred proof. I think I
said that already. And the new one I introduced is
a ten year Henry McKenna. This is also bib bottled
in Bond. It was bottled in April fifth, twenty twelve,
which one good, sir.

Speaker 1 (10:00):
So it's a twelve year not a ten year.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
Well nowadays, but it was bottle that ten years. They
don't continue to age once they're in the bottle joke
like last time, which would you like?

Speaker 1 (10:11):
Well, listeners, you guys don't know how the sausage is
made with this particular kind of aspect of the show.
But I'm gonna give you the choice. I'm gonna give
you the answer. It's gonna be the Rye. It's gonna
be the.

Speaker 3 (10:23):
Written House, the written House Rye. Yeah, good choice. I've
really wanted to try this one.

Speaker 1 (10:28):
You don't say that's.

Speaker 3 (10:31):
Try okay, So I'm gonna open the sucker up.

Speaker 1 (10:33):
It's not like you told me I had time to
pick this.

Speaker 3 (10:35):
I would never what tell me this is not a
screw cap. I'll be really upset if this is a screwcap.

Speaker 1 (10:42):
It looks like it is from here.

Speaker 3 (10:43):
It certainly does, doesn't it. But oh, it's a screw cap.

Speaker 1 (10:47):
Really it loses respect, doesn't It.

Speaker 3 (10:50):
Really does lose a low respect. I like getting that
first nose filled as soon as you crack that bottle. Yep,
it's alcohol. I don't have that palette. I don't have that.

Speaker 4 (10:59):
No.

Speaker 3 (11:01):
I love bourbons and whiskeys. I just don't have the
nose of the palette. It's kind of sad, actually, I
have even less. It's a wonderful color.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
Oh, I do like the color, deep deep color.

Speaker 3 (11:13):
I don't know if there's an age statement on here anyway. Oh,
it's bottled and bond. Okay, give me your glass. There, sir,
is a mic picking that up it is. That's a
nice sound right there.

Speaker 1 (11:31):
Well, okay, I can definitely tell us stronger.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
Yeah, that that very old saint nick. That wasn't even
I don't think eighty seven proof. This is a hundred proof,
so good, good solid hunch. Give her a little. Don't
you taste it yet to tell me there's definitely some
thing there's that's caramel for sure. M Okay, here we go.

(11:54):
I'm gonna swirl it away.

Speaker 1 (11:56):
You smell camel?

Speaker 3 (11:56):
Really?

Speaker 4 (11:57):
Do?

Speaker 1 (11:58):
I smell like dead dreams? Wow?

Speaker 3 (12:01):
This is a Christmas episode for Christ's like, Oscar right now?

Speaker 1 (12:04):
It ain't.

Speaker 3 (12:07):
Yeah, man, carmel, it's not great. It smells gin. That's okay,
spicy cinnamon for sure. Yeah, I guess you kind of like,
all right, we got our whiskey mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (12:31):
And he's pouring in other glassbooks.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
Oh you're gonna hear that, but oh you won't hear
the bottle because it's a fucking twist cap. Yeah, tonight, Oscar.
We have one of those rare, few and far between
kind of timely episodes. But we actually originally covered this
topic back in twenty nineteen as one of our very

(12:55):
first Patreon only shows. Now I decided to cover this
topic again and expand on our original episode because recently
it's seen a resurgence in popularity, or at least in curiosity,
due to a Netflix movie called Woman of the Hour,
which started streaming on October eighteenth, twenty twenty four. Now.

(13:21):
Woman of the Hour is directed by my celebrity freebie,
you know the celebrity.

Speaker 1 (13:26):
Oh my, I remember nats All coming back?

Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yes, the celebrity my wife says, I could you know
I could sleep with if the opportunity ever arises. I
think hers is Josh Hartnett. Anyway, Anna Kendrick. She directs
the movie and she also stars in it. She plays
a woman named Cheryl Bradshaw, an aspiring actress who in
nineteen seventy eight picked a serial killer as her winner

(13:53):
on a wildly popular game show called The Dating Game. Now,
this serial killer and rapist in question is a man
more like a goddamn animal named Rodney James Alcala, also
known as the Dating Game killer Now. Al Kala was

(14:15):
active between nineteen sixty eight and nineteen seventy nine, and
he had a very peculiar mo since Rodney was considered
good looking, tall fit, bright white, shark smile, tan skin, long,
thick black hair, and he was incredibly smart and very smooth,

(14:38):
and he was good with a camera. Rodney Alcalo would
lull his victims into this false sense of security because
he would pose as a successful fashion photographer. So here's
this handsome for the nineteen seventies guy. He's an incredibly
smooth talker, and he's got a camera, and he's a
fashion photographer. He's harmless, so women open themselves up to him,

(15:03):
totally clueless as to who the man behind the camera
really was. And that was his m tricking women into
getting them alone by posing as a photographer. Well that
in rape and torture, he liked to strangle his victims
to the point of death, then revive them again, only
to do it again and again and again. He also

(15:27):
loved to pose his victims' bodies to as a calla
put it, defile the victims the best I can and death.
This is a real fucking winner we're talking about this
time had said that Rodney alcala is one of the
most prolific serial killers in American history, and he's often
likened to Ted Bundy. Just a killing machine. Any young

(15:49):
woman or girl, young man who crossed this guy's path
and survived is extremely lucky, as anyone regardless of age, race,
or second was a potential victim. And when it comes
to victim count, Rodney Alcolla's trail of bodies is placed
between eight and one hundred and thirty. Okay, Now, if

(16:13):
the numbers are correct, and I'll Calla's body count is
really that high, that would rank this monster as the
second worst serial killer in modern history, the first being
Luis Garavito, known as Labistilla the Beast, a child murderer
from Colombia who has one hundred and thirty eight confirmed kills.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
I'm sure you will explain it. That gap, right, and
there must be a reason. Yeah, there is, Okay, there is,
and I won't ask until you get there. But obviously
to my first question is like, how do you go
from A to one thirty?

Speaker 3 (16:50):
Yeah, no, you're right, and I will I'll touch on that.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
Now.

Speaker 3 (16:56):
I'll calla this guy. He was fucking smart, incredibly smart.
He had a genius level IQ. Now, when it comes
to intelligent quotient or someone's IQ, I want to give
you guys some information on how people score and what
those IQ numbers mean. Now, generally, an IQ under one

(17:17):
hundred is considered below average, almost kind of borderlining on
a mental issue, mentally challenged, while an IQ of one
hundred is considered average. An IQ over one hundred and
forty is considered a high IQ, and an IQ score
of one hundred and sixty plus is considered genius level IQ.

(17:39):
Approximately seventy percent of the population falls within the IQ
range of eighty five to one point fifteen, which doesn't
say very much about population. In most scoring systems, less
than three percent of people score higher than one hundred
and thirty. Rodney Alcala, this asshole had a staggering one
hundred and sixty IQ, which classified him as exceptionally gifted.

(18:04):
And this is rare occurring in about one in thirty
one thousand, five hundred and sixty people. Isn't that some shit?
This fucking guy was a genius like verifiably, verifiably, Charles
Darwin and Ludwig van Beethoven had IQs of one sixty five.
Einstein and Stephen Hawkings both had IQs of one sixty,

(18:27):
Ted Bundy one twenty four, Adolf Hitler one forty one,
and Jeffrey Dahmer won forty five. If al call it
didn't become a serial killer, God knows what he could
have accomplished with a mind like that. I mean, he
had an IQ equivalent to Stephen Hawking and Einstein.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
Isn't that something Hey kind of makes you think about psychopathy.
I'm assuming he has that or had.

Speaker 3 (18:50):
That, and sexual satis for sure.

Speaker 1 (18:54):
Yeah, But you know, psychopathy is interesting because a lot
of people attribute that to intelligence, not like saying people
that's not a fright eire, not like people who people
who don't know what's going on with that with you know,
the psychology of that would can attribute people being a
psychopath with being smart.

Speaker 3 (19:15):
Yes, you know what I'm saying. Yes, they say, like dumb.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
People can be psychopaths one hundred percent, but like that's
what we don't attribute that that way.

Speaker 3 (19:23):
Well, they say, like your your high powered lawyers, you're,
you're cream of the crop, doctors, you're, you know, these
insanely successful businessmen, you know, captains of industry. They share
a lot of similarities with people that are psychotic with psychopathy. Yes,
it's Michael Jordan, this is true. Yeah, you're you're your
cream of the crop, ultimate sports stars, right, have a

(19:45):
lot of the same similarities as psychopaths.

Speaker 1 (19:48):
It's fucked up any Kubrick. He was an asshole with Kubrick.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
Oh, Stanley Kubrick.

Speaker 1 (19:53):
Yeah, yes, like that, you know, and you whatever tweaked.
There is to a psychopa psychopathic person that can lead
to violence enough to merit them serial killer. Obviously, that's
where you differ from you know, other psychopaths slash other geniuses.
But it's it's I think it's fascinating that we see

(20:14):
it that way. We tend to see smart people less evil,
bad or callous, a callous cold good point, you know,
it's there's gotta be some connection there that's more obvious
that I'm not gonna talk about right now. But beyond
that connection, it seems like it's a it's a fact
when it isn't two separate things. You can be empathetic

(20:37):
and a genius. It doesn't have to be one of them.
There's many examples of that. But yeah, I just found
that interesting. I want to how many people blame his intellect.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
Yeah, I haven't seen that too much. I don't think
people want to give him the credit, you know. Yeah,
but yeah, genius genius. Possibly one of the worst serial
killers in modern history, but he was a genius. And
one of the craziest things about Rodney Alcola, besides being
a genius level murdering piece of shit. While he was

(21:08):
an active serial killer, Rodney Alcola had the gall to
appear as a contestant on a hit American television show
called The Dating Game Now The Dating Game, If you
don't Know, was an incredibly popular sleazy daytime television show
in the mid to late nineteen seventies. We're talking a

(21:29):
smoking hot bachelorette would ask ridiculous questions, usually dripping with
sexual undertones, to a hidden panel of three handsome bachelors.

Speaker 1 (21:40):
No, it's funny because I've I've seen this clip, and
I've seen a lot of jokes, like skits that makes
fun of the dating game over the years in my lifetime,
Like I've seen the Simpsons do it, I think, and
other things. I always find them funny. They're ridiculous. It's
as bad as love is blind. Honestly, it's as bad
as any of those things.

Speaker 3 (21:58):
Yeah, I equate milk, Oh god, I equated to like
today's bachelor.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
Yeah, that's another good one. Man. And now their questions
are always so ridiculous.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
Yeah, that's all this. And listeners, I would get to
this in a second, but you're gonna hear it. You're
gonna hear it firsthand, the questions that are asked, the
tone in which they're asked, and the responses.

Speaker 1 (22:19):
Also the pride. I mean talk about pride before the
fall of the sky.

Speaker 3 (22:25):
Well he was already fallen.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
I'm just saying, like the kind of balls. He's got
to be you said Raisen to fight. It's beyond Braisen.
It's idiotic, it's psychotic. Yeah right, yeah.

Speaker 3 (22:38):
Now so yeah, so, these sexually charged questions would be
asked to a panel of three handsome for the seventies bachelor's.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Honestly hand some for today, to a lot of a.

Speaker 3 (22:49):
Lot of butterfly collars, a lot of porn stashes, a
lot of manes of hair going hair. This is very strange. Now,
based on the bachelor's answer, the bachelorette would ultimately choose
one of these guys to go on a date with
with hopes of something more happening kind of harmless BRAUNCHI
fun right. But on this particular episode of The Dating Game,

(23:13):
which aired on September thirteenth, nineteen seventy eight, despite his
criminal history because at this time, Alcala had been arrested
on numerous occasions up to this point, and stories differ
as to whether or not producers for The Dating Game
really checked into his background or not, which they were
supposed to do for all contestants. Anyway, on this date,

(23:35):
millions of people got to watch a deranged serial killer
called Bachelor Number one attempt to lure his next victim
into his web by giving these cute, quippy, sexually charged
answers to the bachelorette's probing questions with this big, flashing,
bright smile. It's kind of this hyena smile to shading grin,

(23:59):
shitting grin of the cameras. It's actually it's horrifying once
you know who this guy is. Right, And as I
mentioned at the top of the show, the bachelorette Ryl Bradshaw,
actually chose to go on a date with Alcala. And
I'm not going to tell you what what happened to
the unlucky bachelorette yet yet. Now, actually we have a

(24:21):
clip from the Dating Game episode featuring Rodney Alcala as
Bachelor number one. Now listeners, it is a pretty long clip.
It's over three minutes. I hope you don't mind. But
now that you know just a little bit about Alcoala
and his crimes, the answer he gives in this Dating
Dame episode Dating Game episode are that much creepier and fascinating.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
Just imagine yourself as the audience while you're listening.

Speaker 3 (24:45):
Absolutely, Oscar, could you please roll that clip?

Speaker 4 (24:50):
Thank you very much, thank you, and Welcome to the
dating game, and we'll get right on the way. It's
fun to meet our first three eligible bachelor's for game
number one, and here they are. Good luck Gallan, Well,
let's see bats. Number one is a successful photographer who

(25:12):
got his start when his father found him in the
dark room at the age of thirteen. Fully developed. Between takes,
he might find him skydiving or motorcycling. Please welcome Rodney
Alcohol Rode. Welcome, and it's time to beat our young
lady for game number one.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
And here she is.

Speaker 4 (25:32):
Here's a young lady with a welcome experience.

Speaker 3 (25:35):
She once earned a.

Speaker 4 (25:36):
Living massaging feet, but she quit when her boss suggested
that she worked.

Speaker 2 (25:40):
Her way up.

Speaker 4 (25:41):
Then she taught school in Phoenix, Arizona. Now she's here
to educate our three bachelors in the article more, It's
welcome if you will sensational Cheryl Bradshaw, Hello, Cheryl, don't
sit down the.

Speaker 1 (25:53):
Act just a minute.

Speaker 4 (25:54):
I want to make sure everything is straight. He relaxed,
to do okay, all right, you know there are three
bachelors over there. There'll be one, two, and three. Anything
you like to find out more about them except their name, age, occupation,
or income.

Speaker 1 (26:04):
Okay, and we're gonna start by.

Speaker 4 (26:06):
Having them say hello to you and see how they
shall Number one, would you say hello to Cheryl?

Speaker 2 (26:10):
Please?

Speaker 1 (26:11):
We're gonna have a great time together.

Speaker 4 (26:12):
Cheryl, okay, nad here we.

Speaker 5 (26:15):
Go, Bachelor number one, Yes, across your best time.

Speaker 1 (26:23):
The best time is at night, a nighttime.

Speaker 5 (26:27):
Why do you say that because.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
That's the only time.

Speaker 5 (26:29):
There is the only time. What's wrong with the morning? Afternoon?

Speaker 4 (26:33):
Well, they're okay, But nighttimes when it really gets good.
Then you're really ready.

Speaker 5 (26:37):
I'm a drama teacher and I'm going to audition each
of you for my private class. Bachelor number one, and
you're red, dirty old man.

Speaker 3 (26:51):
Take it. Come on over here.

Speaker 4 (27:00):
Y go latin me.

Speaker 5 (27:05):
A Bachelor number one. I am serving you for dinner.
Oh what are you called? And what do.

Speaker 4 (27:16):
You look like? I'm called the Banana and I'm looking
really good?

Speaker 5 (27:24):
Can you be a little more descriptive?

Speaker 3 (27:26):
Peel me.

Speaker 5 (27:34):
Later, Bachelor one later.

Speaker 4 (27:38):
Welcome back to the dating game, and Cheryl, we have
reached the moment of truth, as we call it. You've
heard from the bachelor's You've got some great dramatic presentations,
some good answers. But now I'm gonna ask you a question.
We'll let d be bachelor number one, Bachelor number two,
or bachelor number three. Who gets the dates?

Speaker 5 (27:54):
Well, I like bananas, so I'll take one number.

Speaker 4 (27:57):
One batchlor number one. All right, Well, there they go. However,
you did leave one remaining, and this is your date.
And I want to tell you something about him, Cheryl.
He's a skydiver, so he's got a lot of nerve.
He's in a motorcycle. He's also fine photographer. And say
hello Rodney Alcalo. Rodney, God the hell I said, Rodney dinner?

(28:24):
But the one answer.

Speaker 3 (28:27):
Such a creepy, sleazy fucker he is. Now, I'll leave
a link to the video showing all of this so
you can see Cheryl and Rodney and Rodney's shitty grin
in his mane of hair, and his eyes, his eyes
are there's nothing there there. Yeah, you could tell.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
You know who's playing. You mentioned an the contract in
the movie. You know who's playing.

Speaker 3 (28:49):
I've seen him, I mean i've seen a picture of him.
To me, doesn't look anything like Rodney Alcala. But I
can't think of his name.

Speaker 1 (28:56):
Okay, sorry, I mean I could look at it.

Speaker 3 (28:57):
But yeah, it is of right this and recording this.
It's not October eighteenth yet, it's the thirteenth, so I
haven't seen the movie yet, right. We could always come
back and report on it in January.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
That's true.

Speaker 3 (29:12):
Now, as prize is for winning the dating game, paid
to send Cheryl and Rodney for tennis lessons and for
ridiculous looking matching tennis outfits and to Magic Mountain, a
theme park in California. Sadly, the couple would never take
those tennis lessons or visit Magic Mountain. We'll get into why,

(29:35):
and we're also going to get into Alcala's hideous crimes,
of course, but for now, let's take a look at
his background. Was something there that could have foreshadowed this monster?

Speaker 1 (29:46):
Oh? Sorry, I didn't know. I guess you're wanted to know. Yeah,
I did find them. It is your mom. Oh no,
that's not right. His name is Daniel.

Speaker 3 (29:56):
Daniel Silvato is playing Rodney Alcala.

Speaker 1 (29:59):
Yes, and he's been in things before. Funny enough, we
mentioned a movie of his in the last show. He
was in The Pope s Exionist. I think he plays
one of the younger priests in that movie. Really, yeah,
that's funny. Interesting, interesting connection. Okay, so now we know,
but he's more about He's definitely not a big name.
I definitely, I know I reckonize his face, but I
don't know him offhand like that, not like Anna Kendrick.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
Anyway, m Yannndrick.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
Yes, it's such a hard offer.

Speaker 3 (30:26):
That's my celebrity free bree bo I get it now.
Rodney Alcala was born Rodrigo Jacques Alcala boukoor yikes on
August twenty third, nineteen forty three, in San Antonio, Texas.

Speaker 1 (30:39):
Is that bottling bontu?

Speaker 3 (30:42):
No, the Rodney Alcola is definitely a fucking twist, cap
oh nice. His parents were Raoul Alcala Bookor and Anna
Maria Gutierres. In nineteen fifty one, Rodney Alcala moved with
his family to Mexico, and around nineteen fifty four out
his father, Raoul abandoned his family, which led to Alkala

(31:04):
and his brother's Alcal and his brother and two sisters.
So he's got a brother and two sisters and his
mother moving to Los Angeles, California when he was only
twelve years old. His childhood was pretty uneventful from what
I can tell. No real warning signs to predict what
he would become. And I've read too much about this asshole,
watched too many documentaries, and really there was nothing there

(31:27):
that would have signaled this. This is someone other than
the and the father, right, But that doesn't mean you're
going to grow up to be the rapist ciracular this guy.

Speaker 1 (31:37):
Was because so many of us are ab.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
And there's not much on his parents either. I read
that his mother, Anna Maria, was incredibly hard working. She
did whatever she could to provide for her son and
for the brother and the two sisters. It said his
mother gave Rodney every opportunity to succeed, including sending him
to private schools bare So there's nothing tragic there. Really. Yeah,
you know, a little father issue who doesn't have those,

(32:03):
that's it. But at the edge of seventeen, he joined
the US Army and served as a clerk. But four
years into his service he suffered what was likened to
a nervous breakdown, and he faced allegations of sexual misconduct,
and he was ultimately discharged from the army in nineteen
sixty four after being diagnosed with severe antisocial personality disorder. Okay, now,

(32:29):
once side of the Army. Alcala enrolled in the UCLA
School of Fine Arts and earned his Bachelor of Arts
degree in nineteen sixty eight. And it's in nineteen sixty eight,
that's something in Alkala snaps or triggers. What triggered him,
we don't know. We know that in sixty eight Alcala
attempted to kill what we think was his first victim,

(32:53):
an eight year old girl named Tali Shapiro, just a
fucking vicious, heinous crying. Were they're victims before Tali Shapiro?
We don't know. But from the details I'm about to
give you about what Alcala did to the little Tally,
I find it hard to believe she was his first,

(33:13):
Like he just decided out of nowhere to do what
he did to her. I just don't buy it. I
think there were victims before this little girl.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:25):
So, on the morning of September twenty fifth, nineteen sixty eight,
Rodney Alcola pulled up to Tally as she was walking
to school on Sunset Boulevard. This is in Los Angeles.
Of course, he tried to convince little Tally to get
into his car, but she refused, saying that she wasn't
allowed to talk to strangers. Good for you, ever, the

(33:47):
smooth talker. In response, Alkala told Tally that he was
good friends with her family and that if she got
into his car, he'd show her a pretty picture. And sadly,
this was enough to convince Tally to get into Alcala's
beige color sedan with no license plates, and according to
court testimony, getting into the car is the last thing

(34:11):
Tali Shapiro remembers, thank God now as literally a heaven
sent miracle. A good samaritan who was also heading down
Sunset saw this whole thing transpire. He saw a little
girl walking down Sunset Boulevard, He saw this beige car
pull up to her, and then he witnessed the girl

(34:31):
getting into the vehicle. Thinking this was kind of odd,
the good samaritan called the police and proceeded to give
a detailed description of Alcala and the vehicle. Now, some
articles I read say that the good samaritan actually followed
Alcala's car. Either way, the police were able to quickly
locate Alcala's DeLong Pre Avenue apartment. When the police arrived

(34:55):
at Alcala's apartment door, they demanded to be let in.
They're banging on the door, and Alcala peeked through the
door and said he couldn't let him in because he
was taking a shower. The cops gave him a few
seconds to get his shit together, and when he didn't
come back to the door, they said fuck it and
they kicked the door in, but Alcala, that slippery piece
of shit, had already escaped out the back door. Upon

(35:18):
entering the apartment, police found poor Tali Shapiro on the
kitchen floor close to death. Now, remember this is an
innocent eight year old girl. Tali was found naked, legs
spread and lying in a puddle of her own blood.
Alcala had beaten, raped, and nearly strangled Tolly to death

(35:41):
with a ten pound metal bar. Now, thankfully, this incredibly strong,
brave little girl survived the most vicious attack imaginable, but
only after being in a coma for a month, and
after months of intense medical treatment following that coma. After
Tali was well enough, her family moved out of the country.

(36:02):
And I don't blame him. This fact becomes important later
and unfortunately leads to many more murders. Now I understand
as we go through this. This guy, he was a traveler,
a wanderer. Alkala traveled from California to New York and
back again a number of times while he was an

(36:23):
active serial killer, stopping who knows where and doing who
knows what across country. Killer. Now, when Alkala fled his
apartment after brutalizing Tali Shapiro, he high tailed it to
New York. And while he's in New York, Rodney Alcala
changed his name to John Berger. John Berger enrolled in

(36:45):
film school at NYU, and he even got to study
under none other than Roman Polanski.

Speaker 1 (36:54):
Well not a little surprising, I guess.

Speaker 3 (36:56):
Now, while studying at NYU, Alcoala is added to the
FBI's ten most wanted list for the attempted murder of
Tali Shapiro. And I guess he began to feel the
heat in New York, was he? Because he quickly moved
to New Hampshire, where he again changed his name, but
just a little bit. In New York, Alcala was John
Berger b E r g e R. And when he

(37:18):
moves to New Hampshire, he's now John Berger b U
r g e R. Like a fucking cheeseburger. Yeah, In
New Hampshire, Alcola or Cheeseburger gets a job as a
counselor at, of all places, a girls camp. This fucking guy,
I'm telling you can't make this ship up, Oscar.

Speaker 1 (37:39):
I mean well, I mean talk about our system being
slow to catch up with things.

Speaker 3 (37:46):
I mean, Jesus Christ there, wait, just wait.

Speaker 1 (37:50):
I mean the other the idea of him flying from
one to the other, assuming he flew from LA to
New York.

Speaker 3 (37:54):
He's he's he's pretty much driving it, driving it, which
is worse. That's worse for a guy like this.

Speaker 1 (38:01):
It does seem worse, yes, but also like it feels
like well, I mean, compared to today flying you can't
get away with not with your face, you.

Speaker 3 (38:10):
Know, Oh you should be caught in a second, in
a second. Yeah. See, he gets a job at a
fucking girls camp in New Hampshire. Cheeseburger does. Now, now
this is great.

Speaker 4 (38:20):
Now.

Speaker 3 (38:20):
A few girls from the camp noticed an FBI wanted
poster tacked up at a post office what and they
commented to each other that the man on the poster
looks an awful lot like their creepy Cans camp counselor,
mister Cheeseburger. Yeah, the girls notified authorities and Alcoho was
apprehended and brought back to California to stand trial for

(38:40):
the abduction, rape, and attempted murder of Tillie Shapiro. Thank god. Right,
here's where the problem comes in.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
I know exactly where you're going.

Speaker 3 (38:50):
Because the Shapiro family was out of the country and unavailable,
there wasn't a primary witness to testify against Alcola. All
the charges Alcala would have faced, which would have come
with a lengthy prison term. He instead was offered a
plea deal and pled down to a lesser charge of
child molestation alcohol. Wound up spending only thirty four months

(39:14):
in jail, and he had to register as a sex
vender thirty four months for what he did to that
poor kid. Yeah, so fucked up. So in less than
three years, the animal was back out in the streets
and hunting once again.

Speaker 1 (39:28):
Yeah, I mean I saw it come in. The second
you mentioned yeah, my bad, Okay, the second you mentioned
that they went out of town, well the country, not
the country. Sorry, Yeah, I knew exactly what this was going.
And then this is nothing necessarily that I would It
is easy to blame the justice system. But when I
here to do that right now? Yeah, it's super predictable there.

(39:53):
For there was something you mentioned earlier. I'm trying to
remember what it was before you got into the Little Girl,
which something about his upbringing. I had it a minute ago. Man,
I'm losing it as I'm talking.

Speaker 3 (40:09):
It's late. It is late, and we just recorded the
second Exor System right episode.

Speaker 1 (40:15):
We're doing that double.

Speaker 3 (40:16):
We're doing two for if he comes back, say hey,
stupid stop, No, you're fine now. Alcohol's next victim was
a woman named Cornelia Cryley. Originally Alcoholo was only suspecting
suspected of killing Criley in New York in nineteen seventy
one while he was on the run for the crimes

(40:38):
he committed against Tali Shapiro. Criley was a twenty three
year old TWA flight attendant. Alcala brutally raped and strangled
Cryley with a pair of her own pantyhose inside her
Upper East Side apartment. When police found her, Criley was
lying naked and posed against an overturned bed, with the

(40:58):
nylon stocking to strangle her still cinched around her neck.
Cornelia's bra had been pulled up over her head, and
Alcola had severely bitten her left breast. Alcolo was confirmed
as Cryley's killer in twenty twelve. So for forty one years,
Cornelia Cryley's murder went unsolved. Wow, forty one fucking years.

(41:21):
Imagine being their family and not knowing for forty one years.

Speaker 1 (41:25):
Imagine allowed them to make it through all that time.
Probably the ones and then I remembered and.

Speaker 3 (41:34):
Not much is known about this next victim, but this
one was lucky to get away. This one actually got away.
In California, in nineteen seventy four, while on parole for
Talie Shapiro's molet station charges, Remember he was plied down
to a molestation, Alcolo was arrested for assaulting a thirteen
year old girl referred to in court documents only as

(41:55):
Julie J. Julie J had accepted from Alcala what she
thought was be a ride to school, very reminiscent of
Tarlie Shapiro. Instead, Alkoala attacked and sexually assaulted Julie J.
He was caught and only spent two years in jail
for these terrible offenses. Then he was back out on
the prowl and unbelievably, his parole officer allowed him to

(42:17):
travel back to New York in nineteen seventy seven.

Speaker 1 (42:20):
I wonder if that's a case of, like, you know,
too much going on, like an overbearing amount of cases,
that kind of thing.

Speaker 3 (42:26):
I don't even know if it was that.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
I think Alkoala was charming that much charming at that
kind of harmless.

Speaker 3 (42:33):
I mean, this is a I don't know, I feel
like killer were dealing with he could talk, right, buddy,
you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (42:39):
I guess you're right. But also like and maybe this
is me living in the current age, and I just
don't feel like anyone will get away with that anymore,
and just not to back then. But it does seem
like when it comes to Convex in general, basically they've
been traying like shit all their lives in his country forever,
whether or not they're deserved, but especially they're deserve once.

(42:59):
And I feel like when it comes to that, especially
if you're a po officer or halfway house manager or whatever,
you beat the rap sheet. You assign a judgment to
that person by reading what they've done, what they're sentenced for,
before their looks are charmed. You don't believe any bullshit
they're gonna tell, are you? You know, everything they say
is a lie. I feel like there's a there's a

(43:21):
disconnect there that I'm not understanding that I don't think
it's just the time.

Speaker 3 (43:25):
You're right, there is a disconnect, a huge disconnect, you
know what I'm saying, because what follows, you know, is terrible, right,
you know, had he not been allowed to go back
to New York at that point?

Speaker 1 (43:35):
Also, like you know, did you hear all these stories
that are very very true today and must been must
have been true back then? That child moll the station
doesn't go well with people or incarcerated.

Speaker 4 (43:46):
You know.

Speaker 3 (43:46):
That's another great point that that too, he got off
pretty easy, not getting fucking.

Speaker 1 (43:50):
Shanked pretty fucking easy twice.

Speaker 3 (43:53):
Yeah, yeah, Dad's again, did was he turning up the
charm in jail?

Speaker 1 (43:57):
What the fuck was he doing? I don't understand. Once
he's yeah, que genius, doesn't mean he gets away with everything.
It just means he had a capacity I did not
doesn't mean you know what I'm saying, If I if
I see this guy in jail, in a jail cell,
I automatically know he's an asshole. Convicted asshole felon and
I know he melested a child. No way am I
trust anything he says. How can he charm me from
that point?

Speaker 3 (44:17):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (44:18):
I don't understand.

Speaker 3 (44:19):
I know it's rhetorical, but yeah, great point. And by
the way, you mentioned that you know how he looks,
and I mentioned how he looks. Listeners, go to the
show notes. I should have mentioned this at the top
of the show. All the victims I have pictures of,
and I also have pictures of cheeseburger I'll as fuck.
So yeah, go to the show notes. But no, that's
a great point. How did he not get the shit
kicked out of him in prison or killed for doing

(44:40):
this stuff?

Speaker 1 (44:42):
Did he merely jon the Natzi gang in there or
who knows? Well he's actually Hispanics? Now maybe the other right.

Speaker 3 (44:49):
It wouldn't work. No, I don't know, but yeah, it's
a great question. I don't know.

Speaker 4 (44:54):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (44:54):
Yeah, So his pro officer lets him back to New York.
So in New York in nineteen seventy seven, alcohol got
right to it, killing a woman named Ellen Hoover. Ellen
Hover now she was twenty three years old at the
time of her death. On July fifteenth, nineteen seventy seven.
She was a comedy writer and an aspiring music conductor

(45:17):
who disappeared after leaving her Manhattan apartment on July fifteenth,
nineteen seventy seven. On the date she went missing, Ellen
had written that she was to meet with someone named
John Berger, a photographer, in her date book. That used
to be a thing back then. Now I use Google

(45:37):
Calendar for everything, but there used to be a date book.
So in her date book on that date she was
meeting with a photographer named John Berger. Fucking red flags
right for us. And her friend said that this John
Berger character had been pressuring Ellen to have lunch with them,
so that's what she did. She left her apartment on
July fifteenth, again, seventy seven, and she was never seen

(45:59):
alive again. Eleven months later, Ellen's bones were found near
Rockefeller Estates the grounds the Rockefeller Estate grounds. Alcohola liked
to use the beautiful, vast Rockefeller Estate as a backdrop
for his photography sessions, so he is intimately familiar with
the grounds and any potential hiding spots. When Ellen Hover's

(46:22):
body was found, she was so badly decomposed that dental
records were the only way to identify her. Now here's
a twist, Ellen Hover, she wasn't a nobody. Yeah, her goddaughter.
She was goddaughter of both Dean Martin and Sammy Davis Junior.
You're kidding that was their goddaughter.

Speaker 1 (46:41):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (46:42):
And her father owned an incredibly popular, probably the most
popular nightclub in Hollywood at the time, a joint called Ciro's,
which Ellen was set to inherit. She was an heiress
to this vast kind of They were very wealthy and
she was going to inherit this nightclub and all that
came with it. Baby. Yeah. And it wasn't until twenty

(47:02):
ten that Alcohola was confirmed to be Hovah's killed, Hoover's killer. Wow.
And I didn't mean that the other women that were
killed were nobody's right now, but she was a somebody. Clearly,
she was a somebody and Samit Day was junior and
Sami Day.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
No if anything barks and me when you mentioned that,
it's not that you know that other victims are nobody
says more that I'm surprised that the the and maybe
maybe you're about to say, how that the investigation didn't
get kicked up a notch because of the celebrity status connection.
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (47:35):
Oh, it was Front page News also.

Speaker 1 (47:38):
Okay, police, you know usually that's the thing that was
involved that kicks this off to one hundred famous infamy.
They didn't catch them, right, but they didn't catch them.

Speaker 3 (47:49):
Yeah, front page News. Hover was for sure now. Alcola's
next victim was a woman named Jill Barkham. Barkham was
eighteen years old at the time of her death. She
was an New York transplant who moved to la with
aspirations of becoming a Hollywood actress. How many times we've
heard that story. And she was a small thing, barely

(48:09):
five feet tall, had less than one hundred pounds. Jill
disappeared from Sunset Boulevard and her body was found on
a service road off Mulholland Drive near Marlon Brando's house
actually in the Hollywood Hills, on November tenth, nineteen seventy seven.
She had been raped, sodomized, her face bashed in with

(48:30):
a rock, and she'd been strangled three times with belt,
with her pantyhose and with one of her pant legs,
and she had been posed on her knees with her
face in the dirt. Alcolo was charged with Jill's murder
through DNA evidence. So this guy, he was a fucking maniac,

(48:50):
just a maniac.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
So I assume that they know they she got found
out to his house because he used three different implements.

Speaker 3 (48:57):
Yes, and this.

Speaker 1 (49:01):
Will come up again soon.

Speaker 3 (49:02):
I don't know if the implements were still around her
neck that wasn't disclosed, or whether they were kind of
strewn around the body.

Speaker 1 (49:09):
Oh, there's patterns to it that you can tell.

Speaker 3 (49:11):
Oh, oh yeah, definitely. Yeah, he's got an mo for sure.

Speaker 1 (49:15):
I'm just saying. I wonder if he had just used
his hands, could they have told could they be would
they be able to tell that he strangled his victims
multiple times?

Speaker 3 (49:24):
Oh? I don't know.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
I can you tell that? I'm sure maybe now you
can with our modern sciences.

Speaker 3 (49:29):
But no, that's true. Yeah back then, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
I'm curious, which makes.

Speaker 3 (49:32):
Me think that's why they knew, because that shit was
either still around her neck or it was strewn around
the body, and there could have been ligature marks that
were of differing widths, or.

Speaker 1 (49:41):
Do they mention at all if these items were broken,
they didn't because it's possible that he strangled this victim
maybe at least more than those three times, because and
then used a different item after it broke, which meaning
that he could have used an item more than once,

(50:02):
like in the middle of the second time.

Speaker 3 (50:04):
He did have that thing where he liked to choke
him to the point of death, then.

Speaker 1 (50:06):
He's prolonging that he may he's making that emotion multiple
times with one person, right, yes, whereas a lot of
other strangulations just a one and done. I wonder if
he's using the panty host first, right, let's her go
breathe come back down. It breaks on the second time
he uses a different thing, you know what I'm saying.
Maybe it's more than three.

Speaker 3 (50:26):
It could be, right, Well, this guy.

Speaker 1 (50:28):
Depending on how their forensics were able to tell at all,
how how this vectorm was strangled, right, I don't know
how they had it.

Speaker 3 (50:37):
Well, the technology certainly wasn't there back then, right, you know,
because a lot of these cases aren't being closed until
the you know, twenty tens and higher.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
You know, is that when they found out about her,
I didn't.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
Write a date on that. I apologize, Well, it was
through DNA evidence so I'm assuming.

Speaker 1 (50:53):
It has to be after that because then, okay, Now, on.

Speaker 3 (50:57):
June twenty fourth, nineteen seventy eight, Alkala murdered thirty two
year old Charlotte Lamb. Lamb was found posed again this
is one of his emos, in the laundry room of
a large apartment complex in El Segunda, California. She had
been raped, beaten, and strangled to death with a shoelace.

(51:17):
She was found with her arms behind her, bound behind her,
and bite marks on one of her breasts. Once again,
DNA linked Alcala to Charlotte Lamb. Now for one of
the most interesting things about this case, during all this
murder in Mayhem and less than three months after killing
Charlotte Lamb, so he's already a fucking rapist, child rapist,

(51:40):
and he's a multi multiple murderer. At this point, Rodney
Alcoa had the balls to appear on the Gate dating
game television show. Like I said on September thirteenth, nineteen
seventy eight. Now, up to this point, from what we know,
Alcala has killed at least two women, attempted to kill
one child, and is spect in two murders and the

(52:02):
Jay was it Julie j a rapist as well. He's
also been in prison multiple times for offenses ranging from
child molestation, drug possession, parole violation, providing drugs to a minor,
and assault. I mean, a real gold star here. If
the producers on The Dating Game just took a peek

(52:24):
into this clowns background, we're talking literally a surface level look,
they would have seen that he was an animal, and
he would have never been led onto the show.

Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, this is what the internet would have been used?

Speaker 3 (52:38):
Or would he remember Rodney Alcala? He was attractive. He
was an intelligent guy with a huge, pearly white smile,
tanned skin, a supposedly lucrative career as a fashion photographer
who also liked extreme sports like parachuting and motorbiking. A
guy like that great for ratings. So who knows what

(53:02):
the Game Dating Game's attentions really were. Maybe they did
look into his background and said, ah, he's too good,
we got to get this guy on camera. I don't know,
I can't say that for.

Speaker 1 (53:10):
Sure right now. And also those people are long gone
and like they still have those jobs to worry about it, right, yeah? Right,
I assume so I hope. So anyway, if you're still
in that job, you know, old TV producer, I'm sorry
for you. I yeah, see the more you tell these
details of the story, when we talk about the prison stuff,
when we talk about how he gets people like I

(53:31):
get how he gets the victims, the charm of that
with the women that I get. This charm makes sense
when his life is dedicated to just getting his next
fucking strangulation. He tries his hardest, but when it comes
to these things like the TV producer angle, the prison
thing we mentioned, seems to me like it's easier to
just attribute a lot of his success to his smarts

(53:57):
and his looks. And it's easy to go there. And
I'm sure it works for some stuff, but it can't
be for everything. And I don't know how that game
show thing is the producer's faults.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
And if something well.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
There's no man ach arm. He could have done his
way in there.

Speaker 4 (54:17):
You know.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
It almost seems like he did it on the lark
and he got in and like on my end, I'll
do it right. It almost seems like that, yeah, yeah,
like someone dared him.

Speaker 3 (54:29):
You know, I don't know, but the Bachelorette that starred
in that episode with Alcohola, the one Anna Kendrick is
playing in Woman of the Hour, and that voice you
heard at the top of the show when we played
that clip, the woman asking questions that Ryl Bradshaw. Bradshaw
was an attractive bond with this bubbly personality, and she

(54:49):
wore a revealing low cut top on the show, exposing
her ample cleavage, which we know he likes, and he
does and ultimately and so do I. Ultimately, as you know,
as you know, Bradshaw chose Alcala as the one she
would like to go on a date with. And if
you follow that link in the show notes, you could
see the newly joined couple hugging each other and shooting

(55:13):
these big, cheesy grins to the cameras. Outwardly on camera,
both contestants seemed really happy with each other until they
were backstage alone after the show. Cheryl Bradshaw immediately began
feeling uneasy around Alcola. She didn't like being alone with them,
and she said he was acting creepy. She said Alcohola

(55:35):
tried to smooth talker, promising her a date she'd never forget,
Bradshaw sen said when she began to fish she began
to feel really ill, sick, physically sick, and really uneasy
being an Alcala's presence with her internal alarm bells blaring,
Bradshaw decided to reject Alcohala's promise for a date she'd

(55:58):
never forget, and she sided to Ditchum, having absolutely no
idea at how close she came to being likely brutally murdered.
So fate intervened and the two never went out, and
they never saw each other again. But just think what
this kind of rejection would have done to a person

(56:19):
like Alkala mentally. Authorities do feel that Cheryl Bradshaw's rejection
led to the next string of violent murders we're going
to talk about.

Speaker 1 (56:29):
Oh see, I don't know you were going with that.
I was gonna say, I wonder, and maybe you're gonna
get to this later. I wonder if she has said
anything after alcohol was captured.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Dude, it's so hard to find anything on Cheryl Bradshaw.
Oh Man quotes where she at today. That's why I
can't kind of wait to see this movie, and I
want to know where she because I've searched, I can't
find shit about her.

Speaker 1 (56:54):
Well, it doesn't mean that she doesn't either.

Speaker 3 (56:56):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
It's a movie. They're going to make it up.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
They probably have better research, and I am, but I
couldn't find shit.

Speaker 1 (57:02):
I mean saying they could just make it up, saying
it's a movie.

Speaker 3 (57:05):
But oh, I got you.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
You're gonna make up?

Speaker 3 (57:07):
What if I see if it's really true?

Speaker 1 (57:09):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (57:09):
I got you.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Yeah, you know what I'm saying. They don't. They probably
haven't talked to you, Shay Broshaw either, but you think
probably not.

Speaker 3 (57:15):
I would hope they would have.

Speaker 1 (57:16):
Nah.

Speaker 3 (57:16):
Yeah, Frankly, I don't even know if she's alive. I'm
hoping she I'm assuming she is.

Speaker 1 (57:20):
I mean, she's well within the age to be alive.
So yeah, yeah, but I'm just that's my first quest. Obviously,
you don't have an answer that I don't. Yeah, I
can tell you. Yeah, that sucks for you. But yeah,
my first question would be, like, did anybody follow up
on an interview with her?

Speaker 3 (57:36):
You know, it's almost like after this, she just got
ghost Yeah nothing, Yeah, maybe she was that scared.

Speaker 2 (57:42):
I don't.

Speaker 3 (57:42):
I don't know, but you're right, it bothers me. I
do want to know.

Speaker 1 (57:45):
I mean, she seems pretty like sharp instinctively. Why she
follow that instinct watching to follow it again? Like why
even pursue any kind of limelight or whatever. She's only
can be chased and follow it can only be negative
for her. Might as well just immediately get out of
the spotlight, disappear as soon as you found out, Like
why even?

Speaker 3 (58:02):
Yeah, I mean they say women's intuition, it's a real thing. Yeah,
and she didn't even I mean, this is backstage. This
isn't a month down the line when they're out alone,
you know, in his car parked somewhere. This is fucking
behind stage of the dating games. She got it, She
felt it. She was right because just three months after

(58:23):
appearing on the Dating Game and facing rejection by Ryl Bradshaw,
Rodney Alcala claimed his next victim. Twenty seven year old
Georgia Wicksted Wicksted, a nurse, was found murdered in her
Malibu home, California, of course, December sixteenth, nineteen seventy seven.
She had been raped, sodomized, sexually abused with a hammer

(58:46):
which mutilated her genitals. Then the claw end of the
hammer was used to bash her head in, and she
was also strangled with her own nylons as if everything
else wasn't enough. DNA evidence and a handprint found at
the scene matched Alcala's next Alkala murdered twenty one year
old Jill Parento. Parento, a computer programmer, was found raped

(59:11):
and strangled to death in her apartment in Burbank, California,
on June fourteenth, nineteen seventy nine. She was found naked
on her bathroom floor, posed with pillows under her shoulders.
She had been sexually assaulted, beaten, and strangled. Blood was
found at the scene matching that of three percent of

(59:31):
the population, which did not rule out or confirm Rodney
Alcala as the killer. However, Jill Parento's friend, Catherine Bryant
testified that she and Jill had met Alkala at a
club several times, and Alkalo would ultimately be charged in
Jill Parento's death. Okay, now, this next murder, this is

(59:55):
the one that finally nailed Rodney Alcala. In Long Beach,
calif on June twentieth, nineteen seventy nine, Alcala murdered twelve
year old twelve years old Robin Samso.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
Robin Boy or Robin Girl, A girl. I assume girl
but just making sure no.

Speaker 3 (01:00:12):
No, you're right. No at the point name, she's twelve
years old man.

Speaker 4 (01:00:16):
So.

Speaker 3 (01:00:17):
On June twentieth, nineteen seventy nine, Robin was set to
start a job answering phones at a local ballet studio
in exchange for a ballet lessons It's so sad, dude.
Before starting her first day at work, earlier in the day, Robin,
along with her friend Bridget Wilvert, decided to go to beach,

(01:00:38):
and there Robin and Bridget were approached by a man
with long, dark hair who asked if he could take
their picture. The girls agreed, but at the same time,
one of Bridget's Robin's friend, one of Bridget's neighbors, ran up,
this woman named Jappie Jackie Young, and she because she
witnessed this man talking to the little girls, and she

(01:00:59):
approached there and she said, hey, is everything okay? You
guys all right? And at that the man, who of
course was Rodney Alcala, he put his head down and
he turned and he walked away fast, and Robin and
Bridget then decided to leave that beach. But Robin never
made it to work at that ballet school. In fact,

(01:01:20):
that was the last time anyone ever saw Robin alive.
Twelve days later, on July second, nineteen seventy nine, a
film crew found I'm sorry. A fire crew found the
badly decomposing body of a child in California's Sierra Madre
Foothills near Monterey Park. Animals had done a number on

(01:01:42):
the poor child's body. As there was nothing but scattered
bones left. It took three days to identify the body.
It was Robin Samso Alcala didn't get her at the beach.
He waited, and he got her while she was riding
a bike to that ballet school. Now, luckily, Bridget Wolvert,

(01:02:02):
the friend, was able to give a description to the
police of the man who offered to take their pictures
at the beach. The description led to a composite sketch,
and that composite sketch very much looked like Rodney Alcala. Now,
I left this composite sketch in the show notes so
you can see it for yourself. It's pretty remarkable how
accurate this sketch is. Twelve year old Bridget did a

(01:02:26):
great job at describing Alcala. The sketch was released and
Alcala's parole officer saw it. He then called the cops
and said, you know what, that sketch looks an awful
lot like this guy I have in my caseload. You
really need to go check him out. Police took the
advice and quickly tracked Alcala down. Turns out he was

(01:02:49):
living with his mother very near where he dumped Robin's
body in Monterey Park. This guy's such a loser. Alcola
could not provide an alibi for his whereabouts during the
time I'm in question, so on July twenty fourth, nineteen
seventy nine, Rodney Alkoo was arrested for the kidnap and
murder of Robin Samso and he never saw the lighted

(01:03:09):
day again. Now for killing Robin Samso, Alcala received the
death sentence in nineteen eighty Yay, But we know that
Alcala had been slippery before when he served such a
ridiculously light sentence for its violent crimes against Tali Shapiro
because the Shapiro family was out of the country during

(01:03:30):
his trial. Here too, with Robin SAMSO's trial, Alkalo was
slippery once again. I guess terrible people can have good luck.
Six years after his death sentence for killing Samso So
In nineteen eighty six, it was decided that scumbag Alcala
had received an unfair trial. His legal team argued that

(01:03:51):
the jury had been improperly told about Alcala's past sex crimes,
including the attack on Tali Shapiro, which clouded their judgment,
which lat led to an unfair verdict and therefore his
death sentence was overturned. A second trial for the kidnapping
and murder of Robin Samso was held, in which Robin's mother,
Marianne Conley had to testify and face Alcala again. She

(01:04:16):
did in the first trial. Now she's facing her child's
killer again in the second trial. Now it was later
discovered that Marianne, Robin's mother, brought a twenty five caliber
pistol to the trial. She was going to murder Alcala,
but ultimately decided against it. Now, thankfully, just justice system
work and Alkalo was found guilty a second time and

(01:04:37):
was served another death sentence. Now that a second judgment
had been handed down, with another death sentence, Rodney Alcala
had the right to appeal, and of course he did
through working appeals and the justice system in two thousand
and one, So twenty two years after he murdered Robin Samso,
a federal court of appeals overturned Alcala's death sentence again,

(01:05:02):
now for the second time, based on Alcala's claim that
he had evidence that would prove his innocence, but he
never got a chance to present it in court. This
fucker was about to get off, But while Alcala's third
trial was underway, police were working hard in the background.
It's during this time police figured out through patterns, fingerprints,

(01:05:24):
bite marks, and DNA that Alcala had in fact murdered
Joe Barkham, Georgia Wicksted, and Charlotte Lamb. They also linked
the murder of Joe Parento to him as well. Now
the police could prove Alkala was the serial murderer they
always thought him to be. In a hail Mary play.

(01:05:46):
For Alkali's third trial, California prosecutors decided to try him
for all five murders at once, that's Barkum, Wicksted, Lamb, Parento,
and Robin Samso. In this trial, Alcala acted as his
own attorney, really asking himself questions in the third person

(01:06:07):
and answering himself in a much lower, creepy voice, just
a circus show. He even called Robin SAMSO's mother to
the stand. Could you imagine being that mother being questioned
in open court by your own daughter's murderer. The ball's
on this now. The third time around, there was a
star witness, a specter from Alcala's past, Tali Shapiro. Tali

(01:06:33):
captivated the jurors by recounting her harrowing story from back
in nineteen sixty nine, what she could remember anyway, and
on February twenty fifth, twenty ten, the jury found Alcala
guilty on all five counts of capital murder, along with
one count of kidnapping and four counts of rape. Good
fuck this guy. The jury handed him another death sentence.

(01:06:56):
The judge agreed, and this time it stuck. Alkala was
sent to death row at San Quentin and then to
California State Prison Cochrane, the same prison where Charles Manson
was housed, and that's where his ass sat up until
his death on July twenty fourth, twenty twenty one, from
quote unspecified natural causes. He was seventy seven years old,

(01:07:20):
and good writtens to that piece of shit. But this
isn't the end of the story. In twenty ten, police
released online a cash of over one hundred photos of men, women,
and children seen as possible victims of Rodney Alcala. Shortly
after his final arrest on July twenty fourth, nineteen seventy nine,

(01:07:40):
for the kidnapping and murder of Robin Samso. While he
was in jail, Alkala fucked up. You see, his sister
came to see him, and while Alcala and his sister
were visiting with each other, he told her about a
storage locker he kept in Seattle, and he begged her
go to the locker, clean it out, get rid of everything.

(01:08:01):
But little did Alkala know this entire conversation was being recorded.
The police now had a hot tip, and actually, while
the police were searching his mother's house where Alkala was
staying when he murdered Robin Samso, they found a receipt
for that storage locker in Seattle. Now, the contents of
this locker is what's keeping the Alkala story alive to

(01:08:21):
this day and the new movie, of course, and what
leads investigators to believe his actual murder count is much
much higher than what he's charged for.

Speaker 1 (01:08:30):
Now we're getting there.

Speaker 3 (01:08:31):
Inside this Seattle storage locker, police found somewhere around a
thousand highly suggestive and pornographic photos of mostly women and
young girls and some little kids and a few men,
which Alcala had taken over the years. He was posing
as this fashion photographer, so.

Speaker 1 (01:08:50):
He took these personally. Oh yeah, oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:08:53):
He was mad active, I mean, this was his thing. Now.
Also in the storage locker, underneath all these illicit photos,
police found a silk bag, this little silk bag filled
of earrings. He was keeping trophies on. One set of
earrings was later proven to belong to Robin Samso, and
a second pair of earrings with tiny roses would years

(01:09:16):
later reveal Charlotte Lamb's DNA. They got this guy, I
mean lockstock Enberrel And of course Lamb was the woman
found murdered and posed in her apartment complex's laundry room
in Al Sagundo, California, back in seventy eight. Now, the
photos that could be released online are out there right now,
and they're available to view, and I'll leave a link

(01:09:37):
in the show notes to these photos. Now, listeners, please
check out the pictures and don't worry. It's nothing that'll
give you nightmares. Pg. Thirteen. At best, police hope that
by putting these photos online, someone will recognize a friend
or a loved one and alert authorities to that person's
current status. Are they alive, are they dead? Are they

(01:09:58):
in order to help identi possible additional victims. Now, of course,
Alcola didn't keep detailed records and the photos are decades
old from the seventies, mostly so the people in the
pictures are really lost to time. No names, no locations,
nothing now. So far, twenty two women have been identified
since the pictures were posted, and thankfully, twenty one of

(01:10:21):
those women are still alive. But unfortunately, a woman named
Kathy Thornton saw her missing sister among the online photos.
Through working with police and mitochondrial DNA evidence, Kathy Thornton
discovered that Alkala did in fact kill her sister, Christine Thornton,
in Wyoming in nineteen seventy seven. Christine Thornton was six

(01:10:46):
months pregnant at the time of her murder. So the
photos do work and they have revealed an additional victim.
Who knows how many people this animal really killed? Remember
he was a traveler. Now again, there's a link to
the photos in the show notes, do you recognize any
of these people? If you have information about anyone in

(01:11:07):
the photos, police asks that you contact Sergeant Sam Shepherd
with the Huntington Police Huntington Beach Police Department at seven
one four, five three six, five nine four seven. That's
Sam Shepherd seven one four, five three six, five nine
four seven. Take a look at the photos. See if
you know anybody. It's fucked up. So that's how they

(01:11:30):
get that big gap. He's got his confirmed kills, and
then this and and.

Speaker 1 (01:11:35):
Now they discover that this archive is not filled with
just dead women or dead victims, because a lot of
these are alive. So yeah, yeah, so he played up
his role just to probably make money move on. Maybe
couldn't find the right opportunity at most of these places
as well. You think of that, maybe they come with
chaperones and it's too hard.

Speaker 3 (01:11:54):
Well yeah, well that's funny because this last one, Christine Thornton,
the one who was six months pregnant at the time. Yeah,
she was kind of a wanderer, kind of a loose
spirit if you will. Her sister said sure, And she
was with a man who was abusing her and somehow
during travels Christine's and Rodney's travels. They met, Christine dumbed

(01:12:14):
her abusive boyfriend and wound up kind of traveling around
with Rodney. And the picture her sister saw online is
of Christine on a motorcycle. She's got a big smile
on her face. She looked good. Yeah, you know, she
just happened to not know who this person she happened
to be traveling with really was and fucking killed her. Wow,

(01:12:35):
that sucks, fucked up. It's this is such a such
a shitty story.

Speaker 2 (01:12:40):
Man.

Speaker 1 (01:12:40):
No, yeah, he's a piece of shit.

Speaker 3 (01:12:41):
They know.

Speaker 1 (01:12:42):
Also, he's not very smart. I'm not Stephen saying I
almost don't get me wrong, once sixty IQ not saying
not nothing. Obviously it's not.

Speaker 3 (01:12:50):
Nothing to sneeze at it at one sixty.

Speaker 1 (01:12:53):
That but uh, he made a lot of mistakes, a
lot of mistakes than not. He are really forgivable in
the seventies. DNA evidence is he is forgivable because that
that technology is invented.

Speaker 3 (01:13:10):
Yet he's that's okay, So then what's not forgivable?

Speaker 1 (01:13:15):
The brazen attitude of some of these places and victims.
He sounded like the way he acted around that girl,
like the one before he got the one before he
got captured. I forgot a name. I'm sorry. You know
what the adults saw her with her friend that gave
a good description of him.

Speaker 3 (01:13:29):
Yeah, Robin Sansu and like Wilvert.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
Yeah, like there's ways to do that.

Speaker 3 (01:13:33):
It's just fucking broad daylight, broad daylight, broad fucking daylight.

Speaker 4 (01:13:36):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:13:38):
There were other details that I forgot to exactly remember.
But he is making mistakes a lot actually, like he
is beholden and brazen, like he is too comfortable and
thinking he's getting away. But he's been cop before too,
by the way, should be said he's been caught before. Yes,
It's almost like it's almost like he feels like his

(01:13:59):
power is that he'll get away with a murder, is
that he could get a murder that he commits knocked
down to a misdemeanor. It's almost like his power is
like his charm, his whatever, his genius looks whatever. Maybe
it serves him best in the judicial system than it
does on the streets or with people on the streets,

(01:14:21):
or with potential victims or victims families. I mean, where
is this brazen that is coming from?

Speaker 3 (01:14:26):
I would hope it's not the judicial system, that's for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:14:29):
Well obviously on to at least two occasions that I'm
out when they shouldn't have one of them.

Speaker 3 (01:14:34):
And let him travel when he shouldn't have.

Speaker 1 (01:14:36):
That's a big one. That's a big one. Huge. It
just seems like a lot of stuff is more to
be to just luck. And I'm not saying charming genius
or sorry, charming cleverness don't hold hands together. They do,
but they're also two different things. I don't know. I
feel like pretty dumb for a smart guy.

Speaker 3 (01:14:57):
No, you're right, you're right, you know, maybe he's book smart.

Speaker 1 (01:15:01):
Obviously, obviously there is different kinds of you know, smart,
like you just mentioned, different kinds of whatever. I just
I don't know. I don't know this guy. There's another
thing mentioned way earlier. Yeah, and you're gonna hate You're
gonna love this because it's gonna make you scroll up again.

(01:15:22):
Well maybe not, maybe not. When you were talking earlier
on his career before he started killing about his uh,
when he turned seventeen eighteen, he went to the military, Yes,
and then he got I don't know, I assumed dishonorably discharged.
I'm not sure what you said. It doesn't matter. It
doesn't matter.

Speaker 3 (01:15:36):
I had just said discharged, discharge.

Speaker 1 (01:15:38):
I wasn't sure if it was dishonorably, but he he
had done something.

Speaker 3 (01:15:42):
So there was some sexual devency, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:15:45):
Which is not specified, which makes sense. Yeah, this could
be because it's homosexual related either get rumor or reel.
Or it could be something else like a Barrack's bunny thing,
which probably wasn't existing back then.

Speaker 3 (01:15:56):
I do, but Barrack's bunny. Yeah, there's not a lot
of talk about him being homosexual or anything.

Speaker 1 (01:16:02):
Wait.

Speaker 3 (01:16:03):
No, he did have male photo male posing for photos,
but it's never it's never explicitly said that he also
had sex with men.

Speaker 1 (01:16:12):
Yeah, because that could also be a legit shoot for money.

Speaker 3 (01:16:16):
I do think he thought he was a legitimate photographer. Yes, yeah,
some of his pictures are good. I've seen him. Some
of them are good. But it never says he was
specifically gay. So I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:16:29):
Well, I want to feel like if that's the real
first sign, right, Oh, I think definitely, And you mentioned
so right after that he I think definitely.

Speaker 3 (01:16:37):
The military thing was the first sign.

Speaker 1 (01:16:38):
He joined the arts right before he cracks and then
starts peaking and start graduate becoming the wandering serial killer.

Speaker 3 (01:16:45):
Yeah, he wandered, he graduated and correct, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
Yeah, after the military, you know, which is a short
time after but after it, after the military. I kind
of think, and again maybe this could be in the movie.
I don't know, but what it's me when you mentioned
that before he started killing, he became a wandering serial killer,
which is all the rage in the seventies.

Speaker 3 (01:17:08):
By the way, it really was.

Speaker 1 (01:17:10):
It really was. I said it as a joke, but
it's so true. Is that what if what made him
crack was a piece like a piece of art, you know,
like because like we talked about his childhood, nothing there.

Speaker 3 (01:17:27):
Really not really nothing there right now.

Speaker 1 (01:17:29):
We're we're attributing to something about the military regarding this,
But then he probably would have been disarmly discharged if
it was that bad, as opposed to like maybe not
really think so I don't think that's enough either. And
I feel like the not the not the U turn,
not the one to eighty, but the ninety degree turn
he made from his time in the arts, meaning learning

(01:17:51):
photography or whatever, into becoming a serial killer or trying
to be or killing is or trying to kill that
a young girl. Uh, I feel like, what if something
broke him artistically, because it seems like.

Speaker 3 (01:18:07):
The expand on that what it was interesting because they
say it wasn't Hitler a failed artist. He was all
depressed because he couldn't be that's a artist, and then
he moved into Public's good.

Speaker 1 (01:18:15):
Any connection I can make with Hitler is great. I
didn't think of that that's good. I mean, yeah, that
could be enough Avenue. I was thinking more like he
saw something. No, I'm not saying in his own art.

Speaker 3 (01:18:26):
Well, don't forget he was also with Polanski. He was
studying under Polanski for a while too. Well he was Oh,
that's when he went to n YU though, that's when
he went to n YU.

Speaker 1 (01:18:36):
That was after. This is when he was escaped, after
after his first attempt. Yeah, this after the breaking point,
and he probably just, I don't know, got tips on
how to talk to young girls from Plansky. Sorry not sorry,
it's true. It's true, great filmmaker, but it's goddamn he's
a piece of shit anyway. So I'm thinking like, oh, so, right,

(01:19:00):
be one thing that at the failed artist thing broke him?
Like he saw it early on. Manson Kazza has that
too with the music career and just fucking broke them
and you know, started slaking his thirst, so to speak,
his urges right instead and just going for that the
focused zero. Then it could be that which the connection

(01:19:21):
to the connective tissue to that is the way. Uh
sure what I forgot her named the dating gang girl
denied him saw Bradshaw My bad When Bradshaw denied him
could be like a second fail, you know what I mean?
Like a like you could connect those two the way
he overreacted, the way, like the way he picked his

(01:19:43):
victims from that point on, the way he kind of
showed his hand by trying something so brazen as going
on the dating game, like it knocked them down a
few notches, the way the arts thing knocked them down
a few notches. I feel like those two connect.

Speaker 3 (01:19:56):
It's interesting and that could wonder.

Speaker 1 (01:19:59):
That could be something or where I was originally thinking,
which is less likely now that I'm talking, is that
what if he saw a piece of art. I don't
know what kind of it's la right, So they have
museums to have a lot of things, They have a
lot of personal things. Students are making shit all the time.
What if he saw something that broke him, Like maybe
he saw talent way beyond what he feels he could

(01:20:19):
have done, you know, something like that, or something more personal,
he saw something that reminded him something awful about himself,
you know, something much more like this is this is
where it gets cinematic and not be realistic. But like,
what if he saw something reminded of mouth sucked up
he is and just trying it just went forward like
kind of inspired him to kill I don't know, I

(01:20:40):
kind of had that these because the way again, ninety
degree turned that one to eighty, but.

Speaker 3 (01:20:44):
To the seventies were weird time, weird time. There were
some weird shit in the seventies.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Trust me, there's no way he's never high in this decade.

Speaker 3 (01:20:50):
No, no, no way, all the time.

Speaker 1 (01:20:52):
No way, He's never not you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 3 (01:20:55):
It's uh fucking I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:20:58):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:20:59):
Yeah, I mean, what do you do when what happens
when a genius psychopath gets knocked down a few rungs? Yeah,
fuck God help.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
They usually overreact. I'm usually to get themselves caught. But
they also have a lot of damage along the way.
You know, they do a lot of carnage on the
way out.

Speaker 3 (01:21:15):
I'm saying, I can't wait to see this movie. I
can't wait to see now that I've researched this too.

Speaker 1 (01:21:18):
I hope you're not hyping up too much. I don't
know how good it's gonna be.

Speaker 3 (01:21:21):
I don't know. I don't know. That's what I'm saying,
now that I researched this thing to death, this topic,
you know, seeing the movie, I can't wait to see
what's what they talked about, what's not talked about, what's
brought up? You know. But I mean, we'll we'll let
you know what we think of the movie. Are you
gonna watch it?

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
I mean yeah, I am now, yes for sure. I
don't even know it existed until.

Speaker 3 (01:21:40):
When I heard it and Kendrick IM like, I'm watching it.
I don't even know what the fuck it was about, right,
but yep, I'm in right. Katie's like, that's that's terrible,
You're terrible.

Speaker 1 (01:21:48):
Did you see trap? She didn't.

Speaker 3 (01:21:52):
I saw her eyes peeled the entire time, didn't look
at her phone once Josh whip his ass.

Speaker 1 (01:21:58):
He was a sarracad in that movie, Whip your ass.
It was all right, that's all I got on there.

Speaker 3 (01:22:03):
Yeah, me too. Just think this guy's dead fuck him. Yeah, cheeseburger.

Speaker 1 (01:22:08):
I love how you mention that over and over. That's great.
He's actually been the motor to Hamburger.

Speaker 3 (01:22:13):
Cheese, no cheese, veggie burgery.

Speaker 1 (01:22:17):
Man, you got it, Cale Burger. Okay, we're done now.

Speaker 3 (01:22:21):
Merry Christmas listeners.

Speaker 1 (01:22:22):
Oh yes, Merry Christmas.

Speaker 3 (01:22:23):
We will see you when you see an oscar take
us home. Yeah. So Game of Thrones, that's that was

(01:23:11):
our big thing. We're watching the new Menendez show. That's
pretty good. Remember than Menendez Brothers in the early nineties.
Rich kids killed their family, killed their mom and dad.

Speaker 1 (01:23:22):
Oh I saw. I saw the thumbnail for this. I
haven't seen it. I don't know crime ship most of
the time. Oh okay, they don't give a ship.

Speaker 3 (01:23:28):
Yeah then yeah, they won't like it.

Speaker 1 (01:23:29):
Then, my god, like it. If you write it, I
gonna like. I think.

Speaker 3 (01:23:34):
What a Tulsa King stallone? Probably not interested.

Speaker 1 (01:23:37):
No, but I know that the new season's coming up
because I've been seen trailers. It's out and they finished Evil.
I was great.

Speaker 3 (01:23:43):
You like the ending.

Speaker 1 (01:23:44):
I love the end.

Speaker 3 (01:23:45):
Hated the ending? Why because nothing happened? Literally nothing happened.

Speaker 1 (01:23:49):
I mean she goes to the back, went to Rome.

Speaker 3 (01:23:51):
Yeah, but Leland's still out there kicking.

Speaker 1 (01:23:56):
Wasn't he like taking away?

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
Yeah, but you don't know what happened to him. He's gone, No,
I don't think so, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:24:02):
Well, also, like they leave it open, propose there's a
whole thing where you know, they wanted to leave things
open because they're like, well, he was never really dead.
But like there's also talking about season five now, well,
I mean that's what people are rallying for it. Well,
that's I just don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:24:15):
I just wanted more. Nothing really happened with David.

Speaker 1 (01:24:18):
He's wanted to fuck. You know, like two characters that
you ship in a show fuck. As soon as they fucked,
the show becomes uninteresting.

Speaker 3 (01:24:24):
Really, maybe you're right, Ben, what happened to Ben the Magnificent?

Speaker 1 (01:24:30):
I don't remember.

Speaker 3 (01:24:30):
I don't remember either, Like the whole thing was the
fun I.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Mean I did see this a month ago, so I
don't remember.

Speaker 3 (01:24:35):
Now, aner the whole thing.

Speaker 1 (01:24:36):
Yeah, he was saying that the man nothing happened. No,
he did something. I just remember what it was.

Speaker 3 (01:24:42):
Well, he got this job that was paying him like
three hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year, half a
million a year or something like that.

Speaker 1 (01:24:48):
That's all right, I remember that.

Speaker 3 (01:24:49):
Nothing that was like, oh this is great, we invested
all this time and there's a payoff. Well, I didn't
feel like there was a payoff.

Speaker 1 (01:24:56):
Well, I think he's the truth skeptic right of the show.
Who yeah, I mean if he starts believing out of nowhere,
I would have not found that believable either.

Speaker 3 (01:25:07):
He was coming close.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
Yeah, he was close for sure. So what else?

Speaker 3 (01:25:14):
Movies? What movies did we see? We Trap?

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
I love Trap?

Speaker 3 (01:25:18):
Trap is okay? Trap?

Speaker 1 (01:25:19):
I mean I can no, no, I'll tell you it's
a terrible movie. I love it. It's awful. I didn't
have so many mistakes.

Speaker 3 (01:25:26):
I didn't think it was awful.

Speaker 1 (01:25:27):
Why people say it's awful and every time they give up,
you know, like this is awful and this is up,
Like I totally buy it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
We understand what were some examples.

Speaker 1 (01:25:34):
Which are so many things in the movie is so unrealistic.
It's so unreal it's so laughably unrealistic. But I had
so much fun with attention that I didn't care and
I loved it was But like and in the high
water mark, being like they let him hug his daughter
at the end, or let him fix the bike off

(01:25:54):
the lawn, like why why has he not any police
escort on the way to the wise alone? It's so dumb.
I get it, it's dumb. I had a blast.

Speaker 3 (01:26:04):
Though that that's the least of my worries.

Speaker 1 (01:26:06):
Yeah, but there's a lot of ship like tim saying.

Speaker 3 (01:26:08):
So it's night shamala emending though.

Speaker 2 (01:26:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:26:10):
Right, So I was waiting for that twist. Man, I'm
waiting for the twist, and I'm like, okay, no.

Speaker 1 (01:26:15):
It's not really twisted. The twisty thing is that you
find out that well, that could be a twisty thing,
but no, I was the only real twisty thing in
the movie is that I thought the movie was going
to take place entirely on the concert and then they
moved away. They have a fourth act on the at
the house, and yeah, that was cool. I didn't expect it.

Speaker 3 (01:26:32):
Oh see, I didn't consider that a twist.

Speaker 1 (01:26:33):
No, that's not twisted. Neither is the wife thing that she's.

Speaker 3 (01:26:37):
The one who found the ticket and turned it in
and blah blah blah.

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
I mean, I guess it kind of plays twist.

Speaker 3 (01:26:42):
But not a Shyamalan twist.

Speaker 1 (01:26:43):
No, no, not a temon.

Speaker 3 (01:26:45):
So my whole thing was I was having fun with
it because everything fell into place for Josh Hart and
it's character.

Speaker 1 (01:26:53):
To a tee.

Speaker 3 (01:26:54):
Every single time, every a door opens, a card just
happens to be laying there. The apron that he stole
happens to have a wall in it, and oh, there's
the secret card that we were given, you know, at
the debriefing, and you know, he meets the black dude
who gives him the word.

Speaker 1 (01:27:10):
I think the worst of that every time you do
on the radio. He had perfect information for there hed
it that was like the word.

Speaker 3 (01:27:16):
So I was like, Okay, this is so outlandish. This
has to be part of the twist. That the twist
is he's writing or not.

Speaker 1 (01:27:22):
That's why you thought it was just okay, because you
thought it was building into something. You're giving m I
too much writerly credit. He doesn't care about that.

Speaker 3 (01:27:28):
Well, back in the early two thousands, that's or late nineties,
that's what he was.

Speaker 1 (01:27:32):
Well in the late nineties, we also had shittier movies.
I think we were just like so used to a
certain kind of movies. And we're so used to different
kinds of movies.

Speaker 3 (01:27:39):
Now, when was Shemelin's Heyday?

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
Early? Two thousands?

Speaker 3 (01:27:44):
Early?

Speaker 1 (01:27:44):
Okay, because ineteen ninety nine was with six Sense came out?

Speaker 3 (01:27:47):
Okay, there are two thousand, it's right. So yeah, all
those twists were like mind blowing.

Speaker 1 (01:27:51):
Mane because we're also dumber as cinema cinema goals. Maybe
we'll tell you we were. I'll tell you we were,
and think about the best movies of that era and
how dumb they are if you look back at him,
so dumb, so many errors were. We're used much more
sophisticated plotting. We're not great at the emotion stuff. The
nights are much better at that, but we're so much
better at plotting stuff, making things sense, making things tension.

(01:28:14):
We're so much better at that now, something that m
Night was the grandfather of. But that not so much anymore.
We just had so many better, wow, more tightly packed stuff.
But he also doesn't care about that. He likes the shlockiness.
He likes being kind of like Scream, the first Scream,
kind of like being a slasher. I know it's not
a slasher, but like he likes being in that way.

(01:28:35):
I think I personally think he needs a partner to
settle him down so you can write a little better,
Because you're right, his dieg is not great. I hate
he puts himself in the movies. I don't like any
of this stuff. Well well I hate it and a
few times it makes the movie worse. Not always, but
and then but and with with Trap, it's like I

(01:28:55):
just felt I just like like I was.

Speaker 3 (01:28:57):
In the mood you know it was. Or there's another one, yeah,
Josh Harten and all these twenty thousand people, he just
happens to turn around and there's the Brad's uncle and
it happens to be m Night.

Speaker 1 (01:29:09):
Yeah, that's another thing.

Speaker 3 (01:29:10):
He's like, oh, hey, my daughter was dying.

Speaker 2 (01:29:12):
She's not.

Speaker 3 (01:29:12):
Oh why don't you come backstage? So watching the movie
with this in mind, where okay, this is so outlanded.

Speaker 1 (01:29:18):
What would be the reason though, what like this twist
that you.

Speaker 3 (01:29:21):
Are I don't know, Like the guy's fucking laid up
in the hospital or it's m Night right in the
book and this is in his mind or whatever it is,
there's some big reveal if that was gonna hatch Why
all these things just wanting to fall into place.

Speaker 1 (01:29:33):
I would have bought a table just to flip it.

Speaker 3 (01:29:35):
During the movie I was in. I was watching it.
I was like, oh yeah, this is cool. Something thing's
gonna happen.

Speaker 1 (01:29:40):
This makes no I mean the biggest thing was a nepotism.

Speaker 3 (01:29:43):
Oh yeah, yeah, who was I forgot a name. Someone
told me that it's like a commercial for his daughter.

Speaker 1 (01:29:49):
It's like, yeah, oh no, it is.

Speaker 3 (01:29:51):
That's her.

Speaker 1 (01:29:53):
M Shaymon's daughter is the singer the Lady, and she
wants to be a pop idol singer in real life.

Speaker 3 (01:29:58):
Oh she does.

Speaker 1 (01:29:58):
And those are her real songs that you listen to
the whole movie. So you're listening to an album for
free or for the move for a price.

Speaker 3 (01:30:05):
Of a movie.

Speaker 1 (01:30:05):
He's like, good, you know what I'm saying. I guess
so he's trying to help her. It wasn't Oh no,
I don't know anything about pop music. I didn't care either.
I'm just saying that's a super movie. I'm just saying
it's very blatant.

Speaker 3 (01:30:17):
Yeah, oh one hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:30:18):
That's all I mean. I don't think it's terrible. Like whatever,
you have power, go do it, you have money, go
do it.

Speaker 3 (01:30:23):
What I would do it with my kid. But after
anything was done and I realized, hey, there's no twist here.
Now none of this ship makes sense, and I was angry.

Speaker 1 (01:30:34):
See I was fine with it not making sense in
the moment, and I was like, let's just go with
it because I wasn't hoping for a big twist.

Speaker 3 (01:30:41):
I guess, so there was a difference I was waiting.

Speaker 1 (01:30:43):
Or at least the twist I was hoping for had
nothing to do with why the movie's written badly. I
mean I like that and some of that stuff was
cool though, like when he pushes that girl to see
the reaction of the cops and they don't move because
they have other cops to do that, so they're not
going to move from the entrance so he can't escape.
I'm like, that's a cool move. That's a cool time.
I think the way he talks his way out of
the cops when he's like when they're doing a briefing

(01:31:05):
thing and he gets in there like, oh the sugar
down here, Like I thought that was cool too. The
way he acts some good moments, great moments. But yeah,
overall the movies also super silly. No cop on the planet,
whatever stage a trap on this magnitude nothing well nothing,
The concept is so ridiculous.

Speaker 3 (01:31:21):
It's all off of a ticket stub.

Speaker 1 (01:31:24):
A dumb ass ticket stuf that that I mean that.
I guess that may explain why it felt like a
twist when you find out the wife did it, because
that comes back later. But yeah, it's a dumb reason.
Why would they think that it's not enough? Also with
the point in that, because we review on the show,
the point of the thing we argued about the most
was I was pissed that we didn't get enough of
the f pive profiler because they were making her off

(01:31:46):
to be like the super smart person, but we get
no evidence of that, And I really wanted to know
what would they have asked at the entrances that kept
Josh Harten is so scared to be questioned, and like
if he just showed us a little bit of that
intelligence by these well, I would have bought into it more.
I was like, that's is one of the clients I had.

Speaker 3 (01:32:06):
Well, especially because that profiler is a famous actress from
the Hayley Mills from the Parent Parent Trip. Yeah, I
mean that's who.

Speaker 1 (01:32:16):
Are you texting people? Everyone go to sleep?

Speaker 3 (01:32:19):
Well, I hear the chair it was like almost the
same exact title, right, so we're like, oh my god,
it's like Downar ninety nine on vod or whatever. Let's
rent it. Okay, it was the worst B movie, piece
of shit. They completely just took advantage of the name.

Speaker 1 (01:32:34):
That's how they get you.

Speaker 3 (01:32:35):
And we were so mad. So now it's out and
so I'm going to get that one. That what else?
Horror wise?

Speaker 1 (01:32:44):
Nothing I told you about this great movie. I tested
you about it. Oddity.

Speaker 3 (01:32:48):
Oh we did see Oddity?

Speaker 1 (01:32:49):
Did you like it? It was okay? Okay, movie man,
I love that movie.

Speaker 3 (01:32:54):
Really.

Speaker 1 (01:32:55):
Everything paid off about it. Everything was perfectly set up
from the very beginning. Everything worked out. There's no like
loose thread in the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:33:01):
You didn't want to see more than dummy.

Speaker 1 (01:33:03):
No, we got enough.

Speaker 3 (01:33:04):
Really Yeah, just sitting there.

Speaker 1 (01:33:06):
I think working detention. I think I feel like, whatever
the budget was, maybe they couldn't show it with us
looking too hokey. I feel like like the Jaws effect,
the less you show, the more horroring it is. So
I felt like it was fine that way. It is
technically an indie movie, so, like you know, they probably
couldn't do.

Speaker 3 (01:33:22):
A whole lot.

Speaker 1 (01:33:23):
We didn't know, and if they and if they had
to ceg the whole thing, it might have looked funny.

Speaker 2 (01:33:28):
Humm.

Speaker 1 (01:33:29):
You know, I liked that it was sitting there, It
was real there, it was tactile. For me. It was
enough for me.

Speaker 3 (01:33:34):
Yeah, okay, so I guess for me it wasn't. Everyone
was saying it's the scariest movie of the year, it's
the best movie.

Speaker 1 (01:33:40):
I'm not saying that, but I I thought it was
pretty creepy.

Speaker 3 (01:33:42):
Yeah, I guess maybe, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:33:44):
I just I mean that whole thing with the sister
and jump, don't open the door or that was that was?
I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:33:49):
Scene the crazy Eye. Ye, yeah, we saw it. I didn't.
I liked it when I watched it again.

Speaker 1 (01:33:55):
No, I wouldn't.

Speaker 3 (01:33:56):
But yeah, what else? What other horror?

Speaker 4 (01:34:01):
Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:34:01):
I mean I actually looked in my been watching.

Speaker 2 (01:34:05):
So much?

Speaker 1 (01:34:10):
All right, So I did see Fidoh. I saw Zombie
Flash Shooters, but that's from seventy nine. I saw Never
Let Go With.

Speaker 3 (01:34:20):
How was it?

Speaker 1 (01:34:22):
It was okay?

Speaker 3 (01:34:23):
It looked the previews look really good.

Speaker 1 (01:34:24):
No, it asked retty good tension. It has really good scenes.

Speaker 3 (01:34:27):
Watchers that was a while ago. I saw Watchers for
some reason that movie reminded me of Watchers, both in the.

Speaker 1 (01:34:34):
Forest I can't leave this also both in the forest
and the forest. Uh yeah, I like that movie too.
I say, Never Let Go is I think better film,
like better made, but I think it falls apart with
the ending. I don't think I liked.

Speaker 3 (01:34:51):
It really, I liked it. I liked I liked Watchers.

Speaker 1 (01:34:54):
No, I'm in Never Let Go. No, No, I like,
you know, the Watches was more even the whole time.
It was like even, Yeah, it was cool, Like the
whole thing with the Ferio is cool. Yeah, let's see.
I saw The Last Stop in Newma County is not
a horror, but that's a very good movie. Really, it's
like a crime movie. I guess, uh almost entire movie.

(01:35:14):
He's based in this like shitty diner in the middle
of nowhere. It's about this guy who is putt is going,
uh stops at this diners thatched to a gas station.
He wants to put gas in it, but they don't
have any gas. They're waiting for the truck. The truck
is late, and they gave if you want to wait
to go into the diner. Right And as he's waiting,
there's chatting up with the waitress there. All these people

(01:35:36):
start coming in, including uh and you said you hear
on the radio that earlier in the morning a bank
was robbed, like a bank robbery, and the bank robbers
need gas and they stop in the diner, right, and
they get found out, so they start kid, you know,
having people hostage until the gas truck arrives. And it's
just a mountain tension that just keeps tension, tension, tensine

(01:35:57):
until the ending. I'm not gonna spoil it, but that's
a very good movie.

Speaker 3 (01:36:00):
It's a new one.

Speaker 1 (01:36:01):
Yeah, well, well a few months ago. But yeah, I
did see Spaceman. Forgot about that spaceman that's uh, what's
his name?

Speaker 3 (01:36:10):
The Mexican dude.

Speaker 1 (01:36:11):
No, there was a space with No you think of
a sling shot. Maybe not.

Speaker 3 (01:36:19):
He he's been in a ton of stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:36:21):
I don't know his spaceman is with uh a little nikky?
Was this guy's name Adam Sandler?

Speaker 3 (01:36:27):
Oh, with a big spider.

Speaker 1 (01:36:29):
Yes, I didn't like that movie. You didn't like it?

Speaker 3 (01:36:31):
I did not?

Speaker 1 (01:36:31):
Oh? I did like it?

Speaker 3 (01:36:33):
Did I love it? I guess I just missed the
whole prime. I guess I just missed the point. Maybe
oh maybe I was tired. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:36:38):
I did not like I enjoyed that one. Who are
you thinking of though?

Speaker 3 (01:36:43):
It's a I can't think of it, And now, of
course I can't think of a movie that the hispanic
dude's been in.

Speaker 1 (01:36:49):
That's funny. I did see Blink twice.

Speaker 3 (01:36:53):
Blink twice.

Speaker 1 (01:36:53):
That was good. Is it might still be in theaters.

Speaker 3 (01:36:57):
I'm not sure who's who's in that.

Speaker 1 (01:37:03):
Shot. Quat that's her name.

Speaker 3 (01:37:05):
I know I've heard of Bling twice.

Speaker 1 (01:37:07):
Channing Tatum is the bigger name in that movie.

Speaker 3 (01:37:10):
He takes him off to the island.

Speaker 1 (01:37:11):
Yes, that's the movie.

Speaker 3 (01:37:12):
It was good, very good. Really.

Speaker 1 (01:37:15):
A lot of people are not hailing it, talking about
like Irreverend, like, oh my god, there's this crazy, fucking
like traumatic rape scene or I saw it. It's not
that traumatic, okay, but also I've seen way worse. So
like I thought it was pretty tame, Like I thought
it was, not that it has to be amazing, but
people were talking about it as if it were I'm like, guys,
come on, I've seen compliance. Not that that shows it either,

(01:37:39):
but that felt worse. M No, but Bulling Toys was
a very cool, very cool movie, very cool again and
it's like it is a horror kind of thriller stuff,
but it's also very like it's funny along the way.
It doesn't try to be just one genre. It tries
to like kind of be fun with it cool. Strange, Darling, guys,
when that comes out on already watched it. Strange. Don't

(01:38:01):
even read into it unless you know the better. This
is literally a spoiler if you know one thing, like,
that's an amazing movie. We view that movie took. Yeah,
this is a show strange. Listen to the show.

Speaker 3 (01:38:15):
Have you seen Cuckoo?

Speaker 1 (01:38:16):
I did say Cuckoo?

Speaker 3 (01:38:17):
What did you think was good?

Speaker 1 (01:38:18):
I thought it was good, not great? Though, where's Cuckoo
on here?

Speaker 2 (01:38:22):
Damn?

Speaker 3 (01:38:24):
That's out now too? We want to rent that one.

Speaker 1 (01:38:25):
Oh, you know what, that's so funny. I never added
Cuckoo to my list of things I watched.

Speaker 3 (01:38:30):
M Have you seen have you heard about this? Milk
and Cereal?

Speaker 4 (01:38:35):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:38:35):
What's that?

Speaker 3 (01:38:35):
Did I text you about it? Milk and Cereal? It's
a movie on YouTube. It was done for like eight
hundred bucks. And you know now they're saying this kid
who directed, he's a comedian, he's a comedy. He made
it big on YouTube with comedy skits, but now he's
into directing horror short films and things for YouTube and

(01:38:58):
Milk and Cereal. It was really fucking good for eight
hundred bucks fro an eight hundred dollars budget with these
guys were able to pull off. And now, I mean
it's got the attention of like everybody people in Hollywood.
You know, they're milk and cereal and it's cereal like
Serial Killer with s c R I A L.

Speaker 1 (01:39:14):
Milk Cereal. Mom.

Speaker 3 (01:39:16):
Yeah, yeah, it's very good. It's very good. Watch our
our ish that goes back quick? Oh well everything htes
Oh God, Jesus take the wheel.

Speaker 1 (01:39:36):
I see demons.

Speaker 3 (01:39:39):
I'm just gonna let's start there. Okay, let's do this.

Speaker 1 (01:39:47):
Five was that n this cage and gone sixty seconds?

Speaker 3 (01:39:52):
Well I can see him he's doing something like that.

Speaker 1 (01:39:54):
Yeah, yeah, he doesn't. Gone second, Let's do this, Let's
go or something like that. Five four three two

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}EPISODE 159: The Dating Game Killer

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EPISODE 159: The Dating Game Killer

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