February 2, 2025 • 22 mins
I sat down with Aniekeme Umoh, Founder of Aniekeme Admissions Consulting and a Wharton MBA graduate. We dived into her controversial take on imposter syndrome and discussed why getting an MBA isn't always the answer to career challenges. As someone who was once told she wouldn't get into a top business school, Aniekeme now helps others navigate the MBA admissions process, including one client who went from being rejected by five schools to getting accepted to all five with $250,000 in scholarships. We wrapped up with a powerful message about reframing the concept of "quitting" as an act of self-respect and empowerment.
https://aniekeme.com/
https://www.ahyianaangel.com/
https://aniekeme.com/
https://www.ahyianaangel.com/
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is amazing media production.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Hello, hello everyone, We are here today for another episode
of the Switch privoter Quip podcast. I'm your host, Ayana Angel,
and we're here to discuss career choices through a personal
and professional lens.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
I've made my own.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Switch privot e quip, going from sports entertainment PR to
a traditionally published author via Simon and Schuster. So I
chat with people to help you make informed decisions, to
let you know that you're not alone in your career
choices that you are trying to make and your feelings,
and so I just want to let you know that
I see you, we see you in these conversations are
(00:47):
to serve you.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So today we are going to.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Be speaking with Nackamey. No, I hope I said it right.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I said, god, I even know that.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Yeah, oh gosh, because I know how it is when
people mess up your name, and I don't get super offended.
But I'm always like, if you make an effort to
get it right, I appreciate that. So I try to
make an effort to get it right. So Anka May
is the founder and lead NBA Admissions Consultant at ankame
Emissions Consulting. What does that do, you might ask. She
(01:22):
helps people to get into NBA programs with their application process,
and so I thought that was a very interesting thread
because so many people when they're trying to figure out
if they want to make a switch Privotal quick, they're thinking,
maybe I have to go back to school, and that's
the answer to all my problems.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So a Neka may, welcome to switch Privotal quick.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Yeah, I have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
I am as well. I am as well.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
So obviously, if you're helping people get their NBA, you've
gotten your NBA. That's correct, right, Okay? From Wharton Business School.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yes, so I graduated from my MBA from Wharton.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
So before we get to Wharton, what was your first
entry into the corporate world. What was that experience like
for you, Like, what kind of impact did it make
on you? What thoughts or feelings did it leave you with.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I'll have to take a step back to give context
to the experience. I had my first corporate job. So
I'm Nigeria and I was born and raised.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Then I moved to the US to go to college.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
I went to Columbia for undergrad and after I graduated,
I went into consulting, very specifically technology consulting at one
of the Big four companies. And if you work at
a Big four, you're familiar. You know that it is massive.
Up to hundreds of thousands of people in this firm,
and then Ashley, it's massive.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
These are massive firms.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
That was my first corporate experience. So I was working
as a consultant, and it's really interesting. I was in
a practice, one of the smaller practices that was program
and portfolio management. So right after college, I was managing
projects where I was like managing quote unquote directors and
partners and senior managers. So it was a very interesting dynamic,
(03:13):
and of course I had like directors who were guiding
me and supervising me and all that. What I took
out from that or the experience, how it influenced me
was one key thing that I like to call out
from that entire time. I spent three years at this
consulting firm before I went to business school for my MBA,
and this firm really indexed on coaching and mentorship. And
(03:39):
as someone who I gave the context, I'm international. The
corporate culture already can be a shock to the system
for a young career professional. For me, as someone who
did not grow up in the American culture, it was
an additional shock to the system. There's ways that you communicate,
there's ways that you network, there's ways that you advocate
(04:01):
for yourself that were so new to me. And having
a coach guide me and care about my process and
check in with me consistently and challenge me was critical
and that really molded the experience that I had while
I was there.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
When you say challenge you, I think sometimes that can
feel intimidating for people. People don't want to be critiqued.
They don't want to be told what they're not doing right.
How did you approach the idea of being challenged? Did
you welcome it?
Speaker 3 (04:38):
You're so right, it's difficult to take constructive criticism or
negative feedback if the relationship you have is not safe.
The container of the relationship has to be secure for
you to be able to adequately and like comfortably receive feedback.
And I will shout out my coach Fernando like I
(05:00):
I have so much love.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
And respect for him.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Honestly, I talk about the experience that I had with
him a lot because it was. He did an amazing
job as a coach. He created a relationship where I
felt safe. I felt like he cared for me, and
he was challenging me not to hurt me, but because
he really wanted.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Me to go and he would challenge me. He'd asked
me to do things that scared the shit out of me.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Tell us about one of those things, Like.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
I said, this is a massive company, right, a massive firm.
I was working in the New York office and the heads,
like the global heads of the firm have offices in
New York. My coach told me this was I was
what twenty two?
Speaker 4 (05:45):
He said, they need to know who you are. So
here's what you're gonna do.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You and Kemer are gonna go walk into their office,
no meeting, no appointment, Just walk in, introduce yourself, say
a little bit about you saying you're here to introduce yourself.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
That's it.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
And I kid you not And I did it. I
mean it was scary, but like because I knew he
expected that of me, Like, you wouldn't have asked me to.
Speaker 4 (06:12):
Do that if you didn't think I could. If he
thought that that was the thing I could do. Okay, fun,
but it was really scary.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
But that was one like challenge, one example of him
like challenging me.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Do you remember the moment before you walked into that
executive's office, like how you were feeling what you had
to do or tell yourself in order to like go
through it. I feel like my legs would have felt heavy,
my breathing would have been likely really shallow.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
I don't remember. I will say the partners that were
really kind. I think it just took them by surprise.
But also like the culture of that firm, great people
are just really nice, but it took them by surprise,
and so they were really welcoming, like, Okay, it's so
nice to meet you.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Oh that is amazing. I love that child challenge. I'm
sure you didn't love it as your twenty two year
old self, but now having something like that under your belt,
it's almost like I could walk into any room, in
any space and be Okay, oh yeah, you have this
challenging mentor slash coach. You're working at this firm for
(07:18):
three years. What is the thing that sparks that says
I need to go to business school.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
I had always wanted to go to business school. I
took the GM at right after I graduated from college,
so I could have my school ready to go when
I was ready to apply. This is something that I
had wanted for a long time, and I wanted to
go to business school for the sake of business school.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
At the time, I.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Felt like I would become a different person based on
the experience that I had there. I didn't know what
that would be, but I knew that it would like
I would develop in a way that I wanted to.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
As far as.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Timing with business school, you need a minimum of two
years to be competitive in the applicant pool. I applied
when I had two years of experience. I was like,
I'm ready to go.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
Let's go, Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
I've been waiting for this moment.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Yeah, So I applied then.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
And the timing reason was, you know, I really wanted
to go at the time, As I said, I'm international.
There was also like visa concentuations. I wanted to make
sure that I was in school in case I didn't
get the lottery for the work visa.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
So now you've transitioned into helping other people, and I
feel like, in familiarizing myself with your story, a part
of that was because you were made to believe that
it wasn't going to be really realistic for you to
get into one of the top business schools based off
of your experience at the time. Talk to us a
little bit about how you help other people shut down
(08:47):
those criticisms or those limiting beliefs that are imposed by
other people about what you can and can't do when
it comes to business school.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
The impetus for me starting to practice was when I
was applying. Like I said, I was younger, I had
two years of work experience, and I was referred to
a senior admissions consultant to one of the more established firms,
and she essentially told me to not even bother, replying
that I wouldn't get into a top school. And now
(09:16):
that I'm in the business, having been in it, now
I understand the risk of taking on someone that you're
not one hundred percent confident you can get in because
there's numbers and metrics, and those are success factors that
firms used to advertise their services, right, So I understand,
I get it.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
But I went on and applied.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
I was supported by an incredible female coach through that
process who believed in me and understood my background. I
knew that I actually was a strong candidate, and sometimes
it just takes someone to actually take more time to
look at what you're presenting them with and to want
to take a chance on you. My favorite story that
(09:56):
I tell is there was someone who I was working
with who had applied to five schools a year prior
and was rejected from all five. Then we worked together
and he got into all five of the new schools
that he applied to, and these were all top schools,
and he got over two hundred and fifty thousand dollars
in scholarships. When that happened, I was like, wait, okay,
Because I had been helping people, I hadn't done it
in a formal way till then, and it made me
(10:19):
realize I really have something here and I can help people,
especially people who feel like it's not possible for them.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
If people are thinking that business school is their way
out or their way to the next theme, it's the
answer to solve all their problems, what would you say
to that, I would.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Say, take a step back and let's examine if that
belief is true, because business school can change the trajectory
of your career in your life. That is facts but
sometimes it's not what you need. And so to believe
that if you don't go to business school like your
career is crippled, that's a limited belief. And it all
(11:00):
really just depends on the context of your career, your industry,
your goals is holistic. The other thing that I really
would like to share here is the fact that business
school is a massive financial commitment. So unless you're certain
of the return that you expect to get, you have
to just take the decision really seriously because you're investing
(11:24):
not just a lot of money, but a lot of time.
If you're doing a two year program, that's lost income
for two years. I will say there are a lot
of pivots and switches that can be made without going
to business school. But when business school does make sense.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Yeah, jeez, I hate to break up a good conversation
with an ad break, but that's what we gotta do.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
A girl's got to pay the bills, right.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
It's a whole type for me, and we'll be right
back before you know it. Is there a characteristic or
maybe a couple characteristics that stand out to you in
terms of someone who is a good fit for going
to business school. No, Okay, that's I was just very
(12:10):
curious about that and that I love it just straight now.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
Because it all depends. Everyone's story is different, everyone's why
is different. There isn't a cookie kuta this person. Most
people think, Okay, a lot of bankers, a lot of
consultants go to business school, And that is true. It's
part is ingrained in the career progression for years now.
That is not that's not exhaustive of the profile of
(12:33):
business school applicants and candidates.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
What's something that you're extremely opinionated about right now?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
So I was literally I was just on a panel
recently and one of the things I was asked on
the panel, you know, what is your take on imposter syndrome?
And I have a very strong opinion on imposter syndrome.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
My take, I believe that imposter syndrome is a limiting
belief label. I believe that anyone's feelings of anxiety and nervousness,
questioning are all valid. But to take a term imposter syndrome,
which is so intense, imposter a fraud, someone who's trying
to defraud others, like actively syndrome, Like the word is
(13:17):
too intense for something that millions of people experience and
is truly a normal part of doing something.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
New or being in a new environment.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
The problem that I have, in addition to what I
just said about imposter syndrome is when you have a label,
sometimes it becomes so sticky that you're not able to
move away from it, Whereas if you put the label
aside for a second and then address the actual feelings
that you have and you can actually then use like
practical tips and practical tactics to address them, then you're
(13:53):
able to move forward like you have imposters to do. Oh,
my imposter syndrome is acting up as you've taken ownership
of it. It's sticky, like it's locked you in this place.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
No, no, don't need it.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Oh, in the midst of all your accomplishments, is there
anything that you feel like maybe you still struggle with Oh?
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah, of course we want to know.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
So on things I'm working on right now is being
able to structure the practice, not the coaching of it,
but like the operations and the back end of it
in such a way that as it grows, I'm able
to bring admins and like additional people on so that
we can scale properly, and I know that I'm struggling
(14:38):
with it because I see people who are just like
this is just easy peasy, But I need steps, like
I need to try things out and structure it based
on how it's like working in my brain. So it
takes a bit more time sometimes, but yeah, I'm excited
to get to the point where I can do it
like more automatedly. So yeah, that's something I'm working on.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
I still struggle with is there any personal strength that
you feel like you've identified for yourself that has helped
you to get to where you are today.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
I draw my strength from God, so started with that,
and then the source empowered me with specific things, so
I can tell you like some strength. People who know
me will say that I'm resilient, and I would agree
with that. I'm also an ambeavert, so I can be
very extroverted. I can make friends with almost anybody, and
that is a core strength and a core part of
(15:29):
my personality. But I'm also able to draw back and
dig really deep into the.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
Details of work.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
And so the way that then works as a strength
is I'm able to create meaningful content and meaningful work,
and I'm able to share it and promote it in
a way that the people who need it can find it.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You do a lot on LinkedIn.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Tell us a little bit about what role LinkedIn plays
for you, and maybe did you just start gravitating to
LinkedIn or is that something that you've been dabbling with
but gotten stronger lately. Like talk to us a little
bit about LinkedIn and that being sort of like because
it seems to me that is your platform of choice.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
You know what's funny is I.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Used to have a lot of anxiety about posting on LinkedIn,
like a lot of discomfort. I used to feel really
uncomfortable about it. And then when I relaunched the practice
for this application cycle, I relaunched with a bunch.
Speaker 4 (16:26):
Of guides and sharing the story all of that.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
So I had spent weeks kind of prepping for that launch,
and I posted the very first launch post on LinkedIn
and it got over one hundred thousand impressions, and the
one after that got even more impressions, and I was like, wait, okay,
And that's the thing. I think a little bit of
success helps to resolve some of your anxiety and give
(16:51):
you a little bit of confidence. So when I saw
that It made sense also because I do NBA admissions
consulting those clients.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
They live on LinkedIn.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It's professional platform, so it makes sense that it resonates
that way. But it was not always like that for me,
Like LinkedIn was one of those oh my gosh, she
can't even have to do this.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I'm glad you got on the other side of that.
And like you said, sometimes when you see some traction
with something, it makes it feel like, Okay, maybe that's
not so bad, you know, or maybe I should try more.
It gets you excited, like, Okay, what can I do
if I did more? I love that for you. That's
so good. Ooh, I know it's getting good, but we'll
(17:29):
be right back after we.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
Hear from our sponsors.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
You recently did a TED talk and it was called
finding a Story to Believe in. If someone is trying
to formulate their story, what are some things that come
to mind for you in terms of how someone can
grab a hold of their story, because sometimes it's hard.
You know, all the pieces and everything is swirling around
(17:57):
for you, it's hard to narrow it down into something
a bit more concise and digestible for someone else.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yeah, the answer to that kind of depends on the
context in which you're trying to tell the story, right.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Okay, So first it's who's your audience you're telling the
story too, okay?
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Correct?
Speaker 1 (18:13):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (18:14):
And then the second is what do you want to
tell them?
Speaker 4 (18:17):
Not from a specific perspective, like what do you want
to leave with them? So what's the goal of Is
this a promotion? Is this an MB education?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Is this storytelling and social media so that people can
do something in particular.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
That needs to be super clear?
Speaker 3 (18:31):
And then three, and this gets into the meat of
then figuring it out for yourself is to be able
to tell an effective story, you need to do a
lot of reflection. And in order to do really good reflection,
you need to ask yourself the right questions.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
You have to have questions to ask yourself when you
do that process.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
I won't give question examples because it also like really
depends on the context, right, But when you've put yourself
in a position where you're now asking yourself questions and
you're seeing what the answers are, you can start to
look for connecting threads in those responses, and that thread
will likely connect to your number one and number two
(19:08):
responses of who the audience is and what you want
them to take out of it, And that's how you
connect and tell a coherent story, because otherwise you can
just start talking and then you're telling a story, but like,
what are you telling it to? What do you want
them to get out of it? And once the thread
that ties it all together.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Mm hm, you can tell a whole story and they're like, okay,
so what does all that mean? I love your storytelling ability,
but what am I supposed to do with it? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (19:37):
That makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
So as we wrap up, is there anything burning on
your heart that you wanted to scream from the rooftops
but you just haven't had a chance to do it
yet about maybe careers, what people are doing right or wrong,
or maybe about switching careers any of that. Is there
anything burning on your chest to share?
Speaker 4 (20:00):
If this is not burning or my chest?
Speaker 3 (20:01):
But you've asked, and I just I don't want to
leave your question on answering. One of the things that
I'm asked about, or like people struggle with, is staying
in a role or a job longer than they need
to be, or when they know that they want to
leave because of the word quit and the connotations around
it in a similar vein to imposter syndrome. It's the
(20:23):
way you think about it, the mindset behind it. Quitting
honestly is a powerful decision. It is an empowered action.
So for if anyone needed to hear this, of course
you're considering your options, but if you're being held back
because oh my gosh, you don't want to look like
a quitter, no, like quitting is power, quitting is respecting yourself.
If you're quitting for the right reason, just wanted to
(20:45):
leave with that.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Yes, oh, I talked about that on the Quit Playing
Swap podcast. Because we have this negative connotation around quitting,
Quitting equates to failure in some people's minds. It makes
you feel like I couldn't achieve, or I had to
fall short, or I stopped short of something. But really,
like you said, it's an empowering decision. It's you sometimes
(21:08):
choosing yourself over other people, over other circumstances. It's you saying, actually,
this doesn't work for me anymore, and so this is
the decision that I have to make next. And it's
not quitting haphazardly and just like on a whim, No,
it's being strategic about it and strategically thinking about what
works for you.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
So I'm so glad that you.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Bought that up. Thank you, thank you, Yes, and that
can make This has been a great conversation. Thank you
for all of your insights around just how we can
move forward in terms of our careers, if we're thinking
about maybe going towards an NBA and also getting us
in check with our imposter syndrome.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
I got love it.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Yes, yes, Thank you so much for spending time with us.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
This was a wonderful conversation of course, and as always
you guys, I appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
All spending time with us.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Go and check out and let them know where they
can check you out and your website and whatnot.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
Is a KMA dot com a n I E K
E M E dot com. My social media is also
a KMA, so you can find me on LinkedIn. You
can find me on Instagram at a nake. You can
also find me on YouTube. I'd be active on YouTube
as well. Yay yay oh on Twitter too, is I
(22:28):
love it?
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Thank you guys so much for joining us, and as always,
be well
This is amazing media production.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Hello, hello everyone, We are here today for another episode
of the Switch privoter Quip podcast. I'm your host, Ayana Angel,
and we're here to discuss career choices through a personal
and professional lens.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
I've made my own.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Switch privot e quip, going from sports entertainment PR to
a traditionally published author via Simon and Schuster. So I
chat with people to help you make informed decisions, to
let you know that you're not alone in your career
choices that you are trying to make and your feelings,
and so I just want to let you know that
I see you, we see you in these conversations are
(00:47):
to serve you.
Speaker 1 (00:48):
So today we are going to.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Be speaking with Nackamey. No, I hope I said it right.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I said, god, I even know that.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Yeah, oh gosh, because I know how it is when
people mess up your name, and I don't get super offended.
But I'm always like, if you make an effort to
get it right, I appreciate that. So I try to
make an effort to get it right. So Anka May
is the founder and lead NBA Admissions Consultant at ankame
Emissions Consulting. What does that do, you might ask. She
(01:22):
helps people to get into NBA programs with their application process,
and so I thought that was a very interesting thread
because so many people when they're trying to figure out
if they want to make a switch Privotal quick, they're thinking,
maybe I have to go back to school, and that's
the answer to all my problems.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
So a Neka may, welcome to switch Privotal quick.
Speaker 3 (01:41):
Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Yeah, I have this conversation.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
I am as well. I am as well.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
So obviously, if you're helping people get their NBA, you've
gotten your NBA. That's correct, right, Okay? From Wharton Business School.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Yes, so I graduated from my MBA from Wharton.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
So before we get to Wharton, what was your first
entry into the corporate world. What was that experience like
for you, Like, what kind of impact did it make
on you? What thoughts or feelings did it leave you with.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I'll have to take a step back to give context
to the experience. I had my first corporate job. So
I'm Nigeria and I was born and raised.
Speaker 4 (02:26):
Then I moved to the US to go to college.
Speaker 3 (02:29):
I went to Columbia for undergrad and after I graduated,
I went into consulting, very specifically technology consulting at one
of the Big four companies. And if you work at
a Big four, you're familiar. You know that it is massive.
Up to hundreds of thousands of people in this firm,
and then Ashley, it's massive.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
These are massive firms.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
That was my first corporate experience. So I was working
as a consultant, and it's really interesting. I was in
a practice, one of the smaller practices that was program
and portfolio management. So right after college, I was managing
projects where I was like managing quote unquote directors and
partners and senior managers. So it was a very interesting dynamic,
(03:13):
and of course I had like directors who were guiding
me and supervising me and all that. What I took
out from that or the experience, how it influenced me
was one key thing that I like to call out
from that entire time. I spent three years at this
consulting firm before I went to business school for my MBA,
and this firm really indexed on coaching and mentorship. And
(03:39):
as someone who I gave the context, I'm international. The
corporate culture already can be a shock to the system
for a young career professional. For me, as someone who
did not grow up in the American culture, it was
an additional shock to the system. There's ways that you communicate,
there's ways that you network, there's ways that you advocate
(04:01):
for yourself that were so new to me. And having
a coach guide me and care about my process and
check in with me consistently and challenge me was critical
and that really molded the experience that I had while
I was there.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
When you say challenge you, I think sometimes that can
feel intimidating for people. People don't want to be critiqued.
They don't want to be told what they're not doing right.
How did you approach the idea of being challenged? Did
you welcome it?
Speaker 3 (04:38):
You're so right, it's difficult to take constructive criticism or
negative feedback if the relationship you have is not safe.
The container of the relationship has to be secure for
you to be able to adequately and like comfortably receive feedback.
And I will shout out my coach Fernando like I
(05:00):
I have so much love.
Speaker 4 (05:01):
And respect for him.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
Honestly, I talk about the experience that I had with
him a lot because it was. He did an amazing
job as a coach. He created a relationship where I
felt safe. I felt like he cared for me, and
he was challenging me not to hurt me, but because
he really wanted.
Speaker 4 (05:19):
Me to go and he would challenge me. He'd asked
me to do things that scared the shit out of me.
Speaker 1 (05:26):
Tell us about one of those things, Like.
Speaker 3 (05:29):
I said, this is a massive company, right, a massive firm.
I was working in the New York office and the heads,
like the global heads of the firm have offices in
New York. My coach told me this was I was
what twenty two?
Speaker 4 (05:45):
He said, they need to know who you are. So
here's what you're gonna do.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
You and Kemer are gonna go walk into their office,
no meeting, no appointment, Just walk in, introduce yourself, say
a little bit about you saying you're here to introduce yourself.
Speaker 4 (06:02):
That's it.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
And I kid you not And I did it. I
mean it was scary, but like because I knew he
expected that of me, Like, you wouldn't have asked me to.
Speaker 4 (06:12):
Do that if you didn't think I could. If he
thought that that was the thing I could do. Okay, fun,
but it was really scary.
Speaker 3 (06:18):
But that was one like challenge, one example of him
like challenging me.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Do you remember the moment before you walked into that
executive's office, like how you were feeling what you had
to do or tell yourself in order to like go
through it. I feel like my legs would have felt heavy,
my breathing would have been likely really shallow.
Speaker 3 (06:40):
I don't remember. I will say the partners that were
really kind. I think it just took them by surprise.
But also like the culture of that firm, great people
are just really nice, but it took them by surprise,
and so they were really welcoming, like, Okay, it's so
nice to meet you.
Speaker 2 (06:56):
Oh that is amazing. I love that child challenge. I'm
sure you didn't love it as your twenty two year
old self, but now having something like that under your belt,
it's almost like I could walk into any room, in
any space and be Okay, oh yeah, you have this
challenging mentor slash coach. You're working at this firm for
(07:18):
three years. What is the thing that sparks that says
I need to go to business school.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
I had always wanted to go to business school. I
took the GM at right after I graduated from college,
so I could have my school ready to go when
I was ready to apply. This is something that I
had wanted for a long time, and I wanted to
go to business school for the sake of business school.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
At the time, I.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Felt like I would become a different person based on
the experience that I had there. I didn't know what
that would be, but I knew that it would like
I would develop in a way that I wanted to.
Speaker 4 (07:53):
As far as.
Speaker 3 (07:54):
Timing with business school, you need a minimum of two
years to be competitive in the applicant pool. I applied
when I had two years of experience. I was like,
I'm ready to go.
Speaker 4 (08:05):
Let's go, Let's do it.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
I've been waiting for this moment.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
Yeah, So I applied then.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
And the timing reason was, you know, I really wanted
to go at the time, As I said, I'm international.
There was also like visa concentuations. I wanted to make
sure that I was in school in case I didn't
get the lottery for the work visa.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
So now you've transitioned into helping other people, and I
feel like, in familiarizing myself with your story, a part
of that was because you were made to believe that
it wasn't going to be really realistic for you to
get into one of the top business schools based off
of your experience at the time. Talk to us a
little bit about how you help other people shut down
(08:47):
those criticisms or those limiting beliefs that are imposed by
other people about what you can and can't do when
it comes to business school.
Speaker 3 (08:55):
The impetus for me starting to practice was when I
was applying. Like I said, I was younger, I had
two years of work experience, and I was referred to
a senior admissions consultant to one of the more established firms,
and she essentially told me to not even bother, replying
that I wouldn't get into a top school. And now
(09:16):
that I'm in the business, having been in it, now
I understand the risk of taking on someone that you're
not one hundred percent confident you can get in because
there's numbers and metrics, and those are success factors that
firms used to advertise their services, right, So I understand,
I get it.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
But I went on and applied.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
I was supported by an incredible female coach through that
process who believed in me and understood my background. I
knew that I actually was a strong candidate, and sometimes
it just takes someone to actually take more time to
look at what you're presenting them with and to want
to take a chance on you. My favorite story that
(09:56):
I tell is there was someone who I was working
with who had applied to five schools a year prior
and was rejected from all five. Then we worked together
and he got into all five of the new schools
that he applied to, and these were all top schools,
and he got over two hundred and fifty thousand dollars
in scholarships. When that happened, I was like, wait, okay,
Because I had been helping people, I hadn't done it
in a formal way till then, and it made me
(10:19):
realize I really have something here and I can help people,
especially people who feel like it's not possible for them.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
If people are thinking that business school is their way
out or their way to the next theme, it's the
answer to solve all their problems, what would you say
to that, I would.
Speaker 3 (10:38):
Say, take a step back and let's examine if that
belief is true, because business school can change the trajectory
of your career in your life. That is facts but
sometimes it's not what you need. And so to believe
that if you don't go to business school like your
career is crippled, that's a limited belief. And it all
(11:00):
really just depends on the context of your career, your industry,
your goals is holistic. The other thing that I really
would like to share here is the fact that business
school is a massive financial commitment. So unless you're certain
of the return that you expect to get, you have
to just take the decision really seriously because you're investing
(11:24):
not just a lot of money, but a lot of time.
If you're doing a two year program, that's lost income
for two years. I will say there are a lot
of pivots and switches that can be made without going
to business school. But when business school does make sense.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
Yeah, jeez, I hate to break up a good conversation
with an ad break, but that's what we gotta do.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
A girl's got to pay the bills, right.
Speaker 2 (11:49):
It's a whole type for me, and we'll be right
back before you know it. Is there a characteristic or
maybe a couple characteristics that stand out to you in
terms of someone who is a good fit for going
to business school. No, Okay, that's I was just very
(12:10):
curious about that and that I love it just straight now.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
Because it all depends. Everyone's story is different, everyone's why
is different. There isn't a cookie kuta this person. Most
people think, Okay, a lot of bankers, a lot of
consultants go to business school, And that is true. It's
part is ingrained in the career progression for years now.
That is not that's not exhaustive of the profile of
(12:33):
business school applicants and candidates.
Speaker 2 (12:36):
What's something that you're extremely opinionated about right now?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
So I was literally I was just on a panel
recently and one of the things I was asked on
the panel, you know, what is your take on imposter syndrome?
And I have a very strong opinion on imposter syndrome.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Tell us about it.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
My take, I believe that imposter syndrome is a limiting
belief label. I believe that anyone's feelings of anxiety and nervousness,
questioning are all valid. But to take a term imposter syndrome,
which is so intense, imposter a fraud, someone who's trying
to defraud others, like actively syndrome, Like the word is
(13:17):
too intense for something that millions of people experience and
is truly a normal part of doing something.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
New or being in a new environment.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
The problem that I have, in addition to what I
just said about imposter syndrome is when you have a label,
sometimes it becomes so sticky that you're not able to
move away from it, Whereas if you put the label
aside for a second and then address the actual feelings
that you have and you can actually then use like
practical tips and practical tactics to address them, then you're
(13:53):
able to move forward like you have imposters to do. Oh,
my imposter syndrome is acting up as you've taken ownership
of it. It's sticky, like it's locked you in this place.
Speaker 1 (14:04):
No, no, don't need it.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Oh, in the midst of all your accomplishments, is there
anything that you feel like maybe you still struggle with Oh?
Speaker 1 (14:13):
Yeah, of course we want to know.
Speaker 3 (14:16):
So on things I'm working on right now is being
able to structure the practice, not the coaching of it,
but like the operations and the back end of it
in such a way that as it grows, I'm able
to bring admins and like additional people on so that
we can scale properly, and I know that I'm struggling
(14:38):
with it because I see people who are just like
this is just easy peasy, But I need steps, like
I need to try things out and structure it based
on how it's like working in my brain. So it
takes a bit more time sometimes, but yeah, I'm excited
to get to the point where I can do it
like more automatedly. So yeah, that's something I'm working on.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
I still struggle with is there any personal strength that
you feel like you've identified for yourself that has helped
you to get to where you are today.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
I draw my strength from God, so started with that,
and then the source empowered me with specific things, so
I can tell you like some strength. People who know
me will say that I'm resilient, and I would agree
with that. I'm also an ambeavert, so I can be
very extroverted. I can make friends with almost anybody, and
that is a core strength and a core part of
(15:29):
my personality. But I'm also able to draw back and
dig really deep into the.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
Details of work.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
And so the way that then works as a strength
is I'm able to create meaningful content and meaningful work,
and I'm able to share it and promote it in
a way that the people who need it can find it.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
You do a lot on LinkedIn.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Tell us a little bit about what role LinkedIn plays
for you, and maybe did you just start gravitating to
LinkedIn or is that something that you've been dabbling with
but gotten stronger lately. Like talk to us a little
bit about LinkedIn and that being sort of like because
it seems to me that is your platform of choice.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
You know what's funny is I.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Used to have a lot of anxiety about posting on LinkedIn,
like a lot of discomfort. I used to feel really
uncomfortable about it. And then when I relaunched the practice
for this application cycle, I relaunched with a bunch.
Speaker 4 (16:26):
Of guides and sharing the story all of that.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
So I had spent weeks kind of prepping for that launch,
and I posted the very first launch post on LinkedIn
and it got over one hundred thousand impressions, and the
one after that got even more impressions, and I was like, wait, okay,
And that's the thing. I think a little bit of
success helps to resolve some of your anxiety and give
(16:51):
you a little bit of confidence. So when I saw
that It made sense also because I do NBA admissions
consulting those clients.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
They live on LinkedIn.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
It's professional platform, so it makes sense that it resonates
that way. But it was not always like that for me,
Like LinkedIn was one of those oh my gosh, she
can't even have to do this.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
I'm glad you got on the other side of that.
And like you said, sometimes when you see some traction
with something, it makes it feel like, Okay, maybe that's
not so bad, you know, or maybe I should try more.
It gets you excited, like, Okay, what can I do
if I did more? I love that for you. That's
so good. Ooh, I know it's getting good, but we'll
(17:29):
be right back after we.
Speaker 1 (17:31):
Hear from our sponsors.
Speaker 2 (17:35):
You recently did a TED talk and it was called
finding a Story to Believe in. If someone is trying
to formulate their story, what are some things that come
to mind for you in terms of how someone can
grab a hold of their story, because sometimes it's hard.
You know, all the pieces and everything is swirling around
(17:57):
for you, it's hard to narrow it down into something
a bit more concise and digestible for someone else.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
Yeah, the answer to that kind of depends on the
context in which you're trying to tell the story, right.
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Okay, So first it's who's your audience you're telling the
story too, okay?
Speaker 3 (18:13):
Correct?
Speaker 1 (18:13):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (18:14):
And then the second is what do you want to
tell them?
Speaker 4 (18:17):
Not from a specific perspective, like what do you want
to leave with them? So what's the goal of Is
this a promotion? Is this an MB education?
Speaker 3 (18:25):
Is this storytelling and social media so that people can
do something in particular.
Speaker 4 (18:30):
That needs to be super clear?
Speaker 3 (18:31):
And then three, and this gets into the meat of
then figuring it out for yourself is to be able
to tell an effective story, you need to do a
lot of reflection. And in order to do really good reflection,
you need to ask yourself the right questions.
Speaker 4 (18:44):
You have to have questions to ask yourself when you
do that process.
Speaker 3 (18:48):
I won't give question examples because it also like really
depends on the context, right, But when you've put yourself
in a position where you're now asking yourself questions and
you're seeing what the answers are, you can start to
look for connecting threads in those responses, and that thread
will likely connect to your number one and number two
(19:08):
responses of who the audience is and what you want
them to take out of it, And that's how you
connect and tell a coherent story, because otherwise you can
just start talking and then you're telling a story, but like,
what are you telling it to? What do you want
them to get out of it? And once the thread
that ties it all together.
Speaker 2 (19:25):
Mm hm, you can tell a whole story and they're like, okay,
so what does all that mean? I love your storytelling ability,
but what am I supposed to do with it? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (19:37):
That makes a lot of sense.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
So as we wrap up, is there anything burning on
your heart that you wanted to scream from the rooftops
but you just haven't had a chance to do it
yet about maybe careers, what people are doing right or wrong,
or maybe about switching careers any of that. Is there
anything burning on your chest to share?
Speaker 4 (20:00):
If this is not burning or my chest?
Speaker 3 (20:01):
But you've asked, and I just I don't want to
leave your question on answering. One of the things that
I'm asked about, or like people struggle with, is staying
in a role or a job longer than they need
to be, or when they know that they want to
leave because of the word quit and the connotations around
it in a similar vein to imposter syndrome. It's the
(20:23):
way you think about it, the mindset behind it. Quitting
honestly is a powerful decision. It is an empowered action.
So for if anyone needed to hear this, of course
you're considering your options, but if you're being held back
because oh my gosh, you don't want to look like
a quitter, no, like quitting is power, quitting is respecting yourself.
If you're quitting for the right reason, just wanted to
(20:45):
leave with that.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Yes, oh, I talked about that on the Quit Playing
Swap podcast. Because we have this negative connotation around quitting,
Quitting equates to failure in some people's minds. It makes
you feel like I couldn't achieve, or I had to
fall short, or I stopped short of something. But really,
like you said, it's an empowering decision. It's you sometimes
(21:08):
choosing yourself over other people, over other circumstances. It's you saying, actually,
this doesn't work for me anymore, and so this is
the decision that I have to make next. And it's
not quitting haphazardly and just like on a whim, No,
it's being strategic about it and strategically thinking about what
works for you.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
So I'm so glad that you.
Speaker 2 (21:27):
Bought that up. Thank you, thank you, Yes, and that
can make This has been a great conversation. Thank you
for all of your insights around just how we can
move forward in terms of our careers, if we're thinking
about maybe going towards an NBA and also getting us
in check with our imposter syndrome.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
I got love it.
Speaker 2 (21:47):
Yes, yes, Thank you so much for spending time with us.
I appreciate it.
Speaker 3 (21:51):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (21:52):
This was a wonderful conversation of course, and as always
you guys, I appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
All spending time with us.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
Go and check out and let them know where they
can check you out and your website and whatnot.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
Is a KMA dot com a n I E K
E M E dot com. My social media is also
a KMA, so you can find me on LinkedIn. You
can find me on Instagram at a nake. You can
also find me on YouTube. I'd be active on YouTube
as well. Yay yay oh on Twitter too, is I
(22:28):
love it?
Speaker 1 (22:29):
I love it.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
Thank you guys so much for joining us, and as always,
be well
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