Next 3 Years Of Apple's Spatial Hardware

Tailosive Tech Streamed: October 14th, 2024

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. We are back with Taylos
of tech Live on YouTube. Good evening out in Missouri.
Thank you Nicholas for tuning in. Good night, says Clerk
from Tehran. Wow, we've got people tuning in from all
over or a Mac tuning in from Texas. Thank you
all for watching the stream. Jordan's stream. Yeah, I've got

(00:25):
some questions from Taylos of tech pro members that we'll
get into in a little bit, but I wanted to
kick off the live stream, of course, with what's in
the title in thumbnail. If you're new here, I'll just
remind everybody that we're not trying to talk about just
the title and thumbnail for the entire length of the stream.
That would get all very fast. No, the beauty of
live streams is that the audience can kind of dictate
the direction the stream goes. So I kind of pick

(00:47):
a topic to get kickstarted, and then you guys can
kind of direct where you want it to go. Rather
than me, try to guess what you're interested in, make videos,
edit them, post them, read your comments, and then see
what you think. This is just a much more real
time way to cover the news. But This one is
kind of interesting to me because in my view, as
far as development of stuff that's going on at Apple,

(01:09):
the whole spatial computing sector is probably the most interesting.
And I'm not even trying to say that that's the
most interesting thing in the world, but in my opinion,
more interesting than what's going on with iterative upgrades with
iPhones or Apple Intelligence and all that Happy Thanksgiving from Canada?
Is it earlier Thanksgiving in Canada? Interesting? I did not

(01:31):
know that I need to go to Canada someday. But
we kind of have something to expect in the hardware
department from Apple when it comes to spatial computing devices
or at least wearables that kind of go over your eyes,
that kind of segment. Thanks to Mark German from Bloomberg,
who's been somewhat reputable in the past, he has pretty

(01:52):
decent sources. And the first one here is about next year.
Let's just go in order, because that's the simplest Apples
working on a different pair of Apple Vision had said
that is not supposed to be pro This one is
slightly more affordable, but we won't say affordable. We should

(02:15):
what's the terminology. It's cheap er, but it's not cheap.
Of course, we're not trying to say a two thousand
dollars headset is cheap, but that's the number that he
says they're now targeting. That's the official number they're floating
around with, is two thousand bucks for an Apple Vision Air,
Apple Vision Se Apple Vision Plus instead of bro I
don't know something that's not pro. And then after that

(02:39):
he mentions that in twenty twenty six they want to
have Apple Vision Pro second generation. So if it goes
according to Mark German's report, it sounds like the low
cost version will be next year, in twenty twenty five,
probably end of next year, not early twenty twenty five,
so we've still probably got a year of before they're

(03:00):
ready to unveil it. Of course, this is new, uncharted
territory for Apples, so a lot of things could change,
a lot of things could be thrown off. Hey, Concept Central,
good to see in the chat. Thanks for tuning in,
and Randy, recent iPhone sixteen owner, congratulations on Ultramarine. Yeah,
it's lower priced, but it's not low priced, we'll put

(03:22):
it that way. Two thousand bucks is still pretty difficult
to stomach, but I believe German's report is also saying
that the non provariant of Apple Vision will not be
rocking an eyesight display, surprising no one. That's pretty much
the unanimous consensus from the community is that the eyesight
display is not that helpful. It doesn't achieve the intention

(03:46):
behind having an eyesight display, which was to make people
feel like you could look into the eyes of someone
wearing the headset. It's just creepy, It looks weird, it
looks tacky. So it makes a lot of sense in
my opinion that they're probably gonna do away with that.
Maybe they'll try to improve it on Apple Vision Pro two,
but I kind of doubt it. My prediction is that
they will just scrap it entirely. Maybe they'll have some

(04:08):
kind of display on the outside that just does the ultramarine,
you know, blue purple waves. But I think the whole
showing the eyes on the outside just adds too much cost, complexity,
and weight to the headset, which are all working against it.
So but then that's not the end of the report.
German's also talking about what to expect with a twenty

(04:30):
twenty seven released, which is not a new cheaper headset,
not a new pro headset, but instead a pair of
smart glasses that may not necessarily have a bunch of
augmented reality features like metas oreon glasses where you actually
just have transparent displays and then you run fully fledged
vision os on that. No, he's saying, more of like

(04:52):
a Meta ray band technology. So there's cameras in, there's speakers,
and there's microphones, probably Apple intelligence or visual intelligen features,
but it's basically just a fashionable, lightweight pair of glasses
that don't really look that different from a regular pair
of sunglasses or prescription glasses. They just so happen to
take photos and automatically sinks with your phone, so all

(05:14):
the pictures it takes show up on your photo library automatically.
And also it could have serri built in so you
could talk to it and listen to phone calls, take
phone calls on it, because it's just kind of like
having a bluetooth earpiece that also happens to be glasses.
So he's saying Apple's admired or has taken inspiration from
Meta's ray bands and probably just wants to make them

(05:35):
much much better and probably much more expensive because they're
made by Apple, So cheaper augmented reality headset, but still
expect it to be a headset, not glasses. I don't
know how you want to exactly draw the line between
glasses and headset. For me, I'm gonna say headset whenever
it's something that isn't transparent displays. So Apple Vision Pro

(05:57):
is a headset because there's a strap often on the
top and bottom, but not only that, you're looking into
displays that are stitching together reality through cameras. Whereas I
would start to say, okay, maybe we can call it
glasses in less of a headset when it's a transparent
display that's not stitching together reality through cameras and displays,

(06:18):
but instead it's just a transparent display that's letting you
see the real world, letting light pass through it without cameras.
Cheaper is probably more priority than lighter. Yeah, but they
tend to go hand in hand. I mean, Apple makes
AirPods out of plastic instead of aluminum for a reason.
It's not just that it's lighter weight. I think there's

(06:41):
a decent chance that the cheaper version of the Apple
Vision headset will be made out of kind of an
AirPod style plastic similar to AirPods and maybe not have
a display on the outside to save on cost and
batteries and that kind of stuff. Apple glass comparable to
ray band would be my dream Apple ARVR product. The thing, though, Nicholas,

(07:01):
is that the ray ban thing doesn't really do anything
augmented reality. There's no displays on those glasses, so I
don't even know if you can really call it an
ARVR product. It's more of just a handy wearable. It's
like AirPod. Like the terminology they used in the article
was like AirPods with cameras. I obviously don't think they're

(07:21):
talking about doing like literally just this AirPod with a camera,
because then it's only gonna get your left point of
view or your right point of view. That seems silly,
but no, it's more just like it can do some
light audio playback, like it could do audio calls without
you having to pick up something or without you having
to answer through a watch or headphones, and then it

(07:41):
can also take photos. So I don't know if they
would brand it as AirPods. Randy says, I'm very interested
in those glasses. I'm just sad to say that we've
got to wait till twenty twenty seven for Apple to
catch up to where Meta is basically already today, I'm
doing well, Svisualizer, Thanks for asking a really good day.
The good day, Yeah, so I'm happy to chat with you.

(08:05):
The proper ux ra ar headsets lies in their comfort
and battery life. Yeah, that's I think going to be
the challenge with them for decades to come is that
you want them to be lightweight so that they're more comfortable.
But of course the lighter weight they are, the worse
the battery life is. And there's really no way around that.
Battery technology. There's always some prototype hype chemistry around the

(08:27):
corner that never actually makes it into math production. Do
I think they'll ever get Apple Vision pro down to
one thousand dollars? Never say never, But if you're asking
me my personal guest, I would say no, because over time,
at least statistically from what I've seen, Apple, when they
find a product that changes the world or changes the game,

(08:49):
or at least maybe let's not use such grand vocabulary
like change the world. Maybe maybe we'll dumb it down
a little bit, and let's say when Apple develops a
very successful product, it usually doesn't get much cheaper over time,
it gets more capable, and it gets better, and the
use cases for it grow, but rarely does the price

(09:12):
shrink by that much. Pick anything, any example, really. I mean,
the iPhone, for example, was five hundred dollars on a
two year contract when it first came out way back
in two thousand and seven. If you wanted to buy
the original iPhone unlocked for one, I don't think they
had it for a while, but once they did finally
start allowing it unlocked, I think it was around seven

(09:35):
hundred dollars, maybe seven fifty. And sure they probably tried
to lower it a bit with the three G and
the three GS. But you look at today, years and
years later, almost you know, basically two decades after the
first iPhone, and the average purchase price of a new
iPhone is still about what a thousand bucks. I mean,

(09:59):
I know there's some cheaper ones in the flagship like
the regular sixteen and sixteen plus, but the most popular
ones are still the pro maxes, which are north of
twelve hundred dollars. So if you look at the average
of the best selling iPhones and where their price points are,
most people are still spending probably around one thousand bucks
on a new iPhone. But that's before trade in deals

(10:21):
and discounts and all that YadA YadA, which there was
in the past anyway. But my point is usually the
same thing with AirPods. Like the first generation AirPods, I
love them, but a lot of people didn't until the
Airpod's Pro came out. Now, Apple has told us publicly
that the AirPods Pro are the most popular variant of AirPods.

(10:41):
They outsell AirPods Max. They outsell the cheap AirPods, the
slightly more expensive AirPods. The pros are the most popular,
and those are not the cheapest. Those are the two
hundred and fifty dollars ones, not the one hundred and
thirty dollars ones. So I think there's a decent chance that,
like many Apple products in the past, it's not cutting

(11:03):
the price by two thirds or three quarters that makes
it go mainstream. It's usually by the use cases for
it and the functionality of it that make it go big.
And once the functionality comes in, that's when that's when
people start opening up their mind to dropping as much

(11:25):
money as it is. I just don't think the use
cases are there for the spatial stuff yet. But hypothetically,
the sky's the limit for what they can do as
they improve battery life, as they improve efficiency. I guess
that's why it excites me the most is because it's
not there's so much room for improvement with Apple Vision Pro,

(11:46):
and I don't really feel that way with really any
other Apple product. What more can they do with AirPods
where color options but longer battery life? Okay, big whoop,
they can fix AirPods max. That's a whole other thing.
But iPhones as well. iPhones have gotten so good now.
The cameras are fantastic, the battery life's great, the displays
are great. There's just really no reason to upgrade your phone.

(12:09):
Same thing with iPads. Like you know, a lot of
people are using iPads that are six, seven, eight, some
people ten years old, because it's an iPad. At the
end of the day, what else can it really do.
You can spend thousands of dollars on a new iPad
and still get ninety percent the same experience. Same thing
with Apple watches. By the way, Apple watches have also
gotten more expensive. I mean, there are cheaper ones now

(12:31):
with the se but those aren't the best sellers. The
data is showing the Apple Watch Ultra is out selling
the se so the more expensive Apple Watch is actually
doing better. So once again, once the capability has proven,
people will justify the price. And if we get to
the point where Apple glasses or Apple headset can start
to replace every display in our life, like it can

(12:52):
replace our TV, it can replace our desktop monitor, it
can replace our laptop, it can replace our tablets if
it starts replacing or in our smart watches, if it
starts replacing all these other things. Then spending two thousand
bucks or three thousand bucks on one product that can
do the job that used to cost you know, all

(13:12):
those things put together, probably close to two thousand and
three thousand anyway, but you have to charge them all
separately instead of just one device that can do it all.
I'm not hating on iPads. I'm just saying there's not
much more for them to improve on. There's nothing wrong
with a twenty eighteen iPad pro. Natiri, Why are you
hating on old iPads. I'm defending the old iPads. What's

(13:35):
with the hate? No, I don't even hate on ipdos
anymore because I've seen the sales of IPEd pros and
they're doing well. So I've acknowledged that, and I've done
it on camera and everything. iPads aren't for me. iPadOS
doesn't fit my use cases or my lifestyle. But if
you're fine with ipedos the way it is, then there's

(13:57):
genuinely very little reason to upgrade your iPad because twenty
eighteen iPad Pro works just fine, or a twenty twenty
iPad Pro, or just keep buying a used one from
a few years ago because there's nothing wrong with it.
I wish they would make a version of Beats Flex
neckband with ANC. I prefer that form factor. Outside of India,
there's very little market for neckbands. I agree neckbands are

(14:19):
kind of underrated. They are kind of practical and useful,
and they can extend battery life by quite a bit.
But top mavericks is how is your camera this good?
It's the iPhone sixteen Pro camera. That's what I'm using
right now. Yeah. I think a lot of people once
they decide they're spending more than one hundred bucks on
wireless earbuds, they're probably going to want and C. I'm
sure that's why they added it to the lower model. Yeah,

(14:40):
I was impressed with how well it worked. The usefulness
of the capture button might correlate with the size of
people hands. I wonder as to the ergonomic benefit. I
don't think it's that at all. I just think using
the display is a thousand times easier than using the
camera control, which is a lot more picky and takes
a lot more getting used to and fine tuning than
just use the screen. The screen does everything the camera

(15:03):
control thing does, except the camera control involves more shake
when you're actually taking the photos. Is there a reason
to get thirteen inch over eleven inch iPad? Not? In
my opinion. There used to be back when you know
that you could only get the XDR display on the
thirteen inch iPad, But now that you can get the

(15:24):
OLED display on either size and there's like a three
hundred dollars price gap between them, yeah, I would just
get the eleven inch one. Although good sales doesn't always
justify a decision in my mind, I mean, a lot
of good business decisions are flatly bad for consumers. But
I take your point. Well. I agree. If if the
sales were doing poorly for the iPad pros, then I

(15:46):
would say like, yeah, this isn't good for them, But
it was like, yeah, but people are buying it. People
clearly want it for whatever reason. So Apple's supplying a demand,
so we can argue whether or not it's a good demand.
But that's not really our job to figure out whether
or not people need those things, but they choose those things.

(16:07):
Steve Jobs would not approve of a camera control button,
who knows, but who cares. Also, Steve is gone, it's
not really up to him, and the Apple's job is
not to do exactly what Steve would have done. In fact,
that was something Steve Jobs advised Tim Cook. He said,
don't do what I would do. So maybe he followed

(16:28):
that advice a little because they did a lot of
things Steve wouldn't have done, and there's probably a lot
of great things Apple has done that Steve wouldn't have done.
Bart Jansen, thank you for thirty six months of support.
I appreciate that. Imagine an Apple TV with m one
running AI tasks from other Apple devices. Okay, I'm trying
to figure out what Apple Intelligence features I would need

(16:51):
on my TV. But anyhow, my point is there's not
a lot of room for improvement with other Apple product categories.
So when people tune into the stream and say, Drew,
why do you want to talk about Apple Vision, Why
do you want to talk about spatial computing? Because Apple
Vision pro is not that good. It's not that impressive. Yes,
exactly why I want to talk about it because there's

(17:12):
lots of room for improvement, and the sky's the limit
for what it could be capable of with the right
software and the right hardware improvements in advancements. There's a
lot of things that it can eventually do that it's
not doing now, which is what gets me excited for
future generations of that product. I'm not that excited about
the iPhone seventeen. I'm not that excited about Apple Watch
Series eleven. Why Because it's going to be slight iteration,

(17:35):
slight tweaks on what they already do. That's why I
straight up couldn't recommend the Apple Watch Series ten to
anybody in my opinion, it was objectively worse than the
Series nine or eight, which you can find much much
cheaper at thicker bezels and worse health Sensor Suite. And
I couldn't recommend the iPhone sixteen because the iPhone fifteen

(17:56):
was ninety nine percent the same experience at a discounted price.
So if I'm not excited about future AirPods, I'm not
excited about future iPhones. I'm not excited about future Apple
watches or future iPads, and Max are just in the
game of chip upgrades. That, in my opinion, the most
exciting thing going on with Apple since they canceled the

(18:17):
car project. If they were working on a car, that
would probably be the most interesting thing. But because they're
not working on an autonomous driving vehicle or a non
autonomous vehicle, just working on any car would have been
interesting to me. This is the most interesting thing going on.
And now John Turnas is taking over Apple spatial computing sector,

(18:37):
which excites me because he's did an amazing job with
the Mac lineup. I think he's shown that he's willing
to listen to customer feedback and that's why he got
rid of the touch bar, brought back mag Safe HDMISD
card slot, and he oversaw the transition from the Intel
chips to Apple Silicon chips. So there's just a lot
of good that we've gotten from John Turnis. And now

(18:59):
he's in charge of a whole Vision Pro team and
everything going on with spatial computing and vision OS. So
that gets me excited for the future because it's the
segment of Apple that has the most room for improvement,
and there's a lot to be gained from future follow
up models, because yeah, that first generation Apple Vision Pro

(19:20):
is really just a proof of concept because as a
product is not that great. Thirty five hundred bucks for
something that's not very comfortable to wear, with not a
very good battery life, with the limited software applications, with
limited use cases. Yeah, that's why I'm like, let's dive
more into this, because there's a lot more it could
be doing. And that's why I'm less pumped or excited
about things like the HomePod. Like the HomePod basically does

(19:44):
everything that it can do. Maybe if it supported Bluetooth connectivity,
that would be refreshing and nice, but yeah, there's not
a huge like margin for improvement, Like the sky is
not the limit with the HomePod. Best case scenario, we
get a display on the home pod so that when
someone rings her doorbell, it appears on there. That's about it.

(20:05):
Not too excited about it. I think the iPhone has
gotten to the point where it's so mature and it's
plateaued with its new techniques that they're forced to add
things to it that are not even that good just
for the sake of them. Well, we got to have something.
We have to make it sound like we did something.
And that's what camera control feels like. To me. It
feels like, I don't know, there's not enough changes, so

(20:28):
let's add something. Nicholas, thank you for fifteen months of support,
he says, Will we ever see a true replacement? Proudest
from Apple? Tim Cook seems to be about enhancing the iPhone,
not creating a product to replace it, as Steve did
with the iPod to the iPhone, ARVR does not seem
to be that vision. I don't think you have to
replace something in order to make a massive impact, like

(20:51):
you could argue Steve Jobs didn't replace the Mac. But
that doesn't mean that the iPhone was not a big deal.
Quite the opposite. The iPhone had a massive impact on
our world and basically changed the way we interact with
all technology and app stores and software and hardware. The
iPhone reinvented the computer. But did that mean that the

(21:11):
Mac was killed off? No? Not really, But I think
that's a false premise. It's a false milestone or false
expectation that a lot of people in the community have
is that you can't make a influential or big product
if it doesn't replace the present day biggest product. And
for a while, the Mac was like the biggest bread

(21:33):
and butter thing at Apple. That was like their big
headlining product was the Mac and Tosh and then they
made the Power books and the Eyebooks, and you know,
there were lots of different options for the Mac. And
then they did the iPod, of course, which was successful,
and then the iPhone came around and killed off the iPod.
But the iPhone never killed off the Mac. But it
was about finding a new form factor, finding a new

(21:55):
use case for this hardware technology that was still impactful.
The iPhone was super impactful despite the fact that it
didn't replace the Mac. I feel similarly about Apple spatial
hardware like the Vision Pro or the Apple Vision Glass
or whatever they end up calling the glasses. It can
be very impactful, It can make a huge difference on

(22:18):
our world in the way we interact with technology, and
yet still not replace the iPhone. I think every year
and camera control is a perfect example of this. Every
year the iPhone is going to become more and more
of a personal camera and maybe less and less of
an actual phone. You know, when Apple announces a new iPhone,
they don't talk all day about how easy it is
to text people and have phone calls. No, it's like

(22:41):
a bigger and bigger portion of the event is spent
on here's how great the cameras are. We've improved the
cameras with this, and we've made it more of a
camera a device like this, and now the microphones are better.
They weren't. That was kind of a lie, but still
they're putting time and energy into Hey, the microphones are better. Hey,
the lenses are better. Hey, this captures more life. Now
it's a few camera. Now it has better zoom, maybe

(23:01):
a better ultra white. Now we can crop in and
lose less detail as we're zooming all of that stuff.
I think that the iPhone isn't going to be replaced,
but it might become more and more of a camera product,
whereas Apple Vision stuff is of course going to be
much more of a visual it's about what you see.
It's not going to be as much of a camera
focused device. It'll be a passively decent camera photo or

(23:26):
video taking experience. But I don't think it'll ever replace
the iPhone in that regard, but yeah, you gotta Rick says,
you guys need to aim way lower than replacing the iPhone.
That is not happening. And I don't even think it's
about aiming lower. I just think that it's a false
premise that you need to replace the iPhone in order

(23:46):
for it to be a big deal. It can be
a big deal and not replace the iPhone. That's all
I'm saying. It might transform the way you use your
iPhone in the same way that now that we have iPhones,
we probably use our MacBooks very differently than we used to.
Before we had smartphones, you probably used your Mac and
people could justify spending one thousand, two thousand bucks on
a laptop because they need to do email, because they

(24:09):
need to have instant messages, or they need to do
photo editing or documents, or you know the kind of
work stuff. But now there's so much you can do
on your iPhone. Maybe a lot of people don't need
to buy the fanciest Mac, or maybe they don't need
a Mac just for email anymore. It's like, well, if
I'm mostly just doing email and messaging, yeah I could

(24:32):
get by with an iPad or I can get by
with the phone. Doesn't change the fact that the Mac
still exists. Mac hasn't been replaced, But the iPhone was
a big impact, arguably, I would say much bigger. Yeah,
I did see that twenty years later, twenty eight years
later is being filmed on an iPhone fifteen pro doesn't

(24:52):
surprise me at Apple's shot whole events on iPhones. iPhones
have pretty good sensors, and it looked like to me
that the twenty eight years later crew is attaching a
lot of third party accessories and lenses. What people fail
to realize is that it has a lot more to
do with lighting than it does the actual camera. And

(25:12):
that's what Apple is proven, and that's what filmmakers are proven.
It gets to a point where the camera sensor can't
get all that much better, but it has much more
to do with how good is the lighting, how good
is the lenses that you're using? What if asks do
you think VR and AR have a lot of growth
potential in the future. What do you think the platforms
for VR and AR lack right now that would lead

(25:32):
to mass adoption? Yeah, that's kind of My whole point
is that they can get way way better than they
are right now. I think, particularly shared experiences, making it
so that one person could be watching a regular TV
while the person wearing the headset could be in sync
with them watching the same movie, interacting with virtual content,

(25:52):
with gaming, and stuff like that could get way better,
more seamless centered between our existing hardware. Like, I think
there's still a lot that could be done. There's practically
nothing right now that they've done with this, but there's
a lot that could be done with adding to the
smartphone experience with the headset, Like if you looked at

(26:14):
your phone and the headset, just paste it as a
display on top of it so that it doesn't look
all blurry like it does if you try to use
your iPhone with Vision Pro on right now instead, you know,
it could mask out your thumbs or whatever and just
make it feel like the display on your phone is
way better. Or when you're adjusting the volume, it can
put a volume indicator off to the side. Notifications could

(26:36):
come out from behind the phone, or if the phone
is sitting on a table, the notification can pop out
of the phone as you're looking at it. You can
see the battery percentage without having to use the display.
There's all kinds of ways I think you could transform
the iPhone software experience when you're using a headset simultaneously,

(26:57):
or example like this where I'm holding up my camera
use the rear facing camera, but then of course I
don't have the display. If I had the headset on
with the goggles, I could get a viewfinder right above
the phone or right next to the phone, so I
see what the camera is seeing. That way, I can
hit record and capture the display iPhone mirroring for Vision OS,
I guess is what I'm pitching. Same thing with smart watches,

(27:18):
you could Apple could come out with an activity ring
for people who don't want to wear a watch, or
people who want to wear a luxury collectible watch instead
of an Apple watch. But then when you look at
that ring with your Apple Vision headset on, it tells
you how many calories you burned, or you know your
current status or your heart rate or those kinds of things.
All these things that could be activated just from looking

(27:40):
at it. Just a lot of spatial awareness with other
tech that hasn't really been pursued. So there's a lot
that hasn't been messed around with but you think Apple
will release a new studio display in the next few months,
ask Simuls this kind. I don't think I've read much
about it. I mean, it's possible they're supposed to be

(28:01):
kind of a Mac focused release or Mac focused event
near the end of this month, but sadly I haven't
heard a much, so I'm kind of guessing no. I
don't think they have anything up their sleeve apart from
the applevision prone a bunch of other small devices. Now
that they've deleted their car, they should try something like
a personal robot like the one Musk showed a few
days ago. Eh. There has been some talk of them,

(28:24):
more so pursuing a table top robot, not a humanoid robot,
but I don't think. I don't think the humanoid robot
thing is worth pursuing personally. I've talked to a lot
of people about that. But the problem that the problem
that I think Tesla is distracted by and not really understanding,

(28:44):
and the event kind of proved my point actually is
that humanoid robots, developing the hardware for it is the
very very easy, trivial part of development, very easy relatively.
I mean, obviously I'm not saying I do it. Engineers
have to work tirelessly for months and months and years
and years in order to get to the point where

(29:05):
they can make a robot that's capable of walking around
and standing on two legs and using hands and looking
around like a person. That's still in itself a big challenge,
and Tesla's working on lowering the cost of doing all
of that so that it could be really cheap and
easy to mass produce, to make kind of Star Wars
looking droids everywhere. The hard part that I still feel

(29:29):
like they're barely even scratching the surface on development with
is the software. See, the whole reason you would want
to develop a humanoid robot is because you want a
generalized robot instead of, you know, instead of something like Rumba,
which is designed for one very specific task. It's a

(29:50):
robot that can plug in and charge itself and then
clean your floor, but that's really all it does. The
whole appeal to a humanoid robot is it can do
anything a human can do well. Unfortunately, the only way
for that really to be economical or obtainable for businesses.
The only reason a business or a brand would be

(30:10):
interesting it would be interested in buying a humanoid robot
is if it was very easy to train, It was
very simple to tell it and explain to it what
its job is and how it needs to do it,
so that it was just as fast as learning as
a human would be, if not faster, because if it

(30:31):
takes longer, then it's going to cost more on the
upfront to get implemented. And there's you know, it's a robot,
so there's always things that are going to break and
need service. So a company's really not going to be
interested in it unless they can train it fairly quickly,
otherwise they're just going to grab a human to do it.
And that's something that I think Elin has underestimated, and

(30:52):
he's gotten things wrong as far as timelines a lot.
He does amazing things, but one thing that I think
he's underestimated is how much data and how much time
machine learning and AI tends to need in neural network
training needs to get good at something like as good
as a human. And that's really the only way that

(31:17):
that humanoid robot can be practical is if it just
can learn things as quickly as a human can, so
that you can tell it to do anything you need
and it can just do it like a human would.
And I haven't seen much evidence or much proof that
AI learns or neural nets learn in the same way
as humans do. There's more similarities than just manual coding,

(31:40):
which is what most robots do. So I get it
that people call it neural net training because it is
kind of simulated on how the human brain works, but
it still fundamentally learns very very differently. I'll give an
example because this is a very relevant one. But you know,
back in twenty nineteen, Tesla had an event called Autonomy

(32:02):
Day where they showcased how they have all these specialized,
custom built full self driving computer chips built in all
these Teslas on the road already, and they're training, they're
doing self driving, and they're going to use all of
these millions of miles of data. Now they probably have
billions and billions of miles worth of self driving data,

(32:26):
and they're saying they're going to use all of that
data to make the cars better and you know, learn
from the best drivers and ignore the bad drivers and
figure out what is causing people to intervene in what's
causing people to make mistakes, and just simply don't do that.
And think of how many billions of miles had to
be driven to get where FSD is today, which is

(32:48):
of course much better than it was in twenty nineteen,
but it's still not ready for regulatory approval. Tesla has
not submitted those vehicles for the government to manually, you know,
ride around in and see if they can launch it
without a driver, without supervision. And yet my younger sister

(33:11):
just you know, it's kind of a big day for her,
big milestone. That's why I said earlier in the stream
that this was a big day for me. She just
passed her first behind the wheel driving test. Okay, she's
sixteen years old and she just passed that. We're really
happy for you know, she was practicing a lot. We
were teaching her and trying to get her all prepared

(33:32):
for the test, and you know, she had to pass
the writing test and we had to do professional driving lessons,
lessons and that kind of thing, and you know, she
just started this whole process of behind the wheel practicing
when she was fifteen and a half, so like six
months ago. So of course, my sister who now has

(33:53):
a legal license, at least in according to our government,
she is legally allowed to drive by herself without supervision,
and that took probably, if I'm being honest, less than
a thousand miles of practice. There was repetition, and there
were mistakes made along the way. Of course, we had

(34:14):
to correct her and say, oh, you got to speed up,
or you got to turn a little more, you got
to turn at this angle. So she had to practice,
she had to have neural net training with her brain.
But over the span of six months got from never
has driven a vehicle before to legally allowed to drive,
to the state and to the federal government and yet Tesla.

(34:39):
It's taken them years and years and years and billions
and billions of miles driven. And having been in a
vehicle where Tesla is driving itself, and having been in
the vehicle where my younger sister's driving, she does better.
I'm sorry, she does better now. Obviously it was different

(35:00):
at the beginning, but she's a better driver than the
Tesla is. And it took Google Wai Mo, you know,
years and years in training, and years and years of
supervision and millions and millions of miles driven before they
were allowed to actually drive around without any supervision, without
any writers, without any drivers ready to take over. So again,

(35:22):
that's just a relevant example because it's a personal one
in my life. But I have multiple family members and
friends that work in the AI field, and I can
tell you confidently none of them think it's as big
a deal as journalists do or fans of AI. I
know people who don't work in AI that are convinced
it's going to take over the world and change everything.

(35:42):
And then everybody I know who works with large language
models or AI training bots, and everybody who works in
the software industry and software engineers is like, yeah, this
is all a bunch of over hyped baloney. I won't
say which companies they work for, but I guess garantee,
you've heard of them. If I did say the name,

(36:03):
you go, oh, yeah, I know who that is. And
they're confident whenever they talk to me about it that yeah.
AI is very good at appearing intelligence. There's a big
emphasis on the artificial part of it. It's very good
at figuring out how to appear like it knows what
it's doing when in reality, again, it's just a lot

(36:26):
of training data that's like, this outcome appears to result
in the best reaction from people. So I'm going to
say that, but it's not genuinely learning or genuinely thinking
in the same way a human is. And that's a very,
very key, crucial detail you have to get right in
order for humanoid robots to start making sense. And at

(36:46):
this point I am not convinced whatsoever. I haven't seen
anything very impressive. And again the Wee robot event, Tesla
had proved my point, which is that, you know, developing
a humanoid robot that can walk upstairs and grab things
and walk around on two legs, that's been done. That's

(37:08):
not new by any means. Tesla is just the latest
company to do it, and they're doing it in their
own way by saying, you know, we're developing it in
a way that it's cheap to manufacture and all the
parts are lightweight and cost effective. That's really the only
difference is that Tesla's working on how do we mass
produce the humanoid robot? How do we make it scalable,
which is I suppose an important part of the equation

(37:30):
in Tesla does have manufacturing expertise, so I get why
they think there's a special but that's not the mountain.
The mountain of making an effective, generalized humanoid robot is
the software getting it to learn and train just as fast,
if not faster, than a human, and the Wei robot event,
to me, proved that it's still nowhere near close to

(37:56):
that because they had to have humans intervene. They had
to have humans talk for them and control the hands
for them, so the robots were not moving around purely
on their own. The robot that's filling drinks at the
bar is being controlled by a human remotely, probably with
a bunch of sensors rigged up on his hands. They've

(38:18):
done that with demos in the past, where they're like, look,
the Tesla bot can fold laundry, but then right off
camera you can see a person actually making all the motions,
and I'm like, yeah, but that's the hardest part. Developing
just a robot with hands and legs, that's not the
hard part. That's the relatively trivial part. It's like, Okay,
I believe you can build a robot that can walk
around and grab things, but the hard part is can

(38:39):
it learn? Can I teach it something and have it
pick it up like that? That's what companies need, That's
what is going to be disruptive, and that's what Tesla
thinks their AI is going to be capable of doing,
but they haven't really proven it's capable of doing that yet.
AI doesn't drink drug and have hormone overloads. But apart
from that, yeah, it's inferior. No. I understand there's advantages
to automate. I'm not denying that. I'm saying in order

(39:03):
to be practical and profitable with a humanoid robot, it's
the learning that it has to get done properly. I mean, yeah,
you can have human employees that drink or do drugs
or don't show up to work on time, but you
fire those employees most of the time. A company doesn't

(39:25):
like it when people do that, so there's penalties and
they get rid of you. You'll be punished. But if
you take a thousand hours to train, but a human
that you just pick up that needs a job only
needs twenty hours of training, the company's going to take
the human, even if the human can be unreliable. Sometimes,

(39:46):
in my full opinion, will never change the world. But
with time, just as the Internet progressed, AI will one
day confidently enhance all human, everyday lives. I think it's
here to stay like that. Actually ties into some of
the questions we got from the Taylor's of Tech pro members,
and let me jump into those before I forget. But
Alpha de Wolfe was the first question. He said, when

(40:07):
will this AI fad ever die off? Because he's sick
of it, just like me. I don't think the AI
technology itself will ever die, but I do think that
the marketing of it will tone down eventually. Right now,
that's just the most interesting thing going on, I suppose,
And it honestly feels like it's more about the investors
than it is the consumer. I don't think, at least

(40:28):
for Apple, it changes much for the consumer. But it's
so the investors know that Apple is catching up with
everybody else. We're doing AI stuff too, because investors were like,
AI is where it's at. That's why open Ai got
all this investment. And that's what Google's doing with Gemini,
and Microsoft's doing and Meta's doing, so you guys need
to be doing that too. So Apple's over hyping the

(40:49):
Apple Intelligence stuff just to please the investors. In my opinion,
it's not really for the consumers, which is a shame.
It's like I would rather than be more focused on
cool features and cool heart where But yep, we're not
going to get that. But I don't think the technology
will die. The technology will be around, but it'll eventually
blurn too the background and not take up so much

(41:10):
of the marketing. I think right now it's taking up
a very disproportionate amount of the marketing material. Where Apple
is acting like iPhone sixteen is built for Apple Intelligence
from the ground up, and it's like, no, it's not.
It's a slightly tweaked version of the fifteen and it
has slightly more neural cores than before. That doesn't make it,
you know, as big a difference. It takes six months

(41:32):
to train one individual to drive, if even if it
takes ten years to train AI to drive, Once it does,
millions of cars will be able to drive. That's the difference. No,
I get it. It's a lot more scalable and repeatable.
But my point is they learn differently. Don't detract from
my original point. I'm not saying it's wrong to try
to develop self driving cars. I'm all in favor of it.

(41:52):
I want robot taxis. I freak out whenever I go
to the Bay, which is pretty regularly now, and I
see Google weimos driving around with nobody in them. I'm like, duh,
that's so cool, that's so exciting, and I want that
for our future. All I'm saying is, at the end
of the day, they learn very fundamentally differently how the
AI learns versus how a human learns. And the only

(42:14):
reason to build a robot that is shaped and behaves
like a human with arms, five fingers, and two legs
and two feet, the only reason to build that is
because you believe that the AI will learn just as
quickly or just like a human. And I don't think.
I don't think we're there yet. I think with the
humanoid robot application, it's edge case upon edge case upon,

(42:37):
it's like a million, a billion edge cases of well,
you need to behave this way, but not if this happens,
if this happens, that I need you to be like this,
or if this happens, I need you to be like this.
I actually think more specified robotics like a ROBOTAXI, like
a weaim, or like a Tesla cyber cab, or like

(42:57):
a Zeukes vehicle. That actually makes more sense. It's like
design a vehicle not to be driven around like a human,
like I guess a better example would be I think
it makes more sense. Like Jay Money said that, by
the way, thank you for thirty months of support. He says,
you would think the car's three sixty field of view
would help it, and it does. To be clear, there

(43:18):
are there are many applications where an autonomous ROBOTAXI even today,
like FSD or WEIMO, will perform better in one situation
because it's got at least eight eyes constantly looking around it.
And like you guys said, the AI will never get drunk,
it will never get drowsy, it will never get distracted.

(43:38):
It's got eight eyes surrounding it. That's good. That's how
you should design it. It's more specific for that task.
Even though when a human is driving a vehicle, we
don't have eight eyes constantly looking around the car. We
have a knack that's very versatile that we could look
around and make sure our surroundings are okay. But to me,
developing a generalized humanoid robot is kind of like saying, well,

(44:03):
let's turn any vehicle into a ROBOTAXI by just putting
a humanoid robot in the car with two eyes that
has to flip around, Like what if we had two
cameras inside the car that had to flip around and
move like a human head. It's like, no, you don't
want like motors and actuators shaking around, moving around like
the human head. No, the cameras are cheap and you

(44:24):
can put wires to them. Just put cameras on the back,
put cameras on the front, and let those cameras see
way better than a human ever could, and let them
see in the dark, and let them see in poor visibility.
And build a robot specific for that task. Build a robotaxi,
specifically for being a ROBOTAXI. Don't just try to emulate
the human driver. You can design the vehicle all around

(44:47):
the fact that it's autonomous. That's the way to do it.
In my opinion, that's a lot more practical than developing
a humanoid robot and say we're going to be able
to teach this thing anything and it will just learn
as quickly as a human can. I wish I saw
evidence that they're doing that, but I've watched several different
humanoid startups and I all see them hitting the same wall.

(45:10):
It's like they all start with the hardware, and they
all think that the hardware is the tricky part. They're like, okay,
let's develop a prototype. Let's have some demos where the
prototype picks up a backpack or picks up a box
or hands you a drink. It's like, okay, well, look
the humanoid robot is working. But it's like, yeah, but
it's being controlled by a person because we can't get
the robot brain to think and act and learn like

(45:32):
a human brain. We can make it appear like it
is with large language models and with neural netraining, but
it's really not. And that's why Tesla is still having
to rely so heavily on remote controlled human tracking because
you need a lot of data to train AI to
do very specific tasks. My uncle, I won't give away

(45:53):
too much, but my uncle kind of works with this
kind of neural net training and AI software development because
he's a software engineer and he's been for many decades.
And the example he used, which I thought was very helpful,
was a human understands context way more naturally than any machine,

(46:13):
even the smart ais, even the chatbots, even the you know,
machine learning, neural net whatever. Even though because he said
an example with a human is you show it a fork,
if you showed a human a fork and you said, hey, okay, listen,
this is a fork. Got it. A human's like, okay,
I get it. That's a fork. Then go this is
a spoon, and the human goes, okay, I see it

(46:35):
that spoon. There's a fork. Here's a spoon, got it.
Here's a plate. The human's like, all right, I get it.
Here's the plate, here's my fork, here's my spoon. I understand.
That's generally how a human brain kind of thinks, but
with a robot, with neural net training and machine learning,
if you're talking to a Tesla bot, for example, you

(46:55):
go okay, here's a fork, and the robot goes, okay,
I got it. This is a fork, and then you
hand it a spoon. You go here's a spoon, and
it goes, okay, I got it. This is a spoon,
and this is also a spoon. So now I have
two spoons. And you go no, no, no, no. That first
thing is a fork, and you go why why is
this a fork? Because they both aren't made of metal,
they both have a curvature at the end, a little

(47:18):
divid if you will, for scooping up food. They both
have these rounded backs they both have rounded handles. Therefore
these both must be spoons. And then you have to
feed it ten more images, ten more videos of what
a fork is before it understands the difference between no, no, no, no, fork, spoon, fork, spoon.
And then you introduce a plate and it goes, that's
a huge spoon. Then you have to explain, no, that's

(47:40):
not a spoon. This is a whole different thing. Here's
a hundred pictures of plates, so you understand the difference
between a plate and a fork and a spoon. So
he said, that's kind of a dumb down example, of course,
because I can't. I'm no expert in this field. But
all I can tell you is what I've seen and
what development usually goes much much slower than people anticipate.
It's always the software, it's never the hardware when it

(48:02):
comes to humanoid robotics. But what was more impressive in
your eyes? SpaceX achievement over the weekend or Tesla's with
the cybercab. Either way, what an amazing week from us?
Oh yeah, for me, easily the SpaceX achievement. I know
I don't really have a space channel, but for those
who don't know, I was extremely impressed by what SpaceX did.

(48:23):
I think it was on Sunday? Was that just yesterday? Wow,
it was pretty early in the morning. But yesterday it
was a first ever in the reusable rocket industry that
the first stage booster basically went back exactly to where
it took off. By the way, that's never happened before.
I know, we've seen rockets land with the Falcon nine,

(48:45):
which is an incredible feat of engineering in itself, but
they'd ever land exactly where they took off from. They
land at a launch pad, or they land on a
drone ship in the ocean. This is the first time
for one. It's also a starship booster, so it runs
on copletely different engines than the fucking nine, completely different
fuel fuel that's possibly fuel that's using compounds that can

(49:07):
be found on Mars, so that's why it's kind of
a big deal. It's also like the most powerful rocket
booster of all time, and they were able to catch
it mid flight with the control tower that it took
off from, so it comes back to the tower and
with these two arms, literally it just grabs it in
mid air. And this is the first time they've even
attempted to catch a rocket booster, which is fifteen stories

(49:30):
high by the way, it's basically like a giant flying
statue of liberty. It's never been attempted in the history
of mankind, by NASA, by Boeing, by Russia, by anybody.
And they were able to fly it all the way
back and the booster arms were able to catch it.
And yeah, there were people saying it was impossible, but
the truth is, it's just never been attempted. And it's

(49:52):
crazy to me that SpaceX was able to do it
successfully on their first attempt, because many people would have
considered it a successful mission even if it didn't catch it,
just because the intent behind these test flights is to
figure out what the weakened points are, what is failing,
what doesn't work yet, how do we make it better.
That's just kind of how SpaceX has gotten as far
as they have. That's why they're such a market leaders,

(50:14):
because they know how to push the limits and test
things and break things. It's honestly what I think Elon
should be spending most of his time doing. I think
he spends way too much time on Twitter and on Tesla.
I think he should spend all of his time on
SpaceX and neuralink in the boring Company. Those don't get
enough attention in my opinion. But yes, SpaceX achievement was fantastic.

(50:34):
The Cybercab event, nothing about it was particularly groundbreaking to me.
A lot of it was smoking mirrors, a lot of
it was premapped routes. It's a fairly efficient. It's a
cool looking vehicle. As a fan of super efficient evs,
I was excited to see it, but it's not more
efficient than an Apter era, and it's fairly similar in

(50:58):
design to existing the was a lot of people were
pointing out it looked just like the Volkswagen EXL one.
So making an aerodynamic small vehicle that's a two seater
is not unheard of. That's not like I've never been
done before. And I feel similarly about humanoid robots that
are remote controlled by humans that's also been done. I

(51:19):
would have been a bit more impressed if they let
people like high five the robot, but they weren't even
doing that. People were like, can I high five the
Tesla bot and they were like no, no, no, no, no,
air high five. You couldn't even fist bump the Tesla bot.
I was like Okay, if this thing is supposed to
like replace the labor force, it's got to be somewhat rugged.
It's got to be somewhat durable. And you're telling me

(51:39):
I can't. I can't just high five a little robot. No,
that might break it, that might push it over. It
was probably a liability thing, But I don't know. It's
just nothing with the humanoid robot has impressed me yet.
It's all just kind of like it walks, it talks,
it can pick up things. Wow, And I'm like, that's like,

(52:01):
I don't know if the goal of making a generalized
humanoid robot that can learn and do things just like
a human learns and does things, that achievement is like
climbing to the top of Mount Everest, And what they've
shown us with the Tesla bot so far, which is walking,
picking up packages, handing out drinks, that's like climbing a

(52:23):
jungle gym. It's like, Okay, it's climbed the jungle gym,
but it's still got to get to the top of
Mount Everest. That's that's kind of how I see development.
Whereas what SpaceX did yesterday with the super Heavy Booster
being caught in mid air. That's like, that's huge. That's
game changing because it puts the rocket booster right back
where it needs to be to be refueled so that

(52:44):
it could launch again within the hour, which is a
very very key crucial part of figuring out lower cost
to orbit making space travel more affordable is figuring out
how to make it rapidly reusable and are recyclable. And
the fact that they did that on their very first
attempt is kind of mind blowing. So yeah, I wasn't

(53:04):
tweeting or posting much about it because it doesn't really
go with you know, the text stuff I normally tweet,
but that was an amazing milestone for SpaceX. That's definitely
the coolest thing he did. Anyway. That's kind of a
side tangent, but that's a huge spoon. They used two
giant spoons to catch it, right exactly. I still wonder

(53:26):
what exactly we will end up doing with everything SpaceX does.
I don't think the Mars missions are going to be
as sought after or profitable as Elon does, but I
do think that there's a lot of industry that could
come from space tourism, lunar tourism particularly. I think that
the Moon could basically become like Las Vegas. You know,

(53:49):
you look around when you go to Las Vegas and
there's like nothing. It's just this desolate desert. But here's
all this development in casinos and you know, industry and
enterprise that went in there, that turned it into a
destination even though it's really just a big desert. And
I think that you could basically do something similar with
the Moon because be a ride in itself, just getting there.

(54:12):
It's not that far away, so you could have internet
access and you could go there and come back within
a week or two. You'd be like, I'm going to
go to the Moon for a couple weeks and come back,
and you don't have to worry about bone density or
losing too much muscle mass, or being too far away
from home. You go to Mars like you suddenly can't
have phone calls or FaceTime calls anymore. Like the speed

(54:33):
of light won't let information even if you covered Mars
and Starlink satellites, and you had Starlink satellites going all
the way between Earth and Mars, it's just they get
out of sync with each other. You could only the
shortest you could do a Mars trip is about two
and a half years because they end up on opposite
ends of the Solar System, so at certain times of
the year you couldn't even send text messages to people

(54:57):
back on Earth with out having to wait fifteen minutes
thirty minutes each way. Hey dad's in the stream. That's cool.
Lower cost of space travel makes other stuff possible. Mining
on the Moon, Mars asteroids, yeah, I don't know what else.
I don't know what much there would be to do
in regards to mining, But I just think SpaceX is

(55:18):
all about, like you know, it's a private company, so
they're trying. They're constantly figuring out what's the revenue stream.
So if there was some proof that we could find
something on the Moon or Mars or asteroids that was
super valuable, like gold or platinum, then there could be
an industry built around it. But so far there hasn't
been much evidence that there's a lot of valuable minerals
and stuff to pull from out there, Whereas if we

(55:41):
turned it into a tourist industry, we turned it into
something fun, then there could actually be a revenue stream
for it. That's why SpaceX was so focused on Starlink
was because Starlink wasn't just you know, space travel or
space stuff for the sake of space stuff. It was
we could flood the atmosphere. We could not the atmosphere,

(56:01):
but you know the outer We could flood low Earth
orbit with satellites that allow anywhere on Earth to be
to have access to fast, reliable Internet access so that
during emergencies, or you can be on cruise ships in
the middle of the ocean, or you could be miles
away from the nearest cell tower and still get adequate

(56:23):
Internet service. Basically revolutionized the satellite satellite internet industry because
no one else could get Internet that fast because no
one could deploy satellites at that scale. So now they've
reached the point that it's profitable. I don't know if
you guys were aware of that, but Starlink in itself
is now a profitable business because they have like tens

(56:43):
of millions of people all paying like one hundred bucks
a month to have access to the Starlink network, and
now SpaceX is actually making money on that. So in
order for a private sector to succeed, they need to
have some kind of revenue stream. Elon's theory was that
there would be people willing to pay money to go
to Mars and live there, and I just personally don't

(57:04):
think that's gonna happen. I think that it's too far,
it's too disconnected from the rest of humanity. You're not
gonna be able to have video calls, You're not going
to be able to have phone calls. Texting is going
to be slow and unreliable. It's very cold up there,
and I don't and knowing that the shortest possible Mars

(57:24):
trip is going to be two years, that's a big commitment.
I don't know if everybody's going to be comfortable going two, three,
four years. When they go up into space and they're
in zero gravity for months at a time. Now you
got to worry about bone density and muscle mass. It's
a lot of work, and it's very isolating, and it's
theoretically fairly dangerous because basically there's no law enforcement up there,

(57:46):
so if people lose their mind, whoever has the strongest
punch basically calls the shots, and you can't arrest a
person if they start being abusive up in space. Are
up on March, I think there's all kinds of issues
with traveling to Mars when it comes to the human factor,
but with the Moon it's a lot closer. You can
have internet access on the Moon. You can have FaceTime
calls with people on the Moon. You can have phone
calls with people in Hawaii to the Moon. You could

(58:09):
have a star based resort on Earth where you hang
out and then you go to the Moon for like
a week and then come back and you're only in
space and zero gravity for a couple of days, and
then you can jump around in low gravity on the Moon,
much lower gravity than Mars, by the way, and you
can hang out up there. You could have super crazy
basketball games where people can jump thirty feet in the air.
And just because it's closer and the time commitment is

(58:32):
much less and the internet connection would be much better.
That's why I personally believe there's a lot more that
could be done with just building a fun Las Vegas
style experience on the moon. Mars would be a lot
more challenging though. That's basically like do you want to
give up your life and friends and family for the
next four years. Helium nine would be a fuel for

(58:55):
fusion front in the Moon, mining where there are fewer
people to effect. That's a good point, Dad, I didn't
think of that. Dad also says colonies on Mars would
have to be self contained. If a resources found it
could be self supported. It could be I just don't
think the demand will be very high. Like there will
be scientists maybe that are willing to go up there
and have a job and have a role. But I
could see people five months into the zero gravity journey

(59:18):
realizing that they can't call their loved ones and have
to wait longer for text messages to send. In an
era where we already are battling with attention spans, Elon
is figuring that people are going to pay money to
move to Mars. That was his original grand vision, that
you would spend two hundred thousand dollars. That's the dream scenario,
which of course never happens. In the dream case scenario,

(59:41):
he thinks you will go out of your way to
spend two hundred thousand dollars to move to a cold
desert so you can mind stuff. I don't think that's
gonna happen. And you don't know all those people around you,
everybody on the Martian colony. If one guy annoys you,

(01:00:01):
you can't move away from him. You're stuck with that guy.
If some guy annoys you on the spaceship to the Moon,
you can just put up with him for a week
and then you're done and you go back home. Just
be like, Okay, I'm not sitting next to that guy again.
With Mars, it's like, oh, I'm stuck with him for
the next four years. That guy's kind of annoying. And
I can't even call home and call my parents or

(01:00:23):
call my kids, or call my sister and be like, boy,
this guy is really driving me nuts. You can't have
a phone call anymore. You go to Mars. I would
not move to Mars. No, at least not at this
stage of life. No. I just I got too many
friends and family members here I wouldn't want to leave behind.
Maybe I reached a point where everybody I ever loved

(01:00:44):
or cared about was gone and I was all that's
left and I only had five years left of my life.
Maybe that'd be fun. I don't know. Probably not, I
don't know. I think Earth is pretty cool. We got
oceans and waterfalls, and it's really fun to hike here.
You want to experience Mars just like go out in
the middle of Utah, desert and drop you off and

(01:01:06):
act like you can only breathe through scuba gear. I
just don't think humans are meant to be away from
Earth for extended periods of time without some massive terraforming
going on. Maybe when a colony has been set up
so they have oxygen enclosed canopies and trees and water
and all that. But then again it's like, well cool,

(01:01:27):
you spend all that money and time to just make
it more like Earth. I don't really get the whole personally,
I don't really understand the whole. We need to have
a backup planet in case things go wrong with Earth.
I'm like, I mean, Earth would be a lot easier
to fix up than Mars. Earth might have a lot
of problems, but at least we could freaking breathe here.

(01:01:50):
Can you imagine how much work it's going to take
to turn Mars into a inhabitable planet without you know,
living within little bubble and domes everywhere, which of course
could be easily damaged, and again is not that large,
and so even even a massive dome isn't going to
hold as many people as planet Earth. Miners prison colony

(01:02:14):
miners making money for a short term five to ten years,
come home and retire. Yeah, it just doesn't sound very
fun to me. We're having a hard time getting people
to work at Burger King. Imagine getting them to commit
to ten years on a desolate planet. I don't know.
There's a lot of a lot of things on Earth
I would like to experience before I go to Mars.

(01:02:36):
It's like living at a mall. Imagine being on a
planet where you can't you can't take your shoes off
and feel the touch of grass. Imagine not being able
to go swimming, you know, swim in a pool on
a hot summer day, Go to a lake, go on
a boat, go canoeing in a river, play in the snow,

(01:02:59):
Climb a tree you smell like fresh air, hear the
birds chirping in the woods. All of these things you'd
have to say goodbye to. You wouldn't get that anymore.
You'd have to listen to replays of it on your headphones,
on your beat studio pros. I don't know. I don't
think Mars would be fun, but I could do the Moon. Yeah,

(01:03:20):
it just got be gone for a couple of weeks.
Jump around up there, play some games. Sure that sounds fun.
Elizabeth says, terraforming Mars it's not possible. Oh, dream bigger, Elizabeth,
this is possible. We're terraforming California as is. We're already
changing the world with all of our waters and dams,

(01:03:41):
and you know, like we can terraform the anything. Thank
you Raptor Buddy for joining day Leze Tech plus anyway,
Moon River says, this space discussion is bumming me out.
I don't mean to bum you out. I think it'd
be fun. Just bring Apple Vision. Oh yeah, you wear
Apple Vision Pro and you can pretend you're on Earth.
You'd be two iPhone generations behind. Yeah, you're not getting

(01:04:02):
the latest iPhone. Yeah. Not be fun, though I'd like
to look down at the Earth from above. We'd miss
all those places and people I love. So although I
might like it for one afternoon, I don't want to
live on the Moon. No, not live there, but I
think it'd be a fun place to visit. I don't
want to live in Las Vegas either, but it's a
fun place to visit. The Moon would just be such

(01:04:27):
a great way for I think everybody to experience zero gravity.
You get to experience a little bit of space travel,
you get a rocket launch. I think that's like a
Disney ride and once it's safe and consistent and reliable.
I mean, think of the g forces you experience on
a roller coaster and then on a starship rocket. You know,
you strap in, your seat goes back and you feel

(01:04:48):
the rumble of the rockets and you fly into space
and then you're in zero gravity and it's really quiet,
and there's probably games up there you can play, and
you could play pong with ping pong without a board
and now you're just hit and the ping pong back
and forth. You play around in zero gravity for a
few days. You get to the Moon and it's like
a big fun Las Vegas thing there. I don't know
there's casinos. That's basically what the moon is. It's just

(01:05:13):
Las Vegas without air. But think of the sports. Think
of how far? Think of golfing, like how far could
you hit a golf ball on the moon. That in
itself sounds funner. You could have bumper cars or do
off roading. They could build four wheelers and all wheel
drive little off road dunebuckey machines that are encapsulated and

(01:05:34):
you drive around on the Moon and see what the
off roading is like all kinds of fun stuff you
could do up there, and then after a week or
two you're done, you just go home. I think that'd
be fun. I think a lot of people would be
willing to pay big money for that, and then over
time they could work on lowering the prices. But oh, yeah,
play the Harry Potter broom gave. Yeah, quidditche Yeah, they

(01:05:55):
could throw stuff around, see how far you can throw stuff.
I think it'd be a great time, just a little vacation.
I don't think we need to leave the planet forever,
but I just think the Earth has got to be
really screwed up to get to a point where Mars
would make more sense. Because Mars has got a lot
of problems, especially with the solar radiation. Doesn't have a

(01:06:17):
powerful a magnetic field to stop from the gamra. Mars
could be a great high security colony. Suppose if I
watched For All Mankind, the way you talk about this
stuff makes you think you should. If you haven't, I've
seen clips of it and parts of it, but no,
I don't have Apple TV Plus at the moment. Anyway,

(01:06:41):
what's going on? I think it's windy. I gambled all
of our money on the Moon on Starbucks. Get it? Okay,
I'll stop anyway. There's other questions from Taylor's of tech
pro members. Let me read these here. Marjelle's got a
funny story and a question. He says, I work at

(01:07:02):
a place that takes in iPhone trade ins and ships
them to Apple, and one night, a customer drops off
an iPhone that's already packed at to have it shipped.
Excuse me. Thirty minutes later, he comes back after realizing
he was still using his fifteen Promax, so I had
to get his box, and as it turns out, he
accidentally traded in his brand new sixteen Promax. Even when

(01:07:24):
he had the phone side by side, we still couldn't
figure out which phone was which until I looked for
the camera control I guess that shows two things. For one,
that guy was not paying attention at all, and two,
the new iPhone pros looked more identical to the last
generation than ever before. Okay, here's the question. How long
do I think the iPhone will have camera control button
before Apple removes it like they did with three D Touch.

(01:07:44):
I give it three generations and they'll remove it with
iPhone nineteen or twenty. Yeah, I think that's pretty plausible,
depending on the use cases of it. I know some
people in the tech community have defended it and said
they like it, but a lot haven't. I'm like, if
the tech community is to then the average consumer is
probably not divided. I wouldn't be shocked at all if
the vast majority of people don't use camera control. But yeah,

(01:08:09):
I agree with you, probably around three years, maybe a
little more. It took a while for three D touch
to go away, but a lot of people like three
D touch. The tech community was fairly positive on three
D touch early on, and it took a while before
Apple was like, you know how people just start using
this thing. But now that the tech community is already
hard on camera control, yeah, I feel like it might

(01:08:33):
be less than That's about three year sounds right. Outer
Space Australia, Well, there's a lot less spiders on Mars,
I hope. Imagine having beef with someone and getting flying
sidekicked Jupiter. Oh, it's fun. I don't think it's going
to happen in the very near term future though, It's

(01:08:53):
going to take a long time. But the key to
building a fun experience or fun travel Desk Nation on
the Moon is drastically lowering the cost of delivering payload
to orbit, and part of that is of course rapidly
reusable rocketry. So that's why what SpaceX did with the
Starship booster was so influential. It was like, yep, that's

(01:09:15):
the key thing, and they got it on the first try,
which is impressive. Burkhard says, all of the non techi
people my age like camera control and want sixteens for it. Wow,
we live in very different places. That's fascinating because nobody
I know wants it, even the people who have the
iPhone sixteen don't really care about it. Maybe wanting it

(01:09:38):
and using it is two different things, But I don't know.
We'll see moon River says, I tried camera control. It
seems pointless. Yeah, I just don't understand why you wouldn't
just do it on the display. Also, colonizing the Moon
will shut up flat earther so that's a plus. Don't
expect to get rationale and logic from flat earthers. I
do think you'll probably get some billionaires that pay to

(01:09:59):
fly flat earthers. They'll probably they'll probably point out the
Earth and say no, it's round and flat. We don't.
There's nothing that will shut up a flat earther, don't,
I think? My dad? Yeah, Like the Italian Stallion says,
those people never shut up. My dad had a friend.

(01:10:21):
I forget who, but my dad was telling me this
story that he had a friend that was working on
a documentary to explain why the Earth was round and
why flat earthers were so wrong, And he was like,
why are you trying to reason with these things? I
would not try to waste my time explaining all of that,
with all the different ways we can check to make

(01:10:43):
sure that the Earth is round. It's like, you don't
believe that? Why would I? Why would I try? What's
the point? They clearly just want to be a non conformist.
Doesn't matter what you tell them, they're not going to be.
And that's that's a lesson I've learned over the years,
especially with dealing with a lot of electric vehicle misinformation
out there, is that you can't necessarily rationalize with anybody

(01:11:05):
because it assumes that people just will believe the facts,
when in reality, people believe what they want to believe.
This happens a lot in our divisive country, especially during
a political season we're in right now, you see a
news story that supports your viewpoint, you're gonna believe that one.
And then when you see a news story that doesn't

(01:11:26):
support your viewpoint, you won't believe that one. And you say,
can we really trust that? So people believe what they want.
That's what I've learned about. It's not just a tech
commune anything. That's just a human being thing, the confirmation bias.
You know, I'm more likely to believe things that support
my ideology in my viewpoint, and if something doesn't support that,

(01:11:48):
then I'll write it off as probably an accurate and
poorly researched. Happens on both sides political spectrum all the time.
A brain transplant might silence a flat earth. Well, I
don't think you can have a brain transplant without a brain,
but that's just my opinion. Have I seen the cyberpunk
d Runners, there's a similar situation to what you're describing
for the Moon in it. I've yet to see anyone

(01:12:09):
showcase Las Vegas on the Moon. That's that's all I'm bitching.
People go there for a couple weeks at a time.
You never are there for much longer than a month
or two, because then your muscle density starts falling apart,
your bones start getting more fragile, which is a real
problem with space travel. If people are up there for
months at a time, then you got to start including

(01:12:31):
gym equipment and make sure everybody's working out a certain
amount of time. I feel like that would get really
annoying on Mars missions, making sure everybody's exercising the proper amount.
We can't get people to go to the gym on
this planet. Now we're going to try to get people
to go to the space gym when they're halfway to Mars.
I watched a terrible movie yesterday that none of you

(01:12:53):
should watch, but it's called The Idiocracy, and it's the
most accurate portrayal of the future I think I've ever seen.
Do not watch this movie. It's terrible. Two more weeks
and you can start using Apple intelligence features. I'm so excited.

(01:13:14):
It's also the cognitive disonessance that's of worry people who
preach one thing and then do another thing in practice. Yeah,
that's another thing. It's true, But again, don't think you
can reason with everybody. That's why I think a lot
of political discourse online is mostly pointless is because it's like,
you're not gonna stop believing what you're believing, and you're

(01:13:36):
not gonna stop believing what you're believing, but you're gonna
argue all day with this person about why they're wrong,
and you're just gonna make the other person feel even
more right about their opinion. So we just got a
lot more stressed, our heart rates went a lot higher,
and we got angry. We wasted time instead of saying
nice things to people we love or hanging out with

(01:13:56):
people we care about. Instead, we just spend all of
our time being mad with strangers on the internet, Like,
why don't you just keep all that crap to yourself
and vote how you're going to vote, And you know,
if you can find someone who you can rationally and
respectfully debate with, good for you. But I feel like
that rarely happens, at least on the internet. Which will
happen first, Apple removing camera control or Tesla putting Robobin

(01:14:19):
into mass production? Uh, removing camera control is not that
far away. I would say only three or four years,
So definitely, I think the Robobin is going to be
even later than the Roadster. The Roadster was supposed to
come out in twenty twenty, and we're going into twenty
twenty five still no roadster. So that's five years late.

(01:14:41):
And I think the Robobin's going to be even more
challenging to get into production. Oh you're right, I'm going
home to rethink my life. You want to buy some desticks.
Did the cyber Taxi have a trunk? I'd totally get
one if it had a steering wheel in a trunk.
Oh yeah, I had a massive trunk. I'll pull up
a picture of it here if you want. It was

(01:15:02):
actually bigger than the trunk and my Model three, despite
the vehicle being smaller than my Model three, I think
this one's it. Let me pull it up here. Check
that out. It's massive. It's basically just pure trunk behind
the seats, lots of storage space. You could fit so
many bodies back there, I mean pieces of luggage. Excuse me,

(01:15:26):
what did I say? Apple doesn't need to remove camera control,
They just need to make it solid state and move
it to be more ergonomic. The problem is, as you
make it more ergonomic and landscape, it becomes less ergonomic
in portrait. And I think the data Apple's going to
see over time is more likely just going to show
that nobody uses it. Anyway, they might tweak it a

(01:15:46):
little bit. You're right, maybe next year they'll tweak it,
or the year after that they'll move it a little bit,
or they'll make it just solid state. But in the end,
I think they're going to realize that just nobody's using it,
and they'll get rid of it to save on cost
and make manufacturing easy. But I think we had another
question from Nicholas. Oh yeah, I save this for last
because unfortunately the answer is not that interesting. But Nicholas

(01:16:10):
lent the com says, what was Louise's first impressions when
she started using your old iPhone fifteen pro? It was
not a max by the way, it was just a pro.
Must have been miles ahead from the iPhone ten she
was using. Has she come to appreciate all the smaller
day to day benefits from making such a jump? Can't
wait to see the video where she gives her thoughts.
Just curious on her initial impressions for the meantime. Yeah,

(01:16:30):
you're not gonna like this answer, but she really hasn't
cared much at all. She's made very few comments about it.
She's complained if anything, because the fifteen Pro is one
hundred and twenty eight gigs and the iPhone ten was
two fifty six gig. That was the one compromise she made.
So when she switched over, she was like, it keeps
telling me it's filling up with storage, because obviously she

(01:16:50):
moved a bunch of her photos and videos over. I'm like, yeah,
I'm sorry I didn't get the two fifty six gigs.
She'd be like, oh, we should have gotten two fifty
And I was like, how do you like the dynamic island?
She was like the what? And I was like a
little thing at the top that opens up. She was like, oh, yeah,
it's fine. You know, I'm craving any kind of opinion

(01:17:11):
from her with the iPhone fifteen Pro. I'm like, give
me something to work with, honey, I want you to
say anything about this. And she's just like, yeah, that's fine,
it's a phone. Whatever. She's she is, so I envy her.
I wish I could have her opinion on tech because
using older tech would be so much easier for me

(01:17:33):
if I didn't care about the little things. But like
just today, she was taking a picture and she was like,
why can't I get the exposure right right, I'm trying
to adjust it and it's not right. She's the average consumer, yeah,
she said, normal human being that doesn't make a big
deal out of everything like we do. So she made
no comments, absolutely zero comments about one hundred and twenty hertz.

(01:17:53):
Never said a word. Yeah that I'm telling you everything
I've heard. I'm not leaving anything to the imagination. You know.
We were switching around phones because my younger sister needed
a upgrade from her iPhone six, so she's on the
iPhone ten now and my wife is on the iPhone

(01:18:15):
fifteen Pro. So the switch, my wife's main focus was
getting the iPhone ten ready for her sister, and then
the fifteen Pro was the least of her worries. She
was just like, yeah, just set it up, make sure
everything transferred in it works. And I'm like, okay, here
you go, and she's like, okay, got it. But no,
she was like, no, she's made no comments on the

(01:18:39):
better battery life. Pretty sure she has a charger at work,
so that's not really something she thinks or worries about.
Do I think the Dynamic Island is any better looking
than the notch? No, if we're talking purely aesthetically, I
think the notch is actually less intrusive because the the
dynamic island cuts deeper into at the display. I like

(01:19:01):
the dynamic island when it's doing things, though, it's so
much better than the notch. When it actually like opens
up for air drop notifications or shows now playing widgets
or timers at the top of the screen. You can
hold them to expand them. When dynamic Island is actually
serving its point and you know, serving its purpose and

(01:19:21):
being dynamic, that's when I really like it, and I'm like, Okay,
this is better than the notch. But when it's doing
nothing and just sitting there, that's when I'm like, yeah,
it's just cutting in on my content for no reason.
The way you talk about your pisky morials may not
be true. After all, I said, excuse me, fair point.
If she has a charger with her no, she just
she hasn't commented hardly at all. I mean, she's she's

(01:19:44):
already gotten tot points where she was like, I tried
to plug in my phone and it didn't work. I
need a USBC cable And I'm like, yes, you do, honey,
let me get you a type Sea Cable, What about
USBC or does she chase mag Safe Charge? She mostly
mag Safe Charge. She still has a bag Safe duo.
That's how she charges her fifteen Pro. But yeah, she's

(01:20:04):
very honestly, I think she's complained about it more than anything.
She's been like, the storage isn't as much as it
used to be. I wish I'd had more storage. And
I remember her saying at one point, I thought it
would be faster. She was trying to load things, like
when we're driving around and we're on the go, she's
trying to load a web page, or she's trying to
load a website. Maybe this is a dock on Mint Mobile.

(01:20:26):
But she was like, you know, I thought when I
got a new phone it would load things faster. But
things are still taking too long. And I was like, sorry,
it may be because she ran out of data, which
I kept telling her, but she was like, yeah, but
I ran out of data before and it could still
load things. I was like, yeah, but it's going to
be slower, and she's like, this feels slower than my
iPhone ten sometimes specifically when talking about cellular connectivity. So

(01:20:52):
I wish I could say that she's so happy and
thrilled to finally be on the fifteen pro. But no,
she's yeah, she was kind of annoyed that she had
to get new cables because she was used to charging
with lightning and now she couldn't do that anymore. But
I had lots of type Sea cables, so I was like, here, here,
just switch to this, and she's like, oh, fine, A

(01:21:13):
seventeen Pro not fast enough. I don't think it's a
CPU problem. I think she was complaining about web pages
not loading in places where she was out of data.
But she intentionally wants to be on the lowest data plan.
I keep telling her, honey, we could easily just upgrade
to a higher data plan, and she's like, no, I
don't want to spend more money. I'm fine with the
data plan I have, but you know, she just doesn't

(01:21:35):
feel like upgrading it. I've tried, guys, I've tried to
get her opinion. I've tried so hard, but she just
doesn't have one. She just doesn't care. Uh oh, Mike
Galabo says, I just joined in. My airpod's max didn't connect,
so the stream started blasting at full volume off my
phone in my college dining hall. Yikes, so many people

(01:21:58):
heard my voice. Now turn off the animations. She'll think
it seems much faster. She doesn't want me change in settings,
I think. Does she at least use the eighty percent limit? No, which,
by the way, I did for the year, and it
didn't help the battery health at all. It's still degraded.
So thanks for the update. Hopefully she comes around to
the benefits or finds another phone that suits her better.

(01:22:20):
I don't think there is a phone that suits her better.
She just doesn't care. I just think she wants to
have the phone she has and not have to worry
about it and not have to think about it. And
I think that's a big difference between the average consumer
and the tech community. The tech community will upgrade out
of boredom, whereas the average consumer upgrades out of necessity.

(01:22:42):
The average consumer doesn't like changing their phone. They want
to use the phone they already have for as long
as possible, and the only reason they're going to upgrade
it is because something's wrong with it or something stops working.
They're not looking for new features. The only reason they
bought a new phone is because they couldn't do something
they were already doing. That's why people like my grain
are still getting by with an iPhone seven. My grandma,

(01:23:04):
you ready for an upgrade. You want to get something new,
And she's like, Eh, it's fine. The seven works and
does what I need it to. As soon as it
stops doing what she needs it to, she'll consider buying
a new one. But it's not because she wants an
ultra wide lens. It's not because she wants to run
the latest iOS. It's not because she wants Apple Intelligence.
It's just because she want They want the phone that's
already doing the thing to keep doing the thing. That's

(01:23:26):
all it is. Average consumer cares slightly more than Drew's wife.
She just doesn't care at all. I disagree. I think
you guys probably think the average consumer cares more than
they really do. Depends on the person. We're bunching together
a very very large demographic. The average consumer consists of

(01:23:47):
billions of people, So of course you're gonna find some
average consumers that are slightly more interested in new features,
and other average consumers who couldn't care less. But I'm
just telling you, for at least my social circle, no
one gives a crap. Do you think if Apple gave
the iPhone a punch hole. Would it be any less
distracting than the dynamic island? I feel like it is

(01:24:07):
a punch hole, isn't it. What's the definition? You mean?
It's just a circle at the top instead of an oval. No,
I don't find I wouldn't find that less distracting. It's
still a hole in the display. There's still a cutout
of some kind. No one bought the iPhone sixteen for
Apple Intelligence, I hope not because they didn't get it.

(01:24:27):
I'm fine with the five gig plan, but I hate
it when it's slowed to load because I use more
than five gig. Yeah. She just said she's done that before,
and it felt like the iPhone ten was faster. I
think it's a perception thing. Maybe she was hoping it
would feel way faster. Dad says, you are right aptly stated.

(01:24:49):
Just depends on your social circle, I suppose. But I
feel like I'm becoming an average consumer for phone slowly.
I bought my phone on a plan. I don't care
how fast it is, it just works. Yeah. I think
that's a good inviting line of If you get bored
with your phone and you just want to upgrade, it
because you're bored with it and you're like, I want
something new. I just want to mix it up a

(01:25:09):
little bit. That's more of a techie. But if you're
the kind of person that's like, I'm going to keep
using this phone until it stops working, then you're an
average consumer. My dad says, I have computers from nineteen
ninety nine. Ah, those computers are about as old as me.
You have computers older than that. I think we did
a on a live stream, but no, I think that's

(01:25:32):
rumored to happen top Maverick with the iPhone seventeen Pro.
They're going to put the face I D sensors underneath
the display and then it'll just be a circle at
the top instead of an oval. But again, it's not
a big change. It's still going to be a cutout
at the end of the day. There's still going to
be something obtruding on your content, and uh, there's still

(01:25:53):
going to be a dynamic island at the top. So
do you think smartphone appliances are like toasters or microwaves? Well,
for a lot of people, yeah, they already are. Why
would you go out of your way to upgrade your
toaster unless something was inherently wrong with your current toaster.
I don't know. I work for a major grocery retailer

(01:26:15):
and we're finally getting tapped to pay. My region gets
it next week. Exactly ten years after Apple Pay launch.
There are still places I go that don't support tap
to pay. It's quite mind blowing. And even the places
I see people that have tap to pay, a lot
of people will still pay with a card. They will
still use the chip reader even though they could tap

(01:26:36):
the card. It's hard to get people to change their
mind on things. Raptor Buddy says, are you going to
be reviewing the Pixel nine pro anytime soon? I'm constantly
looking at the secondhand market because I am constantly considering
when I review the Pixel nine that I might want
to keep it. I'm not saying I definitely will keep it,
but there's a chance I fall in love with it

(01:26:57):
and I want to hold on to it. And if
there's a chance that I keep it, I want to
make sure that I get a really good deal on it,
so I won't be buying it brand new from Google
because that's the that's the fastest way to get the
maximum amount of depreciation. So I'm looking at the used
secondhand market, which there's already been quite a bit of depreciation.

(01:27:20):
I think i've seen every week i'm checking the prices.
By the way, I'm just holding off. I'm pulling the trigger.
But I've seen some prices go down to sorry, I
think I just saw something that was weird. I've seen
some prices go down to like eight hundred nine hundred
bucks for the I'm wearing a shirt right now that's

(01:27:44):
older than drew eight hundred nine hundred bucks for the
nine pro or the pro XL. I think I've seen
a few listings already go below a thousand. But I'm
also kind of holding out for renewed because if you
buy through Amazon Renewed, it's like ninety day return windows.

(01:28:05):
And I want to have a longer term review experience.
I don't want to do the typical just I buy
the phone for a week and then I do the
review video and say whether or not I'm keeping it.
I want to review it for a while. I want
to give it a good, honest try. And I think
if I could prove my wife doesn't want me to
switch to Android for the record, but if I could
prove to her that I could use it for two months,

(01:28:29):
or we could live with it for two months. She
might be more accepting to the idea. What do you
think about Apple doing foldable phones in a near future.
I wouldn't buy one, but I think they should do
it just to get people talking about it. I think
they would make the best foldable They would probably get
the software better than anybody else. But yeah, I just
think Apple has to do something other than just slight

(01:28:49):
iterations on the iPhone in its current form. That's not
that's not helping. It's just every year, it's the same
media coverage. It's not that different. It's not that different.
It's not that different, over and over and over again.
I already think the idphone seventeen lineup sounds particularly boring.
The best thing we got going for it is there's
a slim model. That's it. There's one that's just a

(01:29:13):
little thinner, and there's promotion on the base models. Except
the people who buy base models don't care about promotions,
so I don't. I don't think that's a big upgrade personally,
So I think that well, folding phones are niche. I
don't think they're the future. I don't think folding phones
are going to become the norm. I do think Apple

(01:29:33):
should make one, just because for the media attention, just
to mix things up a little bit. Apple, come on,
you can't just keep doing slightly better chips, slightly better cameras,
slightly better this and that. It's like, no, just rethink
the form factor a little bit. Just show that you're
you're trying something new. That's kind of why Samsung did it.
Ask Taurus, if you can sponsor with their latest pixel cases,

(01:29:55):
then make you give you the phone. I still don't don't.
I don't want to phones. Yeah, I guess I kind
of already have two phones. I forget about the douchey.
Sometimes wonder if I could find a good left hand
on the second hand market. My left hand doesn't work.
I'm sorry, James, I'm laughing, but it's not funny. Honestly,

(01:30:17):
there's a chance that I would step down to the
normal model. You could, but again, why buy the iPhone
seventeen when you could probably buy a sixteen Pro or
a fifteen pro for less money. You'd still get the
hundred twenty hertz and you'd probably get the faster USBC port.
Apple should try new things, even if they're not the
most popular thing. I don't think an oled M four

(01:30:38):
chip iPad pro is a game changer. That's a specific niche.
Like people who want to spend three thousand dollars on
an iPad. There's not a lot of people that want
to drop three grand on a tablet, but Apple has
an option for those people. So similarly, there's probably not
a lot of people that would drop three thousand dollars
on a folding iPhone, but Apple should have an option

(01:30:59):
for the people that feel like doing that. That's just
how I feel. But or the Pro, because I think
five X is worse than the three X. Yeah, you'll
get a three X on a fifteen Pro, but you
won't get it on an iPhone seventeen. I've seen the
trifold Wahwei phone. It does look crazy, but again it's

(01:31:21):
a Wawei phone, so I'm never getting that. Clearly, the
public believes you, judging by sales, Well, clearly, Apple has
a very good track record of making something really expensive
that the tech community doesn't think is worth it, and
then a bunch of average consumers go out and buy.
So if you're gonna sell a three thousand dollars iPad,

(01:31:43):
you might as well sell a three thousand dollars folding iPhone.
Why not. I agree tech is boring. That's why I'm
spending more and more time over on Telos a VV.
But I've got some more videos in the works for
the next week. But today's schedule was a little weird
because I was doing some outside of work stuff. So
that's why I just decided, you know what, we haven't

(01:32:05):
streamed in a while. Let's do a live stream today,
but back to your regularly scheduled videos tomorrow. There has
been some talk of Apple moving away from yearly upgrades,
which is not a good sign for tech YouTubers because
that affects us more than anything. Do you think Apple
do anything new or interesting for its twentieth anniversary model? Yeah?

(01:32:27):
I thought they were gonna do something big for the
tenth anniversary of the Apple Watch, and they didn't. In fact,
they made it worse in several ways, so I would
argue that the twentieth anniversary tenth anniversary thing is not
a real deal. I dropped one thousand dollars on the
folding idphone, and then I'd pick up the three thousand
dollars and use it elsewhere. I'm not even saying I

(01:32:50):
would buy one. I'm just saying I think it'd be
a good idea for marketing reasons. I would rather Apple
make a niche, super expensive folding phone that most people
don't buy, than over promise on Apple Intelligence features, which
is what we're getting now. Just to have something different,
just a new form factor to see if some people
like it. I think it'd be cool. I think it'd

(01:33:11):
give the tech community something to gnaw on for a while,
be like, Okay, here's Apple's take on a foldable. Here's
what we like, here's what we don't like. And maybe
the software would be better. It'd be like ipedos unfolded
iOS when folded up like that. Sounds like a really
cool product, even in the slightest would be good. Say
a Slim, a curved reminiscent of the three Gs. Ooh.

(01:33:34):
I didn't like the three Gs because it wobbled too
much being all rounded, But I think there's a decent
chance the seventeen Slim is a folding phone, and it's
just a flip phone and it just goes back and
forth like that. It's not like a hamburger, but more
of a what is it hot? Dog. No, that doesn't
sound right. It's more like a Galaxy Z flip and
less like a Z fold. But maybe next year they'll

(01:33:57):
have a fold ready. The most exciting thing for the
twentieth anniversary might be a foldable. But that's it. Yeah,
they really got nothing else much hyped. I think probably
the most interesting iPhone of the next year is the
se four and that's coming out in the spring. So
what the iPhone seventeen comes out? I don't know what

(01:34:18):
I know. I say this every year, but it is true.
I mean, the sixteen was kind of a big letdown
this year, Drew, you actually changed a lot. You can
now say you have been paid by Apple and had
a sponsorship on your channel. Your opinion on what's to
come in the next year for this channel, ooof I've got.
I've got very little on my plan. There's a lot

(01:34:39):
of things for my future. Someone asked earlier in the stream.
I doubt they're still here, But someone asked in the
very beginning of the stream, if this is my full
time job. The truth is no, I've taken up a
position at a startup company in the Bay and that's
taking up just as much time, if not more. Of
my time than telsup stuff is tell O Trucks is
the name of the company. There's social media, and I'm

(01:35:01):
working on a bunch of projects behind the scenes, so
I don't get to share everything that I'm working on
as quickly as I do with Telosive. But that, I
would argue could change a lot in the next year,
depending on how things go at the company. It might
take up more of my time as time goes by.
So I hate to say it, but yeah, I don't

(01:35:24):
have a bunch of big plans for the Taylors of
Tech channel. It's kind of my hobby now and evs
are more of my passion and I'll jump on here
whenever I have things to say about Apple stuff, for
consumer tech stuff, whether that be Android phones, Apple phones
or meta products that kind of thing. Happy to talk

(01:35:45):
about those when there's something to talk about. But I
do genuinely feel like every year there's less and less
things to talk about. So I don't have some plan
to grow this channel to ten million subscribers or anything.
I'm like, yeah, it'll be there. There will always be
some kind of new tech can Maybe this channel will
become a lot more seasonal to where I post things

(01:36:05):
when there's an Apple event going on, but maybe during
the dry seasons, I don't post much, and I hate
to say that. I wish I could say this channel
is going to be super active and I'm going to
post even more content. But maybe posting less frequently will
give me a chance to post higher quality stuff. Maybe
it'll give me a chance to dive into things with

(01:36:26):
a little bit more precision. But the consequence of that
will be I just don't post as frequently. I don't know.
We'll see is your time between telew trucks and YouTube
like fifty to fifty. It changes on the based on
the week, but yeah, pretty much it's pretty evenly divided
right now. Personally, I think the SE branding should stand

(01:36:48):
for simplified Edition based on where the past sees have
been going. Yeah, I agree, simple Simplified edition is nice,
although the marketing team may not like that term. I
need Apple to up a flip phone so the Samsung
isn't releasing the same phone every year. Maybe the flip
phone angle will be like, we know people liked our
mini iPhones, but our data shows that people liked bigger screens.

(01:37:11):
So a folding phone lets us have a mini form
factor and still have a big screen. Maybe that'll be
their marketing angle. The truth is Apple didn't want to
keep selling mini iPhones because they were cheaper and a
folding phone can be more expensive, so they found a
way to cater to the mini phone demographic with a
max price of like thirteen hundred bucks or whatever. Any idea.
When the curved Mac monitor releases on Vision Pro, What

(01:37:35):
I didn't hear about a curved Mac monitor? No, I don't.
Isn't that part of Vision OS two or something? But
I don't think it's curved. I think it's just ultra wide.
I would love to see Apple drop more money in
developing apps, etc. For the Vision Pro. Yeah. I think
they're doing their thing, but they know that the market

(01:37:56):
right now is very small for it. So it's kind
of a death loop of like, yeah, no one buys
it because there's no content, and because there's no one
buying it, then we don't make content for it. It's
kind of a lute But I think Apple was aware
that was going to happen. I don't think they were
expecting a thirty five hundred dollars headset that's only available
in the us to sell incredibly well. They knew that
it would be kind of niche applicator directly to me

(01:38:18):
with the Series ten watch, with the titanium chassis and
the removal of the red antenna accents. They knew it
was you. They knew they'd get you. James says, I
still think at times that I am holding my breath
on airpower, but then I remembered it's the cop D.
Why not be Oh No, James, with his jokes, I
swear you could do stand up of some kind. Maybe

(01:38:45):
not literally stand up, but you know what I mean.
Taylor's of Space Travel Channel, I wish I had more
time in the day. I make all kinds of videos,
but sadly, I'm barely able to make time for Taylus
of Tech, Taylos of EV, and Tello Trucks. That's kind
of the three big channels and brands that I'm juggling
right now, and I don't have much extra time aside

(01:39:07):
from that. But I appreciate your guys' support anyway. I
know that maybe the content's not as exciting, or the
tech news isn't as exciting as it used to be,
but that's okay. I think It's all right if it
turns into a once or a couple times a year
where it gets really interesting. USBC Mac accessories this month,

(01:39:28):
please app will come on. It's got to be legal.
The sooner all manufacturerstop doing annual updates. Will be good.
Only release new updates when worthwhile. Yeah, I could see
why companies might be tempted to do that, But all
I'm telling you is tech YouTubers are going to have
a very hard time dealing with that because they rely
heavily on the news and the hype leading up to

(01:39:50):
the event and then the reviews of the products. So
if half the products come out over the course of
a decade, tech YouTubers are probably going to make half
as much. A lot of them can't afford to cut
like that. Can I do stand up comedy if I'm
in a wheelchair? Yes you can, James. Anything's possible. That
widescreen virtual monitor can be curved and will be in
Vision OS two point two in December. Thank you Neil

(01:40:12):
for clarifying. I just watch for your skits personally. They
don't even have to be tech related. Oh thank you
Consumer Compute. Appreciate that. I'll be as active as I
can I still have this dream scenario where Google doubles
down on video editing software and makes their own silicon
much better and develops a Chrome book that starts to

(01:40:34):
rival Mac Books with in house designed silicon. You know,
Google is moving towards TSMC for manufacturing. It's the same
company that makes Apple silicon. So if there was an
ecosystem that could rival Apple, I think it's Google, and
they're making a lot of good calls. I used to
be very critical of them because I thought they made
poor decisions, but every year it feels like Google's making

(01:40:56):
smarter and smarter decisions. So that might make this channel
very interesting if you actually watched me pivot from Apple
Sheep to Google Sheep. I already use a lot of
Google services and Google products, so could happen. Could happen?
But anyway, I gotta get going here. But I appreciate
you guys tuning in and appreciate your support. Thanks for

(01:41:16):
standing by me even through the tough news cycles. It's
a lot of fun catching up with you guys. I
love the streams. Lets me figure out what's on your
guys' minds in real time. Yeah. Nick's perspective on the
Ray bands was interesting. I do want to check those out.
At some point, we gotta look around. We've gotta experiment
with that. AnyWho, Thank you all for watching. Hope you

(01:41:40):
have an excellent rest of your day. We'll talk again soon. Bybye.