August 13, 2025 • 32 mins
In this bold and insight-packed episode of That Will Nevr Work, Maurice Chism sits down with growth strategist and serial entrepreneur Dave Valentine to tackle one of the most overlooked (and misunderstood) parts of marketing: the offer.
Dave breaks down why most ads fail—not because of targeting, design, or copy, but because the offer simply isn’t good enough. He shares his proven process for creating offers that cut through the noise, resonate with your ideal client, and drive real conversions.
Whether you're running Facebook ads, crafting landing pages, or pitching on a sales call, this episode will shift how you think about value—and give you the tools to win more, faster.
🎧 Press play and learn how to build offers your audience can’t ignore.
Follow on Linkedin
https://finch.com/
Dave breaks down why most ads fail—not because of targeting, design, or copy, but because the offer simply isn’t good enough. He shares his proven process for creating offers that cut through the noise, resonate with your ideal client, and drive real conversions.
Whether you're running Facebook ads, crafting landing pages, or pitching on a sales call, this episode will shift how you think about value—and give you the tools to win more, faster.
🎧 Press play and learn how to build offers your audience can’t ignore.
Follow on Linkedin
https://finch.com/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I thank you very much for tuning into that We'll
Never Work podcasts. If your ads aren't converting, the problem
might not be your targeting, it might be your offer.
So today I have Dave Valentine who's going to break
down how to build offers that win in any market.
We'll talk about it right after this.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Educate, empower, Enable Impact. Thank you for tuning in to
that Will Never Work, an award winning podcast where we
share inspiring information and personal experiences related to business and
the entrepreneurial journey from those who are leaders in their
respective field. Now here's your host, author and business coach Maurice.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
All right, all right, all right, so we're going to
get all way into this. As you well know, you'll
be able to find all of Dave's information in the
show notes, his bio, his social media LinkedIn, you know,
all that type of stuff. So we'll talk about that
a little bit later. But Dave, if someone tells you
that their ads aren't working, how do you help them
(01:12):
look beyond the copy and start fixing the offer if
they even recognize that that's their problem.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
Offers no matter where you're at, whether it's a restaurant,
a concert venue, it's an e commerce shop, you're doing
B to B legion, it doesn't matter. The offer is
the tip of the spear. And a lot of times
what people think is they need to work on the platform,
(01:43):
they need to work on the creative, they need to
work on how much they're spending, they need to All
those things can and do play a role. But the
thing that I look at first is that offer. And
the reason why I bring that up, I've grown. This
is my eleventh business now that I'm working in. I've
(02:04):
sold nine of the previous ones.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
And you know what we've seen.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
And it's funny because my COO is actually in town.
We've been working together for the path through the weekend
this week, and she and I have worked at other
companies before, and one of the things that we were
talking about with our internal company right now that we're
operating was that at a previous B to B firm,
we went from twelve clients to two hundred clients over
(02:32):
the course.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Of twelve months just because.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
We had a great offer that made it frictionless for
people to try us out before they actually put any
money forward. And so what that did was it made
us a top point one percent agency in that space
in the world, and we did that over the course
of twelve months because we were offer driven. So when
I think about an offer, I often think about what
(02:57):
are the reasons why people would say no? Why would
they say no, I'm not even going to talk to them,
Why no, I'm not going to click on the link. No,
I just don't believe that that's gonna work. Whatever that is,
whatever those reasons are, that's really the friction. And so
what I do is I make it so that those
things are removed. Now it's kind of silly if they
don't click on the link and buy right now, it's
(03:18):
kind of silly if they don't book a meeting. And
so that's really my goal and my aim every time
that I'm working with clients and I'm like, look, let's
create offers. They're so compelling that people just go, how
can you do that and.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Stay in business?
Speaker 4 (03:31):
How are you even functioning at that level? And there's
ways that you can go about it that makes sense.
So it's really starting to look at what your customer
journey is like, understanding where the friction points are in
the sale process and then eliminating those so.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I have an offer. I mean, I have a product
or a service. They're not just love. I've dreamt about
this all my childhood or whatever it might be. So
I think it's just something that is great. So I
think that once you build it mentality, they'll come. So
how do I start to pivot from that, you know, mindset?
(04:06):
Because this is what I have a passion for. So
I just think that because it sounds great, that that's
the best off rock cant all, you know, because I
don't understand any other friction. I love it. You should
love it too. So how do we start to pivot
from that mindset?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Yeah? So I think that it depends.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Yeah, it's a great question, by the way, and so
many people come to me with that same idea.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
I mean, I had a sales conversation with an.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Older founder a few weeks ago, and they were like, man,
we made this awesome product. It's not like all these
other knockoffs. We put a lot of time, energy and
resources into it. We made it with this carbon fiber
and it's better than the other stuff that's on the
market that's made in other countries and it's just plastic,
you know, Like that's.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Cool and they're like, we just don't know why I
won't sell.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
And one of the things that I talked about with them, Maurice,
is you have to really think about what is it
that your customer wants, not what you think is cool.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
And so so for me, I'll give you.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
I'll give you real world examples because I think that
those are the most impactful, at least in my experience.
So the one that I was talking about For a
previous agency, what we did was we were a lead
gen agency, so we worked with B to B companies
booking B to B meetings. Our lowest package was thirty
nine hundred dollars a month. Our biggest package that we
ever sold was.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
One hundred thousand dollars a month.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Right, but we had two hundred clients paying us thirty
nine hundred or more every month in twelve months.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's crazy fast.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
The thing that we figured out was we knew that
we were good at what we did. But what was
scary for people was they just went, hey, I'm a
smart person. I'm a business owner, I'm a CEO, I'm
a chief marketing officer, I'm a chief revenue officer.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
I'm smart. I can't figure out our league, gin.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Why would I believe that you could get me eight
to twelve meetings booked on my calendar every month.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
I'm not going to pay you thirty nine hundred bucks
a month for that.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
There's no way because I can't do that, and I'm
trying to spend way less than that, or.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
What or maybe I'm spending more.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
So what we decided in that circumstance was what is
something that is really going to resonate with that.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
One part was the offer.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
So our offer was really simple, Hey, I'll book you
three meetings for free, no strings attached. So what that
did was it totally diffused their doubts.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
They're like, well, hang on, timeout, what do you mean free?
You know?
Speaker 4 (06:48):
And so then we'd be going back and forth when
we're like, we mean free, like free, And so they
were like, Oh, I'm going to get a benefit just
by giving you some of my time. And if y'all
really do what you say that you can do, I'm
gonna sign in the dotted line because I need leads.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Right.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
It's a big pain point, right, So it's not i'd
like to have. Every business has to have it. Another
one that we did that I thought was really fun, Maurice.
That's in a totally different space, and I'm doing this
on purpose. This one worked exceptionally well. Also, Okay, we
had this company that was based in Washington, DC that
(07:27):
were selling cake pops that were infused with THHC. Okay,
so there in Washington, d C. And they're like, we
want to be out in California. And I was like, great, guys,
we'd love to help you. Well, you would think that
there are a large number of dispensaries in California.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
There are not. They are only a little over four hundred.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
So what they did to try and get meetings before
was they were saying, we're gonna give you free samples.
And I asked them to step back, and I said, now,
hang on, we need to think about this. We are
trying to reach owners of these dispensaries. We're trying to
reach product managers, general managers, right, And they go yeah,
(08:11):
and I said, they don't care about free samples. I
was like, all the frontline staff, they love those after
the account has signed, but you need to do something
that those other three people, what did they care about?
And they and they were very honest, they said, we
don't know okay, and so I said, well, I'll tell you.
I'll tell you exactly what they care about. Product manager
(08:33):
wants to move products. They want to have a good
margin on it. They want to be able to move it.
The general manager wants foot traffic because the more foot
traffic that they get to the store, the more sales
that they do, the bigger their bonuses at the end
of the year. The owner cares about foot traffic, profitability,
product shelf life, they care about a multitude of other things.
So as we thought through it, they said, well, we
(08:55):
want to keep trying our own thing.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
We want to keep trying the free samples. And I said,
that's fine.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
When whatever, you don't book any meetings with us, because
they decided to pay us up front. Whenever you don't
book any meetings with us and you're like this isn't working,
you're gonna come back to me and we're gonna do
a real offer.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
So we tried their offer for two months.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
They booked three meetings in two months, which was not
good in comparison to our other clients. And they finally said, okay, Dave,
what offer should we do? So I came up with two.
We ran them both side by side. One offer was
they could do a co branded billboard because you can't
do digital advertising for THHC, but you can do traditional
(09:35):
out of home for THCHC. The other thing, the second thing,
was what if we sent a chef to a store
location and they decorated cake pops that didn't have THHC.
They were just normal cake pops without the THCHC in them.
They could sell them there too, like through the store,
(09:56):
and it's an event because you know, one of the
things that's weird about dispensaries, at least, said my experience,
they're one of two ways. They're either kind of in
a back alley and you feel like, oh man, this
is a little bit shady, or they are like this
Swedish sanitarium that's all white and clean lines and it
(10:17):
feels like some mix of an apple store in a hospital,
and this is weird, you know. And so it's different
than going to a brewery or a winery where there's
lots of life and you can bring your kids.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
It's a different experience.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
So we started running these two offers. In the first month,
with those two offers running, they booked sixteen meetings. The
second month, they booked twenty five. In month three, they
booked thirty four meetings. In month four they booked thirty six.
There's only four hundred dispensaries in the entire state. They said, Hey, Dave,
(10:51):
this is so good. It's going better than our wildest dreams.
We need to pump the brakes cause we can't make
enough product.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
Right. The champagne problems, right, those all you want to have.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
So so you know, that's a that's another kind of
moment there where we saw that work. I'll give you
one last one, Maurice, because I think this is relevant
to the e commerce brands. In my first agency that
I owned, we worked We were a Facebook and Instagram
ad agency and we had huge clients like Fortune five
hundred brands. Target was one of our clients for that
(11:26):
that agency, and one of the things that we found
is we ran metadata and we would run these polls
on all these different sites for clients. We kept getting
the same information back consistently, which was we would have
a little pop up that came up at the bottom
of a screen when somebody would go to close out
their window and the survey would say, you know, three questions.
(11:53):
Then they'd have another so like, did you not make
a purchase because you thought the product was too expensive?
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Did you not make a.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Product because you didn't trust the you know, efficacy of
the product, right?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You not do something else? And then the last one
was other.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
And we shifted those questions around just to see what
we would get right, so the pre populated questions would
be different. What we found across the board was forty
eight percent of the time and this was true within
about a four percent per window for every client that
we had. People didn't purchase because they had to.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
Pay for shipping.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Mm hmmm.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
And so we went back to clients and just said, hey, listen,
what if you just start to offer free shipping for
everything over more than one item of your like average
one item, if they bought a second one, they would
automatically get free shipping. So we're gonna increase our average
order value. They're gonna get free shipping, so they feel
(12:51):
like they're winning. We feel like we're winning because we're
taking our average order value from you know, one point
two products to one point eight products right now, maybe
even higher. And when we had clients to start to
offer free shipping, all of a sudden, on the low side,
their sales would increase by twelve percent. On the highest side,
(13:14):
we had an increase of forty six percent.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Wow, just because they change free shipping.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
So it's always about looking at what is your customer
looking for, what's their pain point?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
How can we help them solve?
Speaker 1 (13:26):
And as I'm listening to you, first of all, Dave,
thank you for all those examples. I mean you said
a mouthful in every single one. Like if you're listening,
you're not paying attention, you know, and you're not hearing
certain things. Let me break some of this part down
to you, because for those of us that are listening
to this, this audience, they are getting into entrepreneurship right
(13:48):
and so unfortunately, like you're referring to, and I say
unfortunate because sometimes we don't think this way. You're talking
B to B business to business mentality. A lot of
time when we're looking at these situations, we're looking at
B two C. We're only looking at the consumer. We're
not looking at the bigger broader picture. We're not looking
at the mass market appeal across the board, whatever that
(14:11):
might be. Right, So, how do we start to shift
that mentality because that's something else that kind of holds
us back in our offering understanding, how do we move forward?
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Yeah, so when we think about those those individual people
instead of businesses, when we're thinking about what are they
looking for?
Speaker 3 (14:31):
I love getting feedback.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
Right, so let's let's use it for instance of a
B two C situation. Uh, if I go into a restaurant, right,
that's a B two C situation. They're off, by the way.
There are offers to get people into restaurants. I've created some.
I'll talk about those here in a second, because I
think it's fun. One of the things that I'm always
(14:53):
thinking about is so there are some good numbers out
there for the following. It is really challenging to get
someone to try out a new restaurant.
Speaker 3 (15:04):
It's surprisingly hard.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
But the thing that's really interesting is that once you
get them in, it's really easy to mess up that
situation so that they never come back again. There's an
interesting statistic here that if you don't provide an a experience,
(15:26):
they come in, which means food comes out quickly, it's
well done.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
It's like not suspect in any way.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
They feel like they got the appropriate amount of attention,
their check was right. There's a ninety percent chance if
you get that right, that they will come back the
next time. Okay, but if you don't get it right,
if you hit that ten percent, what will happen is
it guarantees that they won't come back.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
And so because they're only going to give you one try, right,
that's what most people do. Right.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
So the idea to get people in is like, Okay,
how do we get them in and then how do
we make that experience great? So here's what we did
with the brew pub, so selling beer, selling pizza. They're
new in an area in the Dallas Fort Worth metroplex.
They're kind of on this far out suburb, but they're
there and they're like, hey, we're having a hard time
(16:24):
getting people in.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
We don't know how to do this. We're struggling.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
So two moves that we did that made it really work.
Move number one, we said, hey, listen, we're gonna put
every door direct mail in these sections that are right
around the brew pub. And in Texas, you can't do
discounts on alcohol, but you can do discounts on food.
(16:51):
So we said, any two pizzas twenty five dollars. Normally
you could get a supreme pizza and it would be
like nineteen bucks. So any two pizzas twenty five dollars
when you come in, will also give two free soft
drinks when you come in. And so what we're trying
to do is get those people in. That way, it
(17:13):
got people to try them out in a meaningful fashion
because we gave them a deal. It was as good
as something you'd get at Domino's or Papa John's. That
was all around them, but they were going to try
on our artisanal pizza. The second thing that we did
that really worked well a little bit later on a
couple of years after that, was we created something called
(17:34):
the Thirsty Muggers Club, and the idea was you could
go in and they only had a finite number of
this sort of membership, so you would pay one hundred
bucks and with that one hundred dollars, it got you
this really cool mug that we helped design for them
(17:57):
nice and it was really unique. It was almost like
they were stone They're stone made, okay, and they have
the Thirsty Muggers logo on them and it looks cool
and they sit up on the shelf and so then
what they would get is they would get like a
little thing that went on their keychain. It was like
a little token and they could go in, they'd set
it down, the bartender usually knew who they were, and
(18:19):
then they would be able to get a dollar off
every beer. Because it was a membership, it kind of
got around some laws in Texas, which was fun. And
then we were also able to give them a twenty
percent discount on all merchandise through the whole year. And
on top of that, they got early and VIP access
to any event tickets that were going on and they
(18:41):
got a ten percent discount off of those.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
So they spent one hundred dollars.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Here's what was cool about this. They spend one hundred
dollars just to be a member. There were only one
hundred seats available exclusivity exclusivity, so people felt like, hey,
if you're in the thirsty muggers, we're like in you know,
right if some every year they had that renewal go
up and if you didn't renew within seven days, they
(19:09):
would open up your seat to anybody that wanted it.
And the list, Maurice, they had a waiting list eight
hundred and ninety people deep the last time that we checked,
and so like for them. Then they're and you know,
we're having conversations do we expand this how much? And
I was like, I think we expanded by like twenty
people to make it feel.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Like, oh my gosh. But what it's done is that
those people have become raving fans.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
So not only are they showing up and spending, I
think that we figured out that the average person that's
in that club, they spend eight point five times more
than they.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
Did in the previous change. They started the club just
because they felt they felt like they were committed, they
were in right.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
But the other thing that happened too was they would
bring people with them to some of the private events
because we always have a plus one, right, So then
there were nights that we would do twice a year
they could come meet with the head brewer, with the
owner of the brewery, they'd have a private dinner, it
was seat of just for them, and they'd have a
private beer tasting. Now then they bring friends in, they'd
(20:17):
get to try it all, and then that kind of compounded.
So when we think about the consumer, right, we think
about getting that individual instead of the business. It's thinking about, hey,
what's an offer that's going to make someone feel like
they're unique, special, because we all want to be unique
and special and there are ways that you can go
about it that really drives a commerce.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
So so before we got on, you know, and I said, Hey, Dave,
we were just going to have a conversation. And if
it goes anywhere, it goes anywhere. So just follow me
for a second. So I'm listening to what you're talking
about and being part of that community, and I'm just
piggybacking off of your example just a few moments ago.
(21:01):
For those of us, I'm a Jenexa born in nineteen
seventy six. There was a TV show I grew up
on called Cheers right, everybody knows your name mentality right?
And so is that type of environment that we want
to make sure that we create, no matter if we
are doing B two C or B to B. We
want to make sure everybody feels included and they are important.
(21:22):
And I think that's something that what you're talking about
and what you're expressing to all of us today, to
ensure that everyone feels important no matter what level you're on.
And that's something that we don't understand because a lot
of times we say, hey, B two C is different
from B to B, different mentality, mindset. No, just be
yourself just great. Just be a great communicator, that's all.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
And I think that so often the best ways that
I've found out. Look, I've been in marketing and advertising
for over twenty years now, which is why I have increasingly.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
More gray in my beard.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
But I think it's one of those things where I
always think, what you know? For me, I always go
what would be cool and interesting if I were the
people in the community that I'm serving? Well, what did
what would make me say? I want to go hang
out at that coffee shop? Right, I want to go
be a part of that that bar. I want to
go be at that restaurant on a regular basis. What
(22:26):
are the things the little details that whenever I step
into a space, I go, WHOA, this is cool? And
I think that it's really analyzed. If we do self reflection, well,
then I think that we end up finding some of
the answers that we're looking for.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, and I think that that part of doing the research,
making sure that you understand who you're serving. You know,
you can't just guess, you can't just assume you know,
you have to find out you know, you have to
do some type of market research, right, you know so,
And I think that's a that's a key part that
we miss, is that feedback loop because a lot of
(23:02):
times we don't want to hear the feedback. We're a
little too proudful in some cases, right, you know, because
we don't want to hear the negative stuff. But we
don't understand we're still growing in that space. So whether
it's positive or negative, it's all the same information to
me anyway.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
Yeah, I think anytime that we phrase things as positive
or negative, it creates a false dichotomy.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Feedback is feedback, right, you know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (23:30):
Like, we love to hear the positive because we've created
in our mind that's helpful, that feels good. You know,
I'm working hard, man. I know that you know this, Maurice.
I know that I've felt this a lot. One of
the reasons why I love your podcast is that you're
creating a space for entrepreneurs and business owners to feel
less alone and that we need often because it is
(23:58):
a lonely endeavor that we have taken upon ourselves. It's
one thing to say I want the positive feedback that.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Makes me feel good. I've said for a long time.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
Now, if you want really good therapy be an entrepreneur, like,
it's gonna force you.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
It's gonna hold up a mirror to you and say,
here's what's wrong, right, here's what you gotta fix.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Because you can't be a successful business owner and have addiction.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Problems long term.
Speaker 4 (24:29):
You can have them at the beginning, but if you
want to get to where you want to go, you got.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
To work through that.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
Can't have poor relationship skills and be in business long term.
Why because if you can't speak to an employee effectively
and communicate clearly, it's gonna be an issue. And if
you're having troubles at home with your relationship, let me
just tell you that's going to carry.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Over as well.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
So it's tough, but man, I think about every time
I've had dynamic growth in my personal life, it's when
I listen to all the feedback I waited as not
negative or positive.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
But as feedback give it to me right.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
And most often it's the feedback that's the hardest to
hear that leads to our biggest results.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Let's just blow up, you know, we just so that's
all you want to do, you know, no matter what
the situation is, right, you know, if you want your
product out there, Hey, you know what, I need to
get those cake pops from DC to California. So I
need to hear what somebody has to say. Maybe along
the way, let's stop in Tennessee. See maybe what Tennessee
people got to say of Colorado? You get what I mean?
Speaker 3 (25:40):
You know?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
So? So sometimes so that way, you understand, because each
culture likes something different, right, every space like something different.
So so how do you expand on your flavors? How
do you expand on maybe colors, you know, whatever it
might be that might be more fun and energetic and
you might be able to get a broader range. I
(26:01):
understand sometimes you want to focus in on one of
two things. But also sometimes when you're ready to do
that special right, hey for a limited time off, or
we're going to do this right you know. So so
it's those type of things that helps you to grow
and expand along the way. So, but I thank you
very much for coming on and sharing all that day.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Yeah, it's my pleasure.
Speaker 4 (26:21):
Yeah. I think that these these kinds of things, as
you and I both know there, they are the things
that we have to talk about to get where we
want to go and be successful in our business endeavors.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Right, you know, and so so, Dave. You know, for
those individuals who might be struggling with their copy or
their ideas, thinking outside the box, maybe even because I'm
holding on too tightly to my passion, how can I
you know, how can they reach out to you and
talk to you and find out more information?
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Great? Damn great question.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Yeah, you can find me on social media at real
Deval on Twitter, LinkedIn or Twitter, Instagram and TikTok, and
then you can also find me on LinkedIn, Dave Valentine
is what you can search.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
You can also find me.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
We have a podcast network where we released three episodes
a week. It's called Vox and Coin, and we talked
to business owners, entrepreneurs, marketing executives at large corporations. We
just had Kettle and Fire on recently and Mars Candy
and so you kind of get some insights there. And yeah,
(27:31):
I'd love to connect with anyone wherever they are most
comfortable finding cool cool.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
So of course, y'all, all the information will be in
the show notes. And if you're walking, running, jogging, whatever
might swimming, whatever it might be his information will be there.
But Dave, I got to ask you one last question
before I let you go. I asked this question of
all my guests, would you rather the question? And because
you are out of the box thinker, so I would
(27:56):
encourage you to think even further out the box. Would
you would you rather choose three doors or a forking road?
No parameters, there's no right or wrong answer. Would you
rather choose three doors.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Or a forking row?
Speaker 3 (28:15):
Three doors?
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Okay? And why three.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
Doors forking a road gives you a fifty to fifty
shot out of the gate.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
M hmm.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
It's a binary and I think that binaries get us
in trouble. Most notably we can see that in our
own political system. I think that having multiple options allows
us to be more creative and dynamic and thoughtful on
how we address.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
A situation move forward.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
And I always think it's easy for us as business owners,
as people to think into to think binary.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
We even have a language that's binary.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
Yes, yes, but I think it's too absolute and giving
us that third option is a meaningful option.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Hm hmm.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
That's cool.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Let's have a little bit more fun. I'm gonna ask
you one last question because I asked this on the
show with my wife and I right, would you? I'm sorry,
who would you choose to sing a duet with? Dead
or alive?
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Dead or alive? Oh? See a duet?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
Man?
Speaker 4 (29:36):
You know a guy that as a kid I just
idolized the heck out of and I'm so sad that
he passed. And he's just this amazing, dynamic character, Robin
Williams A.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
You think about him.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
The Genie and Aladdin and stuff. Man, I mean he
was like he was in everything.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
Oh, he was incredible.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
And and so I think that would be would be
what about you?
Speaker 3 (30:07):
Who would you? Who would you pick?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So for myself, it's been hard because every time my
wife and I asked this question. It changes every week
the week because I might be listening to But if
I had to say one person is it would either
be my wife and I we talk about it. Michael Jackson.
I like Michael Jackson. He would be one because again,
(30:36):
I'm I was born in you know, in the seventies,
so that's where we grew up on right Jackson five ish,
leaning into off the wall and you know, all that
type of stuff, and he was such he was so
big at that time and then the other one somewhat
like an eric a bad or Shania Twain. Like it's
just it's so many other people like, you know, because
(30:57):
I just like all types of music, you know, Herbie Hancock.
It would be like it's a laundry list. Yeah, there's
a laundry list. I don't have one particular person. Every
day is somebody else. And like I tell my wife
all the time, I wake up with a new song
in my head. So so yeah, so that that's where
(31:19):
I am with that.
Speaker 4 (31:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
So, but but you know, and I ask you these
questions because as again entrepreneurs, you know, you gotta have fun.
You gotta find some icebreakers and all those types of things,
you know, and and sometimes you want to leave off
with something memorable, right you know, Hey, you know what Dave?
You said, you want you like to sing with this person?
You know, I listen to you. If that won't ever
(31:44):
word podcasts? Hey, Dave, what about let's sing together, right,
you know? Or talk about all the Robin movie you know,
Robin Williams movies, and you know whatever it might be.
So so, yeah, I like this, I love it. Cool, cool,
so but I think very much we're coming on the show.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Thanks for having me on, Maurice.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
I'd love to have you on of course, boxing coins
sometime in the future. Man, it'd be great to have
you on, brother, and we've got some fun topics we
can dive into.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
I think you'd enjoy it, all right, that's cool.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
That's cool. So of course y'all look out for me
on that platform. And of course, like I said, that
information will be on the show. Notes and Dave, I
thank very much for coming on the show, and I
thank y'all for listening to the note fruit I mean
to that Woe Never Work podcast. I'm sorry, I'm getting confused.
Too many, too many going on that will never work podcasts.
And I'll talk to y'all a little bit later.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Thanks for listening. Follow Maurice Chisholm on social media to
stay connected and check back weekly for new episodes until
next time. That will never work? Or will it
I thank you very much for tuning into that We'll
Never Work podcasts. If your ads aren't converting, the problem
might not be your targeting, it might be your offer.
So today I have Dave Valentine who's going to break
down how to build offers that win in any market.
We'll talk about it right after this.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Educate, empower, Enable Impact. Thank you for tuning in to
that Will Never Work, an award winning podcast where we
share inspiring information and personal experiences related to business and
the entrepreneurial journey from those who are leaders in their
respective field. Now here's your host, author and business coach Maurice.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
All right, all right, all right, so we're going to
get all way into this. As you well know, you'll
be able to find all of Dave's information in the
show notes, his bio, his social media LinkedIn, you know,
all that type of stuff. So we'll talk about that
a little bit later. But Dave, if someone tells you
that their ads aren't working, how do you help them
(01:12):
look beyond the copy and start fixing the offer if
they even recognize that that's their problem.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Yeah, you know, it's interesting.
Speaker 4 (01:23):
Offers no matter where you're at, whether it's a restaurant,
a concert venue, it's an e commerce shop, you're doing
B to B legion, it doesn't matter. The offer is
the tip of the spear. And a lot of times
what people think is they need to work on the platform,
(01:43):
they need to work on the creative, they need to
work on how much they're spending, they need to All
those things can and do play a role. But the
thing that I look at first is that offer. And
the reason why I bring that up, I've grown. This
is my eleventh business now that I'm working in. I've
(02:04):
sold nine of the previous ones.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
And you know what we've seen.
Speaker 4 (02:10):
And it's funny because my COO is actually in town.
We've been working together for the path through the weekend
this week, and she and I have worked at other
companies before, and one of the things that we were
talking about with our internal company right now that we're
operating was that at a previous B to B firm,
we went from twelve clients to two hundred clients over
(02:32):
the course.
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Of twelve months just because.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
We had a great offer that made it frictionless for
people to try us out before they actually put any
money forward. And so what that did was it made
us a top point one percent agency in that space
in the world, and we did that over the course
of twelve months because we were offer driven. So when
I think about an offer, I often think about what
(02:57):
are the reasons why people would say no? Why would
they say no, I'm not even going to talk to them,
Why no, I'm not going to click on the link. No,
I just don't believe that that's gonna work. Whatever that is,
whatever those reasons are, that's really the friction. And so
what I do is I make it so that those
things are removed. Now it's kind of silly if they
don't click on the link and buy right now, it's
(03:18):
kind of silly if they don't book a meeting. And
so that's really my goal and my aim every time
that I'm working with clients and I'm like, look, let's
create offers. They're so compelling that people just go, how
can you do that and.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
Stay in business?
Speaker 4 (03:31):
How are you even functioning at that level? And there's
ways that you can go about it that makes sense.
So it's really starting to look at what your customer
journey is like, understanding where the friction points are in
the sale process and then eliminating those so.
Speaker 1 (03:45):
I have an offer. I mean, I have a product
or a service. They're not just love. I've dreamt about
this all my childhood or whatever it might be. So
I think it's just something that is great. So I
think that once you build it mentality, they'll come. So
how do I start to pivot from that, you know, mindset?
(04:06):
Because this is what I have a passion for. So
I just think that because it sounds great, that that's
the best off rock cant all, you know, because I
don't understand any other friction. I love it. You should
love it too. So how do we start to pivot
from that mindset?
Speaker 3 (04:26):
Yeah? So I think that it depends.
Speaker 4 (04:28):
Yeah, it's a great question, by the way, and so
many people come to me with that same idea.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
I mean, I had a sales conversation with an.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Older founder a few weeks ago, and they were like, man,
we made this awesome product. It's not like all these
other knockoffs. We put a lot of time, energy and
resources into it. We made it with this carbon fiber
and it's better than the other stuff that's on the
market that's made in other countries and it's just plastic,
you know, Like that's.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Cool and they're like, we just don't know why I
won't sell.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
And one of the things that I talked about with them, Maurice,
is you have to really think about what is it
that your customer wants, not what you think is cool.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
And so so for me, I'll give you.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
I'll give you real world examples because I think that
those are the most impactful, at least in my experience.
So the one that I was talking about For a
previous agency, what we did was we were a lead
gen agency, so we worked with B to B companies
booking B to B meetings. Our lowest package was thirty
nine hundred dollars a month. Our biggest package that we
ever sold was.
Speaker 3 (05:40):
One hundred thousand dollars a month.
Speaker 4 (05:42):
Right, but we had two hundred clients paying us thirty
nine hundred or more every month in twelve months.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
It's crazy fast.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
The thing that we figured out was we knew that
we were good at what we did. But what was
scary for people was they just went, hey, I'm a
smart person. I'm a business owner, I'm a CEO, I'm
a chief marketing officer, I'm a chief revenue officer.
Speaker 3 (06:07):
I'm smart. I can't figure out our league, gin.
Speaker 4 (06:10):
Why would I believe that you could get me eight
to twelve meetings booked on my calendar every month.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
I'm not going to pay you thirty nine hundred bucks
a month for that.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
There's no way because I can't do that, and I'm
trying to spend way less than that, or.
Speaker 3 (06:24):
What or maybe I'm spending more.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
So what we decided in that circumstance was what is
something that is really going to resonate with that.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
One part was the offer.
Speaker 4 (06:33):
So our offer was really simple, Hey, I'll book you
three meetings for free, no strings attached. So what that
did was it totally diffused their doubts.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
They're like, well, hang on, timeout, what do you mean free?
You know?
Speaker 4 (06:48):
And so then we'd be going back and forth when
we're like, we mean free, like free, And so they
were like, Oh, I'm going to get a benefit just
by giving you some of my time. And if y'all
really do what you say that you can do, I'm
gonna sign in the dotted line because I need leads.
Speaker 3 (07:05):
Right.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
It's a big pain point, right, So it's not i'd
like to have. Every business has to have it. Another
one that we did that I thought was really fun, Maurice.
That's in a totally different space, and I'm doing this
on purpose. This one worked exceptionally well. Also, Okay, we
had this company that was based in Washington, DC that
(07:27):
were selling cake pops that were infused with THHC. Okay,
so there in Washington, d C. And they're like, we
want to be out in California. And I was like, great, guys,
we'd love to help you. Well, you would think that
there are a large number of dispensaries in California.
Speaker 3 (07:46):
There are not. They are only a little over four hundred.
Speaker 4 (07:51):
So what they did to try and get meetings before
was they were saying, we're gonna give you free samples.
And I asked them to step back, and I said, now,
hang on, we need to think about this. We are
trying to reach owners of these dispensaries. We're trying to
reach product managers, general managers, right, And they go yeah,
(08:11):
and I said, they don't care about free samples. I
was like, all the frontline staff, they love those after
the account has signed, but you need to do something
that those other three people, what did they care about?
And they and they were very honest, they said, we
don't know okay, and so I said, well, I'll tell you.
I'll tell you exactly what they care about. Product manager
(08:33):
wants to move products. They want to have a good
margin on it. They want to be able to move it.
The general manager wants foot traffic because the more foot
traffic that they get to the store, the more sales
that they do, the bigger their bonuses at the end
of the year. The owner cares about foot traffic, profitability,
product shelf life, they care about a multitude of other things.
So as we thought through it, they said, well, we
(08:55):
want to keep trying our own thing.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
We want to keep trying the free samples. And I said,
that's fine.
Speaker 4 (08:59):
When whatever, you don't book any meetings with us, because
they decided to pay us up front. Whenever you don't
book any meetings with us and you're like this isn't working,
you're gonna come back to me and we're gonna do
a real offer.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
So we tried their offer for two months.
Speaker 4 (09:15):
They booked three meetings in two months, which was not
good in comparison to our other clients. And they finally said, okay, Dave,
what offer should we do? So I came up with two.
We ran them both side by side. One offer was
they could do a co branded billboard because you can't
do digital advertising for THHC, but you can do traditional
(09:35):
out of home for THCHC. The other thing, the second thing,
was what if we sent a chef to a store
location and they decorated cake pops that didn't have THHC.
They were just normal cake pops without the THCHC in them.
They could sell them there too, like through the store,
(09:56):
and it's an event because you know, one of the
things that's weird about dispensaries, at least, said my experience,
they're one of two ways. They're either kind of in
a back alley and you feel like, oh man, this
is a little bit shady, or they are like this
Swedish sanitarium that's all white and clean lines and it
(10:17):
feels like some mix of an apple store in a hospital,
and this is weird, you know. And so it's different
than going to a brewery or a winery where there's
lots of life and you can bring your kids.
Speaker 3 (10:29):
It's a different experience.
Speaker 4 (10:30):
So we started running these two offers. In the first month,
with those two offers running, they booked sixteen meetings. The
second month, they booked twenty five. In month three, they
booked thirty four meetings. In month four they booked thirty six.
There's only four hundred dispensaries in the entire state. They said, Hey, Dave,
(10:51):
this is so good. It's going better than our wildest dreams.
We need to pump the brakes cause we can't make
enough product.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
Right. The champagne problems, right, those all you want to have.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
So so you know, that's a that's another kind of
moment there where we saw that work. I'll give you
one last one, Maurice, because I think this is relevant
to the e commerce brands. In my first agency that
I owned, we worked We were a Facebook and Instagram
ad agency and we had huge clients like Fortune five
hundred brands. Target was one of our clients for that
(11:26):
that agency, and one of the things that we found
is we ran metadata and we would run these polls
on all these different sites for clients. We kept getting
the same information back consistently, which was we would have
a little pop up that came up at the bottom
of a screen when somebody would go to close out
their window and the survey would say, you know, three questions.
(11:53):
Then they'd have another so like, did you not make
a purchase because you thought the product was too expensive?
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Did you not make a.
Speaker 4 (11:58):
Product because you didn't trust the you know, efficacy of
the product, right?
Speaker 3 (12:02):
You not do something else? And then the last one
was other.
Speaker 4 (12:05):
And we shifted those questions around just to see what
we would get right, so the pre populated questions would
be different. What we found across the board was forty
eight percent of the time and this was true within
about a four percent per window for every client that
we had. People didn't purchase because they had to.
Speaker 3 (12:28):
Pay for shipping.
Speaker 2 (12:29):
Mm hmmm.
Speaker 4 (12:30):
And so we went back to clients and just said, hey, listen,
what if you just start to offer free shipping for
everything over more than one item of your like average
one item, if they bought a second one, they would
automatically get free shipping. So we're gonna increase our average
order value. They're gonna get free shipping, so they feel
(12:51):
like they're winning. We feel like we're winning because we're
taking our average order value from you know, one point
two products to one point eight products right now, maybe
even higher. And when we had clients to start to
offer free shipping, all of a sudden, on the low side,
their sales would increase by twelve percent. On the highest side,
(13:14):
we had an increase of forty six percent.
Speaker 3 (13:17):
Wow, just because they change free shipping.
Speaker 4 (13:20):
So it's always about looking at what is your customer
looking for, what's their pain point?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
How can we help them solve?
Speaker 1 (13:26):
And as I'm listening to you, first of all, Dave,
thank you for all those examples. I mean you said
a mouthful in every single one. Like if you're listening,
you're not paying attention, you know, and you're not hearing
certain things. Let me break some of this part down
to you, because for those of us that are listening
to this, this audience, they are getting into entrepreneurship right
(13:48):
and so unfortunately, like you're referring to, and I say
unfortunate because sometimes we don't think this way. You're talking
B to B business to business mentality. A lot of
time when we're looking at these situations, we're looking at
B two C. We're only looking at the consumer. We're
not looking at the bigger broader picture. We're not looking
at the mass market appeal across the board, whatever that
(14:11):
might be. Right, So, how do we start to shift
that mentality because that's something else that kind of holds
us back in our offering understanding, how do we move forward?
Speaker 4 (14:23):
Yeah, so when we think about those those individual people
instead of businesses, when we're thinking about what are they
looking for?
Speaker 3 (14:31):
I love getting feedback.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
Right, so let's let's use it for instance of a
B two C situation. Uh, if I go into a restaurant, right,
that's a B two C situation. They're off, by the way.
There are offers to get people into restaurants. I've created some.
I'll talk about those here in a second, because I
think it's fun. One of the things that I'm always
(14:53):
thinking about is so there are some good numbers out
there for the following. It is really challenging to get
someone to try out a new restaurant.
Speaker 3 (15:04):
It's surprisingly hard.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
But the thing that's really interesting is that once you
get them in, it's really easy to mess up that
situation so that they never come back again. There's an
interesting statistic here that if you don't provide an a experience,
(15:26):
they come in, which means food comes out quickly, it's
well done.
Speaker 3 (15:30):
It's like not suspect in any way.
Speaker 4 (15:34):
They feel like they got the appropriate amount of attention,
their check was right. There's a ninety percent chance if
you get that right, that they will come back the
next time. Okay, but if you don't get it right,
if you hit that ten percent, what will happen is
it guarantees that they won't come back.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
And so because they're only going to give you one try, right,
that's what most people do. Right.
Speaker 4 (16:02):
So the idea to get people in is like, Okay,
how do we get them in and then how do
we make that experience great? So here's what we did
with the brew pub, so selling beer, selling pizza. They're
new in an area in the Dallas Fort Worth metroplex.
They're kind of on this far out suburb, but they're
there and they're like, hey, we're having a hard time
(16:24):
getting people in.
Speaker 3 (16:25):
We don't know how to do this. We're struggling.
Speaker 4 (16:29):
So two moves that we did that made it really work.
Move number one, we said, hey, listen, we're gonna put
every door direct mail in these sections that are right
around the brew pub. And in Texas, you can't do
discounts on alcohol, but you can do discounts on food.
(16:51):
So we said, any two pizzas twenty five dollars. Normally
you could get a supreme pizza and it would be
like nineteen bucks. So any two pizzas twenty five dollars
when you come in, will also give two free soft
drinks when you come in. And so what we're trying
to do is get those people in. That way, it
(17:13):
got people to try them out in a meaningful fashion
because we gave them a deal. It was as good
as something you'd get at Domino's or Papa John's. That
was all around them, but they were going to try
on our artisanal pizza. The second thing that we did
that really worked well a little bit later on a
couple of years after that, was we created something called
(17:34):
the Thirsty Muggers Club, and the idea was you could
go in and they only had a finite number of
this sort of membership, so you would pay one hundred
bucks and with that one hundred dollars, it got you
this really cool mug that we helped design for them
(17:57):
nice and it was really unique. It was almost like
they were stone They're stone made, okay, and they have
the Thirsty Muggers logo on them and it looks cool
and they sit up on the shelf and so then
what they would get is they would get like a
little thing that went on their keychain. It was like
a little token and they could go in, they'd set
it down, the bartender usually knew who they were, and
(18:19):
then they would be able to get a dollar off
every beer. Because it was a membership, it kind of
got around some laws in Texas, which was fun. And
then we were also able to give them a twenty
percent discount on all merchandise through the whole year. And
on top of that, they got early and VIP access
to any event tickets that were going on and they
(18:41):
got a ten percent discount off of those.
Speaker 3 (18:44):
So they spent one hundred dollars.
Speaker 4 (18:46):
Here's what was cool about this. They spend one hundred
dollars just to be a member. There were only one
hundred seats available exclusivity exclusivity, so people felt like, hey,
if you're in the thirsty muggers, we're like in you know,
right if some every year they had that renewal go
up and if you didn't renew within seven days, they
(19:09):
would open up your seat to anybody that wanted it.
And the list, Maurice, they had a waiting list eight
hundred and ninety people deep the last time that we checked,
and so like for them. Then they're and you know,
we're having conversations do we expand this how much? And
I was like, I think we expanded by like twenty
people to make it feel.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Like, oh my gosh. But what it's done is that
those people have become raving fans.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
So not only are they showing up and spending, I
think that we figured out that the average person that's
in that club, they spend eight point five times more
than they.
Speaker 3 (19:49):
Did in the previous change. They started the club just
because they felt they felt like they were committed, they
were in right.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
But the other thing that happened too was they would
bring people with them to some of the private events
because we always have a plus one, right, So then
there were nights that we would do twice a year
they could come meet with the head brewer, with the
owner of the brewery, they'd have a private dinner, it
was seat of just for them, and they'd have a
private beer tasting. Now then they bring friends in, they'd
(20:17):
get to try it all, and then that kind of compounded.
So when we think about the consumer, right, we think
about getting that individual instead of the business. It's thinking about, hey,
what's an offer that's going to make someone feel like
they're unique, special, because we all want to be unique
and special and there are ways that you can go
about it that really drives a commerce.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
So so before we got on, you know, and I said, Hey, Dave,
we were just going to have a conversation. And if
it goes anywhere, it goes anywhere. So just follow me
for a second. So I'm listening to what you're talking
about and being part of that community, and I'm just
piggybacking off of your example just a few moments ago.
(21:01):
For those of us, I'm a Jenexa born in nineteen
seventy six. There was a TV show I grew up
on called Cheers right, everybody knows your name mentality right?
And so is that type of environment that we want
to make sure that we create, no matter if we
are doing B two C or B to B. We
want to make sure everybody feels included and they are important.
(21:22):
And I think that's something that what you're talking about
and what you're expressing to all of us today, to
ensure that everyone feels important no matter what level you're on.
And that's something that we don't understand because a lot
of times we say, hey, B two C is different
from B to B, different mentality, mindset. No, just be
yourself just great. Just be a great communicator, that's all.
Speaker 4 (21:48):
And I think that so often the best ways that
I've found out. Look, I've been in marketing and advertising
for over twenty years now, which is why I have increasingly.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
More gray in my beard.
Speaker 4 (22:04):
But I think it's one of those things where I
always think, what you know? For me, I always go
what would be cool and interesting if I were the
people in the community that I'm serving? Well, what did
what would make me say? I want to go hang
out at that coffee shop? Right, I want to go
be a part of that that bar. I want to
go be at that restaurant on a regular basis. What
(22:26):
are the things the little details that whenever I step
into a space, I go, WHOA, this is cool? And
I think that it's really analyzed. If we do self reflection, well,
then I think that we end up finding some of
the answers that we're looking for.
Speaker 1 (22:41):
Yeah, and I think that that part of doing the research,
making sure that you understand who you're serving. You know,
you can't just guess, you can't just assume you know,
you have to find out you know, you have to
do some type of market research, right, you know so,
And I think that's a that's a key part that
we miss, is that feedback loop because a lot of
(23:02):
times we don't want to hear the feedback. We're a
little too proudful in some cases, right, you know, because
we don't want to hear the negative stuff. But we
don't understand we're still growing in that space. So whether
it's positive or negative, it's all the same information to
me anyway.
Speaker 4 (23:21):
Yeah, I think anytime that we phrase things as positive
or negative, it creates a false dichotomy.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Feedback is feedback, right, you know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (23:30):
Like, we love to hear the positive because we've created
in our mind that's helpful, that feels good. You know,
I'm working hard, man. I know that you know this, Maurice.
I know that I've felt this a lot. One of
the reasons why I love your podcast is that you're
creating a space for entrepreneurs and business owners to feel
less alone and that we need often because it is
(23:58):
a lonely endeavor that we have taken upon ourselves. It's
one thing to say I want the positive feedback that.
Speaker 3 (24:06):
Makes me feel good. I've said for a long time.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
Now, if you want really good therapy be an entrepreneur, like,
it's gonna force you.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
It's gonna hold up a mirror to you and say,
here's what's wrong, right, here's what you gotta fix.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Because you can't be a successful business owner and have addiction.
Speaker 3 (24:27):
Problems long term.
Speaker 4 (24:29):
You can have them at the beginning, but if you
want to get to where you want to go, you got.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
To work through that.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
Can't have poor relationship skills and be in business long term.
Why because if you can't speak to an employee effectively
and communicate clearly, it's gonna be an issue. And if
you're having troubles at home with your relationship, let me
just tell you that's going to carry.
Speaker 3 (24:52):
Over as well.
Speaker 4 (24:53):
So it's tough, but man, I think about every time
I've had dynamic growth in my personal life, it's when
I listen to all the feedback I waited as not
negative or positive.
Speaker 3 (25:07):
But as feedback give it to me right.
Speaker 4 (25:09):
And most often it's the feedback that's the hardest to
hear that leads to our biggest results.
Speaker 1 (25:17):
Let's just blow up, you know, we just so that's
all you want to do, you know, no matter what
the situation is, right, you know, if you want your
product out there, Hey, you know what, I need to
get those cake pops from DC to California. So I
need to hear what somebody has to say. Maybe along
the way, let's stop in Tennessee. See maybe what Tennessee
people got to say of Colorado? You get what I mean?
Speaker 3 (25:40):
You know?
Speaker 1 (25:40):
So? So sometimes so that way, you understand, because each
culture likes something different, right, every space like something different.
So so how do you expand on your flavors? How
do you expand on maybe colors, you know, whatever it
might be that might be more fun and energetic and
you might be able to get a broader range. I
(26:01):
understand sometimes you want to focus in on one of
two things. But also sometimes when you're ready to do
that special right, hey for a limited time off, or
we're going to do this right you know. So so
it's those type of things that helps you to grow
and expand along the way. So, but I thank you
very much for coming on and sharing all that day.
Speaker 3 (26:20):
Yeah, it's my pleasure.
Speaker 4 (26:21):
Yeah. I think that these these kinds of things, as
you and I both know there, they are the things
that we have to talk about to get where we
want to go and be successful in our business endeavors.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Right, you know, and so so, Dave. You know, for
those individuals who might be struggling with their copy or
their ideas, thinking outside the box, maybe even because I'm
holding on too tightly to my passion, how can I
you know, how can they reach out to you and
talk to you and find out more information?
Speaker 3 (26:54):
Great? Damn great question.
Speaker 4 (26:55):
Yeah, you can find me on social media at real
Deval on Twitter, LinkedIn or Twitter, Instagram and TikTok, and
then you can also find me on LinkedIn, Dave Valentine
is what you can search.
Speaker 3 (27:07):
You can also find me.
Speaker 4 (27:09):
We have a podcast network where we released three episodes
a week. It's called Vox and Coin, and we talked
to business owners, entrepreneurs, marketing executives at large corporations. We
just had Kettle and Fire on recently and Mars Candy
and so you kind of get some insights there. And yeah,
(27:31):
I'd love to connect with anyone wherever they are most
comfortable finding cool cool.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
So of course, y'all, all the information will be in
the show notes. And if you're walking, running, jogging, whatever
might swimming, whatever it might be his information will be there.
But Dave, I got to ask you one last question
before I let you go. I asked this question of
all my guests, would you rather the question? And because
you are out of the box thinker, so I would
(27:56):
encourage you to think even further out the box. Would
you would you rather choose three doors or a forking road?
No parameters, there's no right or wrong answer. Would you
rather choose three doors.
Speaker 4 (28:13):
Or a forking row?
Speaker 3 (28:15):
Three doors?
Speaker 1 (28:16):
Okay? And why three.
Speaker 4 (28:17):
Doors forking a road gives you a fifty to fifty
shot out of the gate.
Speaker 3 (28:25):
M hmm.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
It's a binary and I think that binaries get us
in trouble. Most notably we can see that in our
own political system. I think that having multiple options allows
us to be more creative and dynamic and thoughtful on
how we address.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
A situation move forward.
Speaker 4 (28:50):
And I always think it's easy for us as business owners,
as people to think into to think binary.
Speaker 3 (29:00):
We even have a language that's binary.
Speaker 4 (29:02):
Yes, yes, but I think it's too absolute and giving
us that third option is a meaningful option.
Speaker 1 (29:10):
Hm hmm.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
That's cool.
Speaker 1 (29:14):
Let's have a little bit more fun. I'm gonna ask
you one last question because I asked this on the
show with my wife and I right, would you? I'm sorry,
who would you choose to sing a duet with? Dead
or alive?
Speaker 3 (29:29):
Dead or alive? Oh? See a duet?
Speaker 2 (29:34):
Man?
Speaker 4 (29:36):
You know a guy that as a kid I just
idolized the heck out of and I'm so sad that
he passed. And he's just this amazing, dynamic character, Robin
Williams A.
Speaker 1 (29:53):
You think about him.
Speaker 4 (29:56):
The Genie and Aladdin and stuff. Man, I mean he
was like he was in everything.
Speaker 3 (30:01):
Oh, he was incredible.
Speaker 4 (30:03):
And and so I think that would be would be
what about you?
Speaker 3 (30:07):
Who would you? Who would you pick?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
So for myself, it's been hard because every time my
wife and I asked this question. It changes every week
the week because I might be listening to But if
I had to say one person is it would either
be my wife and I we talk about it. Michael Jackson.
I like Michael Jackson. He would be one because again,
(30:36):
I'm I was born in you know, in the seventies,
so that's where we grew up on right Jackson five ish,
leaning into off the wall and you know, all that
type of stuff, and he was such he was so
big at that time and then the other one somewhat
like an eric a bad or Shania Twain. Like it's
just it's so many other people like, you know, because
(30:57):
I just like all types of music, you know, Herbie Hancock.
It would be like it's a laundry list. Yeah, there's
a laundry list. I don't have one particular person. Every
day is somebody else. And like I tell my wife
all the time, I wake up with a new song
in my head. So so yeah, so that that's where
(31:19):
I am with that.
Speaker 4 (31:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
So, but but you know, and I ask you these
questions because as again entrepreneurs, you know, you gotta have fun.
You gotta find some icebreakers and all those types of things,
you know, and and sometimes you want to leave off
with something memorable, right you know, Hey, you know what Dave?
You said, you want you like to sing with this person?
You know, I listen to you. If that won't ever
(31:44):
word podcasts? Hey, Dave, what about let's sing together, right,
you know? Or talk about all the Robin movie you know,
Robin Williams movies, and you know whatever it might be.
So so, yeah, I like this, I love it. Cool, cool,
so but I think very much we're coming on the show.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
Thanks for having me on, Maurice.
Speaker 4 (32:04):
I'd love to have you on of course, boxing coins
sometime in the future. Man, it'd be great to have
you on, brother, and we've got some fun topics we
can dive into.
Speaker 3 (32:12):
I think you'd enjoy it, all right, that's cool.
Speaker 1 (32:13):
That's cool. So of course y'all look out for me
on that platform. And of course, like I said, that
information will be on the show. Notes and Dave, I
thank very much for coming on the show, and I
thank y'all for listening to the note fruit I mean
to that Woe Never Work podcast. I'm sorry, I'm getting confused.
Too many, too many going on that will never work podcasts.
And I'll talk to y'all a little bit later.
Speaker 2 (32:35):
Thanks for listening. Follow Maurice Chisholm on social media to
stay connected and check back weekly for new episodes until
next time. That will never work? Or will it
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