The Heat Check Prospect Podcast: Episode 27

Nathan and Ben are  joined by Jarrett Seidler and Michael Donodeo to recap the 2025 draft, and Ben checks in with his Futures Game report.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:14):
Hello, and welcome to the Heat Check. I am your host,
Nathan Graham, and today we're doing things a bit different.
I'll get back to the standard format next time, but
today I wanted to highlight some of the events have
occurred during the All Star break with a look at
both the amateur draft in the Futures Game. Jemmy today
is the godfather of the Prospect team, Jared Seidler, and

(00:34):
with him is Michael Donah deal, Did I say it right? Michael?

Speaker 2 (00:39):
Close enough?

Speaker 1 (00:41):
Don't to day. I apologize, and you guys together, in
my opinion, put together our best amateur draft coverage today. Gentlemen,
how are we doing?

Speaker 3 (00:53):
Pretty good? Pretty good? I am recovering from draft writing,
mid season fifty writing a sort of other nonsense, So yeah,
pretty much everything's uh. You know, we've got the draft
stuff out and Jeffery and I immediately have to start
talking about postseason West coverage, so you know, useful it

(01:16):
never actually yet.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
So I know you guys both put in a ton
of work prior to the draft and during the draft
with the playback. But now that we've had a few
days to kind of process all these selections, I want
to get your thoughts on something. So, so let's jump in.
Let's start the top. How surprised were you with Eli

(01:38):
Willets going first to the Nationals and does it signify
a shift in the organizational change in the philosophy of
the organization overall.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
That's an interesting question. I was. I was surprised the
Nationals actually did it. I you know, we've ranked Will,
it's number one, so we don't think it's an incorrect pick.
But yeah, I was surprised that they actually did it,
just because they've been so so strong on you know,

(02:11):
kind of like the really big tools, really big fastballs
kind of guys, and that's not really Will. It's like
it is a little bit, but it's not like completely.
You know, he's got good tools, but his strongest aspect
is age relative and an overall kind of broad based

(02:31):
of skills in a way that's not super Nationals as
we've defined the Nationals of the Mike Rizzo era. So yeah,
I was a little bit surprised, though, what were gonna take?

Speaker 2 (02:43):
So Michael, Yeah, I mean I agree with that. I
thought for a while Ethan Holliday would be the pick.
I think there were shades of Elijah Green there for
better or for worse. That isn't to say there aren't
any nationals e traits in the class at all. I
think when we look down the board, so they saved

(03:03):
a lot of money with the willets pick, and when
we look down the board at the major preps that
they would afford with those cuts, I think we see
a lot of Mike Rizzoi signal there. So I think
it's kind of to me this is class is kind
of like the good version of Mike Rizzo. I do
like what they did with the class, So I don't
I think it signifies some sort of change. But you

(03:24):
can still see that the system's Rizzo put in place.
There's still a lot of that there.

Speaker 1 (03:30):
Yeah, so his fingerprints are still there, and Mark, you
kind of touched on my next question there. So they
signed him for nearly three million under the lot of
pick value. Who are some of the later round lottery
tickets that you that you might like that they took
late in the later rounds?

Speaker 2 (03:46):
Yeah, so I think there are like three big prep
guys that they were able to afford because of this.
The first is Landon, Harmon so Land and Harmon Big
Fastball ninety five to ninety eight with some cut on it.
I don't think the fastball is gonna miss a ton
of bats right now. I wouldn't be shocked if he's
like seam shifting a sinker at some point, capacity for

(04:09):
really good breakers too, So he's like, you know, their
classic big arm speed guy. Maybe we'll need some shapework.
The Nats have been getting better at that in recent years.
Then if you want to talk about big arm speed guy,
Miguel sim is just a huge arm speed guy. He
throws a hundred for most of his high school career,

(04:30):
could not throw a strike at all. I'm pretty sure
he hit a guy twice in like the same at
bat in a big showcase event. Don't quote me on that,
but I did hear something about that. And he had
a pretty late strike throwing breakout, so he's been in
the zone a lot more. He went to the Draft League,
had some success there New York Kids. Kind of a

(04:51):
late bloomer. But it's really interesting. The fastball has some carry,
it's like nineteen. There's a pretty good curve and there's
a change up with so we probably need to add
some sort of like bridge breaker, but there is some
interesting stuff there. And then Kooy James is another another
prep guy this time of bat no like huge standout skill,

(05:13):
but I think there's good damage potential. His with rates
aren't amazing, but he like makes enough contact against all
pitch types. There's some stuff there and he should be
able to provide some defensive value. So it's so getting
those three, I think it's a lot of a lot
of it's very Nationals esque, and I think it's a
pretty good haul for just the cuts. With the first

(05:34):
overall pick.

Speaker 3 (05:35):
Signma in particular is kind of out of the same
group as like a Travis Scora. He's not as good
as a prospect at the time of the draft is
Trana Sakura and obviously nowhere near as good as Scora
as now, but it's the idea of I think Sakara
was even a fourth round or you know, the wildly
overslot kind of arm speed and interestings apes with the

(06:01):
off speeds, but we don't really know what he's going
to look like in two years, and obviously that has
worked out very well with this occur a pick you know,
a couple of years down the road, you know Penning
is whatever, you know, he's turning on the Shelveldon arment
or you never know how that's going to turn out,
but you know it's certainly a pick that looks a

(06:21):
lot better right now in the day it was made,
and that's definitely got a chance to be that kind
of pick. I did enjoy some of the nets, like
team media, like the blyers and stuff were like, this
is not a Mike Rizzo draft. The winds have completely changed.
It's like, yeah, they took Will it's at one, but like, well,

(06:44):
it isn't even that much of a not Mike Rizzo guy.
And then they took you know, they took three very overslot,
pretty raw preps and then dive bomb senior signs the
rest of the lay, which was exactly what.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
Mike rizzol would have done in this and I think
that is important to point out there. After they took
the round of preps, they took I think five straight
seniors or six straight seniors, and I do, yeah, if
I could highlight one of them, Jack Moroknik, they're eleventh round,
so not even a money saver, but they're eleventh rounder.
We played them, so I was the data guy at

(07:23):
Villanova and we played him. He's coming from the big
East and he hit a ball one hundred and eighteen
miles an hour against us. His handspeed is just absolutely ridiculous.
I don't know if the Nats are going to be
the organization he yet to maximize, to maximize the skill set,
like it's a here, he'll expand the zone a good bit.
But if there's like one guy way down the board

(07:44):
to watch, I think he is a really interesting name.

Speaker 3 (07:47):
And in between, they took Ethan Petree, the South Carolina
outfielder who's also like like he's a right handed, you know,
defensively challenged like college performing slugger, which is also super
Microso it's like the Johando Morales archetype. U. So yeah,

(08:08):
I mean, I don't you know, if if Rizzo was
in the front office and they had taken will It's,
I wouldn't have been like, oh my god, there's no way,
like that's that was not a super Unrizzo pick, you know.
I I thought they were going to take Kate Anderson.
That was kind of my expectation was that they were

(08:30):
going to take Kate Anderson. I personally think, well, it's
just a slightly better pick than Kate Anderson, but also
like fIF you know, these guys were like ten to
fifteen spots a part on the mid season fifty. Like
we we essentially had no difference in grade between our
number one and number six players, and really even down
the number eight with Ethan Holiday. It was a very

(08:53):
flat class at the top and kind of depending on
what your organization was good at developing and precise what
paradigm you were using. I think, you know, anywhere between
six and eight or nine players you could have been
an argument to take at number one. So you know,
they got a three million dollar savings versus slot and
they took a guy who you know, as pretty much

(09:16):
everyone you talked to had Willets in the top five
or six. You know, in that top tier, there were
players that were a little more controversial. You know, some
people had Seth Fernandez in that tier and we didn't.
We had Jojo Parker in that tier and some people didn't.
But for the most part, you know, there was pretty
broad consensus that Willets was in that tier, that Kate

(09:38):
Anderson was in that tier, that Liam Doyle was in
that tier. So within kind of that group of players,
plus you know, Holiday, if you believe in his contact adjustments,
which I believe we're about to talk about the minute.
You know, there really wasn't a wrong way to go there,
and yeah he was number one on our board, and
you know we stand by that. Yeah there was a

(10:01):
nice pick. But it's also like that is like I
put this on Blue Sky when the will at rumors
started going around like a week out before the draft,
Like it shouldn't have been as shocking to people as
it was. That if you put a seventeen and a
half year old guy with blood lines who performed against

(10:23):
older competition on the shell case circuit, who performed well
in athletic testing, like if you put him into an
archetype and a model like what the Washington Nationals do,
he's gonna come out really well on that. And it
was surprising to me that people didn't clock that earlier
because that you know, Mike Rizzol loves blood lines. A

(10:46):
lot of people love blood lines, you know, and a
lot of people like youth, Like youth is not just
like it gets portrayed as like a analytics model centric thing,
but but you know, it's like old there are old
scouts that think it's very important when a player performs
against older competition too, Like that's not entirely a you know,

(11:09):
new age phenomenon. So you know, I think it's a
little to be determined. And you know, Michael hinted at
this point earlier, but this was Mike Rizzo's front office,
Like this is you know, Mike Bartol always hired by him.
Danny Hoss was hired by him, Like these were not
you know, I don't think he was hiring like, you know,

(11:32):
twenty four year old whiz kids right out of college,
you know what I mean. Like the Bartolo has been
in that front office almost the entire time Rizzo was there, Like,
you know, it's been there for a while. Danny Hass
has been around the industry forever, Brad Selik has been
around the industry forever. These are well known people with
well known ideology. So I think if there's more of

(11:53):
a sea change, and this happens a lot in amateur scouting,
it usually lags front office changes by around the year
to year and a half. So that might saw up
in twenty twice like to point twenty seven drafts draft.

Speaker 1 (12:06):
Right, it's not like they totally cleaned house. It was
just vis at the top.

Speaker 4 (12:09):
Yet, right, Yeah, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (12:11):
Well, let's let's move on. Let's let's move down a step.
Is Tyler Bremner going to be in Los Angeles by
the end of the year, And.

Speaker 3 (12:20):
I don't know. I mean, he pitched a lot of innings.

Speaker 1 (12:23):
Like I mean some of that was just hyperbole, but.

Speaker 3 (12:28):
No, but like it is, like so we talk about like,
you know, Bremner or Doyle or William Kate Anderson or
Jamie Arnall, Brenda I believe pitched the least amount of
innings of those guys, so like I could see it.
And also just it's the Angels, and this is a

(12:50):
little bit what they did. Like I know you were
joking a little bit, but you are entirely joking, not
entirely like this is what they do. I don't know
offhand if they've announced anything or said anything. The only
two pitchers, actually I'll go to three. The only three

(13:11):
pitchers I would not be surprised to see in the
major leagues that were drafted this year are Brenner, Chase Shores,
and Nate Sneed, who were also Angel.

Speaker 2 (13:22):
That was going to be my point too, Yeah, yeah,
I was going to twist the question around a little
and say which Angels pitchers are most likely to play
in the majors this year, which I think is a
very fun question, because they took both Chase Shores and
Nate sneaed with pretty soon after, Like these were relatively

(13:44):
high picks and both were college performing relievers at huge
schools in the SEC. So Nate Speed or Chase Shaws
was taken forty seven to Nate Sneed was taking one
hundred and fifth. Both guys are upper ninety is obviously
a huge part of the bull PANDELSU and they wanted

(14:04):
all Nate Speed coming from Tennessee. I think Shors is
the better of the two and probably more likely to
get outs right now in the majors, although I would
try to develop both as starters if I were making
the picks, but I would not be surprised to see
those guys rushed up the way we saw with like

(14:26):
Ryan Johnson last year where they took him third round.
I think out of a out of it was Dallas
Baptist or whatever, and if he was in the majors
right away. So I think Chase Yours is totally a
guy who could Nate Sneed as well, like as a
upper nineties SEC performing reliever.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
I just so I crashed out pretty bad on the stream.

Speaker 2 (14:49):
When they tried it was a very it was probably
the best moment of the stream. Yeah, not particularly close, right.

Speaker 3 (14:57):
And people were like, well, why did you do that?
And like it's not that I don't you know. So
he was a guy who had a chance to be
a good starting pitcher and this is just not the
organization where this is going to happen. Like, it really

(15:20):
is not the organization where it's going to happen. And
that sucks, Like it actually kind of sucks that this
player who was really interesting and really had a chance
is just not really gonna have a chance now because
he was drafted by an organization that has almost no

(15:41):
chance to maximize what he's going to become. And you know,
I just I.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
What what did you like most about Bremner?

Speaker 3 (15:54):
We had Bremner way underwear Bremner in the plenties, Like
I it's kind of a really great change up. It's
like a plus the plus plus change up. But it's
also like, and this is an archetype of pitching prospect
that we've kind of gotten away from because we've seen
guys like Drew, like he's pretty similar like Drew Thorpe

(16:15):
as a prospect, and like I just obviously Thorpe had
Tommy John but like the velosity backed up a little bit,
And it's like, Okay, the velosity backed up a little bit.
Now all of a sudden, major league kiders are no
longer chasing after his change up all the time. And
there's nothing else here because there's not an overpowering fastball.

(16:35):
There's no real breaking ball feel. And like Brenner's got
a little bit better fastball velocity than that, but his
fastball shape isn't as good consistently. It has been as
good at times. So it's just like and he also,
like Brenner, was pretty up and down this college season.

(16:56):
He reshaped his fastball mid season and the second half
shape was better in the first half shape, but like
a slider backed off from his sophomore year, it was
junior here. And you know, I just I kind of
and you know, like Michael can confirm this. I I
was based on feedback and discussion I'd had with team people.

(17:17):
I thought there was a really good chance he was
going to go in the top five. I thought he
had a couple of different landing spots in the top
five honestly, and the Angels taking I may have been
the only person in the world that was not surprised
to hear that pick when that pick I picked the
pick up leads a little bit early, but when the
when the pick came out, it was like, yeah, I

(17:38):
kind of I'm not that shocked, especially because he was
you know, he was seventy five percent under slot too.
They were also looking for a deal. Although I you know,
we're on to talking about drafts we liked the least
later on, like I hate what they did with that money,
Like it's just not not interesting to me. But yeah,

(18:00):
like I'm not like I see it. But it's like,
if you're drafting at the number two overall pick and
you're a team that hasn't developed an impact major league
or unless we're counting Zach Netto, but other than you know,
you could say Zach Nettle or Joe Adell. But you
can also argue that the last impact major leaguer that
developed out of the draft was literally Mike Trout. It

(18:21):
was picked, you know, a decade and a half ago.
If you're drafted number two overall, like I want to
take a guy that has a chance to be a guy.
And it's not like there weren't pitchers that were an
option there. You know, pretty much every positive that I
can say about Bremner, I could also say about kayd Anderson.

(18:44):
His change up's not point as good, but it's change
up's pretty good. And he's also got really good feels
for spinning. He's left handed, and he has better fastball shape,
and it's like, and he was better in college this
year too, and he was you know, a really nice
post it like, oh, you know, it's probably closer than
the majors. And he didn't sign for that much more

(19:09):
than Brennon or he could sign for more, but like
it was like that, like seven hundred kmore or something
like that, Like it wasn't you know, a huge number more.
And you're just like, you look at the rest of
what they did, and.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah, if you're gonna do that at two, you really
need to hit on the story.

Speaker 3 (19:27):
So what did you do? You did this so you
could draft Johnny Slewinsky and C. J. Gray, Like, I.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
To me, this is funny because I was about to
uh to say that I did like some of the
prep arms down the board. Yeah they're fine, but the Angels, Right,
so are you going to maximize these prep arms? Like
I liked Cole Raymond pre draft, they took me to
set Talon Haley was their twelfth round pick, and they

(19:56):
actually were able to sign him for like nine hundred k.
I think he's an he's gotten like he's had a
lot of mistime between injuries and and uh cancer, but
like he's an interesting guy. They got him for nine
hundred Kyah, Cole Raymond's an interesting guy. He's been all
over the map with his fastball shape, but it's looked
like really really good at times. But then it's like

(20:20):
you're doing all this to get these guys and you
probably don't even have the player development apparatus in place
to take advantage of that. And that's that's just kind
of for me.

Speaker 3 (20:33):
You could have gotten a cut for slightly more than that,
or a cut at that level that was better than Brebner,
like you could have gotten if you So, Nates needs
the guy they got for not signing Prager last year.
That's the supplemental third round pick. So I you basically
just did the same thing again, Right, You're actually gonna

(20:56):
sign this year's version. But it's like this is an
organization that's using the Major League Draft to get roll
forty five and roll five major leaguers at positions where
you don't need them, Like this is this is the
organization that drafted Nolan Sean Noel, It's the organization that
drafted Big Choice. It's the organization that drafted Sam Bachman,

(21:20):
Like and these are these are guys that didn't really
have a chance to be impact major leaguers and I
Brendner's got a little bit of a shot, but it's.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
Not like I just was the number two pick. You know,
you'd want some impact potential there.

Speaker 3 (21:37):
Right, Like Brent, I guess I have to actually look
it up, like what all these guys signed for because
they're not actually on the on the draft tracker, Yeah,
because some of the deals aren't official. But Brenner got
like a little bit under eight and like a little
bit less than Doyle and Anderson got. And to me, Okay,
maybe you're not the right team to take Jamie Arnold.

(21:59):
You don't want to weird throwing dude who you're gonna
have to work on release points stuff with if you're
the Angels. I totally get that, but like, on what
planet is Tyler Brenner a better pitching prospect than Liam Doyle,
And you can't tell me. Let's say Doyle would assigned
for five hundred thousand dollars more than Brenner. You can't
tell me if I am a major league team or

(22:22):
a major Yeah, a major league team that's not the Angels,
Like you're not training Willam Boyle and Cole for Cole
Raymond and Tyler Brenner. Nobody's taking the Brennan and Raymond
side of that. In my opinion, really smart teams aren't.
I'm sure there's people out there that are going to
and you know we are, probably Michael and I are

(22:44):
probably lower on Brenner than the industry. We're aware of that.
It's it just, it is what it is. He's again,
change up first, righties, change up first the righties without
another big trade. I'm gonna want to see it against
at least time miners pitching, probably major league pitching. That
archetype's going to beat me a lot. But even still, like,

(23:06):
I don't know a lot of people that had I
will say this, I don't know anybody that had Brenner
or Hediquete Anderson. That's actually the one I can say
I don't know many people that had Doyle ahead of
Brenner that did not have Doyle ahead of Brenner either,
Like those those two, I just I don't get what
they were doing other than and again, I bring those

(23:27):
two guys up in this discussion because I think they're
closer the Major's entire. Brenner is, or at least it
should be, because Brennan there's some work here. There's there's
some work on his mechanics to get a more consistent,
high veloscity fastball up on his own. There's some work
here to reshape his slider. And I would just I
would ask the listener if they think that the Los

(23:50):
Angeles Angels of Anaheim or the team that's best positioned.

Speaker 2 (23:53):
To do that type of work, Ye had a sixteen fastball,
wither it?

Speaker 3 (23:58):
So? You know, he grows really hard and most of
the time has no idea what it. So there are
a lot of relievers drafted all up and down the
board that people think can start, that the team taking
them thinks that they can start. I do not think
the Angels think Mate Steke can start. I think they
think he's going to be their setup guy. And some
time between now and next may like, I think that's

(24:19):
why I talk. But to me, that's not a good
reason to take a pitcher in the third round is
because you think he's going to be a set up
guy two months to ten months.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
All right, So let's kind of look at the rest
of the first round. There was a record fifteen of
the first thirty two picks. Where now it's the short stops.
Take willits out of the equation? Who do you like?
Who of that group do you predict will have the
best career. Let's start with Michael here.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
Yeah, So, I mean, I think the easy answer. Like
the two guys who are announced as shortstops who we
had very high Jojo Parker and iv Or Cat, I
think it's possible neither of them end up at short
stop long term. Parker's probably a second baseman. I think
he can stick there to start. He has he's like

(25:09):
big six', five doesn't really look the, part but he
has good actions. There he's a good. Athlete to, me
those are just two really good. Hitters Jojo parker's got just,
fantastic fantastic bat to. BALL i think it was ninety
seven percent in zone contact on the. CIRCUIT i also
think there's non zero power in. There LIKE i think
it's a. Fifty he's got some some like decent hand

(25:33):
speed metrics when you'll get the blast motion. Stuff Iv
ourquette hits the ball really, hard makes adequate. CONTACT i
think there's some room to play with the. Approach some
it's like it's a very unorthodox approach in terms of
what pitches he's like choosing to do damage. On BUT
i think if you can play with that a, little

(25:54):
WHICH i think is very much more of a mentality
thing because it's not like he's just swinging all the,
time it pitches out of the strike. ZONE i think
if you can get him a little more aggressive and damage,
COUNTS i think he can be really really. Good but
those kind of feel like the cop bad. Answers so
down the board a. Little Dax kilby is a guy
we didn't stick on our top fifty and really should.

(26:15):
HAVE i really like. Him he went to The. YANKEES
i think that's a good org fit. There they've had
a lot of success with these sort of. Bats ALTHOUGH
i do think it's possibly moved to the to an
outfield spot at some, time and Then i'm gonna kind
of break your question a little bit because there's one

(26:35):
like super weird wild card for, me and it's another
GUY i wasn't super high on during the, cycle but
he's just so fascinating to, me and That's Alex lodiz
out Of Florida state went to The, braves and he
he's so. Aggressive he has like some of the highest
swing rates in college. Baseball aggressive in, zone super aggressive

(26:55):
out of his. Zone SO i was, like at, FIRST
i was kind of, like what's the hit tool? Here
with how much he chases out of the, zone AND
i think that could be an, issue but he also
hits the ball so hard with so much consistency of
like launch, angle like the standard the standard deviations of
the launch, angle the launch angle tightness is really. Good

(27:16):
AND i kind of think about like what makes a hit,
tool WHICH i think is such an interesting and nuanced,
Question and it's like he has a lot of markers
here that he could just sustain super high batting averages
on contact with the shape and the batted balls being
hit as hard onlines as much as it, is so
like maybe there's even like A Tim anderson sort of profile.

(27:39):
Here it's you, know so those are kind of the
names i'd throw. OUT i think there are some other interesting,
names All, jericho BECAUSE i just named four.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
To talk about. This SO i will say a number
of players that were drafted stops have less than no
chance this. Stuff Like Savior knines he's not playing shortstop
at the major, Level like that's just not have like
they can AND i you, know they could have announced
him as an astronaut and he would still not be
an astronaut, Either like that's the Old Bill James paba,

(28:14):
Thing like you can call him whatever you, want but
he's not really a short stop dem fiend probably fits
in that group two where you, KNOW i would be
surprised if he plays even an even a significant number
of games of shortstop in the minor, leagues all the
less surprise THAN. I and so some other guys that

(28:34):
we liked within that. Mix Josh, hammond who is a
two way player prep out Of North, carolina was a
kid who had some interesting like damage with kind of acceptable,
contact and also we liked the two way player, archetype you,

(28:57):
know coming into the coming into the, cycle he was
probably a little bit further ahead as a, pitcher and
now he's ahead enough as a hitter that he's probably
not going to pitch is a. Pro Kson, cunningham who
went to The, diamondbacks was one of a couple of
players they got flagged to, me like everybody's looking for

(29:19):
the McGonagall signal right, now because that was you, know
he obviously was a player who went towards the back
of the first time he actually went the sub BUT
i think he went for a first.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
ARM i, mean even The tigers are looking for their Next.

Speaker 3 (29:35):
Okay, Yeah So cunningham was a player who had the
second best ocase back to ball, metrics and Like, parker
a little bit less Than, parker has non zero athleticism
batspeed type markers such that you might be hoping that
there's a lot of focused damage there in the. Future and,

(29:56):
also like, McGonagall was a little older for the draft.
Class and, yeah and then The tigers Took Jordan, yost
who was also not on our, board but was somebody
that we were paying attention to who also kind of
falls into that mold a little bit in terms of
a player who's kind of a shortstop and kind of

(30:19):
a little bit hit over, power but has some non
zero power markers, too and they've they've turned into one
of the better organizations that particular type of, development where
they're all of a sudden now an organization which looked
like you couldn't get out of its own way five years,
ago all of a, sudden like every hitter is optimized

(30:40):
for exactly what they should be. Doing and they took
out not a, shortstop but they Took Michael lolvetto in
the in the comp, ground who is also kind of
a similar, player but he's a catcher in terms, of you,
know kind of a cold, weather hitover, power kind of
natural hitter. Type and you, know you cannot argue with

(31:04):
where they've been able to take McGonagall and Even clark
to a lesser extent in the relatively sort you, know
McDonald's our number one prospect in baseball right, now and
that was not a particularly hard decision to for us
to put him there. Either so, YEAH i, mean that's

(31:26):
kind of everyone's looking for that kind Of, okay this
guy has demonstrably good back to ball such that even
if he maxes out his power a little bit and
starts selling out for, power he's still probably gonna make
a lot of. Contact you, know they also did it
last year with the Par terraane or kind of the
other way where they had a guy who was maximized
for power they decided to try and back them into.

(31:49):
Contact but he's another. One so it's interesting because The
tigers are clearly one of the better drafting teams and
clearly one of the more analytically model inclined, team and
they keep taking over aged high. Schoolers so maybe that you,
know the idea that you should never take an over
aged high school prep bat isn't. Correct it's that you

(32:10):
should be taking over aged high school prep bats who
already have really, advanced especially power abilities relative to, age
because that's the one where the physical development's going to
help out the. Most, like you, know If Eli wallas was,
nineteen he probably would have won the com ground with
his skills and his demonstrable power.

Speaker 2 (32:30):
Output so so IF i could touch On michael olevdo,
here SO i, think, uh, yeah we're going terribly off.
Crack BUT i think he's kind of a little More
Bryce rainery to me Than kevin. Mcdonagaly like he's he
had some really big exit velocities at the, combine like
does really good bat speed any, Six so there's still

(32:51):
some projection. THERE i think he could hit the ball
really like it's easy six power for me potentially More
he's hit everywhere he's gone and it's a good queen.
Swing he doesn't have a ton of this like the
showcase experience that a lot of other guys. Have but
it's interesting bringing Up rainer Because rayner And olivado both
really showed out and increased their stock a lot AT,

(33:13):
nhsi which is like a big high school. Tournament SO
i think it's kind of interesting to see where they're
drawing from, there these like power guys with hit markers
who performed AT. Nhsi it's you, know they it's it's
interesting to, see like what they're doing with those. Guys
that's WHAT i, did, REALLY i did really like their.

Speaker 3 (33:32):
Class, yeah that's not like an unusual group of markers
for because NHS i it so the Biggest i'm about
to go on a three minute tangent that's completely off,
topic but, sure well it's on topic to the drafted
draft of. Scussion it's off topic to the question asked
the Biggest the biggest problem both teams AND us have

(33:56):
right now is evaluating the growth of the high school
hitter from the summer and fall before the, draft which
in most cases is the last time they face really
high level competition in a game setting until draft, day
which is nine months, later ten months, later eleven months.
Later and when we're talking about, seventeen, eighteen nineteen year old,

(34:18):
players they change a lot over the course of a. Year,
nathan you've been you've been AT vp for a. Decade
there have been players you have seen one year that
were borderline non, prospects that were one on one guys
the next. Year, right they're always on The.

Speaker 1 (34:33):
YEAH i remember an amateur scout at one time Seeing
Jackson merrill for the first time in. Hya he couldn't
believe how big he.

Speaker 2 (34:41):
Was.

Speaker 3 (34:41):
Yeah, Yeah so there's physical, growth there's skill. Growth that's
a really important year of. Development and if you don't
have a competition marker to put that, against you're going
to be just like you're going to be grasping. It
swing changes or games in which the guys facing seventy

(35:01):
four mile an hour fastballs from guys that aren't even
going to be pitching in, college or eighty two mile
an hour fastballs from guys that are going to be
pitching IN d three or stuff like. That you're gonna be,
seeing you, know you're gonna be seeing a lot of
reps against, velocity but in shorts or against pitching, machines

(35:21):
not real game. Competition so something that some smarter teams
are starting to value a lot or events LIKE nhsi
And super sixty that are in the spring before the,
draft that have that have best on best high school.
Competition and there aren't a ton of top prospects that

(35:43):
go to those, events but there's some and it's been
for you, know we've really started paying attention to that
in the twenty twenty four, cycle and we paid attention
to the twenty twenty five cycle, too and you look
at a lot of the guys that kind of shot
up out of the prep hitter ring right around the
draft and in some cases after the. Draft price ran

(36:03):
or tyson lois al veto this year and it's based
on this same year quick stop showcase events Like super
sixty and NHS. I so THERE'S i do, WONDER i
suspect it there's going to be more best on best

(36:24):
spring prep tournaments in the not too distant, future because
it's just it's you, know we're going to talk About
Ethan holiday in a. Second we'll just segue To Ethan holiday.
Here you, Know Ethan holiday was absolute garbage with his
hit tool against the spring or against the Last summer,

(36:48):
showcase and then he made a spring change to his,
swing and you talk to six different scouts and you're
gonna get six, different wildly divergent answers as to whether
it's going to help him hit. Velocity So Holiday holliday
has two holes in his, swing or at least had
two holes in his swing as of summer twenty twenty,

(37:10):
four which was velocity up as a huge hole and
soft stuff moving down and away from him as a moderate.
Hole and if you've paid attention to, baseball you, know,
ever if you're listening to this, podcast you, know if
you have those two, holes you're not going to be
able to. Right you're just going to get bounded with
those two. Things and there's a lot more velocity up

(37:33):
and soft stuff down in a way as you move
up the, chain especially once you start getting a DOUBLE,
a TRIPLE, a certainly the major. Leagues so he added
a toe tap to try and combat, that under the
theory that it was a timing issue on the advice
of his father and, uncle who are Former Major league

(37:55):
multiple Time All Star Matt holiday And oklahoma state Coach Stuff.
Holiday so good people to be getting hitting advice, from
as random random family members, go because they're not actually
random family, members actually, extorted not really qualified to be
giving this. Advice but, anyway we don't have any freaking
clue if this is going to work consistently against top end,

(38:18):
velocity because he hasn't faced top end velocity since he
made the. Change so, yeah it's so you also kind
of see the combine is starting to serve as a
little bit of, that even though it is in shorts
and isn't against best on best, competition because at least
it can be you, know you can the team's have
much better control over the environment and that type of.

(38:39):
Thing but it's it's it's hard to tell whether a
prep hit tool is fake or. Not you, know don't
really talking About Tamar, johnson, right the guy who, people you,
know Scouts i've known for a decade throw multiple throwing
eighty hit tools on a guy that it turns out can't.
Hit and that's you, know our valuation to this stuff

(39:02):
have changed a, lot just you, know certainly in the
time period you, know and may have been AT. Bp so,
yeah like just how you evaluate hit tools has completely
changed in that.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
Time, Well Tamar johnson was just what three years? Ago
four years?

Speaker 3 (39:16):
Ago, yeah it wasn't that, long it, Was, yeah and
THAT i THINK i think people really re evaluated how
everybody screwed Up Turmar johnson's, projection and the answer, was
we weren't paying attention to best on best contact. Data
so there's been a lot. More you, know you look
at McGonagall way over performing And Tremar johnson way, underperforming

(39:40):
and the commonality there is best on best contact. Data
so that's what a lot of teams are looking at.

Speaker 5 (39:45):
Right.

Speaker 1 (39:45):
Well, yeah so so we talked About holiday dropping a
little bit in the draft because of the. Reasons he,
Said let's look on the pitching. Side Jamie arnold was
the long projected number one pick early in the. Year
why do you think that he slid so far?

Speaker 2 (40:04):
Down, Yes, SO i think there were a couple of things.
HERE i think there are a couple of things. HERE
i think first, off a better pitching group around him,
happened Like Kate anderson got a lot better this, year
and really towards the end of the, season established himself
as like the best performing pitcher in college baseball. Arguably

(40:27):
Liam doyle transferred To. Tennessee saw vlo, increase saw command.
Increase so he's now looking really. Good so IT'S i
think partially around, him things got. Better there were some
changes With. Arnold he raised his arm slot a tiny.
Bit it was still. Low it's still very, outlier but

(40:47):
it wasn't quite as. Outlier the usage of different fastballs wasn't,
perfect so he wasn't getting like this elite swing and.
Miss he was very, good but it wasn't like this,
elite elite swing and this he. Did now why that
armslot changed? Happened if it, was you, know intentional. Unintentional

(41:09):
maybe it was to get a little more carry on the,
fastball because it is that the shape uses up in the.
Zone maybe it's to help him turn over a change.
Up he added a new change up over the, offseason
and in a, vacuum it's a really good. Pitch it's
like this super funky shape with a ton of. Depth
so you, know the, reason we don't, know but that
he wasn't quite as much of an. Outlier that, SAID

(41:33):
i think he's still very. Good we still liked him.
HERE i think it's good value for THE. A i
think he d an eleven to The a's, like that's
good value for. Us SO i DON'T i don't want
to be like this guy's you, know this guy's not
Good LIKE i think he's a very good. Player we'll
see if it's the right ord fit BECAUSE i think
it might need a little more work than it did

(41:54):
before because NOW i kind of like able to nitpick
a little more of. It but but he's still a
really fun. Pitcher he also got like sick halfway through
the year that that wasn't helping. Him so, yeah just
kind of some stuff. Happened BUT i, mean he's still
a very good. Player he's Still i'm still a fan of,
his so you, know it'll be fun to see him move,

(42:16):
up move.

Speaker 5 (42:17):
Up there was a lot of uncertainty with, him just
as to like because the changes he made didn't really
like the the addition of the change up made, sense.

Speaker 3 (42:27):
But just like the like why is this guy raising
his arms? Loot why is his you, know his if
you look at his fastball heat, map it was like
less up and in good places up and just kind
of like leaking everywhere like he like and that if you're.
Throwing so if you've never Seen Jamie arnold, pitch just

(42:48):
visualize in your Head Chris. Sale this is A Chris sale.
Cosplayer so you, know this is a kid who grew
up in his backyard Watching Chris sale and modern model
those pitching most After Chris. Sale there's going to be
more of. Them this is like when every left handed
pitcher was modeling their delivery After Cole, hamill is like
ten years. Ago so, like if you think About Chris,

(43:11):
sale Like Chris, SALE i don't think in his life
has ever tried to create downward playing with his, fastball
nor should. He like that would just be like the
worst advice you could possibly Give Chris. Sale and like
it looked at times Like arnold was trying to create
Down we're playing with his, fastball and it's just, like
this is not the guy who's supposed to be doing.

Speaker 1 (43:30):
THIS i saw him live this, spring AND i think
it was a conscious decision because the commands started getting
a little loose at one, time and the pitching coach
came out AND i saw him actually like focus on
bringing that arms slot back up SO i think it
was conscious and But i'm not really sure. Why like
you said right to.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
Me it was not whatever that decision, WAS i think
it cost him a lot of, money.

Speaker 2 (43:58):
Right Florida state's usually a team that like gets, this
like they they love their lower lease guys that will
use their fastballs up in the, zone like this is
not a lot of times with a lot of college
guys you can kind of just point to, Like, okay
this is clearly just a bad coaching. Decision Florida state
is well regarded in, this so it does make it.

Speaker 3 (44:19):
Interesting this is not The university Of. Florida this is
not like an organization but a college organization where we're
not like there's a little bit of surprise. Here there
was a lot of you, Know jarrett's naming schools not,
me but, yeah stores all, yeah well you might still
want a. Job what's a college? Team at some?

Speaker 4 (44:38):
POINT i don't.

Speaker 3 (44:39):
Can't, yeah this was Not. Virginia this this Was Florida,
state which kind of made it a little more, Confusing
like When i'm talking to scouts about, this because it's,
like why is he why is? He why is his
fastball not good? Anymore even though it still has like
most the good stuff and that going for, him like

(45:02):
there was not a particularly discernible reason why any of this,
happened which you can view that two. Ways you can
view that as we're going to get him in our
pro system and we're just going to get him to
kind of fix the you, know change the release traits
a little, bit or we have a plan to you,

(45:22):
know improve his fastball quality that maybe at the higher
release or whatever.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
Is good once we can make it good.

Speaker 3 (45:30):
Again, Right so some teams are going to view it like,
that and other teams are gonna view it, like, YEAH
i don't know what's going on, here And i'm not
comfortable taking him with a really high pick WHILE i
don't know what's going. On so you're gonna get kind
of two divergent viewpoints on how to process that is
a major league. Organization.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
Right, Okay so let's kind of finish up this half
the show with kind of a lightning. Round i'll start
With jared on the first on the first, One So,
jared what team had the?

Speaker 3 (45:59):
Best all, Right So i'm gonna give my short speech
here in THAT i think there's two different ways to answer.
This IF i answer this with the best draft as
compared to our value board or the value board in
my head for guys that we didn't. Rank the answers
are going to be The orioles in The, nationals because

(46:20):
of course they. Are they had the biggest bonus pools
and The nationals cut it. One so if The nationals
didn't rack up a ton of value in rounds, two,
three and, four it would have been a. Disaster and
if The orioles didn't take a bunch of first and
second round talents with their what was it seven picks

(46:40):
that were basically first or second, rounders, yeah they would
have screwed up. BADLY i don't think The orioles had
a particularly great. Draft to, me if you've got a
nineteen million dollar bonus pool and the two best players
you walk away with Are irish And Slater debrun AND
i Guess caden bodinin as, well, like they did not
get a clear top ten talent with a nineteen million

(47:02):
dollar bonus, poll and to, me that's just that's a.
Miss and they did not take many particularly big. Swings
they took a lot of guys that were, good solid
picks for where they were, made and the draft had
absolutely no creativity to it. Whatsoever they were just drafting
off a. Board it looked, like, SO i you, know

(47:24):
the same thing kind of with The Seattle. Mariners, yeah
The Seattle mariners had a really nice draft in terms
of racking up. Guys they cut with the third, pick
got a guy who a lot of people thought was
the best player in the, draft and they didn't do
like anything particularly interesting with. That we were not particularly
big fans Of Luke. Stevenson, so having answered three, answers

(47:47):
none of which are the ones That i'm actually going,
with the TEAM i thought had the best draft relative
their bonus poll was The Boston Red. Sox, again because
this is not the first time this has happened. Recently
boston has a very good amateur department that appears to
be getting. Better they took two of our favorite fastball

(48:12):
shape kind of probably going to be better pro pitcher
than college pitcher young for the class college, pitchers And
Kyson witherspoon And Marcus, phillips who were both guys THAT
i think we thought had chances and perhaps should have

(48:32):
went significantly higher than they, did even though they weren't
for everybody because in both cases you're talking about guys
that need a little bit of shape work and have
kind of what you would call high effort releases in
the parlance of ten years, ago that, honestly most people
don't really care about, anymore and we, all not all of,

(48:55):
us but a lot of people stopped evaluating pictures that.
Way and then they Took Kenry godbout in the comp
second who is a player that you, know that's a
round where we had a nice. Player and they Floated
Anthony anson the third, round who we had as a
second rounder but had a lot of first round buzz

(49:16):
and they got they floated him for mid second round,
bonus and he's a nice pitching. Prospect and when you
can get a, nice stable fourth starter prospect in the third,
round you can take more shots on guys like whether
It's Ponting phillips a little bit. Higher and they did
some fun stuff. Later Christian fouch is a guy that
has really loud. Stop like all of the pitchers they

(49:40):
took later were like guys with loud stuff that just
like weren't particularly good in. College Maximus, martin The Kansas state,
shortstop like hits the ball really hard and makes like
an adequate amount of, contact which like and has non
zero defensive, value and like in the tenth you're not

(50:00):
usually getting that package in the tenth. Round that's kind
of a tough package to get that late in the
draft from a college. Player so they just kind of
had had some really nifty picks kind of up and
down where they kind of aggregated a lot of like,
players basically college infielders with like interstingish performance and college

(50:27):
pitchers with like really loud, stuff many of other than,
ice and many of whom did not pitch particularly well
or often in, college, which as we talked about, earlier
is kind of a thing that teams are going towards
now pitchers that kind of sucked in college and but
have really interesting pitch. Rights because the idea, is if
you're The Boston Red sox and you were just able

(50:48):
to Turn Peyton talley into a top fifty prospect in a,
year and you were able to Turn Brandon clark into
a top one hundred ish prospect in a, year as
second and fifth round college pitchers who were not particularly
good in college and in some cases didn't pitch particularly
off in, college you're going to go back to that
well a, lot because of course you are. Right so,

(51:10):
YEAH i really liked what The Red sox did.

Speaker 1 (51:12):
There, michael what about? You what teams did the best
with what they?

Speaker 2 (51:17):
Had, YEAH i MEAN i don't THINK i have like
a clear cut number. ONE i do like what The mariners.
Did that's a LITTLE i think a little more Than.
JARED i don't Love Luke. STEVENSON i THINK i had
some fun picks down the. Board i'll get to one.
LATER i liked what The cardinals did at the. Top Liam,
DOYLE i think it's really. Good Ryan mitchell was a
guy we. Liked it's kind of like averagish tools across the,

(51:39):
board but there's this like really funky but really athletic
swing where it's like maybe you can project gaines out from.
There Tanner, FRANKLIN i think will be a. STARTER i
like what The royals did at the top of the,
draft the top three, picks Where Sean, Gamble Josh hammond
And Michael lombardi gambles like this really really, athletic really.
Insane bat's need prep bad who just had a contact?

(52:02):
Gain is a late contact. Gain he's, old but it's
really high. Upside we touched On hammond and When party's
like a super high carry former two way guy FROM
Twu lane WHO i think could be developed into a good.
STARTER i don't want to shout out The. Brewers they
always do their thing of like taking interesting prep guys
down the board the whole. Time and THEN i also

(52:28):
had The Red, Sox and THEN i also want to
shout out My mets having pretty much no, MONEY i
think they did really well with Their day two arms
And Peyton, prescott Cam tilly And Nathan. Hall those are
guys with a lot of like interesting stuff. Markers SO
i don't really have like one team per, se BUT
i think those were kind of just some standouts for
me in terms of overall.

Speaker 1 (52:49):
Classes, okay, okay, Now, Michael i'm gonna stay with you
on this. One let's go the opposite in what teams
seem to be lacking a strategy or you didn't like
the way they attack the.

Speaker 2 (53:00):
Draft SO i was really curious to see what The
giants would do with their their first Draft Underbuster, cosey
AND i think they they did get some good. PLAYERS
i actually really Liked cody Del, vecchio who is their
twelfth rounder out OF. UCLA i think he has some
really interesting stuff going on with this. FASTBALL i Think

(53:22):
Reid worley could be a really, interesting like ninety five
guy with a double plus sweeper as he fills. Out
but it seemed like it was just a lot of
and for like most of the, drafts a lot of
like college. Performers they really just stacked up a lot
of Like northeastern Guys Gavin keel AND i, thinks, OKAY
i think he's a major league second. Basement i'm not
sure what the ceiling is, there so you, know MAYBE

(53:46):
i wanted to see a little more from, them but
there there certainly are some good good parts there.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
Too, Okay, jared what about?

Speaker 3 (53:54):
You, YEAH i mean The giants are one of the more,
obvious just like we took big name college players who
we saw on the Like Tremor cohen was just like
one of the weirdest picks if they wanted to me
their third round are out Of, rutgers Like i'm in.
Future he's like old for the draft class and doesn't

(54:14):
like have any particularly interesting. Trait he just like hit
really well in The big, ten which, okay, cool but
generally it's not actually how most teams pick. Players, NOW
i hated what The rockies. DID i from being on.
It and this happens to me every, year and every

(54:34):
YEAR i feel Like i'm in the weirdest place on
earth because every year they are at or near the
top of most media rankings of best draft, class and
every YEAR i feel LIKE i feel Like i'm in
the looney. Bin they Took. HOLIDAY i Assume holiday is

(54:55):
getting the biggest bonus of this class based on what
else they, did which take a lot of college players
That i'm pretty sure many of them are. Cuts they
did not take a single high school player other Than
holiday in this entire. Draft they took one two cold,
guy and they took a bunch of. Seniors they took
a twenty four year old graduate student in the seventh.

(55:19):
Round so they TOOK Jp middleton in the second who
is like a pitching prospect we, like but also it's
just a terrible org fit for, Them like this is
just not going to happen in their. ORGANIZATION i may
have said on our draft stream that IF i was his,

(55:40):
AGENT i would tell him not to. Signed he already.
Signed they talked About spellu in the comp second WHO i,
mean he is a big name college player who was
okay in. College they did this exact same thing With
Jared thomas last. Year it was even From, texas you,

(56:02):
know and you, know it's a big name college player
who has some production and is probably gonna hit in
the low minors AND i don't see a lot of
major league impact with and then like this drift just
goes off the red Like Ethan hedges was one of
The If Trevor cohen wasn't the weirdest pick Of day,

(56:24):
one it Was Ethan, hedges usc third. BASEMAN I i
didn't find. IT i don't know anybody that likes him
or thought he was.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
Who was getting like Some lake late, hype, right it
was it was all like.

Speaker 3 (56:39):
The traditional eye scouts off, Right.

Speaker 2 (56:41):
It Wasn't it wasn't for. Me, Yeah Riley. Kelly Riley
kelly was a big like high school prospect and then
wasn't that good in college and his main signature pitches
like a fifty five. Curveball.

Speaker 3 (56:58):
Right it's just, like it's a lot of guys that
are just, LIKE i don't really understand how you are
projecting that this guy is ever going to be more
than a role for a major league or like other
than other Than holley And, middleton LIKE i don't know
that they're you, know you can Say i'm being unfair

(57:20):
to The, rockies and The rockies are a very frequent
punching bag in my, work and my response to that would, be,
okay namely the good players they've drafted outside of their
high first. Rounders and by the, way some of their
high first rounders haven't been any good.

Speaker 1 (57:36):
EITHER i, say you don't want to look What Charlie connon's.

Speaker 3 (57:40):
DOING i, mean he's hitting three, hundred but it's like
an emptiest three hundred on the. Planet he was by
far the most difficult guy to figure out what to
do with on the mid season. Fifty it wasn't like
an injury case because it's, like, okay this guy's one
of the greatest power hitters IN ncaa. History and then
he went to pro ball and his exit last days

(58:00):
have been AND i you, know at one, point fairly,
recently he had a higher on base percentage seasonal than,
slugging which is not what you want to, do not
what you want to see out of a guy that
had like a one to twelve NINETY ev in. College, Right,
so and then we can talk about reasons for, that

(58:21):
and we're word reasons for that and all that type
of stuff until we're blowing the. Face BUT i just,
LIKE i have no idea how to evaluate that, guy you.
Know and this has been a pretty because it's The.
Rockies it's a very stable scouting, department and it's a
very stable player development, department way too stable for what
they've been, doing and they're just you. Know and, again

(58:45):
it's interesting BECAUSE i could have predicted before the draft
that the three DRAFTS i would have hated the most
would have been The, rockies The, giants and The. Angels
and sure, enough there are the three drafts THAT i
hate the, most and we already type you, Know michael
talked about The giants when already talked about The angels
that way. Earlier you, know the organizations that are bad

(59:10):
at stuff and keep ending up in these, spots it's
for a, reason, guys like it's not you, know there's
a reason The rockies are in the lottery every. YEAR
a large part of it is because they draft terribly
and they developed players. Terribly so IT'S i always i
feel Like i'm losing my mind WHEN i see. Them

(59:30):
is like AND i know a lot of it's because
Like Max bellew And Ethan hedges are like name college,
players right, like even even further, down they took some
name college, players you, Know Matt, kleins you know Called
Patrick forbes this year and hit for high average on the,

(59:52):
cake and god, knows there's nothing more that'll make a,
scout like a middle or older scout who doesn't look at,
analytics feel like more of an analyst than, saying this
guy hit three seventy on The cape because it sounds
like it really means, something and sometimes it, does but

(01:00:13):
in this case it probably.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
Doesn't so, yeah it does when it's Like Cam, smith.

Speaker 3 (01:00:20):
Right, like it does within, context but just the existence
of the fact isn't. Context it's a fun. Fact and you, know,
again you can debate what ROLE cape performance has in
all of this, Now and it's not. Zero, look we
wait over Stuff Chase davis and should have paid more
attention to the fact that he didn't hit with what

(01:00:41):
on the, cape Right, Like so it's not it's not.
Zero but also, LIKE i don't know that the drafts
from teams like this are never going to be for.
Me there's a big gap developing between teams like The
rocky who are stuck in two thousand and five, perpetually

(01:01:05):
and teams like The, royals Who michael shouted out as
having one of the better. Drafts the rules are a
traditional ice scouting draft, team but they're drafting for stuff
like fastball shape and hand. Speed they're just ice scouting
it instead of you, know running it into a. Model,
Right like if you're landing On josh Lomb Josh hammond
And Michael, lombardi like we're speaking the same, language we

(01:01:27):
just might not be speaking the same. DIALECT i am
not speaking the same language as The rockies or The.
Angels there's a gap even developing there between that type
of those two types of. Teams so it's kind of
an interesting to watch the.

Speaker 1 (01:01:44):
Play Uh, okay so we talk a lot about the
upper part of the. Draft let's let's kind of look
who's your. Sleeper who's the biggest sleeper that was taking
maybe towards the bottom second half of the. Draft So
jered go first on this one and.

Speaker 3 (01:02:00):
Half i'm not gonna go all the way down to
the second half of the draft because that's that's too
far and most of the guys were gonna say out
of the second half of the, draft like got floated
there for some. Reason BUT i WILL i will do
the second half Of day, two or the second half
of the second half of what used to what used

(01:02:20):
to BE i will what used to Be day two
until recent, YEARS i really Liked Matt barr out of
out of a Directional sunni A juco. KID i we
thought he was the Best juko player in the. Draft
he didn't quite go. THERE i think he. WoT The
twins in like the fifth or sixth round just has

(01:02:42):
like really really nifty stuff kind of it's kind of
a vaguely similar profile is to When Jacob mizzierowski was,
drafted which is not What Jacob mizzierowski is. Now When
Jacob mizzierowski was like the hot Jew co guy leading
up to that. Draft it's not quite as good because

(01:03:03):
the quite throw as, hard but it's the same thing
where it's you, know a really kind of, wacky high effort,
delivery really interesting fastball, shape really interesting breaking ball. Shape
and again it's not surprising to see there's a certain
cluster of teams that really liked that type of, performance

(01:03:24):
and The twins are in that because it's The, twins
it's The, dodgers it's The, rays it's The brewers are
going to take that type of player arc and type
maybe another one or two teams as. Well so it
wasn't surprising to see him go to The. Twins But
matt bars is my answer that. Question and we kind
of stuck him as the kind of number fifty that
maybe shouldn't have technically been number, fifty but we really

(01:03:46):
wanted to get him on the board because we really
felt strongly about the.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
Player All, Right, michael what about, You who's who's the
biggest sleeper in your?

Speaker 2 (01:03:53):
Opinion all, right SO i GOT i got two. Guys
i'm lumping this in with the with the cheese, ball
if you. Know so the first GUY i want to
highlight is a guy Named Jackson, steensma who WAS i
believe the ninth rounder to The Seattle. Mariners so this
is a guy who he was a draft eligible, sophomore

(01:04:15):
which is something we. Like he did not pitch this,
year had an elbow, injury but he pitched his freshman
year at App State Appalachian, state and when he was doing,
that he had this like low nineties fastball it's getting
up to like ninety four ninety, five really cool, traits
gets really far down the mound eighteen vert from a

(01:04:38):
five point eight, release so it's got some, carry and
then the secondaries aren't. Great that's SOMETHING i feel like
you can just iron out For you, know a guy
who's only pitched one year of, college but he's a
draft eligible sophomore with a good, fastball and he was
in the zone as a. Freshman So i'm really curious
to see what The mariners can do at. This they're

(01:04:58):
a great pitching. Organization they're really good at building out,
repertoires like we've seen so many guys just keep adding,
Pitches So i'm really curious to see what they can
do With jackson Steins moa. There the other GUY i
will mention Is Dylan, grego WHO i believe was the
thirteenth rounder to The, Padres so this was a Guy

(01:05:20):
he's got insane just hand speed from the left, Side
like his swing is so fun to. Watch he's from
Ball state. JUNIOR i think a little, no not even
that all for the. Class he's like twenty, one but
really good, contact really good hand. Speed the approach needs
some work AND i think he's probably just going to

(01:05:41):
be like a full time lefty hitter in pro, Ball
so there is some work. Here The padres think they
can maximize these like plate disciplined. Guys he also took
Like Ryan, widman who chases so. Much so if they
have identified something here with these plate discipline, GAMES i
think he could be really fun for for like a thirteenth.

(01:06:02):
Rounder like this swing from the left side is just
kind of nutty with how much hand speed he can.
Get so that's like another deep.

Speaker 1 (01:06:08):
Guy look at, Yeah michael calling out a ball state.
Cardinal love? It, Uh Jared gluh fish, up who's your
personal cheese ball cheeseball's.

Speaker 3 (01:06:20):
Tough out of the? Draft, Like i'm gonna basically under
the same thing As michael and just pick another kind of,
lower a little bit lower draft of guy kind of your.
Background the fourth ront of The, Cardinals Kate, crossland the
left handed pitcher out Of, homa is a GUY i really.
Like so this is one of those if you look

(01:06:42):
at his stats, page you're gonna, go why on earth
was this guy? Drafted all? Right so he was he
was A d two. Pitcher he went FROM d two
to A juco to The cape To oklahoma and has
not has posted airplane e ras everywhere wherever he's. Been
just you, know there's injuries, involved there's all kinds of.

(01:07:06):
Stuff so why on earth did this guy go in
the fourth? Round and why On earth AM i? Saying
this is a really good draft pick if you stick
him into a stuff. Model he has one of the
better arsenals of any left handed pitcher in the. Draft you, know, fastball,
nice high, carry mid, nineties gets a little higher sometimes

(01:07:29):
with left handed. Fastball he's got a clearer plus change.
Up his spin rate is you, know there's there's there's
work that's going to have to happen with his spin.
Pitches but this is a fourth rounder who has really
strong stuff from the left handed, side who barely is

(01:07:51):
pitched against top level competition between injuries and transfers from weird.
Places and this is the type of guy the better,
organizations AND i think The cardinals are getting. There they've
obviously hired Hind. Bloom he's spending this year overhauling their
player development processes and he's taking over as president of
Baseball operations in the next few. Months and he you,

(01:08:14):
know all the stuff we talk about with The Red,
sox he put a lot of that stuff in. Place
he was responsible for a lot of those systems ex this.
Time so you, know an organization THAT i think is
probably going to be an organization that might be able
to help him out with that, spin whereas two years
ago they would not. Have but also it's like kind

(01:08:38):
of a fun nifty background and it's kind of fun to,
see you, know a guy who has not been a
particularly good pitcher, anywhere but we think might actually be
a good pitcher in the. Future like that's that's the
fun of, this, Right it's it's you.

Speaker 2 (01:08:53):
Know also that, yeah Fireballing tennessee really who is in
the zone and has like good command of multiple secondaries
and should probably be, starting but he's been like up
to one hundred with some like vertical approach anglely traits,
Too like he's like another.

Speaker 3 (01:09:12):
Guy, yeah they very clearly have started drafting the last
couple of years much more in the way that we would.
Like they went through some lean years, there but you,
know like, uh their third, rounder The San diego first
baseman whose NAME i can never remember for some. Reason, Jack, Yes,

(01:09:35):
yes you, know he's like he was one of The
like if you just blanked out names and blanked and
didn't care about defense at, all you would have come
back with him as one of the better hitting prospects
in the. Draft, now the reason he wasn't that is
he's first base. Limited he's a small college, guy but
he's he's a draft eligible sophomore with like a really

(01:09:58):
nifty contact power type, thing like if you're hit very, hard,
right like if you're aiming for like The Vinnie pasquintino skill,
set like this is like a really good shot to
take in the third. Round and if you're gonna do
that type of, shot it's much better to do it
in the third round than when you did it in
the first round with your chase they have as. Pick
as much AS i like that, pick at the, time

(01:10:20):
it's not. Working he's not very, good you, know so
that's a you, know they kind of they took a
lot of, guys you, Know Matthew miura there's sixth rounder
Of hawaii was a borderline outlyrish hit toll. Guy but It's,
hawaii so it's kind of like a weird place to

(01:10:40):
go do. That Peyton graham their seventh round or it
was another. Interesting.

Speaker 2 (01:10:45):
Uh Ryan winegardner absolutely torched us in.

Speaker 3 (01:10:49):
College, yeah interesting interesting. Traits Guy Jalen flores was one
of the better defenders in the.

Speaker 2 (01:10:57):
Draft he pade as a guy Of flagg just having
really interesting pitch. Matchs it's like ninety, one but it's
like upshot fastball with a Five krisch. Mix and he's
the twelfth. Rounder.

Speaker 3 (01:11:07):
Right so, conversely when we start talking about drafts we
like and, prospects we really. Like they're going to be
very heavily clustered on teams that think like we. Do
so it's gonna you, know The, Brewers michael shouted, out
is having a really nice they. Did every single pick was, like,
damn that's that's the PICK i would have made IF

(01:11:29):
i was, There Or, damn that's a really interesting guy
THAT i wasn't thinking, about or something like. That so
you can kind of see it over and over. Again you,
know The yankees did their usual. Thing they, Drafted they
got a really high upside prep with their first, pick
and then just stacked a ton of college pitchers who
have like interesting breaking stuff and need fastball tweaks and

(01:11:52):
the thing that The yankees excel at in pitching development
is basketball, Tweaks so, like you, know teams that we
generally like on the process side throughout the prospect team
are also generally teams we like in the. Draft it's
wild to say that The mets are one of those teams,
now but you know The. Mets The, mets all of a,

(01:12:13):
sudden they're drafting nothing but two way, guys cold weather
preps and draft eligible, sophomores all with interesting pitch. Traits
are really interesting data, Trades like the gap between Like
Antonio jimenez and He Will, alloy like it's it's there
always better. Defender alloy did it in THE. Sec but

(01:12:38):
like they've got a lot of the same strengths and.
Weaknesses and one guy got almost four times as large
as a bonus eighty picks ahead of the other. Guy
so you know that's a that's we're gonna like that
Hym andez pick more than THAT eloi pit just because
of you, know the relative nature of where it WAS

(01:12:58):
i got that. Run they Had Peyton, Prescott Nathan, hall
And Cam. TILLY i got so many text messages from
analysts about those three guys from other teams that were, like,
yeah we were all over that. Guy too or, yeah
that name kept coming up in our draft, room and
then The mets popped like the And Nathan hall was

(01:13:19):
like a guy that there was like almost no track
man data floating around on because he pitched for a
Directional missouri and then got. Hurt but you know that
the TrackMan data that existed was just like really strong Cam,
tilly sophomore reliever out Of. Auburn AND i bet you there.

(01:13:39):
WEREN'T i bet you every single team that was looking
to draft him was looking to do it as a starting.
Pitcher but it was only the really smart teams that
were doing it because he's a guy that sucked in
college as a. Reliever but it's a clear starter mix
and with you, know the idea is you aggregate enough
of those guys in or. System and they took a

(01:14:02):
bunch of those. Guys it's not just these these ones
we're talking.

Speaker 2 (01:14:05):
About prescott's another draft eligible sophomore with a starter mix
who doesn't visually look like a. Starter. Right it's like
a three four pitch mix mid, nineties gets, higher good,
traits good, splitter like plad a sweeper when he comes
back like it's it's what they.

Speaker 3 (01:14:22):
Do so you aggregate three of those guys in rounds, five,
six and, seven which and these ARE i think all
three of them signed, underslot are going to sign under.

Speaker 2 (01:14:31):
Slot Or prescott was like two hundred k or.

Speaker 3 (01:14:33):
Something they're gonna be aggregate underslot in the, fifth, sixth
and seventh. Round AND i think they've got a better
than even chance to pull like one of those guys
into like a top one hundred tight pitching prospect in
like two years.

Speaker 2 (01:14:47):
Time this is what they did with Will watson lash, year, right.

Speaker 3 (01:14:52):
Right it's what they did in a slightly you, know
he's a, prep but this Was Jonah tong basically. Right
they Picked Jonah long out of the Draft league where
he was absolutely horrible. There but he had these really
crazy fastball and breaking ball traits and then all of
a sudden he's in the pros and all of a,

(01:15:13):
sudden this change up that until twenty twenty five he's
barely throwing is now his best non fastball, pitch and oh,
yeah the fastball velocity's trending, up and oh, yeah the
command jumped from like a two to four and now
all of a sudden it for command with two extra
miles an hour of fastball velocity and like ten percent

(01:15:35):
upping the change up. USAGE a guy that they got
in the seventh round is like the third best pitching
prospect in baseball or something ridiculous like. THAT i think
that's where we got, him like third or fourth amongst
pitching Prospect but it's a top twenty prospect in all of.
Baseball and it's not like this is like just us saying.
It and also if you didn't, know he's running it

(01:15:57):
over a forty percent strikeout rate in the high, Minors,
like it's not like this is not a fake performance
or anything LIKE i was in the futures. Game so,
yeah it's the teams we like are really the teams we,
like and they're Making you, know if you like blind
told me these, PICKS, i for the most, PART i

(01:16:20):
would be able to tell you whether it was a
good team or a bad team that made, it and
for the most, part it'd be right.

Speaker 1 (01:16:25):
Right, well, guys that was really great. STUFF i really appreciate.
It thanks so much for jumping. ON i appreciate all
the insight and all the work you did for the.
Site so if if listeners haven't read your, stuff make
sure you go back and read the draft recaps That
michael And jared. Did but once, again thanks guys for jumping.

Speaker 2 (01:16:42):
On thank you so much for having. Me this was a.

Speaker 1 (01:16:45):
Pleasure great all, Right So i'm going to move on
to the event That Major League baseball does a terrible
job of promoting the futures, game as players that are
they're going to impact your favorite team much sooner than any.
Draft And Rob manford decides to make it a seven
in a game that competes with regular season big league

(01:17:05):
games On. Saturday you might have missed the, game but
but my next guest did. Not he was there live In,
atlanta and if you didn't read his TEN pac, FEATURE
i really encourage you to go back and check it.
Out so join me, again is Mister Ben? Spannier, ben
how was the?

Speaker 4 (01:17:21):
Trip, no it was a it was a really you,
know it was a fun. Trip my sister happens to
live In, atlanta SO i, decided you, KNOW i visit.

Speaker 3 (01:17:33):
Her and and.

Speaker 4 (01:17:37):
Also enjoy some of The All Star game festive. FESTIVITIES i,
MEAN i totally agree with you about about the logistics of.
EVERYTHING i understand it's not easy to schedule such a
long week of events or long five days of, events
but the fact that the game was only seven, innings

(01:17:57):
so for you, know for exams, ample, uh you, know
you Had Trey yasavich pitching like a third of an.
Inning you had Uh Lasaro montat Uh, montese you, know
hitting bombs in batting, practice but only getting one at
bat during the. GAME i, mean you, know some of
it's just Structural All Star game, issues but, yeah it

(01:18:18):
was an. Ideal but you, know it was fun to be.
THERE i got to meet some cool, people got to
be on the field for batting practice and see some
guys have great vps that didn't. Expect you, know it's
fun Watching Lou, James Lou James gruver hit home, runs you,
know AND bp uh some guys you did you would.
Expect another Guy i'm not going to talk about, later

(01:18:39):
but you, Know Connor griffin put up a GREAT vp
like you'd think you. Would so you know that that
that was, fun cool. Discussions you, know it was fun
to be at the. Game that the crowd WAS i
BELIEVE i saw some commentary about how the crowd in
the ballpark was not was not, huge and that allowed
me to maneuver a little bit and get it on

(01:18:59):
the third base in The firth base. SIDE i don't
know if that's good or, bad but, anyway a fun
day all. Around but BUT i did happen to have
the feeling that even by the TIME i was promoting
the ten, pack that that was WHAT i was. Saying
it was, like, hey you, know you may not even
remember The Futures, game but you know it. HAPPENED i was.

Speaker 1 (01:19:16):
There, well let's take a little bit. Deeper let's just
let's jump in and get your thoughts on a few
guys that stood out to. You let's start off with
THE mvp of the, Game Jose. Depaula tell me what
you thought about about.

Speaker 4 (01:19:27):
Him, well it's it's. FUNNY i you, know you asked
me on the podcast a few weeks ago who ELSE
i must looking forward to? Seeing and IF i had,
remembered you, KNOW i would have set Him depaula an
desire hope from The, dodgers.

Speaker 3 (01:19:41):
You, know.

Speaker 4 (01:19:43):
And you KNOW i liked. IT i THINK i might
flip the question back on you a, bit BECAUSE i
think you know The Futures game was you, know it's
Not it's not you. Know the only real ADVANTAGE i
think in scouting, wise aside from being at THE vp
is the you can see them against top level. Talent
BUT i might ask you in a moment what you
think of those, guys because you've probably seen them more than.
Me but you, know the bigot bat for, HIM i,

(01:20:06):
mean you, know his swing was you, KNOW i don't,
know you, know aesthetically it was, like weirdly not as
pretty AS i thought it would. Be that doesn't really bother,
me of, course you, know as far as a lefty,
swing you, KNOW i just could see everything happening that
that you, know the Reports i've read and the numbers
we had on, him you, know told, us which is

(01:20:29):
that he got like a really uh mature. Approach you,
know he just, looks you, know very very much like
a guy who knows what he's doing up. There a
couple of good, swings one with a deep flyout to left.
Field the other one was the at bat Against Noah,
schultz who has been having a bit of a rough.
Year that's a topic for a different, discussion but you

(01:20:54):
know they were Basically schultz was trying to get him
with breaking stuff and he was throwing you, know it's
breaking stuff around eighty miles per hour over and over
and over, again and after a few, pitches he just you,
know he picked up on one and he hit a
three run home run to give his team the three two.
Leads so you, know he took over the narrative and
that's how he captured THE mvp. AWARD i, know one

(01:21:16):
of the bigger questions for him is the. DEFENSE i
couldn't get a whole lot of insight on that in
such a short, time whether it's going to be a
good a good corner, outfielder or whether whether he's maybe
going to be a first. Baseman BUT i mean he,
definitely you, KNOW i could see all of his all
all the traits we talk about him as a hitter
just in that short, time and he, definitely he definitely

(01:21:39):
he took you, know he captured the, moment you, know
and he got the big hit right.

Speaker 3 (01:21:43):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
YEAH i think that the bat has a chance to
be really special For. Depaula you, know he was our
sixth ranked prospect on the mid season fifty BUT i
THINK i think you could actually make a case for
him being even higher than. That and like you, said
it's hard to see much at one of these showcase,
events but But i've seen him quite a bit defensively

(01:22:05):
is a key for To. Paula and, YEAH i don't
think he's gonna win any Gold gloves or, anything BUT
i think he's going to be passable in the, corner
especially left. Field so AND i think the bat's gonna
going to carry the. Profile but let's, uh, well let's move.
On let's talk about his outfield Made Zire. Hope so
what did you think Is Zire hope during the.

Speaker 4 (01:22:25):
Game you, know he's one where you, know from from
What i've read about him and heard about, HIM i
could definitely see all of, it you, know all all
angles of his, game for better or, worse during during
during the action in such a short time still you
could see it. All you, know you could, see you,
know how explosive he is at the, plate the huge
swings he. Takes you, know he's trying to do damage

(01:22:47):
on every. Pitch that led to some swing and miss
Against Parker, messik who was throwing some tough breaking stuff at. Him,
uh you, know another off speed just you, know a
tricky left handed pitcher and of Course hope it's a
left handed hit or you, know and so you know
he took the. STRIKEOUT i believe he got struck out
on a, fastball but he's dealing with breaking stuff earlier

(01:23:07):
in the, bat so first at bat was not so.
Good later, on he jumped on a high fastball in
the you, know about ninety, SIX i think From Noah,
schultz you, know to set the table for his teammate To.
Paola you, know SO i could see the good in the.
Bat at the, PLATE i definitely could see. Why what you,

(01:23:30):
know just looking at his, numbers he's got the strikeout
rate above twenty five. PERCENT i can see where that
swinging miss comes. From you, KNOW i certainly don't think
it's it's you, KNOW i tend to. AGREE i believe it.
WAS i believe it, was you, know In jarrett And jeffrey's,
right IF i recall, correctly they were saying that it

(01:23:53):
seems to, be you, know less of an issue sort
of picking up pitches or not being able to hit
certain types of pitches in his, zone but, rather you,
know he's trying to do, damage so there's going to
be swinging miss along with. THAT i am interested in
seeing how that develops as he goes into the upper
miners and on. Defense you, know he just BASICALLY i
got to see him uncork one throw on a sacrifice,

(01:24:14):
fly and you, know it was slightly, offline but, man
it was a great. Throw and you, know that's just
another aspect of his game where it's, like, okay there's
the explosiveness. Again so you, KNOW i can see why
he's one of the most fun players in the minor
leagues to, watch even IF i can also see why
there's some people who are really high on him and
some people who are a little worried about.

Speaker 1 (01:24:35):
Him, yeah it's easy to see what's, hope and it'll
be interesting to see how it does in the upper.
Miners moving, on in your in your ten pac entry
On cardinal's middle LANDFIELDER Jj, weatherhol you said that he
was a type of player that you needed to see
in person to fully. Appreciate after seeing, him what did
you appreciate more about his game after seeing him.

Speaker 4 (01:24:54):
Live you, KNOW i don't. KNOW i think there's just
there's just a certain like ease about him in the.
BOX i was kind of having a hard time sort
of describing, it you, know in the ten. Pack but
early in the game again against against The, messik he you,
know he took a pitch just out effortlessly kind of
the left field for a. DOUBLE i believe it was

(01:25:15):
like over one hundred five miles per. Hour might have
been more than, that, actually let me see, yeah, yeah,
yeah about one hundred and six miles per. Hour and you,
know it was just like it was just like you
could see him like processing the pitch and and just
reacting to. It and you, know of, course you KNOW

(01:25:40):
i would see more if i'd seen more of him,
Hitting i'd see more of him using all fields rather
than you, KNOW i think he was using using left
center field a lot during this. Game but it's just
he just had this comfort and this this assurance about,
him and it's, like this guy's going to. Hit this
guy's already a good, hitter which IS i, think you,
Know jeffrey wrote in a previous ten, PACK i believe

(01:26:01):
that he takes what the picture gives, him not in,
like you, know as sort of a negative way that
he doesn't, attack but just you, know he takes what
the picture gives, him you, know and he knows who he.
Is and you, know WHEN i was reading everything about
him previously after you, know he was drafted during his
first year in the, pros that kind of. Thing it
was kind of, like, well if he's this high in the,

(01:26:23):
rankings then you, know maybe there's not a huge amount
of impact talent, besides you, know besides the risky Guys
Sebastian walcott's and the lead degrees and, NO i shouldn't say,
risky but you, know, younger big.

Speaker 1 (01:26:36):
Tools you, know, yeah we the whole seems like a, safer.

Speaker 4 (01:26:40):
Very Different BUT i don't get, excited you, KNOW i
wasn't getting excited about seeing him up, there AND i was, thinking,
well it must not be a really strong, list you.
Know but but having seen, him it's, Like, okay he's
not going to be a, superstar but he's really, close
and you, KNOW i can see, why you, know sort
of on a you know, it it's these days with,

(01:27:01):
pitching with how great the pitching, is how hard it
is to, hit it's hard to guarantee. Anything but he
certainly seems like a guy who's gonna hit in the
major league, level even if he's just a second basement
and even if he's not an explosive. Athlete SO i
can see why he's so highly. Ranked even though you
know the way people had described him accurately described him

(01:27:24):
doesn't make him sound super, exciting but NOW i get.
IT i guess that's What i'm.

Speaker 1 (01:27:27):
Saying, Okay so a next guy THAT i think you,
Like George. Lombard he's struggled a little bit since being
promoted To DOUBLE A, somerset but you seem pretty positive
in your. Report what about his game gives you some
hope that he's going to rebound and keep on path

(01:27:48):
towards the major.

Speaker 4 (01:27:48):
Leagues, YEAH i mean, definitely you, know in terms If
i'm trying to assuage even my own concerns about, him
let alone, OTHERS i probably and this might be a
good project to. DO i might do some more work
on him and try to write a report on, him you,
know now That i've seen, him how he how he
maneuvers in, space and how he operates, LIVE i could
probably do some more work and see how CONCERNED i.

(01:28:10):
Am BUT i really think he you, know he wasn't
the top player in the, game BUT i think, it's you,
know in some, ways he kind of stole the. SHOW
i mean it, was you, know he was you, know
deservedly because he hasn't been great In DOUBLE, a and
there's been there's so much talent on the. Field he
wasn't the starting shortstop because of Course kevin McGonagall, was

(01:28:31):
which you, know very. Deserved McGonagall had a couple of
good swings. TOO i didn't end up including him in
the ten pack because you, know he. Didn't neither have
ended up being hits though though they were interesting swings
in their own. Way you, know definitely looks like mcgonagall's
trying to get into. Power but, anyway With, lombard you,
know he started the second base and he started the

(01:28:51):
bottom of the, lineup and you, know it was JUST
i thought it was. Funny you, know it was basically
everything you'd, expect you know when when you like when
you're like the One yankees, guy like AT, bp it
looked like there was somebody trying to talk to him
like every, minute you, know and he was always, like you,
KNOW i even lent, somebody lent somebody a pen so

(01:29:13):
they could WHICH i bar from somebody else so they
could have their kid ask, him Ask lombard for an,
autograph you, know and he was you, know shaking hands
with with you, know some of the big you, know
some of the people who are hanging around the cage
probably guys who knew his, father you, know but in any,
case he looked like he was like a, celebrity AND
i was, thinking, well this, guy you, know he hasn't
eve been playing that, well he's not the best, prospect but,
anyway he was handling all that IN, bp and then

(01:29:36):
during the game he basically showed a little taste of
everything he can.

Speaker 3 (01:29:39):
Do.

Speaker 4 (01:29:40):
Right he you, know ripped a ball down the left
left field line for a. Double he made a pretty good,
play you, know to his, right you, know you, know
a little, dive and then he tried to you, know
he tried to throw out Lou James, gruver who is
not a not an extremely fast, runner but fast enough

(01:30:00):
that it was a tough play and he didn't finishing the,
play but it's a good, play stole a, base you,
know and just generally his, athleticism which of Course i've
read about And i've watched video on, him so LIKE
i knew what it was, about but it was kind
of cool to see in. Person, he's you, know not
as much an explosive athlete like someone Like, hope but
he's more, like you, know just, smooth like you, know

(01:30:20):
he was kind of on his double he was kind
of cruising a little bit to first then he could
kind of see him just like turn into second gear
and running the second base like and you, KNOW i
do THINK i you're a, Phrase NATHAN i believe is
bet on the, athlete AND i think that that is,
encouraging you, know just seeing seeing how he moves and he's,
younger and you, know if the makeup is, there like

(01:30:44):
it seems like it, is he should be able to
sort of deal with the struggles he's having at DOUBLE
a right, now there's definitely, questions, right you, know we've
seen the, power but can he get into it? Consistently?
Right were projecting the, power but he you, know it's
not a sure thing until it. Happens and the, contact you,
know that's always going to be a. Question he's sitting
for such a low average at DOUBLE. A he can't

(01:31:06):
really hit high level. PITCHING i, MEAN i think that's
true for most. Prospects but you, KNOW i THOUGHT i
thought he looked like someone who was, comfortable you, know
considering how much he struggled, recently SO i thought he
was one of the lower level stars in the.

Speaker 5 (01:31:19):
Game.

Speaker 1 (01:31:20):
Yeah, yeah a twenty year old at DOUBLE. A you,
know you expect him to struggle a little. BIT i
expect him to probably start there again next, year and
what we'll. SEE i think we'll see the Real lombard
next year in twenty twenty six At DOUBLE a talking
about these, showcases and you touched upon it. Earlier sometimes
the game itself is hard to do, anything but batting

(01:31:41):
practice is the best place to kind of get a
gauge on, players especially, Power and SO i was kind
of looking at the roster and just trying to guess
who put on the best power display during batting. Practice
my guess would have Been Josuay bressanio from The. Tigers
WOULD i have been?

Speaker 4 (01:31:57):
RIGHT i think he was pretty good AT. Bp the
funny thing, IS i don't remember him being crazy, there
but also it's it's possible THAT i. WAS i don't,
KNOW i was doing something.

Speaker 1 (01:32:07):
Else there's a lot going.

Speaker 4 (01:32:08):
On it was very hot out, there and there's a
lot going. On but he put on a power display
during the. GAME i thought he didn't hit any home,
Runs but, like he's another one WHERE i kind of
read some of the peripheral stuff about. Him you, know
he's been putting up numbers all, year So nathan we,

(01:32:29):
right the minor league updates every. Day he's been popping
up a fair. Bit and you, know it's Just jared
was talking earlier in this podcast during the draft about
like What detroit is. Doing, yeah AND i think he's
just another. Example you, know he's not a huge, athlete you,
know he's gets, bigger just kind of you.

Speaker 3 (01:32:51):
Know.

Speaker 1 (01:32:53):
First.

Speaker 4 (01:32:54):
Baseman, yeah he's a first baseman who's still. Catching but
it doesn't seem like'istic about. It But i'm not. Either
but but you, know it's kind of funny because people
always used to assume that there'd be too many good
hitting first, basemen but you look around the league and
a lot of teams don't have good hitting first. Basement exactly,
why but seems to be a.

Speaker 3 (01:33:12):
Thing and you, know.

Speaker 4 (01:33:15):
It's JUST i was looking at his numbers after the
game AND i was, like, okay, like you, know his
strikeout and his walk. Rate As, AGAIN i, APOLOGIZE i
don't remember exactly what his age, is but he is
younger for His, yeah he's. Young he's young as. Well
and he was you, know sixteen percent, strikeout says sixteen percent.
Walk he just knows what he's doing at the. Plate
now he's just gotten promoted to DOUBLE a, EERIE i.

(01:33:38):
Believe so you, know DOUBLE a is always a, test
and he's gonna have to hit of, course but he's
just he's kind of like a throwback to. Me it's
just like a lefty who you, know it's not a
huge bat, speed but he's just so strong and he
just gets the barrel like where it needs to be
and he can hit the all. Fields that's another one
where even during a short, LOOK i believe he hit

(01:33:59):
a double a d bright. Field he hit a hard
line drive out to shortstop Against Jonah. Tong it's just,
like as, like OBVIOUSLY i can't get the whole look
in that, game BUT i was, like, OKAY i can
see it, all and you know it Is it's like you,
said he's the first basement kind of what you see
is what you. Get so he's going to really have to.
Produce but you, know another good left handed hitter coming

(01:34:20):
up for The. TIGERS i think.

Speaker 1 (01:34:21):
Right, now to wrap it up, HERE i suppose we
need to talk about a. Picture so let's let's talk
about arguably the best that took them out on that
day In Jonah. Toong it you, know we talked about this,
before but it's it's really hard to evaluate. Hitters but
it's even, HARDER i, think to evaluate pictures in showcase

(01:34:42):
like this when they know they're only going to be
in for a maximum of an, inning so they just
come in and they just they just air it, Out
so it's kind of hard to get really judge they
overthrow some. Stuff with that being, said did you get
a feel for just how Good tong could?

Speaker 4 (01:34:57):
Be, yeah, yeah. Totally he was, DEFINITELY i definitely. CAN i,
mean part of it's, just you, know the INFORMATION i
had before, somehow you, KNOW i let him go last
year in The Sally league AND i never saw, him
so this was my first time seeing him at. All

(01:35:18):
and you, know, yeah it's what you said about About.
VLO i, mean he was up ninety, six ninety. Seven
i'm not even really gonna look At velo when we're you,
know we're talking about these, games, right because all these
guys are above ninety five because they're all just throwing
their wondering AND i Know tom doesn't usually get that,
higher at least that's my, understanding but you, know he

(01:35:42):
and he was overthrowing because he was he was controlling the,
ball but he wasn't commanding the. Ball, again that's NOT i,
know that's not his main skill, set even even starting
in a normal, game but even for you, know but
but basically he was just getting it by. Guys you,
know you could see visually and you could see in
the you, know WHEN i looked at the stat cast readouts,

(01:36:02):
later you know that he was getting that great carry
on the, fastball even if he wasn't locating it every.
Time the curveball was nice to look. At you, know
he was throwing a lot of the change. Up jarrett
was talking about the change. UP i don't know if
he throw a lot of standout change, ups but he
was so comfortable using, it and he was facing a
bunch of leftist so that was a good thing to.
See and you, know but he threw one really enjoyable

(01:36:25):
curveball that Against Harry ford where he just like where it.
Was you, know he just got the big swing and
miss and it was the most aesthetically pleasing aspect of
his sitting in. Generally, yeah you could just see the.
Glimpses you. Know some of it's a little bit biased
on my part BECAUSE i, knew you, know When i'm

(01:36:45):
looking at pictures to write about in a scenario where
it was harder for me to pick out things about
pictures that were. IMPRESSIVE i knew he, was you, know
THE i don't remember if there was anybody above him
in the, game BUT i think there. Wasn't he may
have than the, best the highest rank prospect in the.
GAME i could do. Misremembering but on the pitching, side,

(01:37:06):
YEAH i believe, So, yeah BECAUSE i feel like it's
probably this is this is. This the scenario has to
be right for for for, players for pitchers to even
pitch in that. Game so, yeah but you, know there's
a lot of good stuff out. THERE i don't want
to diminish. It Brody hopkins was another. One you, know
he was he was throwing. Heat he didn't even get any,
strikeouts but you, know it's it's big league stuff for.

(01:37:30):
SURE i, mean so there were there were. Dudes but
BUT i do Think, tom you, know in terms of
both you, know his reputation, beforehand but also just the
way he was able to mix all three pitches and you,
know do it against high level. Competition, YEAH i THINK
i THINK i could, DEFINITELY i can definitely understand why he,

(01:37:53):
has you, know come up from being just a seventh
round guy to being what he is now for?

Speaker 1 (01:37:59):
Sure, sure, yeah testament to The mets pitching. Development so all,
right that's going to wrap up another edition of The Heat.
CHECK i encourage everyone to go back check Out ben's
tenpac from The Futures. Game also go back and look
At jared And michael's draft, recaps both of which can
be found At Baseball perspectives dot. Com feel free to
reach out to the show either On Blue, sky reach

(01:38:21):
out to me at nr gram At Blue, sky or
email us at Heat check At Baseball perspectives dot. Com,
again thanks to my, Guest Thanks, ben and thank you
to the, listeners And i'll see you next. Time