Ka-Why?: Clippers and the Kawhi Leonard Scandal | We T.R.O.Y w 2025 NBA H.O.F Class - The Baseline NBA Podcast

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Speaker 1 (00:01):
This is the baseline discussing the hot button topics of
the NBA.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome everybody, your tune to the baseline.

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Cali Warrenshaw discussing the hot button topics of the NBA.
We are getting so close to that time. NBA season
is right on the precipice. You know that it's starting
to kind of percolate a little bit because the NBA
Hall of Fame finalists have been announced, have been crowned,
have been ceremoniously etched into the archives of greatness, and

(00:33):
so our episode is definitely going to be covering this
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(00:56):
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The Trucker style exactly. We need a Trucker League.

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Speaker 1 (02:11):
Absolutely all right, So we got a jam packed episode.
We got a lot of stuff to get into. Clearly
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But of course, you know the main part of our
show is really to kind of highlight and do our
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doing a reminisce of a particular player. But I think,

(02:32):
as my Man's Shaw had so well put, you know,
it's only right and we kind of do like a
reminisce over you over the class the twenty twenty five
Hall of Fame class and then quite an impressive class
of inductees you know, have been added to the list,
and and so we're going to definitely get into that
as always.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
Be sure to get at my Man's Shaw at the
Warren Shaw.

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content for your listening pleasure. So sew, let's get right

(03:46):
into the butter goods. If people have been following whatever
social media out in it that you get your feed
on stuff going on in the NBA. There is a big, big,
big investigation that is taking place and this is in
relation to Kawhi Leonard and La Clippers, who are at
the center of significant controversy. The NBA has launched a

(04:07):
high profile investigation into allegations that the Clippers attempted to
circumvent the salary cap by facilitating a twenty eight million
dollars no show endorsement deal for Kawhi Leonard through a
now bankrupt sustainability company. The probe, which includes a law
firm hired by the NBA, could lead to serious consequences

(04:29):
for the team if violations are confirmed. This also adds
to Leonard's reputation of his propensity to miss games. Basically,
he's nearly missed half of his regular season contests during
his career and has lasted basically and his last season.
You just recently played thirty seven games before returning to

(04:49):
full playoff series. So Shaw, we'll get into a little
bit about the stuff regarding, you know, the the perception
of Kawhi Leonard. I couldn't help but give this sopranos
feel when we talk about you know, no show endorsement
deals and no show jobs, like as if that really
still happens in today and lo and behold, you know,

(05:14):
we are right in the midst of a soprano resurgence.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
Well, you know, and you know that's early apropos. It's
almost like if you've been in my house. I literally
just started watching Sopranos. That's a whole other conversation. I
never watched the show, so I'm literally in season three
right now, so I'm really getting familiar with kind of
the sopranoism, so to speak. But to me, the ironing
thing about this entirety situation is that it's a no
show deal for a guy who doesn't play all that often,

(05:42):
and so just Kawhi getting away with doing literally nothing
in this case, but always kind of the bare minimum
for somebody who is so great is a really interesting situation.
But the League, the board of governors, is going to
meet probably by the time this show kind of comes out,
and we'll see what the League is going to ultimately
do with this. But there's a lot of smoke. We
got to see if there's fire, But it doesn't smell right.

(06:03):
It looks and it looks and feels a little funky.
And I know a lot of teams, especially the rest
of the league, who doesn't have the same pockets that
Balmber does. Saying if the Clippers will find a way
to circumvent the salary cap by doing stuff like this
for Kawhi Leonard, some serious repercussions are going to have
to be in store.

Speaker 1 (06:19):
I know this sounds really cheesy, man, but you said
it just doesn't smell right, you know, when there's smoke,
there's fire, and we're talking about a bankrupt sustainability company.
To send the heart of the situation, I you know,
it's interesting. I actually you know, had had some interest
you know, years before, you know about aspirations. They they

(06:40):
you know, we're all over the place, you know, emphasis
on you know, being not just a sustainable finance company,
but you know really really really serious about the earth
right and serious about its efforts to help the earth
and sustainability and things of that. And to to find

(07:01):
out that literally this is a bankrupt you know company,
like literally and to find out that somehow they are
wedged into this machine that we call the NBA, I
mean it just speaks volumes man. That like nowadays it
just feels like who people are and what they represent.
You really have to do your research. You have to

(07:21):
do your due diligence and see if whether or not
they are what they practice. They are what they're practicing, right,
They're practicing what they preach. Obviously, every business is out
there about making money, and you put your hands in
so many different pots. But if you don't pay attention
to your pot, you might wind up either with burnt
food or you might wind up with a very dissatisfying

(07:43):
taste in whatever your final meal might be. And that
literally could be the situation with the Los Angeles Clippers.
And I'm not saying this, you know, to be tongue
in cheek. I'm actually being for real because the Los
Angeles Clippers have for the longest time try to get
out of the controversy of being not a well owned team,

(08:06):
not being a team that is taken seriously always is
the little brother to the Los Angeles Lakers. And here
you have an owner who we genuinely have seen in
so many different ways, in so many different occasions, he
really is passionate about seeing the Los Angeles Clippers succeed.
He's been on different outlets saying that he had no

(08:29):
knowledge of this, any of this was happening, that this
was going on.

Speaker 2 (08:33):
I find that very hard to believe.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
I'm not saying I don't believe Steve Barmer, But I
am saying that if you're getting out there and you're
actually saying this stuff to me, it's just still not
a good look. Because as as a mogul, as somebody
who has been as successful as he has been in businesses,
I find it hard to believe that your team didn't

(08:56):
do its due diligence of knowing what kind of people
a surrounding Kawhi Leonard, what kind of people are involved
in things evolving Kawhi Leonard, And Kawhi Leonard is your
cornerstone player.

Speaker 3 (09:07):
You know.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
This isn't the dude that you're bringing up from the
G League or the guy that you know you can't
even pronounce his name on a two way deal. This
literally is a guy that is what started the reason
why you put the Los Angeles Clippers away from the
Staples Center to build all the things that you're building,
and to be in the midst of that just it's
just unheard of to think that nobody on your team

(09:30):
was aware of what was going on or what was
taking place here. And then in a way, you might
actually be throwing Kawhi Leonard into the bus, because if
if Kawhi Leonard hasn't said anything to this, but he's
gonna have to if he doesn't speak up to the
fact that he had no he had any knowledge that
this was taking place. Right, Ultimately, you're saying that whatever
is going on here, Kawhi Leonard may have known. Because

(09:52):
there's only two people that really know about this, and
both names are under investigations, somebody's got to know something.

Speaker 3 (09:58):
Well. Shout out to Paublo Torre as well to want to
make sure that you know, we give.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
Oh yeah, big shout out story.

Speaker 1 (10:02):
I love him, man, I miss him so much on
so many of the different you know, quote unquote ESPN outlets,
But I really appreciated his intellectual perspective on things that
needed to be said about the things that are going
on in sports.

Speaker 3 (10:18):
Yeah, and so I think with this now, Kawhi has
always been an interesting, kind of mysterious type of superstar. Uh.
He's got his bread like that, There's no two ways
about it. Now, as a matter of was his bread
done the bread they got is it? Was it done
in a legal way in according to NBA CBA guidelines
And those are things people will need to find out.

(10:40):
But the league cannot just kind of do a half
assed investigation here. They really need to dig down into
this and figure out what as much as they possibly can.
I know, Cuban has kind of come to Bomber's aid,
and people with money get defrauded all the time, which
seems kind of ridiculous, but I mean it does happen.
But I don't know. I said, I'm not going to
kind of judgment. All we're doing is reporting what we

(11:02):
know or kind of like giving our takes on what
was reported out there, and we'll need to see what
ends up happening to Kawai, Steve Bomber, and LA Clippers.

Speaker 1 (11:10):
Well, So to to the other point Seewan, before we
move on, the first thing is is that this type
of said, first of all, twenty eight million dollars, when
we're talking about a Kawhi Leonard and we're talking about
a Steve Bomber, it's like a drop in the hat, okay,
in the grand scheme of what Kawhi Leonard has basically
made off of the Los Angeles Clippers. So to me,

(11:33):
I think where the problem lies is, you know, if
you're the NBA, what kind of people you have sleeping
in my bed? You know what I'm saying like you
truly have to start questioning like this was one of
the problems that I think we've even spoken to this
about brand activation right and brand having you know, you know,

(11:54):
having a foot in the door sort of speak through
other channels other than what the NBA does, and we
field there's frustrations because at times the NBA, I think
regulates too much, probably misplaced regulation sort of speak. They
regulate on the people who genuinely and honestly want to
help elevate the game, because by elevating the game, it
elevates those outlets that are tapped into it, right, But

(12:16):
when you have situations like this going on now, all
of a sudden, the NBA starts putting its clamps down,
and that could lend itself to repercussions that might hurt
those smaller entities that are trying to make their way.
They're trying to figure out a way to get in
on this money machine that is the NBA. And it's
unfortunate because when you have star players and owners in

(12:40):
the middle of this, it gives credence and justification for
Silver and his team to do certain things. And the
guinea pigs the test case are always going to be
the little men. It won't be those guys because to
your point, they've already gotten paid, you know what I'm saying.
At the very least, whatever comes down, whatever ramifications take place,
have to be severe enough that it's sending a message

(13:02):
to all of the teams that this is not this
can't be allowed. But at some point you have to
wonder if whether or not this is still going to be.

Speaker 2 (13:10):
For the good of the NBA.

Speaker 3 (13:12):
Yeah. The last thing I'll say is that I think
there was similar precedent. It was Joe Smith way back
in the day. I was listening to another podcast previously,
and I think they were referencing that where Joe Smith
and the Timberwolves got into some shenanigans, if you will,
and it cost to the Timberwolves. I think it was like
four or five first round picks. Clippers don't have a
whole lot of draft equity because of the Koar sorry

(13:33):
not the Kuhi, but the Paul George deals like that
could be really disasters. Despite the deep pockets that Bomber has.
If you don't have picks and essence to be able
to draft and curate talent that puts you push your
team in a really really precarious situation, especially at the
quiet aging in the way that he is. Again, we
just need to wait to see when into finding out,
but hopefully things are on the up and up. I'm

(13:55):
not rooting against him here, but again, it doesn't look
amazing right now for the Clippers.

Speaker 1 (13:59):
Yeah, definitely amazing. And and you know doesn't look amazing for
Kawhi Leonard two. You know, there's another situation where you know,
you just have to wonder, like you know, as a person,
you know, do you have your are is your is
your circle as tight as you you may think it is?

Speaker 2 (14:16):
Right?

Speaker 3 (14:16):
Uncle Dennis Man, Uncle Dennis.

Speaker 1 (14:19):
Calling it out? All right, cha, let's quickly move ahead.
Quick signing took place. Cam Thomas has decided I want
to run it up one more time with the Brooklyn Nets.
I'm sure that's putting a smile on Michael Porter Junior's face.
So what do we make of the one year signing
for our man Cam Thomas, who is slated to make

(14:39):
six mil re signing with the UH with the Brooklyn Nets.

Speaker 3 (14:43):
Yeah, qualifying offer. What it boils down to, He felt
like he was he should get more money. There wasn't
a lot of money out there for him, especially at
the stage of the off season. So did he lose
some money? Probably not, because I think he'll be able
to recoup some of this and maybe next year, but
he has to do the bet on himself situation. Hopefully
he can stay healthy on a team that is obviously
not that great, and he and Michael Porter, as I've

(15:05):
said many times, will just be kind of taking turns,
you know, throwing that thing out there. So we'll see
what the statistic foot life for camp Thomas. I'm not
rooting against him in any way. I think he's a
valuable basketball player, and especially when it comes to the
offensive side. But the question is, you know, does that
value equate to winning? And those are things that I
think are still a little bit in question.

Speaker 1 (15:23):
I was going to ask you a question real quick, Seaw, like,
how do you see Cam Tooms, because like right now,
in this climate of the NBA, I think that his
what he brings to the table makes him expendable. And
I'm not saying that to you know, to be to
be slight of him. What I'm saying is, yes, he's

(15:44):
an explosive offensive player at times, but I think in
this day and age right now, with the way teams
are structured, With the way teams are you're looking at
your top tier teams. I don't think it's a question
of those teams wanting just an explosive player that has
to be something else that comes with his game. And
I think maybe if this was maybe two years ago,

(16:05):
then we would be having a different conversation about he's
really only gonna make six mil, when there's maybe like
three or four other different teams that could certainly utilize
what he could bring to the table. I feel like
there is this surgeence of having those I don't want
to say three and D type of guys, but really
defensive intensive, those guys that are like glue kind of

(16:26):
guys that are going to be necessary for the teams
trying to make those stretch runs. And any team that's
basically willing to pay any money for a guy like
Cam Thomas is just like saying, we just need somebody
that looks like they can, you know, put up some
impressive numbers on a certain night or something like that,
but not necessarily become a foundational player. And it sucks
because I think Cam Thomas is a good player, but

(16:48):
I don't think that the situation of what the Brooklyn
Nets doing now with this trade with Michael Porter Junior
does him any service whatsoever. So basically he's getting paid
six million dollars to undermine essentially what his skill set
could actually be meant for in.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
Some other places.

Speaker 3 (17:03):
I mean, he turned none other deals right, he didn't
like the other deals that were offered, and then he
didn't want to not be able to control his destiny.
He could have signed a different offer where he would
have then given up I guess it's not his bird rights,
but he would have given up no trade clause as
a result of the qualifying offer. So he needs to
be able to keep his new trade clause in place,
which he does, and then now decide where he ultimately
wants to go next year. We haven't seen him in

(17:24):
a different situation. He's only been on Brooklyn, and Brooklyn
has had various iterations I think in the cam Thomas era,
so he's gone from not playing at all to be
playing maybe overplay to some degree. Obviously. I think his
role is probably somewhere in the middle. He doesn't need
to be your one a player, but I think if
he's you know, probably like your third option, so to speak,
or your best score coming off the bench on a
good team. There might be some wiggle there, but we

(17:46):
just haven't seen it for Cam. Unfortunately, I'm not down
on him as many people are because they think he's
just empty calories, score, etcetera, et cetera. We haven't seen
him in any other situation, so I won't really judge
Cam Thomas's career until we get to another place, which
will not be Brooklyn, and see where we go for that.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
Absolutely your tuned to the Baseline Cali Warnshaw discussing the
hot button topics of the NBA coming up. Sew and
I do our segment Reminisce over You Hall of Fame style.
We talk about the twenty twenty five Hall of Fame class,
do a little reminiscing on an impressive list of those
who have just been recently inducted into the Hall of Fame.

(18:22):
You don't want to go anywhere, Cali Warrenshaw, Baseline NBA Podcast,

(18:43):
The Reminisce So for you listen, listen, We're back Cali Warrenshaw,
The Baseline NBA Podcast. Time for us to do a
little Reminisce over You twenty twenty five Hall of Fame
class and seaw, what an impressive class of inductees into
the Hall of Fame. It's kind of crazy, right, Like
some of these people, I just probably want to say,

(19:05):
just yesterday we were just probably watching games of their performances,
and now we're already talking about how they are now
forever enshrined in the class into the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
So the Naysmith Hall of Fame.

Speaker 1 (19:19):
So it's really impressive, man, Carmelo, Anthony, Dwight Howard, Sue Byrd,
Maya Moore, Sylvia Fouls, the two thousand and eight USA
men's basketball team aka the Redeemed Team, Billy Donovan, referee,
Danny Crawford, owner Mickey Arrison. So really quite the impressive
list of to say the least.

Speaker 3 (19:40):
Man.

Speaker 1 (19:40):
And I wanted to get your thoughts a little bit
before we kind of dig into each of these guys,
But I just kind of wanted to get your thoughts
about did they get this right with this particular class?

Speaker 3 (19:49):
Yeah, I mean it is an excellent class. There's rarely,
I guess times where we're just like, you're kind of
raising your brow. I don't know how that got in
if I had to question anything the notion of T
teams getting in is something that still doesn't quite connect
with me the way that maybe it should. But this
is the fourteenth.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
Now say how you speak, how you feel Shaw, It
bothers me. It really bothers me.

Speaker 3 (20:12):
Yes, I can't quite figure it out, but it's the
fourteenth team. So I had to look it up because
I was like, how many times has this happened? So
that twenty eight team is obviously extremely rich in terms
of Hall of Fame talent on their own right, but
then it allows guys like Boozer and Darren Williams, Chris
Paul who ultimately go into the Hall of Fame on
his own right, on his own merit anyway, Tayshawn Prince

(20:34):
and some others Michael Red, you know, they kind of
get into the Hall of Fame based on this other
participation on that roster. And I'm not knocking it per se,
But if I was like, oh, well, that's interesting, I
think that was the one thing that kind of caught me.
But I understand in the lore of basketball how special
that team was. But everybody else on this that that
has gotten in there has contributed to basketball. And remember

(20:55):
it's not the NBA Hall of Fame. It's the basketball
Hall of Fame has contributed in a major, major way
to the sport.

Speaker 1 (21:02):
I hear where you're coming from. I agree with you.
It is a little awkward, right, But again, this is
part of where the Hall of Fame loses me in
all sports at times, because it just feels like you're
appeasing to a specific audience or you're appeasing to maybe

(21:24):
a specific group that you know, feel some kind of
way like why don't we do something like that? And
I'm just like, there's a reason why you don't do
something like that, right, Like, because I often thought of
the Hall of Fame as an individual achievement. When you
start putting teams in this, right like, how many of

(21:45):
those individuals really helped contribute to that situation? And you
can't leave any one particular person out of it. So
it always is is a very you know, like these
type of scenarios I think is well received that we're
put it before putting together a historical you know, museum

(22:06):
of outlining the history and the greatness of certain eras
and certain teams during certain times, you know what I mean?
That to me probably resonates a little bit more, and
it's not to take away from the greatness of those
players that.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
Were part of a team. But yeah, I agree with you.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
I think that at times it's too much because you know,
outside of outside the name of the team, we're making
the comparisons of the Redeemed Team against the Dream Team, right, like,
are we doing that? And how many of those players
a part of the Dream Team are in the Hall
of Fame?

Speaker 2 (22:42):
Right?

Speaker 3 (22:42):
How many?

Speaker 1 (22:42):
You know they're Just to me, it gets very etchy
at times when we do things like that. I think
teams are better suited when you do that for something
as a historical context a part of the Hall of Fame,
but inducting them in the Hall of Fame I often
think as well too, it takes away from those players.
You know, Kamene Anthony is basically getting thrown in there twice.

(23:05):
You know what I'm saying is this I just I
just think it's a little too much.

Speaker 3 (23:09):
Yeah, hey, you ask my overall opinion. Seems like on
that is the one thing where we're like, huh, all right,
But again it's not the first time. So that's at
the end of the day. I said, if it was
a first time, this would happen, then maybe there could
be more of a question mark here. But there's been
thirteen other teams that were inducted to the Hall of Fame,
you know, for whatever they were ultimately able to contribute

(23:30):
to the game of basketball.

Speaker 1 (23:31):
Actually, and one other things too, Sean, I want to
speak to this because I feel like there's a level
of hypocrisy to this thing. Okay, and I'm not saying
this because I think people are going to get this
interpretation and be being unpatriotic or anything like that. It
really has nothing to do with that. But we're talking
about consistency. If you're going to start throwing in those
teams a part of the Basketball Hall of Fame, what

(23:51):
about the international teams that won goal medals right that
did basically the impossible. When are we going to actually
have conversations and knowledge them and induct them. They are
part of basketball as well too, Like if we're talking
about to your point, Shaw, the Natesmith Basketball Hall of
Fame should not only be limited to just what the
American basketball players do. It should be expanded to the

(24:15):
globalization of what other athletes and other teams have been
doing to contribute to the popularity and the greatness of
the sport of basketball. So at some particular point, now
by you doing this, you open up Pandora's box, because
my next question is going to be when, when, When,
when are we going to start acknowledging the first African
born player as part of basketball Hall of Fame and

(24:36):
that the Philippine, the Filipino player or a Jeremy like
you get what I'm saying, Like these these are things
that would be considered Hall of Fame in their countries
as well too. But it's part of basketball, and if
basketball is a global sport, they're going to have to
be considered for the reasons that you're putting a team
like the Redeemed Team into the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 3 (24:54):
Yeah, I'd encourage everybody look up the other teams that
have made it. I think there's a good point there.
They are primarily American based, and I don't know that
this is the American Basketball Hall of Fame, so you know,
there's some things in there. I guess I should ultimately
be considered, but also don't know what's going on in
other countries, right, I don't know. Does you know Europe
have a basketball Hall of Fame that we're not aware
of there, probably is on some sort of recognition on that, But.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
How much you want to bet Michael Jordan is in there.

Speaker 3 (25:20):
In any event? So who are we gonna start with?

Speaker 2 (25:23):
First man in terms of our Well, let's let's let's
let's start with, you know, obviously, the Manda Myth, the
legend Carmelo Anthony.

Speaker 3 (25:30):
Right.

Speaker 1 (25:31):
Carmelo Anthony, ten time NBA All Star, six time All
NBA selection, ranks tenth on the NBA's all time scoring
list with twenty eight thousand, two hundred and eighty nine
points over nineteen seasons.

Speaker 2 (25:43):
Led Syrahcuse to.

Speaker 1 (25:44):
His first NCAA Basketball Championship as a freshman, earning Most
Outstanding Player honors in two thousand and three Final in
the two thousand and three Final four. Internationally, Anthony is
also a three time Olympic gold medalist for Team USA,
holding the single game scoring record for the national team
with thirty seven points, and is one of only three
players with four Olympic basketball medals. Well deserved obviously, right,

(26:10):
Carmela Anthony, iconic basketball player, Probably one of the most
deadly mid range players I think we'll ever see of
our generation.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
Right. I know that people want to complicate him.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
In that era of those franchise players and teams that
literally built around the one player type of thing. But
I can honestly say, Sean, We've said this as well too,
like even when great players recognize that the window of
opportunity closes on that possibility of winning an NBA title,
on things that nature, that it's going to force them

(26:50):
to change their game. And I give one of the
greatest accolades I can give a guy that Carmelo Anthony
is he tried, He tried mightily to change the way
that he was as a player, to act, to acclimate
himself to the teams that he was playing for, you know,
And I applaud that, you know, because in in basketball,
even a great player at times who were putting up

(27:11):
great numbers, it's hard for them to walk away from
what they basically helped set up, right, the foundation that
they set up, the great rivalries that they'se had with
Lebron James unmatched, even the rivalries with Duane Wade. They
were part of a trifecta and era of basketball that
I think we love and applaud. But Carmelo Anthony was
just that guy. Man, He was just an offensive juggernaut

(27:32):
and you know with a mid range it was just
to die for.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Yeah, I mean, Mellow is one of those guys where
like you you can always kind of remember who he was.
He had a like this, like really distinct impact on
the game. The Nuggets teams probably kind of stonewalled, if
you will, buy by Bi Kobe era, so to speak.
And then went to New York in a time that
not a lot of stars were going to New York.
I think Marvels always the first guy that Mellow joins whatever,

(27:59):
but the next I had a couple of decent runs
there with Mellow in tow and you know, he he
made sure that he was able to recognize both of
those situations. Yes, he had stops and O KC And
Houston and Portland and even the Lakers, but those his
his career. It was built on his days on the
Nuggets and the Knicks. And I even remember also remember
it's the entirety of his basketball career, so that that

(28:21):
one championship at Syracuse kind of the one and done.
I remember, I forget who it was was saying in
on the on the telecast, but he was just so
physical as a freshman. They were just like you don't
see if you know, eighteen nineteen was coming and being
that physical and he was able to do that put
that put that shoulder in you, you know, kind of
ward you off a little bit and then be able
to explode and shoot over the top of guys, you
know at that six seven six eight frame. I really

(28:43):
really did like Carl Melo Anthony for the majority of
his playing career. You know, had a couple of things,
you know, with some of our Celtics here and there,
but ultimately again Mellow is he goes in as a
Hall of Famer. Twelve hundred and sixty games played, almost
twenty three points per game, six rebounds, three assists, call it,
you know, rounding up a litt little bit fabulous career
for Carmelo Anthony.

Speaker 2 (29:02):
Absolutely.

Speaker 1 (29:02):
I have one quick question to ask you, Shaw, if
there was a head coach that you would have loved
to see coach up Carmelo Anthony, who would have been.

Speaker 3 (29:13):
I think Mellow would have really if Thrid had he
ended up doing this whole situation with Lebron and Wade,
you know, so under Spolstra, I think that's somebody who
could have really gotten maybe a little bit moroud of him,
maybe from the defensive side more specifically, because then he
would have been forced to play, you know, kind of
in that culture air quote, you know, winning solid basketball
because Lebron had to change his mindset, right, And I

(29:35):
don't Lebron was always going to be a very good player,
but winning a championship I think he had. He owes
a lot to that, teaming up with Doing Wade and
Chris Bosh obviously, but also the mindset that coach Spolster
had kind of instilled on that roster. So I think
that's somebody in the days that he was playing, so
to speak. If that would have happened, I think his
career trajectory might have been even a little bit more

(29:55):
amplified because he might even have more accolades under his
overall belt.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
I would have loved to seeing what Popovich would have
been able to do with him, makes sense. Yeah, I
was really curious about, you know.

Speaker 1 (30:09):
That if there was that possibility of having Duncan Parker
and and Carmelo Anthony if that were ever happened, what
what would that would look like? It would be pretty yeah,
I mean, well quickly, but the Spurs are quite fine with.

Speaker 3 (30:24):
I don't know if you remember back in our days
covering you know, All Star Weekend and the one year
it was like he was like he was he was
angry to get out of out of them.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
Yeah we were, we were on court, We were on
the court.

Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah it was Dallas. I think it was All Star
in Dallas, and it was just so awkward, like everything
was like it.

Speaker 1 (30:44):
Wasn't was it was it was? It was it Rashid
Was it Rashid Wallace? No, No, it was Kevin Garnett.
It was it was. It was Kevin Garnett that came
over to the desks, that came over when when everybody
was blitzing him and he really didn't want to talk
about the situation. You want to talk about it, and
he was basically like, you know, it was so weird,

(31:05):
right because then like a couple of years later than
Two Beef, like.

Speaker 3 (31:08):
I remember, I mean those days, like I remember, Duncan
was there, Dirk was there, and so they were like, listen,
we don't want to be involved in this conversation, right,
like especially dark because I think I'm pretty sure it
was Dallas. You know, he's he's the host player if
you will, so He's like, I don't care about what's
happening with Carmelo in Denver. I got my own thing to.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
Worry about, my own stuff to worry about.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
But again, that's kind of like not putting a disparaging
mark on it. It was just something that when it comes
to Carmela, I'll always remember that because hey, we were
really kind of the midst of that at that All
Star weekend. Then again a few days later, he ends
up traded to the Knicks, and you know the rest
is history.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yeah, absolutely, Cally won't shot basedline NBA podcast. All right,
let's go on to our next inductee, and his name
is uh Well, he says he's Superman, even though Shack
says he's Superman. But now the two have made ups,
and now we have two Superman. Dwight Howard is the
only player in NBA history to win Defensive Player of

(32:03):
the Year three consecutive times from two thousand and nine
to twenty eleven, ranking top ten all time in rebounds
over fourteen thousand and blocks twenty two hundred and twenty eight.
He's an eight time NBA All Star, eight times All
NBA honoree, led the NBA rebounds five times and blocks twice.
It was a core member of the two thousand and

(32:23):
eight Redeemed team that won Olympic gold. Howard secured his
first NBA championship with the Lakers in the twenty twenty season.
Look man, Dwight Howard was, this was a monster essentially
when he wanted to be. I felt bad because I
think the prime years we could have been talking about

(32:45):
Dwight Howard maybe winning won maybe two NBA titles, but
the Cavaliers Rhism's way, the Celtics were in his way,
and then just things just didn't work out when he,
you know, played with Kobe Brian and the Los Angeles Lakers.
And I think one of the things that I'm always
going to take away from what I've reflected about Dwight

(33:07):
Howard and what I've always found to be who he
is as a this guy's athleticism is just off the charts,
man like he could do what few people could do
with his size and his build is just absolutely remarkable.
And to be a three times Defensive Player of the
Year three years consecutively, it just speaks volumes to the
level of commitment that he gave and he put himself

(33:31):
into being that good, you know, defensively, I think you
can make the argument he probably will go down as
probably one of the top ten defenders of all time,
maybe even top five with just how as who he
was as a person in the emphasis that he had
on the defensive side of the basketball was just unheard
of and unmatched.

Speaker 3 (33:50):
Yeah, Dwight was a truly physical, dominant presence. Again a
quick story with that as well, the height of kind
of like our coverage years following the league, being in
a Lando meat locker rooms as well too, and just
you know how jovial he would be, but then he
took he took losing really really harshly as and some
people didn't always see that right because you know, he

(34:11):
has a really jovial overall spirit, and some people just
didn't take him seriously. But I was in locker rooms
where he would be really upset, you know, after tough losses,
and Dwight understood that, you know, he had a job
to do. But there's a lot more to life even
than basketball. So his overall embodiment of being a human
being is what I really expect about Dwight Howard. In
addition to the statistics, as he was able to put

(34:32):
on the basketball for on a regular basis. But again
that physical presence dominance on the rebounding dominance and on
you know, when it comes to block shots. One of
the better lobterards we've had in our game, not only
just because of his size, you know, multiple time dunk
champion and all of that. Despite what you want to
say about the dunk contest, et cetera, et cetera, Dwight
Howard really put it out on the floor and wasn't
really afraid to be embarrassed. Right. He put himself in

(34:54):
air quote kind of compromising positions, so to speak, to
be judged, but that didn't matter to him. And then
the fact that he ends up getting an NBA Championship
in twenty twenty really kind of puts the chef's kiss
on his overall career.

Speaker 1 (35:05):
Yeah, my last thought about you know, Dwight Howard Shaw,
and I think it's regarding what you were just saying that,
you know, people didn't take him seriously. I think the
problem that maybe some people had with Dwight Howard is
that that fire that burns inside of a person like

(35:26):
a Lebron James, who you played against numerous times he
found it within himself to find another gear. And I
don't know I whether or not we ever really kind
of saw that because of everything that was going on
with with with with Dwight Howard, in the situations and
the circumstances regarding the Orlando Magic, and that has a factor.

Speaker 2 (35:49):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (35:49):
It plays It plays a part, you know, and it
also changes your perspective at times. I listen, we could
have the same conversation about Carmelo Anthony that some players
at certain points just realize, you know what, I have
to start accepting the fact that I might not wind
up winning this thing under the landscape of what the
current NBA looks like because that person is in my way,
or because that circumstances is just not allowing me to.

Speaker 2 (36:12):
Be where I want to be with certain things. And
you know, we have to we have to.

Speaker 1 (36:16):
You know, as fans, it sucks because it feels like
we're coming down on a player, but it's because we're
seeing someone who's doing it differently and is figuring out
a way to do it, and we're not seeing it
from the person that we want to believe has that
ability to do that and it sucks, you know, because
I was hard on Dwight Howard. I wanted to see
Dwight Howard thrive to a level where like how we

(36:37):
look at giannas Atatukunpo. You know what I'm saying, Like
that was what I was expecting when I went during
our heydays of watching Dwight Howard, and I think in
some ways it kind of fell short. But as I've
gotten older and I've relooked and re litigated all of
the circumstances that are kind of combined into that, I'm
not putting that all on him. I do think that
what was missed to your point, Shaw, is having one

(36:59):
of those players who actually did enjoy the game of basketball,
gave his all when he did play. He never, you know,
shorted anybody on when he was on that basketball court,
and I think we have to appreciate that. And I'm
glad he did finally win that NBA Championship and was
a part of it. Like he wasn't somebody that was
riding the bench. He actually contributed significantly to the success
of the Lakers winning that twenty twenty title.

Speaker 3 (37:21):
Yeah, I mean, there's he He's he's bothered by the
fact that he make the top seventy five. So then
and he kind of gets his revenge if Bill by
going in twice on the same night on the twenty
eighteen and then obviously for his career. But it is
interesting because yeah, he could always say like, yeah, he
close one a little bit more and you go look
back at like his highest points per game ever was

(37:41):
twenty three. He never averaged more than twenty three game
for somebody that that was that physical. And then obviously
not being able to super freet those wells kind of
took took some of his points.

Speaker 2 (37:50):
It took some of the toll. But I also think
as well to stan Van Gundy had a lot to
do with it, because remember stan Van Gundy, in his
style of offense was just was basically chart Lewis.

Speaker 3 (38:00):
Those guys were out there doing that.

Speaker 2 (38:01):
Yeah, in out type off miss right.

Speaker 1 (38:03):
Yeah, he believed the prioritizing the three more so than
than Dwight Howard, and Dwight will never speak to you know,
ill of stan van Gundy. Obviously, stan Van Gundy allowed
you know, Dwight Howard to thrive, but you could clearly
see that on the back end of his time and
his tenure with the with the magic and the magic
not succeeding and falling, you know, short of expectations with

(38:25):
being Gundy. You could see that their relationship started to
become strained because you heard a lot of outward noise
and comments post games and things of that nature. He
didn't hear they're there. But again, Dwight Howard well deserved
and his numbers clearly. And listen, you can make the
argument regardless of what people see on on on big
you know, Big three and stuff like that, basketball, Dwight
Howard could still probably play in this NBA right now.

(38:46):
He could still there is a team that could definitely
use the body and the athleticism that he could bring
to the table. May not be able to give you
some thirty something minutes, but he can definitely give you
some significant minutes that other guys that they struggle to
get from some of the guys that they got on
the benches plane that plays at the big position. Sir,
All right, coming up, Sean and I will go over
a few now we're gonna transition to the w NBA.

(39:09):
We got some notable names to throw up in there
that are now Hall of Fame inductees.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
You don't want to miss it. Here on the baseline.
We are back, Cali Warrenshaw Baseline NBA Podcast. We're back
and it's time for us to continue our coverage of
the Reministe Segment twenty twenty five Hall of Fame class.

(39:36):
Next up, Shaw, Sue Bird, of course, fly Eagles Fly,
I mean Sue Bird, the legendary point guard, winning four
w NBA Championships, two NCAA titles, five Olympic gold medals
over twenty one w NBA seasons with the Seattle Storm.

Speaker 1 (39:57):
Sue Bird set records for most games played, ciss ranked
ninth all time and points second and may three pointers,
thirteen time All Star, and consistently ranked as WNBA's top
ten in any major statistical category. Listen, Shaw, you can
make the argument that sup Berd could probably be one
of the top top seventy five, top one hundred greatest

(40:20):
basketball players. You know that, well, we'll ever know or
come to know. I love SUPERB, man. I hated Connecticut,
but I love Superb you know what I'm saying. And
it sucks, man, because all of the players that I
love watching all play for Connecticut. But she set the tone.
She set the tenor. She is the foundation of why

(40:42):
the WNBA is as successful as it's been, and for
what she's been able to achieve is just remarkable and
well deserved to be in the Hall of Fame class.

Speaker 3 (40:51):
Yeah, I gotta be honest. In terms of women's basketball,
I know there's a many great players that even came
before her and even since, but she was really the
first one who I absolutely like, kind of like was
paying attention and resonated with. You know, I remember us
even being in college at the time, what's going on
in you can just you know, that historical run that

(41:11):
they were having. They were just quite crushing people. And
then for her to be able to maintain that briestent
overseas or whatever, and then all of a sudden joining
the inaugural you know season the WNBA and literally the
first NBAWNBA player with their own statue. Sup Berd is
a living, living legend in basketball as a duded to
not just the WNBA, not women's basketball, but basketball period.
She's an amazing, amazing individual who's highly accomplished and I'm

(41:35):
a very very big fan of, very very big fan
of as well.

Speaker 1 (41:39):
One of the things Shaw that I love about Sue
Bird is in its essence, in its core, she embodied
and embraced the point guard position. I mean, she is
the definite like we often threw out the definitions with
the you know, Chris Paul's and you know we talk
about the halet checks and the Jerry West, you know.

(42:00):
But I'm telling you, man, you look at the accolades
that you put her, her resume up against some of
those guys that we talk about, those greats that we
talk about. And I'm telling you right now, if I
had to choose and put a team together, I'm putting
Sue Bird on my team.

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Man.

Speaker 1 (42:16):
I know that she has the requisite knowledge, but she
also has the gameplay to get my guys in the
best position possible to go out and compete. It doesn't matter, man,
woman child, it doesn't matter. Super Bird will take whoever
she has on that roster and she will make them
significantly better. And when the time calls for, when you

(42:37):
need a big shot, when you need something, you need
to play, you need something to spark, she was always
in the middle of it. She is our quote unquote
Derek Jeter of the NBA.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (42:49):
I think a lot of people get all fascinated that
she has to score like these ton of points and
everything that she does across the board significantly impacted not
just the team, not just the sport, but the culture
in and of itself. And I just love the fact
that she is a part of that. Man, That's one

(43:09):
of the things I love about superb Man. I don't
want to go too much on that tangent, but man,
watching her be a part of this class, I mean,
it's it's just the chef's kiss right there, because it
was well deserved and not a moment too soon. Because
everything that she has done has always been laying the foundation.
She did that in Connecticut where we see we saw
that era of dominance take off again for Forgo what's

(43:35):
the head coach's name, Gino Gino for Gino, And we
saw her do that for the sale out of Storm.
We've seen her do that just like literally everything that
she's done, man, has been foundational, and I appreciate that
more than anything else.

Speaker 3 (43:51):
Yeah, I think I'm trying to figure out, like her
NBA comp if there would be one, and then I'm
not trying to just arrange like I don't know if
her NBA comp was like a Steve Nash had Jason
in or sock Good or whatever, but just one of
the better point guards in the game of basketball to
ever play.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
But it's almost like you can't, right, because every one
of those guys you would probably mention lacks something that
she was able to achieve in our own right. Which
is why it's like I can't imagine what we say
in point guards of all time, Like she wouldn't be
like one of those people that you speak of.

Speaker 2 (44:21):
Initially, you know what I'm saying, All right, seall let's
move on and this one. Listen, I'm not gonna say
this is a no.

Speaker 1 (44:28):
I will say that this is a it's wow, this
is really soon, Like maybe because Sue Bird is in there,
And then in my head I'm thinking wow, because I
probably said to myself, maya more right? I think I
feel almost feel like it's a way that she shouldn't
she still be still playing w NBA.

Speaker 2 (44:46):
She was that damn good of a player.

Speaker 1 (44:48):
But she is one of basketball's most accomplished athletes, with
four w NBA championships, two NCAA titles, two Olympic gold medals,
a w NBA MVP Award and a w NBA Finals
MVP Award, Rookie of the Year, selected to the six
selected to six w NBA All Star Games, five All
WNBA First Teams, and finished with one of the highest

(45:10):
winning percentage in pro basketball history. Moore is also recognized
for her advocacy and justice work after step away from
the game in twenty nineteen.

Speaker 2 (45:19):
Man, look, when.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
I read that off, I'm like, yeah, she definitely deserves
to be in there. And in my head, I'm just like,
it's just crazy to me that she still isn't playing
the game of basketball.

Speaker 2 (45:29):
But what an impressive resume probably could go down as
maybe one of the greatest basketball players to ever play
the game. Is she had continued to keep playing bro
with everything that she did. Man, maya more a what
a you know what a cherish to the culture.

Speaker 3 (45:44):
Man, Yeah, I think, you know, not trying to judge it.
And everybody had their moment and did their thing. I
think her speech was probably the best of the night,
something that I think you can go back and play
and encourage, you know, people, women, men, doesn't really matter
at her She's just so extremely intelligent as an individual

(46:04):
and connected as a human being and That's one thing
I think again about the entirety of this class, like
they're just really good people, or they've evolved into even
better people with some of the experiences if they've had,
but maya more just had, like locked and loaded. I
remember watching her speech and even my wife was like, well, damn,
you know what I mean, it was just inspiring. So
what she did on the basketball court, you know what

(46:26):
cannot even be it got into the Hall of Fame.
But what she's done as an individual is, you know,
is almost you know, like a Noble Peace Prize worthy.
She's just so so embedded in terms of just doing
the right thing. But again, she was an incredible basketball
talent that I was really really excited that we had
an opportunity to see in our lifetime.

Speaker 1 (46:44):
Absolutely, all right, Sean, we got one more we're gonna
throw into the mix here of our female contemporaries getting
into the Hall of Fame. Sylvia Fouls renowned, is one
of the WNBA's greatest centers, winning two wa NBA titles,
two Final MVPs, four Defensive Player of the Year awards,
second to only Tamika Catchings, eight All Star selections, ranked

(47:08):
second all time, and rebounds, fourth and blocks named to
eleven all defensive teams. Won five Olympic gold medals with
Team USA, and her jersey retired with both the Minnesota
Lynx and the LSU Tigers. What can be said, man like,
and it's so weird, man, because she came up in
a time where I think the fixation was on like

(47:28):
the Supers and at least the Leslies and things of
that nature, and we're just like, have we not forgotten
the greatness of Sylvia fALS. I just think it's apropos
that the icing on the cake for her illustrious NBA
career is topped off with her being considered as one
of the greatest and is a Hall of Famer.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
Yeah, somebody who had that ability to really defend, you know,
at a high level, you know, almost Dhite Howard asked,
I guess if you can say, you know kind of
like not necessarily the counterparts, but you know, similar skill sets,
you know, when it comes to the men's and women's game.
And again somebody else who too, who really didn't always
get their flowers at the highest level. Right. She obviously

(48:04):
she's very accomplished and decorated, but sometimes maybe still a
little bit underrated because it wasn't the highest scoring person
on the regular basis because she really, you know, honed
in on the defensive side of basketball, but winning MVPs,
you know, winning those multiple defensive players a year, and
being such a rebounding process that she was, you know,
on so many many great women's teams. I'm really excited
to see that she was honored in the way she was,

(48:26):
you know, even understated. I think some degree in her
speech as well too, just like, hey, I'm happy to
be here. But you know, she doesn't need to need that.
She earned every bit of that Hall of Fame induction
that she got last night.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Absolutely your tune to the Baseline Cali Warrenshaw discussing the
hot button topics of the NBA. Coming up, we'll wrap
up with our reminisce overuse segment discussing those that have
been indoctrined. We got the two thousand and eight redeemed team.
We also have a head coach, and we also have

(48:57):
a referee who's well deserved and is big now college
an inductor.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
So you don't want to miss it here on the Baseline, We're.

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Back Cali Warnshaw Baseline NBA Podcast rounding up our coverage
of the Hall of Fame twenty twenty five class. So
now we have the two thousand and eight USA Men's
Basketball Redeem Team. The Redeem Team dominated the two thousand
and eight Beijing Olympics, winning gold in undefeated fashion, featuring

(49:33):
stars like Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, Carmelo Anthony,
and Dwight Howard. And they set the new Olympics standard
standard for teamwork, defense and star power. What more can
be said, shaw, I mean, after what happened in two
thousand and four, you knew that this was coming, and
those guys showed up and showed out and they dominated.

Speaker 2 (49:52):
You know, they dominated.

Speaker 1 (49:55):
And to this day, there is not a time where
we don't talk about, you know, Kobe Bryant, Lebron James,
Dwayne Wade, the conversations, what they did together being a
part of the Redeemed team, you know, just just awesome,
you know, showing a display of re aligning the you know,

(50:15):
the men's basketball team back at the top of the
pecking order.

Speaker 3 (50:20):
I think about that and also watching the ceremony, you know,
anything with Lebron and Kobe on it is going to
be legendary and that of itself. And so we touched
on this earlier and the thing in terms of like
maybe our questions on why a team was being inducted
into the Hall of Fame. But there's no doubt that
was talented. And when I think about just like the
point guard roster, you know, especially on that, you know,
Darren Williams is somebody who will probably not again into

(50:42):
the Hall of Fame on his own marit so to speak,
but he was he was a problem back in those days,
hence why he was on the team. So Jay Kidd,
Chris Paul, Darren Williams as your point guard lineup really
just absolutely ridiculous and stunning. In addition to obviously Lebron
weighed you know, Chris Bosh on that team as well too.
I really am you know, and Coach k at the Helm.

(51:03):
That team really did what it set out to do.
Extremely talented. And I know there's been a lot of debates,
you know, the Redeemed Team beat the Dream Team and
so forth that stuff for y'all to play out on
two K I'm not really getting into any of that,
but ultimately, you know, really really well deserved honor in
general for a team that did out exactly what it
accomplished what it set out to do.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Two K or NBA Live.

Speaker 1 (51:24):
We already know he helps, all right, Sean, Let's transition now,
let's talk coach.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
Head coach Billy Donovan, celebrated for coaching excellence guiding the
University of Florida to back to back NCAA championships in
two thousand and six to two thousand and seven, ranks
among the top college coaches of his era, and it
successfully transitioned to the NBA. Currently serving as head coaches
in Chicago. Bulls a little weird on.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
This one, because look, I'm not saying that Billy Donovan
is not deserving, but in my head, I'm thinking maybe
a little too soon. But listen, if you are going to,
you're going to right now. Look at what he was
able to getting the University of Florida back to back
NCAA championships. You know, him being a part of the
Patino lineage. You know, listen, what more can be said? Man,

(52:12):
Billy Donovan is that guy he is.

Speaker 3 (52:14):
I mean successful runs at okay see and you know,
at having maybe some difficult times here in Chicago, but
has always been known as as a coach that players
do appreciate and want to play for, and that says
a lot. And obviously his time at UF is primarily
I think that the sticking points and getting him into
this inductor here at this point of his career, and
he's still got some more track record to go as

(52:34):
well too. So having success at the college level, having
success at the NBA level as well too, to a
certain a certain degree, really gives Billy Donovan, you know,
the the resume that is needed in essence, I think
at this stage.

Speaker 1 (52:45):
All right, now we get to talk about a referee,
Danny Crawford, officiating more than two thousand NBA games, including
multiple NBA finals over his thirty two year career and
the lessurious career. Recognized for professionalism, consistency, and integrity, he
set the bar high for the league officials and he's
basically earned a respect amongst most players and coaches. You know,

(53:07):
Danny Crawford's name resonates man and you've probably heard his
name being called as one of the head referees officiating
any playoff or NBA finals. We were not going to
have that conversation about the game uh being fixed.

Speaker 2 (53:22):
So kudos to Danny Crawford man. But yeah, his name
always is in the is in.

Speaker 1 (53:27):
The breadth of conversations of the great games that have
been covered, uh during his tenure of the NBA, and
and and it's it's well proposed that he's also been
added into this mix, uh being inducted into.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
The Hall of Fame.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
Yeah. I mean, you don't always want to know the
referees' names and who they are. But he's somebody who,
especially in our day, one of the first ones I
started to really recognize and know, you know, even dare
I say, you know, as a black official as well too,
and just understanding you know, the respect that he had
amongst his his you know, the players and that sci
that he was officiate in games for.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (54:01):
So I really respect Danny Crawford. I never really looked
at him like, oh god, he's referring the game. There's
some guys who I won't name on him, like, oh,
you kind of feel like, you know, they have their
their own personalities and tempers that seem to overtake some
portions of the game at time. I never really got
that from Danny Crawford. And again, somebody who seems to
be really really expected by his peers and coaches alike.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Absolutely. Finally, Shaw will round up our conversation here with
your favorite guy, owner of the Miami Heat, Mickey Garrison.
Micky Aarrison is guided the franchise to three NBA Championships
and several NBA Final appearances. Under his leadership, the Heat
became a model organization for power, for player empowerment, in

(54:43):
front office innovation, while elevating Miami standing as a major
basketball city. I will say this show despite your your
your love and affection for Micky Garrison, the fact that
he is responsible for making Miami basketball a relevant basketball market.

(55:06):
I think speaks volumes allows you to live comfortably there
and then you can actually go and see the bus
and Celtics take it to the Miami Heat down in
Miami and not get and I have to drive all
the way up to Orlando to see that happen.

Speaker 3 (55:18):
I will say, in terms of you know, governorship, he's
one of the more understated individuals. He lets the basketball
people do the basketball thing. He's not really you know,
most people don't may not even know.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
Mcgerrison is right exactly like that, which is remarkable because
everyone is always under the assumption that pat Riley owns
the Miami Heat when it's really mcgerrison.

Speaker 3 (55:40):
Yeah, and he's you know, done a great job. I
believe some of them investments of money comes from the
Carnival cruise line era, et cetera, et cetera. But understands
what it means to run a top notch and top
level organization. Invested in the team, invested in the player
development and coaching of that, and even the overall facilities,
you know, at a time where I'm not saying that

(56:00):
was that was frowned upon, but he understood that there
was a value into that too. I think guys like
Cuban came into the league and say, hey, how do
we make our players and coaches feel better even within
our own confines and spaces. While it's not overly luxurious
and you know what I mean, and and almost you know,
kind of just foolish with the spending. He understands that, hey,
these are top level guys, so they deserve top level treatment.

(56:21):
But I also want you to play at the topest
level the top level as well too when you're putting
your effort on the basketball court. I think Mickey Arrison
gets it as a as a owner slash governor in
the NBA and hence why he's been able to, you know,
get his way into the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 2 (56:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:34):
And one of one last point to to what you
were saying, Shaw, Mickey Arison really truly appreciates what the
Miami Heat has been able to do without him having
to have a heavy hand in allowing it to flourish.
Some owners, I think, have to have their imprint in

(56:55):
order to like the The style of how the team
is is a reflection of what the owner is. I
think that was one of the things that alert us
to what you know, the Dallas Mavericks had evolved into,
you know, with Mark Cuban and Steve Bomber with the
Los Angeles Lakers and the Bus family with I'm sorry,
with the Los Angeles Clippers and the Bus family with
the Los Angeles Lakers. But Mickey Arrison was one of

(57:17):
those owners who honestly you could not tell whether or not,
but you can see that the culture was a reflection
of what was most important to him. And that's why, Hey,
culture I think is been adopted and now is really
been understood because now that you're putting someone like him

(57:37):
into the Hall of fame.

Speaker 2 (57:38):
It's not just a fluke thing.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
It's not something that gets kind of bantered about on
the social media of tweets and memes and people saying
that Miami, you know, doesn't have a real fan base.
You know, all of that is dead, right, Like you
literally legitimately now have to respect the man who was
responsible for establishing something that's no longer a myth but
is actually real.

Speaker 3 (57:59):
Yeah. I don't know the exact number, but you figure
he's probably one of the longest tenured you know, governor's
owners in the league, I think currently, you know, and
with the record prices, record prices that our teams are
being gone for, you don't know if okay, you know what, Hey,
it's a right time just from a business opportunity. But
he's again, he's a lot of basketball to let the

(58:20):
basketball people do the basketball thing without over empowering and
understanding that hey, if they shine, then I automatically shine
as well too, because hey, I'm the one who's paying
the bills. So I really respect Mickey Rrison and the
entirety of that kind of ownership group. You will, when
you talk about culture, Yes, it gets overutilized and kind
of even made poked fun out of I think a
lot of times too, But they are really truly a steady,

(58:42):
steady leadership group. And it starts with Mickey, you know,
and at pat Riley and Spo and Andy Ellisburg as
well to guys who've all been a part of that
organization for a very very long time. Absolutely.

Speaker 2 (58:52):
Man, Wow, it's a lot of names.

Speaker 1 (58:55):
We went through, brot of a lot of Hall of famers,
a lot of good stuff, a lot of good memories.
All of them, you know, thankfully are alive and kicking,
and you know, they all gave great, eloquent speeches, but
now they are forever shrined in the level of greatness

(59:15):
that is what we consider the culture of basketball. And
I think every single one of them is deservative because
each and every single one of them are responsible for
certain timelines and certain moments and certain periods you know,
where the greatness of basketball has shined. And I just
couldn't be happier for each and every single one of
the people that we just discussed.

Speaker 3 (59:35):
Yeah again, if you haven't had a chance to watch it,
you know, go back. There's plenty of replays, catch clips
on YouTube. Watch Maya Moore's speech the entirety of it's
it's it's really is moving. I think in general, I'm
going to see the joy Dwight Howard had, specifically mellow
and his call outs to his mom, you know, his sister,
Puerto Rico, you know, all the hard times he had

(59:56):
in Usin's kind of growing up. Just a lot of
great moments kind of throughout that, and an opportunity to
celebrate basketball culture in the way that it really should
be and not really focusing on the negativity and some
of the hyperbole that we often get caught in, especially
when the coverage of today's game. This is all about
the positivities of these fine individuals and teams one team
rather that got in. So skudos to the Basketball and

(01:00:18):
a Smith Basketball Hall of Fame, the NBA, WNBA, and
all parties associated with this event.

Speaker 2 (01:00:23):
Absolutely great episode, my brother, great episode. I know that
we are on a little bit of a hiatus, but
we'll be back in two weeks.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
I'm sorry, Well, yeah, two weeks. We'll be back in
two weeks. Getting ourselves ready for this upcoming NBA season.
Got a lot of stuff happening, got a lot of
things for us to get ready and get you and
yours ready for.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
Because this is going to definitely be one of the
most interesting NBA seasons to date. For the baseline, Cali
warren Shaw, we appreciate you, guys, thanks for hopping on
board with us this week. To catch up with you
next time.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Ka-Why?: Clippers and the Kawhi Leonard Scandal | We T.R.O.Y w 2025 NBA H.O.F Class