The Full Nameless Mid-Day Show w/@JersyJames23 & @LeifThulin - 7/2/24 - The Bill Riley Show

Episode Transcript
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(00:21):
We're going along here, our oneof the midday show, James Peterson,
Leaf too Lean, and our everyone'sfavorite guests, the Great Gordy chiasa tune
it or cranking up some New Radicalsas you come in here, Gordie,
how you doing, James Leif I'mdoing well? Thanks, and it's good

(00:43):
to be here. Yeah. NewRadicals. Yeah, I know I'm sort
of old school, but they're reallya great group, only second to many
other groups back in the nineteen seventies, eighties, nineties and yesteryear two thousand.
Yeah, long time ago. Absolutely, we're glad to have you in.

(01:06):
We will, we want to wewant to talk about NBA Draft with
you. You were on our livedraft show. We we haven't an issue
with the headphones. Guys. No, all good, Okay, I'm beaging
to go and uh the draft showwas it was amazing and uh, yeah,
you you were. I was sayingin the first segment, Gordon,

(01:27):
you were in in top form onthat draft show. You always are,
but you you took it to anotherlevel last Wednesday night. I feel like
I was consulting to I was consultingwith my colleague Leaf. I was gonna
sol Leaf for the last four orfive months. So I've been built in.
Uh a person Leaf next to mehere that knows the draft also to

(01:48):
say the least, and the draftagain it's it's promising and Jazz basketball.
They did a good job of gettingthe players that they need as to go
forward, and you'll like their talentnow as always, Cody Williams is a
young guy picking number ten and hewill absolutely contribute. I love his all

(02:08):
around game and I love how hecan create off the dribble. Isaiah Khller
Collier is a tremendous young talent.And then Philipowski meaning Kyle. He's a
stretch five that for some bad reasonhe slipped in the draft, but it's
good for the Jazz. Last yearslipped in the draft of Leaf and James

(02:30):
was Cam Whitmore. This year wasKyle Philipowski. And he can make shots,
and he's skilled and just very simpleat basketball terms. He's really good
as far as having the ball outin perimeter. Yeah, he will contribute
right away. Yeah, and Leaf. I think you can make an argument
that Isaiah Collier slipped a little bittoo for the Jazz, so they got

(02:50):
two really good value picks. Theend of the first round started the second
round, right, Yeah, theCallier pick I think was the best value
of the entire draft. Like,if you were to look at, Hey,
this guy's the number one recruit inhis high school class and he fell
to twenty nine, you'd think theissues were far more severe. Maybe they
were attitude issues, maybe he wasthe complete inept shooter or something like that.
Well, call youer. If youlook at his spot of numbers,

(03:13):
they're not very good, but theyare better than the likes of Ron Holland,
they're better than the likes of StefanCastle who went number four and Gordy
and I very much like. Butthis guy went twenty nine, and his
numbers are better than those with shootingissues that went in the lottery. His
passing issues, turnovers, spacing,all these things. At the USC was
a pretty dysfunctional program. And maybein probably some shots selection issues with Callier

(03:35):
two, right, and then justbeing a better decision maker in general,
Yes, But then you look onthe flip side, he has an inate
ability to put pressure on the rimthat I think is probably the best of
anyone in the entire draft. Idon't think he's amazing as a shooter,
I don't think he's amazing as apoint guard, but he gets the rim
and he creates havoc. You putNBA spacing and that type of guy who
gets there and he has the rightpassing reads. I think he's one of

(03:58):
the better passers in this draft.Didn't bear out in terms of assists because
his team couldn't shoot, and Idon't think he was a great decision maker
at times because he put too muchpressure on himself. But he also put
that much pressure on the defense,and you got that guy at twenty nine.
I had am number twelve on mybig board. Wow. And I
had Cody Williams number five and hewent number ten obviously, so I thought
the Jazz did great. I'm lessof a fan of Kyle Philipowski, but

(04:19):
at thirty two, I'm not goingto argue with the value there. I
just wouldn't have wanted him in thefirst round. Yeah, yeah, so
great great draft coverage last week withGordy, Bill and Spence. We'll talk
a little bit more about the Jazz'sdraft and the NBA Draft as a whole,
NBA free agency as well. WithGordy here and starting to hear some
more legitimate Lowry markin and trade rumors. Gordy, what's your thoughts, first

(04:42):
off, just at the thought ofthe Jazz maybe seeming more likely that there
might be a deal here. There'sit still feels pretty likely he's back,
but it's it's more likely than everthat it feels like that he might be
on the move. Yeah, itmight be in a move. The question
is you get almost what value getback for him because he's highly coveted.
So here's an example that there's norush for the Jazz right now to trade

(05:05):
him. So they have to getthe best deal for them, whether it's
a player that can future out,really can perform well, and get other
assets for the draft because next yeardraft's going to be a tremendous vehicle for
teams that get better. But let'slet's let's pause for one second. Would
you lack a guy that averaged twentythree point two points per game, shot

(05:28):
forty eight percent from the field,thirty nine to nine, from three eighty
nine to nine, from the foulline, eight point two boards a game,
and to assist where he assigned Ijust described Larry Marketing, and so
he's being almost criticized because he's anold guy at age twenty seven. What

(05:49):
he is right now on a playoffteam, whether it's the Jazz or someone
else, He's the third best playeron a fifty something win team that when
he play that stretch five is thedefensive player is guarding him have a difficult
time. So if wen Beyonber andchreed Holmgrim were right on perimeter guarding Larry

(06:12):
Marketing, I lean towards Larry Marketingmajority of the time, catch and pop,
put it in your face, orcatch it go drive and dunk in
your noggin. However, the Jazzlost twenty five or the last thirty games
last season and not again. Marketingmissed twenty seven game because of the injury,
and so the Jazz are starting over. And I have no problem with

(06:35):
that, but Marketing, it's hardto replace him. So I'm gonna go,
I'm gonna pause for a second,and that don't do it right now,
and wait until reassess in early February. Reassess again the trading deadline where
you might get more value for him, and you'll know your team a lot
better. But the Jazz are playingfor the future, and the future is

(06:59):
very bright because of so many guysnext year in the draft. So here's
the top three in the draft intwenty twenty five, because when we talk
about the Jazz, we'll talk aboutthe draft. Number three should be a
Dylan Harper, a combo guard outof New Jersey at of don Bosco High
School. And they know the coachfor the last fifty years, to say
the least. And that's Ron Harper'sson number two when he's going to Rutgers,

(07:20):
of all people, a spelling smallfold going to Rutgers. Also,
VI, your Georgia should be eithertwo, either two or three in the
draft. And Cooper Flagg, thesix to nine guy that plays defense like
Carolinko but can shoot unbelievable. He'llbe a freshman at Duke. And let's
not think also the young Russian guythat's going to be yu IgA Demon going

(07:43):
to BYU shall be in the topten. And so it's a bat it's
a batter draft. So that's whothe Jazz are gonna play for guys like
that next season. But in themeantime, it's this year. And again,
as always, what is the messaging. See wherever I go in uh
in this area, people ask me, Yo, Gordy what's up with the

(08:03):
jazz? Just like that. WhereverI go, literally ten times a day
they asked me about that Jets.That's exactly right, and that street talk
as far as asking me, andI say to them that the Jets have
some good young talent. Now,if you're Collin Sexon and if you're John
Collins and you'll Walker kess this rebuildingstuff, you don't want to hear that.

(08:24):
You do not want to hear thatI want to play, Jordan Clarkson,
I want to play. And sothat's what it gets iffy right now?
How do you message it? Howdo you how do you transform your
team into being a contender? Andremember the West is loaded, so it's
so hard. So you might getbetter. You have to tear it down
to get better. But doesn't meanyou're gonna be as good as you think

(08:45):
you can be, because you remember, you're gonna make a narrative over the
last X amount of years. DetroitPistons and as Charlotte Hornets are always your
building, and the Washington Wizards thoseguys are always your building for the last
x amount of years. So arethe jazz those guys or the jazz the
thunder who've been who've been sensational thelast four years. As far as building

(09:07):
their roster, however, you rememberthat's not forget their best player. That's
first you will MBA. They tradedfor j Jullis Alexander on the Pull George
trade, and so they drafted absolutelywisely. And by the way, lou
Dort, who's a big part oftheir group, as far as the fifth
starter, was undrafted. So it'sa combination of everything. You've got to

(09:28):
draft the right guys and fast tracktheir development by playing time. I just
just have a follow up on somethingyou said a little bit earlier, Gordy,
when you said when you said keepkeep lowry and reevaluate the trade deadline,
but then you also talked about justhow loaded the top of this next
draft will be and how deep inpotential stars this next draft will be.

(09:52):
So are you are you in favorof Danny Aings and Justin Xanak doing the
same thing they've done the last coupleof years, seeing how good they can
be in the first half of theseason, then kind of then then at
the trade deadline, reevaluating and maybepivoting towards getting as high a draft pick
as they can, because honestly,I feel like this is an opportunity to
maybe start the season at it notnot as bad as you can be,

(10:16):
but with the goal of, hey, let's try to get at the top
of this draft, rather than thandoing that halfway through at the trade deadline.
I agree with you exactly. Soyou're gonna, if you're gonna build
for the future, start from dayone as far as play the young guys
right now and so that so thenthere'll be less chemistry for the Jazz,
but Marketing playing. So if you'regonna play, if you're gonna play anybody

(10:37):
as often play Larry Marketing to keephis trade value, but play the young
guys. In other words, theseare the six young guys on the Jazz,
the three last year and the threethis year. If you've got to
start many of them, and ifnot start him be the first guy in
the game, and this in theend of the first quarter, to start

(11:00):
the second quarter. And then mostof all, give them the ball.
You see Kalia give them the ball. In other words, in a second
the second unit, just for thenarrative, it's just for the discussion.
Is that he gets the ball inthe second quarter and he plays with the
ball to make to make shots forhimself or kick it out through the corner
or shortcut a love spacing. Sobut I would play Larry Marketing because he

(11:22):
would keep you competitive during the game. But the rebel is starting. Well,
here's a question for you. Then, Gordy, you got to you
gotta end up in the top fiveto get those guys. And I understand
the Hawks got Lucky, jumped thelottery, he got to number one.
How how good of an offer wouldyou have to consider for Lowry? Like,
what does an offer that comes inthe next few days have to look

(11:46):
like for you to consider Lowry?And then alternatively, if Lowry is on
the team, does it just takeplaying the six young guys so much that
the Jazz are bad enough to bethere? Or and does Lowry get frustrated?
You've managed the egos of basketball,You've been in the front office as
well as a coach. And ifI'm Lowry Marketing, I'm a competitor.
I'd be pretty annoyed that the teamis going backwards and I'm still there.

(12:07):
Does like how do you manage that? And then obviously the first question is
what type of package does it take? To sway the Jazz front office to
part with a guy like Lowry Markinthat, like you mentioned, along with
all these sets, he's also sevenfeet tall. Like that's probably the greatest
asset he's got at all those shootingNumbers's seven feet tall, moves like a
small forward, has prototypical center size. So what it would take. It
would take three or minimum three Frostround draft picks minimum and maybe a second

(12:35):
round and a player, a playeroff the bench to make the money work.
So that's what it would do.Yeah, three Frost round picks future
and again possibly a second round downyou know, twenty twenty nine pick a
year and maybe a player would Andthen I want to ask you this because
the Warriors have been the team thatis in the latest rumors that they want

(12:56):
to try to trade for Lowry Markinand if and Spence was really good on
this yesterday, bringing up on hisshow The Drive from two to six here
on ESPN seven hundred ninety two oneFM, he said, yeah, you
get kaminga who could be who lookslike a guy who could be a potential
star in this league the way heplayed at the end of last season.

(13:18):
You get maybe a Moses Moody,who could be that bench player you're talking
about, Gordy, who's who lookslike he still has some potential to be
an NBA rotation player on a goodteam. And then you get three picks.
But are those picks those picks willprobably be with with Lowry and Steph
and Draymond, even without Klay Thompsonwho's going to the Mavericks, those picks
are not going to be that highin the lottery. Those won't be lottery

(13:41):
picks probably, those are going tobe probably at the lowest fifteen to twenty,
probably even into the twenties. Right, So, when if you're Danny
Ainge and you're considering these trades,you're also thinking about what the potential quality
of these picks will be, Right, You're not just going, Hey,
three picks from the Warriors is thesame was three picks from the Wizards.
No, it's not absolutely, Andso that's that's absolutely the balancing act.

(14:05):
That's why is that that's why youhave to try to get those picks later
on as far as the end ofthe end of this decadees like like they
tried to do with Minnesota, verymuch a right Minnesota and Cleveland very much.
So the Jazz is trying to getthe top five picks and next year
as far as being in the topfive to have to win, probably just
guestimating. Went between nineteen to twentyfour games, roughly nineteen to twenty four

(14:33):
sounds about right. San Antonio Spurs, for reference, got twenty two wins
and they were the fourth pick.So I think they were the third best
odds four third best odds. Yes, yeah, so leave here was right,
Yeah, here was the standings.Pistons were fourteen and sixty eight,
Wizards were fifteen and sixty seven.One it's twenty one and sixty one,

(14:56):
Trailblazer is twenty one and sixty one, and the Spurs sixty and Leaf mentioned
about the Hawks, it was aluck. It was a beautiful them.
It was a beautiful day. Theygot the first pick. There were thirty
six and forty six, but thisyear the first pick. The first pick
is a good player, but wedon't know if he has a knockout unbelievable
talent and killer instinct. We don'tknow that yet because it's he's still a

(15:20):
work in progress, and he's aFrenchman. And we'll sell all plays out,
but next year, these kids areThese kids are absolutely more talented.
And again you're picking in the topfive. Usually speaking, that talent prevails,
so you're picking the top five thatguy. Two of those five guys
should be All Stars very soon.And if the world's perfect, the world

(15:46):
not the world's the world is round, not flat, that guy could be
a franchise player. Should be goahead, Leaf and then we'll and then
we'll we'll go to our first breakhere with Cordy back, and I would
argue that Zachary Reesa, I thinkit's unlikely he's ever going to be an
All Star. And I'm not tryingto be overly critical, but that's the
number one pick this year. Iwould argue that a guy we haven't mentioned,

(16:07):
like Nolan Troure, a Frenchman justjust going countryman to countryman, is
already a better player than what Rescheis, and he's the fourth or fifth
best player in next year's class.So that's why I truly believe the Jazz
have to make the decision sooner thanwhat Gordy mentioned. And obviously I'll defer
to Gordyon basketball knowledge one thousand percentof the time, but I think that
There's something to be said for thisweekend being a time to pounce on the

(16:32):
offers because mckel Bridges, who Ithink is a comparable player to Lowry Markingham,
went to the Knicks and the Knickspaid a ton of picks like that
was four first round picks. Thatwas a ton to hemorrhage away for a
player that's twenty seven, has neverbeen an All Star. In mckel Bridges,
Lowery's been an All Star, averagessimilar amount of points to Bridges,
not quite the defender of the Bridgesis I think the Jazz need to pounce

(16:52):
and try to get some sort ofoffer that is similar, if not better
than what the Knicks provided for mcklbridges. And also it provides a clear
direction as opposed to going ten andthree when when Benyama is available to start
the year or win nineteen of twentysix games like the Jazz did this year,
only to finish the year with theworst record through the past thirty of
the final thirty games. So Ithink the Jazz direction is most clear if

(17:17):
they pounced. Now, yes,you could accelerate Lowry's in terms of his
asking price. You could probably geteven a little more if he has an
All Star season, but I thinkit's difficult to have an all Star season
well frustrated with the direction internally,and I think Lowry, though he's stoic,
though he likes Utah, I thinkit's hard to be happy with the
direction if you're the franchise's core pieceand you haven't had direction. So I

(17:37):
would pounce sooner rather than later.In the team that I would throw out
there as the San Antonio Spurs.Yes they have a franchise piece, and
yes they're going to be good soon. Yes they took Chris Paul, but
they just have the number four pickStephan Castle. They made a trade to
get Minnesota's picks in the twenty thirtyone, so you could get one in
the next decade. Like Gordy justalluded to, you could still get picks
from the twenty twenty five because theSpurs have a boatload of picks that they've

(17:59):
acquired from other teams while selling offsome of their previously very good players.
So that's the team I would lookfor. I think the Jazz need to
pount sooner rather than later. Yeah, and it'll be definitely something that'll be
interesting to follow. We'll see inthe coming days if these rumors start to
accelerate and Lowry Markinen truly is onthe move. For now, he is

(18:21):
a jazz man still. And onething we know for sure is Danny Aine
just going to look for a reallygood deal to make, and if he
thinks it's a deal that he wins, he's gonna make that deal, no
matter who it is. He doesn't. He doesn't He makes those deals if
he thinks he wins the deal,no matter who is on the block.
He doesn't put emotion in or orsentimental sentimentality into any of that. So

(18:44):
certainly something to watch here as thedays go along. Here in the beginning,
really the beginning of the NBA offseason, we will continue our conversation with
Gordy on NBA free agency, NBADraft and more. Here. Gordy's with
us till twelve thirty, so excitedto continue to have him on. We'll
have his list as well before weset him loose here on the midday Show

(19:07):
James Peterson, leave Tueen going andtell two here on Utah's number one sports
talking home of the UTESPN seven hundredand Hungry, another Gordy favorite, Come

(19:33):
and get your love Redbone. Whenyou hear those kind of songs, you
know who's in studio with us.It's the Great Gordy Chiz, a former
Utah Jazz assistant coach, front officeman for number and coach for a number
of other teams college basketball ranks aswell. Talking NBA Utah Jazz, we
talked a lot about the draft.Just now I want to talk more about
free agency. We're gonna do areal short segment here like we normally do

(19:57):
to end the hour, and thenwe'll talk a whole lot more free agency
than the next segment until about twelvethirty. So for this one, Gordy,
maybe just you say you got alist of your top five, the
top five teams in free agency andhow they've done, what they've done in
freegency so far? Right, maybewhat's preview our free agency talk with your

(20:18):
list there? Okay, number numberfive as far as is the Celts.
All right, before I say thenames for the Knicks, three, the
MAVs, two the seventy six ers, and one the thunder just visualize those
teams of who they got and alsowho they didn't lose. Yeah, that's

(20:41):
a factor of it also, Soit's interesting free agency is nothing like it.
You know, I always talk aboutit is that you get younger by
the draft and more talent, butyou get better by free agency and trades.
So and the better teams do bothwell consistently. Yeah, And that's
the catch where consistently the ability forfor teams to keep every year adding players

(21:07):
or signing signing we signed your ownplayers for for smart contracts. Absolutely,
and that's absolutely what what the betterteams do. And those second round picks,
if they play well as far asrotation players or even starters, they
can't catch up as far as theirvalue economically until that's until their third contract.

(21:30):
Yeah, definitely, I agree withyou there. And the team historically
that comes to mind, that's that'sdone. Teams that have done really well
in all three phases, as yousaid in team building, and I think
about the San Antonio Spurs and theirdynasty and their dynastic run. I think
about the Warriors recently and their recentdynasty. I mean, who do I

(21:53):
wonder, Gordy, do you havea do you have a list of teams
historically that have been best at allthree or maybe maybe off top of your
head, maybe who who else?Can you think of historically that were that
have been really good, had reallygood runs in all three Lakers. Yeah,
Lakers absolutely by retaining their players,star players and free agency, getting

(22:15):
those guys to go there and addingpieces to it. As far as the
role players that have played extremely well, Robert Horry, Rick Fox, guys
like that are absolutely, Derek Fisher, those players are a huge part of
them winning, especially when the starplayers are being double teamed in playoff games.
So whether it was Kobe or whetherShock Shack in the mid block and

(22:36):
Kobe out on perimeter, that ballis swung swung on perimeter, those guys
had to make open jump shots andthat was that was just quickly. That
was the MAVs downfall this season.When they double team Kyrie and when they
double teamed uh out on perimeter,Luca Dontege, they couldn't make a consistent
outside shot and that became a hugefactor of what was going on. And

(22:59):
that that's why that the Mavericks signedClay Thompson because he shot forty one point
eight from three and open three pointshot attempts this past season. The MAVs
shot as a team in the NBAFinals with open threes James and Leaf twenty
nine point seven percent. So theyadded Clay Thompson because the way the team

(23:22):
is structured with their elite players,that they can when the balls swung to
Clay Thompson and klay'son, Clay's notgonna be a two guard, He's gonna
play a small forward. He's gonnareplace Derek Jones, not as a defensive
player, but as more of ashooter. And so they made that value
judgment the MAVs that that's the oneto do because it's very frustrating in the
NBA finals when you have an openshot and your floormates can't what consistently make

(23:47):
them, and that in the selfpoint of view, James and Leaf,
that was the opposite. So PeytonPritchard, who's basically under talented just in
a big picture of things, buthe's an overachiever to his credit, makes
open jump shots. And so SamHauser, Yeah, and so Sam Houses
undrafted, suddenly he's averaging what sevenpoints seven points per game in the NBA

(24:07):
playoff, especially in the finals,where the Bulls comes to him, it
makes the shot. And then addto Drew Holliday, who's a tremendous all
around player and Derek White, who'sa tremendous all around player. When the
ball came to those guys, theywere they were making shots and plays and
stealing. That's what That's what theCeltic was a champion. Al Horford's become
quite the corner three assassin himself theselast couple of years. Yeah, versus

(24:32):
heavy lifting. So when al Horfordplayed for the for the Atlanta Hawks and
other teams, he was heavy lifting. Now again, at age thirty seven,
he's on a team where he's theperfect fit for what they need.
And so brazingis got a was rejuvenatedafter this was his fourteen with the Celtics,
and then he got hurt in theplayoffs before that, but he had

(24:52):
tremendous season. So al Horfer wasable to do a lot of good things
without the mental part of it.So now the mental parts all on a
Jason Tatum and Jail and Brown.Absolutely, we do have to head to
a quick break. We'll have anotherhalf hour or so with Gordy here.
We're gonna dive much more deeper intothe league at large in free agency coming

(25:14):
up on the other side. Aswe start hour two of the midday show
James Peterson leave two. Leen Gordychias is still with us for another half
hour in studio here on Utah numberone Sports Talk ESPN seven hundred and net.
Last segment with Gordy. James Petersonleave two, Leen Gordy chiasa in

(25:40):
studio. Love it when Gordy's herewith us. We're talking NBA. We
talked a lot about draft already.We previewed kind of our our free more
free agency heavy segment here with Gordy. Gordy, give us that list again
that you had of the teams thebest five teams in the NBA was the
best five teams in the NBA.Threw this, thus far in free agency

(26:00):
are the best five teams as they'vewhat they've done in free agency. No,
it's a little bit both it's freeagency and also an element of the
draft. Okay, so five ofthe Celtics. Remember the Celts World champions
they played absolutely tremendous. They bringthey're bringing almost everyone back. He got
that right. So they they resignedJason Tatum, they re signed them,

(26:22):
They resigned Derek White with the extension, and then they added Luke the Public.
They re signed Luke Cornette, who'sa valuable tenth man. Again,
I keep making the way with that'sthe guy's ceiling. So Luke Cornette as
the tenth man who has been effective. So Tatum they give him three hundred
and fifteen million with the extension,and then Derek White won sixty one with

(26:45):
the extension. So those guys aregoing no place. So that they so
they did an underrated job where theyhad to do it, and they did
it as the fifth best offseason Knickerbocker'sbut kel bridges see again the Knicks.
The Knicks are trying to chase theseventy six ers now and they're trying to
chase the Celtics. So who wouldto say if Jalen Brunson doesn't get hurt,

(27:10):
and og and Andoba doesn't get hurtin the playoffs doesn't get hurt,
who's to say that the Celts wouldbe that this dominant and that that that
in the Knicks world room. That'swhat they're saying right now, that they
think they because they play defense thatalso so do the Celts. I get
it. So it's gonna be fascinating. So with with the Knickerbockers, they

(27:30):
had mckel Bridges, who is atremendous all around player. Did the overpay
as far as given the assets away, probably, but their window right now
is what two to three years thewindow, and so they added him right
now. They re signed og Anernobi, who's a two way player, all
right, and then they resigned theJeremy Simms, who's a again tenth eleventh

(27:55):
man. But in Nickobacker basketball,they think that they can have enough defensive
proudness to slow down the two bookendsof the Celtics. So with Jalen Bronson
and now with Michel Bridges, DanteGivincenzo Julius Randall, who probably they would
like to trade if they can finda partner they can free up some of

(28:15):
that money. So Nick's had agood off season as far as the fourth
best, the third best off seasonis the MAVs Klay Thompson you mentioned earlier
a few minutes ago, knockdown shooter. He's getting a new lease on life.
He's thirty four years is he thirtyfour years young or thirty four years

(28:37):
old? It's like, you knowwhat that reminds me of? That's that
reminds me of the way Will Hardytried to tried to manage Mike Conley for
the first half of his first season. He told him, hey, we're
both the same age. Everyone thinksI'm young, everyone thinks you're old,
but we're both the same age.He tried to play that kind of help
him feel younger by by trying tocompare that, so were you So yeah,

(28:59):
Mike Conley ended up being thirty fiveyears thirty four to thirty five years
young. We'll see if Kay Thompsonis thirty four years young or thirty four
years old. I love that,Yeah, and especially in that in the
role now, So again, don'tpitch your clay right now. As far
as him with the Warriors back intwo thousand and fifteen, sixteen, seventeen,
eighteen nineteen before he got hurt,he remember he missed two years,
missed two years, and so heplayed. He with the Warriors for thirteen

(29:22):
years. So now the question isemotionally, you go from your team that
drafted you have the thirteen years forMBA championships. Now you go through the
MAVs. H by the way,will they like me? Will I fit
in there? And the answer isboth those star players are pass happy and
so he'll do well there. Defensively, he's slightly slipping, but they made
a value judgment that they needed shootingmore than the defense. He also added

(29:48):
Najie Marshall all right, who willhelp them as far as defensively small forward
hybrid, and then more importantly DerekLively. They take another year of growth
and Daniel Gaffit and PJ. Washingtonanother year in this quote the system.
So they think that they could bevery, very talented now number two best
offseason so far. That could changea week from now. The Philadelphia seventy

(30:11):
six ers MB is a major talentwho's been hurt back to back years that
has set him back. But theyadd Paul George. Again, is the
narrative right now is Paul George?Is he thirty four years young or thirty
four years old? They gave himan incredible contract. The first two years
will be it will be team friendlyif they win. They also added Andre

(30:34):
Drummon, who who permittes play itas far as rebounder is solid, so
he will back up Joel Embiid.They had also added Eric Gordon, give
me the ball off the bench,he can make open shots. And then
they drafted very wisely Jared McCain fromDuke as a young point guard, and
then they resigned the All Star franchiseplayer besides mb and Terry Smaxi. And

(31:00):
the question his name can Nick Nurse? Can he get that group together and
play as a unit. So theyhad they had the second best offseason so
far and number one is the ThunderAnd from Jazz point of view, that's
that's that's the blueprint as far asthat's where the Jazz would like to be
and they're in the same division.Alex Carusoe again, what he lacks as
far as shooting the ball accurately,he makes up an unbelievable defensive players.

(31:26):
He can guard one, two,three. How dare you try to post
me up in the game right now? Also, they added Isaiah Hartenstein,
who is a is a big guythat has talent outside. He's actually a
ball handler, so a lot oftime with dribble handoff action, he makes
that clean exchange on perimeter and thatgives the the the acceptor a chance to

(31:47):
watch go down the lane and godownhill. He's an offensive rebounder as far
as crashing the boards, he's whatthey need. The Thunder, the back
to back up home grin and theycan play both in the same lineup.
Also, they were signed Aaron Wigginsdefensive player. They were signed Isaiah Joe
knockdown shooter. They drafted Nikolai Toppich, who's not gonna play this year from

(32:08):
Serbia, so they're probably gonna havesurgery on ACL so they almost get called
a red shirt year. And thenthe Dylan Jones from Weavers State, who
again got a winning game. Andso the Thunder they have a cast of
characters that are very good and theyand they fit and for the next two

(32:30):
years, their salaries are still relativelytame. Then comes the hard part when
these guys with their second and thirdcontracts what they do. So they have
a lot of draft assets and theirtheir roster are tremendous and that they the
last four years, they have unbelievabledrafts as far as picking the right guy

(32:51):
and fast tracking them. So theThunder number one offseason? Are they your
favorites in the West based off ofthese I know they were young. I
think most people said they were tooyoung, myself included. I thought the
Maveris would win that series because ofversatility, So I guess too. Faceted
question here is are the Thunder thefavorites in the West. And do the
MAVs improve their chance in the Westbecause they added a marksman and they shot

(33:14):
thirty percent from three in the finalson open catch and shoot looks, or
do they lose what made them sodifficult to beat. I get for the
Timberwolves and for the Clippers and forthe Thunder in that defensive versatility with Derek
Jones Junior and Josh Green sent elsewhere. Yeah, Josh Green went to the
Charlotte Hornets. As far as partsthat freeway trade, No, the Thunder

(33:35):
are number one as far as sofar right now. I like the Timberwolves.
They got punched in the face inthe playoffs. What happens Leif and
James this thing called the playoffs.I had the privilege the coach one hundred
and forty nine playoff games. SoI'm saying his first hand, you get
punched in the gut, you getpunched in the face, it's forever in

(33:57):
your mind, and that from theplayer's point of view and the coach and
that that tells you what you haveto emphasize and what you have to correct.
And so the t Wolves, thoseguys got talent. They have talent,
and they added a lot of goodyoung young players and Anthony Edwards man,

(34:17):
oh man, what that guy cando. I like Grub Dillingham,
I like Tyren Shannon come off thebench for those guys. And so I
think it's going to be the tthe Thunder and the t Wolves and everyone
else are going to try to whata leaf froud them. I agree with
that. My one thing that I'mwatching with Minnesota, and I said this
on my show Sports Saturday ten tonoon every Saturday, right after they got

(34:44):
eliminated from the playoffs, I said, everyone's penciling in the t Wolves to
be bet, to be able toget back to where they were conference finals,
NBA Finals, contention, maybe NBAChampionship if everything goes right. But
a big red flag for me,Gordy, I wonder if you agree with
me on this. Anthony Edwards conditioninghe looked gassed way too early in that

(35:06):
NBA Finals, And I understand youalluded to just how hard it is to
play in the playoffs. Minutes goup to compared the regular season. So
it's gonna make you more tired becauseyou're playing more and and you're playing in
much more physicality. But my counterto that is we see guys like Jason
Tatum, we see other guys notlook quite as gasted as Anthony Edwards did

(35:30):
and able to look like they haveplenty more in the tank to lead their
teams farther than the conference finals.And Anthony Edwards just looked like he hit
a literal wall. I feel likeif he if he's gonna if he doesn't
take that seriously, I think wesaw the same thing with Luka Dancic.
By the way, quick aside withthe Mavericks. If those guys don't take

(35:50):
that conditioning seriously this offseason heading preparingfor this season, I think we might
see another playoff disappointment for both thoseteams. Okay, valid point. I'm
gonna add to that. If analternative is that Edwards. Oh, by
the way, he turns twenty threeon August fifth of this year, so
the age twenty two and here's aknockout punch, and that is very good.
Also, the t Wolves, Jamesand Leaf, they have really a

(36:14):
good all around team. They playgood defense, those guys. So Mike
Conley's aging absolutely, Anthony Edwards allstar, Jaden McDonald's very good defensively,
call Anthony Towns. He's the onethat might be a question mark where they
need more from him. They needthey need more offense defense consistently from him.
That's the other big concern, andmore of a concern than Anthony Edwards

(36:37):
conditioning, because at least you knowAnthony Edwards is gonna bring it, whether
you know he's gonna still play atthe top of his level, whether he's
tired or not. But but youhave those questions about Kat for sure,
absolutely very much. And by theway, his contract is huge. So
much is based on your contract.Hey, I like so and so at
X amount of million, but Idislike him. So next year's contract for

(36:58):
for contany town next year are yousitting down, guys please forty nine point
seven million, twenty five, twentysix fifty three point six million, yikes,
Oh yeah, twenty six, twentyseven fifty seven point six million,
and the twenty seven to twenty eightseason sixty one point six million player option.

(37:19):
So when he signed that contract backin July sixth, twenty twenty two,
he had leverage because Anthony Edwards didnot at that moment, still was
a rookie as a rookie season.He had talent, he didn't pop out
what he did right now, andthen nos Reid comes along. See so
nas Reed, that guy the sixthman of the year. What he did

(37:43):
for them. See naz Reid's aclass example. By the way, he
wasn't even drafted. So we're talkingabout here we are this guy in the
draft, this guy leief, thisguy in the draft. We like this
guy. We like in the draft. We like this guy next year in
a draft. The answer is yeah, we do. However, there's always
people that surprise you. That's thebeauty of the NBA and in the NFL.

(38:04):
Reed Nash Reed's undrafted back in twentynineteen from Lshue. Now, you
can't say Lshue you never saw himplay that often in the SEC the answers
you did. But what happened hematured, That's the first thing he matured.
Also by Mike Conley being there.The value of Mike Conley type players,
TJ. McConnell type players, ChrisPaul and his heyday type players is

(38:30):
that they make everybody around them better. So what they lack those guys when
they first come into the league orthey're film starved for themselves in the year's
number two and three. When theyhave a point guard that's past happy,
those guys suddenly emerge what they shouldhave done to your three years earlier.
But those passing point guards make themso so more effective. I agree with

(38:55):
you, and I think Mike Conleymentoring Rob Dillingham might be the biggest thing
for the Timberwolves in the future.It prolongs their window because he can score
the rock. Like if he werepicked by the Spurs like he was and
didn't get traded, I could haveseen him get Rookie of the Year.
But now he's on a winning teamand they have the different defense to make
up for his deficiencies offensively, Ithink that he could be a steal,

(39:15):
but you have to find a wayto keep the defense as good as it
is with paying McDaniels, you gottafind a way to pay towns, or
maybe you don't with with Nazred comingup. But I think they they have
a window that's elongated through that.But it also makes them a little more
susceptible immediately, as Conley and Gobertimmediately age, Oh very much, well
said, and so Dillingham the eighthpick of the draft. He's the air

(39:37):
apparent to Mike Conley, and sohe's a Mike Conley cerebral moves the ball
from point A to point B topoint See Dillingham is a rocket ship.
See he's the opposite. And that'sfine. Made me chuckle. He's a
rocket ship. And that's what.Every everybody's different, how they play,

(40:00):
how what their skill set is.And as a coach and management group is
that you've got to put the piecestogether. And then this thing called I
can't explain leif all I know iswhere you don't have it is called chemistry.
And there's that unbelievable spirit in otherwords, as I say this for
decades or by the way, arewe teammates or are we flawmates? So

(40:24):
a lot of times your teammates inthe locker room and your teammates what in
the club at night at twelve o'clockat midnight, and you were teammates on
the plane, But are we floormateson the court? Meaning what help the
help with defense? James, swingthe ball, come back, put a
double team because on mismatch athletically againstthe against a superior player. So I'm

(40:49):
guarding, I'm guarding in the midblock and someone can jump right over me.
Suddenly my teammate does it naturally,double teams and to make the guy
pass the ball out to be rotatedout of what, out of unison He's
there, all things of being aflowmate versus being a teammate that sometimes you're
both. That's even more dramatic.But the most important thing right now,
are you a floormate? And youknow the Celtics, they had a bunch

(41:12):
of floormates. They definitely did Gordyto steer back to free agency. I
wonder, what do you think wasthe best free agent move that you've seen
so far? Was it? Wasit the Sixers getting Paul George? Was
it the MAVs getting Klay Thompson?Was it somewhere off the board, the
Chante Merry going to the Pelicans?Yeah? The trade? Oh yeah,

(41:34):
see again, that guy got awinning game. He's an average twenty one
points a game, five point sevenassists, two point one steals. And
if Ingram's still there, it givesthem another scorer and defensive player, and
it helps Zigns out tremendously. AndI think that trade probably broke a lot

(41:54):
of Jazz fans heart scoredy because Iknow a lot of Jazz fans had their
hearts set on the Jazz trying totrade for Marie. Yeah, very much.
If the Jazz did, then thenthey would delay their rebuilding process.
And so it's that unbelievable tough thelumber in jazz basketball that you want to
be competitive, and they were forthe first part of back to back seasons

(42:15):
and then they weren't. And youcan't get those elite talent if you don't
pick high in the draft, butyou can get talented players who are undrafted
nazriating those guys. But as faras players that are difference makers. So
the Celts right now will be theclass example of back to back years they

(42:36):
picked number three, hit the jackpot, meaning Jellen Brown and then later on
Jason Tatum in sixteen and seventeen,and that was the that was the absolutely
folk rum that get them to beworld champions. And now with the thunder
right now with j Jos Alexander whothey traded for by getting chet Holgerm at
number two and then Jalen Williams atnumber twelve in the draft, they hit

(42:59):
the jackpot. So it's a fascinatingThe best way to do it is that
to try to study the NBA winnersof what they did as far as how
they built the team. Most teamsthat last for a long time are built
through the draft. Just jelly speaking, I mean, that's why I'm an
advocate of the Jazz trying to getinto the top of this draft, get

(43:21):
their franchise talent, pair with CodyWilliams, Deyont, George Taylor Hendricks,
who I believe are supplementary. They'repieces, but they're not dudes. I
think you need to go draft yourdude who you build the entire team around.
In this twenty twenty five draft,whether it's Cooper flag, Ace Bailey,
Dylan Harper, Nolan tare agor Demeanyou can rattle them off. And
I love the draft. And Ihaven't even watched too many of these guys,

(43:44):
but you can see from just thetwitchiness, the way they handle the
ball in their hands, it's differentthan anyone in this draft. Zachary resa
Chet is a guy who's learning howto play with the basketball, and he's
the number one pick, And youlook at the players in this draft upcoming,
I should say I think that's whythe Jazz need to find the player
to build a round as opposed toLowry market and being the player to build

(44:04):
around who I think he's a piece. Gordy talked about on a fifty six
win team, Lowry's the third bestplayer. Well, the Jazz want to
reach those hypes. They don't wantto play in mediocrity, be in purgatory.
We're not looking for playing appearances here, exactly first round exits. And
if you look at those teams withplaying appearances they've I mean recently Gordy talked
about it, Steph forty six wins. Steph's a generational talent. Obviously he's

(44:25):
they were unbelievably successful. But what'sthe likelihood that even last year Steph is
even close to being approached by someonelike Lowry Marketing? And I'm not saying
that's a disparage what Lowry has donewill do in his NBA career. But
unless you're able to keep him andthen find your way into that top five,
I think it's better to get theassets, whether future assets via the
draft, maybe a young player here, like if the Spurs were to give

(44:49):
us Devin Vassell and us being theJazz Devin Vessel along with some picks.
Maybe you could. You probably can'tget Stephan Castle, but Devin Vessel and
some picks. I would definitely bevery interested, and I think you would
get good immediate picks because they'll beyoung enough to where they don't truly succeed
in this loaded West. Like Gordyjust outline three of the teams he really
liked there. They're they're young,like Shay Gillig, just Alexander and the

(45:10):
thunder Chet young. All those guysare young. Lucas still very young,
Minnesota, Anthony Edwards is twenty three, like, so I don't think the
Jazz are going to pass those guysby having a star that's not as good
as them that's older. So I'mvery much in the mindset of build through
the draft because most of the teamsI've gone through the history books, Gordy
has lived it, seen it,coached it. The those teams that win

(45:32):
have their stars drafted through the draft, and only very few teams can acquire
those already established stars through trades orfree agency. Would you agree with that,
Gordy, Would you agree that thatmore success, that success more often
comes from building through the draft ratherthan free agency. I know you said
you have to be good at allthree, but would you say, if

(45:52):
there's one that's indicates success, isit the draft? Yeah? Did you
no words? Your draft number one? And then you add free agency or
aids and even guys that are undraftedjust based on they fall through the cracks.
No, because usually speaking when youpick high d the lottery high meaning
top five, is that those guysare in their age group have knockout talent.

(46:13):
Remember, talent wins in professional sports, they wins. And that's why
our list today, James, Andyeah, let's get to the list and
then we'll and then we'll we'll letyour head out. Here's what's our list
today, James. Let's say,let's state the obvious. One second is
that these guys all have unbelievable knockouttalent. This list today is the fifteen

(46:37):
greatest all time all around players inthe NBA, and the catch word is
all around. His the criteria onescoring, two passing, three defending including
shop blocking, four rebounding, andfive end of game clutch two way plays

(46:59):
and so not the greatest scorers becauseit's a different criteria. But these players
are generational that led their teams incrediblenumber fifteen. He recently passed away.
Jerry West won one NBA championship,fourteenth all time player. He was a
walking triple double before it was emphasized, so that's how crazy he was.

(47:20):
Oscar Robinson won one championship, numberthirteen. He plays for the Phoenix Suns
right now. Kevin Durant generational talent, two championships, number twelve, Mess
of footwork, two NBA titles.Haquem Alajah one number eleven for NBA titles,

(47:45):
Rebound their incredible interior force score.It impossible to guard on a two
footed catch. It's over, it'sit's don't even try. Shaquille O'Neill number
ten when they all great clutch players, Shooter, rebounder, passer. Larry
Bird with three championships, number nine. We talked about him about five times

(48:09):
in the last eleven minutes. Heplays for the Golden State Warriors. The
ninth greatest player of all time,the world's greatest shooter of all time both
catch and fire, also off thedribble. Steph Curry four NBA championships,
number eighth all time all around playerwith five championships, missed the fundamentals played

(48:34):
for the Spurs for nineteen years.He made it all happen. Tim Duncan
number seven, he won eleven championshipsin thirteen years, and he's forgotten because
he passed away about two years ago. His if I say his name,

(48:54):
his his numbers of all time.He averaged fifteen point one points per game,
twenty two point five rebounds. He'sthe greatest ever Game seven performer.
He played in ten game sevens.He was teamed with ten or zero.
He's five time league MVP. Theynamed the NBA Finals mvpfter him. He

(49:15):
was a player coach in the NBAin his last two seasons. Eleven championships
in thirteen years. The seventh alltime greatest player Bill Russell numbers. And
we talk about sorry to catch thatright, It's fine. Well, we
talk about the crazy rebound in pointsnumbers of Wilt Chamberlain. You know who's

(49:36):
right under Wilt Chamberlain as far asall those rebound records, Bill Russell,
and sometimes ahead of him, butits single game career Bill Russell. And
we talked about Wil Chamberlain being thisthe babe ruth. As far as rebounds
go, Bill Russell's right there withWill Chamberlain, and it seemed like he
got even more in the playoffs.Right, one time Bill Russell got in

(49:57):
a playoff game fifty five rebounds.Yeah, insane. Also after this is
that, remember Bill Russell would bethe all time greatest ever shot locker.
But they didn't keep the statistic.I know, it sounds almost like almost
like prehistoric times. They didn't keepofficially steals and block shots until nineteen seventy

(50:17):
three, seventy four, five yearsafter he retired. Right, you've retired
in sixty nine, him and SamJones, so no one knows how many
block shots he had. All Iknow is that what I saw is that
when you drove the lane, hemost times he'd blocked your shot. Number
six all time greatest ever performer,Magic Johnson, we know about him.

(50:37):
He did it with a smile.Five championships, Number five all time.
He left his way too soon threeyears ago, with five NBA titles.
Absolutely clutch player, the unbelievable scorewhen they needed him. Kobe Bryant number
four, James alluded to a secondago. Wilt Chamberlain set these incredible records,

(50:58):
almost impossible to stop. When hein the lane. He one time
they said he shot too much,so the next year that the NBA and
assist with two NBA titles. WorltChamberlain number three all time, six NBA
championships, five with the Lakers,one with one with the Milwaukee Bucks.
Kareem Abdul Jabbar number two all time. He plays for the Lakers right now,

(51:22):
all time leaders scorer in the NBA. He will set many incredible records.
Lebron James with four NBA titles,and the number one greatest player of
all time is Michael Jordan with sixNBA titles, six finals, MVP eleven

(51:42):
times voted to the All Defensive Team, averaged thirty three point four points per
game for his career in the playoffs. So Michael Jordan. Thus, that's
my list. We can debate thatone through fifteen. We could add,
we could add five more guys.Todation now being in ten through fifteen,
it's incredible everyone's trying to draft someonelike these guys. These guys are absolutely

(52:06):
all winners, and they're all generational. Absolutely heck of a list there,
Gordy. The Goat list for Gordy. Their greatest all round players all time
in NBA history. Gordy thank youso much for another awesome hour here.
We're gonna keep you on with withthe Sean O'Connell Show, which starts next

(52:27):
week, so we're gonna just tohave you on next Thursday with Sean.
It's so excited to continue to haveyou on here on the mid days as
OC gets in the air chairs startingnext week. Gordy, peace out,
Thanks Ay, peace out, SeaLeaf say well and everyone else also have
a great and safe July fourth.Absolutely, that's the great Gordy Chiasa with
us here on the Midday Show.James Peterson, Leaf Tuleen hosting it today

(52:52):
as we kind of bridge the gapbetween the Bill Riley Show and the Sean
O'Connell Show, which gets started nextMonday, July eighth. Back on the
other side with more here, I'mJames Peterson. That's Lee Twoeen on Utah's
number one sports talk and home ofthe You. It's ESPN seven hundred and

(53:16):
standing in line to see the show. That hour two of our Midday Show,
we just said goodbye to Gordy Chiaza. If you missed our conversation with
Gordy on the NBA and the UtahJazz Draft Free agency, projecting to next

(53:37):
season and more. You can headto ESPN seven hundred sports dot com.
We'll we'll still post this on theBill Riley Show podcast, so you can
you can hear this on UH ifyou search the Bill Riley Show wherever you
get your podcasts, yeah, oron the ESPN seven hundred app. If
you have not downloaded the app,do me a favor. Download that.

(53:58):
It is free and it's all atyour preferred app store, Google Play,
Apple, wherever you get your apps. You can hit the on demand section
and listen to all of our interviewson the station here. Again, this
will still be on the Bill RileyShow podcast the Show podcast in all of
our interviews until Sean comes in andtakes the air chair and we'll have the

(54:22):
Sean O'Connell Show podcast starting on Julyeighth. I'm James Peterson Lee Tleen sitting
across from me. Leif. Ikind of just wanted to continue the NBA
conversation with us here. You saidsomething interesting just off the air. You're
the more you think about it,the more concerned you are for the MAVs

(54:43):
chances to get back to the Conferencefinals or NBA Finals. Tell me about
that. Yeah. I mean,if you listen to Gordy and I try
to talk to Gordy as much asI possibly can, he always talks about
the playoffs are really the litmus test, like how how can you continue to
improve because each each stage the playoffsis a level up and people are going
to find your deficiency. So whatthe Mavericks deficiency was in the finals was

(55:06):
they didn't shoot well in sert KlayThompson, I understand, that's a great
fit shoots, one of the bestshooters of all time on a team that
needs shooting to supplement the great creatorsin Luka, Doncicic and Kyrie Irving.
But what made the Mavericks win againstthe Clippers, against the thunder and against
the Timberwolves in particular is their defensiveversatility. What they were able to do

(55:27):
is frustrate teams because they had DerekJones Junior, is an elite perimeter defender.
They had PJ. Washington, who'sa big guy who moves his feet
very well. They had two centersnot always on the floor at the same
time, in fact, rarely atthe floor at the same time. And
Lively and Gafford, who really areenergizers protect the rim, have the athletics
leam to switch, and they compensatefor Luka don Chich and Kyrie Irving's ineptitude

(55:51):
at least consistently on the defensive end. Well, Kyrie and Luk are going
to be there, Clay's going tobe there. Clay's played the two guard
his entire career as a big twoguard. Now now he's an average size,
maybe even undersized three who's in thewaning limits of his career. Like
athletically started the decline, it seemslike we already. I mean, I
think he just started a few yearsago when he first got injured, and

(56:14):
now it's just become further and furtherbecause he's had horrible injuries and he's had
the bravado to carry on and playgood basketball like he wasn't himself. But
that's a Hall of Famer you're talkingabout. And now, the reason I
bring all this up is the teamsthat have the most versatility added more versatility,
Caruso makes them better rebounding the ball, Hartenstein. That was the two

(56:36):
areas of deficiency. Josh Giddy didn'tshoot well and he wasn't as good defensively
as Caruso is. Now they reboundbetter because they have Heartenstein, who can
play with or without Chet Holmgren.And you won't lose because he's won't lose
production because he's very, very good, and you paid eighty seven mil for
that type of guy. They reassuredtheir bench the Thunder. I think the
Thunder probably were better than the Maverick. They just were inexperienced. So the

(56:59):
Maverick to me, yes, theygot Nauseie Marshall. Yes, They're probably
going to end up with Quentin Grimesto replace Tim Hardaway, which I think
is an upgrade because Hardaway wanted out. But I just don't think they had
the defensive recipe in which they Thatwas what provided them the chance to make
the NBA Finals, And so Iwonder if they strayed too far away from
what their roots were that led tothat success. And they found a player

(57:21):
that's injury prone and older and he'syes, he's a great shooter, but
he demands the ball, and whatdo you have two guys who really need
the ball in their hands. Sothe more I think about it, the
less I'm high on the Mavericks,and the more I love what the Thunder
it like Gordy had them number oneand deservedly, so I agree with you.
It's I've been low on I've beenlower on Klay Thompson for his whole

(57:42):
career than most people. And bythat I mean people had him. People
have him as a no doubt Hallof Famer, perennial All Star. I
don't have him as that I havehim. I mean, maybe he's a
Hall of Famer be because of whathe did in the playoffs, great,
but I have I've always had himis maybe the best role player in the
league. That's and and like bettera whole other level than any other role

(58:06):
player in the league, but notquite All Star level. That's that's where
I always had him. And soI've been lower on him his whole career
than most people, but i've beenI feel like I've been even more lower
on him since he's started to declinebecause of those two devastating injuries. I
mean, tearing your acl and thenturn around and tearing your achilles back to

(58:30):
back is insane. Like the factthat he's even playing and as a starter
ish level player speaks to just howgood he is and the kind of athlete
that he is. But I Ijust I don't see him as the defender
that he used to be, andthat, to your point, that's huge

(58:51):
for the MAVs. They're getting abetter shooter, but they are not They're
not going to be replacing the defensethat they lost in Derek Jones Junior in
particular and others on the perimeter bybringing in a guy with a better defensive
reputation than what he actually does onthe defensive end now with Kway Thompson,
and he's just he actually hasn't beenas great of a shooter since he's gotten

(59:13):
back from those two injuries either.And we're now three years from that two
full year, two and a halfyears removed from his return to the floor.
I mean it just, and he'sthirty four. It feels like if
we haven't seen that restoration to whathe was pre injury or something close to
it, realistically close to it,I'm not sure we're going to see it,

(59:37):
which is speaks to why the Warriorswere like, yeah, go ahead
and find a better offer somewhere else, because we don't think you're worth anywhere
near a max contract or worth anywherenear what he got from the MAVs.
Because of all those things. Ihave an analogy that I think you'll agree
with, and I don't know ifeveryone else will. Yeah, right before
it, Ray Allen went to theHeat and he was integral and then winning

(59:59):
a champion, and he was asix man guy. Yeh Yes, And
Klay Thompson's getting paid fifty mil overthree years to play starters minutes, and
I don't think they're terribly different players, Like Clay's probably still better than Ray
was at that point because he's alittle younger and he's a little bigger,
so he can play the small forward. But you're asking that same sort of
ilk of player at that same sortof stage of a declining career to play

(01:00:23):
far bigger minutes on a team thatdoesn't have Lebron James, that doesn't have
Dwayne Wade, that doesn't have ChrisBosh. Like those guys all through of
those I mentioned are at a levelthat is comfortable with Luka Doncic, and
I understand that he's better than Bosh, and I understand he's better. He's
going to be better than the way. But what those guys were were excellent
defenders along with being otherworldly offensive talents. So you're asking for a bigger role

(01:00:47):
on a worse team, and Ithink that's a recipe for disaster. That
said, Luca's brilliant, like hewill get Clay unbelievably open shots and there
will be a game. Will Claywins them the playoff game because he hits
eight threes. Can very much seethat. But I overall think it's a
downgrade because of the recipe that gotthem there wasn't necessarily oh the ineptitude shooting

(01:01:07):
like that would that didn't cost themthat much until the finals when the other
team was that much better. Theyneeded to make those shots and they could
push the ball out of Luca's hands. I actually liked the actually like Miami
heat Ray Allen comparison to last fewyears analogy for the last few years Warriors
Clay and now MAVs Clay. Iactually really like that analogy. I don't

(01:01:29):
think it's it's that inaccurate Clay.This Clay probably has a higher ceiling than
that Ray Allen did. Just becausewe all are kind of giving, and
myself included, I'm kind of givingClay the benefit of doubt just because we've
never seen a player restart their careerafter back to back Achilles and acl and

(01:01:51):
then Achilles, and so I kindof give them the benefit of doubt that
let's just give them some time becausethose those used both of those used to
be career enders leave. Yeah,not that long ago, and he is
he had him back to back,So I still am inclined to give him
a little bit more time to maybetry to figure this out. I just

(01:02:13):
that, all being said, timesrunning out, I think on him being
able to get back anywhere near thelevel he was pre you know, to
twenty nineteen Klay Thompson, which asI said before, I don't think was
as near as great as a lotof people in the NBA world have say
that it was, but is stillas much better than he is now.

(01:02:34):
And I'm with you. I evenagree with about the Clay thing. I
think I'm a little higher, butI was lower than the consensus. But
let me ask a follow up,like Gordy said, Timberwolves, Yeah,
I find that one interesting because theTimberwolves have a clear issue at the end
of the games, and that's goingto be you know, maturity is going
to help them, Anthony Edwards,you can get better at the end of
the games, Karl, Anthony Towns, nas Reed, and Rudy Gobert are

(01:02:57):
all headed different directions of their career. Rudy is bound to decline. Yes,
he won the defensive Play of theYear. Yes, they were unbelievable
defensively. Jade McDaniels is getting better. I mean, nas Reed, they
just extended. So how are theygoing to balance that front court of how
many minutes? And yes, that'sa good, good problem to have,
But those things matter because all theseplayers have egos. Carl Anthony Town's played
unselfishly in the finals, but he'sa guy that if you put him on

(01:03:21):
a bad team, could score twentyseven a game. And now he's gonna
have to sacrifice for the betterman theteam. I think he will do it.
I think Mike Conley's good, butI do think Mike Conley in a
type and like if they had madethe finals, I think he would have
been exposed by the length and strengthof Derek White and Drew Holliday like that.
He's a mentor at this point.For Anthony, Edwards is his most
valuable piece, along with being avery good table sitting guards. Kyle Anderson

(01:03:45):
Gordy talks about valuable depth members.He might be joining the Celtics. I've
heard rumblings about that, so Ithink that's interesting. I think the Tea
Wolves are probably about the same asthey were last year. I think the
MAVs are trending downward. I thinkthe Thunder are trending upward. And then
you look the Nuggets. They're justkind of hiding and playing sight like,
Yes, they just lost KCP.Christian Brown's gonna take a bigg role.

(01:04:06):
Do they get Bruce Brown back?That's something that I've heard about. But
I think they might be the secondbest team in the West. To me,
I think it's the Thunder, butthey're unproven. It's hard to win
when your first, like real goaround last year was the test drive.
This is the real go around.I think it's the Thunder, the Nuggets,
the t Wolves, and then theMAVs and as my top four,
and then I'd be curious to seewhat the Pelicans turn into. But de

(01:04:28):
Jontay Murray doesn't solve all their issues. They still have to find a way
to play with Brandon Ingram, CJMcCollum, Zion all wanting the basketball.
Do they trade Ingram? How doesthat help them in the short term.
Yeah, that's more of a longterm thing. And then obviously you need
the health of Zion. So Idon't know the West is really shaken up.
I think it's good, but Idon't know if it's as good as
it was last year because there area lot of question marks. Even for

(01:04:49):
the best teams that were fifty sevenwin teams in a loaded Western conference.
Yeah, you're right, and ateam that lost in the first round,
but for three three and a halfmonths looked like they could be the best
team in the West. In theregular season La Clippers, they got significantly
worse. They're bringing back James Harden, but losing Paul George makes them significantly

(01:05:13):
worse. I do like what they'vedone defensively, adding Derek Jones Jr.
And our guy Chris Dunn former jazzMan now we can say former jazz Man
now. I like what they didadding those guys the length and just their
defensive they're just defensive stars, thoseguys are, and I think that I

(01:05:33):
think that done also helps them wina way that pre James Harden, certainly,
but even with James Harden, theyalso one of their other big weaknesses
offensively was they didn't have an organizerout there at the point guard ish role,
that lead guard role. And wesaw this past season that huge stretch

(01:05:54):
that you mentioned earlier in the showleaf when they looked like a team that
could be at least a play whenthey went nineteen and six or whatever it
was in December and January, ChrisDunn was in the starting lineup. That
was one of the big adjustments tothe rotation that Will Hardy and the coaching
staff did and one of the bigreasons why they were even able to go

(01:06:17):
on that run. In addition toColin Sexton, you know, taking its
game to another level, in additionto Simili Fontekio taking his game to another
level, only for the Jazz toshift and trade those guys, some of
those guys away at the deadline.But I like what the Clippers have done,
but they're not gonna be as goodeven with those good additions that help

(01:06:40):
them defensively Jones and Done, SoI'm with you. It feels like it's
still gonna be a loaded West,but maybe not as tough a Western conference
to get through. I think there'sthree clear top teams. It's the Thunder,
It's the Nuggets, and it's theTea Wolves in some order. And

(01:07:00):
I think I might put the TWolves just slightly ahead of the Nuggets right
now because of the depth factor.But people talk about the Nuggets depth was
so was so good when they wonthe championship. They played eight guys,
yeah, seven and a half really, So they have proven even when they
won the championship, they don't needa large rotation to win it all.

(01:07:26):
And so I give them, I'mwith you, I give them a little
bit more of the benefit of doubtthan it seemed like Gordy was given to
be able to figure this out,especially if they can keep Jamal Murray healthy
and not playing through a hamstring injuryor worse in the playoffs. But depth
is still a bit of a questionmark unless they're able to bring back a
Bruce Brown. Like you said,that certainly changes things, and it's not

(01:07:49):
near as much of a question markfor a team like the T Wolves.
I think Denver is better than thet Wolves, even though I've rooted very
hard for the Tvves. Yeah,I think Denver this year will be better
because now they're the hunter as opposedto the hunted, and then likely you'll
have health. I mean You don'tknow that for certain, but I think

(01:08:10):
you could tell that team was ailingin terms of the workload that Jamal Murray
had to have and was inefficient inthat role. Yes, Jade McDaniels was
excellent defensively, Anthony Edwards was aswell, but you could see he wasn't
himself even in the Lakers series.Yes, he had two game winning shots,
but that wasn't Jamal Murray that I'maccustomed to seeing Torch the Jazz and
the playoffs, which just ruined mein twenty four. Yeah, like absolutely

(01:08:31):
destroyed the Jazz and then what hedid last the year before this past season
twenty twenty three, he kind ofbasically did the same thing with the little
less fifty point games, right.Yeah. And the last point is I
believe there's internal growth that could happenfor the Nuggets that really fixes a lot
of their issues with a guy likePeyton Watson. Payton Watson and Christian Brown.

(01:08:55):
Yeah, Peyton Watson's a bigger versionof Bruce Brown. Bruce Brown wasn't
a good shooter. He was justa more mature version of Peyton Watson.
Watson wasn't terribly playable because he wasn'tready for the limelight of shooting the ball,
but also because Jamal Murray wasn't aseffective as an offensive player, that
created more necessity of making shots andsupplementing the offense than what he's used to
of just being, Hey, I'mgoing to be an athlete, I'm going

(01:09:16):
to defend my my head off,and I'm going to cut. Well,
it became less easy to cut becauseAaron Gordon's having to do different things in
the basketball court, like the roleswere less upon Christian Brown. I think
it's nearly ready for that role thatBruce Brown had, and you paid or
Bruce Brown was paid by the Pacerstwenty two millions. So the Nuggets got
a rookie deal version of Bruce Brownand Christian Brown. I think they could

(01:09:40):
make a trade. Maybe they findBruce Brown again. KCP was excellent this
year. That is a big loss, But I do think that there's a
way that they can supplement their rosterthat makes them a threat. And they
have the most consistently good player onthe basketball court at all times, nicolea
Jokic. I hesitate to say he'sthe best in the NBA, but it's
hard to argue this point of theimpact he has every single time because what

(01:10:02):
he does is he scores the balland he makes the other kids. He
gets every rebound when you need it, he hits every big shot, but
he makes the other team make ahorribly difficult decision. Do we play isolation
basketball and him score forty against thebest defenders in the world, or do
we double? And it's even worsebecause Michael Porter Junior, now all of
a sudden, is gonna hit twentyfive points on five threes. And now

(01:10:24):
they swing it again, and AaronGordon's gonna catch an alloy you dunk,
So he's the ultimate mismatch. Andthen all they have to do is show
up their defense and have just alittle bit more confidence from Peyton Watson,
Christian Brown and whoever they use tosupplement that bench. So I am pretty
high in the Nuggets. The Jazzfantom me doesn't like saying this. I
think it's the thunder and the Nuggetsare clearly the best two teams. I
like, I want the tables tobe good because I still love Mike Conley

(01:10:45):
and Rudy Gobert, but I thinkthat's the top two. And if you
look at those teams. Yes,Jokis was picked forty first, but Gordon
Gordon was an addition, but JamalMurray and Michael Porter Junior picked by the
Nuggets. You look at the thundershake Gil just Alexander is an exception as
the star who was traded for.And then you have chet number two pick,
Jalen Williams twelve pick home built throughthe draft, built through the draft.

(01:11:08):
Absolutely, And I'm gonna tie thisback to the Jazz. Just local
topical. The Jazz just had agood draft. They had a good draft
last ye. It's already proven tobe good and could get better. Could
I think it will get better.You've got six young pieces. You're not
going to win. But I thinkwill Hardy's proven he's a good coach,
winning as much as he has withthe ineptitude relatively on the roster. I

(01:11:29):
think you need to commit to havinga baron cupboard entirely and get the players
that can help you win a championship, not win a play in game.
I don't disagree. We can continuethat conversation about about what the Jazz should
do, what their strategy should befrom day one next season. Also,

(01:11:49):
Utah Hockey Clubs schedule is out.We'll talk about some of the marquee games
coming to the Delta Center and nottoo far from us, maybe Vegas and
Colorado as well some short road tripsthat you can check out's the Utah Hockey
Club and the NHL schedule is out. Talk more about that and more about

(01:12:10):
the Jazz rebuild on the other side. This is the Midday Show. James
Peterson Leaf Tween sitting in with youhere on Utah is number one sports dock
ESPN seven hundred and we'rerowing along here, just about to start our three of
We're calling it the Midday Show.For now. We're bridging the gap between

(01:12:32):
the Bill Riley Show and the SeanO'Connell Show, which starts next Monday,
July eighth. I'm gonna give aquick shout out to a couple of our
sponsors here. The sponsor of ouropening segment, Totally Space, bringing us
up in the opening segment. We'llget to them now here though. ALVR
Moani they'll fix your hairline, yourconfidence level. They'll fix your hairline,

(01:12:53):
they'll change your confidence level and yourlife. At ALVI Rmani, our count
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Stop. We are fifty eight daysfrom the start of the Utah football season.
Appreciate our great sponsors of that Bigtwelve Media Day a week away.

(01:13:15):
Media Days begin a week from today, July ninth, at Allegiance Stadium in
Las Vegas. Sean O'Connell and Spencecheck Its will anchor our coverage from Sinn
City at Big twelve Media Days.And yeah, also a quick message from
the Road Home Apple Tree. Helpthe children at the Road Home start school

(01:13:40):
in style. Stop by the Advocatesin Ogden, American Fork or Murray and
pick an apple from the tree andyou can supply shoes, clothing, and
backpacks for a child at the RoadHome. Every child deserves an advocate.
Stop by today. Obviously an outstandingcause where we love partnering with the Road
Home and the Advocates to help thesechildren and families experiencing homelessness get their kids

(01:14:08):
off to school with everything that theyneed to start school and all and new
stuff too. Every kid wants tohave new clothes, new shoes, and
new backpack. It makes you feelgood to start school out the school you're
aut with that kind of stuff helphelp the road home and the advocates and
us here at ESPN seven hundred andninety two one FM do that for Utah

(01:14:29):
children experiencing homelessness. Real quick beforewe head to a break and welcome in
draft analyst James Barlow from NBA BigBoard Podcast, part of the Locked On
podcast network, to recap the draft. I want to talk about the Utah

(01:14:49):
Hockey Club leaf. The schedule isout. A lot of people excited about
this, and you and I havenot been hockey fans before this, but
I'm pretty pumped to see Utah HockeyClub begin their season October eighth against the
Blackhawks. How about you. Yeah, that's a big hitting franchise too.
That's a proud franchise that through upthroughout my time growing up, it was

(01:15:13):
them, the Red Wings, theBruins, all these teams on the East
Coast, and I couldn't really getinto hockey that much like you'd see it
on Sports Center. I was mostintrigued by the Saves. Well, it's
right here, it's at the DeltaCenter. You're going to see the Utah
Hockey Club and Connor Bedard, oneof the guys who's seen as an up
and coming star in this league leadingthe Blackhawks right now. He was compared

(01:15:35):
to Wemby last year. So forthose who were more basketball oriented like myself,
they were supposed to be prodigies inboth drafts, and so you might
see the hockey's version of Wemby thevery first hockey game played in Utah for
Utah Hockey Club, the regular seasongame, for sure. There'll be a
couple of preseason games, but yeah, for the regular season for sure.
A couple other notable matchups at theDelta Center will be the car out of

(01:15:59):
Avalanche, who looks like could bea natural rival for Utah, will will
come in the same week or atleast three days apart. The Avs will
come to the Delta Center on Octobertwenty fourth and the twenty seventh, and
the Vegas Golden Knights will make theirfirst visit here November fifteenth, they will
play They will play at Vegas acouple weeks before that too. That also

(01:16:23):
feels like it'll be a rivalry atsome point. Utah and Vegas Edmonton Oilers,
the NHL runner ups, are cominga couple weeks after Vegas comes in
on November twenty ninth. I believedthat's Thanksgiving weekend or the week after Thanksgiving
somewhere in there and Florida. Thedefending Stanley Cup champions come one time this

(01:16:45):
year. That'll be on January eighth. So some big time matchups coming to
the Delta Center. Starting in October. We have the start date for the
inaugural season for the Utah Hockey Club. On the other side, though,
we'll talk more Utah Jazz and NBAwill focus more on the draft with our
guy, James Barlow, leif's goodfriend and podcast partner with the Lockdown NBA

(01:17:10):
Big Board podcast. James Barlow isnext here with me, James Peterson,
that guy Leaf Tooleeen on Utah's numberone sports talk and home of you.
It's ESPN seven hundred and ninety.Welcome back. We are into our three

(01:17:35):
of we're just calling it the MiddayShow right now. The Sean O'Connell Show
starts on July eighth. The BillRiley Show is in our rearview mirror,
so we're just calling it the MiddayShow for now. At Leaf James Peterson,
Leaf Tooleen across from me. We'vetalked a ton of basketball here.
We had Cordy chiays on for anhour in studio at the ESPN seven hundred

(01:17:57):
sports dot com If you miss that, or the ESPN seven hundred app download
for free today in your preferred appstore if you miss that. We talked
draft, we talked free agency.But uh leif you've got a good friend
that we're that we're bringing on nowto continue the draft conversation. Huh yeah.
James Barlow and I host locked anNBA big board together and he has

(01:18:21):
very similar thoughts to me about someprospects. One we disagreed on is one
the Jazz were very high on CodyWilliams. And that's that's where I'm very
excited to start here. So let'sbring on James and and and James,
firstly, how are you doing andthanks for joining us, but also let's
let's just give your analysis on CodyWilliams and maybe anger some people in Utah,
but we'll battle back and forth likewe typically do. All right,

(01:18:44):
Thanks for having me Leaf, I'mdoing all right. Hopefully I don't anger
anyone. Uh. I'm for wherehe was drafted at tim, I get
it, So that's a good sign. I get Uh. Some people had
him a little higher, I know, least we were doing our MAXU that
mentioned him possibly going six to Charlotte, and that's where we kind of finally

(01:19:10):
started to disagree on something. Butat ten, I think it works.
Just My biggest concerns with Cody isthat he's like a jack of all trades
and master of none incense, whichyou know you can mold him into,
you know, a specific skill set. But him being six' eight and

(01:19:31):
only grabbing three raybounds a game doesworry me. But I do like his
versatility as far as you know,being able to put the ball in the
ground in spurts, being able tomake plays in spurts, and you know,
the measurables look good obviously in thesegames. And wait, but I
think at ten, you know,you can't really complain about what you ended

(01:19:55):
up getting, especially for somebody whosome people thought could have been the top
five pick. Yeah. I thinkLeaf said earlier he thought he will maybe
not a top five pick, butyou said five on your big board,
right, Leaf. So so we'vegot someone in studio here, James that
uh that that thinks he could havebeen maybe a top five potential pick.
Uh. I'm curious, what howlong do you think it'll take for Cody

(01:20:20):
to reach if he let's say,let's just say eventually he reaches app he
reaches his absolute potential, which ofcourse is never a safe assumption with with
draft picks, especially ones that areas raw as Cody Williams. Let's just
assume that eventually he does. Howlong do you think it'll take him to
get there? Because it seems likeit'll take him at least a few years

(01:20:41):
in my opinion, generally with guysyou want to say, especially those drafted
where he was drafted. I mean, it's an open draft, but you
think that it would take him positivelytwo to three years to kind of like
figure it out. An example,not the same player, but like Denny
Abdia who was just traded to Portland, I think it took him to year

(01:21:04):
four for him to just figure outlike okay, I need to He did
some good things, and it wassimilar in the sense where he was good
at some things, not like projectedto be a big time scorer. He
did have length, he did pass, and he you know, could handle.
But it took him, I wantto say, until his past season,

(01:21:24):
which I believe was his fourth seasonin the NBA where he figured out
the shooting and it kind of likehe put together his best season. Cody
did shoot the ball well this pastseason, but it was on a low
volume. So I want to sayhe gives him about to the third year,
maybe you can see what you havein him and how he projected.

(01:21:45):
Also to give him some time tojust really physically mature, because he's on
the thin side, but most ofthese eighteen nineteen year old kids are.
Yeah, we've talked about this atlength, but I think Cody's things that
you would say are worst off inhis game, I think they're very correct.
Well. With adding strength, whichI think is the easiest thing to
do. In the NBA, wealways talk about can you teach an athlete

(01:22:08):
to shoot? Can you teach ashooter to become athletic? Well, Cody
Williams, like you said, maynot be a master of any trade,
but he's pretty solid a lot ofthem, and that's good. But I
think he can become very good atthose ones he's pretty solid at. By
adding strength, I think he becomesa better finisher at the rim. I
think he becomes a better playmaker asa six foot eight to two guard,
bringing it to the rim because hecreates more advantages having more strength, being

(01:22:30):
less reliant on your dad James kindof knock his rebounding numbers two. I
would think adding strength would help inthat regard to Yeah, And I think
the biggest thing that he can dois I don't know if he's necessarily a
star in the NBA, but Ithink he can be a star in his
role at a very high level becausehe has positional size, because he has
the ability to shoot, even ifit is a low volume, and I'm

(01:22:50):
critical of that low volume, Ithink that he can shoot it well enough.
I think he can get to therim put pressure. I think he's
a very good defender, like heguarded the best players for Colorado as a
freshman on a team that had akind of a glue guy, rugged guy
and Javan Hadley, that had Tristanda Silva, who is a highly picked
player. He was in the toptwenty of the NBA draft went to the
Magic. I think what Cody Williamscan work on is strength orrington. That's

(01:23:15):
why I have optimism about his developmentbecause you look at a lot of these
players that don't shoot well well.They may not shoot well at all,
and they're more physically mature at thispoint. So that's why I've got some
optimism for Cody Williams. And Iwas thrilled at the Jazz picks, as
you well know, as we've talkedabout this numerous times. Yeah, I

(01:23:35):
think if you sit here and toldme that this case scenario or you know
what, we look at his size, his lembs, his body types and
we say, you know what hecould be our Jaden McDaniels, then that
is good because it took Jaden McDaniel'shis third year for him to like figure

(01:23:56):
it out and he has similar concerns. Well, I mean, because he's
guarded best player, he doesn't reboundeither, so he's had about three rebounds
per game. But year three,Jaden McDaniels became a full time starter,
he got paid, and now yousee how important he is to what Minnesota
does. So again for where youdrafted him at, obviously you don't get

(01:24:17):
the top end all star upside,but like we said, you may end
up getting a star in his role. A lot of it does have to
do with strength, but again justcontinuing to develop his ability to put the
ball in the basket. It's goingto be key for his growth. We're
talking with James Barlow from the LockdownNBA Big Board podcast here. We're just
calling it the Midday Show for nowbecause Bill Riley shows in the rearview mirror,

(01:24:41):
Sean O'Connell shows looking ahead here.We don't have a name for this
bridge situation. It's just the MiddayShow. James Peterson Leaf twen with you
here on ESPN seven hundred ninety twoone FM. James, I wanted to
first of all, you got agreat name, fellow, fellow, James
got to be we got to lookout for each other and make sure we

(01:25:02):
would compliment each other on our greatnames. Right, Yes, I agree,
James. Not Jim. Yeah,yeah, not Jim my grandpa.
So I'm named after my grandpa,same middle name and everything, and yeah
that's crazy. And he's a gym. Is it the same with your grandpa?
Yeah, he had to go byJim because there was like five people
in our family names. And Ijust, at a very young age,

(01:25:26):
I stood on my ground and said, I'm not Jim, So I'm James.
Yes, I'm James. That's awesome. So, but I wanted to
I wanted to ask you One ofthe things that a lot of jazz fans
were critical of in regards to thetaking Cody Williams at ten was a Dalton
Connect was on the board and alot of a lot of our listeners were
like, man, I would havetaken Dalton Connect. He seems to be

(01:25:48):
more of a proven commodity, whichis certainly the case, but I I
would have taken Cody Williams. Iagree with with them taking Cody Williams instead
of a Dulton Connect. That inwhat they did. I think Leif agrees
with that as well. I justwant to I wonder where you land on
that. Were you in that situation, if you're Danny Ainge, if you're

(01:26:11):
justin Xanik, do you do whatthey did and take Cody Williams or would
you have gone over the guy thatseems more plug and play gone for the
guy who seems more plug and playand Dalton Connect. I'm my thinking is
I want long term upside considering wherethe jazz organization is right now. You
know, I understand you guys areallegedly dangling Larie Markingen and essentially kind of

(01:26:33):
want to be in the best positionfor next year's draft, which appears to
be stronger, and if you endup getting with picks and you end up
getting a star, you need piecesto complement that star. And I think
that's what Cody Williams long term wouldbe able to do better than what a
Dalton Connect does. I think DaltonConnect I didn't think he would slide that

(01:26:58):
far, but he is a plugand play guy. But in the sense
that plug and play for Utah doesn'tultimately move the new like I think it
like I think you would want itto, and you gotta, unfortunately,
have to bottom out to get greatagain, like what Oklahoma City did.
So like uh, Connect would havebeen there and he probably would have scored
some points, but would it havehelped you in the long run, I

(01:27:20):
don't know, because now you're gonnasee even in the situation with the Lakers,
Connect role connects role excuse me,is gonna be like demitted. He's
gonna have to stand the corners andhave to play off off of guys.
And I mean, you can't askfor a better player to playoff than Lebron
James. But I think for forUtah, they made the right choice.
Maybe you could have went with Bozellisif you felt like his upside was a

(01:27:44):
little stronger, but I would I'mpro young guy in that situation, especially
on the team that has like uncertaintyas far as like are we gonna go
for with Laurie A, We're gonnatrade him not. I mean, that's
where you and Iowa line, aswe've established over the last couple month talking
about prospects. Let's talk about IsaiahCollier. This is a guy that I

(01:28:04):
asked you once and for people listening, we do a lot of podcasts together,
so this is these are conversations we'vealready had. But I said,
what's the difference between Isaiah Collier andStephan Castle? Other than Stephan Castle's a
little bigger because if you were tolook at Castle in the role he played
at Yukon, obviously you can projectand be more on ball, have more

(01:28:26):
talent to demonstrate than he was ableto do at Yukon. But Isaiah Collier
was thrust in the opposite situation wherehe had the ball and his two guard
didn't really pass, so he didn'tvery pass very much. His team didn't
shoot well. They're both deficient shooters, but if you actually boil down the
stats, call your shooting numbers,his driving numbers are off the charts good.
Each was a seventy three percent finisherof layups, which is unbelievables for

(01:28:48):
a six or four guard. Andthe Jazz took that player who was a
number one recruit out of high school, albeit in a not very good recruiting
class, at number one, sorry, a number two nine when he was
a number one recruit. What doyou make of that pick? And maybe
he can help the Jazz be oneof those pieces to elevate you to the
higher level like you talked about Oka. See, they've had to hit on

(01:29:10):
some drafts, but they're not allsexy picks at number two like chat Holmgrin.
Sometimes it's twelve Jalen Williams. Sometimesit's second rounders that they've just extended,
like Isaiah Joe or Aaron Wiggins.So tell me what your thoughts on
Isaiah Collier because I'm pretty high onhim. I had twelve on my big
word for the listeners. Yeah,and to get him at twenty nine,
who probably had, like I mean, if it wasn't for the Bug Carrington

(01:29:33):
push, he may have gone inthat same situation to Washington. But like
to get him at twenty nine.You really can't ask for a better opportunity
for actually him and really the organization, because he has a lot of talent,
big strong guard, he gets downhill. I think his best plays are
made when he gets downhill. Andif you are able to keep orfure,

(01:29:56):
if you decide to keep lowry himand lower pick and roll, is to
make everyone around them better because withNBA spacing and a knocked down sutar like
Larry markin and like, that's whenyou really get to see the best of
Isaiah Callier, and you automatically haveto think that the chip on his shoulder
is humongous because there's no way thathe personally thinks that there are twenty eight

(01:30:17):
guy better than him or in thatdraft, and you know you may have
it. He may think he shouldhave went number one, as most of
these kids do. So like you'vegot a really really good piece there,
and he should be able to playalongside Kyante or be that guy off the
bench who you know provides a differentspeed to help speed up things because you

(01:30:40):
do have some young athletes like TaylorHendrix. So I really like to pick.
Like I said, I thought Miamiwould have been an option for him
at fifteen, but they decided togo with klil War, but to get
him at twenty nine, like Idon't. I think it's a great opportunity
for both sides. And then theirlast pick at thirty two, James,
they go with duke center Kyle Philipowskior Flip as they call him. I

(01:31:08):
think that's good value. Another guythat that's good value for because this is
a guy at least at least atthe end of the college basketball season,
a lot of people, Uh,there's a lot of people that saw him
as a potential first round guy.To get him in the second round,
I think it is pretty good value. And I think that he would be
able to provide some push to aguy like Walker Kessler who had a down

(01:31:29):
second year, to maybe be forthe coaching staff to be like, hey,
you got to improve because we gotthis young guy coming up behind you.
Yeah. And again, you know, I wasn't the highest on Philipowski,
and it wasn't because he is intalent. It's just where he was
projected to go. But again,if you get somebody in particular big that
can potentially shoot, potentially passed,potentially put the ball on the ground and

(01:31:51):
you get him at thirty two,Like, you can't really ask for much
better for for a fan base inthe front office, and as far as
like putting pressure on Walker, ifnothing else, he should be a change
of pace from what Walker Kesler doesprovide. So like coming into the draft,
you know there were comparisons to Kellyolennok Or I thought at some point

(01:32:14):
he's not the he's not as quick, but he does have some ability to
put the ball on the ground likea nas Red when nas Reed went undrafted
because people just kind of overthought hissituation. He was a tweener and he
didn't shoot the ball as well.Maybe you get something similar in Kyle Filapowski.
And if nothing else is to changethe pace from when Kesler does check
out, because now you got topotentially a pick and pop big or another

(01:32:36):
big that can initiate offense. Soyeah, again, Kyle Philipowski at like
fourteen, I wasn't okay with it, But Kyle Philipowski at thirty two,
You'll absolutely take that. And againnow you have you can give defenses a
different look instead of shuffling in thesame guy. So now you have the
game plan for the rim, runningbig and also you have the game plan

(01:32:59):
for the stretch big who can potentiallypass as well. Yeah, I echo
your thoughts entirely about Philipowski. Iwas never very high on him, had
thirty five on my board, andso at thirty two I'm perfectly content as
opposed to taking him in the lotteryas he was projected. I've got a
question, speaking of the lottery andalluding to something you just mentioned. We
talked about Lowry Mark and you saidthe Jazz are dangling him right now,

(01:33:19):
which the Jazz vehemently we're against throughoutmuch of this process. But mckel Bridges
yields four first round picks and Lowryhas been an All star, Bridges has
not. I think they're comparable players, but Lowry markin will get a haul.
But what I'm going to ask you, as THEFT Draft expert twenty twenty
five is a tauted class. Thereare a lot of players that are to

(01:33:40):
be excited about. Give give abrief breakdown on a few of those guys
that Jazz fans who are like myselfthinking the Jazz might want to invest in
the future as opposed to the present. Give them something to be hopeful about
and maybe watch a little film onall right, So if you don't know
who Cooper Flag is, you shouldimmediately when you finish listening to this go

(01:34:00):
find out who Cooper Flag is.Yes, please go educate yourself on Cooper
Flag. He he looks the part. He plays extremely hard, and he
has athleticism, motor and the skillset is developing. And he is the
reason well he was one of themain reasons why cards are being shuffled right

(01:34:21):
now. Ace Bailey is a verytalented player. He is going to Rutgers
alongside with I think the number threeplayer in this class ranking to be wrong.
But they have another guy, DylanHarper, the son of Ron Harper.
I don't know how he is perceivedin Utah since the Bulls did beat
Jazz that talk about that a goodconversation down We can atone for that because

(01:34:49):
his son is a six to fivepoint guard left handed, he can shoot.
Uh. There are other guys,but like this particular draft, it
looks like it's the one and throwout a name out there. We know
that in this particular draft there werewhat three guys in the top ten drafted
from France. Four in the personround, they got a French point guard

(01:35:12):
named Nolan Trejor t r A Or E. I don't speak French,
and my French has improven with allthese French guys being drafted, but he
could potentially go number two. Andyes, and if teams passed on him
and you get the opportunity to takehim in Utah, you absolutely should take

(01:35:32):
him because him and Kiante George wouldfeed families. Yeah, and I would
think that this iteration of the Jazzwould would not pass on a potential great
point guard. Like back in theday we had we had Gordy Chiese in
with us. He was an assistantcoach, one of the lead assistants for
Jerry Sloan, and he worked outall the draft prospects and he likes to

(01:35:55):
tell the story of working out TonyParker twice and the Jazz passing on him
anyway. So I would think thatin this new regime of the Utah Jazz,
if they get a chance to workout and they're in the range to
be able to take Trey Arra,and I think that they would remember what
happened with Tony Parker and maybe notmake that miss same mistake twice. James

(01:36:16):
he has the ability and the speed, maybe not as fat as Tony Parker
is a he was about five speed. He has four out of five speed,
but he's six three six' four, so he's taller. And if
you again, if you're have anopportunity, just go look and see what
he did at the Nike Global Games. He basically dominated and he's been playing

(01:36:40):
well and I'm surprised he's not playingfor France in the Olympics right now at
eighteen years old. But he islegit and if you if he's there,
that's the guy you should take.I mentioned him when when Gordy was in.
He had a list of five andI was the one he left out,
and I was like, oh,we got to talk about him because
he turns a corner and gets tothe rim and you're like, oh my

(01:37:02):
goodness, he's there in a splitsecond. And then he's also got the
size and vision. He played inthe Hoop Summit, which is where Nikola
Jokic and Jamal Murray actually kind ofcame into prominence. Obviously, Jokic fell
to forty first, but Murray wasa well known prospect, one MVP of
the Hoop Summit, and this guywas unbelievable. All the attention was all
in the American players, the trioand maybe even VJ. Edgecomb, Wh's

(01:37:24):
from the Bahamas and he's playing aBaylor. But I looked at him and
I was like, well, thatguy I'd never seen, but he's unbelievable.
So I think behind Cooper Flag,he's my number two. And that's
only because Flag's big and that's justwhat's hitting in the modern NBA right now.
But Troy might be a little bitmore polished at this age, and
he's still got a plenty of upside. So that's why I'm so adamant the

(01:37:45):
Jazz look toward the future, investin the future, and become one of
these powerhouses. So I can celebratethe Utah Jazz. You guys can celebrate
the Utah Jazz being a contender,not a play in contender. Hey,
look the way that the West islooking even before you know, those older
teams look old, and the Clippers, who knows what's gonna happen. They

(01:38:09):
really need healthy Kawhi because they lostPaul George. The Warriors don't look good.
So I mean, I would wantthe Jazz as an honorary Jazz fan
because of my friend leave here.I would want them to not try to
take that bait and think about thenext season, because the next season,
those those teams are going to beeven older. So you can catch it.

(01:38:31):
You can catch it in about twothree years and be like, hey,
we look like the new Oklahoma CityThunder a couple of pieces away.
Yeah, that's the model for sure. That that the jazz and the Jazz
front office I'm sure is trying tofollow, and jazz fans are certainly looking
at as the hope for their futurethat maybe they can be the next Okay,
see James, tell tell us whatyou got going on on the pod

(01:38:54):
and how what's the best way tofor our listeners to tune in? So
myself leaf sometimes my brother and RichardStayman, we are on the NBA Locked
on NBA Big Board podcast. We'reon their at least in season five days
a week. We talk about everything. Sometimes we don't agree, but me

(01:39:15):
and Leif kind of have the samephilosophy, but at the same time,
it's still fun to disagree. Andyou know, I'm not afraid to give
my opinion, Lease not afraid togive his opinion, and if not,
you can find me on They callit X now I won't ever call it
X, but I am draft junkieJames on ACT If you would like to
follow me, I try to tweetabout basketball stuff, so that is where

(01:39:38):
I am. Great stuff, James, Thanks for hopping on. We'll have
to do this again sometime, man. Have a good rest of your day.
Thank you for having met James Barlowwalcked on NBA Big Board podcast Get
It wherever you get your podcasts.Leif is also prominently featured on that show
as one of the regular co hoststhat podcast. It sounds like a fun

(01:40:01):
guy to interact with. Certainly somesome good insights on next year's draft to
look forward to if you're a Jazzfan, and hopefully after hearing all that,
the way you and you and hewere talking about some of the guys
not named Cooper Flag, especially Trore, I mean that that makes me,
and I think it probably makes alot of our listeners who are jazz fans

(01:40:23):
go, Yeah, you know what, maybe trading Lowry wouldn't be the worst
thing in the world. Yeah.I mean I was listening to him talk
and I knew he was gonna gothere because we'd very briefly spoken about Troy
before, and I just started smilingin here, like I know, I
saw the smile that the guy onthe guy, the guy is unbelievable Trore
and that's like supposed to be fifth. I have him too, but he's

(01:40:46):
supposed to be fifth. That showshow good the class is. Like the
Rutgers guys are going to be awesometo watch Cooper flag. And then there's
another guy that we haven't even mentionedhim, common Maloloch who's seven foot two
from Sudan and he's playing on Dukenext year next to Cooper Flagg in the
same front court. So there's mesome teams Duke and Rutgers to watch these
prospects, and the Jazz fans mightas well familiarize themselves right now with those

(01:41:09):
guys and hopefully find them in Jazzuniform soon. Absolutely. On the other
side, we're going to talk aboutUtah football. The preseason poll for the
Big twelve Media Days is out.Utah's number one. Who's right behind him?
And how big a gap is therebetween Utah and some of these other

(01:41:29):
teams we'll talk we'll get into thatalso. Morgan Scally, the big news
from yesterday his coach and waiting titlehas been reinstated, so he is now
back to being the all but guaranteedguy to take over for Kyle Whittingham if
and when he retires or or whenhe leaves the program for good in the
next maybe couple of years. Sowe'll break that down for you next here,

(01:41:54):
as we're about twenty twenty five minutesleft here of the show, we're
just calling it the Midday Show fornow, as wedge the gap between the
Bill Riley Show and the Sean O'ConnellShow, which starts on Monday, July
eighth. I'm James Peterson. That'sLeaf too. Leen More next right here
on Utah's number one sports talking homeof the Utes, ESPN seven hundred and

(01:42:14):
no. Starting to wind down theshow. Here we go until about two

(01:42:35):
o'clock. It's just the Midday Showfor now. Where the nameless Midday Show.
James Peterson, Leaf too. Leen. I shouldn't even give our names,
we should we just should just bethe nameless host of the name was
Midday Show. Maybe that's what Porterand I will be tomorrow. Shoot,
I just gave names again here aswe as the Bill Riley Shows in our

(01:42:57):
rearview mirror. It's super weird tonot have Bill doing a show every day
on this station anymore. But weare so excited leaf to UH to bring
back Sean O'Connell. And is heplaying in Wimbledon. O'Connell Australia is playing
right as I talk about Sean O'Connellstarting the on mid days with he's got
a crafty one handed backhand. I'dlike to hit hit it on the courts

(01:43:19):
with him. So he we alreadyknow he's a versatile athlete because he played
college football and he's an MMA champion, million dollar prize winner and m m
A in the PFL who he callsfights for now, I didn't know he
could play tennis at Wimbledon. Leaf. I'm no longer the top dog at
the station on a tennis court.This is horrible now that I believe,

(01:43:42):
Oh that's Christopher O'Connell. Okay,common mistake, common misconception Wimbledon on the
TV. We haven't really even mentionedthat. Maybe we'll get into your maybe
just a couple of guys you thinkmight be able to can win this Wimbledon
Leaf at towards the end of thissegment here. But first one. We
do want to talk about Utah beingpicked number one in the media poll to

(01:44:05):
win the Big twelve, something weexpected before that, though, I want
to tell you Imagine Dragons has addeda third show day in October at the
Utah First Credit Union Amphitheater out inWest Valley. That's the one that used
to be called Usana if anyone's confused, it's the one in West Valley.
It's now Utah First Credit Union Amphitheater. They'll be there October eleventh, twelfth,

(01:44:28):
and the fifteenth. Now listen allweek around four o'clock to the Drive
with Spence checkets. He and Porterwill give away a pair of tickets all
week and details on that go tothe website ESPN seven hundred sports dot com.
And then we just talked about theBig twelve Media Day poll. Big
twelve Media Days start a week fromtoday Tuesday, July ninth, go through

(01:44:53):
July Wednesday, July tenth. We'vegot a ton of sponsors. We really
appreciate all of these guys for supportingour Big twelve Media Days coverage. Starting
next week, We've got Chipman Roofingon board, Advance Window Products, Nate
Orchards, Company, Silverton Casino Lodge, Las Vegas, where I stayed just
barely for the draft. Great placeto stay and it's a little off beat

(01:45:15):
compared to the rest of Vegas.If you're if you're not in for the
classic Vegas strip kind of partying,kind of style of Vegas. If you
want it to be a little morelow key, Silverton Casino Lodge is your
place to go. Clearwater Distilling.You know about those guys, Les Schwab
Tires, They're the sponsor of thisshow. They'll continue to be the show
sponsor when it's the Sean O'Connell showas well Big Willie's Bar, bout Time

(01:45:40):
Pub and Grub, Overtime Cards andCollectibles, alvi Armani our opening segment sponsor
here in the middays and Utah ToyotaDealers, Spence, checke Its and OC.
Sean O'Connell will be live from AllegianceStadium next week on the ninth and
tenth in Las Vegas, anchoring ourBig twelve Media Days coverage here on your
with the UTESPN seven hundred and ninetytwo to one FM and speaking of that

(01:46:03):
leaf, Utah number one in theBig twelve Media Poll but not by much.
Kansas State seventeen points like voting pointsoff of them sitting at number two,
and they only got one lass firstplace vote. It goes to show
you that we expected Utah to probablybe on top of this poll, but
it goes to show you that thepeople who cover the Big twelve are really

(01:46:27):
high on Kansas State as well.Yeah, I think that was the top
two. I think it's a clearcut and that and people may be against
that because Oklahoma State has a longtenured Mike gunn To who's been there as
long as WIT's been at the U, and they've got a really veteran team
coming back similar to Utah and anelite running back who's going to be a
Heisman front runner. But I thinkUtah and Kansas State are the class of

(01:46:48):
the Big twelve. I think they'reclearly the best teams. And Utah fans.
I know, if you're listening tothis, you probably don't need to
be excited, But I got somestats for you. I love statistic let's
hear. I do stats for theJazz. So these are some stats that
aren't crazy because you guys may knowthem but may have forgotten them. But
this will get you excited. KyleWhittingham often runs the ball, and I
think people have been like, oh, let's throw the ball. This might

(01:47:10):
be the year. And Bill Riley'sbeen saying this that the hashtag throw game,
as he calls it, is goingto be used. Cam Rising.
The last year he started the entireseason, twenty twenty two, the Utes
averaged thirty nine points per game.So Utah is known for their defense.
Well, wait a minute, thirtynine points, that's gonna be the best
offense in the Big Twelve. Theyalso that year did not have Brant Keithy.

(01:47:32):
That was Dalton Kincaid's emergency. Well, Keithy's back. Dorian Singer,
when he was at Arizona, wasAll Conference receiver in a conference that is
known for having an air raid offense. As elite receivers think about USC and
all the guys they produced, well, he was better transferred to USC and
was among the very best. Theyalso didn't have a running back that was

(01:47:53):
great at that year, and theystill ran the ball fifty to fifty.
This year, I think with McKay, Bernard, Jalen Glover, those guys,
I think it's gonna be fifty fiveto forty five in favor of the
passing game. But the stats thirtynine points per game last year twenty three
points per game? What inspires faithoh Morgan Scalley. Morgan Scalley is the
head coach in waiting. We mentionedthat he had his title reinstated. Well,

(01:48:16):
they were still in a position inorder to win the conference prior to
all the injury bug getting a littletoo severe, and they were tied twenty
eight a piece with the best teamin the Pac twelve, the runner up
Nashley Washington Huskies. And the defenseis going to be arguably as good as
maybe better, Lander Barton, allthese stars coming back, and I have

(01:48:38):
a thirty nine point per game offensewith more weapons and a seventh year starting
quarterback. I think Utah should expectto be a representative in the college football
Playoff in their first year in theBig twelve and deserved that top spot.
And I like Kansas State, butthirty nine points per game and unbelievable balance,
that's what to expect should be aplayoff team. And I'm not even

(01:48:58):
a Utah fan, so this isnot home speaking the Jazz. I'm a
Homer, I'll admit it, butI'm a Stanford fan, Will Will I
basically have cried about games. UtahI think should be the favor in the
Big Twelve and should have a byein the College Football Playoff. Completely agree
Kansas State, though I don't.I think there's a bigger gap than what

(01:49:20):
the voting shows there is. Theonly seventeen voting points between these two.
Only one first place won't vote betweenthese two in the poll. I think
that on the field, Utah isfarther ahead than that of Kansas State,
but that doesn't mean on any givenSaturday. They won't have to play until

(01:49:40):
the Big Twelve championship game, whichvotes well for Utah, But that doesn't
That doesn't mean that on any givenSaturday and in the Big Twelve championship game,
Kansas State can't beat this Utah team. They are certainly capable of winning
this conference almost as much as Utahis. But I'm with you. I
agree with those two at the top. I agree the top five. Let

(01:50:02):
me just name this top five foryou here. Utah Kansas State basically neck
and neck. A little bit fartherbehind in the voting. At three Oklahoma
State and they're they're a little bitthey're a little bit more neck and neck
with Kansas and Arizona. That's yourtop five in the media poll. I
you said you said earlier, Lee, if you think that those three are

(01:50:26):
closer, Oklahoma State is closer tothose other two in the top five,
Kansas and Arizona, than they areto Kansas State and Utah. I tend
to agree with that. I thinkthere's a group it. I think that
they're a good grouping there. Ifyou're trying to group teams as as far
as how good they are together,I think those three are kind of at
the same level. Utah is probablyat their own level. Kansas State is

(01:50:48):
just underneath that. But I can'tdisagree with this top five. I think
maybe if I'm gonna quibble with one, it might be Iowa State instead of
Arizona. But I would keep theother four in. I think the other
four are securely in, especially ifJalen Daniels, the Kansas is Great quarterback,

(01:51:09):
is able to stay healthy this year. Yeah, I think Lance Leipold's
building a good program there. Youmentioned Arizona, and people that are listening
to this probably watched Arizona thump Utahspast year. Well, they lost Jed
Fish. Yes they kept Fifita,Yes they kept McMillan. It's hard to
sustain without the coach who brought thatculture. So I'm a little out on
Arizona. I think Iowa State,West Virginia, and UCF, who are

(01:51:30):
six, seven and eight respectively,are on the same playing field as Arizona,
and I don't think the gap between. I think Oklahoma state's probably a
I think if there's a two teamfirst tier and that's Utah and then Kansas
State, and I think Utah's better, but I think they belong on the
same tier. And then I thinkthere's a single tier as the second tier,
and that's Oklahoma State. Then Ithink there's a five five team next

(01:51:53):
session and that would be the Kansaswould be my favorite there and then I
would go Iowa State. I wouldgo West Virginia, then Arizona, then
UCF and UCF the ultimate dark horsebecause they have a ton of talent.
The transfer portal has been lucrative forthose in central Florida. You got a
national championship winning coach right Chiswick wasthe auburyship coach with with Auburn with Cam

(01:52:15):
Newton. It was a while agonow, but that's still a proven coach.
I would not be surprised whatsoever ifthey infiltrate the top four of the
Big twelve because they just have ahot bit of talent and a proven commodity
at coach. And that's as simpleas it gets. And then you look
at the quarterbacks. We haven't reallymentioned that many. I mean, I
think Daniels might be the most individuallytalented. Then they're should do at at
Colorado. But cam Rising is aproven winner. Avery Johnson has talent at

(01:52:39):
Kansas State. But yet you gottahave near the top two last year.
And but I think cam Rising isclearly the one that you would you'd want
to go to war with of thisgroup, and I think you you really
build off of that, Like OllieGordon of Oklahoma State might be the most
nationally impressive player statistically, but youyou need a quarterback. And then you

(01:53:00):
look at the defense. We talkedabout offense, thirty nine points a game
is something you could expect defensively,I think it's Utah, Kansas State,
and Oklhoma State top three, andI don't think anyone else is close.
I agree BYU by the way,in it thirteen not the worst. There
are sixteen teams in the league startingnext year. ASU was voted last number
sixteen BYU thirteen. I think weboth agree that that's probably right for the

(01:53:27):
vote, but they probably we couldboth see them getting closer to the top
ten as far as the final standingsin the Big twelve, but somewhere between
ten and thirteen is probably about right. So I can't really quibble with thirteenth
in the media poll so far.And then real quick, gotta mention this
the big breaking news yesterday you mentionedit being a when you talked about Utah's

(01:53:51):
defense being a hope for the futureof this program and this season. Morgan
Scalley, the defensive coordinator, isthe head coat in waiting that's been reinstated
that title and he's going to getwith the new contract he signed yesterday,
or at least that was announced thathe signed yesterday, five million. He'll
get five million dollars starting starting salarywhen he becomes head coach if he's elevated

(01:54:15):
at the end of this year,and it tops out at almost five and
a half million dollars in four years. So if it's if he starts his
head coach next year. That'd beby twenty twenty eight, almost five and
a half million dollars for reference.WIT's making five million right now after twenty
years. So big news there,And as you said, Leaf, that
bodes well for the future because weknow that's a constant at Utah and it's

(01:54:39):
been basically because of Morgan Scaley's leadershipas head coach, as the head coach
of the defense, if you will, the defensive coordinator at Utah. He
is going to be head coach inwaiting once again, and he'll be the
head coach when Kyle Whittingham is doneat the University of Utah. We got
a head to a break and wehave We've got topical trivia with you or

(01:55:00):
for you. On the other side, We've got two tickets to the Ultimate
Sports Bash that's a sports expo goingon at the Mountain America Expo Center next
week. And then two tickets tosee post malone September eighth. Posty coming
to Utah First Credit Union Amphitheater inSeptember. Two tickets to give away to
those two events. On the otherside in topical trivia, this is we're

(01:55:23):
just calling it the midday Show.The Nameless Midday Show here on ESPN seven
hundred and ninety two, just aminute or so left of We're we're calling
it the Nameless Midday Show for nowwith your nameless hosts James Spearson, Lee
twe here. Who's porter walked in? Was that porter that gave our names

(01:55:48):
away? Come on now? Definitelynot the three time Sports Broadcast with you
at future. Come on, We'recoming for Bill's titles here he's gone.
Now we're coming for all of themnow Bill Riley's show in the rearview mirror.
But we're so excited to welcome inSean O'Connell. Welcome in back to
the station. The Sean O'Connell Showwill debut next Monday, July eighth.

(01:56:12):
You got me and Leif for today, We've got a couple of prizes for
you here. We're gonna continue tocall a topic trivia at least for today.
Two tickets to the Ultimate Sports Bash. Brian Russell and Greg Oster Tag
will be there, mingling with fans. It's kind of fan x ish for
but just sports related. And thenCam Rising and Britain Covey will be there

(01:56:35):
representing the University of Utah and theCrimson Collective, mingling with fans, signing
autographs, those kind of things.That's going on on the twelfth and thirteenth
at Mountain America Expo Center. Thenwe've got two tickets to see Post Malone
on September eighth at the Utah FirstCredit Union Amphitheater out in West Valley.
To the first person to Texas onthe dish pros text line, the answer

(01:57:00):
to this trivia question, which is, we had Gordy Chisa on. Man,
we we were going with something elsethough, weren't we? It was
the Oh that's it. I'm sorrywe had Gordy chias on. Listen to
that. I apologize. We leifand I can't we uh brainstormed about a

(01:57:21):
question we're going with Utah Hockey Clubscheduling question because the schedule is out,
when's the first time Vegas comes totown. Vegas Golden Knights won the Cup
a couple of years ago for thefirst time, and that looks like it's
gonna be the natural rivalry for theUtah Hockey Club. When is the first
game that they will play at theDelta Center, the Vegas Golden Knights against

(01:57:42):
the Utah Hockey Club give us thedate on the dish ros text line eight
seven seven three five three zero sevenhundred and you will win those two tickets
the Ultimate Sports Bash and two ticketsto see post Malone Leif. On the
way out, we didn't talk Wimbledonat all, and I know that pains
you very much. Pains me too, because it's my favorite ten His tournament.
We all know is until Djokovic retires, he's gonna be in the running

(01:58:04):
for just about any major to win. We also know that Carlos al KaAZ
and Jonick Center look like they're gonnatake the reins from Djokovic and be the
generational players of the next generation.And they they're in the running to win
this tournament and just about every tournamentgoing forward. Give me a dark horse,
a guy not named Djokovic, alKarez or Center that you could see

(01:58:26):
winning Wimbledon this year. I thinkthe next guy would pick his Alexander Zaverev,
who lost in the French Open final. He's not good pick. He's
not well suited to grass because hetypically plays very deep in the court,
returns with a lot of spin,but he has a big serve and his
draw lines up pretty well. Iwould say in terms of winning, that's

(01:58:48):
the guy would take. A darkhorse that maybe you'd let fewer players of
fewer listeners know of, would beHuby Horcotch. He's Polish, He's another
good pick. He's a big server, and he is on djokovic side.
Djokovic I think is the most susceptibleof those big three to lose early because
he's coming off of a knee injuryand he hasn't played great in twenty twenty

(01:59:08):
four. Frankly, like, Idon't like him, and I'm not gonna
hide from that, but the statswould bear out he hasn't won a title
and we're more than halfway into thecalendar year, and that's very very rare
for a guy of Novak Djokovic's caliber. So watch for him to fall out.
And if a guy were to usethe opening of the draw, I
think hub Horkatch would be the oneto watch out for. And he's been
a semi finalist at Wimbledon before.Awesome stuff. Continue to watch Wimbledon.

(01:59:32):
That's on ESPN all day, Eurosgoing on on Fox and FS one as
well. Turkey up Nothing one Nothingearly in their match going on on Fox
and FS one. This has beenthe Nameless Midday Show. That's what we've
landed on here as we bridge thegap between the Bill Riley Show and the
Sean O'Connell Show. On July eighthis the first day of Sean O'Connell's show.

(01:59:56):
Porter Larson and I will be inthe airchair tomorrow in the Nameless Midday
Show. From Loving Into Spence andThe Drive are next here on ESPN seven hundred

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}The Full Nameless Mid-Day Show w/@JersyJames23 & @LeifThulin - 7/2/24