Ep. 2 - Abusive Relationships & Discovering Self-Worth | Jenn Kryz

In this episode of “The Bounce Back,” Andrea Vecchio opens up about her experience in an abusive relationship, and talks in depth with friend and domestic violence survivor Jenn Kryz about Jenn’s horrific experiences with abuse. The two talk about the path to finding self-worth and learning to love yourself again.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
BFCB Radio Network, where Real Talklives the mission we hold Back. Then

(00:27):
I'm Andrea Echio. You're listening toThe bounce Back the podcast. If we
can change one person's life for thebetter by sharing our story, then it's
a story worth telling. Life isa mixed bag and there's so much of
the good stuff all around us,but it's the failure, pain and setbacks
that can make us feel stuck.The teachable moments come from how we bounce

(00:49):
back from our struggles. You're aboutto listen to an incredible story and lessons
learned from the bounce Back. Today'sguest on The bounce Back entered my life
at a time when I was onthe precipice of being broken. She didn't
know that at the time, andwhile she doesn't have her degree in psychology,
she's certainly earned life's PhD on theanatomy of a breakdown, the will

(01:11):
to bounce back, and the giftof influencing many others through the life coaching.
She does in a dark room ona bike that technically goes nowhere,
but is really taking its rider onone heck of a journey. I wrote
about this woman who eventually became afriend. In chapter ten of my book
Livir Playlist, the chapter is calledEminem told Me not to quit. Here's

(01:36):
an excerpt from that chapter. Thefirst time I started working out to Eminem's
music was during my cycling classes.I found a place that I love to
work out called Cycle, and Cyclewasn't just a workout, it was mental
and physical therapy. It was likechurch for the body and soul. My
instructor, Jen, who eventually becameone of my most cherished friends, was

(02:00):
kick ass in every way. Jenstood at six feet tall, with a
bodylike Sigourny weavers, but with biggerboobs. Her dark hair was chin length
and always pulled back in a bandanna, and her voice was powerful. Jen
got up on her bike in frontof us sold out class and motivated us
as if we were riding to thepromised Land. The room was dark,

(02:23):
with a few dim lights and candlesburning and aromatherapy scent of eucalyptus. Jen
talked about coming to class with anintention for our lives, and she encouraged
us to push ourselves to our limitand then push a little harder. Jen
reminded us that our bodies were amazingtools. Capable of doing things we didn't

(02:44):
think were possible if we could beopen to change. And she talked about
making positive changes every day, nomatter how big or small. Jen told
us that sweat cleanses the parts ofour bodies that a shower can't reach.
I'm just going to go off scripthere because I love that. I want
to say it again that Jen toldus sweat cleanses the parts of our bodies

(03:07):
that a shower can't reach. Ithink about that every time I'm sweating,
and I don't really want to be. As a studio full of riders pedaled
to the beat of the music,which drenched our bodies and we had fire
burning in our legs, Jen wouldyell out I didn't say it would be
easy. I said it would beworth it. She was right. The

(03:30):
ride wasn't easy. I was physicallyexhausted, and at that time in my
life, I was mentally drained.But with each pedal stroke and drip of
sweat, I became stronger and Istarted cleaning out all of the negativity in
my heart and mine. Jen Krizis the owner of Cycle in Cleveland,

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Ohio. She's a coach, mentor, and cheerleader to the many who seek
her influence on a bike. Jenis able to inspire because she comes from
a place of depth and experience.She's a survivor of domestic abuse, and
today we will thoroughly tackle the topicof self worth and how to bounce back

(04:14):
from repeating our unhealthy choices. Jen, Welcome to the bounce Back. Thank
you for having me. I rememberthe first time I rode in one of
your classes, and I had kindof dabbled in cycling, and you may
remember this. It was it wasThanksgiving Day. I remember my sister Kathleen

(04:34):
was in from out of town,and she was an avid cycler, like
she went as often as she could, and we were determined that because we
were going to eat so much,we needed to get a good workout.
And I had recently met you throughmy television talk show at the time,
and I couldn't. I mean,it was Thanksgiving Day, of course,

(04:54):
that's today. Everybody wants to burncalories. And I sent you a message
like any chance you can get usin, which you did did. And
I had never been to a classlike that before. I mean, I
had gone to cycling, and Iwas like, oh, I sweat a
little bit like under my armpits.Right, I was soaked. I kept
saying I'm gonna die, I'm gonnadie, I'm gonna die. And I

(05:14):
looked at my sister like a fewtimes, like what the hell are we
doing? And at the end ofit, she looked at me. My
sister looked at me and she said, you know, this is where you
need to keep coming. I thinkJen, like you're What was so special
about you, aside from the factthat you push people physically, is that
you really challenge people to think mentally. You're really a sole preacher up there

(05:39):
on the bike, and I youknow, when you can speak to people
and communicate in a way that reallyinspires and motivates them when they think they
can't push themselves any harder. Areyou planning out what you want to say?
Or would you call that like God, God, the universe or divine
intervention when you get on a bikeand start talking right, Well, first

(06:00):
of all, soul preacher, I'mgetting a T shirt that says that.
For sure, I'm going to doa hashtag. Hashtag soul preacher. That's
my new call me. You know, it really depends. I'll tell you
my best classes where I really feellike I reach people. Are classes where
I am there and I am morethan vulnerable, and it's just coming from

(06:24):
my experiences, whether it be thatday or past experience or something I read.
I pull from so many different venues. It could be from a book
I read, It could be fromsomething on the news I saw, it
could be from a song. Butdefinitely, I think my classes that really

(06:46):
land hardest with people and really makea difference with people are ones where I'm
not pushing. And there are classeswhere I go and I'm like, oh,
you know, what am I goingto talk about today? And I'll
try to find a topic. AndI've learned over past experience that pushing there
probably isn't the right thing to do, because sometimes we don't have something to

(07:06):
say right. Sometimes the best motivationis to let people be within their own
thoughts and push them to and encouragethem to be within their thoughts and maybe
get rid of things that are notserving them. I tell them, you
know, just anything that's not servingyou, get rid of it, put

(07:27):
it on your floor, will mopit away right as much as you can
get rid of in that in thatsixty minutes. Or by the way,
your first class was ninety minutes,which is crazy, just get rid of
it. At that point, Iremember going into your classes because then I
started going regularly. On Thursday night, that was the night I would go,

(07:49):
and I just right in the backof the class. I think,
you know, my life was socenter stage. It was on camera right
where you're putting yourself in front ofpeople to either cheer for you and applaud
you or to tear you down,and because that's just what that's what happens

(08:09):
in life, right. But thenwhen you are doing work that's so public,
that just comes with a territory.I had so many things going on
in my life at that time though, that on those Thursday nights, I'd
either I'd either feel so angry likeI'm riding out like oh gosh, it
was so hard on my body becauseI was so mad about something going on,

(08:30):
or I would just cry because Iwas feeling so broken. So there's
this range of emotions that I rememberwhat happened when I was just, you
know, in on this bike inthe back of the class where nobody could
see me. It's in a darkroom, and I'm riding through a broken
phase or broken time in my lifewhere I just I don't know. I

(08:52):
think I had broken hopes and dreams. Right, there were so many hopes
and dreams that were dying in mylife at that time, And and there
you were up at the front,and I think, I don't think we
can have true wisdom without true experienceof pain. Correct, Okay? Right?

(09:15):
Age? And so while you embodiedthis person who was like, she
has her ship together, well,she knows exactly what she's talking about.
Yeah, my very first Cycle Tshirt on the back side cheaper than therapy.
And I was like, this istrue, because this is what I

(09:35):
would imagine that therapist would be.Like, it was you, but you
were able to be so wise becauseyou had gone through so much in your
own life. Right. You know, I tell my instructors at Cycle all
the time, you know, whatcan I do to increase my class sizer
or you know, take my classfrom one level to another? And I

(09:58):
have thought a lot over the lastten years that I've been teaching, what
makes my class successful? Or why? You know, why do I why
am I drawn to a certain instructorwhen I travel to New York. You
know, there's a couple instructors atNew York that I'm really drawn to and
I really truly believe and came tothe conclusion that what makes a good instructor

(10:26):
as someone who's passionate and who's willingto get up there and be vulnerable,
because I can't get up there andbe you know, rah rah rah.
Everything's wonderful when it's not so Beingtruthful and telling my story, even if
it's tiny little snippets of my story, really I think gets the crowd to

(10:52):
trust you, right, because you'rein it with them, and you being
there that day and or the youknow, that time period, those Thursday
nights or whenever it was, andyou're you know, you're either angry or
you're in pain or you're in agood mood and you're just celebrating. Everyone
else in the room is an exactsame spot that you are, right.

(11:15):
Everyone else is has a story andthey're all there for their healing, whether
it's whether they're in a good partof their handling and they're celebrating that they
got through something or they're just steppinginto it and they don't know where to
turn. But everybody is there,and I think that's what really makes cycle

(11:37):
different because there's no judgment in thatroom, everybody's really working on the inside
and not paying attention, you know, to what you're wearing or what this
person's driving. And you know,I say it to my class all the
time. You come in that roomand show up for someone. And if

(11:58):
you can't show up for yourself thatday, show up for your neighbor.
But in showing up for your neighbor, you're showing up for yourself, because
that's where it all starts. Thathas to start, has to self work
and self worth and self love.And at fifty one, it took me
fifty one years to learn that.Oh my gosh, I think we're always

(12:18):
still learning. But let's then let'sgo there, right because I think UM,
our story begins with the foundation,right at the beginning starts with the
foundation. So let's go back tothe beginning for you. What what was
your childhood like my child I grewup in Strongsville. UM. I have

(12:39):
an older brother and a younger sister. All three of us are very close,
and UM and my parents were together. You know, we lived in
the suburban home, walk to school. I had a super happy childhood,
UM up until you know, eveneven even in my even in my preteen
years Um, my relationship with myfather started to struggle, and I always

(13:03):
wondered why that was. Now thatI'm a parent and an adult and you
know, work on communicating with people. Some people are a better communicator as
than other, I do realize andfeel sorry for the fact that he really
struggled with communicating with me once Ihit puberty. He was an incredible father,
and he was really an incredible fatherup until the day he died,

(13:26):
but he fathered differently. He wasthe best dad he knew how to be
when we hit puberty. It washe was at every game. That's how
he showed his love. It wasn'tspending time really having these deep conversations with
me like my mom would. Itwas his way of being a parent,
and as a parent. Now Iappreciate that and I'm grateful to him for

(13:50):
that so well. I think,you know, parents serve different roles,
right, I mean, I thinkin my own life, my mom initially
would be the one where you havethe like deep conversation with right, I
got my period, let's talk,right, this friend is being's being nasty,
right, And that's where you havelike the car rides with your mom

(14:11):
and um, there are those morelike touchy peely conversations and you know,
dads, it was like I needmoney or right, it isn't it funny
with your mom? I remember,I vividly remember, and I remember my
daughter Kennedy going through this. Iremember thinking I don't want to talk to
her about this, mostly like injunior high in high school, because she's

(14:33):
going to tell me something and damnit if it doesn't always come true,
because she knows. How does sheknow? So I don't even want to
know. I don't want her totell me what's going to happen because because
I don't want, I don't wantto know that that's what's going to happen
because I know what she's gonna say. Yeah, exactly, I know,
right, But they they were usat one point time, right, I

(14:56):
feel like, oh, they don'treally know, right. I remember when
I was god, I don't know, maybe sixteen, I had a high
school boyfriend. I was like,mom, I don't worry, I'm not
going to have sex till I getmarried. I'm sure she was like great,
she thought that sounded great. Thenshe probably told my dad that night
and he was like, oh,good, good, right, and what

(15:22):
we think, like, oh,they are not hip to any of the
things that are going on in ourlives. But they are. But back
to the point where like parents,they sometimes can fill a different role,
right They they work a narrative thatthey were comfortable with. And so for
your dad showing up to games,which was important, absolutely, it was

(15:45):
his way of saying, I'm here, I support you. And that's a
lot of games. Three kids,all in different sports, it's a lot
of games. It's a lot ofeffort, even away games. So that
relationship with your dad, was italways strong or was they or a period
of time where you feel like itwavered or it broke down. I really
felt and still feel like when Ihit puberty, he really struggled to communicate.

(16:10):
I remember being in the car withhim, and I still to this
day remember it being an uncomfortable silence. You know, sometimes with people that
you love, there's a comfortable silence, and for me, it was an
uncomfortable silence with him. So,you know, throughout my junior high and

(16:32):
my senior high, my high schoolyears, I struggled with him, and
I remember when I graduated, heasked me to go on a trip with
him, he was a CFO andhe was going out to Stanford in California.
Never been out there, so heflew me out. He had been

(16:52):
out there for a couple of weeks. He flew me out and we had
an incredible time. I mean Isnippets of that. We were at Huntington
Beach, um, we really wentup and down the coast. It was
really an incredible trip. I rememberas when I really first drank around my
dad because we were at dinner withall his you know, cronies, and
they're all like, oh, gether a beer. And of course the

(17:15):
waitress was dead on that. She'slike, she really can't drink, but
it was. It was really kindof camaraderie with him, which I hadn't
ever felt that with him before.So it was such an incredible feeling.
And coming home and coming off ofthat was a huge high, right and
getting ready to go to college,which is a big time in our lives

(17:37):
as as kids, and now seeingwhat Kennedy went through. And Kennedy's your
daughter. Kennedy's my daughter. She'stwenty and she just finished her sophomore year
yesterday at Ohio State. So she'sshe's nat Gobox she is now a junior.
But seeing you know, how shemanaged her summer, her senior year
and her summer, and looking back, you know what, wasn't really that

(18:00):
different. Things have changed, butit wasn't really that. The feelings aren't
that different from then to now.And just having that camaraderie with my dad
was really cool and unfortunately didn't lastthat long, but it was really cool
that period of time with him,and I wouldn't have that. Interestingly enough,
I wouldn't feel that camaraderie with himuntil very later in life because there

(18:26):
was a period of time where hewas not in your life then. Is
that correct? Yes? So whenI was my summer going into college,
my mom worked for the Cleveland Brownsfor many years, which was an incredible
perk for us. But my momwas out. This is when the interneing
camp out it Lakeland Community College.So Nancy was my mom's name is Nancy.

(18:48):
She was out at college and Iwas dating a guy who worked at
the Palmer House. My dad hungout at the Palmer House a lot.
So I want to see Eddie,my boyfriend friend, and he came out
on a break and I'm like,hey, you know, have you seen
my dad and he kind of shuggedme off, and I'm like, have
you seen my dad? And he'slike, well, you know, let's
walk over here. And at thatpoint I saw my dad pull up in

(19:11):
a car with another woman and wassuper hurtful for me. And at eighteen,
I didn't really understand what was goingon. I kind of had a
feeling, you know, I neverreally remember my parents being loving together.
I remember sitting at the top ofthe stairs hearing my parents fight, but

(19:33):
they always really kept it together forus in front of us. But there
was just that feeling like, youknow, I don't ever remember them hugging
or kissing. And yeah, soI saw him pull up in this car
and I gets out and lets thiswoman out and he kisses her, and
I'm like, well, you know, oh my gosh, that's a huge

(19:55):
deal. Yeah, and that Whatdid that make you feel like at that
time when you saw all that,Like you how you're processing and are you
thinking like I don't want this tobe what I think it is? But
yeah, you know it was Idon't want this to be what I think
it is. And what do Ido? You know, what do I
do with this information? Yeah?Because I can't be the reason they break

(20:17):
up, right, me knowing andtelling my mom, Wow, I can't
be you know, my eighteen yearold brain is well, then I'm the
reason they broke up, which reallyis not Yes, no, that's not
true. But I ended up goingto I was very close with Eddie's family.
I went to his house and Icalled my mom's friend who was with
her at training camp, and andtold her. My mom called me back.

(20:41):
I mean, you know, hindsightis twenty twenty now that I'm adult
and I've been through everything that I'vebeen through. My mom knew and she
was very kind to me and obviouslyvery worried about me. But that started
an interesting relationship for the rest ofmy life up until now with my father,

(21:02):
where I really truly believe at somepoint I forgave him, but I
think he really struggled with forgiving himselfand that was what really caused any hardships
in our relationship throughout the next thirtyyears forty years Which parents approval or attention

(21:26):
do you think you craved more yourmom or your dad's. Definitely my mom.
I was very close with my mom. I'm still very close with my
mom. All three of us werereally clear. She was, you know,
just super fun when we were alittle and both my parents, I
mean, I don't get me wrong, my parents raised us to not see

(21:47):
color in people, not see statusin people. They raised us. One
of the things I am so gratefulthat they did for all three of us.
They took us every summer or toanything a baltonwall cedar that they could,
so we were really exposed to thearts and too music and m and

(22:08):
culture, you know. So thatwas something I will always be grateful for.
But my mom especially, you know, my mom is a she's a
I like to say, she's verycrunchy. She's a very different person.
She she reaches out and tries differentthings, very into contradancing or drumming circles.

(22:30):
And she wasn't always that way.I mean, my house was very
codependent. But through all of thisand all of this had happened, my
mom really, through therapy and agroup called Koda, really healed herself through
that. And that was another giftthat I couldn't I couldn't thank her enough

(22:55):
for was then teaching the three ofus how to not be codependent, because
when you're raised in a codependent family, that's all you know, right,
So early on enough, thank god, Nancy learned this and was really vocal
to us about that and would catchherself that she caught herself doing it.

(23:15):
You know, she's older, soit's ingrained in her right her. She
grew up in a codependent family,so that's all she knew. So to
break that cycle and then teach yourkids how not to live that way that
you really grew up with is suchwhat a gift that she gave us,
because that would be very difficult todo. I mean, first of all,

(23:36):
to have the self awareness to knowthat she was that way but didn't
want you to be ya. That'sharder work, right, It's a whole
lot easier to just keep doing whatyou're doing right exactly. And back then,
you know, we're talking eighties,early nineties, it wasn't really talked
about. You know, Melanie Beatywasn't around then, or if she was,
you know, we really didn't readabout her. And my mom really

(23:57):
just immersed herself in this group andbrought a ton away from it that she
taught us and that we have nottaught our children. Right, So you
are given some of these great lessonsand tools by both of your parents.
They that is a marriage that doesn'tlast. They were How old were you

(24:18):
when they got divorced my first yearof college. I mean that that event
was the end, and my dadmoved out and we still saw him,
and but it really did become webecame the parent with him, like we
had to make the effort and goteventually got old. Would you say,
then, when you look at yourhistory of choosing a partner and relationships and

(24:44):
I'm not talking about like the onesyou have a crush on when you're in
elementary school or maybe not even likethe high school boyfriend, right, but
when you start making choices for significantrelationships, would you say, your your
picker. My brother calls it apeople picker. Was it on point or
were you making bad choices? Iwas making bad choices. I was making

(25:06):
bad choices. I I really Ithink for me, I was looking maybe
for that father figure from a securitystandpoint, not his personality as much.
I mean, if anybody met mydad, they would Your dad's a great
Dwayne's a great guy. You know, his head of city club he was.

(25:29):
He was a great guy. Butfor me, my choices and men
became security, and that certainly isn'tthe right reason to marry someone, right,
I have now learned at fifty one, maybe this past year and a
half, I have to rely onmyself for security. Right. It's like

(25:52):
finding happiness within yourself. You haveto find it. Nobody's gonna do that
for you. Just security is kindof the same thing. Right. If
you can find security with you inyourself and believe in yourself that you're going
to be okay, because you're goingto be okay, then that's it's amazing
than how your relationships and people thatyou draw yourself to or you find attractive,

(26:15):
or your relationships change. Even theI'm curious about the part where you
say you were looking choosing men,so maybe even looking for a man who
would provide security and where that comesfrom. Was that as simple as you're
a woman and you're gonna you know, you might work for a little while,
but then you're going to meet aman, you're gonna get married and

(26:36):
he's gonna take care of you.Because it doesn't really sound like how your
mom would think based on what youdescribe, But was that something that was
like ingrained in you or taught toyou? Or told to you when you
were a younger woman. No,you know, in all honesty, nobody's
ever asked me that question. Ithink it was kind of a push and

(26:56):
pull for me. I want tosay I was a super independent woman.
You know. After I had Kennedy, I went back to work right away
and that was my choice. Dave, my first husband, wanted me to
stay home and I did not wantto. I was like, no,
you know, I'm going to getout there. I'm going to be independent.

(27:17):
But I always had that fallback,right, so if something happened,
like the big thing happened, lossof job, I would be okay,
and because he would be there totake care of me, right instead of
thinking I'm gonna be okay, Tragicthings happen in our lives and we are
going to be okay. So Ithink the security standpoint came from that,

(27:45):
and it was always a push andpull with you know, there were three
main men in my life. Twoof them definitely that was the same story
in the same situation, and unfortunatelyboth of them were abusive in their own
different ways. When you first sufferedabuse from a man in your life,

(28:12):
and was that a husband, aboyfriend, someone you were dating. I
would. I would tell you thefirst time I experience that was in college,
my college boyfriend. But it wasn'tphysical. It was mental. It
was mental. It was emotional abuse. And what did it look like?

(28:33):
How did that? What was thatdialogue? Like? Um, I never
did anything right? Why are youso stupid? You know you don't know
what you're talking about? He wouldactually was he was a tall guy,
and he would actually he would shameme a lot. And he would he
had this little stupid step stool thathe would actually get on and point his

(28:56):
finger, shake his finger at mewhile he was yelling at me. What
Yeah, And at the time,you know, I would just you know,
break down in tears. Oh mygosh, you know, because you
cared about him. You cared abouthim, about him, I cared about
his opinion. You know. Icouldn't do the grocery shopping by myself because
I wasn't able to do that.I wasn't smart enough to do that.

(29:18):
I couldn't do this, I couldn'tdo that. Um, And yet I
stayed with him, right, Heactually proposed to me and I was engaged,
and something made me call it off. Yeah, pretty close to the
wedding. But that's so he's puttinghimself on a step stool because he's already

(29:38):
taller. So now he wants tooverpower you even more absolutely and talk down
to you absolutely, and you're tallabsolutely. As I mentioned in the open,
I mean you stand it. Whatabout sixty six? So I mean
there's certainly like um that that's asomebody who wants control of a relationship.
There's a power issue there, right. Did you when he would do those

(30:03):
things, would you fight back likeno, I'm not or would you just
take it? No? I wouldtake it because I really believe at that
time, I didn't really feel likeI had any self worth. You know,
I didn't. I didn't look atmyself and say, wow, you
have all these great attributes. UnfortunatelyI looked at myself like, you know,

(30:25):
oh you have frizzy hair, oryou know, maybe I'm not that
smart or you know, whatever itmight be. Maybe I didn't, you
know, graduate college, and somaybe he's right, maybe I'm not that
smart. I gave him so muchpower. I gave him so much power,
and there would be little times andlittle lights where I would get my

(30:47):
power back. You know, whenI left him, that was getting my
power back, and instead of holdingon to that, I readily gave it
away again, right readily gave itaway again to the same type of person.
And every time you use that phrasetake our power back, or you

(31:08):
could phrase it as you choose yourselfor you stand up for yourself. But
every time we then come back aroundand give it back to that person,
they get even more. Right.So it's that whenever somebody's in a relationship
and they're in an unhealthy relationship andthen they go I'm not taking it anymore,

(31:30):
and you walk away, right,you feel a little bit stronger,
but then something inside of you feelsweak and you go back to that you
give that person even more control andeven more power, and it becomes worse
every time, doesn't it? Absolutely? Absolutely? And you know, I
think with Kennedy's dad, who wasmy first husband, of course, and

(31:57):
I have to say he never wouldhave laid a finger on me, but
he absolutely was emotionally abusive, andhe would get me into these arguments and
instead of walking away like it shouldhave, which would have taken my power
with me, I just handed itover and kept arguing with him, right,

(32:17):
and he would just belittle me,and there was a lot there.
He was, you know, outrunning around, and I remember one situation
where again I really tried to takemy power back. And at this point
in my marriage, I had hadKennedy. She was about too and I

(32:37):
was thinking to myself, Okay,this is not I can't live this way
and I'm gonna have to figure somethingout. And I knew that I could
take care of my daughter, andI I was starting to get that,
Okay, I can do this right, and I wanted to get my tubes
tied. I knew I wanted tohave one child. I have always known

(32:58):
that I wanted to have one child. And he was really upset with me
about that. And he at thattime, which is hilarious because it's not
that long ago, he had tosign a paper to say that he would
agree, Oh yeah, for youto have He had to sign a paper
for you to decide what you weregoing to do with your body. Yes,

(33:19):
yes, which I have. Thatisn't that long ago. Kennedy,
she's twenty okay, so there,yeah, and he wouldn't sign it.
So I went I went back tothe doctor and I said, he's not
going to sign it. I'm stillhaving the surgery, and he's like,
well, you know, we're notgoing to be responsible blood, and I'm
okay, that's okay. And Iremember he took me down to Metro and

(33:40):
he reached across me and opened upthe door and he said, get the
fuck out, and so I gotout and went in. My sister works
at Metro, so she came andmet me, and I had the surgery
done and I came home to mind, you have a two year old who's
crawling all over, all over everything. And when I got home, he
left for a week and left mewith her right after I have this major

(34:06):
surgery. But there's like, that'sa very symbolic moment that the person who
is supposed to be your partner inlife, right, who you share space
with, who you love, becauseI'm guessing there was still some love there
for you, says go do this. This is something important, and I'm
not going to be there for youright, just like throwing you at the

(34:27):
door like yesterday's trash. Yeah,in hindsight is twenty twenty. He is
an alcoholic. He struggles with alcoholismstill to this day. So I understand
there were things there that happened whilehe was drinking, which isn't an excuse,
but I think if I told himtoday some of the things that he

(34:52):
did, if I told him whilehe was sober, he probably wouldn't believe
me. But nonetheless they happen.You know, it was real, It
was my reality, and I finallyagain got the courage to leave. Right.
He wasn't healthy, but then itwas his unhealthy behavior was starting to
make you not so healthy, right, and it was another thing contributing to

(35:17):
your own self worth exactly. Iknow that leads you to another relationship or
maybe a few others along the way. But there was a story that you
told me a long time ago,and it really stands out in my mind
because I think there's a lot totalk to talk about when it comes to
this particular story, and you,I'll lead you into it, but you

(35:39):
may need to set the table alittle bit more. It was a moment
where you had been physically abused bythe person you were in a relationship with.
And I remember you were in thebathroom, maybe even the bathtub,
and your daughter Kennedy was there rightand consoling you. Yeah, I wonder

(36:02):
if you could kind of take usto that moment because I feel like that's
a really significant moment, especially fora woman. And then to have a
daughter, right see what was goingon, and a daughter who was almost
like stepping up like an adult eventhough she was still little, right,
So she did not she didn't seethe abuse, she saw the aftermath of

(36:25):
it. And this person, Um, what's really sad about this is it
occurred during a sexual encounter, andUM, I was shown a gun and

(36:46):
this gun was put in certain placesin my body, and um, it
was a you're not going to fuckwith me basically a situation, right,
and leading up to this, Iwas shown the gun, but you know
he you know he he was exmilitary, He was safe with it.

(37:10):
So it never really, it neveroccurred to me until it started being you're
I'm showing you this because you needto know I have it, right,
not I'm going to use it onyou. But in this in this instance,
that is what happened. It wasimplied, it was applied up until

(37:30):
the point where it happened in thisencounter. And there were other things,
um, from a sexual standpoint thatwe're clearly um disturbing. Did he sexually
abuse you? No, it wasmore rough sex hands around the neck when

(37:52):
I wasn't asking that for that,right, and um, what what you
what you explained with Kennedy occurred afterthis happened, right, And it might
have even been a couple of daysafter that happened. I remember I was
in the bathtub and at that moment, I was like, I have to

(38:15):
leave, I have to I haveto leave. And I remember she was
sitting on the toilet and I saidto her, I said, you know,
um, we're gonna need to move. And she said, it's okay,
Mommy, I understand it's gonna beokay. That's what it was.
Yeah, okay, Um she wouldhave been six, right, so six

(38:39):
year olds seven, seven years old? Seven, Mommy, it's gonna it's
gonna be okay, mommy. Yeah, She's been through a lot with me.
When that moment happened between the twoof you, Yeah, were you
thinking like what effect is this havingon her? Were you just like trying

(39:06):
to do the best you could togo through the motions. I'm like,
if you take your brain back tothat moment, that exact moment, like
what were you what were you thinking? What was going on in what was
the head? What was that internalconversation sure, I don't want to fuck
her up? Yeah, right,So what can I do to salvage this?

(39:28):
What's best for her? And atthat point, I think, as
a mother, whatever's best for her, I'm going to do if that stay
or go in or out of thisrelationship. The problem was it wasn't just
me, it was Kennedy as well. It was I paid a lot of
money for the meat. You're notgoing to put a one on your on

(39:52):
your steak. And that's when Iwas like, I'm want to talk to
my kid like that, right,So Mama bear were come out and then
I would get punished for it.Basically that's what was happening. Or I
would, you know, because atthis point I'm starting to find my voice,
right because I've been through multiple hardrelationships and I'm starting to find my

(40:15):
voice. So I would speak upand then I would get punished for it,
and punishment was always physical, notalways no, I would tell you
that that was probably the physical physicalpart of it where it was definitely like
I'm going to scare you with this, and this is what's going to happen.
Where he was putting a gun upto your body, into your body.

(40:37):
Yes, that was the first timethat ever happened. Correct, prior
to that, had he shoved you, punched you, grabbed you, drawn
blood and caused bruising. No,never bruising, not up to that point.
After that point, yes, butnot up to that point. No.

(40:59):
So that that happens where you're Imean, that's violence. Yes,
that's a threat. Yeah, that'san attack. Yeah. How much longer
do you stay? Not long?The relationship was very very short because again
I think that at that point Iwas really starting to get my feet underneath

(41:22):
me from the standpoint of knowing whatI needed to do, right, because
now I have it's not just me, it's Kennedy, right, So it's
not just my life, it's herlife, and I can't I don't want
to mess her up. Yes,So it was trying, you know,

(41:47):
picking myself up. You know,people say it's not it's not what happens
that defines you, it's how yourecover and pick yourself up from it.
And I think that's probably the storyof my life, right, you pick
yourself up and you move on.And um. It wasn't soon after that
that I met an incredible man,But unfortunately, all of the baggage that

(42:15):
you bring after being through those typesof relationships, is you know you can't
just leave your bag and walk intoa relationship without it. Unfortunately, it
comes. It comes with you,as does his Yes, but it's different
this time. I want to askyou though this because I've had this happened

(42:36):
to me too. In fact,I wrote about in my book, and
I've I'd kind of forgotten about it. But if somebody had challenged me to
write a chapter about relationships, becauseI write a lot about relationships in the
book, like giving a relationship advice. And so the woman who wrote the
forward, Dominique Mocciano, you know, Dominique shoot was an Olympic gold medalist

(42:59):
from the Atlanta Games who had writtena New York Times bestseller, so she
was a great sounding board for me. When she was reading the manuscript,
she said, You've got to takeus through some relationships of your own.
So I'm digging back and one storythat came pouring out was one of physical
violence in a relationship, and itreally was just a while there was a

(43:20):
lot of mental abuse, this wasjust a one time physical occurrence that ultimately
led to blood on my shirt,lots of tears, lots of yelling,
and I write about it, andit was difficult to write, mostly because
I knew my parents would read it, and I'm like, I'm okay today,
I think, but are they goingto be okay reading it? Absolutely?

(43:45):
What happened after people read that story? And I'm wondering the same thing.
I bet the same thing happens toyou or even other women who might
be listening to this, who arehave experienced that type of relationship or are
in this type of relationship. Peoplego, that happened to you, right,

(44:07):
but you seem so smart all together, you're independent, you're so strong,
you seem like you wouldn't take crapfrom anybody, right right, right,
So there's this perception of who youwere what you were that people wouldn't
buy it. And and I'm notsure that that's the right question to ask

(44:28):
a woman, like how'd you letthat happen to you? Because trust me,
we don't want right now that tohappen. I think it's just more
what was your perception of yourself?Like did you have that perception of yourself
at the time that you were strongand you were independent and you wouldn't take
anything from anybody? Um, whatwe would like to say, we have

(44:50):
that perception, but what happens,And this is a topic that's talked about
with regards to domestic violence, whetherit's woman on man or man on woman,
and I want to make sure thateveryone understands it goes both ways.
It happens both ways. And Ithink the first thing that you think is
what did I do wrong? Yes? What did I do wrong? What

(45:14):
did I do to deserve this right? Because for my relationships, I've been
told that I'm not enough. Really, that's the string that goes through,
whether I'm told that verbally or fromactions. You know, my first husband
cheated on me. I must notbe enough. My boyfriend in college stood

(45:37):
on a chair and pointed his fingerand shook his finger and yelled at me,
I must not be enough. Right. So so interesting you say that
because I remember the exact moment whenmy physical that physical fight happened for me
and I'm pinned up against a walland I looked down at my shirt and
there's blood on it. And thefirst thing this guy said to me was
that's your fault. You did that. Yeah, right, So, and

(46:00):
you're right, it does work bothways. It does work both ways.
Often sometimes we think about this,and it's always the man abusing the woman.
That's not always it can be theother way around, or like you
said, give me a woman andwoman, right, But that is a
common theme. Yes that what didI do to cause this? Or we

(46:20):
are told you cause this? Correct? Correct later on in my life,
I and we'll get to that.But I did understand, and um,
it all made sense once I knewwhat a narcissist was, in the definition

(46:42):
of a narcissist and how they treatand paths, because I'm certainly an ampath,
right, I have so much empathyfor people, and I'm the bleeding
heart and want everyone to be happy. And boy, we are prey forcissistic
people. We are prey for narcissicystic people if we don't have another piece

(47:06):
of ourself that is full and full, and that's that self worth, self
love part. Absolutely, because havingempathy is a beautiful thing. Absolutely,
we don't. I don't think anybodywho's empathetic don't change that about yourself.
No, no, but understand yesthat, Yes, that's when you have

(47:27):
a kindsole, you can become atarget. And part of that is I
think when someone does not feel goodabout themselves or they are, you know,
emotionally not well. They are drawnto that energy, right, I
mean, who Isn't you want tobe around positive, happy people. Yeah,
it's just a matter of the typethat comes to you. If they

(47:51):
are negative and unhealthy, they'll bringa lot of that into your life too.
So so you're in, You getout of this abusive relationship and you
spend some time on your own,or do you then get into another relationship
quickly? Oh? No, Iwent right into another relationship. I mean,
why not? Right? Looking forthat security? Of course, why

(48:14):
would I do anything different? Thisis what I know. You know,
why would I spend time by myself. I don't like to spend time alone
because I'm not enough. So Idid, Thank god, it was with
an incredible man who was going throughhis own stuff. So when I say
did I jump into a relationship rightaway? We were not romantically involved right

(48:38):
away, but we were very goodfriends, very very close, very good
friends. And I mean, who'skidding who? Right? You knew there
was an attraction there? Y,Yeah, there's a chemistry. There was
a chemistry there, and it wasfunny when I met him. I met
him on New Year's day at abirthday part. I had been writing next

(49:02):
to him, so I found writingright at this point, I'm writing,
I'm like indoor cycling, and Iwould ride next to him. So this
is where you're working your shit out, This is where I'm working out.
Yeah, And I have to tellyou that I found this incredible instructor.
His name was Ed Meyer, andI truly feel like he saved a part

(49:23):
of me, or he helped mesave myself because he was the first person
that I was exposed to in aworkout environment with music and sweat and tears,
who spoke from his heart and fromhis experience. And I'm writing and

(49:45):
sharing energy as I talk about inclass all the time with this person next
to me. You know, everything'sto the beat of the music. And
you're writing next to this person whoI am becoming good friends with or becoming
friends with, and you know you'reriding to the beat and your foot is
exactly on the same beat with him, and I mean, everything's the same,

(50:07):
and I can't lie. I meanimmediately, I'm a gosh, he'd
be great in bed. We wouldbe great in bed together, right,
because you're like, it's just likea dance. Yeah, I'm in sync
with this guy, um, whichis very ended up being very true.
But but immediately that's what I'm thinking, and it was just horrible to say,

(50:27):
but that's when you're riding and there'sso much emotion and you're sharing just
this electric energy and um. Soyeah, we became friends and but really
didn't talk much until that day.Um that birthday party. It was actually
Ed's birthday party, and we stoodand talked um a long time. I

(50:49):
didn't know anybody. I'm surprised thateven went, but it was kind of
like, what do I have tolose at this point, I guess we
know why you went? Yeah,Um, and I talked about Kennedy the
whole time, and to this day, he just told the story the other
day that the thing that attracted himmost to me was that I had such

(51:10):
a love for my daughter and spokeabout her a lot. Because it turns
out in his relationship that he wasgetting out of his ex wife wasn't really
like, didn't have those motherly figures, you know, didn't really have that

(51:30):
motherly instinct. So this was sucha huge attractive thing to him about me
was that I just my life wasKennedy. It still is um, but
that was a huge attraction to him. So I think he might have been
thinking the same thing on the biketoo, but thinking he eventually became your
husband. He did eventually become myhusband, and then not my husband,

(51:54):
probably my husband again. Right,okay, we have another duet. Yeah,
we don't have enough time for story. This is the chapter version a
chapter of Scott. Right, soyou should there be like a I thought
he would like that, he wouldlike that, he would like that.

(52:15):
Keeps laughing right now, by theway, the music, right, yeah,
So you have this incredible energy withScott, you form a bond.
Um. Ultimately you end up ina relationship together, You date, you
get married, and happily ever after. Right, No, isn't that how

(52:36):
it goes? I don't think thatexists. Well it does, but it
takes a lot of work. Themodern day Disney story. Right, I'm
a story. Somebody needs to writethat. Let's get on that. Could
I could play the evil stepmother.So but you when you have somebody who
you're so in sync with, andI remember, I remember, like I'm

(52:59):
speaking from a place of experience,there are people who are listening who don't
know either of you, but Ithink we all know a couple in our
lives right where you're like, god, that is like, there are a
couple goals, right, Like theyhave fun together, they play together,
they have chemistry together. Oh,they they're challenging each other in work and
in business, in life. Andhe was so much a part of your
daughter's life. And they seem tohave this like fun, cool, little

(53:22):
happy family and they travel together andthey talk about this great sex they have
together, and everyone's like, wow, Jen and Scott a couple goals.
But reality is everybody has challenges exactly, And I think you know, there's
a couple parts of mine and Scott'sstory that caused failure, a couple things

(53:49):
that brought us back together, acouple things that have kept us together through
this whole period of ten years.Right, you've been in each other's eyes.
It's ten years. Uh yeah,actually it was. It was the
beginning of two thousand and eight.How many years were you married? We
were married in two thousand and tenand we got divorced in two thousand and
fifteen. Okay, so I'm sorrytwenty fourteen, Okay, okay, so

(54:15):
four years? Four years? Didyou I mean, nobody ever gets married
thinking they're gonna get divorced, andif they do, then they shouldn't be
getting married, like you know,every now and then somebody will hindschle.
Yeah, I knew on my weddingday it wasn't last Oh, my first
one. I could have told youthat, but no, this one definitely

(54:36):
I locked on a But I thinkgenerally speaking, most people don't get married
thinking they're gonna get divorced. Soand especially for you with Scott, like
I think you probably felt like I'molder now, like I've made my mistakes,
I've come into my own. He'san incredible man. Yes he's not
abusive or he's fun and he's extremelyhandsome, and you know so, but

(54:59):
what had happened, and it alwaysthere's something on both sides, right,
so we don't I don't want tobe like picking on you because he can't
be here to defend himself. Butyou still hadn't done all the work on
yourself. I still had not doneall the work on myself. That was
a big part of it. Anotherbig part of it is we in a

(55:19):
in a very short period of time, moved into new home, started our
business, started a new job me. It was a lot of stress,
and I think, you know,when you're in this blissful relationship, he
tended to not notice when things startto creep up, right, And I'll

(55:42):
be honest with you, And inhis defense, he asked me to go
to therapy, and I was reallyafraid to do that. I don't know.
I don't know why I was soafraid to go to therapy with him.
I honestly, maybe I was afraidof hearing what was wrong with me,
right, because I've heard it foralong, you're not enough, right,

(56:02):
So maybe it was me avoiding that. I would probably tell you that
that's the first time I've ever exploredthat thought, and that's pretty dead on.
I think that's why. It certainlyhad nothing to do with him,
And it wasn't that I didn't wantthe marriage to survive. The business definitely
took a toll. You know,we're in this space. The Landlard was

(56:25):
a complete asshole, and Scott tookthe brunt of that and it was very
stressful for him. And I didn'tgive him enough credit or listen enough to
that. With him, I Ibrushed it off. You know, when
you're you know, just take careof it. I'm teaching class. I

(56:45):
don't have time, you know,I'm selling my classes out. I'm doing
my part. I don't have time. And that's not how a business should
be run. I'm so important,right, And you just go figure out
whatever that little thing is that you'redoing right, Yes, And finally I
realize that that's not the case,and which was belittling to him, that

(57:08):
making his wants and needs and hispurpose feel small. Absolutely absolutely, So
you had that part of it.Then you had the part where now I
have I'm selling these classes out andI've created this following of people. And
when you and I know you knowthis. When you create this following of

(57:31):
people, people want a part ofyou. Yes, right. And if
you are an EmPATH who has ahard time saying no, you overextend yourself.
You give yourself way too much andnot take time for yourself, or
for yourself and your partner, foryourself and your daughter, right, or
for yourself and your stepdaughter, andyou tend to if you're not careful,

(57:58):
start to think, well, thisis the most important thing. These people
are my people and they need tobe with me. This one needs to
have a cocktail with me. Thisone has to have coffee with me,
and it's it's constant. Now.Mind you, both Scott and I have
full time jobs while we're running thisbusiness, so it's a lot of time.
And I think that was another partof it, in my energy and

(58:19):
my time that I was spending withthese people was being taken away from him.
Yeah, there are too many peoplecoming into your marriage, too many
people coming into my marriage, andI didn't recognize it because I'm on this
whirlwind thing, right and You're comingfrom a good place. You feel like
I'm helping people. The emails I'mgetting in and I don't want that to

(58:40):
get lost in this message, whichis what I was doing. I don't
regret it was such an important thing. I was figuring out how to connect
with people the way I've never connectedwith them before. People I don't even
know. But I wasn't spending enoughtime taking care of the home in my

(59:04):
relationship. There were holes in yourlife. You've talked about it through this
entire process as there's this self worthissue, so then you have people from
the outside feeding the self worth.You are amazing. You have changed my
life. I don't know where Iwould be without you you saved me.

(59:27):
I'm guessing that's some of what theywould say. So there are people from
the outside who are feeding into thathole of self worth that's lacking. But
really the right people that mattered tofeed that number one yourself, but would

(59:47):
have been your husband and your daughter, right your family or an inner circle.
So you were feeding it from thewrong place, correct. And then
what I did, because there wasan issue at home, what I did
was take that and hooked into itright. And then it became a huge
issue, and it grew and itgrew and it grew, and it was

(01:00:09):
again, well, you're not takingcare of this issue, which was really
an issue that he needed to takecare of, and in his mind,
he was trying everything it could.But at that point I'm like, well,
I'm so busy over here, andit really started to take on a
life of itself and and we brokeup. Yeah, it was hard.

(01:00:31):
It was hard. It had tobe hard because especially in like I always
think of when celebrities break up,right, and then it's plastered everywhere,
Like think of when you're like onyour own and go through a breakup.
It's so painful, let alone.Then it's written everywhere, right, So
within your circle there were because youowned a business together and it was a

(01:00:52):
successful business, you had a lotof people who knew you as a duo
and as a team. And sothen suddenly you've got what how that happened?
Right? You're the perfect copa,you're the power couple. How can
that happen? So you're already feelingawful that there's a breakup. Then you've

(01:01:13):
got that being an expectation. Andthat was the other word I was going
to say, you know, theexpectation that people put on you. Wow,
and Scott and I was really hardto live up to. And we've
fed that because we involved a lotof people in our life and we I

(01:01:37):
think, I know not I thinktoo many opinions, right, too many
opinions, too many, too manypeople. Everybody has an opinion, which
is funny to me because I've alwayslived my life like, hey, I
don't care what you do because itdoesn't affect me. I just want you
to be happy. But people aren'tthat way, and they want to have

(01:01:58):
an opinion on everything, what youshould do, how you should live your
life, you know, So thatbecame really hard. It was a very
it was a very hard breakup.Yeah, not the hardest, but it
was hard. Those opinions start tobecome very they become your opinions, right
then you adopt them as your own. Yeah, So that breakup happens.

(01:02:22):
And and like you had mentioned atthe beginning, I mean, Scott's a
good man, So this was probablyone of the healthier relationships that you'd had.
I mean, yeah, I hadits own set of issues. But
every relationship is going to like,nothing is going to be smooth, standing
or perfect. You know the differencebetween the unhealthy problems and the ones where

(01:02:43):
you go, okay, just talkthrough this, we can work it out,
right, So that relationship devolves,dissolves, and then well, I
mean, you know what, shouldwe get back into another one right away?
Or not? Of course I breakthat. That's what we do.

(01:03:05):
And to make it worse, it'salmost like I was. I reverted way
back to what was comfortable for me, and that was being with someone or
being around someone who was a narcissistic. And this is when I learned the

(01:03:27):
term. Unfortunately not soon enough,but I did learn a term through therapy
after this relationship, what a narcissistwas. And I was in such a
bad spot and met the think ofit as like you're in the middle of
an ocean and you're bleeding and there'sa shark right and the shark can just

(01:03:47):
smell. They can smell that you'rethat you're weak, and it's exactly the
same thing. A narcissist can smellthat on you. And boy, that
is a good way to put it. That's a powerful visual that can smell
it on you. And of courseI'm going to save the world, and

(01:04:11):
I'm going to this person had ahorrible hard life, and I'm going to
teach the world that I'm going toteach this person that the world isn't that
bad of a place and they're notthat bad of a person, right,
So I'm doing anything i can tofix this person. It's interesting because you
know, I like to keep itvery real with all of my storytelling and

(01:04:34):
all of my life and protective ofother people's But I think that you'll be
fine with me sharing this because youand I were very good friends at this
time. Yes, it's sort ofironic because I was entering into a healthy
phase of my life. You hadbeen a big part of helping me work
through a lot of the junk,right, and I had been coming out

(01:04:57):
of it, so I could seething with clarity at that time, and
I clearly wasn't. And I rememberthis person, and at first I was
kind of like, okay, Ididn't have a firm opinion one way or
another. But then I was observingthat this person was cutting important people in

(01:05:26):
your life out of your life.And it was a slow process, right.
But I remember you and I oneday sitting in a car and I
said, I have to tell youbecause I feel like i'm going to I'm
not being a good friend if Idon't say this to you, because I
had. I had walked in ona conversation and like you listen, if
you are in touch with people atall, you know when you walk into

(01:05:48):
something that's heavy, right, AndI had walked into something where I was
like, I think John was crying. I don't know what this conversation was
about, but something is palpable andit does not feel good in this room.
Right. So I had a littleprivate time with you. You're sitting
in a car, and I said, this person's going to hurt you.
And I don't mean like they're goingto hurt your feelings I'm like, they

(01:06:11):
are going to physically hurt you.And I know you heard meant, but
you didn't want to hear me.But I understand why. I understand why.
But that's because when and when anabuser or someone who maybe has sociopathic

(01:06:33):
tendencies, they're very is and ifwe don't even want to go that extreme,
if somebody is manipulative, they're smarterthan everybody else in the room in
terms of they know how to takeadvantage of their prey and pull the prey
and really really tight so that theprey does not have that soft landing pad,

(01:06:55):
mean that soft landing pad meaning thepeople who are there to support them,
right, they pull them away fromtheir support system. Absolutely, and
I saw that happening. That's ultimatelywhat happened for you, right it is,
And I would have you know.I remember my mom one time telling
me we were talking about depression andhow for her she felt like depression was

(01:07:21):
a blanket over her and every oncein a while, the edge of the
blanket would lift up and then itwould come back down again. For me,
it was I felt like I wasin the edge of a river bank
trying to get out, and Iwould grasp for a root and it would
come loose, or so it's okay, I'm going to reach, I have
enough courage to reach, and thenI fall back down again. And in

(01:07:42):
this relationship, whatever the relationship was, it was certainly something that every once
in a while I would get aglimpse of Okay, this is not right,
but then I was sucked back inagain. Right. They're very manipulative
and um, very good at whatthey do, very calculated, very good

(01:08:03):
at what they do. And Iwas no match, no match. You
had no prayer, you had nochance. I had no chance. And
I remember I remember where I wasdriving. I was on Crubs Road,
um, and this is where Iwas driving, and I remember thinking,

(01:08:24):
how am I going to get outof this? Wow? The only way
I can get out of this withoutsomeone else getting hurt is by killing myself.
That's it. The only way soScott doesn't get hurt or Kennedy doesn't
get hurt. That's the only waythis person is going to let me out

(01:08:44):
of this. And there was amoment, and it's interesting, I would
bet you probably remember this, butI'm not sure you knew what led to
this event. So it was itwas not very long after that, I
teach on Thursday nights, as youmentioned, and it was a Thursday night

(01:09:08):
and I was on my way toteach class and I was just I don't
even know what happened, but Icouldn't even catch my breath. I was
so upset because this thought had beenbuilding in my head, right, I
have to protect my daughter and Ihave to protect Scott, and the only

(01:09:30):
way of me getting out of thisis now not being here. And I
remember I pulled into Steinmart parking lotof all places, staring at the studio
across the street, crying and thinking, I don't know how. I don't
even I would. That has tobe the lowest point in my life ever,

(01:09:55):
just crying, thinking I have tothis is all I can do.
That's the answer, that's the answer. And I had to still go teach.
I don't know how I did it. I walked into the studio,
I walked in the back room,and you walked in the back room and
you said you, oh my gosh, you've been crying, and I'm like,

(01:10:20):
no, I haven't been crying.And then I started crying and you
give me a big hug and you'relike, it's gonna be okay. And
we were not on really really solidterms on because of course I had lied
to you for this person, right, and you were gracious enough to come
back into my life. And itwas so it was interesting that you were

(01:10:44):
the person that I ran smack dabinto after this huge botomy. Now,
right, the lowest of low,even lower than when I was with that
person who physically had a gun atme, lower than that because I was
a piece of shit. I wasa piece of shit because I was told
I was a piece of shit.I was pished because I did this.

(01:11:06):
I put myself in this position.I knew I shouldn't have done it,
and I did it, and nowother people are going to be harmed.
And I taught that class. Itaught an amazing class that day. And
I made the decision that day thatI was done. I made the decision
I was done. And it wasinteresting because I was I'm one of those

(01:11:30):
people. I'm a light switch person. If I'm done, I'm done.
Yeah. So the light switch wentoff, and the next day I saw
that person and I said, Icannot have I can't be in your presence
any longer. I can't be friendswith you. This is just not going
to work for me. This isamazing to me because in we're talking about

(01:11:55):
that time period right from where you'resitting in your car having a breakdown,
thinking the only way to get outof this is to end your own life.
Yeah, and then you have togo across the street, get in
front of a room of people,physically put yourself out there, mentally,

(01:12:16):
put yourself out there, go througha workout, right, which is the
opposite of what you want to dowhen you're at your lowest of the low
and you I mean lowest of thelow times a hundred and then I had
to go there, I would havedone. I think it saved your life.
It did. And then and thepeople in that room, and you're
telling me that story that um thatI came there that day and if we

(01:12:42):
had been on rocky terms, Iprobably wasn't coming in regularly. That just
first of all, like that isso emotional. Like that gives me chills,
and it makes me think like ifyou know somebody who is in pain
and you're listening to this and you'rethinking like, I don't know if I
should reach out or not right becauseyou're mad at them, do it right?

(01:13:03):
Do it. If you know somebodywho is struggling and in pain,
shelf your ego, yep, becausewhat's the worst that happens. If you're
in a healthy space and you getrejected, okay, you'll be all right.
But if they are struggling, God, that as simple, it's gonna

(01:13:25):
be okay. And a hug couldsave could save somebody's life, especially if
you know that person's core being andthey're acting outside that core being. Since
they've been with us with this personchanged change. Let me back up.
I changed who I was when Iwas around this person. I'm not going
to give them a power to thinkthat they were able to change me.

(01:13:49):
That was on me. But yeah, then being in that room and making
that decision, I'm like, Ican't you know. First of all,
Kennedy's flash in front of my eyes, and my mom is fashion in front
of my eyes, and my sister, my brother, and obviously Scott,
and I'm like, okay, Ican you know in Scott and I were

(01:14:09):
broken up at this time, Ican't do this. What we haven't said
because we keep kind of referring tothis person, so we know it's an
unhealthy relationship and we've used the word, you know, a narcissistic and manipulative
and sociopathic and mean, you know, lots of like big psychology words obviously

(01:14:32):
for a person to get you toa place where you think the only way
out is to end at all inyour own life and to take your own
life. They'd been doing a lotof damage and we're very unhealthy. Had
the physical This was somebody who,aside from mental abuse, physically abused you.
Had the physical abuse happened at thispoint and you're you're sitting crust me

(01:14:56):
shaking your head. I'm I'm gonnainterjected this part two. Um, a
mutual friend of ours had said Jenfell in her driveway and she really like
banged herself up. You should callher check in on her. This was
somebody who knew that you and Ihad kind of been like on shaky,
sort of on the outs a littlebit with our friendship. Um, did

(01:15:18):
you know I had a sense.But I remember calling you and I said
I heard, I heard you hadan accident, and you gave me the
whole story about you were carrying groceriesand you tripped. You got the grocery

(01:15:39):
story. I got a couple ofdifferent stories. You you tripped with a
grocery bag, and boy did youyou got a black eye from you?
Really you got a black eye.And you know, I think maybe a
broken nose or something like that fromthe grocery bag that you dropped and fell
and tripped over. And I thoughtit wasn't I wasn't in a place where

(01:15:59):
I thought it was my place becauseI had already interjected, right, And
I think my interjecting I probably didn'tdo it in hindsight, it wasn't sensitive
enough with it, and it contributedto how do you even what do you
do? Right? I don't know, but whatever I did, sometimes I
think, well, maybe I justdidn't say it the right way whatever I
said, because this relationship that wassuch a strong friendship, it kind of

(01:16:25):
broke in a little bit, andso I thought it's not my place to
say what I was thinking anymore,just to say are you okay? Right?
Wasn't long after that that you saidI have to tell you the truth
and you sent me a picture ofyour face. Yeah, And I knew
that was not from stumbling over agrocery bag. Yeah, because you you

(01:16:45):
took a picture of your face afteryou'd been beaten up. Yes, So
when I turned the light switch offand I told this person it couldn't be
in my life anymore. Um,it didn't. They weren't really happy about
that. And it's really interesting.A couple of days went by and I

(01:17:06):
was doing a ton of yoga atthis time. Laney is amazing Landy got
me through. She gets a lotof people through a lot of stuff.
She is a soul preacher's air aswell. I'm going to hand them out
to people. She's a gift fromheaven, from heaven. Um. She

(01:17:30):
I was actually going. I wasin a workshop with her about healing,
and it happened in the middle ofthis workshop. It was a six week
workshop and I came in one dayand my face looked like that. She's
like, well, what happened?And being a survivor of abuse, Um,
she knew. And we talked andshe taught me how to really ground

(01:17:51):
myself. And so I hung andclung um to music and Toad, an
amazing therapist that I got hooked upwith, amazing therapist and breathe learned how
to really breathe. I still strugglewith it, but I'm getting better.

(01:18:11):
And what ended up happening was thisperson like the fact that I wanted them
out of my life. And Iwas asleep one night, my daughter was
asleep, and I woke up tothem on top of me. They broke
in my home and literally on topof me in my bed, and my

(01:18:34):
car was not at my house becauseI had had a couple of cocktails at
Crocker Wi Scott And now I knowthis person probably followed me and knew I
was with him. And ironically,it was the night that he gave me

(01:18:56):
the signed divorce papers. He hadn'tsigned them, and he we met for
dinner and he said, I justwant you to be happy, and he
gave me the papers that night anddrove me home because we had had some
wine. So I wake up.The long story short, I wake up
to this person on top of me, screaming at me. Where's your car?
Where's your car? And I'm like, you know, trying to wake
up. I had a couple ofglasses of wine, a couple more than

(01:19:17):
a couple of glasses of wine,and Kennedy's home, so I'm like okay,
and they grab my cell phone andran downstairs. I don't have a
house phone, right, you do? I don't know why I do.
It's like I'm hanging on an oldnumber that I can't get rid of,

(01:19:38):
so I just keep it off thehooks. You can call me on it.
But you're right, most people theyjust have a cell phone. Yeah.
So I get downstairs and long storyshort, they run outside. I
run outside. I'm trying to getthem outside, out of my home,
and they run outside trying to getmy cell phone back so I can call
the police. Because clearly they wereon drugs and they had been drinking.

(01:20:02):
I had never seen the rage thatI had seen in this person's eyes before
that night. And incidentally, Ithink the thing that really set this person
off was I went that day andgot my hair cut. My hair was
long, and I cut my hairreally short, and it was almost like
a it was almost like a freeingfor me. Right. A lot of

(01:20:26):
women do that, right. Yeah, I go through a breakup and they
cut their hair. Yeah, Ihad it short ever since now I'm growing
again. But they saw a pictureof me, and when I was that
night in the middle of this,you didn't you didn't ask me permission to
cut your hair. So they breakinto your home, they're on top of
you when you're in the dead asleep. Yeah, and they say to you,

(01:20:50):
you didn't ask my permission to cutyour hair. Yeah, so what
did you think? Well, you'reprobably like, how are you in my
house now? At this point?Now, at this point, I'm like,
again, just trying to get themout of the house because of Kennedy
survival mode. Survival mode. Um. They get in their car, and

(01:21:11):
I will preface this by saying,I am not proud of this moment,
but we do what we need todo. Absolutely, they get in the
car, I get on top ofthem, like in the driver's seat,
and they're holding the phone away soI can't reach it. So I bit
their ear. Well, I thinkthat's I mean, they broke into your
house and tried to they drunk thephone. Yeah, And I get the

(01:21:32):
phone. You I don't even know, like even to him, like,
I can't believe I did that,but it's the only thing I could think
of at the time, Like thatwas the only way it was going to
get this phone. I had toget the phone. So I get the
phone and I'm shaking. I'm tryingto walk up the driveway to call please,

(01:21:57):
and they tackled me from behind onthe concrete and start have the back
of my head and just start smashingmy face in the driveway. And then
now I'll be honest with you.Right now, I'm pissed. Good now,
I'm pissed, but you needed toget good and pissed. And I
literally, and I mean I'm talkinglike the force of a three hundred pound

(01:22:18):
weightlifter, throw this person off myback. And I'm like, you,
motherfucker, you broke my nose.And that was it, right, I
get my phone back, tackled them, kept them, called nine one one,

(01:22:38):
and for some reason, the universewas on my side. The police
were literally like right around the cornerthirty seconds. So they come, they
separate us, they take this personto jail. They're like, you need
to go in an ambulance, andI'm like, no, no, no,
no, no, really you're inreally bad shape. Like, well,
you need to call my friend Brooke. So of course, God lover,

(01:23:00):
she gets a call at four Imean at this point it's probably it's
probably two thirty three am. Shecomes over, Um, I go in
the ambulance. She's got to wakeup Kennedy. Until Kennedy, what happened?
The worst? That's the worst partever in my entire life. It's

(01:23:24):
amazing that Kennedy slept through all ofthe slept through it. I was even,
thank god, I was even atthat point honking the horn, trying
to get hurt of it so shecould call the police. Fast forward.
You know, I had a brokennose and seven stitches in my lip,
and I was pretty messed up,but I was broken. I was broken.

(01:23:45):
Um got back from Brooke literally infiguratively, literally in figuratively got back
from the hospital. Brook's parents tookKennedy and they were nice enough to let
me come over and I spent thenight there because we weren't sure where this
person was. Right. So it'sinteresting that when you look back on the

(01:24:08):
history of you, Yeah, andso many people did things to, you
know, mentally break you down,and some of them physically. It took
getting a broken nose for you togo, this is my AHA moment you
break because you do have a greatnose. Your nose got broken, and

(01:24:30):
so that was the moment. Youknow, I say a lot because the
show is called The Bounce Back thatwe have bounced back moments and then we
you know, we fall again.I mean, that's just life, right,
we rise, we fall, it'sjust it's ever, it's it just
blow it is. This is ahuge bounce back moment for you, though,
because when you're at the lowest ofthe low and you're broken, I've

(01:24:54):
been Therefore, when you are broken, it's again that choice of quitting or
that fight or spirit. And Ithink the human soul and the human spirit
is really remarkable that way, becauseit does fight. It does, and
fighting for you meant let me dothe work on myself. Right, I'm

(01:25:16):
not going to get back into arelationship right now. It was about you
at that point. It was aboutme. And don't get me wrong,
I mean that it has been fouryears of working on me, and even
after someone treats you that way,it does that. I remember the feeling

(01:25:39):
of I kept telling my therapist,like, why do I still think about
this person? Not in an affectionateway, but what I just I remember
I kept saying, why can't somebodyinvent a pill that you can take and
you get to choose memories you havethat you can completely erase. Right,

(01:26:03):
I think that might be an episodeof Black Mirror, but I need to
watch that one. Somebody might beworking on it. Right now. Actually,
I know what you mean, youknow, I just want to forget.
And I know you know that becauseI know yours that you would forget,
Yes, And I'm pretty sure Iknow yours. Yeah, And tom

(01:26:23):
My therapist had a great explanation forit, and he's like, someday,
someday you'll come across this person andyou won't feel one way or another about
them. I'm like, that willnever happen. It'll happen. There's a
chord between the two of you rightnow. It's an energy chord, and

(01:26:46):
it's really bright, and it's gonnadim, and it's gonna dem and it's
gonna dem and it might take along time, might not take a long
time, an eventually it's going todie, almost like an umbilical cord,
right, it's going to die andit's going to split. And that's when

(01:27:13):
you'll know you won't need that pillanymore. Right, it won't be you
think about you know, just outof the blue you see something that you'll
see something and it won't need thatperson won't even come to your mind.
Do you know what that's called.What's that called? It's called forgiveness.
It is all right, and oftenthat's forging forgiveness of self. Yeah,
it's not necessarily even the other person. Yeah, because there's a lot of

(01:27:36):
blame that happens again to a victimof violence. Yes, a lot of
blame. What did I do todeserve this? What if I wouldn't have
done this, if I wouldn't havecut my hair, or if I wouldn't
have, if I wouldn't have,wouldn't have would have? Right? Um?
So that became the process then ofthe and the long journey of Kena

(01:28:00):
and Gen. And there was upsand downs through that way highs and way
lows, but nothing is lows whereI had been. Um, And I
found an amazing therapist. Tom retiredand went away from therapy because I thought
I was fixed and I wasn't fixed. I found amazing therapist. Her name

(01:28:21):
is um Cameron Plagans. She's awesome. And therapy was your medicine, Therapy
was my medicine. And she cameat it from a really different angle,
which was a lot of very healingsmudging, really believed in the energies in

(01:28:45):
the universe and a lot of alot of a lot of smudging, a
lot of healing, you know,talk and I went to her at a
time where I had already started reallyrejuvenating myself as a woman, as a
person, as a mom, asa friend. And it's probably been a

(01:29:15):
year since that time that I've reallyfelt really good. That's not to say,
you know, Scott and I hadanother back together break up, but
I don't think we were ready.I don't think we were ready at that
point personally. Yeah, there wasstill work to be done, but you've

(01:29:38):
spent this time putting the work intoyourself. And you know, there are
a couple of reasons why I wantedyou here today. I mean, I
think you have great wisdom and greatinsight because of the experiences you've gone through.
You're so open and talking about yourexperiences with domestic violence, right and

(01:29:59):
being abused, And I think it'san important thing to talk about because I
think it happens to a lot ofpeople who don't want to talk about it
because they think, well, thatdoesn't happen to me. Does that happens
a different kind of person? Notme? But it doesn't happen in Navan
Lake, right, it doesn't happenin the suburbs of any I mean,
whoever's listening wherever it is right,happen to me that's happening? And were

(01:30:21):
there a lot of drugs and wherethere's crime. But guess what, wherever
it's happening, it shouldn't be happening. No, it doesn't matter what aide
you are, how much money youhave, what color your skin is,
whether you're with a man or awoman, or I don't care who it
is, it is not right.And so that was a big part of

(01:30:42):
why I wanted to have you heretoday. And I've seen how you've come
full circle. And I do thinkwhen people do heavy intense therapy they gain
so much wisdom and so much wisdomto pass on. So I want to
wrap this up by asking you aseries of questions, and I just want
to know what your thought or youranswer is on all of these because I've

(01:31:03):
said before, I think when webounce back from great struggles and we're challenged
in and we keep doing the bounceback, we learned some great tools.
And so this series of question willbe questions, will just be tapping into
some of the tools that you've learnedand sure can pass on to others.
So I want you to just fillin the blank journeys. I know I

(01:31:26):
can bounce back from my challenges whenwhen I believe in myself and I find
happiness within, I'm the best versionof myself. When I'm the best version
of myself, when I am atpeace with myself. I feel the most

(01:31:49):
vulnerable. When I feel the mostvulnerable when I am in a room full
of people that don't know me yet. I practice self worth by doing what

(01:32:10):
writing. I find clarity when Ifind clarity when I ride, when I
get to ride, not teach,when I get to ride. And I
find clarity when I take the timeto meditate, which I should do more.

(01:32:33):
Just That's when I really find clarity. What happens to you when you're
on a bike, just you,not teaching, just writing. You know,
I have three favorite instructors, threewomen that I just adore and have

(01:32:55):
offered so much to me. Fromthe standpoint of a room to feel safe
and and I you know, youcan get in and anybody who's ridden,
even in my class, it's nervous, and you know your bike, you
can't get your bike set up right, and the lights go down and the

(01:33:21):
beat drops, and immediately the teacherbecomes the student, and I'm there to
learn not from them, but frommyself. Right, That's when I really
learn about myself because the things thatmaybe I've been afraid to pay attention to,

(01:33:45):
I'm going to give them some timenow and really work through that and
really take a look at myself andhow I am living my life. That's
been a big part of minut Scott'srecent success is not blaming others anymore,

(01:34:10):
right, really taking a look atyourself and what you had to do with
it and how you can change that. Right. Yeah, I think that's
a beautiful lesson to learn. Sothat might be an answer to an earlier
question that you asked me, andI was maybe when I answered it.
When you asked me, how whendo I feel most vulnerable? And I
said in a room full of people? I don't know. I think that's

(01:34:31):
when I feel scared, right andunsure of myself. But when do I
feel most vulnerable When I'm on abike, riding by myself, or in
front of my class. I feelvery safe in front of my class,
and in therapy with Scott now,I feel very vulnerable, but I feel
safe being that way, right,Well, there's courage and vulnerability. It

(01:34:55):
takes courage to be vulnerable because we'reexposing the things that those private places that
nobody gets to see unless we decideto share them. So I think what
you just said previously, those thatwhen you're on the bike the greatest lessons
you learn, you're learning from yourself. Absolutely, so I thank you for

(01:35:16):
sharing your story so that we canlearn from you. Yeah, thank you
for having me. This is reallyfun. It was beautiful, the heavy
hair. It's always good to talkto you. Likewise, my friend,
thank you for listening to this episodeof the bounce Back. It would mean
so much to me if you wouldsubscribe to my podcast and rate it on
iTunes, five stars would be amazing. You can find it on Spotify and

(01:35:41):
Apple Podcasts. Search The bounce Backand click subscribe. The FCB Radio Network
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