September 30, 2025 • 35 mins
Buckeye Weekly: In-Depth Analysis of Ohio State's 24-6 Victory Over Washington
In this episode of the Buckeye Weekly Podcast, hosts Tony Gerdeman and Tom Orr provide a detailed analysis of Ohio State's 24-6 victory over Washington. The discussion covers key takeaways from rewatching the game, standout performances, and areas for improvement. Highlights include a deep dive into Caden Curry's impressive defensive play, the strategy behind the Buckeyes' pass rush, and Caleb Downs' critical tackles. The hosts also talk about the effectiveness of Ohio State's running game, the utilization of tight ends in the offense, and Julian Sayin's decision-making in the passing game. Lastly, they touch on some issues with the CBS broadcast and share their thoughts on potential adjustments Ohio State could make moving forward.
00:00 Introduction and Welcome
00:10 Ohio State vs. Washington Game Recap
00:28 Demond Williams' Performance and Challenges
01:49 Caden Curry's Standout Plays
05:07 Defensive Strategies and Execution
11:54 Tight Ends and Offensive Strategies
16:34 Running Game Analysis and Adjustments
18:24 Uncharacteristic Defense Strategies
19:24 Missed Opportunities on Offense
21:06 Quarterback Decision-Making
26:25 Impactful Defensive Plays
30:34 Broadcast Critiques and Final Thoughts
In this episode of the Buckeye Weekly Podcast, hosts Tony Gerdeman and Tom Orr provide a detailed analysis of Ohio State's 24-6 victory over Washington. The discussion covers key takeaways from rewatching the game, standout performances, and areas for improvement. Highlights include a deep dive into Caden Curry's impressive defensive play, the strategy behind the Buckeyes' pass rush, and Caleb Downs' critical tackles. The hosts also talk about the effectiveness of Ohio State's running game, the utilization of tight ends in the offense, and Julian Sayin's decision-making in the passing game. Lastly, they touch on some issues with the CBS broadcast and share their thoughts on potential adjustments Ohio State could make moving forward.
00:00 Introduction and Welcome
00:10 Ohio State vs. Washington Game Recap
00:28 Demond Williams' Performance and Challenges
01:49 Caden Curry's Standout Plays
05:07 Defensive Strategies and Execution
11:54 Tight Ends and Offensive Strategies
16:34 Running Game Analysis and Adjustments
18:24 Uncharacteristic Defense Strategies
19:24 Missed Opportunities on Offense
21:06 Quarterback Decision-Making
26:25 Impactful Defensive Plays
30:34 Broadcast Critiques and Final Thoughts
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hello, everybody, Welcome to the buck Eye Weekly Podcast. I'm
Tony Gerdaman here as always with Tom or Tom.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
How's it going well, Tony, you get to rewatch the
Ohio State Washington game due to the vagaries of travel
from the West coast to the East coast. We're getting
this studio a day later. But good news Ohio State
one once again as we rewatch the game, coincidentally by
the same final score twenty four to six.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Tom and rewatching it. I feel just as bad as
I did initially for Demond Williams because he I don't
know what his nil situation is. He I hopefully he
earned a nice payday from that because he was the
main event for the Ohios date defense and he should
be paid like a main eventor because he took a beating.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, I feel like he probably signed a deal with
Tylan all on Sunday or Advil or someone it was.
Yet he was elusive, and you know, we talked about
this a bunch last week, where he's great, really fast,
gets at the speed being incredibly fast, very elusive, but
he needs to not get hit like that because he
(01:09):
doesn't slide, he doesn't avoid hits and the.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Ohio State defense.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Sometimes he was able to kind of dodge around them,
but a lot of times it was just kind of
sunny styles reaching one hand out and grabbing him and
saying not so fast, my friend, and flipping him around
in the air, and then Taiwan Malone landing on him.
I have several sequences of pictures of Demon Williams where
it's like, I, you know, I know everyone grows up
(01:34):
dreaming of being a college quarterback. Like that does not
look like a whole lot of fun to me watching
Taiwan Malone and Cayden MacDonald and Kayden Curry land on
you a whole bunch of times like, No, that doesn't
look like all that much fun.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So I want to start I'll start off with by
talking about Kayden Curry. And we talked about him plenty
after the game and why wouldn't he eleven tackles, ninth
star those five tackles for lost three sacks and watching
this and watching him specifically, he had some incredible plays
and everybody talks about you. He's a grinder, he's a
hard worker, he never gives up. He had some very
(02:13):
athletic plays in this game where he's lunging for ball carriers,
he's able to bring guys down. He's he's also showing
his intelligence. There's one play where, one play after he
sacks him on Williams, he's outside on the edge and
he steps further out because he sniffs out a wide
receiver screen and he's like, hey, we got this going
(02:34):
on over here, let's pay attention to it. Then he's
there making that play as well. He was everywhere. He
was a middle linebacker at defensive end and pointing stuff out,
making tackles, tackling ball carriers, tackling receivers over the middle.
It was impressive to watch. There should be a just
(02:54):
maybe maybe I'll do it just to cut up of
all of his plays from the Saturday's game, because it's
a clinic on what an All American defensive end should
look like. And yet we only get focused on that.
We'll get so focused on sacks. It's like, yeah, he
had a bunch of those, but he was everywhere. He
(03:14):
was a complete player on Saturday and it was fun
to rewatch as well. Well.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
There was a sequence where Washington had first in gold
the two and the sequence was first and goal to two.
Cayden Curry tackle for loss second in gold three false start,
second and goal at the eight, Caden Curry tackle for loss,
third and goal at the nine, r VL Ree's tackle
for una scramble for no gain or maybe a yard
or something like that. And you go from first and
goal at two to kicking a field goal.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
From about the ten.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
And it was just the defensive front and specifically Cayden Curry,
and they just they just predominate. And Curry was just
so impressive in so many different ways. You mentioned, you know,
three sacks, five tackles for loss, those are both enormous numbers,
but he had just it was just so many different.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
Ways he was impacted. Well, there was one where they.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Washington was setting up a screen and I think.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
The running back just kind of didn't get out there
quite in time or was covered, and Kaden Curry's in
there so fast. You know, they'd let you go by
on a on a screen, but you're not generally getting
let you know, letting the get go by, and just
being in there so fast. He was in there immediately
on DeMont Williams were as soon as it wasn't exactly
ready and exactly the right time. Boom DeMont Williams on
(04:26):
the ground with Kat and curR on top of him.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
It was just so so quick.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
He he was just so dominant kind of throughout the game,
even more so than watching on TV than watching live.
Watching live, it was like, Wow, it feels like Kayten
Curry's had a pretty good game.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
And the watch on TV and it, holy smokes, you went.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
It went from Kaden Curry had a pretty good game
to this is right up there. You comped this after
the game to the JC two Moloa Penn State game
and yeah, I mean you can you can see it
watching watching wide, you know, watching the TV copy and
getting to see the whole field.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Man, it is.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It was a a incredible performance right right up there
with some of the best in Ohio State defensive line history.
All Right, so we'll go to let's talk I guess
maybe more a little bit about the pass rush on
the whole where you know, my view on the field,
I'm down on the field and I'm watching the pass
rush kind of come towards me. But I've got a
(05:19):
bunch offensive linemen in the way, and you know, and
so it's kind of hard to tell exactly why stuff
hasn't happening.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
I was.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
I was surprised several times throughout the day that the
pass rush wasn't getting there quite as quickly as I
thought it might against this Washington offensive line. And then
you go back and rewatch and it's like, well, they're
being real, real cautious. They're they're not focused as much
on getting home on the pass rush as they were
unjust containing Demond Williams. Don't let Demond Williams get out
(05:46):
of the pocket, get loose. They did a fantastic job
of that kept him very much fenced in the whole game.
But then also you're keeping him fenced in, and then
the coverage down field is so good that then you
get the sacks anyway, So you're not rushing reckless, you're
not getting out of your lane, you're not losing contained
on the pocket, but you still, because of the coverage downfield,
(06:07):
was were able to get home and end up with.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
What six acts or whatever it was.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
So you know that that was as complete a holistic
defensive performance and game plan as you're going to see
where it was. Yeah, the defensive line was great. The
defensive line did a great job getting him to the ground,
and I'm kind of including RVL Reese in that, but
it's also because the coverage downfield was so good. There
(06:31):
were guys open, there work places to go with the ball.
So he's standing there patting the ball and he doesn't
have a place to run, he doesn't have a place
to throw, and then eventually the rush gets home and
that's you know, if you can do that, that really
you know, that was sort of the ideal game plan
for this. And it was like, well, I mean, sure,
if they could do this and they could just not
let guys go open and not let him get over
(06:51):
and then be able to get to him, Like yeah, sure,
that would be great, but I mean, like, come on,
we don't live in fantasy land.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Then that would never happen.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
And then you just sat there and watched it happen
for most of the game.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Yeah. The one place it seemed like they were allowed
to just tear after Demond Williams is up the middle,
and in watching previous Washington games, that's where he struggled.
If there's somebody in his face, he's gonna have trouble.
And then if if they are opportunities for him to
escape that well, in Ohio State's spying him, so r
Vel Reese or Sunny Styles is going to keep him
from getting a big gain. But there's a play where
(07:21):
like Edrick Houston just drops out on an edge and
it's just like if he comes here, I got him.
Like there's there's no pass rest there. You're just waiting
for it and they're just playing as a unit perfectly.
Then when they did get some sacks, there are times
Kenyana Jackson was only credited with one. I know probably
should have had more than that. And I do question
(07:42):
some of the score keeping on this because I think
one of Caden McDonald's sacks, Kanyanna Jackson was there and
maybe r Vel Reese was there and Caden McDonald was
the last guy in, but he knocked everybody down, so
I think there's you know what, we'll just give it
to Caiden McDonald. I think there was some just like
I don't know who to give a sack to. You
(08:03):
can only credit it to two people, but there are
three or four people there, what do we do? And
it's it doesn't matter, you know, there's the home stack
keeping it just whatever. And when there's just so many guys,
it's like, well, who's the last guy you saw who
what number did you notice? And we'll just go with
that because there were times where you could have given
it to three different people, except you can't.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yeah, so that's why Jordan Kovac's got four sacks.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
No, I'm exact. Sorry, there's there's a deep cut for you.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
You know, the one that came out of Jackson did
get credited for with that was a great example of
what I was talking about with sort of the discipline
pass rush where he kind of comes in and.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
He doesn't just go blasting in.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
He kind of, you know, slows down a little bit,
keeps Williams in front of him, and then Williams kind
of goes, crap, I can't throw the ball and like
pulls it down, and then ken Yata kind of pounces
on him and and takes him down. It was it
was a very very good performance overall by the defensive line.
And you know, I think you're seeing a different enough
(09:04):
defensive line this year that Yeah, some of it's probably
partly players, but I think there's just a lot of
just scheme and they're just doing stuff differently, and they're
certainly diversifying their fronts this year. The defensive line is
I think maybe most improved to me on this year's team.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, I think this is the biggest, the most pleasant
surprise on the team is the defensive line. One of
those guys we talked about is Will Smith Junior, who
had a nice play in this one. Got up Field,
got his hand on Williams, slowed him down. He's another
guy that continues to in limited reps. He's just different
(09:41):
than everybody else in terms of, like, you know, the
body types of the guys that you're watching are all big,
and then you see like somebody a little bit smaller
making a play and it's like, oh, yeah, Will Smith.
I remember him from the last time he made a
play in a previous game. And he's putting together and
he's building these things, these performances up and I assume
he's go to continue to get rewarded for that. But
(10:03):
when they there are times where they're only playing three
defensive linemen and Kayden Curry is a nose tackle. We
talked about this before the season, that there are ways
to get around a lack of depth up front, and
they're doing a fantastic job of that, and yet they're
also still building that depth because Will Smith has been
(10:24):
playing well. I thought Taiwan Malone had some good, good
moments in this game. I know we're all waiting for
Edrick Houston. He's still young, he hasn't been a defensive
tackle for an entire year yet. Does need to clean
up the penalties, as we know, but he's the guy
that I see. You're not seeing much from him now
in terms of anything. Wow, But I'm not ready to
(10:44):
write him off at this point. And we'll see what
happens with Jason Moore returns. He was not on the
availability report if I recall correctly this past week.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yeah, he was there.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yeah, So like, can he start doing something? And you know,
can Jark request Carter started doing something? So I feel
decent about the way things are going for this defensive
line on the interior and the fact that Jonah Coleman,
the running back, he averaged five yards a carry or so,
but half of that came on one carry. So when
(11:17):
you can sure eliminate the big runs, but if you're
limiting somebody like that to ninety five percent of his
carries three yards or less, then that's a pretty good
performance by a defensive line.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Yeah, for sure, it was.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Coleman had I think basically three yards of carry outside of.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
The one long one that he had and Demon.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Williams finished with negative twenty something yards Russia. I mean
that in and of itself, that's a winning performance right there.
And you know, you give up zero touchdowns for the
for the second time all season.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
It's you know, that's that's not a bad not a
bad way to go.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Other side of the ball, I have a good thing
and a bad thing with the tight ends. The good
thing is Max Clayer is blocking. Sort of a topic
of conversation earlier. It felt like he had some good
blocks on the edge. There's one in particular that jumped
out to me. It was kind of like a swing
pass to Brandon Innis where Clayer got out there, but
he had I think they maybe singled him out for
(12:14):
something on another block earlier in the broadcast. It just
it feels like, you know, maybe that was an effort
thing or something, or a technique thing that got cleaned up.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
But that feels like that's good.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
On the other side, I think there's too much thirteen personnel.
I think there's I think you're seeing you know, you're
in the goal line and you're in thirteen personnel or
fourteen personnel, Like you could just put Jeremiah Smith out there,
and Jeremiah Smith's going to take one defender with him,
or he's going to take two defenders with him. If
you take two defenders, it's a numbers advantage. If he
takes one defender with him, it's a touchdown. You should
(12:47):
throw him the football. So the same thing for Carnel Tait, Like,
I know they like the heavy sets and the short
yardage and the goal line and all that kind of stuff.
And I'm gonna talk to Ross Spolton about that on
a morning show this week.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
I want to ask him about it as well.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
But to me, I look at this and it's just
it just feels like you've got these guys, and it's
great that you've got all these tight ends, and it's
great that you're coming up with all these creative ways
to use them. But also your wide receiver, you know,
it's the old Jim Tressel. Why are you not throwing
the ball at the tight end? Well, because then I'm
not throwing it to Ted Guinner Santonio Holmes. Why are
you playing three tight ends? Because then you have to
(13:22):
take Carnel Tate or Jeremiah Smith off the field like
it just feels.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
To me like, yep, that's you.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
You are as a former quarterback as your head coach
and a former wide receiver as your offensive coordinator.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
It feels like.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
They should be more you know, pass heavy, wide receiver
heavy and there it's like they've almost over corrected the
other direction. It's good and it's working sometimes, but the
struggles in the short yardage, I feel like maybe you
need to mix it up and try something else because
it's not working, and especially in those kind of short
goal line situations.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Yeah, and you really tell the defense what's coming.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Now.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
The side of that is when you throw out of it,
as they did to C. J. Donaldson, it catches them
off guard and Jelannie Fairman was opened on that play
as well. But I'm with you. When you compact everything,
it just makes it harder to run. And it's at
times to be counterintuitive, but yeah, we're gonna run the ball,
so we need as many big bodies as possible. Well,
(14:20):
then let's bring all the big bodies, including the defense
as well, and see if it gets any easier, because
it's not going to and well, you're just trying to
get two yards and it's like, well, that's not easy
when everybody's in there, is it? With the first failed
fourth down on the first drive, we know Nate Roberts
missed that block. He could have gone into the hole
(14:41):
and CJ. Donaldson presumably would have followed him. I Nate
Roberts improved got the block on the subsequent CJ. Donaldson
touchdown on the ground, So that was a nice improvement
by him. You know, just true freshman tight end that
you're playing at fullback, you can't expect it to go perfectly.
And so when you play you have fourteen personnel at
(15:01):
times or thirteen fourteen when he's in there, you're asking
a lot of a true freshman. And they did it
against Texas and it worked. That was they scored on that,
But yeah, I wonder what their success rate is on
that and how r I day? And maybe we'll talk
to him about it on Tuesday, Like how do you
feel about those packages? Those heavy sets? Are you getting
(15:22):
what you want? And if you aren't, is it because
of the blocking? Is it because at times CJ. Donaldson
is too upright? Does Bo Jackson need to be more
involved in those packages? You know he'll get you down
inside the ten, but then they don't necessarily give it
to him inside the ten because that's the CJ. Donaldson territory.
So I'd be interested to know how he feels about it,
(15:43):
and he's probably not. I don't feel great because we're
not scoring as much, and it's like, well, why not?
And are you going to do anything about it? Or
are you just going to continue to Well, eventually, I'm
sure the heavy sets will work, you know, we're just
gonna keep doing it until it works. And it's like, well,
what if it doesn't? What if it doesn't work? And
what if CJ. Donaldson continues to run high towards the
goal line and you are not as successful as you need?
(16:07):
Would you? Would you would behoove you to spread things
out maybe and light in the box and then run
from there.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
I think that that's something that they're probably looking at
right now because if it's not working, and obviously it's
not working to the level they want it to, then
you owe it to yourself to try and figure out, Okay, why.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Do you need to do what you're doing and.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
Just do it harder or better or whatever, or do
you need.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
To look at something else? And I'm sure they're looking
at all of that stuff right now, you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Know, because I think we're still waiting for the Ohio
State running game to be good, you know, be very good.
And right now they're fifth into Big ten five point
three yards per carry, which you know is fine for
it's fine, but what they'd like it to do is
(16:56):
get higher than that because because of explosives, and they've
not yet done that. And when you look at this
game and the long play is what nineteen yards? That's
that's not going to get it done over the course
of the season. So it'll be interesting to see what
they can do to open up the explosive plays on
the ground and do they have the guys that can
(17:17):
do that. And we've seen Bo Jackson with a sixty
four yard or whatever in Game two I think it was,
And can they get more out of that? CJ. Donaldson,
he was a big play guy as a true freshman.
Hasn't necessarily been that yet. We haven't seen that from
James people's yet. Is this scheme is it? You know,
player is an execution that you know, That's one of
(17:37):
the things that Ryan Day talks about, is it coaching
is an execution? Is a scheme. You got to figure
that out. So I just said, I'm sure they're working
on it. One of the things that I did like
was the adjustment to Washington playing back. Then they started
throwing it short the touchdown passed to Jeremiah Smith at
the end of the first half. They didn't wait until
halftime to make their adjustment perfection, and they're just dragging
(18:02):
in front of the you know, behind the line of
scrimmage so that there could be some downfield blocking and
everybody executed their blocks perfectly, and was a third and
sixteen or something like that. He basically just you know,
third and twelve and he just walked into the end zone.
And I thought that was a perfect play called perfect execution,
perfect design. And you know, they held it and they
(18:22):
called it at the right time.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Yeah, And I you know, I think you saw a
lot of kind of uncharacteristic stuff from Ryan Walters.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
We talked about the fact that they.
Speaker 4 (18:32):
Just were man man man man man like, single high
man like.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
It was really kind of almost the in a lot
of cases.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
They played basically the twenty nineteen Ohio State defense, where
it's kind of single high man coverage where a pressman team.
You mean, you remember all these things, and they kind
of got away from a lot of that against Ohio State.
But yeah, definitely the touchdown Jerremi Smithy, they figured out, Okay,
this is what you're going to do. You know, this
(18:58):
is this is how you're gonna beat what they're in
and they caught him in something that was gonna you know,
it was a great a.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
Great well, a great call there.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
And you know, I mean that was as one man
route as a one man route can be because it
was Jeremiah Smith and everyone else is blocking. So it
was the ball's going to Jeremiah Smith, so I hope
he's open, but if he's not, the ball going to
Jeremiah Smith.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
So yeah, that was that was a that was a
good call.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I want to go back to defense, you know what,
Let's talk about offense one more time. They were a
couple times rewatching that there were guys open that Julian
Saying could have thrown the ball to. There was an
out and up that Caleb or that Jeremiah Smith had
that he was like open open, and you know there
was some pressure and so that probably factored into not
being able to get it out there. But there were
(19:45):
there were times there were guys open downfield that the
ball didn't come out. And I don't know if that's
the coaching staff trying to have them be cautious and
you know, don't take a shot unless you're really sure
about it, or if that's just Julian saying.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
Being a little bit risk averse right now, because.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
As you said earlier, with no one of you know,
one of the guys being sort of young, it's it's
you know, you're you're sort of learning.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
It's a little bit of a progression.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
It's gonna be he is not a finished product right now,
so you're gonna you're gonna see him get more confident
and more comfortable with everything as he gets more reps
throughout the course of the season. But there was some
stuff there that the Buckeyes didn't take.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
And you know, if.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
You're if you're struggling to get explosive plays, you want
to take your shots when you have your opportunities to
get explosive plays.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
You don't want to be the you.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
Know, I think I think Bryce Underwood for Michigan is
almost the other way where Bryce Underwood is going to
take his shots. And if there are two defenders down
there and only one of guys from Michigan.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Well, that's fine. He's gonna throw it down there.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
And I don't think they've completed any of them yet,
but he is going to take his shots. Julian sayin
feels like he's kind of at the other end of
things where he's gonna be cautious and if the guy's open,
you know, and.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
And he's got time, he'll get it down there.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
But otherwise he's gonna be cautious, he's gonna check it
down and and they'll kind of, you know, just kind
of keep moving and try and be efficient on offense.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
Is much more so than the explosive.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, And I think it was Ross Fulton, one of
our exes and nose guru's at Bucke Huddle, who said
that there are four or five shots that saying could
have taken that he didn't and the All twenty two
will tell you more. But I do wonder going back
to the Texas I think it was the Texas Star
to Cardell Tate. I asked Julian saying about that, and
(21:27):
they were, like, we talked about it before the drive,
that we're going to take a shot. And I wonder
if are they are they doing that at this point?
Are they not doing that like we're taking a shot,
like we need you to pull this trigger, And is
this just they're they're not as emphatic about it right
now because they feel pretty good about the defense. So
(21:49):
it's like, well, if it's there, take it. If you
don't think it's there, don't worry about it, check it down.
We'll live to fight another day. And is this a
case where they need to be more emphatic about it,
like we're doing this and as long as you get
the look clearly you know you're you're not gonna throw
in a double triple. You're not gonna throw it a
triple coverage. There are times throwing in a double coverage
with Jeremiah Smith isn't really double coverage. And I think
(22:09):
that's one of the things that Julian Say needs to
recognize better, which I think he will. What he's had
more than you know, four starts under his belt, and
all of these are learning experiences and he'll go back
and I'm sure he's looking at film and he's like, Okay,
I see, I see what I could have done here,
and I'll know to be able to do that next time.
And I know we see college football nerds on Twitter
(22:34):
being critical of Julian saying's deep passing and the lack
of it, and we talked about that against was It
Texas where there are virtually no deep throws until that
one to Carnal Tay And so that has been a pattern.
But so far it's been effective enough. And they they
did attack with the passing game in second half, and
(22:56):
if you're not going to give anything up deep, then
you can just you know, by a thousand cuts and
it worked and they scored on just by every drive
in the second half. So Brian Day wants to get
those deep shots going. I just wonder do they is
this something where they need to focus on it more
and emphasize it more and say, hell or high water,
we're doing this.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, you do wonder if And because if you're leaving
it up to him and he's not pulling the trigger
and you want him to pull the trigger, then you
know you probably have to change the approach a little bit.
And you know, as you said, you don't want to
go into it saying no matter what you're throwing this route,
no matter what you see, that's not that's not a
(23:38):
good approach because sometimes you'll do that and you're not
going to get the coverage, you're not going to get
the look you're expecting. Right, They talked about that after
the game all the time. Yeah, we had something and
we didn't get the look we wanted. And so if
you don't get the look you wanted, then don't throw it. Understood,
But I think you need to go in and say, listen,
unless you see the Jeremiah Smith bracket out on us play,
(24:01):
or unless you see they're in cover three or let
whatever whatever the in less is, pull the trigger, throw
the ball. We we will live with if you're thrown in,
you throw it in incompletion, or you throw an interception,
we'll live with it. We think it's worth it for this.
You may just sort of need to change your approach there.
And you know, at that point, if you're.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Julian saying, and you're you're trying to be a.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Little bit risk averse because you constantly it's drilled into
you don't turn the ball over. Then okay, if they
tell you that, then it's not on you, then it's
on them. It's on the you know, coaching softball constantly
you're trying to have a runner go first to third
and if they get thrown out a third, you tell
them it's on me.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It's the coaches to the coaches say.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
You know, I'm going to tell you what to do
and if and if it doesn't work out, it's on me,
it's not on you. That's the same thing with this.
You can you can tell them, look, we want to
take a shot in this situation. If you get X,
look whatever, don't otherwise pull the trigger and it's on
us if it doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
And one last thing on Julian's saying, second week in
a row, he's thrown the ball over the middle and
had it tipped at the line. That's it'll be interesting
to see if that becomes something that is pops up
at the worst times, because again we know he's not
the tallest guy, so they're gonna be linemen who are
just waiting to knock the ball down as they continue
(25:28):
to scout that. So I think buck guys got away
with it. That was the completion to Jelanie Thurman, and
it was still completed, but it got tipped the line.
So just something to watch there.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Yeah, and you know he's not you know he is
not six foot five, which is you know, that's fine,
but that this is kind of one of the and
he doesn't throw the ball from you know, a super
super high release point, which you know his release is quick,
so you're not going to change that, but you just
you're gonna have to deal with the fact that, you know,
unless you get him out there on stilt's like one
(25:59):
of the Savannah bananas, like, you're going to probably get
some tip balls from time to time. It is what
it is, you know, this is this is something that
I think has been priced into the quarterback decision where
he brings all this other stuff, you know, great decision making,
quick release, you know, strong arm, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
You know, he's not he's not.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Six foot six, but he also moves pretty well. We
think we saw that a couple times as well, so
that all that's kind of baked in, I think to
that decision. One thing I did want to get back
to on the defensive side of the ball is Caleb Downs.
He only hit two tackles on the day, but they
were both immensely important. You know, you feel like he
takes things away from the defense on plays where he's
(26:37):
not getting tackled because the defense is going not going
over there.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
But there's also both of his plays. One of them
ended a drive.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
It was kind of a play on the edge where
it was just an open field tackle and just boom.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Just brought him, brought him down, never a doubt.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
We talked on the postgame show about Davis Nigguinos and
had an open field tackle on a running back who
was like, Oh, he might be out, Nope, he's already down.
How did he get down that fast? And it was
just incredibly good tackling. But David Snigbinosen, Caleb Downs had
one like that, and then he had one where Jonah
Coleman was kind of inside the five. It looked like
maybe they were going in for a touchdown. Coleman kind of,
(27:13):
you know, was like maybe gonna get the edge and
then boom, he's on the ground immediately. Just two really
really good, impactful open field tackles. One ended a drive,
one kept Washington out of the end zone, and a
drive where I think they ended up kicking a field goal. So,
you know, Caleb Downs only two tackles, how much should
he impact the game? Like?
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Well, turns out it was a bunch.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Yeah, Lorenzo Styles also had a nice tackle inside the ten,
but yeah, Caleb Downs. I'm trying to like, what is
what is a good analogy? Is it like a hockey
defenseman who just shuts down somebody keeps them from the
getting the puck, They can't do anything with it, and
you never see the guy, you never notice them. And
yet everybody was like, yeah, this guy, the impact that
(27:53):
he had on this game. You may not understand it,
but everybody playing the game does everybody trying to play
the game. Does the offense and Demand Williams and Jonah
Coleman and Jed Fish all understand the impact that cayleb
Downs had in that one and you know, well two tackles.
I mean, is he even all big ten? And you know,
for the people who just look at the stats, they're
(28:14):
probably going to say, well, he's overrated. And you had
to watch him running around and ask the offensive people
if they feel like he's overrated because they're always having
to keep an eye on him and the competitive excellence.
When his number is called, he's making that tackle and boom,
he's right there. Kind of like this separate but similar
(28:35):
didn't really hear much from Jermaine Matthews in this game,
and it's like did he play. It's like, yeah, I
saw him. He gave up a couple of catches here
and there on that, but like other than that, you'd
never heard from him. And they're just like he was
out there, I promise you, but there was the ball
never you know, Like, like I said, he gave up
a couple of catches, but outside of that, there was
(28:58):
no involvement from him because he was doing his job.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Yeah, it's funny you started talking about that, and I thought,
you know, I thought the same thing about Jermaine Matthews,
and I looked up his stats as you were talking,
and then you got to Jermaine Masthews and I thought.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Well, good news.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
I already know he had two tackles on the game
because it was it was the same thing. He was
a really really quiet day from him, which as a
corner it's like being a long snapper. If you don't
hear your name all day, that's a good thing. That
means nothing bad is happening. So yeah, he was really
solid all day. Jermaine Matthews had as many tackles in
the game as Aaron Scott did. Aaron Scott did not
(29:29):
play on defense. Aaron Scott had two great tackles on
kick coverage. He had Washington only returned.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
No, it doesn't say Washington.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
I think returned two or three kickoffs, and Aaron Scott
had had tackles on two of them and they were
both like again, really good open field tackles. And you know,
I think to me, Tony, the question is, do you
think he can beat out Austin Mockerman for the starting
quarterback job next year?
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Perhaps we shall see. It's it's too early and way
way too soon, Tom, still too soon. One of the
last things I have is when you go back and
we watch this, this is a fun rewatch for the defense.
There are times where it's just perfection. Everybody is covered,
the spies are spying. Uh, there's nowhere for demand Williams
(30:24):
to go with the ball, and it's just like, well,
why did he get sacked six times? Because there's nowhere
to go with the ball and everybody was covered. Very
impressed by that, Uh, not so impressed Tom by the broadcast.
And we don't we don't need to harp on it
too much.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
But yeah, I have this too, yep, you know, like.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Jackson Corville getting getting a graphic for an unsportsman like
that was shocking from a from a backup kicker. You
got to get these guys under control. And of course
the talking about Sonny Styles with the rental Styles Junior's
picture up on the screen. That was just a couple
of things. But not I used to love brad Nessler
(31:04):
and Gary Danielson one of my all time favorites. I
don't clearly the fastball is no longer there not a
great overall product from what is your number one team
for CBS.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Yeah, the broadcast itself just in terms of camera shots,
Like the picture was good, The camera shit, they had
some greats that they think they did a nice job
capturing sort of the atmosphere around Washington.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
You you, I think people.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Who were sitting at home probably went, hey, that looks
really pretty and having been there, yaha, So they did
a nice job with that. But yeah, I mean we
talked about this on a show. I don't remember why
we were watching the CBS broadcast last week. Was it
a rewatch of a Washington game or something like that,
but it was it was very much a or maybe
the Michigan game, but it was just you kind of
(31:52):
went like oh Nessler and Daniel centers like really lost
a step and Danielson announced that this is going to
be his last year, which, you know, congratulations, great career,
we understand. So, you know, I think it's you can
nit pick a broadcast and it's a live TV and
stuff happens. But you know, to the guy in the
(32:14):
truck who's punching up the chirun with ninety six, like
the defense is out there. One of the ninety six
is is on defense and one of the ninety.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
Six is is a on special teams?
Speaker 2 (32:23):
Which one do you think it is? And the graphic
with Sunny styles and Lorenzo styles, that's not something that's
getting made on the fly in the middle of the broadcast.
That was right at the beginning of the broadcast. It
was obviously a pre produced thing. Six people looked at that,
eight people looked at that before it went on the air,
and no one caught the fact that nope, that's the
wrong styles.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
And again, like this stuff happened.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
I remember when I think it was when the MLB
All Star Game was in Cleveland a.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
Few years ago.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
They had, you know, they had a graphic with like
Jacob de Grom and you know, he's the starting pitcher
or something, and they put up a picture of Jeff Wickney,
who was also a white guy with kind of scruffy
pacial hair and long hair, but you know, very much
not Jacob de Gram And it's like.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
How did that not get caught?
Speaker 2 (33:08):
But sometimes it doesn't get caught. But yeah, it was
just or your number one broadcast. As you said, like
the attention to detail on some of that stuff needs
to needs to be a little Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
I was eaves dropping a little bit on their pre
production meeting in near the photo room on Saturday, and
they were talking about we got this drone chat, we
got that drone shot. We're gonna have this nice drone
chat coming in. Drone shots were fantastic. A little bit
more attention to the details and the fact that you
do you do this sport. You know there are double
numbers and you need to know, okay, which numbers go
(33:41):
with which side of the ball. I mean, it's it's
very simple and just you know, again nitpicking, that's what
we do. We watched the broadcast and take notes because
we didn't get to see it live, and I'm sure
I was told that a lot of that. The Corville
and Style stuff was going and talked about on Twitter
as well. So these are the thing if you don't
want your product and talk poorly about you know, again
(34:07):
the attention to details, and then that wouldn't happen. But
anything else time before we get out of here.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yeah, if you don't want your project talked about like that,
go play intermurals.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Brother.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
We talked about this with with the Michigan Monday Show
a few years ago, where we're kind of nitpicking stuff
and people are going, why are you nitpicking so much?
It's like, well, if you want to be at the
level that we're talking about, like if you want to
be the national championship level team, yeah, you're gonna nitpick.
Like yeah, Julian Sand's being been very good. If you
want them to be a national championship team, he's gonna
have to continue to improve. If you want to be
(34:36):
the number one broadcast, you gotta be better like you
got to. You gotta have some attention to detail on
that kind of.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
Stuff if you want to be as good as Gus Johnson.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
Ha ha.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Well you know what, I don't know if the attention
to details matters as much anymore. Anyway, Anyway, good night everybody.
I want to thank you op for tuning in, if
you could hit the thumbs up before you go, if
you're watching on YouTube, and as always, continue to find
us at buckey huddle dot com. Thank you all for
tuning in, and we'll talk to you all later
Hello, everybody, Welcome to the buck Eye Weekly Podcast. I'm
Tony Gerdaman here as always with Tom or Tom.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
How's it going well, Tony, you get to rewatch the
Ohio State Washington game due to the vagaries of travel
from the West coast to the East coast. We're getting
this studio a day later. But good news Ohio State
one once again as we rewatch the game, coincidentally by
the same final score twenty four to six.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
Tom and rewatching it. I feel just as bad as
I did initially for Demond Williams because he I don't
know what his nil situation is. He I hopefully he
earned a nice payday from that because he was the
main event for the Ohios date defense and he should
be paid like a main eventor because he took a beating.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, I feel like he probably signed a deal with
Tylan all on Sunday or Advil or someone it was.
Yet he was elusive, and you know, we talked about
this a bunch last week, where he's great, really fast,
gets at the speed being incredibly fast, very elusive, but
he needs to not get hit like that because he
(01:09):
doesn't slide, he doesn't avoid hits and the.
Speaker 3 (01:11):
Ohio State defense.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Sometimes he was able to kind of dodge around them,
but a lot of times it was just kind of
sunny styles reaching one hand out and grabbing him and
saying not so fast, my friend, and flipping him around
in the air, and then Taiwan Malone landing on him.
I have several sequences of pictures of Demon Williams where
it's like, I, you know, I know everyone grows up
(01:34):
dreaming of being a college quarterback. Like that does not
look like a whole lot of fun to me watching
Taiwan Malone and Cayden MacDonald and Kayden Curry land on
you a whole bunch of times like, No, that doesn't
look like all that much fun.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
So I want to start I'll start off with by
talking about Kayden Curry. And we talked about him plenty
after the game and why wouldn't he eleven tackles, ninth
star those five tackles for lost three sacks and watching
this and watching him specifically, he had some incredible plays
and everybody talks about you. He's a grinder, he's a
hard worker, he never gives up. He had some very
(02:13):
athletic plays in this game where he's lunging for ball carriers,
he's able to bring guys down. He's he's also showing
his intelligence. There's one play where, one play after he
sacks him on Williams, he's outside on the edge and
he steps further out because he sniffs out a wide
receiver screen and he's like, hey, we got this going
(02:34):
on over here, let's pay attention to it. Then he's
there making that play as well. He was everywhere. He
was a middle linebacker at defensive end and pointing stuff out,
making tackles, tackling ball carriers, tackling receivers over the middle.
It was impressive to watch. There should be a just
(02:54):
maybe maybe I'll do it just to cut up of
all of his plays from the Saturday's game, because it's
a clinic on what an All American defensive end should
look like. And yet we only get focused on that.
We'll get so focused on sacks. It's like, yeah, he
had a bunch of those, but he was everywhere. He
(03:14):
was a complete player on Saturday and it was fun
to rewatch as well. Well.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
There was a sequence where Washington had first in gold
the two and the sequence was first and goal to two.
Cayden Curry tackle for loss second in gold three false start,
second and goal at the eight, Caden Curry tackle for loss,
third and goal at the nine, r VL Ree's tackle
for una scramble for no gain or maybe a yard
or something like that. And you go from first and
goal at two to kicking a field goal.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
From about the ten.
Speaker 2 (03:42):
And it was just the defensive front and specifically Cayden Curry,
and they just they just predominate. And Curry was just
so impressive in so many different ways. You mentioned, you know,
three sacks, five tackles for loss, those are both enormous numbers,
but he had just it was just so many different.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
Ways he was impacted. Well, there was one where they.
Speaker 4 (04:02):
Washington was setting up a screen and I think.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
The running back just kind of didn't get out there
quite in time or was covered, and Kaden Curry's in
there so fast. You know, they'd let you go by
on a on a screen, but you're not generally getting
let you know, letting the get go by, and just
being in there so fast. He was in there immediately
on DeMont Williams were as soon as it wasn't exactly
ready and exactly the right time. Boom DeMont Williams on
(04:26):
the ground with Kat and curR on top of him.
Speaker 3 (04:28):
It was just so so quick.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
He he was just so dominant kind of throughout the game,
even more so than watching on TV than watching live.
Watching live, it was like, Wow, it feels like Kayten
Curry's had a pretty good game.
Speaker 3 (04:40):
And the watch on TV and it, holy smokes, you went.
Speaker 2 (04:43):
It went from Kaden Curry had a pretty good game
to this is right up there. You comped this after
the game to the JC two Moloa Penn State game
and yeah, I mean you can you can see it
watching watching wide, you know, watching the TV copy and
getting to see the whole field.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
Man, it is.
Speaker 2 (04:59):
It was a a incredible performance right right up there
with some of the best in Ohio State defensive line history.
All Right, so we'll go to let's talk I guess
maybe more a little bit about the pass rush on
the whole where you know, my view on the field,
I'm down on the field and I'm watching the pass
rush kind of come towards me. But I've got a
(05:19):
bunch offensive linemen in the way, and you know, and
so it's kind of hard to tell exactly why stuff
hasn't happening.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
I was.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
I was surprised several times throughout the day that the
pass rush wasn't getting there quite as quickly as I
thought it might against this Washington offensive line. And then
you go back and rewatch and it's like, well, they're
being real, real cautious. They're they're not focused as much
on getting home on the pass rush as they were
unjust containing Demond Williams. Don't let Demond Williams get out
(05:46):
of the pocket, get loose. They did a fantastic job
of that kept him very much fenced in the whole game.
But then also you're keeping him fenced in, and then
the coverage down field is so good that then you
get the sacks anyway, So you're not rushing reckless, you're
not getting out of your lane, you're not losing contained
on the pocket, but you still, because of the coverage downfield,
(06:07):
was were able to get home and end up with.
Speaker 3 (06:09):
What six acts or whatever it was.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
So you know that that was as complete a holistic
defensive performance and game plan as you're going to see
where it was. Yeah, the defensive line was great. The
defensive line did a great job getting him to the ground,
and I'm kind of including RVL Reese in that, but
it's also because the coverage downfield was so good. There
(06:31):
were guys open, there work places to go with the ball.
So he's standing there patting the ball and he doesn't
have a place to run, he doesn't have a place
to throw, and then eventually the rush gets home and
that's you know, if you can do that, that really
you know, that was sort of the ideal game plan
for this. And it was like, well, I mean, sure,
if they could do this and they could just not
let guys go open and not let him get over
(06:51):
and then be able to get to him, Like yeah, sure,
that would be great, but I mean, like, come on,
we don't live in fantasy land.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Then that would never happen.
Speaker 4 (06:57):
And then you just sat there and watched it happen
for most of the game.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
Yeah. The one place it seemed like they were allowed
to just tear after Demond Williams is up the middle,
and in watching previous Washington games, that's where he struggled.
If there's somebody in his face, he's gonna have trouble.
And then if if they are opportunities for him to
escape that well, in Ohio State's spying him, so r
Vel Reese or Sunny Styles is going to keep him
from getting a big gain. But there's a play where
(07:21):
like Edrick Houston just drops out on an edge and
it's just like if he comes here, I got him.
Like there's there's no pass rest there. You're just waiting
for it and they're just playing as a unit perfectly.
Then when they did get some sacks, there are times
Kenyana Jackson was only credited with one. I know probably
should have had more than that. And I do question
(07:42):
some of the score keeping on this because I think
one of Caden McDonald's sacks, Kanyanna Jackson was there and
maybe r Vel Reese was there and Caden McDonald was
the last guy in, but he knocked everybody down, so
I think there's you know what, we'll just give it
to Caiden McDonald. I think there was some just like
I don't know who to give a sack to. You
(08:03):
can only credit it to two people, but there are
three or four people there, what do we do? And
it's it doesn't matter, you know, there's the home stack
keeping it just whatever. And when there's just so many guys,
it's like, well, who's the last guy you saw who
what number did you notice? And we'll just go with
that because there were times where you could have given
it to three different people, except you can't.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Yeah, so that's why Jordan Kovac's got four sacks.
Speaker 3 (08:28):
No, I'm exact. Sorry, there's there's a deep cut for you.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
You know, the one that came out of Jackson did
get credited for with that was a great example of
what I was talking about with sort of the discipline
pass rush where he kind of comes in and.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
He doesn't just go blasting in.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
He kind of, you know, slows down a little bit,
keeps Williams in front of him, and then Williams kind
of goes, crap, I can't throw the ball and like
pulls it down, and then ken Yata kind of pounces
on him and and takes him down. It was it
was a very very good performance overall by the defensive line.
And you know, I think you're seeing a different enough
(09:04):
defensive line this year that Yeah, some of it's probably
partly players, but I think there's just a lot of
just scheme and they're just doing stuff differently, and they're
certainly diversifying their fronts this year. The defensive line is
I think maybe most improved to me on this year's team.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Yeah, I think this is the biggest, the most pleasant
surprise on the team is the defensive line. One of
those guys we talked about is Will Smith Junior, who
had a nice play in this one. Got up Field,
got his hand on Williams, slowed him down. He's another
guy that continues to in limited reps. He's just different
(09:41):
than everybody else in terms of, like, you know, the
body types of the guys that you're watching are all big,
and then you see like somebody a little bit smaller
making a play and it's like, oh, yeah, Will Smith.
I remember him from the last time he made a
play in a previous game. And he's putting together and
he's building these things, these performances up and I assume
he's go to continue to get rewarded for that. But
(10:03):
when they there are times where they're only playing three
defensive linemen and Kayden Curry is a nose tackle. We
talked about this before the season, that there are ways
to get around a lack of depth up front, and
they're doing a fantastic job of that, and yet they're
also still building that depth because Will Smith has been
(10:24):
playing well. I thought Taiwan Malone had some good, good
moments in this game. I know we're all waiting for
Edrick Houston. He's still young, he hasn't been a defensive
tackle for an entire year yet. Does need to clean
up the penalties, as we know, but he's the guy
that I see. You're not seeing much from him now
in terms of anything. Wow, But I'm not ready to
(10:44):
write him off at this point. And we'll see what
happens with Jason Moore returns. He was not on the
availability report if I recall correctly this past week.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yeah, he was there.
Speaker 1 (10:54):
Yeah, So like, can he start doing something? And you know,
can Jark request Carter started doing something? So I feel
decent about the way things are going for this defensive
line on the interior and the fact that Jonah Coleman,
the running back, he averaged five yards a carry or so,
but half of that came on one carry. So when
(11:17):
you can sure eliminate the big runs, but if you're
limiting somebody like that to ninety five percent of his
carries three yards or less, then that's a pretty good
performance by a defensive line.
Speaker 3 (11:30):
Yeah, for sure, it was.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Coleman had I think basically three yards of carry outside of.
Speaker 3 (11:34):
The one long one that he had and Demon.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Williams finished with negative twenty something yards Russia. I mean
that in and of itself, that's a winning performance right there.
And you know, you give up zero touchdowns for the
for the second time all season.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
It's you know, that's that's not a bad not a
bad way to go.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Other side of the ball, I have a good thing
and a bad thing with the tight ends. The good
thing is Max Clayer is blocking. Sort of a topic
of conversation earlier. It felt like he had some good
blocks on the edge. There's one in particular that jumped
out to me. It was kind of like a swing
pass to Brandon Innis where Clayer got out there, but
he had I think they maybe singled him out for
(12:14):
something on another block earlier in the broadcast. It just
it feels like, you know, maybe that was an effort
thing or something, or a technique thing that got cleaned up.
Speaker 3 (12:23):
But that feels like that's good.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
On the other side, I think there's too much thirteen personnel.
I think there's I think you're seeing you know, you're
in the goal line and you're in thirteen personnel or
fourteen personnel, Like you could just put Jeremiah Smith out there,
and Jeremiah Smith's going to take one defender with him,
or he's going to take two defenders with him. If
you take two defenders, it's a numbers advantage. If he
takes one defender with him, it's a touchdown. You should
(12:47):
throw him the football. So the same thing for Carnel Tait, Like,
I know they like the heavy sets and the short
yardage and the goal line and all that kind of stuff.
And I'm gonna talk to Ross Spolton about that on
a morning show this week.
Speaker 3 (12:59):
I want to ask him about it as well.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
But to me, I look at this and it's just
it just feels like you've got these guys, and it's
great that you've got all these tight ends, and it's
great that you're coming up with all these creative ways
to use them. But also your wide receiver, you know,
it's the old Jim Tressel. Why are you not throwing
the ball at the tight end? Well, because then I'm
not throwing it to Ted Guinner Santonio Holmes. Why are
you playing three tight ends? Because then you have to
(13:22):
take Carnel Tate or Jeremiah Smith off the field like
it just feels.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
To me like, yep, that's you.
Speaker 2 (13:29):
You are as a former quarterback as your head coach
and a former wide receiver as your offensive coordinator.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
It feels like.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
They should be more you know, pass heavy, wide receiver
heavy and there it's like they've almost over corrected the
other direction. It's good and it's working sometimes, but the
struggles in the short yardage, I feel like maybe you
need to mix it up and try something else because
it's not working, and especially in those kind of short
goal line situations.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
Yeah, and you really tell the defense what's coming.
Speaker 3 (13:59):
Now.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
The side of that is when you throw out of it,
as they did to C. J. Donaldson, it catches them
off guard and Jelannie Fairman was opened on that play
as well. But I'm with you. When you compact everything,
it just makes it harder to run. And it's at
times to be counterintuitive, but yeah, we're gonna run the ball,
so we need as many big bodies as possible. Well,
(14:20):
then let's bring all the big bodies, including the defense
as well, and see if it gets any easier, because
it's not going to and well, you're just trying to
get two yards and it's like, well, that's not easy
when everybody's in there, is it? With the first failed
fourth down on the first drive, we know Nate Roberts
missed that block. He could have gone into the hole
(14:41):
and CJ. Donaldson presumably would have followed him. I Nate
Roberts improved got the block on the subsequent CJ. Donaldson
touchdown on the ground, So that was a nice improvement
by him. You know, just true freshman tight end that
you're playing at fullback, you can't expect it to go perfectly.
And so when you play you have fourteen personnel at
(15:01):
times or thirteen fourteen when he's in there, you're asking
a lot of a true freshman. And they did it
against Texas and it worked. That was they scored on that,
But yeah, I wonder what their success rate is on
that and how r I day? And maybe we'll talk
to him about it on Tuesday, Like how do you
feel about those packages? Those heavy sets? Are you getting
(15:22):
what you want? And if you aren't, is it because
of the blocking? Is it because at times CJ. Donaldson
is too upright? Does Bo Jackson need to be more
involved in those packages? You know he'll get you down
inside the ten, but then they don't necessarily give it
to him inside the ten because that's the CJ. Donaldson territory.
So I'd be interested to know how he feels about it,
(15:43):
and he's probably not. I don't feel great because we're
not scoring as much, and it's like, well, why not?
And are you going to do anything about it? Or
are you just going to continue to Well, eventually, I'm
sure the heavy sets will work, you know, we're just
gonna keep doing it until it works. And it's like, well,
what if it doesn't? What if it doesn't work? And
what if CJ. Donaldson continues to run high towards the
goal line and you are not as successful as you need?
(16:07):
Would you? Would you would behoove you to spread things
out maybe and light in the box and then run
from there.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:15):
I think that that's something that they're probably looking at
right now because if it's not working, and obviously it's
not working to the level they want it to, then
you owe it to yourself to try and figure out, Okay, why.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Do you need to do what you're doing and.
Speaker 4 (16:28):
Just do it harder or better or whatever, or do
you need.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
To look at something else? And I'm sure they're looking
at all of that stuff right now, you.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
Know, because I think we're still waiting for the Ohio
State running game to be good, you know, be very good.
And right now they're fifth into Big ten five point
three yards per carry, which you know is fine for
it's fine, but what they'd like it to do is
(16:56):
get higher than that because because of explosives, and they've
not yet done that. And when you look at this
game and the long play is what nineteen yards? That's
that's not going to get it done over the course
of the season. So it'll be interesting to see what
they can do to open up the explosive plays on
the ground and do they have the guys that can
(17:17):
do that. And we've seen Bo Jackson with a sixty
four yard or whatever in Game two I think it was,
And can they get more out of that? CJ. Donaldson,
he was a big play guy as a true freshman.
Hasn't necessarily been that yet. We haven't seen that from
James people's yet. Is this scheme is it? You know,
player is an execution that you know, That's one of
(17:37):
the things that Ryan Day talks about, is it coaching
is an execution? Is a scheme. You got to figure
that out. So I just said, I'm sure they're working
on it. One of the things that I did like
was the adjustment to Washington playing back. Then they started
throwing it short the touchdown passed to Jeremiah Smith at
the end of the first half. They didn't wait until
halftime to make their adjustment perfection, and they're just dragging
(18:02):
in front of the you know, behind the line of
scrimmage so that there could be some downfield blocking and
everybody executed their blocks perfectly, and was a third and
sixteen or something like that. He basically just you know,
third and twelve and he just walked into the end zone.
And I thought that was a perfect play called perfect execution,
perfect design. And you know, they held it and they
(18:22):
called it at the right time.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
Yeah, And I you know, I think you saw a
lot of kind of uncharacteristic stuff from Ryan Walters.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
We talked about the fact that they.
Speaker 4 (18:32):
Just were man man man man man like, single high
man like.
Speaker 3 (18:34):
It was really kind of almost the in a lot
of cases.
Speaker 2 (18:38):
They played basically the twenty nineteen Ohio State defense, where
it's kind of single high man coverage where a pressman team.
You mean, you remember all these things, and they kind
of got away from a lot of that against Ohio State.
But yeah, definitely the touchdown Jerremi Smithy, they figured out, Okay,
this is what you're going to do. You know, this
(18:58):
is this is how you're gonna beat what they're in
and they caught him in something that was gonna you know,
it was a great a.
Speaker 3 (19:04):
Great well, a great call there.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
And you know, I mean that was as one man
route as a one man route can be because it
was Jeremiah Smith and everyone else is blocking. So it
was the ball's going to Jeremiah Smith, so I hope
he's open, but if he's not, the ball going to
Jeremiah Smith.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
So yeah, that was that was a that was a
good call.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I want to go back to defense, you know what,
Let's talk about offense one more time. They were a
couple times rewatching that there were guys open that Julian
Saying could have thrown the ball to. There was an
out and up that Caleb or that Jeremiah Smith had
that he was like open open, and you know there
was some pressure and so that probably factored into not
being able to get it out there. But there were
(19:45):
there were times there were guys open downfield that the
ball didn't come out. And I don't know if that's
the coaching staff trying to have them be cautious and
you know, don't take a shot unless you're really sure
about it, or if that's just Julian saying.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
Being a little bit risk averse right now, because.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
As you said earlier, with no one of you know,
one of the guys being sort of young, it's it's
you know, you're you're sort of learning.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
It's a little bit of a progression.
Speaker 2 (20:08):
It's gonna be he is not a finished product right now,
so you're gonna you're gonna see him get more confident
and more comfortable with everything as he gets more reps
throughout the course of the season. But there was some
stuff there that the Buckeyes didn't take.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
And you know, if.
Speaker 2 (20:24):
You're if you're struggling to get explosive plays, you want
to take your shots when you have your opportunities to
get explosive plays.
Speaker 3 (20:31):
You don't want to be the you.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
Know, I think I think Bryce Underwood for Michigan is
almost the other way where Bryce Underwood is going to
take his shots. And if there are two defenders down
there and only one of guys from Michigan.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
Well, that's fine. He's gonna throw it down there.
Speaker 2 (20:43):
And I don't think they've completed any of them yet,
but he is going to take his shots. Julian sayin
feels like he's kind of at the other end of
things where he's gonna be cautious and if the guy's open,
you know, and.
Speaker 4 (20:53):
And he's got time, he'll get it down there.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
But otherwise he's gonna be cautious, he's gonna check it
down and and they'll kind of, you know, just kind
of keep moving and try and be efficient on offense.
Speaker 3 (21:03):
Is much more so than the explosive.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
Yeah, And I think it was Ross Fulton, one of
our exes and nose guru's at Bucke Huddle, who said
that there are four or five shots that saying could
have taken that he didn't and the All twenty two
will tell you more. But I do wonder going back
to the Texas I think it was the Texas Star
to Cardell Tate. I asked Julian saying about that, and
(21:27):
they were, like, we talked about it before the drive,
that we're going to take a shot. And I wonder
if are they are they doing that at this point?
Are they not doing that like we're taking a shot,
like we need you to pull this trigger, And is
this just they're they're not as emphatic about it right
now because they feel pretty good about the defense. So
(21:49):
it's like, well, if it's there, take it. If you
don't think it's there, don't worry about it, check it down.
We'll live to fight another day. And is this a
case where they need to be more emphatic about it,
like we're doing this and as long as you get
the look clearly you know you're you're not gonna throw
in a double triple. You're not gonna throw it a
triple coverage. There are times throwing in a double coverage
with Jeremiah Smith isn't really double coverage. And I think
(22:09):
that's one of the things that Julian Say needs to
recognize better, which I think he will. What he's had
more than you know, four starts under his belt, and
all of these are learning experiences and he'll go back
and I'm sure he's looking at film and he's like, Okay,
I see, I see what I could have done here,
and I'll know to be able to do that next time.
And I know we see college football nerds on Twitter
(22:34):
being critical of Julian saying's deep passing and the lack
of it, and we talked about that against was It
Texas where there are virtually no deep throws until that
one to Carnal Tay And so that has been a pattern.
But so far it's been effective enough. And they they
did attack with the passing game in second half, and
(22:56):
if you're not going to give anything up deep, then
you can just you know, by a thousand cuts and
it worked and they scored on just by every drive
in the second half. So Brian Day wants to get
those deep shots going. I just wonder do they is
this something where they need to focus on it more
and emphasize it more and say, hell or high water,
we're doing this.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, you do wonder if And because if you're leaving
it up to him and he's not pulling the trigger
and you want him to pull the trigger, then you
know you probably have to change the approach a little bit.
And you know, as you said, you don't want to
go into it saying no matter what you're throwing this route,
no matter what you see, that's not that's not a
(23:38):
good approach because sometimes you'll do that and you're not
going to get the coverage, you're not going to get
the look you're expecting. Right, They talked about that after
the game all the time. Yeah, we had something and
we didn't get the look we wanted. And so if
you don't get the look you wanted, then don't throw it. Understood,
But I think you need to go in and say, listen,
unless you see the Jeremiah Smith bracket out on us play,
(24:01):
or unless you see they're in cover three or let
whatever whatever the in less is, pull the trigger, throw
the ball. We we will live with if you're thrown in,
you throw it in incompletion, or you throw an interception,
we'll live with it. We think it's worth it for this.
You may just sort of need to change your approach there.
And you know, at that point, if you're.
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Julian saying, and you're you're trying to be a.
Speaker 2 (24:24):
Little bit risk averse because you constantly it's drilled into
you don't turn the ball over. Then okay, if they
tell you that, then it's not on you, then it's
on them. It's on the you know, coaching softball constantly
you're trying to have a runner go first to third
and if they get thrown out a third, you tell
them it's on me.
Speaker 4 (24:45):
It's the coaches to the coaches say.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
You know, I'm going to tell you what to do
and if and if it doesn't work out, it's on me,
it's not on you. That's the same thing with this.
You can you can tell them, look, we want to
take a shot in this situation. If you get X,
look whatever, don't otherwise pull the trigger and it's on
us if it doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
And one last thing on Julian's saying, second week in
a row, he's thrown the ball over the middle and
had it tipped at the line. That's it'll be interesting
to see if that becomes something that is pops up
at the worst times, because again we know he's not
the tallest guy, so they're gonna be linemen who are
just waiting to knock the ball down as they continue
(25:28):
to scout that. So I think buck guys got away
with it. That was the completion to Jelanie Thurman, and
it was still completed, but it got tipped the line.
So just something to watch there.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Yeah, and you know he's not you know he is
not six foot five, which is you know, that's fine,
but that this is kind of one of the and
he doesn't throw the ball from you know, a super
super high release point, which you know his release is quick,
so you're not going to change that, but you just
you're gonna have to deal with the fact that, you know,
unless you get him out there on stilt's like one
(25:59):
of the Savannah bananas, like, you're going to probably get
some tip balls from time to time. It is what
it is, you know, this is this is something that
I think has been priced into the quarterback decision where
he brings all this other stuff, you know, great decision making,
quick release, you know, strong arm, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3 (26:16):
You know, he's not he's not.
Speaker 2 (26:17):
Six foot six, but he also moves pretty well. We
think we saw that a couple times as well, so
that all that's kind of baked in, I think to
that decision. One thing I did want to get back
to on the defensive side of the ball is Caleb Downs.
He only hit two tackles on the day, but they
were both immensely important. You know, you feel like he
takes things away from the defense on plays where he's
(26:37):
not getting tackled because the defense is going not going
over there.
Speaker 3 (26:41):
But there's also both of his plays. One of them
ended a drive.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
It was kind of a play on the edge where
it was just an open field tackle and just boom.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Just brought him, brought him down, never a doubt.
Speaker 2 (26:52):
We talked on the postgame show about Davis Nigguinos and
had an open field tackle on a running back who
was like, Oh, he might be out, Nope, he's already down.
How did he get down that fast? And it was
just incredibly good tackling. But David Snigbinosen, Caleb Downs had
one like that, and then he had one where Jonah
Coleman was kind of inside the five. It looked like
maybe they were going in for a touchdown. Coleman kind of,
(27:13):
you know, was like maybe gonna get the edge and
then boom, he's on the ground immediately. Just two really
really good, impactful open field tackles. One ended a drive,
one kept Washington out of the end zone, and a
drive where I think they ended up kicking a field goal. So,
you know, Caleb Downs only two tackles, how much should
he impact the game? Like?
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Well, turns out it was a bunch.
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Yeah, Lorenzo Styles also had a nice tackle inside the ten,
but yeah, Caleb Downs. I'm trying to like, what is
what is a good analogy? Is it like a hockey
defenseman who just shuts down somebody keeps them from the
getting the puck, They can't do anything with it, and
you never see the guy, you never notice them. And
yet everybody was like, yeah, this guy, the impact that
(27:53):
he had on this game. You may not understand it,
but everybody playing the game does everybody trying to play
the game. Does the offense and Demand Williams and Jonah
Coleman and Jed Fish all understand the impact that cayleb
Downs had in that one and you know, well two tackles.
I mean, is he even all big ten? And you know,
for the people who just look at the stats, they're
(28:14):
probably going to say, well, he's overrated. And you had
to watch him running around and ask the offensive people
if they feel like he's overrated because they're always having
to keep an eye on him and the competitive excellence.
When his number is called, he's making that tackle and boom,
he's right there. Kind of like this separate but similar
(28:35):
didn't really hear much from Jermaine Matthews in this game,
and it's like did he play. It's like, yeah, I
saw him. He gave up a couple of catches here
and there on that, but like other than that, you'd
never heard from him. And they're just like he was
out there, I promise you, but there was the ball
never you know, Like, like I said, he gave up
a couple of catches, but outside of that, there was
(28:58):
no involvement from him because he was doing his job.
Speaker 2 (29:01):
Yeah, it's funny you started talking about that, and I thought,
you know, I thought the same thing about Jermaine Matthews,
and I looked up his stats as you were talking,
and then you got to Jermaine Masthews and I thought.
Speaker 3 (29:08):
Well, good news.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
I already know he had two tackles on the game
because it was it was the same thing. He was
a really really quiet day from him, which as a
corner it's like being a long snapper. If you don't
hear your name all day, that's a good thing. That
means nothing bad is happening. So yeah, he was really
solid all day. Jermaine Matthews had as many tackles in
the game as Aaron Scott did. Aaron Scott did not
(29:29):
play on defense. Aaron Scott had two great tackles on
kick coverage. He had Washington only returned.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
No, it doesn't say Washington.
Speaker 2 (29:40):
I think returned two or three kickoffs, and Aaron Scott
had had tackles on two of them and they were
both like again, really good open field tackles. And you know,
I think to me, Tony, the question is, do you
think he can beat out Austin Mockerman for the starting
quarterback job next year?
Speaker 1 (30:01):
Perhaps we shall see. It's it's too early and way
way too soon, Tom, still too soon. One of the
last things I have is when you go back and
we watch this, this is a fun rewatch for the defense.
There are times where it's just perfection. Everybody is covered,
the spies are spying. Uh, there's nowhere for demand Williams
(30:24):
to go with the ball, and it's just like, well,
why did he get sacked six times? Because there's nowhere
to go with the ball and everybody was covered. Very
impressed by that, Uh, not so impressed Tom by the broadcast.
And we don't we don't need to harp on it
too much.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
But yeah, I have this too, yep, you know, like.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Jackson Corville getting getting a graphic for an unsportsman like
that was shocking from a from a backup kicker. You
got to get these guys under control. And of course
the talking about Sonny Styles with the rental Styles Junior's
picture up on the screen. That was just a couple
of things. But not I used to love brad Nessler
(31:04):
and Gary Danielson one of my all time favorites. I
don't clearly the fastball is no longer there not a
great overall product from what is your number one team
for CBS.
Speaker 2 (31:17):
Yeah, the broadcast itself just in terms of camera shots,
Like the picture was good, The camera shit, they had
some greats that they think they did a nice job
capturing sort of the atmosphere around Washington.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
You you, I think people.
Speaker 2 (31:31):
Who were sitting at home probably went, hey, that looks
really pretty and having been there, yaha, So they did
a nice job with that. But yeah, I mean we
talked about this on a show. I don't remember why
we were watching the CBS broadcast last week. Was it
a rewatch of a Washington game or something like that,
but it was it was very much a or maybe
the Michigan game, but it was just you kind of
(31:52):
went like oh Nessler and Daniel centers like really lost
a step and Danielson announced that this is going to
be his last year, which, you know, congratulations, great career,
we understand. So, you know, I think it's you can
nit pick a broadcast and it's a live TV and
stuff happens. But you know, to the guy in the
(32:14):
truck who's punching up the chirun with ninety six, like
the defense is out there. One of the ninety six
is is on defense and one of the ninety.
Speaker 3 (32:21):
Six is is a on special teams?
Speaker 2 (32:23):
Which one do you think it is? And the graphic
with Sunny styles and Lorenzo styles, that's not something that's
getting made on the fly in the middle of the broadcast.
That was right at the beginning of the broadcast. It
was obviously a pre produced thing. Six people looked at that,
eight people looked at that before it went on the air,
and no one caught the fact that nope, that's the
wrong styles.
Speaker 3 (32:43):
And again, like this stuff happened.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
I remember when I think it was when the MLB
All Star Game was in Cleveland a.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
Few years ago.
Speaker 2 (32:51):
They had, you know, they had a graphic with like
Jacob de Grom and you know, he's the starting pitcher
or something, and they put up a picture of Jeff Wickney,
who was also a white guy with kind of scruffy
pacial hair and long hair, but you know, very much
not Jacob de Gram And it's like.
Speaker 3 (33:07):
How did that not get caught?
Speaker 2 (33:08):
But sometimes it doesn't get caught. But yeah, it was
just or your number one broadcast. As you said, like
the attention to detail on some of that stuff needs
to needs to be a little Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:18):
I was eaves dropping a little bit on their pre
production meeting in near the photo room on Saturday, and
they were talking about we got this drone chat, we
got that drone shot. We're gonna have this nice drone
chat coming in. Drone shots were fantastic. A little bit
more attention to the details and the fact that you
do you do this sport. You know there are double
numbers and you need to know, okay, which numbers go
(33:41):
with which side of the ball. I mean, it's it's
very simple and just you know, again nitpicking, that's what
we do. We watched the broadcast and take notes because
we didn't get to see it live, and I'm sure
I was told that a lot of that. The Corville
and Style stuff was going and talked about on Twitter
as well. So these are the thing if you don't
want your product and talk poorly about you know, again
(34:07):
the attention to details, and then that wouldn't happen. But
anything else time before we get out of here.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Yeah, if you don't want your project talked about like that,
go play intermurals.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
Brother.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
We talked about this with with the Michigan Monday Show
a few years ago, where we're kind of nitpicking stuff
and people are going, why are you nitpicking so much?
It's like, well, if you want to be at the
level that we're talking about, like if you want to
be the national championship level team, yeah, you're gonna nitpick.
Like yeah, Julian Sand's being been very good. If you
want them to be a national championship team, he's gonna
have to continue to improve. If you want to be
(34:36):
the number one broadcast, you gotta be better like you
got to. You gotta have some attention to detail on
that kind of.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
Stuff if you want to be as good as Gus Johnson.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
Ha ha.
Speaker 1 (34:48):
Well you know what, I don't know if the attention
to details matters as much anymore. Anyway, Anyway, good night everybody.
I want to thank you op for tuning in, if
you could hit the thumbs up before you go, if
you're watching on YouTube, and as always, continue to find
us at buckey huddle dot com. Thank you all for
tuning in, and we'll talk to you all later
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