EP 449: More Playfully Inappropriate with Jared Volle

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Welcome to Episode 449 of The Clean Comedy Podcast! This week, JD welcomes comedian, creative mastermind (M.S. in Creativity and Innovation from Drexel), writer, and motivational speaker Jared Volle to break down comedic creativity and writing. 

Jared's new, amazing book, "Playfully Inappropriate," is a top-notch comedy tool and resource for comedians of all levels. Take your comedy storytelling to the absolute next level. 

Check out Jared's website with free comedy lessons here: http://creativestandup.com/

Check out Jared's book, "Playfully Inappropriate" here: Playfully Inappropriate

This is a money-making episode if you listen and take their advice. You can get more tips on producing comedy shows by picking up a copy of “How To Produce Comedy Shows For Fun & Profit” on Amazon. 

Come see Zane and I! You can see all the tour dates at ZaneLamprey.com

Feel free to email me: jamesdcreviston at GMAIL.COM

Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-clean-comedy-podcast-w-jd-creviston--4825680/support.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, real quick, if you're a clean comedian or trying
to be one, you've got to get on my Clean
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so stop guessing, start growing, go out there, be clean,

(00:21):
get some green. Hey, everybody, welcome to the Clean Comedy Podcast.
Is JD and I have a great guest. He's actually
a return guest, and he wrote a book called Playfully Inappropriate.
It's a good way to teach you how to write comedy.
It's pretty amazing. It's a pretty fun book. I have
the first edition, but he's here with the second edition,
a workbook, a comedy class, and a joke analysis app.

(00:45):
So please get up for mister Jared Bull Joe Jared
with welcome.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
Thank you, am I getting feedback right now. I just
realize that my microphone is.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
He got nothing. We're good, all right?

Speaker 2 (00:57):
Cool? Well, hello, everybody. That's so great to back. I
think it's been like four, four or five years since
I've been on it's been a long time.

Speaker 1 (01:05):
What's crazy about this? So I don't know if you
know this. I don't know if you listened to the podcast,
but this is going to be one of the last
episodes of the actual Queen Comedy podcast and this will
transition to a new podcast just because I lost Luke.
And then there's really like a kind of a stigma
with queen comedy. So it's hard getting guests sometimes because
they don't want to do.

Speaker 2 (01:24):
There's a stigma with clean comedy.

Speaker 1 (01:26):
There is one hundred percent why just there is there's just.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
People really hate comedy that is universally applicable to everybody.
That's that's duiculous. There should be a stigma to dirty
comedy where people like I don't know if I want
to touch that because I want a wider audience. Like
it's so much cooler that you can be funny within
this uh this, you know, this small limitation of being
of being clean, like that is just an amazing thing.

(01:51):
So I don't understand why people would would say, like,
I mean, it's so easy to be dirty, it's so
easy to shock people. You can down the street and naked.
You don't need to say anything that impressive, Like it doesn't.
What is impressive is people like shocking people who can
shock people that are also able to make you feel

(02:15):
like they're being playful and that the joke is harmless.
That impresses me. So I'm impressed by both extremes, like
the Brian Reagans who never say anything bad at all,
Like you know, you just go and walk into any
church in America and that would be fine, Like that
is really impressive that you can do that. But on
the other end of the spectrum, like I've been watching

(02:36):
a lot of Matt Matt Rife lately. He is so
good at at going into the audience and like like
insulting and playing with these like disabled people, but he
is so so good at creating this safe space where
those people actually are happy, like they're they're gaining this

(02:57):
social value because he is interacting with them like anybody else.
And it's just so so cool that there are both
of those extremes. Both of them have created this awesome
balance where where Reagan has a great balance where he's
he's super clean but funny, and then Matt Rife he
is super he's he's so close to offensive but at

(03:20):
the same time, you look at him and you say, like,
this is a good person. He's being harmless right now.
One thing I love about Matt Rife is like you
watch these videos of him, like the audience will maybe
like gave him like one hundred dollars for like a
fan for signing something or something, and he'll take that
hundred dollars and he'll run over to somebody else in

(03:41):
the audience that that he talked to earlier, that needs it,
and he'll just give that money to him. And that's
just such an amazing thing. So we look at this
person and we say, like, what a good, decent person
you are, right, and that is what allows him to
say such things, say you say such awful things at
the same time, because we know that he's being playful,
We know that he is a harmless, good person and

(04:03):
that we trust him to go there.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:06):
Whereas if somebody has no like we have no idea
who you are. You're an open mic comedian and you're
you're starting to talk to a disabled person, I am
I am going to be clinched up and I am
going to be so stressed that you're about to say
something awful.

Speaker 1 (04:21):
Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 2 (04:22):
Being able to create that safe space is just so important,
especially for people that are on that extreme like Matt
Rife where where Rife or Anthony Jesselneck or anything. It
is impressive that you can do that, but I am
equally impressed by the clean comedians that just don't need
to go there as well.

Speaker 1 (04:41):
I agree, No, that's great, and that kind of cuts
us into your book right playfully and appropriate where it
talks about that stuff, where we're talking about the psychology
of humor and a way that people could use this
to get laughs. And that's the thing is, if you're
playful with people, you could say anything to them. I'm
crudently on tour with a comedian named Zane lamp. It's
very funny. You used to have a drinking show called

(05:02):
Drinking Made Easy, three sheets, this kind of stuff, so
he's known as the drinking Guy. He says funny stuff
to people in the audience, but it's done so playfully
that people never get mad. We've never had anyone come
after the show it's like, hey man, you were meaning me,
you're rude or whatever. They always are like, hey man,
that was so much fun. Thank you so much for
including me thanks for whatever. That is such an important factor.

(05:24):
I'm not great at crowd work. I could do a
little crowd work here and there, but it's one of
those things that it scares me because I'm worried I
might say something that might offend somebody unintentionally. You know,
I'm not sayingthing dirty, but I might say something that,
you know, offend him somehow.

Speaker 2 (05:38):
So, yeah, that's totally possible. When you're improvising, you don't
know what's gonna happen. But let me ask you this.
So you know, you could say something potentially inoffensive, but
if that did happen, could you also back out of
it and make it feel playful or make it feel
at least not harmful.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
Yeah, I believe so.

Speaker 2 (05:56):
Like you can say things that are wrong on stage
and it becomes hysterical once you realize it's wrong. I
was once riffing on the I was riffing on the
Declaration of Independence for a good like five or ten minutes,
like we were having fun. And at the end of this,
we're in this college gig, and then at the end

(06:17):
this history major goes you're talking about You're not talking
about the Declaration, You're talking about the Constitution and we
just busted out laughing. We had no idea. We were
talking about the wrong document for like five minutes. It
went over all of our heads. But it was like
this mistake, but that mistake becomes so much more fun
than anything you actually planned.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Right, that's true. I mean that does make that doesn't
make sense.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
So yes, it's not that. It's not that you you.
I don't think you should worry that you might say
something inappropriate, because that could absolutely happen, But you should
trust yourself that in that situation. Let's say I do
say the wrong thing in that situation, do I also
trust myself to get my self out of it? And

(07:01):
if you do trust yourself to get out of it,
then you will give yourself the license to to try
those things.

Speaker 1 (07:08):
I like that. I'm gonna try I'm gonna try that
this weekend when I'm up in Reno and trucky and
doing stuff like That's that's a great that's a great
thing when we do like yeah, just a little.

Speaker 2 (07:16):
Like in the moment, like like okay, so think about
like the last mistake you made on stage, you know,
is like you probably thought up something pretty quick to
get yourself out of it. But if you and I
were to sit here and go, what if I accidentally
did this, then we try to imagine the situation. That's
way harder than just being there and going I said

(07:36):
the wrong thing. Hey, everybody, I said the wrong thing,
and then people start laughing just because you that. I mean,
it's so much easier than we make it out to be.

Speaker 1 (07:44):
Oh, that's true. That's true. So what's the difference between
your second edition? If someone has like the first edition
of your book, what's difference between that edition and the
second edition? What is what are we gaining from this?
What's the Oh?

Speaker 2 (07:54):
Yeah, I rewrote It took about four months or so
of just straight rewriting. There's only I think the introduction
is the same, and then the conclusion is the same,
and then I reworked pretty much everything aside. You'll see
a lot of the same, like examples, some of the
main examples are the same. But really what I was

(08:15):
doing is I was taking I took out all the
things that were I would say, like needlessly complicated, not
needlessly They were correct, but I think they weren't as
helpful as I wanted them to be. And then so
I made a lot of rooms. So I took out
I think I started at two hundred pages. I took
out about one hundred pages, and then I wrote a
new hundred pages or so. Wow, there is there's a
significant difference in the book now. But I was really

(08:40):
focusing on making it easier to apply. So for the
first edition, like I realized going in that this is
such a new way of looking at comedy that I
wanted to back it up with proof, right. I felt
like I didn't want to just say, hey, there's this
brand new thing, and I promised you it works, right,
So there was a lot of science where I was

(09:00):
trying to prove that, yes, this is actually how have
the psychology of a humor, this is how it actually works.
And so for the second edition, I backed off on
that and I said, Okay, I feel like we agree
now that benign violation theory is valid. Let's let's instead
of going hard into like the science, let's make it
more usable. So now I have I did away with

(09:22):
playfully inappropriate juxtaposition questions. Those are called punchline questions. Now.

Speaker 1 (09:30):
I don't know why.

Speaker 2 (09:31):
I don't know why I never thought of that, but
it was like the most easy thing anyway. So that's
the weird thing when you are like in this new
area where nobody has gone before. Like I was literally
asking doctor Peter McGrath, the person who came up with
benign violation theory, like what are other people doing with this?
And he's like, I don't know. I'm like, well, who's

(09:52):
approached to you? He's like nobody. I'm like, okay, something
to work with. So basically, like I would everything along
to him and I would say like, you know, is
this based on your research? Is this a valid way
of doing it? And he'd be like, yeah, looks good
to me. So I just look every time I went
up to him, like I had to just come up
with my own ideas and he would just go yeah,

(10:15):
all right. And so I had to name everything, like
the like the why problem. It's still a called a
why problem because I just don't have a name for it.
But it's just so like the idea that you have
to name terms, right, it's like something you don't think about,
like like that's just what it's called. But I've like
I've spent a day trying to figure out a better

(10:35):
word for why problem, and I just don't know's it's
just like this stupid term that I recognize. It's a
dumb term too, but that's all I got. So anyway,
so yeah, I renamed a lot of that stuff just
to make it easier. There's new examples. I passed it
along to some stand up comedy teachers and I had

(10:58):
them provide some feedback. They said, like, the way that
I teach finding finding comedic inspiration was really good, So
I ex I expanded that area of the book. And
so yeah, there's a lot of changes within the book
that I even like posted it. So I gave it.
I gave both copies to chat Cept and I'm like,

(11:20):
what's different, And of course Chatchipt just does the stupidest
analysis ever where they're like, well you use a different font,
and I'm like, oh, thank you. I will be sure
to post that into the.

Speaker 1 (11:33):
So there's also now a work book for it. Is that, yes,
and so's the what's the idea behind that?

Speaker 2 (11:41):
The idea mind that is so like I when I
was creating the first edition, I had all of these
these exercises that I wanted to put inside and I
really loved, like you know, like in chapter I think
chapter twelve or thirteen. This is where I really get
down into how to use the playfully inappropriate method with

(12:05):
your your conventional jokes. So there's only one chapter of
that book that is really giving people what they thought
they were getting, right, Like, I'm giving you the story,
I'm showing there is so much more that you don't
even you know, these are answers to questions that we
haven't been asking. So for the majority of the book,
I'm just loving how we can expand on this idea

(12:28):
and storytelling. But then there's this one chapter where I
dive down into the like twenty different kinds of jokes
out there, And so for those people, I wanted to
have a bigger guide where I can actually show you like, okay,
step one, two, three, four, And so I break down.
I do the same thing I did in the book.

(12:49):
I will, except for I give you an actual step
by step guide now okay. So it's sort of like
splitting the splitting the difference. So in the main book,
it's all about flexibility. It's all about out here's what
the audience is actually responding to, and here is a
way that you can give them what they want without
needing to worry about joke structure or any of that. Okay,

(13:12):
So the main book, it defines a quality punchline as
a playfully inappropriate surprise. So anytime you give an audience
a playfully inappropriate surprise, then it has a very very
good chance of making the audience laugh, right, And the
reason is because of benign violation theory. And so yeah,

(13:32):
chapter one we just go deep into how that works.
So the main book is super super flexible, but I
also recognize that for a brand new comedian that flexibility
can be really scary, and so I wanted to provide
a way for people say, like, Okay, I understand that
I will at some point in my life want this flexibility,

(13:53):
but what if I don't want it right now? And
so the workbook is really for those people who who
they want a system for writing different kinds of jokes
and something that's going to scale with you. So you
have a system for each joke. But also it's the
same system, but it's applied in a different way. So
I'm using the exact same steps. So like you know,

(14:16):
you like you read here's how to write a broken assumption,
Here's how to write an exaggeration joke or whatever. What
I did is I made everything into the same number
of steps and the same types of steps, but I
show you a different way of going through. And this
is the reason I did this is because this is
what feels right, psychologically right. It does not make sense

(14:40):
that somewhere in your brain there is a circuit that
just handles exaggeration, jokes or something. No, there is a
humor circuit in the brain, and we trigger it in
different ways. And so what I'm doing there is what
I'm doing is saying, okay, here is exactly what triggers
it right, playfully inappropriate surprises. But there are many different
ways to trigger. And instead of just giving you twenty

(15:02):
ways to write twenty jokes, I'm gonna give you one
way that you can master. You can find your own
comedic voice. Right. You don't need to worry about you
don't need to worry about what type of joke you're
even writing until like the like I think the step
four or so, so I mean like you're going through
the same steps and you get to be you and

(15:22):
then at the very end, you're you're you're you're asking
yourself a different punchline question, You're getting a different punchline answer,
and then you're you're, you're, you're, you already have your punchline.
And what's great about that is that we don't need
to reference all of these external rules about how things
should be in order to write the joke right, because

(15:43):
too many rules and you shut down right in life,
in writing, in wherever, Like, the more rules somebody puts
on you, the more stressed you are, and the harder
it is just to be right. So that's not what
I want. I feel like the more rules, Like as
a as a comedy teacher, giving you rules is the
easiest thing I can do. The easiest thing for me

(16:05):
is to know exactly where you are at any given second,
so I can tell you what to do. That's the
easiest thing for me. The hardest thing is giving you
one system and then saying, all right, here's the way
it works. Here's twenty different ways of using this, of
creating these jokes and have fun.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
That's I like that because the fact that you're saying,
you know, I give you the same steps over and
over again. The only thing that changes. At a certain
step you're deciding what type of joke you're doing, and
then you're going there repetition will make it so your
brain knows, Okay, this is how I start to write
a joke. This is where I get to and now
I need to decide what filter I'm putting it through
and boom, here's the punchline.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
Right, so that's right, right, and then yeah, and I
would even push back on the on the ondeciding, there
is no decision, it's feeling. It feels good to me
right now. If you're deciding to me, that just deciding
means I'm gonna sit down, I'm gonna survey, and it
just feels like not a not an emotional process. Creativity
and humor are both emotional processes and hand not. That's

(17:05):
why I say in the book the most productive thing
you could possibly do when you're writing is be playful.
That's it. Yeah, Once you're in that emotion, like, you
can take any premise or whatever, and if you bring
enough playfulness into it, you're gonna find something fun. But
at the same time, if you actually want to, I mean,

(17:26):
you could have the world's easiest slam dunk premise. If
you're in a bad mood, you are gonna butcher that joke. Yeah,
So the most productive thing to do is be in
a good mood. It's so it's simple.

Speaker 1 (17:39):
Now here's the other question. I know that the new
book is on Amazon as a ebook. Is the workbook
at some point going to be ebook? I know that
you probably want people to handwrite them there, but if there.

Speaker 2 (17:48):
Is, it's it's gonna be handwritten. Yeah. Yeah, I feel
like I want people actually in like diving down and
actually working through this book. There are there are like
fifty to fifty there's there's jokes where you're there's or
there's exercises where you're actually writing down and you're you're
inside the book. And then there's a lot of exercises
about like go to YouTube, watch this sketch, watch this comedy. Uh,

(18:12):
and then let's let's talk about the difference things that
we can learn from you know, from from this, from
this cliff.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
For me, it's for me. The only reason I'm asking
is because when I write stuff, I I can't read
my own handwriting, So I don't write out jokes anymore.
I'll talk them out or type them out. So be
like if I had it, I could be doing it
on an airplane and then talking out or typing it
out or something like that. So make it easier, and
I'm not my chicken scratch is unreadable to myself afterwards
for some for some terrible reason, I don't know what.

(18:42):
My wife says that all the time. Now, now you
also have your online comedy course and then you also
have a joke analysis app. So let's talk about the
course first. Is the course use everything from playfully inappropriate
to get there? And like what is the what is
that core look like for like a new community.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
So there's actually there's there's a course which has been
available for a long time now, uh, and that that
follows through the best of that one's called faster and Fundier,
but it uses the best of faster and fundier and
playfulle inappropriate. So that's Scott that walks you through everything
that you need.

Speaker 1 (19:18):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (19:19):
There's also an online comedy class that's going to be
starting a live comedy class that will be starting here
probably next month. I've been for the last like three
months or so, I've been going back and forth with
with different with students that are interested in taking the class,
figuring out exactly what they want from the class and

(19:39):
how how can it be different than in the other classes.
So the last three months has been me talking and saying, well,
what if we try this, what if we do this,
and would that provide you more value than you would
get normally? And so that's what I've been going doing
and I think next month is when we're going to
actually launch. That'll be the founding Class. But right now,
what my my future students are towards is they want

(20:01):
they want a hybrid class where we're going to be live,
we're going to be performing comedy, but at the same time,
we're going to have a an email course that is
happening at the same time. So it's gonna be probably
three emails per week with different challenges, different lessons inside.
And then we we meet up at the end of
the week and we discuss everything that we learned, we

(20:24):
apply what we've learned, and then we then we at
the end of class, we talk about what we want
to learn this week, I create new lessons for everybody,
and then again for the next three weeks, we're getting
we're getting lessons in our email exercises in the email.

Speaker 1 (20:39):
That's amazing, that's amazing. I really really, I really like.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
What happens when you stop and listen right Like I
I would not have thought of that at all. But
I was asking my students, like, what will be the
best for you, and they're like, some people wanted this,
some people wanted this, and so one of the one
fun creative strategies. Instead of saying either or you say yes,
let's do both. You know the yes and from from
improv right, and so Yeah, for the last three months,

(21:05):
this is what we've been doing. We've been going back
and forth and getting more and more excited. We're like,
nobody has tried this before. This could really really work.
This can be a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (21:13):
Wow, that's I mean, that's such a smart thing to do,
because I wouldn't have thought that the email thing would
be would work. I understand the in person zoom whatever
those things work. Yeah, they have an email with kind
of kind of like homework or kind of like prep work,
and then you're getting it and then you're reviewing and
going back and then you're starting the next steps again
to keep growing. I really like that. That's such a

(21:35):
thoughtful way to wow, attack it. Okay, wow, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:39):
And the big thing here, like, let's let's generalize this
what you know what I did as an entrepreneur. Let's
generalize this so that it's useful in in in stand up,
all I did was decide. I decided in the beginning
that I don't know right. That was the most important thing,
was me deciding that I have no idea what the
right answer is. Because once I have the questions, then

(22:00):
I'm allowed to go out and I'm allowed to figure
it out for myself. But as long as I consider
myself like the expert or whatever, then then I already
know what you want and I don't really need to
ask you. And then that's that hurts everybody that I
love going into situations trying to be the person who
like trying to be the student like I, I don't
know any of the right answers. I'm taking my best

(22:23):
guess for everything. And so if you approach your writing
like that, you approach your writing your you're performing or whatever,
then you're gonna consistently get so much better.

Speaker 1 (22:34):
That makes sense. That actually really really really makes sense. Wow. Okay,
Now for the other for the app to joke analysis app.
What is that I'm on the page, I'm looking at
it right now. There's one thing that says raw text,
and there's one that says preview. What if I was
using this right now, we can use this. I can
pull one of my jokes somewhere, that's.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
Sure, and uh yeah, this is totally improvised, by the way,
for everyone want we weren't actually thinking about doing this.
But so what I can do is like there's a
there's a tutorial button. You can go down and click
on it, and there's got like three different jokes there.
You can copy paste it into the raw text on
the left side of the screen.

Speaker 1 (23:13):
So one the one that says, how does a penguin
build this house?

Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah? Can you can you screen share? This will be
really boring for people.

Speaker 1 (23:20):
No, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm try try to do all right,
let's see, let's talk.

Speaker 2 (23:24):
About something that you can't see.

Speaker 1 (23:27):
Okay, let's see can I share?

Speaker 2 (23:30):
Yeah? So what this app does while you're while you're
getting it up the app is is a way of
scoring yourself for scoring your jokes. And it can be
like okay, cool, so there you go. So the so
you can put in and then if you copy and paste,
so here is let me give this to you. So

(23:53):
if you copy and paste that, then that has two
jokes in the first bit, and then there's two bits
and Okay, there, so it's got The app will automatically
recognize that you are, that you have, how many jokes
you have, and how many bits are inside the joke?

Speaker 1 (24:10):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
So you see those those stars, So the app is
looking for stars to tell it that that's a different bit.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (24:16):
See the purple outline on the right side. That just
means it knows that there's two different bits, and it
knows that there's three different jokes.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (24:23):
So anytime there's an open an open line, a line
break like between, it loes it together and why did
why did the scare Coe win? When it sees that
it knows that a new joke is.

Speaker 1 (24:35):
Started, gotcha? Okay?

Speaker 2 (24:37):
So then click on it glues it together. Click on
on the right side.

Speaker 1 (24:42):
Are here all right?

Speaker 2 (24:43):
So you just told it where the punchline is?

Speaker 1 (24:46):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (24:47):
And then now if you you scroll down, you can
see some textual analysis, so like view performance stats. It's
gonna be really boring at the moment. So now we
have a right, there's ten words seven words in the
setup punchline. There's no tag yet because that was only
a one liner, right, And then what you can do
is you can scroll down further and hit the plus

(25:10):
on the right side plus. Okay, yeah, And then so
this is let's hit record. So let's say we're we're
watching our self perform. Hit the start button, okay, and
then now we're we're talking in our setup. You see
the the laugh equal zero, that circle up. Okay, all right,
that's laughter happening. And now they stop laughing. You pull

(25:32):
it down and hit stop and okay, good, So that
has scored, and then everything after that will be on
the next joke will be a setup for the next joke.
That's why you don't have the the why it stops
at ten. But if you scroll up, what you'll see
is that it's now scoring not only your words per minute,

(25:53):
your laughs, but it also has that laugh quality score,
which gives you an object active way of looking at
how how funny your material is per per minute, per
second on stage, give them how much time you're on stage.
So that's a thirty six point nine percent joke. So

(26:15):
if you have a long joke that gets a really
good laugh and a short joke that gets a decent laugh,
how do you tell which one is actually better? That
that score will tell you regardless of how long. So
basically that is it's dynamic. It's telling you that's an
a joke, a b joke given the length of it.

Speaker 1 (26:34):
Gotch you Now, now you're basically that off the laugh score.
So a forty eight, it's a forty eight out of
one hundred, I'm assuming right, correct.

Speaker 2 (26:41):
It's forty eight out of so that is the total.
That is the total blue area under the curve. So
the let's see the biggest laugh ten so laugh quality.
So basically the laugh quality is the most important. Thirty
six point nine. So if you were to mathemat look
at the blue area and the white area in the graph,

(27:04):
thirty six point nine percent is blue.

Speaker 1 (27:06):
Okay, gotcha.

Speaker 2 (27:07):
Got That's what that's saying. And that's a way of saying, Okay,
maybe our setup is super long, but the punchline is
really good, or maybe it's super short, but the punchline
is not good. What we really care about is the
ratio between between Yeah, that that's I'll talk about that.
What we care about is the ratio between those two. Okay,
So if you have a long setup that freaking kills,

(27:30):
then that's still gonna show up in there. But also
if you have a short setup that gets that gets
a decent laugh. It can compare whether whether you should
be using the long joke or the short joke.

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Gotcha, that makes sense?

Speaker 2 (27:44):
Yes, right, And then what the rest is doing is
saying like, because we only have one joke, this looks
really boring. But if you did the same thing for
other jokes, then you would start seeing a bit analysis
that that will analyze all the jokes inside of that bit,
and then the performance bit from earlier, the performance analysis

(28:05):
that will take everything that you've already scored and put
it together.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
Wow dude, So now the only other thing I was
thinking about with this, so I would what I would
do is I would listen to my set and then
just go up and down through this, like I would
paste my set in here and then just go through
it and do that. Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 2 (28:22):
Yeah, exactly, Okay, and yeah, and I tried to figure
out how to get AI to do it, and there
is just nothing out there that that is doing what
I wanted to do.

Speaker 1 (28:32):
If you could upload it in there with the audio
track and habit pick up the laugh, but it probably
is very hard to do that.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
Yeah, And also it depends on it's going to depend
on where your your phone is when you're recording the venue,
so it's going to be very Yeah, you can click
on the other punchlines and just see what happens, because
it'll it'll start to you can't click on the first.
It knows your first line cannot be a punchline, so
you have to click on number two.

Speaker 1 (28:57):
Gotcha.

Speaker 2 (28:58):
And then actually, what you can do, how about combine
joke one and two, So take out the take out
the space between, or you can do that too.

Speaker 1 (29:08):
Okay, so take.

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Out the space between, and then now it says, oh,
this is you actually won in one joke. And now yeah,
when you click that, now it knows that you have
one punchline and two tags.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
Oh wow.

Speaker 2 (29:21):
So now what you do is you come down and
then your options will change, so you hit record again, right,
and then it's all so now you have like three
different Yeah yeah, it's already selected. But now if you
hit start, you can go up down to zero and
it'll it'll score each individual joke.

Speaker 1 (29:39):
So you'd be like, okay, that's the thing.

Speaker 2 (29:41):
Yeah, that's your first You go down touch zero and
then then it goes back down, correct, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:47):
Then it goes back down and then we stop, that's
the end of the thing, and save.

Speaker 2 (29:52):
And so.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
Ten lasts for minutes. For that's I mean, yeah, that
makes total sense. Man, I'm gonna come back use this
with my stuff. The only thing that worried about is
I write in a weird way. So if I here,
I'm gonna I'm gonna paste one of my jokes in here.
Just see you can see it.

Speaker 2 (30:15):
Yeah, you just have like line breaks I do. I
have line breaks and those line breaks or is that
is that line spacing? That's all I guess we'll find
out in a second. Okay, all right, so how about
click on a punchline and see what happens. Where's one
of your punchlines right there?

Speaker 1 (30:33):
Okay?

Speaker 2 (30:33):
And then so now is the next one attack line?
Or is that a setup? Uh? Set up? But then
put a space between those two and then you can
get going again. Okay, put a line, just an empty
line between your punchline and your next setup.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
Like that, so it'll do this way.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
And then oh so it needs an empty line, so
like like that.

Speaker 1 (31:01):
Yes, okay, gotcha. Now it's all part of the same joke.
Does that matter or no?

Speaker 2 (31:06):
No, You're you're still in it? Is what hold on, so.

Speaker 1 (31:11):
This is all one one bit or whatever.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
Yeah yeah, one bit is fine. Yeah yeah, this is
already one bit.

Speaker 1 (31:16):
Yeah yeah yeah. Okay, So in order to.

Speaker 2 (31:18):
Make in order to make a new bit, you're you're
just gonna put in like three stars and then that's
the way you tell the app that a new bit
has started.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
Oh gotcha, gotcha, gotcha? Okay. Uh So that's this is
a that's actually a that's actually a tag. This is
a see said, this is gonna manfortunately to go through
here and do this. It's really undersod like really good.
That's also a tag. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
I haven't even released this to people. This is the
first time anybody do this.

Speaker 1 (31:52):
This is amazing because it's it's something I didn't think like,
uh you know, uh, that they would do that. This
is almost all all now that I look at it.
This is almost all punchlines and tags after this. And
this is a punchline and tag. So there there you go.
That's that would be That would be it, you know.
So then we go expand, right, and so if I.

Speaker 2 (32:17):
Go report the laughter, so you'd have it looks like
two different punchlines. There a punch line. Yeah, and then
also you scroll up, you have like save that will
put a Jason file onto your your computer, okay, and
then you can use that file to upload it later on.

Speaker 1 (32:39):
Now here's the thing. Why is it only doing three
lines like this? Like I'm not seeing the rest of
the joke for some reason?

Speaker 2 (32:44):
Is that is that that's probably a bug? Okay, like
I'm learning to code this as I go.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
No, No, I was just curious because it's like, you know,
I could go through and do my whole set this way.

Speaker 2 (32:55):
Yeah, so it looks like it it has line two.
Yeah that that should be expanded, okay, So yeah, I
would have to check and see what's what's exactly going on?
I bet can you hit the down button and is yeah? There,
but it needs to be expandable. So for some reason,
it's it's thinking that that is one super long bag

(33:18):
line instead of many tags. I'll have to go through
and figure that out.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
But I definitely like this. I definitely like that there's
a way for me to go through and say, okay,
this is where this joke is. Because sometimes you will
do a joke and you'll go, I don't know why
it didn't work, I don't know what's happening, and when
you go back and listen to it, you're trying to
understand it. But this kind of gives you a ranking
of saying, well, this is where the laugh was. There
was no laugh here or there whatever you're and you're like, oh,
that's the line that I said. Why am I not

(33:45):
seeing it anymore? Why am I not you know? Why
am I not having that realization? So this is a
great way to go through my entire set and do
it bit by bit and figure out what worked, what didn't.
Where I could add jokes, where I could cut things,
What's what's killing the joke, maybe what's stopping it from
getting the laugh, or what I could expand on that

(34:06):
I'm be getting a laugh.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
Yeah, and there's a lot of things I really want
to do with this. I want to turn it into
a like a document that's designed for comedians, where like
the app analysis would just be one portion of what
we're doing. But but really this version doesn't have any
AI hookups, but I have an API that that calls

(34:30):
to chat GPT and that can help you come up
with ideas. I am not happy with where it is yet.
It's it's I've I've used it. I tried for like
over a month to get it to go through so
several different jokes, and I just have not gotten it
to the point where I feel like I feel like
you should be ten you know, at least or at

(34:53):
most ten tries from a really quality joke, right, And
it's not if it takes you longer than ten. I
think it's just now we're just talking about random stuff. Yeah,
and people can do random by themselves. They don't need
me for random. So you know, I'm holding myself to
a higher standard where it needs to consistently get somewhere

(35:14):
that I think is worth worth being.

Speaker 1 (35:16):
Yeah. No, that's exactly right. And what's so great about
this is that is such a great tool for people
to figure out what they're missing because a lot of
comedians will go, don't First of all, that kimies don't
listen back to their sets after they do jokes, so
that's what they I understand.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
It's uncomfortable, but.

Speaker 1 (35:33):
It's very uncomfortable, but having it to score over and
over again, saying this is the set I did this night,
Let's listen to it, scoring it. You know, this is
for this night, and that way you could have it.

Speaker 2 (35:43):
Yeah, And that's why, like if you can find an
AI that can actually score it for you, that would
be so awesome. But right I have looked for it.
There is nothing that I feel like it can actually
figure out the last for you. But if I find that,
I'm yeah, if any of your our listeners know, let
me know, because I am really interested in finding that.
But I am not uh an AI model that can

(36:07):
that can listen to an audio file and then pluck
out the laughter.

Speaker 1 (36:12):
Yet that's amazing. That's That's so how this came up, guys.
As I was asking Jared about this, was saying, Hey,
I wanted to build this app that you could put
on your phone and you record your set to it,
and then at the end of the set, when you
hit stop, it does an analysis and then it gives
you last per minute and like what where the stuff is?
And it scores all of your jokes you know, A

(36:33):
B C, d uh, you know F or whatever and
let you know what they what they are. And he
was like, oh, I have something like that, and then
that's what he showed me. So if you were if
you you're wondering how that came up, it was an
idea that I had that I've been thinking about and
again I also have the same issue. I can't figure
out a way to get AI to actually score it.
So I was in the process of trying to figure out.

(36:55):
So apparently Jared and I are on the same He's
smarter than me, by the way, if you guys don't know,
he's like, basically, should be have like a PhD. And
I think that's one of the quotes on his website
that I said, is like basically.

Speaker 2 (37:05):
I want one.

Speaker 1 (37:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (37:07):
If I wasn't doing this, I would probably be at
the Humor Research Laboratory in Boulder, Colorado.

Speaker 1 (37:13):
Like that's the real thing.

Speaker 2 (37:15):
Yeah, Yeah, that's where doctor Peter McGraw, he's the director there.

Speaker 1 (37:19):
Wow, I didn't know that.

Speaker 2 (37:20):
I've talked to him before, Like I asked him. I
was like, I I kind of want to quit this
and come up and be a research assistant. Like and
then I've talked to a couple of my old professors
and they're like, you know, it's professorship is just not
good right now. The industry is just not good. You're
you're you're gonna be a t t A for a
teacher assistant for a while. You're gonna make almost nothing

(37:42):
and then it's so I've had my my when I
was getting my master's at my the director of the
creativity American Creativity Association, I think, uh she and then
also doctor Peter McGraw, two doctors that I said, Hey,
I want to come study creativity. I want to come

(38:03):
study humor, and both of them are telling me, like,
the industry is just not good right now.

Speaker 1 (38:08):
So wow, that's crazy. I would have never even thought
of that is an issue. I like, well, higher education
is always going to be kind and stuff.

Speaker 2 (38:17):
The money that we're paying for higher education is ridiculous
right now. So what do you mean to your assistance
or making barely anything right now?

Speaker 1 (38:25):
That is ridiculous because it's all going to the admins.
That's why, because the people running college is not the
actual people that are doing the artwork.

Speaker 2 (38:31):
I think, Yeah, I have no idea, that's over my head.
I just but anyway, Yeah, but that is a PhD
in the psychology of humor or in creativity that I
would love that so much.

Speaker 1 (38:44):
That's amazing. Well, Jared, now that you have this coming out,
where can people find it? Where can people go find you?
Where can they go watch all your stuff? Learn? I
know you also have a YouTube channel. We didn't cover that,
but definitely something that people could go check out as well.
What's the best place for them to go find you?

Speaker 2 (38:58):
So you can you can leave that link to the
link tree that has a bunch of that's a one
link that has a bunch of other links inside. O.
Uh so depends on what you want. If you want
the book Amazon, just type in type it in. Make
sure you get the second edition, not the first edition.
Online Comedy Training dot Com uh slash classes is how

(39:19):
is where we're going to be launching the founding the
Founding class for online live classes. Uh that'll happen probably soon,
sometime in the next month or so.

Speaker 1 (39:30):
Gotcha? And what what did? What are those are going
to run? For people and stuff?

Speaker 2 (39:36):
Right now? This is again we're still going back and
forth on right now. I'm thinking it's gonna be there's
gonna be like maybe three different tiers. So one tier
is like performer tier. So I have a lot of
people that want to come and actually perform in the class,
but there's too many that if if I let them

(39:56):
all in, we would be here for five or six hours.
Like there's there's no way to get everybody in. So
I'm thinking maybe like five five to eight performers in
one class, and then maybe like ten other people that
are that are spectators that are they're there, they're getting
all the lessons, all everything, they're they're talking, they're just

(40:19):
not performing, gotcha.

Speaker 1 (40:22):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (40:22):
And then another one would be a monthly like twenty
five bucks a month. You can come, you can watch
the live the live classes, but there's no performance, no
no lessons, nothing like that. And that would be a
way of like dipping your toe in and kind of
seeing what we're doing.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
I like that, And would those be something also where
that eventually in the future you'll offer it as like
a recorded class that people can go and take, like
you know, for a discounter rate in the future or
something like that.

Speaker 2 (40:49):
I have so much stuff that's already recorded that I
think if you want, if you want me recorded you
So this is like a new thing for me, is
actually live because I I am I'm an extreme introvert.
I love to just be a book. I I do
not do like the marketing stuff. You go to my

(41:10):
my Facebook, it's got pictures of my son and that's
about it. Like that's the only thing that I really
want to show people I am not like a natural marketer.
So for me, I feel super comfortable writing a book.
That's that's the kind of thing I feel like I
was meant to do because I love doing the research,
I love putting it together, I love having deep thoughts,

(41:32):
and I love being alone.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
All of those things.

Speaker 2 (41:34):
Well, and so for me, like pushing, I am pushing
out of my comfort zone when I do live stuff.
And that's my goal for myself is to is to
not just do the online videos, in the in the
books and stuff. Actually I do. I have another idea
for a book that I'm really interested in. But yeah,
so for me, pushing, pushing out and being more accessible

(41:58):
live is something that I'm I'm really interested in. And
in fact, I did my first live YouTube live stream
and a m a U. It was a few days
ago and it was a total total trip for me
because I've never done anything like that. But it's super
fun to push yourself and and do something that's new,
if only for the reason that it's new, and that's awesome.

Speaker 1 (42:20):
I like that, Well, that's such a great thing. I
were very excited. Whenever you announce it, whatever you like
or ready for or can people go and sign pre
sign up for classes on your on your site there
if they want.

Speaker 2 (42:30):
There's a there is a class interest form and actually
I will I'll send that to you and you can
put it in the description of wherever this is going.
Uh there's a class interest form on Google Forms, and
then you can just tell me what you want. And
then I got everyone's emails and I kind of have
when when you signed up as well. And so that's
what I'm using to to talk back and forth with

(42:52):
with students and figure out what they what they actually want.

Speaker 1 (42:55):
That's so exciting, man. I would even I would love
a tier where you do the uh where because I'm
on the road so much. I probably could go to
a class. But the email thing where I send up
for the emails and that you're sending me that to
get like, you know, I could work on stuff. It
gives me something to do on a plane or while
i'm you know, if Zaye's driving or I have downtime
in a hotel and I can't jump on a class,

(43:16):
but I can go over this and go over a
lesson in you know, fifteen minutes, thirty minutes, whatever it is,
and kind of do something like that that for me
would be something that I would definitely find interesting and
helpful to me, you know, to do. So we'll tell
you what.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Let's set you up, let's get you in for free. Dude.

Speaker 1 (43:32):
All right, I appreciate it, man, Thank you very much,
and you guys go check out Jared's stuff. I love
the first book. I'm very excited to get the second book.
I'm gonna buy it this week. Are you gonna do
an audio book version at some point or no? Is
that really?

Speaker 2 (43:45):
You know, there are so many examples that I have
no idea how to You're like, there's a Mitch Hedberg example,
and I'm like, do I really have to do that?
But like, there's no way to do an audiobook for that,
he said, because.

Speaker 1 (43:59):
It'd be nice to drive. I even hear you and
then like be you know, pause, think about it. For me,
it would for me. That's my that's my learning style.
It's so easy for me.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
Yeah, yeah, I I totally get that. I would love
to have an audiobook, but there are so many examples
and stuff throughout the book that I have no idea
what an audiobook would even look like. It would just
be it would be ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (44:23):
Fair enough, fair enough, Well, that's awesome. You guys would
put all the links for Jared stuff in the show notes.
You guys, go check it out. Go grab a copy
of Playfully Inappropriate The Fun Way to Write Comedy. It's
going to be second edition. It'll have a different cover.
You just go look it up. You'll find it'll pop
up on there you go, it'll pop up on Amazon.
And then there's also the workbook, which I guess I

(44:44):
have to.

Speaker 2 (44:44):
The second edition cover is right here, and then this
is the workbook right here, and it uses the old
cover but it says workbook over here.

Speaker 1 (44:52):
I guess I'm gonna have to order the work workbook. Now.
I'm gonna have to actually write legibly for some of
this book, I guess. But very exciting thing again, Jared,
thank you everybody for listening. Again. This podcast is going
to transition to a new podcast where we were working
on it. It's gonna be amazing. So after episode four
fifty four to fifty one will be a new podcast,
a different name. But then they'll start at episode one

(45:13):
as opposed to four fifty one, So get very excited
for that. All these episodes will still be available for
anyone to listen to. So don't feel like they're gonna
go away. You're gonna lose them. You're gonna this pier.
They're gonna stay. We're just gonna have a different name.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
And oh create urgency. They're all gonna go away. You
gotta do them now. Nah.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
I love every I love everybody. I love everybody too
much to rush them into doing something I wish I could.
I'm also not a great marketer, So there you go.
That's there you go. I can't go thank you everybody
that the.

Speaker 2 (45:42):
Sketch that I made with Luke that was so much fun.
That was me taking how bad of a marketer I
am and then just playing around with it and making
a sketch.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
There you go. That's that's sometimes. That's all you gotta do. Well,
thank you very much, Yre, Thank you everybody for listen.
Have a good one to talk to you soon. Bye.