Ep,2915 Friday

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:07):
This is it right here?

Speaker 2 (00:09):
Combining a team of reporters, columnists, and commentators, Are you serious?
Jack Ebling has brought thought provoking discussion.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
What are you doing?

Speaker 2 (00:20):
That's a day in coaching? The fake opinion.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
Customer, the one who decides when the future gets here?

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Oh no, just checking report?

Speaker 4 (00:31):
Are you married me?

Speaker 5 (00:32):
That?

Speaker 2 (00:32):
Games and overall infotainment.

Speaker 5 (00:35):
I'll tak jimarba.

Speaker 6 (00:36):
What is he done?

Speaker 4 (00:37):
Greeuda Comincia?

Speaker 5 (00:42):
Quiet?

Speaker 7 (00:42):
Please exactly fifteen seconds We'll be on the air.

Speaker 5 (00:45):
Thanks, big fellow.

Speaker 8 (00:46):
Don't you ever come.

Speaker 9 (00:47):
Back here again?

Speaker 1 (00:48):
No arguments.

Speaker 8 (00:49):
Those are called ashtans.

Speaker 2 (00:50):
So buckle up.

Speaker 8 (00:51):
Are you talking to me?

Speaker 2 (00:53):
It's time for the Drive with Jack Ebling.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Yeah, for some reason or another. Who signing?

Speaker 2 (01:00):
And it is Tall Radio.

Speaker 9 (01:03):
Great afternoon, mid Michigan and beyond, and welcome to the
Drive with Jack the Spotlight Radio Network. Jack Ebling here
with my producer Boston Rob on a Friday, warm Friday,
sixty six degrees here in Greater Lansing cloudy. Might get
a little rain for the next hour, Bot, but should

(01:24):
be a very nice night for high school football. We'll
see if it's a nice night for Detroit Tigers fans.
They are in Seattle, an eighth eight first pitch against
the Mariters in Game five of an American League Divisional series.
And the weather should be pretty good tomorrow as well.

Speaker 1 (01:44):
Rob.

Speaker 9 (01:44):
We're talking about from fifty eight to sixty two degrees here,
almost perfect football weather for homecoming at Spartan Stadium, Michigan
State hosting UCLA teams that haven't met for a long time,
and even in this series, Michigan State got off to
a great start and then UCLA has won the last

(02:08):
three matchups. But looking forward to that game, Rob, I
am not sure what we're going to see from either
one of these teams. UCLA looked like the worst team
in the country for most of September and managed to
get run by New Mexico, lost to Northwestern, then came

(02:29):
out and maybe the most surprising performance of twenty twenty five,
beating Penn State and running the ball on Penn State. Meanwhile,
the Spartans in Lincoln, Nebraska, fell behind, rallied, took a
twenty one to fourteen lead, looked like they had found
some answers, and then proceeded to wet themselves again. They

(02:52):
had a block punt for a touchdown, there was a
kickoff in thirty mile an hour wins that two guys
tried to catch and neither of them could. That led
to another score. Next thing you know, the Spartans were
way behind and it wasn't Aidenchilds day. He's had a
lot of good ones this year, but that was not
one of them. Did some nice things with his feet.

(03:13):
Really the only offense Michigan State had for much of
the day Aiden Hilds scrambling, but as far as throwing
the ball, a couple of bad interceptions, some overthrows, some underthrows,
you name it. So Michigan State has a lot of
work to do offensively. The defense which was so bad
in the first half of the La Coliseum against USC,

(03:35):
and USC can do that to people, but not to
the tune of three hundred and fifty five yards in
the first thirty minutes. Michigan State's defense got five sacks
five last week in Lincoln and only had six the
first four games, so a very different performance. We have
a great show planned for you, and you're going to

(03:58):
hear from Gary Gillette, our baseball historian, in just a
few minutes. Looking forward to that, you're can to hear
from my best friend Marty mackintan, who travels all over
the globe, it seems, watching his favorite teams, including the
Detroit Tigers. Of course, Jay Green is going to be
with us. Looking forward to that, and we're going to

(04:21):
be talking a little more football with Connor Eargood of
the Detroit News talking about Michigan State. But I am
really looking forward to our first guest. Do we have
Yogi on the line, Rob, Yep, he's ready to go. Fantastic, Okay,
he needed an extra minute to join us, and very
happy to have Yogi Roth with us from Big Ten

(04:44):
Network as a receiver at Pittsburgh, who's a coach at USC,
He's an author, he's a filmmaker, you name it, Yogi
Roth can do it. And really looking forward to his
broadcast tomorrow. Yogi, what are we go to see? Do
you have any idea of which UCLA is going to
show up? It's a nine a m. Pacific time kick

(05:07):
for the Bruins, and if you can figure out which
spartans are going to be there, I'd sure.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
Love to know.

Speaker 6 (05:14):
Well, I'm excited to be there.

Speaker 5 (05:15):
I'll tell you that.

Speaker 6 (05:16):
I'm sure we'll figure it out as the game gets closer.
And closer with the availability reports that are part of
the Big Ten Conference. But I'm looking forward to this one.
I think it's a really cool opportunity for everybody, right,
and there's so many storylines. You hit a couple of them,
but from Michigan State coming off of two tough road
games where all you know hear it all the time,
but like the three phases, never were all thriving right,

(05:40):
whether it's se defensively struggled, you reference special teams. Last week,
the win was a factor. So curiously, if they could
put it together at home on homecoming and you know,
a noon kickoff to your point, and then for the Bruins,
find a team on a bigger high in America, you know,
after last Saturday, and I'll wait right, so it's gonna
be really fun. I was at their practice earlier this week,

(06:02):
just left the facility here in East Lancing, and I
can't wait. Love being around your community.

Speaker 10 (06:07):
Man.

Speaker 6 (06:07):
Other than the rain that just came down, I feel
pretty excited.

Speaker 9 (06:11):
The name new Heisel is so closely associated with UCLA
football from his rose ball heroiccent his coaching days, but
that's Rick Neuheisel and a lot of people weren't aware
of how long Jerry had been with this program. Has
any coach that you know yogi had a better debut

(06:33):
as a play caller than Jerry new Heiseel did last week?

Speaker 1 (06:39):
I don't know.

Speaker 6 (06:40):
I mean, I'm sure some have in terms of like
yardage and how they felt, you know, but they were
probably ones that had the job for the entirety of
an offseason.

Speaker 5 (06:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (06:49):
I can't think of one in my career that was
as dramatic or really as symbolic as Jerry new Heidel
is to UCLA. I mean, you know, I don't know
if you've ever been to campus there, but the UCLA
Hospital is literally a stone's throw from the facility. That's
where Jerry was born. For crying out loud, right, His
dad was a rose ball MVP as a quarterback at UCLA,

(07:10):
was the head coach at UCLA. Jerry walked on, played
started at UCLA, iconic win as everybody knows now, carried
off the field in Arlington against Texas in a neutral
psyche game a few years ago, and what he did
was impressive, man. And I think it's just a if
I'm being honest, I think that the way that college

(07:30):
football is going now with teams that have to rebuild
their teams via the portal, it's going to take all
of them a month or so to get really in sync.
I think it's just the truth. UCLA last year this
time of the year, they got hot. I called them
munch of their games. They went to Nebraska won on
the road, when it's the Rutgers won on the road.
They lost to Minnesota the last play of the game,
like all of a sudden, it flipped. It's kind of

(07:52):
the same timing, right. They made a bunch of changes
to also impact, you know, the start of the season,
but you're seeing a team that has is much more
talent than people thought when you watch their first four
games of the fall. And I think that definitely has
caught the eyes and the football minds of Spartans as
it should.

Speaker 9 (08:13):
Yogi, you know, everybody on the West Coast. I am
so curious as to what Deshan Foster was thinking last Saturday.
Has he watched that game or if he didn't watch it,
if he had just heard about it.

Speaker 6 (08:27):
Yeah, I know it's done really well. And you know,
I speak to him or Kaika Maloy or Tino Sensei,
three people I consider good friends, and they were you know,
you get in this coaching profession for usually for the
for one reason is you want to spear on the game,
and the next part of that is going to are
on the players in the locker room. It's the closest
thing you get to play. Him knowing to Sean as
I do, he was thrilled. He was thrilled for Tim Skipper,

(08:50):
a guy he's known since he was a child, who's
the interim head coach.

Speaker 5 (08:53):
Now.

Speaker 6 (08:53):
He was thrilled for the players, all of whom he recruited.
He was thrilled for the coaches because it's one thing
when a head coach gets fired, and I know that
it's either celebrated by a fan base or ridiculed by whatever,
but there's also like three hundred people that get affected
on average. I'm talking about spouses, coaches, assistants that aren't
making seven figures, aren't making six figures, children like, so

(09:17):
when you see him win, like Deshaun is such a
good man, like, he was thrilled for those players, and
probably mom that he didn't get enough time or he
didn't get enough out of him early on, because he
knew it would take a little bit to put together
a roster with so many new players. I mean, the
entire defense is new. You know, they haven't starter that
started last year on the entirety of the defense, so

(09:38):
they had to rebuild the whole thing. And I know
that those three coaches who you know, all were you know,
sadly no longer part of the program, and they were
thrilled for what the program was able to accomplish.

Speaker 9 (09:51):
You know, Can you tell us about nico Iamalieva and
what we can't expect? He ran the ball so well
last week, maybe a little bit like Bryce Underwood when
they had him under bubble wrap. The Michigan offense wasn't
the same. Is this a different UCLA team? When they
tell Imaleva just let a rip?

Speaker 6 (10:14):
Yeah, Nico I Maliava. He is probably the most misunderstood
player in the country. And I'll say that to start
the broadcast tomorrow. I think that oftentimes at that position,
you get a lot of praise, you got a little blame.
In my favorite phrase is praise and blame are all
the same. I'm stealing that from Chip Kelly, who he
wrote about it in a book I wrote called five

(10:34):
Star QB. And I love that because it really is
symbolic of Nico. He is a guy. If you look
at the first four games, and I've watched every snap
for whatever it's worth, the system didn't change. The system
didn't change, the effort change. The way the players played
with a belief and a passion changed. The execution dramatically changed,

(10:57):
and they met the moment and they kept riding that wave.
And a big him to me when I watched him play,
he oftentimes I onway counted two steps the whole game.
We had to go to his second or third read.
It was first read, not there, I'm gonna run, and
he utilized that athleticism. Now part of that is the
monsters coming off the edge for Penn State and they

(11:17):
were rushing up the field as fast as possible. I
can't imagine Michigan State doing that tomorrow. I think it's
got to be a controlled rush because he's a game changer.
I mean, he is six foot six all of two fifteen,
and he just takes up a lot of ground when
he takes one step, let alone three or four, and
all of a sudden, you know you're gonna run over you,
like he did in the first drive of the game

(11:38):
against Penn State, or you're gonna run past you like
he did the majority of the game against Penn State.
So yeah, man, I don't think they necessarily cut him loose.
I mean, he's been their leading rusher before in the season.
He's obviously the leading passer, like everything goes through him.
I just think finally got some help up front on
his offensive line, his receivers. They were the most disappointing

(11:58):
part of that offense first four games in my eyes,
because I thought that there was too many loafs on tape.
The body language is horrible. They were balling, blocking down field,
making plays downfield, catching the ball in the screen pass
and turning a two yard game into a first down.
And part of that at him. And I think that's
also part of really what turned the tides a week
ago is he told the team, you know every saying

(12:19):
is Nco going to stay? He told the team, if
you don't want to stay, and I know who he are,
get out in so many words, and if you want
to stay, let's go, and I're gonna go win the game,
and they did so. Again. I just think he's the
most misunderstood player in America, and I think that he's
playing at a really high level and the whole thing
again is going to go through him.

Speaker 9 (12:37):
So if im Maliaba is playing the way he can,
the way he has shown he can at Tennessee and
last week, is he one of the top quarterbacks in
the Big ten? Could it be in the top five
of the eighteen?

Speaker 6 (12:54):
Well you think about it. I mean, let's just do it.
I don't have any in front of me. I haven't
done the exercise to be a defensive coordinator who freaks
you out. Okay, So let's just start with anybody who's
a dual threat player or a premier passer. So I'll
start with Dante Moore. I think he's the best quarterback
in the conference. Okay, So that's if that's sitting at one.

(13:15):
You can't not say Fernando mendoz is the way that
he's played, he's a Heisman candidate. He's got to be
in the conversation, even though he's not really a dual
threat type of factor. I have to put Jade Mayava
in that conversation because of the way that he's played.
Luke Altmeyer has won eight games in the last in
a two minute drive in his career. In a come in,

(13:36):
comeback fashion, So you've got to scare a little bit
when the ball in his hands. Juliant's saying, you know,
to use the point that you made moments ago, like
they kind of let him rip, right, And so I
just think, like that's kind of what the league is
demon Waningams is probably the scariest guy to a DC
at Washington, So I don't know. I mean, I think
it depends on the weekend. I'd argue, like, who's not

(14:00):
scary in the Big ten? And we start thinking about,
like who aren't you worried about? Like, sure, I can't
think of one off the.

Speaker 5 (14:06):
Top of my head, man.

Speaker 6 (14:07):
I mean Ryan Brown a Perdue scares you because he's
a dual threat guy. And Leake Washington and Bryce Underwooter
freaky freshmen who are going to be NFL players in
my eyes. So yeah, yeah, sure, Top five, yeah eight
and child no doubt, Kilan Royola. That throw he made
in the wind last week was pretty impressive. His command
of that offense is impressive. So I think I said

(14:28):
in the preseason, I don't know if it's true. You
know better than me. I think it's the most talented
the Big ten's ever been at quarterback top to bottom.
I would agree, and I think the West Coast had
a lot to do with it. And then you added
the new transfers and the freshmen and the new starters,
like more insane, and it's hard to argue another league
over the Big Ten.

Speaker 9 (14:47):
In my team, we're talking with Yogi Roth of Big
Ten Network here to do the UCLA Michigan State game
and a guy who's worn as many hats as anyone
has here in terms of college football. Yogi, you are
a Jonathan Smith believer. You know him, you like him,
you understand what he did at Oregon State. There are

(15:11):
a lot of people here who don't care what he's
in Oregon State. Frankly, they've already made up their mind
about him, And right now the fan base is kind
of waiting for a sign of how this is going
to work out. How important do you think this game
and maybe the next couple of games are to him

(15:31):
and to what he can do here.

Speaker 6 (15:35):
Yeah, tell me more about the fan base, Like when
you say a sign, what do you mean by that?

Speaker 9 (15:40):
Well, a lot of them say, you know, he's not charismatic,
They're not wild about the recruiting and you know he
has a process. He is very successful with what could
only be a slow build in Corvallis. But when you
win twenty five games in three years there, you've done
a lot of things right. And they're saying up and

(16:03):
down performances. They don't see any trends or anything to
get excited about. I don't want to say there's apathy
that's set in, but there are a lot of people
who are definitely taking a show me attitude and a
loss to UCLA and maybe not making a bowl for
a second straight year would be an indictment.

Speaker 6 (16:22):
Yeah, well, I think Look, we're being realistic. We're in
a different era in college football where you can rebuild
your roster quickly. The money is ridiculous, and society in
general is a show me society. Hey, let me see
a clip on that cool. Let me just chat GPT
that real quick. Hey what do you want to eat?
And let me just ask ai. Everything is just at

(16:44):
our fingertips. You know football as well as anybody in
this state, and you know that that's not reality when
it comes to anything that's worth a damn ask the
Detroit Lions, right as any program when it comes to charisma.
I've known Jonathan since I was twenty. I've hung out
with Jonathan many times. I spent time with him today
in their facility. I'm a huge fan of his personality.

(17:07):
Do you want it depends what? Like I'd be curious
to fan base, like what do you define that as?
Like is Nick Saban charismatic? Is Kiln de Borger charismatic?
Like how do you find that? Is Marcus Freeman charismatic?
Like what does that even mean? It would probably be
my question to that. I feel fire from him. I
felt it since I met him as a young coach.

(17:28):
I watched him play, I heard him in the press
conference after the Nebraska game. I felt a different pulse
of frustration after that, Like it's not like he didn't play,
like I just urged people to be Like he walked
on and started as a quarterback and led a team
to the Siesta Ball win against Notre Dame. Again, it's
twenty some years ago, but he going to go into

(17:48):
like who his DNA traits are? I say, like, do
a little bit more work before we start judging, Like
if he's charismatic, And I was like, yeah, he has that?
Is he gonna be a cheerleader on the sideline, Like,
that's not his persersonality, And I think he's more stoic,
and I think that's good because he knows what he
is and that's who he's always been. Right as a player,
he's been steady, and his teams traditionally have been steady.

(18:10):
I think what's frustrating for fans, and probably way more
so for him and his staff, is the inconsistency they've seen.
Like I referenced off the top in you know, I've
referenced three different phases in three different games, and they've
all been a little different. I think part of that
comes when you're playing with five different offensive lines in
the first five games of the year because of injury

(18:30):
or competition, which would mean that like you don't have
five that are right truly a separator. If you ask
any coach in America to me, it takes about it
takes up seven eight years to really build an offensive
line pipeline. He just takes a long time. Like because
the minute you gain credence and credibility and recruiting, you
get them on campus, it takes them two or three

(18:50):
years to develop and then rent and repeat. It takes
a minute to get that moving, so I would just
say that, and then you're in the most competitive league
in the country, So yeah, Ucla, you should go win
that game. If we didn't see who they were a
week ago. If you asked me who played more complete
ballgame last Saturday, I probably say Ucla against Penn State

(19:14):
at home versus at Nebraska, where Michigan State had, you know,
had to make consistencies. So do I think he's the
right guy for the job, Yeah, for sure. Do I
think his blue collar personality will remind people of a
coach and who was inducted into the Hall of Fame
a couple weeks when out here for young Stun State
than you and I talked about Yeah, yeah, I mean

(19:35):
he wasn't the most charismatic guy from everything that I
can recall. No, So I think you got it great one.
I think Michigan State should be really fortunate that they
have him. And I also recognize that we're in an
era where everybody wants to win now, and I also
know that's impossible. But that is coaching. You know, every coaching,
every coaching higher doesn't work out like that's just the profession.

(19:56):
So define workout is that the fourth best team in
the Big Ten into the playoffs that overtake Ohio State
as the number one team in Oregon. Like, I don't
know what that is for the fan base. If it's
to be the best and be better than those two
at the top, it's going to take a couple of
years developing recruiting classes, folks. Like, that's just the truth
of how far apart or really like how deep Ohio

(20:17):
State and Oregon are. I don't think Mission State can't
play with them, but they don't have the competitive depth
right now that those two programs have.

Speaker 9 (20:24):
No I think that the thing that a lot of
people were looking for was to make a bowl game
that was kind of like the minimum after a five
and seventh season and a couple of games got away
last year, Michigan State could have been seven and five,
And the schedule is different this year. They don't have
to play Oregon Ohio State, but they don't have any
road games that they would be favored in either.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
So I get that.

Speaker 9 (20:48):
One of the things I see with a lot of
coaches Yogi and new coaches coming into programs we talked
about fan impatience is the Kurt Signetti factor and I've
had a lot of fans say, well, Indiana did it,
and Indiana doesn't have all the resources at Michigan State has.

Speaker 1 (21:05):
Why can't it be done here? Why is it taking
so long?

Speaker 6 (21:10):
Okay, I think that's a I mean it's a fair criticism.
Like I it's a really fun conversation to have. Like
think about Dan Lanning versus Lincoln Riley right like same
year and here's Dan Lanning, you know, playoff back twelve
championship game the year before that and has lost a
big ten conference game and is drilling people and is

(21:30):
a toast to college football right now. And here's Lincoln
took over a different circumstance.

Speaker 5 (21:36):
Right.

Speaker 6 (21:36):
You could say the same thing about jet Fish and
Washington in his second year and cop him to other
second year coaches, And I just think that they're all
a little different, and I think the path to success
that all of them are a little different. Let's talk
about Indiana because I called a bunch of their games
last year and big fan of coach Signett. He's a
Pittsburgh guy and I love bona with him over Pennsylvania stories. Yeah,

(21:58):
he came from you know, one of the you have
not the most successful FCS program, and he took a
bunch of players with him. I think it was over
near twenty from that very team who were starters that
weren't six three, two forty five, There were six to
one to twenty five and guys like Aiden Fisher and
Elijah Surratt went from you know, no name players to

(22:21):
Big ten All Conference players. That happened in every layer
of their defense. So I think there's a world where
like did Jonathan Smith bring twenty guys in them from Oregon?
To say, no, he didn't. He brought in a quarterback,
run a tight end offensive line, like he brought a
couple of key figures, but he didn't bring a ton
of people because you'd like to think that he didn't
have to. You know, in Indiana, Kurt was saying, I'm

(22:42):
bringing everything almost kind of did what Dion did. It
didn't say the quote that Dion made famous in Colorado.
So I just think they're a little different in that
style in which both programs inherited and took over their programs,
and that's kind of I think it shakes out. I mean,
I go back to Michigan State, Ohio State a year ago.
If you remember that game here in town, and you

(23:05):
go back inside of that game and I think, I'm
gonna get it closer to right. First drive, Michigan drives
down the field, they go for it on fourth down
inside the ten. Don't get it. Next drive, they drive
all day down the field, go forward again, and I
think on fourth down instead of twenty don't get it.
Next drive, drive all the down the field, fumble it.
Next time, drive over the field, miss a field goal,
like they move the ball up and down the field,

(23:27):
and then you look at half time and it's twenty
one seven or twenty one three or whatever it was,
and I just think, like the margins for Michigan State
since Jonathan has gotten there are just really small. I
think they're really small again this year for a variety
of reasons. Helped being one of them. And then well
and then we'll kind of see. I think in the
year three or four is where programs get evaluated and
you're right, like it's it's it's fair to say no,

(23:50):
I want to evaluate you right off the jump, because
that's what happened in Indiana. And I think it's also
fossil and insightful to say no, like we want to
go the same during school recruiting, and we want to
build this thing in a different manner, and that's how
Jonathan built organ Stade in the past.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yogi Rath from Bigger.

Speaker 6 (24:11):
Network, Yeah, yeah, whatever, go ahead.

Speaker 1 (24:13):
I'm sorry I lost you for a second.

Speaker 6 (24:15):
I mean, I yeah, go ahead. Oh okay, so go
for it.

Speaker 9 (24:21):
I just want to ask you about two other games
tomorrow very quickly, and get your take on what we're
going to see in Eugene, with Indiana going out there
and playing a team that is one or one A
in the country. A lot of people's minds in the
Oregon Ducks, and what might happen at the coliseum when

(24:41):
Michigan goes out there to face USC.

Speaker 1 (24:46):
What do you think of those games?

Speaker 6 (24:48):
I can't wait. I mean they should be tremendously competitive
and really physical. We'll start the one in LA I
think that the line of scrimmage is clearly where it's
gonna be won. Michigan ran the ball all over sc
last year. They win late. I think this is a
different sc team. They're more physical team up front, but
they didn't show that against Illinois, So what do they

(25:11):
look like coming off of that loss? I think that's
the biggest question mark, you're gonna ask yourself and then
you know, can Michigan and Bryce Underwood can they move
the ball through the air right to your point like
Bryce got moving a little bit in the past game.
He's going up against Danton Land, who comes from the
same pree as Wink Martindale. So it'll just be a

(25:32):
fun game. I see it coming down right to the end.
I think being at home. It's sold out the coliseum.
There's a vibe in LA where I just flew in
from yesterday around this game. For many reasons, two blue
bloods and for SCU this is a huge one if
they get this the one like look out and I
call this one kind of like a CFP entrance exam.
You know, the winners really in the mix of it,

(25:52):
the loser. It's gonna be hard, depending how the rest
of the season shakes out. In the flip side of
the early game with game they being in Eugene, it's
the first game. I believe their students are there check
because the quarter system is the way they do school.

Speaker 5 (26:06):
So yeah, yeah, so.

Speaker 6 (26:08):
The place will be crazy. I mean game they will
be nuts. Lean lead right end up flowing into the stadium.
Uh coach Landing Las team prepared for this. I'm most
curious about that part of it. Though they are really young,
they are inexperienced at being the face of the sport,
and right now they're in that dialogue. I mean, there's hot,

(26:29):
there's red hot, you know as anybody coming off the
Penn State game, then a bye week and all the
contents they put out, So how do they manage that?
And then here comes Indiana. Last time they went on
the road in a big time conference game was Ohio
State and they struggled, admittingly with the noise. With the environment,
I'd imagine they'll be more steady, even though it's a

(26:50):
different cast of players, most notably Fernanda Mendoza. Bike called
the game last time. Fernando played in Austin, so he
knows what it's like. I don't think he'll be shook
by what the environment is, but that one'll be one
at the line of scrimmage again, you know which team
can run the football. I expected to be a really
physical one and I'm excited for Indianax. I don't think
they're still getting any of the respect that I believe

(27:10):
they've earned based on what they've done in a year
and a half under coach Signetty. So I hope it's
a great game, but I think both home teams will
prevail in those games on the West Coast.

Speaker 9 (27:20):
Ye, I think it's maybe as fascinating a weekend a
Big Ten football as we are going to get, and
that includes Ohio State at Illinois. We haven't talk about
that yet, but Illinois had that game circled as its
chance to prove it belongs and erase the stench of
what happened in that the loss fifty three point lost

(27:44):
IU and I still can't believe that a team could
outrush a Brett Bielima unit three.

Speaker 5 (27:50):
Twelve to two.

Speaker 6 (27:52):
So yeah, well neither could he. We had Illinois last
week and he couldn't believe it either, you know, and
you've seen him since then. You'll play really well at
line of scrimmage. I don't know what the health of
Illinois is heading into the game. We had them against
Producer Reference and they were down some key players, like
their starting center, their interior right guard when in and

(28:13):
out throughout the game. So I think I kind of
lean to that, like because against Ohio State, there's man,
there is no marginal hair, and they're so talented, they're
such depth, they're so explosive. Their defense is as good
as I've seen in quite some time in college football,
and their offense says weapons. So they'll get the best

(28:33):
version of Illinois. It'll be insane in that environment at
Memorial State. Will be rocking. And I think for Illinois
that they need this one. They need at least to
be really close if they do lose, because if they
have finished ten and two, that lost to Indiana, to
your point, is such a bad look. And I don't
know if the committee is going to say, well, anomaly

(28:55):
or they're gonna say nope, that's their truth. And I
think this game will have a huge part of impact
that narrative.

Speaker 5 (29:01):
Yogi.

Speaker 9 (29:02):
There are a lot of teams that need a lot
of games, including the one you're going to be calling tomorrow.
Thanks so much for your time. Hope to see it
tomorre at the stadium.

Speaker 6 (29:09):
Yeah, coming out, man, We'll be in the press box.
I'll get there about four if you're un All right.

Speaker 9 (29:13):
Man, I'll see you the Yogi rath a Pig ten network.
All right, we will be right back. And when we
talk with Connor Eargood of the Detroit News get his
take on Michigan State football where it stands and Spartan
basketball as well.

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Speaker 1 (33:28):
Welcome back.

Speaker 9 (33:28):
It is a drive with Jack Spotlight Radio Network. Jack
Eblin here with my producer Boston Rob planning to get
Connor Irgood on the show. And he might be tied
up in some things right now, so that's fine. I
left a message for him and then I will try
to text him as well. While we are talking, Rob,

(33:51):
and we have hockey going last night or not going
in some cases for the top teams the nation. Don't
know that we have ever ever seen a number one,
number two, a number four team in the polls lose
at home, all of them to teams that didn't make

(34:13):
the NCAA tournament the previous season's currently unranked and currently unranked.

Speaker 15 (34:21):
So something was not expecting that on the Bengal card
as we open up a college hockey season for the
Michigan State Spartans last night.

Speaker 1 (34:32):
How do you think that happened?

Speaker 9 (34:34):
After what we saw in the exhibition game against Windsor,
I think most people would have predicted a Spartan win
by a couple of goals. But they probably would have
said the same thing in Kalamazoo, would have said the
same thing in State College.

Speaker 15 (34:51):
Yeah, this is where preseason polls, in my view, are garbage.
Hate them, never liked them. I understand why they're there.
And this is for any sport. It's for sports talk
radio shows much like this one to debate right coming
into the season. But this is where but when you
look on paper, this is the old adage why they

(35:12):
play the games right, Because when you look on the
paper on all those teams, you know, when you look
at the talent level and what you see, most certainly
you would favor all three of those teams. But most
certainly it's you got to give credit in this case
to I'll go to UNH. They played a very good
exhibition game against b BU the other you know, in

(35:35):
an exhibition and was able to tie them. So this
is a team that not very high expectations this year,
had a down year last year, so they had nothing
to lose in Michigan State, not saying that they felt
the pressure of being the number two team in the country,
but most certainly unh came out with a little bit
more jump, I would say, and most certainly carried the

(35:57):
play as far as puck possession goes. And you know
how important that is to Michigan State hockey. And when
you can get the face off circle double what your
opponent is, I mean, these are these are these are
ingredients for a good recipe.

Speaker 9 (36:13):
Right yes, Yes, we were sitting together on the platform
in the corner and talking about that, and when Patrick
Geary got the major penalty, I said, this is big
trouble and I thought at that point New Hampshire might
score more than once on the penalty. Tomy Manisto had

(36:33):
a great goal to tie it, but at that point,
one bounce of the puck. We saw that in Michigan
State's lost to Cornell, and what we.

Speaker 15 (36:43):
Were talking about that in the post game very similar,
right yeah, to what we saw with that last second.
I think it was like what three point eight seconds
with Cornell, and this was about five point two seconds
last night where you and h was able to able
to get the pucket to get the last second win.
But nevertheless, it'll be interesting to see Coach Nightingale and

(37:05):
his staff have most certainly have enough to let the
boys know what they need to do and a lot
of coaching points, I'm sure, and we'll see how We'll
see how this team, still a very young team all
all things considered, we'll see if he can handle a
little adversity, how they come out.

Speaker 9 (37:23):
Yeah, and may turn out to be a good lesson.
This team is incredibly young. They have freshmen standouts on
the first line and second line and edit all freshmen
line after that, which looks like it is going to
be very good. But I think the will of New

(37:44):
Hampshire was very evident, and the fact that they blocked
twenty one shots in the first two periods, And when
we asked Adam Nightingale about that afterward, he was talking
about two kinds of block shots. You know, there's some
guys who, you know, maybe they're kind of hoping the
puck doesn't hit them. These guys were selling out.

Speaker 15 (38:08):
Things like that, right. I mean, it's it's the little
increases of the game that most certainly unh took advantage
of that. Michigan State wasn't able to and all the
credit to u n H. And we got a guy
on the line that knows awful lot about college hockey,
but some other things as well. I know there's a
football game happening tomorrow here, homecoming, a very special time
for Michigan State alums to come and hopefully we'll see

(38:32):
a victory. But let's get Connor here. Good's uh Connor,
your good, uh expertise on a couple of things here
shall we?

Speaker 1 (38:40):
Yes, absolutely, Connor.

Speaker 9 (38:41):
We're talking about what happened last night in the world
of college hockey, not just on ice arena, but it
happened to Western Michigan, it happened to Penn State.

Speaker 1 (38:55):
Not a good night for the Big Ten.

Speaker 9 (38:56):
Minnesota also lost to Boston College, no shame in that,
but the Big Ten's top three teams all went down
at home. What's the lesson to be learned from Michigan
State and New Hampshire One.

Speaker 4 (39:10):
Ah, the lesson is don't schedule games on Thursday. No,
that's that's a joke, but only a partial one, you know.
It was it seemed like a one of those weird
games quote unquote. Obviously it's a home opener there's a
lot of emotion. I'm sure after winning four to oher
last weekend, they were probably feeling pretty good about themselves.
It's it's a young group. And I wrote this in

(39:32):
sort of my preseason feature about the team, like there's
gonna be growing pains. There's gonna be issues with having
so many young players, regardless of talent, regardless of where
they were drafted. And you know, I think that shows
itself in moments like that. I heard you guys talking
about the black shots. You know, experience and an age
tend to have players throw themselves in front of a
buck like that. You don't usually see a star player

(39:53):
doing that. It's usually the teams that are real gritty
have a lot more older players that tend to do that.
And credit to New Hampshire made some key saves in there,
had a real good execution on that goal, sort of
a NetFront kind of not turnover, but NetFront scrambled there
at the end after the turnover that you know, they're
able to put a past a pretty darn good goaltender
who maybe was left out to dry a little bit

(40:15):
at times. But that's what happens in preseason hockey. If
you remember the first game last year they went to
overtime against Lake State and that wasn't a particularly good
Lake State team either, So you know, it happens. It's
one game this season. I'm sure they're going to be
firing on all cylinders tonight. Well we'll see. But no
no overreactions in the sport of hockey. Even if three

(40:36):
top four teams went down in the same night. I
think that goes to show you anyone can win at
any even.

Speaker 9 (40:40):
Thursday, let's start college football, Connor, and what we are
going to see for homecoming tomorrow at noon?

Speaker 1 (40:49):
A noon start?

Speaker 9 (40:49):
Can you imagine that at Sportin Stadium and UCLA rolling
in now one and four? But what a one it
was last week at home against Penn State, and maybe
the Nittney Lyons were still reeling a little bit from
the double overtime lost to Oregon. But UCLA got him

(41:11):
right on the jump and build a lead and then
held on made the plays that had to make. We
saw Nico Iamaliava do some amazing things, especially running the ball,
something that UCLA had not taken full advantage of previously.

Speaker 1 (41:29):
How difficult the.

Speaker 9 (41:29):
Challenge is this going to be for Michigan State, and
is this the most likely win left on the Spartan schedule.

Speaker 4 (41:38):
Well, I'll answer the second question first. Yes, this is
the only I think guaranteeable if there's any guaranteed wins
at college football, this is the one that was circled
at the beginning of the year, like, all right, this
is the win at least in Big Ten play. Now
maybe not right. You know, UCLA's knewing pretty.

Speaker 6 (41:54):
Good about itself.

Speaker 4 (41:55):
Belief is a hell of a drug, and I think
they're they're pretty high on it over at UCLA. A
top ten win like that, I mean that's four teams
have done that in I believe some sixty three. Who's
the stat ESPN had The last one was an eighty
seven UTEP upset. I forget who they upset.

Speaker 9 (42:12):
I should know that up top it was nineteen eighty five,
forty years Yeah.

Speaker 4 (42:18):
Still, it shows the rarity. And you know, I think
that's something that there's two ways this could go. If
UCLA comes out hammers them, gets a couple of touchdowns early,
or you know, it is up or tied going in halftime.
I think this is UCLA's ball game. I think if
they can keep that momentum that that belief going. You know,

(42:39):
I think they could be improving to two wins and
Big ten play pretty soon. I think Michigan State's task
here is you have to get them off track. You
have to make them not believe in themselves, make them
think last week was a fluke. It's gonna be hard
to do that. It's gonna be hard to start early.
I know Michigan State had scored in the first four games,
and it's an opening drive. The last one not so much.
But things like that, you know, had ten happen. So

(43:01):
we'll see how this goes. We'll see how how UCLA respond.
I think it's gonna be a good game. Two mobile
quarterbacks evn in issues with both teams, which tends to
make good football. I know everyone's obsessed with like these
elite teams, but the best football you're going to see
is between you know, the sort of Big ten West
type teams where they're good teams, but they're in that

(43:22):
sort of six and six to ten and two range,
And I think that's going to be an entertaining battle
for sure on Saturday.

Speaker 9 (43:29):
We know how important this game is for the Bruins. Connor,
they have to find out if last week was a
lightning strike or start of a positive trend. But I
think it might be even more important in a strange
way for Michigan State because the Bruins trajectory is pretty
well established. Michigan State. We don't know if this is

(43:51):
going to be a bowl team, if it could be
a six or seven win team, or if the drum
beat for a coaching change and some of the fan
apathy I am seeing now is going to be exacerbated
by tomorrow for homecoming.

Speaker 4 (44:08):
Yeah, I think not to say there's a hot seat
or anything like that, but I think if you do
lose the UCLA, you know, I think the temperature is
going from from zero to one, right like, so it's
on simmer So it's I think it's it's not necessarily
a I don't believe in must wins unless you're like
a team that's going to be in college football payoff.
They can still get the six wins if they lose

(44:28):
this game easily. There's a lot of winnable games on
the schedule. But as I said earlier in the year,
sort of in the fifty to fifty range, you know,
Penn State looks vulnerable Indiana. Now, I think it's broad
watch quote unquote, it's called off. But Indiana looks like
the toughest game on the schedule right now. You know,
there's there's a lot of games that that could go
either way, but this is one. I think this is
the If they were to lose this game, it would

(44:50):
be the first one to go off what I would
have expected at the beginning of the years. You go
to USC you know, three hour time change. Ever, you know,
that's a very losable game he had in Nebraska. It's
a heck of a crowd, right olas, a heck of
a quarterback. They did a good job against him. You
kind of expect that that game might be one that
gets away from you. But u CLA at home, your
first noon game in what two seasons, homecoming, you're gonna

(45:12):
have the crowd on your side. If you're Michigan State,
it's not a game you can afford to lose, just
in terms of program vibes. And obviously there's been some
recruiting trail, lack of momentum, a couple of decommits quote unquote,
and I'm sure Graham and I would argue if they
were commits. I know he was tweeting about it too.
I was as well that if you're visiting, you're probably
not a commit. But regardless, you know, this is a

(45:34):
pretty big game from Michigan State in not the greatest
ways you want big games to be because you can
prove something, because you can, you know, take a step
or approve people that you belong in a certain conversation.
This is sort of a defensive big game. This is
a don't let yourself slip any further in the national conversation,
don't lose momentum that you're already sort of losing the

(45:55):
handle on. So that's sort of what I'm looking out for.
But I think it's a winnable game for Michigan State.
I think if they get decent enough offensive line play.
UCLA doesn't have the greatest of you know, pass rushes
from what I've seen, I think they have five sacks
in the year. I think two of them came against UNLV,
who you know, is a decent team. But I wouldn't
think of their offensive line as elite. So you know,

(46:16):
I think it's it's a game where you should be
able to see some steps and I think there's a
smack in the mouth nature as well, where you know
you lose two straight and big ten plays three weeks,
sort of muddling in it. I think you got to
show who you are here if you're Michigan State, and
that's something I'm watching for.

Speaker 9 (46:33):
I look at this as an opportunity game, Connor. And
if Michigan State can win, and it's more than a
touchdown favorite to do that, and should Michigan lose at
the Coliseum and it's a slight underdog there, you would
have Michigan State in Michigan with the same record. At

(46:53):
the midpoint, both teams would be four and two, not
to say they're the same teams, not the same.

Speaker 1 (47:00):
Wouldn't be a significant.

Speaker 9 (47:01):
Favorite when they meet in a couple of weeks here,
but they would both be four and two. And what
I don't understand, and I was not in Lincoln you were,
is what happened to the team that we had been
watching because the offense Aidenschilds clearly regressed. He threw some
passes we hadn't seen since early last season. Maybe it

(47:25):
was the hits he took or something else. There were
twelve negative yardage plays. Hard to ever win a game
when that happens. The special teams, which had been I
would argue as good as any in the country between
Martin Connington's and merchants. Ryan Eckley's constant performance is maybe

(47:46):
the ray Guy Award favorite. The return game, that was
an effort, a failing effort from the special teams.

Speaker 1 (47:54):
But then the defense, which had been the big question.

Speaker 9 (47:57):
Everyone had been saying, well, this team, you know, they
just don't have a defense. They have to, you know,
have to do something here with Joe Rossi because he's
not getting it done. They got it done. They held
Nebraska under three hundred yards. They did I think a
great job in terms of Dylan Rayola, and they got

(48:18):
five sacks. They'd only had six the first four games.
So how does up become down and day become night.

Speaker 4 (48:26):
Yeah, I'll tell you why. I think the offense struggled.
You know, the coach speak answer is going to be execution,
But I think the real answers trust. If you look
at the way Aiden was in that pocket, he bailed
as soon as he needed to, as soon as there
was an ankling that he would be hitting a turf,
He's gone. And Brian Lander talked about that on Tuesday
I wasn't there, but I was in Western Michigan for

(48:46):
a different story. But playing through the audio, Lingern had
some some pretty apt observations about you know, when you
have a mobile quarterback like Aiden, there is that sort
of fine line between being able to trust your seat
and kind of hanging in there and making your money
on third downs and long and hanging in there to
take a shot and getting to throw off. But I

(49:07):
think the trust is sort of lacking there. You know,
his offensive line has let him get sacked fourteen times.
That's not basically worse than last year, and this was
supposed to be an offensive line that was taking steps
that had some difference makers. I think a big problem
with that is just the injuries with Luka Vincich, who
is probably gonna be a starter, and stating and real
being out you know, some pretty evident struggles there. But

(49:28):
I also think there's some mistrust me between him and receivers.
You look at Nick marsh arguing with them on the sideline,
and I know their friends sitting next to each other
on the plane all that, but when you've got guys
yelling at each other like that, that's never a good
sign for an offense, and you know, we can talk
about that in a million different ways, but I do
think that there's just maybe a bit of a lack

(49:49):
of trust right now, and that's hard to get back.
It's sort of a catch twenty two, right. You need
the trust to play better, but you also need to
play better to get the trust back. So I think
some steps there it may go back to team building,
They go back to just taking a deep breath and
realizing they're gonna be okay. But it was a very
frustrating loss at Nebraska two back to back. I feel
like that because it was so close late, there is

(50:10):
that sort of frustration, and I think they let it
get the better of them, especially in that fourth quarter
when things sort of went awry.

Speaker 9 (50:17):
Yeah, it's important to remember that despite everything that had
gone wrong, including the block punt for a touchdown, Michigan
State did lead that game twenty one to fourteen late
in the third quarter before the sky.

Speaker 4 (50:33):
Fell, and they had they had a chance to score
again after the tie, and they muffed that kick.

Speaker 6 (50:39):
Again.

Speaker 4 (50:39):
You talk about special teams, like, yeah, it's a very
very amenable game against a pretty decent I won't say
great anymore, but a pretty decent Nebraska team. I was
really curious about that.

Speaker 9 (50:49):
There was a play too that I haven't really heard
discuss Connor, and it was right after Michigan State took
the lead and Dylan Royola threw a quick slant and
the ball was mishandled, went up in the air and
Michigan State could not come up with it. If it
had intercepted that ball deep in Nebraska territory and gone
in for a two touchdown lead, I think we see

(51:11):
a totally different game.

Speaker 4 (51:13):
Yeah, Jordan Hall talked about that he was the one
that probably could have made the play on that he
just had no way of seeing it. I mean, it's
three like three different bodies that bounces up. It's one
of those when you're in the skybox, it's like, oh, ball, ball, ball,
you pointed it. But in terms of tips and overthrows,
unless you drilled that, you know, an hour every practice,
I still don't think you come down with that ball
every time. But the fact that we can have that conversation,
you'll show you how close that got toward the end.

(51:35):
I really think he comes down to the defense playing
playing its tailoff. Jordan Hall I think had his best
game as a Spartan, no doubt, the way he was
able to sort of command the communication side I think
is the key. Right We've seen him be a playmaker,
make tackles, did it against Boston College, did it times
being a reserve, but being able to communicate, get his

(51:55):
guys in the right page, have the pass rush in
the secondary behind him working unison. That's all through him
with the green dot, and I know everyone's going to
look toward the secondary making steps and probably look toward
those guys kind of bowing up a little bit and
taking some you know, self respect and using that on
the field. But I think it also goes back to
Jordan halbying a better communicator and leader than he was.
And I know no one was saying he was a

(52:16):
bad communicator, but there's always layers to that, right, you know,
a minus versus B plus that sort of thing, and
a clearly took a step there. So that's something that
I'll be looking for in this game too. If you
can keep those steps going and if the secondary and
pass rush can work in concert like that, if he
can maestro that, that'll be a big thing for this
Michigan State defense to you know, go from being the

(52:37):
clear Achilles heel to maybe his strength of this group.

Speaker 9 (52:41):
You mentioned the offensive line counter and I have a
lot of respect for Jim Mahalchick. I saw what he
did at Oregon State. I know he's put players into
the first round of the NFL Draft. I know that
that became a real strength in court ballas and he
has a tremendous reputation nationally. But I didn't understand the

(53:06):
move and then the reaction to the move. It seemed
like rust and Young had done a really good job,
especially in past protection at USC, and then you wind
up moving Connor Moore, who had been a right tackle
this whole time. Michigan say he was certainly a left

(53:27):
tackle at Montana, but you move him back there and
you put Ashton Lepo in, and let's just say that
was a disaster. So what happens now? I don't know
that Stanton Remeil is ready to go. So do they
go back to what they did at USC? Or do
they just hope that Lepo's going to play better and

(53:50):
more is going to be more comfortable.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
What do they do?

Speaker 4 (53:54):
Yeah, I'm a rusting young believer. I thought he was
very strong in that USC performance. Especially you don't think
you're going to play that many of stamps, right, you know,
shows to dedicate his preparation.

Speaker 6 (54:06):
That he was able to be ready for that.

Speaker 4 (54:07):
But I thought, looking at the tape of the USC
game afterward, there were some run plays, I think that
he maybe wasn't where he needed to be, or maybe
he was was sort of a step behind. Maybe that
was a reason why they'd opted to go with Leo
was a little more experienced. Obviously was a starter for
a vast portion of last year. I think maybe that
was that sort of an experienced winside thing. And we

(54:28):
don't know what happened in practice too. You know, maybe
Young had some some pretty rough goes in practice and
preparation there. So you know, we don't know that side
of things. We'd have to ask Jim, and we haven't
talked to him in quite a while. I think since
yeah week these that I'm trying to remember in my
internal calendar here, but we'd love to ask him about that.
But no, I think More is pretty clearly a right tackle.

(54:51):
I think we saw his issues at left tackle earlier
in the season. I'm thinking of even the game against
Western Michigan. I can't remember I think they put him
there against against Youngstown State. I'm trying to remember, but
I remember seeing him get walked a little bit at
left tackle, and he clearly did in the last game,
but Lefo wasn't giving him any help on.

Speaker 6 (55:10):
The other side.

Speaker 4 (55:11):
And again that goes back to the lack of trust,
where if you're aiden and you see that happening play
after play, what else are you going to do? You
trust your feet to make a play more than your
offensive line. You're trying to win a football game, You're
gonna go run it. And I think that's the great issue.
Is that catch twenty two I mentioned earlier. But Lefo's
got to be better if he plays. I counted eleven
eleven snaps out of I want to say he had

(55:33):
fifty some in the game where he just either completely
missed his guy, didn't come up with someone got beat
after contact that he clearly did not win. And I
even gave him the ties and it was still a
pretty rough go. You know, he's a dedicated athlete. Obviously,
he's been around, stuck around even when there's gonna be competitions.

(55:53):
It's hard to knock him. But when a player doesn't
have it I feel like as a coach, that's when
it goes back to you to make that decision where
all right, my guys getting mean up. I got to
pull him change something up. I think treating a player
like that, and not to say like a sacrificial lamb
or anything, but you know, just throwing him into the
wolves and let him get tore up, I don't think

(56:14):
was a wise move. And then you think of his
confidence and now he's feeling this week. He sees everything
he you know, I'm sure he sees the tweets and whatnot.
Unless he's a no phone kind of guy, I'd have
to ask him. But you know that that's something that
I think is a very real problem in today's day
and age. And I think back in the day people
picking up the newspaper if they did, was still a problem.
It's just more magnified nowadays. So you got to feel

(56:35):
for a guy like that, who you know, had.

Speaker 5 (56:37):
A rough go.

Speaker 4 (56:37):
But we've all had bad days. But when you look
at tackle play, that's been a distant problem over two years,
even going further back. But we're just gonna stick on
the two because it's this staff and they can't control history.
But I think there needs to do some clear steps there,
and I think i'd go with the young guy rushing
young to at least get some experience if he's going
to be at a comparable level.

Speaker 9 (56:58):
All Right, before we let you go four games in
the Big Ten tomorrow, I want you to rank the
four most likely winners of these games. We're talking about
Michigan State hosting UCLA, UCLA entertaining Michigan, Oregon getting a

(57:18):
visit from Indiana, and Illinois at home against number one
Ohio State. The most likely of those eight teams to
win is.

Speaker 4 (57:31):
USC. I think USC is gonna gonna take Michigan to
the woodshed. That offense is nasty, and I know Michigan State, Michigan,
Michigan State, Michigan has a great defense and has some
pretty clear talent, but I think running with that level
of dog is going to be a challenge. You know,
Michigan's not used to seeing that out of a team
that's not Ohio State in the regular season, and I

(57:52):
think we saw that last year and they had to
play Oregon. That these sorts of big matchups when it's rivalry, Yeah,
maybe they have an edge of it in this sort
of setting. I don't know, man, I think this is
going to be a pretty clear USC victory against Michigan.
Now that being said, I think Michigan State beating UCLA
is probably the second and it's it's probably coming down
to a photo finish there. But uh, you know, win

(58:14):
play show wins going to uh the USC beating Michigan.

Speaker 1 (58:18):
All right?

Speaker 9 (58:18):
What about Ohio State at Illinois and Indiana at Oregon?

Speaker 4 (58:25):
Pretty sure I picked Ohio State for our pickhams for
the news. Those are against the spread, So I'm pretty
sure I picked Ohio State either way, But I don't
know Illinois got a shot. I feel like it's a
good team. Altmeyer's playing some some decent ball. The defense
has got to be better. I think you look at
the Indiana tape when they sort of just gave up.
Uh you know that that's that was a problem. They

(58:48):
can't do that against Ohio State, especially when it's it's
your home stadium. But stranger things has happened. Look, you know,
number one can go down in any time. We'll see
it in all sorts of sports. So I think it's
hard to beat a team like State that as a
pretty i think underrated defense, even though they're they're nationally
you know, recognized, I still think a little underrated. They're
hard hitting, they make good plays, they find place to

(59:10):
to turn the tide. I think that's a skill. Uh.
And and the offense has clearly not really missed the
step commergo last year. So uh, I'm pretty high on
Ohio State. But I think Illinois got a shot. Was
the other game? It's uh Oregon. Well, we can't call
it fraud watch if they lose to Oregon because it's
a pretty high of a matchup. But honestly, uh we

(59:36):
call it. Connor was wrong. Uh Indiana, I don't know.
I'm gonna give it to them just because you're on
they're on the road. They're on the road. Mendoz is
playing very well at quarterback, and I think if you're
a good enough playmaker, they beat beat Penn State because
Aler I don't think played a very good game in
order to play win against U. C. L A. But
you know, if you can get him sort of rattled,

(59:58):
you can beat Penn State. I think if if Mendoza
can be calm, can say the course against Oregon, they're
going to have a decent pass. Russia. I think.

Speaker 6 (01:00:08):
What's his face.

Speaker 4 (01:00:09):
Usual Ale, that's the name it was, escaping me. Mateo
is a pretty pretty decent d Lineman is going to
give them some fits. You know. I still think there's
some some things for Indiana to prove to me, even
though they blew out Illinois. But I will say just
being on the road, having a decent enough team, and
Oregon's probably feeling good about itself after beating Penn State.
Probably shouldn't after what we saw against U C.

Speaker 5 (01:00:31):
L A.

Speaker 4 (01:00:31):
But uh, you know, there's probably a high amount of
slagger I guess in that locker room, and that tends
to bite you in the rear. So I think Oregon
probably wins that game. But I do think Indiana, you know,
before the game, when you know it has sort of
the momentum if you will, even playing on the road,
I think they're going to be an easily motivated spot
and that's always dangerous and a big matchup like that.

Speaker 9 (01:00:53):
So in order of likelihood to win, you have one USC,
two Michigan State, three Ohio State or three.

Speaker 4 (01:01:03):
Oregon free Oregon for Ohio State.

Speaker 1 (01:01:06):
For Ohio State.

Speaker 9 (01:01:07):
Wow, all I know is counter if Indiana does pull
this upset and win at outsin stadium. We could have
four and two Michigan State at undefeated and number one
ranked Indiana. Yeah next week and whoever would have thought

(01:01:30):
Indiana could be number one ranked team in the country.
That's beyond my comprehension. Look forward to seeing it tomorrow
in the press box. Thanks so much.

Speaker 4 (01:01:39):
Yeah, absolutely, thanks for having me.

Speaker 9 (01:01:42):
Oh, we will be right back. We're gonna talking to
my best friend Marty MacKinnon. I was with him Tuesday
at Comerica Park. We'll get his take on Tigers, Mariners
and much much more coming up on the Drive with
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Speaker 9 (01:03:09):
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Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
Welcome back.

Speaker 9 (01:04:50):
It is a driving Jackiey Spotlight Radio Network, Jack Eblin
here with my producer Boston Rob Robo. Want to go
out to but that's the Maryland and welcome in a
guy who was just here. He was here for the
Michigan win over Wisconsin and for Detroit's loss to Seattle.

(01:05:17):
On Tuesday, Marty MacKinnon joins us talking about the baseball
series tonight, Game five, and much much more.

Speaker 1 (01:05:27):
Marty, how are you.

Speaker 7 (01:05:30):
I'm a lot better than I was after a couple
of innings of yesterday. Of yeah, the game day before yesterday?

Speaker 9 (01:05:41):
Yeah, were you of the belief that, oh wow, here
they go again. They can't score a run, They're down
three nothing, this is the end. They're not even going
to get to Trek's schooble. He may have pitched his
last game as a Tiger. And how did they score
nine unanswered runs?

Speaker 7 (01:06:01):
Well, they just they just stuck to it, whereas many
of the fans had abandoned them by not even showing
up for that game. The attendance was much lower than
the game you and I were at the day before,
And the Tigers just kept plugging away and aj Hinch
kept making his moves and it all came together. And

(01:06:26):
maybe it'll come together again tonight. But baseball is pretty unpredictable.

Speaker 9 (01:06:32):
So someone asked me last night, Marty, what are we
going to see? I said, I don't know. Can't tell
you that. If I did, I would be talking to
someone else and not you right now. But I can
tell you what we won't see in Game five, and
that's a three hour rain delay.

Speaker 8 (01:06:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:06:55):
Can you tell our listeners a little bit about what
that was like and some very interesting conversations I thought
that we had with Mariners fans.

Speaker 7 (01:07:05):
Yeah, So of course you and I arrived at Camerica
Park early for that four to eight start, and then
not only were we early, but we were really early
because there was that three hour rain delay, which meant
that we were in the ballpark for close to five

(01:07:25):
hours before the game started. But we took advantage of
that time to make the casual acquaintance of a couple
of Mariners fans who were wearing their Mariners gear. It's
very clear that they were Mariners fan and they were
both natives of Washington State, even though one of them

(01:07:48):
lives in Michigan now. And they talked about their team.
They talked about the great players of the past that
the Mariners have had, and they had many Ken Griffy
each Y Row and more and more. And they also

(01:08:11):
told us that they got a very good reception from
Tiger fans, that in general they felt welcome at Kamerica
Park and on the streets of around Comerica Park in
Detroit except for relatively young male fans. And then we
got a demonstration of that where we were standing there

(01:08:34):
with them for well over an hour amid thousands of
people passing us by it everybody was waiting out that
rain delay, and then with no one making any remark
to them at all, But then a group of young
guys wearing Tiger gears started to harass him, and thankfully

(01:08:54):
our Mariners friends just mild and laughed and waved and
said thanks a lot.

Speaker 9 (01:09:02):
Yeah, And in fact, it was such a productive discussion
that I may have landed an ebbling media.

Speaker 1 (01:09:08):
Intern out of this.

Speaker 7 (01:09:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:09:10):
The daughter of one of these Mariners fans happens to
be a student at Michigan State now. But I thought
it was it was very interesting that for Tigers fans,
it seems like the frustration has been going on forever,
and nineteen eighty four is a long time. We're talking
about forty one years. But the Tigers have had a

(01:09:31):
couple of chances. They've been into a World Series in
two thousand and six, they were there in twenty and twelve.
The Mariners are the only Major League Baseball franchise, Marty
as you know, that has never been to a World Series.

Speaker 7 (01:09:45):
Yeah, that's that must be really frustrating for Mariners fans,
especially with all the great players that they've had.

Speaker 9 (01:09:54):
Yeah, so what do you think we're liable to see tonight?
Can tear off Schoobal not beat the Mariners for a
fourth time this season and going back home? How much
difference do you think that will make? Mariners have a
lot of right hand hitters when they can turn their

(01:10:15):
switchers around and cal Roley can hit it out from
either side of the plate. Do you think there's any
reason that school Ball can't be Schooble tonight.

Speaker 7 (01:10:26):
I think Scooble's going to pitch a good game. I
think School's going to hold them to very few runs,
two or fewer in his seven innings. I'm sure he'll
go seven innings if it's at all possible. And then
and the question is will the bats be like the

(01:10:47):
second half of Wednesday's game or will they be like
they were the game we were at where they were pretty
much silent for the Tigers. But I think the Tigers
have a good chance to hit George Kirby he definitely,
he's a good pitcher, but he's not a great pitcher.

(01:11:09):
So I like the Tigers chances. I saw that ESPN
has them as a fifty five percent chances the Tigers
will win the game, and I think that's about right,
and it wouldn't be surprised that they lose, but I
obviously would be excatic if they win and think that

(01:11:29):
they have a better than fifty to fifty chance.

Speaker 9 (01:11:35):
The game is scheduled to start at eighth eight. Do
you believe that Kerry Carpenter got to the ballpark eight
hours before and he is that excited he's already in uniform.

Speaker 7 (01:11:48):
I would doubt it. George Kirby, Yeah, one of his
special friends. So yeah, why not get there early? I
want to ask you a question, Jack, Yeah, can I
do that? Could you tell me what these these guys

(01:12:08):
have in common? David Bednar, Mason Miller, Joan Durryan What
do those guys have in common?

Speaker 9 (01:12:18):
Well, they all could have been or should have been
Detroit Tigers.

Speaker 7 (01:12:23):
And where are right now? Where are they right now?

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
They're on teams that aren't playing.

Speaker 7 (01:12:30):
Yeah, they're sitting at home watching this game on TV.

Speaker 1 (01:12:35):
Yeah, but I.

Speaker 9 (01:12:36):
Don't hold David Bednar accountable for that. You can also
say that if you're if your point is that you
don't have to be super aggressive at the trade deadline,
I don't think Seattle would be here.

Speaker 1 (01:12:50):
I don't think it would have.

Speaker 9 (01:12:51):
Won the division if it hadn't made a couple of
trades for Naylor and Suarez and and done some things aggressively. So, uh,
you know, I'm still trying to deal with what this
Tiger season is about. Being twenty five over and then
being thirteen under and then looking so good and so
bad on consecutive days. People say, well, that's baseball, But

(01:13:15):
I don't have any clue as to how they're going
to hit tonight. I think I know how Trek Scoop
is going to pitch. I feel the same way you do.
But we just sat through a game in Brighton last Saturday,
game one of this series that went eleven innings and
the Tigers prevailed. What do you think the level of

(01:13:36):
angst would be in both of these communities if this
thing goes eleven twelve innings tonight.

Speaker 7 (01:13:45):
I think there'll be a lot of anks on both sides,
and one side's going to go home trying and the
other one's going to be let's get ready for the
Blue Jay And I think you know that if it's
a Tiger blue Jay series, that will be great because
we know how fanatics the Blue Jays fans are and

(01:14:08):
how they attack Comerica Park, So Tiger fans that'll be
ready to buy up those tickets.

Speaker 9 (01:14:18):
Absolutely with what we've seen any other series, Marty, we
know that Toronto got the best, not more than got
the best, just hammered New York pitching. We know that
the Dodgers beat a Phillies team that won more games

(01:14:38):
in the regular season and a lot of people thought
would be better didn't have to play in the wild
card round. We don't know what's going to happen tomorrow
in Milwaukee. Both these teams have won all their home games,
but now it heads back to Wisconsin. What's the number
one takeaway about this postseason so far?

Speaker 7 (01:15:02):
Well, I think it said anything can happen. I mean,
wasn't that just a tragic ending of that Phillies Dodgers
game last night? Yeah, where both teams were were battling
and then to have an end on a complete misplay
was just uh had to be heartbreaking for all the

(01:15:23):
Phillies fans. Yeah, when it should have gone on to
give the Phillies, uh, you know, in fifty to fifty
chance of winning that game. Uh and and and still
being alive. So I don't know. I think there's a
lot of interesting baseball being played. Uh uh and uh

(01:15:49):
you know, guys stepping up that you don't necessarily expect,
and uh in some cases, guys uh not stepping up
like uh Otani has had a miserable Uh yeah playoffs
so far at the plate. Aaron Judge had a spectacular

(01:16:10):
playoff at the plate and his team's sitting at all.

Speaker 9 (01:16:15):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, uh spectacular cs or ds rather
didn't have to play well.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
In the wildcard round.

Speaker 9 (01:16:29):
He wasn't at his best against Boston, but it didn't
seem to matter. You're talking about the way the game
ended last night, And I don't think Philly fans are
known for being forgiving. They're really hard on their own
and samulas, But when when you think about the end

(01:16:49):
of that game and the psychological trauma, the people you
would not want to be today, you know, that was
a combination of Bill Buckner and Donnie Moore. Yeah, and
this guy's going to have to live with that that
was a series, season ending play and to make two

(01:17:10):
mistakes on it. You know, he's only going to see
that the rest of his life.

Speaker 5 (01:17:16):
Yep.

Speaker 7 (01:17:16):
I would think that the Phillies would do a great
favor to trade him to an American League team. Yeah,
in the offseason, all.

Speaker 1 (01:17:29):
Right, I have a quick question for you about college football.

Speaker 9 (01:17:34):
You were in ann Arbor and you saw Michigan beat Wisconsin.
Wolverines didn't look terrific, but they were certainly good enough.

Speaker 1 (01:17:43):
After the first drive of.

Speaker 9 (01:17:45):
The game, they were able to shut Wisconsin's offense down
almost completely turned the water off. You just heard Connor
Eargood of the Detroit News, who covers Michigan State but
is a University of Michigan alum, say that he thinks
that Michigan could get run tomorrow, and he thinks that

(01:18:06):
USC is the most likely of the teams in the
eight games we talked to, four games we talked about
to win. You think Michigan can beat USC or will
beat USC in the coliseum.

Speaker 7 (01:18:19):
I think that Michigan certainly can beat USC, but I
would anticipate that it will be a close game. USC
is an awesome offense, a great quarterback, great receiver, very
strong running backs, and it's well balanced of a good
tight end as well. Michigan is very good on defense,

(01:18:43):
but they're but very good against awesome. Might not be enough.

Speaker 9 (01:18:49):
Yeah, Marty, before I let you go, I have to
hit you with the stat and our good front. Steve
Waite just sent this to me, but I find it
fascinating League Baseball history, twenty five different teams have hit
two hundred and forty five or more home runs in
a season. So the twenty five most powerful teams in

(01:19:11):
Major League history two hundred and forty five homers or
more in a year. Guess how many of those twenty
five have won the World Series.

Speaker 7 (01:19:21):
You're making me think it's going to be a low number.
Let me choose five.

Speaker 1 (01:19:28):
The correct answer is zero.

Speaker 7 (01:19:31):
Wow, that's that's that's really something.

Speaker 9 (01:19:37):
So Baseball website.

Speaker 1 (01:19:43):
Yeah, the championships don't.

Speaker 7 (01:19:46):
Yeah. Yeah, Wow, that's that's pretty amazing.

Speaker 9 (01:19:50):
Yeah, Marty, I will probably be hollering at you at
some point.

Speaker 1 (01:19:54):
You're going to be up till this game ends, to know.

Speaker 9 (01:19:59):
Yeah, we had a long night last Saturday. We're going
to have another one tonight and we'll be able to
make sense of this and either say the Tigers are
colossal flops or they're one of the great stories of
all time.

Speaker 1 (01:20:13):
We'll know in a couple hours.

Speaker 7 (01:20:15):
Yeah, and I might see again next week.

Speaker 1 (01:20:19):
That's right.

Speaker 9 (01:20:20):
That's right, Marty flies in rob. When there's a game
to be played, an important game, Marty mckinne usually finds
a way to get there. And you know, at least
we'll be in a couple of those seats that Toronto
fans can't get.

Speaker 7 (01:20:36):
Yep, all right, Jack, let's thanks Marty.

Speaker 1 (01:20:41):
There you go.

Speaker 9 (01:20:42):
We will be right back and we're going to talk
with Gary Gillette, baseball historian, and then Jay Green will
be with us and we'll talk some college football and
more coming up on the Drive with Jack.

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Speaker 9 (01:21:32):
Jack Kevlin here with my good friend Matt Sloan at
Graph of Opemists.

Speaker 8 (01:21:36):
Big summer are Matt.

Speaker 5 (01:21:37):
That's right, Jack.

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Zero percent. Can't get much lower than that. That's exactly
right in the gang here on West. They're making freaks.

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Speaker 2 (01:22:24):
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Speaker 11 (01:22:25):
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Speaker 9 (01:23:01):
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Speaker 10 (01:23:46):
Bobby Bias Hall Murder earlier first one wha there tay
on field?

Speaker 1 (01:23:52):
Mygain?

Speaker 2 (01:23:53):
Yes, Tigers Hobby is it stop a hole?

Speaker 11 (01:24:01):
Go get him Tiger Row.

Speaker 1 (01:24:12):
Welcome back.

Speaker 9 (01:24:12):
It is the Drive with Jack Spotlight Radio Network, coupling
here with my producer Boston Rob. And Rob, I don't
know if Hobby is unstoppable, but he is unhobbylike. We
hadn't seen anything quite like this explosion the last couple
of weeks, not even when he was the worst All
Star starter in All Star Game history in the outfield.

(01:24:35):
All right, let's go out to our guest line. Very
happy to welcome in. Baseball historian sabermetrician, author researcher Gary
Gillette joins us, Gary, what are we going to see
tonight in Seattle?

Speaker 1 (01:24:55):
Jack?

Speaker 3 (01:24:55):
I think you forgot one of my other titles, all
around good Guy?

Speaker 9 (01:24:58):
Oh yeah, I thought no one knew that, so I
didn't want to just be labor them with the obvious.

Speaker 3 (01:25:05):
Yeah, you know, Jack, I have almost nothing to say.

Speaker 5 (01:25:08):
I know.

Speaker 3 (01:25:09):
I was hoping you'd ask me on the show this week.
But everything I say about the Tiger Creves be wrong,
Other than I predicted they would, you know, well, I
actually freakad they would win the division and they didn't,
So I mean, what do you do with this kid?
I decided to say, they need to do a nickname.
So how about the cardiac kitties k R D I
A C K I T T I E S. How

(01:25:29):
about the cardiac Kings.

Speaker 1 (01:25:30):
Because I like that.

Speaker 3 (01:25:32):
That's the way I feel about these guys. Every time
you think they're dead, they rise up like the money
pipeline schedule.

Speaker 2 (01:25:38):
I'm not good do it.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
And every time you think they're going well, they decide to, oh, well,
let's just throw on a towel for a while and
can scare the Jews on everybody.

Speaker 9 (01:25:47):
Yes, I don't know, And at a time in this
country when up is down and day is night, it's
only appropriate, I think, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:25:57):
Rob.

Speaker 9 (01:25:57):
One of the things, one of the things that makes
Gary Jellette such a good guest for us is that
when he has an opinion and it proves to not
be right, he faces up to it.

Speaker 1 (01:26:10):
In fact, he announces it.

Speaker 9 (01:26:12):
And we have a lot of guests who, you know,
I'll try to pretend it didn't.

Speaker 1 (01:26:16):
Happen, or fudget change it in some way.

Speaker 9 (01:26:19):
But you're not alone because a lot of people, when
the Tigers were twenty five games over five hundred, figured
that this was going to be a cakewalk.

Speaker 1 (01:26:29):
Of course it was not.

Speaker 9 (01:26:31):
Then falling behind it was midway through the game after
four and a half innings on Wednesday, and there were
audible booze at Comerica Park. People were contemplating the future
of Scott Harris, saying that this team had just mortgaged
a lot of its potential for a window by not

(01:26:52):
being more aggressive at the deadline, and suddenly all is
right with the world with Trek Scooble on the mound
for Game five and Tigers are one went away from
being in the ALCS.

Speaker 3 (01:27:04):
Well, I have to say I listened to the local
sports talk station a lot in the last two weeks,
and they need to take there lithium every day, I'll
tell you, because they are up and down, and they
are cursing this team like they were the two thousand
and three Tigers, and then they're pumping it up like

(01:27:25):
they're the eighty four Tigers. Oh my god, they just
can't seem to settle on it.

Speaker 6 (01:27:30):
By the way, I have you may.

Speaker 3 (01:27:32):
You know that was a nice compliment that I admit
I'm wrong. I try to because I know so many
people who won't, but I am. Thirty years ago, after
some goop up where I was wrong, I actually created
a recipe for roast crow, roast raven and blueberry Chipotle
sauce and send it out to somebody. And of course

(01:27:52):
I have a customized crow bib, so when I eat crow,
I'm not going to get the feathers and all that
crap on.

Speaker 1 (01:27:58):
My suit comes in handy, very good. Good idea.

Speaker 3 (01:28:03):
Yeah, better than a lobster good.

Speaker 9 (01:28:06):
So the other day, I guess it was appropriate that
Riley Green, who'd been striking out half his trips to
the plate sometimes it seemed like way more than that,
hit one of the longest. It does, Yeah, hit one
of the longest home runs of the year. And from
that point on, once the Tigers took a four to

(01:28:27):
three lead, they scored nine unanswered runs. One of the
amazing things about baseball gear, and you know this better
than anyone, is there's very little carryover. They used to
say that it all depended on the next day's starting pitcher.
I don't know if it's that or the hitting or
everything else that goes into it, But what happened in

(01:28:47):
Game three had nothing to do with Game four, and
I'm not sure Game four is gonna have anything to
do with Game five, right.

Speaker 3 (01:28:56):
Jim Leland, for one, was not a pleaver momentum. I
think momentum is a tiny, tiny tiny thing, and it
is dependent on who got injured, who comes off the
injured list, who you're starting next, starting picture is you
know that kind of stuff.

Speaker 5 (01:29:13):
I have to say.

Speaker 3 (01:29:14):
I love watching Riley Green play. I think is a
tripic star. I think he's on the custom superstardom. But
I am a paull at the strikeouts this year. I mean,
it seemed like he got you know, he made some
mistakes handling the media by saying well, it is what
it is too often because the fans don't want to
hear that. Now, he still had a trific year. He

(01:29:36):
had a terrific year, and the Tigers dependent on him.
They needed him. But he needs to step up one
more level. When Scott Harris came to Detroit, one of
the things I thought was especially smart about him. We
want to control the strike zone on both sides of
the plate. You know, we want our hitters that control
strikes out and we want our pictures. I think the
pictures do a pretty good job, although the problem is

(01:29:56):
they have too many four A pictures that they managed
to get to be productive in the majors by fooling
other people and by changing their piss selection and because
they hired Chris Feeder, the Albert Einstein of pitching coaches.
But in the hitters, they're not controlling the strike zone.
They're not controlling the strike zone, and they're not making

(01:30:17):
enough contract. I'm not a guy who says, you know,
who tells these less of guys who had more home
runs when they struck out that's seventy five years ago.
Who cares? But they struck out way too much this
year they struck out way too much. They need to
put the ball in play more. I'm hoping that the
Tigers give hitters like Riley Green and Frankly a bunch
of other hitters are theirs some tough love in the

(01:30:39):
off season, like they gave the School of Left and
text School elescive me the Specritorkalsen last year and said, hey,
you need to do better. You can't just go on
your draft status, your previous year. You know where your
peak year. You need to do better. And that's true
of pretty much every Tigers hitter, including especially Green.

Speaker 9 (01:31:00):
Gary. You can speak to this because I've had these
discussions now with new age baseball fans who say strikeouts
don't matter. You'd rather have a strikeout than hitting into
a double play. All that matters is driving the ball,
pulling the ball with power, and lofting the ball and
getting home runs. Can you speak to the advantages of

(01:31:22):
contact in baseball twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:31:26):
Well, there is true the strikeout don't matter when they're
when at the end of the year you look at
them a striking or just another out. And it is
true in a certain circumstance that if you strike out
rather than hit a weak ground or to short for
a six four to three double play, a striking is better.
But the point is you don't want to accept strikeout
because every time Riley Green makes contact, there's a chance

(01:31:48):
for a base hit. Even if it's a ruptured duck
dying quail over the infield, there's a chance for the
other team to boot the ball because the errors happen,
you know, and a lot of what when we were young,
they weren't call a lot of things that their base hits.
Now they would have called the mirrors, yeah, and a
lot of things, you know. Right now, it's gotten to

(01:32:08):
the point where if you want to call an error
on an infielder in a ground ball. The ball pretty
much has to hit him in the cup. He has
to drop it, he has to kick it, he has
to pick it up, look at the ball for five seconds,
and then throw it over the first base and head
for it to be an error. Even then, they might
give him a base hit and a throwing error. Yeah,
you know, a lot of bad things could happen you

(01:32:28):
put the ball in place, especially with like guys like
Riley Green who hit the ball hard. I mean, they
hit that damn ball hard. And so I'm not saying
Riley should strike up fifty times a year now, but
cutting that down to one hundred and fifty, I think
would push him one more step up the ladder towards
true superstardom.

Speaker 9 (01:32:48):
Yeah, Aaron Judge strikes out a lot. Shoyo Tani strikes
out a lot. Kyle Schwarber, Yeah, strikes out a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:32:54):
So pretty damn good hitters, I think.

Speaker 1 (01:32:57):
Yes, yes, exactly. But when did get me to talk
over you? No, No, that's fine. When did this trend
with errors?

Speaker 9 (01:33:06):
Because I've been complaining about this off season and I
noticed it more this year than ever before.

Speaker 1 (01:33:12):
When did the start and why did it start?

Speaker 3 (01:33:16):
Okay, So, were you complaining about the airs where you're
yelling it? Simply get off your lawn, because that's about
what people think when you complain about errors anymore. And
I'm guilty of it too. Back when I was, you know,
a young whipper snapper, they had errors. You know, if
a guy didn't make the play, he stood up and
he took the medicine with that big flashing E on
the scoreboard. Yeah, you know, it started thirty plus years ago.

(01:33:39):
It's been gradual, but it's gotten ridiculous now. I've seen
official scores in press boxes, not just in Detroit, around
the country. I've seen them walk around the press box
after a play, waiting for the replay so they can
find any excuse to not call something an error. And
you know, the way it is is because if you
call it an error, the fielders unhappy. The batter's unhappy, but.

Speaker 1 (01:34:04):
The only pitchers happy.

Speaker 3 (01:34:05):
Who is happy is that pitcher's happy. But the pitcher
isn't going to show up his fielder. He's not going
to show up his third basement or his left fielder.
And so if you call it a hit, you have
fewer people to complain, and players do complain and more
importantly that the teampr officials will complain or front office
person will complain to the official scorer. And I know
they're not supposed to try to influence it, but I've

(01:34:28):
seen it a dozen times. They sort of say out
loud in the press box when it's quiet. Boy, that
fall was hard hit, wasn't it. I don't think many
people could have made that play, or the most ridiculous one.
He had to run a long way to get that
to have that ball clank off his glove, hit him
in the nose and then dribble down his shirt. You know,
I mean, they just make too many excuses. There's no

(01:34:51):
there's no ignominy in making an error. Everyone does it.
And we're not talking about the routine ground ball the
shore where somebody throws it into the stands. We're talking
about hard plays. These are major leaguers. They make the
hard plays most of the time, and if they don't,
any is not the end of the world. The same
way a strikeout isn't the end of the world. Guess
what you strike out us not the end of the world.

Speaker 1 (01:35:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:35:14):
I think what we're doing here is we're condoning and
we're pardoning or not holding players accountable for mistakes that
major leaguers should not make. And I think it is
distorting some statistics. Not that people are winning batting championships
because of it, because it's all across the league. But

(01:35:35):
I also think that as a pitcher, maybe earn run
averages would be a tick lower than they are. And
maybe that's just again, get off my lawn.

Speaker 1 (01:35:45):
But what about the other.

Speaker 3 (01:35:49):
Jack Let me put you on hold. I gotta go
yell at those kids out there. But I'm completely agree
with you. I completely agree with you.

Speaker 1 (01:35:56):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:35:58):
Let's talk about the other three series, the divisional series,
and we have another game five. Brewers won the first
two in Milwaukee. Cubs answered with a pair of wins
at Wrigley Field. Now we go back for a Game
five in Milwaukee. Is that any more predictable than Tiger's Mariners.

Speaker 1 (01:36:24):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:36:24):
And you know, my heart is with the Brewers. I'd
love to see the Brewers win. And I also think
if the Brewers go to the World Series, it helps
defeat the argument for a salary cap is if the
owners try to enforce a salary cap on the players
in twenty seven, we're gonna have We're gonna lose partner
all the season. A lot of people think we'll lose

(01:36:45):
the whole season. And so people have pointed out the
Mets spent more money than FDR did on national defense
in World War Two, and the Dodgers spent more money
than King Krosis. You know, if the Dodgers don't win
the World Series and Mets don't make the World Series,
the Cubs are defeated by the Brewers. All that sort

(01:37:05):
of undercuts the argument that you have to have a
salary tap and that you know, the underdog teams not
I shouldn't even call them underdog. The underclass teams like
the Pirates, the Marlins, the Rockies, that they're just not
trying to compete. You know, they just don't want to
pay to hire smart people in the front office. They
don't want to pay to retain their talent. I mean,
that's certainly true of the Pirates. The Rockies are a

(01:37:27):
basket case. They need new ownership. Nothing else will save them.
The Marlins are the most cynical team in sports, where
they just keep churning their ross, turning their talent and
collecting revenue sharing checks. It's shameful, it's absolutely shameful what
they do. So I am worried about losing a twenty
seven season. Baseball doesn't have the robust base of popularity

(01:37:49):
it did fifty years ago, and people think. People say
erroneously that baseball always comes back after a strike or
a lockout, but it never comes back as strong, never
come back as strong. Attendants might come back three or
five years later, but you look at the TV rating,
and you just look at the number of people who
say baseball is my favorite sport or I'm following baseball.

(01:38:11):
Baseball has never come back as strong from any major
labor destruction. And I know it worked for the NHL.
I know it worked from but the NHLPA was nowhere
near as strong as the MLBPA is. And if they
force a war and both sides go to the mats,
they'll be blood all over baseball. And while the owners
might win, they might very well win. It's not just

(01:38:33):
shooting something on the foot. They've aimed the gun farther up,
like between their crotch.

Speaker 1 (01:38:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 9 (01:38:40):
I think when players say that you don't have to
spend all this money, you could win if you're the Brewers,
they're being disingenuous because if that's the case, and why
should teams spend that much money and they don't want
them to stop doing it. I always point to the
National Football League Gerry and they have a hard cap
and everything is split. They are now America's national pastime.

(01:39:06):
They are the league everyone would want to be and
why because they have parody and with three weeks to
go into season, they have eighty percent of the teams
that still think they have something to play for. And
I think that that otherwise, there's absolutely no way that
the Dallas Cowboys wouldn't be able to get a corner
on the best talent. There's only so many positions they

(01:39:29):
can spend at that level for it. That doesn't seem
to stop the Dodgers and the Mets and the Yankees.
So I don't care what the number is. And the
way it's done in some sports is it's a percentage.

Speaker 1 (01:39:41):
You figure it out.

Speaker 9 (01:39:42):
Maybe it's forty eight percent, maybe it's fifty, maybe it's
fifty two.

Speaker 1 (01:39:46):
I don't care.

Speaker 9 (01:39:46):
If it's fifty five percent of the money going to
the players, there's enough there for everyone to be extremely wealthy, so.

Speaker 1 (01:39:55):
They can fudge the number.

Speaker 9 (01:39:56):
But what I'm looking for is everyone playing with the
same weapons, and that is not the case.

Speaker 5 (01:40:02):
Now, yeah, it is.

Speaker 3 (01:40:05):
It is true that spending money doesn't guarantee success. That's
partly because some people spend money stupidly, and that's partly
because but it does increase your chance of success. Sure,
the number of high spending teams who get to the
postseason is much much greater a percentage of the high
spending teams than the teams that don't spend money. It's
also true that the postseason in baseball is set up

(01:40:28):
to make it if you're Cleveland and you squeak into
the playoffs or Kansas City, or that you have a
chance of winning in these short series that's completely disproportionate
to your regular season record. I was just telling my
sister today called me about the Tigers and the Phillies series,

(01:40:49):
that in baseball it's not quite a coin to a
People say postseason series that coin. To us, that's not true.
Most of the time the better team win, but it's
not seventy percent of the time or eighty percent of
the time like it is in other leagues. It's like
fifty five percent of the time in a short series,
it's sixty forty as a massacre. That's one hundred and
five win team or one hundred and three win team

(01:41:11):
versus an eighty eight win team. If you have a
ninety seven win team versus an eighty nine win team
in a three game series with the coin. In a
five game series, check the home field advantage with the
coin and give a tiny edge to the home field
advantage team on a seven game series a little bit better.
You have more time for a stronger team to prevail

(01:41:32):
even if they lose two of the first three games.
But the system is set up so that if you
spend three hundred million, you can still get bumped off
in the first round of the second round by losing
three games. The first round. You lose two games, you're done.

Speaker 5 (01:41:44):
Second round, you lose.

Speaker 3 (01:41:45):
Three games, You're done. Oh check the Yankees. I would
check the Yankees lately. See where they are. They're at
home crying, you know, and.

Speaker 9 (01:41:54):
You alluded to with the roster formulation. You know, you
worked up with three left handed hitting catchers and you
wind up with the same player over and over on
the roster. But they never seem to address the fundamental problem.
The reason they haven't won a championship since two thousand
and nine. It's the second longest drought in franchise history.

(01:42:15):
I'm just curious to see where this all winds up.
And income inequality is a problem in our society to
begin with, but baseball doesn't seem to recognize that.

Speaker 5 (01:42:24):
Gary.

Speaker 1 (01:42:25):
Before we let you go go ahead.

Speaker 3 (01:42:28):
I will say that the baseball has a soft cap.
People don't recognize it is a soft cap, and anyone
but someone like Steve Cohen has to pay attention to
and the Dodgers have to pay attention to those penalties.
They're really severe. I wouldn't mind to see the soft
cap tightened up in the next negotiation, But I don't
want to see is losing a whole season. I just
don't want to see that. That is just baseball will

(01:42:50):
not come back from that.

Speaker 9 (01:42:51):
Well, if you demonstrate to the players that rising tide
floats all boats. The owners aren't trying to lose money.
That's not the way they're wired. If more money is made,
then everyone is going to benefit, and the players are
going to get whatever percentage is negotiated of that, and
then it's up to the teams to decide how to
split it up. They're all going to have a certain

(01:43:14):
amount to spend, and the competition is going to be
based on how they want to apportion that money. But
I wanted to ask you before we let you go,
gare about where we're headed now in the series. We
have Toronto in, we have the Dodgers in. There are
six teams alive, there will be four after tomorrow. Which

(01:43:38):
two would you guess are most likely to be in
the AL and NL Championship Series?

Speaker 3 (01:43:48):
Oh, the Championship? I thought you were going to.

Speaker 1 (01:43:50):
Say the World Series. Let's say the World Series. Let's
say the World Series.

Speaker 9 (01:43:54):
We know they're going to be four in the ALCS
and NLCS. Which two of those four advances of the
World Series.

Speaker 3 (01:44:00):
I really think the Blue Jays and the Dodgers look
like the best teams that are still standing. Now, anything
can happen. The Tigers and the Mariners have real strengths.
I think the Tigers are going to win tonight, but
I'm still worried about it. I want to tell you
one stat I checked up today. The Mariners have five
players with twenty seven or more home runs this year.

(01:44:21):
All of them are right handed hitters, are switch hitters.
Guess who the Tiger's starting a lefty now Terror School
is not your ordinary lefty, and that still concerns me.
The other thing is I worry about Will Vest. He's
had a terrific postseason, but he had a really rough
second half and a really bad September.

Speaker 5 (01:44:37):
I just worry that.

Speaker 3 (01:44:38):
You know that either his his arm is tired or
somebody's figured stuff out. And I don't have a lot
of confidence in the bullpen beyond Vest, So that's my concerns.
I think the Tigers are Mariners, are worthy opponents, and
they could take the blue Jays. But I think the
blue Jays are a stronger team and they're going to
have more time to rest, and the Dodgers are They

(01:45:00):
should be a super team. They haven't shown it yet.
But my heart's with the Brewers. Yeah, I think the
Brewers have a better chance of taking the Dodgers of
the kum Zuo, but you know, the comes up in there,
they're sort of like the Tigers.

Speaker 1 (01:45:16):
Garret, thanks so much for joining us.

Speaker 9 (01:45:17):
I really appreciate it and enjoy the rest of the postseason.

Speaker 5 (01:45:22):
Yeah, let me know.

Speaker 3 (01:45:23):
Let me know if you get in the hospital cardiac arrest,
where I can come visit.

Speaker 1 (01:45:27):
Ye sounds great.

Speaker 9 (01:45:31):
Uh, that's Gary Gillette and nobody knows more baseball than
he does. What do you think of those comments about
where we're headed? Where the game is headed?

Speaker 1 (01:45:43):
Rob?

Speaker 9 (01:45:47):
Rob must be on the phone. Rob is probably trying
to talk to Jay Green right now. Jay is ready there.
He is, okay, okay, good, Jay Green joins us. Proud
Flinn Stone Spartan dog for life. Uh, you got a
lot of answers. Which Michigan State team are we going

(01:46:08):
to see tomorrow?

Speaker 5 (01:46:11):
I'm hoping that we see the best Michigan State team,
the best version of it, at least.

Speaker 1 (01:46:15):
I know you're hoping that.

Speaker 9 (01:46:16):
You always hope that you you have green glasses. We
know that, But which one do you think we're gonna see?

Speaker 5 (01:46:24):
I think we will see a better version. I think
that it's a It's a lot, you know that's going
on in this game. You know, the two quarterbacks are rivals.
You got a coach who was here last year that's returning,
who played here, that's here, So that's a whole nother
you know issue. And you know they just came off

(01:46:44):
a big win and we just came off of a
game we should have won. So it's a lot going
on and I think that both teams really got a
lot to play for us, So I think that it'll
be it'll be a good game, but I think the best,
the best version of us will show up.

Speaker 1 (01:46:59):
We both know Demetrius Martin.

Speaker 9 (01:47:01):
You know him a lot better than I do, having
been a teammate of his in the early nineties here
and he was an All Big Ten defensive back before
making a tour of the West Coast coaching stops, coming
back to Michigan State and then heading back to UCLA.
Who has the advantage on that Jay? Is it meet

(01:47:24):
for knowing the Michigan State personnel or is it Michigan
State's other coaches for knowing what Meat likes to do.

Speaker 3 (01:47:34):
Well.

Speaker 5 (01:47:34):
I would think it would be him because he because
he was actually in that building. I think it's different
when you actually in the building because you get a
different sense of everything than you know everybody else does.
So if there is an advantage, I would definitely say
that that it's him, But you know, you kind of
wonder if there really is an advantage, because you know that,

(01:47:55):
I feel like they know that they know what he
knows and they going to try to make sure that
they do things that he's familiar with, so I think
that him knowing is definitely an advantage, But I just
don't know how much of an advantage.

Speaker 9 (01:48:08):
It would be. We had seen a notable improvement from
Aiden Childs first four games of the year. He was
the best thing Michigan State had going on offense, maybe
next to it's incredible punter Ryan Eckley. Really a positive
player for the Spartans last week.

Speaker 1 (01:48:27):
None of that.

Speaker 9 (01:48:28):
Some good plays with his legs, but really could not
throw the ball effectively.

Speaker 5 (01:48:34):
What happened, Anna, That's hard to say. That's a great
question I wish I had an answer to. He seemed
very comfortable and yeah, I've been doing very well. I
don't know, you know, coming off the bye week. You know,
you usually expect, you know, more improvement coming off of
bye week because you got that time to you know,

(01:48:55):
kind of get your stuff to things together. But yeah,
that's a good question, which I don't have an answer
for it because I'm not really sure. And I don't
want to say that he's just going in the tank
just because of one bad game either. You know, it happens.
So I'm interested to see how he bounced back, how
he bounces back from that, you know, performance from last

(01:49:17):
week and how he does Yeah, I think that's gonna
be again. That will be a part of what's going on.
To be able to see that, to see how he
bounced back.

Speaker 9 (01:49:31):
You're a receiver, you understand the mindset receivers are are
a little different the way they're wired. But we saw
the conversation slash confrontation last week on the sideline with
Nick Marsh and Aidan Giles and their friends, and you
know they rode back together on the plane and all that.

(01:49:52):
But a lot of frustration and you can imagine for
Nick Marsh, he wants to get the football.

Speaker 1 (01:49:58):
You're not getting it enough for whatever reason.

Speaker 9 (01:50:03):
But how much of getting a receiver the ball if
you have a great receiver, And I've seen teams scheme
to get their receiver the ball in unusual ways. Lou
Holtz was very good at this with Tim Brown with
rocket Ismail with others, and Nick Saban very good at

(01:50:25):
getting his main guy the ball. Is there a problem
here that Michigan State is not getting the ball to
Nick Marsh or he can do something with it.

Speaker 5 (01:50:38):
I think that is definitely a problem because I feel
like he's our best player on offense and you want
to get your best player at the ball. I think that,
you know, after what happened in the last game, I
think that there is definitely a priorian and I think
that they'll figure it out. And I think that, you know,
what we saw is just two guys. You know, it

(01:50:58):
happens in the heat about it. You got two guys
who want to win very badly, and when that's not happening,
you know, we see it on a professional level. I
watched the Eagles game last night, and they have you know,
they had guys who were disgruntled about not getting the
ball as far as receivers. So I think it's just
a thing. And I think that more so, guys just
want to feel like they contributed him. If you're not

(01:51:20):
getting the ball, you don't feel like he's contributing. And
I think that that's basically what it is. I don't
think that, and especially in next case, I don't think
that it's necessarily about getting him the ball. I think
that it's just about, you know, the whole offense as
a whole is what they frustrated with. I don't think
it's just about getting him the ball because I don't
feel like he's a selfish player like that. I think

(01:51:41):
he just wants to win, just like Aid wants to win.

Speaker 9 (01:51:46):
Last week we saw a different Michigan State defense. Jay
we talked about the offense and the special teams not
getting it done. The defense played really well considering some
of the field position. There was a touchdown that was
not on the field for with the block punt kickoff

(01:52:08):
return that was botched, led to a very short field,
some other things that happened. That wasn't the perfect game
for the defense, but much better than what we had
seen two weeks earlier out at the coliseum. So do
you think that the defense took a real step or
is it going to be undressed and exposed tomorrow by

(01:52:31):
Nico Iamaliava.

Speaker 5 (01:52:34):
I think it took a step, but the I think
the question is is whether you can take another step
or you're going to take a step back because we
you know, we haven't been getting any pressure on the quarterback,
which we did. We were able to get a couple
of sacks and was able to get some pressure on them,
and I think that was for a variety of reasons.
So the I think the thing is that building on that,
whether you can build on that to move forward, or

(01:52:56):
again if you're just going to take a step back.
So I think that that will be interesting to see.
And I think again with a with a guy who is,
you know, kind of high profile, I think the bell
would motivate you in order to want to have a
big game. So we'll see how that works out.

Speaker 9 (01:53:12):
And Jay, an interest of full disclosure, two years ago
about this time, certainly it was in the month of October,
you told me that you thought this coach at Oregon
State was terrific. At that point, this was long before
that we knew Alan Haller was going to zero in

(01:53:34):
on him and make him his his focal higher. But
you really like Jonathan Smith just from watching from afar
now the reaction to him is not what he would want.
You don't want to say he's on a maybe on
the hot seat yet, but it's it's heating up and

(01:53:55):
a loss tomorrow might be some irretrievable territory for a
lot of fans. How important is this game? Say they
all count one, but does this one count a little
bit more? If you lose this one, you're probably not
making a bowl game and homecoming the alumps back. I

(01:54:16):
think a lot of people are ready to pass judgment.

Speaker 5 (01:54:20):
No, I agree. I think this is a huge game.
I think with the loss last week, it makes it
even bigger because losing this game would give us free
losses in a row, and you're looking at going to
Indiana and hosting Michigan and the week you know, and
the week's following that, and you still got Penn State,
you know, to deal with. So I think that losing
this game, I think. I always feel like losing a

(01:54:41):
homecoming game is always huge anyway, because I feel like
you try to schedule a team that you know that
you think you can beat on homecoming, So to actually
lose that game, I always feel like it's kind of demoralizing.
But I think that again it's possible. It's a one
to one team that's, you know, kind of I think
we kind of hope that they kind of still celebrating,

(01:55:03):
is what I you know, and being having to travel
across country and then play a noon game. I also
feel like it'll be tough, so they don't have their
work cutoff for them, but we will also have our
work cutout for us.

Speaker 9 (01:55:17):
So you're saying that we should know a lot about
what teams can do. If we look at the other
team's schedules and if we see one team as a
homecoming opponent for two or three teams, those teams think, well,
that's a w that's probably a bad thing when you're
in a lot of homecoming games.

Speaker 5 (01:55:38):
No, I agree, if you are everybody's homecoming game, I
think that that's definitely a bad thing, and you should
take that personally. For sure.

Speaker 9 (01:55:48):
You're one of these guys because you get up very
very early before I go to bed.

Speaker 1 (01:55:54):
Noon games are fine for you, right.

Speaker 5 (01:55:57):
Noon games are the absolute best. And I don't I
honestly don't remember. I think the last noon game we
had might have been when we when we beat Michigan
in twenty one. That's the last noon game that I
actually remember. So I'm here for and there are also
some great games after our game which I'll be able

(01:56:17):
to watch, which makes it even more exciting.

Speaker 1 (01:56:19):
So that's right.

Speaker 9 (01:56:22):
And next week, Rob, you know where Jay and I
are going to be. We will be doing the show
on the road next Friday. And no, maybe we won't
because I think we're going to go in on Saturday.
We're going to leave Saturday morning. Right, you have to
leave Saturday morning and come back Sunday. That's our plan.

Speaker 15 (01:56:43):
Now we are going to Traveling that's right, the Traveling Band.

Speaker 5 (01:56:48):
Yeah, my first official game as a member of the media.
That's right. That's right.

Speaker 15 (01:56:55):
Congratulations about time. It's about them.

Speaker 1 (01:57:00):
Now.

Speaker 5 (01:57:01):
I've just got to find something that don't have a
Spartan logo to win. That's right.

Speaker 9 (01:57:07):
He's got to get a whole new wardrobe here for
one day. Jay, thanks so much for joining us. Really
appreciate it. Enjoy the weekend, and I'll probably run into.

Speaker 1 (01:57:15):
At some point.

Speaker 5 (01:57:17):
Look forward to it.

Speaker 9 (01:57:19):
Jay Green, Prout, Flintstone, Spartan dog for life. I want
to thank all of our guests today, starting with Yogi
Roth and he can take a question and give you
some answers that very few other people can do based
on his experience, especially especially when we're talking about West

(01:57:40):
Coast teams. But you know, he was a player, he
was a coach, he's an author. He did Pete Carroll's book,
He's done films. He certainly understands the game and also
knows Jonathan Smith better than Okay, I'll say it, he
knows Jonathan Smith better than anyone who's covering the Michigan
State beat right now.

Speaker 1 (01:58:00):
I appreciate him joining us.

Speaker 9 (01:58:02):
Connor Earcold from the Detroit News talking to little college
hockey and a lot of college football, and he says
the most likely team the Big ten of the four
big games tomorrow to win is a USC Trojans.

Speaker 1 (01:58:16):
Take away his alumni car. Marty mackinnitt, my best friend.

Speaker 9 (01:58:21):
Tigers die hard and he'll be following the Tigers as
long as they go.

Speaker 1 (01:58:25):
Thetorian, Gary Gillette and Jay Green have a great weekend. Everyone,