DR. PAOLA CECCHI DIMEGLIO
https://www.paolacecchidimeglio.com/
William Stevenson
https://poppoppress.com/
In the series, "PopPop" travels with grandson Ricky around the world and throughout time, discovering Ancient China, Ancient Egypt, Ancient Greece, Ancient Rome and Colonial America. They also blast off into outer space and dive under the sea.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Josh, you always want to bethe best you can be. The Frankie
Boyer Show it's more than a lifestyleshow. It's a show about living in
today's world. I think something ishappening. Frankie enthusiastically brings an amazing,
eclectic mix to the airwaves. Oneof the reasons she's earned legions of loyal
fans is very simple. When youlisten to The Frankie Boyer Show, you
(00:22):
just never know what's going to happen, So listen for yourself. Here is
Frankie Boyer and welcome. It isFrankie Boyer. And what an honor today
to really have an honest conversation aboutdiversity and joining me is someone that has
(00:47):
extraordinary credentials and has been really understandingwhat organizations need to do working with senior
leaders throughout the world. Her nameis Paula shaky Meglio and doctor. You're
a PhD. You are also alawyer, and you're one of the leading
(01:10):
authorities on helping senior leaders make moreinclusive decisions for themselves and their organizations,
having advised some of the largest forprofit and non for profit companies in the
world. As an award winning experton behavioral and data science, big data,
AI, race and gender and leadersleadership strategy. We are so thrilled
(01:34):
to have you with us. Agraduate of Stanford University, you hold dual
appointments at Harvard's Kennedy School of Governmentand Harvard Law School, where you serve
as faculty Chair of the Executive LeadershipResearch Initiative for Women and Minority Attorneys.
It's a mouthful, but needed tobe said. Your new book is out,
(01:55):
it's called Diversity Dividend. And wehave so many biases in the world.
We are in a country right nowthat is so divided. I mean,
we are really in the middle ofthis muck, really and truly.
(02:20):
How how do we convey to thoselistening that they have a right to have
equal pay, that they have aright to have a voice be heard,
that the conditions of which they areworking are have to be acceptable. The
(02:46):
list goes on and on and on. Frankie, thank you so much for
having me today. End You know, this is a great pleasure and owner
to be able to share with youraudience my point of view on that.
I think you rightfully say. Weare today even more in the time where
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it is important to make sure thatequal pay or amy voice or listen and
heard. This is especially true aftera certain decision of the Supreme Court and
in which we have seen a certaindecision needing to people being afraid or scared
(03:31):
about what the future hold related todiversity and inclusion. And I will pause
here and say, well, noteverything is hold back. I'm still very
optimistic into the fact that leader acrossthe world and government are still paying careful
(03:54):
attention to making sure that organization representwhat the world is meaning givers, meaning
inclusive as much as we can be. You know, I'm the first generation
coming in the United States. Itruly believe in the American dream, and
I truly believe that we are strongerwhen voices are different, because those point
(04:18):
of view bring different perspectives that createinnovation, that create economic empowerment. Absolutely,
and you you have put together somevery important changes, you call them
nudges that can have a dramatic impacton diversity. And you say, for
(04:40):
example, if you want to hiremore women, raise the temperature of the
room in which they're interviewing so thatit's between sixty nine and seventy two degrees.
And you say that most buildings arecalibrated to accommodate the thermal the thermal
temperature of men. Yeah, sothis is one intervention that we have done
(05:10):
with a company where we actually realizethrough architectural design. And if you pay
attention, there is a substantial bodyof work who have been done in science
actually demonstrating that most of the buildingacross America and as well in Europe are
actually tailored for the temperature of menmore than the awful woman. And as
(05:38):
such, one intervention that we didwith this company was playing with the temperature
into the room where candidates were interviewed, and we have done so both in
the United States but also interrupt andwe have seen that and we changed slightly
(06:01):
the temperature going up. Woman whowere interviewed were perceived more favorably by their
interviewer. They were seen as lessangry or threatened during the interview. So
what you're saying is that when womenare cold during an interview, they can
(06:23):
come across as as cold as cold. And you know, I not only
will say anyone who who is cold. We just have a tendency to hold
ourselves together and not to be ableto have a behavore that is more at
ease because we are fighting. Ourbody is literally fighting against making sure that
(06:46):
we're warm enough to survive. Yes, yes, you also say that you
should make interview times all the samepart of the day. Ideally you say
between nine and eleven AM. Andwhy is that? Yeah, that's yeah,
that's correct. You know. Workingalso again with several companies, something
(07:10):
that we have seen and this issomething that is very well known in science.
We have a tendency to make differenttime type of decision during the day,
and our decision are also usher interms of decision during lunchtime. There
is famous study around the judicial systemshowing that. And actually with the company
(07:35):
that I have worked with, werealize that the candidates were not redd in
the same way during the day andas such, candidate to where viewed the
morning between nine and eleven we're optimallyseen by interviewer. And so that's something
(07:56):
that I highly recommend to organization tomake sure that all the candidates you know,
throughout the day have the same opportunityto be viewed in the best way
that they can buy the interviewer.This is your nudges are extraordinary. Give
us some more nudges please, SoI should say one thing. The term
(08:18):
nudges was coined by Cassenstein and RichardTeller, So I give back the credit
where it is, But those nudgesare small, you know, life push
into the processes to reorganize an interviewprocess or promotion. An example of another
(08:39):
nudges will be, for example,when reviewing candidates either in term of recruitment
or promotions, right away after seeingthem, write down the scoring that you
have to them. Your memory willbring more biased as you're reading some further
(09:01):
down the day. That's a veryeasy one. Another one that you can
implement is before seeing candidates, remindyourself about the organizational chart and what it
looks like and what are the goalof the leadership related to diversity and inclusion.
That allows you to see the candidatein a different perspective. Reminding you
(09:28):
about what are the higher goal ofan organization and what you're working toward.
Okay, you say, if youwant to increase your company's diversity by forty
five and eighteen months, start byasking current employees who are members of underrepresentative
(09:50):
communities to recommend people they think wouldbe good additions to the team. Yeah,
when we think about how we andtrapped in the work. We all
have networks, and those network basedon our social economic backgrounds, are not
all equal. Can you hold thatthought for just a moment, because I
(10:11):
want to give that the power itdeserves and the attention. We have to
take a break. We will beback in just a moment with this amazing,
amazing woman. She's a PhD.She's a lawyer. She's a leading
authority on helping senior leaders make moreinclusive decisions for themselves and their organizations,
working internationally as well as abroad.And Paula Shaky demeg Leio, We're so
(10:39):
excited you're with us. Diversity Dividendis her book, and what's the best
website? The best website is PaulaShamiglio dot com or reaching out on Twitter
at les Paula or via LinkedIn.We'll be right Backstay tuned, Frankie Boye
(11:03):
and welcome back at his Frankie Boyer. And the book is now available.
It's called Diversity Dividend and all ofthe data and science and it focuses on
application in the real world. Imaginethat a book that has dramatic impact on
(11:24):
diversity, dramatic impact. And shegets into the nudges and we're talking about
that, but she really Paula offersa fresh, detailed look at just how
to realize gender and racial equity inthe workplace. From attracting and interviewing applicants,
(11:48):
it's so important retaining hires, howto remove systemic barriers at the organizational
level that prevent women in underrepresentative groupsfrom advancing. And we have a long
way to go, Paula, butwe've from so far, and I'm really
(12:09):
happy that you're with us. Andyou were talking about reaching out to people
that are already part of the teamand asking to recommend people they think would
be good additions. Yeah, that'scorrect, Frankie. Thank you again for
having me today. You know,as I mentioned, network are not equal
(12:31):
unfortunity and one of the elements thatI have seen working with company that works
extremely well is the power of bringinga new voice. And one element is
an ability to ask around even peoplethat you think may not be I will
see the perfect candidate for the job. You will be surprised to realize that
(12:56):
there is an ability and capacity ofcompany to upscale talent and the the power
of asking around who are the peoplethat you think we should bring, even
if they are not what we arethinking right now, held a tremendous impact.
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And I have seen that working withsome company, especially in field where
you know, having a higher numberof women and under represented individual especially in
the same field is extremely important becauseall our innovation system in the United States
is at the heart of it.And I have seen that that simple nerge
(13:41):
of asking to recommend other people outsideof their network that they know of who
could be a good addition to theteam, a good addition to the company
neck I will say, an increasewhich is absolutely astonishing. You know,
I want you to if you hada cousin or a friend or someone that
(14:11):
you were working with, what wouldbe some of the best chips that you
can give them for interviewing well forinterviewing. You know, that's a very
good question because this is something thatI get on a regular basis. Thinks
that her sounds very easy. Isto buddy with a friend of yours apply
(14:39):
to the same company together. Whybecause you are more likely to be successful
when with as a friend you're goingthrough a process and to remain in the
company. Another one that is easyis when you join the company, ask
what are the five people that youI think I should talk to in the
(15:01):
next twelve months. That gives youthe power of reaching out internally and also
extend your network. Another I willsay simple nudge is at the end of
any project, being able to sendback to your manager either on I will
(15:22):
say on the biweekly or monthly basis, this is what you have done,
this is what you're opening to donext time around better. And also I
will say had one layers to itis going around with the people that you
have worked with and ask them whatdo you think I could improve and write
(15:45):
them an email saying thank you,I understand what you share with me.
I will try next time to incorporatethose feedback in my next project or task,
and you will be surprised much peopleappreciate and see the difference in their
career. I want to talk aboutsomething that I have to because attire.
(16:12):
What should we be wearing for aninterview? It sounds so silly and simple,
but I have to tell you thatthere are still many who are not
understanding how they should be dressed.And I know that it's very important to
(16:36):
look presentable on that day. Yeah, so you know that's a hard question
because if you go into certain sector, you need to come in, you
know, very relaxed, and ifyou were to come up or dress up,
people will think that to our missit. Whereas in other sector and I'm
(16:56):
thinking, for example, if youwalk into a law firm and you arrived
in ship flop, people will lookat you and say, no, I'm
sorry, you're not the right fit. So I think one element is knowing
and starting to look at the companyand the sector in which they are in,
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looking and scrolling down into their webpage, but also any pr activities
that they had and see how peopleare addressed. That will give you a
good tube about what is expected inthe term of the candidates coming in into
that fire, into that organization interms of outfit to where during the interview.
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You know, it's very tough.Two if you if you are in
an environment where dressing is not thebiggest part of your existence, is very
hard to be judged on that.And that's why I as a very delicate
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subject. It's very delicate, isn'tit. It is? It is,
And you know, I don't knowif it's an advice, but something that
is that I truly remember very vividlyis the ability of some of the candidates
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that I interviewed and that I had, you know, the pleasure to be
working with. One element that alwaysworked for them is wearing black and whatever
it is, either a pan oraddress, was something that allowed them to
feel affordable. That I will saymore. And they and from an from
(18:57):
a conversational standpoint more than data driven. But the best advice is looking at
the organization and see what are theirexpectations. Yes, inter mouth such great
information. I'm going to ask youto spell your name, Paula Shaky de
(19:18):
meg Leo, because people need toknow more about you and your website.
The book is called Diversity Dividend andplease spell your website out your name,
Paula b A O l A shackyc e c c h I D meglio
(19:41):
d I M E g l eO. Wonderful. Thank you so much
for all that you do. Andwe have to take a quick break and
we'll be right Backstay tuned. Thisis Frankie Boyd and welcome back. It
(20:11):
is Frankie Boyer. Joining us nowis another DHD doctor, William Stevenson.
He's an acclaimed children's book author anda retired award winning accountant and your doctorate
is in education. Along with inspirationfrom your grandson Ricky, you started to
(20:34):
write the Ricky Ricky's Dream trip bookseries. And tell us about this series
and why you wanted to take Rickyon adventures and discover ancient China and Egypt
and all over the world, andwelcome to the program. Well, thank
(20:56):
you for welcoming me. So Hi, I wanted to do something to try
to bond with him and that wouldlast. So I decided to write a
book, and it was just apersonal book just for him. There was
no commercial enterprise involved. So Iwrote. I put together a story about
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a dream we were. We inthe dream, we traveled through the entire
Solar System, visiting every planet.And I put it together kind of nice
and printed it out from the computerand got some pictures and put it in
the loose leaf book. And beforeI gave it to him, quite accidentally,
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I wasn't retired yet, and oneof my tax clients came into the
office to have his tactor done itand he saw this on my desk.
He said, what's that. Oh. I told him it was a book
I wrote for my grandson. Andhe said, could I say it he
and he looked at it fairly quickly. He said, well, you know,
I just started a publishing company forself publishers, and you can publish
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this and only that my wife wouldlove this book for her grade school.
It was written for when Ricky wasseven. So I went along with him,
and he introduced me to Paul Fireman, who was the president of Fireman
(22:27):
Creative in Pittsburgh, and they're greatdesigners and artwork and they did the artwork
for the book and they breathed lifeinto it. And when it came out,
people really loved it. And ofcourse, at that time I had,
you know, over three hundred clients, and then it was pretty hard
(22:48):
for them to refuse me. Andmany of them loved it. And the
adults liked it because they read itand found information they didn't have. Teachers
liked it for the classroom. Sosince I felt pretty good, let me
do another one. So I dida second book. At the time,
I was doing some reading on Americanhistory. So we did a dream trip
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to Philadelphia when they were writing theDeclaration of Independence and oh nice, yeah,
yeah, how many Ricky's dreams arethere? So far? Well,
we got seven books and I didthe Colonial America one in in Spanish too,
so the thing really grew. Thebook on the American Revolution was very
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interesting because it allowed it allowed peopleto see the process in a fun way
of real history and how the AmericansAmerica started. So uh, and we
(24:06):
went through the same process the processthere. We had the artwork done,
and then people really loved it andteachers thought it was great because they could
put it into their lessons plants.So I said, hey, you know,
maybe I am an author. Letme try a couple more. So
I picked three parts of ancient historyEgypt, Greece and Rome. And and
(24:30):
the first one was Egypt, anduh, I was going to do a
dree. I did a dreen cryptto Egypt, and Uh. My problem
was, Egypt has a six thousandyear history. How do I pull out
one little vignette and I make itinteresting to the children? And lo and
(24:51):
behold, after a lot of reading, I discovered what we already knew sut
in common. He was a boyand about the same age as Ricky.
And so in order to make I'mgoing very fast, they only have a
few minutes. In order to makethe book interesting and teach the kids about
(25:12):
ancient Egypt. The story was theking lost his cat, and in Egypt
cats are very important because for centuriesthey mummified them. So it gave me
an opportunity to take people all aroundEgypt during that particular period at times to
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where pharaohs were buried, and theymet a lot of people and the bottom
line was they couldn't find the cat. And at the end of the story,
Ricky apologized and said he had towake up and go home, and
King Touch said, Okay, Iknow you did the best you could.
I'm going to take you to theback to the stable where you're dream hoards
(26:00):
as were. Then you and yourpop up can go back home. When
they got to the stable, loand behold, what did they say?
The cat was there. And notonly was the cat there, but the
cat had kittens. And that's howthat story ended. And of course,
who doesn't love a story h witha happy ending like that, right?
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Who doesn't exactly exactly my question Iwas gonna say, My question to you
is how many will there be atthe end of all of this? Is
this just going to go on andon and on? I think I pretty
rather, I'm pretty much run outof gas the seven books are. They're
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all well accepted. And I reallyhad three concepts. One was to show
my love for my grandson, whichwas accomplished. The second, right was
he had somewhat of a self conceptproblem, and you know, it's tough
being a kid, and so Imade him very important in each story and
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uh, and he was a centerof attraction. And the third part that
was real based on real history.And so kids loved it, and teachers
h and parents loved it, andpeople were telling me, oh my goodness.
I never really realized that. Probablythe biggest thing for me was when
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when I did Rome, I wantedto meet Julius Caesar. Now, when
you and I think of Julius Caesar, we think of Caesar and Cleopatra,
and he's in its fifties. Butin my reading, I discovered when he
was sixteen years old his father died, he became head of the family and
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the head of the state gave hima job when he was seventeen to be
Jupiter's ma increase and marry his thirteenyear old daughter, and a couple of
years later someone else took over.A lot of people that were in power
(28:26):
were killed, and Caesar was goingto be killed too. And he went
to the leader Sola, who hadcalled him in, and said, look,
I'm going to save your life,but you have to quit your job
and you have to divorce your yourwife. And here's the seventeen eighteen year
old kid. He looks Dulla inthe eye and said, no, I'm
(28:51):
not going to divorce my wife.I love her. And he ran out
into the into the mountains where heNow this is a true story the way,
I'm not making this up. Wherehe almost died. He had uh
malaria and uh uh and he wasstuck. And what happened was in the
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dream pop up and and uh andRicky met Julius Caesar's mother and she told
him what had happened and said uhand showed call him ward was they went
out into the mountains. He wasvery sick. They saw him and they
said, what can we do tosave your life? And he said,
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well, it's a very powerful groupof women and uh and their job is
to keep the light of Rome withThey're called vessels and I didn't say vessel
virgins. And he was only eightyears old and right right, so uh
so they went to the vessels andthe vessels was so powerful, and I
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wanted to emphasize this because I wantedgirls and women who appreciate that they had
an important part in history too.Can you imagine this story? We were
the glass season. Anyway, there'sa whole story. You're really a great
person. I could talk to youforever. But anyway, thank you for
(30:26):
having me. No, thank you. And as president of National Tax Consultants,
where you were one of the fewnon attorneys admitted to practice in front
of the United States Tax Court.What's the best website? Go ahead and
give it. It's a great website. It's called pop pop press dot com
(30:48):
and it has pictured of all thebooks you can access pop. Thank you
so much, Thanks so much,and we'll take a quick break and be
right back. Frankie Bowyer's state andwelcome back to the ranking vointer. I
(31:17):
don't know about where you were living. We are very blessed in New England
right now because we have not hadanything close to what has happened in different
parts of the world in the country. But it brings the question, what
if I had to sustain life fora few days without running to the store,
(31:38):
without having communications important important questions joiningus today is someone who knows only
too well about all of that.She is probably one of the country's top
disaster experts. She's a professor andfounder of the Undivided Project. And Monica
(32:00):
Cassandra is welcome back. Hi,thank you for having me. September marks
National Preparedness Month. So it's atime to encourage natural planning. We have
to, yes, because we areliving in a time where there's extreme weather.
The meteorologists will say we're in analninial pattern, which is why we've
(32:22):
seen you know, we're watching ahurricane forming in the Atlantic right now.
People on the West Coast in Hawaiiare dealing with or recovering from wildfires.
I'm a native of New Orleans,so they're also watching extreme heat and I
also concerned about hurricane So the importantMonica, Monica, we have to talk
(32:43):
about the heat. We're having ithere in New England as well. It's
just disgusting. But this heat hasnot let up. My poor Stephanie,
my producer, and everyone at atat the radio station, at the radio
network are absolutely going crazy with thisheat. I mean one hundred and one,
(33:04):
one hundred six, one hundred ten, one hundred nine. Yeah,
Allas area has just been out ofcontrol. Yeah, and you know when
you're dealing with heat, especially whenyou're not used to it at this level.
And I don't think I can saythat any of us are, you
know. I recommend a couple ofthings. It's always keep water with you
everywhere that you go. I havea water bottle that I just keep filled
up. And then another thing thatI learned growing up in a place is
(33:27):
always hot, like Louisiana is.Before I leave for work or school in
the morning, I throw a coldtowel. I throw a towel in the
freezer and let it get cold.So if I'm somewhere and I feel like
I'm about to overheat and I don'tknow, if there's a cooling station near
me, I can use that kindof bring my body temperature down. So
it's a couple of things. Waterwith you, make sure you have a
cold towel, and then also alwaysstay signed up no matter what kind of
(33:51):
weather you're dealing with, with yourlocal weather station and your state emergency manager.
So when they announced where cooling stationsare, you know where you can
go to cool off. Really important, really really important information. You're also
a professor I just want to sayat Georgetown University Law Center and a senior
fellow at the Chulane University Disaster ResilienceLeadership Academy. So we need to listen
(34:15):
to what Monica is saying. You'realso the founder of the Undivided Project,
and I know that this is suchan important project to you and near and
dear to your heart, and explainto us what it is. Please,
Monica, Well, what we dois is that we help underserved communities.
This means poor communities, rural communities, other types of marginalized groups be able
(34:39):
to use technology because we live inthis digital aid. Who goes anywhere without
their phone or without some app attachedto them. So critical information exactly right
is attached to that and a lotof communities may have it, but they
don't know how to use it tostart doing account of preparation and resilience that
we're talking about. And so theUndivided Project is about looking at this particular
(35:02):
piece of the digital divide and helpingthose communities get ready and build a kind
of resilience that we want everyone todo. And so Monica, tell me
about your team and what you doand how you help. So I will
say to you. We have inmy home state of Louisiana, we're doing
some capacity building in the southeast partof the state, which is facing similar
(35:24):
challenges as your listeners. In NewEngland, we're looking at land loss because
of erosion along our coastline, andpeople are thinking about do I have to
move, how do I deal withflooding and these kinds of events. It
may not be as extreme as ahurricane, but are still important to know
how to deal with. And ina lot of these places, they don't
have Wi Fi. So one ofthe things that we did was we put
(35:45):
up community WiFi so they're able toreceive communications like what we're doing this morning,
or to get those text alerts,and then also started working with them
on some highly local projects that theycan do, like planning Cypher Street for
example, to deal with the coastaldegradation that they're facing. And so that's
one of the projects that we havegoing on, Whereas in another place we
(36:07):
might actually put together a cloud basedpackage of emergency preparedness tools, and so
it really is unique to the community, just like when we talk about preparedness,
that's also unique to each community.So those are some examples of what
we do. Yeah, what shouldwe have. Let's go back to what
we need to have in our home. Food and water. Obviously the most
(36:28):
important is you're mentioning, but whatelse do we need? So we call
that our go kit, even thoughthat's not just for evacuations, is for
shelter and place. You're right,you need food and water for about three
to seven days. Emergency managers willtell you the first seventy two is on
you, which is a way ofsaying, you know, sometimes it can
take up to three days for thefullness of the US emergency response system to
(36:49):
get to you. So you needto have food, water, a few
changes of clothes. If you takemedication, make sure that you work with
your pharmacy or your doctor to getyour feels ready. If you have a
pet, make sure you have yourpet supplies. Charge your devices, have
a power bank or a solar charger. One thing that I tell people you
know, because recovery can also behard and you need documents which also can
(37:13):
get destroyed during disasters, is takepictures of the important documents like burst certificates
and social security cars, insurance papers, and storm on your phone's cloud,
and also keep hard copies either inyour go kid or in a fireproof box.
And then the other thing we needto remember, because we've just been
talking about being really digital and connectedto our phones, go to the ATM
(37:35):
and get money out because no powermeans no Apple pay, no cash payments,
no ATMs working, and fill upor charge your car if it's an
electric Yes, we've seen that right, lines of people. And then when
you finally get to go get gasor get money or get food or whatever
you're gonna do, and they needcash because the powers out, So you
want to make sure you do thosethings right. And if you're going to
(37:59):
shelter and play, I'm all abouthealthy living chow, so make sure you're
throw in some healthy nuts and rawnuts and all those other big things that
sustain you and can keep you.Oh my gosh, Monica so much more,
but we're out of time for moreinformation. And always always make sure
you have clorox. You want usto have a bottle of Clorox for clean
(38:21):
that afterwards exactly you can remove moldand mildew or if they're fire prone,
area is a good way to removesoot. And also if you're sheltering somewhere
that you're not familiar with. Youcan use Clorox disinfecting bleach or spray to
clean up unfamiliar tun Okay, giveus, give us the website. Please
Clorox dot com for more tips thanThank you Frankie, Thank you Monica,
(38:45):
Thanks to all of you. Thishas been another edition of the Frankie Boyer
Show. Thanks for listening. Makeit a great day, everybody and has
always smile face with glad nuts betweensubs. Will wait you maybe ever sow
here and if it's small, helpme are fears and start smile. And
(39:09):
maybe tomorrow you'll see the light asstill worth while if you tomorrow, but tom
Josh, you always want to bethe best you can be. The Frankie
Boyer Show it's more than a lifestyleshow. It's a show about living in
today's world. I think something ishappening. Frankie enthusiastically brings an amazing,
eclectic mix to the airwaves. Oneof the reasons she's earned legions of loyal
fans is very simple. When youlisten to The Frankie Boyer Show, you
(00:22):
just never know what's going to happen, So listen for yourself. Here is
Frankie Boyer and welcome. It isFrankie Boyer. And what an honor today
to really have an honest conversation aboutdiversity and joining me is someone that has
(00:47):
extraordinary credentials and has been really understandingwhat organizations need to do working with senior
leaders throughout the world. Her nameis Paula shaky Meglio and doctor. You're
a PhD. You are also alawyer, and you're one of the leading
(01:10):
authorities on helping senior leaders make moreinclusive decisions for themselves and their organizations,
having advised some of the largest forprofit and non for profit companies in the
world. As an award winning experton behavioral and data science, big data,
AI, race and gender and leadersleadership strategy. We are so thrilled
(01:34):
to have you with us. Agraduate of Stanford University, you hold dual
appointments at Harvard's Kennedy School of Governmentand Harvard Law School, where you serve
as faculty Chair of the Executive LeadershipResearch Initiative for Women and Minority Attorneys.
It's a mouthful, but needed tobe said. Your new book is out,
(01:55):
it's called Diversity Dividend. And wehave so many biases in the world.
We are in a country right nowthat is so divided. I mean,
we are really in the middle ofthis muck, really and truly.
(02:20):
How how do we convey to thoselistening that they have a right to have
equal pay, that they have aright to have a voice be heard,
that the conditions of which they areworking are have to be acceptable. The
(02:46):
list goes on and on and on. Frankie, thank you so much for
having me today. End You know, this is a great pleasure and owner
to be able to share with youraudience my point of view on that.
I think you rightfully say. Weare today even more in the time where
(03:10):
it is important to make sure thatequal pay or amy voice or listen and
heard. This is especially true aftera certain decision of the Supreme Court and
in which we have seen a certaindecision needing to people being afraid or scared
(03:31):
about what the future hold related todiversity and inclusion. And I will pause
here and say, well, noteverything is hold back. I'm still very
optimistic into the fact that leader acrossthe world and government are still paying careful
(03:54):
attention to making sure that organization representwhat the world is meaning givers, meaning
inclusive as much as we can be. You know, I'm the first generation
coming in the United States. Itruly believe in the American dream, and
I truly believe that we are strongerwhen voices are different, because those point
(04:18):
of view bring different perspectives that createinnovation, that create economic empowerment. Absolutely,
and you you have put together somevery important changes, you call them
nudges that can have a dramatic impacton diversity. And you say, for
(04:40):
example, if you want to hiremore women, raise the temperature of the
room in which they're interviewing so thatit's between sixty nine and seventy two degrees.
And you say that most buildings arecalibrated to accommodate the thermal the thermal
temperature of men. Yeah, sothis is one intervention that we have done
(05:10):
with a company where we actually realizethrough architectural design. And if you pay
attention, there is a substantial bodyof work who have been done in science
actually demonstrating that most of the buildingacross America and as well in Europe are
actually tailored for the temperature of menmore than the awful woman. And as
(05:38):
such, one intervention that we didwith this company was playing with the temperature
into the room where candidates were interviewed, and we have done so both in
the United States but also interrupt andwe have seen that and we changed slightly
(06:01):
the temperature going up. Woman whowere interviewed were perceived more favorably by their
interviewer. They were seen as lessangry or threatened during the interview. So
what you're saying is that when womenare cold during an interview, they can
(06:23):
come across as as cold as cold. And you know, I not only
will say anyone who who is cold. We just have a tendency to hold
ourselves together and not to be ableto have a behavore that is more at
ease because we are fighting. Ourbody is literally fighting against making sure that
(06:46):
we're warm enough to survive. Yes, yes, you also say that you
should make interview times all the samepart of the day. Ideally you say
between nine and eleven AM. Andwhy is that? Yeah, that's yeah,
that's correct. You know. Workingalso again with several companies, something
(07:10):
that we have seen and this issomething that is very well known in science.
We have a tendency to make differenttime type of decision during the day,
and our decision are also usher interms of decision during lunchtime. There
is famous study around the judicial systemshowing that. And actually with the company
(07:35):
that I have worked with, werealize that the candidates were not redd in
the same way during the day andas such, candidate to where viewed the
morning between nine and eleven we're optimallyseen by interviewer. And so that's something
(07:56):
that I highly recommend to organization tomake sure that all the candidates you know,
throughout the day have the same opportunityto be viewed in the best way
that they can buy the interviewer.This is your nudges are extraordinary. Give
us some more nudges please, SoI should say one thing. The term
(08:18):
nudges was coined by Cassenstein and RichardTeller, So I give back the credit
where it is, But those nudgesare small, you know, life push
into the processes to reorganize an interviewprocess or promotion. An example of another
(08:39):
nudges will be, for example,when reviewing candidates either in term of recruitment
or promotions, right away after seeingthem, write down the scoring that you
have to them. Your memory willbring more biased as you're reading some further
(09:01):
down the day. That's a veryeasy one. Another one that you can
implement is before seeing candidates, remindyourself about the organizational chart and what it
looks like and what are the goalof the leadership related to diversity and inclusion.
That allows you to see the candidatein a different perspective. Reminding you
(09:28):
about what are the higher goal ofan organization and what you're working toward.
Okay, you say, if youwant to increase your company's diversity by forty
five and eighteen months, start byasking current employees who are members of underrepresentative
(09:50):
communities to recommend people they think wouldbe good additions to the team. Yeah,
when we think about how we andtrapped in the work. We all
have networks, and those network basedon our social economic backgrounds, are not
all equal. Can you hold thatthought for just a moment, because I
(10:11):
want to give that the power itdeserves and the attention. We have to
take a break. We will beback in just a moment with this amazing,
amazing woman. She's a PhD.She's a lawyer. She's a leading
authority on helping senior leaders make moreinclusive decisions for themselves and their organizations,
working internationally as well as abroad.And Paula Shaky demeg Leio, We're so
(10:39):
excited you're with us. Diversity Dividendis her book, and what's the best
website? The best website is PaulaShamiglio dot com or reaching out on Twitter
at les Paula or via LinkedIn.We'll be right Backstay tuned, Frankie Boye
(11:03):
and welcome back at his Frankie Boyer. And the book is now available.
It's called Diversity Dividend and all ofthe data and science and it focuses on
application in the real world. Imaginethat a book that has dramatic impact on
(11:24):
diversity, dramatic impact. And shegets into the nudges and we're talking about
that, but she really Paula offersa fresh, detailed look at just how
to realize gender and racial equity inthe workplace. From attracting and interviewing applicants,
(11:48):
it's so important retaining hires, howto remove systemic barriers at the organizational
level that prevent women in underrepresentative groupsfrom advancing. And we have a long
way to go, Paula, butwe've from so far, and I'm really
(12:09):
happy that you're with us. Andyou were talking about reaching out to people
that are already part of the teamand asking to recommend people they think would
be good additions. Yeah, that'scorrect, Frankie. Thank you again for
having me today. You know,as I mentioned, network are not equal
(12:31):
unfortunity and one of the elements thatI have seen working with company that works
extremely well is the power of bringinga new voice. And one element is
an ability to ask around even peoplethat you think may not be I will
see the perfect candidate for the job. You will be surprised to realize that
(12:56):
there is an ability and capacity ofcompany to upscale talent and the the power
of asking around who are the peoplethat you think we should bring, even
if they are not what we arethinking right now, held a tremendous impact.
(13:16):
And I have seen that working withsome company, especially in field where
you know, having a higher numberof women and under represented individual especially in
the same field is extremely important becauseall our innovation system in the United States
is at the heart of it.And I have seen that that simple nerge
(13:41):
of asking to recommend other people outsideof their network that they know of who
could be a good addition to theteam, a good addition to the company
neck I will say, an increasewhich is absolutely astonishing. You know,
I want you to if you hada cousin or a friend or someone that
(14:11):
you were working with, what wouldbe some of the best chips that you
can give them for interviewing well forinterviewing. You know, that's a very
good question because this is something thatI get on a regular basis. Thinks
that her sounds very easy. Isto buddy with a friend of yours apply
(14:39):
to the same company together. Whybecause you are more likely to be successful
when with as a friend you're goingthrough a process and to remain in the
company. Another one that is easyis when you join the company, ask
what are the five people that youI think I should talk to in the
(15:01):
next twelve months. That gives youthe power of reaching out internally and also
extend your network. Another I willsay simple nudge is at the end of
any project, being able to sendback to your manager either on I will
(15:22):
say on the biweekly or monthly basis, this is what you have done,
this is what you're opening to donext time around better. And also I
will say had one layers to itis going around with the people that you
have worked with and ask them whatdo you think I could improve and write
(15:45):
them an email saying thank you,I understand what you share with me.
I will try next time to incorporatethose feedback in my next project or task,
and you will be surprised much peopleappreciate and see the difference in their
career. I want to talk aboutsomething that I have to because attire.
(16:12):
What should we be wearing for aninterview? It sounds so silly and simple,
but I have to tell you thatthere are still many who are not
understanding how they should be dressed.And I know that it's very important to
(16:36):
look presentable on that day. Yeah, so you know that's a hard question
because if you go into certain sector, you need to come in, you
know, very relaxed, and ifyou were to come up or dress up,
people will think that to our missit. Whereas in other sector and I'm
(16:56):
thinking, for example, if youwalk into a law firm and you arrived
in ship flop, people will lookat you and say, no, I'm
sorry, you're not the right fit. So I think one element is knowing
and starting to look at the companyand the sector in which they are in,
(17:17):
looking and scrolling down into their webpage, but also any pr activities
that they had and see how peopleare addressed. That will give you a
good tube about what is expected inthe term of the candidates coming in into
that fire, into that organization interms of outfit to where during the interview.
(17:47):
You know, it's very tough.Two if you if you are in
an environment where dressing is not thebiggest part of your existence, is very
hard to be judged on that.And that's why I as a very delicate
(18:10):
subject. It's very delicate, isn'tit. It is? It is,
And you know, I don't knowif it's an advice, but something that
is that I truly remember very vividlyis the ability of some of the candidates
(18:33):
that I interviewed and that I had, you know, the pleasure to be
working with. One element that alwaysworked for them is wearing black and whatever
it is, either a pan oraddress, was something that allowed them to
feel affordable. That I will saymore. And they and from an from
(18:57):
a conversational standpoint more than data driven. But the best advice is looking at
the organization and see what are theirexpectations. Yes, inter mouth such great
information. I'm going to ask youto spell your name, Paula Shaky de
(19:18):
meg Leo, because people need toknow more about you and your website.
The book is called Diversity Dividend andplease spell your website out your name,
Paula b A O l A shackyc e c c h I D meglio
(19:41):
d I M E g l eO. Wonderful. Thank you so much
for all that you do. Andwe have to take a quick break and
we'll be right Backstay tuned. Thisis Frankie Boyd and welcome back. It
(20:11):
is Frankie Boyer. Joining us nowis another DHD doctor, William Stevenson.
He's an acclaimed children's book author anda retired award winning accountant and your doctorate
is in education. Along with inspirationfrom your grandson Ricky, you started to
(20:34):
write the Ricky Ricky's Dream trip bookseries. And tell us about this series
and why you wanted to take Rickyon adventures and discover ancient China and Egypt
and all over the world, andwelcome to the program. Well, thank
(20:56):
you for welcoming me. So Hi, I wanted to do something to try
to bond with him and that wouldlast. So I decided to write a
book, and it was just apersonal book just for him. There was
no commercial enterprise involved. So Iwrote. I put together a story about
(21:18):
a dream we were. We inthe dream, we traveled through the entire
Solar System, visiting every planet.And I put it together kind of nice
and printed it out from the computerand got some pictures and put it in
the loose leaf book. And beforeI gave it to him, quite accidentally,
(21:44):
I wasn't retired yet, and oneof my tax clients came into the
office to have his tactor done itand he saw this on my desk.
He said, what's that. Oh. I told him it was a book
I wrote for my grandson. Andhe said, could I say it he
and he looked at it fairly quickly. He said, well, you know,
I just started a publishing company forself publishers, and you can publish
(22:07):
this and only that my wife wouldlove this book for her grade school.
It was written for when Ricky wasseven. So I went along with him,
and he introduced me to Paul Fireman, who was the president of Fireman
(22:27):
Creative in Pittsburgh, and they're greatdesigners and artwork and they did the artwork
for the book and they breathed lifeinto it. And when it came out,
people really loved it. And ofcourse, at that time I had,
you know, over three hundred clients, and then it was pretty hard
(22:48):
for them to refuse me. Andmany of them loved it. And the
adults liked it because they read itand found information they didn't have. Teachers
liked it for the classroom. Sosince I felt pretty good, let me
do another one. So I dida second book. At the time,
I was doing some reading on Americanhistory. So we did a dream trip
(23:14):
to Philadelphia when they were writing theDeclaration of Independence and oh nice, yeah,
yeah, how many Ricky's dreams arethere? So far? Well,
we got seven books and I didthe Colonial America one in in Spanish too,
so the thing really grew. Thebook on the American Revolution was very
(23:42):
interesting because it allowed it allowed peopleto see the process in a fun way
of real history and how the AmericansAmerica started. So uh, and we
(24:06):
went through the same process the processthere. We had the artwork done,
and then people really loved it andteachers thought it was great because they could
put it into their lessons plants.So I said, hey, you know,
maybe I am an author. Letme try a couple more. So
I picked three parts of ancient historyEgypt, Greece and Rome. And and
(24:30):
the first one was Egypt, anduh, I was going to do a
dree. I did a dreen cryptto Egypt, and Uh. My problem
was, Egypt has a six thousandyear history. How do I pull out
one little vignette and I make itinteresting to the children? And lo and
(24:51):
behold, after a lot of reading, I discovered what we already knew sut
in common. He was a boyand about the same age as Ricky.
And so in order to make I'mgoing very fast, they only have a
few minutes. In order to makethe book interesting and teach the kids about
(25:12):
ancient Egypt. The story was theking lost his cat, and in Egypt
cats are very important because for centuriesthey mummified them. So it gave me
an opportunity to take people all aroundEgypt during that particular period at times to
(25:37):
where pharaohs were buried, and theymet a lot of people and the bottom
line was they couldn't find the cat. And at the end of the story,
Ricky apologized and said he had towake up and go home, and
King Touch said, Okay, Iknow you did the best you could.
I'm going to take you to theback to the stable where you're dream hoards
(26:00):
as were. Then you and yourpop up can go back home. When
they got to the stable, loand behold, what did they say?
The cat was there. And notonly was the cat there, but the
cat had kittens. And that's howthat story ended. And of course,
who doesn't love a story h witha happy ending like that, right?
(26:25):
Who doesn't exactly exactly my question Iwas gonna say, My question to you
is how many will there be atthe end of all of this? Is
this just going to go on andon and on? I think I pretty
rather, I'm pretty much run outof gas the seven books are. They're
(26:52):
all well accepted. And I reallyhad three concepts. One was to show
my love for my grandson, whichwas accomplished. The second, right was
he had somewhat of a self conceptproblem, and you know, it's tough
being a kid, and so Imade him very important in each story and
(27:18):
uh, and he was a centerof attraction. And the third part that
was real based on real history.And so kids loved it, and teachers
h and parents loved it, andpeople were telling me, oh my goodness.
I never really realized that. Probablythe biggest thing for me was when
(27:41):
when I did Rome, I wantedto meet Julius Caesar. Now, when
you and I think of Julius Caesar, we think of Caesar and Cleopatra,
and he's in its fifties. Butin my reading, I discovered when he
was sixteen years old his father died, he became head of the family and
(28:03):
the head of the state gave hima job when he was seventeen to be
Jupiter's ma increase and marry his thirteenyear old daughter, and a couple of
years later someone else took over.A lot of people that were in power
(28:26):
were killed, and Caesar was goingto be killed too. And he went
to the leader Sola, who hadcalled him in, and said, look,
I'm going to save your life,but you have to quit your job
and you have to divorce your yourwife. And here's the seventeen eighteen year
old kid. He looks Dulla inthe eye and said, no, I'm
(28:51):
not going to divorce my wife.I love her. And he ran out
into the into the mountains where heNow this is a true story the way,
I'm not making this up. Wherehe almost died. He had uh
malaria and uh uh and he wasstuck. And what happened was in the
(29:18):
dream pop up and and uh andRicky met Julius Caesar's mother and she told
him what had happened and said uhand showed call him ward was they went
out into the mountains. He wasvery sick. They saw him and they
said, what can we do tosave your life? And he said,
(29:38):
well, it's a very powerful groupof women and uh and their job is
to keep the light of Rome withThey're called vessels and I didn't say vessel
virgins. And he was only eightyears old and right right, so uh
so they went to the vessels andthe vessels was so powerful, and I
(30:04):
wanted to emphasize this because I wantedgirls and women who appreciate that they had
an important part in history too.Can you imagine this story? We were
the glass season. Anyway, there'sa whole story. You're really a great
person. I could talk to youforever. But anyway, thank you for
(30:26):
having me. No, thank you. And as president of National Tax Consultants,
where you were one of the fewnon attorneys admitted to practice in front
of the United States Tax Court.What's the best website? Go ahead and
give it. It's a great website. It's called pop pop press dot com
(30:48):
and it has pictured of all thebooks you can access pop. Thank you
so much, Thanks so much,and we'll take a quick break and be
right back. Frankie Bowyer's state andwelcome back to the ranking vointer. I
(31:17):
don't know about where you were living. We are very blessed in New England
right now because we have not hadanything close to what has happened in different
parts of the world in the country. But it brings the question, what
if I had to sustain life fora few days without running to the store,
(31:38):
without having communications important important questions joiningus today is someone who knows only
too well about all of that.She is probably one of the country's top
disaster experts. She's a professor andfounder of the Undivided Project. And Monica
(32:00):
Cassandra is welcome back. Hi,thank you for having me. September marks
National Preparedness Month. So it's atime to encourage natural planning. We have
to, yes, because we areliving in a time where there's extreme weather.
The meteorologists will say we're in analninial pattern, which is why we've
(32:22):
seen you know, we're watching ahurricane forming in the Atlantic right now.
People on the West Coast in Hawaiiare dealing with or recovering from wildfires.
I'm a native of New Orleans,so they're also watching extreme heat and I
also concerned about hurricane So the importantMonica, Monica, we have to talk
(32:43):
about the heat. We're having ithere in New England as well. It's
just disgusting. But this heat hasnot let up. My poor Stephanie,
my producer, and everyone at atat the radio station, at the radio
network are absolutely going crazy with thisheat. I mean one hundred and one,
(33:04):
one hundred six, one hundred ten, one hundred nine. Yeah,
Allas area has just been out ofcontrol. Yeah, and you know when
you're dealing with heat, especially whenyou're not used to it at this level.
And I don't think I can saythat any of us are, you
know. I recommend a couple ofthings. It's always keep water with you
everywhere that you go. I havea water bottle that I just keep filled
up. And then another thing thatI learned growing up in a place is
(33:27):
always hot, like Louisiana is.Before I leave for work or school in
the morning, I throw a coldtowel. I throw a towel in the
freezer and let it get cold.So if I'm somewhere and I feel like
I'm about to overheat and I don'tknow, if there's a cooling station near
me, I can use that kindof bring my body temperature down. So
it's a couple of things. Waterwith you, make sure you have a
cold towel, and then also alwaysstay signed up no matter what kind of
(33:51):
weather you're dealing with, with yourlocal weather station and your state emergency manager.
So when they announced where cooling stationsare, you know where you can
go to cool off. Really important, really really important information. You're also
a professor I just want to sayat Georgetown University Law Center and a senior
fellow at the Chulane University Disaster ResilienceLeadership Academy. So we need to listen
(34:15):
to what Monica is saying. You'realso the founder of the Undivided Project,
and I know that this is suchan important project to you and near and
dear to your heart, and explainto us what it is. Please,
Monica, Well, what we dois is that we help underserved communities.
This means poor communities, rural communities, other types of marginalized groups be able
(34:39):
to use technology because we live inthis digital aid. Who goes anywhere without
their phone or without some app attachedto them. So critical information exactly right
is attached to that and a lotof communities may have it, but they
don't know how to use it tostart doing account of preparation and resilience that
we're talking about. And so theUndivided Project is about looking at this particular
(35:02):
piece of the digital divide and helpingthose communities get ready and build a kind
of resilience that we want everyone todo. And so Monica, tell me
about your team and what you doand how you help. So I will
say to you. We have inmy home state of Louisiana, we're doing
some capacity building in the southeast partof the state, which is facing similar
(35:24):
challenges as your listeners. In NewEngland, we're looking at land loss because
of erosion along our coastline, andpeople are thinking about do I have to
move, how do I deal withflooding and these kinds of events. It
may not be as extreme as ahurricane, but are still important to know
how to deal with. And ina lot of these places, they don't
have Wi Fi. So one ofthe things that we did was we put
(35:45):
up community WiFi so they're able toreceive communications like what we're doing this morning,
or to get those text alerts,and then also started working with them
on some highly local projects that theycan do, like planning Cypher Street for
example, to deal with the coastaldegradation that they're facing. And so that's
one of the projects that we havegoing on, Whereas in another place we
(36:07):
might actually put together a cloud basedpackage of emergency preparedness tools, and so
it really is unique to the community, just like when we talk about preparedness,
that's also unique to each community.So those are some examples of what
we do. Yeah, what shouldwe have. Let's go back to what
we need to have in our home. Food and water. Obviously the most
(36:28):
important is you're mentioning, but whatelse do we need? So we call
that our go kit, even thoughthat's not just for evacuations, is for
shelter and place. You're right,you need food and water for about three
to seven days. Emergency managers willtell you the first seventy two is on
you, which is a way ofsaying, you know, sometimes it can
take up to three days for thefullness of the US emergency response system to
(36:49):
get to you. So you needto have food, water, a few
changes of clothes. If you takemedication, make sure that you work with
your pharmacy or your doctor to getyour feels ready. If you have a
pet, make sure you have yourpet supplies. Charge your devices, have
a power bank or a solar charger. One thing that I tell people you
know, because recovery can also behard and you need documents which also can
(37:13):
get destroyed during disasters, is takepictures of the important documents like burst certificates
and social security cars, insurance papers, and storm on your phone's cloud,
and also keep hard copies either inyour go kid or in a fireproof box.
And then the other thing we needto remember, because we've just been
talking about being really digital and connectedto our phones, go to the ATM
(37:35):
and get money out because no powermeans no Apple pay, no cash payments,
no ATMs working, and fill upor charge your car if it's an
electric Yes, we've seen that right, lines of people. And then when
you finally get to go get gasor get money or get food or whatever
you're gonna do, and they needcash because the powers out, So you
want to make sure you do thosethings right. And if you're going to
(37:59):
shelter and play, I'm all abouthealthy living chow, so make sure you're
throw in some healthy nuts and rawnuts and all those other big things that
sustain you and can keep you.Oh my gosh, Monica so much more,
but we're out of time for moreinformation. And always always make sure
you have clorox. You want usto have a bottle of Clorox for clean
(38:21):
that afterwards exactly you can remove moldand mildew or if they're fire prone,
area is a good way to removesoot. And also if you're sheltering somewhere
that you're not familiar with. Youcan use Clorox disinfecting bleach or spray to
clean up unfamiliar tun Okay, giveus, give us the website. Please
Clorox dot com for more tips thanThank you Frankie, Thank you Monica,
(38:45):
Thanks to all of you. Thishas been another edition of the Frankie Boyer
Show. Thanks for listening. Makeit a great day, everybody and has
always smile face with glad nuts betweensubs. Will wait you maybe ever sow
here and if it's small, helpme are fears and start smile. And
(39:09):
maybe tomorrow you'll see the light asstill worth while if you tomorrow, but tom
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