November 14, 2024 • 22 mins
Steve Stewart of Hunterton Farms, is this week's guest on the Harness Racing Alumni Show. Steve talks about the recent Lexington and Harrisburg sales, along with the success and continued growth of racing in Kentucky. Stewart also discusses the new USTA decision that’s been led by Russ Williams, to add graded stake races beginning next year. Plus, Andy Cohen. All on this informative broadcast...
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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we wake up for the sweet rush of getting that warm,
delicious breakfast right before it ends.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Crush your morning goals with a steak, egg and cheese
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Speaker 3 (00:30):
Welcome to this week's Harness Racing Alumni Show. I'm Freddie
Hudson and I'm here today with Trademartin, Bob Marx and
Andy Cohen.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
The Harness Racing.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Alumni Show is the number one Harness ration podcast in
North America. We have sponsorships and advertising spots available. For
more information, Emailrtrodden at outlook dot com, our visit us
trots dot com. The statements and opinions of our guests
are their personal opinions and beliefs, and it does not
(01:00):
necessarily represent the opinions of The Harness Racing Alumni Show
or of its host. The Harness Racing Alumni Show with
your host, Freddie Hudson and Trade Martin joining us today
from Hunterton Forums is Steve Stewart. Steve, welcome back to
the Harness Racing Alumni Show.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Glad to be back. Steve.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
You had a very successful sale. Tell us a little
bit about the sale, both the Lexington and and the Harrisburg.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Both sales were good. The Lexington sale we sold nine.
To me, it's kind of crazy when you throw out
these numbers. But the sale that we had in Lexington
we sold out ninety I believe it was ninety four
year lanth for think right at at we averaged ninety
(01:57):
five thousand dollars for ninety it was right at nine
million dollars. So to me, it's kind of in a
way you could call it crazy numbers. But obviously we've
we've done very well over the years producing good race horses,
so I guess we're rewarded in that regard. But Parisburg
(02:21):
we don't sell as many we sold, and then unfortunately
we had some sick Phillies that were not able to
attend to say, oh, but I guess we could pat
ourselves on the back and we've got a pretty good reputation,
so we were able to work out thanks. What I
basically did was just work out with trainers and said,
you know, they're pretty much well now. They were sick
(02:44):
for about some of them are sick for one day,
and they spiked some temperatures and and but we were
it was just really bad timing. They start spiking temperatures
about two or three days, a couple of them a
few days before we shipped the front before Harrisburg and
they and then luckily we did not ship because some
(03:06):
of the other ones spike temperatures on over the weekend,
you know, right before the sale. But they were down
here and hopefully prevented other horses at the sale from
getting sick. But we were able to a lot of
people came to us and oh my gosh, it's terrible,
but you know, we were able to work out things
with people. We more or less just kind of agreed
(03:27):
on a semi price and then we're gonna shift them.
They're gonna some of them are being picked up today.
And we more or less said just take the earlands
and we kind of will stand behind them and you
try them for a couple of weeks. And because they
were not they were able to look at the videos,
but they were not able to look at the earlings.
Themselves and so, but we felt fairly confident that we'll
(03:49):
see how it goes. But we feel fairly confident that
we'll be able to get them pieced out and get
them taken care of so and hopefully and we'll look back,
I'm sure a couple of years from now and say, oh, yeah,
that was affilly that didn't make the sale. So that
usually happens that way. Harrisburg was a little bit more challenging. They,
you know, the high sold very good. We sold the
(04:11):
third highest price yield. And then the sale from mission
brief for Jeff Snyder and SRF mister Lennard from Sweden.
They had bought they had had the sale topper or
the the yearling topper of all the sales or whatever
in Kadina the sister last year, and she performed very
(04:32):
well this year, and so they came right back and
bought the colt. He was a Walner colt that brought
five hundred and twenty five thousand, and it was always funny.
Jeff came back and said, well, I was thinking, I
was thinking I was gonna have to pay a lot more.
Sometimes as a seller you don't want to hear that.
But it's nice to hear too in that regard, but
(04:53):
then there was some low prices or whatever, so it's
still have to tweak the sail a little bit, but
they'll be fine. But overall the sales were very good.
You know. My comment about the sales has been that
we don't need to go up any higher, and you
probably don't hear too many consigners say that, but I
just I always worry about the fact that these buyers
(05:15):
have to get the money back, and you don't want
to run anybody out of the business saying I can't
you know, it's not economically feasible for me to buy
these Yearlins. You kind of and I think the breeders
can make money, not all yearlines obviously, not all yearlinds
self for what you want or what you think you need.
But I think if you've got a good product or whatever,
(05:38):
there's plenty of there's definitely plenty of money out there
for what people perceive as a quality yearland, and quite frankly,
if you don't, we're in the same boat. We sold
some life low priced Yearlins at the sales, and you
just have to adjust and maybe that mayor isn't good enough.
Anymore to accomplish it. Most of the time, it's sometimes
(06:02):
it's not just the mayor, it's the fact that certain
certain year lands, certain sires are not popular at the
time and they turn the page. So you know, that's
the challenge of a breeder is that you're deciding right now,
we're deciding on who to breed to on year land,
on horses that will not be sold for three years
from now. So you kind of need a crystal ball
(06:24):
a little bit. But it can be challenging, but there's
plenty of money out there.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Yeah, see the All American Standardbred had a dispersal. Could
you compare that to the Castleton dispersal?
Speaker 4 (06:38):
Now, you really can't compare it to that. You can
compare it where you can compare it is. The reason
why you can't compare it to Castleton is the fact
that Castleton had so many They probably had one hundred
mayors or whatever to our mister Hrdtick probably had twenty
some mayors or whatever. But you know, dispersals will make
(07:00):
high prices, and in my opinion, rightfully so. Because Fred
Herdrick has done an excellent job producing a lot of
Captain Albino and a lot of really good horses, Nazinski
and many top horses over the years. And in a
way they you know, the way you should look at
a dispersal of a successful farm is the fact they've
(07:23):
done a lot of work for you. They've whittled it
down to where you know, and and he's kind of
a he's more than a boutique, but you know, not
a huge numbers that they would sell every year, and
they've done extremely they did extremely well, and it's an opportunity.
The one you would compare it to would be Whitebirch.
So when Mike Birch sold out, they probably had whittled
(07:46):
theirs down pretty good to probably in the twenties or so,
twenty or thirty mayors and so, and they sold accordingly,
we did very very well. We bought my little Dragon,
and we bought a few other mayors from White Birch,
and we did the same thing again this past week
at All Americans.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
Let's talk a little bit about Kentucky racing. The ration
they're going for fantastic money. Do you see that money
growing for the persons.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Yes, it'll it will can There's a couple of things
that really it's good for the industry and even better
for people that the breeders in Kentucky is the fact
a couple of things. One is, though I don't know
how many years ago, it's always more than you think,
but several years ago, five, six, seven, whatever it was
(08:38):
or whatever, they were able to get instant racing machines
and then at the race tracks, it and it there
was X there was probably one or two racing license
that had not been used or whatever. They were just
sitting there and the economics of these machines allowed Churchill
Downs to start to start Oak Grove that has generated
(09:03):
really the most money in our in our there's three
tracks that we have and they generate the most at
the moment. But they were really kind of the first
ones to really get going and do very well. And
they draw from Nashville. Then the other track that got
going about a year or so ago only is Cumberland
(09:23):
Run and it draws from from They're in southern state
of the southern part of the state, and they draw
from Knoxville. And so but there's a couple of things
that going forward is in our favor over a lot
of states. One of the biggest is that all these
(09:43):
race tracks that have these instant racing machines. There is
no casino tied to it. There's no all the ownership
of the tracks are either the Red Mile, Keeneland, Churchill Downs,
and then there's a group of people that own Kentucky
Down and so there's no We don't have to worry
about a casino who needs us to get started, but
(10:08):
then they start realizing that they don't want us anymore.
We're kind of a headache to them or whatever. But
and you just have to make sure that the legislatures
in everybody's state decides that, you know, it's important to
keep racing going, and that's kind of our job. You know.
I was talking to Bob Bonnie about the fact that,
you know, can you support these guys or whatever, they
(10:30):
really support harness racing, and I made the comment back
to him, I said, well, you know what, how we
go forward a lot of times is at our statehouse
and having to lobby and make sure that the new
legislators understand how important uh, harness racing and thoroughbred racing is.
(10:51):
But the other thing that that really helps us is
the fact that we're tied with the thoroughbreds, and so
we don't have to worry about. And so when you
don't have casinos who have more money than we do
going to the legislatures and you know, getting votes and
getting lobbying with their power against horse racing and trying
(11:13):
to take some of our money that we're in my opinion,
totally entitled to that. That what what we're able to
do in Kentucky is we just more or let's just
climb on the back of the Thoroughbreds and they pretty
much more or less Churchill Downs and a little bit
of Keenland pretty much they're the big fish when it
(11:37):
comes to getting things done in Frankfurt. And so we
benefit by you know, piggybacking with the Thurbreads and with
Churchill Downs owning our big our biggest generating track, not
the biggest track obviously Read Models the biggest track, but
it has the most perse money. But Ogo generates the
most money for us. So we don't have that problem.
(12:00):
And as we've seen it year after year, these machines
have not topped out. They continue to grow. And pretty
much the reason why is if Freddi Hudson and Steve
Stewart walk into oh Grove or whatever, the first or
any casino. They say, okay, you know, here's our card,
plug it in or whatever, and you get a free free,
(12:20):
this free that. It depends on how much you gamble.
And so once they do that, then they've got your
emails and they send you, you know, something over the thing.
So they are able to generate more income as you
go forward as these machines and neither none of the
three tracks have come close to topping out, so they continue
to generate more money. So we're I wouldn't say you're golden.
(12:43):
You're never golden, but we're we're sitting pretty good at
the moment with Kentucky racing and the future see Steve.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Are there any plans to market the tracks to improve
the attendance and handles.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
It's something that we are working on now in Kentucky.
To to with, there is a in the statute there
is money allowed from this this money that's being generated
to work with promotions, and it's something that we have
not done a very good job like most people. And
(13:19):
the fact that it and it you know, you have
to be careful when you get money from machines that
you don't do your job, which is our job, which
is to generate more people coming to the track and whatever.
I think that the Red Mile has done a very
good job with trying to put other entertainment along with it.
They've they've changed the a little bit of the starting
(13:42):
time for some of the on Sundays they and gave
Prut has done an excellent job with that, trying to
enjoy costa, trying to get more people there. And I
think they've done a pretty good job. But we can
do better. And the money is there, that's the saying.
It's not like we're you know, it used to be
(14:02):
that we could cry poor and say that, you know,
and you can get a downward spiral. If you're not
generating enough money, then you can't advertise. But that's not
our problem. It's shame on us if we don't do
a better job.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Is there any plans in Kentucky to market to like
TV audiences to for to promote harness rations.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
That I don't know. It's something that I think that
we need to look at, you know, I mean, it's
it's pretty uh, you know. Red Model is one of
the few tracks that it's an in town track. Most
of the tracks are not, and they we need to
just do a better job of you know, we're we're
basically right next to a huge university in the University
(14:45):
of Kentucky and Lexington, so you know, the other ones
probably have a little bit more challenging because they're really
kind of away from very many population centers the ones.
And then basically they did that because there's no casinos
and there's really not very any gambling in Tennessee. So
obviously they put those tracks down near the border of
(15:08):
Kentucky to generate. But where they are in Kentucky is
a very low population area. But I know that Oak
Grove and them have concerts and things like that that
probably generate money for the track and not so much
for you know, attendance. But we just have to do
a better job, and I think we can. The industry
does too, all of us. I don't think we can
(15:30):
point fingers at anybody. We need to point our fingers
at ourselves.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I'll have one more question for you, Uh, do you
have any plans to pursue your directors the director spot
with the usdas.
Speaker 4 (15:44):
Well. I have to wait for another opportunity. And and uh, yeah,
I failed, I failed last year in running uh And
and I don't know whether I could have done a
better job. I don't think so.
Speaker 5 (15:56):
But uh, yes, Well, all I would say is that
I'm willing to serve and try to serve and and
uh if the constituents uh elect me, I'll do my
best and war let's.
Speaker 4 (16:08):
Try to do the right thing for everybody. So thanks
to your question, if if the opportunity presents itself, I'm here,
you know, and we've done a little bit and I
was able. I was lucky to be on the grading system.
And that's really going to be an interesting thing to
watch where Mark Lowe and and uh and Russell Williams,
(16:28):
the president of the USTA, really kind of pushed it
and uh it's gonna happen next year. And there was
about eleven of us, Dave Reid and Steve Jones and
and uh but Mark was kind of the one that
carried the water and did most of the leg work
or whatever. But we've now graded the uh, the all
the races and and and now we'll get to sit
(16:49):
back and listen to some people maybe complain. Obviously it's
always fun to uh to listen to different opinions. But
we kind of had a pretty good group of people
and different you know genres of the industry to come
up with, and there was plenty of arguments and what
about this, what about that? But so I've been able
(17:10):
to do that kind of stuff in which I enjoy.
I think that being doing what we've done. I mean,
the hunter Ton's been here for forty almost forty five years,
so we've kind of seen people come and go and
seen what works and doesn't work. And the grading system
is something that that was, you know, ridiculous that we
hadn't done it before. But you got to take your
(17:32):
hat off to Russell Williams because you know, being the
president of the USTA, he carries the most water or
whatever to get it across the finish line. And you
know it's going to happen, and it'll it'll show up.
I don't know whether it's I guess it'll start with
the race tracks being able to advertise the Grade one,
the Grade one Hamiltonian. And it's so funny that that,
(17:56):
you know, you hear that in all the thoroughbreds, you know,
the Grade one Trap or the Grade one whatever. And
now we get to finally do that, and I think
that it's it's it's long overdue and I'm glad it's happened.
And then the next thing you'll see is it'll be
in the in the pedigrees on the yearly pages, so
that will be and in the USCA on the you
(18:18):
know pathway and stuff like that. I think they're going
to go back. They're not going to go back that far.
I think they're going to go back three or four years,
so kind of the the early you know, you're not
going to see something from the Grade one winning Fox
Steak that was forty years ago. And that's kind of
what I had been saying was that, you know, that
helps you as we go forward, that races like the
(18:40):
Fox Steak would have been a Grade one race when
it was racing back in the day. And if he
shows up in the pedigree, it doesn't really give information
that would help you from you know, maternal lines to
go back, you know, three or four generations. Hey Bob
or Bob, did you want to had anything here?
Speaker 6 (19:02):
I think Steve has covered everything, certainly when it comes
down to great steaks.
Speaker 4 (19:08):
I remember my.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Old boardwalk days that was back in the eighties. We
used to come out and wonder why we don't have
grated stakes, because we do, because you know which whichever
the most people. You know, races that people want to win,
like the Middle Land Space or the Ambiltonian. Yeah, those
are definitely great ones. And there are other races that
(19:31):
people don't necessarily care about that much. And well they
are great twos and great race. I mean they have
to be that way.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
You're right. And and what it what it does is
it just separates uh it, you know, I use the
effect of the Academy Awards. You know, you give out
a reward, you reward greatness and and and people are
able to say, so there's only one winner of the
Best Actor, but everybody gets to say in their you know,
(20:03):
when they describe an actor or whatever, you know, uh nominated,
you know, and and so that that that means something.
And and you know you should have right now, obviously
we have uh you know, Ashwa does a great job
of you know, a Horse of the Year and that
kind of stuff. But there's a whole lot of other
(20:23):
things you can do. And then they had to be
we had to be very very conscious of the fact
that an awful lot of our money is being generated
by the at the state level, and so how do
we do that? So we came up with ours. So
there's R one, R two, R three, and there's grade one,
Grade two, Grade three, And I think that they've done
a very good job. And I think that you're going
to see where I believe some of the other people
(20:45):
argued with me, but I feel like some of these
tracks are when they realize what the levels they are
to be grade one, grade two, Grade three, that they'll
throw a little bit more money at certain ones to
make them grade one and uh. And so I think
that raises everything. That just helps every horseman when it
comes to that. So I think there's a lot of
(21:06):
positives and I don't see a whole lot of negatives,
that's for sure, especially by great by doing the restricted
for horses that more or less just race in Ohio
and they make a lot of money, so they should
be recognized as being the best of that state.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
So right, well, Steve, I want to thank you so
much for joining us today.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
As usual, it's always fun to u, as everybody who
knows me. I don't have a problem in talking, that's
for sure.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Now over to Andy.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Thanks Rad. Finally, good news for David Siegel.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
We're gonna actually publish the interview I've done with him
over the.
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Past couple of weeks.
Speaker 7 (21:40):
I've had to bump it the last couple of times
because we had breaking news on the Keeping Pace podcast.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
But this Monday, David Siegle and I.
Speaker 7 (21:49):
He said some really interesting things. I think folks will
really appreciate hearing from him. He's been away from the
USCA leadership now for I don't know six months or
a year.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
That's it. Have a good weekend. Take care here, Fred.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Thank you Andy. The Harness Racing Alumni Show is the
number one harness racing podcast in North America and has
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next week.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
The Harness Racing Alumni Show
Mourning people wake up for peace and quiet. McDonald's Breakfast people,
we wake up for the sweet rush of getting that warm,
delicious breakfast right before it ends.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Crush your morning goals with a steak, egg and cheese
bagel or any breakfast sandwich, and snag another one for
just a buck with a buy one, get one deal
only in the McDonald's app. Limited time only at participating McDonald's.
Valid ones per day must open the rewards bottom.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
Welcome to this week's Harness Racing Alumni Show. I'm Freddie
Hudson and I'm here today with Trademartin, Bob Marx and
Andy Cohen.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
The Harness Racing.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Alumni Show is the number one Harness ration podcast in
North America. We have sponsorships and advertising spots available. For
more information, Emailrtrodden at outlook dot com, our visit us
trots dot com. The statements and opinions of our guests
are their personal opinions and beliefs, and it does not
(01:00):
necessarily represent the opinions of The Harness Racing Alumni Show
or of its host. The Harness Racing Alumni Show with
your host, Freddie Hudson and Trade Martin joining us today
from Hunterton Forums is Steve Stewart. Steve, welcome back to
the Harness Racing Alumni Show.
Speaker 4 (01:22):
Glad to be back. Steve.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
You had a very successful sale. Tell us a little
bit about the sale, both the Lexington and and the Harrisburg.
Speaker 4 (01:32):
Both sales were good. The Lexington sale we sold nine.
To me, it's kind of crazy when you throw out
these numbers. But the sale that we had in Lexington
we sold out ninety I believe it was ninety four
year lanth for think right at at we averaged ninety
(01:57):
five thousand dollars for ninety it was right at nine
million dollars. So to me, it's kind of in a
way you could call it crazy numbers. But obviously we've
we've done very well over the years producing good race horses,
so I guess we're rewarded in that regard. But Parisburg
(02:21):
we don't sell as many we sold, and then unfortunately
we had some sick Phillies that were not able to
attend to say, oh, but I guess we could pat
ourselves on the back and we've got a pretty good reputation,
so we were able to work out thanks. What I
basically did was just work out with trainers and said,
you know, they're pretty much well now. They were sick
(02:44):
for about some of them are sick for one day,
and they spiked some temperatures and and but we were
it was just really bad timing. They start spiking temperatures
about two or three days, a couple of them a
few days before we shipped the front before Harrisburg and
they and then luckily we did not ship because some
(03:06):
of the other ones spike temperatures on over the weekend,
you know, right before the sale. But they were down
here and hopefully prevented other horses at the sale from
getting sick. But we were able to a lot of
people came to us and oh my gosh, it's terrible,
but you know, we were able to work out things
with people. We more or less just kind of agreed
(03:27):
on a semi price and then we're gonna shift them.
They're gonna some of them are being picked up today.
And we more or less said just take the earlands
and we kind of will stand behind them and you
try them for a couple of weeks. And because they
were not they were able to look at the videos,
but they were not able to look at the earlings.
Themselves and so, but we felt fairly confident that we'll
(03:49):
see how it goes. But we feel fairly confident that
we'll be able to get them pieced out and get
them taken care of so and hopefully and we'll look back,
I'm sure a couple of years from now and say, oh, yeah,
that was affilly that didn't make the sale. So that
usually happens that way. Harrisburg was a little bit more challenging. They,
you know, the high sold very good. We sold the
(04:11):
third highest price yield. And then the sale from mission
brief for Jeff Snyder and SRF mister Lennard from Sweden.
They had bought they had had the sale topper or
the the yearling topper of all the sales or whatever
in Kadina the sister last year, and she performed very
(04:32):
well this year, and so they came right back and
bought the colt. He was a Walner colt that brought
five hundred and twenty five thousand, and it was always funny.
Jeff came back and said, well, I was thinking, I
was thinking I was gonna have to pay a lot more.
Sometimes as a seller you don't want to hear that.
But it's nice to hear too in that regard, but
(04:53):
then there was some low prices or whatever, so it's
still have to tweak the sail a little bit, but
they'll be fine. But overall the sales were very good.
You know. My comment about the sales has been that
we don't need to go up any higher, and you
probably don't hear too many consigners say that, but I
just I always worry about the fact that these buyers
(05:15):
have to get the money back, and you don't want
to run anybody out of the business saying I can't
you know, it's not economically feasible for me to buy
these Yearlins. You kind of and I think the breeders
can make money, not all yearlines obviously, not all yearlinds
self for what you want or what you think you need.
But I think if you've got a good product or whatever,
(05:38):
there's plenty of there's definitely plenty of money out there
for what people perceive as a quality yearland, and quite frankly,
if you don't, we're in the same boat. We sold
some life low priced Yearlins at the sales, and you
just have to adjust and maybe that mayor isn't good enough.
Anymore to accomplish it. Most of the time, it's sometimes
(06:02):
it's not just the mayor, it's the fact that certain
certain year lands, certain sires are not popular at the
time and they turn the page. So you know, that's
the challenge of a breeder is that you're deciding right now,
we're deciding on who to breed to on year land,
on horses that will not be sold for three years
from now. So you kind of need a crystal ball
(06:24):
a little bit. But it can be challenging, but there's
plenty of money out there.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Yeah, see the All American Standardbred had a dispersal. Could
you compare that to the Castleton dispersal?
Speaker 4 (06:38):
Now, you really can't compare it to that. You can
compare it where you can compare it is. The reason
why you can't compare it to Castleton is the fact
that Castleton had so many They probably had one hundred
mayors or whatever to our mister Hrdtick probably had twenty
some mayors or whatever. But you know, dispersals will make
(07:00):
high prices, and in my opinion, rightfully so. Because Fred
Herdrick has done an excellent job producing a lot of
Captain Albino and a lot of really good horses, Nazinski
and many top horses over the years. And in a
way they you know, the way you should look at
a dispersal of a successful farm is the fact they've
(07:23):
done a lot of work for you. They've whittled it
down to where you know, and and he's kind of
a he's more than a boutique, but you know, not
a huge numbers that they would sell every year, and
they've done extremely they did extremely well, and it's an opportunity.
The one you would compare it to would be Whitebirch.
So when Mike Birch sold out, they probably had whittled
(07:46):
theirs down pretty good to probably in the twenties or so,
twenty or thirty mayors and so, and they sold accordingly,
we did very very well. We bought my little Dragon,
and we bought a few other mayors from White Birch,
and we did the same thing again this past week
at All Americans.
Speaker 3 (08:08):
Let's talk a little bit about Kentucky racing. The ration
they're going for fantastic money. Do you see that money
growing for the persons.
Speaker 4 (08:17):
Yes, it'll it will can There's a couple of things
that really it's good for the industry and even better
for people that the breeders in Kentucky is the fact
a couple of things. One is, though I don't know
how many years ago, it's always more than you think,
but several years ago, five, six, seven, whatever it was
(08:38):
or whatever, they were able to get instant racing machines
and then at the race tracks, it and it there
was X there was probably one or two racing license
that had not been used or whatever. They were just
sitting there and the economics of these machines allowed Churchill
Downs to start to start Oak Grove that has generated
(09:03):
really the most money in our in our there's three
tracks that we have and they generate the most at
the moment. But they were really kind of the first
ones to really get going and do very well. And
they draw from Nashville. Then the other track that got
going about a year or so ago only is Cumberland
(09:23):
Run and it draws from from They're in southern state
of the southern part of the state, and they draw
from Knoxville. And so but there's a couple of things
that going forward is in our favor over a lot
of states. One of the biggest is that all these
(09:43):
race tracks that have these instant racing machines. There is
no casino tied to it. There's no all the ownership
of the tracks are either the Red Mile, Keeneland, Churchill Downs,
and then there's a group of people that own Kentucky
Down and so there's no We don't have to worry
about a casino who needs us to get started, but
(10:08):
then they start realizing that they don't want us anymore.
We're kind of a headache to them or whatever. But
and you just have to make sure that the legislatures
in everybody's state decides that, you know, it's important to
keep racing going, and that's kind of our job. You know.
I was talking to Bob Bonnie about the fact that,
you know, can you support these guys or whatever, they
(10:30):
really support harness racing, and I made the comment back
to him, I said, well, you know what, how we
go forward a lot of times is at our statehouse
and having to lobby and make sure that the new
legislators understand how important uh, harness racing and thoroughbred racing is.
(10:51):
But the other thing that that really helps us is
the fact that we're tied with the thoroughbreds, and so
we don't have to worry about. And so when you
don't have casinos who have more money than we do
going to the legislatures and you know, getting votes and
getting lobbying with their power against horse racing and trying
(11:13):
to take some of our money that we're in my opinion,
totally entitled to that. That what what we're able to
do in Kentucky is we just more or let's just
climb on the back of the Thoroughbreds and they pretty
much more or less Churchill Downs and a little bit
of Keenland pretty much they're the big fish when it
(11:37):
comes to getting things done in Frankfurt. And so we
benefit by you know, piggybacking with the Thurbreads and with
Churchill Downs owning our big our biggest generating track, not
the biggest track obviously Read Models the biggest track, but
it has the most perse money. But Ogo generates the
most money for us. So we don't have that problem.
(12:00):
And as we've seen it year after year, these machines
have not topped out. They continue to grow. And pretty
much the reason why is if Freddi Hudson and Steve
Stewart walk into oh Grove or whatever, the first or
any casino. They say, okay, you know, here's our card,
plug it in or whatever, and you get a free free,
(12:20):
this free that. It depends on how much you gamble.
And so once they do that, then they've got your
emails and they send you, you know, something over the thing.
So they are able to generate more income as you
go forward as these machines and neither none of the
three tracks have come close to topping out, so they continue
to generate more money. So we're I wouldn't say you're golden.
(12:43):
You're never golden, but we're we're sitting pretty good at
the moment with Kentucky racing and the future see Steve.
Speaker 3 (12:52):
Are there any plans to market the tracks to improve
the attendance and handles.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
It's something that we are working on now in Kentucky.
To to with, there is a in the statute there
is money allowed from this this money that's being generated
to work with promotions, and it's something that we have
not done a very good job like most people. And
(13:19):
the fact that it and it you know, you have
to be careful when you get money from machines that
you don't do your job, which is our job, which
is to generate more people coming to the track and whatever.
I think that the Red Mile has done a very
good job with trying to put other entertainment along with it.
They've they've changed the a little bit of the starting
(13:42):
time for some of the on Sundays they and gave
Prut has done an excellent job with that, trying to
enjoy costa, trying to get more people there. And I
think they've done a pretty good job. But we can
do better. And the money is there, that's the saying.
It's not like we're you know, it used to be
(14:02):
that we could cry poor and say that, you know,
and you can get a downward spiral. If you're not
generating enough money, then you can't advertise. But that's not
our problem. It's shame on us if we don't do
a better job.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Is there any plans in Kentucky to market to like
TV audiences to for to promote harness rations.
Speaker 4 (14:22):
That I don't know. It's something that I think that
we need to look at, you know, I mean, it's
it's pretty uh, you know. Red Model is one of
the few tracks that it's an in town track. Most
of the tracks are not, and they we need to
just do a better job of you know, we're we're
basically right next to a huge university in the University
(14:45):
of Kentucky and Lexington, so you know, the other ones
probably have a little bit more challenging because they're really
kind of away from very many population centers the ones.
And then basically they did that because there's no casinos
and there's really not very any gambling in Tennessee. So
obviously they put those tracks down near the border of
(15:08):
Kentucky to generate. But where they are in Kentucky is
a very low population area. But I know that Oak
Grove and them have concerts and things like that that
probably generate money for the track and not so much
for you know, attendance. But we just have to do
a better job, and I think we can. The industry
does too, all of us. I don't think we can
(15:30):
point fingers at anybody. We need to point our fingers
at ourselves.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
I'll have one more question for you, Uh, do you
have any plans to pursue your directors the director spot
with the usdas.
Speaker 4 (15:44):
Well. I have to wait for another opportunity. And and uh, yeah,
I failed, I failed last year in running uh And
and I don't know whether I could have done a
better job. I don't think so.
Speaker 5 (15:56):
But uh, yes, Well, all I would say is that
I'm willing to serve and try to serve and and
uh if the constituents uh elect me, I'll do my
best and war let's.
Speaker 4 (16:08):
Try to do the right thing for everybody. So thanks
to your question, if if the opportunity presents itself, I'm here,
you know, and we've done a little bit and I
was able. I was lucky to be on the grading system.
And that's really going to be an interesting thing to
watch where Mark Lowe and and uh and Russell Williams,
(16:28):
the president of the USTA, really kind of pushed it
and uh it's gonna happen next year. And there was
about eleven of us, Dave Reid and Steve Jones and
and uh but Mark was kind of the one that
carried the water and did most of the leg work
or whatever. But we've now graded the uh, the all
the races and and and now we'll get to sit
(16:49):
back and listen to some people maybe complain. Obviously it's
always fun to uh to listen to different opinions. But
we kind of had a pretty good group of people
and different you know genres of the industry to come
up with, and there was plenty of arguments and what
about this, what about that? But so I've been able
(17:10):
to do that kind of stuff in which I enjoy.
I think that being doing what we've done. I mean,
the hunter Ton's been here for forty almost forty five years,
so we've kind of seen people come and go and
seen what works and doesn't work. And the grading system
is something that that was, you know, ridiculous that we
hadn't done it before. But you got to take your
(17:32):
hat off to Russell Williams because you know, being the
president of the USTA, he carries the most water or
whatever to get it across the finish line. And you
know it's going to happen, and it'll it'll show up.
I don't know whether it's I guess it'll start with
the race tracks being able to advertise the Grade one,
the Grade one Hamiltonian. And it's so funny that that,
(17:56):
you know, you hear that in all the thoroughbreds, you know,
the Grade one Trap or the Grade one whatever. And
now we get to finally do that, and I think
that it's it's it's long overdue and I'm glad it's happened.
And then the next thing you'll see is it'll be
in the in the pedigrees on the yearly pages, so
that will be and in the USCA on the you
(18:18):
know pathway and stuff like that. I think they're going
to go back. They're not going to go back that far.
I think they're going to go back three or four years,
so kind of the the early you know, you're not
going to see something from the Grade one winning Fox
Steak that was forty years ago. And that's kind of
what I had been saying was that, you know, that
helps you as we go forward, that races like the
(18:40):
Fox Steak would have been a Grade one race when
it was racing back in the day. And if he
shows up in the pedigree, it doesn't really give information
that would help you from you know, maternal lines to
go back, you know, three or four generations. Hey Bob
or Bob, did you want to had anything here?
Speaker 6 (19:02):
I think Steve has covered everything, certainly when it comes
down to great steaks.
Speaker 4 (19:08):
I remember my.
Speaker 6 (19:09):
Old boardwalk days that was back in the eighties. We
used to come out and wonder why we don't have
grated stakes, because we do, because you know which whichever
the most people. You know, races that people want to win,
like the Middle Land Space or the Ambiltonian. Yeah, those
are definitely great ones. And there are other races that
(19:31):
people don't necessarily care about that much. And well they
are great twos and great race. I mean they have
to be that way.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
You're right. And and what it what it does is
it just separates uh it, you know, I use the
effect of the Academy Awards. You know, you give out
a reward, you reward greatness and and and people are
able to say, so there's only one winner of the
Best Actor, but everybody gets to say in their you know,
(20:03):
when they describe an actor or whatever, you know, uh nominated,
you know, and and so that that that means something.
And and you know you should have right now, obviously
we have uh you know, Ashwa does a great job
of you know, a Horse of the Year and that
kind of stuff. But there's a whole lot of other
(20:23):
things you can do. And then they had to be
we had to be very very conscious of the fact
that an awful lot of our money is being generated
by the at the state level, and so how do
we do that? So we came up with ours. So
there's R one, R two, R three, and there's grade one,
Grade two, Grade three, And I think that they've done
a very good job. And I think that you're going
to see where I believe some of the other people
(20:45):
argued with me, but I feel like some of these
tracks are when they realize what the levels they are
to be grade one, grade two, Grade three, that they'll
throw a little bit more money at certain ones to
make them grade one and uh. And so I think
that raises everything. That just helps every horseman when it
comes to that. So I think there's a lot of
(21:06):
positives and I don't see a whole lot of negatives,
that's for sure, especially by great by doing the restricted
for horses that more or less just race in Ohio
and they make a lot of money, so they should
be recognized as being the best of that state.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
So right, well, Steve, I want to thank you so
much for joining us today.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
As usual, it's always fun to u, as everybody who
knows me. I don't have a problem in talking, that's
for sure.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
Now over to Andy.
Speaker 4 (21:33):
Thanks Rad. Finally, good news for David Siegel.
Speaker 7 (21:36):
We're gonna actually publish the interview I've done with him
over the.
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Past couple of weeks.
Speaker 7 (21:40):
I've had to bump it the last couple of times
because we had breaking news on the Keeping Pace podcast.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
But this Monday, David Siegle and I.
Speaker 7 (21:49):
He said some really interesting things. I think folks will
really appreciate hearing from him. He's been away from the
USCA leadership now for I don't know six months or
a year.
Speaker 4 (21:59):
That's it. Have a good weekend. Take care here, Fred.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Thank you Andy. The Harness Racing Alumni Show is the
number one harness racing podcast in North America and has
listened to worldwide on multiple platforms including Speaker, iHeartRadio, US Trots,
dot Com, Harness Link, Google Podcasts, and many others. To
our audience, thanks for listening and please join us again
next week.
Speaker 4 (22:25):
The Harness Racing Alumni Show
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