The 80s were all about HIV and Frizz - Moonstruck (1987)

Harken! The mountain's four wise men/women left the summit to discuss Norman Jewison's Moonstruck! Released in 1987, the film stars Cher, Nicolas Cage, Danny Aiello, and many others. It was filmed in the United States and was distributed by MGM/UA Communications Co.! Enjoy your bi-weekly trip to Shaolin.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hi everybody. This is justin thehoary Urchin and before we start our show,
i'd like to remind you to likeand subscribe to our podcast on iTunes.
Please give us a ranking, preferablyall the stars, and give us
a view, preferably glowing. We'dalso like to talk to all of our
listeners and answer any questions that youall might have, For example, why
do this or for what purpose?Or will Erica ever find love? Well?

(00:24):
Email us at the Heavenly Mandate allone word, the Heavenly Mandate at
gmail dot com. That's the HeavenlyMandate at gmail dot com. And maybe
you can be that special someone Ericahas been looking for. Without further ado,
onto the show. Welcome to theHeavely Mandates. In the past,

(00:58):
we have come down from the mountainand interrupt did our study of kung fu
to review films of Sunji quality forthe rushed in, beliegued people of the
Earth. Now we study secret Skulls. Just feel the essence of Nick Cage.
Nick Cage's kung fu so as tocounter his attempts to destroy the world,
joining us, Join us as wemaster his eclectic flow matches intensity and

(01:19):
expressiveness, open ourselves up to emotionalempowerment and marvel at his unorthodox techniques.
My name is justin the hooriest oforitunes, and I am joined today by
Master by the drunken Master America's curityshJen ping Kellen, how are you doing,
sir? That's new? Thanks forthat. I you know, I

(01:42):
came into today's cast really ready toto grasp it with both hands, which
I'm extremely thankful for. That seemsvery insensitive, Kellen. That's my stick.
Josh, the deadliest of it ofvenoms is here. He sees both
the snake and the rope because younever catch him slipping. How are you

(02:05):
doing, man? Oh, Igotta say it's j Chat twenty twenty four.
Getting ready. I probably should makesure I don't say that too much.
And Erica, lady defstab, theblackest of widows is here. How
are you doing. I'm all right. I'm hoping. I don't. I'm

(02:27):
excited to leave today and hope Idon't mess it up to bed, So
tuck in the life force. Don'tworry, we'll be We're always here to
tell you if you do. Yes, that's true, it's very company.
Shoot. Today we are reviewing nineteeneighty seven's romantic comedy drama Moonstruck, directed
by Norman Jewinson. The film staris Nick cage Chaer, Danny Ielo,

(02:51):
oly Olympia Ducaccus, and Vincent Guardinauh Gardinia. Sorry, And speaking of
being unmarried, child childless and inyour late thirties or what the Chinese call
leftovers, lady desk venture god,wow wow. And here's the funny thing.

(03:14):
I know you warned me about thatintro, but when you started saying
it, I thought you're referring toyourself. Oh but I think did you
say childless? And I remember didyou say childless? I said, speaking
of being unmarried, childless and inyour late thirties or what the Chinese call
leftovers, lady pick us up.That's fine, you know what it all

(03:39):
on it. But what is theChinese term? What is well? I
don't, I don't. It's leftoverwomen they could call leftovers. If you
get past twenty eight, you're considereda leftover. I just want to kind
of know what the Mandarin like isthat is that in's little bit? Yeah,

(04:01):
actually justin If you could send mean image in like the chat,
I'll need something for the tattoo artiststo base off her, right, That
is true. That is true.I think get on like my forehead or
something, just because it does.At this point, what does it matter,
you know what I mean? Whatdoes it matter? What does it
really matter? Yeah, I'm surethere's there's a single character that represents that,

(04:24):
Erica. I'm implying that you area share Oh, it's fine.
If that's any comfort, You're areptoid alien, it's fine, that's cool.
Yeah, I don't know Share.I don't have strong opinions about share
it like me neither. I don'treally care. I feel like there's something
that I feel like is a bitoverrated. But I also feel like I

(04:45):
didn't grow up in her like primetime, so I don't maybe understand the
aura of share, you know,and you're not a so you never will
undershare. She was like a legitimateactor in the eighties, but just for
a few movies, that's the thing. Yeah, yeah, talk about it,
but like it was a very briefwindow of her career, which seems

(05:09):
she's actually pretty good. Like,I don't know why I was. Did
she win an Oscar? She wasnominated for an Oscar for some time.
Yeah, we'll talk about Yeah,so and I you know, fun fact,
I did a tap solo to Believewhen I was in high school,
so I had that connection. Ohyeah, yeah, one of the I
think one of the first mainstream songsto use auto tune. True, true,

(05:33):
Actually, that's a good that's agood point. I remember it wasn't
one of the first though, Imean, I don't think it was,
but it was one of the popularto use auto tune. Yeah, yeah,
definitely, because it was definitely arounddoing it. There were a few
hip hop songs earlier than that thatbriefly would use it, like for certain
parts, but I don't think anythingextensively used it the way that Believe did

(06:00):
this. I feel like I thinkthat I feel there's difference between she.
I mean, she's got a greatvoice on her own, so I feel
like that was like a stylistic choice, unlike you know, most today.
Tevane might be the first artist whoactually used it. That doesn't sound wrong
to me. Also, he alsobecame the first artist to over use it.

(06:25):
Well oh my god, hello,And I feel like that song is
a little bit appropriate for this story. Also, I agree this circle that
I didn't make that this film wasnominated for six Academy Awards, Share one
for Best Actress, Olivia Olympia DoCaucus, one for Best Supporting Actress,

(06:48):
and it won Best Original Screenplay.I'm the Radio to be fair, The
last nominated the Best Picture. Yeahthat's true. I mean, I like,
it's the last Star. Is itbest picture of quality? No?

(07:09):
I have to, all right,so let's get some Moonstruck. Moonstruck is
just to mention a lot of thingsin nineteen eighty seven romantic comedy drama.
It's set in I don't think it'snot little Italy, but it's set in
like an Italian American working class neighborhoodin Brooklyn, and that is a huge
part of the whole story. Isthis this this community within like a larger

(07:33):
city. I mean I was watchingthis being like, oh wow, half
this movie is like legit in Italian, which is cool because you know that
was you know, a language Iknow, but but yeah, I mean
it's such a big part of it. I mean, the whole movie just
literally opens with like the That's Moresong, you know, setting the stage
of what you know of this Brooklynpart of the world, this Italian setting

(07:58):
under a big blue Moon, Soit's kind of like setting the stage.
Would y'all think of that any thoughts? I mean, New York's got a
New York anytime you got a movie, especially in the eighties and nineties in
New York, We're going to geta lot of New York right from that,
Like we're going to use the creditsas an excuse to see the skyline,
to see the bridges, the rivers, to see famous streets, to

(08:22):
see people just walking. This movieknows what it is, just like I
mean, it felt a lot morelike b roll definitely, or not even
b roll, but like stock footagein Vampire's Kiss, this at least feels
like they shot mostly new footage forit. But yeah, are we in

(08:43):
New York? Yeah? I thinkwe are. Are we in the Italian
neighborhood? I have a strong suspicionwe are? Fact right thet so fun
fact. One of the important thingsI did feel like I needed a research
that wasn't about the Oscars is thatyou know, Nicholas came. We know
he's a Coppola, so he's ItalianAmerican, but Shara is not like at
all. And Shara's she's a bigmutt, So she is. Her father

(09:11):
is Armenian American and her mother Armanians. Armenian women, sorry, I will
stop. Armenian women can pass foralmost anything. That is like there is
just a genetic thing about the waythat they that they're that everything expresses in
them. They can pass for anythingother than being like straight off the continent

(09:31):
black. That is like the onlything they cannot. I have my friend,
I have several Armadian women who arefriends, and they're like, people
think I'm everything, like I canjust I don't have to. I don't
have to tell them anything, likethey all assume something. They're like you,
I'm every race apparently. Well,so here's the thing. So Sharah,

(09:52):
she's so she's half Armenian, butthe other side is Irish, English,
German and Cherokee. I have heractually, now that you say that,
that all kind of clicks. Imust have looked this up long long
ago. But yeah, so she'sgot like probably her Armenian mother's side and

(10:13):
then her American dad's side would bemy guess, no, no, no,
her father's yeah, oh oh,all the way around. So it's
kind of interesting because you're right,she can kind of pass for whatever,
but just a good job. Shelike physically looks the part and she acts
the part. So why not.So now that we're in you know,

(10:35):
this neighborhood in Brooklyn, so wemeet Cheer, who is It's funny because
I did sort of have some understandingbetween her character and myself. She's a
thirty seven year old widow woman.She's living with her parents, and she's
in a very pragmatic sounding relationship withthis guy named Johnny. And so,

(11:01):
yeah, I don't one of theopening scenes, if not the opening scene,
I don't work. But they're ata restaurant, like a romantic restaurant,
and they're just like having dinner.And it's so funny because he's like
everything they're talking about is just verylike, oh, did you forget your
medicine? Don't forget you forgot lastweek? Just very like old couple,

(11:22):
a very like practical thing. Andhe has this big proposal planned and he's
like, you guys want to getdessert and she's like, no, we
never get dessert. He's like,no, let's get deserted. She's like,
why you're gonna get heart bur andblah blah blah blah blah. Like
it's this very non romantic thing.And then he insists in the dessert and

(11:43):
lo and behold there's an engagement ring. And and then I can't remember the
funny exactly how it went down,but it's definitely not like, you're right.
He didn't bring his own Oh mygod, you're right. I'm making
that up. Someone else in therestaurant did No, he his pinky ring.

(12:03):
He wasn't there. He uses cokeringe. Someone gave him ship about
not having a ring. He's like, I would ring. There's literally one
of the good fellas at the nexttime. I was like, ring if
it was you, you're right,my dad. I was getting okay,
cool, I'm doing great. GreatStar for met comes through again. G

(12:28):
shat is really failing. I keepmessaging it and not doing anything. Chat
actually isn't in a large language model. It surprising doesn't work. Well,
okay, so that's right. Hematter of fact, he proposes and she
and she's like, well, youneed to get down on your knees.
And he's like really, and she'slike yeah, and then she's like,

(12:52):
where's the ring. Now you hadto have a ring, and so yes,
he transfers his coke ring and thenshe says, yes, yeah,
it's very it's gonna be good.Yeah, it's very awkward. The whole
exchange is awkward, transactional feel toit. You can totally tell. And

(13:13):
I think this is actually, Ithink, a really interesting and well written
film for the eighties. I cansee why it was so popular, But
it really does come across that sheis clearly settling for this guy. She's
like telling him what to do andhow to do it, like he's a
pushover she is. She's she's marryingdown. I think she's like, okay,
choke me now, okay, yeah, right, oh, that's just

(13:37):
marrying well. Also, like thisguy isn't like just in this. This
guy is like a more realistic modelfor George Costanza because Larry David projected himself
into an Italian American character for Seinfelder. This instead of a Jewish man,

(13:58):
this is like the more true versionof George Costanza on the Ronnie scale.
Where is Johnny Nn? I feellike, uh, he said, doesn't
he see like really old to you? Like she's thirty seven. Yeah,
he's not that old, but heseems very old, Like I'm thirty nine,

(14:20):
and I'm like, I that's that'slike an old person that's like dating
like my dad's friends or something,you know, but maybe maybe not,
I don't know. He seems older. He would have been in his fifties
when this was filmed. Yeah,that's where she was thirty nine. She's
definitely like, yeah, thrown inshe actually was she thirty nine in reality?
Or not? No? Sorry,she was seven in the film.

(14:43):
Was in her forties, I thinkin this, but I think it was
in his fifties. They were bothplaying younger than they are and they expanded
the or they contracted the age gapby like five years. So that's not
actually that big of a stretch really, but it seems like it is because
we all know who Danny Iello isand like it just feels right. Oh

(15:07):
no, he's another one of thesefamous Italian American actors who gets to basically
play Actually, this was kind ofweird to see him play such a incompetent
buffoon because he's not he's generally likea hard ass type, not like not
like a hero hard ass or likea bad guy hard ass, but he's

(15:31):
like the no nonsense New Jersey likeItalian guy. So I was like,
man him like being such a milktoast pushover feels really out of place to
me, like I can't. Butyou know what though, here's do you
guys pick up on this? Sothe other thing that happened in that restaurant
scene before he proposed was there waslike a yeah, there was another couple

(15:56):
there, like another middle aged manwith a much younger woman and she gets
upset about something and throws like aglass of water in a space and storms
out. But Johnny like makes acomment like something about not being able to
control his woman. That is aman controls woman. Funny, Yeah,
that's what he says. That's that'sthe question of this podcast. And it's

(16:19):
like it's one of those things likeif that was a modern film, that
would definitely be like red flag,like this is a bad guy or something.
But in the eighties maybe it's justlike no one even I read it
as a red flag even in thatcontext, in this context, because dude,
you're you just showed us that shebasically tells you what to do.

(16:40):
Every like the whole next scene ishers and if anything, it's like undertone
comedic because he obviously isn't in controlof anything. Yeah, but it felt
like a it felt like a likea weird comment for a character such as
Johnny is to make in the place. It did feel a little bit like

(17:02):
this guy is way too meek toeven suggest something like that. But I
guess we have to still begin becauseif he didn't catch this by this twelve
minute mark, this is the mostItalian part of Italian Brooklyn that we could
possibly be in. So we haveto make like fucking hands out. But

(17:25):
he is, but he has tomake some stereotypical Italian comment, so we're
sure we also know even if he'sneurotic and weird and easily pushed around,
don't worry, he's still Italian American. He's still going to say something that's
a little bit off color and offputting. There you go. So they

(17:47):
get engaged, and then it veryquickly turns into a very practical conversation about
when they're going to get married,all these things very matter of fact.
There's a couple of factors at play. One is Johnny's mother is dying in
Sicily, and so he needs tofly out there to be with her and
her like for her last hours,last days. And he what did he

(18:11):
say? Yeah, you know,he can't get married until after she's dead
or something like that. And sheI think, once he get married in
like a month, is that right? Like she doesn't want to waste time
at all. Yeah, she saysone month, and so he's like all
right, because yeah, I thinkhe wanted to wait. She's like,
now, we don't have time forthat. And then the other thing is

(18:32):
that she she tells her dad first, who's, you know, very stereotypical,
I think, kind of Italian fatherfigure, and he's I don't remember
his entire reaction. He seems alittle skeptical. I don't think he likes
Johnny very much. But she sheasked me to pay for the wedding,
and which he apparently she eloped thefirst time around, so I don't think

(18:56):
she talks about with her never mindgoing all over the place, but she
didn't the first time she got married, they didn't have a big wedding,
and she attributes that to being badluck. So she wants to do it
right this time. And so thereis throughout this movie some persuading that needs
to happen for the dead to payfor this wedding right. Doesn't want to

(19:19):
right, which seems at this earlyjuncture that we're at that this is going
to be perhaps one of the majorplot points. But but will it?
But will it? But the mom'sreaction I think is more interesting. So
both of them kind of accept this. But her mom sits down with her

(19:40):
and she goes, do you lovehim? And shared very nonchalock me very
quickly it's just like not, andshe's like, good, it's better that
way. Yeah, we need tohave a slightly lengthier discussion about this that
this moviets. I mean, oncewe hurt here more about her experience,

(20:04):
it makes sense. But I mean, basically she's saying that it's easier I
think in a marriage if you're notin love with your partner, because they
can hurt you less. I wantto pause on the fact that this dude
chose the worst time to propose tohis to his lady, like your mom's
dying and you're about to fly away. He didn't get any proposal sex out

(20:26):
of this. He didn't even getlike a road hand job. He was
doing all the driving. And Iwas gonna say that you wanted to like
lock it down before his like periodof absence, But as we'll soon discover,
like discussed that like didn't matter anyway. But yeah, the kind of
like going away to war feel,I guess is the idea like something that

(20:47):
is about to happen. I haveto leave the country. I must make
sure that I loose ends tied up. Yeah. Yeah, but you know
what, that was funny time,So that breakfast, right, Like she's
telling her mom and Johnny calls herbecause she says, call me when you
get to sicily and like his momwho sounds like a delightful woman who's like

(21:10):
moaning and dancing in the background,he's like crying that she's about to die,
and Share is just like, well, uh, you know, get
it done. What I Done'll befine. There's no compassion, there's no
words of encouragement, just like,oh, okay, thank you for letting
me know. Yeah, but Idon't know what did you guys think of

(21:34):
that? I thought that exchange wasthis hilarious. I mean, we'll get
just a little noise. Yeah,this whole movie is allegedly about love,
and we'll also apparently we're hitting alot of the notes early. I want
to revisit all of them towards theend. This movie is allegedly about love,
and yet like compassion seems to belargely absent for most of the characters.

(21:56):
About this entire movie. No oneseems to have a whole lot of
compassion for any plight anyone else isgoing through. They're very like, almost
so theopathic about their like about thedisregard they have from each other. I
think, yeah, I agree withyou, Kelln, because to me,
that was when it's been a longtime since I watched it. I watched

(22:18):
it first as a kid, andI don't think I washed it again until
college, and then I don't thinkI watched it again since then. Yeah,
one of the things that I noticedmore about this time is the way
in which they're constantly playing upon boththe moon and the wolfishness and the wolfishness
that comes out, and this iswhat's characterizing all these different characters in the
lack of compassion might be just connectedwith that. I thought, it's very

(22:44):
loopine. It's very like people arechanging, they're showing off their wolfish characters,
and we're seeing all these characters actingvery badly in pursuit. What do
you mean by wolfish exactly? Well, at one point she directly cult predatory.
I want to talk about that's thething you're talking about, and I
want to get into that. Iread a really good article about that scene.
But try to charge what you mean, okay, or just that that

(23:07):
that insatiable drive, that animlystic driveto get what you want because you want
it, And that's every character doingthat. True, And so it's interesting.
I don't think I picked up asa kid, but I definitely see
more of that now. Yeah,it's not I'm sure, I'm sure watching
this that naively you wouldn't necessarily pickup on it. But I so it's

(23:33):
this is actually a werewolf movie.It's just any any of the cool transformations
or people getting killed and no vampires. Sadly think we already you know,
we just did vampire. Was thatwas Callen having an aneurysm? That was

(23:59):
funny? Do we think, okay, we might as well get it out
there because the rest of this isjust going to keep coming back. So
this like adamantly religious belief in luckbad luck is like the central theme of
this. If it's not love,is this is this like is this supposed

(24:22):
to be authentic? Is this anidea that like does Italian American culture have
this like really deep seated idea?Of like not just luck that comes and
goes, but like she says,she doesn't believe in curtises when she talks
to this crazy lady at the airportabout cursing an airport or sorry, cursing

(24:44):
an airplane. But then like everybodyin the movie seems to literally believe that
luck is like a natural force ofphysics. I mean with these Italian American
families, I mean, one,they tend to be very religious, They're
very carefulic like, and I meaneven in my family, which is like
Maulti's American, Like, there's thataspect and you know the ones that I

(25:07):
know. But and I think alongwith that, especially when you know,
it's not just going to church,but it's like belief in the saints and
the miracles and all the stories thatyou're told, there's a superstition around the
whole thing, you know what Imean. So I don't know if luck
specifically has something to do with this, but like, you know, but
it's all part of I think,a superstitious aspect of the culture that's believed

(25:30):
in. Yeah, even like GoldenGirls, there's a few episodes where Sophia
is like just sending curses to likeher Sicilian family like, so the stereotype
is alive and well so I don'tknow, but yeah, going back to
that, sorry, going back tothe airplane scene though that that's funny.

(25:52):
Like right before right, she dropsoff her now fiance at the airport,
and this is very what pre twothousand and one. So she's like at
the you know, at a partinggate or whatever, and they're watching the
plane about to leave in this oldwoman next to her very nonchalantly saying,
oh, yeah, by the way, I cursed and it's going to blow

(26:14):
up. It's not going to makeit, and she and shares like,
oh, I don't believe in that, And it was just like, no,
one seems like it's a weirde thingto say. I feel like you're
you know, like you don't justtell someone who's like loved one is on
the plane that you just cursed,that you did that. And then I'm
thinking, oh, maybe it's gonnahappen, and then of course it or
did not, So it was justan awkward interaction. I did briefly entertain

(26:37):
the thought I'm like, wait,is this playing going to blow up?
Now? Is this going to belike the event that pushes the rest of
the plot into the motion. Sogoing back to the kitchen scene, the
other part of that interesting phone conversationis that he says to TOI Loretta,
you know, said, oh,by the way, will you connect with

(26:59):
my brother. We've been a strangefor a few years, but it's really
important that he comes to the wedding. So here's his info. Can you
please go and talk to him?And I were thinking, like why isn't
he Hans, and like can't youdeal this when you come back? But
I don't remember why he can dothat. So because he's handy, and

(27:21):
I doesn't want to deal with anythingthat's difficult, right, he wants his
girlfriend to deal with it instead ofhim. Amazing how I read that.
That's totally the reason. Yeah,okay, well that makes sense. This
is also the point in the filmwhere I am really needing some Nicholas Cage
stat getting like we're at the twentyminute mark of this Nicholas Cage movie without

(27:45):
a Nicholas Cage. I need someheadbanging. I need some opera. I
need some opera. I need somedrama and some insanity or something because I
so far okay, Okay, Sothis is roughly the twenty minute mark of
the movie. Yeah, does itfeel like a normal movie or not?

(28:07):
To me? It did not.It does not feel like almost feel like
a reality show. It does.It feels like they're well, they're I
mean, they're very much being liketrying to be edgy. So it's it's
not like the usual it's not theusual rom com feel. No, not
at all, and I wouldn't expectit nor for it's necessarily be the stereotypical

(28:30):
eighties style of writing. Not really. Yeah, it seems a little bit
too smart out smart alecy for itis. It is extremely It is extremely
dry. Yeah, there's something aboutit that makes you feel like, I
don't I don't want say it's areality show because that makes it sound trashy.

(28:51):
But it's almost like you're just likesitting in their living room watching them
just like in a very authentic kindof way. It happened, Yeah,
watching something happen. It does.I mean I literally got that from like,
well, first, we didn't needto address the weird fact that like
this opens on a scene where she'sdoing accounting for a funeral home that never
will come up again for the restof the movie. It reminds me of

(29:18):
do you ever see it's It remindsme of opera or opera buffer. Yeah,
Erica, do you know that you'llknow this? I don't know.
It's me where it's it's about lowerclass people doing common things without like full
of stock characters and stereotyped characters.You know. It felt like and there's

(29:42):
part and well there'll be a scenelater on in which opera does play significantly
into it, But it felt verymuch like I was watching a modern adaptation
of that kind of vibe where it'slike the characters are meant to be.
Yeah, that it felt not operatically, not quite real. Yeah, I

(30:06):
guess I could get that. Andyou already you put it in the chat
with a gift, and I madethe connection that a lot of these early
scenes and then also again later scenes, to me were a little bit too
almost I think you should leave.From Tim Robinson, I was just like,

(30:30):
I feel really awkward for I knownot one of those people that gets
awkward about watching entertainment from like thiswould be a terrible situation. I don't
have much empathy, so I'm notlike putting myself in their shoes. I'm
just like, I just feel awkwardwatching all of these exchanges happen because they
the no one is acting poorly,but it seems like everyone's almost annoyed to

(30:55):
be there. Like the way thatthey're doing everything is like cool. It
might be in their character, butit seems like nobody's happy to be in
the room they're in at any pointin this movie, unless they're having sex.
Everyone's like, oh God, hereI am with these people again.
Okay, maybe not all the time, but quite a few of these early

(31:19):
scenes, like for this being theestablishing moment of like here's what the premise
of this almost plotless movie is goingto be of. Here is Loretta and
here's the guy that she is consentingto marry out of default. Was like
I get that they're supposed to kindof be settling, but it's so so

(31:42):
heavy in the way that everything isdelivered of like well, yeah, I
guess, yeah, I mean whenare we going to get married? Then?
Okay, like let's have a conferenceabout everything that we're doing and but
then but then juxtaposed against but alsoI believe in the mystical quality of luck.
Let's be really cut and dry andlike almost contractual in a medieval sense

(32:06):
of them getting married and then mebeing like that, but if you don't
kneel, you know, the badluck will hit you with a bus,
like my last husband. It's aweird. It's a weird. I don't
even want to say balance. It'sjust it's just a weird pairing of ideas
that they can be this disinterested inthis cold about something and then also about

(32:30):
apparently the magic of how luck works. Also weird that Olympiadu Caucus an Italian,
well, an Italian mother is makingEggy in a basket for breakfast.
That doesn't feel right, that thatfelt completely off. I don't I don't
feel like that was correct. Butwell, I don't know. She also

(32:52):
wants to tell seven year old herthirty seven year old daughter to continue living
at home, which feels also verythat's Italian for you. Yeah, you
live with your parents until you're married, yeah, or even after. She's
literally like, well, will hemove in with us? Like what you?

(33:12):
Yeah, that's how it worries.I mean, maybe it's different modern
times, but yeah, you staywith your parents and so you get married.
No, but she literally wants Johnnyto move in with She's like,
well, once you're married, you'llmove in here, right, And when
she's like, no, he won't, she's like, we'll sell the house.
I mean a multi generational households.Yeah, yeah, multi general households

(33:37):
aren't that uncommon, so it's practical, right, Yes, it's very old
world. I just feel like,once you've been married, it's time for
your own house in the mod evenin the eighties modern world. Yeah,
but like here's the thing. Imean, if you're by yourself, you

(33:58):
know, I mean, I guessit's different. But it's like if she,
you know, she loves her parents, I mean, why not live
with them if you're happy and you'rekind of used to that, or maybe
there's a lot of family pressure.I do feel like there's like a lot
of family pressure to stay also.I think that's kind of one of the
central messages of this entire movie isvarious familial pressures from different all kinds of

(34:20):
different things. But it just seemsto be like that that's what she knows,
right, Like you can see howI mean her there. It's not
even just her with her parents,her grandfather lives with them too. It's
very much a multi generational household andthey all seem to. It's like they're
used to it. It's just likethis is how it is. You know,
I get having the grandparents in thescheme in the same house trying for

(34:42):
three generations, especially if she alreadymoved out once. I don't know if
that's just the like midwestern non Catholicthing, I guess mmmm. Also,
what was that funeral scene? Whatwas that? It was? That funeral
scene was so bizarre and confusing oflike Grandpa going out with his one million

(35:07):
dogs he has to walk all thetime and has no plot purpose and going
to a cemetery a cemetery to meetwith the other goodfellows of his generation and
be like, my son won't payfor the wedding, And then everybody has
this like conciliary moment of like counselinghim, and you're like, wait,
is this going to get dark orlike, is this going to be a

(35:29):
big flop point again? Is thisgoing to be a big plot point about
Cosmo paying for the wedding? Thisscene certainly would seem to indicate it will
be. So she's like, allright, I'll go find a brother,
and so her brother works at likethe family bakery. So she goes out
there and yeah, and the twowomen who you know run the store.

(35:51):
Maybe I don't know if one ofthem's sister. We learned later the other
one as a crush on one ofthe butt guys, so not a sisterized
and so they're like, she's like, I'm looking for Ronnie. So fun.
I mean, she's engaged to Johnnyand now she's gonna go meet his
brother Ronnie. So that's cool.It's Ronnie. And anyway, so it's

(36:16):
a bakery. But like I feellike most bakeries like look really charming and
like you know, cake boss,and like all these like pretty things around
and like this basement like looks likehe's in the mines or something, you
know what I mean. There's likea big oven, like a fires of
hell are there. He's drenched insweat and like he is working for his

(36:37):
money, taking bread's energy Erica.Before we get too far into this,
I'm assuming, I'm assuming this isno. I can't. I don't like
Nicholas Cage. He just annoys me. And I don't like you are you
are slabbering all over the shared youcan't do it with him. I just

(37:02):
don't like him. He is weird. He's a weird guy like I,
So I'll answer for you. He'sstill himself. He'll always be Nicholas Cage,
even in The Wife Peter. Whichis why it's funny to like think

(37:22):
back to this era though, andbe like, yeah, but Nicholas Cage
wasn't Nicholas Cage yet, I knowhe was. He was not like a
big known quantity with a specific frameworkof expectation about him. So to just
walk into a movie like this andsee an actor who you barely know if
at all, Okay, but likehe's very first scene, is him being

(37:45):
Nicholas Cage, you know what Imean? Like this is not like he
wasn't wasn't like he wasn't like aknown quantity at that point. Yeah,
is him being Nicholas Cage before youknew that's what Nicholas Cage? This is
like if this is this is likethe second movie you've seen with maybe Nicholas

(38:07):
Cage even in it, and you'relike, Okay, this is how this
guy acts, or this is thisis his introductory scene, Like we don't
even get anything with him until weget a missing hand and a veneta against
a brother spoil it. My secondsin the future. That's why this is

(38:31):
a comic opera, Like it hasall the hallmarks of these really, like
like I hate opera. I'm gonnaput it on Front Street. You can.
It's a whole it's it's it's theit's the stuff that you watch before
they invent TV. That's basically whatwe used to put on all of our

(38:52):
marketing materials when I worked an operacompany. Yours is pre TV entertainment.
Yeah, you're being honest, andand I appreciate that this is that's pretty
dead internet entertainment anymore. Yeah,maybe I'm trying to I saw one opera
and I'm trying to remember the stupidname of it. But it was a

(39:15):
comic opera, and it was like, justin, you've seen more than one
opera because we went to one inelementary school as well that you probably blocked
out we did. No, Imean, I'm dead, I don't remember
what it was. I know wewent to one. I don't remember that
at all. I know we Iknow we all collectively did because we were

(39:35):
in the same class. So ifI remembering it, it was there.
It was a very short whatever itwas, and it was at the Tibet's
opera house. I'm sure. OhI don't remember. I honestly don't remember.
If. If that's the case,then I lied and I should be
punished. But but I remember receptacleof memory. That's fine. I'm trying

(39:59):
to remember the opera I did see, and it wasn't like a grand opera.
It was a peasant opera. Itwas about this guy who you know
what it was? You know thecallen maybe you know this? You hip
the what's the opera they show whenGodfather three ship the Woman? Yeah,

(40:19):
that that he goes to watch,Yeah, starring in it. It's do
you remember the composer? No,I don't here, I'm gonna do.
It's even in the town where they'refrom. I think where the Corleoni.
I guess it's an opera in coleIt's a co and this is okay,

(40:40):
Cavellierra or yeah, that's so.I've seen that one. I've seen that
one presented live and I was like, what the fuck is this? That
guy is getting all emo about someship that like he could just easily forgive.
He doesn't. He gets killed overit. Blah blah. It's like
that Italian mafia, like Bendetta aship like to me him everyone for no

(41:04):
reason exactly over bullshit, over nonsense. That could have just been like,
I get it, that was awkward. What it is, Let's not kill
each other. Let's forgive it andforget. Or I watched this scene,
I was like, a fucking course, this has to be an opera because
he loses his hand over a fuckingsome bullshit. Oh my god, we
haven't described it yet. It's opera. This is an opera that's spoken and

(41:29):
not sung. And I'm glad thatthe spoken opera. All right, sorry,
okay, so let's talk about thisstory we built up. So she
goes down and she meets Ronnie,a very charming fellow, very happy she's
here, very stunny disposition. Mytiesare wet when I see him. I
don't know about you guys, Yeah, I mean he's kind of I don't

(41:52):
know, it's hard. It's hardfor me to like forget the fact that
he's still in like thiss cage andhe crushed me out. But he's also
dick. And so she goes down, very calm, very like, hey,
hi, nice to me. I'myour brother's fiance, and he like,
you can go to the wedding andhe's like, yeah, absolutely not
hate my brother. He's an asshole. And she's like, Okay, cool,
what happened? And you'd think there'slike a good story, like maybe

(42:14):
you know, he stole his formergirlfriend or something or I don't know,
like killed his dog or something.I don't know. And basically the gist
of it that he explains is thathis brother, I think, asked him
for some bread or something and hewasn't paying attention and he like chopped his
hand off, she know, wouldship his hand off or whatever, and

(42:37):
so that's awkward. And then becauseof that, his lover, his own
girlfriend or fiance, left him.So for this he blames his older brother
and that is the end of that. Mean, he's not a monument of
justice, Erica. He's not amonument justice. He says. He says

(42:59):
what what's wrong can never be maderight, which is such a badass thing
to say in this it's so dramatic. I love it right because he is
is is this then? Is thisthe beginning of Nicholas Cage's love of opera?

(43:21):
In reality? I don't know,or did he insists that this operatic
tone be allowed in this movie.He was in because they already loved it,
and it was like, also,they have to go to the opera.
I feel like you probably didn't havethe pull to like make scripts demands
at this point. True, that'swhat I would assume too. But it's

(43:44):
in which case this is a perfectmarriage Nicholas. This is Nicholas Cage actually
finding a ideal role for himself asa relatively unknown actor. Like I get
to be in a spoken opera wherewe go to the opera, yes,
but identity to sing opera people.Nicholas Cage's grandfather, the father of Francis

(44:07):
Porcoppolo, was a opera composer.Well, that does explain a lot of
things. You know, if thisis like one of his first movie,
he very much makes an entrance ofthis, it's memorable. Yeah, and

(44:28):
this is what I'm about, sovery you know, rational person, you
know clear sinking and you know reasoning. There. She can't get enough of
it. He's the bad boy.What's funny. What's funny is that the
juxtaposition I'm going to keep using thatterm of how Share is acting versus some

(44:50):
Nicolas Cage is acting also reinforces thisbizarre dichotomy of like she almost seems like
she's falling out of character and melike what what are you talking about?
What are you doing? And butboth of them, it's just enough inside
of like the box of how theircharacters are that even if one of them

(45:15):
isn't exactly acting correctly, it stillkind of works because it's just like you're
so bizarre, what are you talkingabout right now? And what you're saying.
Kelen is also further magnified by howeveryone else in the basement, in
the bakery's basement is so serious andlike they're like about the cry and and

(45:37):
that lady is like, I loveman, I've never I've never seen a
man so tortured. Like this iswhat she this is what she gets off
on. But everyone else, everyoneelse in the scene, everyone else in
the scene almost like when he's likehe asked for the big knife, Yeah,

(46:00):
right over and over again. Thisalmost feels like a cold read or
no other Like Nicholas Cage practiced forthis. Everyone else got a script and
then they just threw them into thisset together and like first take, we
are going to keep We're gonna letshappen. Everybody just go and turn on

(46:22):
the cameras and nobody else. Nobodyelse knew what the dialogue was supposed to
be except for share even Sheridan.Now he seems confused. It's like the
same way that Ridley Scott shot theChessburster Seen an Alien, where he didn't
tell anybody ahead of time what wasgoing to happen. Nicholas Cage is the

(46:42):
chest burster of this movie in thisscene, and everybody just remarkably rolls with
it and let's it all happen.Erica, I feel like you're a lot
like Johnny when you're dating people.You're just Johnny. No, Ronnie,
I'm sorry, Yeah, how becauseyou got to handle stump? Yeah,

(47:10):
her knives you have the stump.Yeah, we look like expectations, always
wearing a wife beater, always justalways just pissed off and blaming your brother
for everything. Always emanating animal sexualenergy. It's all there. Never plucking

(47:37):
your eyebrows, because they definitely,Nick Cages need to be plucked in the
scene. They're wild. The onlytime I've ever noticed that about him.
Actually, all right, so nowthat we've met Nicholas Cage and we've met
our two main characters, you know, and they finally meet. Now things

(47:57):
are starting to like heat up inmany ways. So somehow we go from
hey, nice to meet too,I'm your brother's fiance. Do you want
to come to the wedding? Tolike, fuck you bitch, No,
he ruined my life because I cutoff my hand and I'm blame him anyway.
And here, by the way,give me a knife and slip my
throat. She's like, hew aboutI mean he dinner at your house or
something. I don't even know howthey got from there to there, to

(48:17):
be honest with you, don't.It feels like a missing scene. It
feels like there was a scene thatwas supposed to bridge that gap. I
feel like if I was share,I'd be like this guy's crazy and like
I don't want him at the wedding, Like I see why we're not talking
to him. I'm fine with it, Like let's move on. Somehow she
ends up making him dinner at hisapartment so okay, which, honestly,

(48:40):
I don't know if you guys rememberthat. I was confused for a minute
because I was like, who livesthere? You know you've seen that she
lives with her parents, but itlooks like really neat and like it doesn't
look like and like a nice homeand like Ronnie the sweating, like angry
one handed baker does not seem tobe one. We spend a lot of

(49:00):
time cleaning at night with That's allI got to said. Yeah, and
the bed is made. We're seeingthe layers that has. Just because he's
working class doesn't mean he likes he'snot capable of clean house Erica, he

(49:21):
only has one you're on assumptions,Okay, a few other things though he
only has one functioning hand, Okay, like that would limit I mean I
have to I can't clean. Ohyeah, yeah he no. Listen,
We're not going to be getting mein trouble. I'm just saying, if
you live alone, right, youdon't have anyone else that that's going to

(49:45):
get on you. Like if yousee my house, right, I have
all I am completely able to cleanmy house, and yet I don't do
it because no one else lives hereand I don't have to. So it's
not great. The reason is thatyou're not Ronnie contrary I It's just just
I was a little surprised. Imean, do you think do you think

(50:09):
he's someone that like angry clean,like that's where his rage goes. I'm
gonna get the stand out. Maybethat's where that goes. Yeah, he
prefers the steaks well done, whichI have to disagree with. And I'm

(50:30):
almost curious, Like I'm almost curiousto like did he like she's cooking for
him at his house? Like didhe already have the steaks? Like did
she go I'll go buy I'll buythem for you just because you're so nice
to me. I'm gonna make youa stake dinner at your own house.
I'll serve it to you and everything, Like I don't know how this Tampa

(50:51):
and if I can say, plutthat out because Josh brought it up.
But this is where we get someof the first and most over wolf references,
where we're told that he needs toeat a bloody to feed his blood.
And it's really interesting that that becomeslike, you know, the bloody
steak, rare meat. Yeah,yeah, wolfish blood. But yeah,
I mean, I'm sorry, he'sa fucking Italian American. He just ordered

(51:15):
a well done steak. I doubtthat that feels like a conceit for the
purpose of the metaphor that's about tocome forth. I love how I have
this like episode as us just liketalking about whether like Italian stereotypes or not.
Yeah, sorry, of our listenerswho are Italians or Italian Americans,

(51:37):
this might come across a little insensitive, but also you're we're giving like white
supremacy, so that's on. We'regiving them the benefit of the doubt though
in terms of like not eating crappysteak, right, and we assume you're
better than that. You're the mastersof the Western world of culinary so you

(52:00):
better be better than that. Youalso gave us the Jersey Shore, so
you got to you got all.We're gonna stay. In the words of
Colin Jost on SNL's Weekend Update,the modern Prime Minister of Italy has been
accused of pushing white supremacy ideals,which is crazy. Are we counting Italians

(52:22):
as white? Now? Yeah?It is interesting how like the groups that
were marginalized at one yes, inmany ways become marginalizing, right, isn't
it weird? I mean, ifyou watch It's just is the number one

(52:46):
venue where this comes out of,Like really, really you're going to be
racist right now? Like like BillO'Reilly doesn't want immigrants to come into this
country. O'Reilly old imigrants in thecountry. Weird, all right? So
now things so, now things areheating up. Okay. So then they

(53:10):
have a really interesting conversation where shedesires to like tell him how it is,
like, listen, now that you'refed. This is not Johnny's fault.
And furthermore, I think you didthis to yourself to get out of
a relationship you don't want to bein anymore. So she yeah, accused
him of being a wolf that's chewingoff its own foot to escape a trap.

(53:34):
Very is this an intentional reference toDoune or not? I doubt it.
I have no idea, no idea. I mean, as as Reverend
Mother Mohaim says, that's a veryanimal trick to chew one's own foot off
in a trap. Mm hmm.Also does maybe it's a saw reference.

(53:55):
It's not. I mean, thoseare basically the same sentiment. So maybe
this is just a common idea cuttingyour own were pre saw it this At
this point in time, Thank god, they had just watched David Lynch's Due,
and he's like, I get it, I get it. I love

(54:16):
that movie, man, But Imean that seems does that not seem a
little bit presumptuous. I get thatwe're like working on an accelerated timeline for
the story of like her just havingknown what the hell is his name Johnny
having them ronnie for less than rhymingnames. Well, if you're going to

(54:44):
use mostly biblical names, that's probablygoing to be the case. But like,
I've known you for three hours,and so I'm going to be like,
no, I think you cut yourown handoff to get out of a
marriage. That's a pretty hard hottake to just come in with to a
stranger, and a stranger with atemper problem. I mean, on top

(55:13):
of everything else as far as yourown self preservation goes. Would you not
be like, should I poke thiswolf I guess, since that's what I'm
gonna call him? Or should Ishare? As we've learned with Loretta,
you know share Loretta like there's kindof like like no fucks to give,
right when her own fiance is likecrying his mother's dying, She's like,

(55:34):
Okay, well let me know whathappens. You know, there's like not
last softness to her with all thesethings. So it's like she's either like
a little bit emotionally unintelligent, orjust doesn't give a shit, you know,
like, I'm just gonna tell yousome things that are just truths that
I see and you're gonna do It'sjust it's just something, Yeah that this
kind of story obviously values, Soit's passable. It's passable. I would

(55:59):
say. She just throws all thisstuff at him, especially given I guess
that the bakery scene of him justspewing his background at everybody and without regard.
So but then he pushes back onher, and so she's saying,
you know, like you're you know, you maimed yourself to get out of

(56:20):
this thing, but what are youdoing? Like what are you doing with
my brother who is so you know, like uninteresting, right, Like why
are you you know, who's gotso much else going for you, you
know, with him? And that'swhere she you know, going back to
telling her mom she's in love andbeing like, I'm looking where I have
to to become a bride. Andso this is where the interaction gets interesting.

(56:42):
He goes after her and says,you're a bride without a head,
and she says, you're a wolfwithout a foot. Yeah, yeah,
I liked that was really that wasa fun quick interchange and then that and
that was the conversation that was apparentlythe biggest effort. Mean, yeah,

(57:04):
the hottest conversation you have with someone, as long as it will be metaphor
people being dank after this, Yeah, and then he basically takes her to
his bedroom and they have sex.So so listen, this is what we
awkwardly over all their clothes in aclassic style for the eighties. No one,

(57:29):
Nick Cage will cuckold anyone, andyou just kind of you just have
to deal with it and move on, like you can't dwell on the fact
that you just got cupled by byNick Cage. He's basically the Jack Skellington
of like pounding vagina, Like hetotally makes Wallace fall. And this is
what I learned from this movie.Oh my god, you might have under

(57:52):
saved that for later. But alsoI guess this is at this point,
well, no, we're not quitethere. I'll wait, I'll wait,
I'll bring this point up in justa little bit. I was also going
to say, oh, yeah,she that the only reason that I was

(58:15):
able to tell. Finally, I'mlike, okay, they're at his apartment
because she's like, do you havewhiskey, Give me whiskey and we'll talk.
So I'm like, okay, Iguess, and your parents aren't there.
Yeah, right, But also hepulls out or she pulls out,
I don't know. You see abottle that is jay and B. It's

(58:37):
suspiciously light. I'm gonna say theyjust used water with a little food coloring
in it, so very very itlooks like it looks like she's throwing white
wine out that and that's not that'snot accurate. And that's where that's I'm

(59:00):
remembering correctly, going back to this, you know, with my elaborate notes
that have in front of me.Clearly she spends the rest of the day
with him right in bed, andI think she spends the night there,
and yeah, gee, chads onlycan do so much. And yeah,
if I memor ray, it's likea blue moon that night, right,

(59:20):
it's this big full moon. Andat the same time, her parents and
her uncle and aunt and grandfather allhaving dinner together, and her uncle recounts
how he remembers this big romantic nightlike this when her father was courting her
mother, and that's where you kindof get this moonstruck kind of like this
love struck feeling under this big bluemoon because this whole thing just happens within

(59:43):
a matter of days, right,So that's probably it's lunacy. It's the
actual definition of lunacy. Oh yeah, yeah, oh yeah, good point.
And going back to the wolf,look at all these connections we're making.
Yeah, it does plastic world.But as we learn that dinner with

(01:00:08):
the love scene with our parents isalso bittersweet. Going back to her mom's
earlier conversation also because we learned thatCosmos actually having an affair. Yeah,
and her mother senses this, andso that that comment that exchanged they had
earlier is very poignant when she goesdo you love him? And Share goes

(01:00:28):
no, and she goes good,it's better that way because she knows the
paint it is to love the personyou marry and have them betray you.
You know. I find it inI love this film because it's so bizarre.
But one of the things that Ilike about it is that, like
it doesn't, it shows old peoplebeing in love, and I think that's
something that we get start a lot, justin You've got to watch The Golden

(01:00:51):
Bachelor, except they're all like agedup there in their thirties. They're plus
Josh already told me the ending ofthat, and I don't want to see
that horror show. He doesn't knowthe ending. No, I read the
script. He connected it. Yeah, there's a secret room that he doesn't

(01:01:13):
want the winner to look into him. I'm calling it. When I'm right,
I mean, but that is twosets of Broadway tickets. When I'm
right about this, I'm going toget the one set for the Kim Kardashian

(01:01:34):
and I'm getting the other set forthe Golden bash It Right now, are
the Kardashians same thing they can passfor like anything? Ye? True?
I mean already is they're trying tobe black and they get they get in
trouble for that a lot from likedarkening their skins, like wearing corn rows

(01:01:59):
and stuff. Right, because they'relike jament. They have absorbed, they
have absorbed like six hundred lifetimes ofUbans. Okay. Yeah. And also,
by the way, by the way, all Italian Americans, and I'm
gonna say this, this is theone point blank thing they don't fucking drink

(01:02:21):
J and B anyways that they're drinkingScotch. They drink sark. It's in
every fucking movie that has ever beenmade about Italians who are drinking scotch.
So they didn't get that right.No matter what, that's the pill I
will die on about this movieet isenraged about this. There's no truth in
this art, okay. So theyhave their passionate nights together underneath this big

(01:02:50):
blue moon where her parents are actuallysort of remembering their own love, which
is kind of sad in its currentstate. But the next morning, she's
like, look, this was fun. Can't happen again, because you know,
I'm engaged to your brother, andalso, let's just pretend this isn't
happened. And he's like, yeah, oh yeah, right, that's right.
I forgot about that. And she'slike, also, I don't think

(01:03:13):
you should come, and he's like, actually I am, but he says
but he goes, listen, here'sa better idea. He's like, how
about this go to the opera withme tonight, because that's his passion.
I think he even says that theonly later on, but maybe or maybe
now that the only thing he's morepassionate about than opera is her. So

(01:03:37):
he's like, come to the operawith me and then I'll leave you along,
so she goes okay, and thisis what's interesting because this is where
she gets her like makeover. SoI was reading other things about this,
just not the specific plot points toactive, you know, to leave this
conversation well tonight, but really otherthings. And they're talking about how,
you know, a lot of movies, like they have their characters like makeover

(01:03:59):
scenes, like She's all that orPrincess Diaries, and you guys, I've
never seen any of that, right, but they're like these montages, right,
and they're always fun, but usuallythere's like other outside people doing it
and kind of seeking that beauty.But she does this herself, like she
you know, first stop, she'sgot to go deposit some money from her
aunt and uncle's store. So shecollects some money, then forgets about it.

(01:04:21):
But that's that I'll come back later. But she's like and then she
just like goes the hair salon anddecides that she doesn't want to have gray
hair anymore, so she like getsher hair dyed and styled. She buys
a new dress, like she justkind of I think after being like a
widow for seven years or five howeverlong it's been, you know, like

(01:04:41):
she's you can see that she's sortof excited. Now. She'd gone from
settling to Mary Johnny and just beinglike very practical, this is my life,
you know whatever, to all ofa sudden being you know, passionate
about someone and wanting to feel beautifulagain and wanting to feel like that life
again, which is interesting. Sothey go to the opera, right she

(01:05:02):
goes home. Am I missing anythingto go to the opera? I don't
really really know? And just justlike twenty five minutes of the old Man
walking dogs, Yeah, which Ilove. The old Man was adorable,
like when he starts howling on themoon. He was cute, but they
were let's serve no purpose, wellmaybe having five dogs howl at the moon

(01:05:29):
for this whole wolf moon love struckthing, like they just needed a hammer
at home. Also was throwing andhowling dogs that one scene. Yes,
it's just the redundancy of like,what is Grandpa doing with these dogs?
Why do they have so many thosedogs? I felt like one more excuse
to like have another walking shot ofNew York City, which is movie already

(01:05:53):
indulges in pretty heavily. But wow, I'm saying justin I love that share
share went from looking very eighties toinexplicably looking even more eighties after makeover.
I know, I know, yougot the frizz hair. Her hair gets
bigger and curlier and blackhir. Itwas an era. It was an era

(01:06:14):
of frizz. Yeah, eighties wereall about HIV and frizz. Oh my
god, Josh, another grid isgoing to cancel us title I titled,
Oh my god. You know,I had tuperms in elementary school, and
like, they didn't stay. Theydon't. That's they're not supposed to.

(01:06:35):
They're they're not aptly named. No, they're in fact they had. We
just actually had this conversation a coupleof nights ago with a friend. Remember
that year when perms for guys werein for one year. Yeah, like
I had one. Yeah you did, You had everything Josh's experiments on stages.

(01:07:03):
Yeah bad. It's relieving to notreally have much hair that it just
takes care. So they go tothe opera. But this is I just
want to say. This is alsothe point in the movie where I gave
up on the idea that there wouldbe any plot. This movie is just

(01:07:29):
going to be a lot of confusingsort of conversations that I'm not really sure
about where everyone's annoyed, and thentalking about luck and then people babble a
lot. Maybe that's why I'm gettingthat reality show kind of feeling, just
because Yeah, I mean it's notit's not a plot, but it does.
It feels like a normal life kindof plot. Like it doesn't really
feel rambling. It's it's not necessarilystrategic focused for a reason, right,

(01:07:59):
Yeah, exactly exactly what it is. And then they all tend to talk
when they talk for more than afew minutes into these like extended metaphors,
and like even the characters within thescenes seem not to be sure what they're
talking about. So it does reinforcethis like realistic I guess, feel about
it, except no one talks thatabstractly in real life. If you like

(01:08:24):
an abstract version of reality, Iguess. Hmmm. Uh So, you
know, the opera ends up beinga turning point for both of them when
they really fall in love. Youknow, Nicholas Cage, what the inspiration
the inspiration for your your favorite rent? Rent? Yeah, they go to

(01:08:46):
see Labo M and Nicholas does thatone does make that up. I feel
like he makes a comment about likethe only thing he's more passionate about than
opera is her, and now hehas them together, right, he said
something, He said something along linesyeah, and then Share, as you
always find out, this is verypretty woman. Right. It's like someone
who's never been to the opera beforeit gets all dressed up and goes and

(01:09:06):
then they feel so moved and cryabout it, exactly how Justin's experienced opera
in his time. You just needto go once and then you just feel
everything. So now Share is allinto the opera and very into Nicholas Cage.
And so they're they're having a happytime and they're leaving the theater,
and who do they run into isCosmo and Cosmo's mistress and both of them

(01:09:31):
are kind of looking at each otherlike she naturally is like, dude,
what are you doing? This isn'tmom, And he's kind of like,
what are you doing? This isn'tlike. Let's uh, let's pretend we
didn't see each other here. Ilove that they keep America the code.

(01:09:53):
You keep, you keep Themerica nomatter what, even in your own famil.
They don't rattle each other, whichis amazing. I should also point
out one other parallel that this iskind of bringing up that only occurred to

(01:10:15):
me right around this scene of like, well about the same point of thinking,
perhaps there is not a plot tothis story at all. This is
just going to be a vignette.So we're at the opera. So now
it's like, okay, sure andRonnie are like a thing. Now she
just seems to be like fully inand they go back to his house.

(01:10:38):
Meanwhile, while all this is happening, Loretta's mother, you know, sad
lonely, having a sense of whereher husband is, decides to go to
dinner by herself, and she seesthat guy from the very first scene,
that middle aged man once again eatingwith some young woman who throws water in
his face and storms out. Soshe ends up, you know, they

(01:11:00):
end up chatting, having dinner together. And what if she asks him,
Oh, yeah, she you findout he's a professor that dates his students,
and like, you know, yeahand up, and what does she
ask him? She I think sheasked some white men cheat and she men

(01:11:21):
chase women. He didn't give herthe answer that she wanted, because she
goes, why do men chase women? And she goes, I think it's
because they fear death, she said, she does, she does later,

(01:11:42):
but I think she also asked him. She asked Perry is the name of
the professor? She asked him first, and his answer is a little bit
less concise. Well, so fromhere it's like, you know, they
She ends up having a really nicenight with this guy, and he ends
up walking her home, which isinteresting because you know, she knows her
husband's having an affair, her daughter'sgod knows where, and this says the

(01:12:06):
stage of like she could be havingher own affair. But she turns him
down and she's like, I'm tooold for you. Whatever. So that's
interesting, right because she's presented withthe same choice other characters have had and
she doesn't do it. But whatthe other big thing happening tonight is that
Johnny has come home after his motherhas miraculously recovered. So this is her

(01:12:31):
the soap opera now, and sothe next morning everything's going to come to
a head. So Johnny stops fight. No, Johnny comes by that night,
right, He goes by that nightand he's looking for share and her
mother says, I don't know whereshe is, and she really doesn't,
which is probably for the better.And he goes, well, my mom's
fine and I'm back and I gotto see her, and she's like,
come back for breakfast. So thenin the morning when Loretta gets home,

(01:12:56):
she's like, oh, got somenews. Johnny back and he wants to
see you. Who's coming for breakfastbecause I invited him? And she's like,
why did you do that? Soevery time someone asks in the door,
they all think it's Johnny and we'reall in for a super awkward conversation,
but it doesn't happen right away.So at the breakfast table, we
have mom and dad and Grandpa.I think they get there some point in

(01:13:18):
the case. And then we heara knock and it's Ronnie. Ronnie,
who is roney, Hey, we'retogether now, like I'm here and I
don't remember what he said actually,but now he's there, so okay.
Usually I me and your family andwe're putting all that on the table today.

(01:13:38):
And then we hear another appreciate thatkind of openness. He's not keeping
secrets here. Yeah, And thenyou hear another knock and who is it?
And he's there for tea as well, And the next thing you know,
you have twelve dwarves in your Okay, so our next guess are our

(01:14:02):
aunt and uncle because you're like,hey, remember yesterday when you're supposed to
take the money from our like businessand put in the bank. What happened?
Totally totally Like did you look forthem as well? Why is she
charged putting them in the bank?She was, she was their their money
person. Yeah, luckily this waslike you know, when it's a wonderful

(01:14:27):
life situation. She's like had itand she's like, oh my bad,
here you go. Didn't have tolike, you know, ruin her life
over it. So she's just anaccountant for all of little Italy. Like,
no matter what your business is,she just like goes around doing your
books if the mafia doesn't, andtaking your deposits and putting them in banks.
That's like basically a job. That'sso point I feel like this conversation

(01:14:54):
happens before Johnny gets there. Idon't remember, but he's not there yet.
But yeah, basically, once everyone'saround the table, the mom like
just point blank looks at Cosmo andsays, I know you're having an affair
and you need to end it.And he's just like okay, and yeah,

(01:15:17):
okay, I there's actually a reallynice moment where you know, it's
very honest, right, I mean, she made that choice. She could
have had you know, she couldhave chosen to do the same thing he
did, right, They could havedissolved their marriage further. And that action,
I think prompts her to be like, I'm gonna fight for this and
I'm not going to settle for thiseither, So you know, I love

(01:15:40):
how like I think also the timewith being the moon struck with the brother
reminding them of their love from theiryouth and all that time, it's like
she reminds him of the love thatthey had and calls not on it,
and he remembers that and says,okay, Like it's a nice brief moment.
And there's a whole text where heone of the first lines he says

(01:16:01):
in the movie is I can't sleepanymore because it reminds me too much of
dying. And then we get thesewe get these conversations that she's having and
she finally gets to the idea thathe's chasing women, not because she's he
may not be in love with her, but he's in fear of his own
mortality. And then he has thatwonderful line that afterward he goes, I

(01:16:25):
think he says something to the effectof my life was built upon nothing,
and she goes, well, noit wasn't. And you have that really
great moment of them to understanding thatthis isn't nothing. That we are,
we have this, we have thishistory. I thought, you're right,
Erica. To me, that wasa very poignant moment in a film in
which there's all these really strange emotions, and I thought it was pretty lovely,

(01:16:51):
not the cheating, but the resolutionand the cheating going. Just so,
given our earlier conversation, which Iexpressed my own fear of life,
aging, immortality, and dying,is this going to be me? Am
I just going to keep chasing?Like? Is that my thing? When
I'm I'm just going to just chasemen my whole life, life until you

(01:17:11):
die. That's how it's going togo. Is this my future? And
on? Like the flip side,Okay, you know who are really loyal
though, the five dogs? Butyou have to replace them every fifteen years
too, I know, but there'sgreat loyalty while their lives. Yeah,
while they're alive. My little buddy'sover here, so yeah, I mean

(01:17:35):
it's it's good that they it's yeah, I love it. It's honest,
it's resolved, and yeah, it'sit's a nice moment from give them what
it came from. And then wefinally get the knock that we've been waiting
for, which is Johnny who walksinto the Full Family and we're expecting this

(01:17:57):
scene to be where, uh,Share Loretta breaks his heart says hey,
you know a few things happened whileyou were gone, but instead he goes,
I've got news my my mother survived, and therefore I cannot marry you
because if I did marry you,she would die or some twisted sense of
stupidas yeah, yeah. And what'sfunny is Share is actually like upset by

(01:18:23):
this, and you're like, honey, you just got to get at jail
free card. You just go,you know. And then I think it's
Ronnie who's like, babe, wejust got to go to let's up,
and how does it go? Ithink she throws the ring at him,
yeah, and then he asks forit, and then Ronnie's like, can

(01:18:46):
I have that? And then andthen Ronnie proposes, and given how everything's
resolved and it works out basically foreveryone's best interests were just happy and they're
like, don't worry, Johnny,You're so part of the family. And
then they just have a big mealtogether or something like that, right,
And I enjoyed the old man sayingI'm so confused that, yes, why

(01:19:15):
are they dropping into their champagne tabletsof some kind like some sort of like
I had no idea what that wasbecause they kept doing it. I'm like,
what do you This must be anItalian specific thing. I don't know,
so I'm fine with it, butI'm like, yeah, they're definitely
putting something in their drinks. Icouldn't figure out what that was, some
sort of dosing right there at leasttwo scenes where they did that too.

(01:19:40):
Yeah, yeah, oh, Ijust looked it up. It's sugar cubes.
Wow, there's a superstition apparently aboutdropping sugar in champagne flutes to celebrate
a marriage proposal. Oh oh,okay, I've never heard of that before.
Yeah, I'm never heard it either. It's a not to an old

(01:20:00):
Italian wives tale that dropping sugar cubesinto bubbly wards or champagne wards off bad
luck and keeps the devil away.Okay, So again, in keeping again
as this entire movie has. Ifeel like, despite the guys, who's
this written by? Uh? Ihave no idea, Erica, you did

(01:20:23):
all the research. Norman Jewis wasthe director, but I don't think he
was the right. I got it, I got it, I got it,
I got the Criterion in front ofme. Okay. Directed by Norman
Jewison, written by John Patrick Shanley. Oh yeah, him, all the
Italian stuff I've ever heard. I'mjust gonna say that, like, these

(01:20:45):
are the these are the surnames ofeveryone in the credits who are not the
actors Jewison, Palmer, Shanley,Walkin, Rosenberg, Lombardo. There's one
Hymen and al I want I want. I want the writer to be Weedo
ROSSI put together by Jews, Englishand Irish people and then starrying nothing but

(01:21:12):
Italians so not quite actually Olympia ofGreek background. Yeah, and shares them
money. Right Yeah, I didthink that, right, Okay, So,
given all these specific nods that havehappened, I was like, there
must be one very Italian American writerbehind all of this. Wow. I

(01:21:36):
just looked up who John Patrick Shanleywas, and like he's won an Academy
Award. He's won a full surprise. He's he's pretty well regarded as that's
amazing. He wrote a Doubt thatthe play Doubt. Oh wow, Yeah,
it was doubt a play or amovie first. It was a play
first and then it became a movie. Oh wow. He is in no

(01:22:00):
way Italian. Yeah, he grewup in the Bronx. Sure fine,
trust I guess he's in an AmericanIrish or something who writes Irish American?
Yeah, okay, also always getall of it. He wrote We're back
at Dinosaur Story, and he wroteCongo. He wrote fucking Congo. Really

(01:22:25):
things, that is so many things. Justin wants green drop drink. That's
a that's like a that's a goodrange. Yeah. I wrote animated films
and then I wrote that we gotwe got some stats, uh in this

(01:22:45):
one. So we had on asecond. We had one freak out.
Yeah, one in one hundred andtwo minutes. Not a high ratio,
but that's fine, that's good wecount. It wasn't really freaking out much

(01:23:12):
do we count share slapping the shitout of Nick Cage and that in that
one scene twice? Oh, that'slike, that's more her freak out yeah,
yeah, I'm only counting Nick Agefreakouts. Okay, let's rank this
film on the heavily mandate hair today Gone Tomorrow scale. This modern scale,
drading back to a few now aboutsix months ago, has been used

(01:23:35):
by the Whoarrior version to come toterms with this with his mail path and
baldness and inevitable slow death. Onthis scale, we ranked films along continuum
related to Nick Cage's hair. Thebest films can be christianed the mullet vintage
eighties and early nineties Nick Cage,Business in the Front and Party in the
Back. Meanwhile, the first filmscan be described as the hair piece,

(01:23:57):
low budget, bankrupt desk, ita little sad and forced the star in
movies wearing cheek wigs. Finally,average films to be called the wind blown,
toustled, wind swept the hair youonly get by stealing the Declaration of
Pendants and killing Sean Me. Collectyour chie and rank this film. Lady
Desta, you go first. Okay, Well, I think I already mentioned

(01:24:21):
this earlier, mainly, but Iknow that you think there you were thinking
I might love this movie or likethis the best of the Nicholas Cage movies.
I just thought it was okay.I didn't get bored, I didn't
get like annoyed. It was likepleasant to watch. But I just I
don't know, I don't I'm notI don't really love any of the characters

(01:24:43):
very much, especially the main two, especially not Nicholas Cage, and I
just don't. I don't know.This is not like a love story that
I don't I don't really get it, to be honest with you, I
don't really see, like I likethe idea of of you know, her
being able to find love again.I mean, because she does mention the

(01:25:05):
first time that she did marry forlove but it didn't work because she was
unlucky, and so she just doesn'tthink that's in the cards for her,
and she just, you know,she choose, you know, she decides
she's going to try to settlem Butit's nice that, yeah, she doesn't
have to do that. But Idon't know, maybe just my unromantic side
is like, you don't even knowthis other guy, he's this is not

(01:25:26):
going to give you happiness either,you know, like this, I don't
see this as being like a realthing. I don't see that connection for
them. So whatever. I mean, it's a pleasant film. I liked
the kind of you know, ItalianAmerican community that you're like just engrossed in.
You know. It's just definitely verylike feeling like you're just hanging out

(01:25:48):
with a family and seeing what's goingon. I said, there were a
couple of nice moments. I don'tknow, but but I'll give this a
seven out of ten. Good.Wow, I actually might be one of
your highest rings. Okay, Ican go next. So Moonstruck was definitely
an enjoyable, watchable film. Uh, not my favorite movie. It's it

(01:26:10):
was kind of like vegetable lasagna.It's notice it's nice to see amination to
God and man that it's nice tosee a delving into Italian American culture that
in no way had to do withorganized crime. So it was it was
a pleasant but that's true. Yeah, and we can kind of see the

(01:26:35):
origins of some Nicholas cageisms here.So but I wasn't as interested in all
the subplots, you know, Iwasn't particularly interested in the subplot involving the
professor, for example, or reallyher father's affair. It was pretty much
just the Nick Cage share romance,which was somewhat implausible, and I like

(01:26:59):
the Grandpa with the dogs. SoI'm going to give this one a six
out of ten. We have apoem generated by Geehad dammit future in Bargo
on this concept, it has tobe that in Moonstruck tailso grand Share starred

(01:27:26):
in the Italian American land. Whatis no mobsters in sight? Just loves
pure delight, Nicholas Cage's wooden handhad in hand Share not yet made of
plastic. You see in a heartwarminglook at family and glee. No crime

(01:27:49):
to be found in this joyful surround. Just Moonstruck's Italian lovespree. I love
the I love that that is soself aware of people will think about it,

(01:28:11):
which basically just makes it sound likeit's Mama Mia for Italians. Hey
taking up with the g chat nextFriday. No way. Justin give his
final I said six out of ten. Okay, that's right, right,
I said, yeah, right,that's right. I will go next.

(01:28:34):
I guess if people are okay withit. Yeah, I gave this a
ten ten. I've given every filmthis season. I believe, Yeah,
I believe. Actually I don't thinkyou have. I think I have.
I can't stain, but I will. I'm pretty sure most of them have

(01:28:57):
been, if not the basket doorof it, which system. I viewed
this film as a comedic opera that'sspoken, it has fairy tale elements,
and what I really loved about itwas we have two characters who've been fucked

(01:29:18):
over by random chance, encountering eachother by random chance, and in that
moment they realize that they're perfectly somepatico to each other. And I found
that to be a very charming lovestory. I also like the idea of
doing dumb and crazy things for love, and I recall back when in graduate

(01:29:40):
school, Jana and I are nottogether. We're broken up. She moves
across the country to Buffalo, anduh, Buffalo, Yeah, yeh off
to Buffalo by the way. Butokay, yeah, but you guys know,
I don't know how to and youknow, basically I am a fucking

(01:30:02):
manchild at this point in terms ofmost adult responsibility and spending money and creating
pretense pretext to go to Buffalo tosee her and taking flights there basically once
or twice a month just to bearound the woman of my dreams and the
person who my best friend. Igo about five thousand dollars in debt which

(01:30:26):
I can't pay. And it's sucha dumb, dumb thing that may not
have worked out, but it did. So I like the idea of doing
dumb things sometimes for love, andluckily it worked out for me, and
hopefully it works out for these twolovely couples. And I do am worried
that the kids that they have willend up growing up to be on Jersey

(01:30:47):
Shore, because I feel like that'sthe kind of home life they're going to
have. Okay, so I supposethat puts it on me. Well,
when the stars make you jewel justlike a pasta a fasool, that's samore.
When you dance down the street witha cloud on your feet, you're
in love, but you walk ina dream, but you know it's not
dreaming. Scam me. But yousee Becka no Napoli, that's a mooring

(01:31:15):
because that's the song that opened thisentirely, which is the most obviously stereotypical
Italian. Also, I don't thinkItalians rap that often, so I can't
believe they might be an emerging nichegenre. I mean, look at Gezy
there there Gez. Eventually the ItalianAmericans will get into it and excel as

(01:31:42):
he shows. I don't know.This movie was a little bit confusing in
terms of what it was trying todo. Like I said, a little
bit off the whole time. Itkind of felt like a weird sketch show
where I'm not sure if I'm supposedto wait enough I with anybody ever,
because they all seem kind of annoyedor off put. The scenes they're in.
They seem natural, but they seemnatural in a scene that wasn't written

(01:32:05):
with any point often so I enjoythe fact that we get our first genuine
cage shreakout that kind of defines thegenre of nick cage shreakouts, and that
is the only one throughout the entiremovie. He never again does it,
so it's not like a gimmick.As we said, still seems a little

(01:32:26):
fantastical operatic. It's like it'll bea six out of ten for me.
We will degree to everybody. Ericawas the median. Mmmm. I guess
that's that wasn't remember that was originallyErica's job when we first hired her for
no money. I would like tothank Shane Ivers for allowing us to use

(01:33:11):
his track Tremendium under a Creative Commonslicense. Thank you, one, two,
three minuted palms straight up