#661 - Chase McWhorter - Controversial ex husband stars on hit TV series Secret Lives of Mormon Wives - The Jimmy Rex Show

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello and welcome to another episode of The Jimmy Rex Show.

Speaker 2 (00:02):
Today on the podcast, we have a local legend, mister
Chase mccorder, one of the stars, one of the husbands
of the Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, and I guess
ex husband I should say, but actually, no, you're still married.

Speaker 1 (00:13):
I found out.

Speaker 3 (00:14):
Yeah, technically, yeah, we'll get semantics.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
Well, yeah, we'll get into it here on the episode.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
But if you haven't been watching, season three just dropped
on Hulu and so we got the exclusive interview to
talk about how it's been so far this week for
a mister Chase.

Speaker 1 (00:28):
Dude, welcome to the show.

Speaker 4 (00:29):
Thanks man, stoked to come on. Yeah, it's been a
big week, dude.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
Big week for you guys. What's been the response to
season three?

Speaker 4 (00:36):
You know, I was stoked because you know, obviously Miranda,
it has been. I think people have seen a little
bit more of her and started to realize that she's
like the coolest, chillest person ever and people love Miranda,
and I think that's that's what I knew they would
with time. Obviously, I have a couple of those I'm

(00:57):
in a little bit here and there, and there's a
few scenes I'm either making people mad. That's kind of
my whole thing I think in this in the show.
But it's been good, it's been all right.

Speaker 3 (01:05):
Well.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
It's interesting though, because they try to make you out
to be a villain a little bit, but you're kind
of not. Like I'll give you an example. In season two,
you go to this Halloween party right by the way.
What is with you and draw and Halloween parties? Bro,
I threw a party at my house there a couple
of weeks ago.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
This freaking guy shows up. Three different women at that
party thought they were there with you? So what was
going on? Oh?

Speaker 3 (01:25):
Halloween gets dark for me? Man, I don't know what
it was. It was a tough month.

Speaker 2 (01:29):
It was, yeah, I literally like three different women like
fighting each other and it's like, which one did you
end up leaving with?

Speaker 3 (01:34):
Oh, dude, A sad thing is like most Halloween parties.

Speaker 4 (01:37):
I don't think I remember how the night ends's yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:41):
You know you had a good party?

Speaker 3 (01:42):
Oh yeah, well no.

Speaker 2 (01:44):
On the show, though, it's been It was bothered me
because I'm watching this you kind of scrape by.

Speaker 1 (01:48):
To me and Bro, she's acting like you assaulted her.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
Literally, she keeps bringing it up and it's like, I like,
you gotta be careful when you start using words like
saw like and you can see it on the show
and I really love it, and Miranda kind of went
to baf for you.

Speaker 1 (02:01):
They did because.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
Anybody watching is like, girl, I'm sorry, like he brushed
against you on an accident to get by you.

Speaker 3 (02:07):
And well, that's the whole thing about season two.

Speaker 4 (02:11):
I remember, like that whole Halloween party, which was, by
the way, completely organic.

Speaker 3 (02:15):
There was no set up there. That was just a
shit show.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
But I remember leaving obviously was was charged. I had
just had an document with Taylor. I don't think I
handled it the right way, which you know, obviously talked
to her about later. But yeah, I remember like leaving
that party thinking like, based on to me's reaction, I might,
I might, I might. Am I gonna go to jail?
Like I was like, I don't know how this is
going to look. And thank god they had it on camera,
because yeah, every even everyone now is like, dude, that

(02:40):
that was just like walking past almost as like a
excuse me. It wasn't even like a derogatory I don't know, dude.

Speaker 2 (02:46):
It was literally well and it's tricky because and you know,
I've gotten in trouble for talking about this before. But
and then like, well, the new season, she accuses Mauricio
guy of sexually assaulting her, and a lot of the
women are like, yo, that you're talking about having come
in your mouth afterwards, Like you keep hitting this guy up,
having hour long conversations with him.

Speaker 1 (03:06):
I just hate to say it, but well, because what
it does is you got.

Speaker 2 (03:09):
Women on the show that have really had drama, like
Mikayla had her sexual assault or whatever when she was younger,
and then Macy had physical abuse, and so it kind
of really minimizes the real victims.

Speaker 1 (03:21):
And that's the problem with it totally, man.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
And it's exactly what I think Miranda did a good
job of saying in that episode, I think the penultimate
episode where she's like, it's not I think our whole
thing has always been no one will ever know what
actually happened with her and Marciano or whatever, and what
is we can both things can be true. There can
be like maybe she was flirting with him and then

(03:43):
maybe you know, quickly he crossed the line that she
wasn't actually comfortable with because yeah, like consent is obviously
that's a it's a massive gray area, and it's really hard,
and so you want to be on the side of
believing people that say that happened, but at the same time,
with the data that we already have from how episode
that she still hasn't really ever like apologize or said anything,

(04:04):
you know, worth taking accountability for with regards to that.
It's just hard because you're like, it's tough to believe
you over and over and over again. It gets harder
to believe, and it makes other women who've experienced it,
I think feel a certain way as well.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
So and I watch it, it was just like, we
really do cause all of our own problems, but she's
creating issues in her life where they're just not there.
And I think what happened in her case with the guy,
or at least look not to put words in herround,
but at least part of what happened was whether he.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Sexually assaulted or not. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (04:31):
We like you said, we won't know, but what we
do know is she crossed many lines a hundred married
woman to be texting stuff like that, like if you
were the husband, how would you feel exactly? And she
got caught with her hand in the cookie jar and
she's trying to get herself out of it, and so
she's trying to make it act like, you know, she
didn't do anything wrong, and you're just like, girl.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
It's not. And that's the hard thing.

Speaker 4 (04:51):
Every I think everyone on the cast now has kind
of agreed that, like, it's not so much that we
don't believe you, it's just that we wish that you'd
be able to say that you did a certain thing wrong,
like own up to something well, because you can.

Speaker 1 (05:04):
Americans are very forgiving when you own stuff and for
you know, look.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
At Tiger Woods or I mean Bill Clinton, you name
a million, it's you name them totally if you like,
own the thing you did wrong. I think the problem
right now that everybody has with Donald Trump is he
trying to gaslight any everybody with the Epstein file.

Speaker 1 (05:18):
Sure, it's like bro, hold on a second, Yeah, you
can't tell.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
The economy is great and I just paid twenty eight
bucks for Chipotle, and like, I don't know people are living,
but like you have, like people aren't dumb. So when
you're not owning it and you're gaslighting people, that's really frustrating.

Speaker 4 (05:32):
For it's a hunt it's so true. And I think
a big theme of the show is like accountability. I know,
the essential theme in this season is Jesse's affair, and
obviously that's, you know, whatever your feelings are about that.
She's came on and said like, I shouldn't have done that,
and she's pointed to reasons why she thinks it might
have happened. But I appreciate Jesse because I think she said, like,
I did do this, this is what happened. And I

(05:56):
think if you do that, you admit to what you're
wrongdoing is people can then eventually forgive you. But if
you don't give them the chance to forgive you, because
you keep backing yourself into a corner and never ever
owning anything, it's just hard to like want to be
around someone like that.

Speaker 1 (06:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
I remember one time I did something to really break
or friendship. It was one of my best best friends,
and I realized later what I'd done and I just
went to his house did it was on a Christmas Eve.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
It was a big deal. We didn't talk.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Performance and we were best friends, you know really, and
I just owned it and I just told myself, this
is what I did, and this is what I thought,
and this is why I did it, and this was
what I was experiencing. Dude afterwards, Like we're sitting there
and I said, what else can I do to make
this right? He because you did it? He goes, I
can trust you again, Like you know what you did wrong,
you owned it. Sorry, I can trust you again. And
that was the thing you said. It was like, oh,
it's like, yeah, this dude knows. Because what we don't want.

(06:42):
I don't want to be out and like, have you
embarrassed me? And then you don't even know you've done it. Yeah,
I don't want you to make me feel bad and
you don't even know that that's what happened. It's like,
if you own it, people are pretty.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Forgiven one hundred percent.

Speaker 4 (06:52):
And I think I've, in a small small sample way,
seen that where I've made.

Speaker 3 (06:56):
Mistakes obviously on the show.

Speaker 4 (06:59):
You know me and we're divorced, so while we're working
on a divorce, we're separated. We're just lazy, honestly, but
like our separation came due to mistakes I've made, and
I think that talking about that isn't the most awesome
thing to do, but it's also nice because after people
hear you say that, they're like, oh, you know, you
know what, you can get past it once you'd own it.

(07:19):
And I wish that to me would actually take a
lesson from that, because I think that her and Brett
are cool people. I actually have I knew them dating
back to prior to the swinging scandal. They'd come to
someone Taylor and Tates parties and like they were not
to say that they were swingers at all, because honestly,
that whole thing was blown out of proportion. But I
remember thinking they were cool. And Brett is BYU quarterback,
so we'd always talk about, you know, his experience there,

(07:41):
and prior to the Halloween party, me and him had
a good comp well. Actually at the Halloween party they
cut this, but the first person I talked to there
was Brett and he has a I think a nephew
or a cousin that's a I think he was like
fifth on the Utah depth chart at quarterback last year,
so he probably got some playing time last year. But anyways,
we were chopping it up about that and then the
whole thing happened, and now I feel like they the

(08:01):
whole group, I don't know talk to anyone so I
feel bad because they're cool, but I do think that
they're like, you got to own it at some point
to me, Well.

Speaker 2 (08:08):
It's been fun to watch, Like you didn't come until
season two, obviously, I think it's been fun to see.

Speaker 1 (08:13):
I think we'll ask you why do you think it's
so popular?

Speaker 2 (08:16):
And I think it's so popular because it really does
capture Utah culture, And obviously it's like a dramatic version
of it, right, but it captures You've got like the
women that are very Mormon and they're doing it, and
you've got the ones that are trying to be Mormon
but they're not doing so good.

Speaker 1 (08:29):
And then you got the ones that are pretending to
do it they don't really want to. And then you
got the ones that are doing this but they're at all.
It's like you got a little of everything.

Speaker 2 (08:36):
And then you mix in Taylor, which, by the way, dude,
like she's just such a star. Like I saw it before,
I swear, I like, just I saw her TikTok the
first time I saw it, Dude, I called Sam Munday.
You know, yeah, I was like, bro, you got to
connect me this girl. I got to have her on
my podcast. She's going to be a star. I just
knew it because she had so much presence on video
and uh yeah, so I I just it's so fun

(08:59):
to watch her control roll it and then watch everybody
else like, well, that was the funniest part about last
season is when to me's like it's me or you
and it's like, oh girl, you don't make your place.

Speaker 1 (09:07):
No, she is God bless you.

Speaker 4 (09:08):
I was actually at the gym with Sam today and
I was just telling him, like, Taylor is like your
like your AJ debantsa of like reality TV, Like she's
just the she has everything. When it's colorizing, she's polarizing.
She she'll give you a glimpse of every part of
her like day to day. She's also yeah, she can
I mean she can rage on you. I've been on
the bad side of that a few times. Like not

(09:30):
trying to go back to the bad side of Taylor
because she is like she's she's a powerful person and
but she's also very likable because she owns what she
does going back to talk about it, So I think
that's actually the kind of her superpower.

Speaker 2 (09:43):
Well, dude, Episode ten left us with a little Cliffinger
with you and Taylor bro something brewing there or what.

Speaker 1 (09:49):
Can you talk about it?

Speaker 3 (09:49):
Dude? Yeah, I mean it's funny man.

Speaker 4 (09:52):
Like I I I obviously watched back season two when
that first came out. Season two, I watched the Halloween
episode and that was, you know, first i'd kind of
relived it since it actually happened, and I was so
mad that night that I feel like you kind of
black out a lot of things just because I was
like yelling and you're stressed and there's cameras. So watching
it back, I was like, damn, Like obviously, I felt

(10:14):
like I going into that hadn't seen Taylor in years,
so I was kind of a charged. Really been seen her, yeah,
literally since the scandal basically, So I was like I
had some feelings about that. And then I remember watching
it and like the fact that I was pointing at
her and like just really saying a lot of things condescendingly.
I was like, that was not a good look, and
so I texted her then I just said, hey, you know,

(10:34):
I would love to, you know, to squash this. And
so we met up and you know, they had the
cameras there and stuff, and it is true, like with Taylor,
I have felt like since we had that friendship dating
back to twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, Like I felt like
we have always had I've known her for so long,
and I do actually think that she's really charismatic.

Speaker 3 (10:54):
She's fun to talk to you.

Speaker 4 (10:55):
There's I mean, she said chemistry in the episode, which
I actually agree with, but uh, yeah, I don't know.
I mean, I do think that there's I don't know,
I could. I feel like it's funny because there's already
so much speculation about like what was said, what happened,
and it's like, dude, I've always thought Taylor was really pretty.
She's obviously on the Bachelorette right now, so like, I
don't know that there's a path to any sort of

(11:17):
like situation there.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
I feel like there's wits. It's it's pretty tied up
with Miranda.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
Just go nuts if you didn't know.

Speaker 4 (11:24):
That's the funny thing is, people are like, this is
so disrespectful to Miranda. I'm like, if you haves Miranda,
She's like, I don't give a fuck, Like I don't
care what Chase does. Like she's she's like this guy
doesn't surprise me. Ever, she's a she. I don't think
she'd care, but I also just don't think that's in
the cards because again, actually one of my guys, like
my good friends, who maybe I don't know if he's
been over here at your place, but Dakota, yeah the

(11:46):
last part he was here, right, So like Dakota is
my dude, So like, yeah, I think there's like a
respect thing there.

Speaker 1 (11:51):
But it's definitely not over for him.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
And I actually think, dude, that's my prediction.

Speaker 4 (11:55):
My long term play is that I actually do think
that Dakota and Taylor are thin, and.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
I think the family member thing was too much.

Speaker 3 (12:02):
I don't think anything's too much for those guys.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
You know what's interesting.

Speaker 2 (12:05):
When I was younger, I would see couples that they,
you know, bad things happen or they go through really
terrible things, like because people screw up, dudeeah, people just
fuck up, like that's just life it is.

Speaker 1 (12:14):
And I used to think, like move on, find somebody else.

Speaker 2 (12:16):
But when love is involved, dude, there's a reasons like
all is fair and love and war. It's like, if
you love each other, make it work, figure it out.
I really believe that. Now I've seen so many guys
that came into my coaching program, and dude, some of
these dudes, there's just you know, when we have our
traumas from our youth, we don't know how to handle
it like people do dumb shit. Yeah, we've all done it,
everyone us. And and if you're not willing to look

(12:38):
at that and just go okay, like I still love
this person, and love usually can win if you do that.
Now that being said, both people have to be committed
to working on themselves in order to get through.

Speaker 3 (12:47):
Yeah, And that's that's the answer there.

Speaker 4 (12:49):
It's like there's some work that needs to happen, not
just like Dakota, not just Taylor, and I mean anyone.
Everyone in the show that's for the most part, has
some work to do.

Speaker 3 (12:57):
You know.

Speaker 4 (12:58):
That's kind of probably why the shows has been as
a successful.

Speaker 2 (13:01):
Well, you can see yourself in a lot of the characters,
Like even with the Coda and Taylor, Like, for example,
they're at the.

Speaker 1 (13:08):
Country uh oh yeah, the Western what the hell is
it called the State States Touch Stakes?

Speaker 2 (13:13):
Yeah, And the Coda is innocently talking to some girl
that comes over and Taylor flips the freak out ruins
or and I and I'm like, oh, I've been in
that relationship. And I've also been the guy that like, oh,
when we broke up, I did go like hook up
with someone I shouldn't have and guess what, Like I
get it. That was my trauma, and I wish I
was a better guy in that moment where I'd already

(13:34):
worked through my shit, but my triggers were to go
to that, whereas hers were this. And you get together
and you realize you're a gift in each other's lives. Oh,
it doesn't mean you didn't hurt the hell out of
them too, And so that's where it gets tricky because
there's so much pain involved in it, and I see
that with the coda and Taylor's just they love each
other so much and there's so much pain, And I'm like,
I know exactly what that relationship is because I have
one of those that I've I've had that same relationship.

Speaker 4 (13:54):
Yeah, No, I one hundred percent agree. I having known
Taylor for a long time, seeing the way that I
think Dakota evokes emotion in her, I'm just like, I
know that deep down, you really, really, really really love him.
And I also know that there's been a lot of trauma,
a lot of pain. I know that Dakota really loves her,
So I don't know, like maybe it works out, but
they have to probably both do some work.

Speaker 3 (14:15):
I mean, I need to do work on myself. But
do you work on your stuff right now? Dude?

Speaker 4 (14:18):
I feel like I try, and like I probably should
go a little bit more. I should do a little
bit more with like therapy and stuff.

Speaker 1 (14:24):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (14:24):
Leah's got a breath work class coming up. Maybe I'll
jump into that. I'm trying, man, Yeah, I'm working on it.

Speaker 3 (14:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
What's cool about your generation?

Speaker 2 (14:34):
I mean, you're ten years younger than I am, but
you know, there's a lot of modalities that I mean,
we didn't have these things when I was younger.

Speaker 3 (14:39):
You know.

Speaker 2 (14:39):
I mean it was dude, it was for me. It
was I just I grew up in a setting. And
I think we have a lot of things in common.
As I listened to you on the Weekly Trash podcast,
one of which was when we were younger, I felt
like I was like a really good kid. I wasn't
in the drugs, I wasn't an alcohol but I was
that kid that was just getting in trouble all the time. Yeah,
it's because it wasn't okay in my world not to
be okay. I couldn't talk about my feelings my parents.

(15:00):
That wasn't the relationship we had. And another thing that
you had in common, you said, is like your parents,
you realize you get older and you're like, oh, they
just weren't that in love. I just didn't have this
beautiful love story. I was laughing at how many things
I was like, really do well. Yeah, I think that's
why I related to you a lot. I'm like, shit,
because we butt heads when we first met. Yeah, yeah,
I think it's because we just.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
Are very a lot of commonality.

Speaker 3 (15:17):
Yeah, dude, But I think.

Speaker 2 (15:18):
That's like, you know, when I was young, I didn't
know about breath work. I was the first one that
I ever like. I was just into going to all
these random things and trying to find ways to improve
myself because I thought something was wrong with me, honestly.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
Yeah, And so I discovered breath work.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
And I remember when I brought it to Utah with
my first men's group just four or five years ago. Huh, dude,
there was fifty five guys in the room, not one
person that ever done breathwork. Now, good luck, you can't
find any room without people that doing breath.

Speaker 4 (15:41):
Work and that's it's awesome. The first time I did
it was last year, and it blew my mind. I
had no idea that it was such a powerful thing
you could do just from literally breathing consistently for you know,
the amount of time, and like it's it's great. So
I actually I love that you've brought that, like the
normalized the work that has to go into you know,
individual people. And I feel like I've missed a step

(16:03):
in that because I got married young. What age were you, dude,
I got married at twenty I was barely twenty two.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
There's so much empathy for your situation.

Speaker 2 (16:11):
I know, like you talked about where you had inappropriate
text when you were married and some different things, and dude,
I just had there's a lot of empathy there because
it's like you did get married at twenty two and
you didn't know the world. You didn't know you're doing.

Speaker 3 (16:22):
Like I served a mission too, so I was well
eighteen to twenty.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
Here's the thing.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
It's not an excuse, but it's like, look, I can
I look at my last relationship and I thought I
was ready to be in a relationship, but I looked.
But when we broke up, dude, like the final time,
and I was able to I like to take extreme accountability,
you know, the whole concept. I was like, all right, Jimmy,
what could have done different? And Dude, by the time
I got done, there was twenty seven things I came
up with I could have should have done different? Really,
and I was like, the bottom line is I just

(16:47):
wasn't ready sure and that sucks because I wanted to be.
I thought I was, but dude, I did things that
I'm like, oh, yeah, if I was all in, one
hundred percent all in, I wouldn't have done that. Yeah,
And they feel like I talk about this with my
guys that I coach. There's like red lights, green lights,
and then there's yellow lights, and green lights are like, yeah,
you're good. Red lights you're like, okay, no, I can't
do that. And then there's the yellow lights and those

(17:08):
are the ones that will get you in trouble and
if you haven't committed, like you can do things that
phil innocent at the time, but looking back, I'm like, no,
that was actually a form of cheating. You talked about
this what is cheating on your podcast and you had
a good answer. He said, anything you wouldn't want the
other person to know you didn't show the other person.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
I think it's a great.

Speaker 2 (17:23):
Response because in the moment again I can go back
to that relationship. And it was like, I'll give one
quick example. But I was at this event I was hosting,
and I see this beautiful girl and she's like giving
me the fuck me eyes, you know, and I just
noted it. I was like, oh, yeah, wow, that girl's beautiful.
She was definitely giving me the look.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
I go home.

Speaker 1 (17:42):
A couple hours later, she's I got an Instagram message
from her.

Speaker 2 (17:44):
It was my event, so she knew how to find me,
and she's like, thank you so much for the in
or for having me there. And I loved it, but
there was ten thousand people there. Wasn't like I personally
invited her, but I made a note, Okay, if this
doesn't work out, I'm going to definitely call this girl.
And so when our relationship fell apart, I really hadn't
ever hit her up again. But the next day I
went and hung out with her and screwed up a

(18:05):
lot of things. Like I can take ownership of that,
but I can look back at it now and I'm like,
I probably just wasn't ready sure because.

Speaker 1 (18:09):
I wanted to be.

Speaker 2 (18:10):
But if I really was all in, I wouldn't have
called that girl the next day. I wouldn't have even
have saved her, like the thought of it, I would
have been more all in.

Speaker 4 (18:18):
Well, I love your yellow lights analogy because I really
do feel like that's where I messed up and I
went wrong in my not only marriage but also my
last relationship with Kate, which we talked about on the
you Know Weekly Trash podcast, But it was more of
that you know yellow light.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
And the funny thing is, when you're driving, it's the
same thing.

Speaker 4 (18:36):
You kind of have this moment of like, am I
gonna step on the gas here? Am I going to
slow down? And if you do, you know, you make
the wrong decision, You'll you'll get pulled over sometimes, and
you know, anyways, there's consequences that come with that. And
I feel like the yellow lights thing's a great comparison
because I didn't ever feel like I was going into
it to deliberately cheat on Miranda. But I also think
that in hindsight, I look back and I'm like, yeah,

(18:58):
I don't think.

Speaker 3 (18:59):
That I was, Like, it's an excuse by for.

Speaker 1 (19:02):
Suider myself a cheater, but that was probably cheating.

Speaker 4 (19:04):
And then you have to deal with the like the
I mean, the worst part of it is just is
not is not getting caught. The worst part is not
getting caught. The worst part is realizing that you're, like
I just really hurt someone that they care so much
about and you have to live with that. So, I mean,
that's that's tough, dude.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Well, that's the other hard part because as a guy,
I know I went into this a little bit, you
start to try to deflect or defend it a little
because you don't want to admit that you're hurt the
person totally, and that hurts them even more because now
they feel unseen and they don't think you understand what
you did.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
And I like, well, like again, to go back to
that relationship.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
I was speaking about earlier, she said something once and
it kind of like really jabbed me in the heart,
but she said, I just felt like I was never
chosen by you, And I'm like, damn, because I know
how painful that would be to like, and you know,
it's probably right, Like ultimately I wanted to, but I didn't.

Speaker 4 (19:54):
Maybe it wasn't conscious well, and I think it was
the relationship I needed to like see the chain or
like experience that to get me ready for what, you know,
the one where I will be sure.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
But I look at my siblings like I got most
of my siblings have been married since they were twenty
one and they're still married.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
Wow, like pretty much all of them.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
And so it's like I can look at it they
just like, oh, they just make that choice once. Yeah,
it's like on the mission, like I was never gonna
cook us some random girl. I'd made the decision once
that I didn't cross that line. My sexual energy did
not go out. Yeah, And it's a lot easier when
you're mission right, because sure you're out there, like yeah,
going out all the time. But my point of it is,
like I do think it's as much as like you
just make that commitment and really be all in. And again,

(20:31):
if you're twenty two, you're probably just not ready to
make that.

Speaker 3 (20:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (20:35):
Yeah, a lot of lessons learned, obviously. I think that's
why I try to be I'm really grateful that me
and Miranda have a good relationship still because I do
think so so so highly of her, and I think
that I also wasn't the husband that I told her
I would be, So there's a little bit of guilt
that comes with that. Obviously, that'll always they'll it'll always
be the case. But something that I did want to
I think I mentioned on the podcast, but I just, yeah,

(20:55):
I want to. I want to move forward with being
an asset to Miranda going forward and not a live
but like I was and I had times in our relationship.
So do I feel like I'm ready to do that
right now with someone No, But I think through you know,
like you said, like the the stuff that you can
do to help yourself out. I'd love to get there
because I am a relationship oriented person, like I've always

(21:15):
I've gravitated towards relationships basically my whole life, and I
think it's way more fulfilling when you're in one than
if you're just single and kind of doing the typical single.

Speaker 3 (21:23):
Activity on weekends.

Speaker 4 (21:25):
So I want that, but I also want to be
the version of myself that someone that I really like deserves,
and I don't feel like I'm all the way there.

Speaker 2 (21:32):
Yeah, I mean there's a level of life that you're
not experiencing if you're not doing it with someone else.
I just totally being in a relationship where you really
want to be there just enhances everything.

Speaker 1 (21:40):
Everything's better.

Speaker 4 (21:43):
Yeah, I think that, like it's tough now because I
feel but you've been labeled America's fuck boy. I know, dude,
that was crazy to your Instagram page and it's like
your kids everywhere. I know. It's like, yeah, I don't
know about America's but no, it's funny, dude, because now, yeah,
having having it on that side of.

Speaker 3 (22:02):
Both where it's like I've had the.

Speaker 4 (22:04):
Marriage, you know, kiddos, and then recently been going through
this like single phase and it's like, yeah, probably a
little bit fuck boy adjacent at the very least, you know,
the last few months. So I was a loan up
to that, and uh, it's not even my first time
in your podcasting frankly, you know.

Speaker 1 (22:18):
But like let's just say we had to get rid
of the couches and oh, dude, cut that out.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
No, no, don't cut it out this next time. Give
me less alcohol because I was those I think it
was those jello shots.

Speaker 4 (22:31):
But no, dude, I just I feel like, yeah, like
you said, like it's fun to be single, and I
feel like you need to work on yourself when you are.
But like going back to the relationship, and you said
how you had one that you know, there's nothing more
fulfilling than having like a partner that you want to
do things with and you want to live life with.
So that's obviously still the goal. I just need to
do some of the work. And so you're a good

(22:52):
person to talk to about that, given what you do well.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
And it's look, it's here's one of the things that
with my program because look, there's so many Even when
I was going to start my coaching program, I had
so much resistance because I'm like, I'm not qualified to
do this, Like look at me. I'm freaking at the time,
forty in single and I've got I know, my issues.

Speaker 1 (23:08):
I'm very aware of plenty of them.

Speaker 2 (23:10):
And I'm like, well, but then I'm like, wait, I'm
not telling people or teaching people to be like me.
I do know how to help you connect to yourself though,
and then therefore be able to help you connect to
other people.

Speaker 1 (23:19):
And that's kind of my superpower.

Speaker 2 (23:20):
And so it's like, if I can just stay focused
on that, and I think that's the thing reason why
my program keeps growing is because I've never once been
like be like, man, they all know it, like they
know no part of me is trying to tell people
this is how you need to live your life.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
I'd feel inauthentic if I was doing that.

Speaker 2 (23:35):
But what I think there's so much power in is
just being very aware of like, hey, I am falling
short at these things.

Speaker 1 (23:42):
I'm going to keep trying. I'm going to keep working on.

Speaker 2 (23:44):
I mean, dude, I've already signed up for in the
next three months, i got three different retreats for a week.
I'm going to for different things. Yeah, I'm always kind.
I try to go to five or six a year.
Wow where I'm.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
The student instead of the teacher.

Speaker 3 (23:54):
Oh dude, that's awesome.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
And I just I just believe in, like I think
all this nately have this desire to become the best
version of ourselves. And I don't understand people that don't
have that right, Like people are just like okay, just
like you can do No, you.

Speaker 4 (24:08):
Do, dude, Actually something I wanted to I don't think
I've told you this, man, but like when we this
is probably dating back about a year and a half ago,
when I used to do the whole podcast with that
group of guys.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
I forgot you had a podcast.

Speaker 3 (24:17):
We had a.

Speaker 4 (24:18):
Podcast for a sec and I had a short life.
But yeah, I did take trouble at.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
The beginning of season three. I'm like, what was that
on that podcast? Bro?

Speaker 4 (24:25):
That led to me saying sorry a lot, which has
kind of been my theme right lately. But one of
your guys from your program and I'm gonna I'm gonna
mess up his name.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (24:33):
He came on the podcast and this is to this day, man,
It's it's something that really resonated with me, and I
feel like has has helped me embrace some of my shortcomings.
And it was I think his name is Matt and
his wife blonde and they do like stuff together at Yes,
and he talked about it was so cooilt. I actually
have like written it down a couple of places. I've

(24:54):
considered getting into the tattoo. But his whole thing that
he learned from you was like, your mess is your
message and he kind of said that, and I was
just like, holy shit, that's one of the more profound
quotes I've ever heard. Because when the scandal came out,
obviously it was really embarrassing and it was something that
I wish would just go away, and I wish it
would just.

Speaker 3 (25:11):
Didn't I wish it didn't exist.

Speaker 4 (25:13):
I wish I could bury myself away from anyone that
talked about it, because it was such a reputation hit,
Like it was such an optic hit that I you know,
we put way too much stock into anyways. And it's
funny because now if you look at me and Miranda,
I think the only reason people you go back to
my comments now on me and Miranda's post and people
are like, you got we wish you were guys were
getting back together, and I was like, dude, that's so
crazy because two years ago people were like chases Satan,

(25:36):
like get the hell away from him, Miranda, And honestly,
the answer is probably not either one of those. But like,
it's just funny because I think that us being able
to own up to and me for what I've done
that is that does resonate with people, because, like you said,
everyone fucks up and we all want to point the
finger of like oh this we heard this guy did this,
but no one wants to see the skeletons or show
the skeletons in their closet.

Speaker 3 (25:58):
So I really appreciated that.

Speaker 4 (25:59):
With that, Matt shared that, and I feel like it's
something that has helped me a ton and just being like, dude,
I like, I like you a lot too, because you
are self aware. And I feel like self awareness especially
when you do stuff like podcasts and you you know,
you're a leader of a group. I think self awareness
can sometimes be kind of hard for people because they
try to maintain an image. And I feel like you're
always pretty transparent about yours and that's something that I

(26:20):
look up to because you know, my image has been
tainted a few times.

Speaker 2 (26:24):
And yeah, no, thanks for saying that, you know. Yeah,
I always say life is a beautiful mess, like it
just is. And when you can embrace that, I mean,
you grew up in the same religion that I did.
There's a lot of bad days when you're not living
up to who you're supposed to be. Like I always
felt like I was letting God down. And I was
a good friend kid, dude, I was a virgin into
my thirties. Yeah, Like my first trip of alcohol is
at thirty four, Like I was locked in, Like I was,

(26:44):
I really was, and I look back and I'm like,
I felt so guilty all the time, and so you
have so many bad days, and when you can embrace that,
life is just yeah, your mess becomes your message, or
you're most qualified to help the person you used to be.
I guess what's the number one thing I can help
guys with if they ever start feeling lonely? Dude, I've
been You know how many holidays I've had by myself?
You know how many times I've been like when you're
singing to your forty four, there's a lot of perks,

(27:05):
but there's a lot of bad to it too, Like
you kind of got to pick your path totally. But
I've because of that, I can relate on so many
levels to so many men, and I can help them
in ways that you can't do that unless you've been
in the fight for that lot basically.

Speaker 1 (27:19):
And so it's just like.

Speaker 2 (27:20):
This gift of my life that I have, this has
been my path because it's forced me to look at
so many different things and I've been able to bring
a lot of that to help other people. But yeah,
we have to embrace this thing as a mess. If
you expect things to go a certain way, there's a
lot of pain. It's not going to go the way
you want. It's just not you never thought you'd be
divorced and swinging with your knowers like everything else. And

(27:42):
guess what, because of that, you know many people will
be able to relate to that story. And like, you
know what Chase and Miranda are like, Look how they
co parent, Yeah, Look how well they get along. Look
at how they dealt with this pain and there's trauma
that they had in their lives. And now like you
were a model couple of what it looks like to
be healthy parents co parenting after divorce.

Speaker 4 (28:01):
You know, oh dude, And that means a lot because again,
my parents and you relate to this where they, I think,
optic wise, tried really hard and the generation above us
did this where they like want to maintain this the
look of doing everything right, and that's that's a huge
that's like a huge thing to try to do and
it's exhausting and like you said, we all fall short anyways.
But I think what's nice about me and Miranda is

(28:22):
where the exact opposite, where like my parents, they did
a good job of maintaining the image like we had
I always had it, Like when I got a little
bit older, we had nice house, like nice cars, like
my parents I had, like grew up in an affluent neighborhood.
Always felt like, you know, want some new shoes, get
new shoes. We had that image of like a family.
We all went on missions, you know, so we checked

(28:43):
a lot of boxes. But my parents just didn't didn't
like each other. And I think that like me and Miranda.

Speaker 3 (28:47):
Are the flip side of that, where it's like, dude, our.

Speaker 4 (28:49):
World's been turned upside down based on our my poor
decisions and you know, being involved in that scandal and whatever,
and now it's like, you know what, despite all that,
I still really care about her. I really love Miranda.
She's like one of my best friends. And it's something
that like I really really am grateful for. And it's
it's funny because it's like I would take that, And
I've actually told a couple of friends of mine. I'm like,

(29:11):
you know, what's funny about the show is that there's
a lot of marriages that I just think are because
marriage is hard. I'm like, I would actually take me
in Miranda's relationship even though we're not married.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
Oh bro, if you surveyed the audience, yeah, most of
you guys would be one or two.

Speaker 3 (29:22):
I thought, it's amazing.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
It seems like she's in a pretty healthy relationship.

Speaker 3 (29:26):
Jacob are locked in.

Speaker 2 (29:27):
I'll be honest, though the rest of them And by
the way this is, I was gonna actually talk to
you about this and maybe's a good time to do it,
but no, you're.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
Right though, you guys have a healthy relationship and I
love that.

Speaker 4 (29:35):
And it's like, and it just so tappened that we
had to like rip out the romantic side, uh, because
if we were still trying to make the romantic thing
happen after the stuff I did, like, we'd probably hate
each other. And so yeah, I'm grateful for the fact
that we're so close and so like. I mean, I
stayed with her in New York the whole time she
was doing press and everyone's like, dude, you guys like
hooking up, and I'm like, no, like I would tell.

Speaker 3 (29:57):
You if we were, you know, I.

Speaker 4 (29:59):
Haven't been really about that, no, but like, we're just
friends and I really appreciate that.

Speaker 2 (30:04):
What's going you see the love that she has for you.
I mean, she's gone to bat for you multiple times
on the show.

Speaker 1 (30:08):
I love it. I like watch it.

Speaker 3 (30:09):
I'm like, hell, yeah, you know she's.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
Because every guy wants that right.

Speaker 2 (30:12):
You want your woman to go to bat for you,
whether it's your ex wife or your cur or whatever
it might be. I was gonna say that you can
see the strain that it's been putting on the couples
on the show, and I got to ask, well, okay,
my biggest concern with the show is they're not very
good friends to each other. Let's just call it out
what it is. They're actually really terrible friends. I don't
know how good of friends they actually are in real life.

(30:33):
I think they're decent friends. Are they forced to hang
out or what? Because they're either terrible friends and it's
giving this model. I was with a buddy the other day.
He was getting surgery, and so I flew out to
spend a day with him. And he had his knee
up and needed some help, and so in Colorado and
we watched an episode he never seen it, but really
he greted Mormon with me.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
You know, He's like, all right, let's watch it. What
are you talking about?

Speaker 2 (30:53):
And I was like, I don't know if this is
entertaining because I know everyone, or if it's actually entertaining,
But I want your own opinion and his takeaway has
daughter that's twelve, and he goes, bro, I'm terrified, Like
this is the world my daughter's living up with. I
don't want to happen to like have deal with shit
like this. These friends are terrible. Yeah, and so I
don't know, it looks like it's been really hard.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
Do you think a lot of the women. I don't
think any of them are regredit person I know a
couple of the guys do.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
But what do you think? No, I think that like
most of the girls, Like the girls are truly.

Speaker 4 (31:21):
It's so crazy to say this because like people you
joke about me, I'm like, I I am such a
background to answer in this whole thing, and it's just
because of my proximity to the pretty good. But if
I have a good time, I think it's fun. But like,
the girls are truly, like they're famous. Like you go
to any city and you walk around with Miranda and Leila,
like anywhere I go with them and people are like,

(31:41):
oh my god, I can get a picture. Like in London,
dude with Dakota. People were stopping Dakota in London, like
ten twenty people, and I was like.

Speaker 2 (31:48):
Oh yeah, I shake all over the country, and I
have a like a story that I tell and I joke, well,
I I teach you a lot about how social media
can I tell a story about Taylor of how like
that kind of came together. And I was like, grazer hand,
if you've ever seen this show Secret Lives of Mormon Wives,
and dude, I'll be in Oklahoma or Arizona, whatever.

Speaker 4 (32:03):
And so it's the audience did they walch wild? And
I think that, like, obviously the girls like going into it.

Speaker 1 (32:11):
All.

Speaker 4 (32:11):
There's friendships, like there's little like two groupings of two
or three they're close, and then two or three that
are close, and I think that like they maintain a
cordial relationship I think throughout it. But it's also hard
because to their credit, I mean, they're all pretty girls,
and they all have a massive amount of influence, and
it's pretty easy to get to that point probably and
then just be like I'm too cool for everyone. I

(32:33):
feel like most of the girls do a pretty damn
good job of not doing that. But there's just already
like you get eight girls in a room together and
like lock the doors and give it an hour, and
it's probably gonna be some dissent amongst the group.

Speaker 3 (32:45):
Well, so, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (32:46):
I think it's it's it's toxic for sure, it's kind.

Speaker 2 (32:50):
Of I will say, they're good at causing drama. Oh yeah,
they are really good at creating drama, you know.

Speaker 3 (32:55):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, there's there's a lot of that.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
But you see the other side of it too, that
you see them work through something and they see them
like sit down. One thing I like that they do
on the shot. Whether they plan it or that's just
how these women are, but they sit down a lot
and they talk about it.

Speaker 3 (33:08):
They do.

Speaker 2 (33:08):
My number one thing in life, dude, is if I
have a problem with you, or you have a problem,
let's talk talk about it. I have no respect for
the person that just goes and blabs their mouth about somebody, like,
let's talk. If you don't like me, let's sit down.
If you don't agree with me, let's sit down.

Speaker 3 (33:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:22):
I'll have any conversation anytime. And I think that's one
of one of my favorite quotes. Every guy that I
coach they know my number one quote is the quality
of your life will be directly proportionate to the number
of uncomfortable conversations you're willing to have Wow, it's just
talk it out ninety nine times out of one hundred, totally.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
Yeah, it's why people don't do it.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
Yeah, but a ninety nine times of one hundred, you
get to a place where like, alright, I can at
least see where they're coming.

Speaker 4 (33:43):
Yes, one hundred percent. Yeah, And I think the girls
have done a good job of that. I do appreciate
that they I think they all are trying, for the
most part to make.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
The group work.

Speaker 3 (33:52):
But it's hard because there's.

Speaker 4 (33:54):
I mean, obviously there's going to be egos, there's relationships,
there's marriages, there's other things going on. So dude, that's
I tell Mirand all the time, Like I feel like
we have a get out of jail free card because
we are co parents, but we're not tired romantically. So
there's just not a whole lot they can do to
make us like there's nothing here, you know, there's only so.

Speaker 1 (34:14):
Much drama that can cause.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Right, So, how do you because your family still active Alds,
still Mormon, and which is kind of funny cause about
it seems like maybe two thirds of the characters aren't
really active Alds, but they're still Mormon. Yeah, I like
to say to people because I grew up Mormon, I've
never removed my records. Maybe I will one day.

Speaker 1 (34:30):
I haven't decided yet.

Speaker 2 (34:31):
But like when people are like, are you still a
member of the church, I said, no, but I'm Mormon.
That's my heritage, that's my culture, right totally. So I'm
totally and I'm being Mormon, but I'm just not a
member of the church. How did your parents take it when? Well,
I guess first with the swinging scandal, Like what was
that experience, bro when.

Speaker 4 (34:47):
All of a sudden you're all public everywhere rough Man,
because leading up to that was I was. I mean,
we were maybe a little bit inactive. We weren't going
to church like every Sunday, but we were still kind
of like I still if you asked me, i'd be like, yeah,
I'm Mormon, you know. And I remember kind of going
through a faith deconstruction there where I was like, you know,
we had our first son or our first kid, and

(35:09):
I was like, Okay, am I going to do this.
I don't want to half ask this. I mean they're
going to do it all the way. Go get a
calling and like go to church, or like if I
don't believe this.

Speaker 3 (35:18):
I'm just not going to do it.

Speaker 4 (35:19):
And anyways that, like, while I was going through that,
I was didn't tell my parents I want to talk
about it, because yeah, they're very, very into the church.
And then the swinging scandal comes out and I was like,
oh God, Like, not only do my parents not know
that I drink or that I smoke, they also didn't
anticipate that I was, you know, hooking up in the
shower with Miranda while Taylor and Taylor over here and

(35:41):
like do whatever, like swinging. They make it sound like
it's a huge orgy party, which it wasn't, but at
this point kind of wish it was.

Speaker 1 (35:47):
By the way, let me ask me a quick question.

Speaker 2 (35:48):
And it sucks being misunderstood, especially for the first time
if you haven't experience date at a high level, Like
I feel like I'm a very misunderstood person and tell
people get to know me, and so it can be
kind of threatening when you hear people publicly they just
totally misunderstand you.

Speaker 1 (36:05):
Yes, And that whole thing feels like, oh, I can't
only imagine.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
How misunderstood you. It was so different like having talking
to you. It's very different than what was perce.

Speaker 4 (36:12):
Such a departure from what happened, But at the same time,
it was like, yeah, there was some weird stuff going
on for sure, but we weren't just having orgies every Saturday.
But like it was tough because yeah, my parents immediately
are like, whoa like you? That's a lifestyle that we
don't condone. You know, you've been taught not to do
those things. And so the silver lining is as I
ended up being able to like it was kind of

(36:32):
the push that I think I needed to eventually have
the combo with them where I just said, you know what,
for me, I don't think this is for me, Like
I've actually made the conscious decision to remove my name
and step away from the church. It's not something that
I would ever push my brother into or my sister,
Like I want them to do whatever they want to do.
But for me, I think it's the right move. And
it was tough for I think both my parents to

(36:53):
hear that.

Speaker 3 (36:53):
My mom.

Speaker 4 (36:56):
Got over it really fast and like we're really good friends.
My dad has a hard time with that still because
he's again if you go back to his childhood, like
no dad eight siblings grew up with no money, and
they like the missionaries knocked on my hit my grandma's doors,
just smoking a cigarette, and like they converted, and it
like worked for him. You at the BYU became a
pediatric dentist and like his whole life is kind of

(37:17):
worked out because I think and he gives a lot
of credit to his faith.

Speaker 3 (37:20):
A mission it gave.

Speaker 1 (37:22):
It gave him like balance, it gave him a base.

Speaker 4 (37:25):
Yeah, it gave him like a path and like he
didn't have a dad, So like I gave a lot
of a lot of empathy for my dad because I'm like, dude,
it worked for you. It's also okay for me to
say that, like it doesn't really work for me because
I had a different up ring than he does. But
uh yeah, I think that they. I mean, now it's
been a couple of years and they just know kind
of where I stand. But at first it's hard, man,
It really is, like the Mormon culture is. It's funny

(37:47):
because like you said, it's captured really well in the show,
where there's just so many different levels of belief within
friend groups.

Speaker 3 (37:53):
Like there's you know, Macy and Jacob I think go
to church like pretty regularly.

Speaker 4 (37:56):
Yeah, they're active and like, then there's you know, there's
just seeing Jordan. I don't think are they probably wouldn't
say they're Mormon anymore. I'm not really sure. And then
there's me and I'm like, I my name removed, but
I grew up Mormon. And so it's funny because that
is Utah, Like that is that's this area where it's
like there are people that go to church on Sundays
and they're still drinking with the people on Fridays that
are not more and it's just this huge like and

(38:17):
I think that's why it's such an interesting, like this
is a hotbed of relevancy right now with you know,
the housewives and the Secret Lives and so it's just interesting.
But it's definitely, yeah, the the church influence is something
that affects everyone.

Speaker 3 (38:29):
So yeah, I Uh.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
One thing I love about Utah it's just the people
here are just great people. I love Utah, unapologetic about it.

Speaker 3 (38:37):
I love you.

Speaker 1 (38:38):
Every time I leave, I.

Speaker 2 (38:39):
Just want to come back. I'll give an exampt. Dude,
I was a couple like two months ago. We're doing
our fantasy football draft. I just moved into my new
house like six months ago. Huh, and like, God blessed
these neighbors, Like they've you know, built these houses and
they're probably just like this nice quiet I have a
quiet neighborhood. Yeah yeah, And this single guy moves in
and dude, I throw parties first two months I'm living here,

(39:01):
you know what I mean, pull cludging and stuff and
like big parties a couple hundred people and my neighbor
in the back of my house.

Speaker 3 (39:07):
I'm like, I need to go meet this guy.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
Apparently he came over at one of the parties, but
I always nowhere to be found and probably met George.
So dude, it was funny because there's this girl that
I was kind of seeing those making us chili and
for me and my buddies as we're doing our fancy
football draft, and she was like, she's I got to
go to my car and grab some and then like
a minute goes buy and I hear a knock on
the door and I thought it was her, so I'm like,
come in, and I'm like, what are you doing?

Speaker 1 (39:32):
Come in?

Speaker 2 (39:32):
And I go open the door. It's my neighbor. It's
my neighbor, and dude, he's standing there and he's like,
I just want to meet you. He had like some
non alcoholic cider, like a wine body and uh and
I'm like, god've been what I mean, He's like, Hey,
we're gonna go shoot guns on Saturday.

Speaker 1 (39:48):
If you want to come, it's the other's corn. And
I was like, how cool is this?

Speaker 2 (39:51):
Like this guy all I mean, you could judge me
for already in a few months, like holy cow, this
guy's gonna ruin the neighborhood. This guy's a mess, Like whatever,
you know, I need whatever. But and he was just
like so cool. And he just was like no, like
you're welcome, we want And I was doing an event
with my men's group that weekend. I was like, hey,
I got an event with these guys I coach, but
invite me next time, And like how cool is that?
Like that's that's Utah.

Speaker 3 (40:11):
No, it really is.

Speaker 4 (40:12):
And that's like anytime when people try to dive into
like the negatives that come with the Mormon influence, like
because we can talk about that too, but there really
is a side of like people are very kind and
people are giving like shirt off in your back, Like
there's a lot of salt of the earth people in Utah.

Speaker 3 (40:26):
And like you said, I I fucking love. Utah, I
don't think I'll do it.

Speaker 2 (40:29):
I look, no matter how you're raised, you're gonna have
some trauma, right, And like, I know the things that
I've had to work through because of the way I
was raised, and I had a lot of shame and
things over like sexual things for sure, Like every experience
I had with a girl up till age like thirty
three or thirty four, there was shame instead of love.
I was trying not to screw up or I'm going
too far and now I'm feeling guilty. And so was like,
it's a really awful way to like try to date

(40:50):
somebody because it's just a lot of negative feelings and
it's very selfish.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
Because you're worried about what you're doing.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
And doing confident totally, and so it cauld like I've
had to work through that, and I know it's messed
with me, but dude, I'll take that trauma all day.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
Wow.

Speaker 4 (41:02):
You know over some other stuff like where people like
grow up and it's like bad neighborhoods.

Speaker 2 (41:07):
Or stuff you like, Yeah, how many kids go to
bed every night and they like can hear gunshots? Like
literally half the country literally there was a guy from
New York. He played football for bou Black guy comes
out here and somebody asked me.

Speaker 1 (41:17):
We were together.

Speaker 2 (41:18):
He was in my men's group and somebody asked him
in the group once They're like, dude, this is it
weird beating in Utah?

Speaker 1 (41:21):
You know, like is are you like? Is it just
like the culture being weird.

Speaker 2 (41:24):
With you know, because he wasn't he never baptized into
Mormon church or anything, but he was here, and he goes,
are you kidding me?

Speaker 1 (41:30):
He goes, bro I grew up. I go he goes.

Speaker 2 (41:32):
Every night I went to bed, I didn't know if
like I was going to wake up next day. I
didn't know somebody was gonna break in my house. We
had gunshots out the window every night. Yeah, he goes,
I move out.

Speaker 3 (41:40):
Here, he goes.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
All people want to do is like, take care of me,
give me free stuff like this. So he goes, I
love your daughter.

Speaker 3 (41:48):
I love.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
People need to hear that.

Speaker 2 (41:51):
No.

Speaker 4 (41:51):
And I have a soft spot too for the whole thing,
because I think when I left the church, I was
a little angry for a while. But you really you
look at Mormons just like any religious group, and you're like,
they're just to do what they think is the best
and disagree with whatever, because I have things that I
don't really agree with. But it's like the end of
the day, I know that if I whenever I see
the elders coming by, I'm like, dude, I've been there. Man.
Like you're just a good kid trying to serve, probably hungry,

(42:14):
like you probably miss your mom, Like I know exactly what.
You're just trying to help people at the age of nineteen,
which is very rare, Like nineteen year olds don't give
a damn about anybody with themselves.

Speaker 1 (42:22):
Bro. It's it's a cheat code of live in that mission,
it is.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
But it's funny.

Speaker 1 (42:25):
We have a guy in my men's group. He's he's
from the Midwest.

Speaker 2 (42:28):
He's from like Missouri, super Christian, heard about me through
real estate, joined the group, like, loved it so much
that he moved to Utah, so he lives here.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
Now.

Speaker 2 (42:36):
Wow, falls in love with this girl at BYU. Bro,
he's actually getting baptized on Saturday. Oh dude, into the
Elios church and it's I love it. I told him, well, hey,
I love it because he's just such a good kid.
But I was laughing because people that don't know me.
They just know that I left the church. And so
like I like, there was in my first men's group
there was a guy who stay president called him in
and he's like, hey, I'm really worried, like is this

(42:57):
guy going to try to get you to leave the church?

Speaker 1 (42:58):
And it couldn't be further from not at all.

Speaker 3 (43:01):
No.

Speaker 2 (43:02):
So I was joking with this kid. I'm like, bro,
because he's like, will you come, I'm like, are you kidding?
I'm making sure everyone comes, Like we're all gonna be there, bro,
And it was so funny and I was like, dude,
this is actually really good marketing for us because so
many people think I'm trying to get people to leave
the church.

Speaker 1 (43:14):
Dude, a hardcore Christian to join.

Speaker 4 (43:16):
Hell, yeah, this is great And like yeah, like you
like that's that's totally too yeah, And I do you
feel like you are misunderstood? And I feel like that's
why I also like you toube because I feel like
I am. But like, yeah, I can't imagine you ever
being like hey, you shouldn't join this religion because.

Speaker 2 (43:29):
Like you said, I think everybody goes through like a
deconstruction of their faith, right, And I think I was
in the privileged place if I didn't have a single
decision in my life that was irreversible because of my
membership in the church. So what I say to people,
I've actually like counseled a lot of people that like
have left and they seem bitter because they come to
me and that all the time.

Speaker 1 (43:48):
They're like, you're not bitter, Like what did you do?
How'd you do it?

Speaker 3 (43:50):
Yeah, And I teach you a couple of things.

Speaker 2 (43:52):
I said, Well, number one is like, if you're going
to blame the church for everything wrong in your life,
you better give it credit for everything right totally and
ultimately I kind of like where I'm at in live,
so ultimately, like I'll take it right. But then another
one is like, if you fight with your parents, this
is actually I tell people this all the time too, Like.

Speaker 1 (44:07):
Imagine being the parent. Your dad is a great example
of this.

Speaker 2 (44:10):
You've done everything you possibly could to help give you
the best life you could, and you truly believed in
your soul one hundred percent that being in the church
was the way to do it. And like you said,
it works for maybe eighty percent of the people. For
I think for twenty percent of us it doesn't. It
just doesn't work and for one reason or another.

Speaker 1 (44:25):
And like so for your dad, if you leave.

Speaker 2 (44:27):
And you start telling them all the reasons that you
left and being all pissed about it, and you're like,
you know, you ruined my life or what. Because a
lot of kids they do that think about the pain
that parent has to have, right, And so you've created
a situation where they can't accept you leaving because the
amount of pain it causes them, Like their brain literally
won't let them go there.

Speaker 1 (44:45):
That's a great So they fight you on it, whereas
if you go to them.

Speaker 2 (44:48):
So this is the advice I get people to say,
is I go to your parent and say, hey, I
just want I don't think i've ever thanked you for
raising me in the church, because even though it's no
longer like my path, it was right for me till
it wasn't. Yeah, and I'm just grateful that you raised
me with so much love and tried so hard to
give me the you know, a good life.

Speaker 3 (45:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
When you do that, you immediately the parent goes, oh
my gosh, they don't think I screwed up.

Speaker 1 (45:11):
Yeah, and it's so true, Like that's true. I look
at it. I was like, God, thank God I was
raised in the church, Like, who knows?

Speaker 3 (45:16):
You know, Oh, dude, that's such a good point.

Speaker 2 (45:18):
I don't think I couldn't have been a good person
out of it, but I know that it worked this way.

Speaker 1 (45:21):
It works, like I'll just take it straight upward going.

Speaker 2 (45:24):
To your parents and saying that this one girl, she
was so bitter and she's like, my dad tried give
me a blessing.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
I go stop, I go, let me just paint you
a picture. I was like, why not let him do
the damn blessing?

Speaker 2 (45:33):
I give you bless Like who cares if if nothing
else it's a father's blessing, Well, I think it alone
is worth something.

Speaker 1 (45:38):
He doesn't have to have any pray let or special
power like.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
A father's bless an act. It's an act.

Speaker 4 (45:42):
And I really I like that you said that, man,
because I do think that I had some conversations that
were again out of anger or resentment and just like
feeling like, oh, I wish that I could have take
all this back because I don't believe anymore. I look
at it now with my parents and I'm like, you're right.
My dad and my mom raised me in the church
literally because they thought this is the best thing for

(46:03):
us to do for him, and if they would have
thought something.

Speaker 3 (46:05):
Else was better, they would have done that.

Speaker 4 (46:07):
And so it's not fair for me to sit here
and be like, well, I'm mad at you now because
you didn't raise me perfectly, because I'm not raising my
kids perfectly, and I adjust things based on what I
think they could have done better. And I think that's
like the refining process of parenthood. Is like Brooks when
he grows up, he'll do things with his kids that
he's like, I wish my dad did this, you know, but.

Speaker 3 (46:24):
Like, yeah, I really like that.

Speaker 4 (46:25):
That's a great perspective too, because I think we should
be a little bit more grateful about our parents trying
to raise us, like raising kids in a religion's heart,
Like I think about the Sundays they have to get up,
like everyone's getting meetings.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
In my family. I don't know how they did it.
We did, We didn't miss it.

Speaker 4 (46:39):
That's insane. Like as two kids, to me, I'm like
anything more than two, I'm like, I don't know, you
deserve an award. But like getting kids to church, like
doing the sacrifices that come with their callings like my
dad was always like doing meetings and stuff, and it's like,
you know what, that's a worthy pursuit. In my opinion,
I think we should give them grace because they didn't
know all the access to information that we'd end up having.

Speaker 3 (47:01):
And maybe for them like my dad, now I don't,
there's nothing that I would. I would never want him.

Speaker 4 (47:05):
To leave the church same because it's so good for
him and it's such a foundational piece of who he is,
so it would just not it wouldn't be him if
he like were to leave. And I want him like
I don't want to impose my beliefs on him, and
that's simply what I'm asking him to do with me.
And he's I think he's done a decent job of
it where it's like I don't want to believe it,
I don't want to follow it. I want you to
do it. Though, So I think even.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
Like for people that live just like communicate it like, hey,
like this is what I enjoyed, this is what I
like because all of a sudden, you know what I mean.
It's like like I told that girl with the blessing
of her dad, I said, I go, and I could
tell she really loved her dad. I'm like, you guys
are close. She goes, yeah, but just this thing has
really come between us. I said, if you could give
your dad his favorite dream car, like it was gifted
and you could just create that, would you do it?
She's like, of course, Like how happy would that make him?

(47:47):
She's like, oh my gosh, so happy. I go would
it be happier for that car? Or if you went
to him and asked him to give you a blessing?
She's like, shit, I'm doing it tomorrow. And she did,
and she was just in tears. Dude, she called me.
She's like, that was the best experience ever.

Speaker 4 (47:59):
Like, yeah, Another way to look at that is like
it's some if someone from like yeah, if someone from
like the Buddhist religion came up to you and said, hey,
I'd love to bless you with however they do it,
it's like would you would you turn them away.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
With some kind of funny on that.

Speaker 2 (48:11):
I go to all these different countries, you know, and
so when I go to like Indonesia, did the Buddhist
things right?

Speaker 1 (48:16):
Or when I go to.

Speaker 2 (48:17):
Saudi Arabia, we went into the Holy Mosque and we
did their prayers and stuff. Well, I went to uh
freaking Jerusalem and I went to the wall and like,
I don't know if you know like how closely fall politics,
but basically every politician that's bought.

Speaker 3 (48:31):
By how they go and kiss the wall and it's like.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
It's like a humiliation ritual basically. Oh yeah, it's a
way to like basically pledge that they're part of.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
The swamp essentially.

Speaker 2 (48:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, so you can tell who's bought by,
like if they're well. And I'm like, thank god when
I went it was the old I didn't. It just
felt weird to kiss the wall. So I just have
a picture of me standing like with the whole behind me.
But I'm like that picture is going nowhere. Like I
was so innocent. I was just wanted to experience this culture,
you know.

Speaker 3 (48:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (48:57):
Yeah, And I just think it's so funny because like
I remember on my mission, someone was like I remember
one time we were someone from our reward or something
was in the hospital and they're like, hey, can the
missionaries go and can they give him a blessing? And
we're like, yeah, obviously that's what we do. So we
went over there and give a blessing. And then I
think over the neighboring room was a man from another
religion and like I can't remember, and he came in
and he was like, oh, is it okay if I

(49:18):
if I give him a blessing? We're like, yeah, of course, dude,
Like it's more blessing.

Speaker 2 (49:22):
How one of the guys in my group who's super
lds it's a couple of years ago, but he asked
me to give him a blessing and I didn't do
like in the name of the one, I just can't,
but I gave him a blessing.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
Yeah, he wanted me to do it.

Speaker 3 (49:34):
Yeah, like unblessed.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
I know where I'm at with God, Well do it?

Speaker 4 (49:41):
That whole act thing is like whenever my dad gave
me a blessing, you know it, did it have this
magical I don't know.

Speaker 3 (49:46):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (49:47):
Probably I probably don't believe that it did.

Speaker 4 (49:48):
But the fact that your dad is like the intention
is just like I love you so much and I
want to conjure up whatever I believe in, like vibes
and manifesting, Like I do believe in that. So if
that's part of it, Like, yeah, I mean, who cares,
you know, I agreed.

Speaker 2 (50:03):
Dude, I was shifting angles here in a little bit.
Your brother is dating Layla, who used to date you,
bro brother.

Speaker 1 (50:11):
What's going on there, dude?

Speaker 3 (50:12):
It's funny. Uh yeah.

Speaker 4 (50:14):
Me and Layla kicked it like a couple months after
me and Randa divorce. Is really really fresh. And it's
funny because she had a friend and then me and
Mason met up with her and her friend at the
bar downtown and we just kind of hit it off,
and I thought Leila was super cool. We kind of
hung out for like a month. I don't think it
was a whole lot longer than that. And it's super

(50:34):
funny because yeah, yeah, you see it in the in
the third season when I go to her birthday party
and we kind of squash our beef, which again, my bad.
And then Mason's there and he's kind of like fresh
out of a relationship and she's asking him about it,
and then they've been dating ever since and they're like, yeah,
they're like super super they're always together. I never see masonnymo,
so they're like always together, and I like stoked for him.

Speaker 3 (50:55):
Was super cool.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
Is that weird to be brothers with your brother?

Speaker 4 (50:58):
I don't think so people asking like, you know what
being from Rexburg where there's like four people.

Speaker 3 (51:04):
That.

Speaker 2 (51:05):
Yeah, well, like the last party I had at my
house there was three girls I used to date at
the party. Yeah, like that we had, you know, into
my relationship with for a long time. And I'm like
sitting there. I barely talked to him at the party.
It's not weird, no, just like guys are hitting It's
just we live in a small community.

Speaker 4 (51:20):
It's a man, it really is. And I felt for me.
It's never been weird. I mean, remember Mason her started talking.
He was kind of like, well, and I was like, dude,
I can do your thing. I think Leilah's cool. I
think she's really funny. I'm actually glad that she got
more airtime this.

Speaker 1 (51:34):
Well, she finally kind of she kind of broke up.

Speaker 4 (51:36):
Yeah, and she talks about how she I think she
was going through a lot in the first season and stuff.

Speaker 3 (51:40):
But like, Leila's hilarious.

Speaker 4 (51:41):
She's actually really fucking funny, really really good humor, and
her and Mason are awesome, and she's a really good
mom and yeah, dude, she's she's awesome. So I shipped
the whole thing for sure.

Speaker 2 (51:52):
Well, that's cool too that, like, you know, one of
the benefits of being a very social person, he seems
a little bit more reserved than you, maybe just on
the show.

Speaker 3 (52:00):
Yeah no, I think Mason's a little bit more like
a little quieter and probably.

Speaker 2 (52:03):
But what I was going to say is like one
of the cool things about being super social is you
just introduce a lot of people. Sometimes that comes with
the negatives and that comes with the positive, but it's
really cool when stuff works. Like my favorite thing about
my men's group is I see these dudes doing life together.
Like that's every single day I pull up my Instagram,
there's a group of four to ten dudes sometimes with
their spouse is like doing stuff. They're doing life and

(52:24):
it's my favorite thing by far. Of the whole thing
is just like, what's the value of creating a situation
where somebody meets their best friend?

Speaker 3 (52:31):
Oh dude, it's it's it's priceless.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Meets the person they're dating.

Speaker 3 (52:34):
App Yeah, no, that's a priceless thing.

Speaker 4 (52:36):
And that's really another thing that's cool is that when
you create a community of people, because so many people
I think that's a core need is community, And that's
why I think if you really get down to like
a baseline layer of what I like about churches is
the community aspect. And so I like that you've done
that because a lot of people just need especially when
they're going through divorce, so they're going through anything that's hard,
financial turmoil. If you just had a friend group that

(52:57):
you felt like you could talk to and like when
I went through my divorce, dude, I lean on my
friends really heavy. And so yeah, the fact that you
create that is I think massive.

Speaker 2 (53:06):
One of the things, like, for example, we talked a
little bit about being missunder said, I'll give you an example,
like one of the parties I threw this summer. The
whole reason I want to throw the party, one of
my guys that I coach was going through a divorce
and he kind of got I mean destroyed is the
word I'll us. But his ex wife was already dating
somebody knew and they were both still living together and
it was just kind of messy, and I was like, dude, let's.

Speaker 1 (53:26):
Throw a party.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Let's get over here, and dude, I walked out during
the party. And this is like, my heart is huge.
But also like sometimes I get confused on what is
sure or bad, but I'm just like, he's in the
hot tub, he's got like a beer in his hand,
there's like six girls in there with him, and he's
just you could just see. And he told me the
next day he goes, I know, I know I'll be okay,
and it's like people might see me Jimmy's in dejitner,
but I'm dude to me, is like, I love that ship.

(53:52):
That is so many of those experiences. I'm like, if
I can help him know that he's gonna be okay
when he didn't know that yesterday, then I'll take people
misunderstanding me being a fuck boy or a degenerate, whatever
you want to call me.

Speaker 1 (54:02):
You know what I mean, I.

Speaker 4 (54:02):
Don't care, dude, and I love that man, because it
really doesn't you. The less you put stock into what
the you know people are saying, the better obviously, And yeah, doing.

Speaker 3 (54:12):
That for your guy again.

Speaker 4 (54:13):
When I when I had my divorce, it was really
tough because I had my guy friends, but it was
like winter time. It's like the January February, that like
really rough stretch in Utah where it's like dark and it's.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
Winter already. You've gotten the whole winter. You have to
February March. I'm gone, like the whole because.

Speaker 3 (54:30):
It's so depressing.

Speaker 4 (54:31):
And it was like that compounded with the fact that
I was getting divorced, and then I remember just like
every every free moment that I had that I didn't
have my kids, I actually ended up being like with
my guy friends, whether it was just like watching a
game at the break or we're you know, hanging out
at someone's house.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
And it's so it was so crucial.

Speaker 4 (54:48):
To me being like, oh, I'm gonna be fine because
if you just in moments like that, if you're just
sitting by yourself.

Speaker 2 (54:52):
Well, and the problem is when you're in that spot,
you don't reach out like you need a guy like me,
a buddy that's like, come on, we're going out, Hey,
come on, We're going to this party. I went to
a Halloween party again a couple of weeks ago. It
was the day after Halloween, but the dress up one
yeah yeah, yeah, really good party.

Speaker 4 (55:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (55:10):
Anyways, and Aaron and that party yeah yeah, but I
didn't even really want to go.

Speaker 1 (55:14):
It was Game seven of the World Series, that's right.
So I'm watching the game.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
I'm dressed up watching the game because I was like, okay, guys,
as soon as this is over, we're good.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
But I know it's one of the best parties all year.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
There were like two male models and they're gay, so
that they invite every girl in this party.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
It's like everyone goes crazy.

Speaker 1 (55:28):
It's a great party and great costumes. It's very rare.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
I go to a party and I'm like, hell, yeah,
this is this is done right, and they always do
it right.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
Really.

Speaker 2 (55:35):
So anyway, so finally the game Man's Extra Innings and
it's like eleven eleven thirty and I'm like, okay, but
I had two guys that have recently gone through a
divorce with me.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
I'm like, guys, let's go. I got this party and
to the head time of their lives.

Speaker 2 (55:46):
The one guy's gotten some girls numbers and ran into
some old friends and it's like again, it's like, you
need a guy that's going to be like, come on,
we need to get out, we need to go to
social Yeah. I've kind of just taken on that role.
I've realized a long time ago. If you sit around
waiting for people to come to you, you know, nothing's
gonna happen then. But if you could be the guy
that shows up for those other people, Like it's it's

(56:06):
a pretty cool position to per dude.

Speaker 4 (56:08):
Yeah, that that actually has like long, long impact on people,
So I think that's really cool.

Speaker 1 (56:13):
Well, dude, Season four is already filmed, right, that's kind
of weird how they do.

Speaker 3 (56:16):
It They already cut.

Speaker 4 (56:16):
Yeah, Season four is done, man, they're uh they got
a few pickup scenes I think they're doing, but like,
for the most part, that's done.

Speaker 3 (56:22):
I think that comes out in like.

Speaker 2 (56:23):
March, so they're doing like every six months, and I
think so yeah. I mean it's like their number one
show now, so.

Speaker 4 (56:28):
It's still I just checked today because Miranda was talking
to me about it, and it's number one on Hulu.

Speaker 3 (56:32):
It's crazy.

Speaker 4 (56:33):
I just think that's wild, Like it's it's awesome, stoked
with the girls, but I'm also like why, like you know,
like people.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
Are fascinated by the culture they're fascinated by. I mean,
the women do a great job of being real with stuff,
and then it's driven. It's got star power.

Speaker 3 (56:47):
You know, it's cool.

Speaker 4 (56:48):
So I ride that pony while they can you get
paid or what do you get paid?

Speaker 2 (56:52):
I don't really get paid, man, I think you did
because you're the only one that's come on the podcast permission.

Speaker 3 (56:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
No, I've had like four other ones like that, like
Leila came on and Taylor came on, but a couple
of days that want to but they got to get permission.

Speaker 1 (57:04):
Oh really, it's just kind of awesome.

Speaker 4 (57:05):
I mean I think that I got I mean I
got paid a little bit for the last one, but
a little more. Bro, You're well, did I need your
negotiating strength because I feel like I'm just like, I'm
background dancer guy and they're like, hey, we need you
and we want to piss people off and crash a party.

Speaker 3 (57:18):
But I don't know, we'll see I.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
Like it, dude. Well, thanks for coming on, man, I'm
sure we'll have many more fun times.

Speaker 4 (57:24):
Thanks for having me. It's it's been a blasting big
fan of the show, appreciate you.

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#661 - Chase McWhorter - Controversial ex husband stars on hit TV series Secret Lives of Mormon Wives

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}#661 - Chase McWhorter - Controversial ex husband stars on hit TV series Secret Lives of Mormon Wives