March 27, 2025 • 55 mins
What are the motives of my heart? With Meri Duarte In the latest episode of "The Kay Wats Podcast," Kay interviews wife mom, and author to Church Healed Meri Duarte. Kay and Meri share her journey through ministry and motherhood. Discussing the complexities of the church and the hope we find in our relationship with Jesus. Meri offers personal testimony of how she overcame idolatry of titles and positions and how she encouraged others to forgive and find community. They share examples of how being in the church as Jesus exemplified is the best way to honor God.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey guys, welcome to the KOs podcast. I'm your host
Kashawn Watson, but you know me as Kawats.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
This is the place where we chat about the questions
that we ask God.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
You shared testimonials around healing, homeness and forgiveness, and I'm
super excited that you're joining us here today. At the
end of this episode, make sure you give us a like, share,
subscribe again.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Welcome to the k WATS podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Hey guys, welcome to an whole new episode of the
k WATS podcast. I'm your host Kashan Watson, but you
know me as Kawats, and I am super excited to
have my sister in Christ with me today. I am
talking about wife, mom and author of church Hell. That's right,
Maddie Duarte, Welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Hello solady, I'm here. Oh sorry, already messed up.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
No, You're totally fine. There was no mess up. We
are right on track. Well one, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I was like laughing on the inside because I know
that we had booked to do the conversation, to have
the interview, and at that time, I don't know if
I knew you were pregnant, So in my mind I
was like, oh yeah, I kind of like have a
little bit of an idea of where I want to go,
and I'll talk book things.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
I don't talk light things. I don't talk ministry things.
And then you came.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Through with the post and I'm like, oh my goodness,
we're pregnant at the same time.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
This is gonna be fun. And she's making this face.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
You guys can't see her because she didn't know I
was pregnant. But I am like three days out from
third trimester.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
So here we go. I can't wait to unpack all
the things.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
So before we dive into book stuff, let's just talk life.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Okay. So this is your third this is my first,
I know.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
And it's so funny because I checked in on her
guys before we hit the record button, because I'm like, listen, girl,
if you need to go do a tinkle, if you
if you have your snacks. I definitely have my water here. Okay,
but talk to me a little bit. What it's like, Okay,
about to be a mom of three? Like, tell me
(01:58):
how you're feeling.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Yeah, definitely excited. I love being a mom. I think
that being a mom truly changes your heart. I think
that I didn't really understand what the love of God
meant until I held my baby, and I think we
will never really comprehend it, but it was this like
(02:24):
awe moment of like, oh, and I will never love
anybody like God loves me, you know. And so but
I think that in that moment of just holding my
baby after having him, it was this just awe of Wow, God,
you do miracles, You are so real. And I just
(02:46):
felt His love just embrace me. And so I think
that for me, like being a mom, like it's just
been such a great experience of experiencing God in a
whole new level. It's definitely very humbling. We find ourselves
very vulnerable. We find ourselves doubting ourselves or what are
(03:11):
we doing or what is going on?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:14):
The pregnancy it's it's a preparation right to the Promised Land.
But it's it's this season of God really preparing our hearts.
And even though pregnancy feels so long, I'm grateful for
it because it really allows us to mentally prepare somewhat.
(03:35):
I don't think really much prepares you for postpartum and
the things that come with motherhood, but I do think
that it prepares our heart to understand that we need
to rely on God no matter what, that he is
our source of everything, He's our source of life. These
are sources of peace and our love that we have
for our children. And so I think that for me
(03:56):
just being a mom, it's just been an incredible heart
change and the mindset and just gratitude and just humbleness,
you know. And so I'm excited to experience what it
is to have three children boys. Okay, you don't know
what we're having. What are you having?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
I'm having a girl? I know, I know we thought
like we were in the state of shock.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
There wasn't one person that thought that I was having
a boy because my symptoms were having a girl, because
my symptoms were so mild. And it was like everybody
you know, prepares you for, Oh, when you have a girl,
it's a lot and all the things.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So if it was easy.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
So when the doctor said it, like my husband's face
was like stuck for like five minutes, right like as
the as the doctor to go, like, let's just double
check and make sure, and like, no, it's a little girl.
So we are super excited to welcome her. But you
don't know it's so funny that you said that, because
(04:57):
I now basically going into third trimester. There was something
that I recently said to a friend of mine. I
only said this to my husband because of course, you know,
our husbands are the ones start getting the blunt of
what we look like behind the scenes pregnancy. It's a
different type of grace that they are having to offer, right.
(05:20):
And I literally said, if you would have told me
that pregnancy would have been one of the most sanctifying
seasons of my life, I would have not believed you.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
But if I had to sum this up, yes, it has.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
So when you set the word humility, I totally understood
because this has been one of the most, if not
the most sanctifying seasons of my life.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Because, for whatever reason, the.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Thought that I had going in is like pre preparation
for motherhood. My job is to protect the baby. And
then the Lord has shown me, oh, I'm using the
baby to purify you, and it blows my mind the
things and areas that I have struggled with for so long.
(06:11):
It's like God is just touching those areas. He is
exposing things that I thought were healed that we're not.
He is showing me things that I thought I had surrendered,
but I did it. I had thought that I had
overcome areas of pride, but oh, we're just gonna go
ahead and keep this bad boy rolling.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
So it has been.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
A holy season, a hard season, a humbling season. Like
if I had to sum up what first and second
and probably third try mastery. It has been hard, holy,
and humbling, like those are the three words that I
would use. But I am still so blown away by
his grace, yah, and his kindness during the season, because
(06:58):
Lord knows I haven't been so gracious, and Lord knows
that when the kindness escapes me in the moment, he
then just you know, just it's just.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
I don't know where it went.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
It just you know, it's absolutely true. Right, where's the fruit?
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Lord? Wait a minute, bring it back? Right?
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
So I totally relate, and I think that I have
just been in all one asking the Lord's question, like
does every pregnant woman go through this? And I'm sure
everyone does in their own way because God is just
so intentional on how he just has unique relationships with
his daughters. But every single person has said it's humbling.
(07:39):
It truly truly is.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
So Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
So excited all the things. Well, that kind of like
leads me into my next question. Now that we're talking
about humility and motherhood and all the things, I want
to talk a little bit. How with the excitement, do
you also feel a certain level of anxiety with preparing
for the expansion of family and what do you do
(08:06):
with that? Like, I'm sure there is the spiritual aspect,
there's the practical aspect, But where have you just been
preparing practically? Where have you preparing spiritually? And what scriptures
or what do you do when you start feeling yourself
getting anxious for the next season and stage of life
of what it looks like in your home.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Yeah, definitely, And I think it's so real the fact
that we experience that fear and that anxiety. And I
believe it's because we care, you know, because we want
what's best. And I think that it also comes with
want in control, you know, we want to make sure
(08:48):
everything's okay, everything's fine, everything's going according to plan. And
I think that's another thing that God has shown me
in motherhood, is that there are just things that are
not going to go to your plan. First thing, maybe
the timing of when we got pregnant, or maybe the
gender of the baby or the birth that we planned,
(09:14):
you know, and it's just like and so I feel
like even in those things, God what he wants from
us is just the surrender of do you trust me?
This surrender of if you really believe that this child
is from me, that this child's a gift from me,
then there's going to be things that you're not going
to have control because it's my perfect will. And so
(09:38):
I think I do have to admit that I believe
that with my first I did experience a lot more
fear and anxiety because I didn't know what to expect.
I didn't know what was I going to walk into
the appointment, what was going to be the test result,
(09:58):
what was going to be the diagnosis or things like that.
And like I've learned that we don't talk about those things,
you know, Like we don't talk about what you experienced
after postpartum. And I personally feel like I didn't have
a community around me of women that were going through
(10:20):
it and that we're open about it. Everybody was just
like it's beautiful, you know, awesome, and then I'm going
through it. I'm like, am I alone?
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Right? You know? What beauty? Are y'all experience it?
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Because I know right, and I'm just like, wait, is
this like real? And they're like, yeah, no, we go
through that. I'm like, how come you didn't tell me?
But I think that with my second I do believe
that my relationship with God was a lot stronger to
(10:55):
where those thoughts of fear. Also, I got pregnant with
my second twenty twenty. It was twenty twenty. It was
right when the pandemic was alive.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Very very much of you know, we were buying groceries
with gloves, we were pressing ourselves coming into the home,
and I had to go to all of my appointments
without my husband and so like that was terrifying. But
I think that that allowed me to just really rely
on God and really do one of those things where
(11:32):
it's like I'm in the car, got be with me, God,
I need you in this moment. And it was those
things of remembering God's promises of I'm not alone, you know,
I'm with God. He's with me. I'm courageous, i am
braved through him. Then I feel like in this pregnancy,
if I'm so real, I don't think I've even had
(11:55):
time to have fear.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
It's just been go, go, go, go go.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Yeah, and I think that, you know, my oldest he's seven,
he goes to school. My other one like he's home
and then I work, and so my third one, like
I was saying, I haven't had time. I haven't had
time to process certain things. And I think too when
(12:26):
when my first in my first trimester, you know, I
was really sick, and there was a moment that I
was having a lot of cramps. The cramps get stronger,
and I remember that one night, I'm like laying hand
in my womb and I'm just like, God, I trust you,
got I surrender this to you. This pain feels a
(12:48):
little weird. I don't think I've experienced this amount of
cramping while I'm pregnant. But but God, I surrender to you.
And I cast out any any thoughts of fear, any
feelings of doubt, And so I cast out any anxiety.
I rebuke it in the name of Jesus, and just
like taking a moment to like breathe the hands, pray,
(13:12):
rebuke the spirits. And then I fell asleep and then
the next morning I had a belly. So my uter
is growing.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
So again that's just been my personal experience.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
I think, yeah, so busy you.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
That you don't have time sometimes even like think about
sometain things, you know.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
So yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
I'm so curious because I know when I first came
across your page was through say GRAYC and Co. And
I was blown away and so excited about your testimony
and you're releasing your book, and I even think I
may have been even on the launch team for I
(14:00):
was so excited for you. I was so proud of you,
the obedience that you had and following through. So if
we rewind a little bit for people that are listening
kind of like for the first time learning who you are,
learning about what you do, could you just tell us
a little bit about like the testimony and journey to
get you to church.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Yep, yeah, I think you so very much. Your support
means the world.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Like amazing, it was an honor to do it, like,
super proud of you.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Yeah truly. Okay, So I was in short, I was
raised in church, always loved the church, still continue to
love the church. A few years ago, I got to
a point where I started to experience a lot of
things that I thought it was normal in the church,
(14:50):
and I would even say I was kind of even
part of that, like just being in leadership, and honestly,
I'm not even being in it for the right motives,
being in it too because everyone's doing it and to
be seen and to be validated, and because I have
(15:11):
these gifts, so I used to use them, but am
I really giving God the glory for it? And or
just being in settings and meetings and churches and church
services where I would experience a lot of spiritual and
verbal and emotional abuse not just to myself but to
my husband and other people where the word honor was
(15:33):
confused with idolatry. And it was a point in my
life where I really had to mature spiritually. It was
definitely not an easy season in my life. But now
that I'm on the other side of it, I am
grateful for it because Number One, I understand that I
didn't just go through this because a while she went
(15:56):
through that, but too, I went through it because I
know this is hell helping so many other people that
also experience the same thing. And God always uses everything
for good and for his purpose, and so I believe
that writing this book God put it in my heart
to talk about it in a way that number one
(16:17):
is in a healthy way. If you read the book,
I'm not bashing any church. I'm not saying anything about
any pastor or minister. If I wanted to, I could have.
But the reason why I wrote this book is because
God told me, I want you to write a message
for my church, because I want to bring revival in
(16:40):
the church. But I can't bring the revival in the
church if the heart of the people in it aren't
after me, if the heart of people in it aren't
after seeking me and surrendered. And so I write it's
a book, and a lot of people tell me I'm
They're like, I've actually never even meant to church or
(17:01):
having gone through this, but they're like, but when I
read your book, I realized that there was so many
things in my spiritual walk with God that I was
not surrendering, that my heart was cold towards Him, or
that I was experiencing unforgiveness and bitterness and I was
ready to just walk away, or I didn't have a
(17:23):
prayer life. And so again the book is called Church
Healed because I'm not just talking about the Church of
the Four Walls. I'm talking about us the body of Christ. Yeah,
being healed in a way that is not just physically
but mentally, and our mind and our soul and our
(17:45):
hearts to really love God how he says it, to
love God with all your mind, with all your heart,
with all your soul. And so that is the heart
behind this book. I've for the glory of God. I
have heard so many testimonies of people after they read
the book. They reconcile with their parents, they reconcile with
(18:11):
a friend, they reconcile with a pastor, and or maybe
not reconcile, but they forgive and they let it go,
and then they step back into the church and they're like,
oh my gosh, like I see things different, or I've
heard many other testimonies when they're like, I was reading
this book because I've been to church, but I never
realized that the reason why I felt this way is
(18:33):
because somebody did something to me, and like you, writing
this just brought all the memories and now I just
need to forgive. You know. Actually, my publishing coach, she
was not a Christian when she first read kind of
(18:53):
like the first chapter of the book. She actually told
me she was like, hey, I'm excited to help you,
but I to work with you. But I've never been
to church, so I actually don't know anything you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Sometimes that's the best audience because there is no biases,
there's no preconceived notions. They are taking it as face value.
If you are going out and preaching the gospel or
testifying to a non believer, which I love.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
That actually right.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
And so to me in that moment, I'm like, wait,
how is this person gonna really not gonna lie go
a little? Like? Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Did I like right person.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
The wrong company? Like and just you know, and I
just felt God tell me surrender it to me. I
have already put the right people. This is, you know,
part of my purpose. So anyway, so I finished writing
my first rough draft. She she was the first person
that I send it to to read it could prove
read it all the things. She sends it back to me,
(19:54):
and she goes, I never understood what on forgiveness would
do to your heart until I read your book. And
she's like, and then I also realized the amount of
unforgiveness that I had towards people, including in my family.
(20:15):
And then she goes and I want that Jesus you're
talking about in your book.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Here we go, and I just cut it.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
Yeah, yeah, because that's what I told God. I said, hey,
i'll do it. If you want me to write this book,
I'll do it. But as long as there's just one person,
as long as it just touches one person, God like
it's done, you know. And so my husband read the
email too, and he was hugging me and I'm crying,
(20:44):
and he's like, that's it.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
You know.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
You can shut your laptop down. You don't have to
publish it, you don't have to do anything else. You
prayed God just at least one person. And then months
later she actually messaged me and she was like, hey,
why Bible do you recommend? I want to start reading
the Bible that has never never considered themselves any religion
(21:10):
or vituality or anything, you know. So I'm grateful that
God just has been opening the doors to people that
have never been to church, that have been to church
so that maybe felt like they couldn't relate, and they
read it and they're like, well I needed this, you know.
So it's been a true blessing just to walk with
(21:32):
people seeing them come back to church.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
So, yeah, WHOA that was so good, And to be
honest with you, is one of the things that actually
really attracted me to the book was the fact that
it wasn't you talking about the church and the aspect
of just four walls, right, because the Body of Christ,
(21:55):
we are the church, and sometimes I think that we
forget the impact and the influence that we have on
people being a representative of Jesus Christ. And yet sometimes
a lot of times we fall short in doing the
two things that He told us to do, which is
to love Him with all our heart and mind and
soul and love people as ourselves.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Like those two areas we struggle with.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
So when you're approaching people that have no concept and
do not know the Jesus that we're talking about and
have never been to church, sometimes like those are the
best people to kind of be Like, if I'm just
giving you the gospel, just straight gospel, I'm not even
I'm not even utilizing any of the gifting. I'm not
even to give you words of knowledge. I'm not even
(22:42):
over here trying to flex prophetic gifting. I'm not even
doing all that, because come on, let's just talk about Yeah,
sometimes we rely very heavily on the gifting, the prophetic
movements and things like that. But if we take all
the those things away and we just get straight to
(23:03):
the foundation of our faith and what we believe and
what makes us different. It should be as a disciple
of Jesus Christ, that we love God with all of
our heart, mind, and soul, and that.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
We love His people.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Those are the two things, right, And I loved it
so much, and it's one of the things that the
Lord has really been tugging on me about when it
comes to, you know, gathering women together and bringing women
in one room, and he's like, you have to understand
that grace isn't just simply said.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It was greatly shown through my son.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Amen, yeap.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
So it can't just be so.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Easy sometimes to brush off and say yeah girl and
pray for you, and you know, so passive aggressively. We
have to be able to show his grace and his
love and his mercy and his kindness to his people
because that's what we claim that we believe who we are.
And I love so much that when we see more
(24:04):
testimonials and more women and men walking in obedience like yourself,
to where more of the gospel is being spread.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
This is what you see. You see real transformation happening.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
You see people really really going to Jesus and being like, Hey,
I don't know who you are, but I just feel
like I'm supposed to approach you. I want to ask
questions about you. I want to get the word for
myself so I can start reading. I want to then
find a church home. Like there's just so much so
want just thank you for your obedience. Your husband was
(24:37):
right on the money. Like after that, it's like, listen, God,
whatever else you want to do with the book, we
can do. Like I want to be a good steward
over what you gave me, but I know that the
whole point was to transform lives, and this just told
me that this is exactly what this book is going
to do.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
So yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:59):
I also think the other key part that you spoke
on and that you wrote about, which I think is huge,
is during this process of understanding the difference between honor
and idolatry, these are bars. These are things that people
don't talk about. These are bars.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
You didn't say that you're a rapper, that he didn't
say she was a rapper. She at least gave us
a solid sixteen.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Okay, oh gosh, but.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
This is one of the things that I have found,
especially like I'm I'm married to a PKU. My father
in law is a pastor. Now let me just say this.
I was not raised in the church. My parents were
not saved when they were married. I literally ended up
getting saved because my.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Godparents were pastors.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
And it was a radical situation that had I am
the only Pentecostal in my family, yes, only one. So
when I then entered into marriage with my husband, who
this is just what they do.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
This is what they've done.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Like my husband literally at five said I want to
be a worship pastor.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Like knew the presence of the Lord.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
It blows my mind right, But it was so different
from me to where it was me navigating and understanding
how much the word honor was used and thrown around
in church. And because I didn't come from the world,
I just thought like, oh, this is something that I'm
not educated on.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
This is an.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Aspect of church that I maybe just don't know. And
the Lord kept highlighting to me it's not honor, it's idolatry.
And this, okay, I'm like, I have zero content story issue.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
So Holy Shayer, you guys are really.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Call me this because these people weren't saying it's honor.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Help me here, help me here.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
So I am really curious to know how the Lord
started unpacking that for you, Like, how did you really
start being able to see, Like, I don't really know
if what we're calling honor is honor, or if we're
just using honor to mask idolatry for worshiping people in
(27:16):
men and women in ministry.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Because people don't talk about that.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
People don't talk about that ministry can be an idol
for you, that the four walls of Church can be
an idol for you, that positions in ministry can be
idolatry for you, that those things can happen. So I'm
just very curious to know how that started to be
revealed to you.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
Yeah, definitely, I think that it was the moment that
I realized that, or I asked myself, what are the
motives of my heart? Why am I showing up to church?
Why am I saying yes to this? Why? Why?
Speaker 2 (27:59):
You know?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
And and really just trying to understand the motive. The
Word of God says that he cares more about our
heart than anything else. He looks at the heart, and
I definitely believe that. For me, it was a very
crucial not moment season of where I really had to
(28:23):
dig in my heart and really ask God search me. Oh, God,
search me. And there is definitely a difference between honor
and idolatry. And it was crazy because even yesterday I
was having this conversation with one of my interns and
(28:43):
from our church, we have a college and we have interns,
and this time around, I get to have six interns,
and I just love it because I get to just
be super open. I tell them ask me anything that open.
And it's funny because a lot of our students they
(29:04):
always run away from kids ministry. For context, I am
the kids pastor at my church, and so they're like
kids ministry, you know. And even when I say kids pastor,
people picture something that like, that's not my job, you know.
They think that I'm in the classroom with all the
little children, and yeah, that's actually the fun part of
(29:26):
my job. But what I actually do is pastor people
that are teaching the kids and partner with the parents
to disciple their children. So all that to say, you know,
the students, they're always like, oh, I don't know. I
don't want to do kids ministry, and then they come
to my rotation and then they're like, oh my gosh,
(29:47):
I love it so much. Can I stay here forever?
And so yesterday I was talking to one of my
students and we were talking about how as leaders, it
is also our job to make sure that people are
not idolizing us. I can't force anyone to honor me
(30:11):
as a pastor, as a woman of God, I can't
force people to honor me. But I think that there
is a certain line that as believers, as leaders in
the church, sometimes we put ourselves in a pedal stool,
and then we demand people to see us in that
pedal stool, and then we demand people to serve us,
(30:35):
to treat us a certain way, to call us a
certain way, and honestly, just entitlement in the church leadership.
And so the sheep, the people in the church, some
of them don't know better. You know, at least in
my church we have I want to say, oh my goodness,
like eighty percent of our church they're new believers.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
Oh wow, yes, that's beautiful. Though. I love that it is.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
It is a blessing.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, And with a lot of things.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
I'm supposed to really be clubbing the night.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
People they showed up hung over and yeah, no, no.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
But like for real, we had last week we had
a person just pass out drunk in the middle of
our service, and you know what, that's what the churches for.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
They showed up the next day they were like, listen,
I went out and make it service.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I think he came straight from the club.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Well, okay, there you go. There was commitment and we
just honored its commision.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
He's keeping his New Year's resolution. But again, like you know,
it's beautiful to see so many people who have never
been to church or they've never known Jesus, and now
they're like, I actually need this, I want this. And
so I'm grateful to be part of a ministry where
(32:10):
we don't weird out church. And it's so funny because
a lot of people think that our church is non denominational,
but we're actually not. We're Pentecostal. We are the assemblies
of God and so but again, and it's not that
we're hiding anything, we're not masking anything, but we're just
very intentional with making sure that the lost doesn't feel
(32:32):
like they're coming in and they're the weird ones, or
they're the sinners, or they're the ones that deserve the
shame or whatever, you know, and so we say it,
we welcome you as you are and before you believe
you belong, because that's the way that people are gonna
get to God if we start to and I'm sharing
(32:53):
all this to say that, then it is my job
as a pastor in the church to be relatable in
a way that doesn't push them away in a way
that obviously like I'm not sinning or anything like that,
but it's like, hey, I'm human too, and I'm here
for you. And how do we do that when they
(33:14):
tell us, like things that they're going through that they're
struggling with, we don't shame them, but instead there's forgiveness
and then there's grace there, you know. So definitely, I
think that we have done as pastors and leaders in
the church. We have done the church the sheep a
misservice of pretending like some of us are perfect, pretending
(33:38):
or putting ourselves in a pedal stool that I am
above you when the Word of God says that Jesus
came to serve us, you know, and it's like so
why do we feel the need to put ourselves in
a pedal stool and now misguide and mislead the church
to now idolize us. And so I also think about, like,
(34:02):
what does idolizing mean? You know, idolizing is putting something
before God. And that was for me part of my
story of being in the church. For me, it was
why do I care more about the opinion of my
leader or my pastor than what God is saying and
(34:22):
showing me? And that's the difference. I'm gonna honor the
authority that God has placed over my life. But what
is God saying to me? What is his word saying
to me? What is He speaking to me? And I'm
gonna go ahead and follow what God is saying, yea,
and honor the authority that God has placed in my life,
(34:45):
you know. But at the same time, it's like I
know that I'm saying yes to this commitment to God
to serve him because I'm being obedient to Him, not
because a man is asking me or a woman is
asking me to do it. To serve in the church
at a certain level. And I also think that we
need to be careful because even people that Okay, maybe
(35:06):
they don't go to church, Like, oh, that doesn't apply
to me. Yeah, but what are you idolizing right now?
You know, social media, music careers, oh my gosh, even
our children, like.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
A I was I was gonna say that was another
one that was one of the questions that I really wanted.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
To talk about. I don't know if I have time.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
I had two other questions, but yeah, okay. So one
of the questions that I did have is something that
before finding out I was pregnant, and then very shortly after,
I was also very mindful of how often I showed
my baby bump on social media. I was very I
don't At first, I had to check it, and I
was wondering, like during first trimester or was it out
(35:51):
of fear? And then like was it you know, like
am I just been a little bit reluctant?
Speaker 3 (35:57):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (35:58):
And then I was like, I don't know what it
is about flashing it all the time or pointing to
it or kind of like showcasing it on display, like
look what I did when I.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Know I didn't do nothing. Well, I did you get
what I'm saying?
Speaker 3 (36:15):
Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (36:16):
Yeah, So there's the aspect of that, like just idolizing
getting pregnant, being pregnant, becoming a mother.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
And then there's the aspect of just idolizing motherhood.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
Now, when my husband and I were dating, and I've
said this before, but this was kind of like one
of the things the Lord reminded me of when we
were dating. The Lord told my husband, don't make having
children an idol.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
And my husband tells me.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
My husband now, but he tells me this when we're dating,
and I remember how I received that. I thought that
the Lord was telling him that because we weren't going
to be able to have kids, and he was preparing
him for this.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
That's where my mind went.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
I'm like, why would he say that, Like, why would
he tell you, don't make having kids in idol? Right,
So fast forward to find out that we're pregnant and
during my pregnancy, the Lord reminded me, don't make your
children an idle. Like that statement still stands right now,
(37:18):
and I'm very curious to know, like being a mom
of three, being being a kid's pastor, I mean, you
are engaging with parents all the time. I'm going based
on just the social media aspect, where there are baby
bumps being flaunted, there is motherhood being idolized, and I always,
you know, wonder like, how am I being empathetic and
(37:41):
supportive to my sister in Christ who is currently single, unmarried,
divorced and has children I'm single mother in the situation
those that have been trying and have been unable? Am
I being a good representative of the Gospel and His
grace in that? Or I then flipping the switch real
(38:02):
quick and be like I'm breaking you know, Like so,
I'm just curious at your thoughts on that.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Yeah, I it's so crazy. You just said all this
because yesterday I was listening to a podcast and it
was about being single, and it was so good. Mind you,
I've been married for ten years. Like that does not
apply to me. But the reason why I was listening
to it is because I have We have about thirty
(38:30):
something leaders in our kids ministry and just the leaders,
not even like the volunteers, just the leaders. And they,
I want to say, out of the thirty twenty our
single Yeah. And I as a pastor as I walk
them through life, like I want to be able. I
(38:52):
can't relate because I'm married, but I can probably I
need to do my job to be able to understand
or to be able to speak into some things, not
because maybe I'm walking through that right now, but am
I doing my due diligence to educate myself to be
(39:16):
able to walk somebody through that. And I think that
that's grace. I think that we can't just in being empathetic.
We can't just yeah, I'll pray for you, like you
said earlier, and we don't pray for them, or I'll
listen to you, but we can't, you know, And when
(39:37):
we go through things, it definitely holds weight. You know,
I've been through a couple of years ago, my husband
and I went through a lot of grief. We lost
my brother in law, my father in law, and so
now we're able to see death in the family in
a different light, you know what I'm saying, Yes, we're
going to empathize with that. But just because yes, we
(40:01):
haven't gone through something, does not mean that we're going
to be arrogant and we're just gonna oh, or ignorant
and we're just gonna be like, oh, I don't know,
because then is that grace? So that's kind of like
my first point that I was kind of just reminizing yesterday,
Like I'm listening to this because I want to understand
(40:23):
what these girls are walking through because they look up
to me, because they're like, oh my gosh, one day
I want to be married, one day I want to
have kids, and they think that this is the glory,
this is weiring. It's like, hey, idolatize my my life.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
Yeah, it's the comparison aspect where we think from the
single aspect that being the married wife with children is
the goal. Is the glory means I did it right?
And I same thing. Was listening to a podcast and
I had never heard this before. I never thought about this,
but it really made me sit back and think that
(41:08):
when we start comparing ourselves to our sisters in Christ,
it's then easy to make our sister in Christ the
enemy or a form of idolatry, because we're like, clearly,
there's either something missing for me that they had that
I didn't get right, or God favors them over me, right,
(41:31):
so we start going there. But comparison is a form
of judgment because in order to compare yourself to someone,
you have to look at them and start measuring them
by a certain level of metrics. And what metrics are
you measuring your sister or brother in Christ. By you
get what I'm saying, because the Lord says that you
(41:51):
will know them by their fruit. Correct, Like, listen, I
love my husband and I am so grateful to be
able to carry his children. But nowhere in scripture does
it tell me that when I get to heaven that
the Lord is going to judge me for how many
years I was married and how many children I gave
birth to.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
I have not read that nowhere. Yeah, that's I haven't
seen it. It is not I mean that he doesn't
care about it.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
It doesn't mean that he hasn't called or created me
to stewart what he gave me.
Speaker 2 (42:19):
But I don't believe that.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
The Lord's going to say the person that was married
for fifty years, I'm going to give them something better
than the person that.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Was only married for five.
Speaker 3 (42:28):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
So there is this level of removing comparison, and we
talk about it all the time, but it's really I
think the enemy has used we've used the buzzword comparison,
but I really think that.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
It's really judgment mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
It's really us looking at our neighbor and sizing ourselves
up to our neighbor, right, and looking at their life,
their family, their cute pictures, their lifestyle, their home.
Speaker 2 (42:55):
They're all of the things.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
So that's something that the Lord's been highlighting to me
in this season, which I think is very interesting that
I've just been very mindful of. But thank you so
much for sharing that, because I think there is the
level of we should no matter this season and stage
of our own lives, you know, especially as believers, as sisters,
(43:20):
as disciples, we should be educating ourselves. We should be
making sure like, hey, how are.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
My sisters in Christ doing?
Speaker 1 (43:29):
No I may not be walking hand in hand every
single day with my single friends and going out and
knowing what's going on out here and these online streets
with the dms, I may not know the day to
day you know, the day to day of the dating apps.
I haven't been on them in quite some time, but
I can only imagine what it looks like.
Speaker 2 (43:48):
But let me not think that I'm so above it.
Speaker 1 (43:51):
But let me just know what you're dealing with, so
I know how to encourage you in that season and
to pray for you and to cover you.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
So thank you so much for sharing that last question.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Yeah, for someone that has experienced, because this is something
that I have seen and heard a lot of that
someone who has experienced church hurt and they, for whatever reason,
don't look at it as like the people inside the
church hurts you. It's not the church in totality in
(44:25):
the way the Lord has designed the church to be,
and they have decided to take a step back from
going to church, attending church, becoming a member at church,
or maybe for some people, they have completely changed their
entire denomination because they think it was that specific denomination
(44:49):
that hurt them. How would you encourage them to start
being able to come back in the fold of community,
to start being able to trust those relationships again with
the Body of Christ, Because I do think there is
a vast majority of people.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
That I have met.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
When I have casual conversations with people to talk about,
you know, their faith or where they go to church,
they either.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
Go, yeah, you know, I love the Lord his people.
I'm struggling with That's usually what they say.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
And they're like, I haven't committed to a church, and
they'll say something like and to be honest, like it's
just being in the house and His glory, and I'm
totally fine with that. And I'm not saying that his
glory has not shown up in yet.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
House.
Speaker 1 (45:37):
I think that there is a season for everything. But
then there's also a difference in isolation and being afraid
of going back into community. So I'm very curious on
how you would encourage someone that has been struggling with that.
Speaker 3 (45:51):
Absolutely, I think that, Oh my gosh, I love when
I don't know if you've seen those memes on Instagram,
but it's like God, I love you so much, but
your children, I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
Lord, send Jesus now. They need you like I love you.
It's your people.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
It's your fault, Lord, but we are his people exactly.
I am his child too. I think that one of
the things that has helped me, uh deal with this
because like now now I work in ministry, and how
you feel like I see it all? I see so
much and God has given me, uh what people call
(46:35):
a gift. Sometimes I call it a little bit of
a not so much of a gift.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
Yeah, yeah, it is a gift.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
It's hard sometimes when you're able to do it.
Speaker 3 (46:47):
And I walk around and I tell my husband, got
prap up that one. Be careful with that one. And
he's such a kind soul and he's like, I don't know.
And then months later he's like.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Oh, yeah, I didn't see that one coming, uh huh.
Speaker 3 (47:03):
And I have asked God, I'm like, Lord, why do
you give me so much discernment? Like I don't want
to see people different? I don't want to you know.
And he's like, well, you got to mix that discernment
with wisdom, because if you don't mix that discernment with
my wisdom and my love and my grace, then it's
just pride for you to walk around and saying I
was right about that one.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
So yeah, I'm can I tell you that will preach?
Speaker 1 (47:31):
And can I tell you I so relate to that?
And to be honest with you, have literally had this
running joke with my husband to where have you ever
noticed that sometimes the most prophetic people are so prideful
and so mean?
Speaker 2 (47:45):
And it's because when they see.
Speaker 1 (47:47):
And I always I ask like the same question, why
do you let me see? And he has told me
before because I want you to pray because you see
and then you judge, and then you see and then
you want to warn. But there's an aspect of you
see and I need you to poray right.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
Right, right, yes, And so good, same thing, pray. And
I think that sometimes when I deserned something in a
person or in a situation, the Lord wants to reveal
something in my heart. The Lord wants to reveal something
in me. And I catch myself thinking whether that's or
(48:25):
you know, I never struggle with that or or judgment
or comparison or whatever it may be. And again those
things where like the Lord meant it for good. And
then so really that's how we like enters the body
of Christ with wanting to pervert things. I mean, even
(48:49):
the way that God created creation. It was supposed to
be beautiful. And then he comes in with the lies,
and then he comes in with with his fear, with
his stuff, and then you're just so, it's when we
separate ourselves from God that we're not able to handle things,
you know, in a way that is with grace, with wisdom,
with love. But to answer your question, I believe that
(49:12):
when we walk into the church understanding that we are
all broken, that we are all in this walk of
getting to know God. Because I think that when we
say I don't need the church, I don't need to
go to the building, I think that we are automatically
(49:33):
saying I am better than them, I'm better than that.
I don't need that, I don't need people. And where
does that come with pride? And again, is this constant
pursuit of him that will allow us to really see
what are the areas in our heart that need to
humble ourselves. And here's the other thing that, let me
(49:54):
remind you all that is biblical iron sharpens iron, meaning
we're always going to encounter people, I mean, even our spouse,
even our children like and why because there's pride and
there's pride. And then when both prides just rub around
like it's just you know, but what happens. What happens
(50:16):
when you sharpen two irons, you know, they become sharper.
But again is when we allow the Lord to come
in with that wisdom, when we humble ourselves and say, hey, God,
here I am. But one of the things, you know,
in our church we do this where we have lots
of small groups, and the small groups are moms or
(50:39):
cooking or the gym or you know, I did one
with my book or so it's like finding smaller settings
with people that you can do things that maybe you're
going to be able to enjoy and it's really stepping
out of your comfort zone, but also asking God, God
my heart. I think that you know that that part
(51:02):
in the world where it says to God our hearts,
like that is something that we need to live by
every single day because at the end of the day,
you can go ahead and find community somewhere else. But
but is it. Is it really people in the community
that are gonna love you, that are gonna want to
do what's best for you? And so but at the
(51:23):
same time, let's have the right expectations that God is
God and that people are not God. That the body
of Christ it's gonna probably messed up, you know, like
who crucified Jesus the religious leaders like and so two
(51:43):
of his closest like disciples, one denied him, one betrayed him.
And you see what I'm saying, Like it's just unfortunately
is part of life. But what did Jesus He still
believed in them. He sat at the table with Judas,
knowing he washed Peter's feet, knowing that he was going
to deny him. And I know that sounds like so crazy,
(52:04):
but that's being like Jesus, And it's really sometimes just
putting our hearts out there and understanding and knowing that
God is going to use it all for good. But
then at the end, if something happens, He's going to
sharpen our hearts. And then going back to idolatry where
we idolizing the community and the church to where we
put it in such a high pedalstool that now going
(52:27):
to church and being part of God's community and it's just.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
Out the door.
Speaker 3 (52:32):
So it's just finding that balance and that you know,
of Lord God my heart here I am. I'm here
for you. I want to do this. I know that
people may fail me, but I trust you God, and
I want to step into my God given purpose and
I want to serve you at church. And I know
that walking in your perfect will requires me to be
(52:56):
part of a community. And so yeah, so isolation. I
believe it's alive from the enemy and God doesn't want
us to live life like that.
Speaker 1 (53:07):
So and on that note that was so Bars, Can
I just say thank you, thank you for you have
such a and clearly we know like this is just
the Lord's hand on you, but there's such wisdom and
grace that you carry that the tough conversations that people
(53:28):
seem to have like a tough time, especially the church.
Just discussing it just seems that the Lord has given
you just the ease to be able to communicate to
his people, right, and it brings It brings understanding, and
it brings revelation and and that brings restoration in a
renewed mind. And that's what we need every single day.
(53:50):
So just thank you for just being so transparent, thank
you for being so honoring and how you do it, Like, listen,
you got the honor thing down, you understand.
Speaker 2 (54:00):
You do? You do?
Speaker 3 (54:01):
You do you do?
Speaker 1 (54:03):
I mean, you know it's a process, but I feel
like that's how you do it.
Speaker 2 (54:07):
This is how you honor.
Speaker 1 (54:08):
The church by not idolizing the You get what I'm
saying there, You can tell that you truly walk this
thing out with the Lord and that He has truly
been with you, and like just like revealing that to you.
So thank you so much for testifying. So for people
that can find you, also order the book, like tell
them all.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (54:30):
Yeah, let's be friends on Instagram and that's where I
hang out most of the time. If you want to
follow my pregnancy journey, I've been sharing all pregnancy stuff.
Speaker 2 (54:39):
Mother, I love it. You're so funny. She has humor
to y'all. Go he follow on Instagram. It's so funny.
Speaker 3 (54:46):
I love making people love, okay, So yeah, you can
find me on Instagram at M E R I Underscore
Duarte d U A r T E Underscore. You can
go to my website medidaktor dot com be part of
my email list. I send out devotionals and the book.
The book is available on Amazon. You can just search
(55:08):
church Heal to buy medid and it's right there. And yeah,
I love making friends and I am excited to just
meet more people, share my testimony and get to know
more people.
Speaker 1 (55:20):
So yeah, guys, definitely go follow her. Order the book
order Churchill today at Amazon. Guys, thank you so much
for tuning into this week's episode of the KOs Podcast.
Speaker 2 (55:31):
Until next week, be blessed,
Hey guys, welcome to the KOs podcast. I'm your host
Kashawn Watson, but you know me as Kawats.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
This is the place where we chat about the questions
that we ask God.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
You shared testimonials around healing, homeness and forgiveness, and I'm
super excited that you're joining us here today. At the
end of this episode, make sure you give us a like, share,
subscribe again.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Welcome to the k WATS podcast.
Speaker 1 (00:23):
Hey guys, welcome to an whole new episode of the
k WATS podcast. I'm your host Kashan Watson, but you
know me as Kawats, and I am super excited to
have my sister in Christ with me today. I am
talking about wife, mom and author of church Hell. That's right,
Maddie Duarte, Welcome to the podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:41):
Hello solady, I'm here. Oh sorry, already messed up.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
No, You're totally fine. There was no mess up. We
are right on track. Well one, thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (00:51):
Listen.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
I was like laughing on the inside because I know
that we had booked to do the conversation, to have
the interview, and at that time, I don't know if
I knew you were pregnant, So in my mind I
was like, oh yeah, I kind of like have a
little bit of an idea of where I want to go,
and I'll talk book things.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
I don't talk light things. I don't talk ministry things.
And then you came.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Through with the post and I'm like, oh my goodness,
we're pregnant at the same time.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
This is gonna be fun. And she's making this face.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
You guys can't see her because she didn't know I
was pregnant. But I am like three days out from
third trimester.
Speaker 2 (01:22):
So here we go. I can't wait to unpack all
the things.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
So before we dive into book stuff, let's just talk life.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Okay. So this is your third this is my first,
I know.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
And it's so funny because I checked in on her
guys before we hit the record button, because I'm like, listen, girl,
if you need to go do a tinkle, if you
if you have your snacks. I definitely have my water here. Okay,
but talk to me a little bit. What it's like, Okay,
about to be a mom of three? Like, tell me
(01:58):
how you're feeling.
Speaker 3 (02:00):
Yeah, definitely excited. I love being a mom. I think
that being a mom truly changes your heart. I think
that I didn't really understand what the love of God
meant until I held my baby, and I think we
will never really comprehend it, but it was this like
(02:24):
awe moment of like, oh, and I will never love
anybody like God loves me, you know. And so but
I think that in that moment of just holding my
baby after having him, it was this just awe of Wow, God,
you do miracles, You are so real. And I just
(02:46):
felt His love just embrace me. And so I think
that for me, like being a mom, like it's just
been such a great experience of experiencing God in a
whole new level. It's definitely very humbling. We find ourselves
very vulnerable. We find ourselves doubting ourselves or what are
(03:11):
we doing or what is going on?
Speaker 2 (03:14):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:14):
The pregnancy it's it's a preparation right to the Promised Land.
But it's it's this season of God really preparing our hearts.
And even though pregnancy feels so long, I'm grateful for
it because it really allows us to mentally prepare somewhat.
(03:35):
I don't think really much prepares you for postpartum and
the things that come with motherhood, but I do think
that it prepares our heart to understand that we need
to rely on God no matter what, that he is
our source of everything, He's our source of life. These
are sources of peace and our love that we have
for our children. And so I think that for me
(03:56):
just being a mom, it's just been an incredible heart
change and the mindset and just gratitude and just humbleness,
you know. And so I'm excited to experience what it
is to have three children boys. Okay, you don't know
what we're having. What are you having?
Speaker 2 (04:14):
I'm having a girl? I know, I know we thought
like we were in the state of shock.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
There wasn't one person that thought that I was having
a boy because my symptoms were having a girl, because
my symptoms were so mild. And it was like everybody
you know, prepares you for, Oh, when you have a girl,
it's a lot and all the things.
Speaker 2 (04:34):
So if it was easy.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
So when the doctor said it, like my husband's face
was like stuck for like five minutes, right like as
the as the doctor to go, like, let's just double
check and make sure, and like, no, it's a little girl.
So we are super excited to welcome her. But you
don't know it's so funny that you said that, because
(04:57):
I now basically going into third trimester. There was something
that I recently said to a friend of mine. I
only said this to my husband because of course, you know,
our husbands are the ones start getting the blunt of
what we look like behind the scenes pregnancy. It's a
different type of grace that they are having to offer, right.
(05:20):
And I literally said, if you would have told me
that pregnancy would have been one of the most sanctifying
seasons of my life, I would have not believed you.
Speaker 2 (05:32):
But if I had to sum this up, yes, it has.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
So when you set the word humility, I totally understood
because this has been one of the most, if not
the most sanctifying seasons of my life.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Because, for whatever reason, the.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Thought that I had going in is like pre preparation
for motherhood. My job is to protect the baby. And
then the Lord has shown me, oh, I'm using the
baby to purify you, and it blows my mind the
things and areas that I have struggled with for so long.
(06:11):
It's like God is just touching those areas. He is
exposing things that I thought were healed that we're not.
He is showing me things that I thought I had surrendered,
but I did it. I had thought that I had
overcome areas of pride, but oh, we're just gonna go
ahead and keep this bad boy rolling.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
So it has been.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
A holy season, a hard season, a humbling season. Like
if I had to sum up what first and second
and probably third try mastery. It has been hard, holy,
and humbling, like those are the three words that I
would use. But I am still so blown away by
his grace, yah, and his kindness during the season, because
(06:58):
Lord knows I haven't been so gracious, and Lord knows
that when the kindness escapes me in the moment, he
then just you know, just it's just.
Speaker 2 (07:07):
I don't know where it went.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
It just you know, it's absolutely true. Right, where's the fruit?
Speaker 2 (07:13):
Lord? Wait a minute, bring it back? Right?
Speaker 3 (07:16):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (07:17):
So I totally relate, and I think that I have
just been in all one asking the Lord's question, like
does every pregnant woman go through this? And I'm sure
everyone does in their own way because God is just
so intentional on how he just has unique relationships with
his daughters. But every single person has said it's humbling.
(07:39):
It truly truly is.
Speaker 2 (07:42):
So Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
So excited all the things. Well, that kind of like
leads me into my next question. Now that we're talking
about humility and motherhood and all the things, I want
to talk a little bit. How with the excitement, do
you also feel a certain level of anxiety with preparing
for the expansion of family and what do you do
(08:06):
with that? Like, I'm sure there is the spiritual aspect,
there's the practical aspect, But where have you just been
preparing practically? Where have you preparing spiritually? And what scriptures
or what do you do when you start feeling yourself
getting anxious for the next season and stage of life
of what it looks like in your home.
Speaker 3 (08:26):
Yeah, definitely, And I think it's so real the fact
that we experience that fear and that anxiety. And I
believe it's because we care, you know, because we want
what's best. And I think that it also comes with
want in control, you know, we want to make sure
(08:48):
everything's okay, everything's fine, everything's going according to plan. And
I think that's another thing that God has shown me
in motherhood, is that there are just things that are
not going to go to your plan. First thing, maybe
the timing of when we got pregnant, or maybe the
gender of the baby or the birth that we planned,
(09:14):
you know, and it's just like and so I feel
like even in those things, God what he wants from
us is just the surrender of do you trust me?
This surrender of if you really believe that this child
is from me, that this child's a gift from me,
then there's going to be things that you're not going
to have control because it's my perfect will. And so
(09:38):
I think I do have to admit that I believe
that with my first I did experience a lot more
fear and anxiety because I didn't know what to expect.
I didn't know what was I going to walk into
the appointment, what was going to be the test result,
(09:58):
what was going to be the diagnosis or things like that.
And like I've learned that we don't talk about those things,
you know, Like we don't talk about what you experienced
after postpartum. And I personally feel like I didn't have
a community around me of women that were going through
(10:20):
it and that we're open about it. Everybody was just
like it's beautiful, you know, awesome, and then I'm going
through it. I'm like, am I alone?
Speaker 2 (10:30):
Right? You know? What beauty? Are y'all experience it?
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Because I know right, and I'm just like, wait, is
this like real? And they're like, yeah, no, we go
through that. I'm like, how come you didn't tell me?
But I think that with my second I do believe
that my relationship with God was a lot stronger to
(10:55):
where those thoughts of fear. Also, I got pregnant with
my second twenty twenty. It was twenty twenty. It was
right when the pandemic was alive.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Very very much of you know, we were buying groceries
with gloves, we were pressing ourselves coming into the home,
and I had to go to all of my appointments
without my husband and so like that was terrifying. But
I think that that allowed me to just really rely
on God and really do one of those things where
(11:32):
it's like I'm in the car, got be with me, God,
I need you in this moment. And it was those
things of remembering God's promises of I'm not alone, you know,
I'm with God. He's with me. I'm courageous, i am
braved through him. Then I feel like in this pregnancy,
if I'm so real, I don't think I've even had
(11:55):
time to have fear.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
It's just been go, go, go, go go.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
Yeah, and I think that, you know, my oldest he's seven,
he goes to school. My other one like he's home
and then I work, and so my third one, like
I was saying, I haven't had time. I haven't had
time to process certain things. And I think too when
(12:26):
when my first in my first trimester, you know, I
was really sick, and there was a moment that I
was having a lot of cramps. The cramps get stronger,
and I remember that one night, I'm like laying hand
in my womb and I'm just like, God, I trust you,
got I surrender this to you. This pain feels a
(12:48):
little weird. I don't think I've experienced this amount of
cramping while I'm pregnant. But but God, I surrender to you.
And I cast out any any thoughts of fear, any
feelings of doubt, And so I cast out any anxiety.
I rebuke it in the name of Jesus, and just
like taking a moment to like breathe the hands, pray,
(13:12):
rebuke the spirits. And then I fell asleep and then
the next morning I had a belly. So my uter
is growing.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:23):
So again that's just been my personal experience.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
I think, yeah, so busy you.
Speaker 3 (13:33):
That you don't have time sometimes even like think about
sometain things, you know.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
So yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
I'm so curious because I know when I first came
across your page was through say GRAYC and Co. And
I was blown away and so excited about your testimony
and you're releasing your book, and I even think I
may have been even on the launch team for I
(14:00):
was so excited for you. I was so proud of you,
the obedience that you had and following through. So if
we rewind a little bit for people that are listening
kind of like for the first time learning who you are,
learning about what you do, could you just tell us
a little bit about like the testimony and journey to
get you to church.
Speaker 3 (14:21):
Yep, yeah, I think you so very much. Your support
means the world.
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Like amazing, it was an honor to do it, like,
super proud of you.
Speaker 3 (14:29):
Yeah truly. Okay, So I was in short, I was
raised in church, always loved the church, still continue to
love the church. A few years ago, I got to
a point where I started to experience a lot of
things that I thought it was normal in the church,
(14:50):
and I would even say I was kind of even
part of that, like just being in leadership, and honestly,
I'm not even being in it for the right motives,
being in it too because everyone's doing it and to
be seen and to be validated, and because I have
(15:11):
these gifts, so I used to use them, but am
I really giving God the glory for it? And or
just being in settings and meetings and churches and church
services where I would experience a lot of spiritual and
verbal and emotional abuse not just to myself but to
my husband and other people where the word honor was
(15:33):
confused with idolatry. And it was a point in my
life where I really had to mature spiritually. It was
definitely not an easy season in my life. But now
that I'm on the other side of it, I am
grateful for it because Number One, I understand that I
didn't just go through this because a while she went
(15:56):
through that, but too, I went through it because I
know this is hell helping so many other people that
also experience the same thing. And God always uses everything
for good and for his purpose, and so I believe
that writing this book God put it in my heart
to talk about it in a way that number one
(16:17):
is in a healthy way. If you read the book,
I'm not bashing any church. I'm not saying anything about
any pastor or minister. If I wanted to, I could have.
But the reason why I wrote this book is because
God told me, I want you to write a message
for my church, because I want to bring revival in
(16:40):
the church. But I can't bring the revival in the
church if the heart of the people in it aren't
after me, if the heart of people in it aren't
after seeking me and surrendered. And so I write it's
a book, and a lot of people tell me I'm
They're like, I've actually never even meant to church or
(17:01):
having gone through this, but they're like, but when I
read your book, I realized that there was so many
things in my spiritual walk with God that I was
not surrendering, that my heart was cold towards Him, or
that I was experiencing unforgiveness and bitterness and I was
ready to just walk away, or I didn't have a
(17:23):
prayer life. And so again the book is called Church
Healed because I'm not just talking about the Church of
the Four Walls. I'm talking about us the body of Christ. Yeah,
being healed in a way that is not just physically
but mentally, and our mind and our soul and our
(17:45):
hearts to really love God how he says it, to
love God with all your mind, with all your heart,
with all your soul. And so that is the heart
behind this book. I've for the glory of God. I
have heard so many testimonies of people after they read
the book. They reconcile with their parents, they reconcile with
(18:11):
a friend, they reconcile with a pastor, and or maybe
not reconcile, but they forgive and they let it go,
and then they step back into the church and they're like,
oh my gosh, like I see things different, or I've
heard many other testimonies when they're like, I was reading
this book because I've been to church, but I never
realized that the reason why I felt this way is
(18:33):
because somebody did something to me, and like you, writing
this just brought all the memories and now I just
need to forgive. You know. Actually, my publishing coach, she
was not a Christian when she first read kind of
(18:53):
like the first chapter of the book. She actually told
me she was like, hey, I'm excited to help you,
but I to work with you. But I've never been
to church, so I actually don't know anything you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (19:05):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
Sometimes that's the best audience because there is no biases,
there's no preconceived notions. They are taking it as face value.
If you are going out and preaching the gospel or
testifying to a non believer, which I love.
Speaker 2 (19:18):
That actually right.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
And so to me in that moment, I'm like, wait,
how is this person gonna really not gonna lie go
a little? Like? Oh?
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Did I like right person.
Speaker 3 (19:34):
The wrong company? Like and just you know, and I
just felt God tell me surrender it to me. I
have already put the right people. This is, you know,
part of my purpose. So anyway, so I finished writing
my first rough draft. She she was the first person
that I send it to to read it could prove
read it all the things. She sends it back to me,
(19:54):
and she goes, I never understood what on forgiveness would
do to your heart until I read your book. And
she's like, and then I also realized the amount of
unforgiveness that I had towards people, including in my family.
(20:15):
And then she goes and I want that Jesus you're
talking about in your book.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Here we go, and I just cut it.
Speaker 3 (20:23):
Yeah, yeah, because that's what I told God. I said, hey,
i'll do it. If you want me to write this book,
I'll do it. But as long as there's just one person,
as long as it just touches one person, God like
it's done, you know. And so my husband read the
email too, and he was hugging me and I'm crying,
(20:44):
and he's like, that's it.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
You know.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
You can shut your laptop down. You don't have to
publish it, you don't have to do anything else. You
prayed God just at least one person. And then months
later she actually messaged me and she was like, hey,
why Bible do you recommend? I want to start reading
the Bible that has never never considered themselves any religion
(21:10):
or vituality or anything, you know. So I'm grateful that
God just has been opening the doors to people that
have never been to church, that have been to church
so that maybe felt like they couldn't relate, and they
read it and they're like, well I needed this, you know.
So it's been a true blessing just to walk with
(21:32):
people seeing them come back to church.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
So, yeah, WHOA that was so good, And to be
honest with you, is one of the things that actually
really attracted me to the book was the fact that
it wasn't you talking about the church and the aspect
of just four walls, right, because the Body of Christ,
(21:55):
we are the church, and sometimes I think that we
forget the impact and the influence that we have on
people being a representative of Jesus Christ. And yet sometimes
a lot of times we fall short in doing the
two things that He told us to do, which is
to love Him with all our heart and mind and
soul and love people as ourselves.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Like those two areas we struggle with.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
So when you're approaching people that have no concept and
do not know the Jesus that we're talking about and
have never been to church, sometimes like those are the
best people to kind of be Like, if I'm just
giving you the gospel, just straight gospel, I'm not even
I'm not even utilizing any of the gifting. I'm not
even to give you words of knowledge. I'm not even
(22:42):
over here trying to flex prophetic gifting. I'm not even
doing all that, because come on, let's just talk about Yeah,
sometimes we rely very heavily on the gifting, the prophetic
movements and things like that. But if we take all
the those things away and we just get straight to
(23:03):
the foundation of our faith and what we believe and
what makes us different. It should be as a disciple
of Jesus Christ, that we love God with all of
our heart, mind, and soul, and that.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
We love His people.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Those are the two things, right, And I loved it
so much, and it's one of the things that the
Lord has really been tugging on me about when it
comes to, you know, gathering women together and bringing women
in one room, and he's like, you have to understand
that grace isn't just simply said.
Speaker 2 (23:35):
It was greatly shown through my son.
Speaker 3 (23:38):
Amen, yeap.
Speaker 2 (23:41):
So it can't just be so.
Speaker 1 (23:43):
Easy sometimes to brush off and say yeah girl and
pray for you, and you know, so passive aggressively. We
have to be able to show his grace and his
love and his mercy and his kindness to his people
because that's what we claim that we believe who we are.
And I love so much that when we see more
(24:04):
testimonials and more women and men walking in obedience like yourself,
to where more of the gospel is being spread.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
This is what you see. You see real transformation happening.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
You see people really really going to Jesus and being like, Hey,
I don't know who you are, but I just feel
like I'm supposed to approach you. I want to ask
questions about you. I want to get the word for
myself so I can start reading. I want to then
find a church home. Like there's just so much so
want just thank you for your obedience. Your husband was
(24:37):
right on the money. Like after that, it's like, listen, God,
whatever else you want to do with the book, we
can do. Like I want to be a good steward
over what you gave me, but I know that the
whole point was to transform lives, and this just told
me that this is exactly what this book is going
to do.
Speaker 2 (24:58):
So yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:59):
I also think the other key part that you spoke
on and that you wrote about, which I think is huge,
is during this process of understanding the difference between honor
and idolatry, these are bars. These are things that people
don't talk about. These are bars.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
You didn't say that you're a rapper, that he didn't
say she was a rapper. She at least gave us
a solid sixteen.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
Okay, oh gosh, but.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
This is one of the things that I have found,
especially like I'm I'm married to a PKU. My father
in law is a pastor. Now let me just say this.
I was not raised in the church. My parents were
not saved when they were married. I literally ended up
getting saved because my.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
Godparents were pastors.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
And it was a radical situation that had I am
the only Pentecostal in my family, yes, only one. So
when I then entered into marriage with my husband, who
this is just what they do.
Speaker 2 (26:03):
This is what they've done.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Like my husband literally at five said I want to
be a worship pastor.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
Like knew the presence of the Lord.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
It blows my mind right, But it was so different
from me to where it was me navigating and understanding
how much the word honor was used and thrown around
in church. And because I didn't come from the world,
I just thought like, oh, this is something that I'm
not educated on.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
This is an.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
Aspect of church that I maybe just don't know. And
the Lord kept highlighting to me it's not honor, it's idolatry.
And this, okay, I'm like, I have zero content story issue.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
So Holy Shayer, you guys are really.
Speaker 1 (26:46):
Call me this because these people weren't saying it's honor.
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Help me here, help me here.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
So I am really curious to know how the Lord
started unpacking that for you, Like, how did you really
start being able to see, Like, I don't really know
if what we're calling honor is honor, or if we're
just using honor to mask idolatry for worshiping people in
(27:16):
men and women in ministry.
Speaker 2 (27:17):
Because people don't talk about that.
Speaker 1 (27:19):
People don't talk about that ministry can be an idol
for you, that the four walls of Church can be
an idol for you, that positions in ministry can be
idolatry for you, that those things can happen. So I'm
just very curious to know how that started to be
revealed to you.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
Yeah, definitely, I think that it was the moment that
I realized that, or I asked myself, what are the
motives of my heart? Why am I showing up to church?
Why am I saying yes to this? Why? Why?
Speaker 2 (27:59):
You know?
Speaker 3 (27:59):
And and really just trying to understand the motive. The
Word of God says that he cares more about our
heart than anything else. He looks at the heart, and
I definitely believe that. For me, it was a very
crucial not moment season of where I really had to
(28:23):
dig in my heart and really ask God search me. Oh, God,
search me. And there is definitely a difference between honor
and idolatry. And it was crazy because even yesterday I
was having this conversation with one of my interns and
(28:43):
from our church, we have a college and we have interns,
and this time around, I get to have six interns,
and I just love it because I get to just
be super open. I tell them ask me anything that open.
And it's funny because a lot of our students they
(29:04):
always run away from kids ministry. For context, I am
the kids pastor at my church, and so they're like
kids ministry, you know. And even when I say kids pastor,
people picture something that like, that's not my job, you know.
They think that I'm in the classroom with all the
little children, and yeah, that's actually the fun part of
(29:26):
my job. But what I actually do is pastor people
that are teaching the kids and partner with the parents
to disciple their children. So all that to say, you know,
the students, they're always like, oh, I don't know. I
don't want to do kids ministry, and then they come
to my rotation and then they're like, oh my gosh,
(29:47):
I love it so much. Can I stay here forever?
And so yesterday I was talking to one of my
students and we were talking about how as leaders, it
is also our job to make sure that people are
not idolizing us. I can't force anyone to honor me
(30:11):
as a pastor, as a woman of God, I can't
force people to honor me. But I think that there
is a certain line that as believers, as leaders in
the church, sometimes we put ourselves in a pedal stool,
and then we demand people to see us in that
pedal stool, and then we demand people to serve us,
(30:35):
to treat us a certain way, to call us a
certain way, and honestly, just entitlement in the church leadership.
And so the sheep, the people in the church, some
of them don't know better. You know, at least in
my church we have I want to say, oh my goodness,
like eighty percent of our church they're new believers.
Speaker 2 (31:00):
Oh wow, yes, that's beautiful. Though. I love that it is.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
It is a blessing.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, And with a lot of things.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
I'm supposed to really be clubbing the night.
Speaker 2 (31:14):
People they showed up hung over and yeah, no, no.
Speaker 3 (31:20):
But like for real, we had last week we had
a person just pass out drunk in the middle of
our service, and you know what, that's what the churches for.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
They showed up the next day they were like, listen,
I went out and make it service.
Speaker 3 (31:39):
I think he came straight from the club.
Speaker 2 (31:41):
Well, okay, there you go. There was commitment and we
just honored its commision.
Speaker 3 (31:47):
He's keeping his New Year's resolution. But again, like you know,
it's beautiful to see so many people who have never
been to church or they've never known Jesus, and now
they're like, I actually need this, I want this. And
so I'm grateful to be part of a ministry where
(32:10):
we don't weird out church. And it's so funny because
a lot of people think that our church is non denominational,
but we're actually not. We're Pentecostal. We are the assemblies
of God and so but again, and it's not that
we're hiding anything, we're not masking anything, but we're just
very intentional with making sure that the lost doesn't feel
(32:32):
like they're coming in and they're the weird ones, or
they're the sinners, or they're the ones that deserve the
shame or whatever, you know, and so we say it,
we welcome you as you are and before you believe
you belong, because that's the way that people are gonna
get to God if we start to and I'm sharing
(32:53):
all this to say that, then it is my job
as a pastor in the church to be relatable in
a way that doesn't push them away in a way
that obviously like I'm not sinning or anything like that,
but it's like, hey, I'm human too, and I'm here
for you. And how do we do that when they
(33:14):
tell us, like things that they're going through that they're
struggling with, we don't shame them, but instead there's forgiveness
and then there's grace there, you know. So definitely, I
think that we have done as pastors and leaders in
the church. We have done the church the sheep a
misservice of pretending like some of us are perfect, pretending
(33:38):
or putting ourselves in a pedal stool that I am
above you when the Word of God says that Jesus
came to serve us, you know, and it's like so
why do we feel the need to put ourselves in
a pedal stool and now misguide and mislead the church
to now idolize us. And so I also think about, like,
(34:02):
what does idolizing mean? You know, idolizing is putting something
before God. And that was for me part of my
story of being in the church. For me, it was
why do I care more about the opinion of my
leader or my pastor than what God is saying and
(34:22):
showing me? And that's the difference. I'm gonna honor the
authority that God has placed over my life. But what
is God saying to me? What is his word saying
to me? What is He speaking to me? And I'm
gonna go ahead and follow what God is saying, yea,
and honor the authority that God has placed in my life,
(34:45):
you know. But at the same time, it's like I
know that I'm saying yes to this commitment to God
to serve him because I'm being obedient to Him, not
because a man is asking me or a woman is
asking me to do it. To serve in the church
at a certain level. And I also think that we
need to be careful because even people that Okay, maybe
(35:06):
they don't go to church, Like, oh, that doesn't apply
to me. Yeah, but what are you idolizing right now?
You know, social media, music careers, oh my gosh, even
our children, like.
Speaker 1 (35:19):
A I was I was gonna say that was another
one that was one of the questions that I really wanted.
Speaker 2 (35:26):
To talk about. I don't know if I have time.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
I had two other questions, but yeah, okay. So one
of the questions that I did have is something that
before finding out I was pregnant, and then very shortly after,
I was also very mindful of how often I showed
my baby bump on social media. I was very I
don't At first, I had to check it, and I
was wondering, like during first trimester or was it out
(35:51):
of fear? And then like was it you know, like
am I just been a little bit reluctant?
Speaker 3 (35:57):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (35:58):
And then I was like, I don't know what it
is about flashing it all the time or pointing to
it or kind of like showcasing it on display, like
look what I did when I.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Know I didn't do nothing. Well, I did you get
what I'm saying?
Speaker 3 (36:15):
Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (36:16):
Yeah, So there's the aspect of that, like just idolizing
getting pregnant, being pregnant, becoming a mother.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
And then there's the aspect of just idolizing motherhood.
Speaker 1 (36:29):
Now, when my husband and I were dating, and I've
said this before, but this was kind of like one
of the things the Lord reminded me of when we
were dating. The Lord told my husband, don't make having
children an idol.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
And my husband tells me.
Speaker 1 (36:44):
My husband now, but he tells me this when we're dating,
and I remember how I received that. I thought that
the Lord was telling him that because we weren't going
to be able to have kids, and he was preparing
him for this.
Speaker 2 (36:55):
That's where my mind went.
Speaker 1 (36:56):
I'm like, why would he say that, Like, why would
he tell you, don't make having kids in idol? Right,
So fast forward to find out that we're pregnant and
during my pregnancy, the Lord reminded me, don't make your
children an idle. Like that statement still stands right now,
(37:18):
and I'm very curious to know, like being a mom
of three, being being a kid's pastor, I mean, you
are engaging with parents all the time. I'm going based
on just the social media aspect, where there are baby
bumps being flaunted, there is motherhood being idolized, and I always,
you know, wonder like, how am I being empathetic and
(37:41):
supportive to my sister in Christ who is currently single, unmarried,
divorced and has children I'm single mother in the situation
those that have been trying and have been unable? Am
I being a good representative of the Gospel and His
grace in that? Or I then flipping the switch real
(38:02):
quick and be like I'm breaking you know, Like so,
I'm just curious at your thoughts on that.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
Yeah, I it's so crazy. You just said all this
because yesterday I was listening to a podcast and it
was about being single, and it was so good. Mind you,
I've been married for ten years. Like that does not
apply to me. But the reason why I was listening
to it is because I have We have about thirty
(38:30):
something leaders in our kids ministry and just the leaders,
not even like the volunteers, just the leaders. And they,
I want to say, out of the thirty twenty our
single Yeah. And I as a pastor as I walk
them through life, like I want to be able. I
(38:52):
can't relate because I'm married, but I can probably I
need to do my job to be able to understand
or to be able to speak into some things, not
because maybe I'm walking through that right now, but am
I doing my due diligence to educate myself to be
(39:16):
able to walk somebody through that. And I think that
that's grace. I think that we can't just in being empathetic.
We can't just yeah, I'll pray for you, like you
said earlier, and we don't pray for them, or I'll
listen to you, but we can't, you know, And when
(39:37):
we go through things, it definitely holds weight. You know,
I've been through a couple of years ago, my husband
and I went through a lot of grief. We lost
my brother in law, my father in law, and so
now we're able to see death in the family in
a different light, you know what I'm saying, Yes, we're
going to empathize with that. But just because yes, we
(40:01):
haven't gone through something, does not mean that we're going
to be arrogant and we're just gonna oh, or ignorant
and we're just gonna be like, oh, I don't know,
because then is that grace? So that's kind of like
my first point that I was kind of just reminizing yesterday,
Like I'm listening to this because I want to understand
(40:23):
what these girls are walking through because they look up
to me, because they're like, oh my gosh, one day
I want to be married, one day I want to
have kids, and they think that this is the glory,
this is weiring. It's like, hey, idolatize my my life.
Speaker 1 (40:45):
Yeah, it's the comparison aspect where we think from the
single aspect that being the married wife with children is
the goal. Is the glory means I did it right?
And I same thing. Was listening to a podcast and
I had never heard this before. I never thought about this,
but it really made me sit back and think that
(41:08):
when we start comparing ourselves to our sisters in Christ,
it's then easy to make our sister in Christ the
enemy or a form of idolatry, because we're like, clearly,
there's either something missing for me that they had that
I didn't get right, or God favors them over me, right,
(41:31):
so we start going there. But comparison is a form
of judgment because in order to compare yourself to someone,
you have to look at them and start measuring them
by a certain level of metrics. And what metrics are
you measuring your sister or brother in Christ. By you
get what I'm saying, because the Lord says that you
(41:51):
will know them by their fruit. Correct, Like, listen, I
love my husband and I am so grateful to be
able to carry his children. But nowhere in scripture does
it tell me that when I get to heaven that
the Lord is going to judge me for how many
years I was married and how many children I gave
birth to.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
I have not read that nowhere. Yeah, that's I haven't
seen it. It is not I mean that he doesn't
care about it.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
It doesn't mean that he hasn't called or created me
to stewart what he gave me.
Speaker 2 (42:19):
But I don't believe that.
Speaker 1 (42:21):
The Lord's going to say the person that was married
for fifty years, I'm going to give them something better
than the person that.
Speaker 2 (42:27):
Was only married for five.
Speaker 3 (42:28):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
So there is this level of removing comparison, and we
talk about it all the time, but it's really I
think the enemy has used we've used the buzzword comparison,
but I really think that.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
It's really judgment mm hmm.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
It's really us looking at our neighbor and sizing ourselves
up to our neighbor, right, and looking at their life,
their family, their cute pictures, their lifestyle, their home.
Speaker 2 (42:55):
They're all of the things.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
So that's something that the Lord's been highlighting to me
in this season, which I think is very interesting that
I've just been very mindful of. But thank you so
much for sharing that, because I think there is the
level of we should no matter this season and stage
of our own lives, you know, especially as believers, as sisters,
(43:20):
as disciples, we should be educating ourselves. We should be
making sure like, hey, how are.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
My sisters in Christ doing?
Speaker 1 (43:29):
No I may not be walking hand in hand every
single day with my single friends and going out and
knowing what's going on out here and these online streets
with the dms, I may not know the day to
day you know, the day to day of the dating apps.
I haven't been on them in quite some time, but
I can only imagine what it looks like.
Speaker 2 (43:48):
But let me not think that I'm so above it.
Speaker 1 (43:51):
But let me just know what you're dealing with, so
I know how to encourage you in that season and
to pray for you and to cover you.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
So thank you so much for sharing that last question.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Yeah, for someone that has experienced, because this is something
that I have seen and heard a lot of that
someone who has experienced church hurt and they, for whatever reason,
don't look at it as like the people inside the
church hurts you. It's not the church in totality in
(44:25):
the way the Lord has designed the church to be,
and they have decided to take a step back from
going to church, attending church, becoming a member at church,
or maybe for some people, they have completely changed their
entire denomination because they think it was that specific denomination
(44:49):
that hurt them. How would you encourage them to start
being able to come back in the fold of community,
to start being able to trust those relationships again with
the Body of Christ, Because I do think there is
a vast majority of people.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
That I have met.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
When I have casual conversations with people to talk about,
you know, their faith or where they go to church,
they either.
Speaker 2 (45:13):
Go, yeah, you know, I love the Lord his people.
I'm struggling with That's usually what they say.
Speaker 1 (45:22):
And they're like, I haven't committed to a church, and
they'll say something like and to be honest, like it's
just being in the house and His glory, and I'm
totally fine with that. And I'm not saying that his
glory has not shown up in yet.
Speaker 2 (45:36):
House.
Speaker 1 (45:37):
I think that there is a season for everything. But
then there's also a difference in isolation and being afraid
of going back into community. So I'm very curious on
how you would encourage someone that has been struggling with that.
Speaker 3 (45:51):
Absolutely, I think that, Oh my gosh, I love when
I don't know if you've seen those memes on Instagram,
but it's like God, I love you so much, but
your children, I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
Lord, send Jesus now. They need you like I love you.
It's your people.
Speaker 3 (46:10):
It's your fault, Lord, but we are his people exactly.
I am his child too. I think that one of
the things that has helped me, uh deal with this
because like now now I work in ministry, and how
you feel like I see it all? I see so
much and God has given me, uh what people call
(46:35):
a gift. Sometimes I call it a little bit of
a not so much of a gift.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
Yeah, yeah, it is a gift.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
It's hard sometimes when you're able to do it.
Speaker 3 (46:47):
And I walk around and I tell my husband, got
prap up that one. Be careful with that one. And
he's such a kind soul and he's like, I don't know.
And then months later he's like.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
Oh, yeah, I didn't see that one coming, uh huh.
Speaker 3 (47:03):
And I have asked God, I'm like, Lord, why do
you give me so much discernment? Like I don't want
to see people different? I don't want to you know.
And he's like, well, you got to mix that discernment
with wisdom, because if you don't mix that discernment with
my wisdom and my love and my grace, then it's
just pride for you to walk around and saying I
was right about that one.
Speaker 2 (47:26):
So yeah, I'm can I tell you that will preach?
Speaker 1 (47:31):
And can I tell you I so relate to that?
And to be honest with you, have literally had this
running joke with my husband to where have you ever
noticed that sometimes the most prophetic people are so prideful
and so mean?
Speaker 2 (47:45):
And it's because when they see.
Speaker 1 (47:47):
And I always I ask like the same question, why
do you let me see? And he has told me
before because I want you to pray because you see
and then you judge, and then you see and then
you want to warn. But there's an aspect of you
see and I need you to poray right.
Speaker 3 (48:01):
Right, right, yes, And so good, same thing, pray. And
I think that sometimes when I deserned something in a
person or in a situation, the Lord wants to reveal
something in my heart. The Lord wants to reveal something
in me. And I catch myself thinking whether that's or
(48:25):
you know, I never struggle with that or or judgment
or comparison or whatever it may be. And again those
things where like the Lord meant it for good. And
then so really that's how we like enters the body
of Christ with wanting to pervert things. I mean, even
(48:49):
the way that God created creation. It was supposed to
be beautiful. And then he comes in with the lies,
and then he comes in with with his fear, with
his stuff, and then you're just so, it's when we
separate ourselves from God that we're not able to handle things,
you know, in a way that is with grace, with wisdom,
with love. But to answer your question, I believe that
(49:12):
when we walk into the church understanding that we are
all broken, that we are all in this walk of
getting to know God. Because I think that when we
say I don't need the church, I don't need to
go to the building, I think that we are automatically
(49:33):
saying I am better than them, I'm better than that.
I don't need that, I don't need people. And where
does that come with pride? And again, is this constant
pursuit of him that will allow us to really see
what are the areas in our heart that need to
humble ourselves. And here's the other thing that, let me
(49:54):
remind you all that is biblical iron sharpens iron, meaning
we're always going to encounter people, I mean, even our spouse,
even our children like and why because there's pride and
there's pride. And then when both prides just rub around
like it's just you know, but what happens. What happens
(50:16):
when you sharpen two irons, you know, they become sharper.
But again is when we allow the Lord to come
in with that wisdom, when we humble ourselves and say, hey, God,
here I am. But one of the things, you know,
in our church we do this where we have lots
of small groups, and the small groups are moms or
(50:39):
cooking or the gym or you know, I did one
with my book or so it's like finding smaller settings
with people that you can do things that maybe you're
going to be able to enjoy and it's really stepping
out of your comfort zone, but also asking God, God
my heart. I think that you know that that part
(51:02):
in the world where it says to God our hearts,
like that is something that we need to live by
every single day because at the end of the day,
you can go ahead and find community somewhere else. But
but is it. Is it really people in the community
that are gonna love you, that are gonna want to
do what's best for you? And so but at the
(51:23):
same time, let's have the right expectations that God is
God and that people are not God. That the body
of Christ it's gonna probably messed up, you know, like
who crucified Jesus the religious leaders like and so two
(51:43):
of his closest like disciples, one denied him, one betrayed him.
And you see what I'm saying, Like it's just unfortunately
is part of life. But what did Jesus He still
believed in them. He sat at the table with Judas,
knowing he washed Peter's feet, knowing that he was going
to deny him. And I know that sounds like so crazy,
(52:04):
but that's being like Jesus, And it's really sometimes just
putting our hearts out there and understanding and knowing that
God is going to use it all for good. But
then at the end, if something happens, He's going to
sharpen our hearts. And then going back to idolatry where
we idolizing the community and the church to where we
put it in such a high pedalstool that now going
(52:27):
to church and being part of God's community and it's just.
Speaker 2 (52:31):
Out the door.
Speaker 3 (52:32):
So it's just finding that balance and that you know,
of Lord God my heart here I am. I'm here
for you. I want to do this. I know that
people may fail me, but I trust you God, and
I want to step into my God given purpose and
I want to serve you at church. And I know
that walking in your perfect will requires me to be
(52:56):
part of a community. And so yeah, so isolation. I
believe it's alive from the enemy and God doesn't want
us to live life like that.
Speaker 1 (53:07):
So and on that note that was so Bars, Can
I just say thank you, thank you for you have
such a and clearly we know like this is just
the Lord's hand on you, but there's such wisdom and
grace that you carry that the tough conversations that people
(53:28):
seem to have like a tough time, especially the church.
Just discussing it just seems that the Lord has given
you just the ease to be able to communicate to
his people, right, and it brings It brings understanding, and
it brings revelation and and that brings restoration in a
renewed mind. And that's what we need every single day.
(53:50):
So just thank you for just being so transparent, thank
you for being so honoring and how you do it, Like, listen,
you got the honor thing down, you understand.
Speaker 2 (54:00):
You do? You do?
Speaker 3 (54:01):
You do you do?
Speaker 1 (54:03):
I mean, you know it's a process, but I feel
like that's how you do it.
Speaker 2 (54:07):
This is how you honor.
Speaker 1 (54:08):
The church by not idolizing the You get what I'm
saying there, You can tell that you truly walk this
thing out with the Lord and that He has truly
been with you, and like just like revealing that to you.
So thank you so much for testifying. So for people
that can find you, also order the book, like tell
them all.
Speaker 2 (54:29):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (54:30):
Yeah, let's be friends on Instagram and that's where I
hang out most of the time. If you want to
follow my pregnancy journey, I've been sharing all pregnancy stuff.
Speaker 2 (54:39):
Mother, I love it. You're so funny. She has humor
to y'all. Go he follow on Instagram. It's so funny.
Speaker 3 (54:46):
I love making people love, okay, So yeah, you can
find me on Instagram at M E R I Underscore
Duarte d U A r T E Underscore. You can
go to my website medidaktor dot com be part of
my email list. I send out devotionals and the book.
The book is available on Amazon. You can just search
(55:08):
church Heal to buy medid and it's right there. And yeah,
I love making friends and I am excited to just
meet more people, share my testimony and get to know
more people.
Speaker 1 (55:20):
So yeah, guys, definitely go follow her. Order the book
order Churchill today at Amazon. Guys, thank you so much
for tuning into this week's episode of the KOs Podcast.
Speaker 2 (55:31):
Until next week, be blessed,
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