Fans DEMAND Change for UFL Season 2! What to Expect in 2025!!

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:12):
Well here, we are, happy New Year. We have great
parks back on ufl board. On paternity leave, Greg, how
the heck are you? It's been an exciting time for
you and your family.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
It has, thank you, Reid.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
We had our little blessing on Christmas Eve, so I
got to spend Christmas all Christmas in the hospital, which
is not the greatest place to spend Christmas, but for
a good cause for sure. And I've been off the
last couple of weeks, you know, helping my wife out
here around the house with the baby and everything like that.
And it's been a lot of fun, a lot of

(00:46):
new things, learning new things every day how to take
care of a small child. But it's been, you know,
a blessing. It's we're so happy she's healthy and everything
like that. So I go back to school next week.
It's going to be off, but you know, got gotta
continue making that money.

Speaker 4 (01:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Well, so to set the stage here, Greg's coming on today.
Greg just put out a poll for ufl board, kind
of leading in the season two. What did fans think about,
you know, kind of temperature check for season one? What
do we think about season two? We'll get Greg's thoughts
on that I know. Greg's also been busy with the
Raw on Netflix. I've been watching lots of PW Torch stuff.
Not that much Greg on there, but obviously talking with

(01:26):
you behind the scenes, but see and Wade and Brandon
and everyone else there. You pentus debut and everything, so
I'm very excited about it. I have my seeing this
shirt and I have my plane ticket spot for Vegas,
so I haven't quite popped on the two thousand dollars
or whatever for a two day ticket, but we'll see.
So we'll talk wrest Real Quick Power rankings. New Baby
Raw on Netflix, UFL season two.

Speaker 4 (01:48):
What is the order of importance here at the Parks House?

Speaker 3 (01:51):
New Baby number one, which means some of the things
that used to be priorities or not so anymore. But
UFL season two number two, Raw on Netflix, number three.
I mean it's still Monday Night Raw. Not a ton
has changed. So that's that's kind of the order my
first impressions right now.

Speaker 1 (02:10):
Anyway, we'll get well, we'll talk here, so UFL season two,
we'll get through the poll results here in a minute.

Speaker 4 (02:16):
Greg.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
We haven't had you one since you know, we had
the schedule release. We were talking there opening expansion for ownership.
We had John Lewis come on with John Lewis Sports
to kind of talk through all of that stuff over
kind of the ob season. What is just kind of
general thoughts here were January fifteenth, as we record this,
I think it will be Friday, you know, March twenty eighth,
Wriday's kickoff. We just saw Jordan Taamu re sign. We've

(02:38):
had some transactions and things. How are you kind of
feeling right now?

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Pretty optimistic, you know, I think things never really move
at the pace that we would prefer them to. You know,
we wanted this schedule earlier, partly because we wanted them
to be able to sell individual tickets earlier to individual games,
which I think is probably coming maybe at the end
of this month beginning of next month, based on kind

(03:04):
of what I've seen out there. But you know, they're
doing things, They're getting these done transactions. You mentioned, they're
signing a lot of talented players. I think the talent
pool for twenty twenty five in the UFL is going
to be deeper than even twenty twenty four. So I'm
really looking forward to that, and not only the talent

(03:25):
pool being deeper, but now you're in season three, season
four of some of these teams existing under these coaching staffs.
So you should see the gelling of these teams and
the opening of the playbooks both offensively and defensively get
a little better. You're not going to see the simplicity
maybe that you saw at times last season because they

(03:47):
were rushing around and so many players were new because
of the dispersal draft and everything like that. You know,
you've got players going on season four of a Birmingham Stallions.
You're going on players who are on season three playing
under Bob Stoops.

Speaker 2 (04:00):
And the our Legs and Renegade.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
So you know that's the that's the opportunity for coaches
to kind of say, okay, we have the basics down,
we have the playbook down pretty well, let's add some
wrinkles to it as we go. So I'm hoping we
see that. We've seen ownership and some high level management
talk in the off season. They seem very optimistic. Of course,
what else are they going to say? Right, But I

(04:23):
mean that kind of gives you the warm fuzzies inside.
Heading into season two, we're seeing the commercials drop. I know, Reid,
you've had some strong feelings about the commercials.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
Thoughts you like the commercial I mean, I'm glad they're
getting the airtime. Don't get me wrong, I think it's
obviously a big spot right now. But yeah, what's your
thoughts on I like.

Speaker 3 (04:40):
Them, and I like them because they're creative. They catch
your eye if you're someone who doesn't really pay much
attention to commercials and kind of, you know it, kind
of let commercials.

Speaker 2 (04:50):
Wash over you.

Speaker 3 (04:50):
You may take a second to stop and it might
attract your eyes. But most of all, it gives the
impression that Fox is serious about this. They obviously put
a lot of time and effort. This wasn't just slapping
some highlights together and doing a voiceover and saying, oh,
let's just put it out there. You know this is
They really marketed this, and they really put some thought

(05:12):
into the marketing of these ads. So that gives me
a lot of confidence about where Fox is at with
with the UFL as a brand. So maybe even more
so than just liking the commercials, I like what the
presentation tells me as a viewer.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
Yeah, meanwhile, you know you have ESPN and you have
destroying on right. They clearly the league views him as
one of the more marketable stars. And you know they
said it up at the beginning, right, Okay, you know
Donald's back here season, you know, his second season, but
it was you know, mostly about Donald, Okay, training with
Travis Hunter, how's your YouTube channel going?

Speaker 4 (05:48):
And like ESPN's and media partner.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
Right, So they should be doing in my view, the
same that Foxes in terms of running and all that.

Speaker 4 (05:54):
Yeah, in terms of ownership.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
We saw The Rock on Netflix obviously not talk you know,
I talk UFL. In his New Year's Day posts, there
was a lot of like doing things that you want
to do, not versus not doing things you have to do.
And I'm curious for the UFL fits into the kind
of the Rocks, you know, current kind of mindset of that.

Speaker 2 (06:12):
I did like.

Speaker 1 (06:13):
Also, we had rest Brandon on Front Office Sports this
week with their editor in chief. I thought candid, I
thought Russ is always pretty good for that and talking like, wow,
we're still really trying to be nimble and we don't
really have a game plan yet, We're still trying to
kind of figure this out.

Speaker 4 (06:25):
I like that. I like kind of that open honesty.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
I wish they were a little bit more with the
fans that would But I like that, like, hey, we're
really trying to figure this out, like we don't have
all the answers. Do you like that kind of that
humility of that for the league I found. I think
it's a good look for Russ, who sometimes, you know,
as a former NFL guy, could come across as like
I'm an expert, which obviously he is, but like kind
of being a little bit more honest.

Speaker 3 (06:46):
Sure, And what it does is it tempers expectations. I think,
you know, we would love to see this league take
off like a rocket and spend all kinds of money
to do that and to patch the holes that they
have right now. And we'll get into what some of
those holes are that fans see. But I think realistically,

(07:06):
and you know, this is something Russ Brandon brings up
all the time when he does interview with something Daryl
Johnson brings up all the time when they do interviews,
is we've just passed the one year mark of the
UFL as an entity. And so I think that kind
of for the people who are constantly wanting and wanting
from the league, I think what that does is it
kind of says, okay, let's take a step back here,
and let's understand where we are as a brand. We're

(07:28):
one year in and when you look at year one
of the UFL, yes you can pick knits, and yes
you can complain about some things attendance, marketing, whatever like that.
But just the fact that they were able to have
the quality of broadcasts and have the quality of gameplay
that they had kicking off just over two months after
the merger was official is really a feather in the

(07:48):
cap of league management and ownership. So I think we
have to look at that as well. But now, obviously
full off season in the books heading into year two,
this is where you want to see some of those improved,
and so I think ownership and league management acknowledge that
where they're where they have shortcomings and where they're trying
to improve.

Speaker 4 (08:08):
All right, so let's look into this year.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
We'll go through all the survey votes and we'll get
Greg Stotts on all this, and then we have some
questions for.

Speaker 4 (08:14):
The audience at the end.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
Like I said, like as I bring my microphone like
and subscribe, try to get to four that subscribers, Tostiner
throw Retros is going to give away a customer a
couple of custom jerseys.

Speaker 4 (08:23):
We can take them all that.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
I have a c Dragon's twenty twenty awagersy lots of
different options there, and they have lots of UFL and
stuff here as well.

Speaker 4 (08:30):
But I will link the article in the YouTube.

Speaker 1 (08:34):
Here we have the UFL Fan Voice Survey resultant analysts.
First question here, and obviously I'll encourage you know, everyone
to go on and kind of read through all this,
but we're talking question one, how would you grade ownership
on the overall performance of the first season of the UFL.
You can see their fifty percent vast majority with a.

Speaker 4 (08:50):
B feeling good. I hear that.

Speaker 1 (08:53):
Yeah, if it was just a championship game, it might
not be that might not be a bee. But overall,
I mean, I think everyone left the season feeling like, Okay,
this was you know, we accomplished this. You know, the
wedding happened, right, we kind of got through the event.
What did you make and what did you see here?
And that we talked a lot about kind of the
difference between social media, you know, and what the actual results.

Speaker 4 (09:13):
And kind of feelings are. So what did you take
from this?

Speaker 3 (09:16):
Sure, you know, social media you can kind of get
bogged down in negativity. And that goes for any topic,
not just the UFL. But you know, as you know,
I'm a wrestling fan. I cover professional wrestling, and it's
the same way there, and I'm sure it's the same
once you get into any genre of entertainment that there's
just a lot of negativity. So sometimes when you surround
yourself with that, it can feel like, boy, nobody likes this,

(09:38):
nobody likes the decisions they're making. Everybody's very hard on ownership.
But again, when you take a step back and you
realize where we are with the UFL in year two,
when you realize all the heavy lifting that had to
be done to make season one happen the way it did,
I think people looked at ownership and said, okay, you know,
we'll give them a be They got it off the ground.

(09:58):
It was an entertaining product. It worked right, It drew
viewership to the television networks, which is one of the
big goals. And I am curious as to now that
that has worn off a little bit, now that the
ownership and the management have a full off season, and
now that we get into year two, if there are

(10:21):
not a lot of changes, if attendance doesn't go up,
if ratings don't go up substantially, if it's the same broadcast,
Like is that honeymoon over with the fans? Are they
gonna look with a with a more strict eye at
ownership next year when we do this survey and say, well,
year one looked a lot like yar too, that they
didn't make those improvements, They didn't make those jumps that
they had talked about wanting to make in the off season.

Speaker 4 (10:44):
I think a lot.

Speaker 1 (10:45):
And we've heard this even when Daryl Johnston was on
the show and rest on the interview this week with
throat off of sports, like a lot on that, man,
we really had too much and like and I totally
buy that right where they were kind of in a
little bit of a standstill, and you know, I think
maybe more football ops that way, right, Maybe there's more
conversations happening behind the scenes and we're maybe, hey, we're
working out together because we're kind of probably you know, hey,

(11:07):
we're going to be together. But you know, like the
teams and everything existed. I mean, like, yeah, it was
a really fire hose like hydrant. Okay, we got to
go now we have but it wasn't like none of
the infrastructure was in place. I mean, I do obviously
grant them kind of that grace, but I think a
lot to that. The other thing just for me with
Russ on that interview this week, they were talking about
and obviously Reus isn't going to get into like performance metrics,

(11:28):
which I was kind of helping of, like money, you're ratings.
It's like, well, you know, we're on seventy six or
seventy eight percent of our games are on broadcast. It's like, well,
that's not because of like anything you guys earned. I mean,
that's because Fox and ESPN have a vested interest in
making this work. But it wasn't like you've started and
you know it was like wrestling, you started in a
warehouse whatever on you know, close circuit. Now you've worked

(11:50):
your way up to a Netflix. I mean, you were
given a lot of this that we're kind of promoting
as part of your success.

Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah, and I think that's more of you know, him saying,
this is a spring league that's going to work, and
why is it going to work? It's because we are
seventy six or seventy eight percent on you know, Fox, ESPN, ABC,
whatever it is, it's giving the viewers the best chance
to sample the product. They're not hiding this away. So

(12:16):
I think it's also saying, hey, ownership is serious about this.
They're giving us prime real estate on their television networks.
They want it to succeed. We wanted to succeed, So,
you know, I think it's more of that than saying, hey, look,
you know we did so well that we're on these networks.

Speaker 4 (12:32):
Now.

Speaker 3 (12:32):
I don't think it was that so much as we're
on these networks and it's giving us the best chance
of success as a spring league because anytime a Russ
Brandon is out there or anyone else, you know, they're
they're not talking to fans, they're talking to potential sponsors.
They're talking to potential team owners, they're talking to potential

(12:53):
investors in the league, and they want those people to
know that.

Speaker 2 (12:56):
It's safe to invest with the UFL.

Speaker 3 (12:59):
They're not going anywhere. And this is an example of.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
That, especially like with that army stuff that kind of
came out. Are you sed to pro I mean, it
didn't really seem like they had really any long lat
It felt like that could have been a thing with
the Rock and them it feels like they kind of
weathered that in terms of sponsorships, kind of you know,
rushing to pull out or anything.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
That story felt so one sided and so like outrageously,
how do you even measure the fact that they lost
commitments based on this sponge Like it just seemed like
someone had an axe to grind and there was not
a lot of fact checking done by the author.

Speaker 2 (13:35):
There was not a lot.

Speaker 3 (13:35):
I mean, it was just so outrageous some of the
claims in there that it was just really hard I
think for anyone to take seriously that the article and
some of the claims in there. So I think that's
why maybe it didn't take hold as much as it did.
And now, of course Russ Brandon saying, hey, we're we're
on we're on good terms. Although I think an article
came out and said that the Army isn't going to

(13:58):
be working with the UFL this year, or at least
isn't going to be a presenting sponsor the way it
was last year. So they may have several ties, but
it certainly it doesn't sound like it's as acrimonious as
the initial article made it sound.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
Yeah, we were in Boston that week on my Kamara
inners like Party road Trip.

Speaker 4 (14:13):
So obviously it was not the height of my I
was like, oh, this is interesting.

Speaker 1 (14:16):
I will say though, in just one of my cracking
podcasts I was listening to yesterday, was talking about this
that we've had coaching issues and locker room issues, and
this national media reporter came out and have the story
and there were all these questions and they raised a
good point, and I would echo this with the UFL
that like, you know, we're kind of in this minutia
every day, right, you know, as much as we can't
where you know, you do get like the Kevin Sefferts

(14:38):
of the world or whoever had that report, Like you know,
they're kind of popping in once every three or four
months kind of like okay, what's going on, Okay, what's
the league? Told me, like, you're not getting that same
kind of access that way, And maybe there was ruffle
feathers or whatever, but it's you know, you're you're someone
that's just kind of popping into the situation to figure
it out, versus like I've been living through this the
entire season and like, yeah, that doesn't make I just

(15:00):
thought it was interesting because people were going crazy for Seattle,
and you're, well, this is just.

Speaker 4 (15:03):
One local guy either not even the local.

Speaker 1 (15:05):
Guy, one national guy from you know, Minneapolis or whatever,
freaking out about this. And you're like, well, okay, let's
we can kind of look through this with a little
bit different support support your local media, yes, yes, yes,
anything else with that, anything else with uh. I mean,
I would probably be a B minus BB minus, but
that's fine to have an abc D, you know. I
would be in that camp.

Speaker 4 (15:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (15:25):
And what I did too, because we had done at
UFL board back last year when it was XFL board,
we had done a very similar survey a lot of
the similar questions that I asked at the end of
the XFL twenty twenty three season, and so I kind
of compared the scores to each other for the UFL

(15:46):
and XFL, and certainly the scores were quite similar in
terms of the B. That was the overarching feeling of
XFL fans after twenty twenty three.

Speaker 2 (15:57):
They gave it a B. Although the ds.

Speaker 3 (16:00):
And f's were much less for UFL ownership this year
than it was for XFL ownership the end of twenty
twenty three season.

Speaker 1 (16:06):
You probably had a lot of USFL guys too like
this stalk like this was no good.

Speaker 4 (16:10):
We're now we're kind of all in this, you know,
we're all in the.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
Van together, right, yeah, all we're all on the road trip.
How would you say, see on field play? This is
in line with what I would say in terms of,
you know, better than I expected. Fifty three point two percent,
a worse point five percent, you know, about what I expected.

Speaker 4 (16:27):
That's what I've always said.

Speaker 1 (16:28):
The quality of play with the XFL, and certainly as
you set off the top with the talent sign going
into this year, that is one of these strengths. You know,
this is the highest quality of football we've seen in
the spring league right in at least since kind of
the eighties. Thoughts on that in terms of that statement
and then the results.

Speaker 3 (16:45):
Yeah, for sure, promising results if you're the UFL, you know,
especially the football ops department. You guys know what they're doing,
and so you know, the the about what I expected
is a little misleading because if you expected a higher
level and it was a higher level, that I mean,
that's your vote. So it is very promising to see

(17:06):
that a lot of people. The football is not the problem.
Is what we can say by this answer, you know,
we can kind of set that aside and say, because
a lot of times when we talk about spring football,
we say that a big part of its success is
going to be what is the quality of play on
the field. I think we can kind of set that
aside now and we can focus on some of the
other issues that need work correct.

Speaker 1 (17:27):
And I agree without one hundred percent, I think a
lot is rested from ownership on the quality of And
it's like, yes, like we understand the quality of sport.
You know, the football is great. Now we need to
focus on other things, like you've done step one, but
there's eighty seven, you know. And I'm just thinking about
all the different TV shows coming back, like that Severance
is on Apple and I think Dorothy went to school
with the guy that like works on that show. But

(17:49):
like we it's such a we talk rate and we'll
talk TV ratings on this. We're in such a fragment
in space anymore, Like you know, what is TV ratings anymore?

Speaker 4 (17:59):
You know, Netflix is thrilled.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
With this stuff with raw and there, like you know,
it's a whole new benchmark. They can't even I don't know.
I just think there's there's so much fragmentation anymore. But yes,
I feeling the play is good and I do think
it will only improve with kind of you know that
we've had some coaching shakeups and some players resigned and
we're still kind of figuring out all that stuff. But
I do think, yeah, it should be good going into
the season. Anything else on this.

Speaker 2 (18:22):
One, I think that's it.

Speaker 4 (18:25):
Now.

Speaker 1 (18:25):
This is surprising number three, Taking into account all aspects
of production, Which network do you believe had the better
game at?

Speaker 4 (18:32):
Fox?

Speaker 1 (18:33):
Know, Abc, ESPN or no significant Everyone raves about the
Fox broadcast. Everyone at least our audience is very down
on the ESPN broadcast. So this to me very speaks
to yes, Fox with forty six percent. I don't get
that more than just like people are down on the
ESPN talent or the focus on betting, Like what do
you Obviously Fox has been in but ESPN has been

(18:56):
doing football games for decades too.

Speaker 3 (18:58):
Yeah, anecdotally, I was hearing the same things you were
that people were saying Fox was such a better broadcast,
and I'm scratching my head and I'm like maybe, like,
but to me, it's incremental, if anything, And then to
see it born out in the results. I mean, like,
I mean, this is the hard data, right, this is
people are really thinking this. So I think part of

(19:20):
it is people get annoyed by the betting, which was
a lot heavier on the ESPN side of things. I
think some of it could be the talent that you
mentioned in terms of presentation. Fox I think probably had
a little higher level. You know, Joel Klatt doing games.
I mean, that's a big deal. He does major college
football games. He's probably one of the best in the

(19:42):
business as a color analyst, and ESPN didn't really have
anyone that could approach that. Like I loved Greg McElroy
in XFL twenty twenty and twenty twenty three, he wasn't
there last year for ESPN. So I think those two
maybe the two keys. Beyond that, I don't really have
an answer that would push so far in the direction
of saying, well, Fox's broadcast was a lot better. I

(20:05):
do think I think that ABC and ESPN had a
lot more of the audio from on field and from
coaches that were live, so there was a lot more
muting of things, and Fox didn't have that audio and
didn't have the muting issues when you had guys cursing
and things like that. So if that was something that
annoyed you as well, that may have pushed you in

(20:26):
the direction of Fox for this answer.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
Yeah, we said before, you know, this is Fox just
knows how to do their football and there's no real
sense that this is any sort of different product right
than the NFL, just in terms of the resources and
the way they talk and they do it.

Speaker 4 (20:40):
Just it's it's the same game where you know, it
feels a little bit more bootleggy.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
Sometimes on ESPN with Fox or excuse me, with the
you know, XFL and then the UFL, like I agree
with the with the betting, and then also yeah, like
ESPN had laid off all those people, so you're getting
people that aren't you know, maybe weren't even the bea
tier that were kind of going on.

Speaker 3 (20:59):
The familiarity too, I think is is the thing. Because
Fox announcers may have felt like they were a little
more familiar with the product and some of the players
than the ESPN ABC announcers were. That could have been
another point in Fox's favor.

Speaker 4 (21:15):
Yeah, we had heard.

Speaker 1 (21:16):
That, like, well, it didn't seem like the ESPN like
maybe they hadn't research enough, like We've had Kevin Cooler
on here a lot talking about like, God, I gotta
spend hours kind of figuring out who all these players are,
because this isn't LIKEAKA Patrick Mahomes, where you just the
story rights itself. I got to talk about okay, and
then Jorin Tamu when he win did this and he
was here like and maybe they just don't have the
time right, maybe they're trying to balance and that's one

(21:37):
of eighteen things on their slate that week, so I
could see that as well. But yeah, definitely know that
not a surprise for me that way. Uh, this is
a big going to get Rick Sarah tell on talking
about the live experience of a UFO game. When Rick
McGray on the hear of that episode, Rick went like,
with Sports to Earth, like, how would you assess the
live experience UFL game better about what I expect?

Speaker 4 (22:00):
Worse than I expect?

Speaker 1 (22:01):
Did not attend to me, no surprise, thirty five percent
obviously over we have a you know, a third of
the people didn't attend the games. That makes sense considering
the UFL this season is not in all the same markets.
Maybe you were a fan of you know, XFL Seattle,
and you're not in all that. I've had a great
time every time I've gone to the games. I think
they spend a lot of time working, you know, halftime

(22:24):
things and he kind of for media, commercial breaks and
doing things with the fans.

Speaker 4 (22:28):
Greg have you.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
I can't remember if you had a chance to attend
the game live and then if so, but then.

Speaker 4 (22:32):
What's your thoughts on the results.

Speaker 3 (22:34):
I attended a Orlando Guardians game as media, so I
was in the press box. I've never been to a
game sitting in the fans. Yeah, So look, I think
one thing we have to remember about a survey of
this nature is I'm not going out in the community
and surveying fans. I'm not going to the stadium and
surveying fans. These are the hardcore fans that are taking

(22:58):
the survey, and so if you just asked a casual
fan who may kind of stumble into a game at
some point, they may have different answers than this. So
I think that's something we have to keep in mind
with not just this answer, but the survey as a whole,
is you know, these are the fans who are seeking
out information about UFL online, and so I just want
to throw that out there as well. But I wrote

(23:20):
in my analysis here, which you can see on the screen,
you know, this is a feather in the cap of
a lot of the people who work hard behind the
scenes at the stadium, the people who, as you mentioned,
come up with the ideas of how to entertain the
fans at halftime, and come up with the giveaways and
do the local advertising to get fans out and do
you know things like that. I mean that is to

(23:42):
have a majority or a plurality anyway say that an
experience was better than they expect.

Speaker 2 (23:48):
It even is a.

Speaker 3 (23:51):
Good thing, and hopefully that kind of word of mouth
spreads at the anecdotal level in these cities, because you know,
you need fans to attend these games.

Speaker 4 (24:01):
Yeah, I to me.

Speaker 1 (24:02):
This speaks better to this result, just because, like you said,
these are the hardcore fans, like I would think a casual.

Speaker 4 (24:09):
Fan, the experience plays very well.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
Like I think this is probably a little bit more
like a string, you know, like a hardcore wrestling pan.
Like I have my expectations where you're just bringing the family.
You're like, like Dorothy, doesn't you know, like, oh this
is fun, Like we're going I will say, as someone
that has attended you know, these games as a fan
and media, you know, but as a fan with Dorothy
and then uh CFL games like there is a lot
of heavy lifting needed to kind of keep everybody engaged

(24:34):
during the entire time, you know, especially halftime and stead
when you don't necessarily know all the players. So I
think they do a good job is lifting that Dorothy
and I always laugh. I think it was last year
we saw a BC Lions game and that, you know,
the quarter entertainment or the halftime entertainment was the guy
had already, you know, walking into the game, had won
a free tire for his car, and they're like, well,
you can risk that to win up to four tires,

(24:57):
And I'm like, okay, so this is like, well, you're
you've already one, like you can just walk out of here.
But no, but it's a lot of heavy lifting.

Speaker 4 (25:03):
I think they do.

Speaker 2 (25:04):
And that's the importance of local sponsorship too. Get those
local companies involved.

Speaker 3 (25:08):
Get a tire shop here, who's going to donate it,
and then advertise it at halftime that hey, this is
coming from this local tire shop. I mean, that's the
kind of really outside the box thinking you've got to
do when you have you know, this isn't an NFL
team where sponsors are going to want to flock to it.
You have to go out there and pound the pavement
for these sponsors and for these local companies. And those
are the kind of creative things sometimes you.

Speaker 2 (25:29):
Have to do.

Speaker 1 (25:30):
And that's also the one of the roles and this
you know kind of all season long employees we need
to have for this league. It's like you're the one
going in this time of year, like, hey, what do
you think about sponsoring this upcoman like even the Cracking
podcast we listen to, Like they got some lawyer sponsoring them. Now,
Like you know, you got to be creative with that,
like hey, you got a couple hundred bucks to throw
our away and we can put your name, you know,

(25:50):
like you got to always be in this. Yeah, like
you said, this is not the NFL at all. I've
always said, this is way more like the CFL, where
you really you need to be proactive and going out
there anything else game day. I think they do a
good job that they always got people working, boots and
stuff chon ta you can.

Speaker 4 (26:05):
Walk around that whole thing.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
There's stuff to look at I thought they do a
good job with the shops Day of two.

Speaker 4 (26:10):
I think you can get a lot of good stuff there.

Speaker 1 (26:11):
They had all sorts of different stuff you could try
on anything else with that.

Speaker 3 (26:15):
The one question I didn't ask, and maybe it was
an oversight on my part, I certainly didn't purposely omit.
It was asking about the pricing of tickets, and I
wonder if people took that into account when they answered
this question, because you know, UFL game is a lot
more affordable than a lot of the other professional sports
that may be happening in that city, So some people
may have taken that into account when they're answering this question.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
Positively, Yeah, I agree. I to me, the only bemoaning
I've ever seen for tickets was like when they increased
it from ten dollars versus twenty twenty to now, Like,
I mean, this is very affordable compared to any Like, yeah,
I understand you might have been paying sixty and now
you're paying seventy five or whatever, but like, in all,
this is pretty affordable. Someone that pays one hundred and

(26:59):
sixty dollars AG cracking gams like this is pretty affordable
to go, right, How would you access UFL's merchandise, I
take you too. I like this question and taking into
kout variety, price quality better than I expected about forty six,
worse than I expected twenty eight, and then no opinion
at thirteen.

Speaker 4 (27:17):
Yeah, I feel like it's there and nothing's really wowed me.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
I have thoughts, you know, when the shop came on
and I thought they should have had more available if
you're going to make a big shop launch as opposed
to kind of silently rolling stuff out.

Speaker 4 (27:28):
I won't be buying any more UFL merch But what
do you think of kind of the you know the
results of the question.

Speaker 3 (27:34):
I haven't purchased any so my answer was no opinion
on this. I'm still kind of waiting for, Like, I
don't want to buy a bunch of UFL merchant then
like have them say, oh we're shutting down. I'm like, okay,
what am I going to do with all this Memphis
show boat stuff? So I would like to see the
league survive and thrive before I start spending significant money
on merchandise. But you know, from browsing the shop as

(27:57):
I do from time to time, it certainly looked a
lot better than the XFL shop and the answers when
you compare because I asked a similar question about the
XFL and the answers are certainly a lot more favorable
to the UFL Shop. And I do think the variety
is there. I do think they look good to me.
A lot of the products, a lot of the clothing

(28:18):
and things like that you would expect as time goes
on for them to continue to roll out new products.
But yeah, about what I expected. I'm surprised better than
I expected didn't get more votes, just because that's kind
of my own from perusing the shop. I kind of
thought it's better, especially for year one again, we go
back to kind of grading on a curve here, and

(28:40):
for the UFL shop to have the level of merchandise
they do having just been over a year old is
pretty impressive to me.

Speaker 4 (28:48):
It feels like a shop now.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
It felt like when the especially when the USFL had
their original one, like that was when Paul and I
were making like our own stuff, you know, when we
were kind of really on the merch thing. I'm like,
just it's mostly just for us to be able to
buy stuff to wear, but like they were using like
the same templates and things that we were using, and
I'm like, this does not speak to like a high
quality we're We're like, oh, I see how they design

(29:13):
those sweatpants because we have the exact same you know,
like we're using the same software. That should not be
a good thing. It feels like more of a shop now.
I'm pricing wise. Shit, I just bought that John c
in the shirt. It's like forty five bucks. I mean
that's about it's wrestling sure in the while, so like
clearly that's like what the pricing is now. But I
was I was surprised forty five bucks pust shipping for
a WWE T shirt.

Speaker 3 (29:34):
And pricing maybe too, because that's one thing I noticed
as well.

Speaker 2 (29:36):
I mean, the price is to me.

Speaker 3 (29:37):
And again I don't buy a lot of merch so
you know, maybe, as you said, that's the going rate
now for merchandise for major companies. Like I kind of
I'm afraid now to go on the NFL shop and
see how much things are. But the prices do seem high,
but again that could be just the going rate these days.

Speaker 1 (29:57):
Oh and then the last thing I was going to
say was just in terms of like we always get
that like with missprints and stuff, you know, in terms
of like quality, I think the quality of merchandise is
just plummeted, like across the board. I don't even think
it's UFL thing, And I think fanatics and just whole
like I get so many like really nice hats and
things I bought that like don't look right in so anyway.

(30:17):
I mean, I've seen quality issues and I even I
think my XFL twenty twenty one of my jerseys was
printed like crooked. Like the quality of merchandise is surrendous anymore. So,
I you know, I think that the UFL is just
a part of that as well.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
Now, this is what we like.

Speaker 1 (30:31):
What is the most important thing the UFL needs to
improve for season two? More advertising to the league nationally
we see those commercials, more marketing of the league in
team markets, more competitive pay to attract players, stronger social
media presence, better communication from the league, depth charts, injury reports,
things with the fans games, I'm more consistent time slots

(30:52):
is zero percent voted for that, which is weird. Higher
quality of on field play ten percent, and then other
please specify with five percent. So majority of echoing us
forty eight percent want more advertising in the team markets.
I think nationally right now, we're doing fine. We've been
talking about those commercials. Pay for the players got a
large portion as well, with thirteen percent.

Speaker 4 (31:11):
This echoes what I've been screaming.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
I'm are you surprised with these results at all?

Speaker 3 (31:15):
I'm a little surprised because I offered so many possibilities
and this just came.

Speaker 2 (31:20):
From what I had been hearing.

Speaker 3 (31:22):
Like I tried to take whether it was on podcasts,
whether it was on social media, whether it was on
the ufl board message board. I tried to take in
all of the stuff that I'd been hearing consistently and
offer those as options. And of course the other option
as well, that where people can kind of write in
their own if I didn't touch on it, so I
thought maybe giving so many options, one wouldn't be the

(31:46):
overwhelming winner. But as I mentioned in the analysis, fans
didn't take that bait, and it was advertising in team markets.
I think fans acknowledge the need to grow attended in
these markets, the need to get word out about these teams,
especially with the use of the hub in Arlington. When

(32:07):
these teams are not located in these cities, it is
especially important for the marketing to reach the fans and
the people in those cities and so and look, this
is something that the league acknowledges. Again when when Mouse Johnson,
when Russ Brandegle and do these media interviews, they acknowledge.

Speaker 2 (32:25):
This as much as we do.

Speaker 3 (32:27):
So it's one thing to acknowledge, it's another thing to
do something about it and to have an effective plan
in place. And I guess we'll see come March and
April whether or not that plan for year two work.

Speaker 4 (32:39):
I just curious your thoughts.

Speaker 1 (32:41):
And we've talked obviously with John Lewis whatever the week
or two ago about the schedule and all that stuff.
Like you know, especially for a market like the Brahmas,
you have four home games, you're losing the game anyway,
You're not going home until the first part of the
season because of March madness.

Speaker 4 (32:54):
Like that feels like an impossible task to me.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
There, like trying to mobilize a fan base for for
home games in a calendar year, right you're not playing
until halfway through the season. Like You're always gonna have
oddities like that just with scheduling and kind of the
way this league works.

Speaker 4 (33:10):
But it's really hard.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
I mean, I don't like, I don't know what my
sales pitch would be for that, like here, come out
and support your team. That could be duty by the
time they even play in front of you, and you
get four. To me, it's just really hard. I don't
I don't envy the people, like I think that this
is a lot harder than you know, just kind of
staying it out loud, but I don't genuinely know what
you do, and just curious, like especially markets like San

(33:31):
Antonio that struggled already, Well.

Speaker 3 (33:34):
It's cheaper the buy season tickets to four games than
to five, so there's there's a big selling point for you.
But no, I think, and that's why you have seasoned people,
hopefully in these markets whose background is marketing and whose
background is advertising, and who are a lot more creative
than I am in coming up with ways to reach

(33:54):
out to fans, and you know, a lot of it
is just so first of all, getting that team, to
getting people in that city to acknowledge that this team exists.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
That's the first step.

Speaker 3 (34:09):
You can't sell people on a team they don't know exist.
So it's going to local high school football games and
setting up a booth. It's going to events in that
city and setting up a booth. It's meeting people where
they are and getting word out about the team. And
once you've done that, then you can say, hey, we've
got these four home games coming up. Casual fans and
people who are not hardcore followers of this aren't going

(34:30):
to know, oh, why are there four home games instead
of five? You know, they're not going to ask those
kind of questions. You just want to bring them in
and get their feet wet into UFL football first and
then let them ask those kind of questions later.

Speaker 1 (34:44):
I want to get your thoughts that I was just
looking ahead here in another tab to kind of remind
myself of the questions.

Speaker 4 (34:49):
We'll talk at tendons.

Speaker 1 (34:50):
But I'm curious your thoughts here in terms of the marketing,
in terms of the fan base. You know, with the
UFL being on Fridays, obviously smack down leaving and we
have college FOOTBA, all right, and then they're going to
take that over. John Lewis and I kind of, you know,
bemoaned on the fact that a lot of these early
Friday games are in some of the struggling markets for

(35:10):
the UFL. And if you're going to have a UFL
game on Fox Primetime. Like Week one is in Houston.
They're moving back to the original stadium, but obviously Houston
has been a lackluster.

Speaker 4 (35:21):
Week two we have the Michigan Panthers.

Speaker 1 (35:23):
Week three we have the Stallions, but perhaps therefore is
the Panthers again. You know, we have the Brahmas in there.
Week seven and then they're traveling, you know, doing that
for the Saint Louis Like curious.

Speaker 4 (35:35):
You know the energy that the WWE is able to captive,
you know, kind of harness there for that Friday night show,
right and you know they do the interstitial where they
cut in the Hey, we got the big show coming
up here. There are all the.

Speaker 1 (35:46):
People like, how can the UFL work to replicate that?
Or like just curious your thoughts on that. Now that
we kind of know how these home games have laid out.

Speaker 3 (35:56):
You and John did a great job of breaking down
the schedule. For anyone who hasn't listened to that episode,
I encourage you to go back and listen to that.
You guys brought up a lot of things that I
didn't even think about, and I do think there are
some legitimate questions about what led to the schedule developing
the way it did. I think the answer is always
going to be the league is not in a position

(36:19):
to dictate dates to the stadiums. Instead, it's the stadium's
dictating dates to the league. So you kind of have
to take what you get. And that's what leads to
Houston being you know, I would not have been among
the top half of guesses as to who was going
to get that Friday night, that first Friday night game,
But it's Houston, probably because there's a schedule in conflict somewhere,

(36:41):
or there's something behind the scenes that we're not even
thinking about that is requiring Houston to host that first
Friday home game. So I kind of think it's it's
just stuff that's on another level that we're not even
thinking about. Would I prefer to see Saint Louis hosting
the first home game?

Speaker 2 (36:57):
Sure?

Speaker 3 (36:58):
Would UFL management probably prefer to see Saint Louis hosting
that first Friday night home game, absolutely, you know, but
it just didn't work out that way. So I do
think more so after the schedule was released, I am
really excited about what Friday Night UFL football could be.
Looking at the college football ratings I've tracked all of them.

(37:19):
Looking at the college basketball ratings. So far, I think
they've had three or four games of college basketball on
that Friday night and three quarters of them have been
under a million viewers. So I'm not sure that the
expectations are going to be super high ratings wise. No,
absolutely for the UFL. But I do think having a

(37:40):
night that you can brand as your own, because when
you're a spring league like this, you're always looking for
what can I call my own? What can I really
hang my hat on as a league that's going to
get fans to check it out? How can I be
different than other leagues? And I think having this Friday
night football game every week, you know, because when it
was first announced, one of the things we're wondering is, Okay,
are they gonna be sharing dates with other sports games?

(38:03):
Are they gonna be you know, is it gonna be
five dates? But it's all year, So that is something
that I think can really work in the favor of
the UFL this season.

Speaker 1 (38:12):
I'm in just having gone through the schedule, John, that
is probably the most excited thing I am for and
curious thing kind of going into this year because I
think it's and that was kind of my question.

Speaker 4 (38:23):
I think it's such an.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Opportunity to get a totally different demo that's watching Fox
on Friday at home, younger whatever. You know, you're gonna
get very different than the mid Saturday game on you know,
ABC or whatever. I just think there's a different demo.
It's like I watched this YouTube tech guy. You know,
you've got like millions of subscribers being up like he
was just on Jimmy Fallon. Because that's a totally different

(38:46):
audience than what I have. And so I'm hoping that
they utilize that. And like you said, I think it's awesome.
It's every week, you know, it's you know, five o'clock,
you know, eight o'clock Eastern.

Speaker 4 (38:56):
I just hope that they're able to.

Speaker 1 (38:59):
You know, that that the visualis of it don't hurt
them coming out the gate where you're at maybe a
lackluster or at time. And that's where I'm just worried
about it is we have all this Gangbusters going in
and by the time we get to some of these
better games, they're like, well, no one's you know, it
looks Dad on TV or no one's watching.

Speaker 2 (39:15):
Yeah, you always fear that narrative. I'm not sure.

Speaker 4 (39:20):
I always no.

Speaker 3 (39:22):
Now, I understand that, hey, we're spring football fans, that's
you know, we're pessimistic by nature. But I'm not really
sure that historically when you look at and now you know,
we have a pretty substantial amount of data for these
spring leagues over the last several years, I'm not really
sure there's any correlation to viewership with fans in the stands, right,
Saint Louis doesn't draw significantly more viewership than a Memphis game,

(39:46):
you know, or anything like that. So I really don't
know how much damage that can do other than you know,
Mike Florio on Pro Football Talk making a post about how,
oh you know, it's a Friday night game and they're
not drawing very well.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
I don't know, yeah, yeah, this one, so the other
one on this and then we're getting into some rules
and stuff.

Speaker 4 (40:04):
Biggest concern moving forward.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
And that's why I kind of started with the attendance thing.
That leading with thirty three percent, TV ratings at six
percent interesting because it's just something that I feel like
generate so much, so.

Speaker 4 (40:16):
Many clicks on YouTube.

Speaker 1 (40:18):
It's like, oh, the ratings ran like six percent of
people are actually here about that long term financial backing
from ownership at thirty two percent, viability of the franchises
thirteen lack of franchises in Key mart you know, Key regions,
East Coast, West Coast eleven percent, others we always saw attendance.
I guess I'm just concerned or not concerned. I'm just

(40:38):
surprised that television ratings concerned is so low. I mean,
maybe we've just heard it from enough experts so they're like,
it's fine. And then obviously the long term backing here,
you know, basically a third as well.

Speaker 4 (40:50):
Are you thoughts on kind of the results well?

Speaker 3 (40:53):
As far as the television ratings, I think if I
look back to the XFL survey in twenty twenty three,
I think that score was much higher. But I think
the results of twenty twenty four has assuaged a lot
of fans that, Okay, we've kind of hit a mark
that's acceptable in television ratings and television viewership for the UFL.

(41:13):
So that's not so much a problem. Let's bring some
of these other bigger problems to the fore being attendance
and long term financial backing almost the same amount of votes.
Interestingly enough, between attendance and long term financial backing, which
is interesting because long term financial backing from ownership is
either going to be you.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
Have a league or you don't attendance.

Speaker 3 (41:33):
Probably, you know, attendance is important for sure, but they
can survive drawing ten thousand in Memphis.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
If ownership is willing to continue to move forward.

Speaker 4 (41:44):
Well, I wish as we've.

Speaker 1 (41:45):
Just said that, like attendance doesn't necessarily correlate to TV
ratings either, So it's like that's more than just like
a pride thing, like we want to have more people
in the stands.

Speaker 3 (41:53):
Yeah, I mean it's it's obviously an easy way to
get revenue through ticket sales and then merchandise of the
fans who come. It makes it look better as a
TV product, sure, but it's not. I don't think whether
you draw ten thousand or fifteen thousand in Memphis is
not going to make or break the UFL.

Speaker 1 (42:11):
No, but having long term financial backing exactly, Yeah, I
mean I guess you just I don't know in terms
of this long even if the backing just I guess
it's the commitment of it. I mean, Russ can say
as many times like we're all in this and we've
done and even at any of you this week, but
you know we still have there's no guide rails or

(42:34):
timetables or benchmarks.

Speaker 4 (42:36):
I mean, you know, we're kind of in the dark here.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
So I think that all kind of goes into that together,
like we just want to have some sort of way
to tell are we accomplishing what we're trying to do
or not.

Speaker 3 (42:45):
And I guess the other way you can look at
these results is only thirty two percent are concerned about
the financial long term financial back and that tells you
that people are believing what the Russ Brandons and Moose
Johnson's are saying that hey, we are here for the
long haul. Ownership is committed to this, and there's a
there's a belief amongst fans that that's true.

Speaker 4 (43:04):
Yeah, anything else on this one, you know? To me,
I I think that you know.

Speaker 1 (43:09):
This the visibility ties into obviously the marketing up above
and the franchises and key regions. We have a question
about expansion before we get out, we'll taco taco real quick.
But uh yeah, I mean these are all I don't
know if I would have put the attendance, I think
I probably would have put maybe in current regions just
to kind of get it more of a breath of
the US on that. I mean, I think Fox has

(43:32):
the money. I mean, Fox is going to be in
this as much as there going to be another. No,
I don't think stressing about that is doesn't change whatever.
You know, Fox has their own But I guess that's
why we put what would be your would be your vote.

Speaker 4 (43:42):
On this one before we move on.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
I mean I I kind of think long term financial
back and just because we've seen before ownership being one
committed to spring football until they're not. And so it's
it's easy to go out and put on a happy
face and say and for Russ Brandon and Moose Johnson,
who by the way are not part of ownership, so
they can go out and say, hey, ownership is dedicated
to this, but they're not the ones right in the checks.

(44:06):
The one thing I do wonder is there are a
lot of fingers in the UFL pie. I mean, if
let's say ESPN says we're not interested anymore, We're gonna
back away from this, do Fox and Redbird and Danny
Garcia and Dwaye Johnson do they just like kind of
put more money into it. Or do they all at
once back away and say no. So, because there are

(44:28):
a lot of different ownership figures in this, you could
conceivably see one maybe it's Dwayne Johnson Danny Garcia who
say we're gonna sell our ownership shares to Fox or
whatever like that, and then does the league keep going
or is it like if one pulls out, they all
pull out. So I don't know that having so many
owners is good in some ways. It can be complicated

(44:48):
in some ways. But that's a question I wonder sometimes
as well.

Speaker 1 (44:51):
And I think it was like Mitchell kind of reported
that where you know, basically Fox was like we kind
of need someone else to kind of help burden this
a little bit here in terms, you know, not even
maybe a money. They would just like, you know, it
kind of be like me, like I'm kind of done
with this podcast, Like Greg, you know you want there whoever,
like you know, do you.

Speaker 4 (45:08):
Want to come on?

Speaker 1 (45:09):
And like, you know, it feels like that to me
was more Yeah, so if like ESPN got out or
The Rock and Daniel, like, I think Fox is like okay,
like that's fine. I don't I don't feel like they are.
I think that they were probably, you know, teetering on
the fence. I'm not saying their foot was all the
way out, but I think it was like, hey, we
need some help here.

Speaker 4 (45:28):
We got help, Okay, we'll keep kind of figure.

Speaker 1 (45:30):
I mean that's how I read it, but I mean
that your interpretations open to anything. So favorite gameplay element. Yeah,
So we have a couple of rules here, and then
we'll have some questions. Uh, you know, we talked about
the kickoff, they tiered extra points and fourth and fifteen
option when trailing coaches can challenge, you know, the clock rules.
I voted I like them all because I do like

(45:50):
them all. And we'll get into the kickoff here the
next question, which I think is interesting. But you know,
as someone that is a strong proponent of Sam Schwartztein
and the dynamic kickoffs and all the rules and everything
the innovations at the EXCEP Belt, I'm a big fan
of all of them. You know, the challenge that's something
I think we're looking at for the NFL as well. Curious,

(46:10):
do you have any big strong takeaways from this?

Speaker 3 (46:14):
Certainly another good sign for the league that one third
of respondents here liked all the rules, and so that
works for a lot of people.

Speaker 2 (46:21):
And then you have, you.

Speaker 3 (46:23):
Know, the rules that are specifically different from the NFL
are the ones that get the most votes. Here, coaches
being able to challenge any play, the fourth and fifteen option,
the tiered extra points. You have the kickoff from the
twenty yard line that is similar historically to what the
NFL has done, not getting as many votes. So yeah,
I like that. You know, the coaches challenge got a

(46:44):
lot of votes. I thought that was interesting, but the
fact that so many fans liked all of them is
a good sign for the league.

Speaker 4 (46:49):
I did laugh.

Speaker 1 (46:50):
I think it was the first time we played Dallas
that we lost the Commanders and I was just like incredulous.
But I'm pretty sure Brandon Aubrey, like you missed. I
think kicked it out whatever is the worst penalty for
the kickoff, and they need to kick it out of
the bounds it goes to the forty And I was like, well, Brandon,
I kind of practice.

Speaker 4 (47:06):
The kickoff the mom maybe he would have been better.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
So then the follow up to this question is, oh,
that we've been the least favorite, so that we'll get
to that.

Speaker 4 (47:15):
I forgot we had this one.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
What's your least favorite rule kickoff from the twenty yard
line at thirty percent, So that'll obviously segue into the
you know, should the UFL adopt the xi A kickoff
over lovingly over sixty percent?

Speaker 4 (47:28):
I feel like they're gonna stick with it and not.

Speaker 3 (47:31):
I don't. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (47:32):
I see Darry'll be in a hard nose on those
curious your thoughts because to me, that's the takeaway from
all of this is people don't like the kickoff and
they want it changed again.

Speaker 3 (47:41):
You got to remember that this website where we ran
the survey used to be XFL Board, so a lot
of the people who come to this website still for
the UFL were probably XFL fans to begin with, so
that could color the results of that when you have
a lot of maybe more XFL fans than USFL fans
taking the survey. Just throwing that out there. The thing

(48:04):
to remember, too, is the NFL adopted the XFL style kickoff,
but remember it was kind of a one year experiment
and they're going to revisit that in the offseason. So
the last thing Daryl Johnson wants to happen to say, okay,
because the NFL went back to the XFL kickoff, and
because we want, you know, apples to apples comparison for
NFL scouts to look at coverage guys in our league

(48:26):
to sign them into the NFL, We're going to go
back to the XFILE style kickoff. And then later on
the NFL Competition Committee says, yeah, we didn't like that
XFL kickoff, let's go back to the regular and then
it's like you're back in the same situation you were
in this year, only reversed. So that's part of the
reason I think I agree with you. I think they
stick the UFL does with the kickoff rule this year,

(48:46):
but clearly there is an appetite among fans to readopt
the XFL style kickoff in spring football.

Speaker 4 (48:55):
I agree with that.

Speaker 1 (48:56):
I'll lay my side here so we can get to
these expansion questions and then get you out of here,
hopefully for too long here.

Speaker 4 (49:02):
I appreciate your time, and I know it's busy with
all that.

Speaker 1 (49:05):
Should the UFL question eleven? Should the UFL have expanded
its number of teams in your expansion?

Speaker 4 (49:10):
Pretty guy? You know?

Speaker 1 (49:12):
Fifty to fifty here, forty four percent and forty five
percent for no.

Speaker 4 (49:17):
Such a hot button issue.

Speaker 1 (49:18):
But I think most people realize, or at least, you know,
the FIM majority here realized like, uh, it's probably proven to.

Speaker 4 (49:25):
Wait here before expanding.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Are you surprised that he was so evenly matched and
that people want to be the no expansion.

Speaker 3 (49:31):
I was surprised that it was so evenly matched, I thought,
and I didn't really have a good sense of what
side was going to win out, whether it was the
yes or the no, but I did think one was
going to have significantly more than the other. So to
see it not only close but within a percentage point
of each other was surprising to me. I still think
there are fans who they love talking about expansion. Expansion

(49:55):
is a sign of a healthy league, and they want
to kind of want to reel the league to health
by having expansion. And then you have the more judicious
fans like ourselves probably who say, let's crawl before we walk,
Let's get the franchises we have in a healthier state
before we start adding more teams, and so that's kind

(50:17):
of my theory of the case anyway, And so I'm
a no. But I do think it's a good sign
that they've kind of opened up the expansion process. They're
not committing to expanding for year three. They are just
kind of testing the waters a little bit, and who knows,
maybe if they get real interest from some of these
cities and the infrastructure is there in those cities for

(50:37):
it to work, we may see two teams in twenty
twenty six. But the fact that they're opening expansion without
committing to say yes, we are absolutely expanding in twenty
twenty six doesn't put them behind the eight ball when
push comes to shove. It gives them flexibility to either
add teams or to not and to delay it another year.

Speaker 4 (50:57):
I'll have a fall up here.

Speaker 1 (50:58):
I think Chris has about the expansion before we get out.
I will just for the ten percent that said they
have no opinion. Everybody has an opinion on expansion, So.

Speaker 4 (51:05):
That is a lie.

Speaker 1 (51:06):
That is, no one has no opinion on spring football expansion.

Speaker 2 (51:11):
I even wrote that.

Speaker 3 (51:12):
I wrote that at the end of my analysis, I
wish I could put myself in the shoes of the people.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
Who yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, there aren't taking them with
all right, So the last one here, and then we'll
get into a couple of bonus people. I'd asked, have
UFL expands future markets, what should be its first new
market other So clearly nobody liked you had the good glitzer.
You know, kind of your standy is you know, Seattle, Orlando,
can't New York, San Diego, Chicago, Phoenix, Oakland. I think

(51:39):
Oakland makes a lot of sense, and that people hate
the you know, the California taxes or whatever. Was there
a different because you said, please specify. Was there a
different one that you were or was it just like
pick Keepsie whatever I mean?

Speaker 4 (51:52):
Was there another city that you forgot or was it
just well.

Speaker 3 (51:55):
It probably was a city I forgot. But I again,
I tried to do the same thing here. I tried
to collect and remember in all the expansion hullabaloo that
I've read about, I tried to take it. You know,
the cities that I was hearing over and over again
people bringing up and put them in there. New Orleans
was one that over a dozen people had brought up.

(52:15):
New Orleans, Oklahoma City and Tulsa somewhere in Oklahoma got
multiple votes. But yeah, there were twenty almost twenty cities
or states that people put in the comments who voted others.
So there is not a real consensus about where the
UFL should go when they expand, at least among the

(52:38):
fans that were surveyed here. But I think the fan
base probably would want more coverage of the United States,
which makes Oklahoma a tough sell, you know, and which
makes New Orleans a tough sell because that's all kind
of still within the confines of where the league is
right now. So if you want the league to expand,

(53:00):
and I think you really do need to quite literally
expand the map in the United States, and you need
to go to a Seattle or you know.

Speaker 4 (53:09):
Some of these other Oaklands.

Speaker 3 (53:11):
Yeah, some of these cities that touch pieces of the
United States that the UFL doesn't currently touch right now,
even if it may be difficult and maybe more expensive
in terms of flights or whatever the case may be.

Speaker 4 (53:22):
Last thing on this, it's just hard.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
And obviously I'm a big proponent of targeting non UFL markets,
right Like we've seen Saint Louis here be successful, and
DC is an NFL market, But when the XFL started
in there and no one liked Dan Snyders and then
wanted to support the Washington you know, I think that's
where But generally, like the NFL markets or NFL markets
because they have the people and everything that you know,
it tracks in NFL market. So when you start throwing

(53:46):
out these random like you know, there's a reason why
you know, Canton does not have.

Speaker 4 (53:51):
An NFL franchise right now, you know.

Speaker 1 (53:53):
Like it's just so when we're trying to reinvent the map,
like there is a reason why some of these work
and some of these don't. Any other thoughts on the survey,
and then I have a couple questions from the listeners
before we get out.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Well, just to touch upon what you're talking about.

Speaker 3 (54:03):
There were a lot of people in the comments who
said go to non NFL cities, and you have to remember.

Speaker 2 (54:08):
It's not as easy as that.

Speaker 3 (54:09):
It's not going to magically work because they don't have
an NFL team right otherwise Memphis would be drawing twenty
five thousand a game. So I don't think it's not
a magic wand that you can put over things and say, Okay,
this team doesn't have an NFL team, or the city
doesn't have an NFL team, so let's put a UFL
team there. There has to be more in depth research

(54:31):
done in the market to determine whether or not that's
a place.

Speaker 2 (54:35):
You want to go if you're the UFL well.

Speaker 1 (54:37):
And I think that there is a misconception from ownership
of I don't even know if they know get really
why some of these markets have worked. I mean, you
look at San Antonio. Not in an NFL market does
not work. And we've had many San Antonio fans like
Bemow that like, you know, we want to prove that
we can have an NFL franchise.

Speaker 4 (54:59):
We want you know, people aren't showing up and they're upset.

Speaker 1 (55:01):
But like I mean, Saint Louis works a because they
did not have an NFL franchise, but B it's because
of you know, the work that's been put in there
for six years. Like I said, I would say the
same thing with DC, like when the XFL started that
they were.

Speaker 4 (55:13):
Not an NFL. No one wanted to support the os either,
so they went. But like you know, at Birmingham, you know,
I mean.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
They've had this hub anyway, just just being an NFL market,
like you said, isn't in and of itself enough to
justify going to those places.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
And that's when I wrote my column a couple of
weeks ago about how the UFL came to be, you know,
taking your inspiration about these locations. And just one of
the things that I tried to dig into is, Okay,
you know, why why was DC working the way it was?
And you're right, you know it was an NFL city,
but nobody liked the Washington football team because nobody liked

(55:47):
the ownership, so they were going to give him a
big middle finger by going and supporting the defenders instead.
And you know, so I tried to look at these
markets individually and why is the UF They're what made
the USFL or XFL want to be there in the
first place, and why they've had the success or haven't
had the success that they've experienced over the last couple

(56:09):
of years.

Speaker 4 (56:10):
A couple questions.

Speaker 1 (56:11):
So Chris, we're not going to break He wants us
to break down all the potential buyers.

Speaker 4 (56:15):
I'm not going to do that.

Speaker 1 (56:15):
But I am curious your thoughts because we haven't talked
to you about the expansion, like we're opening this now.
Just a weird way to handle that, and I guess
like egg on your face and no one wants to
do Just do you have any thoughts on just like
we're we're open, Like if you want to talk to
us like we're here, but maybe it takes less pressure
off because we're not reaching out. But also now we've

(56:36):
opened this kind of candon worms. It's curious your thoughts
on that.

Speaker 3 (56:39):
I'm trying to remember XFL twenty twenty. I think they
actually had cities kind of like send proposals to the
league and say hey, we want a team. This is
why it'll work here. And it sounds like that's kind
of what the UFL is trying to get cities to do.
They said, Okay, this proof of concept that we've put
out their works, the UFL works. Now we want instead

(57:01):
of us going, you know, hat in hand to these
cities to say, gee, ca, can we play in your stadium?
You know, they want cities coming to them and want
to be a part of this league. So I kind
of like the way they did it because, as I
said earlier, it's really a win win, like if they
don't expand the next year. They didn't put a timeframe

(57:21):
on it, right, They didn't say we're expanding in twenty
twenty six. We want teams to come now if you
don't expand you're like, okay, well what happened, right? But
also they're kind of doing that to show fans, to
show again, all of this is smoking mirrors, meant to
present the UFL as a viable product for marketing purposes,

(57:43):
for sponsors, for potential team owners of the teams that
are in existence today, for potential investors in the league.
And by putting out this announcement that they're looking into expansion,
what's the first takeaway that you have for that? Ah,
this league must be healthy enough if they're willing to expand.
Now I was on the fence about sponsoring. Now I
feel like this league's going to be around for a

(58:04):
few years. I'm going to put my money into it.
So you could look at it that way, and you know,
maybe if that works and if that attracts one extra sponsor,
maybe it was worth it. But again it's it's not
time sensitive. If the UFL doesn't find viable cities, they
don't have to do anything. It was just one press release,

(58:24):
like they didn't do go on this huge media tour
where they said we're expanding, we're expanding. It was just
a press release. If nothing ever happens, nothing happens, I guess.

Speaker 4 (58:34):
You know.

Speaker 1 (58:34):
Just speaking of that, like you talk to the CFL
about like, oh, we just got to find the city.
Like they got all sorts of cities and stadiums. They
can't figure out a that. I mean, they've been able
to figure out the tent team forever here, I will.
The idea of sponsoring the UFL is kind of like
I used to work at the NBC station here and
we had like basically our own like closed station, like
closed network like talk show every you know, it's like

(58:56):
noon every day.

Speaker 4 (58:57):
Margaret Larston would talk to you.

Speaker 1 (58:58):
And I remember when I quit and I was doing
my wedding stuff and they're like, oh, would you like
to come on? I think it was called New Day Northwest,
like you can come on our show and talk with
Margaret Larton about like it's twenty thousand dollars spots respond
I'm like, I'm not they need twenty thousand dollars to
come on? Like do feel someone that way? Where's my
money going here? That there's like New Day Northwest Like yeah,

(59:19):
let me sponk to the UFL. Get like my pdlighte
you know, ads on the side of the you know,
the stadium or whatever. The sports here was talking San Diego, Oakland.
They seem opposed to California for some reason any sense,
and just like has cost too much travel and taxes there.

Speaker 3 (59:35):
Yeah, I think cost prohibitive right now. Same with New York,
the taxes and just the cost. Is if they can
stay away from those places and be successful, they're going
to want to do that. I mean, if if push
comes to shove and they feel like they can't be
successful without there, they may as one last gasp or
last ditch effort to make the league work, they could

(59:55):
try to put a team there. But I think they're
going to try to make it work as much as
they can without there. And to be honest, I mean,
they can work around California. They kind of tried doing
that with Vegas. And by the way, I did have
one person vote for expansion in Vegas, which I.

Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Could not tell.

Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
I could not tell if they were trolling or not,
but they did suggest Vegas as a city. Maybe it
was a USFL fan and they didn't realize that the
dregs that the XFL went through in twenty twenty three.
But I mean, you can put teams in Portland, you
can put teams around, maybe in Phoenix, around California to
kind of still attract some of those fans.

Speaker 2 (01:00:29):
Same with New York.

Speaker 3 (01:00:30):
There's enough big cities around the state of New York
without needing to go into New York City to maybe
where you can kind of pepper teams throughout there and
attract a little bit more of the fan base there
by being in the locality without being in the state.

Speaker 1 (01:00:45):
I do wanting to talk about the TV ratings for Friday.
I think we kind of touched on that.

Speaker 4 (01:00:49):
You said sub.

Speaker 1 (01:00:50):
Million for three of the four college football games so far.
You think, I mean if UFL pulls in about a million,
that's acceptable for Friday nights.

Speaker 4 (01:00:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:57):
It was actually college basketball college football.

Speaker 4 (01:01:00):
They had a really basketball.

Speaker 2 (01:01:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
I did have a column about halfway through the college
football season looking at their ratings, and there was there's
a pretty bit wide gap. I mean, there were some
games that were drawing three or four millions, some games
that were drawing barely a million.

Speaker 2 (01:01:13):
So there's a pretty big gap there for college football.

Speaker 3 (01:01:15):
For college basketball, there's been a couple of games that
have been drawn under a million, So I would say
a million. I mean, look at what the UFL I
kind of use as a benchmark. The UFL Championship game.
The most watched game of the season last year is
one point five million, So if they can get one
million for regular season games during the week, I think
that's a win.

Speaker 4 (01:01:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
And then it tends to average attendance, you know, I'm
always somewhere in like fifteen twenty.

Speaker 4 (01:01:42):
For that, it depends market to market.

Speaker 1 (01:01:45):
I mean thirty thousand and say, Lou, you know, if
you have thirty thousand and then Houston, you'd probably do backflips.
But certainly for that any strong feelings on that we
can kind of work through that, it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:55):
Would definitely be market to market.

Speaker 3 (01:01:57):
I can't say that there's one blanket number that's going
to work for the entire league, because these franchises all
came to the UFL in different spots, right at different
levels of health in terms of the local attendance.

Speaker 2 (01:02:10):
I remember XFL two thousand and one.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
All the way back then, I mean, twenty thousand was
the benchmark, Like that was the number that if you
drew twenty thousand or more you were good. If you
drew under twenty thousand, it was concerning. I think that's
been wound down a little bit now in twenty twenty five,
just because you mentioned the television ratings and the fragmentation
because there's so many different streaming services and there's so

(01:02:32):
many different ways people consume television or a televised product
these days. I think a lot of it is the
same for football, is there is a fragmentation in these cities.
There's so much more to do in these places than
there was twenty five years ago when the XFL first
kicked off. That it's going to be hard to draw
that many, even for five games over the course of

(01:02:54):
a couple months. So it is going to be different
market to market, I think in terms of what you're
going to look at as successful in twenty twenty five, O.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Break my stuff here Shark Mako talking about if they
could do some like special defensive, offensive, special teams. Players
of the week receive a bonus. That would be cool
if I figure out some more ways. I thought they
announced that. I thought they do announce them, but they.

Speaker 4 (01:03:20):
Pulled the bonuses right with the CBA. I'm pretty sure
that's for that.

Speaker 3 (01:03:23):
Yeah, there were some sort of grievance that I think
the UFLPA filed last year because that was part of
the agreement, and then the ufl and didn't end up
doing those Players of the Week, so there was no
bonus money given out. That's going to be Another interesting
thing that doesn't get a lot of play is what's
the UFLPA going to look like this year? The steel
workers union pulled out and now we have you know,

(01:03:46):
Kenneth Farrow's group is now sort of the leading the UFLPA.
So are they going to have to come to a
whole new agreement this year? Are they tweaking the agreement
they had last year? What is that going to look
like for twenty twenty five for the players? So I'm
kind of interested in seeing when that is released.

Speaker 4 (01:04:05):
Let's get a J. Mccerroon involved in that. Then we
don't have to hear from him complain anymore. Then, hencept
this has at the conditions.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
Well, it sounds like a J.

Speaker 3 (01:04:13):
Mcceron might be having his own podcast soon, So we're
not We're not nearly done hearing AJ mccarren complain about things. Unfortunately,
it's like Daniel plain View and there will be blood.
Like you are my competitor now, Ajmharon.

Speaker 4 (01:04:24):
I will do all that. I just real quick with that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:27):
Duane Johnson be involved more with the marketing. It makes
sense because he does the run to WrestleMania right now,
but I think it's so focused on that. I think
the timing works out, but I don't think there's no
bandwid there for the Rock to do whatever he's gonna do.

Speaker 4 (01:04:41):
Plus because I feel like he's going to be.

Speaker 1 (01:04:43):
In Vegas right for forty one Yeah, well who knows, okay,
but I just like I don't see him. I think
the dream was like, Oh, he's going to be on
RA and then oh, you felt like this is a
very separate, despondent world right now.

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
If it it happened last year when SmackDown was on
Fox and the UFL was on Fox, then it's not
gonna happen this year when SmackDown isn't on Fox anymore.
So they had a prime opportunity to last year in
the build a Wrestlemanian, as you mentioned the Rock being involved,
there being a pretty frequent presence on television weekly television
for WWE, and they got really no extra press out

(01:05:22):
of that. I would be surprised if it happened this year,
but I do think that would be like the perfect
melding of these two worlds. But for whatever reason, it's
just not happening that way.

Speaker 4 (01:05:33):
Well, also, like the Rock.

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
Is like whipping like a bleed like last year was
like whipping Cody with like a bleeding belt.

Speaker 4 (01:05:40):
Like I don't know if then you want him to
be like, hey, come watch my football league. I mean
because the Rock.

Speaker 3 (01:05:45):
I mean it is hard to do organically. I think
for the Rock, you know, he's not gonna go out
to cut a promo on Cody Roads or cut a
promo on somebody. And then, as an aside, mentioned the
Arlington Renegades game coming up on Saturday, Like.

Speaker 2 (01:05:59):
Right, I mean, yeah, so it would be it would
be difficult.

Speaker 4 (01:06:03):
Jenna and.

Speaker 1 (01:06:05):
Joe and the know both want to know about the kickoff.
We talked about that last couple of year. Pip wants
to know just in terms of them, like invested in
these markets. Is this megor break for any I know?
Mike Mitchell said, this is just megor break for the league.
I say a lot of people like.

Speaker 4 (01:06:20):
Oh, there are announcing stuff that it's still make or
break for the league.

Speaker 1 (01:06:23):
It's very easy to cancel an expansion search or cancel
a Kicker showcase next January or whatever. But like, uh,
megor break, certain markets or.

Speaker 4 (01:06:33):
I just kind of just to make sure we touch
on pipscrap comment here.

Speaker 3 (01:06:39):
I don't know, because the announcement of expansion certainly makes
it seem like, I mean, it would be very hard
to expand by two teams and then find another market
for some of the teams that already exist. Yeah, so
if they're planning on expansion, you know, best case scenario
twenty twenty six, that kind of gives me the idea
that they also plan on keeping all these teams in

(01:07:00):
these markets. And I mean, if you want to look
at underperforming markets, Memphis certainly is I think on the
verge of being concerning. I follow Steve Macy, one of
their marketing guys, on social media, and he's constantly out
in the community doing stuff. So it's not for lack
of effort in places like Memphis, but I do think

(01:07:20):
you want to see some growth in some ways, whether
it's attendance, whether it's sponsorships. I notice in the San
Antonio Bramas schedule release they have a presenting sponsor for
their season in San Antonio, which is really cool.

Speaker 4 (01:07:33):
Oh I think I saw that, Yeah, Yeah, And I
mean those.

Speaker 3 (01:07:36):
Are the kind of opportunities that this league presents to
sponsors in the community that like, if you're a DC uh,
if you're a DC business and you can't afford sponsor
sponsorships with the Commanders, get in with the Defenders or
something like that. Or if you're in Memphis you don't
have maybe the Grizzlies are all their sponsorship is taken,

(01:07:59):
so maybe you can market with the show Boats or
something like that. So give as many opportunities as you can,
like stick a stick a logo on anything you can
to get that money from the community and to get
a presence in that community. I think that's really important.

Speaker 4 (01:08:16):
Yeah, wbs, are you doing it on the mat? Now?

Speaker 1 (01:08:19):
You got all these things, all these mothers. Lastly, Alex,
he just threw Phoenix in there.

Speaker 4 (01:08:24):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (01:08:25):
I think like just anything to get as far west
as you can, I think it would be great. And
then the last question, Steven here says, if we want
better quarterbacks, you're going to have to pay them better.

Speaker 4 (01:08:33):
Do you see this happening?

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
You know, you see a lot of quarterbacks now that
could utilize some more you know, seasoning. I think maybe
you can look back at like an Anthony Richardson maybe
could have benefited from not being thrust you know, you
see all these new quarterbacks.

Speaker 4 (01:08:46):
That you know there can all be Jade Daniels.

Speaker 1 (01:08:48):
I'm just curious long term vision for that, just because
you're going to have a wealth of you know, trying
to get some of these guys in and attract better players.

Speaker 3 (01:08:58):
I mean, I think they have pretty good quarterbacks right now.
You always want to be better at every position, for sure,
But is the difference in the quarterbacks you have now
versus the quarterbacks you would have Is it worth the
extra money that you would be paying And I really
don't know if it's going to be worth it.

Speaker 2 (01:09:17):
I think they've got Kellen Mond.

Speaker 3 (01:09:20):
They had Emery Jones before he signed with the Atlanta
Falcons a futures deal, So they aren't getting some young
talented quarterbacks with the pay structure that they have now,
And we don't really know what that is. We assume
quarterbacks are being paid more than regular players on the roster,
but that numbers never released and it could be more
of a case by case basis. If you're a j McCahon,

(01:09:42):
you're probably making more than Lindsay Scott, for example, right
But I don't think quarterback play again, you always want
to be better because, especially because quarterbacks are the straw
that stirs the drink when it comes to on field play.
And if you want to keep people happy with the
on field product, which we saw that they were in
twenty twenty four, you want to continue to strive for

(01:10:04):
a higher level quarterback play. I'm just not sure the
juice is worth the squeeze and the cost is going
to be worth it to get incrementally better quarterback play,
which is what you get for paying a little extra.

Speaker 4 (01:10:16):
I think that was a good answer. Well, there you
got what.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
It could be a really heated UFL media market this year.
If aj mccerrn's got the podcast and then Destroying has
his show, and then weeks like I like this, we
get in some feuds with another podcast. Well, Greg, I
appreciate it. I tried to keep it in an hour.
We went ten minutes over with all the questions. I
appreciate it. With the fraternity leave good luck with that, obviously.
I'll link this article. It's on UFL board. Please like,

(01:10:40):
get subscribe Greg, anything else here talk your wrestling coverage
and the UFL set before we get out.

Speaker 4 (01:10:46):
I'm sure you'll have some stuff coming.

Speaker 2 (01:10:48):
No, that's it.

Speaker 4 (01:10:50):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:10:50):
I mean it was great.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
I really I really enjoyed talking about the results. You know,
I wrote up my analysis of it, but to actually
kind of kind of bounce thoughts off of someone else
was a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (01:11:00):
So thanks for having me on to talk about.

Speaker 4 (01:11:02):
That read all right?

Speaker 1 (01:11:03):
Well, like I said, everyone like it, subscribe, we'll be back.
We'll figure that out.

Speaker 4 (01:11:06):
But I figured this was a good before Gray goes back,
we could talk.

Speaker 1 (01:11:08):
Through all this, so I will play the outro well
live but not live, so we'll see you guys next time.

Speaker 4 (01:11:14):
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