Looking at the growth of men's wrestling and men's sports since 1981-92 - Mat Stats 33 - The Mat Stats Show by the NWCA

Episode Transcript
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(00:03):
Statistics. They can mean many things. It can be a batting average,
a win percentage, correlations, andstandard deviation. But numbers aren't just for
nerds. In life, decisions needdata. In wrestling decisions, projections and
hypotheticals also need data. Here onMatt's Stats, we take historical data,

(00:28):
theories, and statistics and apply itto the world's oldest and greatest sport.
Now to your trio of numerical nerdballs, Glenn Gormley, Kevin Hazard,
and Jason Bryant, and once again, welcome back wrestling fans to the Matt
Stats Show, where we're looking atstats, fun facts and more. Here

(00:48):
with Kevin Hazzard and Glenn Gormley,I'm Jason Bryant, and today we're going
to be looking at the participation numbersof Kyle's rustling teams over the years.
Because we've got the NCAAA report thatcomes out every fall. Glenn dove into
the numbers and has looked at thesethings intricately and whatnot. And we also
have just a discussion about numbers likewe always do here. But since we've

(01:10):
been back since the last show,let's see I had just come back from
his Stan Bull then it turned aroundand I don't even know where I've been.
Went the Hall of Fame Honors weekendthen were I was up in New
York for Beat the Streets for thebenefit there, so not as busy,
but yeah, busy. What aboutyou, guys, Glenn, How how's
the world been treating you down inyou know wherever, Smoky Knobville, town

(01:32):
Field, Tennessee. At the moment, well, the world's treat me great.
We're headed to the College World Series, so I'm excited about that.
And then tomorrow I go to oneof the William Mary Rustling reunions, which
is the most fun week of theyear for me. So things are going
great. I actually did see aregional game when I was in Stillwater for
Honors weekend. They were hosting aregional with Niagara, Florida and Nebraska,

(01:56):
so I got to see one ofthe games there. I saw the the
Floridaca game because there was no onethey were doing. We were doing our
cocktail hour on Friday night during theNiagara Oklahoma State Oklahoma State game. But
that stadium they have in Stillwater now, the new Baseball Stadium, the Obrate
Stadium. That place is awesome.I got a ten dollars ticket. Matter
of fact, the beer I hadwas more than the ticket, but it
was also one of those It wasthe official craft beer of Oklahoma State.

(02:19):
So it was the eighteen ninety fromIron Monk Brewing, which I believe or
not Dayton Fix's brother Derek works at. So each year Kevin knows this.
We sampled the We had a tourof that place last year, so they're
like, I know, Danny's Glassis like the unofficial not sponsor of our
numbers, but I don't know.Hall of Fame Weekend, it might be
Iron Monk Brewing. They provided somestuff for the Hall of Fame Honors weekend,
which we had some great honorees.I love Honors weekend. Kevin,

(02:43):
you were down there last year.You, Brian and I we get to
spend some time down there. Butyou're now in Delaware as a retired guy,
which had been like for you thenext month into not having jackhammers behind
you during the show. It's great, it's great, except they're building the
end of a subject vision right behindme. So there's still the backup alarms
going every day. But you can'tget away from it now, you can't

(03:07):
constructions everywhere, kept me, keptme busy for fifty plus years, so
made me happy. Yeah, it'sjust like a little bit of it's your
happy place. Well you wake upme. Oh wait, No, that's
not my back hoe that I haveto worry about. That's not no,
that's not our table saw. That'sthat's gone missing. So I still dream
about construction every night, you know, and I'm still making decisions and getting

(03:28):
all tight. So hopefully that goesaway after a while. I know,
I just had I had an atrandom afternoon so that the kids and my
wife went somewhere over the last weekend. I'm like, you know what,
I got to clean up this garage. You know how you get that corner
stuff like your outdoor shovels are yourwinter shovels or with your summer shovels,
and I get a shed in theback. I'm like, how'd all this
crap end up here? So Itook it, cleared out one corner,

(03:51):
and then all the cushions that areup and just moving things around. And
you know, I had one carout of the way because I actually had
backed out incorrectly and basically took offone of my side mirrors, so that
was a nice little mistake. SoI actually had the space and had the
scrap woodland around. I was like, I need to get this up off
the ground. I need to putthis here for my wet dry, my

(04:12):
shot back and then my little,my minor dust collection. I built a
shelf out of scrap wood in aboutan hour. I'm like, yeah,
all right, so, you know, using the job site saws and stuff.
I felt I was channeling my innerKevin Hazard. Yeah exactly. I
wasn't framing anything because we don't wantthat. But framing is what we're gonna
do today. We're gonna frame thearguments based on facts. So Glenn,

(04:36):
we will jump to our other screenand as always, folks, if you're
listening to this on the audio,we will have the PowerPoint slideshow accompaniment.
I will also in the show notesinclude the link to the NCAA Participation Statistics
Report that has come out every fallsince the nineteen eighty one eighty two series
season or year. And that's whywe use it, because that is the

(04:58):
NCAA tracking the stats. Before thenwe're to talk about this, and we've
talked about this on previous shows.We didn't track the participation prior to then
eighty two is significant because that iswhen the NCAAA also officially adopted women's sports.
Before then, in the college women'ssports side, it was the AIAW,
the Association of Interclaesiate Athletics for Women, in which Miama Mater that placed
in orfic was pretty good at theround ball, which is you know that

(05:21):
Caitlin Clark phenomenized is filtered over intothe WNBA from college sports and now they're
complaining about it with the Olympic team. But that's another topic entirely. But
those stats, those athletes are nowcounted the with the NCAA since nineteen eighty
one eighty two, which is weirdto say that was in all three of
our lifetime. So moving to oursheets, and we talk about Glenn not

(05:45):
the Boys of Summer, the Boysof Winter, Boys of Winter. Yes,
Roger Kahn, the famous author wrotethe book The Boys of Suburb about
the famous Brooklyn Dodgers when Kevin Houserwas old enough to remember it. And
then Kenny Chesy did the video TheBoys of Fall. That's a picture of
Keady Chasey there with his parents inhigh school. We're doing the Boys of
Winner, okay, And I justwant to let people know the reason we're

(06:10):
concentrating mostly on boys now, notboys and girls, is because there wasn't
girls wrestling in colleges back in eightyone eighty two, so there isn't the
datta to do it. It's notthat we overlooked them, Okay. The
normal stuff that we do on theshow, I feel like a number the
old Bob Seeker song, okay,and then of course we got to give
a shout out to Danny's Glass andOffolk eight six seven five three oh nine

(06:33):
nine gain in the seven in theseven five seven Okay. The experience opinions
expressed on this show do not necessarilyreflect any opinions of the NWCA, nor
do necessarily Gormley, Bryant Hazard alwaysagree on everything. Okay. Matt Status

(06:54):
is a numbers based show, Okay. I want people to understand that there
is some opinion that we were buteverything on the show basically starts with numbers,
Okay, So we revolve around stats. That's just that's why this is
called Matt Stats. We like toshort start each show with a slide as

(07:15):
of May twenty seventh, now,ironically, I had to do all the
CUDDLEFS time at some point to doall these numbers. But the next day,
Hope Internationals started an Anaia team.So there's really five hundred and five
teams. But for this show,we're using the numbers that are on the
screen now and we like to keepdoing. We picked up because I always
go back and check and like,okay, when was our last show?

(07:36):
What did we look at? Howmany we have? And I look like,
well, wait, Glenn, wejust added a team. So it
was literally the day before. He'slike, okay, this is my cutoff
date. The next day so IHope International in Fullerton, California. In
case you're wondering, they are startingAmen's program. Yeah, another ANAI in
California. We're losing a couple Anaisin California because Vanguard and Menlo are transitioning

(07:58):
to Division two. So that's wherewe're at. Glenn, moving on,
Okay, moving on, Okay,Kevin, go ahead, Okay, So
we talk about that. We're goingto talk this week about month about statistical
state of collegiate wrestling, and theNCAA has done such a good job and

(08:20):
since nineteen eighty one eighty two,when they started when women became part of
the NCAA. They published their dataevery year, and men's wrestlings had an
NCAA championship since nineteen twenty eight.But let's start talking about the statistical state
of NCUBA men's wrestling. Okay,Sharley, thank you, Kevin. Just

(08:45):
so everybody knows, I'm going toI go what Jason Brian said earlier.
The data we get is from theNCAA Sports Sponsorship at participation rates. The
most recent one came out nine totwenty nine, twenty three, So at
some point in a couple months we'llhave enough data. Thing. And also
Jason keeps up some phenomenal stuff onhis website on numbers and stuff. Okay,

(09:07):
now, the first slide we havehere if you're viewing this at home,
even if you're just listening, it'sa history from eighty one eighty two
the number of teams men's teams thatDivision one, Division two, Division three
had Okay, what every year.Now, if you look at this,

(09:28):
the Division two number is higher thanit's ever been. Okay, Division one
in three were highest in eighty oneeighty two. The total number of NCAA
teams is higher, right, nowthan at any time since eighty eight,
eighty nine. Okay, that's astaggering thought to think of people, especially

(09:52):
me and Kevin's generation, that havebeen watching a lot of teams go okay,
and now all of a sudden,we're in a good position right now.
Also also want to point this out, so before we get too deep
into the woods about when we countingnumbers, because like Glenn and I and
Kevin will talk about, there's alwayscaveats and minutia to statistics. So there's

(10:13):
well, what about this, Wellwhat about this? Keep in mind this
is the NCAA statistics only. Thisdoes not include junior college, the n
CWA, or the NAIA. Soand we know in an era prior to
I want to say ninety six iswhere we kind of started seeing the dual
affiliates, the NAIA and Division two. Mostly those schools, the dual affiliates

(10:35):
don't really exist anywhere anymore. Westill had some stragglers in wrestling late I
think Menlo was one of the lastones. But this is just NCAA schools
at the time. So Glenn isgoing to touch on this later in the
episode where we look at the numberof teams in their sponsorship total participation.
But when you're looking at these numbers, there's a reason we're focusing on D

(10:56):
one, D two, and Dthree is because that's what the NCAA covers.
The NAI does not do a reportlike this annually, so that is
why we've got the three divisions ofmen's wrestling we have for this particular episode.
Thank you very much, Jason,I'm glad to point that out.
Now, let's for people be andKevin's generation and maybe even a young Jason
Bryant might remember some of this iswhen you were young. Jason, You're

(11:18):
not young now, okay, thewell, thanks for that, Jerk'll give
you. In my mid forties,I'm still holding off on the I'm not
yet forty five, so although myhair may have limited next episode, I
may end up looking like Kevin Hazzard. You don't know this actually probably get

(11:39):
the cat out of the bad.So anyway, a lot of people me
and Hazard's generation, old people justalls, we remembers the team's going away.
So this slide slide number eleven thatJay says up on the screen,
this is the most recent the topfive twenty first century years. That number

(12:01):
of teams a, D one,D two, D three A total If
you look at this for D two, D three and total all of the
top five years of the most recentfive years, Okay, that tells you
something. That shows you that inthis century D two, D three and
total number of teams. There's moreteams now than they've been in this century.

(12:24):
So that's a great thing. Now, Slide twelve, okay, shows
you the bottom five years, okay, and those are all long ago this
century for D two and D three, but for D one someone more recently.
Okay, So it does show usthat something good is happening D two

(12:48):
and D three, but not Done. Okay. Now, since we've
all picked on each other about ourage, okay, there's now two hundred
and eighty four NCAA teams. Innineteen eighty eight eighty nine, there was
two hundred and eighty six. Ifyou were thirty five years or younger,
this is the most NCUBA men's teamsin your lifetime if you were fifty.

(13:16):
If you're younger than fifty, thisis the most teams there's ever been since
you wrestled in college. Okay.So it's really starting to be, you
know something, something good's going onhere. Okay. Obviously in the past,
in the eighties and stuff like that, it wasn't good. But there's
something going on here now that's good. Okay, Okay, So we're gonna

(13:41):
look, we're looking at eighty one, eighty two, ninety nine to two
thousand, you know, just inyou know, in ten twenty year increments.
And now how are we going tocompare it to other male sports in
the n NCUBLEA with a number ofteams eighty two until now till twenty two

(14:01):
to twenty three, which is thelast time we have complete recordsang, and
let's break down the number of teamsgoing forward. Sure, One thing I
want to point out is Kevin's correct. The most recent thing for nc DOUBLEAU
is a twenty two to twenty threeseason. On these charts that are the

(14:22):
most recent for wrestling. Uh MattStats has put together the number of teams
through five, twenty seven, twentyfour. Okay, so it's one thing
I have that up there. I'mnot going to read you guys all this,
but we have the number of main'sNCUBLEA teams for the sixteen sports that
are championship and I threw in,threw in rowing, and I'll get to

(14:43):
that for a reason why I didthat later. Okay, this is from
the numbers I however, for eightyone eighty two that I've included, Okay,
Then I included ninety nine two thousandjust because it's the turn of the
century. Then I included two thousandand nine two ten because that was the
low point of the number of wrestlingteams at nc douablea okay. And then

(15:07):
the next slide is for twenty twoto twenty three, okay. And what
we do then is we can seea percentage increase and decrease in everything going
on in those years and selective variables. I'm going to sum this up.
We're going to go to slide twentyfive because I don't want to be taking

(15:31):
an hour going to everything very specifically. But this is what I want to
tell you guys that you can seeon slide twenty five if you want to
really dive into it deep. LikeJason said, we have all this data
on the thing. Again, Ihave one link to this slide show where
you can look at those slides andthe actual participation report in the show notes

(15:52):
on NWCA online dot com and MattTalk online dot com, so you'll be
able to get links to this ifyou want to dive in deeper and look
at you know, not just factcheck Glenn's stats, but look at the
numbers from the other sports and lookat where where where has ice hockey gone?
Where have the emerging sports come from? Those type of things, because
that's also relevant to our women's wrestlingconversation, is like women's emerging sports.

(16:14):
So all this data there within,I mean, there are pages and pages
and pages and pages of charts foryou visual learners out there. Yes,
thik you Okay, Now I'm goingto summarize from nineteen eighty one, eighty
two to twenty two to twenty three. Okay, team sports grew faster in
the twentieth century. In the twentyfirst century, it was very close between

(16:36):
team and individual sports. For example, track is an individual sport, Gymnastics,
wrestling, obviously, volleyball, baseball, basketball, or team sports.
Okay, Men's wrestling from that timeperiod eighty one eighty two to twenty three
was down forty five percent in Done, D two was up nine percent.

(16:59):
D three was down thirteen percent.Only gymnastics was lower in D one
than us. The total, wrestlingwas down twenty two percent. All sports
were up forty percent, okay,and only gymnastics all worse percentage of US.
So something's weird here that all themen's sports were up but overall but

(17:23):
US at gymnastics were down. AndCAA football it's going to be interesting,
guys in Division one from nineteen eightytwo till today has actually seen a decrease
in the number of teams. Okay. So for anybody who thinks everything's just
all about big time football, it'snot really exactly accurate, okay as of

(17:48):
today, because tomorrow, with theHouse versus NCAA and NIL, we could
have a vastly different show a yearfrom now too. Oh, yes,
we're in some interesting times. Somaybe if we're getting this stuff down for
uh, for just for documentation purposes, yeah, for prosperity. I'm wondering,
Glenn, if that's gonna be likefamous last words or a famous premonition

(18:10):
either way, yeah, either way, or like Philip Fulmer said, Oh,
that's not good, not good.Yes, I'm summing up what wrestling
was like at the end of thetwentieth century. Philip filbercent, Oh that's
not good. Okay, he wasn'ttalking about wrestling, was a different story.
Okay, Now next we're going togo this century, Okay, and

(18:33):
CAA, men's D one is downten percent. D two is grown by
eighty five percent. D three isgrown by twenty four percent. Men's lacrosse
at volleyball lead the way in that. And that's interesting because they've basically been
writing the cotales of women's across thewomen's volleyball total men's wrestling this century is

(19:00):
our own twenty one percent in theNCAA, men's volleyball and locks of the
top percentage gross football and basketball havegrown ten to nine percent. Okay,
So once again what Jason just said, whether it's a premonition or whatever,
it is, Okay, So volleyballlacrosse once again are the two that are

(19:23):
beating it. Now when we getto from twenty nine ten today, men's
D wrestling is down one percent.I'm sorry that it is. All men's
D one sports are up three percentthis century, so we're really not that
far off in that. Yeah,and Glenn, this also shows that D

(19:45):
one is not really where the growthof men's sports is to begin with.
At any sport in the last thirteenfourteen years. It's it's it's a trickle
at the highest level of college sports. Correct. Now, when you look
at this, men's D two wrestling, this since twenty nine ten is up
fifty seven percent. All men's Dtwo sports are only up nineteen. So

(20:10):
we're doing better than D two isdoing. With D three wrestling, it's
up forty seven percent, and allsports are up twelve. Men's wrestling overall
is up thirty one percent. Allmen's sports are up ten percent. Okay,
the fastest percent is growing men's sportsat the NCAA once again, of

(20:30):
the cross at volleyball, they're ridingthe coattails of the women. Hopefully we
can do the same thing. Now. This next slide is a great stat
that I think is going to reallybe fascinating for many people. Since two
thousand and nine twenty ten, men'swrestling has grown sixty seven teams, men's

(20:53):
basketball thirty nine, and football thirtythree. I heard that right, We
are growing more teams than either footballor basketball. Okay, Now, the
best way for me to sum thisup is I hope Mowyer doesn't run for
president because we need them too muchin our sport Okay, football and basketball

(21:15):
have all the media in the world, ESPN, pro Leagues, March Madness,
College Game Day, Monday Night Football. We got Moyer of the NWCA
and that's basically what we have andwe're doing damn well on it. So
I want you guys to take fromthis for team growth. Twentieth century wasn't

(21:36):
good. Oh no, that's notgood. Now it's good, Kevin Hazard.
Okay. So we're saying that we'regoing to look at it from two
thousand and nine to two thousand andtwenty three. So let's look at the
participation numbers all oh nine, ohten, two, twenty twenty two,
twenty three, top five years ineach division in over the bottom five years,

(22:03):
and it's part of this because ofchanges in average squad sizes and how
do they compare to the fast Okay, thank you Kevin for those questions.
The next couple slides, just likewe have with teams, is the participation
numbers. For whatever reason, theNCAAV first of its participates, not athletes,
because wrestlers are wrestlers, track runnersare runners, so it's participants.

(22:25):
Okay. So we have the numbersof twenty nine to ten and then twenty
two to twenty three. On thesecharts, we don't know how many part
participants to work in the most recentthing. These are from the NCAA the
same years. Because if a teamdecided, we don't know how many participants
they have, Okay, so thenwe have the increase or decrease and the

(22:48):
percentage. Okay, So you guyscan look at this at you're on your
own time. We're going to thensum it up on slide thirty five,
okay, And what we learn onslide thirty five is since two thousand and
nine to ten, the wrestling participationnumbers understandably follow the team growth. Wrestling

(23:10):
has seen the third highest participation percentagegrowth of all men's NCAA sports, trailing
once again only men's across of volleyball. Of course, the vast growth comes
from D two and D three.Despite D one seeing a one percent decrease
in the number of teams, Done has seen a four percent increase in

(23:34):
the number of participants. That's greatnews, guys, now, and that's
interesting. That's an interesting stat Yes. And what you see here on the
next slide, on slide thirty seventhirty six, excuse me, is the
participation numbers for each respective division,and then the total and the squad size

(24:00):
are just two squad sizes. Ever, overall were the last two years for
wrestling. Okay, the number ofparticipants in Division two the highest four years
of the most recent four years.For D three three of the top the
total is now fourth and fifth inparticipants all times since division total since nineteen

(24:26):
eighty one eighty two. Sadly,all the top d ones are way back
when when I was young. Okay. Then you can see the bottom young
on this young stuff. Okay,okay, thank you, thank you so
and you could see then the bottomsituations. They're highlighted in purple. So

(24:48):
if you don't have the screen,there what this shows you. There's all
the low numbers for Division two,Division three and squad sizes. We're all
way back when, Okay. Now, an interesting thing here, the squad
size and men's D one wrestling fromeighty one eighty two have never been larger

(25:11):
in recent years. The top tenaverage squad sizes are all from twy ten
twenty eleven moving forward, So everysingle year from ten twenty eleven is better
than any year before that statistically known. That is what's known as first order

(25:33):
stochastic dominance. That means it's damngood, okay, And it's also one
thing. It also kind of throwsthe you know, we've got a lot
of the enrollment driven schools and Divisiontwo and Division three. That's where you
know, we're seeing where the growthis. But you're seeing that the numbers
even though you know, we've gotpeople showing up at Division one when it's
you know, there are enrollment drivenschools and Division one. But we look

(25:56):
at the number of schools that we'vegot and it's like, well, they're
clearly not all of Rollman driven,So what is the correlation and causation whatnot?
With statistical significance they're Glenn, that'smaybe another correlation. Yeah, something
we can dig into be like,well is it you know, where are
we can maybe a future episode likeis it the enrollment driven schools that have
the larger rosters? How are theyimpacting the greater thing? But you know,

(26:18):
look at that, we're like,well wait a minute, because we've
we know, we've had roster caps, we've got roster management some places.
Uh. And now again this isnot what we've researched on this episode.
But with what's coming with house versusNCAA and nil and such, where there's
the suggestion that scholarships are going scholarshiplimits are going away. They're just gonna
have basically roster caps where you canoffer, you know, if you've got

(26:41):
a if you've got a wrestling team, all right, well we've got a
cap at twenty five. We havetwenty five rides. Hypothetically probably not gonna
happen with wrestling, but that typeof world is soon potentially on the horizon.
So that's something we can keep anout. And how's that going to
change roster caps? Well, arewe going to have schools like we have
some Division one schools that have aroster cap of twenty two, which is

(27:04):
mind blowing to think about. Sothis is a stat when we come back
to this a year later, wewere talking about we're interested to see what
these Well maybe it's not gonna benext year, but hypothetically in the future,
is this our tipping point? Isthis going to be like, Okay,
we're going to go down from here. So Glenn, this is a
great slide to have up and definitelyfor one for historical relevance in reference,

(27:25):
yeah, thank you. It iswild also, and also this is like
Jason was just kind of hinting at, there's some deeper stuff to find for
this. You know, why isit? Why have the the squad's gotten
larger, you know, across theboard? I mean even in D three

(27:48):
they're larger, and there's no scholarshipsthere, so there shouldn't be as money
much cap I think the first answerto that question as well, there's fewer
places to wrestle at Division one thanthey're worse, So you've got the same
amount of wrestlers going into a smallerpool. So in theory, your your
roster's gonna be bigger because it's youknow, I guess Glen, again,

(28:10):
this is your wheel house to belike the number of athletes coming into college,
give or take what that percentage orwhat that ratio is compared to what
it used to be. That's somethingto look at and be like, well,
again, we can look at thisand be like, well, what
is it like compared to when wehad twenty four in a roster and one
hundred and forty nine teams versus youknow, seventy eight with thirty three on

(28:30):
a roster. So something also tokick the can down the line and look
at that later too. Yeah,it would make sense that the number of
teams and the squad size would benegatively correlated as one goes down one goes
on. That wouldn't make sense.Okay, now we summed up that thing,
so on to slide forty Okay,during episode number seven. This was

(28:52):
way back when in March of twentytwenty two, Gorb's predicted that we have
more men's wrestlers in the end tournamentby March twenty twenty five. Okay,
So that gives me a year anda half to come up with that number
being the most ever. Okay,I made that prediction. I'm standing by
it, even with whatever might happenin the House versus NCIA and then IL

(29:17):
and all that. Okay, wedon't have the numbers for the twenty three
twenty four season yet, so wewon't have these numbers it told us fall
and for twenty five. Won't haveit till the fall twenty five. But
just to put in perspective, guys, the record number of participants in NCAA
since eighty one eighty two is eightyfive, seventy two and nineteen eighty five.

(29:41):
Ironically, so almost eighty six hundred. We in the last two years
have had over eighty three hundred wrestlers, so it's not a crazy thought that
we can jump two hundred and fiftymore wrestlers and get over that. Now,
Glenn, you will be correct thatin twenty twenty five will be more
wrestlers at the national tournaments. Forthese facts alone, One, the ANAI

(30:03):
is now at two hundred and eightyentries, and then now Division three has
recently approved thirty more entries, sothey're gonna be at two hundred and ten.
So there will be more wrestlers atthe divisions national tournament in twenty five
than there are twenty four. Sothe great Gormac has come through once again.
Yes, yes, but and ifyou don't know that reference is,

(30:25):
you are definitely. If you doknow that reference, you're definitely Glenn and
Kevin's age, Yes, we referenceSIMS has been the Johnny Carson. Yeah,
okay, so people don't know whatis now, come on, guys,
anyway, moving on, Thank youfor pointing that out. But my
prediction is by the NCAA Wrestleague tournament, okay, in twenty twenty five,

(30:47):
we would have more participants, notin the tournament. Why are we going
to look at stats and why arewe gonna read Nobody reads stuff on the
internet anymore. Le's just look atwhat's on the screen and share it.
Come on anyway, Okay, goodenough, fair enough, Okay, Now
slide forty two. Guys, Thisis for people that are my age or

(31:11):
older, because yes, I didwrestle in college before eighty one eighty two.
Okay. And in the NCAA guidetheir participation number thing, they explain
it. They only do the surveysin five years. Okay. This slide,
in case anybody was wondering, hasthe total member institutions, the wrestling

(31:33):
teams, and the wrestling participants.Okay, And once again to interject,
every time Glenn brings us by willsay this is this being an Olympic year,
I do not have the time thissummer to go through the stacks behind
me. But again, just tolet everybody know what I'm doing to fill
that gap, going back at leastuntil the three divisional split seventy three,

(31:56):
seventy four, because as you know, again we've got you know, eight
years of data that since we've haddivisions that we can actually say, okay,
these are Division two, these areDivision three years Division one. I
can go back through and my challengehere again this is an unpaid challenge,
but if you want to contribute,you know how to get a hold of
me is going through all the amateurwrestling news is and the NCAA guide,

(32:17):
which stopped being printed oddly enough innineteen eighty two. Is count how many
teams reported results into AWN or ina conference tournament or a dual meet through
those stacks of amateur wrestling news,so I can come up with an accurate
account of how many actual wrestling teamswe have. And again one of my
hypotheses is most of our losses havecome from junior colleges that may have started

(32:43):
up a program for a year ortwo and then that doesn't work, and
then they just they just get ridof it. So I'm again putting the
time in this Summer's going to betough to do, but to go through
those old pages, page by pageand type in every school I see and
come up with the number and seewhat this has. Because we've got gaps
in the data, we don't know, we cannot tell you the high water

(33:06):
mark of teams with any certainty,right now because the number it's on screen.
Again, the NCAA didn't classify wherethose intramural teams where they club teams?
And the club wasn't a term weused a lot back then. I
wasn't alive yet, but they didn'tturn a club. But a lot of
intermural, a lot of sub varsitytype teams. Are we doing a JV
team? Is that counting as ateam because we'd have varsity teams like Brown

(33:30):
had, you know the ivy leaguesthey all had jvs. Lehigh had a
freshman team. Those type of teams, are they counted as teams? So
there's a lot of different nuances.So I want to find out how many
schools we're sponsoring some type of wrestlingthat was reportable score in interscholastic competitions,
so our inter intercollegiate competitions classics differentstory entirely. So that is where eventually

(33:52):
we will have an answer to thesegaps. That's what I'm working on,
Thank you very much, Shasha.And the slide that I do, I
do put up their pre chase.It says nobody reads it stuff anymore than
just listen to the internet. Thoseare the exact words on slide forty one.
That's use what Jason just summed upperfectly. Why you might have used

(34:14):
more words? Actually, how long? When did I get yes? Brevity
is not a strength of mind.Now to a man, it's all about
brevity, Kevin, speak softly andcarry a big stick. That's what I
always say. NCAA men's teams andparticipants per school. Okay, we're talking

(34:35):
about number of teams. How muchhas that changed? How many teams per
school? So we're gonna look atthis a little differently. We've been looking
at total numbers. Now we're gonnalook at the number of teams, you
know, NCUBA teams, you know, be it football, basketball, whatever,
per school and how has that change? And then what about the participation
the participants? How many athletes didthey have from eighty one eighty two,

(34:59):
and what is change from there totwenty two to twenty three? Okay,
thank you for those questions, Kevin. On the slide here, what you
see is D one, D twoand total the number of teams per school
drop from eighty two to twenty three. For example, in D one,

(35:22):
it used to be ten point threeteams per school, now it's eight point
five. Only D three has grown, So something's going on. This is
men's sports, now, something's goingon that the teams per school have changed,
have decreased now with the number ofparticipants okay, per school, they

(35:46):
have all increased, Okay, whichis very surprising to me that all the
school it's increased twenty three percent,from two hundred and twenty five per school
to almost two hundred and eighty.Okay, seaw, Kevin, Okay,
I got a question going back tothat. That's something be interesting to find

(36:10):
out. Is looking at those numbersand how many total teams do the schools
now have male and female? Andis there a Title nine influence in there
on that? But going forward onthis, so total number this beans went

(36:30):
up from eighty one, eighty twoto twenty three to twenty three, so
we've got a fewer teams for school, but we now have more college teams.
And how is that? How isthat possible? And we heard this,
you know, we've we've I've heardfor forty years the sky's falling,

(36:51):
you know, Title line's killing us, and I think there has been some
influence, But is that accurate?Okay, Kevin, thank you for asking
that question. From nineteen eighty oneeighty two till now, there are two
thousand, six hundred and thirty ninemore men's NCUBA college teams. Okay,

(37:13):
that is an increase of forty percent, right, and it's up on Division
one, Division two, and Divisionthree. Clearly, Division two and Division
three, like we've said before,is really where the growth is for the
number of participants that you can seeon slide forty eight. Okay, in
the same timeframe, there are onehundred and thirty two thousand and change more

(37:37):
men's and Cuba athletes. The populationof Green Bay, Wisconsin is one hundred
and seven thousand, So that meanswe've added more male athletes from nineteen eighty
one eighty two till today than thecity of Green Bay has people. Okay,

(37:57):
it's an eighty one percent increase inthe number of athletes. Now,
as long as we didn't add onehundred and thirty two thousand more Packers fans,
that'd be fine. Yeah, exactly. Now, I don't apologize for
that statement. I'm a Buccaneers fan, so uh yeah, it's not Yeah,
well, will you suck go ahead? And that's fine, okay,

(38:22):
So on slide forty two, saythat I know that I've I've only bold
that's where the nationals are on you. I've never been cursed out in was
it an Angel's Phillies game? Ordid not wear an Angel's hat and I
still got cursed out anyway. ContinueOkay, so on slide forty nine,
guys, we could see we'll getback on this and people saying, well,

(38:45):
great, men are out of onehundred and thirty two thousand athletes,
but how many of women at itin the same time frame. Well the
answer is almost one hundred and sixtytwo thousand. So yes, women have
added more, but that's not that'ssomething bad because we've also added. Now,
this century, there's been a largerincrease in male athletes than women's athletes,

(39:07):
eighty nine thousand versus seventy nine thousand. So for anybody who's sitting back
there saying, well, it's justall about women's sports, that's wrong,
guys. Okay, men's sports aregrowing too, and again something to think
about with this fact. Why,here's another why enrollment. Women's enrollment surpassed

(39:30):
male enrollment significantly. So now someof these schools like, well, we
need to get men's enrollment back up. So what's one of the best ways
to add men to your college campusad sports. So this is where we've
seen again that enrollment drivers. It'snot just men and women. They're women
attend more than men do. Andthat's a statistically proven fact. I mean,

(39:51):
you can just look at the numbers. I think the HBCUs are the
point where they're almost like sixty threesixty four percent women, and the national
averages is not far below that.So that's one thing that consider is like,
why are there more male opportunities beingadded in large roster sports usually at
sub D D one school like Done, Sorry, in the D two,
D three, And again we don'thave the stats for the ANIA that

(40:12):
is a direct reason why we've gotmore men's opportunities. Says they need more
male students. Got to even thingsback out. Yeah, and it's going
it's not just undergraduate school. There'sgoing to be a day where every lawyer
is a woman. I mean,it's like sixty percent women in law schools
now, So it's it's that wayin undergrad and grad schools. Okay,

(40:34):
Kevin, slide fifty two, we'refifty one, Okay, fifty one.
I'm sorry, my fault, allright, guys. Now, I'm trying
to answer this question as best Ican. I have a quote up here.
It's easier to fool people that convincethem they've been fooled. Mark Twain
famously said that. Okay, andthen I'll go back to one of my
famous quotes. There are liars,damn liars, and statisticians. Okay.

(40:59):
I happen to be the third one, for sure. I hope I'm not
the first too. Also, allright, now, one could easily point
to a specific sport in a specificschool and find and I'm using air quotes
here evidence the title nine has hurtmen's sports. If we examine the big
picture, men's NCAA sports have neverbeen statistically stronger. I personally think it's

(41:22):
short sighted to simply blame Title nine. Okay, Matt Stats is here to
dig into numbers deep and explore it. We've already pointed out that since eighty
one eighty two, there's over twentysix hundred more men's n CUBA teams.
That's one new team every five pointseven days. I want you guys to

(41:45):
think about that, Okay, So, in other words, even more than
for yeah, how many years,for thirty years forty three, yeah,
forty four years yep. Okay,so jeez yeah, sorry if you're born
in the nineties or thirty geez a, right, sorry. There's also one
hundred and thirty two thousand athletes.That is nine per day, and that

(42:10):
time frame nine more men's athletes perday. Okay. So I'm really finding
a struggle for people that just wantto blame Title nine. You know,
as a statistician, I can't justwith a straight face tell you Title Nines
the boogeyman and stuff like that.Can you point to specific anecdotes? Yes

(42:32):
you can, Okay. Why iswrestling suffered and the other sports haven't.
Perhaps it's because we're one of twosports that didn't have a female equivalent now
we do what we've changed it around. And also's other things to consider too.
As we go back and look atthe participation stats from the NAFHS,

(42:52):
the number of sports offered at thehigh school level back in the seventies isn't
as robust as it is today.Matter of fact, I mean, I
was in I graduated high school twentyseven years ago, which is very hard
for me to speak on right now. But we were still adding sports in
the nineties in the late nineties.I graduate high school nineteen ninety seven,

(43:14):
so there were still being sports addedat high school I and they're still being
added. Minnesota just added boys volleyball. We were talking about volleyball earlier.
That's a you know in Virginia hadbeen there because you know, the beach
is such a good area with atRichmond and Northern Virginia. But like Minnesota,
the boys volleyball was like, whoa, that's they've been fighting to be
a varsity sport for a while.So, yeah, we're still adding opportunities

(43:35):
for both men and women, boysand girls across the line. Forty fifty
years ago, the opportunities were limited. Or as you see with the teams,
there's also been a shift in wherethese schools are investing their resources.
Did they want Glenn talking about squadsize, do we want a roster of
twenty men, twenty two men,or do we want that lacrosse team with

(43:55):
fifty at an enrollment driven school.So we're looking it. You know,
again, the whole bubble of men'ssports versus our niche, we've we've niched
down considerably. Every niche can argueour point about losing programs. Every niche
sport can do it, and thenwhen you add them all up, you're
like, well, we're all addingsomewhere. Again, I do think that

(44:16):
that big college football is going tomake things at the Division one level again,
and that's where everybody's focusing their attentionon. But again, your high
school coach typically is not going tobe your your D one national champ unless
you live in like Central Pennsylvania.It's going to be the guy that wrestled
D two or D three more oftenthan not. So there are a number
of factors that come into play.It's not just one simple thing. It's

(44:37):
not. It's not as simple.That's the reason. So I think that's
one thing that uh, these numbersdo show, and that's one thing you
have to go in this not necessarilythinking wrestling first. You have to think
totality of population, totality of interest, and the variation of interest changing too.
So it's an important thing to considersomething. And again this is a
part where it's like not everything wesay, We're all going to sit there

(44:58):
and be like, well, Imean, I'm gon to put a little
bit more emphasis on the bad athleticdirectors in the eighties using the law as
a crutch that convinced again to thequote convinced them this versus actually telling him
the truth. So you know,we can just see in social media,
just because the quotes on the internetdoesn't make it true. And just because
oh well our ad says that that'sgot to be true, Well maybe they

(45:20):
weren't telling the truth back then andyou just believed it. So there's there's
so many different ways to try toput a banger point of finger on on
programs that we lost over the years. We just know we've got numbers now,
we're growing, We're creating opportunities againthat we once didn't have. We're
celebrating our growth here. That's mysoapbox here on this topic. I'm glad

(45:40):
you got on that soapbox. Itwas very good. Okay slide And by
the way, I have to saythis too, that also is a tweak
of my opinion over the years,because I, like many, was initially
going to be like, well thatwe've lost this many you know, research,
fact stats, develop and understanding asa whole. Do I like it?

(46:01):
No? Do I want all thoseprograms back? Yeah? Boy?
Also realize is it better I usethis as an example, Is it better
to have a well funded program likeGrandview and Wartburg in the NAI and Division
III than it is a horribly fundedprogram with half a ride that happens to

(46:22):
be at a D one school thatdoesn't care. So I'm going to use
Marquette for an example, no offenseto anybody that may have wrestled Marquette.
What's more beneficial to the long termgoals of wrestling? A forty and fifty
rostered program at Wartburg and Grandview thatproduces high school teachers and coaches and has
this large swath and gets kids interestedand you know, has opportunities to compete

(46:44):
at the next level and coach atthe next level and generally loves the sport.
Or a team that's struggling for existenceat a school that again doesn't care
about it. So I think we'rebetter having health as smaller colleges than half
ass schools at D one's that don'treally care about him. So that's one
thing. It's like, you know, don't hold you know, if you

(47:04):
don't have asked one thing whole lastone, you know, something like that.
I don't know, but I thinkit's beneficial to have healthier, small
programs more than poorly funded big ones. So to speak. Great, you
summed it up brilliantly, Jason.Let's be clear, Alabama was not a
well funded program when they were inthe SEC. Last that was my mic
drop here. Well do you knowwhy they got a program? Do you

(47:28):
remember why they got a program?I don't because I wasn't born yet.
Well, Bear Bryant was the coach, and I was talking to Eddie Steers
over the weekend, who was theWilliam Mary coach, and then he was
the Citadel coach, and he hada player coming out of high school and
he said, coach, and Ican't remember the guy's name, but he

(47:49):
ended up in the NFL for years, and and he told Barry, said,
Coach, I want to play footballand I want to wrestle in college.
And Bear Bryan said, no problems, son, And within two weeks
Alabama had a college resident program.I also in side note, I don't
mean to distract it, because we'vegot, you know, several more slides

(48:12):
to go. I also want somebodyto dig into this, because again I
wasn't born yet. I remember whenI worked at the newspaper and one of
my mentors got named Jim Hodges usedto cover hockey for the LA Kings was
working on the desk at the DailyPress when I was cutting my teeth,
and he lived in Chesapeake in southeasternVirginia. And it was the amount of

(48:32):
community colleges that popped up during theVietnam era for college students so they would
not have to go to war.I am curious on the number of college
sports that were started in that erafor the reason of keeping people from getting
going to war. I'm genuinely curiousabout this. This is not me deflecting

(48:54):
or any I'm curious. I waslike, because they were at community colleges
were adding left and right, Ohwe're college, we can't go like that
type. Yeah. I'm wondering howmuch of a role sports played there and
how many sports were added in thatera. And then when the war ended,
and then the advent of gender equityis like, oh, okay,

(49:16):
what do we do now? Howmany of these small schools like, well,
okay, we don't have people hidinghere anymore. And I'm saying,
you know again, I'm not makinga political statement, want to say that,
but I'm just curious if there's everbeen a studied or research or even
that type of path has been thoughtabout to dig into. Be like,
is it because you know the collegedeferment where we adding sports at big schools

(49:36):
in the South to avoid going overseasto fight. That's something I'm always curious
about. That's an interesting point.I've never thought about it that way,
Jason, sounds like the show.Yeah, well I was. I was.
I was born four or five yearsafter that particular skirmish ended, so
I have no direct knowledge there.And my dad served in that time and

(49:58):
he has since passed, so don'treally have any direct involvement there. But
that's just something that was brought upabout. I remember it being brought up
in a conversation about how quickly theseschools were being accredited to get those college
deferments, like Tiwater Community College andChesapeake was the TCC location that Jim and
I were talking about. So that'swhere we're at and what I knew was

(50:20):
going to be a long little topichere on slide fifty one. So okay,
let's go next time. We couldspend a whole week on that one,
yeah, Kevin, Okay, Sowe've got additional men's teams and participants
and where do they come from?And why, Gormes, Why have we
seen such a dramatic increase in thenumber of NCAA men's teams and participants and

(50:44):
at the same time we have adecrease in number of teams through school.
Where are these teams coming from?Okay, Kevin, that's a very good
question, because if you have lesssports per school, those team's per school,
how do you have all this growth? Well, the NC DOUBLEA has
grown drastically from seven hundred and fiftytwo members in eighty two to a little

(51:07):
bit over eleven hundred. Now.That's three hundred and forty nine more schools,
and they're in NC Double A.Now. Of course, most of
this growth is coming from D twoand D three. Okay, there aren't
also healthy in D one. Ohyeah, D one's going up twenty seven
percent in that time. Okay.What we've seen is there's so many more

(51:30):
member schools in the NC Double A. Albeit some of those came from the
NAIA, some game from different places, but they came from somewhere and well,
dovetailing what Jason and Kevin said earlier, is it better to have a
school that really cares about it,even if the Division III or school that
doesn't care about it. At Divisionone, okay, well as all as

(51:52):
these these kids are getting to wrestle, they're getting an education, and they're
being successful at something. You know, I think it's great because you know,
you talk to people on the street, Oh, the team's not successful
unless they win the Super Bowl.Well, when were you ever second best
in the world at anything? Youknow, to be a runner up at

(52:14):
the football anything? Right? Sothe situation is we're growing more teams in
the NCAA and the main reason isbecause the NCAA is growing, and that's
great. Who cares where they comefrom, how they get there. Give
kids a chance to play, runjump? Okay, So we see forty

(52:36):
percent increase of members. And incase anybody was wondering the public private breakdown,
as you might have guessed, Divisionone is primarily two thirds public schools
and eighty percent of Division three isprivate schools. Overall, there's actually more
private schools in the NCAA than theyour public fifty six to forty four percent

(52:59):
in case, but a difference there. D two. I didn't realize it
was that close. We two isdead, almost dead on the same it's
one fifty seven public one fifty fiveprivate. So you round, it's a
rowdy yards fifty to fifty. Wow, you brought something out that I actually
had no idea about anyway, Okay, Kevin, Okay. One of the

(53:23):
things that I heard, and againmy era was when when I finished college
wrestling. I think it was probablyat the high point of D one wrestling,
and I think, I think we'vetalked about in the past, seventy
one seventy two was the high point, and it started and so we started

(53:43):
seeing, you know, feeling thechange more than seeing it, and it
felt like that the revenue sports weren'tbeing diminished like we were. So are
we Is that accurate? Are theremore football and basketball teams then? Do
they still dominate the growth or not? Okay, Kevin, thank you for

(54:06):
asking that. If you look atif you look at this football and basketball,
okay, of men's basketball we're talkingabout here, only used to be
nineteen percent of the teams. Nowthey're only sixteen. Okay. If you
take football one A and basketball Divisionone, that's only six percent of all

(54:31):
the teams in eighty one eighty two. It's down to five percent now,
So what gets all the attention isfootball one A and basketball Division one,
whether it be for the ball games, the march badness, whatever reason,
they get the attention. If youadd women into that, they're like two

(54:52):
percent of all the teams football oneA and basketball Division one. Well what
about this, Glenn too. Welook at football one A. We know
that, the G five and youknow the mid you know, of looking
at one A, we're not talkingabout you know, North Dakota States of
the world. We're talking about theGeorgia States of the world. That school
in Norfolk. We're looking you know, the schools that are moving up.

(55:13):
You know, Tarlton State is movinginto the subdivision. But like looking at
who is it like the packed okay, the PAC twelve, Big twell,
the P four and then you takethe Power five program or the Power five
conferences and men's basketball, where there'syou know, three hundred change. The
amount of schools that they're actually beingpaid attention to are even lower than that.

(55:34):
I mean we're talking maybe, Imean sure, I'm sure, Glenn.
If you run the numbers, wemight be looking at literally a one
percenter type of situation where one percentof the team's dictate the one hundred percent
of the money. Oh frustrating whenyou're a niche sports fan, you know,
I mean, I think about,Yeah, there are college World Series
about to start. All eight teamsare from the SEC and the ACC Women's

(55:58):
College World Series. They were allpowerful programs. Yeah. Interestingly enough,
Duke, the women's the softball teamhad made their first prints. They had
only been a team. They werestarted I think we'll say within maybe ten
fifteen years ago, so they weren'tThey're a relatively new program. I need
to be fat I need to factcheck that. But I was on the
plane with several Duke fans on theway to Honor's weekend, and it was

(56:20):
like, Duke, Yeah, itwas their first they had they had not
been around very long. And tocome in and be immediately competitive in a
good college softball conference, the ACCis not chopped liver there. So and
all you know, all all teamsin women's College World Series were Power five
schools. Yep. Okay. Sosome people then they asked me, well,
football obviously has much larger fosters thanany other sport. Okay, because

(56:43):
you know the requirements, only sevenpercent of all participants male participants are football
one A and basketball Division One,And if you reduced that down to the
now the power for in football becausethe Pack twelve's going to and the basketball
D one schools that aren't located inWillnisburg, Virginia that never make the tournament,

(57:06):
it would be a very low percentageyeah, of people doing that.
Yeah. So and just just forthe record, one of the reasons I
was given when I was the assistantwill you Marry when they were about to
drop it is because we couldn't becompetitive. Well, I wish we married.
Basketball team wouldn't make the tournament,but they never have since d after
so so maybe maybe they were incorrectin that assessment. Yeah, what is

(57:31):
your baseline on being competitive? BecauseI guarantee you this sport can be more
competitive at a national scale than thatsport has been for one hundred years.
So oh sure, we just uhwe Right before they did that, we
had a wrestler that made the nationalsemifinals, Rob Lauermore, we had a
two time biwaow Okay, so wewere being competitive and basketball wasn't. But

(57:55):
anyway back to the show, Okay, you're not going to chase my opinion
of what they did. Will YouMary was wrong? Okay, it was
totally wrong. Okay, what typeof growth is one A football scene?
Okay, well, like we saidearlier in the show, one A football
has seen a decrease of seven teams, and the growth has come from one

(58:19):
double A football. A lot ofthose schools that were one A in eighty
one eighty two, William and Marybeing one of them, dropped to one
Double A. Whether that was away to formulation of one double A.
You know, the ivys used tocompete against the big dogs and you know,
bowl games and such, and thenthey're like, Nope, this is
not our I wish more schools wouldtake that approach, like this is not

(58:42):
our this is not our fit,our mission, So we're going to do
this now. Granted I wish theivs would play in the playoffs, but
again they're they're there. They docompete in their own world in a lot
of ways. So I wish moreschools and conferences would understand this is the
reality. Why are we trying tochase something we can't have? And again,
I think all these the house andthen the nil stuff is going to

(59:05):
get to give some schools hard decisionsbecause there are schools that are going to
close. There are schools that arelike okay, And problem is, once
you're up at Division one, it'slike almost like okay, well, we
lose whatever money we have from youknow, the basketball tournament payouts and units
per conference that if we go backto where we should be in Division two
for example, for a lot ofthese schools, you have no business being

(59:27):
D one and and but you don't. You can't tell the fan base that,
you can't tell the alumni that thecult of college sports, especially with
football and basketball D one or nothing. It's like it's painful. You would
make the sports you have in yourathletes experience better if you were not shooting
above your rank. So anyway,again we are we are niche sports fans

(59:47):
preaching to people who aren't listening tous. So I have a question on
this though. So we're looking atFB football one A and one double A.
Any prediction in five years whether thatnumber gets rebalanced to even more,

(01:00:09):
No, because I don't know.They're they're still backfilling every every realignment move.
Like we saw that the move tothe SEC from Oklahoma created how many
created Tarleton State is moving to Divisionone because Oklahoma moved to the se state.

(01:00:30):
It's a ripple effect that is beyondbelief. And then you know the
you know, then actually they're they'rethey're working on funding their getting their wrestling
program funded too. So maybe that'sgonna be good for us in the long
term, you know, long term. Okay, well, they're we've got
we've got schools that are being pulledup, pulled up, pulled up from
Division two to backfill smaller D one, you know, mid to low major

(01:00:52):
conferences. I don't I don't seethat stopping. Again. The reality is
that some of these schools should not. You know, we Division one system,
in my opinion, is broken.But that doesn't mean college sports is
broken. Because college sports, aswe've shown on this show, a Division
two and Division three, and againwe don't have the stats for the NA,
college sports is thriving at those levelsfor those athletes. It's just again,

(01:01:14):
we got one percent of the sportsgetting ninety nine percent of the attention,
and it makes it it skews thereality of what's going on. The
problem is is money is the reality. Kevin. I'll give you a prediction
another soapbox. I think there's goingto be three football playoffs for Division one
one day one for the schools thatcan afford the nil all the Division one

(01:01:35):
day one that can't, and thenthe normal one double A thing. I
just and you might have the samething in basketball, Well you have two
tournaments. I Division one double Awill grow substantially in the next five years.
Yeah, that's what I think.All right, Okay, let's go
to slide sixty one. Okay,you said I think one of the first

(01:02:00):
lade. You said, it doesn'thave men's ruin, doesn't have an NCUBA
championship. But why are we talkingabout it? Why is there a lesson
there that we can talk about?Okay? The reason I did this was,
first of all, rowing is theoldest intercollegiate sport. The first race

(01:02:22):
was between Harvard and Yale who elsein eighteen fifty two, if you did
hear that right, It's been anorganized collegiate championship since eighteen seventy one.
Okay, Women's rowing became an ncDOUBLEA championship sport in nineteen ninety six ninety
seven, and according to Wiki,men's growing declined to join as an NCAA

(01:02:43):
championship sport. I have no ideawhy, but what you can see here
on the next slide. And incase you know just listening, in nineteen
eighty one eighty two, they werealmost the same amount of teams forty eight
men forty three women. Okay,then it got to ninety and ninety eight

(01:03:05):
because that's when women added to thechampionship. Since then, men has grown
has decreased thirty three teams and womenhas grown forty eight. My belief in
this year, once again, correlationdoes not prove causality. Okay, but
I think there's something to do withthe NCAA having a championship. And the

(01:03:27):
reason I'm hoping this is true isbecause soon we are going to see NCAA
Women's wrestling championship. So that's thereason I included this in on it as
a thing that hopefully that helps womengrow, okay, and then we ride
on their coat tails like men's lacrosseand volleyball have done to women. So

(01:03:51):
that's that's Kevin's the reason I've putthat in there. Thank you for noticing
that. And guys, I wantto say one more thing here before we
let Kevin wrap it up with thekeV notes. In case anybody doesn't know
slide sixty five, please congrats toLarry Connolly and door Knock for winning the
twenty twenty four Belmont Stakes. Now, Larry Connolly isn't a horse. He's

(01:04:14):
one of the people that started westPaces Racing, that owns Dorknock, and
congratulations. Larry is a proud memberof the We Marry Tribe family and we're
happy to have him as a aspart of our family. And we're all
happy for you, Larry. Congratch. I just been getting my money on
don to win the El Segundo Steaks. Okay, Keny get that movie reference.

(01:04:40):
If you get that movie reference,send me a tweet at Jason M.
Bryant, because I want to knowif you picked up on that one.
Don't bother Glenn or Kevin with that. I want to know if you
picked up on now one. Anyway, moving forward, okay, all right,
in our first slide and go backand look at it. We showed
Kenny Chesney he is a dead ringerfor Rogers. Stallback, you put them

(01:05:02):
side by side, so old,you're so old. I went back and
except six, So all right,number two. The NC double A has
kept great, great record since eightyone eighty two, and Jason also does

(01:05:25):
one hell of a job with hisyou know, his data that he puts
together. As of five twenty seven, twenty four, there are more n
Cuba men's wrestling team since eighty eighteighty nine. Number four. Men's wrestling
and men's gymnastics are the only NCUAeighteen men's sports to see a decrease total

(01:05:48):
number of teams since eighty one eightytwo, but number five. There have
been explosive growth in the number ofNC double A D two and D three
wrestling team you know, the latterpart of this century, fifty seven and
forty seven percent. Number six.Twenty one and twenty three we saw the

(01:06:13):
fourth and fifth most men's wrestlers inthe nc Double A since eighty one eighty
two, and gorm says by twentyfour to twenty five we will have the
most number seven. And we spenta lot of time talking about this and
trying to figure it out. Men'swrestling squad sizes are larger today than any
time since eighty one eighty two.Number eight. This century, the NC

(01:06:39):
double A has seen a larger increasein men's athletes than women's athlete. Kind
of debunks the you know the conspiracytheories number nine eighty one eighty two.
The nc Doualea has an increase oftwenty six hundred plus men's teams and one
hundred and thirty two thousand male athletessince eighty one eighty two and number ten

(01:07:04):
since two thousand and nine ten.The men's wrestling has had a larger increase
in teams than either football or men'sbasketball. You put them together, they're
just slightly larger than wrestling. Thankyou for summing to show up, Kevin.
I want to let everybody know thenext show will be out Wednesday,

(01:07:26):
July twenty fourth, Okay, thatis the day before the convention starts.
Hope to see many of you guysat the convention. We will be doing
a show live at the convention inaddition to this show coming out the day
before, okay, so we lookforward to doing that. It'll be our
first ever live show. The showthat comes out the day before the convention

(01:07:47):
is how the adoption to the threepoint takedown rule in the two three and
four near point four rule has effectedthe sport. And right now I just
want to give thanks to Kevin.Howzard is going to watch every match in
Division two and twenty three and twentyfour, So we're gonna owe him a
big thank you. And you're bigdogfish Head, because you're right there there,

(01:08:11):
aren't you and don't Yes, he'sright next to Dogfish. So,
guys, minutes six minutes my caraway from the dog Fish Brewery, what
about my stumble? That's that's that'show I want to track it. Let's
not do that. Let's not dothat. We've we've already had one hand
to get a concussion doing things wedon't want another anyway. Okay, guys

(01:08:31):
on behalf of Jason Bryant and theOlder Hazard, Kevin Hazard. This is
Glenn Gormbley. Wrap up your show, see you next month and hope to
see you at the convention.

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Looking at the growth of men's wrestling and men's sports since 1981-92 - Mat Stats 33

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Looking at the growth of men's wrestling and men's sports since 1981-92 - Mat Stats 33