Chicago attorney turned author Thomas E. Patterson with “American Populist: Huey Long of Louisiana”!
December 29, 2025 • 41 mins
Chicago attorney turned author Thomas E. Patterson talks about his latest release “American Populist: Huey Long of Louisiana” as a monumental biography of Louisiana senator Huey Long as a progressive thinking populist hero and radical influence on the New Deal before an assassin bullet ended his life in 1935, transformed politics by siding in the interest of citizens who’ve been ignored by state officials and made his mark in American politics with ideals like taxing the rich, minimum income for American families, free college admission and more! Thomas spent 40+ years preparing & trying business lawsuits and achieved several notable settlements involving Rep. Dennis Hastert, David L. Paul, Chemical Bank and wrote two books about handling business emergencies, temporary restraining orders and preliminary junctions! Check out the amazing Thomas E. Patterson and his latest release on all major platforms and www.pattersonbooks.com today! #thomasepatterson #author #laywer #chicagoattorney #hueylong #americanpopulist #louisiana #populist #progressivethinking #americanpolitics #americanfamilies #businesslawsuits #spreaker #spotify #iheartradio #applemusic #bitchute #rumble #youtube #mikewagner #themikewagnershow #mikewagnerthomasepatterson #themikewagnershowthomasepatterson
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Check it out today. Here's the amazing attorney turned author
(01:34):
from Chicago with a major in history and serving two
terms as student Senate president. We'll talk about that. Spend
forty plus years preparing in trying business lawsuits and achieved
several noble you know, noble achievements including Dennis Haster and
also they have a pucket as well most normable clients
(01:55):
as well, and also served on the Law Review. He
has a new book out with the mind metal biography
of a senator from Louisiana, a progressive thinker, populist and
also a racal influence on the New Deal. And the
book is called American populacet Hughelaw with Louisiana Live Lace
and Jonen plus Duwis and Beat with Downtown Chicago. The
amazing attorney turned author from Chicago with the major in history,
(02:18):
serving two terms on a student Senate president and also
spent forty years preparing trying business lawsuits multi time. Thomas
Patterson Thomas, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Thanks for
joining us today.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
Hey, thanks for having me on your show. It's a
real thrill to be here.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, it's great to have you on, Borrod Thomas. So,
your attorney turned author with a major in history, serve
two terms as student Senate president. You spend forty plus
years preparing in trying business lawsuits. You achieved seto nobles
including Dinner Hastard and David Puck and morm. You achieved
several of that you served on the Law Review. You
(02:53):
have a new book out which is a mind mel
biography of Huey Lewis, who is a Senator from Louisiana
as a progressive thinker, populist hero in a racal influence
on the Neil Deal before being assassinated back in nineteen
thirty eight as well forty two. The book is called
American populist Huey Long Louisiana and four getting olla Thomas
(03:14):
tell Us. I first got started well.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
As you noted, I was a history major at Illinois
Westland University, and then I went to law school. After that,
wrote for the Law Review, and I had a job
with a justice on the Illinois Supreme Court, William G. Clark,
a very notable figure and he had an amazing political
career before he became a justice on the Supreme Court.
Then I joined a large Chicago law firm and I
(03:40):
tried a lot of business lawsuits there, and I started
my own law firm in the year two thousand April fourteenth,
two thousand with eight clients. We've had a pretty spectacular
success since then. As you noted, we sued Dennis Hastert,
the former Speaker of the House of Representatives, for preach
of contract. We also on the largest legal malpracticed verdict
(04:02):
in the state of Ohio, and we've had several other
notable victories, some of which I can't explain because they're
subject to confidentiality agreements. So since then, I had written
a book for lawyers called Temporary Restraining Orders and Preliminary
Injunctions Handling the Business Emergency, and we've gone through two
(04:25):
editions of that. It was published by the American Bar Association.
But after that I was looking for a new project.
And when I saw the financial crisis of two thousand
and eight and two thousand and nine, and I saw
books by Piquetti and Stiglitz talking about the unequal distribution
of wealth, I recalled that I had been fascinated by
Huey Long of Louisiana back in the nineteen thirties, whose
(04:47):
primary contention throughout his life was that there was a
crying need to redistribute the wealth of the United States
so that there would not be an unequal distribution of
wealth and power. And so I I had looked at
the different biographies, including the spectacular won by T. Harry
Williams in nineteen sixty nine. There was a Ken Burns
(05:09):
documentary in the mid nineteen eighties, and then later authors
had kind of chipped away at what Williams had said
and had disagreements with him, And so I thought, well,
maybe I'd take a look and see if I could
get my own answers. But of course I was helped
by the Internet, enormously helped because I could get because
of digitization, I could get every Chicago Tribune article that
(05:31):
mentioned Huey Long from nineteen twenty eight to nineteen thirty five,
and I did the same thing for the New York Times.
So I had almost a day by day, point by
point analysis of what hue was doing, and that allowed
me to draw some cause and effect relationships that other
biographers had missed. Then, by luck, I found out that
(05:53):
his personal papers existed at the LSU library. They had
not been available when Harry Williams wrote his book, and
later biographers had not used them to a significant extent,
and that was a treasure trove of information about his
early days, in his conflicts with his brother in the
Bank of Winfield and so on. So it was a
(06:14):
very interesting project, much like working up a court case.
You have the primary sources. You had the t Harry
Williams interviews of Hughey's contemporaries, and you had what other
people had written and what other people had thought and
their opinions on and so I just tried to construct
the story of Huey Long from scratch. So there we are,
(06:35):
and only I thought that the book for Lawyers took
only three years to write. I thought, well, okay, I
could probably knock this Huey Long book out in three
years too. Of course, that was in twenty fourteen, and
the book didn't come out until February of this year.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Oh wow, so I guess a little faster for this
seems like.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
Yeah. Yeah, it was a lot of work, but of
course I had to keep my day job, and so
I was a lawyer by day and a fledgling author
by night.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
I guess that's a case of here. He is all
about redistribution of wealth. In your case, this is a
redistribution over time.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Yes, you're right about that. And the LSU Press was
kind enough to publish the book, so I'm grateful for them.
But they also, you know, told me to cut one
hundred and thirty thousand words out of the manuscript, which
I did, and uh that was a job in and
of itself.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Oh wow, was it like you know, possible conflict of
ventures or it's just like your your filler words like
you know as uh maybe like filler words and all that.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
There's no question it's a denser work now than it
was ahead of time because I was getting down to
the actual individual words instead of at the same time.
You know, if I said contemporaneously, I say three words, Oh.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
My, I guess a redistribution of you know, we just
keep building on right there too, red just bet whatever too.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
So I tell you it's like somebody said, you know,
there's no such thing as good writing, just rewriting. Or
I think it was Faukner who said, the trouble with
editing is you have to murder all your little darlings,
all those little nice sentences that I enjoyed, they had
to go.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Oh my gosh. That is something I'll tell you. And
where's some bar your other favorite authors and writers growing up?
Especially books?
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Oh, I like the t Harry Williams biography. That's the
first one that got me interested in Huey Long. I
liked there's a book about Louis the eleventh, the King
of France and the fourteen hundreds by Paul Murray Kendall
that I thought was terrific. I've read the book about
Rockefeller and Grant, and some of the well known biographies,
Robert's biography of Churchill, those kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
I like.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
You know, A good A good biography, I think is
a has an interesting person and interesting times and so
I thought Hughey, he was a fascinating person. He had talent,
he had flaws, he had victories, defeats, comebacks. He had conflicts.
You know that stuff you learned in eighth grade English,
you know about conflicts. He had conflicts with his brother,
(09:12):
the biggest bank in Winfield. He had conflicts with the
Louisiana oligarchy, had conflicts with Frank and Roosevelt and so on.
He conflicts with himself, and then you had interesting times.
You've got the worst depression of the nineteenth century, which
is when he was born. You've got the robber barons
in the early nineteen hundreds, you've got World War One,
(09:33):
you've got the Roaring twenties, and you've got the greatest
depression in the United States history. And all took place
within the span of forty two years of his life.
So if it's a bad book, it's all my fault.
I had a lot of good stuff to work with.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
I was just going to ask you something as well, too,
that you know, there was a Ken Burns documentary that
came out. Was there a made for TV movie or
a movie came out theaters about Huey Long, Oh, something
like that that.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Yes, there's a there's a movie that starred John Goodman,
and there's another one start ed ed Asner. And of
course the fictionalized version of Hughey's story. I mean, it's
not quite the same. But All the King's Men Lying
is in the streets. All the King's Men was a
great novel, and it was made into a movie in
the nineteen forties and again in two thousand and six
(10:22):
or two thousand and seven. You know, Hughey has had
an amazing impact on novelists as well as historians. And
you've got it can't happen here where Sinclair Lewis wrote
a thinly disguised character based on Huey Long and so
it's hard to imagine another political figure who was not
(10:43):
president who had a similar impact on the imagination of
novelists and writers and playwrights. He's had an opera written
about him. I mean, the stuff that's happened because of
Huey Long is is quite amazing.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
If Huey Long were run for president, would it be
like an independent party? Or what party would he have
liked been in, or what kind of party would you
have created.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
In preparation for the nineteen thirty six election, he was
looking at whether he could start a third party, and
the thinking was under this theory was that he could
split the liberal vote with Franklin Roosevelt elector Republican who
would do nothing about the depression, and then in nineteen
forty heo he would be stronger than ever and be
ready to win the presidential election. He had not finally
(11:30):
decided on that course of action. He was going to
sound out sentiment by taking a tour in the West
and the Midwestern states after the congressional session of nineteen
thirty five, And remember, he would have had all of
nineteen thirty six to figure out what he was going
to do and to register a new party if he
decided ultimately to do that. But he was definitely looking
(11:52):
at that, and the Republicans fearing or accounting on the
fact that he would split the liberal vote with Roosevelt
to some extent, backing him financially in the hopes that
he would split Roosevelt's vote an elected Republican.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Did FDR view it as like, you know, as a
threat or I'm like as a helping or was just
like basically just neutral.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
Well with respect to politics, Roosevelt was scared the death
of Huey Long. They commissioned a secret poll to gauge
Long's strength in the found that he could attract enough
votes in enough states that would swing the election to
the Republicans. And then he set about allocating public works
(12:37):
and relief funds in those states where he thought he
was afraid that Huey Long would tip the balance of
power to the Republicans. And Roosevelt was frank in admitting
to some advisors that he was going to have to
steal Huey Long's thunder. And if you look at his
legislative program in nineteen thirty five, the so called Second
New Deal, or the so called turn to the Left,
(13:00):
it was motivated primarily by fear of Huey Long, and
some of Roosevelt's advisors, like Rexford Tugwell, gave Huey Long
the credit for the passage of the Social Security Act
because Roosevelt and his advisors were afraid that Huey Long
would arouse support for something more substantial than the limited
Social Security Act that was passed. And so you can
(13:21):
see that some of the Roosevelt then advocated for the
first time in nineteen thirty five increased taxation on the wealthy,
and gave a message to Congress outlining the fact that
he thought that there was an unjust distribution of wealth
and income in the United States that needed to be
remedied by increased taxation. And of course, the Senate, which
(13:44):
was sick to death of Huey Long's advocacy of that,
sat in stunned silence as this presidential record message was read,
and then Huey was strutting around the Senate saying, I
just wish to say I'm in. But of course the
Roosevelt tax plan didn't raise as much revenue as Huey
thought he could raise by his proposed taxing system. And
(14:08):
he also proposed minimum income, free college educations, generous veteran benefits,
a limited working day, you know, uh, management of farm surpluses.
I mean, he had a progressive program that was and
still remains somewhat relevant today.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
And do you think do you think some of that
was influenced today as well too, like with the basic income,
and I think there was also what was that other
one is is that similar to what's going on today
like with Hughey.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
Well, there's no question that Bernie Sanders sounds a lot
like Huey Long when he denounces the oligarchy today and
when he explains that three people in the United States
own more wealth than the bottom fifty percent of the
population combined. It's interesting that while Sanders says that I
don't know what his plan is. Maybe I haven't paid
(15:06):
enough attention, but I don't know what his plan is
to remedy that. I mean, I know he talks about
universal health care. I appreciate that, but what is he
going to do about the oligarchs? What does he plan
to do about it? Hughey said, let's tax him. Let's
tax him at one over a certain amount. So you
had a ceiling for wealth on the one hand, and
(15:26):
a floor underwealth on the other hand. A minimum income.
And if you look at the people, if you google
minimum income advocates today, you will find all kinds of
business titans, Republican former Treasury secretaries, and other politicians like
Daniel moynihan, former Senator of New York, many other people
(15:47):
who think that minimum income is a good idea. And
you have to wonder, I mean, if a minimum income
had been adopted instead of some of these bureaucratic programs
to provide housing or food stamps or snap funds or
whatever you wonder what would have developed in the United States.
There would have been less bureaucracy, more control over their
(16:10):
spending by by the poor, and private enterprise would have
built the houses and provided the food instead of having
the government decide when and where those houses were going
to be built and who was going to live in them,
and that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
And I think that makes sense as well too, you know,
comparing the First New Deal and the Second New Deal.
Will file more about that with Thomas E. E. Parrison and
the book American populist Huey Long of Louisiana. But first
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PayPal and the Mic Winnershow dot com. We're here. It's
amazing attorney turned author from Chicago with a major in history,
(18:38):
and the book is called American populist Huey Long of Louisiana,
Thomas E. Paerson and here of Mike Winners show. Before
get back to the book, you brought some about the
First New Deal with Roosevelt and the Second New Deal
under Huey Long. So what was like the similarities and
the differences between the First New Deal and the Second
New Deal.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Well, it seems to me the First New Deal started
with a lot of hoopla over the National Industrial Recovery Act,
and that was basically state capitalism that was proposed by Roosevelt,
and Huey criticized that. And Roosevelt also cut veterans benefits
and that was criticized by Huey. But they had several
(19:18):
other aspects that engendered patriotic of patriotic fervore at that time.
And initially Huey had a real downturn in his prestige
in nineteen thirty three because Roosevelt was very popular. Huey
was criticizing certain Roosevelt programs. But even while you realized
(19:38):
that Huey Long criticized certain Roosevelt programs, he actually strengthened
other New Deal programs that were issued in the First
New Deal. For example, Roosevelt proposed a Banking Reform Act
because all the banks had failed at the time of
his inauguration. Huey is the one who advocated insurance of
bank deposits, which had a leading role in restoring confidence
(20:00):
in the banks by the people. And he also pardon
me yes. And then Hughie also proposed, which was missing
from the original Roosevelt legislation, protecting state banks, not just
the federal banks, because there were seventy five percent of
the banks for state banks and only one quarter of
the banks were federal banks. So Hughey wanted to propose
(20:24):
protecting the state banks as well as the federal in
Roosevelt under because of Hughey's pressure, advocated that ultimately signed
that bill that included those two provisions which strengthened the
early New Deal. But by opposing the cuts to veterans
benefits and by opposing the National Industrial Recovery Act, Roosevelt
(20:44):
cut off Hughey's patronage. And then at that time hue
also had an encounter at a country club where he
got punched in the eye, and that was front page
news all over the country, and people said, you know
he was They said he was inebriated and been overserved
and so on, and so that accompanied a downturn in
his prestige even in Louisiana, and as a kind of
(21:07):
a comeback from that, he started what he called to
share our Wealth Societies in February nineteen thirty four, in
which he advocated limiting fortunes, minimum incomes, free college educations,
and the like. And those societies spread like wildfire, and
where by April of nineteen thirty five he had estimated
(21:29):
seven and a half million members, and by September of
that year, when he was killed, they estimated he had
nine million members of that society. And that's when Roosevelt
turned to the left in his administration by adopting some
of Hughey Lung's proposals increased taxes on the wealthy, social
security and similar legislation.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
And I think there's also what we covered as well too,
funding college, paying old age, ensuring bank deposits, and it
call so increasing the money supply. I think that was
a big one right there. I mean a lot of
beause he used money, right.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Oh yeah. And the thing is, Hugh, we wanted to
really expand the money supply, but Roosevelt convinced the progressives
who advocated that to give him the discretion whether to
increase the money supply, and then he really didn't do it.
And so the progressives like George Norris and Burton Wheeler
(22:23):
and Huey and the rest of them wanted to increase
the supply of money, but Roosevelt was kind of recalcitrant
on that, and that retarded the recovery. I mean, the
recovery would have been faster, more enduring if he had
increased the expenditures on public works and if he had
increased the supply of money.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
You talk about the expensure of public works as well
too with the infrastructure, rebuilding bridges, sidewalks, everything like that,
And this came to mind. Increasing my supplier would have
been great. Do you think there would have also increased
inflation or without like maybe without lower the value of
the dollar anything like that, because you hear about money
(23:01):
supply or print out more money, would that back in
the day increase the value of the doll or would
have decreased the value of the doll back in nineteen
thirty five were around that time?
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Yeah, I think that if you print money, the value
of the dollar will decline to some extent. But what
we should remember, in my opinion, is that in nineteen
twenty eight or nineteen twenty nine, we had say fifty
billion in circulation. I can't remember what the exact number was,
but by nineteen thirty two or thirty three, we had
(23:32):
like twenty nine billion dollars in circulation. I could be
a little off in the numbers, but we had a
tremendous decline in the supply of money, and that either
in some economists view, that caused the depression. Another economist view,
it prevented or retarded the potential recovery. So I mean,
and this is conservative economists today, like you know, Milton
(23:55):
Friedman advocated increasing the supply of money or keeping it.
I mean, he didn't want inflame huge inflation, but he
wanted to increase the supply of money, and economic thought
of the day just didn't realize how important the inflating
the money supply would be. In one other point, we
had huge deficits spending to pay for World War Two.
(24:18):
I mean about fifty billion dollars per year. I mean,
that's just huge numbers. But where did that money go to?
That money went to people who had been previously unemployed
or underemployed, and so those people now had more money,
even if the dollar was worth less, they had more
money than they had before. And the people that were
(24:40):
sitting on their wealth had less of a total percentage
of the money supply than they had previously. So I
think I don't agree that we should always print money
no matter what the circumstances are. But I think if
we had increased the supply of money in the nineteen thirties,
it would have helped alleviate the Great Depression.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
And do you think increasing money every single year would
have health the economy more and prevent inflation?
Speaker 4 (25:07):
Well, I think if the gross national product had kept
up with the money supply, I think, you know, the
inflation would be minimized, Okay.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
And plus I'm sure in Hugh's case as well too,
being Louisiana, he wish he had some money supply as
well growing up, and he was a rough start for him.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Oh, there's no question about it. And you know, if
you look at Hughey's program in the state of Louisiana
in nineteen thirty, thirty one, thirty two, he had a
huge one hundred million dollar bond program. Now they were
sold in fifteen million dollar tranches, and he was employing
about ten or twenty percent of the entire country's workforce
(25:46):
on roads. In Louisiana, he built something like two thousand
miles of roads, plus bridges, you know, the first bridge
over the Mississippi, all kinds of new state capital, that
was the tallest building in the South, a new airport.
He had huge public works projects in Louisiana. And there
is a writer who studied the fiscal income of Louisiana
(26:08):
at that time, and while the income of Louisiana declined,
it declined about half as much as the decline was
in other states because Huey had used bond financing, deficit
financing to keep public works and to keep money in
the hands of the people. So I think it shows
that fiscal policy that is deficit spending, under certain circumstances,
(26:30):
it can alleviate a depression.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
And plus he had his share of successes and faults
as well, and even issues in the family as well,
especially his brother you're talking about.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
Well, yeah, Erlong had a very colorful career. After hughe died,
he became he was lieutenant governor on the ticket that
was elected after Hughey's death, and then he lost the
election of nineteen forty to a reform candidate because some
of the Huey's leaders had stolen money and there were
(27:05):
Louisiana scandals after in nineteen thirty nine, right before the
nineteen forty election. Then Earl made a comeback in nineteen
forty eight and won the governorship and served four years there,
and then he won the governorship again, I believe, in
nineteen fifty six, but had that infamous nervous breakdown caused
by a series of strokes that was memorialized, well, it
(27:29):
was unfairly memorialized in the Blaze Star movie. But there's
a great book by aj Leebling of the New Yorker
chronicling Earl's adventures. And there's a fellow in Louisiana named
Jack Maguire who has written the book, a great book
about Earlong's last campaign in nineteen sixty for Congress, in
which his theory was he was going to win the
(27:51):
race or die trying. And he won the race and
had a heart attack right after he won.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
That was fitting. I got said that. And here you
long stuff for a save fan as well too. And
how do you manage Gussnail? Find out when we're met
with Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Heure Long with Louisiana.
You listen to The Mike Widner Show at the Mike
Winnershow dot com power by sondqweb Studios brought you by
professional sponsor to Mike Widner's show, internetion warring author me
(28:18):
and most is missing The Sweet Salmispresserena Wagner based on
life of Davenplin, three squizz of Paints and Kandavin psalms
Amazon dot com. Keywords sweet Samas Swerena Radner would be
Buckley the amazing author from Chicago, Thomas E. Patterson of
American populist Hue Long of Louisiana alfter this time.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
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Speaker 5 (29:03):
Hey there, Dana Laksa here, American news anchor. Hey, let
me ask you something real quick. Why do you read
a book. You're buying a story, a thought, a message,
and a good book entertains and inspires. And that's exactly
what A Missing By Award winning author me on the
Zia does. I have his book right here, and it's
based on real events with relatable characters that hook you
(29:26):
from start to finish. I personally love this book. It's
super powerful and meaningful through You can actually get it
on Amazon right now.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist, now a Velveon Emson. This
book includes thirty exquisite pintings by well known and unknown
painters and King David Soalms. The Sweet Sawmist gives us
a new perspective on his life in this book through
the songs he wrote. His time as a shepherd in
the field is where the book starts, and it goes
on to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with King Saul,
(29:54):
as well as other events It's a story of love, betrayal, repentance,
and more. It also offers advice and approaching God and
living a life that pleases him. Check out the book
The Sweet Sawmist by Serena Wagner, now available on Amazon
keywords Sweet Salmis Sorena Wagner. Hey, Hey, this is Ray
Powers and boy, are you in luck?
Speaker 4 (30:13):
Right place?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Right time? Tuned into the Mike Wagner Show. You heard me,
We're back on Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Herey
Long of Louisiana. Here on the Mike Wagner Show. We
covered Hreey Lung's legacy in the book as well, and
he was assassinated. However, that was in nineteen thirty five,
(30:36):
and tell us more about that and how did that
lead up to the assassination.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Yeah. Here, we had called a special session of the
legislature in September of nineteen thirty five, and one of
the bills was to Jerry Mander, a political opponent, out
of a judge ship this fellow's The judge's name was
Benjamin Pave and he had a son in law named
Karl Austin Weiss, who was a well regarded ear nosen
throat specialist practicing in Baton Rouge, and he officed in
(31:03):
a building that was full of anti Long politicians. He
had been in Europe and had seen some of the
European dictators operate. There was a rumor going around that
he was going to smear his family by accusing his
wife's family. I think it was being part black. I
(31:23):
don't think that rumor was well founded, and the stories
vary after that. I mean, there have been four books
on the assassination alone, and three out of the four
consider that Carl Weiss did not shoot Huy, that he
was killed by a stray shot from one of his bodyguards.
(31:46):
But when they the best evidence is that Karl Weiss,
for whatever reason, the motive is still a mystery, hid
behind a column at the Louisiana State Cappital approached Huey,
drew his gun from behind a hat and shot him,
and one of Hughey's companions had struck at his arm,
(32:08):
so the shot was deflected downward away from his heart,
but it pierced the kidney and Hughey was taken to
the hospital right away, and there was an operation that
didn't cure the bleeding, and he died two days later,
at about four ten or four h six in the morning.
And so the conspiracy theories are that Weiss went up
(32:30):
to Huey and struck him, and or they had some
kind of an argument and then the bodyguards went berserk
and drew their guns and Huey was hit by a
ricocheted shot. But the state police reopened the investigation in
the nineteen nineties, and they found the pictures of Hughey's clothes,
and they found the assassination weapon. And while the evidence
(32:53):
is not air tight, there were powder burns in Hughey's
clothes precisely where the eyewitness has said Weiss's shot Huey.
And so I think it's pretty unbelievable that a ricocheted
bullet would cause powder burns. I just don't think that
that's particularly possible, and I don't think there's a reason
(33:15):
to disbelieve this. Several eyewitnesses to the event that said
Weiss just walked up and shot them. But Jack Maguire,
the guy who wrote the book on Earlong, is writing
a book on the assassination that'll be out next year,
and I expect that he will have the last word
on it.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
You're talking about having the bullet ricochet and hitting Hughey
as well. Could that been from one of the columns,
maybe having that powder or that concrete where it is
just like you know, you know, just give it off
like that. Could it be like just hit one of
the columns, like that concrete or anything.
Speaker 4 (33:50):
Well, there are people who have gone down to the
state Capitol and they will show you where some of
the bullet holes hit in the wall. I don't know
if those panels of marble are still available or actually
are the ones, but if you go down to the
Louisiana State Capitol, they will show you where the bullet
holes are. And they used to have a display cabinet
there that would explain the assassination. But I just don't
(34:13):
think that. I mean, the bodyguards put there were sixty
one bullet holes in Karl Austin Weiss, you know at
the end, I mean they just shredded him. They were
you know, crazed by rage or grief or whatever, and
they just you know, just pumped all these bullets into
him and so he was dead right on the spot.
(34:36):
But I just don't think that you would have powder
burns from a ricocheted shot. There's no question that bullets
are probably ricocheting around there. But I just don't think
a bullet without a powder burn, you know, if there's
a powder burn on his clothes and there's only one hole.
Some theories have said that there were three different shots
or two different shots. There's one person said that, you know,
(34:59):
in the in the mortuary, somebody came in and removed
a bullet from Hughey's body. None of that stuff makes
sense to me based on all the evidence.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
How about the movies Daring John Goodman? How did that
depict the assassination?
Speaker 4 (35:14):
I can't remember now how the Goodman movie depicted it.
You know that movie took some liberties with the facts,
and you know I didn't rely on that for analyzing
how Hughey was dyed and how he was assassinated or
what Karl aust and Weis did or didn't do?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Okay? And plus where about the book as well too?
Speaker 4 (35:38):
That?
Speaker 2 (35:39):
And and I guess I just you know, cover the
bases right here? And where can we find your book
American Populace here you long, Louisiana.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Well, it's on Amazon, it's on Barnes and Noble, and
it should be. And if it's not in the other
major bookstores. Ask for it and get it in there,
all right, and.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Become populous as well if you order Hue do that right?
You got and we can find your other works. And
what's your website?
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Tom?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
The website is Patterson law Firm dot com. And I
also have a website Pattersonbooks dot com. You can find
the book on Preliminary Injunctions, which is mainly of interest
to lawyers. That is also available on Amazon, although it's
quite expensive.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
All right, well, certainly check those out where with the
amazing author Thomas E. Patterson of American populos Huey, Long, Louisiana.
Here on the Mike Wainer. So, Tom, just a few
more things? What else can expect me twenty twenty five
and beyond.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Well, I'm thinking about a couple of different books, but
I haven't decided exactly what I'm going to write on next.
I might write something on the perception of Nazis in
the United States. I've thought about doing a memoir of
some some lawyer stories, and I've thought about writing a novel,
but I haven't. I have an idea, but I have
(36:56):
never written the novel, so I suppose it'd be something new,
But of course writing this book is new too. You know,
I've never been a promoter of a book before. This
is kind of an interesting situation for me to find
myself in. I appreciate people like you put me on
the show so that I can discuss the book and
generate some interest in it.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
And of course another step love of read, distributing time,
wealth and everything like that, to see how long a
next book is going to take. I think to be
interested in journey.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
Yeah, And I'm getting up there in age, so I
better hurry up, right.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
You got that right. Redistribute age. I think that's another
one too, So.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
That's a surefire winner.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
You got that right? Yeah? And who do you consider
biggest influence in career?
Speaker 4 (37:41):
Oh, I'd say my first bosses, the partners there, Max Wildman,
Tom Allen, Bernie Harold and Stud Dixon were influences on
my law career. In terms of my history influences, I
suppose my professors in school were influences on me. And
they've been supportive in my efforts to write this book.
(38:02):
They're thrilled for me to have written it and very supportive.
So that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
Okay, that certainly is And what's the best advice you
can give to any of bte this.
Speaker 4 (38:11):
Point, who I would say? You know, Hughey was asked
by a sixteen year old boy what his life advice was,
and Huey wrote a couple of sentences about his career
and then he said, make the most of your opportunities. So,
if I was going to give advice to somebody, I
think that's pretty good advice. It's all it's very abstract, yes,
(38:33):
but it puts you in the right frame of mind.
What is an opportunity? How do I capitalize on it?
How do I make the most of it? I think
that's good advice for people.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
And I think that's the best advice out there too.
We need to take advantage of it. Here with author
Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Huey Long Louisiana, here
on the Mike Winner Show Tom a very big thankf
the time you've been absent, amazing, learned a lot, looking forward,
having soon, keeps up today, keeping touch, laugh at you back.
What's your website? How do people contact you? Or can
people purchase or check out your book?
Speaker 4 (39:02):
That's great, yes, if anybody wants to check it out.
Look at Amazon dot com or Barnesandnoble dot com, or
check out my website Patterson Law Firm dot com or
Patterson Books dot com. Get in touch with me in Chicago,
my numbers on my website and be happy to talk
to anybody or signed copies of the books. I've had
people write me from as far away as Australia asking
(39:24):
for signed copies of the book. It's pretty interesting and
amazing how far Huey Long's reach goes.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
A certainly asmazing. He'd be definitely popular as well. Once again, Tom,
a very big thanks time. You've been absolutely fantastic, looking
forward having soon keeps up today, keep in touch, laugh,
Ivy back, we wish I'll best and Tom you definitely
have for great fit check.
Speaker 4 (39:43):
Thank you very much, Mike appreciate being on your show.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by Sonicweb Studios. If
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(40:06):
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Speaker 5 (40:15):
Hey there, Dana Laxa here, American news anchor. Hey, let
me ask you something real quick. Why do you read
a book. You're buying a story, a thought, a message,
and a good book entertains and inspires. And that's exactly
what's missing by award winning author me on Zia Does.
I have his book right here, and it's based on
real events with relatable characters that hook you from start
(40:39):
to finish. I personally love this book. It's super powerful
and meaningful through you can actually get it on Amazon
right now.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist, now a velve on Emsom.
This book includes thirty exquisite pintings by well known and
unknown painters and King David Soalms. The Sweet Sawmist gives
us a new perspective on his life in this book
through the songs he wrote. His Amazon Shepherd in the
Field is where the book starts, and it goes on
to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with King Saul
(41:06):
as well as other events. It's a story of love, betrayal, repentance,
and more. It also offers advice on approaching God and
living a life that pleases him. Check out the book
The Sweets Amis by Serena Wagner, now available on Amazon
keywords Sweet Salmi is Sorena Wager.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Thanks for listening to The Mike Wagner Show, powered by
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Speaker 2 (00:03):
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No Time for Love. Check out my latest book, Missing,
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So sit back, relax, and enjoy another great episode of
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Speaker 2 (00:51):
Everybody, It's Mike for The Mike Wagner Show, powered by
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Check it out today. Here's the amazing attorney turned author
(01:34):
from Chicago with a major in history and serving two
terms as student Senate president. We'll talk about that. Spend
forty plus years preparing in trying business lawsuits and achieved
several noble you know, noble achievements including Dennis Haster and
also they have a pucket as well most normable clients
(01:55):
as well, and also served on the Law Review. He
has a new book out with the mind metal biography
of a senator from Louisiana, a progressive thinker, populist and
also a racal influence on the New Deal. And the
book is called American populacet Hughelaw with Louisiana Live Lace
and Jonen plus Duwis and Beat with Downtown Chicago. The
amazing attorney turned author from Chicago with the major in history,
(02:18):
serving two terms on a student Senate president and also
spent forty years preparing trying business lawsuits multi time. Thomas
Patterson Thomas, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Thanks for
joining us today.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
Hey, thanks for having me on your show. It's a
real thrill to be here.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, it's great to have you on, Borrod Thomas. So,
your attorney turned author with a major in history, serve
two terms as student Senate president. You spend forty plus
years preparing in trying business lawsuits. You achieved seto nobles
including Dinner Hastard and David Puck and morm. You achieved
several of that you served on the Law Review. You
(02:53):
have a new book out which is a mind mel
biography of Huey Lewis, who is a Senator from Louisiana
as a progressive thinker, populist hero in a racal influence
on the Neil Deal before being assassinated back in nineteen
thirty eight as well forty two. The book is called
American populist Huey Long Louisiana and four getting olla Thomas
(03:14):
tell Us. I first got started well.
Speaker 4 (03:16):
As you noted, I was a history major at Illinois
Westland University, and then I went to law school. After that,
wrote for the Law Review, and I had a job
with a justice on the Illinois Supreme Court, William G. Clark,
a very notable figure and he had an amazing political
career before he became a justice on the Supreme Court.
Then I joined a large Chicago law firm and I
(03:40):
tried a lot of business lawsuits there, and I started
my own law firm in the year two thousand April fourteenth,
two thousand with eight clients. We've had a pretty spectacular
success since then. As you noted, we sued Dennis Hastert,
the former Speaker of the House of Representatives, for preach
of contract. We also on the largest legal malpracticed verdict
(04:02):
in the state of Ohio, and we've had several other
notable victories, some of which I can't explain because they're
subject to confidentiality agreements. So since then, I had written
a book for lawyers called Temporary Restraining Orders and Preliminary
Injunctions Handling the Business Emergency, and we've gone through two
(04:25):
editions of that. It was published by the American Bar Association.
But after that I was looking for a new project.
And when I saw the financial crisis of two thousand
and eight and two thousand and nine, and I saw
books by Piquetti and Stiglitz talking about the unequal distribution
of wealth, I recalled that I had been fascinated by
Huey Long of Louisiana back in the nineteen thirties, whose
(04:47):
primary contention throughout his life was that there was a
crying need to redistribute the wealth of the United States
so that there would not be an unequal distribution of
wealth and power. And so I I had looked at
the different biographies, including the spectacular won by T. Harry
Williams in nineteen sixty nine. There was a Ken Burns
(05:09):
documentary in the mid nineteen eighties, and then later authors
had kind of chipped away at what Williams had said
and had disagreements with him, And so I thought, well,
maybe I'd take a look and see if I could
get my own answers. But of course I was helped
by the Internet, enormously helped because I could get because
of digitization, I could get every Chicago Tribune article that
(05:31):
mentioned Huey Long from nineteen twenty eight to nineteen thirty five,
and I did the same thing for the New York Times.
So I had almost a day by day, point by
point analysis of what hue was doing, and that allowed
me to draw some cause and effect relationships that other
biographers had missed. Then, by luck, I found out that
(05:53):
his personal papers existed at the LSU library. They had
not been available when Harry Williams wrote his book, and
later biographers had not used them to a significant extent,
and that was a treasure trove of information about his
early days, in his conflicts with his brother in the
Bank of Winfield and so on. So it was a
(06:14):
very interesting project, much like working up a court case.
You have the primary sources. You had the t Harry
Williams interviews of Hughey's contemporaries, and you had what other
people had written and what other people had thought and
their opinions on and so I just tried to construct
the story of Huey Long from scratch. So there we are,
(06:35):
and only I thought that the book for Lawyers took
only three years to write. I thought, well, okay, I
could probably knock this Huey Long book out in three
years too. Of course, that was in twenty fourteen, and
the book didn't come out until February of this year.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
Oh wow, so I guess a little faster for this
seems like.
Speaker 4 (06:55):
Yeah. Yeah, it was a lot of work, but of
course I had to keep my day job, and so
I was a lawyer by day and a fledgling author
by night.
Speaker 2 (07:06):
I guess that's a case of here. He is all
about redistribution of wealth. In your case, this is a
redistribution over time.
Speaker 4 (07:14):
Yes, you're right about that. And the LSU Press was
kind enough to publish the book, so I'm grateful for them.
But they also, you know, told me to cut one
hundred and thirty thousand words out of the manuscript, which
I did, and uh that was a job in and
of itself.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
Oh wow, was it like you know, possible conflict of
ventures or it's just like your your filler words like
you know as uh maybe like filler words and all that.
Speaker 4 (07:41):
There's no question it's a denser work now than it
was ahead of time because I was getting down to
the actual individual words instead of at the same time.
You know, if I said contemporaneously, I say three words, Oh.
Speaker 2 (07:57):
My, I guess a redistribution of you know, we just
keep building on right there too, red just bet whatever too.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
So I tell you it's like somebody said, you know,
there's no such thing as good writing, just rewriting. Or
I think it was Faukner who said, the trouble with
editing is you have to murder all your little darlings,
all those little nice sentences that I enjoyed, they had
to go.
Speaker 2 (08:21):
Oh my gosh. That is something I'll tell you. And
where's some bar your other favorite authors and writers growing up?
Especially books?
Speaker 4 (08:30):
Oh, I like the t Harry Williams biography. That's the
first one that got me interested in Huey Long. I
liked there's a book about Louis the eleventh, the King
of France and the fourteen hundreds by Paul Murray Kendall
that I thought was terrific. I've read the book about
Rockefeller and Grant, and some of the well known biographies,
Robert's biography of Churchill, those kinds of things.
Speaker 2 (08:51):
I like.
Speaker 4 (08:52):
You know, A good A good biography, I think is
a has an interesting person and interesting times and so
I thought Hughey, he was a fascinating person. He had talent,
he had flaws, he had victories, defeats, comebacks. He had conflicts.
You know that stuff you learned in eighth grade English,
you know about conflicts. He had conflicts with his brother,
(09:12):
the biggest bank in Winfield. He had conflicts with the
Louisiana oligarchy, had conflicts with Frank and Roosevelt and so on.
He conflicts with himself, and then you had interesting times.
You've got the worst depression of the nineteenth century, which
is when he was born. You've got the robber barons
in the early nineteen hundreds, you've got World War One,
(09:33):
you've got the Roaring twenties, and you've got the greatest
depression in the United States history. And all took place
within the span of forty two years of his life.
So if it's a bad book, it's all my fault.
I had a lot of good stuff to work with.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
I was just going to ask you something as well, too,
that you know, there was a Ken Burns documentary that
came out. Was there a made for TV movie or
a movie came out theaters about Huey Long, Oh, something
like that that.
Speaker 4 (10:01):
Yes, there's a there's a movie that starred John Goodman,
and there's another one start ed ed Asner. And of
course the fictionalized version of Hughey's story. I mean, it's
not quite the same. But All the King's Men Lying
is in the streets. All the King's Men was a
great novel, and it was made into a movie in
the nineteen forties and again in two thousand and six
(10:22):
or two thousand and seven. You know, Hughey has had
an amazing impact on novelists as well as historians. And
you've got it can't happen here where Sinclair Lewis wrote
a thinly disguised character based on Huey Long and so
it's hard to imagine another political figure who was not
(10:43):
president who had a similar impact on the imagination of
novelists and writers and playwrights. He's had an opera written
about him. I mean, the stuff that's happened because of
Huey Long is is quite amazing.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
If Huey Long were run for president, would it be
like an independent party? Or what party would he have
liked been in, or what kind of party would you
have created.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
In preparation for the nineteen thirty six election, he was
looking at whether he could start a third party, and
the thinking was under this theory was that he could
split the liberal vote with Franklin Roosevelt elector Republican who
would do nothing about the depression, and then in nineteen
forty heo he would be stronger than ever and be
ready to win the presidential election. He had not finally
(11:30):
decided on that course of action. He was going to
sound out sentiment by taking a tour in the West
and the Midwestern states after the congressional session of nineteen
thirty five, And remember, he would have had all of
nineteen thirty six to figure out what he was going
to do and to register a new party if he
decided ultimately to do that. But he was definitely looking
(11:52):
at that, and the Republicans fearing or accounting on the
fact that he would split the liberal vote with Roosevelt
to some extent, backing him financially in the hopes that
he would split Roosevelt's vote an elected Republican.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Did FDR view it as like, you know, as a
threat or I'm like as a helping or was just
like basically just neutral.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
Well with respect to politics, Roosevelt was scared the death
of Huey Long. They commissioned a secret poll to gauge
Long's strength in the found that he could attract enough
votes in enough states that would swing the election to
the Republicans. And then he set about allocating public works
(12:37):
and relief funds in those states where he thought he
was afraid that Huey Long would tip the balance of
power to the Republicans. And Roosevelt was frank in admitting
to some advisors that he was going to have to
steal Huey Long's thunder. And if you look at his
legislative program in nineteen thirty five, the so called Second
New Deal, or the so called turn to the Left,
(13:00):
it was motivated primarily by fear of Huey Long, and
some of Roosevelt's advisors, like Rexford Tugwell, gave Huey Long
the credit for the passage of the Social Security Act
because Roosevelt and his advisors were afraid that Huey Long
would arouse support for something more substantial than the limited
Social Security Act that was passed. And so you can
(13:21):
see that some of the Roosevelt then advocated for the
first time in nineteen thirty five increased taxation on the wealthy,
and gave a message to Congress outlining the fact that
he thought that there was an unjust distribution of wealth
and income in the United States that needed to be
remedied by increased taxation. And of course, the Senate, which
(13:44):
was sick to death of Huey Long's advocacy of that,
sat in stunned silence as this presidential record message was read,
and then Huey was strutting around the Senate saying, I
just wish to say I'm in. But of course the
Roosevelt tax plan didn't raise as much revenue as Huey
thought he could raise by his proposed taxing system. And
(14:08):
he also proposed minimum income, free college educations, generous veteran benefits,
a limited working day, you know, uh, management of farm surpluses.
I mean, he had a progressive program that was and
still remains somewhat relevant today.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
And do you think do you think some of that
was influenced today as well too, like with the basic income,
and I think there was also what was that other
one is is that similar to what's going on today
like with Hughey.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
Well, there's no question that Bernie Sanders sounds a lot
like Huey Long when he denounces the oligarchy today and
when he explains that three people in the United States
own more wealth than the bottom fifty percent of the
population combined. It's interesting that while Sanders says that I
don't know what his plan is. Maybe I haven't paid
(15:06):
enough attention, but I don't know what his plan is
to remedy that. I mean, I know he talks about
universal health care. I appreciate that, but what is he
going to do about the oligarchs? What does he plan
to do about it? Hughey said, let's tax him. Let's
tax him at one over a certain amount. So you
had a ceiling for wealth on the one hand, and
(15:26):
a floor underwealth on the other hand. A minimum income.
And if you look at the people, if you google
minimum income advocates today, you will find all kinds of
business titans, Republican former Treasury secretaries, and other politicians like
Daniel moynihan, former Senator of New York, many other people
(15:47):
who think that minimum income is a good idea. And
you have to wonder, I mean, if a minimum income
had been adopted instead of some of these bureaucratic programs
to provide housing or food stamps or snap funds or
whatever you wonder what would have developed in the United States.
There would have been less bureaucracy, more control over their
(16:10):
spending by by the poor, and private enterprise would have
built the houses and provided the food instead of having
the government decide when and where those houses were going
to be built and who was going to live in them,
and that kind of thing.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
And I think that makes sense as well too, you know,
comparing the First New Deal and the Second New Deal.
Will file more about that with Thomas E. E. Parrison and
the book American populist Huey Long of Louisiana. But first
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PayPal and the Mic Winnershow dot com. We're here. It's
amazing attorney turned author from Chicago with a major in history,
(18:38):
and the book is called American populist Huey Long of Louisiana,
Thomas E. Paerson and here of Mike Winners show. Before
get back to the book, you brought some about the
First New Deal with Roosevelt and the Second New Deal
under Huey Long. So what was like the similarities and
the differences between the First New Deal and the Second
New Deal.
Speaker 4 (18:57):
Well, it seems to me the First New Deal started
with a lot of hoopla over the National Industrial Recovery Act,
and that was basically state capitalism that was proposed by Roosevelt,
and Huey criticized that. And Roosevelt also cut veterans benefits
and that was criticized by Huey. But they had several
(19:18):
other aspects that engendered patriotic of patriotic fervore at that time.
And initially Huey had a real downturn in his prestige
in nineteen thirty three because Roosevelt was very popular. Huey
was criticizing certain Roosevelt programs. But even while you realized
(19:38):
that Huey Long criticized certain Roosevelt programs, he actually strengthened
other New Deal programs that were issued in the First
New Deal. For example, Roosevelt proposed a Banking Reform Act
because all the banks had failed at the time of
his inauguration. Huey is the one who advocated insurance of
bank deposits, which had a leading role in restoring confidence
(20:00):
in the banks by the people. And he also pardon
me yes. And then Hughie also proposed, which was missing
from the original Roosevelt legislation, protecting state banks, not just
the federal banks, because there were seventy five percent of
the banks for state banks and only one quarter of
the banks were federal banks. So Hughey wanted to propose
(20:24):
protecting the state banks as well as the federal in
Roosevelt under because of Hughey's pressure, advocated that ultimately signed
that bill that included those two provisions which strengthened the
early New Deal. But by opposing the cuts to veterans
benefits and by opposing the National Industrial Recovery Act, Roosevelt
(20:44):
cut off Hughey's patronage. And then at that time hue
also had an encounter at a country club where he
got punched in the eye, and that was front page
news all over the country, and people said, you know
he was They said he was inebriated and been overserved
and so on, and so that accompanied a downturn in
his prestige even in Louisiana, and as a kind of
(21:07):
a comeback from that, he started what he called to
share our Wealth Societies in February nineteen thirty four, in
which he advocated limiting fortunes, minimum incomes, free college educations,
and the like. And those societies spread like wildfire, and
where by April of nineteen thirty five he had estimated
(21:29):
seven and a half million members, and by September of
that year, when he was killed, they estimated he had
nine million members of that society. And that's when Roosevelt
turned to the left in his administration by adopting some
of Hughey Lung's proposals increased taxes on the wealthy, social
security and similar legislation.
Speaker 2 (21:48):
And I think there's also what we covered as well too,
funding college, paying old age, ensuring bank deposits, and it
call so increasing the money supply. I think that was
a big one right there. I mean a lot of
beause he used money, right.
Speaker 4 (22:02):
Oh yeah. And the thing is, Hugh, we wanted to
really expand the money supply, but Roosevelt convinced the progressives
who advocated that to give him the discretion whether to
increase the money supply, and then he really didn't do it.
And so the progressives like George Norris and Burton Wheeler
(22:23):
and Huey and the rest of them wanted to increase
the supply of money, but Roosevelt was kind of recalcitrant
on that, and that retarded the recovery. I mean, the
recovery would have been faster, more enduring if he had
increased the expenditures on public works and if he had
increased the supply of money.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
You talk about the expensure of public works as well
too with the infrastructure, rebuilding bridges, sidewalks, everything like that,
And this came to mind. Increasing my supplier would have
been great. Do you think there would have also increased
inflation or without like maybe without lower the value of
the dollar anything like that, because you hear about money
(23:01):
supply or print out more money, would that back in
the day increase the value of the doll or would
have decreased the value of the doll back in nineteen
thirty five were around that time?
Speaker 4 (23:10):
Yeah, I think that if you print money, the value
of the dollar will decline to some extent. But what
we should remember, in my opinion, is that in nineteen
twenty eight or nineteen twenty nine, we had say fifty
billion in circulation. I can't remember what the exact number was,
but by nineteen thirty two or thirty three, we had
(23:32):
like twenty nine billion dollars in circulation. I could be
a little off in the numbers, but we had a
tremendous decline in the supply of money, and that either
in some economists view, that caused the depression. Another economist view,
it prevented or retarded the potential recovery. So I mean,
and this is conservative economists today, like you know, Milton
(23:55):
Friedman advocated increasing the supply of money or keeping it.
I mean, he didn't want inflame huge inflation, but he
wanted to increase the supply of money, and economic thought
of the day just didn't realize how important the inflating
the money supply would be. In one other point, we
had huge deficits spending to pay for World War Two.
(24:18):
I mean about fifty billion dollars per year. I mean,
that's just huge numbers. But where did that money go to?
That money went to people who had been previously unemployed
or underemployed, and so those people now had more money,
even if the dollar was worth less, they had more
money than they had before. And the people that were
(24:40):
sitting on their wealth had less of a total percentage
of the money supply than they had previously. So I
think I don't agree that we should always print money
no matter what the circumstances are. But I think if
we had increased the supply of money in the nineteen thirties,
it would have helped alleviate the Great Depression.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
And do you think increasing money every single year would
have health the economy more and prevent inflation?
Speaker 4 (25:07):
Well, I think if the gross national product had kept
up with the money supply, I think, you know, the
inflation would be minimized, Okay.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
And plus I'm sure in Hugh's case as well too,
being Louisiana, he wish he had some money supply as
well growing up, and he was a rough start for him.
Speaker 4 (25:26):
Oh, there's no question about it. And you know, if
you look at Hughey's program in the state of Louisiana
in nineteen thirty, thirty one, thirty two, he had a
huge one hundred million dollar bond program. Now they were
sold in fifteen million dollar tranches, and he was employing
about ten or twenty percent of the entire country's workforce
(25:46):
on roads. In Louisiana, he built something like two thousand
miles of roads, plus bridges, you know, the first bridge
over the Mississippi, all kinds of new state capital, that
was the tallest building in the South, a new airport.
He had huge public works projects in Louisiana. And there
is a writer who studied the fiscal income of Louisiana
(26:08):
at that time, and while the income of Louisiana declined,
it declined about half as much as the decline was
in other states because Huey had used bond financing, deficit
financing to keep public works and to keep money in
the hands of the people. So I think it shows
that fiscal policy that is deficit spending, under certain circumstances,
(26:30):
it can alleviate a depression.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
And plus he had his share of successes and faults
as well, and even issues in the family as well,
especially his brother you're talking about.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
Well, yeah, Erlong had a very colorful career. After hughe died,
he became he was lieutenant governor on the ticket that
was elected after Hughey's death, and then he lost the
election of nineteen forty to a reform candidate because some
of the Huey's leaders had stolen money and there were
(27:05):
Louisiana scandals after in nineteen thirty nine, right before the
nineteen forty election. Then Earl made a comeback in nineteen
forty eight and won the governorship and served four years there,
and then he won the governorship again, I believe, in
nineteen fifty six, but had that infamous nervous breakdown caused
by a series of strokes that was memorialized, well, it
(27:29):
was unfairly memorialized in the Blaze Star movie. But there's
a great book by aj Leebling of the New Yorker
chronicling Earl's adventures. And there's a fellow in Louisiana named
Jack Maguire who has written the book, a great book
about Earlong's last campaign in nineteen sixty for Congress, in
which his theory was he was going to win the
(27:51):
race or die trying. And he won the race and
had a heart attack right after he won.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
That was fitting. I got said that. And here you
long stuff for a save fan as well too. And
how do you manage Gussnail? Find out when we're met
with Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Heure Long with Louisiana.
You listen to The Mike Widner Show at the Mike
Winnershow dot com power by sondqweb Studios brought you by
professional sponsor to Mike Widner's show, internetion warring author me
(28:18):
and most is missing The Sweet Salmispresserena Wagner based on
life of Davenplin, three squizz of Paints and Kandavin psalms
Amazon dot com. Keywords sweet Samas Swerena Radner would be
Buckley the amazing author from Chicago, Thomas E. Patterson of
American populist Hue Long of Louisiana alfter this time.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by sonicwebs Studios. If
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(28:54):
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Speaker 5 (29:03):
Hey there, Dana Laksa here, American news anchor. Hey, let
me ask you something real quick. Why do you read
a book. You're buying a story, a thought, a message,
and a good book entertains and inspires. And that's exactly
what A Missing By Award winning author me on the
Zia does. I have his book right here, and it's
based on real events with relatable characters that hook you
(29:26):
from start to finish. I personally love this book. It's
super powerful and meaningful through You can actually get it
on Amazon right now.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist, now a Velveon Emson. This
book includes thirty exquisite pintings by well known and unknown
painters and King David Soalms. The Sweet Sawmist gives us
a new perspective on his life in this book through
the songs he wrote. His time as a shepherd in
the field is where the book starts, and it goes
on to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with King Saul,
(29:54):
as well as other events It's a story of love, betrayal, repentance,
and more. It also offers advice and approaching God and
living a life that pleases him. Check out the book
The Sweet Sawmist by Serena Wagner, now available on Amazon
keywords Sweet Salmis Sorena Wagner. Hey, Hey, this is Ray
Powers and boy, are you in luck?
Speaker 4 (30:13):
Right place?
Speaker 2 (30:14):
Right time? Tuned into the Mike Wagner Show. You heard me,
We're back on Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Herey
Long of Louisiana. Here on the Mike Wagner Show. We
covered Hreey Lung's legacy in the book as well, and
he was assassinated. However, that was in nineteen thirty five,
(30:36):
and tell us more about that and how did that
lead up to the assassination.
Speaker 4 (30:40):
Yeah. Here, we had called a special session of the
legislature in September of nineteen thirty five, and one of
the bills was to Jerry Mander, a political opponent, out
of a judge ship this fellow's The judge's name was
Benjamin Pave and he had a son in law named
Karl Austin Weiss, who was a well regarded ear nosen
throat specialist practicing in Baton Rouge, and he officed in
(31:03):
a building that was full of anti Long politicians. He
had been in Europe and had seen some of the
European dictators operate. There was a rumor going around that
he was going to smear his family by accusing his
wife's family. I think it was being part black. I
(31:23):
don't think that rumor was well founded, and the stories
vary after that. I mean, there have been four books
on the assassination alone, and three out of the four
consider that Carl Weiss did not shoot Huy, that he
was killed by a stray shot from one of his bodyguards.
(31:46):
But when they the best evidence is that Karl Weiss,
for whatever reason, the motive is still a mystery, hid
behind a column at the Louisiana State Cappital approached Huey,
drew his gun from behind a hat and shot him,
and one of Hughey's companions had struck at his arm,
(32:08):
so the shot was deflected downward away from his heart,
but it pierced the kidney and Hughey was taken to
the hospital right away, and there was an operation that
didn't cure the bleeding, and he died two days later,
at about four ten or four h six in the morning.
And so the conspiracy theories are that Weiss went up
(32:30):
to Huey and struck him, and or they had some
kind of an argument and then the bodyguards went berserk
and drew their guns and Huey was hit by a
ricocheted shot. But the state police reopened the investigation in
the nineteen nineties, and they found the pictures of Hughey's clothes,
and they found the assassination weapon. And while the evidence
(32:53):
is not air tight, there were powder burns in Hughey's
clothes precisely where the eyewitness has said Weiss's shot Huey.
And so I think it's pretty unbelievable that a ricocheted
bullet would cause powder burns. I just don't think that
that's particularly possible, and I don't think there's a reason
(33:15):
to disbelieve this. Several eyewitnesses to the event that said
Weiss just walked up and shot them. But Jack Maguire,
the guy who wrote the book on Earlong, is writing
a book on the assassination that'll be out next year,
and I expect that he will have the last word
on it.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
You're talking about having the bullet ricochet and hitting Hughey
as well. Could that been from one of the columns,
maybe having that powder or that concrete where it is
just like you know, you know, just give it off
like that. Could it be like just hit one of
the columns, like that concrete or anything.
Speaker 4 (33:50):
Well, there are people who have gone down to the
state Capitol and they will show you where some of
the bullet holes hit in the wall. I don't know
if those panels of marble are still available or actually
are the ones, but if you go down to the
Louisiana State Capitol, they will show you where the bullet
holes are. And they used to have a display cabinet
there that would explain the assassination. But I just don't
(34:13):
think that. I mean, the bodyguards put there were sixty
one bullet holes in Karl Austin Weiss, you know at
the end, I mean they just shredded him. They were
you know, crazed by rage or grief or whatever, and
they just you know, just pumped all these bullets into
him and so he was dead right on the spot.
(34:36):
But I just don't think that you would have powder
burns from a ricocheted shot. There's no question that bullets
are probably ricocheting around there. But I just don't think
a bullet without a powder burn, you know, if there's
a powder burn on his clothes and there's only one hole.
Some theories have said that there were three different shots
or two different shots. There's one person said that, you know,
(34:59):
in the in the mortuary, somebody came in and removed
a bullet from Hughey's body. None of that stuff makes
sense to me based on all the evidence.
Speaker 2 (35:09):
How about the movies Daring John Goodman? How did that
depict the assassination?
Speaker 4 (35:14):
I can't remember now how the Goodman movie depicted it.
You know that movie took some liberties with the facts,
and you know I didn't rely on that for analyzing
how Hughey was dyed and how he was assassinated or
what Karl aust and Weis did or didn't do?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Okay? And plus where about the book as well too?
Speaker 4 (35:38):
That?
Speaker 2 (35:39):
And and I guess I just you know, cover the
bases right here? And where can we find your book
American Populace here you long, Louisiana.
Speaker 4 (35:47):
Well, it's on Amazon, it's on Barnes and Noble, and
it should be. And if it's not in the other
major bookstores. Ask for it and get it in there,
all right, and.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
Become populous as well if you order Hue do that right?
You got and we can find your other works. And
what's your website?
Speaker 3 (36:04):
Tom?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
The website is Patterson law Firm dot com. And I
also have a website Pattersonbooks dot com. You can find
the book on Preliminary Injunctions, which is mainly of interest
to lawyers. That is also available on Amazon, although it's
quite expensive.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
All right, well, certainly check those out where with the
amazing author Thomas E. Patterson of American populos Huey, Long, Louisiana.
Here on the Mike Wainer. So, Tom, just a few
more things? What else can expect me twenty twenty five
and beyond.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Well, I'm thinking about a couple of different books, but
I haven't decided exactly what I'm going to write on next.
I might write something on the perception of Nazis in
the United States. I've thought about doing a memoir of
some some lawyer stories, and I've thought about writing a novel,
but I haven't. I have an idea, but I have
(36:56):
never written the novel, so I suppose it'd be something new,
But of course writing this book is new too. You know,
I've never been a promoter of a book before. This
is kind of an interesting situation for me to find
myself in. I appreciate people like you put me on
the show so that I can discuss the book and
generate some interest in it.
Speaker 2 (37:16):
And of course another step love of read, distributing time,
wealth and everything like that, to see how long a
next book is going to take. I think to be
interested in journey.
Speaker 4 (37:25):
Yeah, And I'm getting up there in age, so I
better hurry up, right.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
You got that right. Redistribute age. I think that's another
one too, So.
Speaker 4 (37:33):
That's a surefire winner.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
You got that right? Yeah? And who do you consider
biggest influence in career?
Speaker 4 (37:41):
Oh, I'd say my first bosses, the partners there, Max Wildman,
Tom Allen, Bernie Harold and Stud Dixon were influences on
my law career. In terms of my history influences, I
suppose my professors in school were influences on me. And
they've been supportive in my efforts to write this book.
(38:02):
They're thrilled for me to have written it and very supportive.
So that's good.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
Okay, that certainly is And what's the best advice you
can give to any of bte this.
Speaker 4 (38:11):
Point, who I would say? You know, Hughey was asked
by a sixteen year old boy what his life advice was,
and Huey wrote a couple of sentences about his career
and then he said, make the most of your opportunities. So,
if I was going to give advice to somebody, I
think that's pretty good advice. It's all it's very abstract, yes,
(38:33):
but it puts you in the right frame of mind.
What is an opportunity? How do I capitalize on it?
How do I make the most of it? I think
that's good advice for people.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
And I think that's the best advice out there too.
We need to take advantage of it. Here with author
Thomas E. Patterson of American populist Huey Long Louisiana, here
on the Mike Winner Show Tom a very big thankf
the time you've been absent, amazing, learned a lot, looking forward,
having soon, keeps up today, keeping touch, laugh at you back.
What's your website? How do people contact you? Or can
people purchase or check out your book?
Speaker 4 (39:02):
That's great, yes, if anybody wants to check it out.
Look at Amazon dot com or Barnesandnoble dot com, or
check out my website Patterson Law Firm dot com or
Patterson Books dot com. Get in touch with me in Chicago,
my numbers on my website and be happy to talk
to anybody or signed copies of the books. I've had
people write me from as far away as Australia asking
(39:24):
for signed copies of the book. It's pretty interesting and
amazing how far Huey Long's reach goes.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
A certainly asmazing. He'd be definitely popular as well. Once again, Tom,
a very big thanks time. You've been absolutely fantastic, looking
forward having soon keeps up today, keep in touch, laugh,
Ivy back, we wish I'll best and Tom you definitely
have for great fit check.
Speaker 4 (39:43):
Thank you very much, Mike appreciate being on your show.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by Sonicweb Studios. If
you're looking to start or upgrade your online presence, visit
www dot sonicwebstudios dot com for all of your online needs.
Call one eight hundred three oh three three nine six
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(40:06):
com to get started today. Mention the Mike Wagner Show
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take your image to the next level.
Speaker 5 (40:15):
Hey there, Dana Laxa here, American news anchor. Hey, let
me ask you something real quick. Why do you read
a book. You're buying a story, a thought, a message,
and a good book entertains and inspires. And that's exactly
what's missing by award winning author me on Zia Does.
I have his book right here, and it's based on
real events with relatable characters that hook you from start
(40:39):
to finish. I personally love this book. It's super powerful
and meaningful through you can actually get it on Amazon
right now.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist, now a velve on Emsom.
This book includes thirty exquisite pintings by well known and
unknown painters and King David Soalms. The Sweet Sawmist gives
us a new perspective on his life in this book
through the songs he wrote. His Amazon Shepherd in the
Field is where the book starts, and it goes on
to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with King Saul
(41:06):
as well as other events. It's a story of love, betrayal, repentance,
and more. It also offers advice on approaching God and
living a life that pleases him. Check out the book
The Sweets Amis by Serena Wagner, now available on Amazon
keywords Sweet Salmi is Sorena Wager.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Thanks for listening to The Mike Wagner Show, powered by
Sonicweb Studios. Pasit online at Sonicwebstudios dot com for all
your needs. Mike Wagner Show can be heard on Spreakers, Spotify, iHeartRadio, iTunes,
YouTube Anchor, FM Radio Public, and The Mike Wagner Show
dot Com. Please post our program with your donations at
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(41:45):
for another great episode of The Mike Wagner Show.
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The Burden
The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.