Author/Hungarian-born highly decorated female chess player in history Susan Polgar talks about her latest release “Rebel Queen: The Cold War, Misogyny & The Making of a Grandmaster” as a true story of one of the most decorated female chess players in history who took on a sexist establishment, stood up to an authoritarian empire, and rewrote the rules of what women could achieve against an oppressive backdrop of Cold War Eastern Europe! Susan began her career at 4 on her birthday accidentally discovering a chess set at home, became the first woman to qualify for the Men’s World Championship, earned the Grandmaster title at 21, and led two universities to more national championships than any other coach in history! Check out the amazing Susan Polgar and her latest on all major platforms and www.susanpolgar.com today! #susanpolgar #author #hungarianborn #chessplayer #rebelqueen #coldwar #grandmaster #chessnationalchampionship #chess #spreaker #iheartradio #spotify #applemusic #youtube #anchorfm #bitchute #rumble #mikewagner #themikewagnershow #mikewagnersusanpolgar #themikewagnershowsusanpolgar
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hearing an amazing lady who's an author. Hungarian born, highly
decorated female chess player, Ian history, born to a poor
(01:40):
Jewish family in the Cord War Budapest. First female to
win the Men's Grandmaster taland eighty one, only playing history
to orn win all six world prestigious chess crowns. I'll
talk more about that. Yaron crew foreign her birthday accidentally
discovering a chess step and became the first woman to
qualify for the Men's World on Chess Championship and also
the highest rayed female chess player in the world, earn
(02:02):
a men's grand Master of twenty one and also left
Hungary become an American system and become a college coach
fourteen years Texas Tech and Webster University in Saint Louis
and led to the more major championships than any other
chess program or in sports overall. And we'll find out
who she managed to match. She has the root of
book out. It's a true story about one of the
(02:22):
most renowned women in chess history, took on a sexist
establishments still have the authority Empire and rewrote the game
the book. It's called Rebel Queen, The Cold War Misogamy
and the Making of a grand Master. Live Lads and
generalen Plus Studios and beautiful Downtown Florida. The amazing author,
Hungarian born, highly decorated female chess player in history with
the book Rebel Queen, The Cold War, Misogamy and the
(02:45):
Making of a Grand Master Laison Jones, the multi talented
Susan Polgar. Susan, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Thanks
for joining us today.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Thank you for having me, Hi hoi you doone.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
What's great to have you on and we just want
to say we're just checking in with you, so so
we got to say that too. Arthur in a Hungarian born,
highly decorated female chess player in history or born to
a poor Jewish family in the Cold War bidipest, your
first female win the Men's grand Master title in eighty one,
only player in history to earn all six world prestigious
(03:16):
chess crowns. You began your career four and your birthday
accident discovering a chess set at home. Became the first
woman to qualify from the Men's World Championship, highest rave
female chess player in the world, earn a Men's Grandmaster
in eighty one, left Hungary, become an American citizen to
become a college coach at Texas Tech and Webster University,
and he won more chess championships than any program in
(03:38):
history and also in any other sport. We'll find more
about that. You have a book that's true story one
of the most renowned women in chess history. You took
on sex establishment stuff to an authoritarian empire and rewrote
the rules about chess. In the book that's called Rebel Queen.
The Cold War Misogamy and the making of a grand master.
For getting O Susan, tell us how you first got.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
I was at home when I was almost four years old,
and I was looking for something you went fun to do,
and all of a sudden, I'm opening a cupboard and
the chess peace chess board and the chess pieces fell out.
My mother ran over what happened and she sees what
happened and she says, well, you have to wait until
the next day because that is at work and I
(04:22):
don't know how to play chess. And my dad came
home and the following day he started slowly, slowly introducing
me to the game. And that's how my career began.
And about six months later I entered into my first competitions,
first in the district Championship of Buda Peste my native
(04:44):
country Hungary, and I qualified the bondos to play in
that Championship of Buda Peste final, where I will also
all ten out of ten games perfect score. And that
was a big flash and the media in the chess
community and the career got them on its way.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
And you and you must have been appealed by the
horses and no shiny things and everything goes what's this?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Was that?
Speaker 4 (05:13):
Oh I see a horsey? I can imagine that.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
So yeah, initially that's all it was cute figurines and
little did I know how much depth and beauty and
challenge there is still a game of chess.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
Now, Now, the chess pieces that spill?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Was it on like?
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Was it silver? Was it like copper gold? Or was
it like a plastic one? Was it wooden pewter? No,
wooden wouldn't just oh wooden? Okay, all right? So it
was that your ordinary chess set. Now you your dad
got you interested in playing. You guys play together and everything. Now, Now,
was he like a mastered chess player himself, or was
(05:55):
just like a casual average person or anything like that?
Was he competitor? He just liked to play for fun?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Yeah, he was just a casual amateur player. He used
to play in his high school days. But he hasn't
played much after that until I accidentally discovered again, m hm.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Right, And I think that's great as well too. And
what was the other one precise moment is simply influencing
into UNIVERSI your career was knocking over Yeah, besides knocking
the pieces over, discovery, what else simply hill light bulb
moment for you.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Well, but I won that first big championship, that was
obviously a sign that this is something I may enjoy
and get good at. But I won my first world
championship title when I was twelve years old for girls
under sixteen, So that was the next big milestone.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
And this kind of came to mind as well too,
that with chess and everything like that. Who are some
of your favorite chess players growing up?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Well, obviously, Bobby Fischer was a legend as I was
growing up. He won the World Championship just a year
prior when I discovered a chess pieces and it was
like a big myth. Will he defend his title three
years later in seventy five and then he disappeared. So
obviously he was a legend as I was growing up.
(07:23):
And then when he did not defend his title and
Anatolie Karpov became the world champion. As most people, you know,
when they start playing developing players, the actual world champion
obviously had a huge influence on them. And you know,
as eventually I met other great players like Mikhail Kaal
(07:46):
was a big you know, I was a big fan
of his and I had a funny story when, just
as a thirteen year old, I met him when we
were visiting in Moscow, and I had a dream if
I could play a game with him, that'd be incredible.
And he was in the middle of playing a begin
(08:07):
international tournament and I was there as a spectator with
my parents, and as he was walking up and down
the hallway in between his moves smoking, which was allowed
at the time.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Man, that's gonna be a great sport to get into.
I should have done that years ago. Make you move,
have a smoke, go back. I wish I had done
that years ago.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
That's how it was.
Speaker 6 (08:31):
It.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Fortunately it's no longer allowed, so today you cannot smoke
in buildings and you cannot smoke during games, but at
the time you could. So he was having his walks
up and down, and my mother had the courage to
go up to him and ask him, my daughter's dream
is to have a quick game with you, a blitz game,
and he says, hold on, hold on, let me go
(08:52):
back to my game. I'll be back soon, and so
sure enough, it was pretty shocking. Normally, games in those
times used to go four or five, six, seven hours,
but within half an hour he was back out. He
offered a draw to his grandmaster opponent. They settled on
a draw and he was out. I'm ready to play. Yeah,
(09:13):
that was a dream come true for me. And in fact,
the first game we played, I was attacking him fiercely
and I sacrificed a bishop and then a Knight, and
things were looking very good. Unfortunately, he managed to defend
well and the game ended in a draw. Nevertheless, it
was an unforgettable moment for me, and it was really
(09:35):
generous of him to give me an opportunity to play
a world champion.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Oh my gosh, that is so amazing. There's some other
legends like Gary Kasparrov, Magnus Carlson and Boris Bowsky as
well too, and and you know, tell us about those
guys as well.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Yeah, I was very fortunate that I got to know
practically every great player of my lifetime and got to
play with most of them as well. I became good
friends with the late Boris Pasky. He just passed very recently,
but I write about my experiences meeting Boris Spasky or
(10:14):
Bobby Fisher, Deerka Sparow. So I'm very fortunate to meet
all of them, and I learned from them, you know,
they inspired me, they gave me advice, and it was
it was a really great experience to being able to
spend time with the legend of chess.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
And which player would you say you most emulate or
have a similar style like you among chess plurds.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
It's hard to say, but as I mentioned earlier, when
I started playing chess, Anatoly Karpov was the world champion,
and I think personality wise, I'm a more strategic persons
as is he, and my style I try to be
emulating his style of.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Play, okay, And are some of the other styles like
you know, strategy and all that, and it's true or not.
You know, you're supposed to think like several moves ahead.
Is that still true today or is it like lesson
now more than that?
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Oh yeah, that did not change over the years. Obviously
some players like Ericasparov, he has a lot more aggressive,
dynamic attack in style, which I usually don't prefer. I
prefer to have a slower build up and get to
attack when all my pieces are well positioned for it.
(11:38):
So I typically prefer not to burn the bridges behind
me as much as he did. Obviously he did it
fantastically and I wish I could play like him, but
it's just a different style, different personality.
Speaker 4 (11:54):
And which are some of the players that you played against?
And how do you do against some of the legendary
players you play it against.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
Yeah, unfortunate that I can say I have beaten some
of them. I have drawn many of them. Obviously I
lost a good number of games as well. But I
managed to be given in a game Anatolic Karpov a
couple of times, and Drone Boris Pasky. I played Bobby
(12:23):
Fisher many games, actually all those friendly games, and did
about fifty to fifty score, So okay, yeah, yeah, I
managed to help my own against most of them.
Speaker 4 (12:36):
And what would you say your most memorable game was
or a memorable match?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I should say one of my favorite memories is when
for the first time I got invited to an elite
tournament in Spain with the top players, with world champion
Anatoli Karpov and top ten players, and one of those
top ten players, in fact, he was top three in
his speak, oh wow. Grandmaster Riboyevitch from Yugoslavia. He has
(13:05):
voiced his view that he was in a shock and
surprise at how can organizers invite female players to an
elite competition? And when I played him in the second
round of that competition, I was motivated to prove him
(13:25):
on the board why and I was very proud to
say that I was able to win him and he
had to resigned shortly before he would have gotten check
made it. So that's one of my favorite stories.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
Probably make him eat us words at that point too.
And of course, you know, you know it's being Hungarian,
your faced off against Hungarian players, Russian players, you know, Spain, France, Germany,
Japan and everything like that. Who would you say is
like the most competitive, the toughest like from the country,
and how they compared to like American players you thought
(14:00):
on American chess players.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Well, I don't think it really matters what country the
opponent comes from. Obviously, when as I was growing up,
the Soviet players were pretty dominant, but over the years
things have changed. Today India actually is a quite dominant source.
They have won the gold Olympiad gold for men and women.
(14:24):
The current Training World Champion is a young man by
the name Gukash just eighteen years old. That of India
some times have changed, especially India and China has great
players to in addition of course to the Russian and
Ukrainian and we also had unexpected the world champion for
(14:47):
about a decade from Norway, Marnascarlsen. So it's not like
it used to be half a century ago when I
started playing chess, when the Soviet players were so dominant.
Now it's very mixed up. We have great players here
in America as well. So it's I think it's the
Internet and the technology that's now widely available for everyone,
(15:11):
most of it for free. It opened the doors and
made our world smaller, brought us all together that it
matters a whole lot less where you're from. Because when
I remember I was growing up, I had to go
to a chess club, I had to have a coach
come to my house or I had to go to him.
It was like logistically very complicated and not easy at all.
(15:36):
While today the young players or anybody who wants to improve,
all the information is out there twenty four to seven
on the Internet, on YouTube videos and so on and
so on, and it's all most of it free and
really available. It's really up to each individual how much
they want to learn. How much time they are willing
(15:58):
to dedicate to it. So it's a huge change.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
And during my lifetime when you talk about technology and
maybe think of the chess games or programs that back
in the early days, it's like, yeah, the chess on
computers are the ones like you know, similar to like
you know, was it the handheld football games, basketball games,
baseball games and they had like like a little laptop ballship,
(16:22):
you know, platform and everything. And what was taking those
type of games and early computers and how did you
do against the computers.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I maybe remember the very first chess computer I received,
I think it was around nineteen eighty. It was called
a Boris Diplomat. It was like, you know, a little
rectanglar shaped box that I was quite amazed that it
was capable of playing a game of chess against me.
(16:52):
Of course, I was defeating it in every single game.
It was not very good, but even with facts, the
new fact that it was able to play llegal game
of chess was mind boggling at the time. Now we're
talking about that about forty five years ago. We came
a long way from there. You know that we went
through the phase in the eighties and the early nineties,
(17:12):
people were debating in the chess community and outside of it.
Better will did they come when the chess machines will
defeat us humans, the best humans chess players, And we
had to wait pretty much until the mid nineteen nineties.
By nineteen ninety seven, IBMSD Blue has defeated the then
(17:32):
reigning world champion Gary Kasparoff, and basically that kind of
ended that debate. We learned that the best chess machines
can defeat the best humans, and the following years and
decades it just re confirmed that that we lost that battle.
There is no race anymore, just as runners don't try
(17:56):
to race against the Porsche or even at Toyota right
any car with doesn't matter. So it's been at the
same stage in just now that any of these chess engines,
like the stock Visions others, that's available freely out there
(18:16):
to any human. In fact, you can put it just
on your iPhone, and anybody with an iPhone can defeat
even the best human jess players today, so there's no race.
On the other hand, we are using the technology to
improve our own skills to compete against other humans. It's
(18:38):
not a competition against the machine, but we just like
with cars, we use them as helpers as our you know,
for our convenience, for our learning, for our sorting, information analysis,
and more to improve our chances for our human competition.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
And do you think the president of AI is also
helping chess as well too, or is it you know,
make it more tougher and everything like that. You know,
do you think chess is going to you know, get
involved with AI or make chess easier or difficult?
Speaker 3 (19:15):
Oh? Yeah, chess is already very much involved with the AI.
In fact, I believe chess has been used as a
testing ground for AI. None just related AI. There has
been Google's Alpha zero engine, and that has been just
(19:36):
mind boggling because Vito that the regular engines like Stockfish
were amazing, and then came this self teaching machine AI
that just crushed the best engines that they were around
prior to this self teaching engine. It's like mind boggling
(19:58):
what program I guess could or AI developers could develop it.
It's really incredible. It's changed how we train I to
answer your question. It made it easier and harder at
the same time. It's easier to get good ideas, good information,
but don't forget. Pretty much everybody has access to that information,
(20:22):
so it's I guess the quality of the games becomes higher,
at least for the parts of the game that people
can prepare in the opening moves and memorize it. But
at the same time it's harder also because your opponents
also have those those same resources to use against So
(20:44):
it's it's it's hard.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
No words, forget about the cheat sheets and everything like that.
We'll talk about your journeys, the Rebel Queen, the Cold War, misogamy,
and the making of a grand Master going from Hungary
to America being highly decorated with Susan paulgar But first
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We're the amazing author Hungarian born highly decorated female chess
(23:19):
player in history, Susan Polgarhill. Mike Werner showed the book
Rebel Queen, the Cold War, Nosogamy and the Making of
a grand Master before we you know, get in to
a book and tell us by during going from Hungary
to America.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
Well, the first time I came to the US was
in nineteen eighty five to compete at the New York
Open Chess competition, which was one of the biggest open
tournaments in the world at the time. And I made
a lot of friends immediately and I and I first came,
but then I went back, and then I kept coming
once twice a year for competitions. And I did not
(23:57):
move here actually until long after the Cold War was over.
I moved here in nineteen ninety four when I met
my first husband and he was living in New York
and I just moved to be with him. And you know,
my children were born here. I have two boys, and
(24:21):
I settled in the US, and I moved around a bit,
lived in New York thirteen years and was in Texas
for five, about nine in Missouri, and Ruddy more than
four years in Florida.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
So oh wow, okay, sounds a heck of a journey
and a bunch. Your two boys. Are they into chess
like you or do you envision to be world chess players?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
I will not quite like me at this point. They
are both grown men, and they did chose not to
become a professional chess player. Although my elder son Tom
has been quite successful as a junior player, as one
of several scholastic national championships in various age groups, and
(25:07):
he became a master player, so it's pretty good. But
he chose to have a professional career instead and just
keep chess as a hobby of mine.
Speaker 6 (25:17):
There you go.
Speaker 4 (25:18):
I think that's a great idea to have. So maybe
he'd confused like that. I mean, he never knows that
he could retire for twenty years and venturing bea a
grand master like you.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So yeah, my very little bump just plays for fun
and he's a software engineer, so they are living fun.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Oh there you go, And s a software engineer. Does
he get to program any chess games on or just
something else?
Speaker 3 (25:43):
I think he does other things.
Speaker 4 (25:45):
Oh good, okay, just want to make sure he doesn't
get too far as well too. And of course, you
know you went on to fourteen years Texas Tech, Webster University,
and Saint Louis nine major championships in history, and you
also accomplished more than any other And when I looked,
you accomplished more than John Wooden when it comes to
(26:05):
basketball and all sports, consecutive championships. That's a feat.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Yeah, I'm very, very proud of my students for everything
that we accomplished at Webster University with a number one
ranked team for every single day, every single week, every
single year in the photo existence of the program. So
I'm really really proud that my students won more national championship,
(26:29):
with more World Championship, Small Olympiaan gold medals and other
major titles than all the others programs Division one men's
sport in the country combined.
Speaker 4 (26:44):
And that is amazing to you want to read about that,
I mean, you you pretty much put John one to
shame in a way.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
So, and I'm the only female head coach in men's
division one. I believe in any sport, yes, true, that
DIP's another dimension. So I'm hoping to inspire other women
in other sports as well and in other male dominated
fields that if I can do it, they can too.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
And of course one the one woman coach I could
think of was Pat Summit of Tennessee being basketball coach,
and I think there was some quite a few others,
but that'd be another subject another time. But then with
your journey, you know, working a way to grand Master,
I mean with today's women, it was like, you know,
it's real easy, but for you, he was a pretty
difficult one that not just renowned, but you took on
(27:34):
a sexist establishment. You still up to authoritarism and also
the Empire's well too, which cold war mentality. And you
also rewrote the rules as well. And I mean you
had a repressive backjob. You you basically had a lot
of obstacles to deal with and how du man to
deal with those obstacles?
Speaker 3 (27:54):
Yeah, it was not easy. One of the toughest moments
in my career was when finally I got to play
in the final of the Hungarian National Championship. I qualified
myself to represent Hungary at the World Championship cycle and
I was told, no, you cannot play because you're a woman.
(28:14):
So that was one of the hardest things. And you know,
in some of those tough moments, I took inspiration from
my maternal grandmother, who was a Holocaust survivor, and she
reminded me in those moments that my daughter, if you
think what you're going through is tough, you have no
(28:35):
idea what tough is. And indeed, you know, I have
no right to even to compare, you know, my heartaches
and difficulties compared to what she went through. And you know,
I just had to pull myself together and work even
harder and try to give more checkmates on the chessboard,
(28:58):
and that I may that my approach that eventually, if
by giving up check mates, things will work out as
and as they did.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Mm hmm. And do you think part of the treatment
that you have was totally different? Experienced anti Semitism and
also you know, being from like a poor Jewish family
and and what the fact did really you know, takes
have honey as well too, that you encounter a love that.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Yeah, it was not simple.
Speaker 6 (29:30):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
We came from a poor family. I remember when we
were traveling to tournaments. Many times we were packing sardines
or Hungarian salami to save money on going to restaurants,
because that's all we could afford for quite some time.
As for anti Semitism in Hungary, fortunately officially speaking, it
(29:55):
was not allowed by the government. But with that's the
p people. Of course, our people and some people would say,
you know, they are not real Hungarians and make decisions,
you know, not saying so, but we just knew based
(30:15):
on what we were told that there were times when
they made decisions to discriminate because they felt we weren't
as Hungarians as they are.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
And of course you also mentioned Mesagam in your subtitles
as well too, that you encounter that and you know
in what ways was just considered sexist as well.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
Yeah, I mean when I started playing chess, I was
told countless times that a little girl like you should
be playing with those not a serious game of men,
which is justs you know. And after that, I was
told girls cannot be that good in just anyway, they're
not as smart as the boys. So I was growing
(31:01):
up with this constant they say, this discouragement, this sexist attitude.
You know that girls just cannot be as good as
the man, and fortunately I had the full support of
my parents and we believed that there shouldn't be any difference.
(31:24):
So as long as I'm working as hard as the
boys do, I'm practicing, I'm playing the best opponents I can.
And that's what created actually a lot of problems with
the authorities, because they believe the girls supposed to play
just with the girls and don't play against the boys
or the man. And we insisted that if I want
(31:45):
to have a chance to be as good as the
top male players, I had to train and compete just
like they do. And they did not condone that. They
thought that was crazy talk. They told how can I
How there's a woman said that she can or wants
to be a grand Master, And I kind of made
(32:05):
it as the mission of my life to prove them wrong.
And I'm very proud that eventually I was the first
woman to earn the Grandmaster title based on the norms
and the ratings just as the men do. So that
has been the struggle of my life, but I'm very
proud that I was able to open the door for
(32:26):
other women, including my sister Judith, who came behind me
and also became grand masters, and today there are I
believe forty two women who have the grandmaster title.
Speaker 4 (32:39):
Oh my gosh, that's so amazing. And of course you
love the game so much about and what is the
part that you love about the game, Well, I.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Love it's fairness that unlike other some other sports where
you're built, your height, your strengths you know that you're
born with or you know inherited in your genes, gives
you a certain advantage over your competitors. Like in basketball, right,
if you grow up to be seven feet tall, it's
(33:10):
kind of an advantage.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
Jump your basketball, or if you're five foot you can
gribble around your way the seven book guys, and if
you have powerful legs, the opportunity to go up and
dunk the ball, so you can do anything at five
foot practically, well, not as.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Much as the seven foot right, it would give an
advantage to a seven foot but not in chess. And
that's one of the things that I really attracted to me.
Even as a four year old, I was a tiny girl,
and I could play chess on equal footing against grown people.
That there is very few other things that we could do,
you know, mutually having fun. But as of the game itself,
(33:50):
I really love the beautiful combinations that the game has,
and I really enjoyed learning more and more and more
every day about the amazing different checkmates and patterns and
the exceptions from the rules. It's just like any art.
It has a lot of beauty to it.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
You say about different checkmates, how many different checkmates are there?
Because I thought there's one checkmate. How many different checkmates
are there?
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Oh no, that are like tens of thousands of different kinds.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Of Okay, all right, just want to clarify, that's all. Okay, Yeah,
because I played some chess myself or probably one like,
I probably got just as bad as a record as
last year Chicago White Sox was. It's like maybe I
was like maybe one three last thirty and drew like
ten or something. Oh my gosh, I have a.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Beautify chat that. It's an easy game to learn and
it's fun to enjoy, but it's a hard game to master.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
Right exactly. And of course, of course the popular Netflix
series The Queen's Gambit, I'm sure familiar with that. How's
the story of parallel to that movie or different?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Yeah, there's a lot of similarities. Obviously that there was
a young girl who basically became a world class chess
player in the Man's World of Chess, which was basically
my real life story. Well, that was based on a novel,
a fictional story. The difference is that in the book
(35:17):
and in the movie they portray her that she had
to take tranquilizers and alcohol and drugs and all that
to help her succeeding chess. I think that, I mean
that certainly did not happen in my life, and also
it's rather unrealistic for anybody doing that to succeed in chess.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
How do you really prepare for a game like chess,
especially if you going to like a friendly or a
simple tournament or going to world championship? How do you
manage prepare? What's your routine?
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, Well, when you prepare for a tournament or a match, especially,
you study your opponents games and try to understand their style,
their lights that this like, their strengths, their weaknesses, and
try to exploit what they are not so good at
that you try to get a type of game that
favors you. Obviously, you have to study your opening moves
(36:15):
because most people have a tendency of play repeatedly in
a certain way, so you've got to analyze that. And
of course today especially you reduce the chess engines to
give you ideas, and the element of surprise is quite
important in chess. So when you do that preparation, pregame, preparation,
(36:36):
pre much preparation, that's what you try to do. You
try to come up with some surprise fair opponent, so
they'll be needing to spend more time on their chess
clock and also they would be less self confident that
they know what they are doing.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
And of course you can also get in some of
the books as well. Author Susan Poulgar has more and
besides Robo Queen, The Cold War, Misogamy and the Making
of a Grandmaster. You listen to The Mike Widner Show
at the Mike Widershow dot compowered by Sodweb Studios, brought
to by official sponsor The Mike Widner Show, inter USh
Warwing Out and Memislim You're missing The Sweet samis by
Serena Wagon based on Life of David, including Three Squizz
(37:16):
of Pains and Kingdavid Salms. Amazon dot Com keywords Sweet
Samaserena Wagner, and Sensey swinging, Ericdimond with all of me
new music coming soon ericdimusic dot com. We'll be back
with the multi tied, highly decorated female chess player in history,
Susan Polgar half of the time.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
Hey everybody, this is Eric Diamond and you're listening to
The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by sonicwebs Studios. If
you're looking to start or upgrade your online presence, visit
www dot Sonicwebstudios dot com for all of your online needs.
Call one eight hundred three oh three three nine six
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(37:56):
com To get started today, mention The Mike Wagner Show
and get twenty percent off your project. Sonic Web Studios
take your image to the next level.
Speaker 6 (38:05):
Hi, I'm Burl Bear, legendary American author, and I'm here
to tell you about Missing. The new mystery suspense novel
by me and most in Zea is really a good book,
very surprising. Never metaphor I didn't like. Especially in this book.
Here you have a main character whose life has been
filled with despair, his wife died. A nine to eleven
is a young daughter died of a rare disease. He's
(38:25):
not a happy camper.
Speaker 4 (38:26):
What does he do for a living.
Speaker 6 (38:27):
He's a physical fitness trainer. When somebody hardly knows, somebody's
never met, he always encountered on our internet chat line,
goes missing. This is his journey. He's going to go
rescue them. This is his search for redemption and search
for his own personal promise.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
Land.
Speaker 6 (38:44):
He couldn't do anything about the death of his wife,
the death of his child, but maybe he could rescue
this woman he's never met, that is, if she exists.
Missing by Me and most in zea international in scope,
vastly entertaining, full of surprises. I suggest you get it
either paperback or an electronica for your kindle. Missing by
Me and mooson Zia.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
Hey everybody, this is Eric Diamond. You're listening to the
Mike Wagner Show. You can check out our music and
know all about us at www dot ericdiamondmusic dot com.
Follow us on Facebook, YouTube, Spotify, TikTok. You can friend
me on Facebook. You can follow me on Facebook, and
you can even buy both of my albums off of Facebook.
(39:24):
Just get a hold of me on the Facebook Messenger.
We have them available in CD or thumb drive. Thank
you so much and hope you have a great day.
Speaker 4 (39:32):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawi is now a velve on emsoon.
This book includes thirty exquisite pinnings by well known and
unknown painters and Kingdavid songs. The Sweet Sawmist gives us
a new perspective on his life in this book through
the songs he wrote. His time as a shepherd in
the field is will. The book starts and it goes
on to describe as complicated and turbulent relationship with King Saul,
(39:52):
as well as other events. It's a story of love, betrayal, repentance,
and more. It also offers advice and approaching God and
living a life that pleases here. Check out the book
The Sweet Sawmist by Serena Wagner now availab one, Amazon
keywords Sweet Sawmist Sorena Wagner. Hey, Hey, this is Raye
Powers and boy, are you in luck right place?
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Right time?
Speaker 4 (40:13):
Tuned into The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
You heard me.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
We're back with Althon Susan paulgar The Hungarian born and
highly decorated female chess player in History of the Mike
Waidner Show with Rebel Queen, the Cold War, Misogamy, and
the Making of a grand Master. That's not your only book.
You also wrote some other books like Chess Tactics for Champions,
A World Champions Guide to Chess, and Learn Chess the
Right Way. Tell us more about that.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
Yeah, My latest series, other than Repel Queen, of course,
is Learned Just the Right Way. It's a five book
series which starts with practice examples, hundreds of them, on
how to check made in one move in the book one,
and then book two, how to capture your opponents is
the Best Way, and then three how to defend against
(41:04):
attacks and threads, and then both book four and five
builds on those first three books and a higher level.
So I'm really proud of those books and they are
best sellers, and I would recommend that book series to
anybody who wants to pick up chess. Start with the
World Champions Guide to Chess. It introduces you how the
pieces even move, what the chess board is and all that.
(41:28):
But then as for practice materials, the Launches The Right
Way is a really good series.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Okay, or certainly check that out. Were can we find
all your books that including Rebel Queen the col worm
is not going to make it a grand Master?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yeah, anywhere where books are sold, from Amazon to Barns
and Noble Aniver, you can find those things.
Speaker 4 (41:49):
And how about your website, Susan.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
My website is Susan Pogar dot com and from there
on you can go to my foundation, the Sudan Pogar
Fund Nation's website as well. The book Rebel Queen has
its own website as well, Rebel Queen sixty four dot.
Speaker 4 (42:07):
Com, Rebel Queen sixty four dot com. And what's the
significance of Rebel Queen sixty four? May I ask?
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Well? Sixty four is for the sixty four squares of
the chessboard.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Ah, I didn't know that I should have used my
mind right there. That was clever, our love a weally,
the amazing Susan Pogar of Rebel Queen, the Cold War
misogamy and making a Grandmaster Hill Mike ran your show, Susan,
Just a few more things. What else can we expecting
you twenty twenty five and beyond.
Speaker 3 (42:38):
Well, I'm working on a lot of activities for the
Susan Bogart Foundation, both on our fundraising side as well
as on activities for kids. Over the past twenty three
years since the existence of the Foundation, we have awarded
over seven million dollars to chess players around the country
(42:59):
and some even internationally. So I'm very proud of that
and very thankful to our supporters and partners enable that. Also,
I'm working on a couple ot of books that I'm
working on, some arches instructional books and another regular reading book. Also,
(43:22):
I'm hoping that The Rebel Queen will become a feature
movie one day, so I'm working on also making that happen.
Speaker 4 (43:34):
All right, we're really looking forward to that. Susan, who
do you consider biggest influence in career?
Speaker 3 (43:40):
My parents?
Speaker 4 (43:43):
Okay, that's really good. And what's the best advice you
can give to a byt this point.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Well, be patient. I think that's really from the most
important thing in life. People get impatient and give things up,
jump from bunting to another. I think, try to find
your passion, work hard at it, and if anything is possible.
That's my motto, and that's what the book means to
inspire people that if you read the book. You'll understand
(44:13):
that things will not be so simple. There will be roadblocks,
there will be people who try to cool you down.
But if you keep with it, you're passionate, you work hard,
you'll succeed.
Speaker 4 (44:26):
And being patient is what we need at this time.
I like what you said. We're the amazing author, Susan
Polgar of Rebo Queen, the Cold War, misogamy and making
a grand master here Mike Weader show Susan, very big, thankfully.
Time you've been absolutely fantastic, learned a lot looking forward
having soon keeps up today, keep in touch, love, have
you back and watch your website. How do people contact you?
(44:47):
Where can people purchase or check out your books?
Speaker 3 (44:51):
Yeah, they can contact me through my website Susanpogan dot com.
And the book can be also purchased on Amazon or
anywhere but books are sold including you can get to
that link through scrabel Queen sixty four dot com.
Speaker 4 (45:05):
We will certainly check that out once again, Susan, very big,
thank you. Time you've been app's amazing looking for him
and soon keeps up today, keep in touch, live at
me back. We wish all best and Susan, you definitely
have a great future.
Speaker 3 (45:16):
Thank you so much, nice for having me.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by Sonicweb Studios. If
you're looking to start or upgrade your online presence, visit
www dot Sonicwebstudios dot com For all of your online needs.
Call one eight hundred three oh three three nine six
zero or visit us online at www dot Sonicwebstudios dot
(45:38):
com to get started today, Mention The Mike Wagner Show
and get twenty percent off your project. Sonicweb Studios take
your image to the next level.
Speaker 1 (45:47):
Hey everybody, this is Er Diamond. You're listening to The
Mike Wagner Show. You can check out our music and
know all about us at www dot Ericdimandmusic dot com.
Follow us on Facebook to Spotify, TikTok, you can friend
me on Facebook. You can follow me on Facebook, and
you can even buy both of my albums off of Facebook.
(46:09):
Just get a hold of me on the Facebook Messenger.
We have them available in CD or thumb Drive. Thank
you so much and hope you have a great day.
Speaker 3 (46:16):
Hi.
Speaker 6 (46:17):
I'm Burl Bear, legendary American author, and I'm here to
tell you about Missing, the new mystery suspense novel.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
By Me and mosen Ze.
Speaker 6 (46:24):
It's really a good book, very surprising, never metaphor. I
didn't like especially this book. Here you have a main
character whose life has been filled with despair. His wife
died a nine to eleven. He is a young daughter
died of a rare disease. He's not a happy camper.
Speaker 4 (46:38):
What does he do for a living.
Speaker 6 (46:39):
He's a physical fitness trainer. When somebody hardly knows, somebody's
never met, he only has encountered on our internet chat line,
goes missing. This is his journey. He's going to go
rescue them. This is his search for redemption and search
for his own personal promise.
Speaker 4 (46:55):
Land.
Speaker 6 (46:55):
He couldn't do anything about the death of his wife,
the death of his child, but maybe he could rescue
this woman he's never met, that is, if she exists.
Missing by Me and Most and Zia international in scope,
vastly entertaining, full of surprises. I suggest you get it
either paperback or an electronic addition for your kindle. Missing
by Me and Mos and Zia.
Speaker 4 (47:14):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist. Now a veil on emsoon
This book includes thirty exquisite paintings by well known and
unknown painters and King David songs. The Sweet Salmist gives
us a new perspective on his life in this book
through the songs he wrote. His time as a shepherd
in the field is where the book starts, and it
goes on to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with
King Saul, as well as other events. It's a story
(47:36):
of love, betrayal, repentance, and more. It also offers advice
on approaching God and living a life that pleases him.
Check out the book The Sweet Salmist by Serena Wagner,
now availab on Amazon keywords Sweet Salmis Serena Wagner.
Speaker 5 (47:51):
Thanks for listening to The Mike Wagner Show, powed by
Sonic Web Studios. Listen online at Sunicwebstudios dot com for
all your needs. Mike Wlagness Show can be heard on Spreakers, Spotify, iHeartRadio, iTunes,
YouTube Anchor, FM Radio Public, and The Micwagner Show dot com.
Please support our program with your donations at The Micwagner
Show dot com. Join us again next time for another
(48:14):
great episode of the Mike Wagner Show,
Hey, everybody, this is Eric Diamond and you're listening to
The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by Sonic Weeb Studios.
Speaker 3 (00:07):
Hi, This is Miamos are also known as Mia No
Time for Love. Check out my latest book, Lifting, available
on Amazon.
Speaker 4 (00:14):
The Mike Wagner Show also brought to by The Sweet
Somuch by Soreena Wagner. Available on Amazon, highlighted up Bogo, David.
Speaker 5 (00:24):
It's now time for The Mike Wagner Show. Powered by
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Mike brings you great guests and interesting people from all
across the globe. So sit back, relax, and enjoy another
(00:46):
great episode of The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Everybody, It's Mike for the Mike Wagner Show. Powered by
Sound quib Studios, official sponsor to The Mike Wagner's Show.
Internation Warring author Me and Multonsia Missing Available on Amazon
and paperback and ebook coming soon, Missing Too by Mea
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on Amazon. Also brought to by The Sweet Songist by
Serena Wagner, based on the life of King David playing
thirty Squizite Pains King David Salms. Check out The Sweet
(01:18):
Solace today Amazon dot com keyword Sweet Solace, Serena Wagner
and Bright to buy the sent sales Swinging Eric Diamonds
Releas Luis Aldmee featured the tid track I've Gotten a Heartache,
Bring Me Sunshine and more. Ericdim Music dot Com. New
music coming soon. Follow on Facebook, YouTube and Spotify. We're
hearing an amazing lady who's an author. Hungarian born, highly
decorated female chess player, Ian history, born to a poor
(01:40):
Jewish family in the Cord War Budapest. First female to
win the Men's Grandmaster taland eighty one, only playing history
to orn win all six world prestigious chess crowns. I'll
talk more about that. Yaron crew foreign her birthday accidentally
discovering a chess step and became the first woman to
qualify for the Men's World on Chess Championship and also
the highest rayed female chess player in the world, earn
(02:02):
a men's grand Master of twenty one and also left
Hungary become an American system and become a college coach
fourteen years Texas Tech and Webster University in Saint Louis
and led to the more major championships than any other
chess program or in sports overall. And we'll find out
who she managed to match. She has the root of
book out. It's a true story about one of the
(02:22):
most renowned women in chess history, took on a sexist
establishments still have the authority Empire and rewrote the game
the book. It's called Rebel Queen, The Cold War Misogamy
and the Making of a grand Master. Live Lads and
generalen Plus Studios and beautiful Downtown Florida. The amazing author,
Hungarian born, highly decorated female chess player in history with
the book Rebel Queen, The Cold War, Misogamy and the
(02:45):
Making of a Grand Master Laison Jones, the multi talented
Susan Polgar. Susan, good morning, good afternoon, good evening. Thanks
for joining us today.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Thank you for having me, Hi hoi you doone.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
What's great to have you on and we just want
to say we're just checking in with you, so so
we got to say that too. Arthur in a Hungarian born,
highly decorated female chess player in history or born to
a poor Jewish family in the Cold War bidipest, your
first female win the Men's grand Master title in eighty one,
only player in history to earn all six world prestigious
(03:16):
chess crowns. You began your career four and your birthday
accident discovering a chess set at home. Became the first
woman to qualify from the Men's World Championship, highest rave
female chess player in the world, earn a Men's Grandmaster
in eighty one, left Hungary, become an American citizen to
become a college coach at Texas Tech and Webster University,
and he won more chess championships than any program in
(03:38):
history and also in any other sport. We'll find more
about that. You have a book that's true story one
of the most renowned women in chess history. You took
on sex establishment stuff to an authoritarian empire and rewrote
the rules about chess. In the book that's called Rebel Queen.
The Cold War Misogamy and the making of a grand master.
For getting O Susan, tell us how you first got.
Speaker 3 (04:01):
I was at home when I was almost four years old,
and I was looking for something you went fun to do,
and all of a sudden, I'm opening a cupboard and
the chess peace chess board and the chess pieces fell out.
My mother ran over what happened and she sees what
happened and she says, well, you have to wait until
the next day because that is at work and I
(04:22):
don't know how to play chess. And my dad came
home and the following day he started slowly, slowly introducing
me to the game. And that's how my career began.
And about six months later I entered into my first competitions,
first in the district Championship of Buda Peste my native
(04:44):
country Hungary, and I qualified the bondos to play in
that Championship of Buda Peste final, where I will also
all ten out of ten games perfect score. And that
was a big flash and the media in the chess
community and the career got them on its way.
Speaker 4 (05:07):
And you and you must have been appealed by the
horses and no shiny things and everything goes what's this?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Was that?
Speaker 4 (05:13):
Oh I see a horsey? I can imagine that.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
So yeah, initially that's all it was cute figurines and
little did I know how much depth and beauty and
challenge there is still a game of chess.
Speaker 4 (05:29):
Now, Now, the chess pieces that spill?
Speaker 3 (05:31):
Was it on like?
Speaker 4 (05:33):
Was it silver? Was it like copper gold? Or was
it like a plastic one? Was it wooden pewter? No,
wooden wouldn't just oh wooden? Okay, all right? So it
was that your ordinary chess set. Now you your dad
got you interested in playing. You guys play together and everything. Now, Now,
was he like a mastered chess player himself, or was
(05:55):
just like a casual average person or anything like that?
Was he competitor? He just liked to play for fun?
Speaker 3 (06:01):
Yeah, he was just a casual amateur player. He used
to play in his high school days. But he hasn't
played much after that until I accidentally discovered again, m hm.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Right, And I think that's great as well too. And
what was the other one precise moment is simply influencing
into UNIVERSI your career was knocking over Yeah, besides knocking
the pieces over, discovery, what else simply hill light bulb
moment for you.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Well, but I won that first big championship, that was
obviously a sign that this is something I may enjoy
and get good at. But I won my first world
championship title when I was twelve years old for girls
under sixteen, So that was the next big milestone.
Speaker 4 (06:50):
And this kind of came to mind as well too,
that with chess and everything like that. Who are some
of your favorite chess players growing up?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Well, obviously, Bobby Fischer was a legend as I was
growing up. He won the World Championship just a year
prior when I discovered a chess pieces and it was
like a big myth. Will he defend his title three
years later in seventy five and then he disappeared. So
obviously he was a legend as I was growing up.
(07:23):
And then when he did not defend his title and
Anatolie Karpov became the world champion. As most people, you know,
when they start playing developing players, the actual world champion
obviously had a huge influence on them. And you know,
as eventually I met other great players like Mikhail Kaal
(07:46):
was a big you know, I was a big fan
of his and I had a funny story when, just
as a thirteen year old, I met him when we
were visiting in Moscow, and I had a dream if
I could play a game with him, that'd be incredible.
And he was in the middle of playing a begin
(08:07):
international tournament and I was there as a spectator with
my parents, and as he was walking up and down
the hallway in between his moves smoking, which was allowed
at the time.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
Man, that's gonna be a great sport to get into.
I should have done that years ago. Make you move,
have a smoke, go back. I wish I had done
that years ago.
Speaker 3 (08:30):
That's how it was.
Speaker 6 (08:31):
It.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Fortunately it's no longer allowed, so today you cannot smoke
in buildings and you cannot smoke during games, but at
the time you could. So he was having his walks
up and down, and my mother had the courage to
go up to him and ask him, my daughter's dream
is to have a quick game with you, a blitz game,
and he says, hold on, hold on, let me go
(08:52):
back to my game. I'll be back soon, and so
sure enough, it was pretty shocking. Normally, games in those
times used to go four or five, six, seven hours,
but within half an hour he was back out. He
offered a draw to his grandmaster opponent. They settled on
a draw and he was out. I'm ready to play. Yeah,
(09:13):
that was a dream come true for me. And in fact,
the first game we played, I was attacking him fiercely
and I sacrificed a bishop and then a Knight, and
things were looking very good. Unfortunately, he managed to defend
well and the game ended in a draw. Nevertheless, it
was an unforgettable moment for me, and it was really
(09:35):
generous of him to give me an opportunity to play
a world champion.
Speaker 4 (09:40):
Oh my gosh, that is so amazing. There's some other
legends like Gary Kasparrov, Magnus Carlson and Boris Bowsky as
well too, and and you know, tell us about those
guys as well.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Yeah, I was very fortunate that I got to know
practically every great player of my lifetime and got to
play with most of them as well. I became good
friends with the late Boris Pasky. He just passed very recently,
but I write about my experiences meeting Boris Spasky or
(10:14):
Bobby Fisher, Deerka Sparow. So I'm very fortunate to meet
all of them, and I learned from them, you know,
they inspired me, they gave me advice, and it was
it was a really great experience to being able to
spend time with the legend of chess.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
And which player would you say you most emulate or
have a similar style like you among chess plurds.
Speaker 3 (10:43):
It's hard to say, but as I mentioned earlier, when
I started playing chess, Anatoly Karpov was the world champion,
and I think personality wise, I'm a more strategic persons
as is he, and my style I try to be
emulating his style of.
Speaker 4 (11:03):
Play, okay, And are some of the other styles like
you know, strategy and all that, and it's true or not.
You know, you're supposed to think like several moves ahead.
Is that still true today or is it like lesson
now more than that?
Speaker 3 (11:16):
Oh yeah, that did not change over the years. Obviously
some players like Ericasparov, he has a lot more aggressive,
dynamic attack in style, which I usually don't prefer. I
prefer to have a slower build up and get to
attack when all my pieces are well positioned for it.
(11:38):
So I typically prefer not to burn the bridges behind
me as much as he did. Obviously he did it
fantastically and I wish I could play like him, but
it's just a different style, different personality.
Speaker 4 (11:54):
And which are some of the players that you played against?
And how do you do against some of the legendary
players you play it against.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
Yeah, unfortunate that I can say I have beaten some
of them. I have drawn many of them. Obviously I
lost a good number of games as well. But I
managed to be given in a game Anatolic Karpov a
couple of times, and Drone Boris Pasky. I played Bobby
(12:23):
Fisher many games, actually all those friendly games, and did
about fifty to fifty score, So okay, yeah, yeah, I
managed to help my own against most of them.
Speaker 4 (12:36):
And what would you say your most memorable game was
or a memorable match?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I should say one of my favorite memories is when
for the first time I got invited to an elite
tournament in Spain with the top players, with world champion
Anatoli Karpov and top ten players, and one of those
top ten players, in fact, he was top three in
his speak, oh wow. Grandmaster Riboyevitch from Yugoslavia. He has
(13:05):
voiced his view that he was in a shock and
surprise at how can organizers invite female players to an
elite competition? And when I played him in the second
round of that competition, I was motivated to prove him
(13:25):
on the board why and I was very proud to
say that I was able to win him and he
had to resigned shortly before he would have gotten check
made it. So that's one of my favorite stories.
Speaker 4 (13:38):
Probably make him eat us words at that point too.
And of course, you know, you know it's being Hungarian,
your faced off against Hungarian players, Russian players, you know, Spain, France, Germany,
Japan and everything like that. Who would you say is
like the most competitive, the toughest like from the country,
and how they compared to like American players you thought
(14:00):
on American chess players.
Speaker 3 (14:02):
Well, I don't think it really matters what country the
opponent comes from. Obviously, when as I was growing up,
the Soviet players were pretty dominant, but over the years
things have changed. Today India actually is a quite dominant source.
They have won the gold Olympiad gold for men and women.
(14:24):
The current Training World Champion is a young man by
the name Gukash just eighteen years old. That of India
some times have changed, especially India and China has great
players to in addition of course to the Russian and
Ukrainian and we also had unexpected the world champion for
(14:47):
about a decade from Norway, Marnascarlsen. So it's not like
it used to be half a century ago when I
started playing chess, when the Soviet players were so dominant.
Now it's very mixed up. We have great players here
in America as well. So it's I think it's the
Internet and the technology that's now widely available for everyone,
(15:11):
most of it for free. It opened the doors and
made our world smaller, brought us all together that it
matters a whole lot less where you're from. Because when
I remember I was growing up, I had to go
to a chess club, I had to have a coach
come to my house or I had to go to him.
It was like logistically very complicated and not easy at all.
(15:36):
While today the young players or anybody who wants to improve,
all the information is out there twenty four to seven
on the Internet, on YouTube videos and so on and
so on, and it's all most of it free and
really available. It's really up to each individual how much
they want to learn. How much time they are willing
(15:58):
to dedicate to it. So it's a huge change.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
And during my lifetime when you talk about technology and
maybe think of the chess games or programs that back
in the early days, it's like, yeah, the chess on
computers are the ones like you know, similar to like
you know, was it the handheld football games, basketball games,
baseball games and they had like like a little laptop ballship,
(16:22):
you know, platform and everything. And what was taking those
type of games and early computers and how did you
do against the computers.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
I maybe remember the very first chess computer I received,
I think it was around nineteen eighty. It was called
a Boris Diplomat. It was like, you know, a little
rectanglar shaped box that I was quite amazed that it
was capable of playing a game of chess against me.
(16:52):
Of course, I was defeating it in every single game.
It was not very good, but even with facts, the
new fact that it was able to play llegal game
of chess was mind boggling at the time. Now we're
talking about that about forty five years ago. We came
a long way from there. You know that we went
through the phase in the eighties and the early nineties,
(17:12):
people were debating in the chess community and outside of it.
Better will did they come when the chess machines will
defeat us humans, the best humans chess players, And we
had to wait pretty much until the mid nineteen nineties.
By nineteen ninety seven, IBMSD Blue has defeated the then
(17:32):
reigning world champion Gary Kasparoff, and basically that kind of
ended that debate. We learned that the best chess machines
can defeat the best humans, and the following years and
decades it just re confirmed that that we lost that battle.
There is no race anymore, just as runners don't try
(17:56):
to race against the Porsche or even at Toyota right
any car with doesn't matter. So it's been at the
same stage in just now that any of these chess engines,
like the stock Visions others, that's available freely out there
(18:16):
to any human. In fact, you can put it just
on your iPhone, and anybody with an iPhone can defeat
even the best human jess players today, so there's no race.
On the other hand, we are using the technology to
improve our own skills to compete against other humans. It's
(18:38):
not a competition against the machine, but we just like
with cars, we use them as helpers as our you know,
for our convenience, for our learning, for our sorting, information analysis,
and more to improve our chances for our human competition.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
And do you think the president of AI is also
helping chess as well too, or is it you know,
make it more tougher and everything like that. You know,
do you think chess is going to you know, get
involved with AI or make chess easier or difficult?
Speaker 3 (19:15):
Oh? Yeah, chess is already very much involved with the AI.
In fact, I believe chess has been used as a
testing ground for AI. None just related AI. There has
been Google's Alpha zero engine, and that has been just
(19:36):
mind boggling because Vito that the regular engines like Stockfish
were amazing, and then came this self teaching machine AI
that just crushed the best engines that they were around
prior to this self teaching engine. It's like mind boggling
(19:58):
what program I guess could or AI developers could develop it.
It's really incredible. It's changed how we train I to
answer your question. It made it easier and harder at
the same time. It's easier to get good ideas, good information,
but don't forget. Pretty much everybody has access to that information,
(20:22):
so it's I guess the quality of the games becomes higher,
at least for the parts of the game that people
can prepare in the opening moves and memorize it. But
at the same time it's harder also because your opponents
also have those those same resources to use against So
(20:44):
it's it's it's hard.
Speaker 4 (20:46):
No words, forget about the cheat sheets and everything like that.
We'll talk about your journeys, the Rebel Queen, the Cold War, misogamy,
and the making of a grand Master going from Hungary
to America being highly decorated with Susan paulgar But first
listen to Mike Waders Show The Mic Wedders Show dot
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Interduction Wowering out the Meamulson's If you love fast based mysteries,
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We're the amazing author Hungarian born highly decorated female chess
(23:19):
player in history, Susan Polgarhill. Mike Werner showed the book
Rebel Queen, the Cold War, Nosogamy and the Making of
a grand Master before we you know, get in to
a book and tell us by during going from Hungary
to America.
Speaker 3 (23:34):
Well, the first time I came to the US was
in nineteen eighty five to compete at the New York
Open Chess competition, which was one of the biggest open
tournaments in the world at the time. And I made
a lot of friends immediately and I and I first came,
but then I went back, and then I kept coming
once twice a year for competitions. And I did not
(23:57):
move here actually until long after the Cold War was over.
I moved here in nineteen ninety four when I met
my first husband and he was living in New York
and I just moved to be with him. And you know,
my children were born here. I have two boys, and
(24:21):
I settled in the US, and I moved around a bit,
lived in New York thirteen years and was in Texas
for five, about nine in Missouri, and Ruddy more than
four years in Florida.
Speaker 4 (24:35):
So oh wow, okay, sounds a heck of a journey
and a bunch. Your two boys. Are they into chess
like you or do you envision to be world chess players?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
I will not quite like me at this point. They
are both grown men, and they did chose not to
become a professional chess player. Although my elder son Tom
has been quite successful as a junior player, as one
of several scholastic national championships in various age groups, and
(25:07):
he became a master player, so it's pretty good. But
he chose to have a professional career instead and just
keep chess as a hobby of mine.
Speaker 6 (25:17):
There you go.
Speaker 4 (25:18):
I think that's a great idea to have. So maybe
he'd confused like that. I mean, he never knows that
he could retire for twenty years and venturing bea a
grand master like you.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
So yeah, my very little bump just plays for fun
and he's a software engineer, so they are living fun.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
Oh there you go, And s a software engineer. Does
he get to program any chess games on or just
something else?
Speaker 3 (25:43):
I think he does other things.
Speaker 4 (25:45):
Oh good, okay, just want to make sure he doesn't
get too far as well too. And of course, you
know you went on to fourteen years Texas Tech, Webster University,
and Saint Louis nine major championships in history, and you
also accomplished more than any other And when I looked,
you accomplished more than John Wooden when it comes to
(26:05):
basketball and all sports, consecutive championships. That's a feat.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Yeah, I'm very, very proud of my students for everything
that we accomplished at Webster University with a number one
ranked team for every single day, every single week, every
single year in the photo existence of the program. So
I'm really really proud that my students won more national championship,
(26:29):
with more World Championship, Small Olympiaan gold medals and other
major titles than all the others programs Division one men's
sport in the country combined.
Speaker 4 (26:44):
And that is amazing to you want to read about that,
I mean, you you pretty much put John one to
shame in a way.
Speaker 3 (26:50):
So, and I'm the only female head coach in men's
division one. I believe in any sport, yes, true, that
DIP's another dimension. So I'm hoping to inspire other women
in other sports as well and in other male dominated
fields that if I can do it, they can too.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
And of course one the one woman coach I could
think of was Pat Summit of Tennessee being basketball coach,
and I think there was some quite a few others,
but that'd be another subject another time. But then with
your journey, you know, working a way to grand Master,
I mean with today's women, it was like, you know,
it's real easy, but for you, he was a pretty
difficult one that not just renowned, but you took on
(27:34):
a sexist establishment. You still up to authoritarism and also
the Empire's well too, which cold war mentality. And you
also rewrote the rules as well. And I mean you
had a repressive backjob. You you basically had a lot
of obstacles to deal with and how du man to
deal with those obstacles?
Speaker 3 (27:54):
Yeah, it was not easy. One of the toughest moments
in my career was when finally I got to play
in the final of the Hungarian National Championship. I qualified
myself to represent Hungary at the World Championship cycle and
I was told, no, you cannot play because you're a woman.
(28:14):
So that was one of the hardest things. And you know,
in some of those tough moments, I took inspiration from
my maternal grandmother, who was a Holocaust survivor, and she
reminded me in those moments that my daughter, if you
think what you're going through is tough, you have no
(28:35):
idea what tough is. And indeed, you know, I have
no right to even to compare, you know, my heartaches
and difficulties compared to what she went through. And you know,
I just had to pull myself together and work even
harder and try to give more checkmates on the chessboard,
(28:58):
and that I may that my approach that eventually, if
by giving up check mates, things will work out as
and as they did.
Speaker 4 (29:09):
Mm hmm. And do you think part of the treatment
that you have was totally different? Experienced anti Semitism and
also you know, being from like a poor Jewish family
and and what the fact did really you know, takes
have honey as well too, that you encounter a love that.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Yeah, it was not simple.
Speaker 6 (29:30):
Uh.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
We came from a poor family. I remember when we
were traveling to tournaments. Many times we were packing sardines
or Hungarian salami to save money on going to restaurants,
because that's all we could afford for quite some time.
As for anti Semitism in Hungary, fortunately officially speaking, it
(29:55):
was not allowed by the government. But with that's the
p people. Of course, our people and some people would say,
you know, they are not real Hungarians and make decisions,
you know, not saying so, but we just knew based
(30:15):
on what we were told that there were times when
they made decisions to discriminate because they felt we weren't
as Hungarians as they are.
Speaker 4 (30:28):
And of course you also mentioned Mesagam in your subtitles
as well too, that you encounter that and you know
in what ways was just considered sexist as well.
Speaker 3 (30:39):
Yeah, I mean when I started playing chess, I was
told countless times that a little girl like you should
be playing with those not a serious game of men,
which is justs you know. And after that, I was
told girls cannot be that good in just anyway, they're
not as smart as the boys. So I was growing
(31:01):
up with this constant they say, this discouragement, this sexist attitude.
You know that girls just cannot be as good as
the man, and fortunately I had the full support of
my parents and we believed that there shouldn't be any difference.
(31:24):
So as long as I'm working as hard as the
boys do, I'm practicing, I'm playing the best opponents I can.
And that's what created actually a lot of problems with
the authorities, because they believe the girls supposed to play
just with the girls and don't play against the boys
or the man. And we insisted that if I want
(31:45):
to have a chance to be as good as the
top male players, I had to train and compete just
like they do. And they did not condone that. They
thought that was crazy talk. They told how can I
How there's a woman said that she can or wants
to be a grand Master, And I kind of made
(32:05):
it as the mission of my life to prove them wrong.
And I'm very proud that eventually I was the first
woman to earn the Grandmaster title based on the norms
and the ratings just as the men do. So that
has been the struggle of my life, but I'm very
proud that I was able to open the door for
(32:26):
other women, including my sister Judith, who came behind me
and also became grand masters, and today there are I
believe forty two women who have the grandmaster title.
Speaker 4 (32:39):
Oh my gosh, that's so amazing. And of course you
love the game so much about and what is the
part that you love about the game, Well, I.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Love it's fairness that unlike other some other sports where
you're built, your height, your strengths you know that you're
born with or you know inherited in your genes, gives
you a certain advantage over your competitors. Like in basketball, right,
if you grow up to be seven feet tall, it's
(33:10):
kind of an advantage.
Speaker 4 (33:12):
Jump your basketball, or if you're five foot you can
gribble around your way the seven book guys, and if
you have powerful legs, the opportunity to go up and
dunk the ball, so you can do anything at five
foot practically, well, not as.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Much as the seven foot right, it would give an
advantage to a seven foot but not in chess. And
that's one of the things that I really attracted to me.
Even as a four year old, I was a tiny girl,
and I could play chess on equal footing against grown people.
That there is very few other things that we could do,
you know, mutually having fun. But as of the game itself,
(33:50):
I really love the beautiful combinations that the game has,
and I really enjoyed learning more and more and more
every day about the amazing different checkmates and patterns and
the exceptions from the rules. It's just like any art.
It has a lot of beauty to it.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
You say about different checkmates, how many different checkmates are there?
Because I thought there's one checkmate. How many different checkmates
are there?
Speaker 3 (34:16):
Oh no, that are like tens of thousands of different kinds.
Speaker 4 (34:19):
Of Okay, all right, just want to clarify, that's all. Okay, Yeah,
because I played some chess myself or probably one like,
I probably got just as bad as a record as
last year Chicago White Sox was. It's like maybe I
was like maybe one three last thirty and drew like
ten or something. Oh my gosh, I have a.
Speaker 3 (34:40):
Beautify chat that. It's an easy game to learn and
it's fun to enjoy, but it's a hard game to master.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
Right exactly. And of course, of course the popular Netflix
series The Queen's Gambit, I'm sure familiar with that. How's
the story of parallel to that movie or different?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Yeah, there's a lot of similarities. Obviously that there was
a young girl who basically became a world class chess
player in the Man's World of Chess, which was basically
my real life story. Well, that was based on a novel,
a fictional story. The difference is that in the book
(35:17):
and in the movie they portray her that she had
to take tranquilizers and alcohol and drugs and all that
to help her succeeding chess. I think that, I mean
that certainly did not happen in my life, and also
it's rather unrealistic for anybody doing that to succeed in chess.
Speaker 4 (35:38):
How do you really prepare for a game like chess,
especially if you going to like a friendly or a
simple tournament or going to world championship? How do you
manage prepare? What's your routine?
Speaker 3 (35:49):
Yeah, Well, when you prepare for a tournament or a match, especially,
you study your opponents games and try to understand their style,
their lights that this like, their strengths, their weaknesses, and
try to exploit what they are not so good at
that you try to get a type of game that
favors you. Obviously, you have to study your opening moves
(36:15):
because most people have a tendency of play repeatedly in
a certain way, so you've got to analyze that. And
of course today especially you reduce the chess engines to
give you ideas, and the element of surprise is quite
important in chess. So when you do that preparation, pregame, preparation,
(36:36):
pre much preparation, that's what you try to do. You
try to come up with some surprise fair opponent, so
they'll be needing to spend more time on their chess
clock and also they would be less self confident that
they know what they are doing.
Speaker 4 (36:54):
And of course you can also get in some of
the books as well. Author Susan Poulgar has more and
besides Robo Queen, The Cold War, Misogamy and the Making
of a Grandmaster. You listen to The Mike Widner Show
at the Mike Widershow dot compowered by Sodweb Studios, brought
to by official sponsor The Mike Widner Show, inter USh
Warwing Out and Memislim You're missing The Sweet samis by
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new music coming soon ericdimusic dot com. We'll be back
with the multi tied, highly decorated female chess player in history,
Susan Polgar half of the time.
Speaker 1 (37:31):
Hey everybody, this is Eric Diamond and you're listening to
The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by sonicwebs Studios. If
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Hey everybody, this is Eric Diamond. You're listening to the
Mike Wagner Show. You can check out our music and
know all about us at www dot ericdiamondmusic dot com.
Follow us on Facebook, YouTube, Spotify, TikTok. You can friend
me on Facebook. You can follow me on Facebook, and
you can even buy both of my albums off of Facebook.
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We have them available in CD or thumb drive. Thank
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The Sweet Sawmist by Serena Wagner now availab one, Amazon
keywords Sweet Sawmist Sorena Wagner. Hey, Hey, this is Raye
Powers and boy, are you in luck right place?
Speaker 2 (40:12):
Right time?
Speaker 4 (40:13):
Tuned into The Mike Wagner Show.
Speaker 3 (40:16):
You heard me.
Speaker 4 (40:21):
We're back with Althon Susan paulgar The Hungarian born and
highly decorated female chess player in History of the Mike
Waidner Show with Rebel Queen, the Cold War, Misogamy, and
the Making of a grand Master. That's not your only book.
You also wrote some other books like Chess Tactics for Champions,
A World Champions Guide to Chess, and Learn Chess the
Right Way. Tell us more about that.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
Yeah, My latest series, other than Repel Queen, of course,
is Learned Just the Right Way. It's a five book
series which starts with practice examples, hundreds of them, on
how to check made in one move in the book one,
and then book two, how to capture your opponents is
the Best Way, and then three how to defend against
(41:04):
attacks and threads, and then both book four and five
builds on those first three books and a higher level.
So I'm really proud of those books and they are
best sellers, and I would recommend that book series to
anybody who wants to pick up chess. Start with the
World Champions Guide to Chess. It introduces you how the
pieces even move, what the chess board is and all that.
(41:28):
But then as for practice materials, the Launches The Right
Way is a really good series.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Okay, or certainly check that out. Were can we find
all your books that including Rebel Queen the col worm
is not going to make it a grand Master?
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yeah, anywhere where books are sold, from Amazon to Barns
and Noble Aniver, you can find those things.
Speaker 4 (41:49):
And how about your website, Susan.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
My website is Susan Pogar dot com and from there
on you can go to my foundation, the Sudan Pogar
Fund Nation's website as well. The book Rebel Queen has
its own website as well, Rebel Queen sixty four dot.
Speaker 4 (42:07):
Com, Rebel Queen sixty four dot com. And what's the
significance of Rebel Queen sixty four? May I ask?
Speaker 3 (42:16):
Well? Sixty four is for the sixty four squares of
the chessboard.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
Ah, I didn't know that I should have used my
mind right there. That was clever, our love a weally,
the amazing Susan Pogar of Rebel Queen, the Cold War
misogamy and making a Grandmaster Hill Mike ran your show, Susan,
Just a few more things. What else can we expecting
you twenty twenty five and beyond.
Speaker 3 (42:38):
Well, I'm working on a lot of activities for the
Susan Bogart Foundation, both on our fundraising side as well
as on activities for kids. Over the past twenty three
years since the existence of the Foundation, we have awarded
over seven million dollars to chess players around the country
(42:59):
and some even internationally. So I'm very proud of that
and very thankful to our supporters and partners enable that. Also,
I'm working on a couple ot of books that I'm
working on, some arches instructional books and another regular reading book. Also,
(43:22):
I'm hoping that The Rebel Queen will become a feature
movie one day, so I'm working on also making that happen.
Speaker 4 (43:34):
All right, we're really looking forward to that. Susan, who
do you consider biggest influence in career?
Speaker 3 (43:40):
My parents?
Speaker 4 (43:43):
Okay, that's really good. And what's the best advice you
can give to a byt this point.
Speaker 3 (43:50):
Well, be patient. I think that's really from the most
important thing in life. People get impatient and give things up,
jump from bunting to another. I think, try to find
your passion, work hard at it, and if anything is possible.
That's my motto, and that's what the book means to
inspire people that if you read the book. You'll understand
(44:13):
that things will not be so simple. There will be roadblocks,
there will be people who try to cool you down.
But if you keep with it, you're passionate, you work hard,
you'll succeed.
Speaker 4 (44:26):
And being patient is what we need at this time.
I like what you said. We're the amazing author, Susan
Polgar of Rebo Queen, the Cold War, misogamy and making
a grand master here Mike Weader show Susan, very big, thankfully.
Time you've been absolutely fantastic, learned a lot looking forward
having soon keeps up today, keep in touch, love, have
you back and watch your website. How do people contact you?
(44:47):
Where can people purchase or check out your books?
Speaker 3 (44:51):
Yeah, they can contact me through my website Susanpogan dot com.
And the book can be also purchased on Amazon or
anywhere but books are sold including you can get to
that link through scrabel Queen sixty four dot com.
Speaker 4 (45:05):
We will certainly check that out once again, Susan, very big,
thank you. Time you've been app's amazing looking for him
and soon keeps up today, keep in touch, live at
me back. We wish all best and Susan, you definitely
have a great future.
Speaker 3 (45:16):
Thank you so much, nice for having me.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
The Mike Wagner Show is powered by Sonicweb Studios. If
you're looking to start or upgrade your online presence, visit
www dot Sonicwebstudios dot com For all of your online needs.
Call one eight hundred three oh three three nine six
zero or visit us online at www dot Sonicwebstudios dot
(45:38):
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Speaker 1 (45:47):
Hey everybody, this is Er Diamond. You're listening to The
Mike Wagner Show. You can check out our music and
know all about us at www dot Ericdimandmusic dot com.
Follow us on Facebook to Spotify, TikTok, you can friend
me on Facebook. You can follow me on Facebook, and
you can even buy both of my albums off of Facebook.
(46:09):
Just get a hold of me on the Facebook Messenger.
We have them available in CD or thumb Drive. Thank
you so much and hope you have a great day.
Speaker 3 (46:16):
Hi.
Speaker 6 (46:17):
I'm Burl Bear, legendary American author, and I'm here to
tell you about Missing, the new mystery suspense novel.
Speaker 3 (46:23):
By Me and mosen Ze.
Speaker 6 (46:24):
It's really a good book, very surprising, never metaphor. I
didn't like especially this book. Here you have a main
character whose life has been filled with despair. His wife
died a nine to eleven. He is a young daughter
died of a rare disease. He's not a happy camper.
Speaker 4 (46:38):
What does he do for a living.
Speaker 6 (46:39):
He's a physical fitness trainer. When somebody hardly knows, somebody's
never met, he only has encountered on our internet chat line,
goes missing. This is his journey. He's going to go
rescue them. This is his search for redemption and search
for his own personal promise.
Speaker 4 (46:55):
Land.
Speaker 6 (46:55):
He couldn't do anything about the death of his wife,
the death of his child, but maybe he could rescue
this woman he's never met, that is, if she exists.
Missing by Me and Most and Zia international in scope,
vastly entertaining, full of surprises. I suggest you get it
either paperback or an electronic addition for your kindle. Missing
by Me and Mos and Zia.
Speaker 4 (47:14):
The Mike Wagner Show is brought to you by Serena
Wagner's book The Sweet Sawmist. Now a veil on emsoon
This book includes thirty exquisite paintings by well known and
unknown painters and King David songs. The Sweet Salmist gives
us a new perspective on his life in this book
through the songs he wrote. His time as a shepherd
in the field is where the book starts, and it
goes on to describe his complicated and turbulent relationship with
King Saul, as well as other events. It's a story
(47:36):
of love, betrayal, repentance, and more. It also offers advice
on approaching God and living a life that pleases him.
Check out the book The Sweet Salmist by Serena Wagner,
now availab on Amazon keywords Sweet Salmis Serena Wagner.
Speaker 5 (47:51):
Thanks for listening to The Mike Wagner Show, powed by
Sonic Web Studios. Listen online at Sunicwebstudios dot com for
all your needs. Mike Wlagness Show can be heard on Spreakers, Spotify, iHeartRadio, iTunes,
YouTube Anchor, FM Radio Public, and The Micwagner Show dot com.
Please support our program with your donations at The Micwagner
Show dot com. Join us again next time for another
(48:14):
great episode of the Mike Wagner Show,
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