Commentary Track: Terminator Genisys

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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Speaker 2 (00:58):
Show Jacky and Brian.

Speaker 1 (01:01):
They're talking about the mob mom and now back.

Speaker 3 (01:03):
I guess the machine sent a terminator back to the
time before the war to kill my mother, Sarah Connor. Sir,
let me say that. Call Weli if you want to

(01:25):
live now, Soldier, it's all right. John sent me here
to save you from the terminator that was sent back
to kill me. I know, but we already took care
of him. I've been waiting for you. This time John
sent you to would no longer exist. We can stop
Judgment Day from happening. I'll be back. Welcome to a

(01:53):
movie film commentary track. My name is Zachie Is. I'm
here with Brian.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Oh hey, how's it going, Zechie?

Speaker 3 (01:58):
Brian? You know, there are times when I hear the
phrase there is no fate but what we make for ourselves,
and it feels like a threat. Yeah, and I feel
like today's movie might be one of those times.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, Terminator Genesis with a spelling that just I've been
putting this in my calendar when we're going to record this.
I was telling someone we were doing a commentary for
this in texts, and every time I'm like, this cannot
be the spelling, And then I'm also like embarrassed. I'm
like I wrote the person IM like, oh, yeah, we're
doing the Terminator Genesis this week. I swear this is

(02:34):
not I know how to spell genesis. I don't know
why they chose to spell it this way for the title,
Like I'm not crazy, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:40):
You know, I have to say to his credit, David Ellison,
who producer of this movie, and now like you know,
chair of Paramount, he said, we may have made a
mistake with that title. Oh did he really with the spelling? Yeah, so,
oh funny. I give props for that if nothing else.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, well, I mean, as long as we're bringing it
up now, I did that.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
It has to do with you know, like the computer
prompt like systems, you know, sy that's why.

Speaker 2 (03:05):
But it's I don't know, it's messy.

Speaker 3 (03:08):
It isn't that, but MESSI might be the word that
most applies to this movie. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I got
a kit.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
When you proposed doing this, I actually got really excited
because I had not seen this since it came out
in theaters. I remember not liking it, but I couldn't
remember why. And sometimes when we revisit these things, I
soften a little bit. Yeah yeah, because you know when
something comes out and it's new and it's like, this
is the thing, this is what's happening now in the
world of the story that you love, it can feel

(03:38):
like a little more painful when you're not on board.
So with time, I was curious how this would play
for me, and so I can't wait to get into
it with you.

Speaker 3 (03:46):
Well, then I don't think we should kick that can
down the curb any any longer. Then, all right, we
are watching twenty fifteen's Terminator Genesis, which celebrated it's ten
the anniversary this year, which is either either a blink
of an eye or an eternity, depending on the lens
you view the world through. And I think it's a

(04:07):
little bit of both, to be honest. Yep, yep, And
so hey, if you want to watch along with us,
you certainly can do that. If not, we'll try to
keep our conversation interesting for longtime listeners. You know that
we are both pretty big fans of the Terminator franchise.
Oh yeah, yeah, so certainly have have many many thoughts
about this one, I said, I suspect I'm actually I
kind of like you. We haven't discussed at all, like

(04:30):
kind of where we landed after our revisits of this.

Speaker 2 (04:33):
I'm very curious, yeah, yeah, curious to see where this
takes us.

Speaker 3 (04:37):
So we will hit play on three. We'll do the
usual thing. One two three plate, Brian, you're ready, I'm ready,
we go one two three plate.

Speaker 1 (04:47):
You know, I was, you know, I was shocked to
As I always do with these, I like to look
at the box office. Yeah, the budget on this was
one hundred and fifty five million, which is like oddly responsible.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Right yeah, right, ye.

Speaker 2 (05:07):
Did you know how much this grossed in the US.

Speaker 3 (05:10):
I think it was like ninety right, yep.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Eighty nine point seven million.

Speaker 1 (05:14):
I was like, holy crap, It's like that's like pre COVID,
like post COVID. You know, all bets are off. But yeah, wow,
this did not hit. But worldwide it.

Speaker 2 (05:24):
Made four something yeah, four hundred and forty million, so.

Speaker 3 (05:27):
Which I think the break even was four point fifty wow,
and and so international didn't even carry him to that. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
But you know what's crazy is that total worldwide makes
this the second highest grossing entry after Terminator two.

Speaker 3 (05:45):
Uh. It's a strange world.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
A strange world exactly. I don't know what to do
with that fact, but crazy.

Speaker 3 (05:54):
Yeah. I've been looking at.

Speaker 2 (05:57):
Like my screen now, I'm like I should watch this movie.
Oh yeah, this, you know, this was funny.

Speaker 1 (06:02):
Too, because I don't tend to rewatch the sequels. I've
seen Terminator three, well, sequel two, of course, goes out saying,
probably one of the movies I've seen most in my life.

Speaker 3 (06:14):
Three.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
You know, I'm kind of in the middle on You've
helped me appreciate it a little bit more. And then four, five,
and six.

Speaker 3 (06:25):
Yeah, I watched.

Speaker 1 (06:27):
Once and then a second time with you when we
do these commentaries. So I gotta say, I am looking
forward to revisiting Dark Fate, but this one, I was
surprised how much I did.

Speaker 2 (06:38):
Remember about it.

Speaker 1 (06:40):
Sure, just a lot of moments like the flashback from
an alternative timeline and Piece's mind, and you know, the
Genesis thing and the hologram with the little boy representing Genesis.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
There's a lot that I had. I was like, oh,
I kind of remember this movie.

Speaker 3 (06:54):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (06:55):
How was it for you?

Speaker 3 (06:57):
Well, first of all, I should say, there's my hometown
right now, just getting obliterated.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
Which is a lot of people leave in their hearts
in San Francisco here.

Speaker 3 (07:07):
Yes, right, So yeah, I saw this one time before.
I saw it in the theater, and I was I was,
I was intrigued to revisit kind of with that same
idea of like, well, what what what does ten years
of detachment feel like? And it's a it's a weird
one because because I honestly, I'm like, you know, there
there's about like a third of this that I would

(07:29):
say is like pretty good, like like I like and
I would say most of that third is like this
front front portion agreed, showing the future war and showing
sort of what what leads into the original terminator or what.

Speaker 1 (07:44):
If you sort of back to the future tude, yes,
like the Biff worlde eighty five? What if you accidentally
could That's what they keep doing, like it or not.
They keep repeating, so they send a terminator earlier, and
then they send a terminator earlier two term it like
you know, it's like how many times can you do
that and affect this one? You know, either eighty four

(08:05):
or ninety whatever it is, you know, And it's like,
so what if something skewed that a little bit and
then all bets are off and we don't know how
things are going to play out and the dates could
be shoved around.

Speaker 2 (08:17):
That's interesting, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:19):
So so what what the filmmakers were supposedly inspired by
was back to the future too. As you said, that's
a let A Kilogratis, who's one of the writers. That's
where I got that, Like it's stuck in my head. Yeah, yeah,
and you get that. And you know the way it
sort of remixes specific scenes and elements from from the

(08:43):
first film at the beginning. I like tracked with all
that stuff. For the most part. I think there's a
portion in the movie where I think the wheels fall off,
and I suppose we'll point it out when we get there,
but even this early stuff. So I should say, first
of all, just Courtney as Kyle. His casting did not

(09:05):
work for me before it does it still does not
work for me as Kyle. Yeah. However, I will say
with ten years of removed, I didn't mind him so
much in the movie, just as like a presence. But
I just I just don't buy him as the same
character that Michael Bean plays. Agreed. Agreed.

Speaker 2 (09:26):
I don't know why I thought about it. Oh, you
know what I thought about it.

Speaker 1 (09:28):
When John and Sarah are at those locker I'm sorry,
Kyle and Sarah at those lockers and they're changing and
I was just picturing what that scene would have been
like with Michael Bean, you know, I was like that.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
It would be a completely different scene.

Speaker 3 (09:42):
Yeah, And so that casting is really goofy to me.
I know, I know that Wilson Bethell was one of
the people who was in the running and he plays
a Bullseye in the Dared Devil series and he's like
a dead ringer for Michael Bean, and I was like,
why would you not cast that guy? But also even
Boyd old Brook, I could see him as you.

Speaker 2 (10:01):
Know too, I saw that in the yeah, some of
the trivia.

Speaker 3 (10:04):
I was like, oh, yeah, it's closer, right, Like Jike
Corney just doesn't I mean, he doesn't. I feel bad
kicking around Jake Carton because I feel like he's gotten
kicked around a lot. And I again, I actually I
didn't mind him in this movie, just as a as
a as a as a performer.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
You know, same, but just not in this role.

Speaker 3 (10:22):
I just not in this role.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
A couple of people are miscast in this movie.

Speaker 3 (10:26):
I did really like Jason Clark in this early portion though, as.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
John Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (10:33):
I don't like him as as the you know what
they do with the character later, but as like an
older version as the same, right, just this, if we
just take this as this is, this has grown up
Eddie Furlong, I can I can buy it, you know what.

Speaker 1 (10:47):
Yes, however, he just has he has he It's interesting.
He has a twinkle in his eye and a little
bit of menace or something like I wish maybe he
was a little warm, yeah, while.

Speaker 2 (11:01):
Feeling tough and you know, and grizzled.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
I don't know, I don't know. He I seesaw a
little bit with him.

Speaker 3 (11:12):
I well, I think it goes to.

Speaker 2 (11:15):
Well, that's a nice smile.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
Yeah, it's our good good.

Speaker 3 (11:21):
Come on, you wouldn't follow that man into the mouth
of hell.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
You know, let me say he's he's he's all right,
he's all right. But I would be interested. Who else
was on their their vision board.

Speaker 3 (11:32):
Well, I know Tom Hardy was was who I think
I think Alan Taylor wanted Tom Hardy. I don't know
about that. Uh yeah, that's an odd one, right, yeah, yeah,
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
If the energy is right.

Speaker 3 (11:43):
There, I think yeah, I agree with that, and I
definitely think that like if you cast Tom Hardy, then
you can't have Jie Courtney like yeah, yeah, I'm seeing
two of them. Yeah, yeah, I think, I think fundamentally,
and I'm sure we'll circle back around to this these
movies after it feels like after the fourth one, they

(12:06):
just don't know what to do with John Connor. Yeah, yeah, right,
And and so you know, here's the biggest problem with
this movie. Okay, it's not the result of some you know, expression,
artistic expression that desperately needed to be given voice. Yeah,

(12:30):
it's the result of a very complicated rights process that
saw one studio sell the rights to a hedge fund
that told it to hear and then it ends up
here and hey, we got this thing, we paid a
bunch of money for, so we got to make something. Yeah. Yeah,
and that's how you get Terminator Genesis. And so in
that sense, it's about as cynical as it gets. And
that's really frustrating because that cynicism shines through in every crevice.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
Yeah, you know, yeah, you know, that's funny. I was
gonna I have so many things I wrote time to
talk about, but like, you know, I feel a little
bad about Alan Taylor. I mean, I'm just reading some
of the stories about his experience on here, Like I'm
not quick to like blame him necessarily, but this movie
feels so like passionless. It just feels like order of

(13:17):
business or something kind of like what you're saying. And
like I I was trying to figure out why I
wasn't connecting with it. And there's a couple of reasons.

Speaker 2 (13:25):
I think.

Speaker 1 (13:26):
Obviously, we know the first two very very very well,
so there's a lot of nostalgia associated with those specifically.
But also those movies have a very specific tone, right,
in a style, And so when you watch something else
that is referencing the movies that I like but doesn't
feel like it tonally connects with those, I'm already a

(13:50):
little disoriented, right And and also you know, there's just
like a lot of things that need to be carried out. Oh,
we got to stop this thing, we got to help
each other. That's great, but like so there's a lot
of tasks happening. But when I think of Terminator too,
obviously I love the action, but I also think of

(14:11):
man I really buy a boy crying at the end
when his robot friend is self being lowered into the lava.
And I think one of my favorite moments in the
movie is when John risks everything to go stop his
mom from killing Dyson. Because he's gonna she's fighting for humanity,
but she's about to lose her own humanity by doing that.

(14:31):
And he's like, no, I won't let my mom do that. Like,
there's nothing like that character wise in this film. Right,
They're just people that are pushing a plot along really well.

Speaker 3 (14:41):
And that's really it. Right now. Now, this this entire
sequence here, if we viewed that this is the lead
up to you know, this was just before the opening
credits of the original Terminator. Yeah, I buy it, you know.

Speaker 2 (14:54):
I actually, by the way, this is very cool.

Speaker 3 (14:56):
I agree, and it beats the shit out of whatever
Terminator Salvation is doing in so far as the future
war stuff.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
Yeah, right, because this, well, I guess I have to
go against what I just said. This at least visually
resembles what we've seen in the future.

Speaker 3 (15:09):
Yeah, it's got the blue tints and everything. That's you know.
But here's the thing. Okay, So we talk about Terminator two,
and I think most people would agree that when you
say greatest sequels of all time, that's in the top
three at least, right, Yeah, sure, but that's a sequel
that did not need to exist, right, And why was

(15:31):
there such a long delay between the first one and second,
and it was ultimately Jim Cameron being like, look, if
I come up with an idea, we'll make it, and
he just so happened to come up with a freaking
amazing idea. Yeah. Right, But there is about two movies
worth of story in this premise. And this is something

(15:52):
I have said many a time, and with every new
film that comes out, it feels like Marge Simpson in
that Chanelle dress. Yeah, just try trying to tweak it
a little so she can wear it one more time,
you know, yep, yep, yeah. Yeah. And so so I
like like this here where they're recreating the opening sequence

(16:12):
of the eighty four Terminator. Man, you know what I appreciate.
I applaud the hustle.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
I remember feeling giddy the first time I saw this. Yeah,
I got a little giddy last night revisiting it.

Speaker 3 (16:24):
Obviously.

Speaker 2 (16:24):
It's the thing that I love.

Speaker 3 (16:26):
Yeah, and and so that all of that stuff I
mostly track with. But then it's kind of like, once
they run out of once they run out of the
runway that the previous films already established, they don't really
have anywhere to go, right right, So, so you know,
it's appropriate since we got so many Game of Thrones people.
It's like they ran out of George R. R. Martin

(16:47):
novels and then suddenly they got to finish the show.

Speaker 2 (16:49):
That's a yeah, that's great. Yeah, right, that's a good example.

Speaker 3 (16:52):
Alan Taylor, his girlfriend was was a storyboard artist. She
read this script and she's said, don't make this movie.

Speaker 2 (17:02):
I hope he married her.

Speaker 3 (17:06):
And he had met with Arnold Schwarzenegger at this point,
and he obviously has the affinity for the Terminator films,
and and I kind of I kind of understand him
being like, yeah, but it's the Terminator.

Speaker 1 (17:19):
Oh yeah, because I guess he knew the script had problems,
but he was thinking.

Speaker 3 (17:24):
He's like, I can fix it.

Speaker 1 (17:25):
I can fix it. And obviously those are famous last words,
but I.

Speaker 3 (17:30):
Said, in a Schwarznegger voice, where you can fix it? Yeah? Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
I mean it's like I'm obviously not even like close
to having an opportunity like this, but you know, in
a scenario where I was, oh, this would be next
to him possible to turn down, because I would think, no,
but I love this series. I can I'll figure it out.
I'll figure it out, like I'll do it. I'll do
it right. I can understand. I can understand that impulse.
Are you or would you be afraid to touch it?

Speaker 3 (17:56):
Well, I mean that's kind of the beauty of being
nowhere near qualified and having no illusions about being qualified
for that. I don't even have to contemplate that decision,
you know what I mean. Yeah, It's like if somebody
asked me, like, if you were president, how would you
negotiate that, I'm like, well, I'm not never gonna happen.
Don't need to think about it. It's freeing in that regard,
you know. Yeah, But I mean before Alan Taylor, we

(18:20):
should say, I mean Alan Taylor, who who who? You know?
Made his bones on Game of Thrones, but that should
be the title of his biography, by the way, made
my bones on Game of Thrones. It's good. And it's
like him shrugging his shoulders, you know.

Speaker 2 (18:34):
Yeah, yeah it Almot sounds like a country song.

Speaker 3 (18:36):
Made my Bones on amal Thrones. But he was coming
off through the dark world, yeah, which, like as calling
cards go, that's maybe not the one, you know. But
but before him, aang Lee was was being courted and
and Ryan Johnson and like Ryan Johnson tell me you

(18:57):
wouldn't want to see his take talk about the guy
to do the the you know, shake it up, shake
it right, like he would be the guy to do it. Yeah. Yeah,
I mean, considering that a lot of the stuff in
this movie is very similar to the thematic stuff that
we see in Looper.

Speaker 2 (19:18):
Yeah, oh that's right.

Speaker 3 (19:20):
Yeah, you got like two sets up memories and things
like that. You know. Yeah. I think even before it
landed at Paramount, they wanted Justin Lynn to do it,
which which I'm gonna say. You know, I liked his
Star Trek movie, so I would kind of be down
for that, to be honest. Yeah, yeah, you know what.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Okay, So that reminds me because I was thinking, like
I like him as a director, Lynn, but again, I'm like,
I want these movies to at least feel like they
have some of the same vocabulary, sure even just visually
sound whatever. And I was like, I don't know if
Lynn would do that, but I do want to then
say out loud that when I was watching this last night,

(19:57):
I was getting a little frustrated, but then I was
also like, Brian, it is it isn't the thing you
want it to be. And it's never gonna be the
thing you want to be, So just watch it for
what it is, yeah, and try to form an opinion
on it. And so I did. I did do that,
and I still feel what I already said about it.

(20:18):
You know, where it's there's some good stuff. There's some
stuff that feels like man, just even on a script
level or like a character level, just how much the
previous two movies are. I mean, the first one is
like part romance, you know what I mean. And there's
just so much humanity in those first two movies. And
I really think those in addition to the groundbreaking visual
effects and the action, I think that's why those movies

(20:41):
endure and are so rewatchable. The characters are so interesting
and fun to watch, and and this, you know, they
there's a handful couple, you know, of moments that are okay,
but just even the direction of this kind of has
a journeyman feel to it. Yeah, you know, like it
doesn't feel like there's a lot of personality to this movie,
or like a lot of passion was injected into it.

(21:03):
And to be fair again to Alan Taylor, I don't
I'm not super familiar with his work and I know
Game of Thrones was really strong often, but Amelia Clark
said that working on this, obviously she knew Taylor from
Game of Thrones and said that she just didn't even
recognize him, like he had been really eaten and.

Speaker 3 (21:23):
Chewed up, she said, by the process.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
Yeah, and she didn't enjoy working on this and speaking
about him. Her quote is he was not the director.
I remembered he didn't have a good time. No one
had a good time.

Speaker 3 (21:37):
Well yeah, supposedly because because the Josh Trank Fantastic Four
was filming around the same time, and people on that
choote had shirts saying at least we're not Terminator. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (21:48):
You know I saw that.

Speaker 1 (21:49):
I was like, no way, and then I saw it
backed up on multiple places.

Speaker 3 (21:53):
So that's that's why.

Speaker 1 (21:55):
I mean, if that's a movie that is completely crumbling
looking at you and being like, well, at least I'm
not on that one.

Speaker 3 (22:03):
Wow. Yeah. Well, and I think it gets to trying to,
you know, turn turn the spigot into a perpetual on position, right,
And that's that's how the studio was looking at Terminator
purely as an asset.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
Oh yeah, sure.

Speaker 3 (22:23):
And and you know this goes to what we were
saying before. By the way, real quick, Matt Smith, has
anyone has anybody been more mistreated by the big studio
franchise machine than this guy?

Speaker 2 (22:36):
You know, it's so interesting you say that.

Speaker 1 (22:37):
I was gonna say, speaking of assets, looking at Courtney's
abs here, Sorry, I have like five five things.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
One did you know that this?

Speaker 1 (22:48):
At one point Cameron was going to include a scene
like this, the time travel scene in Terminator Too. It
was in a draft of the script in they just
realized they couldn't afford it, but it's in the novelization
for Terminator two.

Speaker 2 (23:00):
I thought it was kind of interesting. Matt Smith.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
Okay, this is kind of related to Jie Courtney, but
in an insane cosmic coincidence, Zachie. Last night, I was
listening to a podcast and they were talking about Jie Courtney. Okay,
and when was the last time? Yeah, right, someone was
talking about him in the last couple of years. And
someone was saying, I don't I'm not a fan. But

(23:24):
they watched him in something recently. I think it was
called Dangerous Animals, and they.

Speaker 2 (23:27):
Were like, he's actually really good in it.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
Yeah, for the first time for me personally, not me
but the podcaster, I felt like he was cast correctly
and I just haven't liked him in anything else. And
then another host said, have you ever seen him in Vikings?
And the person was like no, And then the other
guy said, that was the perfect character for him. He
excelled in that role, and I think that's why he

(23:50):
kept getting cast for a while, but he kept getting
put in roles where he wasn't go to suit him.
So anyway, going to Matt Smith, it made me think
I'm Matt Smith, because when I saw him in this,
I thought, you know, it seems like a lot of
people love Matt Smith and they're really rooting for him,
but he's never.

Speaker 2 (24:04):
Hit for me.

Speaker 3 (24:06):
And because you didn't have watch doctor who.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
I was gonna say, I think similarly, I never saw
him in the role where he hit. I've only seen
him in all the roles he's gotten as a result
of that, So I've never got to have that experience, right, right, right,
And so going all the way back to what you said,
that's unfortunate because clearly he has a thing that he
excels at, but he's been placed in a lot of
things where he hasn't either been able or just hasn't

(24:30):
been cast correctly to excel.

Speaker 3 (24:32):
Yeah, I mean, that's that's really and that's really unfortunate
for both them guys, you know. Yeah, yeah, But but
what we were talking about earlier, right, Like, the structure
of this film is not about can we tell a
worthy story within the Terminator world that carries it forward,

(24:52):
that honors what came before. I don't doubt that all
of that thinking was in there somewhere. I don't believe
that that. You know, everybody gets an involved with the
best of intentions, right, but fundamentally the purpose of this
film was to repurpose certain aspects of the prior films
and set up a status quo that you could continue

(25:15):
on with.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
Right, so you can make well obviously, because yeah, they
purchased the rights, they intend to make many more movies exactly.

Speaker 3 (25:21):
So it's kind of like, oh, we got to have
the Arnold Terminator obviously, and he's got to be a
good guy, and we want to go back and make
the characters younger, but we need Sarah to be like
the Sarah from Terminator too. But you know, and and
so it's it's it's like the yeah, you know what
I mean, Yeah, oh, we got to have a two

(25:43):
one thousand because everybody knows the two one thousand, you know, Yeah,
and and and so it's a little bit like the
two thousand and nine Star Trek movie that you know
that that was very successful, where it uses a time,
you know, a nexus point in time to create a
reboot that remixes certain aspects but puts you gives you

(26:05):
something similar to what you had before. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
But I think I think and by the way, I
should say, I think this is really cool when old
Arnold is like, we've been waiting for you. That's pretty cool, man.

Speaker 2 (26:16):
Yeah, it's good subversion, you know.

Speaker 3 (26:19):
I think I think that the way that they face
mapped his younger features onto this this body double, it's
pretty impressive.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
Actually, I was going to bring that up because this
is ten years ago. Yeah, and I actually think it
might look better than Tarkan in Rogue one.

Speaker 3 (26:36):
Yeah, I think you're right.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
This looks you know, I mean, because we know Schwarzenegger's
face so well, our eyes are going to just catch things.
But it looks a little more lifelike to me than
the Tarkan thing, for was a little more rubbery to me.

Speaker 3 (26:50):
Yeah, But like right here, we got young Sarah, but
she's like the T two Sarah four in eighty four exactly. Ye.
And so you know, at some point it's all just
you know, to quote doctor who is just a bunch
of timey, whiny, whibley wobbly right right, and nothing nothing

(27:10):
makes sense and and nothing really makes us care. And
I don't understand the thinking behind let's just wipe out everything. Yeah,
that quote unquote happened in the previous two films. Mm
hmmm or excuse well, it's certainly in the previous two
meaning T three and T four, but I mean even
T one and T two.

Speaker 1 (27:31):
Yeah, yeah, remixing as you put it. Yeah, it feels
a little more satisfying.

Speaker 3 (27:37):
Now that said. Arnold is so damn good in this movie.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
I'm sorry, Oh yeah, I mean this is you know,
it comes up with Harrison Ford. Yeah, and he is
willing to talk about Star Wars and some of the
other movies, but whenever he talks about Indiana Jones, he
is just he loves that character. He's the one who
keeps pushing for sequels, right, and it's it feels like
this is that this swartz nigger, I mean, he's had

(28:01):
great success obviously, but this is the role, yeah, you know,
for him, his most iconic role, and a role that
he seems to really love playing. And so you can
tell he's he's invested.

Speaker 3 (28:13):
Every single time he's played the role. Even in the
movies I didn't like. I have always liked him, and
that's very much the case in this too.

Speaker 1 (28:19):
Yeah yeah, yeah, I mean this is kind of cool. Yeah,
eighty four and then we get a T one thousand, right,
you know.

Speaker 3 (28:31):
I I but but sorry, just to cut you. I
don't mean to cut up, like, why is he a cop? Right?

Speaker 1 (28:37):
I had the same thought, just so we would have
some sort of little thing in our brain that, yeah,
makes us think of Robert Patrick in the cop uniform.
He that's a harder one. I know, this guy he
does a pretty good job. Actually, no, he does a
really good job. Beyond the team on thousands, Yeah, yeah,

(28:58):
you know, he's got like the cool dead stare and
the you know, and I don't even remember who did
it in the next one, but man, Robert Patrick, like
they found the guy, yeah, you know, the guy who's
got like he can put on this folksy charm when
he needs to. But then he can go completely dead
eyed and be the most terrifying thing you've ever seen.
And he's so but he's not even big and bulky.

Speaker 3 (29:18):
He's very live. You know.

Speaker 1 (29:19):
It's like, yeah, he's perfect. And so it's you know,
you aren't recasting Schwarzenegger in all these movies. We get Schwarzenegger.
So it's you almost unfortunate for these other actors because
they're trying to do the thing that the other guy
already did so well, you know, and it's just a
little unfair to them because they just can't.

Speaker 3 (29:41):
Yeah, it's it's it's a it's a weird situation because
because with with this film and it was coming six
years after Salvation, you know, they had to decide what
I do, Like how they just replicated that shot? Yeah,
that's cool. Nikes apparently they didn't make those Nikes anymore.
Mm hmmm. So like they had to go to Nike

(30:01):
and be like, can you special make these shoes from
like thirty years ago? Yeah? I love that. I love it.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
They're like yeah, sure, like they just can.

Speaker 3 (30:09):
Yeah. Right, So they had to decide what to what
to keep and what to ignore from from the sequels. Yeah,
and so they decided we're just going to ignore Terminator
three and four. Yeah, and I think that's where all
this madness started. Mm where in every movie just ignores
the one before it. Yeah, like we can do that, Yeah,

(30:31):
we can keep starting over again and again. And that's
the weird thing, right because because I have to imagine
the thinking was in own Terminator, Salvation comes out, it
doesn't do particularly well, or it doesn't do as well
as they would have hoped, and so they're kind of like, Okay,
what was missing Arnold Schwarzenegger, you know. So they're like,

(30:53):
if we come back and we have Arnold back, then
that'll be the thing. But what you start realizing is
is I don't think there's an audience for this franchise anymore.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
Not as large a one as there was.

Speaker 3 (31:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (31:05):
Yeah, yeah, And just we alluded to it earlier. But
just to finish the thought with the Salvation, you know,
in this one, we were saying we like the Future
War because it just even the colors look like the
Future War in the previous in the first two, but
Salvation for some reason was this weird yellow, dusty look.
And I have no idea why that decision was made.

Speaker 3 (31:29):
Yeah, So I had totally forgotten that this cop character
is the younger version of JK. Simmons.

Speaker 2 (31:35):
Oh me too, Yeah, yeah, which is I like that JK.

Speaker 3 (31:39):
Simmons is fun in this movie. I have to say,
I agree.

Speaker 2 (31:42):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (31:42):
He brings a kind of a fun energy that was
missing a little bit, like a little humor.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, not given a ton.

Speaker 3 (31:48):
To do, but yeah, well it definitely feels like, you know,
they had certain trilogy ends in mind. Yeah, oh you
know what, Yeah right, he would have factored into that. Yep.
So Amelia Clark, who I like a lot and as
an actor, but also this as a person. I didn't

(32:09):
do that before. Probably one of my favorite interviews I've done.
She was just so sweet.

Speaker 2 (32:14):
Yeah yeah, uh not great in this movie.

Speaker 1 (32:18):
Yeah, I want better things for her, you know, I
I think she's she's she's doing it.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
She's doing what's asked of her.

Speaker 1 (32:25):
But like, there has to be it can't just be
on the page, like the actor has to embody like
they have to have it inside it. I mean, you know,
Linda Hamilton, just that grit y you know, like it's
when she's just doing the pull ups in that room,
You're like, oh, that's the person, right, you know, and
I don't. I'm watching Amelia Clark try to contort into

(32:45):
that person.

Speaker 3 (32:46):
I feel like, yeah, And and what I read is
that the studio wanted Bree Larsen.

Speaker 2 (32:54):
Interesting.

Speaker 3 (32:55):
I can see that. I can see that physically, I
can definitely, But actually Tatana Maslani was on the list.
I was like, I think I would have liked her.

Speaker 2 (33:06):
Yeah, this was a little closer.

Speaker 1 (33:07):
I mean again, like the thing that the actor themselves
just inherently brings, like a grittiness or a see I
I feel like Lena Hetty kind of cracked it in
show yep. Yeah, because she doesn't necessarily resemble her, but
she exudes the thing. She exudes the Sarah connorness. Yeah

(33:27):
that's right, another Game of Thrones actress. Yeah, exactly, pre Larson.

Speaker 2 (33:34):
That's so interesting.

Speaker 3 (33:36):
Yeah, well, because she would have been coming off of
her oscar Win at that point.

Speaker 2 (33:40):
Right, Oh yeah, like room, Yeah it was around then.

Speaker 3 (33:43):
Yeah, I think I think that would make sense why
Alan Taylor wanted Emilia Clark because he had already worked
with her and that this experience worked out well for
the both of them.

Speaker 2 (33:52):
So I'm sure she's very grateful that.

Speaker 3 (33:53):
He he He's stumped for her. That's funny. But this
whole so so Movie one is a love story, as
we talked about, Movie two is a father son story,
and so I think that it's like, oh, well, this

(34:14):
one we're gonna do like, oh, you know, it's the
Terminator is Sarah's father, and he's you know, it's he's
like the wacky father in law for Kyle.

Speaker 1 (34:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And even when Jason Clark shows up
again and it's like hey Dad, you know, like I
just like, what a weird family that?

Speaker 3 (34:40):
Well I was gonna say this later, but since we
got there, that part bugged the piss out of me.
Wait why when he says well dad, Because I'm like,
you know, you've known him for decades, You've never once
called him dad. Why would you suddenly call why? Why
would that's not your relationship with him? Right right, right,
right right? It makes no sense other other than the

(35:02):
plot needed to get us to that point so Kyle
would would learn the truth, right right? I hate that stuff.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
Yeah, yeah, so yeah, this this whole sort of flashbacky
stuff with the Genesis going online as like like so
well yeah, oh yeah, yeah right, you know it's interesting.
So yeah, we get the older Schwarzenegger and the conceit is, well,

(35:28):
he's got living tissue. Yeah, right, so he's aging. Yeah,
and apparently that idea came from a conversation with James Cameron.

Speaker 3 (35:36):
Which makes sense. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (35:38):
I was like, this is very smart. It feels very
Cameron to even just think of that, Like, well, obviously you're.

Speaker 3 (35:42):
So here's what I'll say about Jim Cameron. I kind
of love that he basically cut bait on these Terminator
movies a while ago, in terms of the ones that
don't involve him. Huh. But he's like, you know what,
I'm always going to be there from my boy Arnold. Yeah. Yeah,
Like no matter what, here's how you include Arnold. They're like, yeah, okay,

(36:04):
you know he's like, this movie's great, this is this
is what I consider Terminator three. Yes, yeah, and he's like, yeah,
I just said. I just said that because because Arnold
was in it and I wanted to.

Speaker 1 (36:14):
I know, it's funny. I'm I'm of two minds. One,
I'm like, man, screw you, because I showed up thinking
you you had my back. But on the other hand,
he had Swartzenegger's back. They're buds and there's something there
for his boy. There's something charming about that, especially for
someone who's like I don't know, cold as him, you know,

(36:34):
or like I would have said mercurial, yeah yeah yeah,
or just he feels no need to be nice, he
feels no remorse, no pity, and he absolutely will not stop.
You know that hilarious If that was like a quote
that originally came from his wife on the you know
shoot her name's uh, you know, from the first movie.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
The producer Gilan Hurt.

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, you know, that was like a quote from a
fight that they had, so he included it, Like.

Speaker 3 (37:06):
I think that the setup here, this idea that well,
Sarah and Kyle need to screw one day. Yes, it
just feels very forced, puts a lot of pressure. Yeah,
you know, and and I mean that's see the thing,
Like I say this all the time, I think the
love story aspect of the first film is just it.

(37:26):
It's it's one of my favorite elements of it. You know,
this idea that you know, Kyle, Kyle is fighting his
feelings for her m because it's his job to protect her.
And then it just kind of breaks through and he says,
I came across time for you I love you, and
it's this very heartfelt, beautiful moment, right, That's what I

(37:49):
love about that movie. And again I think Michael Bean
just like he's so vulnerable and he projects this, you know,
he's so outmatched, but he's there to lay down his
life for her.

Speaker 1 (37:59):
I love that, you know, use he's got grit, but
there's also a sweetness to him exactly which I'm kind
of missing from this portrayal.

Speaker 3 (38:05):
Yeah, again, this is what it comes down to. I'm like,
you know, this is not a straight up ground floor reboot.
You are beholden too those prior versions, and I have
a tough time seeing either of these folks as the
characters they're supposed to be inhabiting same you know.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Well, and also, you know, you could have done a
version where it's like, okay, now we're aware that we're
I mean, the Terminator himself is like, well, when are
you going to breed?

Speaker 3 (38:32):
You know you go to mate?

Speaker 1 (38:33):
Yeah, And so now there's like a pressure put on
them and you can imagine then there'd just be some
weird resistance feelings about it, but it would be a
nice love story if it's like, yeah, but despite all that,
they're just destined to fall like they do, fall in
love under any circumstance. That would be kind of a
sweet story.

Speaker 3 (38:52):
Right see. I think the other problem is that this Sarah,
she is a fundamentally different person. Yes, right, so you
know the movie establishes that at some point. By the way,
what kind of goofy ass backstory you don't even get
into it. Oh, like a terminator came and killed her
parents when she was a little kid, and like that

(39:13):
seems important to That's a whole other story, right.

Speaker 2 (39:16):
I have I have feelings on that, but I don't
want to interrupt your thought.

Speaker 3 (39:19):
But okay, so now, so she has been raised basically
from the time she was ten by a terminator. Well,
this is this is not the same character we have
seen before, full stop, right, So who is she? Anything
about her? You know? Right?

Speaker 1 (39:32):
Well, and then it gets to the other thing, which
you just cannot waste time thinking about. But it's like, well,
if if you were to like conceive, you know, on
March twenty first, you know, some year, that's one kid.
If you were to conceive like August twenty eighth later, yeah,
that's another kid, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (39:50):
So it's just like just because they have a baby,
doesn't mean it's going to be John Connor.

Speaker 3 (39:54):
That's yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (39:56):
You know that was going to be the plot of.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
Back to the Future too, where Marty, the conception of
Marty was threatened and Marty had to make sure that
they like stay together and conceive. I'm like, yeah, but
if if it's it's just it's it's too much, it's
too much, you know, because then it's like, would it
even be Marty.

Speaker 3 (40:12):
That's a great point.

Speaker 1 (40:13):
Wow, okay, okay, So what you were talking about with
her backstory, it was this scene that was driving me crazy.
So obviously Kyle is confused. He was sent back with
a set you know, set understanding of things and what
he needs to do. So he keeps asking Sarah like, wait, no,
this isn't what I understand what's going on, and she's
like just giving him all like blowing them off. Yeah,

(40:36):
like like you don't even need to know. It doesn't matter,
but it's it's it's bad screenwriting stuff because if she
just says it, it would be too straightforward in exposition
y and whatever, So you know, you have to get
it in dribs and drabs and pull it out of
her like lost was like all about that, you know,
so just give me an answer. I will another time,
you know, And they just keep like withholding the answer.

(40:56):
But it was driving me crazy, this execution of her
withholding the answer from him. It's like, this is a
big deal, and he came across time to try.

Speaker 2 (41:03):
To look out for you.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
The least you could do is explained why everything's topsy
turvy for him. But then one moment, in this moment
right here, when he's talking to her, he has a
piece of information she wants. She's like, what tell me everything?
And I was like, oh, ho ho.

Speaker 3 (41:18):
The shoes on the other foot now, isn't it. Yeah?

Speaker 2 (41:21):
I just thought that was so funny.

Speaker 3 (41:22):
I mean, this is this is the same year that
just a few months later you had Han Solo being
like where'd you get that lightsaber?

Speaker 4 (41:30):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (41:31):
Moz is like I'll tell you later.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
Yeah, yeah, that story for another time exactly. Yes, Yes,
that was the very like JJ abramsz right mystery.

Speaker 3 (41:40):
But I want the character. I want a scene in
the movie where somebody says that and the character is like, no,
now right now, tell me. Now, We're not going anywhere,
you tell me, And then we get like a fifteen
minute just not even a flashback scene, just a character
talking to the other character, right for fifteen minutes exactly. Yeah,
just a single take shot like the end of Pearl,

(42:02):
you know with Mia Goth. Yeah. Yeah, So I was
watching this, I was I was having this moment where
I'm like, oh, this is see this is the Terminator
from that first movie. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:17):
I like how even in the animation they give it
a little bit of like staccato movements.

Speaker 3 (42:23):
This animation looks pretty good. I gotta say, yeah, they
made the end of Skeleton look pretty badass.

Speaker 1 (42:28):
I have to say yeah, because yeah, in the in
the nineteen eighty four version, it is stop motion, so
it looks a little you know, sticky.

Speaker 3 (42:34):
You know, you know the thought I have watching this though, right,
because as I'm talking, I'm like, yeah, this is the
Terminator that kills Kyle, right, and I don't ever get
the sense that he's a like that Kyle is in danger,
you know, oh in this film. Yeah, in this scene.

Speaker 2 (42:51):
Yeah, I mean I think it has a lot to
do with the action and execution.

Speaker 3 (42:55):
Yeah, I mean, cause like to me that you know
that that scene at the end of the Terminator of
the first film when they're in the factory and you know,
it's just they're just trying to outrun the machine. You
get a sense, man, this guy's gonna he's gonna get
them and they're gonna die, you.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
Know, absolutely, And then I mean the for me especially,
I mean that as well, but especially when Sarah's going
through that compactor. Yeah, it's just a puppet hand, but
it's just kind of like lurching forward and like touching
the bottom of her sneakers and you're like, ah, you know,
like it's real palpable.

Speaker 3 (43:30):
See I wonder, like I saw that movie as a
little kid, So I'm like, is it just because I
saw it at that right age? And I'm like, but
you saw you were older.

Speaker 1 (43:37):
Yeah, no, i'd be I'd be willing to bet. I
bet that is the case in some instances with some films.

Speaker 2 (43:43):
But I really do feel like, no.

Speaker 1 (43:44):
That's just great execution that movie. That stuff holds up
because it's it's it's where you put the camera, it's
the editing, it's the you know what, can I say
James Camera is a master filmmaker.

Speaker 3 (43:55):
Yeah, damn him.

Speaker 2 (43:57):
He'll tell you that.

Speaker 3 (43:58):
I'll tell you that himself. Every dance. Get He'll be like,
I don't even like doing this. I just do this
so I can pay for my submersibles. Exactly, I'm just
making Avatar five so I can go to go to
the Marianna's trench. Okay, exactly, probably, but ask him what
he thinks of stocked and rush. Yeah, I'll let you

(44:20):
know that too.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
Yeah, and I've heard it.

Speaker 3 (44:22):
I've heard this. You know what.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
This is always a delicious premise to me, the like
which one's which the twin, you know, because it's like
I don't know, and there is something like, well, don't
shoot the real person, Like maybe it's kind of corny
at this point or something. But even here, I was like,
I don't know which one?

Speaker 3 (44:43):
Can I tell? What would you do?

Speaker 1 (44:45):
And then also if I was the real one, I'd
be like, oh my gosh, she might shoot me.

Speaker 3 (44:49):
Yep.

Speaker 1 (44:53):
I couldn't remember what happened to the t one thousand
and this one, like I didn't remember if it was
there for the rest of them movie or not.

Speaker 2 (45:00):
Oh okay, basically get rid of it here.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
Yeah, it is weird. I mean, he's he's not a
particularly substantial element of the plot. Yeah, but no.

Speaker 1 (45:14):
Going back to the action and whether or not you
feel like the characters are in danger. I mean, we'll
get to it a little bit later, but the see
this stuff looks a little dodgy. Yeah, just in terms
of physics. I think if the physics.

Speaker 3 (45:26):
That's right, that's what it comes down.

Speaker 1 (45:28):
It's moving like a cartoon character while surrounded by human
beings that are not moving like cartoons.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
Right, right.

Speaker 1 (45:34):
But the big action sequence towards the end with the
helicopters and you know, flying through between the buildings, and
I'm trying to get better about not criticizing vision effects
because you don't you don't know what budget they had,
you don't know what time constraints they had. So I'm
trying to just accept the action in front of me, like, Okay,

(45:54):
there's a helicopter between two buildings, right.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
With that set.

Speaker 1 (46:02):
It's rough when your movie is coming almost two decades
after a film where the action was better, right, you know.
I think one of the even though it's not one
of the most visually spectacular shots, but I think one
of the most incredible and palpable shots in Terminator Too
is when they're in the freeway and the helicopter smashes

(46:22):
into the back of the truck like it goes underneath
an overpass, which is nail biting still to this day,
because you're like, oh my gosh, that guy could die.
And then the helicopter, an actual helicopter, is smushed into
the back.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
Of a truck and explodes and you're like, wow.

Speaker 1 (46:40):
Like that that looks really dangerous and amazing.

Speaker 2 (46:42):
And that's what it would look like if.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
A helicopter smashed into the back of a moving truck.
But then when you have all this sort of freewheeling,
sort of computery feeling helicopter going between buildings that don't
even feel I don't sense the danger. I don't see
the wind whipping against the trees at street level. It's like, then,
I'm not feeling anything. I'm not feeling in any sense
of danger. I'm just going through the motions until we

(47:05):
get back to the story, really, right.

Speaker 2 (47:07):
You know, And that's that's kind of a bummer.

Speaker 3 (47:09):
But I did sense that while I was watching this, Yeah,
And and I think that with Terminator too. Obviously, for
as groundbreaking as it was in terms of visual effects
at the time, it was still limited by what was achievable.

Speaker 2 (47:25):
Right, totally.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
It's probably why he only the two one thousand can
only turn into knives and stabbing weapons. The effects weren't
there for you.

Speaker 3 (47:32):
And it's better for that, right because because your limitations
are what make it more more interesting from a story perspective,
but also just from a visual perspective, because you're not
your you're you know, your reach doesn't exceed your grasp,
you know. And I think that's sort of that's been
that that's the post Terminator to world where visual effects

(47:53):
have gotten more and more elaborate and there's more and
more stuff you can do, but the stakes feel a
little bit out of proportion, you know.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
M I also thought it's kind of interesting, you know,
with Terminator two in nineteen ninety one, it makes sense
to have the two one thousand b sort of a
silvery blob and just make sharp objects, because that's what
they were able to achieve, right, And it works and
it works within it makes sense with the story, and
I never questioned it, but obviously that those decisions probably

(48:26):
had a lot to do with the technology at the time.
Then later when we see that in this movie, gosh,
John Connor is a collection of nanites.

Speaker 3 (48:34):
Yeah, hey, your favorite, your favorite.

Speaker 1 (48:36):
Trope, I know, but this is that moment where some
software developer figured out nanites as a visual effect, you know,
so you know what I mean. I just thought it
was funny that the villains in each of these films
and what they do in the way that they manifest
feels indicative of where visual effects are. I don't know

(48:56):
what they're most excited about in their eras or something, right, Yeah,
n Night's were such a thing here.

Speaker 3 (49:04):
See it occurs to me as we're watching this that
we're about forty five minutes in m and all everything
up to this point is just table setting to get
to update the characters to the to the then present. Sure, right,
so I mean it's a lot of legwork. Yeah. And

(49:25):
so this goes to the thought that I had at
the time where I'm like, what what new audience are
you appealing to with this? Hm? Hm And what longtime
fans are you appealing to with this? Yeah? Right, because
because because my thought is like, longtime fans are not
going to be thrilled with any of this.

Speaker 2 (49:46):
Yeah, you're changing the thing I love exactly.

Speaker 3 (49:49):
Yeah, and new viewers are gonna be like, this is
just a bunch of impenetrable huggermugger. So who's who's your audience.

Speaker 1 (49:56):
That's a great point, right, it's a great point. By
the way, So Sarah wants to travel to nineteen ninety seven.
Maybe that time machine she only ge is one shot
and that's how she's going to take it down. Why
would you go when there's like one minute left?

Speaker 3 (50:10):
Yeah, go to like nineteen ninety five. Yeah, anyway, No,
But it's it's so weird because because the filmmakers said
that they were incorporating seven different timelines, and I saw
that quote multiple times, and I'm like, well, I got

(50:33):
three yeah, right, we got we got twenty twenty nine
and the eighty four and twenty seventeen. But I'm like,
where's the other ones? I don't even yeah, right, And
so apparently this is this is the filmmakers being like,
we're taking kind of a multiverse approach. Hey, na Night's

(50:53):
and multiverse.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
Yeah, yeah, which was the style at the time time.

Speaker 3 (50:56):
It's a flat circle, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:57):
They had an onion tied to their belt as they
were saying that.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
Yeah. And and so there's all there's a multiple timelines
that where where some where Skynet has won some where
sky it has lost and I'm like, this is I'm like, guys,
the reason the reason the first two films worked is
that the time travel element was incidental, not not not

(51:24):
the the totality, ye right, I think And and by
the way, I have I have some questions about how
how it even works to travel forward in time because
I'm kind of like, you know, from where they are
in the past, there is no future, so right, Like,

(51:47):
i mean, maybe I'm overthinking it, but I'm like, I'm
going into the past makes sense in terms of the
world of these movies because that's already a past that
that exists, right, But once you're in the past, the
future is not set. One might say, right, right, right, anyway,
what what makes well? Certainly when made the first movie work? Right,
Kyle says that he says to the cops, He's like,

(52:09):
no one else comes back, it's just him and me. Right.
The time travel is is obviously it's an important and
you you have a causal loop that's important, but it's
not just oh, you know, we're gonna go from here
to here and there to I'm like, you know, this
doesn't make sense. Yeah, you know this this was honestly,
this was this is This has bugged me. It bugged

(52:32):
me about Dark Fade. It even bugged me about the
television show to some extent where I'm like, I to me,
the idea that Skynet has has time a time machine, Well,
the TV show did a better job of this, to
be honest. Uh, And all it does is focus on, oh,
we gotta get John Connor.

Speaker 2 (52:49):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 3 (52:50):
It's like, no, no, if you have a time machine,
then you can butterfly affect this ship, like going all
the way back. You know.

Speaker 1 (52:56):
It's so funny because yeah, they in this version they
went back and killed Sarah's parents, and I was thinking,
why don't you just take her family tree and just
go back to the beginning or kill Adam and Eve's.

Speaker 3 (53:08):
Right, you know, like yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (53:11):
But at the same time, I mean, you gotta tell
a story. I guess was it you or Sean who
used to say, if you didn't think about the problem
in the film till the parking lot.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
That's the problem. Yeah, that's a I think about that sometimes.

Speaker 3 (53:28):
I think the television show did a better job of
sort of finding some rationale for there to be a
lot of time travel. It's been a little while since
I've seen it, but that's that's my recollection, right, you know,
and the idea that Skynett is seeding its own creation
in the past, that stuff. I like.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
Yeah, I like the show.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
I kind of resisted it for a while and you
were always recommending it, and you know, it definitely has
its TV occasionally, but really it has a lot of
great ideas and some pretty good characterizations, some new good characters.
The Terminator I forgot her name, Summer, is that right,
or is that the actress's name.

Speaker 3 (54:13):
No, that's the it's Cameron Cameron of course. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:17):
Yeah, she was a great character, very interesting. So yeah,
I would I would recommend that.

Speaker 3 (54:22):
And by the Day, oh yeah, Sarah John and Sarah
are both really good in that show. Yeah yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
And I was looking stuff up about the Terminator series
and I had completely forgotten about the anime on Netflix
called Yes Terminator Zero, which is really good and I
would highly recommend to any Terminator fan. And so I
was like, wait, when did that come out? Came out
August twenty twenty four, It's not even a year old

(54:49):
at this point, and it feels like five years old
to me.

Speaker 3 (54:52):
Yeah. Really, isn't that crazy? Jeez?

Speaker 1 (54:56):
But anyway, I definitely recommend that. A lot of great ideas,
but it a story that feels unique enough unto itself,
but still feels, you know, like it belongs in the
Terminator universe.

Speaker 2 (55:08):
Very good series.

Speaker 3 (55:12):
Let's get naked, I know, naked?

Speaker 2 (55:16):
Yeah right.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
I did want to call out that scene though earlier
when they were in the lockers, Yeah, that was a
nice I was complaining that there where he's telling her
about John, Yes, and just that was what I wanted
more of a little bit more of the connections.

Speaker 3 (55:39):
I wonder if Amelia Clark, like, once she gets on
set and they're like, okay, take clothes off, She's like, oh,
we're doing this again. Yeah right, you have to be
on Game of Thrones. She was nude a lot on
Game of Thrones, is my sense.

Speaker 1 (55:51):
I think in the first season, and then I think
she was able to work it out that she didn't
have to be anymore.

Speaker 3 (55:58):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (55:58):
I think that was sort of a thing like HBO
is definitely like look what we can do on all
their shows, and then as the shows became bigger hits,
a lot of the actors were like, yeah, we're done
with that now now that more Yeah, now that we
can have some sort of say like we're we're saying no.

Speaker 2 (56:15):
Yeah, I kind of remember that being a story.

Speaker 3 (56:17):
So this, you know, jumping the characters into the future.
It reminds me of what they did in the TV
show Yes, right where they jump ahead to the to
the then present.

Speaker 2 (56:29):
They can get on a freeway too, don't they.

Speaker 3 (56:31):
Yes, they do. That's right.

Speaker 2 (56:35):
Twenty seventeen, which would have been the future when this
came out.

Speaker 3 (56:37):
In fact, then it was the future. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:43):
I do kind of like this, like them just appearing
in the middle of a freeway and just the science
fiction einess of it. Yeah, in a real world, you
know location, Yeah, it's always kind of fun, be pretty
wild to encounter.

Speaker 2 (57:00):
Oh man, he gets hit hard that.

Speaker 3 (57:02):
I'm I saw that, he answered. I was like, they
should he should be dead, yeah, or crippled.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
When he lands in that alley naked, like you see
a real actor hit the pavement.

Speaker 3 (57:13):
And kind of scooch yep, I was like wow, yeah, yeah,
well that's that's how they did it in the first
movie too.

Speaker 1 (57:19):
Yeah, but it's just it looked really painful, like in like,
lookly someone really did it? See I'd forgotten about all
this too, maybe because I was confusing the show, but
them getting caught right away and.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
Is this with the Bad Boys music?

Speaker 3 (57:37):
No, that's later, Yeah that's a choice. What what the hell? Yeah,
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
That feels like someone who's partially funding the movie being like.

Speaker 2 (57:47):
Hey, I got an idea. Uh, you know, he's paying
for like twelve percent of this movie.

Speaker 3 (57:57):
He's an associate producer.

Speaker 2 (57:59):
Just exactly.

Speaker 3 (58:04):
Yeah, it is remarkable to think about how each new
attempt at breathing life into this franchise has just led
to greater diminished returns. Yeah, you know, because Terminator three
did okay, yeah, domestically, I mean, like you said, this
one actually did. When you factor in China and everything,

(58:26):
it made more, but it had like no cultural footprint.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
Yeah, which is a hard thing. Maybe I'm just you know,
it's the thing that everyone understands, but I'm like the
last to catch up to it because I love it
so much. I'm like, oh, I guess culture at large
just isn't interested in these stories, you know, or they're like, yeah, yeah,
Terminator two, it's great, it's cool, Like my dad showed
me that movie. Fun, you know, but it's not like

(58:54):
the enduring sort of gonna like Star Trek or something
where they're just gonna keep making seek quills.

Speaker 3 (59:01):
Well you know, I mean it's like I was thinking
about this watching this yesterday, right, like sci fi franchises
where there is room to keep telling stories. M m m.
I feel like you've got less room within Terminator. Yes, right,

(59:23):
Like like you say, Predator, Well, that's easy. Yeah, we
just come up with a new milieu and we drop
a predator in and that's that's the story. Yep. You know,
a Planet of the Apes, right, Well, it's it's a
whole plan. There's all kinds of stories you can tell
within that contract. I think to me, the problem with
with Terminator is that the further you go, the less

(59:45):
special you make. The diad of those first two movies, yes, yes,
you know, and and you know I've said before like
that there there really wasn't room in the premise for
for the sequel for T two. Yeah, but Cameron cracked it, yep,
and he like found it. He found a way to
squeeze it in. And then now we've got we've got

(01:00:06):
that ending. And I said before, see, okay, so by
the way, that's that's Alan Taylor's daughter playing.

Speaker 2 (01:00:13):
Yeah, yeah, I was gonna bring that up.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
But that scene that seems important to me.

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
I wouldn't have minded seeing more of that moment, right
her parents, Yeah, all of.

Speaker 3 (01:00:26):
That, right, because because to me, again, I'm just like,
this is a fundamentally different character and and you can't
just put that in there as a thing that is
meant left unexplored and will presumably come into play in
some sequel down there, down down there, down the line, right,
like you you can't assume that you have that luxury.

(01:00:50):
Mm hm, why would you assume that that? Oh well
we'll we'll figure out. Well, we'll explain that in the
next one. Yeah, yeah, right, yeah, I mean this is
this is the third Terminator movie in a row that
was meant to start a trilogy. Yeah right, yeah right. JK.

Speaker 1 (01:01:12):
Simmons, I'm gonna be honest, I completely forgot he was
in this.

Speaker 3 (01:01:16):
So he's a he's a special treat that means yeah, yeah,
I mean he's not my rhythm, yeah, not my tempo tempo.
But I you know, it's funny because he's speaking of tempos.
This is a rhythm We're not used to seeing him
do the flustered. Yeah. Right.

Speaker 1 (01:01:33):
Usually he's kind of, you know, always in control. He's
he's the imposing figure.

Speaker 3 (01:01:39):
That's right. Yeah, yeah, he yeah, apparently a lot of
this stuff he was just improving. And it's very funny
to me.

Speaker 2 (01:01:46):
Oh really, yeah, yeah, But I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
I like that he saw something he can't explain thirty
years ago and he's driven by it. The people around
him don't take him seriously. We get a little hint
there that he might be a bit of an alcoholic
because of it, but then it pays off for him.

Speaker 2 (01:02:02):
I like characters like that.

Speaker 3 (01:02:04):
It's a little bit like you know what the television
show did with Doctor Silberman.

Speaker 1 (01:02:08):
Yes, you know, right, right right, goes and lives up
in a cabin away from everything. Yeah, but then gets
to encounter the terminators again and confirmed, you know, it's
confirmation for him.

Speaker 3 (01:02:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:02:24):
So when they describe Genesis here, I mean, that's just
our world, right It basically it's like, oh yeah, like
connects all our devices, so they are in sync with
one another. And I was thinking the other day it
was driving me nuts. I was trying to talk to
my parents in the car and my phone the Bluetooth
was connected with the car, and their call kept hopping
between my AirPods and the car, and I was like,

(01:02:46):
damn this future, you know, but that's basically what they're
describing here with Genesis, like this miracle.

Speaker 3 (01:02:52):
See.

Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
I had a hard time putting myself back into twenty
fifteen and thinking about where we were at and how
futuristic Genesis may seem.

Speaker 3 (01:03:02):
I think here's the problem. Right, when I hear the
word Genesis, I think of another Genesis, which is the
Genesis device from Star Trek. I think you're gonna be like, oh,
Phil Collins, certainly that that's that's always a top of mind. Yeah,
But but when it comes to the Genesis device, if
you remember in Star Trek two, we get the scene

(01:03:24):
that were remember where Kirk Spock and mcquoi are watching
the simulation. They see what it does and they're like, well,
what will happen if this is used where life already?
It will destroy life? And so we have a clear sense, okay,
this is what is at stake, whereas Genesis we're just like, oh,
it's an os that everybody's got m But what is it, right?

(01:03:47):
You know what I mean? Yeah, it's a little vague,
it's it's a it's too vague and and it granted,
we probably all are carrying Skynet around in our pockets
right now.

Speaker 2 (01:03:59):
I mean, yeah, it's it's the technology is there now.

Speaker 3 (01:04:02):
The problem really is that we're at a point now
where the technology like it's part of the the you
know that you gotta the shit, you gotta scroll down
and check. It's like that you agree that this technology
will own, you know, control of your life. And and
we're like, yeah, it's fine, let me let me just
edit my pictures or whatever, you know, yeah, right right right,

(01:04:22):
like we're already on board. So this is the threat
doesn't even carry anymore because we're just we're so far
up sky Net's asshole already we are.

Speaker 1 (01:04:32):
And I mean, I know this is an old conversation,
but it happened to me the other day.

Speaker 2 (01:04:35):
My brother was here and.

Speaker 1 (01:04:36):
I mentioned something about, like, you know, shovels, So I
need a shovel or something, you know. I mean, I
didn't google it, I didn't go on Amazon, I didn't
search it. I just said something about like a shovel
or something.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
And then I was.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
Getting a drink in the kitchen and my brother said, oh,
I can just gotta add for shovels, so like it's
listening we and we know it, and we're just here.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
We are just you know, right living our lives and
not doing anything about it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
So I mean that when you think about it, I mean,
that was an innovation that kind of came in with
Terminator three, the idea that sky In it has no
system core, that it's software in cyberspace already.

Speaker 2 (01:05:18):
Yeah, it makes sense in our world that it absolutely does.
The only problem is we're not afraid of it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:23):
We're not afraid like we should be, you.

Speaker 1 (01:05:28):
Know, because then the other day, like I was just saying,
you know, shovel out, I need some lie. I also
need lie, you know, And I didn't google it.

Speaker 3 (01:05:35):
I'm just kidding.

Speaker 1 (01:05:36):
I was trying to make it sound like I was
trying to ferry a body, and my phone was like, here,
here's where you can get some lie.

Speaker 2 (01:05:48):
I won't tell anyone, said Siri.

Speaker 3 (01:05:54):
Well, I I read an article literally just this morning
about AI psychosis, okay, which is a result of people
just forming absurd levels of attachment with with you know,
AI chatbots, okay, And that's just where we are now. Yeah. Yeah,

(01:06:16):
so yeah, I mean obviously Cameron was was was head
of the curve and in some regard, yeah, you know, yeah,
the way that they the last one did this too,
where Skinna's personified, right, wasn't it Helena Bottom cards? Yeah,
so that's what death tastes like. Remember that. Yes, that
was a bone mow.

Speaker 2 (01:06:38):
It's so odd.

Speaker 3 (01:06:42):
So actually we should talk about the fact that, uh,
the trailers for this movie spoiled John Connor's heel turn, yes, which, now,
let me just say, I don't like what this movie
did with John Connor. Mm hmm. I think it was
a bad idea executed badly. Yeah, agreed in my opinion. However,

(01:07:08):
why on earth would you not keep that in your
back pocket?

Speaker 1 (01:07:12):
You know, it is an odd choice because you can
imagine they thought it was a selling point, you know, twist.
But it's like, what, No, the guy that I like,
the guy that I've been wanting to see saved, yeah,
you know, and the hero, the hero you think I'm
gonna be excited to see the hero is now a villain.

Speaker 3 (01:07:29):
I don't want that. So weird.

Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
Yeah, I mean that was.

Speaker 3 (01:07:34):
Not my John Connor exactly exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:07:39):
Well, by the way I heard someone I wish I
could remember where this was on another podcast, but they
had this interesting observation. It made me think in this
scene where we see the one of the police officers
is played by Michael Gladys who was on Madmen Oka,
and they were saying, it's interesting watching slightly older movies
because you can see what TV shows were in the
zeitgeist at the moment because people think, yes, they're like

(01:08:02):
cast is like sort of minor characters in all the
big movies. So watching this, you're like, oh, this was
been like Mad Mint was Madman was really hidden.

Speaker 3 (01:08:10):
You know, that's really funny. Yeah. See, my thought is
is insofar as as having John possessed by Skynett, why
don't you why don't you make him an unworthy or
excuse me an unwilling uh you know vehicle. Yeah, he's

(01:08:33):
fighting it. Yeah, right, Like that seems like a no
brainer to me, Like like all of this up to
like like he does betray them or whatever, but it's
one of these things where he's kind he's fighting it,
and you know he's you know, you you know, you

(01:08:53):
visualize it in a way where where Skynett is forcing
him to do something he doesn't want to do.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
It, you know what I mean, humanity would push through.
Yeah it guess what we'd be rooting for.

Speaker 3 (01:09:03):
Yeah right, you now, Now, what Jason Clark has said
is that had they proceeded with the sequel, which we
should say this was planned as a trilogy, yeah, and
paramount in an act of real you know, hubristic glee,
they scheduled the part two for twenty seventeen and part

(01:09:24):
three for twenty eighteen. Wow. Yeah, I'm like, man, you
guys were ready to go. Yeah, none of that bore out.
But Jason Clark said that part two would have begun
with Connor sort of reconstituting, you know, all the little
nanites and stuff and having to grapple with who he
is or what he is. Okay, maybe maybe, you know,

(01:09:49):
maybe maybe he's like Agent Smith in the Matrix sequels,
where he's detached from the Matrix, but he exists and
there's something existential there that's possibly you know. Yeah, but again,
why would you assume that a sequel is a given?

Speaker 2 (01:10:05):
Exactly exactly.

Speaker 1 (01:10:06):
By the way, this is a cool stunt that kind
of reminds me of the violence from the original movies.

Speaker 3 (01:10:11):
Share it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:11):
Yeah, you know, you're just like oh damn.

Speaker 1 (01:10:14):
That would hurt, like that kind of stuff, like when
he in two when he rips the security guy out
of the car and throws him into that concrete pillar.

Speaker 2 (01:10:23):
You're just like just just ow like that.

Speaker 3 (01:10:27):
But to me, I always think of that woman who
hits him, yes, and then his glasses and then he
just shoves her face first, Yeah yeah, down the hall
and she just kind of slides because you're like, it's
not like killing anyone.

Speaker 2 (01:10:38):
But damn, dude, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:10:43):
Something about that jumped out at me, like now that
feels like the terminator violence to me.

Speaker 3 (01:10:47):
See, and there there's see this here where he's like, oh,
come on dad, It's like you've never called him that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:53):
Yeah yeah, oops, you know right, yeah yeah, I remember
being so angry.

Speaker 2 (01:11:03):
That's just not what I want, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:11:06):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:11:07):
I told you mission impossible. You bring that up all
the time.

Speaker 3 (01:11:10):
They pulled a Phelps. I was about to say, yes, yeah,
now I get it. I see Zachi. I see yeah again,
it's like if if you if you give him, You're like,
we don't know what to do with the character because
we want to do Sarah's story, you know, fine, whatever, Yeah,
the fact is we spent both four previous films invested

(01:11:34):
in John Connor. Mm hmm, right, yeah, so we don't
we don't want to see see this, but you you
could do something where you have him go through the
motions that the story requires, but you have you give
him agency and maybe you give him some kind of
redemptive moment. Yeah, yeah, sure, right, Like you know the

(01:11:56):
end of this film is essentially Pops sacrificing him. Yeah,
and you you have John Connor tell him, look, you
have to kill me, you know whatever, you know?

Speaker 1 (01:12:07):
And I think, yes, I agree. My final answer is yes.
But also I think for me personally, I know, these
movies are filled with fantastical ideas and robots and time
travel and stuff. But frankly, and I know I'm not
the biggest Nanite fan, but like the idea that his
body has literally like a human body has literally been

(01:12:28):
on a cellular level taken over by these little robot dust.

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
Yeah, I just can't. It's too much.

Speaker 3 (01:12:35):
It's too much. I agree with you.

Speaker 2 (01:12:36):
Like, I'm like, so he does he poop?

Speaker 3 (01:12:39):
Like? Does he eat? Like? Is he like? What is he?
You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 (01:12:43):
Like it doesn't make any This is I don't have
to wait for the parking lot to get tripped up
by this, right, you know, And it's it just loses me,
This loses me.

Speaker 3 (01:12:54):
No, I agree, And and I think again, and this
goes to what I was saying before, You're you're you're audience,
you're baked in audience. Do you think they're going to
be thrilled with this? Yeah? Yeah right and yeah yeah
yeah yeah. The newbies aren't gonna carry one way or
the other. So I mean again, it goes to the
whole Jim Phelps thing that I've mentioned before.

Speaker 1 (01:13:12):
Yeah, and to your point, I think it's hubrius to
think that we'd be even patient enough to wait for
another movie to even hint that he could possibly be
redeemed at least, yeah, show a little bit of a
struggle or something. But then again, that goes against what
this plot is. I mean, he's been installed here to
make sure that Genesis goes online and I don't know,

(01:13:33):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:13:34):
See I I again, I think there's a way to
do that, and it wouldn't have taken much effort to
make him an unwilling drone.

Speaker 2 (01:13:43):
Well, it makes me think of when the T one
thousand glitches in T two. It's very subtle. They don't
talk about it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:48):
It just kind of happens, and we understand, Oh, he's
fighting something, or he's breaking down a little bit, something's happening.

Speaker 3 (01:13:54):
We get it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:55):
So yeah, if we saw a little bit of like
resistance or struggle or pushback from John doesn't even have
to be big, maybe that would have been nice to see.

Speaker 3 (01:14:06):
Yeah. I again, I think between between this movie and
the next one, you what you come away with is
the sense of like, uh, we don't know what to
do it John as a character. Yeah, And again I'm
I'm I'm equally baffled by how both versions, both films
treated the character because I'm like, there's, guys, there's a

(01:14:29):
way to do this. It's right.

Speaker 1 (01:14:31):
Well, and remember Salvation, one of the takes they were
going to do was John dies and then they take
his skin and put it on a terminator and then
that terminator with John's face kills everybody.

Speaker 3 (01:14:42):
Good point. So so really the hell are you thinking? Yeah, yeah,
so three movies or they don't know what to do
with John yoh yeah. Uh And it's odd, right because
because I I'm sure the argument would be, well, he's
you know, the he's JC. You know, he's the Savior,
he's the Messiah, and that's important as a concept, but

(01:15:04):
it's hard to develop as a character. Yeah, yeah, and
I mean, I guess, but I think I think it's interesting.
I think a character who's saddled with the responsibility of
trying to save humanity, that's very interesting. You know, I
don't believe that that's a narrative dead end, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
No, No, that that person, yeah, who's supposed to be
a savior, like their struggle, what is their struggle?

Speaker 3 (01:15:30):
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you know, I think I think. I'm
sure that's what drew Christian Bale to the role H
was the opportunity to potentially play that.

Speaker 2 (01:15:39):
Yeah, but it's just if you push it too far,
Like again him, Now he's like this.

Speaker 1 (01:15:45):
Like granular, you know, I mean personally, he's like it's
too much for my brain to take seriously. And even
this whole skin grafting thing Connor's face onto a robot
would be too you know how he would look like
Edgar from me right, like, like that's not the kind
of leaps that the first two movies asked me to make.

(01:16:08):
So I don't I would have a hard time doing them.

Speaker 3 (01:16:10):
And yeah, that's that's goofy too.

Speaker 2 (01:16:13):
Yeah, goofy, It's it's too goofy.

Speaker 3 (01:16:17):
I just did you? Did you see a Final Destination
the new one? Yes? I just happened to see a
clo oh yeah of the MRI scene.

Speaker 1 (01:16:25):
Yes, I thought of that while I was watching this
and holy goddamn.

Speaker 3 (01:16:29):
Yeah, yeah, I was on YouTube it says MRI death scene,
Final Destination. I'm like, hmm, let's hit play on that.
And then I spent the next next you know, thirty
six hours deeply regretting that decision.

Speaker 2 (01:16:44):
Yeah, yeah, that's pretty rough. Good lord, I'm never gonna
go near Mr Dude.

Speaker 1 (01:16:49):
And I'm I'm laughing about that film. I'm not making
light now. But did you hear about that where that
happened in real life after Final Destination came out?

Speaker 3 (01:16:57):
Oh yeah, just recently, right, Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:16:59):
Someone got too close to the machine and they had
a big metal chain around their neck. They were trying
to help. I think someone related to them was in
the machine.

Speaker 2 (01:17:06):
I don't know why they.

Speaker 1 (01:17:07):
Did this, but they stepped into the room like here,
I'll help, and then it, yeah, it sucked them into
the machine.

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
It sucked them in. Well, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:17:16):
I was even as I was saying that, I was like,
I don't remember. I shouldn't say, because I don't know exactly.
But it pulled him toward the machine and killed them.

Speaker 3 (01:17:23):
Oh my gosh. Yeah, it's freaking scary. Yes, very scary.

Speaker 2 (01:17:31):
It's a cool imbit.

Speaker 3 (01:17:33):
In Final Destination, dude has a thing in his dick. Yes, yes,
he's like pierced up the wazoo, right, yes, And.

Speaker 1 (01:17:40):
So it pulls it death turns up the magneticism or
whatever right like on the machine.

Speaker 2 (01:17:47):
And so it pulls him in and basically folds him
in half and pulls him into the machine.

Speaker 3 (01:17:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:17:52):
Yeah, yeah, now that I'm willing to buy. Oh you
know what's funny, By the way, I saw as a
random trivia thing. Jason Clark was on an Australian medical
soap opera called All Saints Okay, playing a character named
Eddie Furlong.

Speaker 3 (01:18:14):
Really, yeah he did.

Speaker 2 (01:18:16):
You're playing John Connor.

Speaker 3 (01:18:17):
That feels made up.

Speaker 2 (01:18:19):
I thought the same.

Speaker 1 (01:18:20):
Thing, and I went on IMDb and I looked it up,
and I'll be damned there it is.

Speaker 3 (01:18:23):
That is so random.

Speaker 1 (01:18:25):
I mean, that's not a very common name. I think, Yeah,
so I wonder if on that show even they were
just like.

Speaker 3 (01:18:33):
I don't know, I kid, you know, Yeah, that's like,
you know, in World War Z Peter Capaldi who you know,
he would go on to play the lead on Doctor
Who after Matt Smith. By the way, uh huh so
several years before that he was on he was in

(01:18:56):
World War Z and the role he played was w
h O doctor.

Speaker 2 (01:19:04):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:19:05):
Isn't that random? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:19:08):
So World Health Organization? I'm assuming yeah, exactly, Wow who
That's incredible.

Speaker 1 (01:19:20):
I love stuff like that. So maybe this is me
being a little nitpicky. But going back to the parking
lot when John Connor.

Speaker 3 (01:19:30):
Real quick right, yeah, this right here, this is this
is the Oracle facility. Yes, here in the Bay Area,
which makes sense because David Ellison, of course his dad
is Larry Elson, so yeah, probably got to shoot there
for free, hey dad? Now, now Corney b Vance is
Miles Dyson. Yes, And it's weird that you get such
a big actor for like such a nothing role in

(01:19:52):
this movie.

Speaker 2 (01:19:52):
Agreed. I was.

Speaker 1 (01:19:55):
I remembered that Danny yeah was a character, but I
was like, wait, is that that's supposed to be Miles?

Speaker 3 (01:20:01):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:20:01):
Yeah, weird I wasn't even sure any Sorry you were saying,
I didn't mean to cut ya.

Speaker 3 (01:20:08):
I don't even remember.

Speaker 2 (01:20:08):
Oh shoot, no, I don't worry about don worry about it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:10):
Parking lot. I think you're saying parking garage. Oh, oh
my gosh.

Speaker 1 (01:20:15):
You know what's so funny is I know that most
people listening remember what it was. And I said, like an.

Speaker 3 (01:20:19):
Idiot, Oh I do remember.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
So the moment, this is a huge moment with John
Connor or Kyle Ree's finding out that John Connor is
his dad?

Speaker 3 (01:20:30):
Like what, yeah, how does your brain even process that? Right?

Speaker 1 (01:20:33):
But I'm watching that scene and that kind of goes
to the what I was saying when it feels sort
of like a journeyman effort. It's like no close ups,
no pushings, no like musical swells, like this is a
enormous moment for this character, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:20:49):
And it's just kind of like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:50):
Medium shot, medium shot, medium shot. And I feel like,
I don't know, I was thinking about this last night.
Maybe there is more on the page here, or if
you could juice it a little bit visually, I might
feel a little bit more than I did.

Speaker 2 (01:21:04):
But the movie kind of doesn't get there.

Speaker 3 (01:21:07):
You know, well, I think the problem is that at
that point in the in the film, in the franchise,
the character, you're just trying to get the characters caught
up to the audience. Yeah. Yeah, and so it's it's
inherently not going to be as dramatic because we're already
ahead of them.

Speaker 1 (01:21:26):
That's true, you know, that's true. I mean I would
I would fight if I was a producer on this movie.
I'd be like, get one close up where we can
see his eyes just darting a little bit process. Yeah,
I really feel like it would have gone a long way.

Speaker 3 (01:21:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:21:40):
By the way, if you're like Apple or something and
you're unleashing this software to the world, why would you
ever make a faceless, creepy kid your mascots?

Speaker 3 (01:21:50):
Hello world, I.

Speaker 2 (01:21:52):
Can't wait to meet you.

Speaker 3 (01:21:59):
I remember, this is apropos of nothing. I remember, way
back in the day a friend of mine. I wish
I could remember who said it, but I just found
it very funny. He's like, you know what I find
the the scariest thing in the world to me is
the idea of opening my curtains in the middle of
the night and I look out and I see a
little kid on a tricycle riding around and laughing like,

(01:22:26):
that's so specific.

Speaker 1 (01:22:28):
That's the funniest thing they can imagine, scary, scary, scariest. Sorry, yeah, yeah,
I'm say funny because I'm laughing.

Speaker 2 (01:22:34):
Wait, what is it for you? Do you have one?

Speaker 3 (01:22:36):
Well? Now, I think it's that I've always said.

Speaker 1 (01:22:39):
For me, it's waking up and seeing a pilgrim at
the foot of my bed.

Speaker 3 (01:22:43):
Oh my god, that's like the scariest thing I can imagine.
I don't know, after the last day or so, I
think it might be an MRI, the mere notion of
an MRI.

Speaker 2 (01:22:52):
Right, Yeah, yeah, you know, it's funny. I've told people
that for years.

Speaker 1 (01:22:56):
And Sean, our friend, his kids one year gave me
a birthday and they drew pilgrims in it because they
knew I was afraid of them.

Speaker 3 (01:23:05):
Is that funny? A pilgrim sitting at the No, I
get that. That's a little scary. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:23:09):
It was when I was my brother and I were young.
We were at my grandparents place and we were in
these like twin beds in this room and it was like,
you know, there's like oil lamps and kind of old,
old person stuff in the room, and I think we
were saying, what's the scariest thing you can imagine happening
right now? And I was like, you know, I think
it's a pilgrim. Like a pilgrim woman opening the door

(01:23:30):
holding like an oil lamp and just looking at me
and like going.

Speaker 3 (01:23:34):
Sh How about a pilgrim riding around on a tricycle.
It's even worse. Yeah, pretty damn scary.

Speaker 1 (01:23:44):
Yeah, I'd be like that guy in mulhalland Drive who
doesn't want to go to see what's behind the dumpster
and then he basically dies of fright when he sees
that person back there. That'd be me seeing the pilgrim
on the tricycle.

Speaker 3 (01:23:58):
How about a pilgrim on a trycle telling you to
go to the MRI room. That's yours, that's yours, that's me.

Speaker 2 (01:24:05):
How did Zachy and Brian simultaneously die at once a front?

Speaker 3 (01:24:09):
You know, Like, well, that that movie clip convinced me
one thing, do not pierce your dick? Yeah that was
the what puts you over the edge for that, I
was I was teetering, but yeah, you convinced me. I
gotta be honest. This scene here, I kind of I
kind of like this me too, Me too, bonding between
the Terminator. I want more of this, right, And I

(01:24:29):
like where he's like the Terminators like old, and then
Kyle's like but not obsolete. I don't know, good. Yeah,
I like it.

Speaker 2 (01:24:36):
And I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:24:39):
That's the enemy his entire life. He only knows that
that's the enemy, these these cyborgs, you know, and so
that's uh.

Speaker 2 (01:24:48):
I like that they're bonding.

Speaker 3 (01:24:50):
I think that, you know, it's a testament to how
much of an impact Arnold made as as you know,
the good guy Terminator in T two, where any notion
of him not playing the Terminator as a good guy
is not even an option.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
And he resisted that, right Schwarzenegger, he did. Cameron pitched
it to him.

Speaker 3 (01:25:12):
Yeah, yeah, I mean to me, you know, in in
T two, you have that great scene where where Sarah
is watching John and the Terminator goofing around, and how
Sarah's voiceovers he's like he would never leave him and
he would you know all that. I love that right too.
And then we get like a version of that in

(01:25:33):
this about like the Terminator to her, oh yeah, and
I'm like, yeah, but I see what you're doing, you know, yeah,
you're trying to you're trying to use my affinity for
that to right.

Speaker 2 (01:25:47):
But again, I is it a bad idea?

Speaker 3 (01:25:50):
Not necessarily maybe if no execution had been better well,
because again it rests on a foundation that you it.
It's like sand you you've had to construct this relationship
between the terminator and Sarah, you know, where she calls
him pops and stuff and that's cute whatever, but like

(01:26:14):
we haven't seen we haven't seen it. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:26:16):
Yes, I would like yes, and that would be interesting
and not like you have to do some sort of
eight minute montage.

Speaker 3 (01:26:23):
But no, no, no, no eight minute scene of just Arnold
that's right facing camera. And then when she was ten
years old, I took her to the circus and it's
just like circus.

Speaker 1 (01:26:37):
Yeah, and he like takes the balloon from a vendor
and the guy's like hey, and then he just shoots
him this like death stare.

Speaker 3 (01:26:45):
And take it. But but again we don't see it.
He describes it. It's just yes, yes, my Sarah wanted balloons,
so I gave it, you know yet and he wasn't
none too pleased, but I knew Sarah would have appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (01:27:01):
Yeah, anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:27:06):
But yeah, I mean, I I just it's it's the whole,
the whole, the whole facade here is erected on at
some point in some future, somebody sent the terminator back
to kill Sarah's parents, and somebody sent the terminator back
to protect her. That's a whole movie. Yeah, Yeah, that's
not the flashback that you will like. I just it's

(01:27:27):
it's very baffling to me.

Speaker 1 (01:27:28):
I would have I mean, in all seriousness, note, I
would have liked to have seen some sort of Yeah,
as she's telling the story, little glimpses of her being
scared of it, and then a little glimpse of it
actually doing something helpful for her, and then a little
glimpse of like almost the equivalent of like this scary
huge machine death thing, you know, holding hands with this

(01:27:52):
girl as they walked down the street together, like that's
where they got Like that's her dad.

Speaker 3 (01:27:56):
I I agree, I agree with that, But I think
I think the movie doesn't want to reckon with that
because I'm like, what is it like for a terminator
to raise a girl? What does that even mean? You
know that's true, that's true, right, because because I I
have an eight year old girl. Yeah, and I'm a
human and and it's it's a it's a freaking you know,

(01:28:18):
it's it's challenging. Sure, sure, right, so I mean, I
mean it's this is not a normal thing. And the
movie is just like, oh and she was raised by
a terminator. Mm hmm. It's it's like, oh, Tarzan was
raised by apes. It's like, well, what does that mean?
Like if you actually think about it, right, right, right,
there's a lot involved there, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:28:36):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. By the way, I thought this was
interesting trivia. We hear the ramones I want to be sedated,
which kind of bumped me a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:28:48):
I don't know, I just felt a little out of place.

Speaker 1 (01:28:50):
But it ends up that is what is written into
the T two script when John and his friend are
in the garage working on the bike. Karen wrote that
they're listening to the ramones I want to be sedated,
but they changed it to guns and roses.

Speaker 3 (01:29:07):
Oh, how funny.

Speaker 1 (01:29:08):
So this is a little nod to that. Interesting, okay,
Red that sometimes I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:29:15):
Curious to read the script, the T two script, What
were you saying?

Speaker 3 (01:29:20):
That tells me that you know the folks who who
who put this thing together did their best to live
up to the legacy. Oh sure, sure, right, I just
think that I think that to some extent they were
at cross purposes with what the the the goal of

(01:29:40):
the movie was. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:29:41):
Well, one of the writers, I'm gonna try to say
her name correctly.

Speaker 3 (01:29:45):
Leetta calli Gratis. I think cal grittis.

Speaker 2 (01:29:49):
Yeah, she's worked with Cameron on Avatar.

Speaker 3 (01:29:51):
On Avatar, Yeah, he kind of nudged her into doing this,
so yeah, so that's sure she sent him a nice
fruit basket.

Speaker 2 (01:29:58):
But I kind of did that.

Speaker 1 (01:29:59):
Like, I mean, for as much as Cameron likes to tout,
you know, and and say everything that he accomplished and whatever,
he does, seem to have people he trusts, right, and
what would it be like to be in that circle
of trust, right?

Speaker 3 (01:30:13):
Pressure, Yeah, I was.

Speaker 1 (01:30:19):
I couldn't help but think, you know, if John Connor
can now like a T one thousand morph into anything,
this motorcycle jacket he puts on that was his choice. Yeah, No,
I just I couldn't help but think about it, like,
oh so he kind of like manifested that jacket, you know,
with that Huh, there's nothing wrong with It's just interesting.

(01:30:39):
Did he see in a store ones, you know, like.

Speaker 3 (01:30:44):
See, I I just what I keep coming back to
is the decision to make John you know, the the
what is it? The T five thousand? Is that what
he is?

Speaker 1 (01:30:56):
I think he might be the three thousand and Matt
Smith is the five thousand? Is that which is a
multiverse jumping entity which would have been explained in the sequels?

Speaker 3 (01:31:05):
Oh okay, good, well, good, well good then yes, I
just think like what they were struggling with, no doubt,
was that, you know, the same thing you've mentioned, like
the T one thousand is such an intimidating heavy. You
can never you can never match that, you can never
match what Robert Patrick did. They tried with with you know,

(01:31:27):
the T X yes, Intermary three. So it's like, okay,
so we got two problems we don't have we we
have trouble coming up with the heavy. We have trouble
coming up with what to do with John Connor. Hey
let's merge them together. Yeah, right, you know, And and
I again, it's it's one of those things where I
don't I don't want to sound like I'm hung up

(01:31:48):
on this idea of of of of like oh, why
would you ruin the John Connor character. But I do
think it gets to something where it's like you you,
to some extent, you have to anticipate where how the
audience is going to feel and and if it's going

(01:32:08):
to be a rug pull, the rug pull has to
be justified in some way, right And and you know,
I said the same thing about, you know, in in
Terminator Dark Fate, where you know, oh look it's Eddie Furlong,
you know. And I remember at the time when we
as we were as as I was watching it, I
was like, okay, okay, okay, let's see what you do.

(01:32:31):
And then I didn't feel like they did anything to
really warrant that, you know. And you know this this
gets to kind of the you know we joke about,
you know, hashtag not my Luke. The one thing I'll
say is, you know, I don't think the people who
are like I wanted to see Luke Skywalker do Luke
Skywalker stuff, are out of bounds because I do. I

(01:32:53):
do get it. I understand that. You know, I personally
I didn't mind what what the last Jedi did with
Luke sky Walker. But you know, look that that that
reaction should have been at least factored in. Sure, sure, sure, sure,
And I think I mean when I think, I think

(01:33:15):
our sense of John Connor is well, he's kind of
an important good guy and and what what are you
gaining by completely shifting that paradigm? Yeah, Now, this whole
sequence here, a lot of it looks digital. But my
understanding is a lot of it was achieved practically.

Speaker 1 (01:33:34):
Yeah, they shot in New Orleans, in New Orleans, and
a big part of that was they had the ability
to shut all this stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:33:41):
Down for the days that they needed.

Speaker 3 (01:33:43):
Well, they they they recreated a portion of of the
bridge something like like five hundred feet or something like that. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:33:50):
No, I agree, I think some of it looks pretty good.

Speaker 3 (01:33:54):
Yeah, yeah, you know, I think the problem for me
is like we've had I don't know, like what is
this like the the third big action sequence, right, but
I have lost count? Yeah, but it all feels pretty unmotivated,
you know. Yeah. Yeah, we're going from set piece to

(01:34:15):
set piece and there there isn't a lot of a
lot of emotional tissue that's threading through it all.

Speaker 2 (01:34:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:34:26):
What I thought you were going to say, too, is
if I had to take a quiz on the action
set pieces, this morning after having watched it last night,
I would.

Speaker 2 (01:34:36):
Struggle a little bit. Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:34:41):
I mean, well, by the way, I do want to
call this out. How the T eight hundred got the
like magnetic coils out of that speaker because he knew
it would he could wrap them, use them like brass knuckles,
right and punch Connor and disrupt him a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:34:58):
I was like, oh, that's that's clever.

Speaker 3 (01:35:00):
Like, it's clever. I agree.

Speaker 1 (01:35:01):
So then it becomes a thing that you need to
hang on to and you can lose track of and
have to get back because without them, you know, you
have no chance.

Speaker 3 (01:35:11):
So now now this sequel where like that right there,
you're telling me that's not a blue screen. Oh, it
had to be, right like, So that's I'm like, well,
what what part of this did they achieve practically, which.

Speaker 1 (01:35:25):
You know, maybe some of the cars flipping, Okay, this
is my guess. Yeah, so here's the thing.

Speaker 3 (01:35:31):
So we've gone from them being in custody to escaping
to go yeah, to go back into custody, and I'm like,
I feel like we could have cut one of those
things out.

Speaker 1 (01:35:42):
You can imagine the board with all the note cards
for every scene they're like, oh, yo, Jeff, you made
two of these cards on accident, you know, back in
please Custody.

Speaker 3 (01:35:52):
What's happening here, Brian Will.

Speaker 2 (01:35:55):
This feels like an SNL sketch.

Speaker 3 (01:35:57):
It.

Speaker 2 (01:35:58):
So now our heroes are back in custody.

Speaker 3 (01:36:00):
And we get the cops theme.

Speaker 1 (01:36:02):
Yeah, cops that bad boys, bad boys, and we're watching
a comedic montage of them getting their mugshots taken. Yeah,
and we get to see Arnold smiling awkwardly for comedic effect,
which was something Cameron decided was wrong to do Interminator,
to cut it from the film, but these people said.

Speaker 3 (01:36:24):
Hey, let's lean into that. Yeah. See in.

Speaker 2 (01:36:30):
Oh Indy, I want to say about this too, Yeah,
got sorry.

Speaker 3 (01:36:32):
Sorry. In the nineteen eighty four Terminator, we have a
scene where Kyle is being interrogated by the police. Yeah. Yes,
And it's a great sequence because you just see his
escalating frustration and he's just as he's trying to explain
to these people the situation, and his you know, his
frustration culminates in him, you know, looking into the camera

(01:36:55):
and saying he'll find her, you know. And it's so
great because you really feel, you feel viscerally how how
real it all is? Right? And I think this this
idea of of Kyle just sort of being like, I
don't know, so cool as a cucumber. I mean, it
goes again, it goes to what I said before. I'm like,
I just don't believe that this is the same character.

Speaker 1 (01:37:15):
I know, I know, I was gonna I was laughing
about this because, uh, Kyle says something about like my
Irish mother. Yeah, and then we see behind the glass
Kyle's family and you see this woman with like fire
truck red hair, and she's like, you know.

Speaker 2 (01:37:34):
But in our son, he's only twelve.

Speaker 3 (01:37:36):
I toy to toy, you know, like, but it's like, yeah,
exactly this.

Speaker 2 (01:37:40):
I was like, gee, could that be his Irish mom?

Speaker 3 (01:37:43):
Begora? T is true.

Speaker 2 (01:37:45):
It just craves so on the nose. It cracked me up.

Speaker 3 (01:37:48):
That's see again. Remember the scene in T one when
the terminator is in the police station.

Speaker 2 (01:37:56):
Oh, it's it chills to the bone to this day.

Speaker 3 (01:38:00):
Exactly. You know, yes, And that's the problem is you
can be like, oh, well, don't compare it. It's like
you have to.

Speaker 1 (01:38:06):
Yes, it came first, you can't. It's related to this film. Yeah, exactly,
this film needs to it the very minimum match it.

Speaker 3 (01:38:18):
Yeah. I mean there's that great sequence where Sarah is
like hiding under the desk, you know, yeah, just you're
getting it solely from her point of view, and somebody
opens the door. She thinks it's the terminator and it's
Kyle Man. I love that movie. Brian.

Speaker 2 (01:38:31):
Oh, it's so good.

Speaker 3 (01:38:32):
Yeah, it's so good.

Speaker 2 (01:38:33):
I mean again, I mean it.

Speaker 1 (01:38:36):
You know this this, I like this where she's giving
him this going a straight line, you know kind of thing,
because of course we need to set that up. But
I was like, no, he needs to coil down this staircase.
It makes no sense in the setting there in.

Speaker 3 (01:38:53):
I think it would be funny if she's like you
got that, and she leaves and you just see him
run straight down, face first into the wall and just
not pass out.

Speaker 2 (01:39:02):
Fall over, and she's like her boy was always a.

Speaker 3 (01:39:04):
Little dim tis true.

Speaker 2 (01:39:10):
I'm sorry for people who are fans of this movie.

Speaker 3 (01:39:13):
Listen to this. It's like, go straight and don't look back,
got it? But Sarah doesn't see anything. She's already gone
right right, right right.

Speaker 2 (01:39:28):
That would be hilarious, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:39:32):
I remember even the first time we saw this, not
hating her calling him pops.

Speaker 2 (01:39:38):
No, I think that's an interesting idea. Yeah, I just
wish I'd felt it more.

Speaker 3 (01:39:44):
Yeah. But what I think it honestly does, is it
it sort of gets to our collective affinity for Arnold
as this character.

Speaker 2 (01:39:54):
Yeah, because maybe we see him that way a little bit.

Speaker 3 (01:39:56):
Yeah, you know, yeah, I mean this is no, this
is the only only time he plays the Terminator where
he doesn't die at the end. Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:40:09):
Interesting, gosh, I dude, Dark Fate.

Speaker 3 (01:40:13):
I don't remember that movie. Yeah, yeah, he I mean,
he definitely dies in that one. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:40:18):
See, I remember he was a carpet salesman. Yeah, Carl,
But I'm not making that up, not a bit.

Speaker 3 (01:40:25):
And he's great in that movie, by the way.

Speaker 1 (01:40:27):
He is because he loves this character. He always merands it.

Speaker 3 (01:40:31):
That's kind of the thing, right is Jim Cameron is
trying to crack another Terminator story. He's hard at work,
you know. And what he said is that the issues
having is like the real world keeps catching up with
whatever they're coming up with. Sure, which kind of what
you and I were alluding to. Yeah, but I don't know,

(01:40:52):
do I want to see a Terminator movie without Arnold
in it.

Speaker 2 (01:40:55):
Yeah, I know, I know.

Speaker 3 (01:40:57):
And at this point do I want to see a
Terminator movie with Arnold?

Speaker 2 (01:41:00):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:41:00):
I know, I know, I frankly, I mean, this is
a hard line in the sand for me. If CAMRA's
not directing it, I'm not interested. Yeah, truly, I don't care.
Like he can have the idea, that's fine, Like Alita
Battle Angel was his idea.

Speaker 2 (01:41:15):
It was fine ish, it was okay. You know, I
remember thinking it was all right.

Speaker 1 (01:41:20):
I don't remember a thing about it now, but if
he had made it, I know I would have at
least felt.

Speaker 2 (01:41:28):
Something I remembered.

Speaker 1 (01:41:29):
Yeah, you know, because that's just what he's able to do.
And you know, so yeah, he might have an idea,
but outside of his hands, I just.

Speaker 2 (01:41:36):
I'm not interested. I'm just gonna be let down. That's
my feeling like it.

Speaker 1 (01:41:42):
By the way, so I was watching this thing last night,
the helicopter thing, was complaining about earlier because this.

Speaker 3 (01:41:47):
Should be scary.

Speaker 1 (01:41:48):
There's a helicopter going down street level in between these
tall skyscrapers. That should feel thrilling. You know, we should
see people going holy crap on the sidewalk and ducking.
But this is just I feel.

Speaker 2 (01:42:01):
Nothing, I feel nothing.

Speaker 3 (01:42:03):
It's just well, it's just Cgi Wonderland.

Speaker 1 (01:42:06):
Yeah, so does but that's what's so great about Terminators,
like these real visceral, spectacular things and so anyway, but okay,
so when there's the helicopter tumbles over the side of
the building and it kind of falls down, there's a
shot where you're looking up at the building, and for
some reason it reminded me of the Matrix and Neo
and the helicopter and the side of the building.

Speaker 3 (01:42:26):
Oh for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:42:27):
Yeah, And I was like, well, look, you know, nothing
sacred anymore. Hollywood has no integrity, Like they're just they
don't care. They're just gonna do anything, and they'll keep
making the sequels, the whatever, the crossovers, the ip business.

Speaker 3 (01:42:39):
Just do it.

Speaker 1 (01:42:40):
Just make a Terminator meets Predator meets RoboCop meets Neo
from the Matrix movie man, just do it.

Speaker 3 (01:42:46):
Just do it.

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
I don't care if it's crass, You're You're beyond crass
at this point.

Speaker 3 (01:42:51):
Well, I mean, they they did. They've done RoboCop versus
Terminator as a comic and a couple of other things,
and it was really good. It's good.

Speaker 2 (01:42:57):
And yeah, yeah, so I mean just just do it.

Speaker 1 (01:43:01):
There's no shame anymore. I mean, I don't I don't
want another one of these.

Speaker 2 (01:43:08):
Just bring RoboCop in.

Speaker 3 (01:43:11):
I I actually really liked how in that RoboCop Versus
Terminator comic, how they how they found a way to
thread both of these things together.

Speaker 2 (01:43:18):
It's really thoughtfully done and really well executed.

Speaker 3 (01:43:21):
Yeah, I thought so. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:43:24):
Our friend Doug listener to the podcast. He sent them
to me because I think I.

Speaker 1 (01:43:29):
Mentioned that I'd never read them, and he sent them
to me in the mail, and I meant a lot
to me and I read them.

Speaker 3 (01:43:33):
And loved them. What a what a nice gesture.

Speaker 2 (01:43:36):
Yeah, very nice.

Speaker 3 (01:43:42):
See. I think for me, you know, when I when
I think of those first two films, right, there's always
these scenes that come to mind, you know, Like here
I'm thinking of when when John Sarah a second. I'm
thinking about when when they break into this ibernine. Yeah,
and that whole sequence and everything that entails, you know.

(01:44:04):
I for me, you know, when when the Terminator goes
to the window and it's and it opens fire on
the cops, you know, and you hear that great music,
you know, I mean, it's still like it gets me
emotional you know, same, And and that's the that's the
frustrating thing, is like, there's this Hollywood idea that, well,

(01:44:27):
if we just take some of the familiar pieces, people
will have the same exact reaction. It's like, no, that
that was the result of somebody with the creative idea.

Speaker 1 (01:44:36):
Yes, and it was made by an artist, yeah, right,
Like you can't just have those ideas and point a
camera and think we're going to feel the same way, right,
There needs to be some artistry.

Speaker 3 (01:44:49):
I mean, idiot. It is odd because James Cameron, like
we talked about before, I mean, in the lead up
to this movie's release, they put out a a you know,
a promo video of him being like, man, this is
as far as I'm concerned, the franchise has been reinvented.
I know, this is as far as i'merted. This is
the real Terminator three. And I'm like, you are full

(01:45:11):
of so much shit.

Speaker 1 (01:45:12):
Yeah, yeah, you can only you get one. You get one.
And then now he said that about T three already
I know. But it's like, well, now we'll never believe
you because.

Speaker 3 (01:45:23):
I remember about T three. At the weekend after it
came out, He's like, oh, my god, I loved it.
I thought Jonathan Mostout is such a great job. I
was like, okay, okay, right on. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:45:32):
Well it's funny because I remember when we talked about
the we did our commentary in that one, Schwarzenegger was
mulling whether or not to do three yeah, and Cameron
was like, asked for the most money.

Speaker 2 (01:45:42):
You've ever asked for ever?

Speaker 3 (01:45:44):
Yeah, and do it.

Speaker 2 (01:45:46):
And he did and he did so.

Speaker 1 (01:45:49):
So I going back to the loyalty thing, it is
kind of cool that Cameron was just like for his friend.

Speaker 2 (01:45:55):
Oh, it's wonderful. I love it. Complete endorsement.

Speaker 3 (01:45:58):
Sure, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:46:01):
I wonder if he hadn't marked on his calendar like
and at this date I will tell them that that
wasn't true to save a little face.

Speaker 3 (01:46:09):
You know. I wonder how much Cameron just sort of
mentally just divorced himself from anything not involving him. Yeah,
you know where It's like, look, I can I can
be gnashing teeth and rending garments over this, or I
can just sort of be in my zen place and
find things to like in all of them.

Speaker 2 (01:46:31):
I would really admire that. Actually, yeah, he's a better
man than I, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:46:36):
Yeah, because you look at like Stephen King for example,
and and like he he always hated you know what
Stanley Kubrick did with the Shining Yeah, and you know
he wanted he he wanted to go back and do
it like like in others. He couldn't let go. Understandably.
I'm not criticizing that because it's his baby obviously, but
you know that's got to be hard to watch somebody

(01:46:58):
essentially raise your child, right definitely, And so you know,
maybe Cameron's just like, well, as long as my friend
gets looked after, I'm fine with it. Yeah. Yeah, you know,
Plus he's got the rights back now anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:47:10):
So yeah, that was part of with the complicated sales,
right right, I mean part of the complication was after
a certain year the rights did go back to Cameron,
that's right, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:47:23):
Nineteen yeah, yeah, yeah. The essentially, i mean, the Terminator
franchise just kills production companies basically, it kind of does,
you know, because it goes from one to the next.
The Halseian Company, which which purchased it from C two,
which was the you know Andrew Vanya and Mario Kassar

(01:47:46):
their company, they did T three and then they went
under and they sold it to House and they did
Terminator Salvation. Then they went under. They valued the franchise
at like seventy million, yeah, but it ended getting sold
for less than thirty million. Wow. Wow, which kind of

(01:48:07):
makes sense to me.

Speaker 1 (01:48:09):
Yeah, I mean it's again, I'm still having a hard
time catching up with that.

Speaker 2 (01:48:13):
But that's my age and affinity showing. I mean, like
my love of the brand.

Speaker 3 (01:48:19):
Well it's to me. It's it's like you look at
like RoboCop, right, how much RoboCop stuff is out there? Right?
And other than the first movie, how much of it
is good? Right? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:48:35):
And you could make a new RoboCop movie now, sure,
and hope it's a hit, But I would never expect
it to be like a billion dollar That's exactly it.

Speaker 2 (01:48:42):
Yeah, I wanted.

Speaker 3 (01:48:45):
To call it.

Speaker 1 (01:48:46):
By the way, Brad Feidell, Yes, composer of the first
two films. I was actually independent of rewatching this movie.
I was thinking about it for some reason. Part of
the score was kind of running through my mind, and
I was like.

Speaker 2 (01:48:59):
What a weird score like the Terminator score, the Terminator score,
particularly Terminator Too, where it doesn't feel dated because it feels.

Speaker 3 (01:49:11):
Out of time. Sure, you know, what I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:49:14):
It's just a weird sounding score that completely fits that
film right, and it's got of a synth the element,
but not entirely. It's just this weird thing that I've
never heard before or since that completely feels like part
of the voice of that film. And I was just like,
what an amazing thing that doesn't happen often.

Speaker 3 (01:49:31):
It's also not a score you can really listen to
on its own. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:49:36):
Yeah, it's not very melodic, No.

Speaker 3 (01:49:38):
It's it's very much tied in with the visuals in
a way that you know, like a John Williams score
or something wouldn't be. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:49:45):
Yeah, but it's really really good and I kind of
missed it.

Speaker 2 (01:49:49):
That's the thing.

Speaker 1 (01:49:50):
I think we've talked about this, but the T one
thousand theme that kind of like that comes from a
keyboard and it's programmed orchestral sounds, so it's these horns.
It's horns literally going bound and he slows them down
so like we're and so every sequel when I hear
an orchestra trying to imitate it, it's interesting, I'm always like, Hugh, no,

(01:50:14):
like that's it's wrong, because it's supposed to make me
feel like I don't know what that is, right, but
I'm hearing horns. It's kind of like when you watch
the Oscars and this, like Jazzy Orchestra is recreating like
scores from different movies, and you're like, oh, that's not
quite it. Like it's a little too bouncy, you know,
or something that's really funny, a.

Speaker 2 (01:50:31):
Little too razzle dazzled in the version.

Speaker 3 (01:50:33):
I know.

Speaker 2 (01:50:34):
That's what It reminds me of the equivalent that that said.

Speaker 3 (01:50:37):
You know, because Lorn Bolf did the did the score
for this, Yeah, with Hans Zimmer having some kind of heat,
some kind of.

Speaker 2 (01:50:43):
Supervisor or something.

Speaker 3 (01:50:44):
Yeah, and it's it's not a terrible score. Yeah, it's
not particularly memorable to me. Yeah. But but like he's
gotten more more visible Lord balf in the decades since,
and you know, I think his his his quality has improved.
You know. I agree.

Speaker 2 (01:51:04):
I feel like I just saw him.

Speaker 3 (01:51:07):
What did you just do?

Speaker 2 (01:51:09):
Just watch something he did?

Speaker 3 (01:51:10):
Well? He did he did top Gun Maverick, Yeah, which
I was very good square. I like that. He also
did he do the most recent mission impossible? Is that? Oh?
Is that what it is?

Speaker 4 (01:51:20):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:51:20):
He did then he keep Gun. That's what I make
it gun.

Speaker 3 (01:51:22):
That's right, that's that's exactly. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:51:24):
Yeah, I remember in the theater.

Speaker 1 (01:51:31):
I bet if we went back and listened to the review,
I remember hating how Skynett was talking to them and
they kept shooting the projections or like the projectors.

Speaker 2 (01:51:42):
I don't know, right, but I'm like, save.

Speaker 1 (01:51:43):
Your bullets, dude, because it keeps reappearing everywhere.

Speaker 2 (01:51:46):
I'm like, right, this is funny. Like I had a
ten year old flashback memory that stuff just from the trailers, no, just.

Speaker 1 (01:51:54):
From my experience of watching, Like he keeps shooting these projectors.
I mean he's not going anywhere, like stop doing that.
But that's like a very that's like a trope, you know,
in these types of movies.

Speaker 2 (01:52:04):
I know, kids, I just complained for two hours.

Speaker 3 (01:52:10):
Ji Courtney and Matt Smith two man trapped in this
movie hoping for better days. Yeah. Yeah, see Ji Courtney.
I enjoyed him in Suicide Squad.

Speaker 2 (01:52:27):
I remember that too.

Speaker 3 (01:52:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:52:28):
It was a well suited role for him, it.

Speaker 3 (01:52:31):
Was, and and that movie did did not do many
people favors. Yeah, but he benefited from that, you know. Yeah,
And so that's when I that that was when it
kind of clipped for me, I was like, I think
maybe Hollywood's been misusing this guy. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:52:45):
Yeah, some people are just suited for certain types of roles.

Speaker 1 (01:52:48):
And they excel at them. Yeah, and they're not you
can't just slot them into anything.

Speaker 3 (01:52:54):
So so the the the John Connor Terminator, this this
sequence really gets to the essential problem with him is
that he doesn't appear to have any limitations. Yeah, in
terms of like being a physical threat right now. Granted,
I mean obviously we're they're about to you know, destroy
destroy him. But but but I think these folks are

(01:53:16):
like there, they keep out thinking themselves in terms of
like trying to come up with the terminator that's going
to be even more deadly than the last one. Because
I'm kind of like, well you kind of maxed out
with the two one thousand. Yeah, I agree, and anything
after that is just like magic, you know, like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(01:53:38):
Because the TX they're like it's metal, solid metal and
liquid metal. I'm like, Okay, that doesn't make sense.

Speaker 2 (01:53:43):
Yeah, yeah, that feels like a step backwards. Yeah, exactly, right.
And then we got this through the jail bars, right yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:53:50):
Right, you know, yeah, and then and then we got
this whatever this is then remember the next one, it's like, oh,
there's like the endoskeleton, and then the nanites form another
guy and they're like what, I don't even know what
I know?

Speaker 1 (01:54:00):
Right, I mean there's something to be said about the simplicity,
you know, and just come up with new cool scenarios
for that thing to be involved in.

Speaker 3 (01:54:11):
You know, here's the problem. The Terminator as originally created
is an infiltration unit, and so by extension, I mean
it has to have certain limitations because the point it's
it's meant to be espionage, you know, because there's no
reason for Skynet to have a whole bunch of human
looking robots, right, Skynet is thinking about a posthuman world, right,

(01:54:36):
you know right? Yeah, I hadn't thought about that.

Speaker 1 (01:54:42):
Yeah, but I understand. I mean it happens with any
even like Star Wars film. It's like, well, we can't
use the same ships we gotta Usually that's probably a
toy making decision. But like I remember seeing the ad
At Walkers or whatever they're called in Last Jedi and
I was like, eh, you know, I can just they're
finding the way they were Rilla walkers. Yeah, but of course,
you know, much time has passed cars. You know, you

(01:55:05):
get a Mazda and a Mazilla different ten years later.
But like, anyway, I agree with you. I just feel
like it gets overthought. Maybe there's enhancements you can give it,
but they think so much that it becomes less cool somehow.

Speaker 3 (01:55:19):
Right right? See, Okay, So this moment here where she's
so emotional about Pops, I don't know how does that
land for you?

Speaker 2 (01:55:27):
Not at all?

Speaker 3 (01:55:29):
And why is that?

Speaker 2 (01:55:31):
Because the movie hasn't done anything to make me feel
their relationship.

Speaker 1 (01:55:35):
It's so frustrating, right, and we saw it in a
two shot, a two shot show me your face, Like
her sad sad moment is in a two shot from
the side.

Speaker 3 (01:55:47):
That's so interesting. It feels like like TV.

Speaker 2 (01:55:51):
Yeah you know what I mean, Like that's what I'm saying.
It's a kind of a journeyman effort.

Speaker 3 (01:55:55):
Yeah, well, I mean Alan Taylor. I think his only
move he did after this is that Sopranos prettyquel. Oh
interesting it's called Many Saints of Newark.

Speaker 2 (01:56:07):
Woh good memory? Yeah yeah yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:56:13):
All right. Well see I'm surprised he didn't say you
are terminated.

Speaker 1 (01:56:16):
Like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, see I just kept thinking,
oh more flakes.

Speaker 2 (01:56:23):
We got the software.

Speaker 3 (01:56:25):
What if he flaked? That's so funny. See, I think so.
So I have two thoughts on what they do with
the with the T the T eight hundred here. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I I was like, you know what, good, I'm glad
they left him alive. Sure, but I'm also like it's
pretty silly, like.

Speaker 2 (01:56:46):
Right, you know, it's funny. I remember after seeing it
in the theater, hating it. I was like, what, he's
liquid metal now, I don't even get it.

Speaker 1 (01:56:54):
Yeah, this time I actually did understand what the movie
was saying. Sure, because they're like, oh, as long as
there's a chip they can control, I was like, oh, okay,
it actually does in their world, it kind of makes sense.

Speaker 3 (01:57:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:57:04):
Yeah, well, I mean it's kind of what we're talking about.
You know, they see him again and they're like, I
forget how they pose the question, but he's just like,
I've been upgraded, and you're like.

Speaker 3 (01:57:15):
Okay, sure, sure you have.

Speaker 1 (01:57:24):
But you know what's kind of funny too, is I
can imagine a filmmaker who's a little more exacting like
Cameron showing how he got flung out of that thing. Right,
you know, this is just kind of like cgi wall
he flew out of there somehow, you know what I mean,
Like and then he he landed and goo and now
he's upgraded the end.

Speaker 2 (01:57:43):
Danna you know what I mean?

Speaker 3 (01:57:48):
I mean, am I wrong?

Speaker 2 (01:57:50):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:57:51):
You know this? You know, Alan Taylor taking the gig
and being like, you know, the script sucks, but you know,
I think I can fix it. So well, the lesson
there is is don't assume that. Yeah, yeah, you know,
it doesn't matter who you are. I mean, this is
no comment on his skills. No, no, I think it's anybody.

(01:58:12):
I mean, I think you should trust your gut. You
should be like, listen, I'll take the gig if I
feel like the script is where it needs to be,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:58:19):
Yeah, And so look, I am critiquing a lot of
the visuals and choices and things, but like it's very
realistic to wonder who was if the script, you know,
he couldn't tweak and fix the script along the way.
There were a lot of forces, a lot of voices,
probably running out of time, things changing, we thought were

(01:58:40):
going to do this. We ran out of money for that,
you know. From a meal, I can't even say the
name Amelia Clark herself saying she didn't even recognize her
friend with what he was going through making this thing.
Who knows what he was up against, right, So it's
just disappointing all around because this is what we have
to live with ten years later.

Speaker 3 (01:58:57):
Yeah, and that's the frustrating thing. You know. You wonder
if if not James Cameron, you know, maybe you get
like a Germo del Toro or a sure, you know,
Peter Jackson or something, and what does that look like?
You know? Yeah, Pops is alive. It's okay, he's alive.

(01:59:19):
Everybody's fine.

Speaker 2 (01:59:23):
No, oh, that's what it was. I thought you're dead.

Speaker 4 (01:59:25):
No, just upgraded, Kyle Reese, have you mate it with
Sarah Fon? Yes, get to work and he just takes
a seat, pulls up a chair.

Speaker 2 (01:59:40):
But it was he was I mean, we know that
they well we don't know that. I guess.

Speaker 3 (01:59:46):
Yeah, the future is no longer set.

Speaker 1 (01:59:47):
Yeah, yeah, but I was gonna say, it'd be nice
to see some sort of romantic connection with him a
little bit like that they've earned along the way in
a different way.

Speaker 3 (01:59:55):
They kiss here and it feels very.

Speaker 2 (02:00:00):
You know necessary.

Speaker 3 (02:00:02):
Yeah, yeah, right, like, Okay, I guess we got to
scratch this thing off, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:00:06):
Yeah, by the way, I love that this cal Reese
is a boy.

Speaker 2 (02:00:10):
Let's just call him a boy.

Speaker 3 (02:00:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:00:13):
Uh, it's not like so Sarah goes up to him like, hey, hey, kiddo, you.

Speaker 3 (02:00:18):
Know, like from that one time you met in the Yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (02:00:21):
Was gonna say, like, I have someone who needs to
talk with you.

Speaker 3 (02:00:24):
Is that okay?

Speaker 2 (02:00:25):
I'm like, you don't even know her? Where his parents?

Speaker 1 (02:00:29):
These strangers all dressed in leather are like approaching your
boy out in the garage telling him to memory talking
to strangers. Kyle, Yes, yes, yeah, although I really like this.
I like this is the conceit, you know, like he's
putting a memory in his head that he knows he's

(02:00:51):
gonna need later.

Speaker 3 (02:00:52):
Yeah, a very Bill and Ted remember a trash can.
I love that stuff.

Speaker 2 (02:00:59):
So this, this, this is a good ending to me.

Speaker 3 (02:01:01):
I like this.

Speaker 1 (02:01:10):
And like you said, I mean this is kind of
like Looper, right, where like the memories become jumbled in
your brain as time travel keeps happening, so.

Speaker 3 (02:01:19):
The idea, see, but it doesn't make sense to me
because so this is after it has all happened. He's
telling his younger self Genesis Skynet so that his future
self who time travels back, will remember, but that future
no longer exists.

Speaker 2 (02:01:39):
Yes, so is it like a loop or is it right? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (02:01:45):
I don't know because there's there's no indication. Okay, what
am I? What am I doing?

Speaker 2 (02:01:50):
What am I?

Speaker 3 (02:01:51):
I know? I know I felt my brain matter start
leaking out of my ear. I was like, oh, wait,
I should stop. That's kind of funny.

Speaker 2 (02:02:02):
Because you gotta do the man. He goes full smile.

Speaker 3 (02:02:09):
See now now we got our Terminator family off for
with new adventures. You know, yeah, yeah, so.

Speaker 1 (02:02:15):
Yeah, I guess, like you said, John was gonna grapple
a little bit more with his humanity in the next one.

Speaker 2 (02:02:21):
Wait where is John?

Speaker 3 (02:02:22):
What?

Speaker 2 (02:02:23):
You just got blown up?

Speaker 3 (02:02:24):
He got blown up? But I mean he's he's all
He's comprised of just nan nits anyway, nights. I know
you you're you're perpetual bane, you know. And then I mean,
and and the the mid credits scene here.

Speaker 2 (02:02:39):
I forgot there was one.

Speaker 1 (02:02:40):
I literally when this was the credits were rolling, I
went on my phone and I was like checking messages,
and then there was a scene.

Speaker 2 (02:02:46):
I was like, there's a scene like a Marvel, Marvel film.

Speaker 3 (02:02:54):
It's crazy to realize. I mean this summer that like
we had Fantastic four came out this summer, the fan
for stick I should say, right, all right, Age of
Ultron was this summer. Yeah, aunt man oh man from
Uncle m so weird, Like I mean, there was there

(02:03:18):
was some quality stuff mixed in there, straight out of Compton.
That was the summer.

Speaker 1 (02:03:22):
Oh wow, okay, yeah, you put me back in the
time period now. And then Force Awakens. Of course we
were anticipating it.

Speaker 3 (02:03:28):
Oh yeah, Jurassic World had also come out this summer.

Speaker 2 (02:03:31):
Oh yeah, yeah yeah, Force Awakens.

Speaker 3 (02:03:33):
Wow geez, can.

Speaker 1 (02:03:34):
You believe this made under one hundred million dollars? Couldn't
even make one hundred million dollars?

Speaker 3 (02:03:40):
I was crazy. I watched a preview screening of this.

Speaker 2 (02:03:45):
Oh did you?

Speaker 3 (02:03:47):
Yeah? It was it was like the night before it opened,
I think, oh, I see okay, but before like the
word had got out and I was like, oh, this
is gonna flop. I knew instinctive it. I was like,
it's not going to do well. Yeah you know, and
and for all the reasons we elucidated just in this conversation.
So so I can't say, I'm uguely surprised disappointed. Yeah,

(02:04:09):
because it's like, we have this affinity for the franchise
and we want to see it do well. But you
realize like this one tanks, and then the arrogance of
like just four years later being like no, no, no,
we really mean it this time. Yeah, like look, I
mean audiences, are you burn them enough times? Yeah? You know,
it doesn't matter if it's good or not, you know,
and people might argue, I would say that that Dark

(02:04:32):
Fate is not much better. Yeah, there's some people who
like it more. But regardless, Oh, here you go, this
is this is.

Speaker 2 (02:04:42):
So, this is Oracle's been blown up.

Speaker 3 (02:04:48):
What do we see?

Speaker 2 (02:04:49):
We see the Genesis is.

Speaker 1 (02:04:50):
Still alive, right yeah, yeah, they forgot to shoot a camera.

Speaker 2 (02:04:56):
They see that now, should have shot them all? And
the device is that what it is?

Speaker 3 (02:05:03):
Or what is that?

Speaker 1 (02:05:05):
Or is that is that genesis? Like it's soul or something?
I don't know, Yeah, I don't know, but dude, so
speaking of two thousands, and then we get this really
really weird pop song that starts playing.

Speaker 3 (02:05:17):
Yeah, yeah it's also kind of weird. Yeah I turned
it off. But all right, sorry you were saying, well.

Speaker 1 (02:05:22):
No, but you know, I'm I'm look, take away the
words Terminator and the Stan Winston designed robots and things
in here. This just feels like any old twenty fifteen
action film.

Speaker 3 (02:05:34):
It really does.

Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
Yeah, And so kudos to JJ Abrams. You know, at
least Tonally Force Awakens, it was like, oh damn, that's Star.

Speaker 3 (02:05:43):
Wars, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (02:05:45):
So I just wish that it even if it doesn't succeed.
I would just love a Terminator film to at least
actually feel like it's related to the other Terminator films
tonally aesthetically, you know.

Speaker 3 (02:05:58):
And all I would say is, at this point, nothing
they do with the franchise is ever gonna evoke those
earlier films.

Speaker 1 (02:06:07):
And that's that's something I have. It's that's a me
issue now, yeh, Like it's how many times must that
be fooled? You know, Like it's so I need to
go in there and stop. That can't even be a
critique anymore, you know. I can critique the other stuff,
but it's not gonna happen at this point.

Speaker 3 (02:06:24):
Too many of the pieces have been swapped out. You know.
It's like it's not the ship of.

Speaker 1 (02:06:28):
The CSS just gonna say yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:06:33):
You know, even even if Cameron comes back and directs,
let's say, well, Schwarzinger's not gonna be in it. I mean,
you know, it's just too much. Too much time has passed,
and and I think what it comes down to is uh,
And I've said this. I think I said this with
regards to to this film, you know, or no, I
said this with regards to to Dark Fate. We've now
seen you know, one too three three different versions of

(02:06:58):
here's what happened after Terminator too. Yeah. Yeah, I'm not
even including this because this is just doing like a
whole reboot, right right. We got T three, you got
the TV show, you got Dark Fate, and none have
fundamentally convinced me that we even needed to go past
T two. Yeah. Right, Of those, I would say probably
the series is the best. But even that, I mean,
it's not it's not necessary, you know, you know, and

(02:07:21):
we realize this theal do we get sometimes it's okay
to just let a story end, and that's fine.

Speaker 1 (02:07:26):
Although if I was an eccentric billionaire and Cameron is
like saying, hey, I got I got an idea. I
think we're going to do this, and maybe a script
even like comes together. Then I think I would go
like all airheads. You remember that movie where those heavy
metal guys hold the radio station hostage. I think I
would hold camera. He's like, but I'm not gonna direct it.
I'd be like, oh, yes you are. And then I
would like old Cameron hostage and use my money, you

(02:07:49):
can make him make that movie.

Speaker 3 (02:07:51):
There we go. Well, we'll hope Spring's etournal that you
get that opportunity.

Speaker 2 (02:07:54):
Oh, thank you, Zachy.

Speaker 3 (02:07:55):
Yeah, I'm doing for you. Hey, but you know what
the nice thing is, Uh, you know you and I
have an opportunity to meet back up. Let's say a
year from now.

Speaker 1 (02:08:06):
Dude, I'm into it. I want to see it again.
I know I didn't like it, but I want to
see it again.

Speaker 3 (02:08:11):
So well, there we go. So, so a dark fate
is in our future. That that that future is set.

Speaker 1 (02:08:20):
And I am sorry for people who are listening who
have a soft spot for this movie. I'm getting ahead
a little bit here because Zachi usually says this, but
please write in I would I would love to hear
those takes and counterpoints.

Speaker 3 (02:08:33):
Well, I say, I am not sorry, because honestly, you
are wrong. If you like, you are objectively wrong, and
I'm gonna I think you might be a bad person. Frankly,
so I think we should be the ones to call
that out. You know what, Yeah, I support your your
take on this now, I feel very strongly about that.

(02:08:54):
But yes to Brian's point of course. Whichever way you land,
you can always email us at Movie Film Podcast at
gmail dot comic can hit like on our Facebook page
Facebook dot com slash Movie Film Podcast and message us there.
As always, please go to Apple podcast, leave a review,
leave star rating. Also do the same at Spotify and hey,
if you're listening to this on YouTube, please hit like
and smash that subscribe button. We also have a Patreon, Brian,

(02:09:15):
Yes we do.

Speaker 1 (02:09:16):
If you head over to patreon dot com slash MOVIEFILM
podcast hit subscribe for only five dollars a month, you'll
find every commentary we've ever done in every episode, a
regular episode moving forward, absolutely ad free. Our free feed
will always be available, but this is our way of
providing what we believe is the most satisfying way to

(02:09:36):
enjoy the show, so without random interruptions and ads butting
into our conversation. Plus, your subscription goes a long way
and helping to support us and helping to sustain producing
the show. So if you're interested in Abele, please head
over to patreon dot com, slash MOVIEFILM podcast and hit subscribe.

Speaker 2 (02:09:53):
We'd be very grateful.

Speaker 3 (02:09:55):
There you go, And if you're looking for me online,
you can find me on social media at Zakie Corner,
that Zakis Corner. Can also find my reviews and writing
at the San Francisco Chronicle and also at The Wrap
and IGN. What about you, Brian? Where can people find you?

Speaker 2 (02:10:07):
You can find episodes I've written of Young Jedi Adventures
streaming on Disney Plus.

Speaker 3 (02:10:13):
And with that on behalf of my partner Brian Hall.
My name is Zachi Ason. That has been our movie
film commentary track for Terminator Genesis. We'll be back.

Speaker 1 (02:10:23):
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