Ep. 325: Caught Stealing

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, this is Brian wanting to let you know that
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(00:21):
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(00:41):
please head over to Patreon dot com slash moviefilm podcast
and subscribe. We'd be very grateful and now on with
the show. Welcome Friends Podcasts Podcasting the show jack again
by talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
The movie Black. Welcome to Movie Film. It's episode three
twenty five, brought to you by mister Boyd Productions. I'm
Zaki is sign I'm here with Brian Hall.

Speaker 1 (01:15):
Hey, how's it going, Zachi?

Speaker 2 (01:16):
Hey, it's it is going, you know I I I
was saying, I'm just enjoying my extended post labor day layover.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
Yeah, I mean we're we're into September. Yeah, like summer's over,
I know, or at least a movie season speaking.

Speaker 2 (01:37):
So right, that's that's very much the case as we
sort of look at the calendar for the next several weeks. Eh,
we got a we got.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
A good, good one to talk about today. It was
one that I don't know that you and I were
even sure we would catch.

Speaker 2 (01:49):
But that's true.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
This I think it's gonna be a fun discussion.

Speaker 2 (01:52):
I agree. But but you've seen a whole bunch of
other stuff too since then.

Speaker 1 (01:57):
Yes, so I think it was the last regular episode.
I was talking about cutting the cord with cable, right,
that's right, And I mean longtime listeners already know this.
But basically I am. I love the ability to flip channels,
and so I've hung on to cable. Although it was
YouTube TV more specifically, but it's basically cable. I just

(02:21):
love the idea of Okay, it's ten at night, I'm
not going to go to bed just yet. You know,
I don't want to go to an app and know
what I want to watch, or just look at the
limited amount of things that are on this app and
then have to go to another app and see what
they have on that app, and then go to another
app and see what I just I don't know.

Speaker 2 (02:41):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
I just love being able to go through and see like, oh,
we're in the middle of I always use the example
of Clueless, which we just did a commentary for, but
I love it being like ten at night and seeing
there's twenty minutes left of Clueless on TBS and going ah, okay,
that's perfect, and then you know, wrapping that up before
I go to bed. So it was really difficult for
me to get rid of it. But you know, you
and I have both said this, as you know, YouTube TV, specifically,

(03:05):
their monthly price just kept going up and up and
up and up. And I found that the last several
times that I had turned it on to flip channels,
I wasn't stopping on anything. I was just flipping, going oh,
I guess there's nothing there, and then going to something else,
and then I thought, what am I paying for exactly.

Speaker 2 (03:23):
You were paying for the option to stop on something exactly,
and it was just happening less and less, and so
I finally made the decision to cut YouTube TV and
have nothing but streaming apps.

Speaker 1 (03:38):
And so it's funny because I did that while I
was away. You know, I don't think I talked about this,
but my grandmother passed away, and so I left town.
I was with my family for a while and you know,
did the the cord cutting. And then I came back
and it had been a long week and I got
back from the airport pretty late at night, and I

(03:59):
played onto my couch and I thought, man, i'd loved
flip channels right now.

Speaker 2 (04:05):
But I couldn't.

Speaker 1 (04:06):
And so but this is this is what I want
to talk about, which is kind of interesting. And again
this is probably a conversation that was interesting seven years
ago to most people. But I've since discovered the apps
Pluto and two B That's right. So I was aware
of these and I had even turned them on before,

(04:26):
but to me, the only thing I saw them as
was like Netflix, but with commercials, which is funny because
now Netflix has commercials.

Speaker 2 (04:35):
But yeah, anyway.

Speaker 1 (04:36):
I was like, all right, well, I mean, what else
am I going to do? So I turned on Pluto,
and to my surprise, Pluto is kind of like having
cable Like it has, yep, dozens and dozens and dozens
of channels that are playing, and it's you know, classic television.

(04:57):
There's like I Love Lucy, and then there's another channel
it is just South Park and you know also you know,
like a Comedy Central kind of thing and old sitcoms
and Growing Pains and family there's like a Family Ties channel.
And then you get to the movie section and it's
just a bunch of movies that are programmed showing at
a certain time, you know, from seven to ten, from

(05:18):
ten to twelve. And I was shocked at the selection.
I mean literally I wrote it down because I thought
it was so crazy. It was like, at the same
time it was RoboCop, Raging Bull, Wayne's World, Goodwill, Hunting,
Almost Famous, forty eight Hours, Punch, Drunk Love, Double Jeopardy,
Chasing Amy. I was like, well, these are I would

(05:38):
stop on any of these, but they have the ads right,
and the only thing that sucks about it. Unlike most
cable providers or YouTube TV, which was my favorite of those,
you can't DVR or anything, and you can't skip the ads, right,
you can't like fast forward through it thing like pause

(06:00):
and then eventually fast forward through stuff. So it was
a little like, oh, I haven't had to do this
in a while, like really actually sit in advertisements.

Speaker 2 (06:10):
Well that's that's really the takeaway from all of this.
So we've been on this whole journey from broadcast linear
television to streaming to all this whole thing, and then
we wound our way all the way back to linear
TV with ads. Yep, exactly, but bonus, now you can't

(06:33):
skip past the ads. I my hashtag progress.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
I know, I know, I dude, I literally thought I
would give anything for a TVO right now. I mean,
who you know, Like this is literally going back twenty
years in time. Yeah, but that's the thing. I mean,
it's still doing the majority of what I want that
experience to do. Like I was flipping and I was like, oh, wow,

(07:01):
the last thirty minutes of Steven Spielberg's Where the World
is playing this kind of.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
Or Brian just curled up in his blanket with a
big smile in his face. This is kind of my bag,
you know.

Speaker 1 (07:13):
And or you can use it as inspiration. So it
was like, you know, I saw that Chasing Amy was on,
I didn't really want to watch it with ads, but
you had mentioned it recently, I think maybe in the
Clueless commentary, and I was like, oh, that might be
interesting to revisit, and so it serves as sort of
an inspiration something I wouldn't have thought of. Actually that's
a bad example because you mentioned it, but like the
dead Zone or you know, something like that where I'm like, oh,

(07:34):
I've never seen the dead Zone, you know, And so
then you go over to your app where it doesn't
have the ads, so it's it's it's not exactly the same,
but I did find like, oh, this is this is
kind of cool. I kind of it's it's scratching, mostly
scratching a certain itch I particularly have, so and toob
is I haven't really gotten into that one, but that

(07:57):
seems more like a streaming service. There is a live
component to it.

Speaker 2 (08:02):
There is, yeah, so well, well, most most of these
on demand streaming services also have a fast write free
ad support at streaming exactly. So, so Peacock has theirs, yes, right,
Amazon has free v right, and there's a bunch I mean, yeah,

(08:23):
it's it's it's just we're in a different time and
you know, if I can lean into the parlance of
this show, it's not a better experience than Froggy, just different.

Speaker 1 (08:33):
Just different.

Speaker 2 (08:34):
You know.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
Well, so I, yes, I found myself. I go to
Pluto the most often because to me, it has the
most options, it feels the most like I'm going back.

Speaker 2 (08:42):
Pluto is the Viacom Paramount one. So that's that's all
that stuff.

Speaker 1 (08:47):
Okay, So yeah, yeah, it's it's uh, it's interesting and
I'm finding my way and I will continue to check
in and let you know how that goes. Oh I
should also mention there was part of me that thought, oh,
I'm going to miss the networks occasionally, just like for
the news or like NBA playoffs or you know, just
certain sorts of things. I would like to at least

(09:09):
be able to have access to them. So I for
twenty bucks on Amazon, I bought an HD antenna, and
I was shocked at how like, again this shows you
how long it's been since I've actually used an antenna.
But it looked like like HD, like crisp, like beautiful,
and so all of a sudden, you know, I have

(09:29):
the Networks again, and then there's basically like Pluto, there's
other sort of live ish TV options playing films and
old sitcoms and stuff. But I but here's the thing.
So I was like, oh, very cool. Now I have ABC, NBC,
CBS whatever. Again, that's cool. It's nice to have those.
And I thought, oh, yeah, and SNL's coming back in

(09:50):
about a month. That'll be nice. But then it occurred
to me, oh, but I can't DVR it and I
can't flip or you know, skip through ads or anything.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
So yeah, yeah, yeah, well and with SNL you can
watch it live on peacock.

Speaker 1 (10:07):
Oh interesting, Okay, so like that's one of.

Speaker 2 (10:11):
Those shows that they that they live stream.

Speaker 1 (10:13):
Well, and then if you have the patience, you can
just watch it the next day. I suppose.

Speaker 2 (10:17):
Yeah. I'm look, I'm at a point now where pretty
much the next morning I'll just go to the SNL
YouTube channel and just watch the individual sketches, and that.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Tends to be my mode. Also, unless it's like I'm
coming back from something pretty late and then I just
want to wind down, I'll cue it up that night's SNL.
But typically it's like a Sunday morning with coffee kind
of affair of these days, so you know. And that's
the other thing too, like the stuff that I'm used
to kind of watching from TV, Like I've been watching
this season of South Park or like blow Deck or something.

(10:45):
Now I'm just used to like, oh, instead on Monday.
Now I watch it Tuesday, you know, like the next day.
I'm a streamer.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yeah whatever, So I mean, look, you're getting habituated to
the new normal, you know. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:54):
And most of the other shows I watch are on
streamers anyway, Like Platonic I've been watching on Apple TV
plus drops, you know, on the day it drops. It's
a whole new world over here.

Speaker 2 (11:05):
And I just thought I would Brian Dispatches from Brian
circa seven years ago. Yes, speaking of south Park, this show,
this season has been pretty nuts.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
Oh yeah, like they're going pretty hard, pretty hard.

Speaker 2 (11:22):
I kind of love that that Paramount handed uh Trey
Parker and Matt Stone what was it, like a billion dollars?

Speaker 1 (11:32):
Yeah, like a billion dollars, a billion.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
With a bee, like the day after they fired Stephen
Colbert for presumably going too hard after the Trump folks,
and then and then the South Park is just like
all right, we will gladly take your billion and and
make you regret ever being born, you know, right right,
It's a lot of yikes. It is funny to me,

(11:55):
Like I was watching this week's episode, the one, the
La Booboo one, and and yeah, there there's so many
different things happening. But but I think for me, my
biggest laugh was was them playing j D Bands like
he's tattoo from oh from Fantasy.

Speaker 1 (12:15):
The way that it was framed, Yeah, and he just
kind of enters frame and like just stands there for
a little bit with that expression on his face like hello, Yeah.
Everything about it was cracking me up.

Speaker 2 (12:26):
I'm just like, man, you know, I we remember when
when South Park started and it was just good clean
fun about Cartman getting a n atal probe, right right,
And now like we're almost thirty years later, here we are.

Speaker 1 (12:41):
I mean that is kind of interesting, right because yeah,
it did used to be the adventures of these kids.
Yeah right, And some of my favorite episodes to this
day are you know, especially the ones involving Butters, Butters
Cartman and uh I. You know, there was a moment
where they were doing nothing but commenting on you know,
news stories of the week where I did find myself
kind of like wandering away for a little bit because

(13:04):
I like, I'm getting enough of this, and it seemed
like they're their moo. Also, they just stumbled into this
pattern where they would lock in on one idea, like
one kind of funny take on something, and they would
just repeat that take for twenty two minutes. Right. But
I do feel like they have this like renewed vigor
right now. Yeah, and it has been you know, pretty fun.

Speaker 2 (13:27):
Hey, you give me a billion dollars, I'll find renewed
vigor too well.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
I also love that they're spending those billions to restore
their favorite childhood restaurants, right know, Casabita and which, by
the way, that's a documentary that's on the Paramount Plus.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
Now you had mentioned that. Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (13:43):
Can't remember what it's called off top my head, but
I'm sure if you put Casa Banita it'll come up.
But it is. It's just it feels like an HGTV,
you know, episode basically falling Trey Parker. Literally, I mean
touring Casa Benita in its current stayed a couple of
years ago, seeing what a disaster it is, and then
people will be like, oh, here's the the ac units.

(14:05):
You want to take a look inside, and they look horrifying.
There's just like every horrifying thing you you do not
want to be breathing, just resting in there. And they're like,
all right, we'll tear that out too, And you just
see the total of the repairs going up and up
and up, you know, millions and millions and millions of dollars.
But then it's just like and then he gets a
new influx of a billion, you know, so he's wow,

(14:25):
he's going to be all right. Yeah, And apparently it's
you have to get reservations still in advance to even
visit that place.

Speaker 2 (14:34):
So really that's there you go. They did all right. Yeah,
by the way, real quick, I wanted to mention when
we talked about your adventures in cord cutting, I know
some people listening might be like, I don't remember that
that was in one of our bonus Patreon episodes.

Speaker 1 (14:49):
Oh yes, that's what it was, so.

Speaker 2 (14:51):
So and that one is available to listen to for
free on our Patreon page, so check that out. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:58):
Yeah, we wanted to offer that is a little bit
of a taste of some of the stuff that we
occasionally release as a bonus content over there on this Yeah. Yeah,
So if you haven't heard it, feel free to hop
on over there and check it out, because it's like
Zachy said, that one is available to everyone.

Speaker 2 (15:14):
So what else is going on brand?

Speaker 1 (15:16):
Well, aside from our main review, I've mostly been watching classics,
catching up on classics that I hadn't seen before, and
so I wanted, you know, it's so funny, I'm such
a booster for Regal cinemas, but I'm gonna do it
again because basically this month, for the month of September,
they are showing classic films almost every single day this month,

(15:43):
everything from I'm going to talk about it for a second,
but I saw Paper Moon this past Monday for the
first time. They're showing Godfather on Saturday, a Citizen Kane
on Sunday, the Thing Forrest Gump, Psycho Cinema Pair Diso,
which I've never seen and I'm very excited to watch
for the first time, Casa Blanca two thousand and one.
There will be blood close encounters. Just every single day

(16:05):
They're showing like a classic film that I would love
to see on the big screen. So I was sort
of like, all right, buckle up, like all the people
at Regal are going to be seeing my face a lot.
But so, yeah, I want to put that out there.
I don't know if it's at every Regal. I was
looking out of curiosity because I knew I was going
to be talking about it, and specifically in my area.
The one that I go to is doing this. But

(16:27):
there's another one that's one or two cities over that
doesn't appear to be doing this, So people may want to.

Speaker 2 (16:32):
Check the app But interesting, Okay, I'm.

Speaker 1 (16:34):
Sure there's at least one, two, three, four things that
people are going to find personally they want to go
check out and see again on the big screen. So
I would recommend that I wanted to put that out
there for people to know about.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
Very cool, but yeah, I just.

Speaker 1 (16:47):
Want to talk really quickly about I saw Paper Moon
for the first time. Peter Bogdanovich, Ryan O'Neil, Tatum O'Neil,
have you ever seen this movie?

Speaker 2 (16:56):
I have not.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
I hadn't either. I'll just the log line real quick
from IMDb. During the Great Depression, a con man finds
himself saddled with a young girl who may or may
not be his daughter, and the two forge an unlikely partnership.
And I don't remember how this got on my radar,
but it was something that I had DVR off of
like Turner Classics, thinking, oh, yeah, I want to watch this.

(17:19):
It's you know, like ninety minutes. It's interesting because it's
from nineteen seventy three, but it's in black and white,
and it very much just even in the filmmaking, resembles
a movie from nineteen forty. It almost feels like a
genre exercise or something. And I was just very curious
about it, so I what better way to watch it

(17:40):
than on the big screen. And I really enjoyed this movie.
It was super charming. I'd recommend it to anybody. It's
I think it's rated PG. It's like a real you know.
I realized that I have a real type with these
movies because I was just talking about matchstick Men, which
is Nicholas very similar, right, He's playing a con man

(18:02):
father figure type to this younger girl. And now I'm
watching this this con man, you know, taking this younger girl.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
What does this tell us about you, Brian? What are
you revealing?

Speaker 1 (18:11):
I don't know, but I love him. I just I
find it so endearing in the way that these character
you know, they're so different. But as they go on
these well speaking to paper Moon, it becomes sort of
episodic where he's going to bring her to her she's
just been orphaned, and so he arranges to bring her

(18:33):
to her aunt, like a couple of states over. But
along the way, he's gonna do these cons to generate money.
But she he finds that she's a pretty good asset.
She's a good little actress. She's very perceptive, and she's
like making him earn even more money as he you know,
cons his way, and so they become this cute, unlikely duo,
and there's just these episodes and people that they encounter

(18:55):
along the way and they you know, influence one another,
and it's very cute and it's a really fun film.
I was glad I got to catch it, especially that
way on the big screen with an audience that was
laughing with it and going aw together.

Speaker 2 (19:11):
You know.

Speaker 1 (19:12):
It was very very cute, and I'm sure you can
find it on most streaming services. But I wanted to
also plug something I try to plug a lot, which
is Canopy. It's an app that you can use your
library card and watch movies uncut, no commercials for free.
So I saw that it's playing on Canopy if anyone
wants to check it out there. What else, Oh, well,

(19:33):
we had mentioned that Spike Lee has a movie out
called Highest to Lowest. That's right, starring Denzel Washington, and
it's a remake of a Kursau movie, and as far
as I understand, it was in theaters for two weeks.
I checked my app and it's still playing next week
for me in theaters. But it is just released today
September fifth, on Apple TV Plus for people who want

(19:54):
to check it out there. But you know, I think
I've mentioned this before also, but a huge cinematic blind
spot for me is Cursawa. I'd never seen a Cursawa
movie before, and I mean there's just so seven Samurai
and Raschamon and all these towering classics that I really
really want to catch up on. But with the Highest

(20:17):
to lowis coming out and I planned to watch that,
I thought, well, you know, I was going to be
on an airplane, Let's what better way to break the seal?
I really watching Cursau film and it was on HBO Max.
I had to think about it. Now, I don't remember
what they're after called anymore, and so I downloaded it,
watched it on the plane, and uh, the premise it

(20:39):
seems a little spoilery, but this is the premise of
the film and it's in the first act. But basically,
this executive at a shoe company his son. These people
call and say, we have your son and you have
to give this amount of money to get him back,
and it's really it's going to bankrupt him if he
does it. But then come to realize they didn't take

(21:02):
his son accidentally. They took his chauffeur's son, and now
he's being held for ransom. So now this executive has
to decide what he's still bankrupt himself for his chauffeurs son.
I mean, how delicious is that? Like that's great and anyway,
great plot. It's you know, it's from nineteen sixty three.

(21:23):
It's a bit of a slower burn than most modern films,
but it just is very captivating. I mean, just the
performances are great, and just the filmmaking, the blocking, like
the blocking makes these static shots become captivating, the way
people move from one spot to another and the way
that they're interacting with one another. And it also becomes
a bit of a procedural and you start following these

(21:44):
detectives as they're trying to figure out who this person is,
you know, who took the boy, and it's just really
cool the clues that they use and how they deduce things.
I think it's about two hours. Like I said, it's
on HBO Max. I definitely recommend High and Low and
I plan to check out Highest to Lois this weekend.

(22:08):
So have you seen it?

Speaker 2 (22:10):
I haven't seen either of them.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Okay, cool, Well, I'll be interested if you check out
either actually.

Speaker 2 (22:14):
To Yeah, well, I'm definitely gonna watch the Spike Lee one. Yeah,
any Spike Lee movie I will I will check out exactly.

Speaker 1 (22:23):
Yeah, at the very least it'll be interesting. Yeah, you know,
an interesting watch. And then this one we can talk
about together. But a week ago they re released Jaws
into theaters for its fiftieth anniversary. Yeah, which I'll just
say really quickly because I want to hear about your experience.
But I saw it on an Imax screen at the

(22:46):
Chinese theater and oh my gosh, it was gorgeous. Just
the restoration is it's pretty pretty impressive.

Speaker 2 (22:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:55):
Yeah, and then you know, I've seen. I had seen
this in the theater before when they released it as
a three D experience, maybe two or three years ago
or something like that, and I really enjoyed that. I
don't like three D, and it was really well done
and didn't put you at a distance. It actually successfully
pulled you in. But this, I mean on this Imax screen,

(23:18):
and it was it was huge. I mean, the shark
felt big again. You know, I've seen this movie so
many times, but when the shark busts into Quint's ship,
it really did make you lean back in your seat
because it was coming right at you. I loved it.
I love the experience. And I would say, if it's
still playing at a theater near your place and you

(23:40):
haven't caught it, it is absolutely worth heading out to
go catch. Yeah, what was your experience, like.

Speaker 2 (23:46):
Well, I mean I saw it when they released it
three years ago in theaters. Okay, you know that was
I don't know what the context of that release was.
It was, you know, they had they had put Et
back out into theaters. I think just so they put
Jaws out too, as like a companion to.

Speaker 1 (24:07):
That, maybe a fathom thing.

Speaker 2 (24:09):
It was not a fathom thing because it was at
is that the amc M anyway regardless, So I obviously
any chance for me to watch Jaws on the big screen,
but I had taken all my kids this year. My
kids are like, oh, let's go see it, like they
wanted to experience it again on the big screen, and
so this time I did the four D thing. Oh okay, yeah,

(24:33):
which I've never done before, and I was like, well,
this is a movie that I've seen enough times that
want to mix it up a little bit, so, uh,
nothing crazy, Like we weren't getting dunked in water, and
you know.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
Did it splash you at all? Because I mean it
does have a water component, not the.

Speaker 2 (24:48):
One we saw.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
Oh okay, oh you could, I know you also you
could have the option if you want to turn it off.

Speaker 2 (24:55):
Oh say. I didn't to the best of my knowledge
that there wasn't anything like that been in my theater.
But maybe maybe there wasn't. I just didn't know. But
I kind of loved how the movement of your seat
was sort of in sync with whatever was happening. And
you know, when you're when you're on the ORCA, you're
the it was kind of going swaying back and forth

(25:17):
and interesting, some cool stuff, you know, not again nothing crazy.
So like when when quint is bit in half, it's
not like you're getting splashed with blood or anything like that,
but it did add something extra, you know. So I again,
for me, it's like, well, this is a movie you've
seen enough times that, uh, you know, zazz it up
a little bit. But I would imagine, just to echo
the point you were making in an earlier episode, if

(25:39):
it was my first time watching a movie, I'd probably
be a little distracted by it, m you know. But
but for this kind of perfect.

Speaker 1 (25:47):
Dude, that's great. I mean, that's the thing. I have
a complicated relationship with it because I think if someone
with forty not with Jaws, no, yeah, yeah, yeah, no
with forty X. My friend actually his first when he
presented it was forty X or IMAX, and I was like, IMAX,
no question. Like I just my first reaction is probably

(26:07):
going to be to say no to forty X.

Speaker 2 (26:10):
Right.

Speaker 1 (26:10):
But that isn't to say that I haven't had good
experiences there. I remember the last Hunger Games movie was
actually pretty good.

Speaker 2 (26:16):
Yeah you mentioned that, that's right.

Speaker 1 (26:17):
Yeah, because it it was a little more subtle it,
you know, there was snow in the movie, and it
kind of gently snowed in the theater when that happened.
And I remember the best experience I had had with
forty X and it's so small, but this woman was
inside a building and then she walked through a doorway
to the outside, and this gentle breeze went through the
theater and I really felt like I had stepped outside.

(26:39):
I mean that that's the stuff. That's pretty cool. But
I've watched other things, excuse me, they're a little more violent,
you know, like shaking you in your seat, punching you
in your back, and I just I don't know it.

Speaker 2 (26:51):
It's it starts sounding like a Saturday Night Live sketch,
doesn't it.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. But but on the other hand, I
did see Twister, the old one the night ninety five
to one, and of course that one was pretty intense.
I mean there was lightning, there was it literally rained
on us from the ceiling. The seats were going all
over the place. But it kind of worked, right, I
don't know. So it could even have to do with

(27:15):
the person who programmed it, you know that that.

Speaker 2 (27:18):
Was my thinking. Yeah, yeah, So, like I was wondering
with Jaws like, did Spielberg sit in the chair and
sign off on all the stuff that they had to do?
You know?

Speaker 1 (27:28):
I wondered that too, actually if he because I thought
the thing that I saw the presentation was so beautiful.
I wondered. But I was like, he's seen this stuff
so many times, and he has so many things that
get re released. I wonder how much of this stuff
actually gets put in front of him or if he
just I don't know.

Speaker 2 (27:44):
Yeah, but that was my question. But regardless it was
it was a good experience. Obviously, we skipped watching, you know, normally.
On fourth of July, we watched Jaws, and I knew
it was coming back to theaters, so I was like,
you know, let's just hold off and we can see
it in the theater. But afterwards, my eleven year old
was like, O, can we watch Jaws two? And I

(28:04):
was like, yeah, sure, you know, and and so he
and I watched that one and and I would say
that the best time to watch Jaws two is when
you're eleven years old and you've just watched Jaws one,
you know what I mean? Because because he just sort
of took it at face valley and he's like, yeah,
I liked it. I like the first time better, but

(28:25):
this was good, you know, And I'm like.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
Sure, that's great, right, yeah, yeah, well that's nice. I
like that. Well, real quick, I want to ask if
you had heard speaking of forty X about you know,
there's this upcoming movie, The Long Walk.

Speaker 2 (28:42):
That's right, Stephen King, right, yes, yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
So it's some dystopian future and like these kids are
basically forced to walk until they can walk no longer,
and if you stop walking, you get killed. Okay, And
apparently there are immersive experiences where you can watch this
movie on a tr readmill.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
Yeah. No, that's that's a no for me.

Speaker 1 (29:03):
I was like, you know, I'm kind of interested.

Speaker 2 (29:07):
I don't know, it sounds it's a hard pass. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:10):
I don't know if this is something that they're really
going to be doing most places. It could even just
be like some something they did for like influencers.

Speaker 2 (29:16):
I don't I don't need to be living the dystopia.

Speaker 1 (29:20):
Yeah, have Mark Hamill behind you just yelling.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
In your ears? Maybe in that case maybe.

Speaker 1 (29:26):
Yeah. I just thought that was kind of funny.

Speaker 2 (29:30):
I have seen the new season of Peacemaker, Brian, okay,
season two right, season two? Now you have not seen
the first season, right, No, I haven't. Yeah, now peace
Maker the first see. This is an interesting one because
this show sort of straddles two different versions of the
dc Universe, hmm, right, And and so that's sort of
interesting because it gives us a window into how James

(29:53):
gun Is is incorporating prior aspects and what he's not.
And so I don't get into it too much, I
will say this is very much existing in the post
Superman twenty twenty five world, you know, So it's picking
up on plot threads from there. Meanwhile, it's picking up
also on season one of Peacemaker, which again was part

(30:18):
of the old Zack Snyder version of the universe.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
Interesting.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
So it's funny because the very first episode of the
season starts with the little recap and it says previously
in the DCU, right, And as we know, the new
version of the universe is called the DCU. Right, So
in essence, everything that's recapped is considered part of the DCU.

(30:44):
And this is all like a bunch of fanboy hugger mugger,
I'm sure, but like they do this thing where the
first season ends with the Justice League shows up and
the Justice League is you know, we see silhouettes of
Superman and Wonder Woman and uh and and we have

(31:06):
Jason Momoa as Aquaman and Ezra Miller as as the
Flash and so we see them, we see them and
they have some some dialogue and there's a joke about
how uh Peacemaker is is spreading this rumor that that
Aquaman has sex with Fish. And then Aquaman's like, I

(31:27):
wish people would stop, you know, spreading that rumor. And
then Ezra Miller's like, it's not a rumor, you know,
and and he's like if you berry, you know. And
so at the beginning of this season, they do the
recap and they show they show that it's not the
Justice League, it's the Justice Gang.

Speaker 1 (31:45):
Mm.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
Interesting, So they did a little like a d R
where a character is like, can you call in the
Justice Gang instead of the Justice League? And then and
then we see a silhouette of Superman, a silhouette of Supergirl,
and we see a Hawk Girl and Gardner.

Speaker 1 (32:00):
Oh funny, And.

Speaker 2 (32:02):
So they've like retconned that instead of a rumor about
Aquaman having sex with Fish, it's a rumor about how
Guy Gardner is a has a puke fetish, and so
they just they just again, it's just in there. It's
before the episode even starts, it's in the recap. This
is a little ret con, right, And and I was like,

(32:23):
I just found I was tickled by that because I'm like, yeah, well,
this is this is like if you've if you've read
DC comics for any length of time, this is just
this is part of the course. This is just a
Tuesday when it comes to DC because they're ret conning
shit all the time. Sure, and you have to have
a scorecard of what still cannon and what's not. And

(32:43):
I'm like, oh, hey, so we're just doing that in
live action. And I'm like that's pretty funny to me.
But it's been amusing to see sort of online just
people people getting really frustrated trying to figure this out.
And I'm like, I'm like, oh, oh, precious child, you
know this is you know, they're just doing in in

(33:05):
in live action what they've been doing in the comics
for decades.

Speaker 1 (33:09):
So they didn't even say some sort of like multiverse,
oh there was a lightning storm by a generator. Yeah, no,
Fermi lab yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (33:21):
I mean the idea is like some of what happened
before it counts some of it, didn't, you know, when
we once we refer to it, consider it cannon, which,
by the.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
Way, I mean obviously I watch a lot of this stuff,
so I'm a little bit conditioned, but I just feel
like we're in a moment now where I see that
and I go.

Speaker 2 (33:42):
All right, I mean really right, like how much? How
much do you want to get worked up over this stuff?

Speaker 1 (33:48):
Right? Right?

Speaker 2 (33:50):
So so the series it is extremely r rated.

Speaker 1 (33:54):
Yeah, you even just talking about the puke stuff or whatever,
it's like, oh, this is goun sort of like like
almost like he was half holding his breath while he
was writing Superman and doing that. He can be like
and just sort of let what he's been a bit
pent up.

Speaker 2 (34:09):
In the In the first episode, there's a full on
org scene where you see everything. Oh wow, yeah, so
don't don't don't gather around the kiddies like kids, did
you like Superman? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (34:24):
I mean I can't think of specific examples, but it
does feel like, well, I mean I just Star Wars
or Marvel or whatever. It does feel like when they
do their shows they don't push things well, because there
was the Netflix Marvel that felt a little bit more
R rated, right, Daredevil and everything. Yeah, but it was
sort of understood that if you watch something with the

(34:45):
Marvel logo at the beginning, whether on Disney Plus or
you know, in the theater, you're gonna be in the
same arena in terms of like age appropriateness. Right, So
this is interesting that this is just sort of without
even any sort of warning or it's like, hey, like Superman,
you got this thing over here too, and then you
don't exactly know what you're stepping into.

Speaker 2 (35:05):
It sounds like, I mean, I look, I I I
think that personally, I think these brands should be pushing
out in these directions more. I think we should just
be able to encompass multitudes. Sure, I think I think that,
you know, well, like Marvel, well they got their Daredevil,

(35:27):
you know, they brought back Daredevil. That's pretty R rated.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
They got there, They got there, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:31):
And they got this Marvel Zombies coming up that shir
doesn't look like you know, it's going to be TVPG
And I'm like good, you know, like, you know, I
I think that that what parent is going to watch
Peacemaker with their kid? You know, I would I would
offer a bad parent, right, because.

Speaker 1 (35:51):
It's funny you say that, because I was actually thinking
more than you think.

Speaker 2 (35:54):
Yeah, and and all of them bad, every single I mean,
you know, do some due diligence, you know, well like
watch it first?

Speaker 1 (36:06):
Sure, sure, yeah, I mean that's what you would hope
most parents would do vet things for their kids. And yeah,
who knows.

Speaker 2 (36:14):
Uh real quick. I wanted to mention also, so the
Peacemaker season is playing out right now. I think we're
about three episodes in. By the way, have you watched Alien,
the Alien TV series? No?

Speaker 1 (36:27):
I meant to, and then this month got a little busy. Yeah,
and then I even thought like, well, I'll binge it
at some point.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
That's kind of where I'm at.

Speaker 1 (36:37):
And I'm hearing sort of tepid things about it.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
So well, here I'm hearing reactions spanning the spectrum, okay,
because I have people who are singing its praises week
upon week. Okay, and then people are like, God, this
thing is just dull as a dishrag. So yeah, I
don't know.

Speaker 1 (36:55):
Well, I'm very curious to hear what you think. Maybe
I'll it'll be easier when there's you know, six in
a row. I can just sort of do it my
own pace.

Speaker 2 (37:04):
Yeah. You know. The critic who reviewed it for The
Chronicles that it's the best thing that's happened with the
franchise in decades, and that has me kind of interesting.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
I do love the idea of stories, like I don't
neither to be a monster movie every week. I like
the idea of there being stories set in this universe,
in particular, I guess on Earth, which is kind of interesting.
So I'm cool with that. Like, I'm cool with exploring
the world a little bit and not having to be yeah,
you know, thrill a minute per se, as long as

(37:36):
there's good characters and intriguing ideas.

Speaker 2 (37:40):
The only thing I and look, I don't know anything
about the show except that it's set before the first film, right,
but it's set on Earth, and that has me confused
a little bit.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
Sure, yeah, right.

Speaker 2 (37:55):
As far as how that, I mean, we're just talking
about canon and stuff. But I got as it fit in,
you know.

Speaker 1 (38:00):
Yeah, I and Noah Holly, who I tend to like
the Yeah, Fargo. I really liked Fargo. The TV show
was skeptical when it started. I want to say, there's
like four or five seasons, and I've really liked maybe
three of them pretty pretty much liked one of them,
and there was one that I most people seem to
not like, and I haven't gotten around to that one,

(38:21):
but I would say, by and large pretty good.

Speaker 2 (38:23):
Yeah, very weird, very.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
I don't know how, but they've managed to remix Fargo
in a weird sort of way with new characters and
new ideas but still feel like, Yeah, that feels kind
of like the movie Fargo without repeating itself. And so
it's it's I would say it was a successful experiment.
So I find him pretty interesting. And so seeing how
he remixes or builds out alien that universe, I'm curious.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
One last thing I wanted to mention, and this is
a show. It's a mini series that's starting on HBO
this weekend as we record this UH, and it's called
Task I don't know, Yeah, it's it's UH. It's created
by Brad Inglesby, who did Mayor of Easttown, Okay, and
it's kind of set in the same did you see

(39:15):
Mary Beastown?

Speaker 1 (39:16):
No, I'm familiar with.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
It, Yeah, with with Kate Winslet. So so this UH
has Mark Ruffalo as the head of an FBI task
force that's trying to find some criminals who are doing
these uh smash and grabs in various people's houses. And
it's essentially I mean it's it's like an eight episode

(39:37):
investigation or seven episodes. Excuse me, and I I I
I like the show, like I would recommend it more
for the performances than the the Like the criminal storyline.
I didn't find that particularly compelling, But I think I
think Ruffalo as the main character, I mean, he's just great. Obviously,

(40:02):
at no point does he say they knew, which is
disappointing to me.

Speaker 1 (40:05):
I was gonna ask, so he requests that from you.

Speaker 2 (40:09):
I he plays uh An, an ex priest who has
lost his faith, and and he's he's working in it
as an FBI agent, and there's a reason for that.
And I think that that arc that they give him
is really interesting. He's such a great actor, you know,
And I think a lot of these actors, the older

(40:30):
they get, the more sort of character they have on
their face, you know. I think I think Ruffalo is
one of those guys. And also the the the the
the the criminal that they're pursuing. His name is Tom
Pelfrey and the actor is Tom Pelfrey. Who he was.
He was on Ozark.

Speaker 1 (40:48):
Okay, I didn't watch Ozark.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
He's very good. He was very good on Ozark from
what I saw, and he's very good here. So both
of them are really good. Uh. I think the the
upside is it's it's only seven episodes, which is kind
of nice, right, like yeah, yeah, it's like, you know,
it's not a season long thing, and so in that sense,
I think the arcs that they set up in the

(41:11):
beginning payoff pretty well. I watched it all at once.
I don't know how it'll play week to week, but
it is being dropped every week on HBO, and I
would recommend it, if nothing else, just for the performances.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
You know, now that you describe it. I do remember
seeing a trailer for this, okay, at least a month ago,
maybe even more, and I remember thinking, yeah, it just
looked I couldn't put my finger on exactly why, but
it did feel compelling, like yeah, like, oh that's something
that maybe I would give a shot, just because maybe
it's what you were saying. The performances were drawing me in.

Speaker 2 (41:48):
Yeah. As I was watching it, I was like, you know,
I would love to see the Ruffalo arc in support
of like more of an episodic procedural where we're going
from case to case, but we've got these you know,

(42:09):
I mean again kind of what you see on a
traditional network show, where you've got these character arcs that
we're following, but but we're like we're the you know,
you're you're not living or dying based on how interesting
the case itself is, you know, right, But but still
I would still recommend it. It's not it didn't blow
me away, but I did find it compelling. I think

(42:32):
the performance make it worth while. Honestly, this is this
is just a month or so after that that that
other show that I mentioned called Untamed with with Eric
Banna oh right, yeah, yeah, which is on Netflix. And
the truth is the two of them kind of make
for an interesting double header because because again kind of
the same drill. Eric Banna playing a very similar character

(42:54):
to to to what Ruffalo is playing. Hm hm, you know,
he's he's uh, he's an officer and he's got this
personal trauma he's working through. And you know, for me,
it's like sometimes you just want to watch these great
actors just just really make a meal out of this.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
You know, Oh, totally you know, you know, I was
just googling really fast because when you were talking about
it being more about the character and less about the case,
I wondered if it was based on a book or something, right,
and it doesn't look like it is. But according to
the showrunner, this was inspired by his real life uncle

(43:31):
who used to be a priest, so it's coming from somewhere.
The character study of.

Speaker 2 (43:35):
It, that's interesting. Yeah, yeah, I mean, well that that
journey is always very compelling to me, right, I mean
I think that's why I think you and I both
really liked mel Gibson's character and signs. Yeah, right, like
what what what does one go through when they're confronted
with you know, their their faith being shad in some

(44:00):
way and having to reclaim it.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
It's a great example because when I think of that movie,
that's almost what I think about first. Yeah, right, for
the Aliens. Yeah, it's the lead character's personal story and
an alien invasion is the backdrop to his you know,
his searching and his growth.

Speaker 2 (44:20):
Yeah, it's so funny. You know, this past week in
my class, I was talking about standard narrative structure, and
you know, you start at a state of equilibrium and
then and then some some question is introduced, some enigma,
and then that leads to disequilibrium, and then we're trying
to get back to equilibrium, right, And I was like,
you know, that's structure. It's a pretty sturdy thing, and
you can you can you can look at it and

(44:42):
just apply it to just about any film. But you
know what I kept trying to to emphasize to my
students is we're talking about the emotional journey. That's what
you got you need to figure out, right, you know,
like why do we care about you know, Luke Skywalker whoever.

(45:02):
It's because because you've set an emotional journey for him
to go on and involves him going through all these
these actions. But it's because we're invested in in how
he grows as a person or whatever. You know.

Speaker 1 (45:14):
Absolutely, and I said growth regarding Signs and Bill Gibson,
but I would say that character it's more about healing,
you know, and that's just really compelling and heart wrenching
and you know, satisfying to watch sometimes. And actually I
mean that you can talk about that with Cott Stealing today.

Speaker 2 (45:32):
Yeah, right, I.

Speaker 1 (45:32):
Mean I was surprised how much it was a character story.

Speaker 2 (45:35):
Very much.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
So.

Speaker 2 (45:36):
Yeah, Hey, we got some listener letters though, Brian, well
be you have eighteen thousands all addressed.

Speaker 1 (45:54):
You've got Mayo.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
Uh so, hey, here's a note we got on Facebook
from Marshall Perry and this is in regards to your
adventures with cutting the cord. Brian. Oh all right, so,
he says, Oh man, I lived vicariously through Brian Hall
and how he would watch movies just because he came
across them on cable randomly. Right, he says, I've been

(46:18):
paralyzed by choice for over a decade, and I missed
the bygone era of simply watching what came on. I
learned to love so many movies simply because I was
forced to give them a chance. By the way, thanks
for putting that feature presentation sound bite from nineties VHS
tapes before your reviews. Hearing that again after so many

(46:38):
years and knowing exactly what it was is why I'm
still listening to every episode of this podcast for ten years.

Speaker 1 (46:45):
Oh, thank you for that.

Speaker 2 (46:48):
You know we've talked about this before, about how like
you and I and our generation like we watched Gilgian's
Island because it was on, Yes, know, we watched the
Monsters and the Adams family and all this stuff, right,
Brady Bunch exactly predated us because that's what was on.

(47:08):
And I I look back, and I'm so grateful for
that because it's part of my the mosaic of my life,
you know. Yeah, And and and we really don't have
that because because what Marshall says about being paralyzed by choice. Man,
that seriously, that's that speaks for so many of us.

Speaker 1 (47:28):
Hm.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
Right, Like, like my my brother, he uses my voodoo
and and I'll be like, hey, you should watch this movie,
or you should watch this movie. For for for for
ten damn years, I've been telling him to watch Arrival, Okay,
the you know, the dni Villeneuve movie. Yeah, and this
is a movie I know he will like. And he's like,

(47:51):
I know I would like it. But every time I
go to your voodoo, I just I see all the
things and I just forget what I'm looking for. Yeah,
And he's like, he said to me, He's like, would
you mind curating a list for me of things you
think I would like?

Speaker 1 (48:07):
Hmm, a little personal video store for him.

Speaker 2 (48:10):
To Yeah exactly. I'm like like, just this is you know,
and I've done that for AMNNA and and you know,
I was thinking, I was like, this is you know,
this is the trade off, right, like back back in
the days of like we're talking pre cable, you had
three networks. Yeah, and that made things easier because it's

(48:32):
a one third chance you're gonna find something m or
you'll just turn it off, so one out of four,
you know, And and you know, paralyzed by choice. That's
so applicable because because how many times do we do
we just scroll through Netflix and just say I don't
even know.

Speaker 1 (48:50):
Yeah, you know, it's and the difference is, yes, you
are scrolling through Netflix, but you're just looking at tiles
with pictures on them. But when I was a kid,
I mean that's how I discovered They Live.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
You know.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
It was eleven thirty at night and I was flipping
in Channel fifty in the Chicago Land area. Was halfway
through They Live, and I saw a guy wearing sunglasses
and when he put them on, suddenly normal people look
like aliens. And I was like, well, what's this? You know,
but I might not have clicked on the tile. Yeah,
if I was flipping through you know, Netflix or something
and spinal tap. That's how I first saw spinal tap

(49:22):
flipping channels, you know, back in the day, and I
don't know, there's just something kind of magical about it.
But the paralyzed by choice thing is interesting. And also
the other thing he said where he forgets why he
opened up the app in the first place, what he
was looking for. I think I've talked about this before,

(49:43):
but I have in the past several years. The app
I use most on my phone is the notes app. Like,
I have a to do list that I write every
single day. I even put lunch on there, just for
the satisfaction of being able to cross off things as
I get through my day, and it's very helpful and satisfying.
And then people will be like, oh, you know tomorrow
is such and such birthday. I oh, just it's habit now.

(50:06):
I put it in the notes app, and then I
don't forget these things. And one of the notes that
I keep is it's called to watch. And so when
people recommend things to me, I have a whole long
list of recommendations. And then I also have things that
are sort of at the top of my mind right now,
things that I feel like I'm kind of in the
mood for. So there's maybe like five or six or

(50:27):
seven things there. So when it's nighttime and I'm not
sure what I want to click on, I look at
that app or the note and I'm, oh, yeah, actually,
I'm kind of in the paper moon mood tonight, you know,
versus like the more violent gangster movie or whatever. And
I find that personally very helpful.

Speaker 2 (50:45):
Well, there you go. Hopefully Marshall finds that helpful too.

Speaker 1 (50:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:50):
Here's a note we got from Rob Kelly, and this
is in reference to our commentary track for Terminator Genesis,
a film that neither you nor I had particular affinity
four before we hit play or after. And Rob says,
it's a testament to how much I like your commentaries
that I listened to this because hot take incoming. I

(51:14):
think there's exactly one good Terminator movie, the first one
that is a hot take, that is hot take. But
this was such a fun listen with you guys trying
to stay positive under what had to be challenging circumstances.
A great listen.

Speaker 1 (51:30):
Wow, thank you, Rob.

Speaker 2 (51:33):
So exactly one good Terminator movie, Brian.

Speaker 1 (51:36):
I was gonna say, I mean you could even say
maybe a hot take is that The first one is
the best one. Yeah, you know, but it's like, oh.

Speaker 2 (51:44):
Well, you know, I.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
Can see why you might feel that way, but just
only the first one. Yeah, that's the only good one. Wow,
them is fighting words.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Now you're not with us, we say, hey live and
let live.

Speaker 1 (51:59):
But yeah, sure, but I was gonna say, I I
saw the second one first. That's right, And so I
mean I am that's alike a Brian Cannon event in
that movie. But I can imagine possibly if you saw
the first one in eighty four first, and that got
seered into your psyche for several years. The sequel didn't

(52:20):
come till several years later, then thinking that as good
as the second one is, you know, it just didn't
have the same impact on you. I can imagine that.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (52:30):
Actually no, I can't what am I saying? But I
appreciate I appreciate you Rob.

Speaker 2 (52:37):
Yeah, well I I saw the first one first. I
think we've talked about this, But again, I was I
was five when I saw the first one. Sure, you know,
so I was. I was still my my, my wet,
my my wet cement was was ready and willing for
whatever the second one had to offer. You know, thank

(52:59):
you for that. Here's a comment we got on YouTube,
and this is you know, the great thing about having
our stuff on YouTube is people dig real deep into
the archives. So this is from Luke's mail twenty four
and this is in reference to our commentary track for
Superman three, which it has been a minute since we
did that one.

Speaker 1 (53:20):
But I remember it. I remember recording that because it
was so much fun.

Speaker 2 (53:24):
So he says, awesome commentary as usual. I remember, even
as a kid seeing this movie in the nineteen eighties,
and even as a five year old thinking what are
you doing? It is still one of the most baffling
creative decisions ever to me. You have two massive blockbusters
and you decide to center the third film around a comedian,

(53:45):
a hugely popular one, I grant you, but still it
would be like centering Avengers Doomsday around Dave Chappelle. I get,
I kind of want to watch that now. I get
humors subjective, but have you ever heard anyone say Superman
three is hilarious? That's a good that's very funny. To me,

(54:06):
this film is one of the biggest missed opportunities in history,
and for that reason, probably in the minority here. I
even prefer to watch the much more hated Superman four.
Even with that film's massive faults, I can go well,
at least its heart was in the right place.

Speaker 1 (54:21):
I agree with that take.

Speaker 2 (54:22):
By the way, Superma, I don't know that that is
a minority take. I feel like I feel like that idea, like, well,
at least it's trying to tell like a serious story.

Speaker 1 (54:32):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's like a good bad movie.

Speaker 2 (54:36):
Yeah. I think they're both bad in different ways.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
Yeah, of fun bad.

Speaker 2 (54:41):
Fun bad. Yeah, maybe good might be, might be yeah,
a walk too far right, But I think both of
them have have their their pluses, foremost among them being
Christopher Reeve is just acting as ass off under what
I can only imagine very trying circumstances.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:59):
Yeah, Speaking of Superman, here is a note I got
from Sandy. They said, Hey, Zachy, love the show and
have been listening for more than ten years. I always
enjoy the way you and Brian take a balanced approach
whenever you're discussing your reactions to movies and don't get
too bogged down by all the fanboy shit that we
see on the internet. That said, I have a question.

(55:19):
I was hoping you might be able to clarify for me.
I see so much discussion online about how Superman the
new movie, the twenty twenty five movie is a big
hit and Man of Steel was a big flop. I
have to admit this is a little confusing for me.
Man of Steel made something like six hundred and seventy
million worldwide and Superman is topping out at just over

(55:41):
six hundred million. Granted, I'm a big Man of Steel fan,
and I definitely liked that one more than the new one,
but I don't think I'm biased, and I'm asking why
the disparity and how these numbers are being reported. Hope
this is something you can tackle.

Speaker 1 (55:57):
Yeah, I'm actually yeah, curious to hear you.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
Well, Okay, so first of all, Man of Steel is
like retrospectively being called a flop. It by who by folks.
See this is the problem. You got folks at the
gendas on either side, right, yeah, And this is look.
Man of Steel is not a flop. Yeah, yeah, I
mean it just wasn't. It did very well. Now, you

(56:24):
might have had people inside the studio who were hoping
it was going to touch a billion dollars. Sure, but
that was We've talked about this before, that that's a
weird metric. M hm, right, I'm sure because at twenty thirteen,
so it was shortly after the Dark Knight rises, so
they were like, oh, Christopher Nolan, do you know, No,

(56:45):
it's gonna make Dark Knight money. But like, why would
you think that.

Speaker 1 (56:48):
I forgot that Christopher Nolan, his name was on Man
of Steel. No, I talk about that.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
Yeah, I mean they used that to really promote the
shit out of it, right right, right, and that that
was unreasonable. But at the time, making six hundred and
seventy million dollars, well, that was a big deal. And
and you know, it did well enough for them to
announce the follow up, you know, within whatever it was

(57:17):
like six weeks, right, because it came out June of
twenty thirteen. By July at Comic Con they announced Baman
Versus Superman. Right now, I'm sure they're thinking, was, oh,
if we put Batman in the sequel, then it'll make
a billion, right. Didn't do that either. That's a separate discussion, right.
But Man of Steel by itself, that was a that
did well. So this idea that Man is Steel flopped

(57:42):
and Superman is not a flop is not true. They
both have done Okay, Now, as far as Superman's box office,
I haven't looked into this, but I'm fairly certain. Well,
you know, we can, we can look at it around.

Speaker 1 (57:55):
Yeah yeah, I was just thinking, yeah, I don't having
this pulled up, but I'm curious now.

Speaker 2 (58:01):
I'm guessing that if we were to look at the
difference in numbers, there would be a China sized difference. Right, yeah,
look at this. There we go. So this is from Forbes.
It says Man of Steel finished at sixty three million

(58:23):
in China. Okay, so there we go. Right there, China
is not interested in superhero movies anymore. So what we
were seeing throughout the twenty tens was was Chinese box
office was rescuing American movies that happened to Terminator Genesis

(58:44):
as a matter of fact, yep.

Speaker 1 (58:46):
And there was a lot of effort right on us
filmmaker's behalf to appease them, right, I mean, wasn't it.
Iron Man three had like an entire scene that wasn't
even in the US cut, but it was in the
China version.

Speaker 2 (59:00):
That featured yeah that's right, Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:02):
Chinese actors, and it also featured Chinese products. Funny, right,
like a soda or something, but we didn't see that.
But just to try to get the Chinese money, yep,
Marvel went the extra mile.

Speaker 2 (59:16):
Yeah, one of the Transformers movies had a big China
set piece.

Speaker 1 (59:19):
Yep, yep.

Speaker 2 (59:20):
Right, So so there there's the distinction. As far as Superman.
Look it. What's the most up to date box office
as we're recording this, the current one?

Speaker 1 (59:32):
Yeah, domestic three hundred and fifty two million, worldwide six
hundred and twelve.

Speaker 2 (59:37):
Six hundred and twelve. Look that. I mean that that is,
if we live in a world where six hundred and
twelve is considered a flop, then I don't even know
what we're doing. It's not a flop. A flop, no.
Do I think Warner Brothers hoped it might do better? Yeah,
totally probably, But I just think that the landscape for

(59:57):
superhero movies has changed drastically.

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
Landscape for superhero movies and just movies that too. Yeah,
I mean, it's really it's something's taking me a very
long time to catch up with. I continue to be
shocked when I look at the box office numbers every weekend,
but this is because they're so insanely low, Like it'll
blow my mind when number ten at the box office
could be less than a million, like this is unprecedented,

(01:00:21):
But the fact is it's kind of becoming precedented, like
that we're in a new era.

Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
We are in a new era. And here's the other
thing to think about is, you know, we were just
talking about the Dark Knight Rises, which broke a billion
dollars Batman Begins. Batman Begins made about three hundred and
seventy million.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
Worldwide, right right, right right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:40):
And this is the thing, right because because box office
is only one one part of this, because Batman Begins
did okay relative to his box office. But what was
it trying to do? I mean, it was coming back
after eight years and Batman and Robin there was a
lot of reclamation that had to happen, right, and then
you know, word of mouth on it was good, and
then it continued to play on home video. And I

(01:01:02):
have a feeling that whatever happens next with Superman and
you tell me, I mean, just anecdotally, the feeling from
people like random people who have no real connection to
this or like, man, I really enjoyed that movie.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
Yeah yeah, I mean my parents loved it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:20):
See, and that's something that is sort of intangible, but
I think it's going to matter going forward.

Speaker 1 (01:01:27):
You know, speaking of a new era. We were talking
about this recently. It's interesting that the box office numbers are,
for some reason the final statement on a film's success. Yeah,
for many people, right, because yes, Superman at this point,
which is now streaming six hundred and twelve worldwide, got it.

(01:01:49):
But it's also now in it's streaming, you can rent it,
you can purchase it, and that's going to make millions
and millions more dollars. But that doesn't get tacked on
to this number that we see on box office Mojo,
you know, when it's playing on airplanes, when it's you know,
streaming on TBS for the next forty years, you know

(01:02:10):
what I mean, Like, yeah, it will continue to accumulate money,
but we don't. The number has stopped for some reason
with box office alone. So I mean you think of
something like Office Space, right where that was a movie
if you look at its box office. I mean it
was really, really bad, but that's a movie that's never
gone away, and it was an enormous one of the

(01:02:33):
top or was it. I'm thinking of Tommy Boy actually,
now where Tommy Boy didn't really perform in theaters. But
then they learned that it was one of the best
selling DVDs in Paramount's history, or at least home video
releases in Paramount's history. And I think it was David
Spade was talking about it. He's like, you mean, like
alongside the Godfather. They're like, yeah, no, like Tommy boy
sits alongside the Godfather in terms of profitability for Paramount

(01:02:56):
through home video. So it's life doesn't end for a
movie's success once the box office numbers have shut down,
and especially in this new era where movies can still
be playing in theaters, but they are having a meaningful
moment in this p VODA you know era where it

(01:03:20):
can be a month later. Superman is still in theaters,
but now it is also available for people to watch
at home at a premium price, right, you know, thirty
dollars a pop or to rent for twenty dollars a pop.
You know what I'm saying. So it's I don't know,
it's just funny that we use these numbers. The box
office numbers is the end all be all for these discussions.
When it's right, It'd be much more interesting if there's

(01:03:42):
a running tally.

Speaker 2 (01:03:43):
I think that would certainly be more more truthful. Yeah, right,
I will say with regards to Superman, I think I
mentioned this before. I mean, I purchased the digital copy,
so I have it available at home, and I'm and
just like, I want to watch Superman again. And she
never watches movies more than once in the theater. And
I'm like, okay, well we can watch it, you know,

(01:04:03):
we can watch it to you know, before we go
to bed. She's like, no, I don't want to watch
it at home. I want to watch it in the theater.
We own it, we own it. Yeah. And so I
was like, well, fine, So we went to the theater. Yeah,
and it was great because it was like a Monday afternoon,
so it was just the two of us. We had
a private screening of Superman. That's great, you know, But

(01:04:25):
I mean that's kind of my point, right Inaya, who's eight,
she she's watched it three times already, once in the theater,
twice at home. Wow, she doesn't, I mean you know
what I mean, Like, this stuff is anecdotally very interesting
to me because for whatever reason that that movie is
speaking to people. But again, just to reiterate, look, Man
of Steel did well enough to warrant a follow up

(01:04:46):
announcement right away. And so that movie did not flop,
nor nor did Superman. So we don't need to pit
these against each other. Believe it or not, It's possible
to like multiple versions. It's not revolution.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
I mean that's the other thing too, where it is
interesting just to sort of compare notes a little bit
and then move on. But it's just at what point, like,
why do you have so much invested in this?

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
You know, that's what I dud You know, I've said this.
I've said this so many times. Unless that money is
coming out of or going into my pocket, I do
not care. It's just a movie that I either enjoy
or don't enjoy.

Speaker 1 (01:05:23):
Yeah, and maybe that's another thing, I mean, being fans
as long as we have. I mean, there was probably
a moment where I was a little bit more invested
in this and interested in the volley discussion about what
was successful and what wasn't. But at this point, I'm
just like, I don't know, I don't know what it.
It doesn't gain me anything, Like I'm not getting points
off of its box office, right, I mean, I can

(01:05:45):
be rooting for something I like to be successful so
they'll make more, yeah for sure, But otherwise, like I
just it just feels like a spiraling thing that will
go nowhere.

Speaker 2 (01:05:55):
Well with that in mind, I mean, while we're on
the subject, we do have a little bit of a
headline about potential follow up to Supermantra Extra Man a
lot of School. So this got announced just earlier this week.
Kind of surprised. I was honestly surprised that that they

(01:06:16):
came out with this so quickly. But I suppose it's
a testament to the performance of the movie.

Speaker 1 (01:06:24):
Yeah. Well, so they announced in twenty twenty seven, July
twenty twenty seven, will be getting Superman Man of Tomorrow or.

Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
I mean, it seems like it's just called Man of Tomorrow.

Speaker 1 (01:06:35):
Oh I see, Oh you know what, I looked up
the old.

Speaker 2 (01:06:39):
Animated version, right, so that which is a good movie
by the way, it's an animated movie. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
Will this be inspired by that? Is this a story
that was in comics first? That is behind?

Speaker 2 (01:06:50):
You know? Well, here's what's interesting to me is that
what James Gunn has said in the past is oh,
he was working on something that involved Superman, but is
not a straight ahead sequel to the movie. That just
came out, and then this gets announced, and somebody asked
him online, or is this in addition to is this

(01:07:14):
sequel in addition to that other thing you said? And
he said, no, this is that thing. This is not
really Superman too, to which I said, thank you for
that clarification, which only makes things even more confusing. So
this was released online in addition to a piece of

(01:07:39):
artwork by Jim Lee with Lex Luthor wearing his green
and purple power suit alongside Superman holding what appears to
be a screwdriver. And so when he said, and so
I'm just looking at deadline right here. So DC already
has Supergirl bowing on June twenty sixth of next year,

(01:08:03):
and then we got a Man of Tomorrow coming in
July ninth of twenty twenty seven, so we got three
years in a row of super shenanigans. But my thought
is this when he says this is not this involved Superman,
but is not a Superman sequel? That makes me wonder
is this a Lex Luthor movie?

Speaker 1 (01:08:25):
Hmm?

Speaker 2 (01:08:26):
And by Man of Tomorrow is he referring to Lex Luthor?
That was my thought.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
I'm well, does that sound like what the older film
is about. I mean, does this resemble that.

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
That animated movie. No, that's just like that's just like
a Superman origin story.

Speaker 1 (01:08:46):
That's just a general title Man of Tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (01:08:48):
Yeah, because Superman, like that's one of his names. Okay,
he's a Man of Steel, is the Man of Tomorrow?
He's the Man of La Mancha. I think that's also
the title.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
That's fine.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
I yeah, the title is like generic enough to mean anything.
But what I'm drilling down on is the fact that
he's like, this is not the Superman sequel, which like
what does that even mean?

Speaker 1 (01:09:14):
I'm it's kind of cool, you know, like don't know,
you know, he doesn't feel beholden to making sequels the
way that we know them. He's just got the stories
he wants to tell within this universe, and hopefully they're
good enough that we get used to something a little different.

Speaker 2 (01:09:30):
See I'm gonna sound old passioned here. I'm like, can
can we not do this all the time?

Speaker 1 (01:09:36):
Not all the time? Don't get me wrong, because I
I we've talked about this with the Man of Steel,
where you know, then you get Batman vs. Superman and whatever,
but we never got a proper Man of Steel sequel. Right,
and that bums me out right, So, I mean I
definitely want I don't know what he has in store.
I don't know if Superman just sort of comes in
and out of this thing and it is alexuth story.

(01:09:57):
Hopefully it's good, but you know, I definitely want another Superman.

Speaker 2 (01:10:00):
Well this is but see this is my point, right,
like like this is this is some semantic shenanigans that
filmmakers do. Or they're like, well, it's not technically a sequel.
She's like, like Tim Burton said that about Batman returns.

Speaker 1 (01:10:13):
You know what's funny. By the way, just you doing
that voice? I was like, is he doing Tim Burton?

Speaker 2 (01:10:19):
Maybe unconsciously? Yeah, I don't really consider it a sequel.
It's like, bro, it's a sequel. Come on, you know,
like you know, it's like it comes next sequentially and
it has all you know what I mean. It's like
I don't really consider a Jurassic Park three a sequel.

(01:10:42):
You know, at some point we're just talking ourselves into
a circle, you know, so we don't know anything as
far as what to entail. But here's my only point.
I think I think a Superman sequel which puts us
in Lex Luthor's headspace. That doesn't kind of interesting to me.

Speaker 1 (01:11:00):
I'm into it. Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
There is a great mini series from from maybe like
twenty years ago called Lex Luthor Man of Steel, and
it's just it's it's entirely from Lex's point of view.
You know, he's he's again, everybody is a hero in
their own mind. Sure, yeah, right, and so it's just

(01:11:24):
his perspective. And here's this alien who shows up with
all these powers and he's Lex Luthor's a human being
and he's standing up for human achievement. Right, It's terrific story.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
I maybe it'll be in that vein.

Speaker 2 (01:11:39):
I would be down for that.

Speaker 1 (01:11:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
And and certainly, you know, the characters as depicted in
that mini series very very similar to to the Nicholas
Holt incarnation.

Speaker 1 (01:11:49):
All right, well, I'm into it. And also, you know,
I was listening to the SmartLess podcast and James Gunn
was on it and he was just talking about he
wasn't making a point of it, but he was just
talking about writing Superman and then writing season two of
Peacemaker and then now there's this new sequel thing coming out,
and it was like, man, like, if you ever want
to feel bad about your time management. Just I mean,

(01:12:13):
this guy is a workhorse. It's yeah, it's incredible his output,
you know, that's that's very true. Yeah. And on top
of that, running DC you know what is it called DC?
You know, yeah, DC, you that sort of executive side
of things, also directing this. So it's not like he

(01:12:33):
just is reading a bunch of scripts and he's reading
other people's scripts of course too, right for the other
DC films, But it's and he's in pre production on
his next movie, and I mean, just where does he
get all the hours in the day. It's pretty amazing.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
What's kind of nuts, by the way, with regards to
this Superman sequel slash question mark, is that it will
come out before The Batman Part two.

Speaker 1 (01:12:56):
I was just going to bring that up, which is
schedule currently to be released the same year, October first,
twenty twenty seven.

Speaker 2 (01:13:05):
Right, so it'll be a few months later. So The
Batman came out during the Mesozoic era. I'm gonna say,
I don't know when.

Speaker 1 (01:13:15):
It's it's been a while, right, right, right, We're getting
a Clayface movie before we get the Batman too.

Speaker 2 (01:13:22):
I forgot about that.

Speaker 1 (01:13:23):
Wow, Yeah, which is I mean, what universe is that in?
Is that in the in quotes the Batman?

Speaker 2 (01:13:31):
No, I didn't Is that in that? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:13:33):
Right to you? Yeah, you know, I gotta be honest.
I when I heard that we were getting a Batman
and Superman movie in twenty twenty seven, I got excited, like, Oh,
what's this new Batman going to be like? And then
I saw that it was this one, you know, the
Matt Reeves version. I was like, oh, right, right, I mean,
I'm I am interested in that, but it does feel
a little bit like, oh, I don't know, do we

(01:13:54):
want to kind of even things out here, get everything
on the same.

Speaker 2 (01:13:59):
Page by the time the Batman Part two comes out.
So that's twenty twenty seven, so it's gonna be six
and a half years, So we're basically bumping up against
the length of time between Batman and Robin and Batman begins.

Speaker 1 (01:14:19):
Was that the same distance between Terminator and Terminator two?

Speaker 2 (01:14:22):
That was seven years? Yeah? Okay, so pretty close.

Speaker 1 (01:14:25):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:14:27):
Look, I I'm I will watch it, but I do wonder,
just in a broader sense, like if they kind of
missed their window for the sequel.

Speaker 1 (01:14:37):
Yeah, well, in just most especially as they have done
a reset. That's right, right, So it's nice. I guess
if they're gonna let Reeves continue to do his thing.
But I do wonder it'll be interesting to read the
book in a couple of years, you know what the
thinking is, because it doesn't seem like the most practic,

(01:15:00):
mad thing to do, right, you know, I don't.

Speaker 2 (01:15:03):
Know, Yeah, I mean, well, I suspect that this is
a conversation we're gonna be revisiting at some point. So anyway,
twenty twenty seven, you got, you got Abinger, Secret Wars,
you got a Superman movie and a Batman movie. So
you know, I guess we're gonna test the hypothesis is
that superhero fatigue is a thing?

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
Yeah, yeah, I'm very curious for the very curious. Yeah,
have you been hearing those rumors and things, which one
coming from the sets from Avengers where.

Speaker 2 (01:15:33):
It's like, yeah, apparently there was like a that was
like a heated argument, let's.

Speaker 1 (01:15:39):
Say, yeah, between two big actors.

Speaker 2 (01:15:44):
Yeah, we're getting And what we know is the two
actors were not Robert Downey Junior or Ryan Reynolds. Right,
That's the only thing we do know.

Speaker 1 (01:15:54):
Like someone made a comment I think in jest, but
it was taken poorly, yes, by another actor, and it
led to having to blow up the schedule. So these
people don't aren't together any longer, which is just I mean,
you think of all the money they're already spending. You know,
it's incredible.

Speaker 2 (01:16:15):
You picture Kevin Feigy, like, do I need this right now?
After the year he's had?

Speaker 1 (01:16:21):
You know, I know, I know is if this movie
also just isn't the undertaking of the twenty first century
to begin with?

Speaker 2 (01:16:28):
You know? Yeah, Like I was actually thinking about that.
I was like, there are gonna be so many people
in the industry rooting for that movie to fail.

Speaker 1 (01:16:38):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Yeah, so it's a lot yeah, so drama. And once
we know anything, we'll come right back here and report
it like the like the caddy little gossip mongers that
we are.

Speaker 1 (01:16:54):
I was gonna say, we'll dish that'll be an extra
little bonus.

Speaker 2 (01:17:00):
Who do you think it was? Hey, here's some news, Brian,
little sad news. I wanted to mention. Graham Green has
passed away. Yeah yeah, at age of seventy three, apparently
of natural causes, natural causes. And we were just singing
his praises Earlier this year, he appeared in Diehard with

(01:17:23):
a Vengeance, and when we were watching that film in
our commentary check, we were both sort of like, what
a great character Graham Green plays. He is, of course
known for other roles. For me, he got on my
radar having played kicking Bird in Dances with Wolves. Yep,
same tremendous. I was an amazing performance in that movie,

(01:17:44):
and he had been in a whole bunch of other
stuff too. He was actually just speaking of Marvel. He
was just in the series Echo.

Speaker 1 (01:17:51):
Oh okay, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:17:54):
In terms of Native American actors, one of the most visible.

Speaker 1 (01:17:57):
I was gonna say, if anyone doesn't know him by name,
if you google him, you're gonna go, oh yeah, yeah,
that's exactly right.

Speaker 2 (01:18:05):
So you know, he was somebody who you know, just
just seeing him it was like kind of reassuring, like,
oh good, you know. He was also in the final
episode of eighteen eighty three, the mini series. He plays
the Native American character who sells the land that becomes

(01:18:25):
the Yellowstone Ranch to James Dutton, which is a nice,
little nice you know, if you've watched the entirety of Yellowstone,
you see the importance of that scene. You know, yep,
I saw that Kevin Costner paid tribute to him on Instagram,
Kevin Costner again having directed him in Dance with Wolves.

(01:18:46):
He says, a few things come to mind when I
think of Graham Green and our time together on Dances
with Wolves. I think of how willing he was to
learn the Lakota language. I think of my joy when
I heard that his work on the film was recognized
with an Academy Award nomination. And I think of this
scene in particular. And the scene in question is when

(01:19:06):
Kicking Bird and John Dunbar played by Kevin Costner, are
first trying to interact with each other. When he was
able to establish so much about the relationship between Dunbar
and the natives with so few words, he was a
master at work and a wonderful human being. I'm grateful
to have been witnessed to this part of his lasting legacy.
Rest in peace, Graham. That was nice, It really was nice.

(01:19:28):
So just another you know, a terrific character actor. And
we talk about character actors all the time. They are
the glue that hold this whole joint together, and whenever
they leave us, you know, there's a little less glue.
Mm hm, you know. Yep, here's another story, Brian. I
thought this one, I should say, since I clocked this
as something we should discuss. Between then and the time

(01:19:51):
we started recording, I've gotten multiple text messages from people
who clearly know our show very well. Yes, happy about
well as it happens, this story is the Magnificent Amberson's finally,
So for those of you who don't know, The Magnificent

(01:20:12):
Amberson's is a film that it has kind of a
storied history. It was Orson Wells's follow up to Citizen Kane,
and it's generally considered one of the greatest movies ever made.
And that's saying something, right, that's saying something because it
exists in this this really severely truncated studio scizzard form.

Speaker 1 (01:20:34):
Right. Well, I was just saying, I mean, to follow
up what many people believe to be one of the
greatest movies of all time, Citizen Kane, truche then to
make your second movie, and they're like, this is also
one of the greatest movies of all time. I mean, yeah,
run yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:20:48):
And so the film as and of course it's become
kind of a running joke on this show where I'll say, like, oh,
this movie it's good. I mean, it's not the magnificstent Amberson's,
but it's good. And so I appreciate that that is
sort of our share parlance with our listeners. So this
story is fascinating in that it ties together two of
the things we end up talking about a lot on
this show. A the magnificent Amberson's and b the encroaching

(01:21:12):
use of AI in a form that is slightly troubling,
right right.

Speaker 1 (01:21:18):
Right, Well, yeah, sir, I think I kind of cut
off the anecdote you're trying to make about Amberson's, which
is to say it is thought of as one of
the greatest movies of all time. But it's almost surprising
in a miracle that that's the case, because Orson Wells
had an original cut he felt good about, but then
the studio took it out of his hands, chopped out
forty plus minutes of it, tacked on a happy ending

(01:21:41):
he didn't like, and that release version happens to be
the version that everybody admires.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
Yeah, and it did tank when it came out, right.
This is another Citizen Kane situation where it was only
appreciated after the fact. And so the quest for the
lost forty minutes of Citizen Kane is I feel like
there's Amberson's. Yeah, did I say Citizens KM? Sorry, of
Amberson's is kind of a legendary at this point. I

(01:22:10):
feel like that could be a movie all on its own.

Speaker 1 (01:22:12):
Yeah, yeah, really could, because I mean people think there
could be, you know, portions of it in Brazil. You know,
it's sort of like a worldwide hunt to find this
lost footage. But many believe it was destroyed as like
a space saving measure, right, Like the studio just wanted
to free up some space and so they destroyed.

Speaker 2 (01:22:34):
Yeah, and so there was a presumption that that Wells
had his own copy of the footage, but it's never
it's never been recovered.

Speaker 1 (01:22:41):
Yeah, and film from that era is notoriously volatile.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
That that too.

Speaker 1 (01:22:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:22:46):
So so here comes AI to solve question mark this
this mystery. Yeah, here's the story that that, like I said,
just broke today via Hollywood Reporter. And essentially, we have
a situation where there's a company called Showrunner, which is
an AI company. It's owned by Amazon, and the plan
is for it to reconstruct the missing forty three minutes

(01:23:09):
of the magnificent Andersen's and just to delve into the
whys and wherefor is here It says here the endeavor
marks of the text further encroachment onto Hollywood as it
eyes the exploitation of AI tools embroiled in controversy, or
the possibility they were created using copyrighted materials from creators
they could eventually displace. So the effort won't be commercialized

(01:23:34):
because Showrunner hasn't obtained the rights to the film from
Warner Brothers, Discovery or Conquered. If they see a marketplace
for it and a path for it outside of an
academic context, then of course they have ownership of it.
The goal isn't to commercialize, but to see them exist
in the world after eighty years of people asking might
this have been the best film ever made? In its
original form? And so using whatever information they have so

(01:23:59):
specific we have a guy named Brian Rose who is
a filmmaker and he's spent the last five years recreating
thirty thousand missing frames from the movie. He's rebuilt the
physical sets using three D models, pinpointing camera movements to
match with the script, set photos and archive materials, and
by his thinking, he's reconstructed the framing and timing of

(01:24:20):
each scene to serve as a foundation for the recreation.
So it's meant as an academic exercise. Yeah, using AI,
using Wells's notes to rebuild the film as it would
originally have existed. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:24:40):
I mean that's an important factor there. I mean calling
it an academic exercise. It's interesting, you know what I mean? Like,
I think what would irk me is if someone were
to say, we did it. This is the definitive version
that Orson Welles wanted the world to see. Yeah, you
know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:25:01):
Yeah, Well, at this moment, it sounds to me like
something in the vein of I'm sure you've seen those
YouTube videos where somebody takes the lightsaber duel from episode four,
yes and adds a bunch of cgi flimflam into it.

Speaker 1 (01:25:18):
Which I think is very interesting as an experiment.

Speaker 2 (01:25:22):
It looks freaking off me just say yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:25:25):
I mean, I'm like, oh, that's okay. But I would
never consider that canon or exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:25:32):
I've had people send that to me be like this
is so awesome, and I defriended them instantly and blocked.

Speaker 1 (01:25:38):
I just took a sip a while you know what,
just getting to that really quick. I really thought it
was a cool idea. The problem was, and it sounds
like these people are going to get around that problem.
They didn't try to match the style of a New Hope,
you know, they suddenly turned it into like a Michael
Bay movie in the midst of yes, yes, with the

(01:26:03):
scenes that they recreated through whatever it was AI or whatever.

Speaker 2 (01:26:07):
But it was a.

Speaker 1 (01:26:07):
Cool idea they were basically trying to take. You know,
you you have the Phantom Menace, Duel of the Fates,
you have this crazy acrobatic Jedi fight, and then when
you go back to New Hope, the initial fight scene
between Darth Vader and Obi Wan Kenobi feels a little slower, right,
So this.

Speaker 2 (01:26:24):
Person was like, tap tap tap is there?

Speaker 1 (01:26:28):
Yeah, yeah, right, exactly, Yeah, and you know Obi Wan
does like a strained sort of twirl like you know
kind but.

Speaker 2 (01:26:38):
He's arthritic after so.

Speaker 1 (01:26:41):
He's been living on a desert planet dehydrated. So but
this person was like, well, what if we could up
the fight, you know, make it look a little bit
more acrobatic like in the earlier films. Yea interesting experiment.
I thought it was kind of cool to watch. I
wish they had tried to match the tone and camera
work a little bit more closely, and I think it
would have been more successful if they had done that.

(01:27:02):
But yeah, it's an interesting experiment.

Speaker 2 (01:27:04):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:27:04):
Wait, so what do you think about this?

Speaker 2 (01:27:06):
Well? So I have two thoughts, right, Like, on the
one hand, you know the quote about Orson Wells when
he when he learned that that you know, they were
going to colorize Citizen Kane. This was TNT, I think,
and he says, tell tell Ted Turner to keep his

(01:27:27):
goddamn crayons off my movie. Like that quote, right, that
quote lives rent free in my head in it. So
there is that, so we know how he feels about
people mucking this film. On the other hand, his film
comes pre mucked. Sure, sure, sure, right, So so you wonder, like,
I mean, how would Wells feel about this, given the

(01:27:50):
fact that the the additional the extended material has been
in fact lost to the ages, would he at least
welcome the opportunity for it to exist in some form? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:28:04):
I don't know. I mean, see this is the thing too.
I mean you look at something like fan edits right,
where people take movies one of the most famous ones
is Teford Grace took the Star Wars prequels and made
his own cut, which, instead of being three full length movies,
I think whittled the whole three movies down to about
ninety minutes somehow. Wow. And I would never consider that

(01:28:28):
an actual movie. I just think it's an interesting experiment.
So to me, this lives in that same place. I
think I would take this case by case. In this
instance interesting, you know, I'm curious what they'll come up with,
But I wouldn't want them then to be like, yeah,

(01:28:50):
but what if in Raiders of the Lost Ark the
Millennium Falcon showed up, you know, And so then they
start futzing with that and then putting that in theaters
and being like, witness, there's a lost article, like you've
never seen it before. Like that, I would not be okay.

Speaker 2 (01:29:04):
Right well, And and another aspect of this is is
we can we can look at this devoid of context,
both before and after and view it as as as
purely benign. And I don't think AI can be viewed
that way, because every use is spinning the ball slightly

(01:29:29):
forward to whatever's coming next, and and it's reaching a
point where without signing alarmist. It's pretty damn scary.

Speaker 1 (01:29:38):
I know, I see this is this is such a
weird thing. I was just listening to James Gunn talking
on the other podcast and he was they're asking him
about AI. What he was saying was it's happening. Yeah,
So I agree with that, and so so then it's like, well,
what do you do with this?

Speaker 2 (01:29:55):
And and I want to be very clear. Look, I'm
not naive about this, and I'm not a lot you know.
I think I think James Gunn is right as many
people look at it is here, I don't think we're
putting the genie back in the bottle. I think as
I look this story makes me curious. Look, as somebody
who has seen Amberson's many times, I want to see

(01:30:16):
what they come up with. There is that that that
parenthetical in this piece though, you know, hey, if Warner
Brothers sees the commercial value in it, then it's up
to them. I think that's where we're headed.

Speaker 1 (01:30:30):
No matter what I know. And I'm realizing, even in
all the things that I'm saying, this is just too
big a conversation, you know what I mean, Like, there's
just so many facets to it.

Speaker 2 (01:30:40):
I disagree. I think you and I can button this
thing down right now, in the next couple of minutes,
we can print it on a gold disc, send it
into space. I think.

Speaker 1 (01:30:52):
Yeah, And then years later it'll be being back to
Jodie Foster and she'll be like Dad, great movie. By
the way, if you haven't seen Contact, Every Contact, it's
just so funny. I mean, I really see saw on this.
It's like you can't talk about AI in general and
not acknowledge that in many ways, where we're heading is

(01:31:16):
going to objectively suck for many people because certain jobs
are going to cease to exist. It's going to significantly
augment or replace tasks specifically for our discussion, in entertainment,
in animation and VFX and things like that, and I
more in that. I know it will probably make things quicker.

(01:31:39):
I know it'll probably make things cheaper, but heck, man,
I look at like the Simpsons and like those first
ten seasons and the Squash and Stretch. Yeah, that those
figures have those characters. It is soul. And when I
look at the newer Simpsons, which is edited still by
humans but on computers, but not every frame is drawn

(01:32:00):
by hand, it's more like puppeteering in sort of a way.
It's missing spark, it's missing a little bit of life,
it's missing that quirkiness that makes those first ten seasons
just you know, charming beyond belief. So I do more
many creative things, charging deeper in that direction, and I

(01:32:22):
can acknowledge that AI can also be a remarkable tool
when well did well. So I don't know, Like I said,
it's a huge discussion when it comes to this stuff.
Like I said, I don't want it to turn into
a Ted Turner sort of situation where it's just like, well, now,
you know, filmmakers won't have a say because they didn't

(01:32:44):
have this in their contracts, and we're just going to
go in. I mean George Lucas went in willingly and yeah,
added a CG. Jaba and all that sort of stuff.
But I don't want this to be a thing.

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
Where that's kind of the thing we were talking about
the episode four. You know that that fan at it,
and let's be real, we were probably like like one
and a half steps away from him actually doing that
in episode four.

Speaker 1 (01:33:07):
Oh sure, sure, I mean if this existed back then,
who knows?

Speaker 2 (01:33:11):
Oh yeah, yeah, I think in that sense, the technology
worked in the audience's favor where he just wasn't there
to do that.

Speaker 1 (01:33:18):
And that's what I'm saying, like, hey, if he wants
to do that, I have every right to not like it,
and he has every right to do it because it's
his baby.

Speaker 2 (01:33:27):
But that again, I just wish he would have hit
save as.

Speaker 1 (01:33:33):
But I'm just saying, like, with this the Orson Welles thing,
I do feel like he's probably beginning to spend in
his grave at this moment, you know, And that sucks.
That sucks. But again, if as long as this isn't
something Warner Brothers is gonna come out and say, like
the definitive version, I'm all right, well it's interesting. But

(01:33:53):
again I guess sorry I keep talking to talking about
like I do get a little nervous about what so
what else do they have in mind?

Speaker 2 (01:34:02):
That's That's kind of where I'm at, Like, I'm very
curious about this, but I'm also very circumspect about what
comes next. And and you do wonder a little bit
like are are are we you know, people like you
and I, people who have this desire to preserve this

(01:34:24):
stuff as it existed? Are we the ones that are
going to be left behind, you know, by by time,
by society. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:34:35):
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I'm trying. I don't
know if people could probably tell a boy my rambling,
I'm like processing in real time. I'm really truly trying
to see the pros and cons of it.

Speaker 2 (01:34:49):
Well, whatever, this future looks like it's not the magnificent Amberson's.

Speaker 1 (01:34:57):
And nothing ever will there you.

Speaker 2 (01:34:59):
Go, Hey, we have a brand new release we wanted
to discuss. Yeah, let's talk about it on the other
side of.

Speaker 1 (01:35:07):
This, and now we're pleased to bring you our feature present.

Speaker 2 (01:35:19):
Hey, cot Stealing is in theaters right now, and I'm
you and I have not discussed this, but if I may,
an alternate title I might give this movie is pleasant Surprise.

Speaker 1 (01:35:33):
Yeah, actually, you know, I mean, just to give even
more personal context, you know. You and I kind of
saw this last minute. Yep, it's a last minute decision.
And so I was like, all right, like I had
some interest in it. I knew i'd get to it someday,
but it became like, oh's we're doing this tonight. And

(01:35:53):
then when I walked out, I was like, I'm glad
I caught that.

Speaker 2 (01:35:57):
That's good. Yeah, yeah, this was. It was one of
those things where, yeah, we were planning to discuss something
else and I had not seen that other thing either,
And I told Brian, I was like, I'd be honest,
I'm I'm in the mood for something a little more larky,
you know. And so indeed, on a lark, I decided
to catch this I'm gonna and I snuck away and

(01:36:20):
and the best thing I can say about this is
it kind of it worked for me on a similar
levels as one of you and I watched Novacane together. Sure, sure,
where it's it's not you know, it's it's something that
you're just like, you're like, hey, let's go see something. Oh,
this is here, you know. Totally totally, and I mean

(01:36:41):
they're very different movies.

Speaker 1 (01:36:42):
I was gonna say, I would say that there's more
to this movie than.

Speaker 2 (01:36:45):
To for sure, but in the sense of it felt
to me like a throwback to the time when going
to the movies doesn't have to be an event. It's
just you go to see what's out.

Speaker 1 (01:36:59):
Totally, I mean, this movie is a throwback in so
many ways.

Speaker 2 (01:37:03):
Yeah. Well, and if I may, you know, the movie itself,
it is set in nineteen ninety eight, and that felt
so appropriate to me because it reminded me of the
type of movies I would have gone to watch in
nineteen ninety eight.

Speaker 1 (01:37:14):
Yeah, this is like a long lost nineteen late nineties
like violent romp.

Speaker 2 (01:37:20):
Yes, yeah, you know, And so a couple of thoughts
I had, and we'll get into the story. But I
was like, you know, I don't know how it's doing
in theaters. Actually I haven't even looked at the box office.
But I'm glad it's not a streaming movie.

Speaker 1 (01:37:32):
Oh right, it really.

Speaker 2 (01:37:35):
Does benefit from from having a theatrical platform. The other
thing is this stars Austin Butler, and he's sure making
a go of having a Leonardo DiCaprio post Leonardo DiCaprio career.

Speaker 1 (01:37:50):
Hmm, what do you mean by that, Like in terms
of the.

Speaker 2 (01:37:53):
Choices he's making, Right, he could have leaned hard into
franchise pictures.

Speaker 1 (01:37:58):
Yeah, sure, sure, Sharon, and.

Speaker 2 (01:37:59):
I do appreciate that he's trying to do more interesting stuff.
I think this guy's got the goods. Honestly, I think
I'm really looking forward to seeing him progress as an
actor because I think, just just based on the things
I've seen him. I'm already he he I mean between
this and Bike Riders. Honestly, I'm like, God, this guy.
He's got presence, he's very talented, and just seeing him

(01:38:24):
silently contemplate is interesting.

Speaker 1 (01:38:27):
See. I couldn't disagree more.

Speaker 2 (01:38:29):
Really, No, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 1 (01:38:33):
No.

Speaker 2 (01:38:33):
I think as soon as he said that, I whole
bunch of people listening leaned forward.

Speaker 1 (01:38:39):
I thought you're gonna know I was joking right away. No,
I completely agree, and I think I've always liked him.
I haven't seen him in anything I haven't liked, but this,
I do feel like, is the movie that's put me
over the top with him, because he's everything he's done previously,
this has been kind of big, well not necessarily by craders,
but like you know, Dune Part two, Elvis, Like those

(01:39:01):
are big performances, and he's playing these different sorts of characters.
But here he's playing in every Man, and to your point,
he's very interesting to watch, you know, and he goes
what I didn't expect, and what I alluded to earlier
is this isn't just like a guy finds a thing
and then there's guns and then it's over. Like he
has an arc in this right, and there's like a

(01:39:24):
really interesting backstory to him. He's an interesting guy, and
I think a lot of that succeeds because of Austin Butler.

Speaker 2 (01:39:33):
Right, Yeah, yeah. You know Roger Ebert used to refer
to bruised forearm movies. Yeah, and they're the ones where
you're watching it and it's so intense that the person
sitting next to you is digging into your forearm. You know.
This was a prototypical bruised forearm movie. Yeah, in that
I don't know whose forearm was more bruised mine or ominous,

(01:39:55):
because there's points where literally I'm like, yeah, I had
a couple of those too. Yeah, And I'm like, if
a movie's making it do that, it's doing something right,
you know.

Speaker 1 (01:40:05):
Yeah, I had my theater was I would say, like
a third full issh okay if that. But I'm the
type of guy like I get really into it. I cry,
I laugh, I make no, I go who And like
I was sitting by myself at the end of this
row and there's people in my row and occasionally I
go whoa, you know, we're like ow or something like that.

(01:40:26):
But I mean people would laugh occasionally. But I think
I was the only one that was making like noises.

Speaker 2 (01:40:32):
Well every time Austin Butler was on screen, where you're like.

Speaker 1 (01:40:35):
Damn, yeah, that guy's done some pushups.

Speaker 2 (01:40:41):
For those of you who are like, what is that
a reference to? You know, back when I watched Fantastic
for the two thousand and five movie, there was somebody
in our screening who was very enamored of Jessica Alba,
and he made sure to let the entire screening room
know every single time she was on screen.

Speaker 1 (01:40:58):
That's so funny.

Speaker 2 (01:40:59):
I love that that guy lives on he is immortal. Yeah. So, honestly,
here's how little I knew about this movie going in.
It wasn't until the credits rolled that I was like, oh,
Darren Aronofski directed this.

Speaker 1 (01:41:15):
Oh interesting. No, I'd seen this trailer many times.

Speaker 2 (01:41:19):
I have seen it zero times.

Speaker 1 (01:41:21):
Oh wow.

Speaker 2 (01:41:22):
Okay, So I truly I went in knowing nothing, absolutely
nothing other than Austin Butler is in.

Speaker 1 (01:41:29):
Oh wow. I mean I don't even know the tone,
like the it's kind of a guy ritchie sort of feel.

Speaker 2 (01:41:36):
All I knew is that involved stealing and presumably being caught.

Speaker 1 (01:41:41):
Oh wow, what a fun way to well tell me
about that a little bit.

Speaker 2 (01:41:45):
I mean, the best way to watch I would say
any movie, but certainly a movie like this, because I
have no idea what to expect.

Speaker 1 (01:41:53):
You know, I agree, And just to tell a really
really quick anecdote, I remember because I go to test
screenings a lot, or at least I used to, and
when you do that, you're seeing a movie that hasn't
been released yet and most likely doesn't have a trailer
out yet. And my friend and I saw this movie
Jason Wrightman Diabolo Cody thing called Young Adult, which and
we saw it and we're like, what a great movie.

(01:42:15):
It's a dramedy. It's you know, it's got a lot,
it's funny in some parts, but it's very sad in
other parts. And we were like, what a great film.
And then it came out and it was sold as
a comedy through the trailers, and I kept hearing people
disappointed because it wasn't what they thought it was going
to be, and I thought, wow, isn't that funny? You know?
It just made me think it would be amazing if

(01:42:36):
we could all go into things knowing the least amount
of information is possible and just take it on its
own terms and I wonder how much a different experience
we would have if we weren't, Like, Oh, that wasn't
what I was expecting based on the trailer, you know, yeah,
I would say the trailer sold this pretty well though.

Speaker 2 (01:42:51):
Yeah, no, I I I went back afterwards and I
watched the trailer, right.

Speaker 1 (01:42:57):
I mean, yeah, it kind of captures the spirit, I think.

Speaker 2 (01:42:59):
Yeah, I think so. I think for me, this is
a movie. I think it really did benefit from the
theatrical experience. I suspect it'll do better once it hits streaming, probably,
and I don't even know how it's performing. Actually not great?
Oh is that right now? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:43:17):
I mean I think you know, Jaws beat it.

Speaker 2 (01:43:19):
Oh okay, yeah, well Jaws.

Speaker 1 (01:43:23):
Actually we didn't mention it, but Jaws did shockingly well.
And its re release it came in second place, I think,
which is amazing, right for a re release it's fifty
years old. Yeah, but well, real quick, just so people
know what we're talking about if they haven't seen it.
This off IMDb. The summary is burned out ex baseball

(01:43:44):
player Hank Thompson unexpectedly finds himself embroiled in a dangerous
struggle for survival amidst the criminal underbelly of nineteen nineties
New York City, forced to navigate a treacherous underworld he
never imagined. And I would say, for me, this felt
like me of early Guy Ritchie. Yeah, oh, very much,
like mixed with the Coen Brothers, like a little less

(01:44:06):
quirky than Guy Richie a little bit and a little
more grubby than the Coen Brothers.

Speaker 2 (01:44:11):
That is a perfect description.

Speaker 1 (01:44:13):
Right, thank you. It's it's got quirky characters, but they're
not as cartoonish as some of the early Richie stuff.
There's like convoluted run ins, people out of their depths,
random violence.

Speaker 2 (01:44:22):
I think the key thing is that there are quirky characters,
but not so quirky that you're ever, you're ever not
aware of how serious the stakes are.

Speaker 1 (01:44:33):
Totally because I think post pulp fiction, there were all
these movies like eight Heads in a Duffel Bag, something
about in the Valley. I don't even remember anymore, but
it was like everyone was like, how can we outquirk
one another with these hitman types, you know, And they
were almost like violent cartoon characters. And I thought this
did a great job of making very memorable antagonists, but

(01:44:56):
they didn't cross that line into being sort of like, oh,
this is like some sort of two and Tino riff.

Speaker 2 (01:45:01):
Right. Yeah, yeah, I think honestly, what helps enormously is
that it's the story felt to me like it was built,
you know, from the character out. So yeah, yeah, you
have a very interesting sort of cat and mouse scenario.
But I mean, ultimately kind of this is what we're
alluding to before. Hank Thompson played by Austin Butler, to me,

(01:45:25):
I found the character interesting and the way the movie
alludes to aspects of his past was such where I
was like, I want to know. I'm like, give me more,
tell me more, right, And that's the trick and and
once once the the you know, speaking on spoilery, he

(01:45:47):
he he is somebody who he's he's he had aspirations
of playing pro ball and something happened that that prevented that.
And I think the way that information is is parceled
out is incredibly effective.

Speaker 1 (01:46:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:46:05):
Terms, so they at any given moment, they give you
just enough to make the next moment meaningful totally, and
then the next time they give you a little bit
more just to make the next moment meaningful.

Speaker 1 (01:46:15):
You know, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, good point. Yeah, because
it really does tie into the plot and his like
as we said earlier, you know, like his growth is healing,
it's not just a detail, and why he's wearing you know,
a giant's hat, right, Yeah, it's a big part of
the story, which is Yeah, and I just felt like, yeah,
it's felt refreshing something as textured as this for being

(01:46:37):
such a fun, violent romp, right, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:46:41):
Very much a throwback to that era, right, Yeah, where
we'd see stuff like that. I think what helps is
in addition to to Butler, who I think very capably
commands the center, but you've got a constellation of great
supporting players, you know, Zoy krab It, you know, Regina King, Vincentinafrio,

(01:47:06):
Lev Schreiber, I mean you name it, like, they really
sink into these terrific character parts and and it it
enriches the journey. Yep. You know Matt Smith, Matt Smith, Yeah,
doing doing something. We were just talking about Matt Smith
a couple of weeks ago. Yep, that's right in our
in our Terminator Genesis commentary. And I think you said

(01:47:28):
something to the effect of, like, you know, you always
hear people have such affinity for Matt Smith, and yet
it feels like he's never really like the movies haven't
really done him any favors.

Speaker 1 (01:47:39):
Right, Well, yeah, it's specifically. I find a lot of
times with those sorts of actors, there's a role where
they really shine, and then people get endeared to that
person and no matter what they show up in, they
are still carrying whatever it is that they had from
that previous experience with that person and loving them moving forward.
And with Matt Smith, I never watched Doctor Who, and

(01:48:01):
I had never really seen him in one of the
roles that really connected where everything aligned with him and
he was perfectly cast for or whatever. So like when
I've seen him in like the Terminator film and people
are like, oh, Matt Smith, Like I didn't. I wasn't
bringing anything. So I've only seen him in or like
last Night in soho He's pretty memorable, but not again,
I wasn't bringing that extra something that everyone else is

(01:48:23):
bringing when they see him, right, And but I do
have to say I thought he was really good in
this and meant fun. He starts as kind of a
big character, but he gets to play that person at
several different speeds. Yeah, and I found that kind of
compelling and even like there's one moment where I was like,
oh no, you know, which I was unexpected, you know.

(01:48:44):
It's yeah, so it's like you said, yeah, it's a
constellation of talent here there there is.

Speaker 2 (01:48:51):
And this is not a spoiler. They're they're alluding what
I was alluding to before, you know, the Bruce Forum.
There is a bit where Austin Butler's character is descending
a fireplace or fire escape Yeah sorry, did I say fireplace? Yeah,
fire escape yep, from the outside of his window, and

(01:49:11):
he's like peeking into a window and doing this whole thing,
and then he's trying to get into and literally I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:49:17):
Like, dude, yes, same. I think that was one of
those oh no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (01:49:22):
No no. And then and then there is a terrific
chase sequence, a foot chase where where Austin Butler is
being pursued by these two hasidic mobsters, you know, yeah,
and it's a terrific sequence and it's so high tension,

(01:49:45):
and again I'm like, this is like old school, you know,
French connection style filmmaking.

Speaker 1 (01:49:52):
You know what I loved. Yes, and it did still
bring in like some modern twenty twenty five. Yes, like
you know what's capable now, but it didn't. It all
felt perfectly blended together.

Speaker 2 (01:50:08):
That's the thing, right, right, Like I saw an interview sorry,
just yeah, yeah, I saw an interview with Aaronovsky. You
talked about incorporating drone footage and things like they actually
had to do digital touch ups to make the New
York streets reflect what they looked like, you know, back
in back in the late nineteen hundreds.

Speaker 1 (01:50:28):
Yeah, that's where you can put it that way, but yes.

Speaker 2 (01:50:34):
Yes, right and so, but it's it's not intrusive, no,
and it does the trick. You know.

Speaker 1 (01:50:42):
It literally does feel like a lost nineties movie and
the best way possible down to There was a moment
where well, it's very grainy, and I did wonder if
that was something they did digitally or if they actually
shot in film. I have no idea, but it looked
I loved it. And there was like a scene where
it almost felt like a real change and he's walking

(01:51:02):
down the street and the color was bad, like it
looked too red, and I was like, did they do
that on purpose? Like they're they're making it look like
an older movie in the bed but not in an aggressive,
you know, distracting way. It just kind of felt like
a lost thirty year old film, and I thought it

(01:51:22):
was brilliant. I was just like so delighted at the
choices with the color timing, and some of it looked
extra faded, but at the same time, so that's funny
doing that mimicry. But then there's a moment where you know,
there's an exchange happening at the World's Fair area out
in New York, and this drone goes through that globe,

(01:51:43):
right they noticed that, Yeah, which could look a little
distracting or showy or something, but it didn't at all.
I just was like, whoa awesome. Yeah, it was just
it was perfect. The old style and the new style
blended together wonderfully. I mean, Darren Aronowski.

Speaker 2 (01:52:00):
Yeah, yeah, you know, at least for me, it was
just just a very pleasant, pleasant surprise. And you telling
me it's not performing is a not terribly surprising, but
it is kind of disappointing.

Speaker 1 (01:52:16):
I know, because you put it so well, this is
that movie and I know, viewing habits of change, but
this is that type of movie where you think, all right,
it's Friday night, what are we going to go see. Yeah,
and so you give a movie like this a shot
exactly right, And I mean I put it out there.
It is pretty violent. So if you don't have like
the tolerance for that kind of thing, yeah, that's good
to know. But it's yeah, I don't know, this is

(01:52:39):
that movie you wish people would go discover and then
tell people about it.

Speaker 2 (01:52:44):
Really, I mean it reminded me of in the late nineties,
you know, when I used to work at cod and
you know, our group of friends every Friday we would
just go to the Canterra yeah and see what there
was mm hmm, and that's what we'd end up. You know,
I've said I've told the story before. We ended up
watching The Sixth Sense. We had no idea, but that

(01:53:05):
was the only thing there was tickets for available form
h you know this it's like that, and so yeah,
I mean it's a throwback to just an era of
film going that is maybe just gone now.

Speaker 1 (01:53:17):
Yeah. But or this will be that thing that you know,
you're scrolling through Netflix and the tile comes up in
fifteen seconds of this movie place, and that's how someone
will eventually.

Speaker 2 (01:53:28):
But I do think if nothing else, I mean, I
think that this is a good calling card insofar as
what Austin Butler is is capable of totally, so he's
going to come out looking pretty good on the other
end of this. And that's why I was making the
DiCaprio comparison, because it really feels to me like he's

(01:53:48):
plotting a career in US along a similar trajectory sure
where he's he's choosing filmmakers as opposed to franchises, right,
and I think that's gonna I mean, I mean, look
at you know he worked with Why did he do
Dune because of Villanous? Why did he do Bike Riders
because of Jeff Nichols, you know, working here with Darren Aronofsky,

(01:54:10):
I mean it's a smart choice of bass lurement, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:54:12):
Totally yeah, totally yeah. Well, real quick, I think it's
worth talking about a couple of spoilers real fast. But
I just I just want to call out while we're
talking about Darren Aronofsky. I mean, what an interesting filmography.
I mean, going back all the way to pie Requiem
for a Dream. But then you also I kind of
found it the Fountain, but even like the Wrestler.

Speaker 2 (01:54:35):
I forgot about the rest. But you're black.

Speaker 1 (01:54:37):
Swan, you know, like he's just an eclectic well and
mother recently, which I didn't even watch because I thought
it was gonna be too intense. I just couldn't find
the mood for that one. But like it's just I
don't know, it's just very varied. And I think that's
very cool that he's Noah, you know, yeah Noah. Right,

(01:54:57):
It's cool that he's been able to do these things.
And then this this doesn't feel like any of the
ones I've mentioned before, right, but it's certainly made with
a very capable, skilled hand. I mean that's evident when
you watch it so well.

Speaker 2 (01:55:09):
And the other thing is, this is just the budget
for this one is forty million.

Speaker 1 (01:55:16):
I'm chefs kissing over here, right.

Speaker 2 (01:55:18):
Like that's I I was like, well, that's about what
you want to spend on this, because even if you
don't end up making it back, like, you'll probably be
okay in the long run, right, And you know you're
not blowing through so much of the studios money that
they got their mits and everything. You can make the
movie reflect your sensibility and your intentions. And I think
that means more ultimately, hm, because I do think I

(01:55:42):
suspect this one will have something of an afterlife, I.

Speaker 1 (01:55:45):
Think, so, you know, yeah, And also I want to
be sort of sort of excuse me, really got something
in my throat today. I want to be clear too
that not that we think this is some sort of
elevated no masterpiece either, Like this is just like a
cool throwback a flick. This is a flick. It's a flick,
you know, And that's exactly it, right, And quoting someone

(01:56:07):
else who was quoting something they saw on Twitter, it's
a five star, three star movie, and I was like,
I love that totally, and like that's something you want
to watch sometimes on a Friday night. And this is
a well done version of that. And like we said,
it really does dig into character. And I found that
it didn't even have to do that. I can imagine

(01:56:27):
the version where it doesn't, but that by this movie
rises up I.

Speaker 2 (01:56:31):
I okay, so yeah, you just said the thing I
was gonna say, like it would have worked just fine
at the level it was at, but I think that
the specific arc that it gives Butler's character to me,
made it something where when it ended, I'm like that
was good, you know, because that's the stuff that that's
that sticks with you, you know, totally. So yeah, you want,

(01:56:53):
you wanted to talk about some spoilers.

Speaker 1 (01:56:55):
It's just a couple real quick.

Speaker 2 (01:57:00):
Spoiler.

Speaker 1 (01:57:06):
So we are in spoilers here, so if you're going
to see this pause. I was shocked when Zoe Kravitz
was killed.

Speaker 2 (01:57:13):
Oh dude, I thought it was a dream.

Speaker 1 (01:57:17):
I didn't know what I thought. I was like, oh,
maybe she just got hit on the head. There's some blood.
But then when they went there, there was part of
me that was not angry, but I was. I really
felt a strong feeling about it. But then there's another
part of me that kind of respected it because that's
the game he's playing here, Like people don't get conked

(01:57:37):
on the head. And then they're just like okay, because
that's what we want to see them ultimately and up
together at the end, Like no, he's playing a very
dangerous game here, yeah, and no one is safe.

Speaker 2 (01:57:47):
And she is a big enough name that you don't
expect her to be off so soon into the story.

Speaker 1 (01:57:53):
And she's featured very prominently, you know, up until that moment.
And so I was shocked, and I can't say I
even loved it. But that's why I think it worked
because I didn't love it. Yeah, you know, uh the cat,
the cat was I mean, you have a cat. I mean,
can imagine Jones behaved.

Speaker 2 (01:58:18):
When we see the cat with this little cast or
this little bandage. I was like, oh, no, little buddy, Yeah,
so sad. The other thing, I I well, first of all,
the whole movie, I'm like, the mom is somebody. She's
got to be somebody.

Speaker 1 (01:58:36):
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean I was trying to figure
it out. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:58:39):
I was like, she's got to be somebody because the
way they're holding back, and I was so just tickled
by it being Laura Dern.

Speaker 1 (01:58:47):
Yeah, that was nice bread and it was just like
a little.

Speaker 2 (01:58:50):
Thing didn't even need to be there. But I loved it.
But the the whole, the whole running backstory with regards to,
you know, Hank having the accident he got into and
the way it's depicted, I mean, it's it's just horrific.

Speaker 1 (01:59:06):
You know.

Speaker 2 (01:59:07):
The first time we see him heading right towards that post,
I mean you're just like, ah, you know. But what
I really loved was when he calls his mom and
he's like it's like the first time in his life
he's taking ownership of what he did.

Speaker 1 (01:59:24):
Yep, yep.

Speaker 2 (01:59:25):
I loved that scene, right, very very profound and so
meaningful for the character. And it really makes the difference
because you recognize, like at the at you know what
he says, He's like, all I cared about was my knee.
I didn't care about how I got my friend killed. Right.
And then at the end of the film when we

(01:59:47):
get the not not at the end end, but when
he realizes that that the the Hebrews have you know,
they're the ones who killed.

Speaker 1 (01:59:57):
Yeah, I was thinking, like, the movie is winding down,
I know. And then when he pulls out that cigarette
lighter with the gun, I was like.

Speaker 2 (02:00:03):
No, I know, and I love Vincentinaffrey in the back
like he's ready to pull his gun out because he's
been and then he you know. But what I like
was how it signifies this is this is Hank being like, look,
I'm willing to die now, you know. That's his full
circle moment. The fact that he doesn't die is irrelevant

(02:00:25):
to the fact that he was willing to, yep, to
sort of to exact some virtue of justice for for for.

Speaker 1 (02:00:34):
It was the name Yvonne, Yvonne. Yeah, yeah, you know,
and I love also it was such a good you know,
they're setting it up a little bit when you know
they they didn't want to drive, and so he's driving
but he doesn't want to drive. I love that detail.
Where he moves from California, you know, like car Central
to New York where you can exist for at least

(02:00:55):
New York City, right, you can exist without a car.
He's running as far away as possible. So him not
wanting to drive is a really compelling, like you feel
it when he's like, no, no, no, I don't want to drive,
you know, he says that to Matt Smith. And then
when he's forced to drive here and he's like, put
on your seat belts. Yeah. I didn't even look at
that as foreshadowing for any It totally made sense as

(02:01:15):
a character that he's like extra cautious and like, if
we're going to do this at all, put on your
seat belts. But then when it dawned on me what
was about to happen, you know, where he's gonna slam
into a pole again, pull his mood, I was like, oh,
that's good, that's good. Then that belt it in.

Speaker 2 (02:01:33):
I have to say, by the way, I loved Leev Schreiber. Yes, yeah,
like Vinca Danafrey. I'm just used to him playing this
variety of characters, but this felt very different for Leev Schreiber. Yeah.
Different speed for sure, you know, and very funny because
because I mean, obviously he's Jewish, so he's able to
bring authenticity. But this could have very easily become like
like you know, Rabbi Krestovsky, you.

Speaker 1 (02:01:55):
Know, totally, totally, he didn't do that.

Speaker 2 (02:01:59):
The other thing is, is that guy, that freaking guy,
that asshole, the bald asshole. Yes, yes, this is like
a freaking dog, you know, yeah, microbe.

Speaker 1 (02:02:10):
I think that's his microbe.

Speaker 2 (02:02:12):
First, I love that that little detail where he steals
Hank's hat mm hmm, yes, because he's just because he's
a freaking cock, right, yes, And then that becomes this
great thing where he's at Chase Stadium and Hank is
able to use that as a way to throw them
off his trail. He's like that guy that that that
that Giants fan said the Mets suck. That's great. But

(02:02:37):
what I loved is that guy was like vicious right
throughout the movie, but he turns out he's got a
glass jaw because it just takes one one shot to
just knock him clean out.

Speaker 1 (02:02:48):
Right. That was so satisfying.

Speaker 2 (02:02:50):
That was really it was very satisfying.

Speaker 1 (02:02:52):
Right.

Speaker 2 (02:02:52):
This is a true righteous Vengines type situation, right.

Speaker 1 (02:02:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:02:56):
And the other thing I have to say, I pegged
Regina King as a heel very early on.

Speaker 1 (02:03:04):
I did two and I don't remember what it was,
but there were something for me.

Speaker 2 (02:03:08):
It was when that guy the Columbus Columbus, his name Colorado.

Speaker 1 (02:03:16):
Oh, Colorado, yeah, Colorado.

Speaker 2 (02:03:18):
He's like, oh you called that, lady cop. Don't do
that again. I was like, how would he know that?

Speaker 1 (02:03:22):
Mmm? Oh interesting?

Speaker 2 (02:03:24):
So that was my that was my red flag. And
then when they were in the diner, I was like,
uh up, she's bad.

Speaker 1 (02:03:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but she was good. She was good.
I liked Matt Smith. Actually, this might be my Matt
Smith moment with him playing the neighbor, because you know,
he's leaving in a hurry, and it seems like they
have a unique camaraderie that's not entirely like they really
like each other, but they like kind of are like

(02:03:52):
neighborly enough him in Austin Butler's character, and so then
when he comes back, and Austin Butler thinks that him
leaving was some sort of like rousse, you know, or
he left because his dad had had a stroke, and
he calls him out about it, like, you know, this
whole message because of you, and you made up this
you know thing about your dad. And then he immediately

(02:04:13):
Matt Smith pulls down his shirt and shows that he
has the weird dad tattooed on his chest and he's like, no,
that was real, like my dad died, you idiot.

Speaker 2 (02:04:20):
I was like, oh, like that, and it makes that
guy more interesting yep, you know, And then he has
that brief heel turn after yes, and they're like, oh,
that's what.

Speaker 1 (02:04:30):
I was gonna say. Because then then they go in
the locker and it feels like maybe they can sort
of team up in some sort of way. But yeah,
then Smith turns on him, and then when he banged
his head, there was something satisfying about it, but then
I was also like, ugh, this makes me feel gross,
you know what I mean, Like it was just such
a realistically violent moment that was sort of off putting

(02:04:51):
in an interesting way. But then he comes back right
and and then the fact that the baseball bat to
the head. Usually in a movie, it's like, you know,
people get like shot and stabbed and whatever, and then
by the end of the movie they're like skipping off
into the sunset. But that that hit to the head
is what ultimately kills him, and he he has that

(02:05:12):
moment where he's walking to the public storage place and
he stumbles, Yeah, because he's suffering from the concussion, and
just so much more texture to this thing than I expected,
and I really appreciated it. And then him ultimately dying
on the subway was kind of sad. Even though he
was a complicated it was mostly kind of an annoying character.

Speaker 2 (02:05:33):
Well, I see. What I like is how it illuminates
our main character, right, because he had every reason to
just leave him there, and he doesn't, you know. I mean,
I think what the movie is at pains to show
us is that Hank is a decent guy. He's in
he's in a not great situation, but he's still he's
at heart basically a decent guy. Yep. And that was

(02:05:56):
something that I did appreciate totally.

Speaker 1 (02:05:59):
I mean, all the all the stuff they gave him,
the baseball stuff, but we haven't even mentioned the alcoholism. Yeah,
you know, which it's very subtle. You know, it's like
some movies you can imagine where it's just you know,
he's got like the beer in his toilet tank and
he's got the d and they kind of make a
thing out of it. But it's just I know, I
clocked and he was drinking a beer at like eleven
in the morning and thought that was kind of weird.

(02:06:20):
But then when he loses his kidney and it's like, oh,
you have to stop drinking. And then he realizes he
has that stuff all over his apartment and it becomes
a real thing for him to also have to you know,
battle throughout this movie.

Speaker 2 (02:06:35):
Yeah, it's just I don't know, I just I mean,
it's effective to the extent that, you know when he
goes to ask his boss for help and then he
just gets shit faced. Yes, yes, definitely, you're like, oh no,
don't don't, oh no, not not more. You know.

Speaker 1 (02:06:51):
Yeah, I actually thought of that. I know I've said
this on the podcast before and I don't remember what
movie it was, but there are movies where you see
people drinking and you're like, I want to, And then
there are movies where people are drinking you're like I
will never touch alcohol again.

Speaker 2 (02:07:05):
This is the ladder.

Speaker 1 (02:07:06):
Yeah, definitely. I was just like, no, don't do it,
don't do it, and it was making me like, I
don't I don't want to touch alcohol, you know.

Speaker 2 (02:07:14):
So here is a question I had and Amen and
I had the same question, which is there is a
scene where you know, he's in the bar with his
boss and then they go into the safe, right, and
he pulls out a shotgun and then they they they
lock the bad guys out right. Yeah, boss dies, Hank

(02:07:37):
is tramped in there, and then we cut to him
walking out. Yes, did I miss how did he get out?

Speaker 1 (02:07:45):
Well? They I did find that a little confusing because
they leave.

Speaker 2 (02:07:49):
Is that what it is?

Speaker 1 (02:07:50):
Yeah? They literally left, and I remember, I mean I
was paying attention, but I feel like I missed why
they thought they wouldn't wait it out, Yeah, because then
they're like, Okay, well we'll meet you again or something
like that, and I wasn't tote Yeah, I wasn't quite
understanding the motivation behind that. But yes, they end up
leaving and he waits a minute and then he exits.

Speaker 2 (02:08:12):
Okay, So I would call that maybe not executed to
the best.

Speaker 1 (02:08:16):
Of Yeah, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I could
have to see it again to fully.

Speaker 2 (02:08:21):
I thought the cut was so abrupt. I thought that
they were gonna give us a flashback in a second
and chow us what happened? You know, right? But that
actually makes sense? Okay, Yeah, anything else you want to
say about cod Stealing?

Speaker 1 (02:08:36):
Uh no, just uh I'm glad. Well you you mentioned,
you know, just a perfect movie to discover in a theater,
and I couldn't agree more. I mean, it's just I imagined
I would catch this at some point. I didn't have
plans to see it in the theater. And I know
it's not easy for everybody, so acknowledging that, but it

(02:08:56):
is just so fun and delightful to just walk into
something that isn't exactly on your radar, but you're like,
let's give this a shot and seeing it where the
world is shut off, you're in a dark room, you're
not looking at your phone, and you're just jumping into
something unexpected and you don't know where it's going. That's
what's this is. I think it's worth mentioning that this
is based on a book by Charlie Huston, and he

(02:09:18):
wrote the script for this also and it feels like
a book in that way, or it's a very shaggy dogtail,
doesn't you know, feel like a precise movie structure. There's
just a lot of stuff, a lot of characters, a
lot of twists and turns, a lot of things going on,
and it's just so fun watching something where you don't
know where it's going. And the ultimate way to experience
any story, you know, in a dark movie theater. So

(02:09:40):
I'm glad. I'm glad we wound up doing this one.

Speaker 2 (02:09:43):
Me too. That said, Yeah, based on the box office,
I suspect for many people this one will be caught
streaming because.

Speaker 1 (02:09:49):
I say, enjoy it on the airplane or in the
comfort of your living.

Speaker 2 (02:09:52):
Room, enjoy it on voodoo in eight days. Yeah, probably
is nobody too, that's already on streaming. I saw that.
Yeah yeah, yeah. But hey, let us know your thoughts
if you have any if you do end up watching
this or we'd love to hear what we have to
say about anything that we said during this episode. You
can email us at Moviefilm Podcast at gmail dot com.
You can also hit like on our Facebook page Facebook

(02:10:15):
dot com slash Movie Film Podcast and message us there
As always, please go to Apple Podcasts and Lead Review
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certainly do our best to read here. Hey Brian, We
also have a Patreon page that's right.

Speaker 1 (02:10:33):
If you head over to patreon dot com slash Moviefilm
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(02:10:54):
into the conversation. Plus, your subscription goes a long way
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Speaker 2 (02:11:08):
There we go, and if you're looking for me online,
you can find me on social media at Zaki's Corner
That z Akis Corner. You can also read my reviews
at the San Francisco Chronicle and The Rap and also
occasionally at IGN What About You, Brian, you.

Speaker 1 (02:11:20):
Can find episodes I've written of Puppy Dog Pals and
Young Jedi Adventures streaming over at Disney Plus.

Speaker 2 (02:11:26):
Here we go and with that on behalf of my
partner Brian Hall. My name is Zachie As this has
been movie Film three twenty five. We'll catch you next time.
Thanks folks, welcome friends. Its podcast podcasting Don Show Jackie again,
Ryan The Talking Dot momy Now podcast on

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Ep. 325: Caught Stealing

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