September 28, 2025 • 8 mins
Bryce McKenzie says results from a recent survey around the Paris Accord show Kiwi farmers are getting frustrated by the purpose of remaining in the agreement.
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Speaker 1 (00:09):
Welcome back to the muster. Bryce McKenzie is co founder
of Groundswell New Zealand and joins us this afternoon.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Good afternoon, Bryce, afternoon, Andy, and listeners.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
How's everything out there in west of Targo today? You're coping?
Speaker 2 (00:23):
All right? Yeah we are, but it's a little bit cool, Andy.
I mean, last year might have been wet, but this
year certainly a cold spring. It was after yesterday's about
twenty one degrees. It was one out of the box
and now we're back to bloom single figgars again.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Yesterday was bonkers. It was like eighteen degrees or something
about three or four o'clock and then it just cooled
downside of raining and gore, I don't know about six
thirty I suppose.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, no, it was quite strange, really, but man, it
was good to have that heat through the day. You
can just out see the grass leaping out on the ground.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Man. Now you talk about strange, it's this whole pair
of situation which a Groundswell perspective. I suppose you're finding. Bryce.
There was a survey go out to farmers recently, ninety
four percent of them saying remaining in the Paris Accord
isn't in the country's best interest. Now, over two thousand
farmers responded to this joint survey you promoted with ENSIP
(01:14):
Farming and the Methane Science Accord. But how many farmers
would have received the survey.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Ah, that's very difficult to know, Andy. I think we
put links to it on social media so that there
would have been a lot of farmers have access to it.
But yeah, really difficult to say. Just how many are
we just.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Going over old retrich though, Bryce, We seem to have
been talking about this for the last twelve to eighteen
months with no real gains either way.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, well, no, there are some gains, Andy. I mean,
we've got two political parties now that are are really
keen on doing something about it. So I guess that's
got to be a gain. Because we talked to that
back about February this year and at that stage they
said it wasn't on their horizon. So that was interesting
(02:06):
that they said that and then what they come out with.
I mean, they've been quite firm on their thinking on
the Paris Accord. So no, there's been some great gains
and you know, time will tell what really happens, and
it's quite in the mode of subject. I mean, we
get one or two emails from people that just think
of it destroying New Zealand if we pulled out, and
(02:27):
we're not saying that there's going to be no repercussions.
I mean, when you do something politically, there's always a
repercussioner too. But if they push what is in the
agreement and might have been decided, if you don't need
targets what it could cost you, then goodness great as me.
(02:49):
You know, it could cost the country billions in the futures,
and it's costing us money already. I mean, there's lots
of places where you can see that the Paris Accord
has cost us money. All our trees and everything is
the result of trying to cut omissions in mine with
the Paris Agreement.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Like meetlaf said, two out of three eight bad bryce.
But it's not three out of three, and unfortunately the
big one is the National Party.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, quite right, Andy, But you know, if you're forming
a coalition then you normally have to have some trade offs.
Having two out of three could mean that there would
be some quite good tradeoffs going on. So let's just
see what happens. Mind you you've got to get those
three parties as part of the next government. And you know,
other things aren't just that sweet in some areas already,
(03:37):
So who would they Have.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
You been in comms at all with Labor like s
Joe Luxton or the likes regarding the Paris.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Accord, Ah, look, just nothing serious, no serious talks about it,
but we have. I have mentioned it to Joe in
one of our conversations. But yeah, nothing too serious. I
don't think labor is interested at the stage doing anything
about it. But however, who knows.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
To be fair, they were still waiting for Labor to
come out with some policy regarding agriculture.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's what I was im blying, And I said, who knows.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Time will tell them that one. Now trade negotiations they're
ruinning to pay around. This is where Todder Clay Trade
Minister overseas, Winston Peters as well. So the arguments there.
You guys are on the ground trying to do what
they can.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Yeah, that's right, and I'm sure they are. You know,
I think Todd mcclay's actually doing a pretty good job
and doing for agriculture. So I haven't really got any
bones to pack with Todd but you know, some of
those agreements are not being held up already. The one
(04:48):
with I think it's European Union, they were to cut
their subsidies on fuel as part of our agreement with them,
and they've actually put them up, so the subsidies up,
so you know, they're not they're not fulfilling the agreement anyway,
and that doesn't appear to be any penalties for not
(05:10):
doing it, so what's the point in having it?
Speaker 1 (05:13):
So Okay, flip the coin around. How many farmers have
been in touch saying that your narrative is wrong and
you're supporting what's going on with Paris?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
A lot, very few that they are.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Out there though, people are out there in agreeanes with
it though.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Yes, yes they definitely are, but not you know, very
very small percentage. But well that we get feedback from.
Put it that way, most of our feedback is from
people that are in favor of it. Probably they could
even be as high as thirty to one, and it's
probably even higher that are in favor of it. But
(05:49):
then you only get those people that are actively interested
that give you feedback. Most people don't bother. It's a
bit like doing the survey that for every question you
you get a massive drop off. I think it's something
like if you put it in an email, about fifty
percent of people open it. If you put one question,
(06:11):
then those fifty percent are likely to answer it. If
you put two questions and fifty percent of them won't
bother going on, and so it goes. The more questions
you put in just keeps dropping off for quite a
high percentage. So yeah, it's hard to get people to buy.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And so in the scheme of things, two thousand farmers
are applying was a win.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Oh yeah, Yeah, we were pleased with that, We really were,
and you know, we had really pitched it so that
we only wanted farmers to answer it. Of course, there's
no way you can really check up on that for
the ones, for all the ones against. I mean, I know,
if you're against it, you could quite likely follow it
in and say you're a farmer, and there's no way
(06:53):
for us really to check. Yeah, there's always a bit
of hit and miss, and that Andy.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
There also release that came out that you stipulated the
National Party policy about a farming tax being implemented by
twenty thirty for the possibility of another labor Green government
being just an election away, Heaven help us a year out.
So what are we actually hearing now as far as
the farming tax by the National Party.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Oh look, I think there's announcement due either this week
or next week. And what we're hearing Andy is somewhere
between fourteen and twenty four percent charge on methane. So
who would know.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
So we're just tasting our tails on this whole subject.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
More or les still Yeah, yeah, yeah, we definitely are. Yeah. Well,
I mean the government has committed to putting a charge
on a missions for farmers and they're basically committed to that,
and so they're going about it in the way that
they do as politicians. That will come out anytime soon
(08:02):
and then you'll hear everybody so well, you know, we're
we've only going to drop another seven percent by twenty thirty,
and we should do that easily. We'll get the same
old river it come out. Well, if that's the case,
why are we even bothering? And you wain't That's exactly
the line they're going to take. It's not going to
be a problem to do it.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
And there recent times Bryce McKinzie, and by the way,
every time I get an email from ground Swell. I
read it in a voice like you have at the moment.
Don't ask me whyever, it comes out that way. Always
appreciate your.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Time, tears Andy, I'm sorry I've got in your head
that much.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Bryce McKenzie, a ground Swenty Zealand always appreciate his time.
That says the Muster. We're going to catch out with
Andrea Dixon next out of the Southern Dairy Hub
Welcome back to the muster. Bryce McKenzie is co founder
of Groundswell New Zealand and joins us this afternoon.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Good afternoon, Bryce, afternoon, Andy, and listeners.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
How's everything out there in west of Targo today? You're coping?
Speaker 2 (00:23):
All right? Yeah we are, but it's a little bit cool, Andy.
I mean, last year might have been wet, but this
year certainly a cold spring. It was after yesterday's about
twenty one degrees. It was one out of the box
and now we're back to bloom single figgars again.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
Yesterday was bonkers. It was like eighteen degrees or something
about three or four o'clock and then it just cooled
downside of raining and gore, I don't know about six
thirty I suppose.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Yeah, no, it was quite strange, really, but man, it
was good to have that heat through the day. You
can just out see the grass leaping out on the ground.
Speaker 1 (00:54):
Man. Now you talk about strange, it's this whole pair
of situation which a Groundswell perspective. I suppose you're finding. Bryce.
There was a survey go out to farmers recently, ninety
four percent of them saying remaining in the Paris Accord
isn't in the country's best interest. Now, over two thousand
farmers responded to this joint survey you promoted with ENSIP
(01:14):
Farming and the Methane Science Accord. But how many farmers
would have received the survey.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
Ah, that's very difficult to know, Andy. I think we
put links to it on social media so that there
would have been a lot of farmers have access to it.
But yeah, really difficult to say. Just how many are
we just.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Going over old retrich though, Bryce, We seem to have
been talking about this for the last twelve to eighteen
months with no real gains either way.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Yeah, well, no, there are some gains, Andy. I mean,
we've got two political parties now that are are really
keen on doing something about it. So I guess that's
got to be a gain. Because we talked to that
back about February this year and at that stage they
said it wasn't on their horizon. So that was interesting
(02:06):
that they said that and then what they come out with.
I mean, they've been quite firm on their thinking on
the Paris Accord. So no, there's been some great gains
and you know, time will tell what really happens, and
it's quite in the mode of subject. I mean, we
get one or two emails from people that just think
of it destroying New Zealand if we pulled out, and
(02:27):
we're not saying that there's going to be no repercussions.
I mean, when you do something politically, there's always a
repercussioner too. But if they push what is in the
agreement and might have been decided, if you don't need
targets what it could cost you, then goodness great as me.
(02:49):
You know, it could cost the country billions in the futures,
and it's costing us money already. I mean, there's lots
of places where you can see that the Paris Accord
has cost us money. All our trees and everything is
the result of trying to cut omissions in mine with
the Paris Agreement.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Like meetlaf said, two out of three eight bad bryce.
But it's not three out of three, and unfortunately the
big one is the National Party.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, quite right, Andy, But you know, if you're forming
a coalition then you normally have to have some trade offs.
Having two out of three could mean that there would
be some quite good tradeoffs going on. So let's just
see what happens. Mind you you've got to get those
three parties as part of the next government. And you know,
other things aren't just that sweet in some areas already,
(03:37):
So who would they Have.
Speaker 1 (03:39):
You been in comms at all with Labor like s
Joe Luxton or the likes regarding the Paris.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Accord, Ah, look, just nothing serious, no serious talks about it,
but we have. I have mentioned it to Joe in
one of our conversations. But yeah, nothing too serious. I
don't think labor is interested at the stage doing anything
about it. But however, who knows.
Speaker 1 (04:03):
To be fair, they were still waiting for Labor to
come out with some policy regarding agriculture.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's what I was im blying, And I said, who knows.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
Time will tell them that one. Now trade negotiations they're
ruinning to pay around. This is where Todder Clay Trade
Minister overseas, Winston Peters as well. So the arguments there.
You guys are on the ground trying to do what
they can.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
Yeah, that's right, and I'm sure they are. You know,
I think Todd mcclay's actually doing a pretty good job
and doing for agriculture. So I haven't really got any
bones to pack with Todd but you know, some of
those agreements are not being held up already. The one
(04:48):
with I think it's European Union, they were to cut
their subsidies on fuel as part of our agreement with them,
and they've actually put them up, so the subsidies up,
so you know, they're not they're not fulfilling the agreement anyway,
and that doesn't appear to be any penalties for not
(05:10):
doing it, so what's the point in having it?
Speaker 1 (05:13):
So Okay, flip the coin around. How many farmers have
been in touch saying that your narrative is wrong and
you're supporting what's going on with Paris?
Speaker 2 (05:21):
A lot, very few that they are.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
Out there though, people are out there in agreeanes with
it though.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
Yes, yes they definitely are, but not you know, very
very small percentage. But well that we get feedback from.
Put it that way, most of our feedback is from
people that are in favor of it. Probably they could
even be as high as thirty to one, and it's
probably even higher that are in favor of it. But
(05:49):
then you only get those people that are actively interested
that give you feedback. Most people don't bother. It's a
bit like doing the survey that for every question you
you get a massive drop off. I think it's something
like if you put it in an email, about fifty
percent of people open it. If you put one question,
(06:11):
then those fifty percent are likely to answer it. If
you put two questions and fifty percent of them won't
bother going on, and so it goes. The more questions
you put in just keeps dropping off for quite a
high percentage. So yeah, it's hard to get people to buy.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And so in the scheme of things, two thousand farmers
are applying was a win.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
Oh yeah, Yeah, we were pleased with that, We really were,
and you know, we had really pitched it so that
we only wanted farmers to answer it. Of course, there's
no way you can really check up on that for
the ones, for all the ones against. I mean, I know,
if you're against it, you could quite likely follow it
in and say you're a farmer, and there's no way
(06:53):
for us really to check. Yeah, there's always a bit
of hit and miss, and that Andy.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
There also release that came out that you stipulated the
National Party policy about a farming tax being implemented by
twenty thirty for the possibility of another labor Green government
being just an election away, Heaven help us a year out.
So what are we actually hearing now as far as
the farming tax by the National Party.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
Oh look, I think there's announcement due either this week
or next week. And what we're hearing Andy is somewhere
between fourteen and twenty four percent charge on methane. So
who would know.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
So we're just tasting our tails on this whole subject.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
More or les still Yeah, yeah, yeah, we definitely are. Yeah. Well,
I mean the government has committed to putting a charge
on a missions for farmers and they're basically committed to that,
and so they're going about it in the way that
they do as politicians. That will come out anytime soon
(08:02):
and then you'll hear everybody so well, you know, we're
we've only going to drop another seven percent by twenty thirty,
and we should do that easily. We'll get the same
old river it come out. Well, if that's the case,
why are we even bothering? And you wain't That's exactly
the line they're going to take. It's not going to
be a problem to do it.
Speaker 1 (08:20):
And there recent times Bryce McKinzie, and by the way,
every time I get an email from ground Swell. I
read it in a voice like you have at the moment.
Don't ask me whyever, it comes out that way. Always
appreciate your.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Time, tears Andy, I'm sorry I've got in your head
that much.
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Bryce McKenzie, a ground Swenty Zealand always appreciate his time.
That says the Muster. We're going to catch out with
Andrea Dixon next out of the Southern Dairy Hub
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