Buying Or Selling NBA Breakouts - Featuring Dan Favale

Mort & Dan discuss NBA breakouts, and discuss whether they're real.

Odds via FanDuel Sportsbook

https://www.fanduel.com/research/ncaab

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
What is up Felasiko's I am Dan Valley coming at
you with Mort Jensen of the NBA Podcast, Fame of Forbes,
fame of Yahoo Sports, fame of HBO, Max Fame, and
most notably of Only Fans Celebrity. We are here to
talk about Grant and I just discussed whether the most

(00:26):
dominant starts for NBA teams were for real. We're now
gonna buy or sell some NBA breakouts, which players are
exceeding expectations, are really balling right now that we didn't
see coming. We only had really two rules. One No
Victor Wemenyama. We've talked enough about Victor Wemenyama and everything
you see from him is for real. And when Mort
and I were going back and forth, no rookies were included,

(00:46):
because it's cool that Cedric Coward is doing his thing.
Ryan Kulkbrenner apparently isn't gonna miss ever. But they're rookies,
and so it's we'll do separately. We'll talk about rookies
at some point before we dive in. Though, mister Mort Jensen,
how the heck.

Speaker 2 (01:00):
Are you doing well? Sir? Doing well? I mean, look,
not talking about Mitima is tough, but I think we'll manage.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
I bet you he comes up because of a player
that we're going to talk about.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
I know, al brid Shinkun. Yeah that makes sense.

Speaker 1 (01:16):
Uh you ready to get started, sir?

Speaker 2 (01:18):
Yes, sir.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
First player is Madus Bouzellis, and we're gonna give more
the talking stick because he is our resident Bulls fan.

Speaker 2 (01:24):
Oh god, oh god, you and Brian support it. Man,
I'm gonna need to spank the ever living fuck out
of you guys. No good time. I know, I see.
I was setting you up for that one. Look. I
might be skeptical of the Bulls at large and their
entire philosophy of we only need eight to nine good
players and then we can compete for a title. No,

(01:45):
no you can't. But I will say, off those eight
to nine good players, Matzas Bozillas certainly fits that bill.
He might actually be somewhat this savior in Chicago because
this guy has legitimate star upside. I just can't hate
on this guy, nor do I want to. I liked
him from the draft and allwards. When they picked him
at eleventh last year, I was like, yeah, they should

(02:07):
have he fell into their laps, but they made the
right call, Like I will give them credit for that
because if they had passed on him, bad move. This
is a guy I absolutely love, six', ten extremely, mobile extremely.
Athletic his movement patterns off the ball is so underrated to,
me and it's something that we need to talk a

(02:27):
little bit more. About, defensively you, know he doesn't have
the best metrics or rosstats in that, category but you
can just sense he is so good at rotating in
the right times and like the timing of it all
is so potent that he discourages teams to shoot from certain.
Angles AND i think that more than just raw blocks
or steals for that, example is such a good way

(02:50):
to like pinpoint good. Defense like if you can deter
players from flat out shooting or to change their, shots
that's a good. Defender he certainly fits that. Bill the
off ball, Stuff daniels where he really sold, me because
WHAT i was nervous about coming into this season, was you,
know the idea of like a Heliocentric Josh giddy, offense

(03:11):
because we saw last year at plenty plenty of times
that the offense would. Stagnate he would stand around just
dribbling the, basketball just sort of a little bit Like
Carmelo anthony when he was you, know when he was
at his, worst so to, speak didn't really move the.
Ball he would stand, still he would allow the defense to.
Set Now Billy donovan has implemented more off ball. Movement,

(03:34):
giddy for, example is passing the ball a little bit
quicker after he crosses half. Court for, example he's setting
Up Trey. Jones Tray jones is getting some angles covered
and like just creating new. Looks but the Way bussella's
has reacted to those two guards and their intraplay and
the increased movement is just so fricking. Beautiful like he's

(03:54):
not afraid to launch, Three so like he'll step into
an open shot from there if he sees his defender
just move his head just an inch or to. Boom
he's back, cutting like he is reading the defense, Constantly
like he's probing without the, ball he's cutting off the,
ball he's catching and, shooting and of course even when
he's on the, ball he's doing stuff with it as.

(04:16):
Well but like he's finding that balance of being both
an off ball on ball. Player so basically what he's
Becoming dan is he's becoming one of those pluck and play.
Guys in my, opinion like we need to see if
the three point shot is. Real that is something we still.
Think we need a little bit more volume to, it

(04:36):
and we need a little bit more experience on that
level to just gauge.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
It but he's seventeen on arc threes, though to start
the year is a pretty big. Deal above the black
threes is a pretty big.

Speaker 2 (04:45):
Deal, no he's been really good to start the. Year
but we're only six game, in So i'm a little.
CAUTIOUS i don't want to like oversell him too. Much
but but, no he's he's becoming a guy WHO i
think has the potential at least to become one of
those luck and play wings who breaks that pattern of
being you, know the oh, yeah here's a, long athletic

(05:06):
wing who can only play. Defense so this guy will,
score he will, rebound he'll, Defend he even tries to
play make it a little, bit although that is still the
weakest part of his. GAME i think we're looking at
a guy who is going to make at least One
All star, team if not more down the.

Speaker 1 (05:22):
Line so you're just basically saying that he's a merge
Of giannis And Lowry.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
Marketing, well he's you know what he? Is he he
could be What Lauri marketIn should have been In. Chicago
that's probably the best way to phrase.

Speaker 1 (05:40):
It do you see cause you mentioned that you think
the playmaking is the weakest part of his, game AND
i would probably. Agree do you see the ability for
him to do more? There or even just as a
frum scratch type of. GUY i think right, now when
you Have Josh, giddy you don't even Have Kobe white,
yet and the way that you want to play, fast

(06:01):
you don't need him to do any of that. Stuff
but like when you're looking at when The bulls are
going to go up against set, defenses and what does
The this is probably jumping too far, ahead but what
does the next iteration of this? Team Is Kobe white
still there at the end of this? Year Is io still? There?
Is Is voot still? There do you see the ability
for him to do? More AS i guess the term
would be maybe as a focal point M.

Speaker 2 (06:24):
M i think we're gonna need to see more reps
BEFORE i can sit here with absolute certainty and say.
Yes but we have seen some On Boald. Juice we
have seen that we have seen him get into.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Love hearing you say on ball juice.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
Right it's, True it's. True and we we've we've seen
him get into the. Paint we've seen him get to you,
know the elbows and make place off the, dribble even
like making the right entry pass or just seeing a.
Cutter so like there is a type of court. MISSION
i think it needs to be a little. Refined we

(07:00):
also have to remember he's super. Young he turned twenty
one to three weeks. Ago, like he's very very, young this.
Kid So i'm not going to see her and, say,
oh you, know his playmaking is. Bad there's a REASON
i phrased it AS i did by saying this is
the weakest part of his, game because in a couple
of years it might not, be you, know the weakest

(07:20):
part of his. Game it might not be even a
bad part of his. Game, WAY i don't even think
it's a bad like he's a bad. PLAYMAKER i think
there is creation. Upside we just need to see more of.
It but to your, point when the ball is going
through the hands Of Josh Gideon Trey jones as it
is right now and then later On Kobe, white it
becomes a math. Problem at the end of the, DAY

(07:43):
i do trust him to get a tighter. HANDLE i
do trust him to improve that court vision. Further the
height alone is working to his. ADVANTAGE i love this.
GUY i absolutely love this. Guy if we were doing
Like Elite pass ranking of individual, players he'd probably be

(08:04):
in my top, twenty top. Fifteen LIKE i find him
extremely entertaining to. WATCH i agree with.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
YOU i think he's super, entertaining AND i think for
him the low hanging. Fruit i'll say, This i'm gonna
buy just because it feels like everything he's if we're
buying or selling, These i'm gonna buy the breakout just
because THIS a lot of this feels like him building
off what we saw In flickers And flashes next year
so last, year excuse, Me and SO i think that
ends up being a really big. Deal i'm just to

(08:34):
wrap up the playmaking. Thing i'm just wondering if he
can ever become someone who he's a little predictable on
drives right, now and so it's can he just this
is the, thing but you also look at these guys
and it's Conthy town still can't pass out of his.
Drives BUT i think Modest buzelsi's young enough to where it's,
okay this is year, two super. Young let's see if
that becomes a part of his. GAME i would buy this,
one THOUGH i might be it's not. Tainted i'm definitely

(08:55):
influenced by HOW i felt about him last year as.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Well. RAY i will say this to wrap it, up
because it was almost too much of a love. Fest
there is one element THAT i do think is reasonable
to ask more, of even as currently constructed and even
as just a twenty one year, OLD i do think rebounding,
wise he needs to be a little bit more. Aggressive

(09:18):
like he's six,' ten, he's athletic, he's agile he's really good,
at actually, you know finding his way. Into seams he
can do that as well by attacking. THE class i
think there have been moments where he's been a little
too passive on, That front so that Is something i'll
be looking for him to improve on as the. C
snaches some of.

Speaker 1 (09:37):
That though definitely has to Do, with okay you Play
with Vouch And, josh, giddy right so those are guys
that are going to grab. Up boards, but yeah that's
a that's a good point you buying?

Speaker 2 (09:45):
Or selling are we doing buying or? Selling that just
buying the upside or buying the?

Speaker 1 (09:50):
Big buy is what he's? Doing now? Is real or
do you think? It's?

Speaker 2 (09:53):
Good oh real, buying buying buying a lot, Of, stock.

Speaker 1 (09:55):
Yes buying a lot of long term Stock And, BOZELL'S yes.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
I Am buying. Busilli's island And.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
This zach lowe has started getting.

Speaker 2 (10:04):
On that.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
He's right not everything can be. An island speaking of, an,
Island Though, josh giddy he's off to a rollicking start to.
THE year i think even if you Said That kobe
white was going to, miss time would you have Predicted
That josh giddy would Be the bulls. Leading scorer that's a.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
GOOD question i don't think. I'D ever i hadn't thought,
about it to be quite honest. With you SO maybe
i will say he's played a lot better over the
course of the past. THREE games i thought his start
to the season was. NOT great i actually thought he
was for the first, three games, FOUR games i thought

(10:43):
he was the fifth best bull and now he's really.
LEVELING up i thought he needed to have a couple
of games where he asserted, himself offensively just to kind
of prove, A point so we're looking at something that's becoming.
More interesting, Still skeptical dan still really skeptical of like
the ripple Effects Of, josh Kitty, right like he still

(11:07):
doesn't bend defenses off, the ball that is still. An
issue seems we're still giving him a ton, of space
and you have to wonder what that would look like
in a play in slash, playoff setting because at the
end of, THE day i assume that's Where the bulls want,
to be since they refuse to pivot the, other Direction,

(11:27):
RIGHT like i have to assume that they want, to
win that they want to get into. The PLAYOFFS and
i just wonder the lack of his natural spacing prowess
and the way that he just does not affect the
game much off. The ball is that going to limit him?
Moving forward like HE will i think, TO me i
will label it him as this he's a guy who

(11:49):
can help you get into, the postseason but then when,
YOU'RE there i don't know if he's actually helping you or.

Speaker 1 (11:57):
HURTING you i think one of the big changes that
we've SEEN that i do think really increases long term
value is that he looks better and more apt to
play into and, through contact and so when moever shots
are coming at, the rim he's shooting a career percentage at.
The rim not a super high clip relative to the
rest of, the league but, for him it's. Pretty high

(12:19):
shooting fifty percent from, float range which would also be a.
Career high and so if he can be more decisive
and physical in, those spots he can eat up space
that the defenses are going to give him from beyond.
The ARC and i think if HE'S also i think
if he's also going to continue to shoot such a
high clip, from three that you will naturally if this
holds for an, entire season the playoff aspect will. Be

(12:41):
different teams will still leave, him open but he will have.
More gravity we've seen It With, lou dort his, former TEAMMATE.
And okc if you take them enough and hit enough
of them over a sustained period, of time you're never
going to be respected the way that some other, guys
are but you will draw a. Close out and so
for him to be balancing those two things right, NOW
now i think is. ABSOLUTELY huge i think What the

(13:02):
bulls are doing kind of does spotlight some of the
concern that we've talked a lot about is the team
isn't necessarily tailored to, him specifically but he has a
lot of freedom the way That the bulls are, currently
built and he's driving value. In transition, for sure they're
seven points better per one hundred with him, in transition

(13:24):
what my question, would be and by, the way him
personally one point five points per possession. In transition and
to my point before about how he is doing better,
with contact he has a career high foul rate in
transition right now. As well all. Good THINGS where i
start to and this might be an extension of what
you're talking about, the PLAYOFFS where i still have some
concern is just in the half court or if you're

(13:45):
going to need to eat up space or come around
screens and hit a pull. Up jumper that still doesn't
feel like it's part of. His game and he's sub
thirty percent on pull up twos at, the moment he's
at like thirty percent on pull. Up threes the half
court off v is borderline worse when he's on, the
court and That's been we've seen that fluctuate a lot

(14:05):
throughout his, entire CAREER and i, don't know, you know
a lot of the off ball stuff will be put
to the Test Once kobe white. Comes back to Where
Can josh getty be the type of guy that we're
talking about eating? Up space but it's one thing to
do that when you have the ball in. Your hands
it's another thing entirely if you're going to be displaced
form it a little. Bit more maybe the solve is
this is someone we want on the ball because he
is a better Passer Than. Kobe white some of the

(14:28):
passes he's.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
The best let's real. About, that, yeah right he's.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
The best passer on. The team and then like, you
know some of the passes that the timing on them
is weird and there could. Be turnovers but a lot
of that is he's also not. In Fury the bulls are,
on fire but he's not working with like the most
seasoned form of personnel or the most reliable Aside From
madis bozellis is going to BE. An mvp we. Already
decided we've been asked a lot in our comments people.
HAVE received i think they commented on the video we

(14:53):
DID is i Graded the bulls harshly when they made
the Trade For, josh giddy Like Trading alex Caruso For
josh Gidty and i've had a lot of well some,
of them it's, been respectful like to, be clear like
how do you feel about? This now and you still
give THEM a? D minus and, then, like well how
are you? Feeling now like Is, any look we're less
than ten games into. This season So Is josh getty
making me rethink a lot? Of, things Sure but i'm

(15:15):
not going to change my stance at. The, Time profinitively
i'm more open To What josh getty can Do, for
CHICAGO but, i like you still don't view him as.
The contract we said it when he. Signed it the contract.
Is fine we Didn't have like Could the bulls have?
Negotiated harder it seems like they. Could have they didn't give,
into EVERYTHING but i don't know that they won an of.
The negotiation this is a really. Good player maybe he

(15:36):
ends up Making An all, star team but if he
is central to everything, YOU'RE doing i don't know what the.
Ceiling is AND if i Were, THE bulls i would
have preferred first round Equity For. Alex caruso if you're
asking in, a vacuum who is More Talented josh getty
can do more things. Than That But alex cruizo just
helped the thunder win a, Title too, So no i'm
not going to SAY that i think The thunder like

(16:00):
lost out when They Traded, josh gitty and you can, also,
say well then it made sense for. BOTH sides I
think i'm more open to that idea, Than EVER but
i still we need to see. This sustain this Version Of,
josh gitty specifically the, contact stuff the foul dry like
that needs to sustain for an entire year because it's
such an abnormality to the way he has played in.

(16:20):
The PAST but i kudos to him And The bulls
like they have implemented a style that. Suits him he's
way more of a fit here than he Was In.
Oklahoma city but we do have to grap it with
the Reality Of oklahoma city was a title contender and
decided that he wasn't going to elevate them to that.
Next step And the bulls, right now this is, all
fine this is, all great this is. All grand what

(16:41):
does he look like if he's your second or third
best player on.

Speaker 2 (16:45):
The team question is how does he look at your?
Best player that should be the question because that's the
way they're, framing him that's how they're. Playing him but
we're kind.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
Of seeing It, WHERE no i don't Think the bulls
are gonna lose, like win, you know five out of
every six games that. They Play but i'm more so
looking at can this well that, is fair that's a, fair, question,
say well how good Are the bulls if this Is
Just josh. GIDDY'S team i don't know what the ceiling
on that, Would be but my question would more so
be like how can he fit into the larger context of,

(17:14):
The offense and also like the thing that's gonna Change
Is kobe White's Not trey Jones Or io desummu on the,
defensive end and so that's going to Be like i'm
gonna be interested to see How the bulls run out these.
Two together, they Did the bulls did close the season strong,
last year but there's a lot of. NOISE there i
THINK where i would land TO say i probably was
out On The josh giddy basketball experience. Too SOON but

(17:38):
i don't think my doubts of oh can he be
a good? Basketball player that it was never rooted in,
That specifically AND so i still have a lot of,
those concerns but what we're seeing right now is. CERTAINLY
encouraging i.

Speaker 2 (17:49):
Have so many thoughts and comments to. All this first,
AND foremost i want to attack this whole idea with, you,
know oh do you like? The? Trait now that is
such a dumb way. Of phrasing and because you have
to look at a trade at, the time that that
is how you conduct. A trade you look at that and, You,
go okay what is this player's value? Right now could

(18:11):
we have squeezed more out? Of it you can't sit
there and bake, in well this guy might go down as,
someone better and that's why we're willing to relinquish Very.

Speaker 1 (18:20):
Neat harrison MAVs fans don't get the vision of us
winning the lottery framework because even if you're NOT and
i don't even, mean interject but even if you're, not saying,
you know they could have gotten more first round picks from,
another team would you Rather Have josh giddy Or? Too,
MIDEN first i think the real question is could they
have gotten more out of, the thunder specifically with their?
Trade partner and THE answer i would assume.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Is yes and that's my point exactly like you want to.
Get more, like so, for exam When the Bulls Traded
jimmy butler right To The, minnesota timberwolves that was in,
twenty seventeen they got laurded market in, you know the draft,
pick there but they also relinquished the sixteenth overall pick Back.
To minnesota and to me at, THAT time i, was
like why you're Giving Up. Jimmy butler you don't have

(19:02):
to give up the sixteenth pick in the draft. As
well like that was and that was even under. Former
management that's always been a Thing, in, chicago, like well
we don't want to a trade to just, go away
so like will relinquish and we'll add in something that's.
Totally unnecessary and this was one of those things again
Where the bulls could have. Gotten more, so, Like no

(19:24):
i'm not going to change my stance on, you Know the,
giddy trade because when people are saying how do you? Like,
it now you're, asking, us Oh Did? Artres cornershovs did
he have? The foresight did he have the ability to
look forward? IN time i promise you he. Does not
he's one of the worst negotiators in the. Entire league, so,
like no that's the First thing, saily, well OKAY.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
Those I Own kobe white contracts turned out.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
Pretty, Good, no No that's i've always that's the One
thing i've always complimented that this regime about that wasn't just.
Those two it was Also The jaalen smith contract that
too was. Pretty good, they've done they've.

Speaker 1 (20:00):
DONE well i think you've been a lot Higher on
john's with, than most but he has been. Largely unspectacular,
inch WELL that's i they Could have how do you feel,
About That mama, kels Freely may.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
I'm, Trying yeah I'm Throw mama. Keylas, freely, yes yes
they could have. HAD him i would have rather. Had him, you're,
right yes that that is unfair that you chose one
of my. Favorite players you know what you were. Doing
there the second point here in regards to like the
half court stuff and like The, CEILING wise I Think
josh giddy is becoming this generation's litmus test in terms

(20:38):
of like are people watching closely or are they still enthralled?
By rawstats because when you look at this line, right
now twenty two points, nine rebounds nine assists looks, fucking
Fantastic right like you're looking at and, you're going oh,
my god this Is like luca like that that is
within those. Same spheres it's not though not even remotely.

(21:01):
Like it's it's when you watch, the games you're seeing
how it's so tailored, towards him and they're closing off
like weakness's path because, they, know oh he just can't,
do this so let's hide his ass in so many of,
These actions like when you, watch closely you realize the
rosstats they certainly do not tell you the. Whole story,

(21:22):
And defensively i'm still worried. As hell the guy can't Bend,
Over dan like everything he's doing is like, standing up
like if you can't even get into a defensive stands and.
Stop guards like, to me he's not a. Point guard he's.
A forward he's like a three or, a four and
he's like a ball handling forward who needs to have,
you know point of. Attack defenders in terms, of guards

(21:45):
he needs to have other ball handlers. Around him that
is where you, optimize him because that allows you to
have a presence of a different guard on. The floor,
for example Him And. Trey jones in the early parts of,
THIS year i freaking Loved, it dan because last year
he was like the guy who was. Doing everything it
was almost Bordering on. Healey centric now you had a

(22:05):
guy who could break down, the defense who could get someone.
To react now You're turning josh getting in too like
the secondary creator for a couple. Of possessions that is
where he. Just shines that is. His ROLE so i
hate the idea Of like pigeon holding him into like the.
Point guard he's a. Point guard he's a. Playmaking wing,
if anything that's where. He shines.

Speaker 1 (22:28):
So we probably could Talk About trey jones too if
we were speaking. Of breakouts that dude's been. ON fire i,
love him love let's frame let's frame it this by
then buy Or Sell josh giddy over under going over
Point Five all star appearances for his career.

Speaker 2 (22:46):
Point. Point five, so like so he's.

Speaker 1 (22:48):
Making it buy Or Sell josh giddy Making An all. Star, team.

Speaker 2 (22:52):
Well so let me let me because you have to
help me on. This one so in terms of Like
The all, star voting it is twenty five, and, fans right,
mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (23:02):
That's starters Though The all star serves are chosen, by
coaches it won't, be players fans.

Speaker 2 (23:06):
Or, media Okay then i'm gonna say UNDER because, i think,
you know assuming it. Is Coaches like i've, Said Before
keith smith has told us repeatedly through, you know his
sources as well that oftentimes coaches like delegate this responsibilities
to like. Video guys so that's that's. The thing but
if it's coaches actually Voting On All star, WARS stars

(23:27):
i think they're gonna find players who are more Influential Than.
Josh Giddy So i'm i'm gonna go the under and
if he makes it this, Year already i'm gonna. Eat,
CROW yeah I.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
Think i'm going To Sell josh giddy As An. ALL star,
i mean there's a lot of injuries In the east though,
this Year, this tatum there's a lot of and, Then Yeah,
Trey young i'll. Buy it i'm just gonna.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Buy it, just okay, all right that see. THAT'S fair
i hadn't consider that all. The, injuries okay you, Know
what i'm gonna change my Stands and i'm gonna say over,
BUT exclusive i want the record to reflect that it's. Injury,
Related dan so.

Speaker 1 (24:11):
You're selling the Idea Of josh giddy As An, all
star but you're buying the idea that he can Make
An All star team is basically what you're saying. Pretty much,
next up you're A guy John fankaminga what are you notice? From?

Speaker 2 (24:24):
HIM so i noticed that he's not looking over his. Shoulder,
anymore basically he is playing with a sense of URGENCY
that i Don't think i've seen from. Him, BEFORE like
i understand that some of the numbers may not look
as great as they did in the past, when you,
you know look at it through a per. Minute LENS

(24:46):
but i think he's just been solid. This year the three,
POINT shot, I mean i'm it's a small, sample, size
granted but like there's a. Level there when he gets
his feet just set the, right way when the confidence
is flowing, that shook that shot is starting to. Look good,
you know he's sitting at an almost forty four percent from,
the outside he's hitting eighty four from. The line he's

(25:08):
still converting. On, twos like, OFFENSIVELY speaking i think we're
seeing a more refined version. Of Him, you know he's
playmaking a little, bit more, he's rebounding, He's putting he's
being put on the best perimeter offensive player from. The,
opponents like so he's getting the toughest defensive assignment on

(25:29):
several occasions when it's, not him It's obviously Jimmy. Or
draymond but like if you have a guy, Who's Shifty
steve kurz not afraid To use kumika's athleticism to try
to negate some. OF that i, You Know I'm i'm
i'm just appreciating the fact that we're seeing him turn
into that, more consistent reliable forward slash wing that we

(25:54):
have for so many years been. WAITING for I think
i think we're finally seeing.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
Right now i've been really impressed that it does seem
like he is fitting. IN better i don't know if
it has to, do with like, you said no longer
looking over, his shoulder if something's. Just clicked does he
have a little bit more of? A runway they have
not been afraid what was the whole thing at the
start of the year where he can't include him in
the starting lineup Because so Draymond And, jimmy butler they've

(26:19):
been unafraid to. Try that his three point. Shooting helps
he's passing on a higher percentage of his drives. As
well he's been ultra efficient. In those he's, over sixty,
he says shooting sixty three percent. On drives and so
you look at everyone who's made more than fifteen shots,
on drives here's everyone who's shooting a better Percentage, Than,
Kamenka Doncicic, Giannis, Peyton Pritchard, Jalen Johnson, Austin Reeves Jared,

(26:43):
jackson Junior And. Julius randall and so, he's right he's right,
up there and the fact that he's willing to defer
more on them kind of a. Big deal we've seen,
moments though where he'll revert back to, you know he
wants to go right the balls in his hands and
he's just going to. Do it but there's also like
kind of value and having that bailout option sometimes and
he still has when it doesn't, always work like the

(27:06):
agility with which he can spin with the ball in,
his hands or kind of change direction or Decide like
i'm really gonna power it to. The rim there's never
gonna be the same dynamism As A jimmy butler in,
that scenario but he's he's, got it and so it
was a. Long time jonathan, KAMINGA skeptic I think i
buy the idea of him fitting in more with the
macro picture Of. The warriors my actual buy or sell

(27:27):
question here, more though buy Or Sell jonathan kaminga being
On the warriors past the trade deadline now though because
of what, We're seeing.

Speaker 2 (27:37):
I'm still selling because we have to factor in his
relationship To the warriors, as well and it felt like
that was. Pretty Out like i'm open to the idea that, he's, like,
oh okay we're, cool now, we're fine but we, don't
know like he might just be looking at this as
a way of, ALL right i mean the biggest display

(27:58):
window of all time right Now that i'm going to
make the most of it to try to get out.
OF here i don't know if that's. The case. He can,
you know he's doing everything right. Right now he's saying the,
right things he's playing the, right way but you don't
really know where his head, is at and we just
all what we know is that he and them and

(28:19):
it became such a contentious relationship with the course. Of
summer so that's the ONLY thing i can sort of
pick at a little bit, and, say, oh like this
is some data we have from. Back then if everything
is no pun intended Kumbaya for kuminga, it's yeah that
changes the course of the narrative and. The discussion but

(28:41):
from what we know right now is that the two
entities are are looking to go their, separate ways and
That's what i'm until we know, something more that's The
one i'm.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Leaning towards i'm gonna buy him still being there after,
THE trade i. Don't know i'm still curious as to
what Are the warriors going to be looking for if
this the Version of cominga, they HAD and i know
they've had a, couple bad. Bad Losses Shorthanded central division
teams are apparently their, achilles heel but what are they supposed?
To get you're you're then talking about how do you

(29:11):
Upgrade from KAMINGA because i guess there's still a chance
that you view them as being able, to upgrade not
from a, talent perspective maybe from a, fit perspective but
if this is the Version of kaminga, you're getting and
there also might be a level of how are we
actually supposed to upgrade? From him unless we're gonna go
all in on, someone ELSE and i don't know who
would be. That player lock can change Now between february

(29:33):
fit Now and. February fifth i'm gonna buy him being
on the winers to finished.

Speaker 2 (29:36):
THE season i actually like that because what you're really
saying is two parties are coming together and hashing out.
THEIR differences i like that on a.

Speaker 1 (29:45):
Human, level look it's ALSO just i might be sipping
the early season kool. Aid here they've had a couple bad,
losses too and but, he's played HE'S been i hate
to overuse, this phrase but he's been more plug and
PLAY than i. Ever expect and they look they've done
a nice job of balancing like he is a usage rate,
of base Him And jimmy butler basically have the same
usage rate when him when all four, Of, Them, Steph

(30:06):
draymond Jimmy and jonathan can make around the court to
find that type. Of balance steph is always going to
be that's what, you want finishing plays for you on an.
Ideal possession but if you're able to strike that kind
of balance between Him And jimmy butler when they're on
the Court with Steph, AND draymond i think that's a really.
Big deal and the offense even just one twenty four
when all those four Guys are when those, THREE guys

(30:26):
i don't Even have steph in there as the filter
are on. THE floor i think that when that was
one of people's biggest concerns coming in and even dating
back to, LAST year i think that's really kind of a.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
HUGE deal i know you're not sipping the, kool aid
Dam because i've met you and you are just fit.
As hell.

Speaker 1 (30:41):
You also know my Takes on kamenka generally skewed towards
lower than a lot, of others including my co Host, Grand,
Hughes Ronna Jalen, doran MOORE and i hope listeners watchers
appreciate just HOW inconsistent i Am On, jalen duran just
the duality of. THIS player i still am trying to
wrap my, head around like how valuable, he is what

(31:04):
would you pay him when he gets the restricted? Free
agency but From what i've seen from him, This season
i'll start with, the Defense because detroit's been at times
monstrous on the. DEFENSIVE end i think even when people
were worried about some of those early, season losses opponents
are shooting fifty two point four percent against him at.
The rim that would be by far and away the
lowest mark of. His career they're also just taking way

(31:26):
more shots outside of fourteen feet in general with him on.
THE floor i think there's, two things and maybe they're
the same thing Or Driving matt one is he has
better talent in front. Of him and so we've already
seen More of Duran And isaiah stewart this year than
we did all of last, year together which has kind
of been a. Fun Wrinkle, kate cunningham he has been

(31:47):
a defensive beast for most of. This year now you're
gonna throw in Minutes With, asar Thompson Some ron holland.
THE second i Think the pistons generally do a, good
job which gets into some of my concerns of we're
very rarely gonna. Have two you were More Of, Ron
Holland ISAIAH Stewart nsr thompson on the Court With, Jalen
duran but having that better talent in Front of duran
has simp has streamlined his, defensive ROLE and i think

(32:11):
it's allowed him to make better decisions around, the basket
not getting be more of, a deterrent not getting caught
out of position as much. The offense the Connection with
caid is just unimpeachable At this those guys operate on
the same wavelength they Just like cay just knows where.
He Is, jalen durnan for the, most part knows how to.
Move once he's setting screen, for kids even trailing some
of the plays. In transition big improvement That maybe i'm

(32:34):
sure Not for, pistons FANS but i think in general
that's flying under the Radar for duran is he's just making.
Foul shots he's eighty four percent from the foul line
at while taking more. Of them that's a really. Big
deal he's been. ANOLE yah i would apologize except for
the Fact that i'm, not sorry and he's been a
monster on the offensive glass, for them which THOUGH before

(32:56):
i throw it, TO you i still do have concerns
a lot of it being on, The offense like if
you're gonna be able to put him in this, defensive
role there might be some matchups where it's Not A Jalen,
duran knight but that's just almost any big and he's
probably more so than many others who would we CALL
like i don't want to, say conventional but these rim,
running bigs he's probably better suited to handle some of.

(33:19):
Those oddities at least he has the physical tools to do,
so offensively though you could just kind of see it
if If Like asar thompson doesn't have The Like asar
Thompson And, JAALEN durn i just. Don't know the pistons
of cobbled together some really good lineups, with them but
they just, they're counterintuitive especially if neither one of them has.
The ball and even if like you're not gonna run

(33:41):
a ton Of A Sar thompson jayleen durn picking rolls
like those are gonna be a little bit more easy,
to defend so, that awkwardness and even Sometimes after jalen
durn is setting screens and just the space that he winds,
up occupying he could get in the way of certain
people that have. THE ball i also just he looks
really good sometimes when he's taking those drives with, the
ball but like the finishing, on layups or when he's

(34:02):
getting those deep seals in the pain and calling for
the ball and kind of the possession Stagnates, because okay
he's in the middle of, the floor he's, not moving
he wants. The ball he needs to be more efficient.
On those but this is just he is such a,
polarizing PLAYER and I find i don't know is that?
Just ME but i just find him to be one
of the most polarizing players IN.

Speaker 2 (34:20):
The nba, he is and part of the reason that
it's it's all about. Last year it's all about, last
year because if you remember twenty three, twenty four we
were already seeing the three, Fro conversion like he was
hitting seventy nine percent of his follow shots and he

(34:40):
was looking pretty damn great as. A sophomore and what
our expectations going into year. THREE were i think we
were looking at a year that was in a bit of.
A transition he obviously saw a. Significant doubt he was
significantly down prioritized last, year offensively like he took seven shots,

(35:02):
per game and everything just kind of. Seemed off and
that's why everyone just kind, of, said, oh, oh dude
we get, This wrong like is he just? A guy
i think the twenty four to twenty five season is
something we just kind of need to isolate and throw
out a. Little. BIT no, i, mean okay he developed
Some chemistry kate, last year which is carried over to,

(35:23):
this year but we didn't see. THE improvements i think
that was just a frickin down year and now we're
seeing you know this. Natural, Progression, Okay dan he's played
one hundred and forty two minutes. This year he scored
one hundred and, seven points grabbed, sixty boards and taken
thirty nine foul shots and made thirty seven shots in

(35:44):
one hundred and forty. Two minutes like, right now he's
a per, minute monster absolutely a major. Permittent monster he's just.
Doing more he's he has the freedom to. Do more
there wasn't that limits he shouldn't put upon him as,
last YEAR where i think it was a new, coaching
staff it was a. New era it was basically everything.

(36:06):
WAS new i think he had to get accustomed. TO
that i think we're seeing him be so much more
comfortable in his, own skin within, the offense within the.
Overall Schemes so i'm ready to go back and just
buy my rebuy my Stock In jaln DURHAM because i
was ready to sell. LAST year i, was like he's
played two. Thousand minutes this year it's looked. Mostly pedestrian,

(36:31):
you know he's never going to really break through if
it's going to be like this up and down career
year to year. To year well he's, breaking, out now.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
Buy or sell Jail and duran getting thirty million dollars
in his, next contract which is it's a lot, of
money eighteen percent of the salary cap next. Season buying
i'm going to, SELL that, i think just the way
restricted free, agency WORKS and i don't. Know that i'm
just trying to think of, that's like what is That
Around jared? ALLEN money, i guess so. It's possible i'm

(37:03):
going to sell it because of THE way, rfa works
and he still does have that rampant inconsistency from his,
past THERE and i Think if detroit plays, IT right
i don't spot. THE team i guess also that's going
to have cap space and come in and, you know
Force the pistons to give him. THAT much, i mean
but also eighteen percent is that's a starting big. Man

(37:24):
money that's probably less than like that's close to by
the market maybe for a Starting, big.

Speaker 2 (37:28):
Look, right now he's playing under a half. Per game if,
that changes, and yes you will have to cut down
on the filing because that's why he's not. Playing more
if he sorts that out and starts to play just
twenty eight twenty nine minutes per game this year with
this level, of production and he can actually sustain that.

(37:49):
Permitted production we're gonna look at like a guy who's
averaging twenty and twelve, who can at the same time
give you about eighty five percent from the, foul line
which means you can't put him in, you know hack a.
Shack situations are you gonna tell me That if lebron
Leaves the lakers and they suddenly have money to spend

(38:12):
and they don't, want to, you know toy around with
the idea Of getting duran to Play WITH LUCA i
i wouldn't, be, surprised Honestly if duran could be the
guy who breaks the offersheet spell that the league is.

Speaker 1 (38:28):
UNDER interesting I just i look at the teams that
are gonna have. Cap space how much space Will the?
Lakers have they're gonna have to Work With austin reeves's
new cap, hold there and There's the hornets might, Have
It and i'm trying to think an. Other Team would
washington want to take a Flyer? On jaylender and? Probably,
not well we.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
Don't know so that's the thing about, cap space right
every we have to go through a trade deadline first
really know. How it teams are set up financially going into. The,
summer now if it turns out that post the twenty
twenty six trade headline and you're like two teams with,
cap space, all Right then i'm gonna buy what you.
Were saying then then it's Not gonna i'm not gonna buy.

(39:07):
Into that i'm gonna.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
Sell what but it could also be a nugget situation
to where If the pistons believe that he is their,
big man they look at the chemistry as, a kid
what he does, this season they could just pay him
thirty million dollars a year because that's eighteen percent of
the salary cap and going down. FROM there I don't
i'm STILL gonna I buy jallen durn having a higher
BASELINE than i would, have said maybe even a couple of. Weeks,

(39:30):
AGO right I just. I don't i think there's still gonna.
Be questions but that's why we have to watch the
rest of the. Game's, unfold yeah next guy up more
your favorite player in the league who doesn't play For,
the Bulls Mister austin.

Speaker 2 (39:42):
Reeves, Cut, UH well, i, mean look he's is he
he's about to show team or not about he is
currently showing teams that, you KNOW if i do end
out on the free, agency market and if you are
interested in the guy who can actually sort of kind
of mimic If option. I'M here, i mean this guy's

(40:04):
feel has always. Been good we've talked about. THIS before
i hate how he's like been pigeonholed as an off
ball shooter when he's just. Not right it's so annoying
to me that that that's the thing that just kind.
Of persisted this, is like it's because, HE'S honestly i

(40:25):
think he's a better slasher slash pick and roll player
than he just is. A Shooter like i'm not saying
he's a, bad SHOOTER but i, you know he's not
necessarily the most natural three point shooter in. The, world
like he's someone who will shake. And bake he'll get into,
the paint he'll get to the free throw line a
ton by. The way he'll make reads out of the pick,

(40:46):
and roll he'll initiate place in the. Half court he'll
do a bunch of. Fun stuff he'll also give. You
rebounding he'll give you potentially, this year like double. Digit
assists like what's? Going on but but this is a
guy who's who's sending a league and not just a couple,
of teams the whole damn league a signal, SAYING yeah
i could be, THAT dude i could generally be, that

(41:09):
DUDE or i could be next to. That dude that
is something we will also have to TRACK because i
do think there's a lot of overlap between Him, a
doncic some of which works to their benefit and some
with the exact. Opposite mantra so we'll see how, those two,
you know finagle their playing time together over the course of.

(41:29):
THIS season i just love his approach. To Basketball though
austin reeves the way that he's so patient when he's
like gauging the defense and understanding time. And score there
is Definitely some doncaic elements in this where he's, Just,
LIKE okay i know when the big man's in, The
paint i'm starting. To count oh he's he has to

(41:52):
move in a second or there's a three. Second violation i'm.
Going now and then he even stopped at the free,
throw line Much like luca if he sees that guy
coming over to rotate and, Saying nope i'm going to
change my plan in the middle of. The play because
the situation around me, has changed like he's thinking the.
GAME out i Love what i'm seeing. THIS year i

(42:13):
absolutely Love what. I'm seeing so many teams right now
should be salvating at the idea of getting him. IN there.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
I think what's impros me impress me the most about
his year is. The passing he is FIFTH and i
know that there's been Injuries to Lebron And luca mis,
some time but he's fifth in assists created at. The
Rim the lakers are not a team that generates any
sort of, rim pressure so that speaks to the attention that.
HE'S drawing i think he's gotten better as we've. Seen
teams we know pickup points AROUND the nba, are higher

(42:44):
but there's just something surreal Even when, luca's out when
you see these teams Picking up reeves just trying to
trap him so high up the floor or There's the
lakers are setting screens at the logo to try and get.
Him free but he's making the right Live dribble reeves
and actively feels like he's elevating to he mates. Around
him i'm going to be so and that'll be the
buyer sell element of this is his price point and.

(43:05):
Free agency that's just to echo all the stuff you
said about, his scoring the, drawing fouls like the in
between gaming when he doesn't have. THE ball i know
people tend to this is. Not you people still tend to.
Get concerned luca has the ball in his hands, a
ton how's he? Gonna work he Worked with kyrie like
that ended up being. Perfectly fine he's Worked. With lebron he. Can,
Work honestly he's probably most ideal when you have another

(43:28):
primary type ball handler alongside, of him because you figure
out a way to give, him breaks streamline, his usage
and we're just we're at the point where you want
guys to be able, to drive dribble and, decision make
and That's What austin reeves is able to Do. Alongside
luca what you, Alluded to how does it? Work defensively it,
probably can so long as you have the right personnel.
Around Them the lakers do not yet. Have THAT but

(43:49):
i think Both with Luca, without luca he has shown
this is Not some lakers' exceptionalism. At play if you're trying,
to say is he a top five player IN the nba? Right,
now okay we're dealing with sort of some market. HYPERBOLE
there i will throw it, to, you though buy. Or
sell he has a player option he's gonna decline. Next
year buy Or Sell austin reeves getting thirty million dollars

(44:14):
in free Agency by i'll buy that. As well, i'm
wondering do we need to go up higher? From, that
yes his max his max From another so let's frame it.
This way his max from another team would be FOUR
years i think one seventy nine. Around there buy Or
Sell austin reeves getting a Max by. I'LL sell i

(44:36):
really think we're we're gonna see teams adjudicate more strictly
how how they're giving out maxes TO non. I get,
I mean i guess you could consider him. A star
he's Just in he's in such. Awkward, territory Man just
he's twenty seven, years old so he's not. Super young
he's also can only get the twenty five percent max
because of his experience, Thus far i'm, just saying, IS fine.

(44:58):
I do i would agree to. Your point this will
be in part he's not a restricted. Free agent, That
helps but there will be a Market For austin reeves
AMONG the i think you Could, Name, Portland well portland
can't have caps. Place Anymore but detroit we just. Talked
about he Would Be austin reeves would be Fantastic Alongside,
Kay Gunning amassar Thompson. And, jaalender, yeah yeah.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
He would he would fit in so many. DIFFERENT places
i actually want to go back a little bit because
you were trying to to tell, me that you. Know
WHAT what i was trying to say was the overlap
between those, Two defensively Donte. And reeves just, To clarify
i'm actually still asking questions about their offensive it because
neither guy is like a natural off. Ball shooter you

(45:38):
Brought Up kyrie karee is, SOMEONE whoay i would trust
more in an off ball capacity Than either Luca. OR
reeves i think that's, fair enough, Of, course yeah sure
so so so. That's WHY and i think in order
To optimize luca you need to you need to pair,
him with, you know a lob threat or a versatile.
BIG man i think that would be the Priority In

(46:00):
los angeles instead of giving him a backcourt mate who
does much of the same thing that. He, Does like
i'm not gonna say that they can't work, it OUT.

Speaker 1 (46:07):
But I think i, probably So, BECAUSE reeves i feel
like you could go and we just haven't needed to.
See it but IT'S almost i need to be CAREFUL
how i. Say This austin reeves Is, not Lebron but
lebron is not the most intuitive off ball, shooter either
and he's ended up shooting a high enough clip on
those looks a lot of the times strout his career

(46:28):
for it. To work but what also makes him special
if you want to use him off, the ball if you,
WANT to i guess you could have, him screen but
it's not something we've made a core core tenant of.
His Game austin reeves can do, two things Is what i'm.
Getting at he can catch, and go so if there's,
any space if there's, not space he'll be able to
get around aggressive. Defensive coverages and then also he's a pretty,
good cutter AND so i think that he will shoot

(46:50):
a high. Enough, percentage now if, you're SAYING do i
trust as a spot up shooter when you look at
kind of the Tier of luca's, Best teammates So It's
lebron Reeves. And kyrie kyrie's, AT one i probably Still,
it's Lebron so i'll Just Trust lebron wars the off
ball spot. UP shooter I think reeves could be good
enough TO where i wouldn't worry about the. Offensive overlap
that's fair Even.

Speaker 2 (47:10):
In, IOTA yeah i will say what we've Seen from reees, as,
well like at, some point you just reach that level
where you're, so good where you're starting, to like if
you're overthinking the, offensive fit you're sort of missing. The
POINT and i concede That when i'm sitting there, going about,
oh well, the OVERLAP then i also have to catch myself,

(47:32):
and realize, oh wait this dude is averaging thirty one
to nine, And five LIKE perhaps i should just focus
on the talent like that will work. Itself out So
like he's and and and that's Probably why i'm saying max,
to him because like it seems like he is just
reaching that point talent wise where we are spending too

(47:54):
much time thinking. About, Fit honestly.

Speaker 1 (47:58):
I'm just he'll be a good litmus test for what
are teams and Including, the lakers willing. To pay because even,
if he let's say he Makes An all, star team,
HE'S right, I mean i guess at this rate he
could Make AN all. Nba team it's sort of a
one year of one year aberration for he was really good,
Last year don't get, me Wrong but hill his free
agency will. Be fascinating i'm just gonna ultimately it's gonna

(48:18):
be a lot. OF money i think people are gonna.
HATE that i think a lot of people are gonna
get sticker shock when they see the raw. DOLLAR amount
i Just a max feels a little rich At the
i'm going out on limb and saying a max fewer
than ten games into the Season For. Austin reeves.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
That's fair that. IS fair i. Get that THAT what
I what i, will SAY what i feel very confident,
in Saying is lebron is now the third best player On.
The lakers has? He ever has he ever been the
third best player on its?

Speaker 1 (48:45):
Team ever the other interesting Part about, reeves too is
are they really just not Married to lebron? Coming back
and how does that whole. SITUATION end i would still
say A healthy lebron is going to be Better Than,
austin reeves.

Speaker 2 (48:59):
But oh he's making case out. Of it though he's been.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
Better this year because he's actually played. If, well, No
No but.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
I'm also saying like, Right now i'm Fully like i'm
recognizing the Fact that lebron can come, back reuseless like
useless rate can, go down and, you know he reverts
back to what he used. To be, but like given
what he's doing, right now if we're applying that logic,
moving forward obviously obviously he's the second best player on
the team if we're applying what he's doing, Right now

(49:29):
and that's just a wild thing to Realize when lebron
is like on, the ROSTER like i don't remember when
he wasn't like the number one or number, two guy.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
Next. PLAYER uh i don't know if this will surprise,
some People But alprin shangoon having himself a season averaging
over twenty, two points averaging almost. Eight assists so he's ad,
twenty two seven point, six assists one point, eight steals,
one block shooting fifty three percent from beyond the arc on,
more volume his two point percentages. Come DOWN what i
think more has fascinated me mo post with him is

(50:01):
That the rockets have decided like he, is going and
Especially with Red van, fleet out this makes a ton,
of sense but they have just kind of effectively, decided,
that hey this isn't someone that we're gonna need to
give ball. Screens too we're not even gonna have him
operate as the roleman really. At all he averaged four
possessions almost per game as the role man. Last year
he's another two per game. THIS year i think that

(50:23):
speaks obviously to the ball. Handling hierarchy but even when
he's having, the ball it's not, It's, not oh we
need to give this guy a ball screen to. Get downhill,
it's no he's just. Gonna go he's just got a
lot of tricks under. His belt there's also the stand
still playmaking. IS fantastic i know that his two point percentage,
is down but he's shooting a boat load more free
throws eleven point two per, one hundred up from seven point.

(50:45):
Eight percent the accuracy at the foul line is up
to seventy, eight percent which is good. For him he's
getting fouled on more of. His drives the three point
volume two point seven three point attempts previously for his
career per one. Hundred possessions that's up to four point six,
this year and again he's shooting over fifty percent. On
them he's doing more, in transition grabbing, the, BALL going

(51:08):
i am going to throw it to you on this
buy Or Sell alprin shangun finishing top ten ON the
mvp ballot. This, year oh.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Top ten, all right let me just so we gots is?

Speaker 1 (51:26):
It one obviously as you were just trying, to argue.

Speaker 2 (51:28):
Right, right obviously uh yo Kitch Wemby Johannis, LUCA donovan I, guess,
donovan right you Gotta Go. Donovan shaye obviously that was
the guy forgod.

Speaker 1 (51:47):
You throw your. Kitchen, THERE yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:50):
I was that was my number. One guy, oh, YEAH
kad i mean on the. Same team THAT'S why i forgot.
About it i'll get out.

Speaker 1 (51:59):
In front By saying i'm going to. BUY it i
Don't think i'm struggling to come up. With.

Speaker 2 (52:03):
TEN yeah i think.

Speaker 1 (52:04):
Even the people who appreciate like YOU and i appreciate what,
HE'S doing i don't think we collectively understand just how
important he is to the offense or how much of
just the sole source of propping it they. Are more.
They're twenty their offensive raading goes up by twenty six
point four points with him on the court, this year
their affective field goal percentage goes up by sixteen point.

(52:25):
Three points when he's on, the court their turnovers. Just
plummet he is like he is like the nerve center
of the offense at. This point and the fact that
he's doing IT with I don't i don't want to call,
it imperfect but it's a lot of dual. Big lineups
it's not the best spacing. You get the Cutting for
houston is just different when it's people on the court
who aren't alp For. In shanngun the way he gets

(52:46):
guys moving, around him THIS is i don't know if
HE'S gonna i. GUESS he i, am saying if he's
gonna finish top ten ON the, mvp vall he's certainly
gonna Be AN all. NBA consideration i flirted with going
there as my buy, or sell buy or Sell outproaching
goon Making AN all, Nba team so MAYBE that's i
don't think that's spicier than top ten ON, m vp

(53:06):
however you would, frame. It though I'm just i'm gonna.
Buy It.

Speaker 2 (53:10):
So i've been thinking because There's also KAID and i
had the name, right before who?

Speaker 1 (53:16):
Was it.

Speaker 2 (53:18):
Bruns And brunson exactly like If the warriors make. More
noise you gotta flow steff. In there What about aunt
if they? Get going ALTHOUGH my i have some Skepticism.
TOWARDS minnesota i can see, It though like what you're
really asking me IS do i have the balls to buy.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
Show you're trying To find you're trying to figure out
a way not.

Speaker 2 (53:45):
TO buy, I can, I am I am i because
that is just that is too that's a little rich for.
My Blood and i'm like trying to come up with
an explanation for why it is too rich for. My
Blood and i'm kind of FAILING because i think he's
right on. That cusp he's, Right there but is he

(54:05):
the fact.

Speaker 1 (54:06):
That HE'S doing i think like he's doing all this
and just not getting as many paint touches because of
where they have to give him the ball and Where it's,
it's honestly it's. HONESTLY incredible i know the numbers aren't a,
huge jump but this feels like sort of a you
look at the talent on. This team You Have aman
Thompson And. KEVIN durant I know fvv is hurt at,
the moment but like and, we've decided, Like No alpern

(54:26):
shangun is the guy who really needs the keys for.
This offense that is a.

Speaker 2 (54:30):
Huge, deal no. It is and and by, the way
in to, your point go check out kd's, assist numbers by,
the way because that is not, an accident that is
not just a case of some all. Sample size he
is being used more as a play finisher now in,
many ways and that is something that has been unlocked
Because Shan Gun shane gun is, like purposely purposefully seeking,

(54:53):
him out trying to put him in advantatious positions like
that is, a clear, you know design from from the
war from. The rockets and to have a guy basically be, Partly,
responsible hey you need To Make kevin durand, Look good
Kevin freaking rand who will look good on his own.

(55:14):
Accord easily that's that's an insane vote, of confidence and he's.
Justifying it so it's it's a really good point just
in terms of like his influence and the importance that
he has to. This team, I'm yeah i'm. Not there i'm.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
NOT there i almost talked you. Into it yeah you.

Speaker 2 (55:34):
Almost did AND then i Remember reached shepherd. Obviously exists so, he's.

Speaker 1 (55:39):
Well look the other look He's reached shepherd shooting really
well from three Off of Alpah and. Shangun passes i'm
just saying something that our next guy up is for
you To Take hami hawk as junior morn is? He back.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
See this is one of those situations again where you
get affected by, you know a more slump or whatever
you want to. Call it, but like can we agree
before we get, Into this like last year, for him.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
It got, really bad got really.

Speaker 2 (56:11):
Really bad, on occasion it like where you were kind
of sitting there watching him play, and, go oh can
you even play him in? This game like do you
need to take him off? The court like there were.
Those moments this, year man he, came back it, was,
LIKE no. I am i am absolutely a guy who deserves,
to be, you know. A STARTER whatnot a funny thing

(56:32):
is he isn't but like he is playing, start basketball
but like he's determined to break into That right like
he's coming back, and saying, You know i'm that guy
averaging nineteen seven five assists almost like he's just he's been.
So good the footwork in like the mid range area is.
Fully back HE'S not i don't, even know like last

(56:55):
year it was, ALMOST like i don't even know what
what went wrong in it was just he just looked
like he didn't grasp the speed or. THE situation i
don't know what really would lay down the cause. Of
it but this year he's far. More determined he's far,
MORE analytical i want, to say in how he approaches,

(57:16):
a defense so like he can dribble the ball up,
the court he'll see like a, high screen he'll, Go
in he'll slow down and he'll like get his defender
a little bit on. A hip then he'll go in
and like everything is so, much more so much, more,
Selective purposeful like he's got a purpose, with everything whereas
last year was a, little wild like he, Was, LIKE

(57:37):
okay i can get the paint TOUCH whenever, i, want
sure but then he didn't really know what to do.
With it he's got a plan every single, time now
every single time he gets into, that paint he's got
a plan that is. Extremely, encouraging NOW do i think
he's gonna keep shooting sixty four percent from. The field,
Probably not like we're probably going to see a slight

(57:59):
offensive downtick as the, season progresses and. That's fair but
what he's doing, right now he's turning, a page he
is flipping, a narrative and he's becoming a guy who
the heat can actually look at, and go, oh see
we have pieces for. The future it's not, just KILWARE

(58:20):
which i greatly appreciate because oh, my god that they.
Need That So I'm i'm i'm. On board so buy er.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
Sell him howk is junior as A legitimate, Mip candidate,
we'll say finishing top ten on. The, Ballot bye i'm.
Gonna sellow this Feels very i've been impressed what. He's
done to. Be sure you look at the like they've
put the ball in his hands and he's almost in a,
weird way well not a, weird way like it's just

(58:49):
he's outright benefited from the injuries that they've had this
year because it's able to put the ball in. His
hands here's every player fun fact more to have as
many points and assists off drives this Year as Jimi Hawkas,
danny Afda, Con Sexton, Kay Cunningham trey Jones Of your
Bulls And. Devin booker pretty good company, to keep especially

(59:11):
when you're shooting fifty five percent, on drives which is
the highest clip of anybody on. That group what is
he off? The ball and when You have tyler hero eventually.
Coming BACK what i think is Underappreciate About tyler heroes
his ability to work away from. The ball what's also
Gonna Help haimy hawk is if you continue to bring
him off, the bench he won't be going up against
as many full fledged. Starting units so there are ways

(59:34):
to sort of. Game it but when you get to your,
Best lineups i'm not tailoring my offense like with your.
BEST players i don't want to have to tailor my
Offense That hymi hawks can have, the BALL and i
still don't know what he is without. THE ball i
don't think the foundation of his driving any. Post ups.
He can't he's not even. Taking threes he then shooting

(59:56):
under twenty five percent on catch and shoot threes. THIS
year i don't like for him to be IN the.
MIP conversation i think we need to step back at
the end of the year and view him as what
you were saying is kind of a core piece for
the heat or that type. OF asset i just don't
see it, with him Or MAYBE i'm i saw too
much last year to buy. Into it right now based
off what we've seen. This year.

Speaker 2 (01:00:17):
That's fair by, the way you Brought up denny in
terms of like the driving, point production.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Is he on? Our list he did this stuff, last
year and It's funny portland has been. Killing it it's
interesting because they've kind of been killing IT with i
don't know this. A lot it's Just Like Jeremy grant
Ball And. Denny auvi you saw that lab But like scoot's,
Not There shade sharp hasn't had the best start to.

(01:00:44):
The season they don't trust any of. Their bigs it
feels like on the, offensive end they are. SO strange i.
LOVE them i want to make it clear they are.
So STRANGE but i didn't Look at denny as a
breakout candidate because. We, Talked yeah i'm sure YOU and,
I Did but GRANT and i talked about him AS
an mip candidate for two, consecutive years like the close
of that Year in washington and then also last year,

(01:01:04):
as well and it's he just seems he's really. Really
good and if anyone doesn't know That About denny auvia,
RIGHT now I would i would recommend watching. Some There
the blazers are fun. As hell they're gonna get out
in transition for a bunch. OF turnovers i don't know
what to make of them on the, Offensive end they're
just so strange in kind of a, cool way but
also it's a little unsettling right when you kind of
look at who have been there most impactful players. This,

(01:01:26):
year Okay Like tamani, kamara awesome But like drew doing
a lot of lifting for That Joy Men.

Speaker 2 (01:01:32):
From dan favalley ON an. Nba podcast i'm sure.

Speaker 1 (01:01:36):
We recorded the extension podcast what a way to close
Out the heimahawkers? Junior SEGMENT and i Had Thought john
hollander is big on why do you pay these guys
all this money before you need to Like Taking timmani
kamara from sub three million to whatever he's at in
twenty six, Twenty seven and it was in my minds
that you really should have focused more. On that i'm
not like they took a. Risk there i'm just watching him.
This year threes aren't even. Falling yet, and no you

(01:01:57):
Absolutely Give tomandi kamara. That contract.

Speaker 2 (01:02:01):
By, THE way, I Mean haimi hokkas is moving UP
the mip charts one RECENT BECAUSE I i i so
far AT least i was very wrong on, my pick very.
Very wrong can't. WAIT more i even said he would
average twenty three at game.

Speaker 1 (01:02:17):
This year we're gonna get To the wizards because they
have they have someone who's been playing. Quite well they
have a couple of someone's but someone that maybe people didn't.
See coming we were on too for the. Moment Though
quentin jackson speaking of how injuries have benefited a, Player's,
role uh basically every single Guard the pacers have ever signed.
Is hurt that is? That? Right more does that happen more?

Speaker 2 (01:02:39):
Or?

Speaker 1 (01:02:39):
Less, Yes Uh quentin jackson's. Been fun he had the
one huge game when they beat the that Was. The
warriors Him And pascal siakam Looked like Magic and kareem during. That,
GAME essentially i really don't know what to make of him,
long TERM but i wanted to put him on. Our
radar he's drawn some pretty nifty fouls in transition nine
to eleven at. The rim he does he see he has.

(01:03:02):
THE game i don't know if he actually is, over
confident but the way he will handle the ball and
try to get to some of, his shots it seems
like he plays with an overconfidence that can border. On
recklessness but he's also shooting six of ten on arc thre's,
this year and most of them have been. Catching shoots
there was that game Against. The warriors they had him
on steph for a lot of the night and he
was holding His own and HE'S also i don't think

(01:03:24):
he's an, excellent passer but he's got good awareness Of
Where aaronie smith. Specifically is but he will get the
ball out of his, hands early he will get it up.
The floor kind of fits the Way the pacers want
to play more buy or Sell the pacers having found
just a miniature diamond in the Rough With.

Speaker 2 (01:03:42):
Quentin, Jackson yeah i'm. Buying that i'm buying that because you,
Know what he's already got. The Mentality and i'll tell.
You why because last in last Season. In, january yeah
it must have Been in January in paris When the
pacers Were. In paris they were gearing up. A practice
i had media credentials along with my, two colleagues and

(01:04:05):
one of my colleagues went over and he like just
to ask him if you could get a few minutes
because he was like his logic was. Pretty imputual, she's
like this is a two. Way guy obviously he would
want some exposure in, some ways like to have some
media come over and talk. To him and practice, hadn't
started like it was probably ten minutes away. Or something

(01:04:26):
jackson just looked, At, him man practice, is STARTING and i, was,
Like nope i'm not talking. TO you i am, Wired
In like i'm. Locked in my guy came back AND
said i. Like him he was just, like nope he.
Was focused he was laser focused on. A PRACTICE and i, was,
like yep. That's interesting that. Is interesting, So uh. I'M

(01:04:47):
buying i. Like it he, seems intense he seems. LIKE
focused i love. THOSE guys i. HAVE nothing i have
no way to back this up with because, he's like
he's what what has he done? This YEAR like pla
two games of twenty? Plus, minutes yeah. That's it two
games of twenty. Plus, minutes frankly we have zero data on,
this guy and yet, we're, like yeah, let's go let's

(01:05:09):
rock and roll based really on one. GOOD game i.
Appreciate it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:14):
IT'S fair i THINK it's i it might just be
it's something to put a pin in because of all.
THE injuries i. LOVE it i.

Speaker 2 (01:05:21):
LOVE it i think sometimes we lack the romanticism in basketball.
As well this.

Speaker 1 (01:05:27):
Is it this is a.

Speaker 2 (01:05:29):
Romantic pick this is us basically saying we like. This
guy we saw what he did Against. The warriors it's
like a super small, sample size, but like gosh darted
it we Are in that is that.

Speaker 1 (01:05:41):
Is romantic you're not saying they're Gonna let benancmatherne walk
Because Of, quentin jackson or they're Gonna Trade andrew nemhart Because.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
Of quenton that would have been that would have been the.

Speaker 1 (01:05:50):
Virus question the buyer cell absolutely by him getting converted
to a standard contract by the end of. The, year.

Speaker 2 (01:05:56):
Right duh.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
Next guy is, for You Mister, moore jensen and he
is one A j Mitchell thunder Just keep we already
knew he was, a dude, but, like.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
Right how do they keep? Doing? This though, it's, LIKE
look i liked him even coming into, last year and
like he wasn't. Bad either, Last year like he was
highly efficient when he, Did play like he showed them on,
ball skills he showed some off. Ball skills this year he's,
just like, oh yeah by, The way i'm gonna turn
into your best best. Bench score i'm just gonna take

(01:06:29):
a bunch. Of shots i'm gonna get into. The paint
i'm gonna nail, Free, FROs, like okay the three bolt
hasn't been, you know hitting to the point where. He can,
That's fine like he's just doing so much. Other stuff
oh and by, the way while i'm being, you know
your your best, Bench scorer i'm also gonna give you
like roughly four rebounds and four assists, per game because,

(01:06:50):
Why not why shouldn't the rich? Get richer we'll figure,
It out like it's he is so so good and,
the size like he can play both, guard positions he
can even play in a pinch in some like some.
Wing minutes he's, twenty three so like there's every reason

(01:07:11):
to believe he's going to add onto this as his,
Career progresses like this is one of those situations where
the thunder can just look at the roster, and, go
hmm if we ever get, too expensive who are we,
gonna drop and then just give the minutes to him
because that's gonna, Be okay like we. Can Survive i'm

(01:07:32):
i'm annoyed at how the rich, get richer and at the,
SAME time i. LOVE it i, love it just such
a dynamic guard.

Speaker 1 (01:07:41):
He is and you mentioned kind of the. Shooting percentage
he's ALSO shooting i think two of twelve from, mid
range but he can get to his spots and he
shot forty percent on catching jud threes. LAST year i
just assume he's not gonna be at thirty thirty one
percent from. THREE forever i expect that some of the
two point jumpers will come up to the malleability he
just gives. You defensively is another one of those guys that's.

(01:08:02):
All right he's, not big but he will just defend
up and you could put him on you, said it
either guard spot and then just along with some. WINGS
there i still camp that contract they gave him his,
highway ROBBERY he's i don't think he's ever gonna make
two percent of the. Salary, cap well he ends up being.
On it that was good negotiating By, The thunder but
this is it's another one of those instances where oh

(01:08:23):
they found this. Other dude, my, question though it's like
the buyer sell, on him is we don't get to
play the buy or Sell aj mitchell being good because
that was kind of well established before, this season buy
or Sell aj mitchell being the most, important player Most
Important Oklahoma city thunder reserved. This season.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
Oh oh that's a. Mean. One okay what you're basically
asking me IS whether i think he's going to be
more Important. Than caruso that's what you're.

Speaker 1 (01:09:01):
Asking, ME well i think we also have to cake
in is do you think he's gonna be more Important
Than caseon? Wallace too it was Case and wallace still
gonna Start when jay dub.

Speaker 2 (01:09:11):
Is healthy, All RIGHT so i Love. AJ mitchell i
stand BY everything. I said But but i'm not gonna buy.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
THAT one i think. THAT'S fair I Love cason. Wallace
too that's just another guy Where it's i'm just assumed
he's gonna shoot better. From three IT'S like I just
i'll see. The, shooting no it's just gonna. Be fine
buy or? Sell him is the LET'S should i say
a top seven? Thunder PLAYER should i just say the
second most? Important reserve so that's when you get Into
the caruso OR. A j mitchell?

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
Of it, All, right no IT'S so I have caruso
there as the number one guy on the bench in
terms of. Pure Influence caseon wallace, is like he's So,
good defensively he's like an. ENERGY guy i, think offensively
like he had the rookie year where he was just kneeling,
everything right like just truly one of those elite, efficiency

(01:10:06):
guys and then last. Year happened he sort of came
back down. To earth, this year he's not been hitting.
That well defensive, He said we've been a starter. This, year, yeah, yeah,
yeah right but more of his threes are going in.

Speaker 1 (01:10:19):
Last year but thirty eight points is No.

Speaker 2 (01:10:22):
Great like, offensively speaking he's still, a project right and
he's about to turn, Twenty two, SO like i think
it's recent to one wonder like what is he? Moving
forward and in the. Playoffs setting that's. JUST me i
love offense MORE than i. LOVE defense i think guys
who com manipulate defenses are more important than. Just Defenders

(01:10:44):
so i'm actually going to Go h mitchell as the
second most important on this very limited sample size that,
we have which is definitely gonna make me look like
an idiot when he doesn't receive a single minute in.
THE playoffs i love.

Speaker 1 (01:10:57):
The spirit, OF it i THINK what, I so i,
THINK offensively i Like aj mitchell Better Than. ALEX caruso
i think there's even a case, to say, you LIKE Like,
aj mitchell who do you trust to run an offense? Right?
NOW More, Aj mitchell Case and Wallace Or.

Speaker 2 (01:11:09):
Alex caruso, oh, Yeah probably.

Speaker 1 (01:11:13):
I'm just, wondering defensively EVEN though i think he's pretty.
Good There alex Caruso and Case and wallace can guard
FORCE and i don't Know If aj, I'LL say i
Don't Think aj mitchell can. Do that you need to
stretch on. Some wings but if you're gonna ask him
to guard up to these, bigger, FORWARDS yeah i like
the spirit of. Buying it i'm gonna sell IT because
i still at least Think If alex caruso has any

(01:11:34):
semblance of healthy the positional mallubility On d although but
again maybe if you're the thunder you look. At, us
well if we get That From, cason wallace how badly
do we need It From. Alex? Caruso yeah can you
believe we're even asking the question though with a? Straight, FACE.

Speaker 2 (01:11:48):
Well, i, mean look this is a scene that just keeps,
Finding Guys So i'm. I'M there, i, mean look they
don't have their two latest first round draft picks at,
their Exposal Like nicol dtopich by, the way to see
cancer like so.

Speaker 1 (01:12:01):
That, all yeah but you, know what we actually haven't
covered that on, the pod so shout all the good vibes.
To him chemotherapy is no, fucking.

Speaker 2 (01:12:07):
Joke folks and and AND it's i have a friend
who went through that same diagnose, the sect, same diagnosis
and and like he also, told me it's just such
a mind fuck really because then every time you just
get a stomach pain after like you come through on the,
other side, you're nervous and it's just this is not
something to be. TAKEN lightly, i saw, you Know typical,

(01:12:29):
facebook shit, you know, people, saying, OH so i guess
he'll end up having, no balls and it's just stop.

Speaker 1 (01:12:34):
It, beef yeah WHEN people i get when they thought
it was, an injury and he apparently asked that the
thunder keep it, under wraps which that's that's the, tough
stuff is that these guys are in the. Public eye
but then it just gets announced to the world you're just.
Sticular cancer but to make jokes, AFTER that I aim i.
Hated it it was Just so but it's also it's
a mind fuck too when you're IT'S no i don't
want anyone to. Get it but like when you're younger

(01:12:56):
and your whole life is supposed to be ahead of
you and you're not supposed to be dealing with this
stuff becomes it's a different type of. Mental hurdle so
we wish him. The best apparently the prognosis is, really
good but even if it's a really good chemotherapy sucks
and so going through.

Speaker 2 (01:13:09):
That's tough, but, yeah sorry go, ahead now it's just
about to say that him And Then thomas sorber is
also going to miss. This, year yep was it THAT
the acl Was? THEN achilles i. DON'T remember i.

Speaker 1 (01:13:22):
Think it WAS. THE acl i want, To say i'll look.

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
Really quick that's just that, also sucks by, the way
for a. Young, player yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:13:30):
Injuries, do suck just. Generally Speaking And thomas sorber is Out,
with yeah that WAS. An acl the, other, thing too
is buy Or Sell brooks barnheiser being more important than.
J dub that's probably think how we should rap just
off the.

Speaker 2 (01:13:43):
Name alone let's go with It Like brooks Barnheiser And,
chris youngblood Like the thunder are racking in guys with.
Cool names come on our next.

Speaker 1 (01:13:52):
Guy Up, Ryan robins GRANT and i talked about him
and we were talking about the. Box start, holy hell
this guy's just. Coming, in oh you're the second option
now For The, milwaukee bucks, and hey you're gonna defend
the other team's best. Best, guard basically you're gonna Hit,
some again he's not hitting like the most. Complicated shots
but when you're Looking, at oh he's taken, Some doozies

(01:14:13):
like there's taken. Some fallaways he's dribbled into his. Pull
ups he's take he he has created off, the dribble
the way he's getting into, the lane showing the patients
and the poison getting all the way to the basket
when he, DOES so. I am i'm Smitten. WITH ryan
i liked him last Year and i've now reached the level.
Of smitten he's shooting twenty two of twenty five in the.
Restricted area more of those are self created than, you,

(01:14:33):
think folks sixty one percent, on drives forty six point
two percent on pull. Up threes, and again he's not
doing The The Luka Doncic Prime james harden stuff to,
get them but like he is fleeing them like he
could come off, the dribble dribble, into them sidle. Into
them he's going to get them Up averaging this is
not gonna hold but one point twenty four points per
possession out of the pick. And roll and he's doing

(01:14:56):
all of this like he is carrying a real. Offensive
workload he's at over eighteen points per game for. THE
season I believe i should have had that pulled up
right in front. Of me but he's shouldering a bigger
offensive workload and maybe not. THE best i know he's
not the best, primary playmaker but you're putting the ball in,
his hands having him run, more things and he's still
just kind of this. Defensive monster you cannot good luck

(01:15:18):
making an entry pass or a cross court pass with
him on. The court he is just a passing. Lane
fiend and he has guarded three of his most. Frequent
assignments more Have Been, jalen, Bruns Him, donovan Mitchell And.

Speaker 2 (01:15:30):
Stephen curry their teams, seems, okay yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:15:34):
Their teams those Offenses When ryan rollins registers as a
defender on one of those three guys are averaging again as,
a team one point zero three points. Per possession that.
Is low that. Is insane that's the type of stuff
that he was doing last, year too Is his he
was cutting his teeth because of what he was, doing
defensively and we kind of looked, and, said oh there might, be,

(01:15:55):
like oh this might be someone who could hit. SOME
jumpers i buy Or Sell ryan rowins is a TOP
TEN mvp kidn buy Or Sell ryan rowins as just
a core Piece of milwaukee's team.

Speaker 2 (01:16:10):
Moving forward define moving forward like within beyond.

Speaker 1 (01:16:13):
This year this is not the Whole like giannis, is
There It's jannis turner and a bunch. Of dudes is
like how it's been framed like buy. Or sell this
is even by our sells him as a legitimate starter in.
Today's league it's this is we're still early enough Into
The ryan rowins ascent to where it's Not By ryan
rowins as most improved or trying to take super macro.
THAT route i think it's by just buy Or Sell

(01:16:35):
ryan rowins as a starter IN.

Speaker 2 (01:16:37):
The, Nba yeah i'm. Buying that i'm. Buying that, YOU
know i see a lot of us predicted that he'd
be good for. The box but this is another thing
entirely like he's he's leveled up to a point where
he's become someone undeniable at least over the first six
games so, the season let's see where he is at in.

(01:16:59):
A month, but like he's looked. So good this was
so Needed for, milwaukee too because they just had no
one really who could step into that playmaking role and
do a bunch of stuff with the ball Outside. Of
yannis for him to do that while he's also, participating
defensively while he's hitting forty percent, from three while he's

(01:17:20):
being very selective on, his twos while he's getting to
the freeview line and converting by, the way, like this
this is the type of get that they had to
go find because, ultimately speaking it might be the difference
making factor In retaining gyanis.

Speaker 1 (01:17:39):
Or not this.

Speaker 2 (01:17:40):
Is huge this is, Absolutely huge and the fact that
he's younger and getting Minutes Under doc rivers should say
Something because rivers historically is, just like unless you're, Thirty
five i'm not going to. Play you so that's that's.
EXTRA impressive i do know that there's like a general
lack of options on that team because it's a prooval

(01:18:00):
platter for the, most part but that doesn't.

Speaker 1 (01:18:03):
Make even what. He's doing Look the bucks have, played
well and they HAVE some i think their spacing is
probably better than even we not YOU. And i but
at least his. Podcast credited it makes what he's doing
kind of even, more, impressive though because It's, not yes
You have giannis on, the court and He has giannis
is just. He's bonkers But who we were asking who
is the second best player On the bucks and everyone

(01:18:25):
just Pencils In miles turner this year Has Been.

Speaker 2 (01:18:27):
Ryan rollins it, has yes It Has ryan ROWLINS And
Aj green's that's that's.

Speaker 1 (01:18:34):
The one buy Or Sell ryan Rollins as milwaukee's second. Best,
Player bye I'M gonna i just just feel so wildly
Disrespectful a turner who's actually been shooting well from Three
when giannis is off. The floor what he Does if i'm,
Gonna buy i'm just. Gonna buy he's, you know what
WHAT do i WHAT if i ALWAYS said i gravitate

(01:18:54):
guys who are just gonna have more agency over the
offense because the ball will be in, His Hands ryan
ronds will have more agency over. The OFFENSE so i
mean by it too.

Speaker 2 (01:19:03):
That could be Disrespectful To. Miles turner you give him
a lego set he'll, Be fine he'll, Be, Like okay
i'll take.

Speaker 1 (01:19:09):
It that the contract frame is still good, three years.
Twelve million but if they would have gotten like a
team option or something on that third year rather than a,
player option because, right, now yeah having him for four
million this year next year is like that's a home.

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
Run for, of, course yes it's It's the it's almost
like getting guy who's underpaid is a good thing to
actually rebuild your, team around, you know something that's. Possible,
TEAM yeah I still i hate how they constructed this.
WHOLE thing i still think it's a mess of. A Roster. The,

(01:19:45):
bucks yeah so.

Speaker 1 (01:19:46):
You're selling the idea Of the bucks being a real
force In the. East Overall.

Speaker 2 (01:19:51):
If jannis is, you Know if joannis misses like fifteen,
Twenty games i'm. Selling, That yeah giannis is just like
he's the, swing obviously but like he's just such a
ridiculous player that you can. Walk it you could sleep
walk your winges of forty wains.

Speaker 1 (01:20:06):
With him what DID they i don't remember where they're
over under ended up Being at it was like forty
two and, a, HALF right i might be prepared to
BUY the i don't KNOW if i picked over, for
THEM but i might be prepared to buy. It now
IT seems i think. The BUCKS what's i guess stood
out to ME is i just expected them to die
Every time yannis was off, the court and it seems like.
They have they might be a, mish mash but it's

(01:20:27):
a mishmash that can fend for themselves a little bit
LONGER than i would have expected. For, now yeah we'll
see Next Up's Tyre's maxie moore buy Or Sell tyre's
maxie MAKING all nba? This, year bye, all right you
want to? Move? On yeah, All right i'm good. HE'S in,

(01:20:48):
i mean he's, been incredible the Dynamic with vija and
the fact that he's doing this in part because the
Way the, Sixers play like fewer of his buckets are
self created this year than they were, last year which
is kind of mind boggling to. Think about when you
know what's going On With, Joel Embiid, paul george you're
lying on a ROOKIE In. VJ edgecombe i know there
was a lot made about his two point percentage earlier

(01:21:09):
on in the year over sixty percent on floaters, right
now the stop on a dime decision making for him
has just gotten a, lot better more of a pull
up threat off. THE dribble I think i'm gonna buy
him As AN all nba. Not candidate i'll buy Him
MAKING all nba. This year especially what did we talk
About With josh giddy Baking An all. STAR team I
KNOW all nba is the, entire league but when you

(01:21:29):
Don't have Tatum or halliburton to have to kind of end,
with there and We Know joel embie's not gonna play
in enough games or even be up to snuff at
that level with all the names that feel like they're
kind of coming off. The Board is lebron even gonna
be Eligible FOR? All nba doesn't seem like he's gonna
play in sixty. Five, games Uh that's i'll buy it.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
As, well great we're Done On. Syrege maxi that.

Speaker 1 (01:21:50):
Was quick but that's really all you want to Do
on no Thoughts, on, tyree.

Speaker 2 (01:21:53):
Honestly no he's you basically Said He's, tyree's maxi and
he's Just, HE'S look i don't want to go along
on this one because it's. PRETTY simple i don't even
care how many Wins the sixers end up with, this
year it's all about finding an alternate path to somewhat

(01:22:14):
that resembles success without the Presence Of joel Embiid Or
paul george necessarily because you can't rely on them in
terms of the. Health Factor tyrese maxi is their, new
star he's their, New priority he's the new, turning point
he's their. New everything that is the guy you. Build.
Around now you can't in, any way shape, or form

(01:22:34):
allow yourself to go in and make roster moves with
the mindset of how does This improve Joel Or? Paul george?
Fuck that that ship. Is that, that's sailed, it's over.
It's done it's all about how do We surround tyrey's
backsey with the? Right talent.

Speaker 1 (01:22:54):
Does that make you more or? Less inclined if You're,
the sixers you're now planning because he? Is honest, second
deal it's The. Fun max to, be fair, he's young
but you ALSO. Have vj edgecumb are you looking At
and jared McCain of course going. Grimes too it's a
lot of guards loan around and a lot. Of guards
are you taking the longer view to where this? Is
not we're NOT looking i get what you're saying Build AROUND.

(01:23:14):
Tyre's maxi but is when you say Build Around, tyre's
maxey does that mean kind of go through a process
or is this you think you're ready to build a
Winner Around tyre's maxey at.

Speaker 2 (01:23:24):
The, moment, well now at, the moment it's pretty tough
because one hundred and six million this year alone is
tied Up in Joel And. Paul george So what i'm,
saying is whenever you make, draft picks, for example whenever
you make trades, moving forward it has to be with
him in mind and Stuff joelan peede. IN mind.

Speaker 1 (01:23:41):
I think that's the. Right call if they're, NOT there
i would question it should be, uh yeah if they're,
not there that they. Should be next up, Your Guy,
steph castle and look he's gonna have more of. An
opportunity not only Is The aaron, fox out But Now
dylan harper is going to miss a few weeks with
a WITH a. Caf strain that's do you find Yourself aside,
EVERY year i FEEL like i, keep saying injuries just

(01:24:03):
keep getting worse. And worse they're. More rampant i'm saying
the same. THING again i just feel like there's a
lot of dudes out.

Speaker 2 (01:24:08):
Right, now yeah they're. NOT wrong i feel the. Same
way that is what happens when you have a league
who now starts their defense at forty feet out instead
of twenty. Feet out which is one of my biggest
pet peeves is when, people, say well people didn't get
injured in the eighties, And nineties, well no because, you
know they didn't pick anyone up until they more or

(01:24:29):
less approached like twenty feet and in, so like you
didn't really move all that much on defense as you.

Speaker 1 (01:24:36):
Are so stress the MODERN day mba puts on bodies
from a game to. GAME basis i don't know how
you argue that it's anything more than, Added RIGHT so.

Speaker 2 (01:24:46):
I, ACTUALLY like i don't REMEMBER where i, ret this
but someone said that the PHYSICAL stress nba players are
approaching is reminding them that there was some personal trainer
or something more of WHAT an nfl player is, going through,
you know for a game to. Game basis and that's

(01:25:08):
just mind blowing because how many games is it IN
the NFL seventeen i think seventeen games and then eighty
two IN. The nba like that is a major. Disconnect
there if that's like WHAT an nba player goes. Through
physically so if that, even resembles, you know from a

(01:25:29):
single game perspective to a WHAT an nfl player does
from a single, game perspective that's worrying on so. Many levels,
We'll see We'll See. Stefan CASTLE though i know a
lot of people are down. ON him i. GET that i.
Get that the, shooting thing the shooting concern is real because.

(01:25:52):
IT is, i mean he is not.

Speaker 1 (01:25:54):
Somewhere he shooting thirty four threes, with VOLUME.

Speaker 2 (01:25:57):
Though, I know i know this is again and this
Is The josh giddy thing all, over, Again right like
conseext is, So necessary like he's hitting only eighteen percent
of his, pull ups like everything for him has to
be served and from a, shooting, perspective obviously and that's
the Only thing i'm talking. About here so he's hitting
forty two percent on wide, open threes wide open threes

(01:26:21):
like six. Plus feet on, anything else he's either not
hit or he's hitting. Fourteen percent so like he has
to be wide freaking open to shoot.

Speaker 1 (01:26:31):
That rock that is.

Speaker 2 (01:26:32):
Majorly concerning he's not hit his, free thros although he
is getting to. The LINE what I love dan is.
Everything else the way that, he's slashing the way that,
he's driving the way he's just dunking, on people like
literally just getting into, the paint rising up and like
looking at that poor defender under, the basket, thinking oh
he's gonna lay the ball up on the glass, and, nope,

(01:26:54):
no no he's just gonna keep going up and he's
gonna put the ball in the basket and just dunk
on Those Guys like it's that is remarkable. To me
his all, AROUND game i think is becoming more and.
More UNDERRATED like i think the passing is so interesting
because to start the year he had a ton. Of
turnovers he was in his. Own head then he dialed.

(01:27:16):
That down still is making like really. Solid reads he's
clawing his way. To rebounds he's just such a high.
Utility player like is he? A star, probably not but
he's one of those guys who is just going to
win you, games somehow some way off defense of energy

(01:27:39):
of just suddenly putting in twenty three points off of.
SHEER drives i think he's far better than what we
give him. Credit FOR and i think, his weakness which,
is grand is a big f and weakness is getting
a little too much overblown in or at least make
giving it. The problem he's just we're forgetting what he's.

(01:28:02):
Doing convinsively we're forgetting what he's doing on. The glass
we're forgetting what he's doing, Driving wise we're forgetting what
he's doing. Playmaking Wise like he's just he is a
good ass. Basketball player he does so much on. The
floor i'm not convinced he's, a STAR but i am
convinced that he's good.

Speaker 1 (01:28:17):
AND influential i am someone who's been notoriously lower. ON
him i don't know if i'd be lower on him than.
Consensus now BUT what i really like the defensive stuff
is just that we don't need to get. Into it
he's awesome on. That end you mentioned the driving that's.
Been big he's the second highest, excuse me third highest
vall rate on drives right now among players who have
scored at least thirty five points, on drives which is

(01:28:38):
a pretty big group at. The MOMENT what i think
is most. Impressed me, and look by, THE way i
know you mentioned the gravity Thing With. Josh giddy if
you told me that he's just gonna shoot thirty five
percent from three, point range on those looks and you
mentioned the wide. Open percentage that's fine because because of.
His driving what did we talk About, With giddy you
don't have that Question With. Steph castle he will eat
up that space that you. Give, HIM yes i think

(01:28:59):
what my give me more confidence in his OFFENSE than
i had before is we, all know like you'll get
the playmaking assist stuff in Transition or Victor m bernama
is such the skyscraping target you will be able to. Find,
assists anyway it seems like he's gonna be able to
make those swing cross court kickouts when he's coming around
a screen and. Going downhill and he actually doesn't have

(01:29:19):
a ton of assists. On drives but if you're just
gonna give him a ball screen in a pick and roll,
or something that part of his game this year. Feels
better AND so I have i'm Higher On steph CASTLE
than i was this time. LAST year i don't there
are two buyer sales we could. Go with let's go
as the easy one buy Or Sell steph castle finishing
as the second leading scorer On the spurs. This, season

(01:29:41):
bye really even With The aaron fox. Coming back.

Speaker 2 (01:29:48):
So here's the Thing, about fox the concerns to me
a little bit you and you it's it's actually in
part because of You that i'm a little down on.
That experience the spacing is Great In. San antonio Now
that wenby has limited his own three, POINT attempts i
am Wondering if fox is going to get the necessary

(01:30:10):
space to get into that mid range area and actually get.
OPEN looks, i wonder because he could always leverage, someone else,
you know the spacing of someone else to get. Those
shots can he do? That here is there enough spacing
around for him to leverage other guys shooting capabilities of
getting the shots that. HE wants i don't know the answer. To,

(01:30:32):
that maybe and, If so i'm gonna. Be wrong but
when it comes to like his capabilities as a Driver
And steph castle's ability as, a driver just finishing plays around,
the rim just creating something out of, NOTE nothing i
just trust a guy, who's Bigger and i'm not just,
talking taller but also physically, like. Bigger Larger the castle

(01:30:54):
is like six six two. Twenty FIVE so i think
if there's a component There for castle where he can
drive his way to like fifteen points, a game and
then he'll come like then you'll have the, occasional three
you'll have some, free froze like the twenty point average
that he's on. Right now it wouldn't even shock me if.

(01:31:15):
That grows Whereas, with fox is the spacing available to
him to be able to go as fast downhill, as
before to get to those mid range jump shots that.
HE loves i don't know the answer.

Speaker 1 (01:31:31):
To that i'll SELL because i think that Even, In
sacramento fox has shown that he can work with in
ty confines to get his and even if that's a
really good point on the driving and, the finishing looking
at the, bigger body the stronger Body in castle and
just being used as more of a, play finisher Where
dearon fox did some of that away from the ball off.
The BONUS but i don't know if you're gonna do
That In san Antonio with wemby or you're gonna try

(01:31:54):
It With dylan Harper Or steph. CASTLE himself i just
Think that fox is gonna be given more A if
wemby he's not on, The Floor daron fox will probably
be on the floor running. The offense and even if
he's Playing Alongsid dylan Harper Or, steph castle he's going
to be the one that. WOULD run i just think
that he's going to have more control of the ball
and he is a score. First guard but oh, Go, ahead.

Speaker 2 (01:32:17):
No it's fair because like they just gave him the
max and a thirty, percent max.

Speaker 1 (01:32:20):
So he's also good, because, no, no, NO NO i I.

Speaker 2 (01:32:25):
If i gave the IMPRESSION that i Don't Think jaron fox,
is GOOD then i failed as. A podcaster that is
NOT what i want. TO insinuate i. LOVE him i
think it's just, he's again it's the spacing thing that
just keeps going around and around. My HEAD but i do,
hear you and it gave him a thirty. Percent max so.

Speaker 1 (01:32:46):
But you're. Probably right this one's interesting by By. Or
Sell steph castle Making An all star team not, this
season but is He An all star for?

Speaker 2 (01:32:55):
His, Career, YES spy.

Speaker 1 (01:33:01):
I want, To BUY but i just what is the
archetype of player that Became An all star that it
just feels like these types, of players specifically at the,
guard position or even if you might view him as,
a wing especially When the spurs are at, full strength
feels like they're. Perennially Underappreciated and i'm trying to think
of what would be a good comp for a player
that Routinely Made all star games well.

Speaker 2 (01:33:24):
HAVING good i don't think we need A, COMP dan
i think we need to look at it through what
we talked about earlier with. The coaches if a coach
has to game plan for a guy defensively, and offensively
that's there are not a lot of those guys around?

Speaker 1 (01:33:42):
His case is it's not Dissimilar To? Amen, Thompson right.

Speaker 2 (01:33:47):
Oh. That's, INTERESTING no I mean I think I think
thompson is was just wild to Say because castle is,
so Athletic like thompson is, more athletic he might be
a little.

Speaker 1 (01:33:58):
Bit more he's more of a nuclear force.

Speaker 2 (01:34:00):
For, sure, right Yes but castle's production is is, Up,
THERE like i don't think there's the disparity between them
is all that much as people like to make it
OUT as.

Speaker 1 (01:34:15):
I think i'm GONNA sell i don't feel good, about
it spurs fans don't, like It but i'm gonna. SELL
it i just don't know that That's the and by,
The Way all star selections are no longer this great metric.

Speaker 2 (01:34:26):
For how great was? No player but let's play in
a game that, doesn't matter and where we don't care whatsoever,
that is that is where the honor Lies, in yes great.

Speaker 1 (01:34:39):
Our final guy More Mister keishawn george Of The. WASHINGTON
wizards i have so many thoughts On. Keish? George why
why are? You pissed you want to because he's He
might he's a where do you land on sophomore's winning most?
Improved player?

Speaker 2 (01:34:56):
Thought? IT so i have A rule I don't i
don't know if you, remember this but for years and
years AND years i had. A rule i still have
that Rule with BRIAN sporg i don't want second year guys,
winning IT and i don't want former lottery picks.

Speaker 1 (01:35:11):
Winning it if lottery picks one, is stupid, that's no.

Speaker 2 (01:35:14):
It's not it's that comes. With expectations it's, not stupid it's.
Super smart. You're, STUPID.

Speaker 1 (01:35:20):
Honestly. I can't i can't argue. With That, keijean, GEORGE
though i want to start you off with a question
that you're already going to know the answer TO before i.
Dig in who Leads the wizards in points created off assists?
This season.

Speaker 2 (01:35:34):
Points created? Off assists? Probably him i'm, guessing yes.

Speaker 1 (01:35:39):
It's Fucking Him kishew george has. BEEN amazing i want
to RECOGNIZE that i don't expect all the efficiency. To
hold he is currently shooting fifty four and a half
percent from three forty four point five percent on pull
up triples that he's had like a trillion percent on catching.
Shoot triples his clip at the rim is fifteen. Of
eighteen that's PRETTY.

Speaker 2 (01:36:01):
What. I, think no but that's SOMETHING that i think
is like he's being selective TO and i like that
about him because last year when he, CAME in i
don't know if, you remember but it, Was like i'm
only gonna, shoot threes this is gonna be my role in.
The league that was more or less like how he
was pegged like coming in and so for him to, suddenly,

(01:36:23):
say no you, know what going into a year, Or
two i'm gonna. Do more i'm gonna try to get
to the line a little. Bit more i'm going to
try to convert at the rim a little. BIT more
i have a Sneaky suspicion dan that he's been speaking
a Lot To corey kisbert and like picking his Brain
because corey is like one of the most underrated at
rim finishers In the league and has been for. Like

(01:36:46):
years it wouldn't shock me if there's been some notes,
comparing there Because if george suddenly turns into someone who's
just more than what we were supposed to be getting,
from him major win For.

Speaker 1 (01:36:59):
The wizards that's interesting because, he Doesn't Like, corey kispert
doesn't really Do What keijon george is doing right Now Like.
Keijon george's they're having him like run. The offense. He's
up he's running seven pick and rolls, per game up
from two. LAST year i echoed the patient's thing that
you said when he's in. THE lane i think it's helped.
Get him he's taking he's another one with taking some

(01:37:20):
audacious shot attempts, at points but he's getting deep on
some of his drives when he's coming around, ball screens
and that's. Absolutely huge he looks. Very, comfortable again the
efficiency in all like lid will, not hold but he
is so comfortable getting off of those. Pull UPS and
i think when you're looking at the, passing specifically none
of it is, super complicated but it's just as far

(01:37:41):
as having his, head up like when he's dribbling the
ball up, the floor being able to. Find guys if
he's coming out of pick and rolls like he, can
spray he's going to see some of THE like i,
should say some of. The bigs it's not like they
have a ton of Bigs. On washington i'm very curious
to see what he could do if there was more
like rather than, kicking out if there was more lobs

(01:38:01):
being Thrown To alex sarr or even if there was
more of like a traditional rim running big man on.
This team that's not, You Know. Marvin bagley just to,
Be CLEAR i'm i don't know if this is someone
you look at, and, say, oh okay he is going
to run. The offense that's not WHAT they've a lot
of this, is happening and it's still coming within the

(01:38:22):
Flow of. Washington's offense but this is like what he's doing,
right now even if the efficiency, comes down this feels
like the actual player to Where it's is this a
bigger version of there are, different games BUT like i
don't even know who's the Best compet is this a
bigger version of just Like What derek white is To
the celtics at, his peak to where it's he could

(01:38:43):
do things as like on his own and that's a
lot of what we're seeing Now. From washington AND so
i was gonna buy or sell to You As keyshawn
george As the wizards's highest upside.

Speaker 2 (01:38:56):
Young, Player no i'm gonna sell on. THAT one, I
mean alex sar. STILL sorry, I mean i. Hear you
but at the end of, THE day i DIDN'T.

Speaker 1 (01:39:07):
Say i was. Buying it that's just the that's. The
buyer so that's. Being, Proposed no.

Speaker 2 (01:39:11):
I'm selling I'm, look, ALEX sorry i understand that the
rookie season he went through was, you know borderline disastrous
is in, Some AREAS and i know a lot of
wishers fans, were like you know all all actually like
nine out of twelve, of them all, of them or
like basically do we trust? This guy like is this

(01:39:36):
is this the guy for. The future we're seeing him
start of, the year the year number two is so
much better when you have a seven footer who can,
drill threes who can, block shots who, can rebound who
can pass, the ball can run, and transition who can
participate in half court sets. As well where yes he
will he does still need, some polishing but still that,

(01:39:59):
to me will all always be so much more influential
than a wing who can sort of create. PART time.

Speaker 1 (01:40:08):
I think i would have to sell, it TOO and
i would probably still Lean Towards alex SAR and I Love,
Blah KOLABALI but i, think maybe and this is like
the niche buy or sell is if we're buying or Selling,
At keshawn george is more than just a tertiary like
third or fourth creator on. A team i would. BUY
it i think there's more that he could do for,
the offense and maybe once the shot making pulls back a,

(01:40:31):
little Bit perhaps i'll. Feel differently but this is what they're.
Seeing now this is kind of just like fortunes altering
for them, from HIM and i. WOULD agree I think
sar IS probably i really do Like, cool BALI but
i don't think he's who has of the young players
who has the highest upside offensively For. The wizards it's Probably.

(01:40:53):
Still sar he has ten dunks this YEAR more i
think only two of them are out. Of. Alley oops
how do you feel?

Speaker 2 (01:40:58):
About that that's a weird way To spell kim whitmore
in terms of the. Highest, Upside, no yeah how's that
mip pick?

Speaker 1 (01:41:05):
Working?

Speaker 2 (01:41:05):
Out, UH no i mean the Answer is alex, are
right it's the it would?

Speaker 1 (01:41:13):
Be two is It Still? Trey johnson would you? Consider
cool SO SO i I Like.

Speaker 2 (01:41:21):
TREY johnson i might legitimately have the offensive upside strictly
isolated this offensive Upside And kim witmore Over. Trade, johnson.

Speaker 1 (01:41:33):
Wait Have cam Whitmore Over. Trey, Johnson, yes yeah, that's
interesting Just Because trey johnson as a shooter definitely A
better he's gonna do more as a Passer Than cam.

Speaker 2 (01:41:44):
WHITMORE probably i just there's Something About trey JOHNSON THAT
i i there's SOMETHING that. I, trust, like hell, He'll
score like he'll find a way. To score like he's
he's a. Creative guy he's not necessarily a strong three.
Point shooter he's not necessarily a strong at. Rim guy

(01:42:05):
but like he will take and make a certain amount
of mid, range shots or he'll get a, Couple laps
like he'll find a, Way right and he's, he's skinny
he's not as he's not really. THAT big i wonder
if he can absorb contact. LATER on i just like
the more the physical the physicality Of kem widmore a little.

(01:42:27):
BIT more i like. THE shooting i think, for him
it's just it's trying to cobble together in, your, mind
like HOW can i be conducive? Towards winning HOW can
i apply myself More when i'm on the floor in terms,
of quality, shot selection in terms of understanding time, and
score understanding my place, in this in this hierarchy of,

(01:42:47):
the GAME so i can level. Up Organically, TREY johnson
i fear, it's EARLY so i don't want to put this.
On him but There's Some jordan hawkins vibes going. On,
THERE okay i don't want to put that, On him by,
THE way i want him to be Better Than jordan
hawkins to.

Speaker 1 (01:43:07):
Be, SURE yeah I think i would Still Go trey johnson.
Over kids.

Speaker 2 (01:43:12):
THAT'S fair. I don't i don't mind being wrong on
this one.

Speaker 1 (01:43:15):
Because you know what it Is with cam, whitmore so
we're now on his second team and it's in the
third year of just like he seems like this guy
who should be, playing more and yet he's not this
guy who is playing more and that And, That Again
trey johnson's only very early INTO his. Nba career so
if you, ever rank if you had to rank the
hierarchy of importance For the wizards young, players prospects and

(01:43:37):
we're including So That, Bizar Kolabali, Trey Johnson, Bob Carrington,
keyshawn George And cam whitmore. Like everybody there so many dudes.

Speaker 2 (01:43:49):
They HAVE not i love the way they. Constructed This,
ALEX saar i think it's one little yeah with with
a bullet.

Speaker 1 (01:43:56):
Probably So but bo was shooting well from three to start.
To year alex, are too and we saw some of that.
Last season I'm gonna i'm gonna say it, right NOW
and i WANT to i want to, make this put
this on RECORD because i have. A noted i Think
cool bali is. Really good the offensive concerns just with
him or what the limitations are gonna be A real
I Think Keishawn george i'm going to buy him as

(01:44:18):
the second most important prospect On The. WASHINGTON wizards i
think you look at just as a. Wing body what
he could, do defensively if you're gonna get a would
be like a good Wing comp in terms of facilitation,
For him like if you're gonna look at the level
of passing he's, gonna get it's higher than a Jail,
in brown but maybe not as much As A, jason
tatum although it's. Still young could he be saddled with

(01:44:39):
that type of but? Making responsibility you give me that
with this type of multi level shot making, from him
or at least the ability to get to the. Basket
draw maybe you want him maybe to draw, more fouls
but the ability to, draw fouls the three, point shooting
being able to work on, the ball off the ball
in general is Basically what I'm what i'm. Getting, At
uh i'm gonna. Call him Maybe maybe i'm being a little,

(01:45:01):
quick HERE but I think george is. The, same oh
you are.

Speaker 2 (01:45:04):
Historically, premature, yes.

Speaker 1 (01:45:06):
Yeah, Oh yeah I'VE got i got references. FOR that.

Speaker 2 (01:45:09):
I know.

Speaker 1 (01:45:12):
So.

Speaker 2 (01:45:12):
We agree it's saar one and we. Can talk you
can't wait more to no, no, NO NO i i
no so so. Not YET i'm i would have been
considering it if he's actually if he'd actually like landed
THE way i thought he would Land. In washington the
fact that he hasn't. Is concerning i'm not gonna sit here,

(01:45:33):
and say, you, know OH because i picked HIM, For
mip i'm just gonna.

Speaker 1 (01:45:37):
Be.

Speaker 2 (01:45:37):
STUBBORN no, i mean you're, obviously right the franchise doesn't
trust him to play more than seventeen minutes, per GAME
so i can't see her and justify. That selection the
thing to Me with kulibli is the fact that he's
just so, raw offensively and we've seen it ALSO in.
Feba competition he hasn't really stood out do? YOU offensively

(01:46:00):
i think the upside, is great but you need to
be a two way player in. Today's game, so like
even though you are, Historically premature i'm actually going to
buy into that and probably agree. With you it's going
To Be keishaw george at the number two spot HERE
because i Can't Justify trey johnson at. THIS point i, just.
CAN'T right i.

Speaker 1 (01:46:22):
Mean the Way Even keishaw george is rebounded this year on,
DEFENSE anyway, i, think yes there's something weird if his
fall rate, was higher and also if he wasn't like
he shot seventy five percent of the line last year on,
minimal attempts which, is whatever and now he's down to
sixty two Point, foot like there's something weird going. On
Here but i'm GLAD that i DON'T think i, sold
You but i'm glad that we're at least on the

(01:46:42):
same page that, he had the fact that we're having
this conversation TO where i don't think what we have
even closed last year thinking? About it?

Speaker 2 (01:46:51):
Probably, not, no, no no do we even care about
who's number three? And four do we need to go down?

Speaker 1 (01:46:58):
The? List, MAN well i guess it becomes a conversation
about cool bally at, that point right is do you
Think That trey johnson belongs? Over him or do you
Think That? CAM why i?

Speaker 2 (01:47:06):
Do, SO yes i do, Again Again, TREY johnson i
don't want to. BE negative i just need to be
Convinced before i'm getting to that point because again that
he just compared so Similarly To jordan hawkins coming out.
OF college i think we're seeing some of the same

(01:47:29):
things where he's like a bit of. A shooter he
doesn't really do a whole. Lot, ELSE really.

Speaker 1 (01:47:36):
I came Out Of summer league so certain he was
just gonna light it up as a shooter IN. THE
nba i, Came Away So trey Johnson Not. Jordan.

Speaker 2 (01:47:42):
Hawk, yeah, YEAH typically i mean AND look i hope
so because again this is gonna, sound weird but, like
again you know how IN the nba that's. Talent Level
Like charles sparkley has spoken about this at length over
the year since one of the few things actually agree with.
Him on, he says the talent level IN, the nba

(01:48:03):
it's it's, So close like you'll find a guy who's
at the end of. The bench he's so much Closure
to lebron that, you actually, you know realize in just
in terms, of talent, you, know professionalism all. These things
So what i'm trying to say here is there's a
fine line between, You Know jordan Hawkins And, ray allen so.
To speak and So For, trey johnson it's just about

(01:48:25):
hitting those marks and Becoming more ray than it is
Becoming Less. Jordan hawkins he's six games into. His Career
so i'm not gonna sit here, and, say Oh He's.
JORDAN hawkins i don't want to. Do THAT but i
am getting some of those vibes, at times and when
he's sitting and when, HE'S on i can Get The ray.
Allen vibes so, it's like where does he end? Up,

(01:48:47):
leaning no, but yes see it sounds, like that but
you KNOW what i, Mean though like sometimes when you
lean into a, good shot like there have been occasions
where he's taking a shot where, you're like, oh yeah
like it's, in rhythm everything, is aligned, you know the
placement of the feet just where you can see that
ball is going in as soon as it left, his.

(01:49:08):
FINGERTIPS right i rarely have that Feeling With, jordan hawkins,
for EXAMPLE like i don't know where that ball is.
GOING up i don't and that's the. Inconsistency Factor trey
johnson is nineteen unless he's. Turned twenty let me just. Double,
check yeah he's nineteen. Years OLD so i feel really
uncomfortable sitting here going, oh yeah like he's not gonna.

(01:49:29):
BE good i just need to, see more like ask
me this Question About trey johnston, And, like march you.

Speaker 1 (01:49:35):
Have anything else to add before we get out.

Speaker 2 (01:49:37):
Of here so we've recorded for almost, two HOURS so
i don't think.

Speaker 1 (01:49:42):
So no can you just tell our audience where they
can finde you in all the great work that.

Speaker 2 (01:49:47):
You do you can find Me At, yahoo sports you
can find Me. At forbes you can listen to me
AT the nba podcast which are probably. Right, now actually
if You, speak danish by, any chance you can listen
to My Podcast, muster beater or you can catch me
calling GAMES on hbo nets.

Speaker 1 (01:50:05):
Until, next time and, as always, with you with the
shout out to, the one, the only the real true
breakout star in our hearts of, all Time mister frank