NBA Teams That Could Surprise Everyone - Featuring Dan Favale

Mort and Dan take a look at which NBA teams could surprise this season, both in a positive, or negative, light.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:05):
What is up Fellasiko's I Am dan fa Valley coming
at you with an NBA podcast crossover, which means it's
featuring Mort Jensen of the NBA Podcast Fame, Duh, of
Yahoo Sports, Fame, of OnlyFans, celebrity notoriety, infamy, and also
of Forbes Fame. I can't believe I forgot about that one,

(00:26):
but really Only Fans is more important. We're taking a
break from single teams, single topic. Deek dives to do
something no one else has ever done. As More, it
was so kind enough to point out to me once again,
just like we went through restricted free agents the other day,
we're gonna talk about teams we were each limited to picking.

Speaker 2 (00:43):
We're gonna pick three.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
We don't know who the other team is picking, so
we need other persons picking, so they will need to
be alternates. We're going to try and identify teams that
could These aren't necessarily predictions, tho in some case they would,
but teams that could surprise us, and that could be
as More, it was kind enough to mind me before
we hopped on good or bad surprise, so disappointments. Pleasant

(01:05):
surprise is unpleasant surprise. Ifoever you want to frame it.
That's what we're going to tackle back and forth. We
don't know what the other person's going to come up with.
It's going to be absolute insanity as usual. But first
and foremost one everyone poorn went out for more. Who's
powering through what sounds like the flu or just some
type of sickness? He sounds he's ready to narrate pornos folks, smort,

(01:27):
How are you doing well?

Speaker 3 (01:28):
I'm not doing fantastic or I'm just going to be
completely honest with you outside of having my annual virus
or whatever the hell that I caught.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
Oh, annual, I thought you said something.

Speaker 4 (01:42):
No, that's for later, honey, don't worry. That's for later.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
But I do always appreciate that when I'm sick, I
have my sexy mort voice going so like, and I
will say, a couple of years ago, my wife was like,
could you just keep that just that around? Like, could
you just somehow turn that into a staple. I don't
want all the sickness, I don't want all the snot
coming out of you, but the voice I could get

(02:09):
used to that.

Speaker 1 (02:09):
So so she just wants you to basically lick public
toilet seats just to ensure that she doesn't want she
doesn't want the work.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
I do that every day regardless. Now that doesn't work,
so well, we will.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
We appreciate you being here so that you can power
through this, uh, this exercise. Do you have any notes
about how you approach this before we get started?

Speaker 4 (02:32):
Well?

Speaker 3 (02:32):
Yes, I mean, look, obviously this is focusing on teams
and not players, but I decided to like give the
rosters a thorough look and try to what's the word,
not predict, but I tried to envision where things could
go wrong and where things could go really okay. And
and it's it's basically off that a lot of it

(02:54):
is shooting variants. I'm not gonna lie to you that
a lot of that came down to that.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
I so that the thing that I struggle with furthest
exercise is I'm looking at it mostly from my perspective
or what I think might be a consensus perspective, rather
than what does this team think about itself? And I'll
throw out a team as an example here. I apologize
if it spoils one for you, But like the Pelicans,
and I don't mean to pile on clearly think that

(03:19):
they're going to be contending for something or going to
be good right away. Otherwise why do you go get
Derek Queen. I don't think they're going to be good
right away, and so when they invariably finish eleventh or
twelfth or thirteenth in the Western Conference, that's not going
to surprise.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Me, right right, And yeah, And that's the way I
looked at it as well. I mean not, I just
didn't lean into anything obvious. So if you wouldn't mind,
I'm actually gonna go to my first one. I actually
have the Bulls. That's a team that could be surprising
in a positive sense because while look, their process and

(03:55):
their roster construction philosophy is horrendous, I actually do like
a lot of the components that they do have on
the roster. I think Sack Collins has historically been pretty underrated.
I think Kevin Herder is someone who offers so much
volume three point shooting and a lot of like space

(04:15):
and gravity. If they hang on to Kobe White, he's
entering like his prime years, Like there's a chance he
could be an All star caliber player. If not, you know,
a short fire all star. I think with more minutes
for Jalen Smith, presumably that that's going to be a
good thing. They have Iod Assumer, who we talked about
matsas Buslas looked really good last year. There's a lot

(04:37):
of reason to believe he's going to take a step up.
Trey Jones is one of those players who kind of
flies under the radar. So again, I don't buy the
Balls as a team for the future in any sense
of the word. But I do think the parts that
they do have can come together on a level where
by the end of the season they might actually be

(04:59):
in that top six playoff hunt. Not saying they will,
and I think that's because again, everything can happen, but
it is the East, and a lot of teams are
basically just mailing it in this year. So I'm just
actually going to say the Bulls could be a surprise,
but through no shar fault or so to speak of

(05:19):
their own, they'll they'll just run ass backwards into it.

Speaker 1 (05:23):
I you know, because I was going to ask you
what does a surprise look like for them? Because they're
aiming for like that thirty seven to forty two win,
right sweet spot, and so what is the ceiling on
that type of a team like that would be that's
like you're thinking they could get to forty five or something.

Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yes see, I actually didn't look at it through like wins.
I looked at it through seeds.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Well. There they're the quintessential like mid team. So that's
I think that's why the wins come into play to
where it's like, oh, if you have you know, if
you have the Wizards winning let's say like twelve games,
and you think that they could win thirty, it's just
like you it's easier to talk about like a wider
range of that. But the Bulls, like they're the definition
of midley.

Speaker 4 (06:02):
Well, they won forty nine games last year.

Speaker 3 (06:04):
I would not be surprised if they had like forty two,
forty three, maybe even forty four. Again, it's it's not
gonna take them anywhere, ultimately speaking, because they still lacked
that top tier guy. I'm not a big believer in
them being able to retain Kobe White past next season either. So,
but this could be the last gasp of this current

(06:26):
iteration of the Bulls because you also have Sat Collins
who goes into a contract year. I think Kevin Herder
is in a contract year as well, So I'm just
assuming a lot of these guys are going to step
up now. Of course, there's also Nikola Vuzovich. He's played
one game so far at EuroBasket where he looked really
good offensively and on the glass. Defensively, though, oh my god, Dan,

(06:47):
it looked horrendous. He was like two or three steps
slow on every possession. I could be a little concerned
that for him specifically, this might be you know, quote
unquote the decline year, especially defensively. But that's almost the
beauty of it, because if that means less vooge, it
presumably means more sac Collins, it means more Jalen Smith

(07:10):
two options. I would frankly prefer for the Bulls if
they play up tempo. So I just think they have
a lot of those safeguards in place. So it's interesting,
like I don't necessarily think that I would be willing
to write this in Stone. I could just see a
scenario where what do you call the sun folder parts?

Speaker 4 (07:29):
Just make it up.

Speaker 1 (07:30):
There's and the only other thing I have to add
on them is I think what would make me reticent
to pick them is the other thing we almost have
to factor in is what if these teams I guess
because it's the bulls. You don't have to factor this in.
But what if these teams decide to steer out or
steer in rather to a skid to where if the
Bulls are like, we're kind of too good, but we're
not good enough, or someone comes along with a Kobe

(07:52):
White offer with him at during free agency, do we
pounce on it? I guess because you picked the Bulls
though you're it's pretty safe to say they won't do that.

Speaker 2 (07:59):
That's the thick about the.

Speaker 1 (08:02):
So my pick is going to be a team that
I think has been getting shit on a lot because
they don't I think people don't believe their roster makes sense,
which to some extent is fair. The Toronto Raptors, for me,
they just have a lot of guys. And this is
something that Grant and I had talked about last offseason
when we were discussing the Portland Trailblazers, and it did

(08:24):
take a while, but things started to coll lace for them.
It didn't seem like everyone fit together. And Toronto is
in a similar boat to.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
Where Okay, RJ.

Speaker 1 (08:34):
Barrett and Brandon Ingram and Scottie Barnes and then what's happening?
They have all these bigs and fours that can't really shoot,
how does Jako Perle factor into it all? I feel
like in the minutes that their core guys have played
together over the past two seasons, it's the season and change.
There hasn't been a lot of it because of injuries.
For the most part, they've absolutely annihilated opponents, and I

(08:57):
isolated even further because I do think that there's something
to be said about RJ. Barrett being the odd man
out here, and so in the time that Emmanuel Quickly,
Scottie Barnes, and Yakub Peertle have logged without RJ Barrett.
Over the past two seasons, the Raptors are plus eight
point seven points per one hundred possessions with an offensive
rating that's like close to one hundred and twenty four.

(09:21):
And they're not shooting threes that well during these minutes
thirty six point seven percent.

Speaker 2 (09:27):
Now you throw they're.

Speaker 1 (09:27):
Shooting like six what is it like sixty crazy percent
on twos out sixty percent on twos. What's really interesting
is now you put Brandon Ingram in RJ Barrett's place here,
brand Ingram's a better three point shooter. That's something that
you could bank. I think RJ. Barrett's better at moving
off the ball right now, But RJ Barrett didn't really
start moving off the ball or operating with these heads

(09:48):
of steam in transition with the Knicks and some of
those second units. Sure, but like RJ. Barrett is used
differently in Toronto than the way he was from New York,
I don't see anything about brandon Ingram, not as much
like RJ. Barrett has more of that like knife through
butter movement away from the ball shore you can use
brandon Ingram, I think in a lot of the same ways.
And I think you could argue that brandon Ingram coming

(10:09):
to the Raptors is better as a passer and a
shooter than RJ. Barrett was coming to the Raptors when
he did. Now, you could talk about the passing after
the season, especially to start that RJ had last year,
So you've upgraded the talent in that spot. And if
you just get a hit from anywhere else, maybe Grady
Dick takes it like another lead he started off the

(10:30):
season really well, or maybe you get something like oh
chaiak Baji just like had a really good year. If
he continues to shoot the three ball well, or maybe
you even fox in fiddle. You're a guy, Mamu, someone
who could space the flour at the five spot. Maybe
you see what that looks like instead of Perle. But
just go through go through the depth chart too. They
have a lot of dudes that will be dogs on defense.

(10:50):
I think Scotty Barnes is good there. Emmanuel Quickly has
not been good defensively in Toronto. I think he has
more to offer. I just think the stop and start
nature of what he's been in terms of availability is
hurt him. Jamal shd ak Baji is another one. If
you get any minutes from Mobo or Colin Murray Boyles, like,
those are guys that I think, especially Colin Murray Boyles.

(11:11):
If you told me Colin Murray Boyle's played thirty minutes
a game, I'm not saying he will. I might like
he could make an all defense team, that's how good
I think he might be out of the gate. So
they just have a lot of guys they're not all
perfect fitting, but like it doesn't always need to be
perfect fitting. This isn't oh. Stars have a way of
figuring it out. But sometimes you're just so deep and

(11:33):
have so much actual positive NBA talent that you will
figure it out. And I also kind of think we
saw this for stages last year, Like even if the
offense is choppy, I really do look at this team
as one that could be a gangbuster on the defensive
end as well. Like they're young, they can play fast,
but also they could force a bunch of turnovers. If
they want to go to that aggressive route, get out
and transition, then that helps your offense. So I look

(11:55):
at the Raptors as I'm not saying there'll be a
top four seed in the East, but if we just
kind of look back and see that the Raptors won
forty five games, it wouldn't it wouldn't shock me. But
I think that they're built to shock in general.

Speaker 3 (12:08):
I love that inclusion and I think it's it's pretty
interesting that we started with the Bulls and then the Raptors,
because I just wrote a piece about the Raptors, specifically RJ.
Barrett over at Forbes, you know, in terms of like
they can probably get to a new level if they
pivot off RJ. Because they need a guard and there
is a world where a deal centered around RJ. Barrett

(12:31):
and Kobe White and Nikola Vusovich kind of makes sense
if you want to optimize, like the floor spacing in Toronto.
Now where it gets tricky, And I didn't mention this
in the piece. I didn't even include Vucevic. I took
this from a Gronto perspective, Like a Kobe White type
of player there would be beautiful for them, a guy who.

Speaker 4 (12:49):
Can play a lot off the ball.

Speaker 3 (12:51):
But like if they are looking at you know, forty
forty five wins, but they want to make that leap,
like they think the trade deadline that they're like, okay,
if we get buried out of town, if we make
that push for Kobe and Booch, maybe that's the ticket
to actually get into the playoffs fully fledged. Would you
even be willing to, like Dankle Colin Murray Boyles in

(13:15):
those trade talks to get those guys in, just like
if I had Kobe on a longer deal, I would,
But since I don't, I probably wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
I probably wouldn't either, just because you do get into
a situation where, yes, they could play together, but how
much money are you gonna want committed to a manual quickly?
In Kobe White long term especially after having paid Barnes
and Ingram so that I probably wouldn't include Collin.

Speaker 2 (13:41):
I mean maybe if the Bulls.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
Are sending out a pick or something in that scenario,
or you're getting ioed assume as well. But he's also
someone who's gonna be up.

Speaker 3 (13:48):
For Yeah, he also needs he needs a new deal
as well. Booch needs a new deal. But I mean, well,
I mean, right, you can get him on the cheat right.
But it's it's interesting. I think those two are going
to be the potential trade partners if we're wrong about
you know, them not being surprises.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
Yeah, I don't. I'm I Finding an RJ. Barrett team
is tough. I've thought about Charlotte a little bit because
they have like not a ton of wings, but I
don't know who, Like, do you are they giving you
Colin Sexton? That makes your team a little smaller, does
help their shooting. He's an expiring contract. I don't I
don't know which side would have interest in that. But
finding an RJ. Barrett team is It's the I thought

(14:30):
about Washington until they traded for Cam Whitmore. Now it's like, okay,
well no it doesn't need to be It definitely doesn't
need to be Washington, who's your next team, sir?

Speaker 3 (14:39):
Well, So by definition I have to go Spurs positive
in a positive light obviously, and that is because I
am I'm going out on a limb, Dan, and I'm I'm.

Speaker 4 (14:49):
Being even more of an idiot than usual.

Speaker 3 (14:53):
I think that the Spurs are going to win fifty
plus games, and I think Victorum Panama's to be the
youngest MVP in league history.

Speaker 1 (15:04):
I think, so this is a good team to pick
because I had them as a team that's going to
be an unpleasant surprise, like to clock. So like this
is a great discussion to have. I kind of just
feel like we're getting ahead of our skis here. I
think they won the minutes with Wemby last year. On
the court, they're like almost a plus four. They have
more talent objectively on the roster, right, but you also

(15:27):
have two major young guards and Steph Castle and Dylan Harper.
And I know that Spurs fans tend a default that
it's just all gonna work out right away. I'm not
saying it's not all gonna work out, that the dynamic
will never work out, but right away, like we're so
are you just if they're going to be good. So
I'll start there. If you think that's going to happen.

(15:47):
Do you think that Dylan Harper then is not really
going to play a major role for this teamer. You
just expect him to be really good?

Speaker 3 (15:53):
Off rip I off rip first and foremost. I love
his game. I think he is an NBA ready player,
both physically and the game. And like the IQ wise,
like the shooting is a legit question mark, and I'm
not trying to downplay that. I think I think the
shooting concerns are greater with Castle than Harper. Though, like
I think we've done the Spurs a bit of a

(16:14):
disservice by going into this everyone and saying, oh, well,
Castle and Harper are both bad shooters where this is
this is partially true, but one is further ahead than
the other.

Speaker 4 (16:24):
I think that's fair to say.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
Again, Also the Harper stuff, I know what the percentages are,
but now after getting a chance to see him and
the way he moves in Summer League, I said this, like,
I'm just not worried about that dude as a shooter
long term, and so it's not on a level of
I know some people provide pushback on Oh, Steph Castle
will eventually be a good shooter. That's the that's the
guy to talk about. I think that's the right guy.

Speaker 2 (16:46):
Like Harper.

Speaker 1 (16:46):
I'm just not really worried about as an off baller
on ball shooter exactly.

Speaker 3 (16:50):
And I think if he comes in and pops, which
I think, then Castle might be a little bit of
a luxury item where he's nice to have, not need
to have, so like whatever he gives you, you can
sort of pluck him in where he's necessary, like he's
a big dude. Or are we saying that you can't
put Castle at the three occasionally to get a little
bit more playmaking and shooting.

Speaker 4 (17:12):
In the back court.

Speaker 3 (17:13):
I'm just not ruling that out. But for me, obviously,
when I have wemp as the MVP here, which is
the real thing is I think this is going to
be like a superhuman year from him, and I think
Darren Fox is Yeah. I don't like his contract, I've
said as much, but that doesn't mean Daron Fox isn't
damn good like him pushing the tempo, him just getting

(17:36):
everyone moving. We know Wemby is able to play with
quick guards. We've seen that both at the NBA level.
We've seen it in the international level as well, Like,
this is a dude who understands, oh, if the guards
are actually running and pushing, I need to make myself
available constantly. Be that as a trailing three point shooter,
be that as a lob threat. Hell be it as

(17:56):
an open mid range guy, like he does not like
look at the game as like, yeah, he does have
an analytical approach, but he's not someone who will not
take an open midranger, you know what I mean. Like,
he understands the value of an open shot, whether it's
a three or mid or whatever, and so he won't discriminate.

(18:17):
That was the word I was looking for. He won't
discriminate shots. And now you also add in Masel, who
I think he had a down year. I think there's
a perfectly reasonable expectation for him to bounce back a
little bit. We know Harrison Barnes is efficient. We know
he takes a lot of threes, we know he scores
a lot at the rim. We know he's efficient. At

(18:37):
the same time, I also don't think they're done. I
don't assume that they're going to finish the year with
the roster that they have now twenty four point five
I think million in backup centers in shape of Kellyo
Linic and Luke Cognette. That to me is just like
such a flag that something is going down before the
traded line, like there's definitely a deal to be found there.

(19:00):
And if they're on the right track by December, January whatever,
I assume that they're going to feel some calls and
try to make a sort of pushing, not like all
the chips, but some of them to make them better
right off the bat. I also think they have some depth,
and I think that goes flies a little bit onder
the radar. I know you have mentioned a lot and

(19:22):
not inaccurately, the spacing issues and like where is the
shooting going to come from? But there are players on
this roster who we always tend to forget about, like
Julian Champagni legitimately rotation guy. He started for him a
lot last year at three million. By the way, major bargain,
no one seems to get.

Speaker 1 (19:41):
The Shampennies are out here just getting robbed.

Speaker 4 (19:43):
They are really good, Both of them are really good.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
I've already put this out there, I've who I proposed
it to. I'm already trying to get Justin Champagne to
the Knicks. Somehows the Wizards just have too many wings.
Right now, Justin Champagne to the next Somebody make it happen.

Speaker 3 (19:58):
He's so good and he he's to get a much
better rebounder than his brother, where his brother's a little
bit more of like a finesse shooter. It's it's interesting
how different their their play style actually is, and ironically
they go great together on the floor because Champangnie is
more for like three to two or so both Champagne,
like Julian's more of a two, like a three to two,

(20:20):
and Justin's more for a three to four.

Speaker 4 (20:22):
Like they could actually play together.

Speaker 3 (20:24):
But yeah, no, I think this is gonna be like
a major major Wenby year, Like we're talking close to
thirty points. We're probably talking twelve thirteen rebounds, four blocks,
efficiency through the roof.

Speaker 4 (20:40):
I think this year three Wemby could be.

Speaker 3 (20:43):
Just an absolute monster, and like, how the hell do
you stop him?

Speaker 1 (20:48):
And look, I have no pushback for any of the
If you tell me that Victor Womenyama's gonna play in
sixty five plus games, there's nothing you could tell me
about him or the Spurs that yeah, that's never gonna happen.
But he's just he defies logic. I think the bar
for them to surprise is just too high because I
think too many people are expecting. And that's why I

(21:08):
would have them as a potential disappointment. I think too
many people fall into your camp to where like, no,
this is a team. They're ready to win fifty games,
maybe what a top four seed in the end. Like
by you saying he's gonna win MVP, I would say
you're banking on them being no lower than fourth in
the West. If you're gonna say that.

Speaker 4 (21:24):
Yeah, then that's probably more than fifty. Then we're probably
looking at fifty.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
Right, And just you know, when you're talking about Okay,
Okac and Houston and Denver. You love the Clippers, there's
the Timberwolves, the Lakers are looming. I just it's a
tall order. So I and I just think that we're
this is to me when Beyama specifically, no, I don't

(21:47):
think there's a rush to coordinate put the fucking crown
on him. I'm there, But I think the Spurs as
a team, and one of the things that that does
concern me is that they can get to some nasty
defensive come combinations. But it's not just about the three
guard stuff on offense. For me, they seem very dependent
on their floor spacing coming from the front court. Right now.

Speaker 2 (22:10):
Their best shooters are Victor.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
Wembinyama, Kelly olinok, Devin Vessel, Harrison Barnes, like a lot
of those names are coming at the four at that
four or the five at that point. And then I
also just kind of wonder, Okay, you have the primary
and the secondary creation to get Wemby more of those
paint touches that everybody wants to see, those on the
move paint touches, but do you have the spacing yet.

Speaker 2 (22:34):
To do that?

Speaker 1 (22:34):
Because he is part of what's important. I know people
get frustrated by a shot selection sometime, and I know
he has some of those just you know, yolo threes.

Speaker 4 (22:42):
Let's call them.

Speaker 1 (22:43):
They're almost a necessity to open the floor for the
Spurs offense at this point, and I just don't know
if they've done enough to change that. And so I
still have a lot of questions about their offensive ceiling
just because you're also talking about Fox is a veteran,
so it's okay you lose CP three. I think the
turnovers will still be fine whatever, But like integrating Dylan

(23:05):
Harper specifically, whether he's running the second unit or you
want him on the ball in like primary lineup minutes
with Wemby and Stephan Cast, I just things could get
really rough. And so I would expect this team if
Wenby's gonna be available the entire year, yeah, like they're
gonna be in the forties. I would think of the
wins total, but like anyone kind of expecting miss to
be their formal entry into fringe contention, I would just

(23:30):
I would pump the brakes. I love when I go negative.
I love to be proven wrong. I want to make
that clear. So I'm sure people are already mad in
the if their Spurs fans mad in the comments. I
just I still have questions about this team, which I
kind of think it's fair when it's it's year three
of Wemby, year two of Castle in year one of
Dylan Harper.

Speaker 3 (23:46):
And look, those are perfectly reasonable arguments at the end
of the day. For me, it's it's really the fact
that they have so much rim pressure now at the
guard spot, where we know the Spurs have just been
excellent when they haven't had a lot of floorspacing and
then getting to the rim, generating good shots near the

(24:07):
rim at the mid range area. Like, they know how
to get two pointers, it's kind of my point here,
and they know how to get efficient looks at two pointers.
So for them to have both Fox who can really
push the tempo. Now Dylan Harper, who is I don't
want to go into the James Harton comparisons, but like,
physically he's similar to James in the sense that broad shoulders,

(24:29):
a lot of strength, can really get people to bounce
off of him instead of him bouncing off of other players.
I just think that component of having that downhill segment
is just going to unleash Wemby in a row that
we have not yet seen.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
This is gonna be an interesting one to track. I'll
have to put a pin in it to see who
makes out closer. So I was gonna go negative and alternate,
but I kind of did just go negative as your
counterpoint to the Spurs, So I'll go positive again. They've
sucked me in again. I said this last year the
Charlotte Hornets. I think yet people are too quick to
just oh they're gonna be like one of the two
or three worst teams in the East. I won't again,

(25:05):
this is not something I'm gonna roll out, but I
would just like to point we're gonna start with Flamelo
ball more.

Speaker 2 (25:10):
I know your favorite player in the NBA.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
Right past three seasons, Here's where his teammates have ranked
in three point efficiency last year the twenty second percentile.
The year before that, the seventeenth percentile the year before that,
the first percentile.

Speaker 2 (25:27):
That's all poor per.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
B ball Index. Now you look at the other thing
that I don't think it's talked about enough when it
comes to help is LaMelo's taking too many shots. He's
on the ball too much. Who else do you want
on the ball in Charlotte his teammates on ball gravity
for his career, so the past five seasons, his teammates
have never ranked.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
Higher than the thirty third percentile.

Speaker 1 (25:47):
In just on ball gravity on ball creation that as well,
Like those two different things. That is insane. And so
you know what the Hornets go out and do this summer. Yeah,
probably came with the expensive defense, but they traded for
Collin Sexon in a deal that I still don't understand.
For the conventional wisdom suggests that if you're the team
giving up the worst player on the worst contract, you

(26:07):
should include a pick. The Hornet's got a pick. Kudos
to Jeff Peterson and co. They draft Conk Nipple, they
draft Liam McNeely. Brandon Miller is going to be healthier
and whether you want to see him, they put him
on the ball more.

Speaker 2 (26:18):
Last year.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
I think he showed stuff as a passer. The turnovers
got a little egregious.

Speaker 2 (26:23):
But now he'll be year three, Hopefully he's healthier.

Speaker 1 (26:25):
He'll be working with better spacing or you know what
they could maybe do for him, get him moving downhill
off the ball more frequently so that he can get
to the rim. Draw some fouls might be a strength thing. Yeah,
there's questions at the center position. They're not like their
best wing aside from Brandon Miller, is like wing defensively,
I mean because Canipple and McNeely have the size of wings,

(26:47):
which I also feel like doesn't get talked about enough.
People keep calling them like these two guards and they're
six to seven, like they got they got real size. Yeah,
but like it might be Josh Green and that's not okay.
I would argue he was fine last year. He's also
injured right now, so we're probably gonna see I would assume,
can nipples start to begin?

Speaker 4 (27:04):
Me?

Speaker 1 (27:04):
I really wish I was. I feel like I would
sound so much smarter about the Hornets because I'm recording
the Hornets look ahead, like twenty four hours after we
record this, I'd sound so much smarter if I'd already
recorded it, shout out in advance to Kannada Edwards. So
I'm just I'm looking at this team. Yeah, they over
indexed maybe on offense and guards, but like, if LaMelo

(27:25):
stays healthy and you're just giving him room to work
to where his efficiency improves, you'll see his decision making
on offense improved. Maybe his assist rate or assist a
turnover rate or assist to usage rate, whoever you want
to frame it, is gonna go up in the right direction.
This is a team that I've and just you know,
Brendon Miller. If you're high on Brandon Miller, I'm not
saying he needs to be an All Star this season,

(27:45):
but if you're high on Brendon Miller, why wouldn't he
get better? Like, what is the argument against Brandon Miller?
Getting better. So I have defensive questions about this. Yeah, right,
and even on defense, look the center stuff. I like
theb the offensive rebounding is good. I think he's done
made some strides as the rim protector. I think he'll
be a better finisher now that there's more ball handlers

(28:07):
in spacing around him too. I do have questions about
the defense, but Charles Lee is also already implemented a
system that did a good job dissuading looks at the
rim with like the personnel last year was like, you're
not looking. If they didn't have Grant Williams, that you
look at the center position wasn't exactly. Yeah, they had
Mark Williams for a good chunk of the year, but
he's no just like, you know, defensive like stopper. So

(28:30):
I'm not saying they'll get better defensively, but like.

Speaker 2 (28:32):
I don't know, they didn't.

Speaker 1 (28:33):
I don't know how much worse they're actually gonna get defensively,
if they get worse at all. So I kind of
like this team. I don't know what their upper end
outcome would be, but I've seen a lot of just oh,
like they're gonna be one of the three worst teams
in the East, and I'm kind of like, I don't
like if they might win enough to be like eight seven,
maybe maybe six. So I'm keeping my eye on the Hornets.

(28:55):
I'm not predicting it. I'm just saying I would say
their ceiling is probably be like six or seven, and
that I think is a higher ceiling. Then people are
giving them credit.

Speaker 3 (29:05):
Well, we agreed that that ceiling means that everything has
to go right, right.

Speaker 1 (29:11):
Yeah, I mean, look, I get if your argument, not
yours specifically, is LaMelo's gonna play in forty games and
Brandon Miller is gonna get he's not gonna play in
sixty five and the center Like, I don't have a
great argument against that. But if if these if this
team is gonna be any semblance of healthier like Trey
Man coming back from the neck injury, if Grant but

(29:31):
Grant Williams will help them if they want to switch
more on defense, should he be healthier like coming off
that ACL injury, Like this is a team that will
I would almost say if they're healthy and they win
fewer than like thirty five thirty seven games, I'd be
pretty surprised.

Speaker 3 (29:46):
Okay, interesting, all right, I mean, look, I know you've
been optimistic about them. I respect that, just as you
respect me being optimistic about the Spurs.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
Yours is easier to justify, though, just because it's the
The Spurs have one to be in the Hornets don't.

Speaker 4 (30:00):
I was about to say that, but in a nicer way.

Speaker 3 (30:03):
But yes, I do see your point though, Like, I'm
not personally that high on Continental, and yet I need
to see a little bit more of him before I'm
like at the NBA level, not summer league level, before
I'm like fully confident.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
I just I was impressed with him and McNeely. I
think this is coming from someone who just doesn't follow college.
The level of just playmaking from the two of them
that you could see in some league that really turned
my head.

Speaker 4 (30:29):
Yeah, and they do have that.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
I just wonder when the competition gets significantly tougher whether
they still have that advantage. If they do, a lot
of my concerns just remove itselves themselves from the from
the table immediately. I do also think that if they
somehow find a way to just take Miles Bridges off
the roster. And I'm not only speaking on you know,

(30:52):
as a human being, because there's that element. Of course,
I also just don't think he's a good basketball player
in terms of like an influentially positive basketball player. He
scores a lot and that's basically what he does. He
takes up a lot of shots within the offense.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
On so so efficiency and so efficiency.

Speaker 3 (31:11):
Like to me, these hornets would be so much more
interesting if you took his role away, or just him away,
and spread out that those responsibilities to like a series
of different players. So like, you know, you almost hope
that if there is an injury out there that it's

(31:31):
not going to be Lamello or or Brandon Miller, that
it's going to be Miles Bridges.

Speaker 4 (31:34):
And yeah, oh oh.

Speaker 3 (31:35):
More, did you just wish injury upon a player for
that guy specifically?

Speaker 4 (31:39):
I have no issue doing that.

Speaker 2 (31:40):
Yeah you also didn't.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
You just said you basically were just boiling it down
to if a team needs to miss a player, you
would prefer to be Miles Bridges, then low ball Brandon Miller,
which is just that's the fair of fact. I think
who's your next team? And I'm assuming you're gonna go
with a disappointment here, a.

Speaker 4 (31:57):
Little bit of a disappointment.

Speaker 3 (31:59):
I I just have to go with the Warriors at
this point, and I understand that we still haven't god
in the resolution to the Jonathan cominga situation. I understand that,
but the lag of spacing so far is problematic.

Speaker 4 (32:13):
In my view.

Speaker 3 (32:16):
We are looking at a team where Steph just has
to carry so much more responsibility. As you know, Gravity
advice that when you look at the squad and look
at his age, you're just sort of setting your up.
So you're setting yourself up potentially for disappointment and potentially
also to just put him in a situation where he's

(32:37):
over taxed physically, and you don't want to do that,
especially at this stage of his career. Like Jimmy is
not an actual shooter, Draymond is not a natural shooter.
They're going to have to play a lot of minutes
together defensively, they're tremendous. I'm not gonna sit here and
say that there aren't positives. Obviously there are, but in
today's league, you just need to have that floor spacing capability.

(32:57):
Where is that going to come from? Even if they
retain Jonathan Kaminga, that's not gonna help them in the
spacing front, Like, what what is your plan here?

Speaker 4 (33:07):
Play?

Speaker 3 (33:07):
Buddy, healed forty five minutes per game. Like Al Horford
presumably is gonna come in. He can help in that department,
but that's not necessarily high volume. To Anthony Melton, we
have no idea whether he's like fully healthy and back
to his normal shooting capabilities.

Speaker 4 (33:23):
Like those are for me a little bit larger question marks. Now.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
I'm not saying this can't go right, but it does
feel like, Yeah, like I said before, everything has to
go right for me to like believe in them. The
talent is there, but it's that talent like does that
fit alongside each other?

Speaker 4 (33:41):
That's that's basically my big ass question.

Speaker 1 (33:44):
Yeah, that's a good one. I don't I don't know
what to make of this team, Meaning before we assume
Comingda's back and they get Horford and Melton, they've been
linked to Brogden. Speaking of players that have health issues,
it's they they're tantalizing because having Jimmy Butler gives you
this lifeline during the on Steph minutes that they've never
even with Durant because of like as a playmaker and

(34:06):
as someone who gets downhill and puts pressure on the
rim that they didn't even have during that era. Necessarily,
but they're all so old and so it's just someone
like that gives you like pause, and then it's we've
just seen a lot of the players that they relying on,
including if Jonathan Kminga is back, or if it is
a Buddy Healed, or if it is a Brandon Pajemski,

(34:27):
they all just sort of wax and wane, Like their
best constant is Quinton Post, Like that is the guy
that you know is gonna be there day in and
day out and giving you all star caliber play. Uh,
just catching to see if you were listening, But it's
also just the true fact.

Speaker 4 (34:40):
The I like, I love Quentin Post.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
Well, he's a little too important though in the sense
of cause you need that floor spacing around the Draymond
Jimmy Butler and if Jonathan Kminga's peppered in there. Do
you want to be that reliant on Quentin Post or
even do you want to say I love Al Horford.
That'll be a fantastic signing should it go through. Do
you want to be that reliant on Quinton Post and
Al Horford? I think there's to me, I still view

(35:04):
spacing at the center position, or I'll say, like floor
spacing because there's vertical spacing with greens.

Speaker 4 (35:10):
Of course, I.

Speaker 1 (35:13):
Still viewed as something that should be more of a
luxury or like it shouldn't be as much of a
necessity as it feels like for the Warriors right now
when it's when it's Milwaukee and you're playing with Giannis, Okay,
I kind of get it, but at the same time,
like that's one of the knocks again, not knocks, but
concerns with building around Giannis is no, you need that
type of a five around him, And now you put
yourself in a situation where whether you have cominga or not,

(35:36):
right now, you almost need that type of a five.
So what if Quinton post progress isn't linear? What if
he kind of has a down sophomore year, or what
if the defense like he had some good straight up
like he's in the right spots around the basket for
the most part, But what if teams like really just
mutilate him on that end this year? What if Al
Horford starts to show his age. So, yeah, I could
see where you're going with it. I think I'm just

(35:57):
so like on the mid end with towards all, like yeah,
they'll be fifth or sixth or seventh in the West
that it's it's hard for me. I don't think that
their floor or their ceiling is much higher. But I
think I could see your case of Okay, this floor
might be a lot lower than even people are.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
Right, because I didn't even specify where I think they
could drop down.

Speaker 4 (36:16):
I think they could drop out of ten.

Speaker 3 (36:19):
WHOA, yeah, saying they will, don't worry, don't kill me,
warriors fans.

Speaker 4 (36:25):
I know there are millions of you after Steff arrived.

Speaker 3 (36:27):
I know, I know. Don't worry. I'm not saying they will.
I'm just saying, like, there is a world wherein the
spacing is just completely messed up, where there it's injuries
galore because of age and things just look horrible and
they're just outside the entire plane picture.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
I mean, so you're saying they will be they could
be worse than one of the Suns, Pelicans, Jazz and Kings.

Speaker 3 (36:55):
Right again, I will say injuries would have to factor
in here, like if they're healthy, they'll find a way
to be relevant, right. I mean, it's it's Steph, it's Jimmy,
it's Straymond, like come on, like, but it's the ages though,
Like Steph is what thirty seven, He's gonna be thirty
eight during the end of the regular season like that,
Let's not sit here and say that that you know,

(37:16):
you can defy Father time. We're even seeing with Lebron
even though he took it to the limit. It's getting there.
It's getting to be that time. That's gonna be applicable
to Steph as well. It's gonna be applicable to Jimmy,
to Draymond and Jimmy, by the way, if memory serves,
he's begun like missing a few games here and there,
like he's he's not the iron man that he used

(37:36):
to be.

Speaker 1 (37:37):
Yeah, he's always dealing with stuff and he just he's
he's selectively Jimmy. Now where postseason Jimmy became like this
mythic figure, but he actually existed, And now it's sort
of like postseason Jimmy might exist because regular season Jimmy
is way more selective than he was what like let's
say three years ago, which, by the way, sure, if
that's gonna if that's gonna keep you like close to

(37:59):
performing at the close to your peak during the most
important time of the year, then I get it. But
do they have the cushion, Like I think it's a fact,
like they have real depth on this roster, but is
it depth that can navigate in absence from it? Because
so I'll ask you this, Are they in a situation
to where it's they could lose, like Draymond or Jimmy

(38:21):
could miss time and you still think they would be
screwed or do you still view them as a team
because you're probably more confident in them if you say, yeah,
Steph misses time, like the whole thing is just fucked
and surprise, surprise, like that's been true for how many
years now? But if you think they're at a point
where it's like, I don't even know Steph could uplift
this roster if you pulled Draymond or Jimmy off of
it for a few weeks, that's where it becomes.

Speaker 4 (38:42):
Really probably, And that's where I'm I'm at because I
I just can't.

Speaker 3 (38:46):
Maybe he can, right, but I don't think that would
be a fair expectation from my perspective, Like I don't
think that's reasonable to go into a season and telling
a forty seven year old Steph, hey, look, Jimmy Butler's
out for the next month. Can you just go utter
ape shit again like you used to and just average
thirty five and hit like six threes per game. Can

(39:08):
you just do that for us? I think that is
such a preposterous ask, and because he also needs, like
we were talking about the spurs and wemb be needing
like downhill action. There's no question then when there is
downhill action, like when Draymond turns on the jets, which
can't really do you know, to the same extent as as.

Speaker 4 (39:28):
He used to.

Speaker 3 (39:29):
But when he just pushed the ball and Steph found
those gaps, especially in transition, he was just so freaking terrifying, Like,
who's gonna be that guy who is going to brag?
A guy that Steph can also play off off because
he does need that on occasion. If you're not having
Jimmy around and Draymond is looking old, what then do

(39:51):
you expect to just say snap your fingers and then
Steph will go back to being twenty six again. It
doesn't work like that.

Speaker 1 (39:58):
So man, imagine if it did.

Speaker 3 (40:00):
Oh oh, that'd be a cheap one. I mean, could
you imagine if you could do that to a whole
roster and like selectively go into the prime years of
each Guy Prime, Raymond Prime, Jimmy Prime Staff.

Speaker 2 (40:11):
Do you know how good the Clippers would be? Oh?

Speaker 3 (40:13):
Like they would cruise, they would cruise to a title
like Oh could you imagine the Spurs just basically doing
the opposite and just accelerating Wemby to like year seven Wemby.

Speaker 1 (40:24):
Oh, I you know, I haven't even given thought this
isn't the Wemby segment. But I don't even think I've
given enough thoughts. Okay, well, what does Victor Webber Yama
look like in his prime?

Speaker 3 (40:36):
I've spent way too much time thinking about it, and
I think it's gonna be preposterous. But no, look, I'm
not predicting that the Warriors will, you know, drop out
of tenth seat. I'm just saying that there is a
world wherein the perfect storm hits and everything just goes bad.

Speaker 1 (40:58):
It does feel you know, I've given I haven't given
them a lot of crap. I've shown some skepticism for
the Clippers, but the Warriors almost feel like their floor
is lower than like the Clippers to me have a
higher floor than the Warriors, probably because they're still just
top heavy, or you're saying JK or Brandon Pajimski is

(41:18):
really going to caps lock pop, which is just that's
harder than like looking at the Clippers cast of veterans
and thinking they can navigate an injury to Kawhi or
James Harden slipping or Bradley Beale not panning out. So yeah,
I don't know that I would, like we said, we're
not predicting things. I want to remind people at this point.
But there, that's definitely a team to keep an eye on.
I don't want to are we ready to move on?

Speaker 4 (41:37):
We are?

Speaker 3 (41:37):
I just want to mention one last thing, and I
know it's sacral issues, sacrilgious to just mention that Steph
is trying to drop off, but have you also seen
like his production level over the past two years, like
we are, I think it is fair to say that
we are beginning to see the not Hasten declined at all,

(41:58):
because quite the opposite, the slow, very gracious decline of
Stephen Curry. I think we approached it.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
So we need to spend a second on that, because
I think it's fair to say that. But I've come
to look at it like this is what is the
current version of Steph Curry in today's NBA. Is he
still one of the ten to fifteen best players? Yeah, yes,
still yes, then I think that's honestly all that matters.
There's a difference between Okay, we can't say that he's

(42:28):
one of the top five, but like I don't want
to say he exited that territory a while ago. But
we've been talking about in any given season, Tatum and
b Jokic, Giannis Luka, Doncic as all being in that.
So him and Lebron have been on the fringes of
Kevin Durantz of course been in there too. So I
agree with what you're saying. And it does, it diminishes

(42:49):
your margin for error. But even Steph Curry at what
seventy five eighty percent.

Speaker 2 (42:56):
Of Steph Curry from two years ago?

Speaker 1 (42:59):
But yeah, it's it's of course something to track and
spoiler alert, someone in their late thirties isn't as good
as they were there.

Speaker 3 (43:06):
I just wanted to say it because I know there's
going to be pushback on it by Warriors fans, and
I understand that because look, how do you not fall
in love with Steph Curry if you're a Deubs fan
over the course of like these sixteen years.

Speaker 4 (43:19):
How do you not do that? Obviously?

Speaker 1 (43:22):
Yeah, I mean his so his scoring per minute has
dipped in each of the past two years, so that
would be something to monitor. But I mean just twelve
and a half threes.

Speaker 4 (43:31):
But it's still ridiculous. Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's still ridiculous.

Speaker 1 (43:34):
And do you know where I think he's probably inoculated
against any individual drop off is that defenses will always
guard him like a five alarm fire. So he is
propping up your team even if he's not scoring or
on the ball or touches.

Speaker 4 (43:48):
In the corner. In the corner, he's providing you.

Speaker 2 (43:51):
Okay, I was.

Speaker 1 (43:53):
I didn't want to go here, and I just want
to make it clear that it's relative to expectations. I
think this team could just point. Oh it's the New
York Knicks.

Speaker 2 (44:03):
Here's my thing.

Speaker 1 (44:04):
They're one of only I think five teams that are
predicted when you're looking at the win totals to have
over fifty three wins. They are, they are good, but
there are a couple things that I think we need
to consider.

Speaker 4 (44:16):
Oh, can I guess one? Can I guess one of
your points?

Speaker 2 (44:19):
Go ahead?

Speaker 4 (44:20):
Carl Anton needs sounds and the lack of rim defense.

Speaker 1 (44:24):
Oh no, that I mean, like, that's a point, but
it's not one of my primary things.

Speaker 3 (44:28):
Oh interesting, Okay, No, you've been harping on that a
lot this summer, so I was just wondering if you
would go down, well.

Speaker 1 (44:33):
What I would harp on it. Well, I guess it's
a tangential point. But let me get the quick one
out of the way first.

Speaker 4 (44:38):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
I like the signings that they've made, but like Gershan
Yabuseli and Jordan Clarkson are not sixth Man of the
Year candidates right now. I guess maybe you could envision
a world where yab Buselli comes in and does it,
But there's the shooting I kind of buy into, and
they needed a four. If you're trying to play him
at the five.

Speaker 2 (44:57):
At all, I don't know what that looks like defensively.

Speaker 1 (44:59):
And if you're not, you're going to play him at
the five and you want to start duel big, you're
playing a lot of Ariel Huckporty at that point, which
I'm fine, but this team hasn't necessarily shown a commitment
to development. That does bring me to my next point,
which and I guess this is Karl Anthony Towns related,
But if you, I think a lot of people expect
them to start Karl Anthony Towns and Mitchell Robinson. We

(45:21):
saw promising moments of that in the playoffs last year.
We also saw there was a game that I think
it was against the Raptors. Kat and Huck Porty were
playing together and they were killing it. But that was
also the Raptors, and it was a very small sample
size Karnthy Towns and this, of course was one of
the biggest problems people had with Tibbs Mitchell Robinson. With
the starters played in place of Heart played sixty seven

(45:44):
minutes across the regular season in playoffs last year, that's
not a large enough sample size to go off of
good or bad. And by the way, it wasn't really
good or bad. In net. They were a minus one
in those minutes, so almost a neutral. But what you're
doing by playing Mitchell Robinson next to Karl Anthony Towns

(46:05):
is saying, we have completely punted on this idea of
being a five out team for a majority of the game.
And now you've either punted on this for one of
two reasons, you don't think you actually have the personnel
to do it because Josh Hart makes you play. Okay,
you can play five out lineups, but it's really more
like what four and a half four in a quarter
out at that point, or you're saying we need Karl

(46:28):
Anthony Towns to play alongside another center, in which case
paying Karl Anthony Towns so much money is inherently problematic.
So yes, that part can come back to Karl Anthony Towns. Now,
if you told me the Knicks, we're gonna start duce
McBride instead. I think that lineup has far more potential
just from a higher end perspective, because duce McBride better

(46:49):
point of attack defender than mckail Bridges. So now Michal
Bridges trickles down, he's playing more of his ideal role
on defense. You do get five out spacing because that's
what duce McBride does, is to threes. But then you
have Mitchell Robinson and Josh Hart both coming off the
same bench. What does the spacing look like there? And
if you don't believe in Gershon Yabucelli shooting just yet,

(47:10):
tons of question marks?

Speaker 4 (47:11):
Oh well you should you should by to that shooting?

Speaker 1 (47:14):
Can we I buy I'm saying, I buy into it,
but it's not like he's coming in and taking what
if he's playing how many First of all, how many
minutes per game is he play? This is someone who
avers about five attempts per thirty six minutes last year, right,
joby Sell. That's not an astronomical rate. And I think
that defenses are still like if he's your fa, just
as someone with a meat to the antidote to a

(47:35):
Josh Hart Mitchell Robinson lineup, Gershon Yabucelli does not have
the gravity to change that.

Speaker 4 (47:40):
No, Well, the thing is because this isn't at you.

Speaker 3 (47:44):
But I've seen like the shooting counter arguments for for
Yap was saying like, oh, like can he really come
in and be an NBA shooter? Like he was only
a pedestrians in Boston and people are just completely ignoring
how elite of a shooter he what's the real Madrid
for example, Like he's been a strong ass shooter for

(48:04):
like five years now. So I just wanted to make
sure the people are aware that this isn't a guy
who's just gonna have like a lucky few weeks where
he hits like forty five percent from downtown. The guy
is a tremendous shooter, and I think the best part
about it is if he gets enough confidence from the
coaching staff, he's a guy who can actually ramp it up.

Speaker 4 (48:25):
So it's interesting. We'll see what happens. But I would
not be in any way.

Speaker 3 (48:31):
Shape or form nervous about a more high volume version
of Yahoo.

Speaker 1 (48:37):
I think he's a good signing.

Speaker 2 (48:38):
I actually think it.

Speaker 1 (48:39):
He'll probably end up playing fewer minutes for the next.
Thing he did with the Sixers. When you look at
other in front court, it's popular. I mean, maybe an
injury happens, But you also can't like if you play
him in towns together, that's five out. I don't know
what the defense looks like in those instances either, a.

Speaker 4 (48:51):
Lot of offense. I wouldn't hate.

Speaker 1 (48:53):
Uh, they're gonna try it for sure. The other thing, too,
is I like Mike Brown from the perspective of more
things should be happening off the ball. He's already kind
of hinted at using Jalen Brunson in different ways, and
I'm a firm believer that Jalen Brunson can be used
in different ways. But but we can't pretend that the

(49:14):
Knicks have another high level creator on their team. Currenty
Towns is too inconsistent, hasn't shown enough live drivel playmaking.
The tunnel vision he gets on drives is just like
a career long epidemic for him.

Speaker 4 (49:28):
That's fair.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
Yes, McHale Bridges has never really been that guy. Maybe
he has another level to get to.

Speaker 2 (49:33):
We will see.

Speaker 1 (49:34):
It's not Ojiananobi. That's not Duce McBride's role I've seen.
I've seen people call Jordan Clarkson a wing. No, he's
not a wing. But he's also not a floor general.
Like he did improve it thought he did. He had
nice moments or at least ratchet up the passing in
Utah didn't really have another choice. But he's not someone
you look at and think that he you're comfortable him
driving the offense. I think the Knicks, as we're recording this,

(49:56):
trying to target a guard as But like they've been
interested in Ben Simmons, They've been linked to Brogden, They've
also been linked to Beasley, and they've been linked to
other guys too. It does kind of feel tell tale
that they believe whether it's Landry Shammitt coming in or
Beasley or Brogden.

Speaker 2 (50:11):
They don't think Tyler Kolek is gonna be the.

Speaker 1 (50:12):
Answer there either, And so are they really built to
make Jalen Brunson's workload lighter, Because this is someone who's
ranked in the ninety fifth percentile or higher and his
three years with Knicks with the Knicks of true usage,
all while logging two thousand minutes or more per season.
The other players to do that more in the same

(50:33):
three year span, Jannis Jokic, Shay.

Speaker 2 (50:37):
Damian Lillard.

Speaker 1 (50:38):
Yeah, you can look at that and say, well, this
is a testament to Jalen Brunton's skill and durability. It
absolutely is none of those other guys, with the exception
of Damian Lillard, who's also a little bit taller than
Jalen Brunton. But like, look at how Damian Lillard's body
held up. We're talking about a smaller guard here. I
know he took on a higher volume role later, but
you want to get to a point where you could
say Jalen Brunson will be at the peak in the playoffs,

(50:59):
which he's he has been, but also we want Jalen
Brunson to be peak. Jalen Brunson two three years down
the line. Still, I just don't know. I'm open to
the idea that they could be better, that this will
be a team that is more capable of winning three
to four playoff series, but I kind of think we're
penciling them in as oh, they're easily like, no worse
than two in the East. When my final part of

(51:20):
this point is I didn't pick them as a team
that could surprise because I think people are high on
both of these squads. The Hawks and the Magic are
right there. There's a chance, like the Sixers, you don't
want to predict they'd be a surprise. But if they
get any semblance of health, like that's a team that
could factor in Miami. I don't know that I'm in
love with the roster, but they're really deep. Now. I

(51:40):
just don't understand the Heywood high Smith trade. Yes, Boston
and Indiana will be missing their best players. Milwaukee has
Giannis Turner and a bunch of guys basically that might
be enough to make a ruckus in the East. So
I think the Knicks are gonna end up being one
of the two or three best teams in the East.
That's how I would But if you're if we're trying

(52:02):
to think that between firing Thibodau and going to Mike
Brown and then signing Yabu selling and Clarkson, then deepening
your rotation to guaranteed nine players. But which is that's good?
I just I I'm put a pin in it. That's all, like,
let's put another pin in it. I'm not saying they'll
be worse, but I don't know that they're going to

(52:23):
be much better than they were last year.

Speaker 4 (52:26):
I think that's that's fair. I think that's that's fair.

Speaker 3 (52:29):
So to your point about using Brunson off ball a
little bit more, you don't think Josh Hart could come
in and take on the on ball reps in those situations.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
With Jalen Brunson on the court, I don't really love
that as like a member of the second unit. Maybe,
and sure you can do that with Jalen Brunson, but
I'm talking more about like of a Josh Josh Hart
to me is more like a full speed creator, and
they need someone who's gonna be better at breaking down
at half court off by the way, guy, the other
thing with Josh Hart too, is that if in those

(53:01):
minutes you're playing him with Mitchell Robinson. Statistically, his rim
pressure falls off a cliff like that's like Karl Anthony
Towns is really important to Josh Hart. So that's another
trade off by the way that you make of having
Josh Hart come off the bench. Now, yes, staggering patterns,
what have you all that, I get it. You could
still game it. This team just still has a couple
of distinct question marks, if not flaws, And so I

(53:23):
could see us looking back and saying, you know, I
think the Athletics poll said that the vast majority of
Knicks fans believe they need to win the conference finals
for next season to be a success. And it's if
they're kind of getting to the NBA Finals or bust.
Let's say, there's a lot of town in the East
to where if they lost in the first their second round, like,
that's not gonna as of right now. I need to

(53:45):
see what happens on the court. Of course, as of
right now. I don't think that that's like a preposterous
thing to one.

Speaker 3 (53:50):
No, I don't think so either. I think that's fair.
I think that's very fair.

Speaker 2 (53:53):
Did you have any other teams that you wanted to me?

Speaker 4 (53:56):
No, I think I think I went through a.

Speaker 1 (53:58):
Three Miami could deserve an They're just so deep. I
don't know what the offense is necessarily going to look like,
and how much are they playing Pelee Larson or Casperus jacacionas.
I don't know what the youth investment's going to be.
Don't love the Heighsmith trible like Norman Powell. People have
already applauded the acquisition, but like that dude gives you
rim pressure and it's going to open up the floor,

(54:18):
make life easier on Tyler hero. But their center rotation
is like or are we just going to burn out?
Bam Adebayo?

Speaker 2 (54:24):
Now? Is that the the endgame here?

Speaker 3 (54:26):
So yeah, no, it's fine, it's fine. Like their their
depth is fine. But I still find the team overall
pretty unspectacular.

Speaker 4 (54:34):
I gotta admit I wonder.

Speaker 2 (54:36):
Is there very quickly?

Speaker 1 (54:37):
Was there another team you considered mentioning as a surprise
or a disappointment.

Speaker 3 (54:41):
Well, see, I thought about Dallas, and then I realized
I have no freaking idea where they're going up and down.
So I thought that that wouldn't be fair because like
you could basically point them in every wish direction.

Speaker 1 (54:53):
I think the Kings could surprise some people and maybe
not move heaven and Earth to make sure that Russell
Westbrook is signed. That could be like real surprise that
could happen there more. This was fun and it was
kind of cool limiting it to three teams because I
had other tough cuts and it's just I was happy
you picked the Spurs, but then I was a little
sad because you picked the opposite end of the spectrum.
But I still I didn't need to burn a pick

(55:15):
on them. But that's why this was fun limiting it
to three teams. Are you able just to tell everyone
where they could find you and all the fantastic work
that you do.

Speaker 3 (55:22):
Yes, sir, you can find you over at Yahu Sports,
for Red Forbes, at the NBA podcast and if you speak,
damish bus.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
Record until next time. And as always, we moved a
shout out to the one, the only, the indelible, the
real surprise MVP candidate of the season once he finds
an NBA team, Mister Frank Nila Keenan